# Should I consider LGDs?



## lynnabyrd (Oct 15, 2007)

I'm trying to decide if I should be looking into LGDs or not and would love suggestions...

We have 30 acres. Currently we're running sheep, goats, chickens and horses, with plans in the works for a beef calf or two in the future. There are coyotes in the area, although we've never had problems with them... what we *do* have are bobcats and the occasional cougar. 

We've been very fortunate to not lose any sheep or goats to cougars, although they've taken numerous deer on our property. We *have* lost chickens to the bobcats. 

We have decent fencing (not great, but it keeps the goats in most of the time so it can't be all bad right? lol), but obviously it's not enough to keep a big cat out. 

At the moment we have one, old, partly deaf, black lab. He was inherited and wouldn't have been my first choice of a farm dog, but he's pretty well behaved around the critters now. Hubby and I both have experience with dog training, although I'll admit it's been many many years since I had a puppy to deal with.  

We also have 5 kids, ages 16-6. :grin: So whatever we get, has to be reasonable easy to socialize. 

Given our setup and situation, should I be considering an LGD? I certainly don't want to wait till we DO lose one of the larger animals to a cougar... it's bad enough to have your daughters' pet chicken picked off by a bobcat. I don't even want to imagine the hysterics if something happened to their very special and very loved goats or sheep. On the other hand, I'm comfortable training a family dog to sit, stay, come, heel, but I know next to nothing about training an LGD to do whatever it is they do. lol. I'm also willing to consider donkeys or llamas or whatever else falls into the "livestock guardian" category these days! 

I've had more than one person suggest getting an LGD recently, and since I know very little about them figured I'd take the question here. 

Thanks!


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## Plowpoint (May 2, 2012)

I really do not think so.

I worked on the railroad for a long time and we always had a saying there; "Nothing is a problem, until it becomes a problem." In this case your farm sounds like mine. Coyotes abound here, however, like you, I have never had a sheep taken, and that includes all the years my Grandparents, and my Great Grandparents had sheep; but deer and wild turkeys are another story...they are taken down hard by coyotes here.

It sounds to me like your fences are working too and providing enough of a deterrent so that these animals are getting easier meals on the deer. Again, this sounds like we have something in common.

Like you I considered and LGD and ultimately tried a donkey a few years back. That did not work so well because the donkey actually inflicted more harm to my flock of sheep then the coyotes. In my silliness, I introduced a problem into my flock when a problem did not exist.

I will always consider an LGD, but for right now I have decided to invest in fencing; as much to keep my sheep in as to keep coyotes out, and I think that is sound thinking. If coyotes start becoming an issue then I will look at the costs of getting and LGD, but its pretty hard to justify spending $1000 on the purchase and annual costs of an LGD, when I am losing $0 dollars out in the field.


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Keep in mind good trained lgds aren't easy to come by. If you choose to buy a pup expect to wait months for it to be old enough to protect. For dealing with cougars I wouldn't just get one.


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## BarbadosSheep (Jun 27, 2011)

If you enjoy interacting with dogs in general, then I would get a pair of them. A fully trained adult may be available through a rescue (go through a breed specific rescue and not an all-breed rescue) or from a breeder. If you get pups, be prepared to do a lot of training. My Anatolians are a year old now and it has been work getting them to the point they are at now, but it has been so worth it. I love watching them work but I also just love these dogs.


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## zephyrcreek (Mar 30, 2012)

I don't regret mine for one second, and I did get one before we had any major problems. I have too much time, money, and energy wrapped up in our stock to take a chance once they coyotes came back to our area. You don't have a problem....until you have a problem. It can take months, if not years to have a solid LGD. Our girl is two this year and I just not completely trust her with everything on the farm. All the local farms around us are loosing animals, but my immediate neighbors and I are good. I know that is due to Kimber's presense.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

Animals learn as babies what is food. Your large predators were taught that deer and turkey are food, so that is what they hunt. Your problems will start if those animals become scarce, or if the predator is no longer able to hunt them. When that happens it will look for something easier to catch. You might want a dog to protect the chickens, but you don't really need an LGD for that. You need a medium sized family dog, or small terrier, that is outside during the hours the bobcats are typically hunting. The dog won't necessarily kill the varmint, but will scare it away.


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## lynnabyrd (Oct 15, 2007)

Thanks for all the suggestions. I really appreciate it! 

Couple of clarifications... 

Plowpoint, I'm not too worried about coyotes. As I said they haven't been an issue up here on our ridge. But we DO have bobcat and cougar, both of which *are* in the sheep and goat pastures, if the random half-eaten deer carcasses we find periodically are any indication! Just because they *haven't* taken a sheep or goat yet doesn't mean they won't. We don't have a large enough barn to contain all the critters, so I'm looking at other ways to protect them. 

Maura, I've thought about simply getting another (most likely, more than one) family/farm dog... but I don't think they'd be much of a deterrent for the big cats. Realistically, the cats are nocturnal hunters, and the current dog sleeps on the front porch. He's not scaring away the cats as it is... in fact the chickens we lost were picked off within twenty feet of where he was sleeping. Granted he's old, and deaf, but the cats had to know he was there. And the sheep/goats are a good distance farther from the house, so with the dogs sleeping here at the house, I can't imagine they would do much good. 

Several folks in our area have lost livestock to cougars and bobcat, so I'm hoping to be proactive. Replacing the chickens is easier than replacing the spoiled bottle-baby sheep and goats.  

Again, I really appreciate the info, thanks, y'all!


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Around here coyotes will take cats, and small dogs. Neighbors almost lost their male corgi to wounds from coyotes. Luckily they found him in the corn field, he couldn't walk. He is big for a corgi, and was traveling with a Rottweiler at the time.


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## gimpyrancher (Jun 6, 2010)

Except for LGDs, I thought the idea was for my dog/s to let me know when a problem is near so I can go out and eliminate the threat? Doesn't help on the "North 40" but it's the way it is around the house and chicken coop. :duel:


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## MonsterMalak (Apr 15, 2011)

The coyotes are usually much more of a problem than the big cats. Usually just because the cats are far fewer, and are very sucessful hunters. Coyote populations are usually at the point of saturation around my parts.

Why not get a LGD? They are great family and farm dogs, and will protect you and your stock. Win win.

I am surprised you have not already had problems. I think your dogs are doing a better job than you might be thinking. Without dogs, things do not last to long in coyote country.

They even kill many dogs in East Texas.
Coyote Repellent in the 4 legged version.


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## holmestead (Apr 22, 2009)

I'd have a pair of LGDs if I were in your situation. Since my first one matured I haven't lost anything to predators. I'm still trying to figure out how to keep him in all the time, but that's another issue.


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