# Farming from the Homestead



## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

This topic may have been opened elsewhere on the site already, but I didn't quickly find it so here 'goes...

I expect to retire from the military in a year or so, unless I can stick around longer, after being screwed up by the flu shot in late 2017. I should eventually fully recover, but the going is slow. I have resolved to never, EVER again work behind a desk or in a cubicle. The sedentary nature of my work the past several years has led to constant back pain, tight muscles, and generally poorer health than a human should ever experience.

I want to move onto some land and become a farmer, where I can spend my days outside and work perhaps somewhat more regular hours than my rotating shift jobs the past 7 years have permitted. I don't mind the long days or exposure to weather, and totally understand some days will run into the night and some sheep will have babies at 2 in the morning.

I want to raise vegetables, poultry, and meat as well as have sheep or goats for milk/wool. I might allow someone to rent my pasture space for cows (intensive rotational grazing). Planning on 40 to 80 acres, probably most of which will be rented for cattle. Why so much land for homesteading? I like the thought of seeing rolling hills and pastures, but don't want to have a neighbor's property right on top of me. I also want to be near other farmers whose advice I can seek, and with whom I can help if they have to travel in an emergency, etc. Of course, hope is they'd reciprocate.

As I consider becoming a farmer, I was wondering what others here can say about HOW to start the business. I have read that "you need an LLC", but have also seen that there is no guarantee of security from lawsuits if one forms an LLC. Also, believe the wise advice is to start small (perhaps with chicken eggs) and move up from there. I believe it will take years to grow/expand my business into something reputable, but was wondering how others here have proceeded and what they've experienced.

Thanks in advance for constructive replies.


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## JohnP (Sep 1, 2010)

_I want to raise vegetables, poultry, and meat as well as have sheep or goats for milk/wool.
_
That's quite a bit to learn and it's a lot of work. Start slow and work your way up to producing enough for yourself and then work your way up to market gardening and worry about being an official business later. I don't think you need any kind of licensing to sell at a farmer's market, except for maybe eggs and prepared foods. Milk, you won't be able to sell raw in most states which means pasteurizing and I don't think it's cost effective for small scale. I read somewhere that it costs a dairy farmer $8/gallon to produce milk and that the fedgov subsidizes the rest.

By the sounds of it, you'll need to start slow anyway since you're still recovering from a flu shot from over a year ago and have worked a desk job. Jumping into long days of physical work could hurt you but of course I don't know what physical activities you do outside of the desk job. _
_
Go for it. Just take it slow. You may find out it's not for you so it's better to not invest too much financial or physical capitol.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Congrats. Love the enthusiasm!
Everything I'll post is meant as you mentioned, to be constructive.
You will not be up and running and hitting your goals during the first year. What you have laid out regarding your background and your plans is akin to a farmer moving to the city and buying a new car dealership. 
It is ambitious and there is a steep learning curve. The best information is from folks who live it; the best lessons are learned thru failure.
Year 1 will likely only be a partial season for crops, livestock, etc. Equipment, infrastructure and settling in with your home should be a priority.
Most homestead/farms of the size you describe produce enough for themselves and friends and family. It is difficult to make more than supplemental income. Farmer's markets and selling on site are not typically cash windfalls. 
Remember, in rural areas you will be surrounded by farmers that have been in the game for generations.
A good rule is that necessity breeds success. If you are dedicated for the long term, you will find your niche with what works in your area. During the long term, you will continue to fail, screw up, over estimate, under estimate, and pay for your education.
You may start your plan with wealth but the only riches you'll get from your ground with me emotional.
If you love it you will succeed.
I wouldn't be concerned about running your farm under a biz until you have a cash register that rings on a regular basis.


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## hiddensprings (Aug 6, 2009)

I agree with starting small and growing. It gives you time to learn a few things and then keep learning. I would say know your market as well. What is missing that you might provide? For example, if there are multiple folks in the area selling eggs, you might not be able to sell your for what is needed to be profitable. There are folks that make a decent profit from growing things other don't or won't. When we were in Tennessee, I had the market on pasture raised chickens & turkeys. No one else raised them in my market and folks were willing to pay $4.25-$4.50 a pound for a whole chicken and $6.00 a pound for a fresh turkey for Thanksgiving. I also did a milk share program with my goats milk (the legal way to sell raw goats milk in the state) and made cheese, yogurt, etc. with the milk. No one else did it in my market so again, I ruled my market. I didn't grow veggies for the market because there were too many farmers that already did. My garden was for me. Good luck to you!


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## CKelly78z (Jul 16, 2017)

I think you should start with finding, and purchasing the property, and getting your home in order. One of the first things I would construct is a high tunnel greenhouse for extending the growing season of vegetables for your own family (start small). I would also build a predator proof chicken coop, and enclosure, and possibly utilize a chicken tractor for grazing. Once you are established, and settled, you can work on expanding.

Raising goats can be frustrating, they are escape artists, and can be cranky as well, but provide good milk, and meat. Our goats always kidded on the absolute coldest day of February, and usually in a bad spot also.


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## weaselfire (Feb 7, 2018)

40-80 acres isn't really that large, especially with cattle. It's all doable, just don't bite off more than you can chew.

Jeff


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## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

Thanks, all. I am working to learn what I can, now, and also to save, Save, SAVE as I know there will be other costs to contend with over and above land purchase. I appreciate all the advice here. It sounds like a long, slow road to get to where I want to go, and I'm much later in life getting started than I'd hoped. No time like the present to begin. 

Maybe start with microgreens and investigating dairy and other laws in my state. Given responses here, I'm probably years away from going into business but I would be interested in knowing about what advantages/benefits are available via the Small Business Administration and also for veterans starting/owning a business.


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## Meinecke (Jun 30, 2017)

The acres can be great but also labor intense...without cattle or other livestock that keeps it short, you will end up mowing the hack out of it or end up with a Forrest real quick...
I would def start small and see if you even have a green thumb...
The saying states the dumbest famers do have the biggest potatoes, but...who knows if you like that kind of life after chewing on it for a while...milk can be a hard job to do...
Get your House/land...start a garden and go from their...add one group of animal after the other and have the learn curve going...
learn hard, work smart...as we all...u r not getting younger by the minute...
Enjoy your life change!!!


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## CKelly78z (Jul 16, 2017)

Chickens are the easiest, cheapest, and most productive to start with. 6-7 hens will produce a dozen eggs a day, and separately, meat chickens will reach butchering age in 4-6 months, and will eat anything, and everything.


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## Meinecke (Jun 30, 2017)

Wow, your hens are on steroids...12 eggs a day out of 7 hens...But you are totally right...
Chickens first, maybe followed by bees for your first few fruit/nut trees 
Not sure WHERE you plan, but if you are in mild climate...you can also do aquaponics...did this for two years in jersey and had great success but the tilapia fish need to much heating here so i had to postpone that plan for retirement in the south...smile
http://www.backyardaquaponics.com/Travis/IBCofAquaponics1.pdf
This way, you would have, without to much work, chicken meat, eggs, walnuts, filberts, veggies and tilapia fish which are all very valuable products on a pretty limited budget needed to start...


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

CKelly78z said:


> Chickens are the easiest, cheapest, and most productive to start with. 6-7 hens will produce a dozen eggs a day, and separately, meat chickens will reach butchering age in 4-6 months, and will eat anything, and everything.



Steroids indeed ! No......at their peak, 6-7 hens might lay 6 eggs/day, but likely less....and definitely less as they age.

If you raise Cornish Cross for meat chicken, they finish in 8 weeks (2 months) from day old chick to 6-7lb bird.


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## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

Your answer leads me to another question... for older hens who aren't producing...is it OK to harvest an old hen and will her meat be tender?



TnAndy said:


> Steroids indeed ! No......at their peak, 6-7 hens might lay 6 eggs/day, but likely less....and definitely less as they age.
> 
> If you raise Cornish Cross for meat chicken, they finish in 8 weeks (2 months) from day old chick to 6-7lb bird.[/


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## weaselfire (Feb 7, 2018)

mml373 said:


> Your answer leads me to another question... for older hens who aren't producing...is it OK to harvest an old hen and will her meat be tender?


Coque Au Vin.

Jeff


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

weaselfire said:


> 40-80 acres isn't really that large, especially with cattle. It's all doable, just don't bite off more than you can chew.
> 
> Jeff


Don't forget property taxs


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## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

Forcast said:


> Don't forget property taxs


Thankfully, not a problem on ag land where I'll be. $420 a year for 35 acres that includes a house.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Old hens are stewing hens. A long, slow simmer will make them tender. I heard that the Campbell soup company buys old layers from the egg farmers and turns them into soup


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

And they cut them into such tiny bits you would never know.


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## Meinecke (Jun 30, 2017)

My pressure cooker does them well...
No matter how old...after an hour in the sauna, they are tender like a young chick


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

We turn ours into dog food. Pluck, gut, cook whole, cut into small enough pcs to fit down the tube of the meat grinder, grind them bones and all, can into dog food if taking out a whole flock, freeze otherwise.


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## JeepHammer (May 12, 2015)

I was a farm kid, then military for 16 years, disabled, and realized civilians didn't make sense to me, so back to farm folks....
If I hadn't been a farm kid, I'd still be trying to figure out how to get this place to grow anything but weeds... (And sometimes I still struggle  )

Let the basics begin...
Pastures are also hay fields, winter food.
Maintain the pasture for weeds you don't want in critter food, let the pasture grow up in the spring (with the exception of the one livestock are in) and cut the rest for hay before rotation.
If you have four pastures, 3 will produce 3 hay cutting a year.

Shaggy, slow/low growth is an unhealthy pasture, grasses that shoot up tall & proud are healthy pastures.
The county extension agent or fertilizer places will usually do these soil samples for cheap or free, and it's usually a pH issue, easily solved.
Once every couple years is plenty, but the 'DIY' pH tests won't tell you what else the pasture is missing or has an excess of, so a professional analysis every 5 years even if you monitor pH yourself.

Since I bought strip mine land, I learned this first hand...
Have the soil professionally tested BEFORE you buy, you have no idea what was dumped there before I got it and the 'Dirt' was way alkaline, while it was mowed 'Grass' and looked green, it took a LOT of rehab before half of it would grow anything but alkaline loving weeds.
It also had a sizeable amount of petroleum contamination.

A 'Garden' isn't row 'Crops' and they will do much better if you DON'T plug them into 'Dirt'.
It will take about 4 years to compost properly (weeds and leaves are slow to compost since they are so fibrous) so start a 4 bin (4 stage) compost pile immediately.

Egg shells & limestone dust/small chips control acid, earthworms are pure gold, so are rabbit droppings, dig it a little below grade level (ramped) so water stands when it rains hard.
Cover it so it's dark and wet, water when it's dry.
I can't even begin to tell you how much this makes 'Loam' when mixed with native dirt!
It's pure gold and 100% safe, you can't add too much.

The first bin is 'Green', anything and everything except meat, animal carcasses or waste from any meat eating animal. (No dog poo)
Throw in some wet (fresh) rabbit droppings and some well rotted wood, wet it down, cover it up with something heat can transfer through, only raise the lid to add more or water.
Damp, dark & most is what you are looking for.
The open end & top of mine face south for a reason.

When the 'Greens' turn gray or black and start growing 'Hairs' (fungus), turn the pile over into the next bin leaving a little behind to go in the middle of your next pile of 'Greens', water and close it up.

When it turns into a fibrous black 'Mush', add worms.
It won't take a lot, my left over fishing worms go in mine.
Turn the pile over again, leave a little in #2, and throw some in pile #1.
When the biggest bits you can identify are about the HALF the size of your little fingernail, turn over into bin #4 and SLOWLY reduce the amount of water so it's not 'Runny'.
'Real Damp', 'Squshy' is fine, but 'Runny' is hard to incorporate into the garden, liquids being harder to handle that semi-solids.
Don't forget to move a shovel full into bins 1, 2 & 3 now that your break down mixture is fully formed and alive, this will make the process MUCH faster for the next rounds.
It CAN take up to 4 years to get a full on warm compost pile going.
Once it is, it will break down sawdust, every weed you can chop to fit, etc.
When it's in full swing, tree leaves are PURE GOLD, so are grass clippings, even corn cobs turn into fertilizer.

In the spring, you can put your starter 'Hot Frames' or 'Hot Beds' on top the compost pile walls, and the heat rising will get you a big jump on plant starts well before the ground warms up.
'Hot Frames' are just that, a frame, glass on top (old storm windows in my case, zero cost) and sheet metal bottom to let the heat pass into the box.
It's a 'Poor Mans' greenhouse that doesn't freeze at night.

If you intend to 'Make Money' the sooner you start, the sooner to market, the FIRST of the season always pays more.
The 'Prettier' your produce is, the more it sells for, and nets keep the bugs, birds, weather, wildlife out of your produce, you get more 'Pretty' produce.
No one wants produce with bird or bug bites, or beaten down into the dirt by spring rains, you won't be growing 'Stewing' tomatoes or 'Jam' strawberries...

Course sand to help keep soil from clumping, so you don't have to break up ground all the time, and sand helps hold moisture.
Sand, native 'Dirt', compost combine to make 'Soil' for a proper garden bed.

For the most profitable, and most vulnerable produce, consider raised garden beds.
Boards, concrete blocks, stones, what ever is cheapest to contain your soil,
Rock, blocks, bricks in the bottom for drainage, and you best soil on top.
If this tells you anything, I grow strawberries and a couple of other things in rain gutters...

The raised beds keeps 90% of the ground crawling creepy-crawlies off the plants/produce, since they need to be tended, raised means you don't break your back, with posts in the corners, maybe a couple down the sides depending on length, you have mounts for gutters/boxes AND a place for nets to protect your produce from flying critters.
Birds are MURDER on produce like strawberries, some tomatoes, etc.

Depending on the net material, it can keep the bugs out, keep storms & wild life from destroying the crops, stop sunburns when it get REAL hot and dry, etc.
The containment allows for effective drip watering instead of general hose downs...
Depending on where you choose to settle down, watering can become quite an expense (and pain in the butt).

In the winter I roll out heavy plastic over the raised beds to keep rain/snow from carrying of my fertilizers.
If you are in an area that freezes, raised beds freeze better to kill off weeds & pests, they also warm up faster in the spring so you can plant earlier.

Raised beds also allow higher or lower pH for specific plants, creating optimum growing conditions.

Many of my 'Nets' are mil-surplus parachutes, cost nearly nothing, and are TOUGH, small enough weave bugs don't get through.
They also keep BENEFICIAL bugs IN. 
Aphids are a pain in particular, but order some lady bugs and turn them loose in the netting, they will scour every plant for every aphid, exactly zero chemicals involved.
Praying mantis will consume nearly every other bug that gets in, or hatches out of the soil.
Once they breed, I keep the pods in the fridge, when the netting goes down I throw one in each, an end to bug problems BEFORE they happen, no cost, 100% effective.

General garden beds are just that, and there is something you can do.
Raise the sides/ends towards the middle SLIGHTLY in dry areas, make the most of rainfall.
In wet areas, some slope so excess rain runs off.
I usually put the acidic side of a garden bed on the high side, acids tend to migrate faster than alkaline,
Spread additives so the high side is slightly acidic (lots of soils are naturally acidic), more pH neutral in the middle, slightly alkaline on the low side.
If you wind up where soil is naturally alkaline, go the other way.
(This is where the little pH tester really shines!)

This is one of those 'Well DUH' moments...
Weeds that don't sprout don't grow, and you don't have to battle them.
You WANT rotted weeds/grass, you don't want LIVE grass.
Simply cover your garden bed with black plastic, metal roofing sheets, whatever light can't penetrate.
Weeds are ALWAYS the first thing up in the spring, choke off the light and they die, THEN till up the ground.
Keep the ground cover for next year.
(Ever wonder why farmers always have sheds & barns, piles of 'Stuff' sitting around?)

Unless you plow live cover (roots/grass/weeds) REALLY deep, you will battle them for at least two years. Just kill it all WITHOUT CHEMICALS and the problem is reduced by 90%+ out of the gate.

I do a LOT of ground cover,
Where weeds can't get light, and the rain/feet don't pack soil, you don't have to cultivate & remove weeds.
The issue with ground cover is watering, I'm big on drip watering UNDER the ground cover.
While I have some plastic, I mostly use non-glossy print paper & cardboard.
By the end of the season, and a rotting cycle all winter, it tills right into the soil.
Plain brown cardboard is particularly effective and DIRT CHEAP! (Pun intended)


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## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

JeepHammer said:


> I was a farm kid, then military for 16 years, disabled, and realized civilians didn't make sense to me, so back to farm folks....
> If I hadn't been a farm kid, I'd still be trying to figure out how to get this place to grow anything but weeds... (And sometimes I still struggle  )
> 
> Let the basics begin...
> ...


Wow! Thank you for your note! Like you, I have military experience. I briefly worked in the civil sector before returning to the military and quickly found it just wasn't going to work for me...so to farming I come. Greatly appreciate your advice here.


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## JeepHammer (May 12, 2015)

While the early & pretty make the most bucks, the 'Ugly' still pays for itself. 
The food banks will give you tax credits for what doesn't turn out 'Pretty'.

Don't overlook decoratives, my wife's day lilies and stuff makes serious cash,
So do her 'Arrangmens', basically dried weeds, some ribbon or dollar store vase sold to 'Designer' shops.
The lavender she grows sells for more than pot did per ounce when I was young (I have no idea what pot sells for now), and lavender won't send you to jail.

Extra hay your critters don't use is money in the bank... 
Keep in mind 'Square' bales are HARD work, but they are cash money.

The best advise I can give anyone wanting to "Move To The Country",
Find the local morning coffee hangout, where the early birds gather (particularly in winter) and just sit a few mornings until the locals start talking to you...
They are naturally nosey, but they also know where you can get anything & everything, know where to find spot labor, will show up and till/disk garden space, and are full of endless tid-bits of information.
They are looking for something/somebody new to break the routine, so they will help you out from one degree to another.


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