# Trying to identify



## jd4020 (Feb 24, 2005)

this beautiful wheel.
We can't find any marks as to company makers.
As well as identify, we'd like to find it's value if we can.
Just turning the wheel, it spins as smooth as butter, the wheel is not warped. I haven't actually spun on it, it's being stored in a garage at this time. It has a 2 inch crack on the flat board where the mother-of-all and the wheel are mounted. Didn't see any other damage.
I am thinking about buying it, but I want my offer to be fair. I was thinking about 350.00-400.00 Too much? Not enough?
Any guesses?





































Thanks.
God bless, 
jd


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

I'd say that's vintage, not antique - the wood is too clean, and the base for the MOA is not like anything I've seen on antique wheels .. usually those are round not square.

Also the supports for the flyer are metal, if I am seeing that correctly - antiques would have used leather. It's got typical "American flax wheel" styling, but that's a wool flyer and it's not old enough to be an actual flax wheel. (and yes, you can spin either flax or wool on any wheel, but flax wheels have wide armed flyers and tend to have very high ratios as flax needs high twist)

Not that vintage is a bad thing - probably the parts are all in decent shape, nothing is going to fall apart from age when you breathe on it - but be *absolutely sure* it is a working wheel, as lots of the vintage ones were made primarily for decoration. I'm not seeing any grooves on the flyer neck, no grease marks anywhere, and no wear on the treadle - which probably means it never got used, or not much. I would not spend over $100 on this wheel if I could not try it out first ... is it local to you? If it spins well and makes you happy, offer whatever you like for it. But don't buy it without stringing a drive band and taking it for a test drive, or at least, don't pay very much if you can't make sure she spins first. That bobbin is on backwards, too - in order to string the double drive, you need the groove down at the end by the whorl. Beware: many whorls come off by twisting *backwards* to what you expect (lefty tighty righty loosey) and you *really really need to hold the flyer by the rod NOT THE ARMS* as the arms may break if you put pressure on them. Ask me how I know. Some whorls are pressure fit and just kind of pop off the end. You need to get that flyer apart and put back together properly before you decide, too. If it gives you grief, lower your price. If it won't come apart at all, walk away as it's not a working wheel (though I have to say this one really does look like a working wheel).

Wheel prices vary dramatically from one part of the country to another. For reference, though, most used wheels in working order where I live go for somewhere in the $200-$250 mark, higher for a brand like Ashford where you know you can get replacements, lower if it's a one off that you will need custom work done if you need a new bobbin or whatever. Not that a one bobbin wheel is actually much of a problem, all but one of mine have only one bobbin and it doesn't stop me at all.  If you can get a Traditional for $275 or $300 with extra bobbins and all the spare parts you could ever want only a click away on the internet, would you pay more for a wheel of unknown origins and performance ability? Only you can decide.

Feel free to ask more questions! I love to see wheels in use, and I hate to see wheel buyers hornswoggled by fake antiques, so I'll help any way I can.


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

Also -that looks an AWFUL lot like an Ashford flyer. Which could be a good thing as getting more bobbins should be simple. However that suggests some kind of home made reproduction style wheel and you may want to be extra careful to ensure the engineering is all as it ought to be.

Not saying that someone who used a premade flyer assembly didn't know what they were doing (in fact anyone very clever would probably do that, why do all the hard work? ) but it's a risk.


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

BINGO!

I think that's an Ashford Elizabeth. 

An older version of it, but I think that's what we're seeing - I did a Google Image search for "Ashford Elizabeth" and that swoopy treadle shape, the spoke design, and the square MOA base look awfully similar.

In which case, yeah, buy it.


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

Look here.

One is listed locally for $500 - I wouldn't pay that much, but I'm me. If it is in good shape and needs no repairs or replacments, then your original price estimate is probably appropriate.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Agree with everything Frazzle said :bow: It looks promising. Keep us posted. Good Luck!


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## jd4020 (Feb 24, 2005)

Thank you so much Frazzle. I will see if I can set it right and spin on it sometime over the weekend. It does feel like the wheel is perfectly weighted as it spins. So exciting. I will let you know. 
jd


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

I looked again and the bobbin is probably ok the way it is. I think they have a groove in either end. I also think the whorl will be pressure fitted. If that is the wheel I think it is, you will be happy with it!


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

That flyer isn't an Ashford or at least is it not like mine. It is similar but not the same. If you end up with this wheel you could take the flyer and bobbin assembly to a spinning shop (or fiber event) and see if you can find bobbins that fit. The bobbin does look like it is an Ashford bobbin. And, I think Frazzle is right, I think the other end of the bobbin has a groove and that is how you can change ratios.


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## Ana Bluebird (Dec 8, 2002)

Looks a lot like my old wheel and I'd say the price sounds good if you can spin on it. Can you get a leader going and actually see if it spins? Might need lots of oil though. I had to sand some on my bobbins to smooth them from too long of storage. Remember to take the bobbin off, the threads are backwards to what we are used to, turn the other way.


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## jd4020 (Feb 24, 2005)

Oh,,,, she works and she's mine!! I brought her home today in trade for 3 Franklins. 
I'm too new at this to know what you mean by "the threads are backwards to what we are used to" Ana Bluebird, but I did take the bobbin off and turn it around. She spins like a dream, but her hooks are on the other side of the flywheel and so she spins to the left and then would ply to the right, with this particular flyer. I used some blue faced leister wool and it just flew out of my hands. That's a first. My other wheel wants to stop in the middle of a pedal motion, but this girl has enough weight on the wheel (or something, that it just keeps going a lot smoother)
Sorry, I don't know how to explain it any better. I'm going to clean her up and oil her.
The whorl is a screw off kind. No problem with it. I'll try to post some close ups of her soon as I get her cleaned up.
Thanks so much for your help. 
jd


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

Wooooooooooohoo!


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## gone-a-milkin (Mar 4, 2007)

Happy NNew Wheel Day!

Not sure I understand why you would have to spin in only one direction though?
If the hooks are facing 'UP", you should be able to go either direction. Unless I am missing something.

Congratulations! You will become a team with her in no time.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Congratulations!!! I agree with GAM, the side the hooks are on should matter which way you spin. If you think it does just switch them to the other side them. But it shouldn't matter.


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## mamajohnson (Nov 27, 2002)

Congrats! She is a beauty!
I know you will enjoy spinning. I love my Ashford.


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