# Is it practical for a homesteader to grow Cocoa, Coffee and Vanilla?



## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

I want to get a greenhouse to grow my own Cocoa, Coffee and Vanilla because I'm a chocoholic plus my dad is a coffee nut. As for Vanilla, We love baking with it.

But is it as practical to grow as is it fun to bake with the 3 ingredients?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Nope.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Nope.


Why not?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I highly recommend that you go to YouTube and enter “how cocoa powder is made”

Then enter “how vanilla extract is made”

Then enter “grow coffee indoors”

Then on Google, enter “how much coffee does each coffee tree produce”

How old are you? I am getting child vibes, which is fine, but some of the answers to your questions are very easily accessed on Google and YouTube.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I highly recommend that you go to YouTube and enter “how cocoa powder is made”
> 
> Then enter “how vanilla extract is made”
> 
> ...


I'm a 30-year old autistic woman. I post these questions on this forum because I have combed all over google and youtube to find answers to my questions and found zilch.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Ah. Welcome to the group!

I am very willing to help you in finding the answers. I think the suggestions above will guide you in the right directions. 

Please let me know how I can further assist you.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Ah. Welcome to the group!
> 
> I am very willing to help you in finding the answers. I think the suggestions above will guide you in the right directions.
> 
> Please let me know how I can further assist you.


Thank You Very Much


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

I live in Maine, I am constantly trying to push the envelope, but a heated greenhouse is well beyond what I can support on solar power.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

ET1 SS said:


> I live in Maine, I am constantly trying to push the envelope, but a heated greenhouse is well beyond what I can support on solar power.


Homesteaders never give up. There has to be a way to practically grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in every part of the US.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

It is more practical to produce crops or products that are appropriate for you location, sell them and buy the products that don't grow easily in your area.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

painterswife said:


> It is more practical to produce crops or products that are appropriate for you location, sell them and buy the products that don't grow easily in your area.


I want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in a greenhouse because climate change will make those 3 crops extinct.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Jerryberry said:


> I'm a 30-year old autistic woman. I post these questions on this forum because I have combed all over google and youtube to find answers to my questions and found zilch.





Coffee Archives | The Survival Gardener


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Jerryberry said:


> I want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in a greenhouse because climate change will make those 3 crops extinct.


If climate change is going to make them extinct, you will have bigger problems then getting your coffee and cocoa fix.

A homesteader would adjust their lifestyle. Or instead they would store seeds or the actual products themselves.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

painterswife said:


> If climate change is going to make them extinct, you will have bigger problems then getting your coffee and cocoa fix.
> 
> A homesteader would adjust their lifestyle. Or instead they would store seeds or the actual products themselves.


How do I get, grow, harvest and store cocoa, coffee and vanilla seeds on a seasonal basis?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

The coffee tree doesn’t yield enough beans in a year to make it practical.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Jerryberry said:


> How do I get, grow, harvest and store cocoa, coffee and vanilla seeds on a seasonal basis?


The point is you can't do this unless you live in the right climate or can afford a huge greenhouse. A practical homesteader understands the limitations of their climate and budget.

Homesteaders who want to live off of only their own land give up certain luxuries.


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

Jerryberry said:


> I want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in a greenhouse because climate change will make those 3 crops extinct.


Climate change will cause serious issues with crop production but I personally wouldn’t worry about these specific crops at this time, instead you could search out long term storage of these items. Vanilla lasts forever in alcohol so that one is easy. 
Cocoa is terribly difficult to grow in temperate climates (I’ve tried and failed each time)- the required year round temp being quite high that the chance of success is low to nil and even a power outage is enough to scratch that off the list unless you are in maybe southern Florida- and even then unsure.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

fireweed farm said:


> Climate change will cause serious issues with crop production but I personally wouldn’t worry about these specific crops at this time, instead you could search out long term storage of these items. Vanilla lasts forever in alcohol so that one is easy.
> Cocoa is terribly difficult to grow in temperate climates (I’ve tried and failed each time)- the required year round temp being quite high that the chance of success is low to nil and even a power outage is enough to scratch that off the list unless you are in maybe southern Florida- and even then unsure.


There has to be a solution to the cocoa, coffee and vanilla problem.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Jerry, the world’s climate has changed many times. Please don’t worry about all your favorite plants becoming extinct.

One thing that you must consider is how much work would be involved in each project? If each coffee tree only makes one pound of finished coffee beans, but requires a LOT of time and effort. I don’t know how much coffee you drink, but you would have to have 50 trees to have enough to drink and some to use to barter.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

painterswife said:


> The point is you can't do this unless you live in the right climate or can afford a huge greenhouse. A practical homesteader understands the limitations of their climate and budget.
> 
> Homesteaders who want to live off of only their own land give up certain luxuries.


How would I give up cocoa, coffee and vanilla? I tried carob chips and it tasted vile. There has to be a palatable alternative to cocoa powder, instant coffee and vanilla extract.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Jerry, the world’s climate has changed many times. Please don’t worry about all your favorite plants becoming extinct.
> 
> One thing that you must consider is how much work would be involved in each project? If each coffee tree only makes one pound of finished coffee beans, but requires a LOT of time and effort. I don’t know how much coffee you drink, but you would have to have 50 trees to have enough to drink and some to use to barter.


I consume more cocoa than coffee. My dad drinks coffee like it's water. I only drink coffee on special occasions.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

There is not a coffee, vanilla, and cocoa problem. You are guessing that there might be a problem in your lifetime. This seems to be causing stress.

I think about the pioneers. They drank other things if store bought coffee ran out. Chicory root can be ground and used as a substitute. 

Here in Texas, the youpon tree’s leaves have caffeine in them.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> There is not a coffee, vanilla, and cocoa problem. You are guessing that there might be a problem in your lifetime. This seems to be causing stress.
> 
> I think about the pioneers. They drank other things if store bought coffee ran out. Chicory root can be ground and used as a substitute.
> 
> Here in Texas, the youpon tree’s leaves have caffeine in them.


How about cocoa and vanilla?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Cocoa was a luxury in most of the history of human beings.

Here is an interesting website that explains the history of human use of cocoa.









The history of cocoa: origin and diffusion of a legend | Cioccolatitaliani


Where does the cocoa plant come from? What are the origins of chocolate? Why was it called food of the gods? Everything you need to know about cocoa! Find out more on the blog!




www.cioccolatitaliani.it


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I don’t think vanilla is an essential product. You can leave it out of any recipe.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

The vanilla plant is a vine. It grows in shade on other trees. A vine can grow to 200 ft.



https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/pdf/HS/HS134800.pdf


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## BadOregon (12 mo ago)

I have looked into this myself. There are truly no satisfactory ways to grow these in enough volume to supply even one person, much less more. A local nursery here had coffee trees in their greenhouses, but they don't produce well inside.
You are limited by the size of your greenhouse and depending on your location would require a lot of energy (no matter what kind you use) to heat. 

As for cocoa, have you looked into how cocoa powder is produced? It is a massive undertaking and requires a lot of space and time. (It's also kind of icky, even though I do love my chocolate)

Vanilla plants, maybe. Again, a large greenhouse and lots of time. But could probably be done if you were determined.
Using the vanilla beans in some sort of alcohol give you an extract of sorts and preserves the beans as well.

As for the coffee, there are a couple of methods for making instant. I would suggest trying several kinds and seeing if there is one you can tolerate. Freeze dried tastes best and would last indefinitely stored properly.

There are a lot of things we would have to learn to do without if the SHTF. It sucks, but there it is. I myself would much more upset about the lack of availability of toilet paper than I would any of the above.


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## BadOregon (12 mo ago)

Also, even if you could grow enough coffee beans, you still have to figure out how to roast them. Which also requires a lot of energy.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Here is an excellent article. If you scroll down, it discusses the difficulty of growing it in a green house.









Make Your Own Chocolate: How To Grow Cocoa In A Greenhouse - Off The Grid News


There must be 1,001 reasons why cocoa is called “the food of the gods.” From the time this super-food was first consumed – archaeological studies date it back to 17-19th century B.C. — up to the present, cocoa has been prized all over the world as a rich, delectable beverage, a medicine, an...




www.offthegridnews.com


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

Jerryberry said:


> There has to be a solution to the cocoa, coffee and vanilla problem.


No, afraid there doesn’t have to be a solution. 
Well, long term storage of these items would be a solution for you. 
Also these species will not go extinct from climate change, rather they may end up being farmed in different places. Perhaps the source that suggested this was being overly dramatic or alarmist.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Cocoa was a luxury in most of the history of human beings.
> 
> Here is an interesting website that explains the history of human use of cocoa.
> 
> ...


Do you think there's a palatable alternative to cocoa powder? I tried carob and it tasted vile.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Managing expectations is more important than luxuries. Coffee and cocoa are luxuries that most people did not have in a quantity even 100 years ago.

Water is the best alternative.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

painterswife said:


> Managing expectations is more important than luxuries. Coffee and cocoa are luxuries that most people did not have in a quantity even 100 years ago.
> 
> Water is the best alternative.


I know that but Is there any palatable alternative for cocoa powder and instant coffee for Baking recipes? I tried carob and it tasted horrid.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Jerryberry said:


> I know that but Is there any palatable alternative for cocoa powder and instant coffee for Baking recipes? I tried carob and it tasted horrid.


Can I ask? What type of homesteading activities do you do now? Do you grow any of your own food? Do you raise and eat any of your own animals? Do you grow food for animals?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I have no knowledge of substitutes.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

painterswife said:


> Can I ask? What type of homesteading activities do you do now? Do you grow any of your own food? Do you raise and eat any of your own animals? Do you grow food for animals?


I'm planning to grow beginner crops real soon. My day program is training me to plan, manage and maintain my homesteading business. I'm a natural foward-thinker who want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla because that's the kind of person I am. That's my finish that I Will cross one day.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Jerryberry said:


> I'm planning to grow beginner crops real soon. My day program is training me to plan, manage and maintain my homesteading business. I'm a natural foward-thinker who want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla because that's the kind of person I am. That's my finish that I Will cross one day.


I think that is a great ambition.

I will tell you this. I believe that most first-time homesteaders dream big, too big. We forget to manage expectations and to take them one step at a time. That means learning how to grow before we expect to sell. Understanding our limitations based on the land we are on, the climate and growing seasons of that land, and our financial limitations and expectations.

I started with chickens and tomatoes. Could I raise and grow them without killing them for more than a year.  How much food could I provide for them without purchasing commercial feed. Should I raise meat birds or egg chickens?

Start small, really small.


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## oldasrocks (Oct 27, 2006)

Jerryberry said:


> I want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in a greenhouse because climate change will make those 3 crops extinct.


First of all there is no Climate Change. The world changes a little at a time normally. I think you are safe for a couple hundred yrs at least.
Second if there was climate change that negates growing these crops why do you think you can do it if no one else can?


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

oldasrocks said:


> First of all there is no Climate Change. The world changes a little at a time normally. I think you are safe for a couple hundred yrs at least.
> Second if there was climate change that negates growing these crops why do you think you can do it if no one else can?


Because someone has to do it. If not me then who can?


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Jerryberry said:


> I know that but Is there any palatable alternative for cocoa powder and instant coffee for Baking recipes? I tried carob and it tasted horrid.


Maybe.








Jackfruit seeds could help ease looming cocoa bean shortage


Chocolate lovers could soon have a harder time satisfying their sweet tooth. Worldwide demand for this mouth-watering treat is outstripping the production of cocoa beans, its primary ingredient. But in a new study, scientists report that compounds found in jackfruit seeds produce many of the...



www.sciencedaily.com


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Growing vanilla.








Vanilla Bean Plants - How to Grow a Vanilla Plant at Home


Vanilla Bean Plants (Vanilla planifolia) - How to Grow a Vanilla Bean Plant at Home - A vining orchid native to Mexico, vanilla bean is a popular spice




www.logees.com


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## Wolf mom (Mar 8, 2005)

Lets not put the cart before the horse - 

The dream greenhouse comes first....


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

i've made vanilla from the vanilla bean and vodka. all that stuff is gone sky high in price now. you dont really need the vanilla. i dont buy it anymore. i use kahlua or rum,maple etc. in place of it because i had plenty on hand when prices started to rise. also had plenty coffee and cocoa. as far as i know most things are still going to be available but cost more. at least that's what my son keeps telling me. ~Georgia


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

if you believe in climate change , then heating a green house big enough to grow coffee or cacao would make your carbon foot print look like that of 100 people.

you maybe use 2 pounds of coffee a week , and if that coffee comes in by train or ship you carbon foot print on a years coffee stays quite low.

the cost of 2 pounds of coffee even if you buy good stuff is 20 dollars a week your at 1040 dollars 

the cost of a large greenhouse and the heat to keep it through the winter would be huge

it would make a lot more sense to order cases of coffee a few cases of cocoa , and a few bottles of vanilla extract or better yet stock up when it goes on sale.

now if your really worried about climate change first understand this , you get Lied to a LOT about climate change.

lots of fear marketing happening.

if you want to help climate change eat as much local food as you can , cut firewood and heat your home with dead wood , if you want to really go all the way use a handsaw to cut the wood and an ax to split it.

use as little electric and fuel as you can.

Reduce , reduce , reduce 


do what you can reasonably to reduce your consumption of energy , ride your bike when you can , stuff like that 

by the time these crops go extinct it first we will all be dead from natural old age , second even if they were to go extinct some how in 30 years and you are 60 long before coffee and cocoa go extinct , you will starve to death or if you have food and no one else does they will kill you and take it from numerous other food crop failures.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

Jerryberry said:


> I want to get a greenhouse to grow my own Cocoa, Coffee and Vanilla because I'm a chocoholic plus my dad is a coffee nut. As for Vanilla, We love baking with it.
> 
> But is it as practical to grow as is it fun to bake with the 3 ingredients?


They are not as practical to grow as they are fun to bake with but growing them can be a totally different kind of fun. Growing plants is much more fun for me than cooking and baking is and I enjoy cooking.

You may be able to grow those 3 kinds of plants in greenhouses if you choose the appropriate *species* of them that are possible for greenhouse growing in your growing zone. Do you know what a growing zone is and do you know what your own USDA growing zone is? Your profile doesn't say what state or community you live in, otherwise I'd look up your growing zone and maybe be able to tell you which species may be most suitable for your particular zone.

*You cannot grow coffee, cocoa and vanilla orchids together in the same greenhouse*, otherwise they will all die. They each need different climates, different soil and different growing conditions from each other so they each need to have a separate greenhouse of their own to suit their species-specific growing requirements. That means you'd need 3 separate greenhouses that are set up differently from each other and that are each climate controlled by you. The 3 greenhouses will also need to be a certain distance apart from each other to prevent cross-transmission of pathogens, bacteria, insects and fungi that are also species-specific.

You will have to do a tremendous amount of research about growing those kinds of plants and what their requirements are and then do lots and lots of careful planning and expensive setting up of equipment before you can start experimenting with growing those plants.

Edited to add: Have you considered the practicality of making your own essences out of cocoa, coffee and vanilla beans that you purchase and then process yourself for your cooking and beverage consumption?

Also, have you considered growing teas? You wouldn't need a greenhouse for that.

.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

I thought you might find this article interesting. It's about growing coffee plants in greenhouses where I live right here in my part of British Columbia. There's other information there too but I thought the information about how coffee plants are grown and the way the beans have to be processed would give you a bit of an idea of what's involved. 









Growing coffee, tea, lemons and papayas in the Fraser Valley - Maple Ridge News


‘Anything that is grown anywhere on the planet we can grow’




www.mapleridgenews.com





On Vancouver Island there is a coffee plantation that grows their coffee trees outdoors and they grow mountain coffees, not low-land or valley coffees. I'd like to try growing a couple of coffee plants outdoors myself just because the plants and the flowers are so very beautiful. I don't care about getting the beans from them, unless they are fertile beans that I can plant and grow into more coffee plants. I'm a tea granny at heart so I mostly grow a variety of plants that are used for making medicinal teas and essences and for cooking with for flavouring.

.


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## Rodeo's Bud (Apr 10, 2020)

I think reality will rear its head eventually.

Heck, I only have 5 acres. I barely have enough time to plant a garden and keep the blackberries at bay moat years. This year we didn't get a chance to prune the orchard.

I do work more than full time, so does my wife, which is how we afford to live here. So there is that issue as well.

I am all for dreaming big. But you need to start small. Imagine doing all this and realizing you don't even like to garden. It happens.


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## boatswain2PA (Feb 13, 2020)

painterswife said:


> It is more practical to produce crops or products that are appropriate for you location, sell them and buy the products that don't grow easily in your area.


You mean....like....capitalism?


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Jerryberry said:


> I want to grow cocoa, coffee and vanilla in a greenhouse because climate change will make those 3 crops extinct.


If "global warming" means the climate changes enough to make tropical regions too hot for those plants, you won't need the greenhouse in your location.

You can buy those plants and try growing them, but they are very expensive and won't produce enough for your needs. 

Several stores carry cheap orchids which require care similar to vanilla bean orchids. If you can't get a cheap orchid to grow and bloom, you won't be able to get the vanilla orchid to grow and bloom. Even if it did bloom, you have to hand pollinate the flowers.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

Jerryberry said:


> There has to be a solution to the cocoa, coffee and vanilla problem.



For the coffee --- Dandelion Root.
I've been reading a lot about dandelion and all the books mention coffee substitute made from the root.
A lot of info online about this, so I won't provide a link, you can easily find info with a search if you are interested.



painterswife said:


> *Managing expectations *is more important than luxuries.


This is huge in all areas of life, I find. My memére used to say "if you don't expect, you won't be disappointed."
Also very true for establishing a homestead. And everything takes twice as long as you think it will. 



newfieannie said:


> i've made vanilla from the vanilla bean and vodka. all that stuff is gone sky high in price now. you dont really need the vanilla. i dont buy it anymore. i use kahlua or rum,maple etc. in place of it because i had plenty on hand when prices started to rise. also had plenty coffee and cocoa. as far as i know most things are still going to be available but cost more. at least that's what my son keeps telling me. ~Georgia


I agree that it is so expensive!! I am glad to hear you don't use it anymore - I'll follow your lead. Do you mean maple syrup when you say maple or does it have to have an alcohol in it to work properly? I'm curious about making it. I'm sure the bean is sky high now too, not sure where to get it actually.


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

sorry i probably didn't explain that properly. i use the vanilla bean and vodka for vanilla. the other stuff is just a substitute for vanilla for baking cakes,cookies etc.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

newfieannie said:


> sorry i probably didn't explain that properly. i use the vanilla bean and vodka for vanilla. the other stuff is just a substitute for vanilla for baking cakes,cookies etc.


Ok.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

I can live without cocoa/chocolate, but I need coffee's most immediate anti-asthma and energy boosting health benefits for myself each morning and as long as vanilla orchids exist and vanilla extract can be produced I will continue to use it for its health benefits too. Vanilla has anti-neuroinflammatory effects as well as other health benefits that aid digestion and that is very important for seniors. Also vanilla isn't only used for flavouring foods, it's also used for changing flavours into other flavours that are more palatable. For example, if a bit of vanilla is added to certain types of seafoods that have no flavour or don't taste particularly palatable or good to start with, the vanillin in vanilla extract changes the flavour of the meat into something different and more pleasant. It also draws out and increases the flavours of certain foods.

To me those plants are important and I can totally understand Jerryberry's desire to grow them, I would want to do the same thing myself if they became unavailable on a commercial basis. Until that time comes I will buy them and will continue to support the people who go to so much effort to grow them for me.

.


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## IceFire (10 mo ago)

You will need more than one of each plant variety, if you're going to produce the product in any amount.

Depending on your location, you would need heated greenhouses (and for the cacao, one with enough height to accommodate the size of the mature trees. The cacao "beans" need to be fermented. 

For the vanilla orchids, be prepared to pollinate the flowers by hand.

It takes a lot of coffee berries to make more than a cup. You'll need several plants.

All of the above products are VERY labor intensive. Also, if you can find the plants, they tend to be expensive. I do know of ONE greenhouse company that does sell the aforementioned plants. They are in Connecticut.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

@IceFire, would that happen to be Logee's? My mom gets their catalog. We call it hardcore houseplant porn. 

If I had a conservatory and money to spare, I would buy several plants from them.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

Danaus29 said:


> @IceFire, would that happen to be Logee's? My mom gets their catalog. We call it hardcore houseplant porn.
> 
> If I had a conservatory and money to spare, I would buy several plants from them.


Thanks for posting their name. 

I just looked at their website. Fruiting, Rare & Tropical Plants for sale online at Logee’s! It has me drooling.  

Now I need to find out if they ship to Canada. 

.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Like I said, hardcore houseplant porn. I have a catalog tucked under my mattress.


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

Geez big money. Guess you can find and order anything nowadays if you have the big money


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

This site might have all the answers and step by step directions for your farm.








How to Grow Chocolate Indoors


If you're interested in having your own cacao tree (or "theobroma cacao"), try raising one inside your home. You'll have the best luck creating a humid, greenhouse-like environment for the plant, which will closely simulate the kind of...




www.wikihow.com


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## Eutychus2 (Jul 22, 2021)

The people who want to talk about everything except their experience growing the three beans should be banned.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Eutychus2 said:


> The people who want to talk about everything except their experience growing the three beans should be banned.


I don't want to be banned as a spammer


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Eutychus2 said:


> The people who want to talk about everything except their experience growing the three beans should be banned.


Then walk away or just put us all on ignore. Thread drift is a fact of life. None of us live in tropical areas where the three beans grow well, or at all.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Danaus29 said:


> Then walk away or just put us all on ignore. Thread drift is a fact of life. None of us live in tropical areas where the three beans grow well, or at all.


I'm sorry


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

What????!?????


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> What????!?????


I said I'm sorry


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I wasn’t asking you what.  I hadn’t been online, and I had missed that dude’s rude remark.

It’s all good.

Jerry, what are you working on in the garden?


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I wasn’t asking you what.  I hadn’t been online, and I had missed that dude’s rude remark.
> 
> It’s all good.
> 
> Jerry, what are you working on in the garden?


Sadly nothing because my official training starts Monday May 2nd.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I wasn’t asking you what.  I hadn’t been online, and I had missed that dude’s rude remark.
> 
> It’s all good.
> 
> Jerry, what are you working on in the garden?


I posted this yesterday. Homemade Buldak Ramen


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Jerryberry said:


> I'm sorry


OH HOLY COW! You have my deepest apology! That comment was NOT directed at you! I am terribly sorry if you thought I meant you. It was directed at the person I quoted who made a rude comment. I think you are a very intersting person and I like your conversations. Forgive me, please, for making you think I meant you. @Jerryberry


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Danaus29 said:


> OH HOLY COW! You have my deepest apology! That comment was NOT directed at you! I am terribly sorry if you thought I meant you. It was directed at the person I quoted who made a rude comment. I think you are a very intersting person and I like your conversations. Forgive me, please, for making you think I meant you. @Jerryberry


I wholeheartedly accept your apology


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

@Jerryberry, I saw something today that made me think of this thread. Meijer had little coffee tree seedlings in pots for I think $10 a pot. One pot had a seedling that still had the seed coat on it. I don't know if you have Meijer stores in your area but if you do you might be able to find the plants there.

I've never gotten tangerines off my seed grown tangerine tree but I still keep it going. Sometimes it's fun to have the plants even if they never produce to our expectations.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Danaus29 said:


> @Jerryberry, I saw something today that made me think of this thread. Meijer had little coffee tree seedlings in pots for I think $10 a pot. One pot had a seedling that still had the seed coat on it. I don't know if you have Meijer stores in your area but if you do you might be able to find the plants there.
> 
> I've never gotten tangerines off my seed grown tangerine tree but I still keep it going. Sometimes it's fun to have the plants even if they never produce to our expectations.


True


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## IceFire (10 mo ago)

Danaus29 said:


> @IceFire, would that happen to be Logee's? My mom gets their catalog. We call it hardcore houseplant porn.
> 
> If I had a conservatory and money to spare, I would buy several plants from them.


Yes, it is Logee's. I've purchased a few plants from them.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

IceFire said:


> Yes, it is Logee's. I've purchased a few plants from them.


I live in Orange County, CA 

There has to be a someplace who sells coffee and cocoa plants so I can make coffee drinks and Nesquik/Bear brand choco


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

There is a reason that coffee is imported to the US from Central America and other countries that are along the Equator. It grows there naturally.

Here is an interesting article with information:








Which country produced the most coffee in 2020?


At the end of 2020, the top 10 biggest coffee-producing nations made up 87% of the commodity’s market share. This is what you need to know.




www.weforum.org


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> There is a reason that coffee is imported to the US from Central America and other countries that are along the Equator. It grows there naturally.
> 
> Here is an interesting article with information:
> 
> ...


I hope climate change won't make cocoa and coffee extinct.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

It won’t.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> It won’t.


How do you know that?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I am not going to have a climate change conversation.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I am not going to have a climate change conversation.


Ok


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

Jerryberry said:


> Ok


As stated previously, these plants are not going extinct. Traditional farming regions for certain crops may change to crops better adapted for the coming climate. That is different From extinction when it comes to domesticated crops. 
Cocoa is from the Amazon rainforest, vanilla is from Madagascar that will be deforested prior to climate change has a chance to take hold, and coffee is from Africa- all crops now grown on 3-4 continents worldwide by perhaps hundreds of thousands of farmers, probably millions of farmers.
Stating that they will go extinct in the wild may be fact, but suggesting they will go extinct in cultivation is false. Farmers will find a way to keep them alive by adapting their farming techniques, their lives depend on it. Have faith. 
Now apparently the clone of bananas that we all buy at the grocery store may go extinct in cultivation. Not due to climate change. But there are other types of bananas that are immune to that disease. Meaning we will have to adapt.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Dandelions are free, except for the incredible amount of work that it takes to dig them out, grind and roast them. We run them through the food processor just after digging and washing. Once they are roasted, they will ruin any implement that you try to use to get them into fine particles. Makes a fairly good coffee substitute, just like chicory does. We use both as coffee stretchers, more so than replacements. 

Some blend of beaver castor and maple syrup would get you a fairly good vanilla replacement.

It's not always about having what you want, but wanting what you have.


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

barnbilder said:


> Dandelions are free, except for the incredible amount of work that it takes to dig them out, grind and roast them. We run them through the food processor just after digging and washing. Once they are roasted, they will ruin any implement that you try to use to get them into fine particles. Makes a fairly good coffee substitute, just like chicory does. We use both as coffee stretchers, more so than replacements.
> 
> Some blend of beaver castor and maple syrup would get you a fairly good vanilla replacement.
> 
> It's not always about having what you want, but wanting what you have.


What about Chocolate? I tried carob it tasted horrid.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Jerryberry said:


> What about Chocolate? I tried carob it tasted horrid.


Chocolate mint or Himalayan honeysuckle. Never tried either, but a quick Google search pointed me in that direction. Carob powder is easy to overdo in a recipe. I don't know about Himalayan honeysuckle but I have tried Himalayan venison, on account of I found Himalayan in the road.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

but I have tried Himalayan venison, on account of I found Himalayan in the road.

LOL!


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## Jerryberry (9 mo ago)

Danaus29 said:


> but I have tried Himalayan venison, on account of I found Himalayan in the road.
> 
> LOL!


Does it taste like chocolate?


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Jerryberry said:


> Does it taste like chocolate?


No. Himalayan venison is road kill deer. It tastes like regular deer but you don't have to shoot it to get one.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Flavor depends on how long Himalayan.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)




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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)




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