# Windows 7 updates



## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

I am running windows 7. Microsoft sent notice that they are not supporting 7 as of 1/14/2020. This includes updates. My computer is set up to ask me for permission to install updates. I have received several "updates" since Microsoft discontinued them. How do I determine if they are really from Microsoft and if I need to install them? Please don't tell me that I should upgrade to 10 or Linnux. I like 7 and don't want to spend money or learn new system.


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## gleepish (Mar 10, 2003)

I upgraded from 7 to 10 for this very reason, and I wish I hadn't! I really do not like 10! The only way you can know for sure is to go to the Microsoft web page and see what they say.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

You can run Windows 7 for as long as you wish but you really shouldn't use it for online work. If you want to keep Windows 7 for some reason then I would suggest getting a tablet or chromebook for your online chores.

My workstation uses Windows 10. I don't have a problem with it, but to each his own.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

As long as your browser and email client (if you use one) is updated as well as virus protection, then I wouldnt worry about it. You will eventually have to either update to newer windows or linux when it gets to where you can no long get an uptodate browser for win7. This is what happened to XP and Vista.

As to win10, as is, its kind of a PITA, but if you spend the time to lock it down where it cant phone home, then its not horrible. Look for a script called Blackbird, it will automagically remove and block lot spy stuff using win10's own firewall. There are several such scripts out there but some never got updated so worked in 2016 but probably not on current win10. Still suggest at least dual booting with whatever linux looks good to you. Get used to that. You can run uptodate Firefox or Chrome/Chromium on it. Looks just like Firefox and Chrome in windows. I use Puppy Linux as daily driver, but really like Debian 10 "Buster". Nothing wrong with Ubuntu/Lubuntu/Xubuntu, except they have kind of a "mother knows best" attitude. I used Lubuntu for several months at one point. It wouldnt let me boot as root so after getting really irritated at using sudo command plus password, I finally just gave the user account full root powers. Which of course defeated what Ubuntu people were trying to do. But made it lot nicer to live with. Some things I still had to use sudo, but didnt have to enter password.

Oh will mention though I have never tried it, lot people like MINT linux which is based on Ubuntu.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

HermitJohn said:


> As long as your browser and email client (if you use one) is updated as well as virus protection, then I wouldnt worry about it. You will eventually have to either update to newer windows or linux when it gets to where you can no long get an uptodate browser for win7. This is what happened to XP and Vista.


I disagree. Operating system vulnerabilities will almost certainly be discovered that will have nothing to do with the web browser or email client, and can't be detected by antivirus software. Hacker communities will share that information, which will unleash a not-so-small army of vandals probing Windows 7 computers all over the world. I really would not recommend using an outdated operating system for online work.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Vulnerabilities nearly always through browser or email client. Thats how the system interacts with the web. And usually its people just clicking on stuff they shouldnt. 

I personally didnt care much for XP/Vista and never used a win7 computer. Only got win10 when I could no longer run tax software on XP. Like say I strongly suggest people dual boot linux for a while. Unless they have great need for some windows only software, it will do everything windows will do for home user. Honest once win10 is cut off from phoning home, you arent going to see huge difference using it than linux. Biggest downside to win10 is it likes to hide settings. Oh and if you let it update, then it will reset stuff to what MS prefers cause mother knows best. Yes you can block updates with firewall, just dont let it phone home to update server. Personally I think rather than automated updates, better to block all updates and just download fresh version win10 after a big update. Tends to work better done that way IMHO. Save copy of old version so if you dont like what they did. Cause most updates are NOT security related, they are marketing related to give you the full windows experience..... and attempt to put more of your money in their pocket.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

HermitJohn said:


> Vulnerabilities nearly always through browser or email client. Thats how the system interacts with the web. And usually its people just clicking on stuff they shouldnt.


Most of the time that's true, but hackers look for potential targets by "probing" computers in entire IP address ranges for particular operating systems and updates. When the robot software finds one the hacker uses a script to exploit the vulnerability. It's a real problem.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Nevada said:


> Most of the time that's true, but hackers look for potential targets by "probing" computers in entire IP address ranges for particular operating systems and updates. When the robot software finds one the hacker uses a script to exploit the vulnerability. It's a real problem.


Router and Firewall should be blocking ports that are probed. But yea, most people pretty clueless to using firewall. Some third party frontends for windows firewall that make it easier. 

Look, people looking for vulnerable computers arent going to waste lot time breaking into a relatively secure computer, they just move on looking for the clueless. Well unless they are trying to break into a particular computer or network. But those just looking for vulnerable computers for their zombie army or something, will bypass those that are secure enough to take some time and effort.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Nimrod said:


> How do I determine if they are really from Microsoft and if I need to install them?


Don't click on any links that pop up.
Go to "control panel" and click "windows update" and that will pull up the real thing.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

HermitJohn said:


> Router and Firewall should be blocking ports that are probed.


Routers and firewalls aren't the obstacle they used to be. Hacker technology has evolved.

You are correct that some probes can be stopped by blocking particular ports, but there's no telling which ports Windows 7 users will need to block. It's a lot safer to simply use a supported operating system.

Then there's the age-old argument about whether open source or a proprietary operating system offers the best security. Microsoft claims that the safety is in keeping their code secret so would-be vandals can't see it. Open source claims safety by having thousands of pair of eyes on the code to catch errors and vulnerabilities. Personally, I don't see keeping the code secret as much security protection. People will always be observing the behavior of operating system features and discover vulnerabilities without seeing the code.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

You do realize even security updates dont happen until AFTER the vulnerability shows up? Guessing if it interfered with some marketing agenda, it would be on very slow track to getting fixed. Frankly all the behind the scenes hidden phoning home and automated updating stuff seems a HUGE vulnerability.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

This past week a number of local win 7 personal users called me asking how hard it would be to switch their PCs over to Linux O/S and how much of their personal files could be run. So far out of about a dozen inquiries I have been able to find best fit Linux versions for 5 0f them and the operating systems loaded on three of them in my spare time.

I was glad that the three I have helped to switch over so far were already using Firefox so they can browse while learning the specifics of their Linux choices as easily as they learned Windows 7 after their XP and Vista eras.

The surge of participation in some of the Linux groups I read as references of the various versions both surprised me at the volume of Win 7 personal users willing to switch and the possibility of black hatters trying to slip corrupt versions in on the Win 7 users not familiar with open source community self policing , authentic checksum verification and such.

As far as outdated Win operating systems, I still have a flight simulation game , the Leisuresuit Larry Land of the Lounge Lizard series and a golf game that runs on an ancient air gapped windows 95 desk side floor tower that hasn't seen the internet since the 28.8k dial up days and it's parallel port modem was repurposed before I was given that junked tower during a workplace clean up because our lab upgraded. LOL


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## NRA_guy (Jun 9, 2015)

A few weeks ago I upgraded to Win 10 from Win 7.

I've got a bunch of things (like MS Office Pro 2013, Adobe Pro, WillMaker, Net Uptime Monitor, MiniReminder, an old version of Viewahead photo editing, and other software) that I use that probably won't work with Win 10.

None of it came over when I upgraded to Win 10.

Some of it I would need to try to reinstall in Win 10 and see how that works, but some I would have to buy the latest version of.

Some of it is simply no longer available.

Some of it I no longer have the installation CD and key for---or it probably wouldn't work in Win 10.

Chrome came over, but my Chrome bookmarks did not come over with the Win 10 upgrade.

Then I'd have to learn how to use Win 10 and the latest versions of whatever I made work.

By the time I got everything working with Win 10 (or gave up trying) and learned how to use it, Win 12 would be out.

I used the Win 10 "revert to previous version of Windows" feature to revert back to Win 7, but (not surprisingly) NONE of my 3rd party software (the things that were missing in Win 10) came back when I reverted back to Win 7.

But . . . I had anticipated that; so I had cloned my old Win 7 hard drive with all of my files. I just put the clone back in and my PC was back where I started before the Win 10 upgrade.

I will continue using Win 7 as long as I can.

I have made sure that I have a decent antivirus (I tested several and settled on the free version of Avast) and firewall. I set Avast to run daily when I am asleep.

And I back it up to an external hard drive fairly often.

If all I ever did was check email, surf the net, and post in forums, I'd be happy with Win 10. But I actually use my computer for other things.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

NRA_guy said:


> A few weeks ago I upgraded to Win 10 from Win 7.
> 
> I've got a bunch of things (like MS Office Pro 2013 <snip>) that I use that probably won't work with Win 10.


I install and configure MS Office products pretty regularly. You won't have any trouble using Office 2013 with Windows 10. Windows 10 is designed to be compatible with Office 2007 and newer.

As for Win7--->Win10 upgrade, I've never done it. I'm a big fan of fresh installs.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

NRA_guy said:


> A few weeks ago I upgraded to Win 10 from Win 7.
> 
> I've got a bunch of things (like MS Office Pro 2013, Adobe Pro, WillMaker, Net Uptime Monitor, MiniReminder, an old version of Viewahead photo editing, and other software) that I use that probably won't work with Win 10.
> 
> ...


Yea, you have to hold onto activation code for any purchased software if you ever want to reinstall it. If company still in business, sometimes they will have record of your purchase and sent you new code/key.

As to bookmarks in Chrome, you can go to bookmarks manager and and click the three dots in upper right corner of bookmarks manager, choose to export them to an html file. This will open in any browser.

Apparently you can even install MS Office from win98 days in win10 if you really want to, takes bit of workaround. Not sure why you would want to, get either LibreOffice or free version WPS Office.

If you have older software (with key) that is too old for win10, usually can get it to run in WINE under linux.

You can also either set up your computer to boot to any of several operating systems installed on your computer. Or you can run Oracle VM Virtualbox and install other operating systems on top of your main one. Virtualbox is free and there are versions for both linux and windows. Sometimes running win10 in virtualbox on a linux computer is easier way to run windows only software than using WINE. It does require lots of RAM though, cause you are in effect running two operating systems at same time.


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## anniew (Dec 12, 2002)

I don't speak computer language. Some of this stuff is like reading Greek.
I have Win 7 and am not going to 10 as I have a second laptop that came with 10 and I don't use it. It is not user friendly for computer challenged folks like me.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

anniew said:


> I don't speak computer language. Some of this stuff is like reading Greek.
> I have Win 7 and am not going to 10 as I have a second laptop that came with 10 and I don't use it. It is not user friendly for computer challenged folks like me.


And there is the problem, you really gotta find it interesting enough to figure how to make it do what you want and not just marketing tool and data collection device for MS. Out of the box, win10 is obnoxious and not pleasant. Sort of like a pushy salesman in carnival midway. And since it forces you to share your computer resources with MS, you need a more powerful computer. .

If however you figure out how to lock it down so it cant phone home and do the marketing updates, then its not that bad. Once locked down, my only real complaint is how spread out and hidden lot of settings/services are. MS really wants you to use it THEIR WAY, not your way. Hint, push the window key on keyboard same time as "x" key, and you get menu thats hard to get to any other way. Its still not easy to find some stuff, but that gives you a fighting chance.

Oh and big help in locking it down is a free third party script called Blackbird, https://getblackbird.net It just gives you list of things and up to you if you want to block any or all of them. Some change settings, some set up firewall rules to keep stuff from phoning home. There are other third party scripts and some setting you can change if you can find them. But Blackbird is one of better ones and keeps upto date. Some of the other ones you find havent been updated for years whereas win10 has changed whole bunch since it came out. If you do let win10 autoupdate, you will need to rerun Blackbird after every update, cause MS updates will reset lot stuff to what THEY think it should be, not how you set it.

Oh last time I installed win10 on a computer, for some reason it doesnt have clock down in tray. I searched online, and yea apparently MS hid it to make desktop more streamlined???? They showed how you can unhide it in registry (really?? why cant it just be an easy desktop option in settings??). Instead of all that, I just downloaded couple third party freeware clocks, one for tray and one with lot more info on desktop, its like similar one I use in linux. oh make sure its actual freeware, lot windows freeware isnt very free and collects data or installs crap you dont want. I have had pretty good luck with freeware from www.majorgeeks.com and especially https://www.oldergeeks.com/ Others of course, but anymore lot of them like to play games to get you to click stuff thinking its download you want when its some sales pitch nonsense.

Oh and on another forum, apparently win10 during install now really really tries to hide the option of installing it with a local account, they want to try and force you to sign up for Microsoft account so they can collect more info. If you want to install it with local account, you have to make sure it cant connect to internet during install. If it can connect (it will try without asking), then it wont even show you option to use local account. If it cant connect, it may ask you several times to connect, but eventually it will give up and let you use local account. I didnt even realize this since my only way of connecting requires I install an ancient XP driver for my ancient 3G cell phone, then jump bunch hoops to make win10 use old dialup dialer workaround to tether and this also requires some custom dialer string to get it to use APN for cell service. Its horribly complicated and counter intuitive, wont even mention MS has wired connection service shut off by default.... and its really hidden. Guess they figure most use wifi or ethernet. Anyway I couldnt connect during setup if I wanted to. So always get offered local account option. Only found out when somebody was claiming you couldnt set up win10 with local account anymore. You can, you just cant let windows installer go online during setup or option isnt offered.


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## NRA_guy (Jun 9, 2015)

HermitJohn said:


> And since it forces you to share your computer resources with MS, you need a more powerful computer.


Great write-up @HermitJohn. Thanks.

And therein lies the genius that made Bill Gates rich.

He figured out long ago that if he could force Microsoft users to buy new hardware with each mandatory Windows upgrade, the computer manufacturers would support him by installing Windows on all of their machines.

Then in a few years, Microsoft would force all users to upgrade their version of Windows, and they would discover that they suddenly need to buy a new computer.

Remember: Neither Microsoft nor computer manufacturers make any money off of satisfied users---unless they can force the users to upgrade.

Imagine needing new tires for your car and being told, "Oh, sorry. The kind of tires that your car requires are no longer available because they are deemed unsafe. You have to buy a new car."


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## anniew (Dec 12, 2002)

Hermit John, I can't even understand half of what you wrote, because someone who understands computers cannot relate to those who don't. I don't even know what a local account option means.
I just want to be able to email, and google things that I am interested in, as well as having something that gives me "news" each day. Nothing fancy, but guess that is too simple for the computer/software producers' pocketbooks!
But thanks for trying...I guess I am un-educationable.


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## Meinecke (Jun 30, 2017)

From my IT tech point of view i would stick with Win7...beef up on router/firewall security, have decent antivirus in place and have redundant PW protected backup and life should be good for a while...
Firefox and Chrome will stick with Win7 support for a good while from now and so browser security should not the issue...
But if you want to go the Win10 route...you can still switch over via in place upgrade for free...the official tools are still available and working...just not as aggressive advertised anymore.
With a good de-bloater (from github for example) and turned of spy functions in win 10 it might be ok...
But for regular work, without playing...go to Ubuntu, Suse or other Linux...office etc is all available and almost as convenient to use...


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

anniew said:


> Hermit John, I can't even understand half of what you wrote, because someone who understands computers cannot relate to those who don't. I don't even know what a local account option means.
> I just want to be able to email, and google things that I am interested in, as well as having something that gives me "news" each day. Nothing fancy, but guess that is too simple for the computer/software producers' pocketbooks!
> But thanks for trying...I guess I am un-educationable.


You would like Puppy Linux. Includes most of basic stuff. Easy to use. No data collection. The linux versions of Chrome/Chromium and Firefox are same as the windows versions. Just as up to date, can use 99% of browser addons. Same with Thunderbird email client. 

But to explain on win10, a local account means one you set up during install to only exist on your computer, nowhere else. You pick a username and a login password IF you want one, you can just leave it blank and no password, just like win98. A Microsoft account is an account with the corporation with personal information shared. You need a MS account to use "the Store", Cortana, and other built in metro apps. Also to sych that Windows computer with other Windows computer and guessing probably your Android cell phone.


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## NRA_guy (Jun 9, 2015)

Serious questions (just curious): 

I notice that several folks seem to be moving to Linux. Is Linux somehow immune to hackers, viruses, and ransom attacks?

Or is the Linux community just so small that hackers and other abusers just don't exert the effort to attack such a small world?

As I understand, there are several versions of Linux. Are there simply too many versions of Linux and too few users for it to be worth the effort to hackers?

Would a person be better off in the long run to bite the bullet and transition to Apple products? I don't hear much about Apple computers getting hacked or held for ransom or infected with viruses.

Thanks.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

NRA_guy said:


> Serious questions (just curious):
> 
> I notice that several folks seem to be moving to Linux. Is Linux somehow immune to hackers, viruses, and ransom attacks?
> 
> Or is the Linux community just so small that hackers and other abusers just don't exert the effort to attack such a small world?


First, I don't know a lot about Linux desktops. I use Linux as a server environment. Linux servers typically have graphical interfaces available (usually KDE or gnome) but it isn't a good idea to install a graphical interface on a server. So the Linux I see is very different from what Linux desktop users see. I could elaborate on that, but it's off topic for this thread. I use Windows 10 for my workstation operating system.

Speaking from a server point of view, there is huge interest in hacking Linux. That's because Linux servers usually have a commercial Internet connection where port 25 isn't blocked. Successfully compromising a Linux server is a huge prize for launching spam & DDoS attacks. You can get into a lot of trouble by running out of date Linux & applications. I have to take a lot of precautions to avoid getting hacked.

Linux has update utilities similar to Windows Update. The big difference is that Linux update utilities are a lot better about keeping 3rd party applications up to date than Windows. Linux also has the advantage of having thousands of pairs of eyes on the code looking for security problems, where Windows & Apple product code is kept secret.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Ah, the general answer is that those that write malware want the most bang for buck. Vastly more people use windows and android. And yes malware virus for Apple so dont think thats a panacea. Get you linux software via package manager for your distribution and very little chance of malware added. 

The linux kernel is same in all linux, well saying that some use older kernels, some are cutting edge. But any particular release kernel is same in distributions that use that kernel. 

I havent kept up on what other distributions are using but Puppy founder, Barry Kauler, now retired from active Puppy development still actively developing his own pups. Some of his experiments end up in community releases eventually. One of his, EasyOS, uses a containerized system. Should be extremely secure. I havent tried it. Its more experimental and not a community release. Puppy Linux by way has several official community releases, usually based one of major linux distributions, only Puppy-ized. But also some unofficial puppy fan versions which may or may not be good, usually just customized version of one of the community releases, more or less software, different desktop, etc. For example the computer I am using right now is BionicPup, based on Bionic Beaver Ubuntu. But you wouldnt know it to use it, its very "Puppy". The latest is DpupBuster, I have it on another computer. I like it a lot. Its based on Debian 10 "Buster". Then again I like the actual Debian 10 "Buster" a lot. You can get it with any desktop you want, I got the LXDE version as I dont like the KDE/Gnome bloat. It assumes you know what you are doing and have your big boy pants on if you make mistake. If you want a "mother may I?" operating system with a more windows mentality, then Ubuntu/Lubuntu/Xubuntu maybe your cup of tea. There is one called MINT that is Ubuntu based but favorite of new refugees from windows world. 

Might look at this: https://fossbytes.com/best-linux-distros-choosing-guide/

Honest think people underestimate Puppy. Its small but very complete as it comes, and usually not hard to add any software you want to add. Maybe my only complaint about Puppy is I dont like its native package manager near as well as apt-get available in most Debian and Ubuntu based distributions. Apt-get is command line (they also offer a gui package manager) but very powerful and finds ALL libraries and such needed for program it is installing. Some others dont always get everything needed.

The best way to get into linux is to dual boot windows and linux. So you arent feeling stuck. Or pickup a second old two core computer. You can get by with less, but honest for even Puppy I suggest minimum of a 2 core processor and 2GB RAM. Its not just the operating system but lot modern software also needs this or you will notice sluggishness. But hey if you already own an old P4 era single core computer with 1GB RAM try it. It will work, just maybe not as well as you want. 

Or run Oracle VM Virtualbox. So you can install linux and install virtualbox then install windows in virtualbox. Or you can install windows and install virtualbox and then install linux in virtualbox. Only downside to virtualbox is that you are in fact running two operating systems at same time on one computer so need lot ram. I have run it with as little as 4GB RAM but honest if you are doing this regularly, you want more like 8GB RAM.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

HermitJohn said:


> Ah, the general answer is that those that write malware want the most bang for buck. Vastly more people use windows and android.


Actually, Android is Linux. It uses the Linux kernel, but has been modified for use in mobile devices, of course. Smart phone users only see the user interface, but under the hood it's Linux. Using the free Linux kernel plays a big part in keeping Android free.

I'm not putting Android down. For what it is it certainly does the job. And as more and more people become familiar with the Android interface it has the potential to become a major player in the PC operating system market. So far we only see it in tablets and chromebooks, but if they expand Android's capabilities we could see it on laptops & desktops, giving Microsoft a run for their money.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Nevada said:


> Actually, Android is Linux. It uses the Linux kernel, but has been modified for use in mobile devices, of course. Smart phone users only see the user interface, but under the hood it's Linux.
> 
> I'm not putting Android down. For what it is it certainly does the job. And as more and more people become familiar with the Android interface it has the potential to become a major player in the PC operating system market. So far we only see it in tablets and chromebooks, but if they expand Android's capabilities we could see it on laptops & desktops.


As popular as Android is on phones/tablets, you can bet the blackhat folk have taken notice. Heck lot of supposedly approved clean apps phone home on regular basis and steal info. When you click ok during install without reading the fine print, you are agreeing to this apparently. Android uses a modified linux kernel, but it isnt linux. You cant run Android apps on a linux computer, not without an emulator. And you cant run linux apps on Android. The newer Chromebooks that use ChromeOS can run Android apps and some linux programs. However it uses emulator, they dont run natively.


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## NRA_guy (Jun 9, 2015)

Wow! Thanks guys!

I'm not sure whether all that encourages me or discourages me from tiptoeing into the non-Windows water. 

I like the idea of picking up a cheap used PC to experiment with. Great suggestion. If I screw it up it wouldn't be a great loss.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Some Windows 10 users I know have found disabling Cortana and selecting the metered setting as their connection flag to restrict MS automatic updating helps to keep MS from being so irritating to them.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

Shrek said:


> Some Windows 10 users I know have found disabling Cortana and selecting the metered setting as their connection flag to restrict MS automatic updating helps to keep MS from being so irritating to them.


Speaking for myself, I have cortana disabled and hidden. I have no use for it.

As for updates, I watch new release news and anticipate the date it's available. I usually wait for a few weeks to hear what experiences others have had with a release, but I apply new Windows 10 releases pretty promptly. I have several reason for wanting the latest release, including the ability to support other users who are using newer releases.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

anniew said:


> Hermit John, I can't even understand half of what you wrote, because someone who understands computers cannot relate to those who don't.


Some just don't get that. 

When someone asks a simple question about Windows, they go off on long rants about Linux and Ubuntu and dual booting from a thumb drive and how to change the registry settings and anything *but* a simple answer to what was asked.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Some just don't get that.
> 
> When someone asks a simple question about Windows, they go off on long rants about Linux and Ubuntu and dual booting from a thumb drive and how to change the registry settings and anything *but* a simple answer to what was asked.


Good thing this post ^^^ offers such a simple answer to the original poster's question about windows.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

HermitJohn said:


> Good thing this post ^^^ offers such a simple answer to the original poster's question about windows.


I didn't attempt to answer the first question.
I also didn't do what they specifically asked people to *not* do:



Nimrod said:


> Please don't tell me that I should upgrade to 10 or Linnux.


Everyone wants a car.
Not everyone wants to become a mechanic.

I did answer one of the OP's questions in Post #9.
You were busy talking about so many other things I guess you missed it.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I didn't attempt to answer the first question.
> I also didn't do what they specifically asked people to *not* do:
> 
> 
> ...


And you missed where I said to keep win7 long as you can get uptodate browser and virus protection. Guess you missed that. Must been to busy looking for something to gripe about. 

I just went on to explain that eventually you have to change and choices you have. But anybody not wanting to become a mechanic can just buy a new computer, sorry that your only choice is win10 or ChromeOS or Apple or there are some available with linux preinstalled. Money is always a cure for any problem you dont want to deal with. Its all about how much money you have and how much you want to spend. But try driving your Model T down freeway and tell me how that works out for you. Eventually change happens, like it or not.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

HermitJohn said:


> And *you missed where I said* to keep win7 long as you can get uptodate browser and virus protection.


I probably did since I tend to skim over the long winded, rambling diatribes that always say the same things.



HermitJohn said:


> Money is always a cure for any problem you dont want to deal with.


It doesn't cost a cent to deal with most things.

.


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