# Log Cabin Practicality



## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

I started learning about homesteading about six months ago after finding "An American Homestead" and "Becky's Homestead" on YouTube (and then so many others, too!) It is VERY daunting to consider finding land (wow what a big commitment, once purchased!) and building a home out and away from where most people live. But very appealing...

I like the thought of a log cabin vs a manufactured home, and see that there are a number of kits available. My concern is over cost and the process of building, and I'm wondering if anyone with experience in log cabins can shed some light on this. For example, I see that 3-bedroom log cabin kits in which I'm interested are about $75,000. This does not include site prep work, kitchen cabinets, electrical, etc., and I'm not entirely sure what else must be done but I'm guessing I'm looking at $200k before I have a finished, livable log cabin. Seems to defeat the purpose of keeping costs under control (I'd wanted to have secured my land and living arrangements for little more than half that cost.)

Of course, I want a basement...which is likely a substantial expense if one right (I'd hire a contractor...no room for error on this one.)

The other question I have concerning log cabins is warmth. I hate the thought of living in a toxic home, with insulation, carpet, and synthetic materials that outgas. Unfortunately, the R-Value of logs seems quite low compared to standard construction. Given that I'll likely end up in a place where there are four seasons (Missouri), I am very concerned about energy efficiency and particularly keeping warm in winter. Appreciate any inputs here.

Unfortunately, purely for cost, I keep coming back to a modular home as being most cost effective. As nice as they can be, I am not a fan of living in a modular home for a whole bunch of reasons.

Thanks in advance for all helpful responses.


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

There are many price differences in log kits, a lot depends on how much milling is done to the logs and the size of the logs. The more milling the better the finished product, up to a point. Log homes are not cheap but there are good reasons to go with one. You will still want/need insulation in the roof system/attic. Best reason to build a log home is if you have a good supply of your own or cheap logs. Buying a kit and having it delivered is costly because of so much big heavy timber and get then get it assembled into a straight well built box. There are alternatives beside a log home and a modular, those are at the 2 extremes, one can take a lot of time and work to build correctly yourself, the other is quick and not much work for the owner. Post and beam and conventional stud frame are 2 others, both can be done with no more off gassing than a log home. Look for a builder that specializes in building them, go to some home shows for ideas. Look for low off gassing materials.

Cabin Fever and his wife, here on this forum have 2 log cabins and they live in Minnesota, their home is nice warm and snug, so it can be done....James


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Log homes are a favorite on mine.....and after spending many years looking, planning , comparing and adding up the pro's and cons....we still went with a log "cabin"....meaning small...total 800sq ft.

Many ways to build one....all the way from cutting, peeling, assembling of your own logs to buying a turn key home.
We looked at kits.....whatever price you see..figure 3 time that...so your estimate is valid.

Our "Place" was built by the Amish 16 x40" w/two lofts....... off site and trucked in.

Disadvantages are.... solid walls do not allow for service components, plumbing, wiring, ductwork.... etc ...in out side walls....This presents design problems.

Side wall insulation would not meet most building codes if under 18 in. thick, but due to a thermal mass multiplier (once it get warm, stays warm....can build with 8"
Logs shrink as well, so allowances need to be made on doors, windows, vertical plumbing...

Building codes can get interesting,... state. local, as these are unconventional homes in the eyes of some banks(financing), fire codes (insurance). 
They required staining and chinking... so more labor intensive.

Advantages is a home that appreciates in value, is solid an last a long time with care.

Not a fan of manufactured home.....I'll stop there, so as to not upset people.

Codes...
https://loghome.com/articles/article/log-home-construction


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## mml373 (May 2, 2017)

I appreciate these replies. I'm not terribly concerned about codes where I'm planning to live, since there aren't any of concern as far as I know at this time. I will continue to research. I have been looking at Amish-built cabins, also, and think 16 by 40 with lofts would be suitable. I'd think that plumbing could be done through the floor vs having to come in through exterior walls. Planning on mostly off grid so need a design that stays relatively cool in the summer/warm in the winter, through good design.

Somehow they used to build all houses without A/C, and even the ones in the hot, humid South were actually quite livable.  (About a quarter of my growing up years were spent in such a home, by choice.)


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Good planning did resuit in a common "wet wall" with service for back to back bathroom/ kitchen.
The rest of the cabin is "open concept"
These were planned, so window and doors placements, were custom features for our builder.
As well as dommers....floor insulation flooring etc.

Wiring in a lot of cabins is run thru the walls, installed while build...I chose to run mile thru the floor an up a common wall.
Good luck ......


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

Electricity is the harder one with log walls. Water can all be in interior studded walls if planned right. So can electricity if minimal and mostly kept to interior walls, under floor and in runs in the interior walls to 2nd floor. A few runs concealed in the chinking or with a basement or crawl space, outlets can be put in the floor too. I built 2 on concrete crawl space to code, 1 1/2 story using milled logs. The plan was the one that Jack Hanna built in Montana, 24'x26'. One open 1/2 loft, one full 1/2 story, bath and 2 bedrooms. Logs for the ground floor exterior walls only, stud built 1/2 walls with board and batten siding for loft. Meter on pole, buried conduit up through floor to fuse box in utility room. I ran some wire back down between the floor beams up to outlets in the floor and then added crawlspace insulation. Other than the outside log walls all the rest was built conventional. I used silent floor beams on post and beam, tar paper and 1 1/2" Douglas Fir T&G for sub/finished 1st floor. I half cut the top log and put hand hewn pine 6"x8" beams 4' apart and used 2" T&G pine for open beam ceiling and the 1/2 loft floor. Open log stair. Even with the open beam ceiling it was not hard to make runs up through floor through "hollow railing posts" to rafters, then to 1/2 walls for outlets for the 1/2 loft model. All concealed. Even with 3 electric convection heaters on the first floor of both and a bath on one. No upstairs heat on either but I did put floor registers on the full 1/2 story, not really used as the heat rises from the first floor and heats the floor of the second story and rises. Planning was everything. I couldn't tell a difference in utility bills from all conventional construction. I did the 2nd floor open beam in my DD's conventional built duplex rental. The second floor is warmer in the summer than with houses I have built with insulation between the floors, knowing that is normal as heat rises, I installed a split duct air conditioner for both floors, all open concept 1st floor with 1/2 bath. Full master suite upstairs....James


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## mike554 (Jun 9, 2012)

We built this little log cabin back around 2000 which eventually led us to building timber frames. A timber frame is a great alternative to a log home. You can have all the wood you want or don't want. You can cover them with structural insulated panels and it will be the warmest house you'll ever live in and easy to cool. I will never live in anything else.


www.mktimberworks.com


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

I have one a log home new built in 1997. Dont do one. Built stick 2x4 2x6 insulation plywood and house wrap and use the log siding. For real and true the log siding and ends that look just like logs. Is the way to go. I have a hard time with drafts no matter how much chinking clulk ect. My garage is done with the plywood insulation wrap and the log siding and you cant tell the real from the siding. You can also use the siding on the inside as well. Or bass wood looks good for the inside. If I ever built another house It would never be with manufactured logs it would be with log siding.


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## Steve_S (Feb 25, 2015)

Just to toss another Log on the Thinking Fire, you might want to look into Cordwood / Stackwall log building... Time consuming it is but it is something that most people can do if they want and the skill set required is less... An Option that many overlook BUT I have to tell you that where I am, there are quite a few of them... Some old Heritage Farms and Barns built with Cordwood which are over 200 years standing... They are still being built here and is in a "Revival" because of what can be done with it and the efficiencies afforded by this method.

REFERENCES:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cordwood_construction
https://cordwoodconstruction.wordpress.com/
http://cordwoodconstruction.org/
http://cordwoodconstruction.org/


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## Fishindude (May 19, 2015)

Log cabins were built because that was the material on hand available to build with. It's still a real neat way to build, but certainly not the most cost effective, economical or efficient. A simple stud wall type home will be much more energy efficient, quicker and easier to build and less costly. Also, log cabins have a few problematic issues such as; where and how to run wiring and plumbing when walls are solid log, upkeep of the exterior wood and chinking, settlement due to wood drying and moving around, etc.

You are probably correct, that from a cost only standpoint, it is hard to beat a modular home.


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

There is such a big difference in what is called modular today. Big difference in materials. Cheap will always be cheap. Big difference in log home kits too. We have a modular factory close and they build homes that off gas very little, are built for people who can not tolerate off gassing. They even set them up and put machines in them to remove allergens and do all the testing to show that. They were at the home show with one and had monitors set up. Showed the difference when people entered a "clean room" and how clean it was after 5 minutes with no one in it. Interesting what people carry on themselves that are much worse than the home itself....James


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

There are lots of ways to build a very livable and durable home. Wood, stone, maybe a few others. I think the methods used are more important than the actual material.

The word "modular" doesn't really mean a whole lot other than it was built offsite and trucked in in pieces. It could be really crappy construction or really good construction.

One thing you could consider is building a structure that's more of a "workshop" that you could finish off and live in while you figure out exactly what you want to build for a house. That wouldn't cost a whole lot and wouldn't have to have every possible thing you'd want in a home to be comfortable. It would also become a very useful building when you do move into your dream home.

I had a carpenter friend years ago that lived in a single wide mobile home. He systematically built around that mobile home and removed it bit by bit leaving a very nice and well built home when he was done. That might not be for everyone but it worked well for him.

Just a thought


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

Me, I would build a garage kit first, live in it. Plan it so it is easy to add the house right on the gable end. Stem walls, concrete floor, frame in the garage door opening, large sliding door, use non-groove T-111 siding and stain. This will be your sheathing and siding until house is done. Put vapor barrier under floor and insulate walls and ceiling. Build in a small bathroom to be used later so no tracking in the house, built later. Smaller, good experience, lot less time to get done, builds confidence. Then on to bigger and better things. When house is built go back and put the siding on you want, to match home. I too like a conventional built building with the log siding, best of both without the hassle of the settling of a log built structure....James


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

I also wanted a log home, spent time at the local log home manufacturers yard and learned it was not for me. 
Maintenance intensive, it's like a hobby of its own, and I personally have enough hobbies than to be chinking and sanding/staining the house, even one side of the house every year on a cycle. 
Expensive to finish from the kit, but so are all kits, kits are extremely misleading once you add foundation and everything else needed to move in.
Can be difficult or expensive to insure, but look into that for your area. 
I don't know where you live, but if you go ahead, do look into western red cedar logs. At least around here everything else will rot or become bait for bugs/termites etc etc. Here, that's the only way to go but you pay a premium. Pine doesn't last here at all.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

I will probably not be popular with this post but I have built many many log houses. In fact if you live in Texas or near here I will loan you my 16" skill saw if you need it. Just pm me. 

Yes they are nice when they are new. But you have to constantly keep stain or paint on them or they will rot. They go up quick and are solid. But they are not as energy efficient as stick built like forecast says. I have also had to replace the bottom three logs on several log houses when they rotted. It's not easy. You have to cut slits in the logs and insert I beams through the house. Then jack them up and replace them. Like a house mover. Figure at least 20k for that for waiting a year for stain. This is for kit houses. Kit houses use mostly new growth lumber. If you build your house from old growth pine or cypress you will be fine. Kit log homes don't last without proper maintenance. But with maintenance they do fine. Just keep that in mind. 

Now if you want the look but the energy efficiency also I have done this. Build it stick frame and use the siding. On the corners take the actual logs to see band saw mill. Have them cut out part of the log to match the siding but leave the ends whole and attach them to the corners where they overlap like a real log house. No one will ever know the difference. If they rot it's an easy replacement.


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## ForestToFarm (Feb 28, 2016)

mike554 said:


> We built this little log cabin back around 2000 which eventually led us to building timber frames. A timber frame is a great alternative to a log home. You can have all the wood you want or don't want. You can cover them with structural insulated panels and it will be the warmest house you'll ever live in and easy to cool. I will never live in anything else.
> 
> 
> www.mktimberworks.com
> ...


Do you have more info on Timber frame homes or can you suggest any? We have lots of pine logs and have considered this type building method.
Thanks Terry


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## mike554 (Jun 9, 2012)

We build timber frames and would be happy to answer any questions. Here is our Facebook page which has lots of pictures. There is plenty of info on line also about timber frames. 

https://www.facebook.com/MK-Timber-Works-310451113777/

www.mktimberworks.com


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## ForestToFarm (Feb 28, 2016)

mike554 said:


> We build timber frames and would be happy to answer any questions. Here is our Facebook page which has lots of pictures. There is plenty of info on line also about timber frames.
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/MK-Timber-Works-310451113777/
> 
> www.mktimberworks.com


Thanks!


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

Code. Code. Code.

Very few places don't have any at all. 

As for cost...cheapest construction I've done, was using my own timber for sheathing (board-n-batten) and the bigger framing materials (joists and rafters) on a stick built house. Studs are too cheap, salvage studs are even cheaper.

If you're anywhere in the hot, humid South, you know the drill...Look at how the oldtimers built their places, when they could afford to build them the way they wanted to...fairly high off the ground, ten foot ceilings, porches, wide overhangs, central hallways and windows placed to catch and circulate the breeze. The old folks used to have a sleeping porch...Usually a back, screened in porch, big enough to place a few beds on. And down here, I like an attic fan in a home (if you don't mind the dust it sucks in). Lastly, some of the best money spent on a home is adequate insulation, be it windows, walls, ceiling, etc.

Heating down here is usually not a big deal and can be accomplished with an efficient wood heater or even a propane burning log fireplace. A/C is the key to being comfortable. You just want to build your home where you use as little as needed.


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## ridgerunner1965 (Apr 13, 2013)

when i built my house 20 to 25 yrs ago, there were several log homes built about the same time near here.

mine is a 1200 sq ft single story with vinyl sideing.2x6 walls.concrete floor.

my house is fine. my cheap siding could be replaced but still very weather proof.

the log homes have not fared well.lots of rotting wood and the owners have done lots of work on them.one has plywood nailed over the windows i assume to keep rain out.

my next door neighbor built one and nearly froze to death in a couple of hard winters.he put in a huge wood furnace but that became a prob when he got to old to cut wood.

i wont even get into trying to air con one of these houses in a brutal summer. often it can be 95 degrees by 10 in the morning.

as staed i have not done much work to my house while the log homes either look ratty and rotten or have had much money and labor spent on them.

if yu do build a log home i would go with lots of roof overhang to keep water off the walls and plan to seal the outside walls at the very least every two years.

and plan on high utility bills.


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## solar (Feb 11, 2010)

I'm in the process of building a log home. The package is being pre-built at a log yard and will be shipped to my land and re-assembled in a week or two.


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## Hitch (Oct 19, 2016)

I'd be interested in learning more about your project and watching it's progression. Have you thought about starting your own build thread?


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## solar (Feb 11, 2010)

You revived an old thread I had forgotten about.
I've been living in mine for a year.


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## Farmerjack41 (Jun 6, 2017)

Beautiful job. You must be in the NW states, think I see a tamarack standing in the picture. You certainly have a place to be proud of.


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