# Tipping, what would you do?



## Micheal

Recently the wife and I had 2 morning appointments to go to - bout 1&1/2 hours apart. We went to the first one and then because of the time between them we went to a restaurant for breakfast.
The restaurant offers 50% off breakfast(s) before 11AM. We got there bout 10, so no problem there....
Some old friends were there also and invited us to share their table with them, which we did. Since they were already eating our order was put on a different ticket. As everyone was getting ready to leave they mentioned that with breakfast being 1/2 price they only had to tip 1/2 of what they would have normally.
I left a tip as per the pre-discounted price since the waitress didn't do half a job.

So the question. When determining a tip for the waitress which price would you have used, the full price of the meal or the 1/2 price on the bill?


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## mmoetc

Micheal said:


> Recently the wife and I had 2 morning appointments to go to - bout 1&1/2 hours apart. We went to the first one and then because of the time between them we went to a restaurant for breakfast.
> The restaurant offers 50% off breakfast(s) before 11AM. We got there bout 10, so no problem there....
> Some old friends were there also and invited us to share their table with them, which we did. Since they were already eating our order was put on a different ticket. As everyone was getting ready to leave they mentioned that with breakfast being 1/2 price they only had to tip 1/2 of what they would have normally.
> I left a tip as per the pre-discounted price since the waitress didn't do half a job.
> 
> So the question. When determining a tip for the waitress which price would you have used, the full price of the meal or the 1/2 price on the bill?


Full meal price. The same standard applies if you have a coupon. If you're concerned about saving a couple of bucks on the tip go through the drive thru.


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## miggyb

Micheal said:


> Recently the wife and I had 2 morning appointments to go to - bout 1&1/2 hours apart. We went to the first one and then because of the time between them we went to a restaurant for breakfast.
> The restaurant offers 50% off breakfast(s) before 11AM. We got there bout 10, so no problem there....
> Some old friends were there also and invited us to share their table with them, which we did. Since they were already eating our order was put on a different ticket. As everyone was getting ready to leave they mentioned that with breakfast being 1/2 price they only had to tip 1/2 of what they would have normally.
> I left a tip as per the pre-discounted price since the waitress didn't do half a job.
> 
> So the question. When determining a tip for the waitress which price would you have used, the full price of the meal or the 1/2 price on the bill?


Tip on the full price!!!


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## frogmammy

Full price!

Mon


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## whiterock

Full price tip, maybe a bit more if good service. Still money ahead.


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## mnn2501

I always tip on the full price of the meals, no matter what I end up paying. The wait staff does the same amount of work no matter what you pay.


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## MELQ

full price.


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## Martlet

I always tip full price. If my meal is comp'd or someone pays for it, I always tip full price or what my comp'd meal cost plus ext


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## GTX63

Full price with the quality of service in mind. They may do the same amount of work but the same could be said of a guy who built a crooked house.


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## Bellyman

I tend to agree with those who say "full price" but I'm more inclined to tip according to service than being a stickler about the dollar amount of the bill and also exactly what the wait staff does for me.

If they work hard and take good care of me, they'll get a good tip even if the meal was only $5. If they ignore me most of the time in ways they are supposed to be looking after me, they'll get a poor tip even if the bill is $50. 

I'm generous when treated well, harsh when not treated well. Don't know if that's right or wrong but that's me. It's rare I don't leave a tip at all, the service would have been horrible.


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## krackin

I never tipped less than 20%. I don't need to be 'taken care of' . When I walk in, I wait my turn regardless of chore coat or heavy leather. I've got a natural rough edge that bothers many young citizens today. All the better. 

Treat me well, I'll treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll show you hell.


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## Bellyman

krackin said:


> I never tipped less than 20%. I don't need to be 'taken care of' . When I walk in, I wait my turn regardless of chore coat or heavy leather. I've got a natural rough edge that bothers many young citizens today. All the better.
> 
> Treat me well, I'll treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll show you hell.


Not sure I understand. You'll "show them hell" and then still give them 20%? 

FWIW, the waitress that waited on us Thursday morning for breakfast got something like 40%. But she refilled our coffee cups and water glasses when we needed it. She brought us ketchup to eat with our meal that wasn't just on the table. She checked in with us periodically to make sure we had what we needed. She had a good attitude. And she deserved what she got. Had she treated us very poorly with a very bad attitude, she'd have NOT gotten much of a tip at all, if any. I'm sorry, but I refuse to reward bad behavior. I will not make a scene without cause. I may speak to the manager if I have time to do so. (I have been known to approach the manager for really excellent service, too! They need to know when someone is doing a really good job.)


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## krackin

You aren't a biker.


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## Bellyman

krackin said:


> You aren't a biker.


You are correct.  

Have considered becoming one someday, though. Have the beard for it already. LOL!


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## chaossmurf

Treat me well, I'll treat you better. Treat me bad, I'll show you hell.

I loved that line hehehe if a waitress notices things we need even b4 we do they get treated accordingly

and if she reaches over an empty glass too take a glass from someone else who had to try to get her attention forever --I hope she like the shiniest copper penny our group can find among our pockets and purses , because that is her salary to learn to do better (her co-workers will explain the penny to her ) hehehe
and I absolutely to make a point to mention great service to managers every time ,, and a few really horrible servers as well that had an attitude
with that said ,I try to make sure whenever the waitress is there we let her know what all will be needed for the table & try too make their jobs easier so our table is very easy to handle ,all I expect is a nice attitude & no cold food that sat without them bringing it out ----UNLESS--- the waiter/ waitress is rude ,then they might find us making it a point to , help teach her how to be a better ..........


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## MoBookworm1957

full price


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## Dutchie

Bellyman said:


> Had she treated us very poorly with a very bad attitude, she'd have NOT gotten much of a tip at all, if any. I'm sorry, but I refuse to reward bad behavior.


For those of you who won't leave a tip at all, please realize that the server pays apprx 8% (depending on where you are) income tax on his/her sales. So if you don't want to tip for bad server, consider leaving at least 8% so it doesn't actually cost the server money.


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## Bellyman

Just to give a little perspective, I think I have made the decision to not tip at all on occasions that I could number on the fingers of one hand. It is not something I do often at all. Seriously, I have to be treated badly enough that I would likely be comped the meal if management saw how I was treated. (I think I was once or twice.) Not leaving a tip is not something I do flippantly or often. Leaving 20% plus, though, requires that they actually show me that they can do their job and do it competently.


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## miggyb

To add a little more perspective, you are dealing with one server, your server has dealt with numerous customers, on the day. My wife and both daughters have worked as bartenders and waitresses and they have their own share of horror stories. Unfortunately, some people ( I am not being specific to anyone,here) confuse server with servant.


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## Laura Zone 5

I've been in the business for 30+ years (server / bartender).

If you feel that the server has only earned 10% or less? You really, really need to speak to a manager.
If it is a locally owned place, speak to the owner.
Managers / Owners NEED to know when their staff are not giving excellent service.
Word of mouth will destroy a restaurant as fast as bad food or dirty kitchens.

20% is the norm.

It is true that we pay taxes on our total sales.
MOST restaurants, the servers have to tip out a % of their tips to the bartender and to the busser.
Where I work, 3% of the servers TIPS go to the bartender, 15% goes to the bussers.
SO if Sally Server makes 100.00, she gives 15.00 to the bussers, 3.00 to the bartender.
Her 100.00 in tips becomes 82.00.

Places I have worked in the past I paid 10% of my tips to the bartender.
Another place I paid 3% of the bar sales to the bartender (for every 100 in booze I sell, 3.00 goes to the bartender) and 3% of my food sales went to the support staff (if I sold 800 in food, 24.00 went to the support staff)
SO if my food sales are 800 and my bar sales are 300 = 1,100, assuming I make 20% in tips, 220.00; I have to give away 24.00 to support, and 9.00 to the bar. My 220.00 I earned? I walk with 187.00.

NOW assume I only make 10% in tips. I have made 110.00.
I STILL lose 33.00.
Now walking with 77.00 for busting my A double but folks were super cheap.
I HATE that restaurants make the servers / bartenders pay the support staff, but they do.

I have done what I do (to my own physical demise) for 30+ years because I LOVE what I do.
They cheap folks are few and far between, and for that, I am so thankful.
You would be surprised at how many people do not realize that in Indiana, servers make 2.13 an hour.
MOST bartenders make 5.00 an hour.
Where I work, I only make 2.13.


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## coolrunnin

Dutchie said:


> For those of you who won't leave a tip at all, please realize that the server pays apprx 8% (depending on where you are) income tax on his/her sales. So if you don't want to tip for bad server, consider leaving at least 8% so it doesn't actually cost the server money.


That would be the wait staffs problem not mine...


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## SLFarmMI

Dutchie said:


> For those of you who won't leave a tip at all, please realize that the server pays apprx 8% (depending on where you are) income tax on his/her sales. So if you don't want to tip for bad server, consider leaving at least 8% so it doesn't actually cost the server money.


So, if I get lousy service, it's your suggestion that I reward the server with a tip? Not happening. If you are a terrible server, I will be speaking to the manager, leaving you 0 tip as well as many times a note explaining why you got no tip. If you are a wonderful server, I will be speaking to the manager, leaving you a great tip as well as many times a note explaining why you got such a big tip. A tip is supposed to be a reward for great service, not part of a server's salary. Don't like the tax laws associated with tipping? Work to have them changed. Don't act like the customer somehow owes you a tip. They don't.


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## Dutchie

SLFarmMI said:


> So, if I get lousy service, it's your suggestion that I reward the server with a tip? Not happening. If you are a terrible server, I will be speaking to the manager, leaving you 0 tip as well as many times a note explaining why you got no tip. If you are a wonderful server, I will be speaking to the manager, leaving you a great tip as well as many times a note explaining why you got such a big tip. A tip is supposed to be a reward for great service, not part of a server's salary. Don't like the tax laws associated with tipping? Work to have them changed. Don't act like the customer somehow owes you a tip. They don't.


No, I am not suggesting you leave a tip. What I am suggesting to leave 8% so the tax she is being charged on the cost of your meal doesn't come out of her pocket.

Her salary is less than minimum wage. I am ot sure what it is now but at one point it was $2.73 an hour. Everybody who does not live under a rock knows this and knows that the only money a server makes is the tip.


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## Danaus29

The federal labor law requires the employer to make up the difference if the server does not earn federal minimum wages after tips. https://webapps.dol.gov/elaws/faq/esa/flsa/002.htm

Of course some customers during the shift could tip enough to bring the income up to minimum wages.

I've refused to tip a couple times. One was a waitress that had waited on me a few times previously. Once she brought me a glass of sweet tea with fuzzy floaters in it. I did tip that time because she brought me a soda for the same price. The last time she waited on me she brought me a plate of the most horrible soggy mushy pasta anyone has ever seen. Then she didn't come back despite several efforts to flag her down. 3 other occupied tables in the whole restaurant. Yes, we spoke to the manager and informed him that she would not be getting a tip due to her lack of service. Haven't been back since.

One other time I didn't tip was the time our meals got cold while we waited on silverware and our drinks were not refilled. Waitress asked how everything tasted 15 minutes later and hubby said "if we had silverware we could try it". Manager took half off our meals that day. Another restaurant I have not gone back to.

No way I would have given either of these poor servers even enough to cover the taxes. It's like a contractor, if you don't do the job you don't get paid. If they don't like it they can either learn to do the job properly or get a job with an hourly wage.


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## Bret

It is my privilege to tip. When I don't have it, I don't go. I tip too much when the bills are small because its fun and it does not cost much to feel like a big cowboy. I once observed a wait person abused for an hour by a couple that were so awful I almost asked to be moved to another table. I decided to stay and get inspired by the waitperson who could not be shaken or brought down to the customers low self-esteem. They bragged how they were not leaving a tip. When the customers departed, I gave the manager a tip for the star waitperson and told the manager how well the waitperson performed for the worst customers ever. 

(This reply contains bragging and self promotion that may have been written by the author in another post place and time that he can't remember. The story is true. The names have been omitted. He had to look up the word"omitted" to see if there should be two "m"s. Don't call him Friday. He'll think you are calling someone else.)


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## SLFarmMI

Dutchie said:


> No, I am not suggesting you leave a tip. What I am suggesting to leave 8% so the tax she is being charged on the cost of your meal doesn't come out of her pocket.
> 
> Her salary is less than minimum wage. I am ot sure what it is now but at one point it was $2.73 an hour. Everybody who does not live under a rock knows this and knows that the only money a server makes is the tip.


That 8% you are suggesting would still be a tip. There is no way I will be leaving a tip for lousy service. There seems to be the thought out there that it is somehow the customer's responsibility to make up for the poor hourly wages the server is making. Where that mindset came from is beyond me. And the percentage that is expected just keeps creeping up and up -- 10%, then 15%, now 20%. When will this sense of "I'm entitled to a tip no matter how poorly I serve you because I don't make a big salary" end?


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## ovendoctor

I worked in the industry for many years and the wait staff go threw he-- someday's 
had a table of construction workers treat a young gal badly, she came in the back in tears.
welp we cant have that so I went out and took their orders and had a few words of encouragement with them
she finished serving them after she got her self back together.
a 20 % tip and an apology was rendered as suggested
it helps wen your 6'10.5 and 275# [no fat] to take care of wait staff 

Doc.


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## bobp

I do not leave a tip when i get poor service. Period. This new thought process that we owe more than the meal just because were there is bunkus. it's always meant to have been a reward, a thank you for a pleasant visit. 
and to top it off some places are almost forcing the tip issue. also bunkus. And asking to add a tip to the ticket prior to ringing it up is pushy and rude. the whole world is running on the sense of entitlement it seems...


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## Gianni

Dutchie said:


> No, I am not suggesting you leave a tip. What I am suggesting to leave 8% so the tax she is being charged on the cost of your meal doesn't come out of her pocket.
> 
> Her salary is less than minimum wage. I am ot sure what it is now but at one point it was $2.73 an hour. Everybody who does not live under a rock knows this and knows that the only money a server makes is the tip.


I understand that the server is taxed on 8% of the meal not paying 8% tax. Huge difference in those two.


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## Laura Zone 5

I worked today from 10am-4pm.
We were VERY slow.....so the very few folks I did have, wanted for nothing!!!
Today was 15% day.
Party of 4, 70's ish years old.
Bill was 43 .95. Gave me a 50.00 gift card and "keep the change".
9.00 is 20%
6.60 is 15%
What I was given was 14%.
.90 of that tip was given to the busser, as I have to 'tip out' 15% of my gratuity to the busser.
SO that makes my 'take away tip' 12%.

Those sweet people wanted for nothing. Tea never ran out, water never ran out, checked back after 2 bites.
Cleared empty plates immediately.
Offered to go Tea / water
Was friendly, helpful, smiling.....
Their service was perfect.

2 top (guessing mid to late 20's)
1 water 1 tea (neither ran low, refilled his tea 4 times, when he was 1/2 finished with the previous. He drank, all 4 glasses)
2 sandwiches, 1 side.
Same service as above.
33.00 bill
4.00 tip.
20% would have been 6.60
15% would have been 4.95
What I received was 12 %.
Again, .60 went to the busser, so I 'walked with' 3.40.

2 top, mid 30's man, with his mid 60's mom.
High maintenance. (Special request this, can I substitute that, etc)
I did everything they asked, and more.
Same service as above.
Bill was a 31.00
He tipped 5.00
20% is 6.20
15% is 4.65
BUT the difference here is, they were VERY NEEDY and I met and exceeded their needs.
He drank no less than 4 waters, she had 3.

So when I server is refilling drinks every 30 seconds.......
When she goes above and beyond to accommodate all 'off menu' special requests (can you sub this, can you split that, etc) and she is friendly, helpful, and exceeds expectations (they were splitting a burger, so without them asking, I had the kitchen cut the burger in half and put it on 2 plates; They were THRILLED I did this for them, and very thank you thank you).......

20% is the minimum.

Never ever should you tip for poor service.
If the service is good and the food sucks, tell the boss, but tip the server.
If you drink 9 diet cokes in 35 min, give her the heads up that you are going to drink diet coke like it's your last so she KNOWS to keep an eye on your drink.
If your server has 90/11 tables, and you are on fire and need water; find a manager.
Good chances are someone has called off, her section is too big (managers fault) and the manager will not 'hold the door' (go on a wait) so the servers can give good service cause all the manager sees is $$$$ signs.

Guest service suffers, servers get stiffed, and the boss lines his pockets.
Tear the manager a new one when you see this happening.
It's his / her fault; the server is just trying to do the best he/she can

The employer only has to make up the difference IF the server makes below minimum wage THE ENTIRE pay period.
Not per shift.
So if you make below minimum wage Monday, Tuesday and Thursday, but what you make on Friday and Saturday brings the WHOLE week above minimum, the employer does not have to make it up.

If you work 45 hours in week one of the pay period, and 35 hours the second week of the pay period
YOU GET NO OVERTIME, because it 'balances' at 80 hours for the pay period.

I love auto-grat.
Parties of 6 or larger, it's an auto 20%.
Why do I love it?
I have worked places that DO NOT have auto grat, and have taken care of 10-12-15 people, their bill 2-300.00 and get tipped 10%.
When I have a large party, I give them 25-30% worth of service, so at the end of the meal, I let them know the 20% grat is on the bill, no one bats an eye.
It's also C-L-E-A-R-L-Y printed on the menu.
Once again, if you are in a large party at a place that auto-grats, and you feel your service was NOT worth 20% GET THE MANAGER

Don't ever tip for bad service, but if it's THAT bad.......tell the boss. Tell the boss. Tell the boss.



> And the percentage that is expected just keeps creeping up and up -- 10%, then 15%, now 20%.


I'd love to walk into any business and pay the owner what the price was in 1970.
I'd love to fill up my gas tank at 2.25 a gallon, what every one else is paying, and go inside and say "I'm pay .54 a gallon, just like 1979".
Pretty sure they would call the police on me!! 

In 1993 I made 1.85 an hour as a server.
In 1994, servers got a raise.
We now make 2.13 an hour......still.......so 23 years, no wage increase.

If you go in a full service restaurant, then be ready to pay for the service.
If you rent a carpet cleaner from the grocery store, and you do the work, no one is providing a service.
If you call Carpet pro, you will pay 5X more to have someone do it for you....hence paying for the service


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## SLFarmMI

Laura Zone 5 said:


> I worked today from 10am-4pm.
> We were VERY slow.....so the very few folks I did have, wanted for nothing!!!
> Today was 15% day.
> Party of 4, 70's ish years old.
> Bill was 43 .95. Gave me a 50.00 gift card and "keep the change".
> 9.00 is 20%
> 6.60 is 15%
> What I was given was 14%.
> .90 of that tip was given to the busser, as I have to 'tip out' 15% of my gratuity to the busser.
> SO that makes my 'take away tip' 12%.
> 
> Those sweet people wanted for nothing. Tea never ran out, water never ran out, checked back after 2 bites.
> Cleared empty plates immediately.
> Offered to go Tea / water
> Was friendly, helpful, smiling.....
> Their service was perfect.
> 
> 2 top (guessing mid to late 20's)
> 1 water 1 tea (neither ran low, refilled his tea 4 times, when he was 1/2 finished with the previous. He drank, all 4 glasses)
> 2 sandwiches, 1 side.
> Same service as above.
> 33.00 bill
> 4.00 tip.
> 20% would have been 6.60
> 15% would have been 4.95
> What I received was 12 %.
> Again, .60 went to the busser, so I 'walked with' 3.40.
> 
> 2 top, mid 30's man, with his mid 60's mom.
> High maintenance. (Special request this, can I substitute that, etc)
> I did everything they asked, and more.
> Same service as above.
> Bill was a 31.00
> He tipped 5.00
> 20% is 6.20
> 15% is 4.65
> BUT the difference here is, they were VERY NEEDY and I met and exceeded their needs.
> He drank no less than 4 waters, she had 3.
> 
> So when I server is refilling drinks every 30 seconds.......
> When she goes above and beyond to accommodate all 'off menu' special requests (can you sub this, can you split that, etc) and she is friendly, helpful, and exceeds expectations (they were splitting a burger, so without them asking, I had the kitchen cut the burger in half and put it on 2 plates; They were THRILLED I did this for them, and very thank you thank you).......
> 
> 20% is the minimum.
> 
> Never ever should you tip for poor service.
> If the service is good and the food sucks, tell the boss, but tip the server.
> If you drink 9 diet cokes in 35 min, give her the heads up that you are going to drink diet coke like it's your last so she KNOWS to keep an eye on your drink.
> If your server has 90/11 tables, and you are on fire and need water; find a manager.
> Good chances are someone has called off, her section is too big (managers fault) and the manager will not 'hold the door' (go on a wait) so the servers can give good service cause all the manager sees is $$$$ signs.
> 
> Guest service suffers, servers get stiffed, and the boss lines his pockets.
> Tear the manager a new one when you see this happening.
> It's his / her fault; the server is just trying to do the best he/she can
> 
> The employer only has to make up the difference IF the server makes below minimum wage THE ENTIRE pay period.
> Not per shift.
> So if you make below minimum wage Monday, Tuesday and Thursday, but what you make on Friday and Saturday brings the WHOLE week above minimum, the employer does not have to make it up.
> 
> If you work 45 hours in week one of the pay period, and 35 hours the second week of the pay period
> YOU GET NO OVERTIME, because it 'balances' at 80 hours for the pay period.
> 
> I love auto-grat.
> Parties of 6 or larger, it's an auto 20%.
> Why do I love it?
> I have worked places that DO NOT have auto grat, and have taken care of 10-12-15 people, their bill 2-300.00 and get tipped 10%.
> When I have a large party, I give them 25-30% worth of service, so at the end of the meal, I let them know the 20% grat is on the bill, no one bats an eye.
> It's also C-L-E-A-R-L-Y printed on the menu.
> Once again, if you are in a large party at a place that auto-grats, and you feel your service was NOT worth 20% GET THE MANAGER
> 
> Don't ever tip for bad service, but if it's THAT bad.......tell the boss. Tell the boss. Tell the boss.
> 
> 
> 
> I'd love to walk into any business and pay the owner what the price was in 1970.
> I'd love to fill up my gas tank at 2.25 a gallon, what every one else is paying, and go inside and say "I'm pay .54 a gallon, just like 1979".
> Pretty sure they would call the police on me!!
> 
> In 1993 I made 1.85 an hour as a server.
> In 1994, servers got a raise.
> We now make 2.13 an hour......still.......so 23 years, no wage increase.


Your post is an example of what I was talking about. You state "20% is the minimum". Why? Why is it that you think you or any other server should determine at what rate a customer should tip? Heck, why not 50%? Or 80%? 

Yes, your hourly wage sucks. No one is denying that. But that is an issue between you and your employer, not you and your customer. It isn't the customer's responsibility to provide a bonus to your wage. Tipping is, and should be, a choice that should belong to the customer. That's why I hate auto-gratuity. It removes the choice from the customer. From your description, you sound like a good server. If you waited on me like described above, you'd probably get a very large tip. But it should be my choice.


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## Laura Zone 5

Why?
If you are getting good service, 18-20% is the norm.
20% is easier to figure! 
It's not what the servers determine, it's what 'the norm' is.
20% is what 75% of the diners, tip.

Again. EVERYONE knows servers make crap wages and EVERYONE knows servers live off of their tips.
It's not a 'bonus' it's a gratuity.
If employers paid servers minimum wage, your meal will cost almost DOUBLE.
So your Applebees 2 for 20 meal is now 2 for 35.00.
Not such a good deal anymore.
Joes Crab Shak in Indy tried for 8 months to 'pay the servers' minimum wage and make tipping optional.
The menu prices jumped 50% to make up the difference.
Business declined......DRASTICALLY.
They said the program does not work. Lowered prices, lowered servers back to 2.13 + tips and guess what?
That's what works. Building has happy patrons, happy servers, etc.

That's why the grocery store carpet cleaner analogy works so well.
If you go get the cleaner and do it yourself (Think McDonalds) then you SAVE a ton of money.
You did it yourself.
BUT
IF you hire Carpet Pro carpet cleaners to come in and do the cleaning for you, you will pay 5x more because you are paying for someone's service.
Does that make sense?


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## SLFarmMI

Your carpet cleaning analogy does not hold water. The carpet cleaners are being paid to do a job (clean carpet) which is exactly the same as the restaurant being paid to do a job (cook and serve a meal). The customer in both instances expects to get that job done for the contracted price, which in the case of the restaurant is the menu price. It is inappropriate for either the carpet cleaning staff or the wait staff to say "I'm entitled to 20% minimum above and beyond the contracted price because I've done a good job and my hourly wages suck". If either the carpet cleaning staff or the wait staff have done a good job and I choose to, maybe I will slip them a little extra. The response in either case should be "thank you" and not "you only gave me 15%, don't you know the minimum I expect is 20%".

BTW, I have actually had, not in those exact words, had that reaction from a server. She came over and actually had the gall to say that my tip wasn't enough. I was actually speechless for a minute.


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## Laura Zone 5

1. I would NEVER tell a guest their tip was not enough. Period.
I have had some TERRIBLE tips even stiffed.....but NEVER would I EVER say a word to the guest.
THAT is grossly unprofessional.
If I were a restaurant owner, and my server walked up to my guest and even so much as MENTIONED her tip, much less complain about it? I'd fire him on the spot. That is 100% unacceptable.
HOWEVER if I gave amazing service, and they had NO reason to give a crappy tip? The next time they came in I would not take the table OR I would not make that table a priority.
If I have other tables that I either know will tip accordingly for my service, or I will roll the dice with the unknown: but I am not going to provide 25% service for a 10% tip.

2. The standard is 20% for good service. It is not demanded, but earned. If a server / bartender has provided excellent service then the standard is 20%. Everyone knows this.
If folks don't want to tip 20.00 on their 100.00 bill after receiving excellent service, then they are stealing from the service provider. They provided the service.
The way to avoid this situation is to go to self-serve type eating establishments.
You pay for the food, the company pays for the employees, you get your own food, you clean up your own mess.
Everyone is happy.

3. You missed my point on the carpet cleaning.
It cost 20.00 to rent a machine and 10.00 for the solution that can clean 3 rooms, and to do it yourself.
It costs 99.00 to do ONE room when you call in a carpet cleaning SERVICE.
It is 9x more to call a carpet cleaning SERVICE because someone is providing a service.
Want it cheap? Do it your self.
Want someone else to do it? Pay for their service.
Want someone to take your order, fill your drinks, bring your food, clean up your mess?
Pay for their service.
Want it cheap? Stay home and cook it yourself. Go to a drive thru.
Sit in a McDonalds, and throw your trash away on your way out.

Cheap people will always be.
There are cheap people who dine at Applebees and there are cheap people who dine at 5 start steak houses.
Experienced servers know what price point scares the majority of cheap folks away.......but you're still going to get some.
For every cheapskate there are dozens who tip 20% or more.


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## SLFarmMI

Laura Zone 5 said:


> 1. I would NEVER tell a guest their tip was not enough. Period.
> I have had some TERRIBLE tips even stiffed.....but NEVER would I EVER say a word to the guest.
> THAT is grossly unprofessional.
> If I were a restaurant owner, and my server walked up to my guest and even so much as MENTIONED her tip, much less complain about it? I'd fire him on the spot. That is 100% unacceptable.
> HOWEVER if I gave amazing service, and they had NO reason to give a crappy tip? The next time they came in I would not take the table OR I would not make that table a priority.
> If I have other tables that I either know will tip accordingly for my service, or I will roll the dice with the unknown: but I am not going to provide 25% service for a 10% tip.
> 
> 2. The standard is 20% for good service. It is not demanded, but earned. If a server / bartender has provided excellent service then the standard is 20%. Everyone knows this.
> If folks don't want to tip 20.00 on their 100.00 bill after receiving excellent service, then they are stealing from the service provider. They provided the service.
> The way to avoid this situation is to go to self-serve type eating establishments.
> You pay for the food, the company pays for the employees, you get your own food, you clean up your own mess.
> Everyone is happy.
> 
> 3. You missed my point on the carpet cleaning.
> It cost 20.00 to rent a machine and 10.00 for the solution that can clean 3 rooms, and to do it yourself.
> It costs 99.00 to do ONE room when you call in a carpet cleaning SERVICE.
> It is 9x more to call a carpet cleaning SERVICE because someone is providing a service.
> Want it cheap? Do it your self.
> Want someone else to do it? Pay for their service.
> Want someone to take your order, fill your drinks, bring your food, clean up your mess?
> Pay for their service.
> Want it cheap? Stay home and cook it yourself. Go to a drive thru.
> Sit in a McDonalds, and throw your trash away on your way out.
> 
> Cheap people will always be.
> There are cheap people who dine at Applebees and there are cheap people who dine at 5 start steak houses.
> Experienced servers know what price point scares the majority of cheap folks away.......but you're still going to get some.
> For every cheapskate there are dozens who tip 20% or more.


1. Yes, it was incredibly unprofessional. I did end up speaking with the manager as well as taking my tip back so in the end her crappy attitude gained her no tip at all.

2. 20% or any tip amount whatsoever is not something any server is entitled to. Not tipping 20% is not stealing. Your wages, crappy though they may be, are what you agreed to be paid when you signed on with that particular restaurant. 

3. I think you missed the point of the carpet cleaning analogy. When you paid the company to clean those carpets, the cost of the guys to do the work is included in the contractual agreement between the company and the customer. There should be no expectation of 20% added on to the bill because they did the work. The same holds true with restaurants. The contractually agreed upon price is listed in the menu. Your wages are included in that price. You are being paid for your service when the tab is being paid. The tip is an extra that the customer may or may not agree to add.


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## Laura Zone 5

I am glad you spoke to the boss. I KNOW it's infuriating to give amazing good service only to get a crappy tip.
Young servers take it personal. They do everything right, and still get stiffed.....
Us who have been in the business for years know it's not a reflection of us, or our service.
But a server has a memory like an elephant..........Rarely do we forget a lousy tipper, and we share that information with all our co-workers......

Servers are entitled to nothing.
Guests, are entitled to nothing.

Servers give good service with the anticipation of being rewarded for their good service.
Guests add a gratuity to the bill showing their appreciation for the service that was provided.

Guests who do not believe in tipping should say so the moment the server walks up to the table.
If you believe THAT strongly, make the announcement.
If you are a guest who is a crappy tipper, or just plain cheap? Tell the server the moment she walks up to the table.
If you believe THAT strongly, make the announcement.

In 35 years, that has happened once.
He and his wife sat down, they were in the 70's, and he announced that he does not believe in tipping.
It was early (4-5pm) and I had 2-3 tables.
I took care of them, just like everyone else.
At the end of the meal, he softened and said, thank you for your service.
He left a 5.00 bill.

If the service is SO bad you feel like 10% is the MOST you can give, ASK FOR THE MANAGER

Industry standard is 18-20% on the total bill before discounts, coupons, comps.



> 3. I think you missed the point of the carpet cleaning analogy. When you paid the company to clean those carpets, the cost of the guys to do the work is included in the contractual agreement between the company and the customer. There should be no expectation of 20% added on to the bill because they did the work.


3. You missed my point on the carpet cleaning.
It cost 20.00 to rent a machine and 10.00 for the solution that can clean 3 rooms, and to do it yourself.
It costs 99.00 to do ONE room when you call in a carpet cleaning SERVICE.
It is 9x more to call a carpet cleaning SERVICE because someone is providing a service.
*Want it cheap? Do it your self.
Want someone else to do it? Pay for their service.
Want someone to take your order, fill your drinks, bring your food, clean up your mess?
Pay for their service.
Want it cheap? Stay home and cook it yourself. Go to a drive thru.
Sit in a McDonalds, and throw your trash away on your way out.*



> The same holds true with restaurants. The contractually agreed upon price is listed in the menu. Your wages are included in that price. You are being paid for your service when the tab is being paid. The tip is an extra that the customer may or may not agree to add.


Nope.
Price on the menu pays for the rent, utilities, food, cooks, dishwashers,furniture, plates, etc.
The server that makes 2.13 hour PROVIDED the SERVICE to guests order to the kitchen, to bring their food to them, to make sure they have plenty to drink, to fetch their every request, to clean up their mess, and to provide them a friendly pleasent experience.
IF the server does this well......the INDUSTRY STANDARD is 20% gratuity on the total bill.

IF a guest does not 'believe in this system' then do not take advantage of the system by receiving service with no intention of paying for it.
Make the announcment to the server as soon as she walks up. Let her know she will NOT be getting a tip / or she will be getting a bad tip, that it's no reflection of her service, but because the guest does not "believe" in the tipping system.
Don't want to make the announcement?
Type it up and hand it to the server as soon as they walk up.


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## mnn2501

Sorry, *industry standard *is 15% on full service restaurants, the *median received *may be 18-20%


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## Laura Zone 5

Maybe in Dallas, but not in Indy.
Even business accounts bumped from 15% to 18%.
When bean counters give us a bump you know that's a big deal!!


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## Evons hubby

I always like to give a good tip, these people work their tails off and manage to do it with a smile. Usually somewhere near the price of my meal.


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## Bellyman

Ok, forgive a stupid question but, are we supposed to be tipping on the amount charged for tax? In some states, that's like 10% of the bill. I know, it's not huge, but it does make a difference in the calculations.

FWIW, Laura, if you gave me the kind of service you speak of, you'd probably be getting around 20+% anyway. It does kinda grind on me, though, that it's an expectation, not something I just give because I appreciate the extra effort. I understand. I don't like the system. But I'd love to sit in your section.


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## Danaus29

Laura, when I get a waitress/waiter as considerate and prompt as you I can guarantee they would have got more than a 20% tip. I can't tell you how often dirty dishes have sat on the table and I never got a first refill. I cringe when they bring me the check with the meal because I know then the server ain't coming back until we're finished eating even if our drink glasses are empty at the time. 

Sometimes even though you get a great server one time, you can get a terrible server the next time. So you tip less than usual because of poor service. That server tells everyone you are a lousy tipper without offering up the info they never refilled a single drink or promised to bring you napkins which never materialized. Then the lousy server quits but the rest of the staff view you as a lousy tipper. The next time you go in, your service is terrible again so you just stop going back. Waiting for a manager so you can complain about terrible service can take 30 minutes or more because the terrible servers know they are terrible and won't get a manger because they know you're going to complain about them.

I love it when the manager comes around, introduces themselves, and asks if you need anything. Those are places where the service and food are almost always exceptional.


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## SLFarmMI

Laura Zone 5 said:


> I am glad you spoke to the boss. I KNOW it's infuriating to give amazing good service only to get a crappy tip.
> Young servers take it personal. They do everything right, and still get stiffed.....
> Us who have been in the business for years know it's not a reflection of us, or our service.
> But a server has a memory like an elephant..........Rarely do we forget a lousy tipper, and we share that information with all our co-workers......
> 
> Servers are entitled to nothing.
> Guests, are entitled to nothing.
> 
> Servers give good service with the anticipation of being rewarded for their good service.
> Guests add a gratuity to the bill showing their appreciation for the service that was provided.
> 
> Guests who do not believe in tipping should say so the moment the server walks up to the table.
> If you believe THAT strongly, make the announcement.
> If you are a guest who is a crappy tipper, or just plain cheap? Tell the server the moment she walks up to the table.
> If you believe THAT strongly, make the announcement.
> 
> In 35 years, that has happened once.
> He and his wife sat down, they were in the 70's, and he announced that he does not believe in tipping.
> It was early (4-5pm) and I had 2-3 tables.
> I took care of them, just like everyone else.
> At the end of the meal, he softened and said, thank you for your service.
> He left a 5.00 bill.
> 
> If the service is SO bad you feel like 10% is the MOST you can give, ASK FOR THE MANAGER
> 
> Industry standard is 18-20% on the total bill before discounts, coupons, comps.
> 
> 
> 
> 3. You missed my point on the carpet cleaning.
> It cost 20.00 to rent a machine and 10.00 for the solution that can clean 3 rooms, and to do it yourself.
> It costs 99.00 to do ONE room when you call in a carpet cleaning SERVICE.
> It is 9x more to call a carpet cleaning SERVICE because someone is providing a service.
> *Want it cheap? Do it your self.
> Want someone else to do it? Pay for their service.
> Want someone to take your order, fill your drinks, bring your food, clean up your mess?
> Pay for their service.
> Want it cheap? Stay home and cook it yourself. Go to a drive thru.
> Sit in a McDonalds, and throw your trash away on your way out.*
> 
> 
> 
> Nope.
> Price on the menu pays for the rent, utilities, food, cooks, dishwashers,furniture, plates, etc.
> The server that makes 2.13 hour PROVIDED the SERVICE to guests order to the kitchen, to bring their food to them, to make sure they have plenty to drink, to fetch their every request, to clean up their mess, and to provide them a friendly pleasent experience.
> IF the server does this well......the INDUSTRY STANDARD is 20% gratuity on the total bill.
> 
> IF a guest does not 'believe in this system' then do not take advantage of the system by receiving service with no intention of paying for it.
> Make the announcment to the server as soon as she walks up. Let her know she will NOT be getting a tip / or she will be getting a bad tip, that it's no reflection of her service, but because the guest does not "believe" in the tipping system.
> Don't want to make the announcement?
> Type it up and hand it to the server as soon as they walk up.



The issue at hand has nothing at all with being cheap or not believing in tipping. The server who takes the order etc. is being paid for doing so by the employer. That's what that hourly wage is. Not giving a tip is not "receiving a service with no intention of paying for it". That server has been paid for their labor in full when he or she receives a paycheck. A tip is an extra.

What I object to is the pervasive belief that a server is somehow entitled to a tip merely for showing up and doing the job he or she was hired to do. Provide the bare minimum that you are required to do in order to keep your job and somehow you should be provided with a 20% tip? Not happening. I have always and will continue to tip based on the quality of the service. Be excellent and your tip will be also (as evidenced by the server who got a 60% tip last weekend). Be terrible and your tip, if you receive one, will be also.

By your logic, no matter how terrible the service, the server should get 20%. Explain to me please why the server who took 20 minutes to come take my drink order (restaurant was not busy, she was chatting with another employee), never came by to check on us once we had our food nor refilled our drinks, was downright surly when she took our order and basically threw my plate at me (it almost ended up in my lap) should receive a 20% tip. By your reasoning, I should have spoken to the manager (I did) but should still reward her with a 20% tip. What kind of sense does that make? Why should I reward her for making my dining experience incredibly unpleasant? She certainly earned no tip and she did not receive one.


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## Laura Zone 5

Bellyman,
A lot of folks figure 20% PRE tax. 
Some folks do not tip on the bottle of wine. So if the bill is 300.00 and the bottle of wine was 100. they figure 20% of 200.
About 1 out of every 10 guests do not tip on the wine; they are usually older folks.

I do not 'expect' a tip, I earn it.
There are times when I am SO overwhelmed with guests (we are so short staffed) that I know the best I can give is 15% because I simply have too many people. When I receive 20% or more, I am humbled.

I don't want to sound like I am 'demanding or entitled to' 20%.
That's not it at all.
It's the industry standard in my area.
I'm just trying to explain from a servers perspective.

Hey it's super slow this week because of Spring Break! Come on in and sit a spell!!


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## Laura Zone 5

What does 20% service look like?

Within 30 seconds, you are greeted 
I bring water with me, at the greet. 
A friendly greet that matches the guest: Good evening Ladies, my name is Laura and I will be taking care of you tonight!
(Table of 50ish and older men) Good afternoon young men, my name is Laura......
I read the table and serve accordingly (some want silent service; they are having a meeting, or deep conversation, some want to chat it up, etc)
Can I get you a cocktail, glass of wine, craft beer or milkshake to begin?
I tell them drink specials, rotating taps, etc.
Take the order, fill the order.
Talk about the menu, what's on special, what's good, what sucks, let them know my sides can feed 2 if they want to share (I hate food bombing people)
I let them know if they are talking or visiting, that when I see their menus fold closed and come to the edge of the table, I will know they are ready THAT WAY I don't keep interrupting their conversation.
Take the order, read it back.
Make sure when glasses are 3/4 full to refill. If I am swamped, I have the busser / expo gal do it for me.
Bring dinner; set the food in front of the person that ordered it (not "Deal a meal" Who had.....bla bla bla)
Make sure everything is correct. Ask if I can bring anything else.
Check back in 2 bites.
Make sure everything is good, refill drinks, etc
As plates are empty I start pulling dirties off the table (UNLESS I can read that this is a first date, and the mans plate is empty and she is still eating As long as he has a plate in front of him she will continue to eat. AS SOON as you pull the mans plate, she stops eating. He feels bad and she is embarrassed......seen it a million times)
IF there are kids at the table, I make eye contact w/ a parent and either spell or mouth that the kids meals gets a free desert and ask if they want it for here or in a box at home. 
When offering desert to the table with young kids I ask "Can I get you anything to finish the meal" A little wink and since my dessert menu is VERY small; guest know what I am saying w/o saying DESERT in front of the kids.
Offer desert, not coffee. Our coffee is terrible and I tell folks so much.
No desert? Ask how they want the bill (split, etc) and ask them if they would like to go water/soda
(at this point the only thing on the table are the drinking glasses)
Deliver check / pick up check / submit payment / return change or receipt.
Thank them for coming and invite them back

This is what 20% or better looks like.
I try to give 25% service (service I would tip 25% for) in the hopes that I will be tipped 20%.

I WILL TELL YOU service today sucks.
SO MANY places are either 'robots' or they don't give a fart.
When the place is empty and the server is chatting with co workers and your drink runs dry......that is bad service
When the place is jammed and the server has 13 tables because someone called off and your drink runs dry.......that's when you find the manager and tell him/her to get you more water cause it's the managers fault she/he's in the weeds.
It's not 'excellent service" but if she is still friendly, polite, apologetic, and doing the best she can? It's slow service because managment does not know how to run the floor........

When I go out I let the server know during the greet that I am a bartender; THAT let's her know "I am in the industry, I grossly over tip, don't give me crappy service, or I will call you out". 
My service is (90% of the time) is amazing.
And I grossly over tip!


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## Laura Zone 5

Danaus29

If you were dining at a chain restaurant and the lousy server will not get the manager?
You can go to the corporate website, send via email a photo of your receipt, the name of the server, etc and spell out clearly your issue.

Believe it or not, when a crappy server whines about a bad tip, we all know it's because she is a crappy server.
We do not hold it against the guest.
When one of the best servers gets stiffed or a crappy tip, THAT is when we look at the guests with a hairy eye.

True story.
Had a guy sit at the bar.
Late 20's early 30's.
I gave him samples of 2-3 beers until we found one he really likes.
Spent time with him walking thru the menu, answering questions.
Gave him complementary snacks.
Water glass / Beer never went dry.
Cleared his plates when he was done.
Changed the tv channel to the game he wanted to watch.
Gave him his bill.
28.50
He intentionally drew a line thru the tip line, and carried the 28.50 to the total.
HE INTENTIONALLY stiffed me.

I showed the boss and asked her if she thought I did something wrong? She was right there.
She was like, "What the badword"?

THE NEXT NIGHT the same guy sits in the same seat.
When I walked around the corner, you could see him filling his pants.
Told my boss "he's back, watch me"
I treated him exactly the same way as the night before.
He had the same beer, same sandwich, same side.
Bill was 28.50
He tipped me 1.50 to round the bill to 30.00
My boss was blown away.

He has not been back, but I promise you if he does come back, he is my LOWEST priority.
I don't care if he runs out of water. I don't care if his beer is empty. I'll get to it when I get to it......

The other bartenders know his face.
And the boss, knows his face.

THIS is the guy I was talking about when I say "lousy tipper".


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## Bellyman

Laura, this might sound like a silly question, but do servers count every tip from every table? I don't often remember of seeing one do that though I don't know if they do. I've often seen them stick the tip in their little apron and continue on with their work, only stopping for a quick, "thank you". 

I will confess that at times, I have probably altered the tip a little based upon my own mood. Hey, just being honest. But I would imagine, just like wait staff have their favorite people, I, as a customer, have my favorite waitresses (thinking of a place I frequent). Depending upon how the bill lines up with the cash in my pocket, it might be a dollar less or a dollar more today than the last time and if I've been a dollar short last time, I tend to be a bit more generous this time. Whether it's the professional demeanor of the waitresses or whether they really don't look at the exact amount, I don't know, but they don't seem to treat me any differently from time to time. Granted, even the 'dollar short' tip was probably 17 or 18%, but was still a little short of what I might have wanted them to have. 

I don't know about other people but at places I frequent, I like to know the waitresses by name. And I'll say "hi" to them, even if they're not waiting on me. I'm genuinely glad to see them and would stop to say "hi" even if it was at the grocery store or the gas station. That's just me, I do genuinely care about people and relationships mean something to me. 

Also, I tend to reflect good energy with a waiter or waitress. If they're happy and friendly towards me, they'll generally get that right back. If they are of a mind to be a little playful, I'll do that too. As odd as it may sound, I WANT my waiter or waitress to enjoy waiting on my table. I absolutely do NOT want to be the grumpy customer. At times, when I may not be feeling the best or I'm extra tired or something where I'm not quite as lively, I have been known to be a much quieter patron. But if the wait staff have been attentive, I tend to actually tip a little better then knowing that I may have looked as though I wasn't having as good of a time, and I'm sorry about that, it wasn't their fault.

Again, Laura, I'd love to eat at your table! You sound like an awesome waitress. You could train people...


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## Laura Zone 5

90% of my tips come on credit card, the other 10% is cash.
I try to pick up the book as they are leaving (1) because A LOT of people forget their cards, and I chase them down in the parking lot to give it back (2) so that if it is cash in the book, I can put it behind the bar (I am a bartender / server) and not lose it. Not everyone in the world is honest.

I will tell you every person gets the same 'thank you very much for having dinner with me, my name is Laura, and I hope to see you again soon! Have a great weekend, night, day, etc. That is BEFORE I see the gratuity.

I treat my guests like they are dining in my home.
I have guests that will not come in on Sunday and Monday because they know it's my day off.
I have guests that will wait for a table in my section to open up, when there are 10 open tables elsewhere.
When the guest and I are chatting and they tell me about something in their life, the next time I see them I ask them "so how is....." AND with me all hobbly wobbly with a busted knee the ask me what's going on in my life.
In the industry today, so few server / bartenders form relationships. They just see $$$$$.
I'm old school, and I love what I do.

What you have described is how to read a table.
I would know that I could horse around, be a little loose, and cut up when you came in.
Some folks just want me to bring food, take plates, and talk little to none.
It's just having a pulse on the table.

I had a table, man and women in their 70's.
Greeted, asked if I could get them a drink, he said "hell yes, make it a double, it's been a day"
I said "double it is"
Came back and said "here's to tomorrow being the best day ever".
He said "honey, we just got back from the lawyer to fix my will. I have terminal cancer and not much time".
I said "here's to right now" touched his and his wife's hand and said "whatever you need, you got it!"
They didn't want silent service, they wanted to chat.
So when I had time, I pulled up a chair, told them about festivals going on in town, told them how to find cool free events on their phones, etc.
I don't remember their tip. It just didn't matter.

Greg was a regular. Feisty old guy. Told me if I didn't get his order right he was going to my competitor.
He was playing but he had a dry sense of humor so some kids couldn't handle him.
He started having back problems (mid 70's) and I told him about a lift chair that he could get the doc to prescribe him to help him get up and down.
He got one.
Sometimes he came in alone, most times with a lady friend. Just a friend, that happens to be a lady.
Sometimes she came in alone.
She drank chard and had a thin pizza (specific, and the same every time)
One day she came in and sat down and I said 'where's that feisty old fart?"
She said, "sit down" and grabbed my hand.
She said "honey, Greg died 3 days ago. We don't know why, he went to bed, and never woke up".
After about 30 seconds of shell shock, tears poured down our faces.
I just didn't care if everyone else in that bar had to wait.
I gave her my cell number and told her if there was ANYTHING I could do to help, call me.

I love what I do, I get irritated when jack wagons act like baboons, or people either don't understand how / why there is gratuitiy or they DO understand the how and why and tip like crap anyway.


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## Horrorshow

I wanted to comment on the concept that tipping is somehow a flexible value for good service, that it is essentially an optional payment that you can decide to bestow upon the server when you feel magnanimous or withhold when you want to 'punish' them.

Servers are paid $2.13 hour, and have been for a generation +. In essence you are subsidizing their low wages with your tip, and in return you get lower food costs. Let's say you get your way, and servers are instead paid a living wage, so tips are really completely optional, and only get paid for actual great service.

Lets say that their wage should be $8/hour. And they have 6 customers per hour average (that's likely high for a full shift). The difference in cost is $6, or $1 per customer. Your $8 lunch is now $9. It's $9 if she forgets the silverware. If she spills the food on you. If she never refills your water. No matter how bad the service is, you pay $9. 

For the worst service in the world you are paying 12% extra. A 12% tip if you will. If you truly believe in rewarding for good service, then you'll pay more. Let's say you throw a dollar at the waitress. Your actual 'tip' if servers were paid a living wage is 25%. In a world where tipping doesn't exist you will be paying 12% more on your food bill to cover the cost of paying someone to deliver your food to your table and refill your water. If you don't want to tip there are places that don't expect it. It's called fast food.

There are places that follow that philosophy, France for example. No tipping needed. And last I heard they weren't exactly known for quality service. 

I feel like I'm in an episode of Reservoir Dogs. Cough up the dollar.


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## Evons hubby

Horrorshow said:


> I feel like I'm in an episode of Reservoir Dogs. Cough up the dollar.


Or two or twenty.... Depending on the service


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## whiterock

I usually tip $3. My bill seldom exceeds $10. I go to small local places alone mostly. Usually served by people that I can call by name.


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## Danaus29

Laura, we did complain to the corporate hq. They offered us a free entree at that store. Hubby told them it took him 6 months after the plastic in the salad incident to get me back in that restaurant, there was no way I would ever step foot in there ever again. Free entree, HA! That was a couple years ago. Never been back, never will go back. That particular store sucks! Been in a couple other of that chain. Good service, good food, gave good tips. But because of this one last incident I will not go back to any of their restaurants.


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## hunter63

If you can't afford a tip....don't use restaurants
If the service is crap...call a manager.


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## alleyyooper

It isn't an issue of affording a tip. It is the principal of the matter. tips were always considered a reward. In the very beginning of the practice the tip was given ahead of the service AKA *T*o *I*nsure *P*rompt service.

Isn't my fault a restaurant owner refused to pay minimum wage like even the lowly McDonald workers get. Isn't my fault that the servers settle for what wage they are paid and expect the customers to dole out a living to them.

So the servers refuse to work for the crummy wage and the owner/s raise menu prices 15 to 20% across the board I don't see the big deal in that as it again puts the tip as a reward again Which the server should not expect as a matter of right.

Worst tip practice I have ever saw was in a burb of New York City. Four same company truck loads of Cherries hauled in to Hunts Point, finally off loaded so we had to spend a night in Jersey truck stop. We decided we would go to a place in New Your with a bill board on the Jersey turn pike on Lobster dinners for seemed like a great price. We dropped a trailer and 8 of us went to this joint. Hostess showed us to tables, wait staff (2) put them together for us, took our orders and said they would run out and buy us booze or beer if we wished. The wait staff keep us supplied with every thing we needed so we all pitched in 15.00 each (1979) $120.00 for the tip gave it to the servers before we were quite finished. You would have thought we had just blew up the Umpire state building when we were leavening and did not hand a tip to the dam hostess. We tipped the servers, well you don't do that here, but we did and do that every place we go.

So if you have no motivation to raise your salary or change the states tax laws don't lay it on the customers.

Many here have expressed a tip is a reward and it will remain so.
Restaurants who add a tip to the bill get told where to go (hot place I am told) and we do not darken their door again and warn others of the practice.

 Al


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## Martlet

https://www.facebook.com/notes/moodys-diner/closed-for-the-day-wed-april-5th/10155092548008788


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## Laura Zone 5

Always look at the bottom of the menu; it is usually in small print, but it will say something like "parties of 6 or more 18-20% gratuity will be added to your bill".

If you are with a large party, always look at your receipt.
It will show your purchase total, tax total, and then the automatic gratuity.
Always always look at your bill (1) to make sure you are not paying for things you did not buy (2) to see if your gratuity has already been added.

Parties of 6 or more EVEN IF THEY GET SEPARATE checks will be auto-grat'ed.
So if you are with an office party of 10, and everyone gets their own check, 20% will still be added.
If you are out with 3 other couples and the bill is split 4 ways, you will still get "auto-grat'ed"

Always always always look at your bill.

again, for those who KNOW how the system works, goes out to dinner and BENEFITS from the system (having full service for their meal and then does not tip or leaves an insult tip), or refuses to pay for the service they have received?
McDonalds is a great place to eat, leave your mess on the table, and leave!!


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## Laura Zone 5

https://www.facebook.com/notes/moodys-diner/closed-for-the-day-wed-april-5th/10155092548008788

I will tell you this.
There is NO WAY I would 'wait on' rude, hateful, demanding, people for minimum wages.
There is no way I could have bought my new home, on minimum wage.
There is no way, a single 50+ year old woman could live alone, on minimum wage.

Every time I go to my Vet, I say "well that just paid her kids tuition / car payment, etc." I say it in jest, but in an odd way it's true.

It only takes a few cheap folks to ruin it for everyone.......


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## Kmac15

we normally tip between 20-25% and even when going to a new place they seem to know it LOL When we went to pay for the rehearsal dinner our party of 16 did not have the tip included, so we just did our normal and added 20% on the after tax amount.


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## AmericanStand

miggyb said:


> Unfortunately, some people ( I am not being specific to anyone,here) confuse server with servant.


 Of course they do. Tips are only appropriate for servants. 

One more reason tips should not be allowed in this country


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## chaossmurf

Dutchie said:


> For those of you who won't leave a tip at all, please realize that the server pays apprx 8% (depending on where you are) income tax on his/her sales. So if you don't want to tip for bad server, consider leaving at least 8% so it doesn't actually cost the server money.


LMFAO --if they cant do the job --let them pay to LEARN IT im pretty sure college students pay to learn , apprentice plumbers don't make union plumbers wages ---if they didn't pay attention when they were shadowing a better server --pay the fines  and better luck in their next failed job


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## lmrose

Micheal said:


> Recently the wife and I had 2 morning appointments to go to - bout 1&1/2 hours apart. We went to the first one and then because of the time between them we went to a restaurant for breakfast.
> The restaurant offers 50% off breakfast(s) before 11AM. We got there bout 10, so no problem there....
> Some old friends were there also and invited us to share their table with them, which we did. Since they were already eating our order was put on a different ticket. As everyone was getting ready to leave they mentioned that with breakfast being 1/2 price they only had to tip 1/2 of what they would have normally.
> I left a tip as per the pre-discounted price since the waitress didn't do half a job.
> 
> So the question. When determining a tip for the waitress which price would you have used, the full price of the meal or the 1/2 price on the bill?


For any service provided I tip according to how the person treats me. Whether a restaurant or taxi driver who helps me with bags; if they do a good job I give them what ever extra I have. Do a poor job then don't expect a tip. Now as for your question. If I lived in a town where a certain percentage is expected then I would have tipped the full price of the meal except if service was poor; then there would be no tip and I wouldn't eat there again.


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## Robotron

Best tip for poor service anywhere is to tell them to get a better attitude. Rarely do I ever have to use that. Being nice does go both ways. I travel for a living on a global basis and rarely do I ever run into a surly person. It starts with your own smile!


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