# Any small diesel trucks coming soon?



## Ramblin Wreck (Jun 10, 2005)

Has anyone heard any hint that a small (4 cyl), high efficiency diesel truck will soon be on the market? The new Chevy/GMC, Toyota, and Nissan trucks are all bigger than their predecessors (by hundreds of pounds), and I don't think a diesel is optional on any of them. (Isuzu had them available in the past, but I cannot find it on any current option listing.) It seems like there is a big market being missed, and if Volkswagen can get one EPA approved in a car, it certainly should be doable for a truck. 

Thanks for any news you can offer.


----------



## labrat (Jun 3, 2005)

I did a search on the subject because this interests me as well and because I don't have the need or funds for a full sized $40K vehicle and came up with this info.

http://www.dieselpub.com/dp/bus_lst2.asp?pick=5646


----------



## jgbndaudio (Jan 26, 2005)

Hello,

Well actually fordy, you're wrong in saying this won't be more efficient. 
It will certainly burn less diesel, compared to the same exact model w/o modifications, so as far as the claim of a more "fuel efficient" vehicle, theyâre not lying. I might not have said that ten years ago but things have changed. Imagine that, technology improved, huh?

Hereâs why.

First, current breeds of high quality electric motors weigh much less than older generation electric motors. Itâs a fact that electric motors are much more efficient than internal combustion engines going from a stop to a start. (Acceleration). Itâs also a fact that the ICE is more efficient at producing the power needed for highway speeds than an electric motor. When you combine the two, you get the advantages of both. By adding an electric motor you can reduce the size of the ICE. This results in a minimal weight gain if any. The weight of the batteries is a different story. Batteries are also lighter now than they were historically so they wonât need âtonsâ of batteries. Besides, some (or all) of the battery weight, can be offset by using lighter materials to build the vehicle. Now you might be concerned about lowering the safety of the vehicle by doing this. Well advances in technology have also answered that for us. Carbon Fiber is stronger than steel and weighs less too! The benefit of that is that while making the vehicle stronger youâre also lowering itâs weight, which further allows you to downsize the ICE, the electric motor and the amount of batteries you need. Carbon fiber also has the added advantage of never rusting! As far as being electrically safe, the risk of electrocution is very likely to be minimal. First of all the batteries they use are small and usually low voltage. In addition, most companies today have at least some interest in the safety of their products because of the litigious state of the USA. They know that if someone gets zapped, theyâre going to get sued! 

Thatâs just the tip of the iceberg but should be enough for someone who probably wonât be convinced that itâs even possible.

Donât be afraid to open your mind and embrace change, some of if it really is good!
Scotty

PS. The people who started this website opened my mind to all kinds of things I never though were possible!
http://www.rmi.org/




fordy said:


> ...................This seems like an absolutely stupid idea ! Attach an efficient diesel motor to a heavy electric motor , then add a ton of batteries , all the computers to monitor and control along with the additional wiring which will eventually have to be replaced or will electrocute the driver and cargo if involved in a wreck ! This is supposed to be more efficient ??? What a load of efficient crap this will turnout to be . fordy...


----------



## Beeman (Dec 29, 2002)

I read about Jeep releasing a 4 cyl model. After all Daimler owns Chry. and Jeep and they build diesel cars.


----------



## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

mightybooboo said:


> But think about locomotives,diesel electric is a very good soluution.So it does work in some manner,though I know zilch about it.
> 
> I agree,we need to think beyond the ICE box,the tecnology is a 100 years old,time to move along in some form.
> 
> BooBoo


.............BooBoo , One BIG distinction I would pointout that differentiates cars vs locomotives.....A locomotive utilizes it's diesel engine to power the individual electic motor(s) via the generator between each set of Wheels , i.e. there are NO batteries as there are in our cars . There is a direct transfer of energy between diesel and motor albeit a slow and gradual transfer . This is why the system works so well . Our cars , OTOH , have to beable to respond MUCH faster than any diesel locomotive . And , IF the concept were adaptable WHY don't we have diesel engines hooked to generators thence to electric motors to power the driveshaft  :shrug: ?? The truth IS , IS , that , they are selling small diesel powered cars in Europe as we speak that get 80 mpg. And , IF they were allowed to IMport those same vehicles INTO the USA , do YOU think it might have an IMPACT on the sales of these vehicles full of unnecessary batteries , electric motors and all the necessary electronics to made the these "Rube Goldberg" mochines operate???? 
.............These high MPG diesel cars are going to be available in Canada shortly!! Not so here in our good old USA . I read this info , by the by on SBC Yahoo so I believe IT to be reliable . The only thing I want Electric is my Lionel Train set from my childhood . And , by the way HOW MUch Is a set of NEW Batteries going to cost for say a Toyata at 100k miles ?? Thousands I would think . fordy.. :nana: :help:


----------



## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

Heck fordy,I dont know. All of it is out of my league on why we get what we have. I would like a small little deisel people car or truck with super mileage,would work for me.

As for battery replacement,dont know the costs,but just about any major powertrain work by a pro is mega bucks too.

Just hope we can get the technology moving along,think we are stuck in a rut.

BooBoo


----------



## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

mightybooboo said:


> Heck fordy,I dont know. All of it is out of my league on why we get what we have. I would like a small little deisel people car or truck with super mileage,would work for me.
> 
> As for battery replacement,dont know the costs,but just about any major powertrain work by a pro is mega bucks too.
> 
> ...


......................All the science is Above my pay scale as well ! I just have a hard time understanding WHY we have gas engines hooked to electric motors with a bunch of batteries and all the expense of Controlling and Integration of their energy transfer to the wheels and they still only get 45 mpg or so . When , there are Diesel powered cars.....Currently Available that Surpass the above mentioned cars by 25% better fuel milage or greater . Doesn't make much sense does IT??? fordy..


----------



## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

How about this posted by Esteban....

I contacted a company in GB which sells diesel motorcycles. Cost about $7000. Wish their was a dealer here. This is thier website. 70mph top speed & 150-200 mpg!!
http://classicmotorcyclesltd.co.za/home.html


----------



## oz in SC (May 13, 2002)

I posted about a smaller SUV 4x4 being made in Brazil that is 'supposed' to be coming here sometime soon...

It is called a Crosslander.It is a Romanian designed no frills Landrover style vehicle.

http://crosslander4x4.com/index.php


----------



## wy_white_wolf (Oct 14, 2004)

mightybooboo said:


> But think about locomotives,diesel electric is a very good solution.So it does work in some manner,though I know zilch about it.


But this isn't done because for effeincy. They are desiel/electric because a clutch could not hold-up to the torque required to start moving that much weight.


----------



## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

Ahhhh...very interesting....And eliminates the tranny to boot,very cool.

BooBoo


----------



## Waltosh (Jul 14, 2009)

I've researched this and Mahindra says it will have small diesel trucks this fall.


----------



## cfabe (Feb 27, 2005)

Yep the mahindra trucks are going to be coming over soon apparantely.

From the Big3, ford and GM were both working on smaller diesel engines for light duty full size pickups, but I have heard those plans may not go forward now because of the auto market and fuel prices seemingly stabilizing for now. None of them were working on a 4cyl/small pickup though to my knowledge. 

VW has a diesel Jetta available agian after a brief absence, over 50mpg I think.


----------



## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

But the headache with the new diesels are the smog control systems,very complex and longevity looks poor from what Ive been hearing.I visit a schoolbus mechanics forum and they HATE THE NEW DIESELS


----------



## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

cfabe said:


> Yep the mahindra trucks are going to be coming over soon apparantely.
> 
> From the Big3, ford and GM were both working on smaller diesel engines for light duty full size pickups, but I have heard those plans may not go forward now because of the auto market and fuel prices seemingly stabilizing for now. None of them were working on a 4cyl/small pickup though to my knowledge.
> 
> VW has a diesel Jetta available agian after a brief absence, over 50mpg I think.


...........Ford\Europe has a diesel powered fiesta that gets close too 60 mpg , and yet they won't import same because the "motor assembly expense in britian" would make the retail price.....Too High ! ? The probable truth is , they Know Implicitly that the diesel fiesta would sell like hotcakes too the exclusion of some of their other models ! 
..........Seems I read somewhere that even Toyata has admitted that gas\electric models is just an intermediate step between full electric and other energy systems like naturaL gas and hydrogen fuel cell . Personal transportation will evolve into about 4 choices , all electric , diesel , natural gas which will or should replace the predominance of gasoline as the fuel of choice since we don't have too import it on a scale like we do for oil and fuel cells which are still a long way down the road . , fordy:viking:


----------



## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

...........I'm trying to post much more diplomatic responses , although I get carried away sometimes I suppose ! , lol , fordy


----------



## Michael Kawalek (Jun 21, 2007)

I too see diesel (especially biodiesel) as the fuel of the future, but since I've already got a Ford 350, I'm interested now in a smaller diesel vehicle. I want something smaller, that can handle the dirt roads leading up to our homestead, but without the weight and size of the Ford. The new boxer diesel that Subaru is making has caught my interest.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/suvs/112_0809_2010_subaru_forester_diesel/index.html 

It's 4X4 and gets about 40MPG, and may be exactly what I need when I'm not trying to haul a load of 20' rafters. For someone wanting to own just a single vehicle, maybe this Forester, towing a trailer, might be a cheaper option than buying a diesel pickup.
Michael

P.S. Fordy, I think the single most important reason you don't see cars like the Fiesta here is because of American (or Californian) pollution regulations. The Europeans have decided to regulate CO2 rather than NO2, so that gives the edge to sipping little diesels. Our regulations are more stacked against diesel, so gasoline wins here. However, european pollution controls are finally catching up with American standards.


----------



## Hip_Shot_Hanna (Apr 2, 2005)

Beeman said:


> I read about Jeep releasing a 4 cyl model. After all Daimler owns Chry. and Jeep and they build diesel cars.


 it is disgracefull there are no small diesels here , in the UK you can not buy a Gas Ranger , they are all diesel , same goes for GM ,they have a joint venture with renault that make wonderfull small diesels , the voyager cant be bought with a gas engine in it , neither can the jeep , less than 30 % of cars / light trucks are gas burners over there , a relative has a renault car (about the size of a Camry )that gets 50 to the gallon US , CITY driving and 69 MPG highway and 0 to 60 in 12 seconds 135 BHP out of 1.9 litres, the Rangers average around 30 MPG being driven real hard .......


----------



## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

The new EPA standards are what's killing any new diesels being available. My son worked for Detroit Diesel and Navistar and he said their making it so complicated with the new particulates that even OTR trucks are getting lousy gas mileage.

Bob


----------



## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

unioncreek said:


> The new EPA standards are what's killing any new diesels being available. My son worked for Detroit Diesel and Navistar and he said their making it so complicated with the new particulates that even OTR trucks are getting lousy gas mileage.
> 
> Bob


How true.

I drive a big Volvo VN, with the "smog fiendly" engine. No power and no fuel economy. A great way for truckers to stay in business. 

It's working out so well, CAT is ceasing production of truck diesel engines (for the U.S. anyway), in part due to emission requirements.

My friend traded Ford F250s from an 04' to 08' and lost about 9MPG, due to the increased emission controls.


----------



## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

plowjockey said:


> How true.
> 
> I drive a big Volvo VN, with the "smog fiendly" engine. No power and no fuel economy. A great way for truckers to stay in business.
> 
> ...


...........This is why I bought an '03 Chevy 8.1 for a tow vehicle . The late '07 and up model diesel trucks have so much plumbing and wiring for "Clean Air" that they will become too expensive to fix for the average self employed guy once the factory warranty runs out . , fordy


----------

