# WWYD cabin build



## farminghandyman (Mar 4, 2005)

not that long ago there was a thread called "*Frivolous homestead ideas" *http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/ge...estions/502042-frivolous-homestead-ideas.html and I posted about a cabin I would some day like to build and since it a nice cold day I have been in the house thing some on it, 

Ok now the question, say I would build it and wanted a energy free building as possible but with he look as I have pictures for posted,
part of the problem is it would set empty most likely 90 to 95% of the time, and I would like as little cost in utilities as possible, to keep it above freezing and not like a sweat box in the summer time, and so if one needed to use it there would not be a long preparation time, 

I posted a thread on "Earth tubes" as a possible heat/cooling system at least when it was not occupied, (would think one would need more heat when living in it, 

what construction methods would you choose?

and other systems would you do?

even tho the grid is available an off grid systems would be considered, would like as energy friendly as possible, even if supplemented with the grid power, 
location, plains of Colorado (Normal max)lows -20 highs 110, winds up to 80 mph, and a lot of windy days,


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## wy_white_wolf (Oct 14, 2004)

For the cost/hassle of installing a earth tube system big enough, one could build a ground level earth shelter with earth built up on 3 walls. Since that would also protect the structure from winds it should be more effective.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

A big "box" like that sitting out in a very windy location, is going to require a whole lot of insulation.
Earth tubes and their problems are not an easy fix all -cheap- answer.


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## homstdr74 (Jul 4, 2011)

Jim-mi said:


> A big "box" like that sitting out in a very windy location, is going to require a whole lot of insulation.
> Earth tubes and their problems are not an easy fix all -cheap- answer.


Agreed. Too tall. Low and flat for windy, cold plains areas---possibly dug in as suggested, and/or thick walls and ceiling (or roof) with lots of insulation.


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

I'd first change your house design.

If low or no heat in winter, like our place was for several years before we finished it and moved in, design your house with NO plumbing in exterior walls and put a drain valve by the main shutoff and one at your water heater. Having all the supply lines installed to drain to the low points would be nice too.

It's 3 here right now and there is no reason for us to leave faucets on or open sink cabinets for warm air. We have no plumbing within about 5' from an exterior wall.


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## farminghandyman (Mar 4, 2005)

the back wall would be about 12 possibly 14 foot tall, not that tall and it would be setting surrounded by some wind break trees,

the reason on the taller back wall is to have a loft that is usable, for sleeping space.

I know I am stubborn, but I like the look of the barn style, I know If I would build a in the ground bermed possibly even earth covered would be much more efferent,

but for a few times a year, use building I not sure that would be cost efficient either, 

one Idea is to build the bath room with additional heat, and possibly use some thing like out door wall faucets to feed the kitchen sink so I would not have to worry about only keeping the bath above freezing, and run the plumbing traps back into the bath room heated area,
and or a portion of the cabinet under the sink open to the heat of the bath room.

and design the plumbing so it would drain back so one could leave it unheated, with a little Rv anti freeze in the traps,


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## SolarGary (Sep 8, 2005)

Hi,
If your main objective is preventing freeze damage in the winter, I'd consider building the plumbing so that you can drain it when you leave, and just let the cabin go cold. 

This just requires some slope on the plumbing lines back to a common point you can drain to. Also have to drain anything that stores some water like hot water tanks, toilets, ...
When its time to leave, you open all the faucets, drain the tanks, pump the toilet tanks with a hand bilge pump and you are done.
You might have to be careful about some appliances -- eg dishwashers?
I used to volunteer at a ski lodge that was only open on weekends and went cold during the week -- they have been using this approach of draining the plumbing every winter week since 1928 --works fine.

I like solar heating a lot and half my home heat comes from solar thermal systems, but its very hard to do a solar system that will guarantee that the house will never drop below freezing. At least in my climate, it would take a lot of insulation, good air sealing, lots of thermal mass and a well designed solar thermal collector system. For a house that is only going to be occupied 5% of the time it may not be worth putting the time and money into that kind of solar design?

This is a small passive solar detail you can incorporate that is aimed at keeping a house a bit warmer when you are away: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/SpaceHeating/VacationHome/PipeFreeze.htm

There are a lot of ways to control overheating in the summer -- e.g. Overhangs on south windows, minimizing or shading east and west windows, tree shading, good insulation. The earth tube approach in the David Allen house mentioned above also seems pretty effective.

Gary


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Good point about the eves. We designed our house and window locations with 3' eves for no sun in the windows at all in the summer and full sun in winter. Tile floors over concrete and over 60 tons of stone in the fireplaces helps to store heat. Passive solar can help but there will be long stretches of no sun in the winter.


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## Raymond James (Apr 15, 2013)

I would use one water wall with the kitchen on one side and bathroom or bathrooms on the other. You can still keep the water lines away from the outside wall. Make the p traps easy to pull and the lines easy to drain back. Plan to shut off the water outside and drain all lines. 

I would try and get the stove closer to the middle of the building. Put closets on the north side. Earth berms on North . West and East sides would be best. Thick walls with lots of insulation. 

A partial basement for an area for utilities access (drain back) and to get into a tornado shelter concrete room floor / ceiling and walls.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

If you grid connect then it would make sense to design around a center of the house "water closet" where all of the plumbing would drain back too and "heat tapes" would handle the cold for the least amount of electric.

If your grid connected your going to pay a monthly fee anyway .....

If not grid connected you stand the chance of having your solar panels covered with snow for the long periods your not there----and therefore a system that could/would drain and kill your batteries.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

I would do concrete walls with insulation on the outside. The roof would be a shed roof . I would sink the whole thing 4 feet in the ground or below the frost line.

Passive and earth tied.


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