# Excuse Me I’m Still Using This..



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Im all for Sharing but have any of you noticed A trend of other drivers using a lane with a car already in it ?
It seems in the last few years more and more cars will pass me WITHOUT fully or partially leaving the lane I’m in. 
Ive also noticed That after passing a car cars will pass me in either lane while I’m still in that transition where I’m in both lanes.


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## Tobster (Feb 24, 2009)

AmericanStand said:


> Im all for Sharing but have any of you noticed A trend of other drivers using a lane with a car already in it ?
> It seems in the last few years more and more cars will pass me WITHOUT fully or partially leaving the lane I’m in.
> Ive also noticed That after passing a car cars will pass me in either lane while I’m still in that transition where I’m in both lanes.


Nothing to worry about. Standard method of passing and general vehicle operation when operator is DUI.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

You could be right but since everyone agrees dui is down why is this behavior increasing ?


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> You could be right but since everyone agrees dui is down why is this behavior increasing ?


Dui has dropped a lot in our area the last year or so. When our county finally went wet, my freinds and I can shop locally.... Eliminating a fifty mile drive one way to the l shop!


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Really bad when riding a motorcycle. If you ride in the right side of the lane, they try to squeeze through on the left, barely getting into the passing lane. Ride out in the left part of the lane, where I prefer because it's easier to see traffic up ahead and they'll zoom through on the right. I've been passed so close, on either side, to kick a car door. That's close cause seated on a motorcycle, hard to kick out very far.

A few days ago I had a Golden Moment. On a rural two lane blacktop road, I came to a section that had a left turn lane, yellow lines on both sides, I had a guy pass me, like the OP, one while still in my lane. That's a lane an oncoming car would use to turn left.

But just 100 yards up the road, there was a temporary traffic light. They are ditching the road and one lane was closed, so traffic was controlled by the light. I could see that way down the road cars were headed our way, so it would be awhile before the light would change. So, I got out and spoke with the driver about his illegal passing and careless behavior. So often when another driver needs a verbal evaluation of their lousy driving, a horn honk or a flipped bird, serves as a poor substitute for a more direct, face to face verbal communication. https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...69367BA13B3C10D5472D69367BA13B3C10D&FORM=VIRE


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Cell phones


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

There's another new driving rule I missed hearing about.
Driving down the interstate, 3 lanes, 4, 5 doesn't matter. The instant when you see that traffic up ahead is stopped or at a crawl, everyone is expected to change lanes. No matter what lane you were in, change. I think it is a blend of finding the shortest line at grocery store, DMV, post office or Bank, with the added thrill to see if you have selected the lane that will get your two ton projectile a few feet ahead of the other guy's projectile. Sort of an Expressway Plinko game.

But the fun doesn't end once you've settled into your space on this four row seven mile long parking lot. Oh no! Now, like a super slow motion Kentucky Derby, you become familiar with the drivers in nearby lanes. The leads change, tension mounts. When the traffic clears this log jam, who will be the winner? Who will take the highway sash of roses? It all goes back to who sought out the best lane as traffic ground to a halt.

The other event, my personal favorite, requires courage and an elitist's expectation.
The huge sign cannot be missed. "Right Lane Closed in 1 Mile". Both lanes are nearly bumper to bumper. The pawns in this game start looking for openings to get to the left lane. But the real players see this weakness and capitalize on it. They move into this soon to be closed lane, instinctively knowing the sheep that got out of the right lane will soon give way to the real players. But what makes it a gamble is that if the number or real players exceeds the kindness of the sheep, their sense of fair play kicks in. When that happens, the left lane community's instincts kick in. It starts with each driver only allowing one real player in, like taking turns. But others in the left lane community, often truckers, edge over, blocking both lanes well back from the actual closed lane. In reality, the players still end up ahead of the polite folks, but these members of the left lane community feel vindicated when they edged their fender dangerously close to the guy in the second car that wanted in.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Lol I believe it’s Pennsylvania that not only has a merge ahead sign but they also have a sign that says merge here and the next one says “take turns “and when somebody can’t figure that one out ya gotta wonder.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

In theory if everyone takes turns at the Merge spot both lanes move equally well. 
But there are more trucks in the right lane than on the left and they are longer longer so possibly the right lane might move faster 
But it’s hard to see around trucks so I don’t know what to do what should I do oh my oh my oh my......


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Try passing an on-ramp in Columbus during rush hour. Seems nobody on the ramp realizes they are supposed to look for an opening to merge. Right along with changing lanes when a vehicle already occupies that lane. I can't tell you how many times people have tried to rush ahead of me then get all ticked off because I don't STOP to let them get in front of me. There's usually a good 200 feet of open space behind me but they have to try to make me stop and let them in front. Go ahead and hit it, you better have some good insurance, Jerk.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

HDRider said:


> *Cell phones*



Yep....that right there. I've cleaned out several right side ditches cause some twit is trying to drive and text at the same time.


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## mzgarden (Mar 16, 2012)

Oh, you mean they're NOT the only people on the face of the earth? <shock> I truly believe these people figure they deserve to go first, go around, be in front, take your lane, whatever. They're entitled.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> why is this behavior increasing ?


There's no real proof it is increasing.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Danaus29 said:


> Try passing an on-ramp in Columbus during rush hour. Seems nobody on the ramp realizes they are supposed to look for an opening to merge. Right along with changing lanes when a vehicle already occupies that lane. I can't tell you how many times people have tried to rush ahead of me then get all ticked off because I don't STOP to let them get in front of me. There's usually a good 200 feet of open space behind me but they have to try to make me stop and let them in front. Go ahead and hit it, you better have some good insurance, Jerk.


I was once in Columbus with a F4 50 a tire service truck pulling another F4 50 tire service truck on a tow bar 
Right in the center of town and lady was trying to merge onto 70 she kept getting closer and closer to my second truck. 
Eventually she started flipping off the empty truck cab ,it took me a moment to realize she was trying to merge between the two vehicles.


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

AmericanStand said:


> You could be right but since everyone agrees dui is down why is this behavior increasing ?


Texting. 

If you're in southern California: Texting. Watching videos/making videos/video chat on phone. Putting on makeup/pants/pantyhose/socks/shoes while texting/watching/making videos. Fixing your hair/man-bun while texting/watching/making videos. Extra cool points for vaping while doing all of the above.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

AmericanStand said:


> You could be right but since everyone agrees dui is down why is this behavior increasing ?


Smarty phones or AKA facebook phones.
That is one of many dangerous and annoying traits that are increasing nowadays.
Poor operation of brake and accelerator pedals is also on the rise.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

AmericanStand, I think I've met that lady a time or two.

Once upon a time, drivers had to pay attention to the road. Now they have lane assist and self braking cars so they think they don't have to pay attention to anything on the road.

Pop used to have a very beautiful, young step-grandson. Unfortunately before he had a chance to grow up, his life was cut short by a texting driver. The driver that killed him was his own mother.
A few years back there was a massive traffic jam in Columbus. Backed up I-70 west of town for hours. A man had been texting and had a horrible accident. He died on his birthday at either 42 or 47, can't remember which. Can't find the link for the man who died on his birthday, it was several years ago. We got caught in the jam on the way home with the casing for our well.

It seems fewer and fewer people know how to show common courtesy or anything other than their "me first" attitude. And it really seems like people just learn enough of the rules of the road to pass the test then throw the book away. Just a couple weeks ago my brother was t-boned by a young man who didn't think he should have to stop when the traffic light is out. To add insult to injury the insurance company is saying my brother, who stopped before proceeding into the intersection, is partially at fault. WHAT?????


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Lol I believe it’s Pennsylvania that not only has a merge ahead sign but they also have a sign that says merge here and the next one says “take turns “and when somebody can’t figure that one out ya gotta wonder.


The assumption of no common sense. In Gaylord, a railroad track runs through town, a block over from the highway. At each railroad crossing, at each cross street, there is a Yield sign. Really? When there is an oncoming train, you need reminded who has the right of way?


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> There's no real proof it is increasing.


That's right.
The "real" proof comes from those of us who do more driving than the average and in various locations, not the same once-a-week trip to town for 10 miles.
And of course you have to examine all data closely. Sometimes the bias is intentional other times not.
The same point was made about drunk driving stats. How they counted the numbers made a huge difference in the results.
https://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2017/10/18/467836.htm

Are they counting only fatalities, or all crashes?
Are they checking the phone activity in single car crashes/1 person involved or not since there's no other person's liability at risk?
What about pedestrian involved incidents? Distraction can play heavily on both driver and pedestrian.
They rely heavily on the states reporting of each event and that varies widely.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

haypoint said:


> The assumption of no common sense. In Gaylord, a railroad track runs through town, a block over from the highway. At each railroad crossing, at each cross street, there is a Yield sign.
> 
> 
> Really? When there is an oncoming train, you need reminded who has the right of way?


LOL.
Probably not more than once.......


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> The "real" proof comes from those of us who do more driving than the average and in various locations, not the same once-a-week trip to town for 10 miles.


Only if they are credible.

From your source:


> Regulators, meanwhile, still have no good idea why crash-related deaths are spiking





> Finally, the increase in fatalities has been largely among bicyclists, motorcyclists, and pedestrians





> Out of NHTSA’s full 2015 dataset, only 448 deaths were linked to mobile phones—that’s just 1.4 percent of all traffic fatalities. By that measure, *drunk driving is 23 times more deadly* than using a phone while driving, though studies have shown that both activities behind the wheel constitute (on average) a similar level of impairment.
> 
> NHTSA has yet to fully crunch its 2016 data, but the agency said *deaths tied to distraction actually declined *last year.


Your source confirms what I said.
There's no proof the behavior described is increasing.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

haypoint said:


> There's another new driving rule I missed hearing about.
> Driving down the interstate, 3 lanes, 4, 5 doesn't matter. The instant when you see that traffic up ahead is stopped or at a crawl, everyone is expected to change lanes. No matter what lane you were in, change. I think it is a blend of finding the shortest line at grocery store, DMV, post office or Bank, with the added thrill to see if you have selected the lane that will get your two ton projectile a few feet ahead of the other guy's projectile. Sort of an Expressway Plinko game.
> 
> But the fun doesn't end once you've settled into your space on this four row seven mile long parking lot. Oh no! Now, like a super slow motion Kentucky Derby, you become familiar with the drivers in nearby lanes. The leads change, tension mounts. When the traffic clears this log jam, who will be the winner? Who will take the highway sash of roses? It all goes back to who sought out the best lane as traffic ground to a halt.
> ...


 OK rumplestiltskin you must of been asleep for quite a while I’m pretty sure that started just after the 1940 opening of the Pennsylvania Turnpike ......
Or maybe it started with the first soldier that tried to pass on the Roman roads?


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Only if they are credible.
> 
> From your source:
> 
> ...



Yeah, that first quote was probably my favorite from the whole thing.
"Gee Wally, _*something's*_ happening but we just can't figure out _*why*_."

So in case it wasn't obvious, the gov't report *wasn't* the source for the article, rather another person who took the time to dig into the *gov't* sources and find the discrepancies in their reporting methods.



> Jennifer Smith doesn’t like the term “accident.” It implies too much chance and too little culpability.
> 
> A “crash” killed her mother in 2008, she insists, when her car was broadsided by another vehicle while on her way to pick up cat food. The other driver, a 20-year-old college student, ran a red light while talking on his mobile phone, a distraction that he immediately admitted and cited as the catalyst of the fatal event.
> 
> ...





> Traffic Accident Deaths Still Increasing as Distracted Driving Reports Decline: NHTSA
> 
> Out of NHTSA’s full 2015 dataset, only 448 deaths were linked to mobile phones—that’s just 1.4 percent of all traffic fatalities. *By that measure, drunk driving is 23 times more deadly than using a phone while driving, though studies have shown that both activities behind the wheel constitute (on average) a similar level of impairment. *NHTSA has yet to fully crunch its 2016 data, but the agency said deaths tied to distraction actually declined last year.





> *Deadlier Than Data Shows*
> There are many reasons to believe mobile phones are far deadlier than NHTSA spreadsheets suggest. Some of the biggest indicators are within the data itself. In more than half of 2015 fatal crashes, motorists were simply going straight down the road—no crossing traffic, rainstorms, or blowouts. Meanwhile, drivers involved in accidents increasingly mowed down things smaller than a Honda Accord, such as pedestrians or cyclists, many of whom occupy the side of the road or the sidewalk next to it. Fatalities increased inordinately among motorcyclists (up 6.2 percent in 2016) and pedestrians (up 9 percent).
> 
> “Honestly, I think the real number of fatalities tied to cell phones is at least three times the federal figure,” Jennifer Smith said. “We’re all addicted and the scale of this is unheard of.”
> ...


But one thing is certain, relying on error filled or incomplete statistical reports, will lead to the conclusion that there is "no proof".


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> But one thing is certain, relying on error filled or incomplete statistical reports, will lead to the conclusion that there is "no proof".


So your "proof" is really one woman's opinion.

The OP isn't about "traffic deaths" though.

Therefore what you are talking about now really has no relation to what I said, or what he said.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> So your "proof" is really one woman's opinion.



Au contraire.
Multiply her, the OP, several other's observations, friends, relatives, strangers, coworkers, etc. and there's much more than
"one woman's opinion".



> The OP isn't about "traffic deaths" though.
> 
> Therefore what you are talking about now really has no relation to what I said, or what he said.


I believe that has already been pointed out, and its relevancy .............post #19.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> *I believe* that has already been pointed out, and its relevancy .............post #19.


*I believe* it has no relevancy to *my* comment which was made before that post.
Your source is about a different topic.
We already had this conversation a few posts back.



farmrbrown said:


> Au contraire.
> Multiply her, the OP, several other's observations, friends, relatives, strangers, coworkers, etc. and there's much more than "one woman's opinion".


That's really just more hearsay, not data.



farmrbrown said:


> But one thing is certain, relying on error filled or incomplete statistical reports, will lead to the conclusion that there is "no proof".


Relying on hearsay is even more worthless.

Your own source supports exactly what I said:




> Traffic Accident Deaths Still Increasing as *Distracted Driving Reports Decline*: NHTSA


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> *I believe* it has no relevancy to *my* comment which was made before that post.
> Your source is about a different topic.
> We already had this conversation a few posts back.
> 
> ...


Yes, I'm aware of what was said......



Bearfootfarm said:


> There's no real proof it is increasing.


I would read further about how they changed the reporting criteria in 2016 and their own admissions about their data before critiquing sources and proof......

https://crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/ViewPublication/812517

Make sure you read all the way to the last page.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Danaus29 said:


> Try passing an on-ramp in Columbus during rush hour. Seems nobody on the ramp realizes they are supposed to look for an opening to merge. Right along with changing lanes when a vehicle already occupies that lane. I can't tell you how many times people have tried to rush ahead of me then get all ticked off because I don't STOP to let them get in front of me. There's usually a good 200 feet of open space behind me but they have to try to make me stop and let them in front. Go ahead and hit it, you better have some good insurance, Jerk.



The DMV handbook in all 50 states seems to have a typo in the chapter for "Merging From An On Ramp."
It seems to state the proper way to merge onto an interstate is to maintain the same speed as the current traffic until you run out of ramp lane. Then display frustration with the vehicles currently on the interstate for not slowing down or speeding up, even if they are already boxed in.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

haypoint said:


> Really bad when riding a motorcycle. If you ride in the right side of the lane, they try to squeeze through on the left, barely getting into the passing lane. Ride out in the left part of the lane, where I prefer because it's easier to see traffic up ahead and they'll zoom through on the right. I've been passed so close, on either side, to kick a car door. That's close cause seated on a motorcycle, hard to kick out very far.
> 
> A few days ago I had a Golden Moment. On a rural two lane blacktop road, I came to a section that had a left turn lane, yellow lines on both sides, I had a guy pass me, like the OP, one while still in my lane. That's a lane an oncoming car would use to turn left.
> 
> But just 100 yards up the road, there was a temporary traffic light. They are ditching the road and one lane was closed, so traffic was controlled by the light. I could see that way down the road cars were headed our way, so it would be awhile before the light would change. *So, I got out and spoke with the driver *about his illegal passing and careless behavior. So often when another driver needs a verbal evaluation of their lousy driving, a horn honk or a flipped bird, serves as a poor substitute for a more direct, face to face verbal communication. https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...69367BA13B3C10D5472D69367BA13B3C10D&FORM=VIRE


In my opinion, this is either brave or stupid. How did you know the mental state of the driver? 
People murder people and drive fast to get out of town. 

And all this traffic/driving selfish behavior is related to the ego and how we are all so directed by the ego and our culture is currently so ego centric. me, me, me. me first, I'm important, I'm the best, I'll just go around these people who aren't driving as well as I am, they are in MY way. I am very important, tremendously important, most important you've ever seen. The best.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

GTX63 said:


> The DMV handbook in all 50 states seems to have a typo in the chapter for "Merging From An On Ramp."
> It seems to state the proper way to merge onto an interstate is to maintain the same speed as the current traffic until you run out of ramp lane. Then display frustration with the vehicles currently on the interstate for not slowing down or speeding up, even if they are already boxed in.


The MA one is similar and also states, - don't look at all, at any time, at the lane you are merging in to.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

If you don't look over or make eye contact with the driver, you can pretend you never saw them and rationalize your driving.
It is a disconnect that works until you have no where to go or call your insurance agent.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> There's no real proof it is increasing.


10 years of stats here seems to indicate it is increasing:

https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/safety/documents/DistractedDriver.pdf


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

TnAndy said:


> 10 years of stats here seems to indicate it is increasing:


Some of those figures show decreases compared to a few years ago.
I suspect any increases are due simply to population growth.



farmrbrown said:


> Make sure you read all the way to the last page.


There's nothing there that says it's *increased*.
It only gives numbers for one year (2016) using a new method, aside from this:


> Estimates of People Injured in Distraction-Affected Crashes *From 2012 to 2015*, the estimated number of people injured in distraction-affected crashes *showed decreases and increases*.
> *The percentage* of injured people in distraction-affected crashes as a proportion of all injured people *remained relatively constant*


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

haypoint said:


> The assumption of no common sense. In Gaylord, a railroad track runs through town, a block over from the highway. At each railroad crossing, at each cross street, there is a Yield sign. Really? When there is an oncoming train, you need reminded who has the right of way?


Yes they are needed. 
Not to tell you to yield but to remind you to look for the train. 
I’m often the new guy in town trying to find my turn out of a mass of confusing array of sigh s and avoiding moving and parked cars while herding 96 feet of unstable trucks with 2 out of 3 having no brakes. 
Yes I may not notice those tracks till I swing the corner.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Some of those figures show decreases compared to a few years ago.
> I suspect any increases are due simply to population growth.
> 
> 
> ...


Yep.
Did you take notice that the year they started using the new method ("a few years ago") the number of total accidents dropped almost half?
You could also quote the part on the last page where they realize these figures are underreported.
But that would make my point more valid wouldn't it?


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Anecdotal, but worth noting....our local paper runs court cases + arrests in a big list about once a month (probably because they lack for ads now days). Looking over yesterday's crowd of 312 names, 103 of them are either meth (yellow 25) other drugs (red 50) or alcohol (green 25). The majority of them are driving on revoked license (1st-4th time) because they already have a DUI/etc.
And these are just the ones that got caught. Tells me there are a WHOLE lot of folks out there driving impaired.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

I’ve seen statistics that say 28 million Americans admit to have driven under the influence last year. That’s nearly 10 percent of the population and surly a larger portion of drivers.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

How many drunk driving accidents with damage /injury to others where there. ?


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## Wolf mom (Mar 8, 2005)

How to lie with statistics in one easy lesson......


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

haypoint said:


> The assumption of no common sense. In Gaylord, a railroad track runs through town, a block over from the highway. At each railroad crossing, at each cross street, there is a Yield sign. Really? When there is an oncoming train, you need reminded who has the right of way?


There's a commercial on tv about reporting bad railroad crossings "because bad crossings kill good drivers". Yet there is a crossing near me that has no visibility and you really have to stop to look for a train. I can't tell you the people I've seen going across those tracks without even slowing down. A stop sign is now in place for the road, yet many people obviously don't know the meaning of the sign since they fly across the tracks without slowing down, still. I say bad railroad crossings kill bad drivers who can't wrap their pea brains around the fact that trains can't stop for them.



GTX63 said:


> The DMV handbook in all 50 states seems to have a typo in the chapter for "Merging From An On Ramp."
> It seems to state the proper way to merge onto an interstate is to maintain the same speed as the current traffic until you run out of ramp lane. Then display frustration with the vehicles currently on the interstate for not slowing down or speeding up, even if they are already boxed in.


I think Ohio has 2 different versions of how to merge. One is "follow the white line and never look to your left to see if another car is there. Don't worry, it will move for you". The other version says, " creep down the ramp at less than 50 mph and cut in front of the nearest vehicle as soon as possible. Then speed up to 75 mph and zip all the way to the furthest left lane without pausing or looking for other traffic".

A lot of accidents in Ohio go unreported. Get smashed all over the road and as long as you can move the cars or there are no injuries the police won't respond. Sure you are supposed to submit a report but why bother if the responsible driver admits fault and properly notifies their insurance company? I've been in a couple accidents where no report was filed.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

wdcutrsdaughter said:


> In my opinion, this is either brave or stupid. How did you know the mental state of the driver?
> People murder people and drive fast to get out of town.


You are right. I lived a while in Detroit and wouldn't unlock my door, much less get out. I was just outside Midland MI, an incredibly passive community. Standing joke about the trouble four way stops create in this town, everyone is so polite, there they sit, each driver motioning the other to go ahead.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> OK rumplestiltskin you must of been asleep for quite a while I’m pretty sure that started just after the 1940 opening of the Pennsylvania Turnpike ......
> Or maybe it started with the first soldier that tried to pass on the Roman roads?


OK, ya got me there. Most of the past 40 years in Michigan's Upper Peninsula. 2% of the state's population an half the land mass. But my 5 years in Detroit didn't seem that bad.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> You could also quote the part on the last page where they realize these figures are underreported.
> But that would make my point more valid wouldn't it?


I haven't seen a real "point".
You just keep showing links that don't really prove there's an "increase" in anything I've commented on.



farmrbrown said:


> Did you take notice that the year they started using the new method ("a few years ago") the number of total *accidents* dropped almost half?


I nor the OP never said a word about "accidents".
That's a rabbit trial you ran down all by yourself.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> How many drunk driving accidents with damage /injury to others where there. ?


You asking me ? No clue.....they don't list it by what happened, just the charges placed. I assume some are accidents, since the charges include "leaving the scene"....but other than that, an accident itself doesn't result in a charge of 'accident', so there's no way to tell.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Wolf mom said:


> How to lie with statistics in one easy lesson......



Directed at who, meaning what ?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

TnAndy said:


> You asking me ? No clue.....they don't list it by what happened, just the charges placed. I assume some are accidents, since the charges include "leaving the scene"....but other than that, an accident itself doesn't result in a charge of 'accident', so there's no way to tell.


Isn’t that a interesting point ?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Isn’t that a interesting point ?


I don't think it's a "point" at all.

"Leaving the scene" implies there was some sort of "accident", otherwise there's no "scene" to leave.
There doesn't have to be an accident to be charged with a moving violation though.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Danaus29 said:


> I think Ohio has 2 different versions of how to merge.... The other version says, " creep down the ramp at less than 50 mph and cut in front of the nearest vehicle as soon as possible. Then speed up to 75 mph and zip all the way to the furthest left lane without pausing or looking for other traffic"...


The NC book has a version similar to OH’s second, but it specifies 35 mph down the on ramp, immediately throw yourself into the “_I’m important, and need to be somewhere lane_”. (Seriously, that’s what it’s called here. Our left-lane restriction signs are a mess to read at speed.), and then begin accelerating to highway speed... at a rate that gets you up to speed in three miles or less... or that which throws the fewest loose parts off your car, whichever is longer.



Ohhhh... and it all has to be done without turn signals. The law actually specifies that indicator lights on cars sold in NC have to be decals, since they have less drag than actual light bezels.

Sos ah ken go fayus, jus lak mah diddy’s favrut rayscor mayun.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Most everyone complained generations ago about poor drivers and blamed it on just being an idiot.
"Sunday Driver" was the popular description. "They've never had an accident but they have sure caused plenty" my dad would say.
The alcohol/dui became so widespread and a serious issue that became a decades-long national focus.
My opinion is that cell phones are potentially more distracting and lethal than booze or grandma has been or will ever be.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Granny going slow on the interstate is less dangerous than the texting driver riding her bumper that waits until another car is passing before whipping out inches in front of them, no signal while waving a middle finger, then hitting the gas and getting it up to 90 mph in 100 feet. Actually had a motorcycle do that to me a few months back.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

My youngest son has a phone app that can track his friend locations. A little avatar/photo of them shows up moving along a live map with their current road speed. His girlfriend has numerous friends that, I call "text bombing" while they are behind the wheel.
Two to three messages a minute going out to different people while they are driving.
Several of them cannot even wait for the phone to refresh. He says they will pull up to red light and immediately check their phones. Zero attention span or awareness of their immediate surroundings.
I just read where the local, county and state police will be actively watching for texting drivers over the 4th of July holiday.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Unfortunately in Ohio, texting whie driving is a secondary offense. You have to commit a traffic violation before police can pull you over. But from what I have seen, texters, and many phone talkers, commit several violations over a few hundred feet. Hubby gets mad when I yell at other drivers to get off the bleeping phone.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Danaus29 said:


> Granny going slow on the interstate is less dangerous than the texting driver riding her bumper that waits until another car is passing before whipping out inches in front of them, no signal while waving a middle finger, then hitting the gas and getting it up to 90 mph in 100 feet. Actually had a motorcycle do that to me a few months back.


 Texting on a motorcycle ?


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

The thing that kills me about the texting drivers is that phones have voice to text. Or better yet, CALL the person you are so desperately in need of sending a text message to. At least you can look at the road while you're doing that.

Ugh. Humans.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> Texting on a motorcycle ?


Yep! I didn't believe it when I saw it! But there he was, holding the phone out texting while going down the road, slowly approaching a line of stopped traffic. I was worried he was going to smash into the back of my van.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I admit that there have been times when I have talked on the phone while driving. But there really is no phone call or text that is so important it can't wait until you have parked. 20 years ago you actually had to be at home to have a phone conversation. Now people in the toilet stall next to you are gabbing on the phone about nonsense. Just put the phone away. If it's important the caller will leave a message.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

It strikes me that years ago when my cell phone was in the bag called the brick talking on the cell phone really wasn’t much different than talking on the CB. It’s the introduction of the television screen that caused so much distraction.


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## hiddensprings (Aug 6, 2009)

I find that even the nicest people you meet turn into total buttheads when they get behind the wheel.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I don't think it's a "point" at all.
> 
> "Leaving the scene" implies there was some sort of "accident", otherwise there's no "scene" to leave.
> There doesn't have to be an accident to be charged with a moving violation though.





Bearfootfarm said:


> I haven't seen a real "point".
> You just keep showing links that don't really prove there's an "increase" in anything I've commented on.
> 
> 
> ...


It took a while but I see what hair you're splitting now.......

You need to see the "proof" of near accidents/close calls - not the documented results when the other driver isn't fast enough or good enough to avoid them.


Well, you're right again, that documented data doesn't exist on paper, just in the minds and memories of those who were there.
That proof will only become apparent to you on the day when it's too late to see it..........


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## [email protected] (Sep 16, 2009)

I used to pick up my mother after her church let out.
It always amused/amazed me how rude the people leaving the church parking lot were.
didn't they learn anything that day ?? lol.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Yes we have a church like that here they talked the village into putting up four-way stops on both corners of the block of Main Street their church is on. 
So now on Sunday after church they can all leave in 15 minutes Without waiting on the one or two possible vehicles that might come down that road while the mass is leaving. 
Lol but of course Instead of waiting on that one car to pass 
They should but don’t All stop at the stop sign. 
Of course the villagers have to stop for the other 167 hours and 45 minutes of the week


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> Well, you're right again, that documented data *doesn't exist* on paper, just in the minds and memories of those who were there.


I knew that all along.
You're still trying to convince me it does, even when you know it doesn't.



> That *proof* will only become apparent to you on the day when it's too late to see it......


I have all the proof I need regarding your claims. 
It doesn't lie.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I had one of those lane changers in front of me today. He was pulling a trailer with no lights and cut me off not once but twice. The second time was just after a turn lane opened and he didn't get into the lane right away but waited until I was almost beside him to change lanes.


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

I think one reason there are more bad drivers is because there are more drivers. I know people say it it the city drivers who are the worst and they are pretty bad but country drivers can be awful both on country roads and especially when they go to the city. At least that is our experience. And now that we live in an area that is mostly wilderness it is obvious that people here do not know how to use turn signals, stop signs or lights, or traffic circles. Changing lanes? Not a problem or even necessary as everyone drives down the middle of the road. Why not? Your chances of meeting someone on a 600 km journey are very remote except on the Alaska Highway. Of course hogging the center line leads to lots of horn honking and swearing in our small cities as you can't pass.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I knew that all along.



Oh yeah, I'm quite sure about that.
Patterns never change.
As I've learned, you often have to play along with a con man until you determine what he's really up to, but eventually you figure it out.


> You're still trying to convince me it does, even when you know it doesn't.


Nope.
Another thing I learned is, a con man is so good, he can con himself.
There's no way to convince him of anything.
Just play along, watch and learn.


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## [email protected] (Sep 16, 2009)

i was riding, wife was driving. a lady came down the on ramp. there was a car right along side of us. we could not change lanes. there were no cars behind us for a mile.
this "lady" came along side of us expecting us to pull over. we couldn't. then she blows her horn and waves at us with one finger. In wisc. it is up to the oncoming car to fit into the traffic on the highway it is merging to
the main trouble with people is they have the "entitled" attitude.. they come first, nobody else matters.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> As I've learned, you often have to play along with a con man until you determine what he's really up to, but eventually you figure it out.


More rambling.



farmrbrown said:


> Nope.
> Another thing I learned is, a con man is so good, he can con himself.


You may be conning yourself.
You're not fooling me.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

[email protected] said:


> i was riding, wife was driving. a lady came down the on ramp. there was a car right along side of us. we could not change lanes. there were no cars behind us for a mile.
> this "lady" came along side of us expecting us to pull over. we couldn't. then she blows her horn and waves at us with one finger. In wisc. it is up to the oncoming car to fit into the traffic on the highway it is merging to
> the main trouble with people is they have the "entitled" attitude.. they come first, nobody else matters.


Yes, that entitled thingy is pretty common, but for the most part, I think people are just ignorant of the laws and don't care to learn them or keep up to date.


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## light rain (Jan 14, 2013)

TnAndy said:


> Anecdotal, but worth noting....our local paper runs court cases + arrests in a big list about once a month (probably because they lack for ads now days). Looking over yesterday's crowd of 312 names, 103 of them are either meth (yellow 25) other drugs (red 50) or alcohol (green 25). The majority of them are driving on revoked license (1st-4th time) because they already have a DUI/etc.
> And these are just the ones that got caught. Tells me there are a WHOLE lot of folks out there driving impaired.


There it is in black, white, red and yellow. No guessing...


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)




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## light rain (Jan 14, 2013)

haypoint said:


>


If it wasn't so durn hot I get up and show this to DH...


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

haypoint said:


>


I have been threatening to do this for years and after seeing this I don't know why I didn't.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Lol lots of trucks have this on the back. 
No one pays any attention to them.


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

AmericanStand said:


> Lol lots of trucks have this on the back.
> No one pays any attention to them.


Maybe it needs to be accompanied by a good loud honk and a certain finger? lol


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Mish said:


> Maybe it needs to be accompanied by a good loud honk and a certain finger? lol


Oddly enough I think that often it is ....


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

and the results can usually be found on youtube or the 5 pm news.


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