# Plant based vs manure based compost.



## Jeffery (Oct 25, 2011)

I can get free plant based compost from the county composting site or I can get free manure based compost from a local agricultural college. Which type of compost do you think is best?


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## imthedude (Jun 7, 2011)

if i had the choice, i would go with the poop.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

Plant compost from the county composting site will likely have the leaf litter that has been collected from the towns yearly pickups, and may have shredded tree limbs and wood. The ag college will have manure, some may be mixed with bedding like straw or wood shavngs. 

Since you want a 30:1 Carbon to Nitrogen ratio for good compost, chances are that neither would be in that propoprtion--the county material being higher in carbon, and the ag college manures being higher in nitrogen. I would attempt to get some of both and mix them into blended copmpost in my own pile. But you won't know the mixture until you take a look at each.

A couple of caveats: if the county compost has grass clippings, that would somewhat affect the C:N ratio, and it may possibly contain some residual weed killers. The ag college may be straight manure and maybe mixed with different animal manures. If a vet school is included, it may have dog and cat feces, and may have certain medicine residues--but again, you'll have to ask.

If I had to get just one, I would go for the manure, all other things being equal. If they are free, I would get all I possibly could haul of each.

geo


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Believe it or not, the manure compost could have less nutrients than the plant compost. Example: grass is at least 1% nitrogen but a cow eats it and the resultant manure contains barely half that. Cow manure has a total of 1.3# of nutrients per 100# while oak leaves also have 1.3#. Advantage to the plant compost is the amount of carbon which becomes humus. Some of that may last for thousands of years whereas pure manure lacks that. 

Martin


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## idigbeets (Sep 3, 2011)

I'd get a load of both, and ask more questions about each regarding what/where they come from etc. 

Leaves pound for pound have similar mineral content, however Nitrogen tends to be lower when compared to manures. Sources vary. The leaves however will provide excellent water retention when composted, be a slow release source of various minerals such as Potash and Calcium. They also provide a structural element to your compost. Best of luck.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

The facts are that nitrogen in leaves is generally higher than the normal farm manures. Apple is 1.0, peach at .9, maple and oak around .8, pear at .7, and cherry at .6. Alder and elm are also very high. When green, some tree leaves may be as high as 3.0 nitrogen. Of the usual farm animals manures, .7 is the highest and that's for sheep, steers, and horses. 

Am I "carrying coal to Newcastle"? Yesterday I hauled a pickup load of shredded and bagged green ash and silver maple to my farm garden. Round trip is about 25 miles. There is a pile of fresh horse manure about 200' from the end of that garden. I can use as much of that pile as I deem fit for the garden but it would do nothing to improve the structure of the nearly 100% silt soil. 

Best advice is to use a mixture of both if available. Carbon and nitrogen from manures can readily escape into the atmosphere unless there is something in the soil to retain them. A leaf-based compost will help do that.

Martin


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Does the bedding in most animal manure compost effect the nutrient value for the long haul? I know that fresh wood chips can tie up nitrogen but that sounds like it may be a good thing actually as it would then be available to plants to take up later.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

In fresh manure, there may be well over 2# of nutrients in 100#. A ton of dry sawdust also has about 2#. All NPK values are for dry weight of pure manure. Therefore whatever is used for bedding dilutes the percentage of nutrients available. 

Martin


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## Jeffery (Oct 25, 2011)

Thank you for your replies.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

My situation is pretty much access to unlimited manure but little leave as I am surrounded by redwoods. 
I have been adding lot composted manure but can see that I have fallen way short of carbon. I was hoping that the bedding composted with the goat manure might help that.
Does the lack of carbon in my soil mean that my plants get a kick of growth when I apply the composted manure in the fall or fresher stuff in the spring to some plants but can't sustain growth as the nutrients are not held by the carbon?


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

jeff you need to look at this thread....alot of myths about compsoting get busted...forerunner even puts entire dead cows in his piles and they compost in no time and no smell.

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=342651

its a long thread but check out any psot by forerunner and he has a few links to other threads with pictures of his results.his crops are out of this world.


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## bowdonkey (Oct 6, 2007)

Martin, where do you get your info? I've been looking for a table of some sorts or book that gives a breakdown of what the various organic materials contain.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

There probably isn't any one site with all of the charts but much of the data found would be in line with _The Complete Book of Composting_ by J. I. Rodale, 1960, and over 1,000 pages. Mine is 4th printing from 1967. Amazon has listings for it from about $70 new to much less used. I did recently come upon an Australian site which had the exact animal manure figures as Rodale but wouldn't know where to look for it right now.

Martin


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

Here is a site with analysis of municipal leaves..... http://www.spectrumanalytic.com/support/library/ff/Plant_Nutrients_in_Municipal_Leaves.htm

And you might find Post# 15 in the "fireside" sticky above useful for contents of various animal manures....

geo


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

I would never use compost from a county composting site on my "vegetables or fruits". I would be concerned some black walnut was mixed in with it. (I may be wrong about the limbs of black walnuts harming the soil. It may only be the root system.)


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Juglone is concentrated in the husks and roots of black walnut and butternut trees. There is very little in the leaves and even less in the wood. 

Martin


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

Oh Martin that is so good to hear. We did a lot of clean up this fall and have quite a few black walnut limbs and small trees. I was wanting to place all our clean-up into raised beds to rot there and was thinking I had to separate the black walnut from the rest of it, which would be quite a chore. Nice to know I don't need to do that.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

You can't get both? I'd get a load of each.

In fact, I'd get as many loads of each as they would let me have.

Manure adds really good humus to the soil, so it is well worth adding.


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

geo in mi said:


> Plant compost from the county composting site will likely have the leaf litter that has been collected from the towns yearly pickups, and may have shredded tree limbs and wood. The ag college will have manure, some may be mixed with bedding like straw or wood shavngs.
> 
> Since you want a 30:1 Carbon to Nitrogen ratio for good compost, chances are that neither would be in that propoprtion--the county material being higher in carbon, and the ag college manures being higher in nitrogen. I would attempt to get some of both and mix them into blended copmpost in my own pile. But you won't know the mixture until you take a look at each.
> 
> ...


I think forerunner says it really doesn't matter the heat in a pile will take care of most anything. On the weed killer look in the stores for what is being sold.


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

idigbeets said:


> I'd get a load of both, and ask more questions about each regarding what/where they come from etc.
> 
> Leaves pound for pound have similar mineral content, however Nitrogen tends to be lower when compared to manures. Sources vary. The leaves however will provide excellent water retention when composted, be a slow release source of various minerals such as Potash and Calcium. They also provide a structural element to your compost. Best of luck.


Pee in your pile. Does wonders.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

am1too said:


> I think forerunner says it really doesn't matter the heat in a pile will take care of most anything. On the weed killer look in the stores for what is being sold.


I doubt if one could find any weed killer, on any store shelf, that won't break down in composting. That's been the standard for years. Has to be for anyone in officialdom to even think of suggesting recycling and composting.

Martin


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## sevenmmm (Mar 1, 2011)

am1too said:


> Pee in your pile. Does wonders.



I would have to ask the Mayor for a pee permit. :shocked:


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