# 410



## wvcabin (Dec 9, 2009)

i was thinking about getting my son a 410 rossi youth model shotgun, he is 12 but very small, it looks like a nice shotgun, but I don't know anything about rossi, are they a good company or should I look to another company?


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## RonM (Jan 6, 2008)

Get him a 20 ga Rem 870 youth model , will last him forever..Dont know anything about Rossi.......


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## bigjon (Oct 2, 2013)

partner .410-very nice -single shot/break action,will use 3" shells.good starter.


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Can you borrow a 20 ga for him to try? A bit more recoil but a lot more shot.


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## M5farm (Jan 14, 2014)

20 GA imo. I started all of mine with one when they were 10.


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## JawjaBoy (Jan 21, 2013)

Rossi's have always been pretty good guns in my experience. 

That said, I would recommend a 20 gauge over a .410. The recoil isn't that much more and the 20 is much easier to hit with and shells are MUCH cheaper. Even the 28 gauge would be a better choice, although shells are harder to find and cost as much as or more than .410's.

My brother started with a youth model New England Firearms (H&R) Pardner and did fine with it even though he was on the small side. One of the combos with shotgun, rifle and rimfire barrels would be an excellent choice.


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## wvcabin (Dec 9, 2009)

thanks guys, I really appreciate it.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

my 10 year old son just got his first shotgun we went with a Mossberg 500c, basic #7 1/2 target loads are not a problem , he started grinning when he fed it slugs , recoil happy i think 

any way he is 5 foot 120 pounds to give you and idea 

Mossberg makes the 500 Bantam or the older 500c and Remington makes a youth 870

they are a little heavier but that helps with the recoil 

not that most people have just one or two guns but a fela who was only interested in hunting and not guns could easily hunt his hole life with a mossberg or remingtion pump shotgun in 20 ga and do just fine from 10 to 80+ you will loose no money if you spend the extra money on a youth pump gun and decide to trade up later they hold their value very well 

to give you an idea I payed 200 for the 500c this winter it probably sold for 200 in 2001 brand new but a new one now is more like 275 to 325 depending on where you buy it and with what options.

the boy might have to watch out I might just borrow his gun when i head out the door hunting It is a very nice sized package.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

A .410 single shot is a fine first shotgun and will do wonders for his aim just knowing he only has that one shot, In a few years graduate him up to a 20 or 12 gauge and he can one day pass his first on to the next generation.

.410s are not only introduction firearms, they are also mementos of passage into a valuable phase of a persons life.

I let my stepson use my original Revelation for his first dove hunt and that Christmas I gave him his own Rossi .410 because he was only 9.

Two years later I upgraded him to a Remington 12 gauge I bought from a friend and started him on his way to his own firearm collection.

I still use my single shot .410 on occasion today to dispatch a snake or possum from a distance as the stock is short but long enough to counterweigh the barrel so I can accurately aim it at a target 30 to 40 feet away like a buntline and deliver a 3 inch magnum load of birdshot


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## Dan B. (Feb 23, 2014)

JawjaBoy said:


> My brother started with a youth model New England Firearms (H&R) Pardner and did fine with it even though he was on the small side. One of the combos with shotgun, rifle and rimfire barrels would be an excellent choice.


Love my NEF's!! Awesome guns for the money...look for them used. Rifles are quite commonly under $200 w/ optics. As for the shotguns, also a great choice. My first gun was a NEF w/ 30-30 Win and 20ga barrel. Still own it. You can buy a used rifle them send it back for a shotgun barrel.

As for .410 vs .20......go for the 20.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

With the cost of 410 shells alone I would not buy one today.

I started out with a old Ivers Johnson 410 single shot break action. I was so disgusted I was having so much trouble hitting any thing I just about gave hunting up. 
Lucky for me my dad worked away from home and only came home on week ends so I got to taking his 16ga. Rather put up with that little extra recoil than keep missing with less shot.
I started my own son out with a 20ga. he did just fine.

 Al


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

My experience with Rossi left me knowing that the 20ga. youth rossi's are a definite no-no...410 maybe...Don't believe me just find some one with a youth Rossi in 20 ga. and fire jist a couple field loads yourself..If you really hate some one slip a 3" magnum in on them..


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

I've had excellent luck with Rossi's but they have there strengths and weaknesses. Just like any gun. My kids all have 4 paws and cold noses, if I hade a 2 foot kid I'd start them with the above mentioned 20ga cheaper shells and less frustrating to get hits. A stock that fits him (why all the talk of Jr or young shooter models usually just mean they have a shorter, but (rear wood) stock, a lot of them will also sell a grown up length but stock so they could very easily changed out to allow them to grow right into it as a grown up or keep it in the family as the youngster gun. 
Just my 2 cents worth, your mileage may differ. have fun be safe.


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## goodatit (May 1, 2013)

.410 cost to much.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

A .410 is not a kids gun, its an experts gun. Go with the 20ga.


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

Giving a kid a 410 can turn him off shooting/hunting real quick. It doesn't kick much because it throwing out very little shot which means you have to be a very good shot to hit anything. 

Want to see how frustrating it can be? Next time you go hunting or out to break a few clays YOU use a 410 and see how many times you miss shots you would have never missed with a 20 or 12.


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## beowoulf90 (Jan 13, 2004)

watcher said:


> Giving a kid a 410 can turn him off shooting/hunting real quick. It doesn't kick much because it throwing out very little shot which means you have to be a very good shot to hit anything.
> 
> Want to see how frustrating it can be? Next time you go hunting or out to break a few clays YOU use a 410 and see how many times you miss shots you would have never missed with a 20 or 12.


Yea, When I was teaching our daughters to shoot, I gave each of them 20 ga break open's. We would shoot trap/clay pigeons, I would pull the thrower and they would shoot, if they missed I would try and pick up the clay with my T/C Contender in 410.. Lets just say I missed more than they did.:shocked:

The 410 is fine for teaching to shoot at still objects, but to hunt with, I would and did use 20 ga's for my kids.Oh and my kids are small. one is 5' (33 yo) and the other is 4'8" (at 32 yo) So the 20 ga isn't too much for them..


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

You can also get downloaded 20 ga shells to use untill he is ready for field loads.

I'd start with a pump action right off the bat as it won't be long until the single shot won't be enough.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

I like my Rossi .410
It's light, accurate, and with 3 inch shells, it hits hard.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

Made the mistake of purchasing the 20 ga.-.22 youth package for my 5'1" wife..She shot the 20 with a field load ONCE,,I shot it Once, Conned my then 32 yr old younger brother into shooting it once his words 'thet s.o.b kicks'.
Took it to local flee market and all the smart people passed on it when I told them recoil was way to hard for a kid..Aless than 5 lb. single barrel (what it weighs with the 20ga. barell) is gonna always kick..
along comes a fella with a 500 Mossberg with the Bantam buttstock on it, wanted to trade for it, even after me warning him about the horrendous recoil..So I traded with him, weeks later I noticed him back at flea market trying to trade it off.. he looked my way and when he recognized me he changed directions..some people just have to learn the hard way..


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

poorboy said:


> Made the mistake of purchasing the 20 ga.-.22 youth package for my 5'1" wife..She shot the 20 with a field load ONCE,,I shot it Once, Conned my then 32 yr old younger brother into shooting it once his words 'thet s.o.b kicks'.
> Took it to local flee market and all the smart people passed on it when I told them recoil was way to hard for a kid..Aless than 5 lb. single barrel (what it weighs with the 20ga. barell) is gonna always kick..
> along comes a fella with a 500 Mossberg with the Bantam buttstock on it, wanted to trade for it, even after me warning him about the horrendous recoil..So I traded with him, weeks later I noticed him back at flea market trying to trade it off.. he looked my way and when he recognized me he changed directions..some people just have to learn the hard way..


so how foes your wife like the 500 bantam ?


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

Poorboy's post reminded me of something else. A single shot is a BAD idea for a first shotgun or for a smaller person. The reason get them for that is the same reason its a bad thing; they are light.

Weight can change recoil from a 'kick' to a 'shove'. I rather shoot a heavy 12 with 3" mags than a light 20 with field loads.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

I was at walmart today , my daughter wanted to go look at the guns , I saw that for 267 they had a youth model 500 , it was within a half inch of the 870 youth , nice little package and I noticed they had moved the forearm back so that it almost to the reciver when the action is closed 

this would be a very nice gun for a smaller person , and really I would like one then ad a big soft recoil pad to make it long enough for me that 21 inch barrel is a handy looking length for woods hunting , and choke tubes , and very interchangable parts , there should be no problem finding parts 

it is heavier than a single but well balanced , and a repeater so it would be a solid life time owner gun


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> so how foes your wife like the 500 bantam ?


Saw the 12 gauge, went and purchased an old(youth) 158 h&r 20 ga. she killed her first squirrels with it..I sold the 12 and put the money back in me pocket..
Bawt 'er a versa-pak..which she likes, but is no longer made..I have a little pump .22 however which she keeps tryin' to claim..:hysterical:


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

"The .410 is an expert's gun" Perhaps, but I like them anyway. My ambition is to find a little .410 double with barrels so thin that they ring like bells when you touch them with a quarter. I fell in love with that double when I was sixteen--it belonged to my hunting buddy. I don't even remember who made it.

I've got a MEC set up for three inch .410 shells. You can buy primed hulls now--that was always my hold-up. I could find plenty of two and a half inch hulls for reloading, but 3 inch shells were quite expensive. Now I reload 3 inch shells and have no lack of ammo. 
In my opinion the .410 is hindered only by the fact that loading anything heavier than #8 shot (or slugs) is impractical.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

Oxankle said:


> "The .410 is an expert's gun" Perhaps, but I like them anyway. My ambition is to find a little .410 double with barrels so thin that they ring like bells when you touch them with a quarter. I fell in love with that double when I was sixteen--it belonged to my hunting buddy. I don't even remember who made it.
> 
> I've got a MEC set up for three inch .410 shells. You can buy primed hulls now--that was always my hold-up. I could find plenty of two and a half inch hulls for reloading, but 3 inch shells were quite expensive. Now I reload 3 inch shells and have no lack of ammo.
> In my opinion the .410 is hindered only by the fact that loading anything heavier than #8 shot (or slugs) is impractical.


my new .410 shells cost just slightly more than 20's or 12's bought at the store, as i have a friend who purchases NEW hulls already primed and and assembles the loads himself..i still have a box or 2 from 4-5 years back that only cost me 5$ each, conversely i can buy 20's and 12's cheaper at X-mart than he can load them due to the high cost of components these days..I have a mec set up for my 20ga..and powder, some shot, hulls though i'm beginning to doubt that I'll ever really need it...have bullets, powder, reloader for my .22 hornet but doubt I'll ever have a real need for those either as i have around 6 hunnert factory loads..What I'm trying to say is i can shoot whatever i wish economically as i have planned it that way...


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Poorboy; I have just finished loading a hundred .410 shells using the new-primed hulls from Ballistic Products. I spent a bit of time getting my loader adjusted, but it is spitting out perfect 11/16 #8 shot shells now. The new hulls cost 15c each but can be loaded several times. Primers are now within reason, powder for the .410 is about $23 per pound. Cheaper than the $17 they want for three inch shells here. 

The cost of reloading has turned upside down in the past few years. Time was when I could reload 12 gauge shells for half the price of new. 
Ox


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## beowoulf90 (Jan 13, 2004)

Oxankle said:


> Poorboy; I have just finished loading a hundred .410 shells using the new-primed hulls from Ballistic Products. I spent a bit of time getting my loader adjusted, but it is spitting out perfect 11/16 #8 shot shells now. The new hulls cost 15c each but can be loaded several times. Primers are now within reason, powder for the .410 is about $23 per pound. Cheaper than the $17 they want for three inch shells here.
> 
> The cost of reloading has turned upside down in the past few years. Time was when I could reload 12 gauge shells for half the price of new.
> Ox


One thing about reloading.. In 1988/89 we reloaded 1000 12 GA rounds. I'm now down to the last 50.. So what ever the costs where then, I've more than saved money.. At some point I will do it again for the 12 , 20 and .410. Then not worry about the costs for many years. Note I did supplement the 12 ga rounds by buying boxes of shells at auction (farm and auction houses) when the price was right. that is one reason that they lasted this long. I'm at auction every Tuesday evening and an occasional Sat mornings. I also don't shoot as much shotgun as I used to. I'm shooting more rifle and pistol now and reload them also.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

Oxankle said:


> Poorboy; I have just finished loading a hundred .410 shells using the new-primed hulls from Ballistic Products. I spent a bit of time getting my loader adjusted, but it is spitting out perfect 11/16 #8 shot shells now. The new hulls cost 15c each but can be loaded several times. Primers are now within reason, powder for the .410 is about $23 per pound. Cheaper than the $17 they want for three inch shells here.
> 
> The cost of reloading has turned upside down in the past few years. Time was when I could reload 12 gauge shells for half the price of new.
> Ox


I found herco for 19$ a lb. out the door, I loaded some home made .410 (blown out .303) shells with It..Just figuring out how to do it if things go south someday.. Friend lets me have .410 shells,new fully loaded for his cost, them ,28's and 16 ga. is about all that's worth reloading due to high component cost nowadays..
I mostly jist shoot the 2 1/2" 'ers and the 1/2 oz. shot and lower powder required make reloading the .410 desirable... ....


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## littlejoe (Jan 17, 2007)

Oxankle said:


> "The .410 is an expert's gun" Perhaps, but I like them anyway. My ambition is to find a little .410 double with barrels so thin that they ring like bells when you touch them with a quarter. I fell in love with that double when I was sixteen--it belonged to my hunting buddy. I don't even remember who made it.
> 
> I've got a MEC set up for three inch .410 shells. You can buy primed hulls now--that was always my hold-up. I could find plenty of two and a half inch hulls for reloading, but 3 inch shells were quite expensive. Now I reload 3 inch shells and have no lack of ammo.
> In my opinion the .410 is hindered only by the fact that loading anything heavier than #8 shot (or slugs) is impractical.


I'd say they are an experts gun as well, or at least more expert than me, Ox! I've already reiterated my story to you, but not here. My kill ratio on doves just sucked when compared to my 12. 

The 410 just felt good in my hands, swung and pointed well, the lines of it just appealed to me. The ammo cost was something to consider at that time, when I had three boys I was trying to keep interested in shooting and fed.  I took the Spanish made lil gun in as a partial downpayment on a saddle I was to make.

A couple years ago, I looked at it and realized how little it had been shot over the last decade. So, I took it to my local gunshop and put a price on it for consignment. A couple days later #3 son just happened to ask about it and I told him where it was. "NO WAY", he said "Dad, that was the gun I used to kill my first dove!"

I went back to the gunshop the next day, but alas, it had been sold. I've regretted selling it many times since, even though it wasn't my pick for shooting anything. It was a fun neat little shotgun to have! It wasn't the first gun I've regretted letting go. but maybe the last? lol
....................
A few have mentioned the single shot guns. I bought an H&R 20 single shot for a birthday gift for one of the boys. He wasn't shooting it well at clays, so I tried it. I'm not a shotgunner by any means, but it was a dirty bugger!

Things loosened a little and we picked up a Browning field bottom eject 12 for him. If memory serves me correct, that was when he placed 2nd at 4-H state level in trap his first year at age 14. Some kids were shooting real high dollar guns.

Most of this was directed at the original post. Keep it real, and keep it fun for your kids. There are all kinds of shotguns out there, and some very reasonable used guns that are really good starter guns, or beyond. Don't get them one that punishes in the name of fun!

Don't know if your a member of a shooting club or not, or maybe 4-H? We shot trap at a shooting club for 4-H, and it seemed all were great to coach/help, and let someone try a different gun/gauge.

It's great your staying involved with them, wvcabin!!!


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Went to Tulsa today and worked at the NRA booth at the Wannenmacher gun show, said to be the largest such show in the world. I had a couple of hours free before I went on duty, so I walked every aisle I could (pretty fast walk to get them all in, too). If I passed a table with any shotguns I asked for .410 doubles. In all that huge building I ran across perhaps a dozen. Not one Stoeger or the other sporting goods models. 

Cheapest thing I saw was $995, as best I recall) and some over $2,000. Some were beautifully engraved with fine stocks that looked to me like Circassion walnut. 

Needless to say, I am still looking for my squirrel slayer.


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## Bondo (Apr 12, 2014)

wvcabin said:


> i was thinking about getting my son a 410 rossi youth model shotgun, he is 12 but very small, it looks like a nice shotgun, but I don't know anything about rossi, are they a good company or should I look to another company?


Nothing wrong with Rossi it does as it is suppose to. What will he be using it for? Target shooting, hunting, if he will be hunting then what game? I see a lot on here saying no to a 410. I started with a bolt action 410 and still have it to this day. I used it for ruffed grouse and woodcock and killed many birds with it. I still use that gun sometimes taking a walk for grouse. If you are going after a bird like these where you have to kick them out of the brush then a 410 is awesome. It swings quick, it is light so you can carry it longer without fatigue which is big for a kid. Also you won't blow the bird up with a 410. I disagree with it being an expert gun but that is my opinion.


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## Pops2 (Jan 27, 2003)

i didn't read every reply so it might have already been said. one the recoil on single shot 20 is horrible. two and way more important, i learned on a 20 & my brother learned on a 410. because he learned to be more careful and precise to hit, he will clean my clock with shotguns everytime.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

I switched from a double 20 to a single 410 and I dropped just as many grouse. The only thing was that I had to be closer. If I could afford it I would get a double 410 and never look back. I'm still surprised when I find 12 ga casings on a grouse trail. That seems way overkill.

My 410 has an exposed hammer and it was a bear to cock so I had a gunsmith weaken the spring. He went too far and now it doesn't fire a lot.


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## Pops2 (Jan 27, 2003)

fishhead said:


> I switched from a double 20 to a single 410 and I dropped just as many grouse. The only thing was that I had to be closer. If I could afford it I would get a double 410 and never look back. I'm still surprised when I find 12 ga casings on a grouse trail. That seems way overkill.
> 
> My 410 has an exposed hammer and it was a bear to cock so I had a gunsmith weaken the spring. He went too far and now it doesn't fire a lot.


 time to find a new gunsmith


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Nobody has mentioned it yet so I will, a bolt action shotgun might be the answer. 

Mossberg and probably others made/make bolt actions that have a 2 round magazine plus one in the chamber for 3 total. They aren't too light and, with a little practice, are not too bad for follow up shot(s) if needed.

My dad started me on a 16 ga bolt action Mossberg. He kept the magazine until he thought I was handeling it ok as a single shot and then upgraded me. I think a bolt action helps teach a beginner shooting instead of the spray-and-pray of pumps, autos and, to a certian extent, doubles for a starting hunter.

Cheap, not too heavy, not too light and they come in all calibers.


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## Bondo (Apr 12, 2014)

Gray Wolf said:


> Nobody has mentioned it yet so I will, a bolt action shotgun might be the answer.
> 
> Mossberg and probably others made/make bolt actions that have a 2 round magazine plus one in the chamber for 3 total. They aren't too light and, with a little practice, are not too bad for follow up shot(s) if needed.
> 
> ...


Yup and mine even came with a choke selector that you just turned on the end of the gun. I love that gun yet.


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## Pops2 (Jan 27, 2003)

Gray Wolf said:


> Nobody has mentioned it yet so I will, a bolt action shotgun might be the answer.
> 
> Mossberg and probably others made/make bolt actions that have a 2 round magazine plus one in the chamber for 3 total. They aren't too light and, with a little practice, are not too bad for follow up shot(s) if needed.
> 
> ...


 the 410 my brother started on was a stevens bolt action


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## ct01r (Jan 21, 2014)

I also started with a bolt action .410, but it was WAAAY too long ago to remember the brand. With practice, I could get a off a second shot with ease. (I should have practiced on hitting the bird with the first shot!) I don't hunt anymore, but have a Mossburg bolt action .410 I use for the pigeons, starlings, etc. on the farm. It's a lot safer and quieter than a 20 ga. Curt


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

I've got one of those Stevens bolt action .410's; good little shotgun. Still looking for the side by side.
Ox


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