# ? re Round-up



## Grandmotherbear (May 15, 2002)

Yeah, I know I said for years I'de never use it- that was before a 2 year hiatus due to multiple injuries, chronic pain, and the growth of shoulder/head weeds and saplings. 
So, If I burn the weeds that the roundup killed, is the roundup broken down by the heat? Or does it remain intact and continue to kill green growing things?
I WANT to put it into my containers. I am cutting way back on the gardening but would like green beans, English or sugar snap peas, tomatoes and lettuce this winter. Anybody know if I can use the ashes in the pots?


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## sisterpine (May 9, 2004)

I found this on the round up site and have gone by it for years with good results. "


*Special Instructions*

All ornamental flowers, trees and shrubs may be planted one day after application. Lawn grasses, herbs, vegetables and fruit may be planted 3 days after application. Glyphosate targets an enzyme found in plants but not people or pets."


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Round-up breaks down very rapidly even under normal conditions.

I've seen farmers spray fields with the soybean planters running right behind the sprayers


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## anniew (Dec 12, 2002)

I think you are probably asking the question for your own garden, but since this is in the organic subforum, I'll say that several years ago when I looked into organic certification, everything had to be free of any pesticide use for three years. It's not exactly what you are asking, but I thought I'd just throw that in. Plus, depending on who you ask, you may get different answers about the potential toxicity of round-up. Opinions seem to run the gamut.


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## doc- (Jun 26, 2015)

RoundUp is very safe: it has low toxicity for animals and degrades rapidly. That's why using RoundUpReady GMO crops is important. It allows farmers to use one of the safest herbicides available instead of more toxic ones.

The "three yrs without pesticide" standard for organic certification is, like so many EPA standards, a number the bureaucrats just picked out of their a...um... air.


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## sammyd (Mar 11, 2007)

The organic standards were written with input from the organic community.
They have been updated with input from the organic community.
The govt could have cared less about the organic business but certain folks in it cried until they got the govt involved. Then cried even more when they learned that big ag could and would adhere to their demands if the money was there.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

Grandmotherbear said:


> Yeah, I know I said for years I'de never use it- that was before a 2 year hiatus due to multiple injuries, chronic pain, and the growth of shoulder/head weeds and saplings.
> So, If I burn the weeds that the roundup killed, is the roundup broken down by the heat? Or does it remain intact and continue to kill green growing things?
> I WANT to put it into my containers. I am cutting way back on the gardening but would like green beans, English or sugar snap peas, tomatoes and lettuce this winter. Anybody know if I can use the ashes in the pots?


I am not certified organic, but I would limit my use of glyphosate to the non-food areas around my place. If I were certified organic(USDA ORGANIC) I would not use it at all because it is a synthetic chemical product that is excluded by the rules of the NOP(National Organic Program) that I voluntarily signed up to abide by. So, could one say I cheat a little?

In your case, if there was any other way, I would try to do that. There are organic seed starting and potting soils available (Espoma seems to be one that isn't too costly); you might try to start a home composting program--once you get enough, you could mix in some of the soil underneath the weedy area; you could maybe hire someone to cut and clear, then burn off the weed residue. With container gardening, once you go through a season, you'll want to get some nutrients into the mix to replenish those that got used up, so you probably should start a compost project if you haven't done so already.

I had the same experience as you this season; due to my physical condition, the weeds got away from me and I ended up with head/shoulder high weeds--i will have to deal with them next season, and I have plans to cut back on my planting space, too(didn't do so well with the garlic, though--I'll be up to my neck in garlic come June and July. I forgot that I had ordered from two separate places and didn't have the heart to leave any unplanted....) I was able to mow the rank weeds down with my riding mower--but the bigger issue will be the weed seeds--glyphosate won't kill weed seeds.....

https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/glyphosate#section=Top

This is the listing of known facts about glyphosate from the NIH (National Institutes of Health) database. The answer to the question about any residual glyphosate being broken down by heat isn't directly addressed by any of the published studies shown, though it does begin to degrade at about 400 degrees( see the quoted reference below labeled Decomposition)--so, you can only form an opinion that can help you make the choice.... 
*Decomposition*

The decomposition temperature of a substance is the temperature at which the substance chemically decomposes
When heated to decomposition it emits very toxic fumes of /nitrogen and phosphorus oxides/.Lewis, R.J. Sr. (ed) Sax's Dangerous Properties of Industrial Materials. 11th Edition. Wiley-Interscience, Wiley & Sons, Inc. Hoboken, NJ. 2004., p. 2947




Here's my opinion: In theory, yes, it does break down when it reaches the soil. It gets eaten by bioorganisms and converted into the elemental forms of carbon, nitrogen, phosphorus, oxygen. In theory and in the testing, the time period is pretty quick. It acts through the leaf system and isn't thought to be taken up by the roots(based on the fact of "bioactivity precludes that") It is broken down by ultraviolet radition of sunlight exposure.

So far, it sounds pretty benign, huh? BUT in _field conditions_ you can't exclude the variables like you can do in controlled testings.....and certainly NOT in my garden. Things like sunlight, weather, overspray, dry periods, amount of spray used, if any other active ingredients(not noticed in the fine print) were in the bottle, amount of organism activity in my soil, rainfall. And I don't know enough chemistry to consider the potentcy of the chemical products that get created during the breakdown process--called metabolites--so, until I could be 100% sure it is All broken down and benign----and, I nearly always spill something on my hands or splash it in my eyes----so, I prefer not to use it.

Just like in the hospital....I'm always glad when the nurse comes in and puts on a new pair of purple gloves. I don't want the greebies from her last patient, and I don't want to pass mine on.

geo


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## KatsFarm (Sep 13, 2016)

There are other ways to kill off weeds without using chemicals. Do any of you really believe it when the manufacturer says "it's perfectly safe"? would you expect to hear the truth about its toxicity?
Everything has a half life, I don't care what it is. As long as there is the possibility of a speck of that poison getting into my food I won't go near it.
I keep weeds down by mulching heavily. It kills the weeds and feeds the soil safely.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

geo in mi said:


> I am not certified organic, but I would limit my use of glyphosate to the non-food areas around my place. If I were certified organic(USDA ORGANIC) I would not use it at all because it is a synthetic chemical product that is excluded by the rules of the NOP(National Organic Program) that I voluntarily signed up to abide by. So, could one say I cheat a little?
> 
> In your case, if there was any other way, I would try to do that. There are organic seed starting and potting soils available (Espoma seems to be one that isn't too costly); you might try to start a home composting program--once you get enough, you could mix in some of the soil underneath the weedy area; you could maybe hire someone to cut and clear, then burn off the weed residue. With container gardening, once you go through a season, you'll want to get some nutrients into the mix to replenish those that got used up, so you probably should start a compost project if you haven't done so already.
> 
> ...


I find your comments puzzling.

Since it is widely accepted that Roundup (glyphosate) breaks down rapidly with soil contact and or sunshine, in what situation would heating to 400 degrees be applicable? Since it is always sold as a liquid, how would you get it to nearly 200 degrees beyond steam? While there may be a way to distil it to a powder form then subject it to 400 degrees, but it seems an odd way to mention getting rid of it.

Nitrous Oxide is often referred to as laughing gas, used by millions of dentists for 50 plus years. I doubt that it is toxic. If it is, the ADA has some 'splaining to do. Hot Rodders inject it into their engines, too. 

As the website you posted shows and you detailed, carbon, nitrogen, phosphorus, oxygen are what it is made from and what it quickly returns to the elements that every garden requires.

What "field conditions" are you referring to that is void of soil and sunshine? Metabolites are formed and then broken down so quickly as to not thought to have any effect. Good that you preface your comments with an admission that you have no knowledge in the category you are writing about. I'm no expert either, but a couple chemistry classes in college and good reading comprehension helps.

I do agree with you. I'm going to wait a ridiculous amount of time, like two weeks, to plant my garden after spraying Roundup. Also, like you, I do sometimes spill Roundup. I try not to, but it happens. I've researched toxicity levels of diluted glyphosate and understand that when I do spill some on my hands, I don't need to go screaming to the house to get it washed off. Like you, I prefer not to use it. But losing a crop to weeds and the more critical issue: formation of a decade's worth of weed seeds, I am willing to use it as another tool in my quest for food production.

BTW, every jug of glyphosate I've ever seen has no other active ingredients, large or small print. Other products may contain glyphosate and other herbicides or they may contain the common nitrogen source: ammonium sulfate. It is made of nitrogen, oxygen and sulfur. Again, all elements common to gardens. But those added products are clearly written across the label.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Roundup is not considered organic.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

For Haypoint: I edited my original posting to reflect the correct quote about the effects of decomposing glyphosate by heat....to show nitrogen oxides and phosphorus oxides...

geo


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## Grandmotherbear (May 15, 2002)

Haypoint- the 400 degrees is probably less than what I burn that dead yard trash at. I try to not use chemicals other than fertilizers and amendments, but needs must when the devil drives, and all that. I have to kill off the live weeds so there will be no bees in it when I try to take it down by hand. Can't mow because it's full of pots of varying sizes, from 3 gallons to 55 gallons. Not to mention about 6 trellises. I uncovered a live pineapple under the dead grasses last week. I am thinking there are probably 6 more somewhere in there, and I would like to get the asparagus pots area cleared of grasses/weeds. That is right by the hive in the rubber tree and I would prefer to work that area in cooler weather. Yes, the heat denatures nitrogen rapidly in south Florida, and my pot fill shrinks over the course of a few months, so I need to keep adding more organic material constantly. Of course, I haven't gardened in the last 2 years.

I thank everyone who contributed information. GFB preferred that we not use massive amounts of salt or vinegar, which are about the only "organic" herbicides I've heard of. And this is personal use garden, not commercial, not organic (altho I porefer not to use chemicals, as I've said)

I'm going to add the ash to my apple orchard. I've had several trees die recently (lifespan, yield, and fruit size all suffer in the heat) and I keep TRYING to get into the lake to rake up the algae/detritus to add to the pots, but with one thing and another, haven't been able to. Again, thanks to all who responded.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

While you might be able to get dry leaves to burn quite hot, not sure you could do the same with a liquid. If you mean getting the Roundup out of the weeds by burning the weeds after they die, then I think the Roundup will no longer exist, breaking down in a day or four. Contact with soil and sunlight breaks it down.
I agree, adding salt to soil is a bad idea. You need a lot of Acetic Acid (CH3COOH) to kill weeds. I've never used Acetic Acid for weed control, but my soil tends towards acid anyway, so adding an acid is counterproductive. Vinegar is acetic acid.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

For Grandmotherbear,

Thanks for getting back with us. I always hesitate to give very much opinion when the question concerns gardening in the deep South. Here in Michigan, what you describe would be cured in the next couple of months with the coming of some hard freezing weather. Most of your weeds would be winter killed and you could clear them out before you start up again when the weather gets warm again. In your case, short of napalm....(which isn't organic, either...)

I'm also very hesitant to give opinions whenever the word "Roundup" is mentioned, since just about every forum on the Homesteading Today site seems to degenerate into a pointless flaming debate about its use. This forum was created to avoid that, so, I hope I have given you something positive, and in the spirit, at least, of trying to use as much of an "organic" approach as possible. Again, thanks for getting back, and I hope I have contributed something useful.

geo


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

While I am not fully organic I see a lot of pro-herbicide's propaganda untruths above.

-No, glyphosate (round ups active ingredient) does not break down in 1-4 days.

-Contact with soil does not specifically break it down. Read the label! It's says right on the label to apply to foliage only, and NOT TO THE POINT OF RUN OFF.

-just because farmers plant direct after glyphosate application doesn't mean it's broken down, it doesn't kill seeds... only foliage from growing plants. Misleading example.


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

haypoint said:


> Roundup is not considered organic.


Nice misleading meme...
Just because something is organic doesn't mean you should rub it in your eyes.
Take for example nicotine. It's been used as an insecticide (it is a natural insecticide from the tobacco plant).
How about cyanide? Also naturally occurring. You still need a mask!


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

fireweed farm said:


> While I am not fully organic I see a lot of pro-herbicide's propaganda untruths above.
> 
> -No, glyphosate (round ups active ingredient) does not break down in 1-4 days.
> 
> ...


I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

They say don't spray to the point of "run-off" because it's wasteful, not because of any hazards. To let it drip off costs money.

There's nothing "misleading" about mentioning planting soybeans at the time of spraying since those seeds, with proper moisture, will be putting up their own leaves in just a few days so if the Round-up was still active they would die.

The OP has nothing to worry about with her scenario, which was asking whether or not Round-up would remain in her weeds long enough to cause problems later.


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## Declan (Jan 18, 2015)

fireweed farm said:


> While I am not fully organic I see a lot of pro-herbicide's propaganda untruths above.
> 
> -No, glyphosate (round ups active ingredient) does not break down in 1-4 days.
> 
> ...


Some versions of Roundup have pre-emergent in them. Definitely not something you would want in you growing area, but in other places, why not.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

fireweed farm said:


> While I am not fully organic I see a lot of pro-herbicide's propaganda untruths above.
> 
> -No, glyphosate (round ups active ingredient) does not break down in 1-4 days.
> 
> ...



Contact with soil and sunlight break down Roundup. Read the label.

I would never advocate spraying Roundup on the soil. However, when spraying a field of weeds, there is often tiny areas of exposed soil. Roundup will be sprayed on plants and soil alike. The Roundup on plants will kill them, while the Roundup that misses plants, goes onto soil, will quickly break down. It is this scientific fact, along with low toxicity, that has made glyphosate the most common herbicide in the world.

After glyphosate has killed weeds, even if there were no sunshine for weeks, the weeds collapse and with soil contact, glyphosate breaks down. 

When farmers plant crops right behind spraying glyphosate, they realize what you stated, Roundup does not kill seeds. But if Roundup did not break down to safe elements within a few days, the tender sprouts from those seeds would be killed. The obvious fact that it doesn't kill the freshly planted crops when they sprout is proof that Roundup is gone in the matter of a few days. Farmers realize this fact.

I do not want to turn this discussion to an argument for or against the use of Roundup. But, I want the truth available. I believe that everyone should be able to choose how to grow plants based on an understanding of all aspects of agriculture. I believe that misleading statements meant to confuse the unknowing deserve to be responded to.


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

It is a shame but completely expected that the crowd pushing herbicides enough to warrant a specific Organic board, spends so much time on the Organic board promoting the benefits of chemicals...


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

fireweed farm said:


> It is a shame but completely expected that the crowd pushing herbicides enough to warrant a specific Organic board, spends so much time on the Organic board promoting the benefits of chemicals...


Sorry. Spread lies and continue on with misinformation in your "safe place".

Not pushing anything but the truth. Like, hate, doesn't matter to me, just want you to like or hate based on facts.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

fireweed farm said:


> It is a shame but completely expected that the crowd pushing herbicides enough to warrant a *specific Organic board*, spends so much time on the Organic board promoting the benefits of chemicals...


Maybe the question shouldn't be on an "organic" board.
I don't see anyone pushing herbicides.
I see people trying to relay just the facts without the fear tactics.


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## i8paintchips (Feb 27, 2016)

As an organic gardener reading these posts I'm surprised by the seemingly casual approach so many people have when it comes to Round Up. Glyphosate is an endocrine disruptor linked to birth defects and Iincreases the farmers risk of lymphoma. Not to mention it wipes out Monarch butterflies. I'm not the tree hugger type but I like to think of myself as a good steward of the soil. And cancer scares the wee-wee out of me.

When you see soybeans being planted in a field moments after Round Up is being applied that doesn't speak to the safety of glyphosate. Those soybeans are genetically modified to withstand the effects of glyphosate by the same company that produces Round Up (Round Up ready crops by Montsanto).

I get it, weeds can suck the joy out of gardening but if you're truly an organic gardener you'll avoid using chemicals that harm the environment, the crop, or the gardener. I suggest using it sparingly and only if you must.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

i8paintchips said:


> As an organic gardener reading these posts I'm surprised by the seemingly casual approach so many people have when it comes to Round Up.
> 
> *Glyphosate is an endocrine disruptor linked to birth defects and Iincreases the farmers risk of lymphoma.
> Not to mention it wipes out Monarch butterflies. *
> ...


I don't believe any of those statements are true.

Any decline in the Monarch population is due more to the loss of habitat in their Southern range, and less Milkweed in their breeding areas. Whether the Milkweed is eliminated with herbicides or cultivation, the end result is the same. Blaming Glyphosate alone is disingenuous.

The only "links" to birth defects are in the lab and at doses much higher than would ever be found in the real world. 

Farmers always use as little of a chemical as possible to achieve the desired result, because anything more is wasteful.

It wouldn't matter if the crops weren't "Round-up Ready" since it's a post emergent herbicide that has no residual effect. It won't kill anything that's not already growing, and typically breaks down in days.


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

haypoint said:


> Sorry. Spread lies and continue on with misinformation in your "safe place".
> 
> Not pushing anything but the truth. Like, hate, doesn't matter to me, just want you to like or hate based on facts.


I don't promote lies. But you clearly have the ---- disturber gene, along with about 5 others adding to this thread, that clearly have only one reason to be on an organic board- to get a rise.


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I don't believe any of those statements are true.
> 
> Any decline in the Monarch population is due more to the loss of habitat in their Southern range, and less Milkweed in their breeding areas. Whether the Milkweed is eliminated with herbicides or cultivation, the end result is the same. Blaming Glyphosate alone is disingenuous.
> 
> ...


 I agree those are all over blown a hyped up for scare tactics only.


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

GMB, would a non-chemical approach such as laying down sheets of black plastic be at all feasible for your application? Some apply black plastic up to several months before planting which can do a serious number on the populations of weeds waiting to cause you frustration. There are numerous methods I'm sure are well explained and maybe even videos showing on YouTube that can be had with some internet surfing. 

I am sorry to hear about the physical difficulties and limitations. It's a real pain getting older... 

Blessings to you and GFB.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

fireweed farm said:


> I don't promote lies. But you clearly have the ---- disturber gene, along with about 5 others adding to this thread, that clearly have only one reason to be on an organic board- to get a rise.


If ---- means MYTH, then yes. I am interested in disturbing myths. By not letting myths about Roundup, I disturb those false beliefs.

I said it before, I'll say it again. I don't care how you get rid of weeds. I really don't care what falsehoods you embrace. But, when a person asks about Roundup on an organic segment of Homesteadingtoday, I think they deserve the truth. 

I was willing to let you use this safe place, but you chose to add a post almost three weeks after my last post to name call. Trying to get a rise? Might be time for you to give it a rest?


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

Oh gawd.


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

If this thread doesn't qualify for some of those "points" mentioned in another thread, I'm not quite sure what would.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

It's okay, folks, it's okay. Some posters on this forum will never have to worry about a job. There's always an opening at the washing machine plant in Benton Harbor. They're always looking for a good agitator.... 

geo


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## JawjaBoy (Jan 21, 2013)

I know I'm dragging an older thread back up, but I'm under the weather today and got too much time on my hands.

I'll be honest, I'm a lot more worried about the GMO seeds and plants created to resist Roundup than I am of the Roundup itself. I've seen far more negative research on GMO's than I ever have on Roundup. That said, I don't like using ANY chemical any more than absolutely necessary. Just like I don't like taking any more medicine myself than absolutely necessary. But like medicine, there are some instances where certain chemicals have their place.


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

I don't know if GMB is still reading or not. I did have a thought, though, that might be of interest.

I have known of a few people who use what they call a flame weeder. It's basically a torch used to burn weeds. It's normally used when the weeds are quite small. I'm not sure how big they can be before it's more of a fire hazard to burn them than a practical weeding tool. But it might be worth looking into next season, if it would work for where you are and the style of growing beds that you have. Might not work for you, don't know, but figured I'd at least mention it.


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## KatsFarm (Sep 13, 2016)

Grandmotherbear said:


> Yeah, I know I said for years I'de never use it- that was before a 2 year hiatus due to multiple injuries, chronic pain, and the growth of shoulder/head weeds and saplings.
> So, If I burn the weeds that the roundup killed, is the roundup broken down by the heat? Or does it remain intact and continue to kill green growing things?
> I WANT to put it into my containers. I am cutting way back on the gardening but would like green beans, English or sugar snap peas, tomatoes and lettuce this winter. Anybody know if I can use the ashes in the pots?


Here is a great source of information about RoundUP. http://npic.orst.edu/factsheets/glyphogen.html I would stay far, far away from anything that has been in contact with this stuff, as it has a half life ... The leaves may break down in a few days but the half-life of the chemical continues to be a danger in the residue.... 

For those who are unaware, the World Health Organization has banned RoundUP and proven that it is a carcinogen, in particular non-Hodkins Lymphoma.


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## KatsFarm (Sep 13, 2016)

JawjaBoy said:


> I know I'm dragging an older thread back up, but I'm under the weather today and got too much time on my hands.
> 
> I'll be honest, I'm a lot more worried about the GMO seeds and plants created to resist Roundup than I am of the Roundup itself. I've seen far more negative research on GMO's than I ever have on Roundup. That said, I don't like using ANY chemical any more than absolutely necessary. Just like I don't like taking any more medicine myself than absolutely necessary. But like medicine, there are some instances where certain chemicals have their place.


Think about this: The RoundUP is sprayed in the fields, the seeders then plant the GMO corn, ..... that RoundUP ends up in the GMO corn ........ the only safe corn is organic corn from heirloom seeds grown in our own gardens. 

Then there is the chain: Monsanto sprays the RoundUp in the fields where they grow their GMO corn, which is then processed into the prepared foods/mixes of the companies they own.... If you removed the long list of these companies from the supermarket shelves, you will find those shelves nearly void of product.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

KatsFarm said:


> For those who are unaware, the World Health Organization has banned RoundUP and proven that it is a carcinogen, in particular non-Hodkins Lymphoma.


No, they haven't "proven" anything at all.

They said it "probably" causes cancer which is a definite "maybe".
They haven't banned it because they have no such power.



> *Washington, D.C. – *The Environmental Working Group today called on the U.S. Food and Drug Administration to require mandatory GMO labeling after the World Health Organization’s cancer research arm designated the herbicide glyphosate, widely used on GMO crops, as “*probably* carcinogenic to humans.”
> 
> “The widespread adoption of GMO corn and soybeans has led to an explosion in the use of glyphosate – a main ingredient in Monsanto’s Roundup and Dow’s Enlist Duo,” said Ken Cook, president and co-founder of EWG. “Consumers have the right to know how their food is grown and whether their food dollars are driving up the use of a probable carcinogen.”
> 
> ...


Reality is there is no conclusive evidence that Glyphosate causes any problems at all in the amounts encountered in the real world. 

https://gmoanswers.com/glyphosate-carcinogen-explained



> One important piece of what IARC does is determine which substances in our environment have the potential for causing cancer. *IARC does not conduct any original research;* it only reviews studies and research already published to determine carcinogen status.
> 
> It is important to note here that other reviewing agencies around the world use different classifications. For example, the EPA has its own separate classification system. IARC is the first – and only – reviewing agency to classify glyphosate as a carcinogen.
> 
> In fact, as I’ll explain a little later, other reviewing bodies have determiend that glyphosate is *not *a carcinogen.


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## oldasrocks (Oct 27, 2006)

I agree with Bearfootfarm. Anything in excess can cause problems. Feed 1 million times the normal amount of anything and it will cause problems. The alternate is to start letting more people starve to death as we cannot grow enough food without chemicals.


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

oldasrocks said:


> I agree with Bearfootfarm. Anything in excess can cause problems. Feed 1 million times the normal amount of anything and it will cause problems. *The alternate is to start letting more people starve to death as we cannot grow enough food without chemicals.*


In today's mega agricultural mindset, that might be true. I think there are more alternatives than just "chemicals and live" or "no chemicals and die".


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

Why am I hearing so much about Round Up but nothing about Vitavax many Farmers have been exposed to Vitavax much more than Round Up??

big rockpile


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## JawjaBoy (Jan 21, 2013)

Like I said, I do _occasionally _use Roundup. Maybe once every couple of years and in no stronger concentration than absolutely necessary. 

And I'll also say again that I'm WAY more concerned about GMO seeds and plants than I'll ever be about Roundup.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

KatsFarm said:


> Think about this: The RoundUP is sprayed in the fields, the seeders then plant the GMO corn, ..... that RoundUP ends up in the GMO corn ........ the only safe corn is organic corn from heirloom seeds grown in our own gardens.
> 
> Then there is the chain: Monsanto sprays the RoundUp in the fields where they grow their GMO corn, which is then processed into the prepared foods/mixes of the companies they own.... If you removed the long list of these companies from the supermarket shelves, you will find those shelves nearly void of product.


This forum is pro-organic. I am not going to debate organic vs conventional farming practices in this forum. However, for educational purposes, I'd like to explain conventional farming that you seem to be confused about.

It isn't likely that farmers would spray glyphosate prior to planting GMO corn. Cultivation prior to planting gets rid of weeds as it prepares a seedbed, so no chemicals needed. After the GMO corn grows, weeds also grow. So, when the corn is about a foot all and before the weeds set seed, glyphosate is sprayed on the weeds. The weeds wither and die and in a week, the glyphosate breaks down as the weeds lay on the ground. By not cultivating to dig and kill weeds, there is a huge reduction in soil erosion. The GMO corn plant is not killed by the glyphosate. In a week or so, the glyphosate breaks down in the corn plant. This all happens before the ear is formed, therefore, there cannot be any glyphosate in the corn seeds.
Heirloom seeds are no better or worse than any other non-GMO corn seeds. Monsanto does not spray Roundup, farmers do. Seed companies licensed by Monsanto do not process their seeds into prepared foods, they sell their seeds to farmers to plant. I know of no food processing companies owned and operated by Monsanto.


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