# Trying New Diet



## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Actually, it's an old diet that worked for me several years ago to reach the lowest weight in at least 20 years. The thing is I didn't document what I was eating and when I tried to replicate it, it didn't work.

But I think I figured it out. FISH!

I was preparing for an appt with a new doctor and was reviewing a DNA analysis I did a few years ago. I found this (for several different SNP's (gene variants)), and for some reason I picked up on the cut saturated fat and increase monounsaturated fat, but missed increasing the polyunsaturated fat.

*"associated with a 2.76-fold increased risk for obesity*, particularly in the context of a high saturated fat and low polyunsaturated fat intake ratio. ...
may benefit by having a _*higher polyunsaturated fat*_ intake to saturated fat ratio."

"This genotype reduces thermogenesis (the burning of fat to produce heat) in response to cold exposure and this genotype and may result in less fat burning in adipose tissue during cold exposure. A possible way around this defect could be _*fish oil supplementation*_ because fish oil activates UCP1 and can increase thermogenesis."

*"associated with a 1.7-fold increased obesity risk*. Saturated fat may have a negative effect on blood glucose and insulin levels and increases type 2 diabetes risk in individuals with this genotype.

Other gene polymorphisms in the FTO gene are also associated with _*obesity*__*, particularly in the context of a high saturated fat and low polyunsaturated fat intake."*_

*"You may have an abnormal fat metabolism*. When people with the genotype (C,G) or (G,G) have a low polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fat intake and a high saturated fat intake then their obesity and type 2 diabetes risks are dramatically increased. But when there is *a higher mono- and poly-unsaturated intake and a lower saturated fat intake their obesity and type 2 diabetes risk is normal. Polyunsaturated fatty acids activate the PPAR-gamma gene."
*
"This suggests that individuals that are at high risk of obesity due to FTO polymorphisms, such as this one, _*may benefit by having a higher polyunsaturated fat intake and a lower saturated fat intake.*_"​For the last couple of years I have cut saturated fat (check), increased monounsaturated fat (check), but I didn't increase the good kind of polyunsaturated fat.

Polyunsaturated fats can be Omega 3's like fish or Omega 6's like corn oil or soybean oil. Ideally the ratio (Omega 6/Omega 3) should be 4:1 or lower, but in a SAD diet it is often 16:1. When I thought of polyunsaturated fat I thought of just the Omega 6 side, and really missed the boat.

All these SNP's are saying "Eat More Fish". For some people, it's Fish before Meat.

Just bought gulf shrimp, scallops, and cod. Already have smoked oysters. For 30 days I will eat fish/seafood at least twice a day. Worst case, I throw a can of tuna fish on a salad.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Avocado, too.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

There is noting "worse" about eating fish on your salad!

Dang, that sounds GOOD!


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Avocado, too.


Hate them.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

More for me!


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

Too much fish. It is not good for you given the toxins they absorb and no real fish is free of these given the state of the oceans and lakes. Add nuts and seeds. Increase veggies and fruit especially those you have control over because you know the source or grow your own. Use lots of oils - good for salad dressings. Flax seed oil has omega-3s and omega-6s. Canola oil has omega-3s. Grape seed, hemp seed, borage, black currant, evening primrose, soybean, cottonseed and safflower oil have omega-6s. Sesame and olive oil have omega-9 fats. No oils contain all three types of fat.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Canola oil......ick.


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

if that's the case I should be dead. I eat fish every day of my life for many years. well all my life I guess. I do know dad started me on cod tongues before I could walk. I don't eat farmed fish though. ~Georgia


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Humans survived for eons on whatever they could catch where they lived.

Eat what makes you happy.


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## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

MoonRiver said:


> ...
> 
> *"You may have an abnormal fat metabolism*. When people with the genotype (C,G) or (G,G) have a low polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fat intake and a high saturated fat intake then their obesity and type 2 diabetes risks are dramatically increased. But when there is *a higher mono- and poly-unsaturated intake and a lower saturated fat intake their obesity and type 2 diabetes risk is normal. Polyunsaturated fatty acids activate the PPAR-gamma gene."
> *​...


And WHICH particular genes are you referring to, as to the C,G and G,G? It seems I remember, there are three main FTO genes...

Who did your DNA analysis?

Mon


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

frogmammy said:


> And WHICH particular genes are you referring to, as to the C,G and G,G? It seems I remember, there are three main FTO genes...
> 
> Who did your DNA analysis?
> 
> Mon


It was in the quote. The PPAR-gamma gene. The SNP is
rs1801282.

There is only 1 FTO gene. An analogy of a gene is address, it's a collection of information; ie address would be street, city, state, zip. These different "fields" are called alleles, of which you get 1 from your mother and 1 from your father. A SNP is when your pair of alleles is different from the common pair shared by most people. A SNP has to include at least 1% of the population or else it is just called a mutation.

So within the FTO gene, there are many alleles. Some are associated with obesity, one with Alzheimers, one with metabolic syndrome., etc

First I did 23andMe to get my DNA. Then I ran it through https://www.foundmyfitness.com/genetics. I think she asks for a donation but not required. Her (Dr Rhonda Patrick) app only analyzes a few specific genes. Fortunately, the genes she analyzes gave me the clues I needed.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

emdeengee said:


> Too much fish. It is not good for you given the toxins they absorb and no real fish is free of these given the state of the oceans and lakes. Add nuts and seeds. Increase veggies and fruit especially those you have control over because you know the source or grow your own. Use lots of oils - good for salad dressings. Flax seed oil has omega-3s and omega-6s. Canola oil has omega-3s. Grape seed, hemp seed, borage, black currant, evening primrose, soybean, cottonseed and safflower oil have omega-6s. Sesame and olive oil have omega-9 fats. No oils contain all three types of fat.


Oils are processed foods and extremely high in calories.

Fish are not the problem you make them out to be.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

This diet has a chance of working for weight loss, if you weigh portions and track calories, and eat at a caloric deficit. Or if you are just lucky enough to randomly eat at a caloric deficit, which is highly unlikely on the long term. With this diet, you might even come close to getting enough protein to not lose a lot of muscle while dieting, which would reduce your caloric needs thereby making your deficit disappear, stalling weight loss. Most fad diets can't accomplish this. I would educate myself on PCB contamination, however, before going this route. Well no, actually I would stick with what I am doing and eat ice cream, yummy bread, carbs, and whatever else I want, and lose weight reliably and predictably.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Does a calorie count less if you weigh it? I think not! There are literally billions of people in this world who are of normal weight but who never count the calories.

I am not one of them. I usually do count the calories: I am more successful that way

Still, the point is what works for YOU, not what works for me. Well done to all of the successful "Losers" on this forum!


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

If someone can show me where in the body calories are counted, I'll listen. Your body doesn't even know what a calorie is.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Had my 1st seafood meal. Sauteed onion, g pepper, celery, mushroom, garlic, ginger, and spinach and then added some shrimp.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Yum


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

I forgot just how much I love seafood. Had scallops sauteed in sesame oil and garlic, a huge serving of steamed broccoli, and some yucca chips. First time I had yucca chips and probably the last. It was like eating a piece of tree.


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## Elevenpoint (Nov 17, 2009)

Seafood is good
I see food I eat it
No seafood here except frozen but occasionally score some salmon
But the river is full of rainbow trout and smallmouth
Fresh smallmouth bass is my favorite


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## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

Thanks Rich! Have you checked out Promethease? Lot of info, but you have to find your own answers.

Dr Patrick has a LOT of videos out there.

Mon


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

MoonRiver said:


> If someone can show me where in the body calories are counted, I'll listen. Your body doesn't even know what a calorie is.


Precisely. Your body absolutely does not know what a calorie is, or how many it has consumed. You can get close by eating intuitively, but chances are, if left to your own intuition, you will eat at a surplus, over and above what your body needs to fuel cell regeneration and bodily functions, plus the smaller amount burned through physical exertion. Weight is lost by eating at a deficit. If you are trying a new diet, chances are you will lose some weight, initially. Figuring out how a diet works, and what you can eat, almost always causes a person to eat at a deficit. Once you figure out how to fit foods in your diet, there is a tendency to fit too much food into the diet, which is always a problem. Without weighing it, or eating prepackaged food, there is simply no way to know how many calories you are consuming. Without carefully tracking your weight, there is no way to know what your maintenance caloric need is,based on your lifestyle and metabolism, so there is no way to know if you are in a deficit. If you are in a deficit, you will lose weight. It is virtually the only way to lose weight, without disease or amputation.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

You may not have succeeded at it, but billions of people do.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Billions of people reach an ideal weight and maintain it, after being overweight, by intuitive eating? Any data to back that up? I know of very few people that are actually in shape, that rely on intuitive eating to get and stay that way. There might be billions of people who meet certain criteria, BMI or whatever, at a certain point in their life, arriving there much by accident or good luck. Check them out in ten years and see where they are at. Probably at Bernie the tent maker's buying a new sundress. There might also be billions of people that are malnourished, so that they meet certain criteria that would make them be considered "not in need of weight loss", but far from healthy, let alone of ideal body condition. Most of them will develop a pot belly at middle age, even though they are "skinny". 

In terms of weight loss, there is "what might work" and there is "what will work". "What might work" will work, only if it employs key elements of "what will work".


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## Elevenpoint (Nov 17, 2009)

I've been out in 100 degree days for most of the day 
It's been about 90 or so since may 1st
I don't know if the craving was chocolate or calories
So I made scratch brownies full of walnuts and ate the entire pan in two days
Better go fishing and even it out


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

The best fish is deep fried battered cod... It's like fish wrapped in a donut


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

barnbilder said:


> Billions of people reach an ideal weight and maintain it, after being overweight, by intuitive eating?


I think what we have is a failure to communicate: I had no idea you were referring only to people who used to be over weight. And here I thought you were talking about everybody, as in all humans everywhere.

As far as people getting overconfident and re-gaining the weight, I do not always count the calories. I often just use the scale. I check my weight once a week and that tells me if I need to eat a bit less than I have been eating.

I also eyeball my portion size but, for me, I need the weekly weigh to make sure I am not fooling myself. So where you measure the portions I step on a scale once a week, and either will work. Whether both work for you or not I do not know as we are 2 different people, but either will work for me.

I suppose there are also other methods that people use that work for them. Because, if a method only works for 1 person in 1000 it does not matter as long as you are the 1 person that it works for. What works for a person, works for that person.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

elevenpoint said:


> I've been out in 100 degree days for most of the day
> It's been about 90 or so since may 1st
> I don't know if the craving was chocolate or calories
> So I made scratch brownies full of walnuts and ate the entire pan in two days
> Better go fishing and even it out


My cravings always involve a combination of fat and sugar. I can't remember ever having a craving for vegetables!


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Weighing yourself must be done very carefully. It is very easy to fluctuate five pounds in a day. Eating salty foods and retaining water versus being dehydrated makes for a big swing. Bowel emptying plays a part. It is best to weigh every day, at a set time or after a bodily function. Track the weight daily, and you can have a much better idea of what is going on. Also, you need to supplement the scale with a mirror. Or a tape measure. Not all weight loss is a good thing. Not all weight gain is a bad thing. Adding the right kind of weight can make losing the wrong kind of weight easier. The mirror doesn't lie. Strip, look in the mirror. Now jump up and down. If you don't like what you see, or don't see marked improvement, you need to evaluate your diet and exercise plan. Think statue of a Greek god. That is what your body is supposed to look like. There is no genetic variant in humans that makes the Michelin man the pinnacle of attainable form.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Salt DOES affect your weight, which is why I prefer to weigh weekly instead of daily. A daily weight loss/ gain for me probably WILL be due to the day's salt intake or how much I have been sweating. I generally gain or lose 1 pound due to salt, max. Salt may make other people may gain or lose more than that, but not me.

When I weigh myself weekly then any gain or loss I see will probably be due to true weight instead of water weight, as the days when I salt heavily and the days that I use little salt tend to average each other out. Otherwise the few ounces a day of gain/loss might be due to me working up sweat or deciding to use lemon salt on my food.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

I had an interesting experience with salt over the last 2 months. I stopped adding salt and my BP dropped about 5 points. After about 3 or 4 weeks, BP started creeping back up until it was where it started. I started salting my food again and BP dropped about 5 points.

My conclusion was I probably need more salt than none and less than I had been adding.


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

MoonRiver said:


> Oils are processed foods and extremely high in calories.
> 
> Fish are not the problem you make them out to be.


And they are not as safe as you think and as the fishing industry would have you believe. Even vets tell you not to feed fish in excess to your cats and dogs. Everything in moderation and fish just like meat every day is not a health benefit.


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

Weighing yourself too often just leads to frustration since body weight does fluctuate according to water retention and when people are trying to lose weight even a pound up can be depressing. I weighed myself once every three or four weeks. Usually four but if I felt like things were moving well or not well I would do it after three weeks. I always noticed the changes in my body - thinner fingers, feet, face, neck, stomach, etc and certainly less stress on my knees- and the changes in how clothes fit so I knew I was losing steadily. 

On average I lost a pound a week but sometimes just half a pound. Four pounds is definitely feel-able on your body and with your clothes. A friend once said to me that a pound a week was not enough for her. Really? That is 52 pounds a year. Even half a pound a week is 26 lbs in a year. We buy our dog food in 40 lb bags. Just carry one of these around for a day (moving it from place to place) and anyone should be thrilled with a 52 pound loss.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

emdeengee said:


> And they are not as safe as you think and as the fishing industry would have you believe. Even vets tell you not to feed fish in excess to your cats and dogs. Everything in moderation and fish just like meat every day is not a health benefit.


Selenium is the antidote to mercury. Eat fish and seafood high in selenium.

"A common concern when choosing seafood is mercury. And for good reason: mercury binds up selenium, an essential mineral that's vital to the developing brain and nervous system. 
But here's the good news: eating ocean fish that contain more selenium than mercury protects against mercury toxicity. 
Ocean fish (e.g., halibut, salmon) and shellfish (e.g., lobster, crab) are chock-full of the mineral: 17 of the top 25 selenium food sources are seafood (it's also in red meat, eggs and chicken)." eatingwell​


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

I should be alright then. I take selenium tablets . I also eat halibut. not so much the salmon because it's all farmed here now.i do eat canned sockeye


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

MoonRiver said:


> Selenium is the antidote to mercury. Eat fish and seafood high in selenium.
> 
> "A common concern when choosing seafood is mercury. And for good reason: mercury binds up selenium, an essential mineral that's vital to the developing brain and nervous system.
> But here's the good news: eating ocean fish that contain more selenium than mercury protects against mercury toxicity.
> Ocean fish (e.g., halibut, salmon) and shellfish (e.g., lobster, crab) are chock-full of the mineral: 17 of the top 25 selenium food sources are seafood (it's also in red meat, eggs and chicken)." eatingwell​


Looks like I'm covered in the selenium are pretty well. Love shellfish, red meat, eggs and chicken. 

I think we all should pay attention to nutrient content of our food.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

emdeengee said:


> We buy our dog food in 40 lb bags. Just carry one of these around for a day (moving it from place to place) and anyone should be thrilled with a 52 pound loss.


Not to worry, manufacturers of dog food soon will further reduce big bags of dog food to 31.64 pounds while keeping the price the same, just so people that have gained weight wont have to carry around anymore total weight when lugging that sack around all day. When this happens, be sure to write them a thank you card.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

It occurred to me that by adding fish and seafood, I might be able to go back on keto. I looked up keto and polyunsaturated fat and found a study where the participants in a keto study, limited saturated fat to 20% of total fat. I don't think I can go that high with saturated fat without triggering my BP spikes again, but it at least shows that you can do keto with unsaturated fat as the largest portion of your total fat consumption. The study started out with carbs at 30 g/day and increased to 50 g/day. That fits nicely with what I am now eating, so it gives me some parameters to work with.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Weigh every day. And chart it. Makes it easier to see what is going on. You can see the little upswings. especially for the younger women, who retain water actually twice a month, which surprised me. There is a spike at ovulation as well as at menstruation. Weekly weigh ins could be very frustrating. There are a lot of tools available now. You put the stuff on a graph it sure makes it easy to see what is working.


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## vickinell (Oct 10, 2003)

I eat two Brazil nuts daily for my selenium.


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