# Home Intruder



## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

I've been building my house and homestead for about 2 1/2 years. Since day one, I always noticed small things missing around the property, especially building materials. A board here, a piece of soffit there. This past summer I started noticing small things missing in the house. Of course I rationalized this as "boy I sure do lose a lot of stuff". Funny thing is that none of it ever showed back up. I also "forgot" to lock one of my doors periodically or so I thought. 

Then about a month ago I was getting ready for bed, opened the medicine cabinet and all of the bottles I had on the shelf were perfectly spaced about 1" apart. I knew for sure then that someone had been in the house. Not only that but they were obviously playing mind games with me. Then I noticed that the forearm on my shotgun was loose and had been tampered with. Also, power cords on my cell phone charger, fan and space heater had all been cut to where they were dangling. Plus lots more.

After talking to some people about the situation, they mentioned the movie "sleeping with the enemy" which I've never seen but the intruder obviously has. Any way, I found out that the deadbolt on one of my doors was not latching completely. This is obviously how they were getting in. 

When I first bought the property my very eccentric neighbor made it real clear that he didn't like the fact that I had bought the property and was building out there. He actually tried to buy it from me but couldn't come up with the money. Since this happens on a regular basis...probably once a month, and since I can think of no one else who would have any motive to mess with my head like that, my neighbor is obviously the only real suspect.

I'm finishing up the house but am only out there a few days a week and since they're going in there maybe once a month, staking it out would be not be practical but I want to catch them. So, here's my plan. I'm going to set up a DVR down in the crawlspace (so they can't find it) and a wireless camera on the porch. I'll set up a loud alarm on the entrance door where they're getting into the house. I'll also setup a motion detector on that door so that when the door is opened, not only will a very loud outdoor alarm mounted up on the house go off so they'll leave but a light will go on in the porch so that as they're leaving I can get a good picture. I could get a night vision camera but the red lights seem like they would be a dead giveaway.

Any way, if anyone's got thoughts or insights on this situation and plan, I would greatly appreciate hearing them.

Thanks.


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## unregistered29228 (Jan 9, 2008)

Well yikes! I can't say what I'd do now, but with the earlier signs of someone messing with my stuff I would have probably shot someone!....


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Be careful, you have a disturbed person on your hands, obviously without conscience.
If at all possible, go armed until you find out who it is, and keep your eyes open.
It's not much of a leap to go from messing with your mind to setting traps, cutting brake lines, etc.
I assume you've reported this to the cops?
They might not be able or willing to do anything, but it'll be on record if something does happen or if you are forced to defend yourself.


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## calliemoonbeam (Aug 7, 2007)

I don't really have any suggestions for you, but I've dealt with a stalker for over 10 years, and if he's already going to those lengths the chances are pretty good that he's already got your place wired and is watching every move you make, so will see you setting up to catch him. Even so, it might be enough to scare him off when he sees you're serious about catching him, but it seemed to have the opposite effect in my case, just made him more determined and more sneaky, plus it really ticked him off, and instead of just being annoying he got dangerous.

Going to the authorities is probably just a waste of time and will only get you labeled as either a trouble maker or a psycho yourself...ask me how I know, lol. I'm a woman and they wouldn't even help me, so I wouldn't expect them to be very forthcoming in your situation. The one thing they told me that was any help at all was to show no response at all and just pretend they don't exist. Their goal is either to scare you off or to annoy you, and any attention is good attention and just encourages them. Hopefully, he'll give up eventually when he sees you're not going anywhere and that his antics aren't getting to you. 

I normally don't talk about this stuff to people, and the few times I have I've been flamed for it or told I was lying, making it up or just crazy, so be prepared for it. I'm sorry you're having to deal with it and hope it doesn't escalate. Good luck.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

I can't comprehend the "sleeping with the enemy" deal here...

I mean, I GET intimidation, but whoever is trying to do the intimidation has a weird way of showing it. 

How far away is the neighbor who you suspect?


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

seedspreader said:


> I can't comprehend the "sleeping with the enemy" deal here...
> 
> I mean, I GET intimidation, but whoever is trying to do the intimidation has a weird way of showing it.
> 
> How far away is the neighbor who you suspect?


In sleeping with the enemy, apparently the "bad guy" is going in his ex'es house and perfectly lines up all the cans in her kitchen cabinet so she would know he was there. I didn't have kitchen cabinets up so the intruder perfectly lined up all the little bottles in my medicine cabinet.

I don't know about intimidation but I think they're trying to scare me. Maybe they hope I'll sell the house but then they'll just end up with another neighbor any way. 

My neighbor's house is about 150' from mine.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

I have no advice, but I do think I'd want to go out with at least a dog that would protect, alert me of anyone around while I was out there.

Be safe, and good luck. That's got to be everything from highly annoying to scarey.

Angie


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## edcopp (Oct 9, 2004)

So some nutjob is playing a game with you, and you want to play also. That might work for you, but would not work for me.

I would immidiately make a police report and call for an investigation. After all you might not be first for this nutcase. The cops may already know him well.

At any rate get the report on file so that when the body is found it won't be a complete surprise, when they have to come pick it up.

Spend a few quiet evenings at home with your vehicle out of sight. Keep the lights off and just call it survival training. Sooner or later the intruder will show up and let himself in. Three or four shots from a 12 Guage should solve the problem on a permanant basis. No electronic toys needed.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

conscious said:


> In sleeping with the enemy, apparently the "bad guy" is going in his ex'es house and perfectly lines up all the cans in her kitchen cabinet so she would know he was there. I didn't have kitchen cabinets up so the intruder perfectly lined up all the little bottles in my medicine cabinet.
> 
> I don't know about intimidation but I think they're trying to scare me. Maybe they hope I'll sell the house but then they'll just end up with another neighbor any way.
> 
> My neighbor's house is about 150' from mine.


I saw the movie... my point is that the movie is scary for women who have a control freak abusive husband, but for the rest of us, it's more of a way to get shot... coming into my house.

If that's not about intimidation, I don't know what it is. 

I'd get it on record with the cops too like Ed said.

Then, I'll tell you, personally, I'd walk over and conveniently start a conversation about how I was planning on shooting the next person I found out had come in my house... but I am a bit forward when it comes to breaking and entering.

A nice exhibition of shooting along the property line would help reinforce the visit.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

edcopp said:


> So some nutjob is playing a game with you, and you want to play also.


How is that playing games? I just want to catch them and get them locked up where they should be.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

seedspreader said:


> Then, I'll tell you, personally, I'd walk over and conveniently start a conversation about how I was planning on shooting the next person I found out had come in my house... but I am a bit forward when it comes to breaking and entering.


I thought about that but I really want to catch them. If I don't, I'll always be wondering and I would prefer to know positively who it is and then get them locked up.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

conscious said:


> I thought about that but I really want to catch them. If I don't, I'll always be wondering and I would prefer to know positively who it is and then get them locked up.


Yeah, it won't hurt to get it on video that's for sure.


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

I would report a break in and vandalism without making any accusations. If the police investigate, one of the first people they talk to would be your neighbor to ask if he'd seen anything. If the guy is a nutcase, the last thing I'd do is get in his face and challenge him. 

Paranoia maybe, but I'd be checking everywhere to make sure he hasn't bugged your place before I started putting together a way to catch him. 

When you leave next time, take time to wipe down your door knobs, medicine cabinet & contents, gun, etc. so if you come in and find things messed with any finger prints will belong to the criminal. Make sure that everything is locked tight. Then go to the police, tell them you're leaving & when you plan to return, give them a contact number and ask them to drive by and check the place while you're gone. Maybe you'll get lucky and the police will catch him in the act.


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

I'm not an expert and don't play one on TV.

Something I learned about dogs and human nature. A bark is a lot easier than a bite. I am not a fan of dogs who are mean and pushy. If a dog comes at me barking and trying to be scary I will lunge at it, start barking myself and chase it full speed for at least 20 yards. (I know it looks insane) With 100% record I have had many dogs, even a pit who was out of his fence but guarding "his" territory run like crazy with their tails tucked so tight they ran in a hunch.

Yes, I am aware that I take a risk doing this.

A dog that is a killer, a real killer like a junk yard dog, (not just an ill mannered mouthy mongrel) will tear your kiester up the instant it sees you. The rest is just a negotiation and sizing up. MOST animals won't fight to the death. Same goes for people. MOST will have a self preservation mode. Very few have the mental issues required to be a creative, stalker killer. Take it a step further and imagining someone who has the intelligence required to premeditate a long term game.....I don't think so. Most crazy killers act impulsively and the really dangerous ones who are like silence of the lambs would never leave a messy trail.

Sounds like this puppy is an amateur trying to make tinkle in your yard. He has too much time on his hands to play games and steal material from hollywood. That just lacks finesse and real whack job flair. IMHO

If the guy were an adversary worth losing sleep over you would never have had the chance to own the property. Think about it. He's got no game, no hustle and no cojones. You sound like you can run circles around him.

Personally, I would pull the wings out of the fly before I smashed it, just for fun. I'm not the girl to be "funny" with though.

Flame away.:flame: This menace is not your average welcome wagon. Watering his plants while he is on vacation probably won't do much good.

:banana02:


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

Change the locks! I've seen all this high tech stuff mentioned, but do not remember any mention of changing that tampered with deadbolt. That would be #1. And maybe check an extra lock on the windows. With a stick, or one of those sticks that can be a peg into the frame of a window.

Angie


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## megafatcat (Jun 30, 2009)

Have that shotgun checked by a gunsmith ASAP. Not hard to remove a firing pin or file off a locking lug and make it dangerous for YOU to shoot. Maybe get a trailcam?


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## MaineFarmMom (Dec 29, 2002)

About the dog suggestions - he doesn't live there. There isn't anyone to take care of a dog while he's gone.

I'd make a phone call to law enforcement and put in the cam and alarm system. The sooner he's caught and dealt with the easier (I hope) it is to have him as the next door neighbor when you're there.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I take it you don't belive in Ghosts?


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

1. Trip wire attached to those exploding ink packs that they put in the bait money for bank robberies. In the absence of ink packs consider something awful like skunk "juice", pepper spray or the like. You sound like a reosurceful fella. A tool box would make a lovely "pandoras" box especially if well placed in a room you still have to paint so ink splotches are a non issue.

2. Net connection there? For minimal price you could set up a web cam to a motion detector in plain sight. Through net connection you could have 24 hour stream to computer at your main location (that records data, only after motion sensor comes on). Although the person will clearly see your webcam those are cheap and by the time they walk up to it and try to shut it down (thinking you set up an amateur detection device, which of course you didn't) they will be recorded already and safely downloaded to the off site computer. 

3. Tempting bait item with electricity hooked up for a jolt.

4. Punji stakes. No, not really. 

5. Change your routine. "Whoever" is bold enough to mess around only 150' feet from the house next door feels very comfortable with their timing. Leave like regular and pop back up silently after darkness to spend one last night. If whoever it is knows you always leave on a Sunday eve and NEVER return before a month is out I bet they get all pupmed up as they see you drive away. Stewing in frustration at you over a weekend of you being around will propably make him jealous to the point of curiosity to see what you have fixed up. That is probably when he feels the safest, he acts out and spends the rest of the month smug and excitedly waiting your return. *just throwing ideas out there*

A thief or average high school vandal would not play mind games and come back over and over for such an extended period. The evidence you find sounds like it is a personal grudge.



Please watch your food and medicines for contaminates.

A person who gets a rush from vandalism and violating your privacy has to be handled either by municipal law or by your own law pretty swiftly and harshly. Those behaviors can very quickly evolve into a person who gets their kicks in more dangerous albeit poorly thought out ways. For some the vandalism is the gateway drug to being a real menace to society. 

There is a line between vandalism/intimidation and actual physical violence. That line can eventually become blurry.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

hintonlady said:


> I'm not an expert and don't play one on TV.
> 
> Something I learned about dogs and human nature. A bark is a lot easier than a bite. I am not a fan of dogs who are mean and pushy. If a dog comes at me barking and trying to be scary I will lunge at it, start barking myself and chase it full speed for at least 20 yards. (I know it looks insane) With 100% record I have had many dogs, even a pit who was out of his fence but guarding "his" territory run like crazy with their tails tucked so tight they ran in a hunch.
> 
> ...


Love your style hintonlady and agree with you. I don't think he's got any cojones either. At first I was a little creeped out but now it just p's me off. 

I've done the same with dogs, it's hilarious when they take off running.

Funny thing is my neighbor's been laid off for over a year so, yea he's got plenty of time on his hands.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

When you set up your alarm, make certain the camera can get a picture of him when it goes off.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

AngieM2 said:


> Change the locks! I've seen all this high tech stuff mentioned, but do not remember any mention of changing that tampered with deadbolt. That would be #1. And maybe check an extra lock on the windows. With a stick, or one of those sticks that can be a peg into the frame of a window.


Angie,

Once the person is caught of course I will be changing the locks and putting in a good security system but until then I want to leave everything the way it is. Thanks for your ideas.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

They make a deercam now that can be accessed by the web or cellphone.

You've got motion detection, infrared capability and undestroyable (is that a word?) pictures in your possession.


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## Bay Mare (Jun 7, 2007)

conscious said:


> I could get a night vision camera but the red lights seem like they would be a dead giveaway.


Could you put a little piece of duck tape over the red light so it wouldn't be seen? 

Agree with changing the locks and locking the windows. The motion light would help with getting a picture maybe but if he is sure you aren't home it won't scare him off. After the first couple of times he encounters it, it won't even startle him - should make for a nice clear picture!

Angela


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

conscious said:


> Angie,
> 
> Once the person is caught of course I will be changing the locks and putting in a good security system but until then I want to leave everything the way it is. Thanks for your ideas.


Okay - but you are allowing it to continue. And with locks changed, you can still do all that camera stuff of him trying to break in. But, you know the end results you are really after. 

The rest of the crew here has some good ideas.


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## swamp man (Dec 25, 2005)

I'd set up the recorder before the alarm and whatnot, so's you can get some video or pics. I can't imagine a scenario where going to the cops will do any good whatsoever until you have hard evidence.

And as another poster suggested, give that shotty a good once-over, and don't leave it at the house when you ain't there until you get this situation resolved for Pete's sake!


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

Bay Mare said:


> Could you put a little piece of duck tape over the red light so it wouldn't be seen?
> 
> Agree with changing the locks and locking the windows. The motion light would help with getting a picture maybe but if he is sure you aren't home it won't scare him off. After the first couple of times he encounters it, it won't even startle him - should make for a nice clear picture!
> 
> Angela


When there's also a 120 decibel alarm mounted on the outside of the house that goes off when the light goes on, I think he or she will leave.

No, you can't cover up the red lights. The nightvision won't work then.


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## Jakk (Aug 14, 2008)

I wouldnt change the locks until after he has been caught red handed. If you change them it might tick him off and cause him to break windows or bust the door. Then you have damage on your hands that you have to pay for. Dont leave anything of value, get a deer cam and wipe your prints off of everything in the house.

The next time you go up there I would bring enough supplies to last you a few days. Make it look like you are leaving but come back later that same night. Have someone drop you off away from the house in the middle of the night and stealthily make your way into the house. My guess is that he does this soon after you leave, knowing you will not be back right away, but not knowing which date you will return. 

Wait for him to walk into your house and meet him with a shotgun, catch him red handed and call the police.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

swamp man said:


> I'd set up the recorder before the alarm and whatnot, so's you can get some video or pics. I can't imagine a scenario where going to the cops will do any good whatsoever until you have hard evidence.
> 
> And as another poster suggested, give that shotty a good once-over, and don't leave it at the house when you ain't there until you get this situation resolved for Pete's sake!


If I file a report, at least there will be a record in case something happens. I already talked to a cop buddy and he said that's about as much good as it'll do. 

The reason I want the alarm and the video to happen close to the same time is that if an alarm doesn't go off right away and they see the camera, they'll be hunting for the recorder and if they find it.....well then I'll be out $200. If an alarm goes off, I'll still get a short video but they'll surely leave right away. Then I'll be getting a call from my other neighbor that the alarm went off.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

Whatever you do, please let us know how this plays out.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

AngieM2 said:


> Okay - but you are allowing it to continue. And with locks changed, you can still do all that camera stuff of him trying to break in. But, you know the end results you are really after.


If they don't have easy access, like they have had since my deadbolt wasn't latching properly, they probably won't even try to get in. Sure I could get a video of them going up to the door and messing with it, but until they go in, it doesn't do me any good, legally.

Covert surveillance gets much more difficult outside as cameras have to be powered (plugged into the only outlets available....on the house) which would be too obvious.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

Jolly said:


> They make a deercam now that can be accessed by the web or cellphone.
> 
> You've got motion detection, infrared capability and undestroyable (is that a word?) pictures in your possession.


I don't have internet out there but never thought about cell phone access. I'll check into it. Thanks.


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## Gercarson (Nov 2, 2003)

The poster who says to get your guns checked out is "right on" - this should be a priority too, your guns may have been seriously tampered with - to cause harm to you or to not cause harm to anything else. Make sure they are fine. You are gong to need them.


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

Awww, be creative... crank it up.

Got any biker friends that want to take a weeks vacation at your place? 

Make sure they are nice and loud, run the bikes at all hours of the night, and party on. Tell them some wild story about the neighbor that will get them worked up, but not enough to kill him, just enough that they glare at him all week. Then, when they leave after the week, go back and tell the neighbor "Gee, somebody was coming in the place while I was gone, so I had to have my friends come over to guard it. They _REALLY_ like the place and want to come back if I ever have a problem again, and maybe stay for good..." Smile, and walk away.

Next idea - watch the "Home Alone" movies and lift some ideas.


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## edcopp (Oct 9, 2004)

conscious said:


> How is that playing games? I just want to catch them and get them locked up where they should be.


At any time that someone intrudes on my right to privacy or security in my own home I get quite irritated. Now when I get to the point that I am willing to spend my money on something like electronics, as you mention; I feel like the intruder is forcing me to do this.

Too often the electronics will be destroyed or tampered with by the unknown party causing even more aggrivation and expense. Just seems like a game to me, that could go on for a long time. 

Prosecuters it seems are not very good at convicting "good ol' boys" who are well established in the neighborhood, especially with new fangled hi-tech electronic stuff, especially if they have a "good ol' boy" for a lawyer.

Now there are several other things that may happen. Consider you enter your home sometime and there is someone already there. Are you prepared for that encounter? You certainly have a right to be.

On this board I am considered an Old guy. Way back in the olden days when I was growing up, breaking into someones houes was called burgulary, now it's called vandalism. If it is the first time the perp has been caught it will most likely be dismissed an not worth the time of the system. This does not solve the problem.

If you quietly occupy your own home when a visitor enters you will accomplosh several things. First off you will find out who it is. It will not be necessary to kill him most likely, but he needs to know you can. From there how the situation is handled is up to you unless he forces the issue.

Personally I like having the intruder lay face down spread eagle, and wait for the cops to arrive. I would call them on the cell, and tell them that there is no hurry because I am holding the bad guy at gunpoint, and I won't kill him unless he moves.

Seedspreader has a good idea, one that has worked for me in the past. Let the right people know that there is likely to be somebody shot before this is all over, and that you intend to survive. Usually the word gets back to the involved person, and things cool off.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Two choices. Do nothing. Do Something. Intimidation sometimes works.

Own a backhoe? If so, dig a deep hole, about 8' deep and as square as possible... 

No backhoe, dig a grave out in the edge of the woods...

Put a note up on the door... 

"Security system in place. Don't move, before you say your prayers. When you move again, it'll be your last. I already have the hole dug for your body. You'll never be found"

_____________________
Sorry that you bought property next to another human... a crazed human at that.

There are only two ways to deal with such a crazy person. Bury them or live with them.

Unfortunately, you don't own the property yet... the neighbor does. You won't own the property until you live on it. This is a very very hard rule for people that aren't familiar with it to understand. A person may 'legally' own something... but until you take physical possession, it's not yours. 

My advice, short of risking prison... don't store anything valuable there until you live on the site. Taking video of a crazed person roaming around your un-lived in home will only start a real war... what's the penalty for breaking and entering? Is that a life sentence? Or a few months in jail, or a fine? Then the psycho has months to stew, and when he's out, he may go really unglued. Also, his family might be connected, and he spends no time behind bars, and then you have even more troubles.

Post shtf or TEOTW.... take care of the problem, if he remains a problem.

good luck!


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

if he had access to your house , it would be no real effort to pull the locks and take them to get a key made.and many people get those 4 lock set all keyed the same deals anymore. if he has done so and has a key your videos will add up to a hill of beans, even with you standing toe to toe with a judge yelling "I never gave him a key". so I would change the locks and make sure there is no way in with out forcing/breaking something if you want to file charges.

breaking and entering is just that, and as you are not living there home invasion is a reach.

best course of action would get your video equipment and find out who it is and confront them. if its been going on long enough they probably got comfy and have a routine and schedual. it may not even be your nieghbor might be someone staying there long term, they may have even been there well you where!

and if he was really smart all he would have to do if you have a mail box setup is have someone mail him a letter to that address
and he can claim residency! no joke.


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

I don't recall this being mentioned - If you haven't, be sure and post multiple, "NO TRESPASSING, VIOLATORS WILL BE PROSECUTED" signs. 

The mailbox? If you have one, cancel your mail service immediately & remove the mailbox.

Locks? I would change them absolutely.

Deer Cam... Go for it & you can also file charges just for "Illegal Trespass...remember your signs."

Digging a hole? That is intimidation not looked upon kindly by authorities and further backs up a threat...further could be used against you legally should something escalate and you have to defend yourself!

Rigging traps? I like the idea of triggering release of paint, however, anything someone could trip over? That constitutes a trap. In most parts of the US, the victim sues and wins if hurt by any kind of trap.

If you want to stake out your property and are prepared to make a "Citizen's Arrest," or otherwise defend your property should an altercation take place, you are of course within that right. However, you must be prepared to use deadly force, should it be necessary. The risk of potential harm to you certainly escalates should this happen. Be careful not to underestimate the nutcase.

I would also agree with wiping off the door knobs and everything you would suspect me may touch. That insures the fingerprints.

If you want this nutcase caught & prosecuted, you would be wise to not confront or in any way let on what you are doing! He needs to be caught, "in the act" and also on a media format which is undeniable evidence.


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

amazing the things a TRAIL CAM picks up and they never ever know they are caught on film. Lots of hi quality lo-detection TRAIL CAM devices out there, from cheap to premium. They caught the Mountain Lions that dont exist in Michigan and loads of other stuff. They hide easily and are designed NOT to be seen or attract attention. They are battery driven and you should "try them out" in the store, so you see how much noise they create if any.........work it out before you set it up.

Personally I'd get some multiple good images on different days, and then decide whether I am going over to talk to my "friend" with "John Law" at my side or proceed some other way. This way, you have the goods, timed and dates, and the culprit in the act, multiple times and incidents so there is no fluke or co-incident excuses.

What you do with it is your business, but that is how to get the goods on the intruders.

DG




conscious said:


> If I file a report, at least there will be a record in case something happens. I already talked to a cop buddy and he said that's about as much good as it'll do.
> 
> The reason I want the alarm and the video to happen close to the same time is that if an alarm doesn't go off right away and they see the camera, they'll be hunting for the recorder and if they find it.....well then I'll be out $200. If an alarm goes off, I'll still get a short video but they'll surely leave right away. Then I'll be getting a call from my other neighbor that the alarm went off.


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## Wis Bang (Feb 20, 2009)

Deer cam w/ infrared flash hidden in those new birdhouses you just bought...


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## coehorn (Jul 29, 2009)

Some really good ideas on the board. A few more:

Check with the police/prosecuting attorney about time/date stamping on your video recording. Will they take action based on a video that does not have it?

One thing I used with great success was to put up very visible cameras -- that were covered by covert cameras. There is nothing quite as satisfying as watching someone slink around to avoid your visible camera. It also is a great method of funneling the bad guy to where you want them.

From the harassment you are describing, I would guess that your psycho may have wired your house with wireless cams or mics. You might want to drop by the nearest "spy store" to buy something cheap to try to intercept/detect any signals that may be present. Alternatively, you could have some security types covertly sweep your place for signals.

Best to stop this situation now ..... before he goes completely over the edge.....


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## damoc (Jul 14, 2007)

file a report

fix the locks some fancy lawyer might get him of on some technicality if you
knowingly leave the house unsecured

and some sort of hidden security as well as visable

sounds like a real crazy but it may be just some mischievious kids also
and if you let them have access to your shotgun and something bad happens guess who is going to jail


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## klickitat (Dec 26, 2008)

I completely agree; deer cams. Get several pics on different dates and take the evidence to the police.


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## MattPA (Apr 9, 2009)

If you have the Internet available out there then buy a AXIS camera. That way you can watch the place over the Internet from your other home and if he breaks in you can capture it and phone police who can catch him in the act. Or if no Internet just tell him you have been having problems with vandalism and you installed some satellite enabled cameras to catch the perpetrator that record 24 hours daily. Her is probably to stupid and will believe you and will stop pushing his luck. The neat things about AXIS cameras is you can setup and watch 4 cameras and can pan and tilt from your any computer anywhere.


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## ChristyACB (Apr 10, 2008)

MattPA said:


> If you have the Internet available out there then buy a AXIS camera. That way you can watch the place over the Internet from your other home and if he breaks in you can capture it and phone police who can catch him in the act. Or if no Internet just tell him you have been having problems with vandalism and you installed some satellite enabled cameras to catch the perpetrator that record 24 hours daily. Her is probably to stupid and will believe you and will stop pushing his luck. The neat things about AXIS cameras is you can setup and watch 4 cameras and can pan and tilt from your any computer anywhere.


Any idea which model. Looks like there are a lot of them. I'm also interested in one like that.


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

Because of so many possible issues, I'm leaning toward changing the locks and setting up outdoor surveillance so that if I do find out it is my neighbor, I can confront him as I'd still really like to know who it is. 

But the first thing I'm going to do is to talk to the county police and learn the legal implications before I do anything else.

Thanks to everyone for all of the good ideas.


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## ninny (Dec 12, 2005)

My concern would be going to the property some day and finding your house burned to the ground. If whoever is doing this is as crazy as they appear to be, this might just be their next step to get you to sell/move from your property.
As others suggested, set up some cameras for your protection.

.


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

I had a friend who's house was vandalized during construction. It was 70 - 80% completed, and people broke in, had a wild vandalizing party, complete with bonfire. Their poor little girl was really shaken by the incident, as this was her new home. 
They never caught the culprits. 
In their case, I think it was young vaandals out looking for trouble. Please do be careful as this seems to be a neighbor, not a random stranger


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## seagullplayer (Nov 6, 2008)

Paul, you live in the right state, just the wrong end...

Good luck.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

On reflection, I would do absolutely nothing, until you start living on site full time. Someone mentioned fire... I read just last week on another board where a family lost 20 years of prepping as well as their bug out cabin, to some local Vandals. People erroneously believe that others will respect their property when they're not around.

OP mentioned wanting to see him locked up. Should really learn to play chess, and apply those rules to life. Yes, he might get locked up... does your state incarcerate people for life, or give death sentences for breaking and entering? He might not even get jail time, but only probation. (Ir)regardless, he will be out at some point, and then what? If you're living on site, you have a war on your hand. If you're not living on site, you have a smouldering pile of ashes.

If arrested, he will make bail, and be "out" till trial, which could be months... plenty of time to burn you out. If he knows he's going to jail anyway, (in for a penny, in for a pound) he has no reason "not" to burn you out. Especially if it looks like he might lose his place for legal/financial reasons. You corner a wild animal, sometimes they attack back ferociously.

In this world, you can do something or do nothing. Sometimes doing nothing will get you further than doing something.

I'd find out what crime the guy could be charged with. Find out what the best and worst sentence that might be doled out, if found guilty by 12 of *his peers (not yours).*. Then run the calculations in your head and see whether it might be worth it or not to proceed with a prosecution. Prognosticate what happens if he is prosecuted and released.

Good luck, my friend. Your between inconvenience and a hard crazy place, located next to one of those things most of us dread... other humans... and you've got one of the rotten ones.


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

Two kinds of snow will help you.

1/ A light tracking snow,2-4" that stays a day or two. Getting over there right the next day would be great.

2/ A deep, all winter snow that stays all winter. If they guy is obsessed/compulsive, he will have to complete his habitual behavior.
If he has a grain or two of sanity, it will deter him as long as the snow is in place.

3/ Depending on whether you have ground cover in place, vines, grass, hay, etc, also allows you to track movements in and out. An experienced trapper would be the guy to help you out here, defining paths this guy runs on.

4/ If you can define the traffic pattern on your property, then you could set up a very less detectable Trail Cam to get an idea what move would be next.

AS a plan of action I would :

A/ document and report the incidents, professionally with objectivity, no emotion, no threats.

B/ Begin to define this guys behaviors with someone knowledge and get an idea of his movements by some of the above actions.

C/ Follow police or professional reco's as to "Posting" your property if at all, 

D/ Pick a course of action, i.e. Trail Cams, Indoor remote cams.

E/ Consider marking dyes or markers that get on the perps clothes or body as he transits certain "close quarters' passages inside, so they can be found in his place or on his person. 

It call all be very passive and hard to detect. Spy, or security shops can point you in the right direction. Some of your stuff has been too good to resist, so invisibly coated with this stuff will give you a "marker" later for this guy.

Simple motion detectors hitched to battery op lights and sirens might alert your close neighbor also.

There are other means I would not suggest in open forums, still legal, but it would compromise them to publicize them. PM me if you have a question.

Good Luck

DG








conscious said:


> Because of so many possible issues, I'm leaning toward changing the locks and setting up outdoor surveillance so that if I do find out it is my neighbor, I can confront him as I'd still really like to know who it is.
> 
> But the first thing I'm going to do is to talk to the county police and learn the legal implications before I do anything else.
> 
> Thanks to everyone for all of the good ideas.


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## Space Cowboy (Apr 26, 2008)

ChristyACB said:


> Any idea which model. Looks like there are a lot of them. I'm also interested in one like that.


I used to sell these. It really depends on a lot of factors. 

For instance;

Do you need to move the camera (i.e pan, tilt, zoom). A "fixed" camera is much cheaper.

Do you need to actually have a high resolution of the the persons face? (Some courts/ police require this, others, as long as you can get a reasonable facsimile)

Do you need to see well in low light (or in the dark)?

AXIS is a good camera, but there are many options.

Other questions might be if it is inside or out. What are the outside conditions like (Rainy, snowy, very cold)?

All these things determine the type (and expense) of the camera. 

If you would like further info, please PM.

SC


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## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

..................I'd install small cameras , activated by either motion or sound . Once , I had the Intruder on CD and a definite ID I'd formulate a plan of action . Counter intuitively , I'd get the intruder on CD before I fixed all the locks , then make the repairs too all points of INgress and see what happens . Besides you need visual proof to take too Law Enforcement for further legal action . , fordy


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

Heck, if he is out of work it's only a matter of time until you see him pack off and move anyway. (unless he is a prepper)

I'd contact the county zoning department and find out what bank holds the deed. Then I would do some digging and some patient waiting. When the time was prime I would lunge with an offer (to the bank) too good to turn down and allowable by contractual provisions set forth by the mortgage contract.

AKA I would sell an organ if I had to in order to buy him out just to be funny. I would also be insured to the hilt.

I LOVE chess but I like being funny even more.

Besides having an extra lot right next door should be nice and affordable in this economy.


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## keyhole (Dec 2, 2008)

You can pick up one of the hunter's game cameras for less than $100 and hide it around outside of the dwelling. Most have IR capability and will take pictures at night. One thing you need to do is hide it well but place it where the intruder will have to walk inorder to enter the dwelling. You can channelize the path by what ever you have outside. Also if your camera has a flashing red light like mine has when something walks in front of it you can place a small piece of tape over the light.

If you don't want to do that buy a couple of the small spy cameras off of ebay and place them in your ceiling or behind dry wall and drill a hole for them to see through and wire them to a VCR. 

Good luck on what ever you decide and let us know how it goes!!!


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

whether in the dark or low light or obstructed vision conditions, snow storm or whatever, I'd rig my first cam outdoors so if he has wired your place inside, with a cam, he doesnt get to see you set up your counter trap.

Whatever you got to do to get it in place, do it so he cant see you first.



keyhole said:


> You can pick up one of the hunter's game cameras for less than $100 and hide it around outside of the dwelling. Most have IR capability and will take pictures at night. One thing you need to do is hide it well but place it where the intruder will have to walk inorder to enter the dwelling. You can channelize the path by what ever you have outside. Also if your camera has a flashing red light like mine has when something walks in front of it you can place a small piece of tape over the light.
> 
> If you don't want to do that buy a couple of the small spy cameras off of ebay and place them in your ceiling or behind dry wall and drill a hole for them to see through and wire them to a VCR.
> 
> Good luck on what ever you decide and let us know how it goes!!!


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## CSA again (May 2, 2007)

I thank the camera, alarms, ect. are all good idea's. 
but I have to say I would have already sent this fool to meet his maker.


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## kygreendream (Mar 20, 2007)

personally I would not put out piercing alarms, but I would file a report so there is notice somewhere. I would also set up the deer cam or web cam to get some pics also put up no tresspassing signs in multiple places on your property so if it is ever questioned you have that to protect your self with.


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## oceantoad (May 21, 2009)

I didn't see it mentioned anywhere, but if they were messing around with bottles in your medicine cabinet, I would be concerned with the contents.

Had me place broken into and trashed years ago when I had a friend who was an LEO living with me. I was into vitamins at the time and since the bottles had been moved around I tossed all the contents. Not sure if they had been tampered with.


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

*CSA , *but without proper prep, if your not gonna do a Dixie Chicks style "EARLE" on this guy, you must cover your *ss very well, and lawyer tight.

Personally I favor a ghillie suite and a night vision scope with perhaps silent device, for getting "field-ready" for that level of solution, but not everyone is gonna square that with how they really feel. Laying in wait is good, taking in everything around you with your senses, even if you get cold, and stiff, maybe wet. Not everyone thinks it is a much fun as I do, but it does give you a feeling of control, as you track your prey. Again, you need an iron diaper that is lawyer proof, so our solution is kinda risky. More fun, but risky.




CSA again said:


> I thank the camera, alarms, ect. are all good idea's.
> but I have to say I would have already sent this fool to meet his maker.


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## wigglesworth (Nov 11, 2009)

Several things come to mind...

The camera recorder is a good idea but I thought that even if you have a remote/wireless camera if the guy is smart and thinks he is busted he could torch the house and stand a good chance of killing the recorder... so take steps to protect it from damage in such.

I like the idea of setting items that may get fingerprints. I would also rake some fine/dirt/sand in areas to pick up footprints- especially if the neighbor can not easily see you doing so or ya could do it without being obvious.

The pepperspray traps are good but will likely ---- the guy off

The no trespassing signs are a given as is a talk with the local authorities as long as you don't think he is in with them... yas never know in small town rural areas. 

As far as "securing the gun... I would make a case that the house is locked so to gain access was/is B&E but then again that is the right thought not the liberal lawyer/prosecutor one.


I have never ad this situation but I did have known thieves move close and I have always "talked" top them but I am somewhat large and have a crazy rep to begin with. I have a low tolerance for trespassers and thieves.... I hate "looky lou's" almost as bad...


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## bowdonkey (Oct 6, 2007)

The problem is, your neighbor is bored. He needs something to do or perhaps something to think about.


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

yeah I can think of when a few mortar rounds made things a lot less boring.

Again, I'd hope for enuf snow, over a long enuf time to track him...........



bowdonkey said:


> The problem is, your neighbor is bored. He needs something to do or perhaps something to think about.


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## momtomany (Sep 26, 2009)

Any news lately? Did he/she come back?


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## conscious (Jan 4, 2005)

momtomany said:


> Any news lately? Did he/she come back?


Nothing yet. I've got the camera set up on the porch and I've got the deadbolt locking correctly. I really don't expect them to break in. I think they came in because it was so easy. I could leave the deadbolt the way it was (not locking properly) and try and catch them but I'm not sure that's the best thing at this point. 

I would really like to know who it is but at the same time the next time they come in could be the time they do something really stupid and I really don't want to give them an opportunity.

Thanks for asking.


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## GrannyG (Mar 26, 2005)

Inquiring minds want to know ~ this thread reads like a great book....curiosity killed the cat, but satisfaction brought it back to life. I really want to know....LOL


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