# Feeding chickens post SHTF



## shanzone2001 (Dec 3, 2009)

Every time I go to the feed store and stock up on animal feed, I always wonder how long until that is no longer an option.

Here comes the gross part......I have heard about "maggot bags" for chickens and would like to know more in case I need to rely on them for protein for my chickens (they free range but are supplemented with pellets).

What I do know is you put anthing that can spoil (leftover parts from butchering are common) in a bag and hang it. What kind of bag? How many chickens per bag?

Thanks!!!


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

they prefer worms but they will eat maggots....I feed "junk" fish whole...I cook it outside on the fire pit and let it cool.....


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

cooked zombie wouldn't hurt them either....


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## shanzone2001 (Dec 3, 2009)

Double gross!!!!


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## Debbie in Wa (Dec 28, 2007)

Here ya go

Chicken Treat Chart The Best Treats For Backyard Chickens - BackYard Chickens Community

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2653

Feeding chickens meat scraps (critter care forum at permies)


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

Chickens can and will eat about anything, their very survival would only come into question in the winter when there isn't anything to forage. But unless they are getting a balanced diet with enough protein and calcium, egg production isn't going to be very good.


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## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

Chickens can feed themselves if you let them free range an area. They just won't starve even if you feed them leftover scraps and let them free range in an area.


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## OkieDavid (Jan 15, 2007)

Take a mesh bag like an onion sack and just suspend the scraps high enough off the ground to keep critters out of it. Once the maggots drop to the gound to pupate, the chickens can get them. Note: that is also a method used "down South" to "bait" a favorite fishing hole. Suspend the bag from a tree limb above the water and the maggots fall into the water and attract the smaller fish which attract the larger fish.....


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## unregistered168043 (Sep 9, 2011)

Not sure how much space you have but I have been growing feed corn and beans for my chickens. They also free range and get scraps and recycled eggs. Once in a while I'll run out of corn or whatever and breakdown and buy a bag of feed.

If things went really sour I would butcher most of my birds and keep about 6 good layers and a couple roosters. That would cut my feed needs down quite a bit but still provide me with more than enough eggs and the potential to regrow/regenerate my flock whenever.


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## kasilofhome (Feb 10, 2005)

I do fish and take in fish guts. All animal used for meat for us the inners go to the birds. I have done the bug deal with the fish I simply put it where I did not have to watch. Lots of them and then the next spring take them down. It works. Cabbage and beets store well. exesss milk and whey is also given.


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

shanzone2001 said:


> Every time I go to the feed store and stock up on animal feed, I always wonder how long until that is no longer an option.
> 
> Here comes the gross part......I have heard about "maggot bags" for chickens and would like to know more in case I need to rely on them for protein for my chickens (they free range but are supplemented with pellets).
> 
> ...


Let's say you had good hay & ran it through your chipper/shredder ?
They'd eat that wouldn't they ? Like in winter if there wasn't much else ?
And w/any of the animals, you might pare back the numbers to just enough to start again in the spring, right ?


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## Guest (May 21, 2012)

Forget the maggots and just feed the meat directly to the birds. You'll get a lot more efficient use of the protein, a lot less stink, and eliminate the risk of botulism to your birds.

In a real SHTF situation everyone is going to end up having to free range just as soon as they are able to eliminate the local predators. Which is likely to happen fairly quickly since many of them are highly edible.

In a real free-range situation the limiting nutrient is usually going to be carbohydrates. In which case you would want to focus on growing something you can feed to the birds that supplies them - some sort of grain, pumpkins, potatoes, whatever will grow best in your climate.


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## shanzone2001 (Dec 3, 2009)

A.T. Hagan said:


> Forget the maggots and just feed the meat directly to the birds. You'll get a lot more efficient use of the protein, a lot less stink, and eliminate the risk of botulism to your birds.
> 
> In a real SHTF situation everyone is going to end up having to free range just as soon as they are able to eliminate the local predators. Which is likely to happen fairly quickly since many of them are highly edible.
> 
> In a real free-range situation the limiting nutrient is usually going to be carbohydrates. In which case you would want to focus on growing something you can feed to the birds that supplies them - some sort of grain, pumpkins, potatoes, whatever will grow best in your climate.




Your way is definitely less disgusting!
As I said, mine free range during the day and knowing what they need to add to that is helpful...I grow lots of squash and potatoes and can certainly grow more to feed the chickens.
Thanks.....


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## olivehill (Aug 17, 2009)

Humans find a lot of perfectly edible things unpalatable. Fortunately, chickens have no such biases. Range 'em, toss 'em your kitchen scraps, plant a few extra squashes, pumpkins, potatoes, etc for them and they'll be fine.


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## ovsfarm (Jan 14, 2003)

Do you think it would be beneficial to "harvest" just the tops of the orchard grass that grows everywhere around here on old hay fields? The heads seed out and then the farmers usually cut and bale it before the heads shatter and the seed falls to the ground. What if I just went out and used some of those hand shears and chopped about 8 - 10 inches off the top (where the seeds are), dried that well and then tossed it in a bunker until winter?

I'd have to estimate how much I wanted to feed out per day, how many days I planned to feed, etc. to figure out how much to cut. I could have my 13yo dd push the wheelbarrow along to gather it. IMO, the biggest problem would be finding a place to dry it without the chickens gobbling it up early, and good rodent-proof storage.

I assume I could later then use a shovel and pitch fork to toss out enough to keep the carb offering up a bit all winter long.

I suppose if I was totally crazy and without other resources, I could "thresh" the seeds off the heads of the haystalks and just store that, but it seems like an awful lot of work. I'd rather just chop the tops and then let the hens use their time scratching out the seeds. That would keep them productively busy and happy during the long, dark days.


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## goatlady (May 31, 2002)

chickens are not ruminent so they would not/do not eat hay much less be able to digest it and get any nutrition, rick. Totally different digestive system.


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## gunsmithgirl (Sep 28, 2003)

I free range my chickens, it's amazing what they find to eat. We have a pond, they will pick out tadpoles and catch frogs. I had a good laugh the other day watching one try to eat a baby snapping turtle. I hardly ever feed my chickens commercial feed. I bought a 50 lb bag in late fall and it is still 1/4 full. Everyone says you gotta feed commercial feed to get good egg production, but I still get 1 egg per chicken per day, so somethings gotta be right!


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

How about grubs? I have a pile of shreded leaves full of them. The dirt underneath is also wonderful.


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## Horse Fork Farm (Jan 3, 2006)

I remember reading not to feed maggots to poultry because of botulism and some other disease. You can grow the old time Mangel-Wurzels for stock feed. They grow huge, but need to be chopped up with a hatchet bite size for small animals.


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## Cliff (Jun 30, 2007)

goatlady said:


> chickens are not ruminent so they would not/do not eat hay much less be able to digest it and get any nutrition, rick. Totally different digestive system.


But they are omnivores and do eat grass and clover and such when free ranging. They love leafy alfalfa hay. I don't know how much they could use straight grass hay, seems like the long fibrous grasses might cause them to become crop bound. But if you could make clover hay or really weedy hay they could use that.


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## Cliff (Jun 30, 2007)

Seems like the maggots would be more efficient than feeding the straight carcass and they would stretch out the feeding time as they would drop off in groups over time. I think in the past this method was used with carcasses that were found? Seems safer as far as botulism goes than just feeding straight rotten meat. Just conjecture though, could be totally wrong  Ugh and it would keep your birds clean - picture gathering eggs that smell like a carcass from the birds getting rot on them then "cleaning" themselves, spreading the smell everywhere.

I have a strong stomach - really strong - but would be seriously unhappy about smelling a carcass for a week at a time on an ongoing basis. But you do what you have to do.

eta - thinking I read somewhere about how to do this with the carcass in a mostly closed bucket which helped contain the stench some, is that familiar to anyone?


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

goatlady said:


> chickens are not ruminent so they would not/do not eat hay much less be able to digest it and get any nutrition, rick. Totally different digestive system.


Ah, but if you google this you will see that chickens do eat some hay - the leaves are grass & chickens eat some grass. What they don't eat will make good absorbant in the coop. Of course this gets more cost-efficient if you are making your own hay.
Are rabbits ruminants ? Do rabbits like good hay ?
I was speaking of a post-shtf era when chickens (& others) will be hungry .


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

shanzone2001 said:


> Every time I go to the feed store and stock up on animal feed, I always wonder how long until that is no longer an option.
> 
> Here comes the gross part......I have heard about "maggot bags" for chickens and would like to know more in case I need to rely on them for protein for my chickens (they free range but are supplemented with pellets).
> 
> ...


Okay, I know this is a hot subject w/people perhaps rightly up in arms against it, but what is the experience here w/Amaranth ?
Yes, I realise it is invasive before y'all beat me with that !
Edible foliage & seeds galore ??


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## Pouncer (Oct 28, 2006)

This subject is of real concern to me, feed for poultry and small livestock.

To that end, I got some mangel wurzel seeds and have shared them with some people up here. I have some prestarted, because they are 78 day plants which is really pushing it for Alaska. I'll be putting them in several places, to see which type of environment they do the best in.

So, they are a long storing, fodder beet, and can get to 20 pounds, each. All parts are edible for humans and critters


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## gracie88 (May 29, 2007)

> Are rabbits ruminants ? Do rabbits like good hay ?


Yes, though their digestive system is set up a little differently than hoofed ruminants.


> What I do know is you put anthing that can spoil (leftover parts from butchering are common) in a bag and hang it. What kind of bag? How many chickens per bag?


Here's a fancy DIY setup, BSF bucket composter v2.1 Â» Black Soldier Fly Blog though I have to say, I feed the scraps and would not do maggots unless there was no other option.


> what is the experience here w/Amaranth


Love it, but it's hard to get it harvested here before the rains come some years which makes it undependable.

Compost is another option. If you let your chickens spread compost for you, they can find an astounding amount of worms and other goodies.

Partly, what you supplement your chickens is dependent on where you live, you want to look at what they can't forage on their own. For example, here in the PNW, it rains all winter which brings the worms and slugs out which means that there is plenty of protein laying on the ground most days. In the winter I supplement with grain and a little oyster shell, which would translate to roots and winter squash if I was growing my own. In the summer everything dries out, worms and slugs go into hiding, and by August, most of the leafy greens are only in my garden (aka: chicken Nirvana). At that point I have to supply protein in the form of butchering and garden scraps but they are getting plenty of carbs from blackberries and other fruits. Many places have harsh winters or summers, or different natural sources of protein, etc.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

I'm telling you...where I live winter feed will be frozen zombie....no stink....hack off a piece and cook it to be on the safe side and listen to those happy chicken noises! LOL


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

rickfrosty said:


> Okay, I know this is a hot subject w/people perhaps rightly up in arms against it, but what is the experience here w/Amaranth ?
> Yes, I realise it is invasive before y'all beat me with that !
> Edible foliage & seeds galore ??


I grow a small amount of amaranth for my quail each year. It is easy to grow and can be harvested by hand. For my chickens, I grow turnips. They love to get them in the winter when they don't have access to other veggies. Of course, I only supplement with them and haven't tried to use them as their primary food. I also have raised mealworms in the past. They were very easy and they lived off a few veggie scraps and oatmeal.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

I've thought about the amaranth. It does grow wild here and there. think its from the birds spreading it,from seed.

I've had the Aquaculture thing on my list for a long time.
My mom back in the 80's got real interested in it, or M.E.N.S version.
I don't remember exactly how the did it, but they had the plants,fish,rabbits and worms.
I will be doing similar. 
I think all the fish by product (guts,scraps) will go to the birds, along with the rabbit offal. Some of the worms,waste plant material and surplus. 
I was thinking of using one tank just for chicken feed,guppy's maybe? 
I also want to grow duck weed. for the fish and birds.

Feeding maggots you have to be carefull. Botulism is a real risk. If for some reason you consumed a bird that was effected you very well could die. every year a few duck hunters die this way. ducks get it from contaminated water. filth flys though get it from contaminated food. either way it can be passed down the food chain.

I posted on this subject before. Your better off feeding direct and cut out the fly or their is another grub (maggot) the Black soldier fly, they do not have the botulism risk and are easy to grow. if your in a warm part of the country you probably have them in your compost pile right now. they eat decaying vegetative material that you may not be able to feed directly and have a good conversion ratio. you can then feed the leftovers to the worm bed. One guy sells them commercially as phoenix worms. you can also buy or build a self harvesting system. their really neat. mostly protein with a good amount of fat. Some folks are looking at collecting the oil.

I may incorporate them into the aquapod I'm working on. Windward farms was working with them they used a old deep freeze chest to grow theirs.


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## olivehill (Aug 17, 2009)

goatlady said:


> chickens are not ruminent so they would not/do not eat hay much less be able to digest it and get any nutrition, rick. Totally different digestive system.


Yes, they will and do. Ours eat hay now, every single winter. Grass and legume forages are a normal part of a chicken's natural diet.


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## whodunit (Mar 29, 2004)

We feed our chickens grass clippings all the time. They don't gorge themselves on it, but they do eat alot of it and really like to scratch through it.


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## mommathea (May 27, 2009)

My grandma talks about what they did durring the depression. They could not afford to feed chickens over winter so they butchured all but 3-4 hens (marking and saving the known broodies) and 1 rooster each fall. Then come spring they'd let 2 hens set on a large clutch and raise those up to eating age. They free ranged all day and got one tiny cup of scraps in the evening so they could lock them up.


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

In a true SHTF situation that going to last several months, unless you have the property type where you are able to allow your chickens (or other livestock for that matter) to free range and enough land to grow a feeder crop, we'll have to eliminate our livestock. There won't be 'scraps' leftover (those will feed the family), brought in bugs won't feed a whole flock daily, and hay will not be available due to the cost of harvesting/not enough money to buy it/too expensive/etc. 

Even if you do have the ability to grow your own livestock feed, all it takes is one bad drought, too much rain, or some sort of environmental SHTF and that plan is toast. Same with regular gardens. 

Besides, I'm willing to bet that most livestock would end up coming up missing overnight due to starving people looking for something - anything - to eat; as well as every veggie in the garden.

IMHO, livestock during a true SHTF will be a liability and people over estimate a garden feeding the family during that time too. 

Having sufficient food canned or dehydrated will be a much better investment in time and money, as well as peace of mind. At least it's behind closed door and not out in view for scavengers as well as you're not at the mercy of mother nature for your food survival.


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## DryHeat (Nov 11, 2010)

We have a lot of Gambel's quail around here and I notice that they, and English sparrows, are strongly drawn to pecking the leaves of oriental/ Ichiban eggplant, even as the plants get quite a bit of size on them. Other stuff like squash, beans, tomatoes, okra, peppers all get experimentally pecked when they're very small but not so much as they get a little size. I wonder if there's some especially useful nutrient like calcium in those eggplant leaves? Anyway, chickens would seem similar to quail, so possibly it would help to plant some number extra of the Ichiban variety, perhaps caging them some with chickenwire coils so outer leaves are accessible as they grow but the core of the plant is protected? I'm trying again with a few black beauty variety standard eggplants this summer, too, and don't notice the bird predation on them much at all, but again quite a bit of pecking at the orientals. They're heat-loving, so might not do well in northern shorter seasons, though.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Karen,

are you not always at natures mercy? 
You could loose your stores to flood or fire, or even a drought.
No water doesn't matter how much food you have and can you transport it all?
Wild life could also factor even if its the new feral human...

What happens when your stored food runs out?

How do you replace it?

Do not think for a minuet just because you have your store out of sight it will be out of mind. Someone will figure you have a stash... 

Then what?

I think storage is a key part but I also think you need a contingency plan to survive beyond that. To me that is livestock and garden.

I'm concentrating on small stock for a reason.

But your post kind of reminded me of the way my dad thought.
Every time I would leave he would be so worried I was going to get myself killed.
I always told him "I could die just as easy and far more likely slipping in the shower or tripping down the steps." 
Guess I'm saying you can play it safe and still die!

The critters and garden may not keep me fat and sassy but may mean survival till something better comes along.
When there is no job to go to, no real place to be, there will be plenty of time to work at such endeavors.
though if you wait till these things are worth their weight in gold,you may not have the chance.


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## Glacialtill (Aug 16, 2010)

Why wait for the end of the world? Your chickens are hungry right now.

I've been doing a bunch of research/reading on black soldier fly larvae as a chicken feed since I first heard of them a few years back and then realized that's what those grubs were in my compost pile. Unlike other fly "maggots" they are not disease vectors and can "self harvest" if you set up a simple diy system. I'm going to give it a try this year.

This is a great place to start for info:

Black Soldier Fly, White Magic

And then there's this great article about feeding your chickens from what you can produce yourself on the homestead:

Feeding the Flock from the Homestead's Own Resources: Part One

Both written by Harvey Ussery, chicken guru/genius.

Check it out.


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

gracie88 said:


> Yes, though their digestive system is set up a little differently than hoofed ruminants.
> Here's a fancy DIY setup, BSF bucket composter v2.1 Â» Black Soldier Fly Blog though I have to say, I feed the scraps and would not do maggots unless there was no other option.
> Love it, but it's hard to get it harvested here before the rains come some years which makes it undependable.
> 
> ...


Thank you, and I like your Chesterton quote - I have said that "I have excellent concentration, it's just that it may not be focused on what is in front of me ?"


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

mpillow said:


> they prefer worms but they will eat maggots....I feed "junk" fish whole...I cook it outside on the fire pit and let it cool.....


Interesting - 'suckers', or perch, or ?


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## rickfrosty (Jun 19, 2008)

Debbie in Wa said:


> Here ya go
> 
> Chicken Treat Chart The Best Treats For Backyard Chickens - BackYard Chickens Community
> 
> ...


Thank you for posting all this info. My chickens used to love styrofoam ?! If gravel had sunk down around foundation insulation - they ate the insul. off my house !!


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

rickfrosty said:


> Thank you for posting all this info. My chickens used to love styrofoam ?! If gravel had sunk down around foundation insulation - they ate the insul. off my house !!


Ours too....natural (un natural?) wormer....LOL


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## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

Not to drift, but maggots have botulism? Can someone elaborate on this?


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Mine will eat alfalfa leaves, but very little of the local hay. 

My birds free range. I feed them about five pounds a day (200? maybe 400 with chicks)... to keep em close to the house.


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## SmokyShadow (May 19, 2007)

lonelyfarmgirl said:


> Not to drift, but maggots have botulism? Can someone elaborate on this?



I haven't heard of this, either, but here is a link:

USGS National Wildlife Health Center - Avian Botulism


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Yup just read through that link SmokyShadow posted and remember Spoiled grain can be a vector also.

Oldtimers called it limberneck.


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## Macrocarpus (Jan 30, 2018)

On the fish: Chickens will eat raw fish, just do not put out so much that it rots before they can clean it up or they will get limber-neck. There was a rime when an uncle had a flock of 400 free-range hens on his farm. We caught and split a six-foot gar, put it in the pasture and by the next day there was nothing but the shell and bones. every bit of meat gone, eaten by the hens. Picked clean as if ants had worked on it for a month.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Original post is 8 years old but the concern and info are still relevant. Maybe more so now with covid shortages.


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## Zombie pizza (8 mo ago)

shanzone2001 said:


> Every time I go to the feed store and stock up on animal feed, I always wonder how long until that is no longer an option.
> 
> Here comes the gross part......I have heard about "maggot bags" for chickens and would like to know more in case I need to rely on them for protein for my chickens (they free range but are supplemented with pellets).
> 
> ...


Start and keep a big worm bin, good for chickens, good for your garden too.


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## Chief50 (10 mo ago)

If it comes to that turn those chickens loose. They will probably last longer than you will.


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

When I was a kid, we didn't feed our chickens any kind of special "chicken food". They free ranged around the barnyard, and got a pan of table scraps in the evening. And some of them would run the dogs off, and eat the dog food. Which were usually more table scraps. In the winter we would shell a five gallon bucket of field corn, with an old hand crank corn sheller, And keep a pan of crushed sea shells for them to pick through, to keep their crops working.

In the rural villages in Mexico, you will see chickens roaming the dirt streets. In the evening they all go home to their own coop. They seem to know where home is, and a pan of tale scraps and bits of stuff left over from butchering beef, or a goat.


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## BadOregon (12 mo ago)

I have goats. The chickens get into the compost pile and have lots of food. Not to mention the added turning of the compost. They are pretty much free range. I throw them table scraps when we have them and a handful of grain 
scratch (which I could grow in the garden if necessary).


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## stamphappy (Jul 29, 2010)

kasilofhome said:


> I do fish and take in fish guts. All animal used for meat for us the inners go to the birds. I have done the bug deal with the fish I simply put it where I did not have to watch. Lots of them and then the next spring take them down. It works. Cabbage and beets store well. exesss milk and whey is also given.


Hi, when you say excess milk and whey, do you mean in liquid form?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Yes. What other form could it be?


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

stamphappy said:


> Hi, when you say excess milk and whey, do you mean in liquid form?


Chickens know how to drink liquids.

Or you can use it to make mash if there isn't a lot of milk and you have the grain to make mash. they will eat that just fine.


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## BadOregon (12 mo ago)

My chickens love milk. It also gives them added calcium for their eggshells.


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

Pouncer said:


> This subject is of real concern to me, feed for poultry and small livestock.
> 
> To that end, I got some mangel wurzel seeds and have shared them with some people up here. I have some prestarted, because they are 78 day plants which is really pushing it for Alaska. I'll be putting them in several places, to see which type of environment they do the best in.
> 
> So, they are a long storing, fodder beet, and can get to 20 pounds, each. All parts are edible for humans and critters


We raise mangel wurzel here, but grow them longer than 78 days. We're in Zone 6. We seed in early Spring (when we can break up the soil and the cold doesn't trigger bone-deep pain in our hands), and keep on top of weeds and varmints.

Goats like 'em, chickens like 'em, even the steer likes 'em. 

We are still looking for a good way to store them over Winter, though. A clamp we built did not really keep them well at all.

As for other SHTF animal and human fare, Jerusalem artichokes can be eaten by one and all. Once established, it's darned near impossible to kill off.

Chickens are (as DH says), "Nom-nivores." They'll eat just about anything. We have friends who feed their chooks on a handful of grain a day, as well as table scraps. They'll eat pumpkins, melons, meat scraps... Extra eggs, surplus milk, whey from cheesemaking...

When it comes to poultry, I love Spring/Summer/Fall best, because our free ranging birds do very well with the bare minimum of feed from us.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Pony said:


> We raise mangel wurzel here, but grow them longer than 78 days. We're in Zone 6. We seed in early Spring (when we can break up the soil and the cold doesn't trigger bone-deep pain in our hands), and keep on top of weeds and varmints.


What do you use to chop them up with?


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

TxMex said:


> What do you use to chop them up with?


A sharp knife. LOL

We don't have one of those fancy cutters, but we don't have a lot of animals, either. 

And now my mangel harvest, if I get one at all, will be minimal. Blasted Bambi and his buddies showed up, decimated my sweet potatoes and mangels.

Flippin' varmints....


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