# South Africa is attempting to remove self defense as a valid reason to own a gun. Never give up your



## macmad (Dec 22, 2012)

http://politicsweb.co.za/politics/saps-are-attempting-to-remove-self-defence-as-a-re

Cherish and protect your 2A freedoms.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

yup , they need you unarmed to come take your farm and redistribute it.

once they kill the Ultimate reason to own a gun then they can make sure only the outlaws have have them.


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## macmad (Dec 22, 2012)

Bingo!


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

not that you need to be reminded of this but I have to remind my kids that a government operating outside of the law still makes them outlaws , a government changing the written laws to conflict with natural law still makes them outlaws.

*a man has a right to an armed defense of his person and his family or he isn't a man he is a slave.*


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## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

When are we going to step in and do something about the carnage there. After all, we directly participated in setting it up to happen.


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## macmad (Dec 22, 2012)

And in our country, the founders were wise enough to grant us this right combat a tyrannical government.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> When are we going to step in and do something about the carnage there. After all, we directly participated in setting it up to happen.


probably never , they are democratically electing to take peoples rights away , heck even democratically elected Democide is allowed inmost cases.
it is really their own making treat the slave poorly for a century then make them the master and wonder why your taking a beating at the hands of your new master. it seems sort of obvious.

we have our own issues and should deal with our problems before we are serving a new master who knows doesn't how to run a country and thinks the government is about what it can give you by taking from others.


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## macmad (Dec 22, 2012)

We shouldn't go around the world trying to "fix" problems. We have done that for generations and the world still mostly hates us. Let them figure it out when their Ag production goes in the toilet, and their people start to go hungry. They have to get their genocide out of the way first.


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## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

IndyDave said:


> When are we going to step in and do something about the carnage there. After all, we directly participated in setting it up to happen.


.......................................
...........We , can't even stop the Swat Teams from breaking into people's homes without a warrant ! That should be the very event we , as armed citizens put a stop too ! , fordy


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

macmad said:


> And in our country, the founders were wise enough to grant us this right combat a tyrannical government.


The democrats are working to turn that around.


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## NRA_guy (Jun 9, 2015)

In 1776, Alexander Fraser Tytler, a European historian published The Decline and Fall of the Athenian Republic. In his publication, Tytler reported that from his research he had determined the following:

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising them the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over a loss of fiscal responsibility, always followed by a dictatorship. The average of the world's great civilizations before they decline has been 200 years. These nations have progressed in this sequence:


From bondage to spiritual faith,
From spiritual faith to great courage,
From courage to liberty,
From liberty to abundance,
From abundance to selfishness,
From selfishness to complacency,
From complacency to apathy,
From apathy to dependency,
From dependency back again to bondage."
---------------------------------------------
The US is around stage 7 or 8.

South Africa, I am not sure.


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## GardenGekko (Jan 31, 2013)

We should be opening up the immigration floodgates to the South Africans. Highly skilled, hard working, can-do attitude, likely facing an impending genocide...


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## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

GardenGekko said:


> We should be opening up the immigration floodgates to the South Africans. Highly skilled, hard working, can-do attitude, likely facing an impending genocide...


I would say this is especially true given that they would not be facing genocide had we not precipitated their present situation.


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

GardenGekko said:


> We should be opening up the immigration floodgates to the South Africans. Highly skilled, hard working, can-do attitude, likely facing an impending genocide...


I have some South African friends and we have talked about this. After doing some research they have discovered that it cost too much to try to start a business or farm in the US. If they leave South Africa, they would only be allowed to take the clothes on their back and very little money. It would take millions to buy the land, millions for equipment, tens of thousands for insurance, and high taxes from the first day. And they see our high crime, and violence as no less or even worse than what it is in South Africa. 
And the main thing is they don't want to leave their country, their homes, and everybody they know to start over as little more than a refuge, in a strange place.


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

macmad said:


> And in our country, the founders were wise enough to grant us this right combat a tyrannical government.


The Constitution doesn't grant us any rights. It spells out and names what the founding fathers thought to be god given rights. Rights that are granted can be taken away, god given rights can not. Your drivers license can be suspended by any Justice of the Peace, if you fail to appear in court, or don't pay a traffic ticket. You are granted a drivers license, it is not a god given right. There is a big difference.


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

IndyDave said:


> I would say this is especially true given that they would not be facing genocide had we not precipitated their present situation.


They can thank Jimmy Carter for that. He is still sticking his nose in other peoples business. He was the greatest President, Panama ever had.


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## ergo (Aug 15, 2017)

only if they're dumb enough to not have bought diamonds, long ago. They can buy debit cards or gold coins, conceal them in something innocuous and mail them to friends overseas, or carry out the diamonds in their dentures, rectum, etc. They can also buy bitcoin and other crypto currencies. If they had any brains, they'd have gtfo of Dodge when Rhodesia fell. I was there at the time and could see it was only a matter of time, especially when the fools gave up their nukes, instead of using them on Mugabe and the other terrorists. They should have sent teams to kill him 30 years ago, as we killed bin Laden. No need to hunt for Mugabe. They knew damned well where to find him. They lacked the moral courage to do so, and now their grand children will be sacrificed on the alter of their cowardice.


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