# Gas Vs Diesel for tractors



## Curtis B (Aug 15, 2008)

As I am looking at tractors again, I am now plauged with the thought of gas vs diesel motors. I am looking at some older 40-50hp gas tractors, and newer 30-40 hp diesels. I would almost prefer the older with more HP (since you allways want more HP after the fact), but I allways thought of diesel as longer lasting motors. Opinions? Suggestions?


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## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

Diesel.Stronger parts,super easy to work on ,great torque,its the only way to go if you want it to last far longer.Not that folks dont have some great gassers.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Diesels are nicest engine for tractor and do outlast gas engines and get lot better fuel economy. Old gas tractors tended to be VERY thirsty. HOWEVER, diesels are more expensive and more complicated to repair. Price a rebuild of diesel injection pump if you dont believe me. 6 of one, half dozen of other. If you are using tractor for several hours daily or are farming lot acres, no brainer to get diesel in good condition. Buying gasoline would bankrupt you. If you are homesteader with few acres and basically use the thing to brush hog and plow the garden, then go with what is simplest and cheapest to keep repaired.

At this point I am not big fan of OEM diesel or gas tractors. If I were needing tractor right now, I'd look for non-running junker that I could adapt an automotive engine to and use a belt driven governor if necessary. Since most of the older tractors were designed for very low rpm gas engines, this would mean splicing in something like a truck granny 4spd transmission to slow output of engine to what the tractor was designed for. The engine then could run at its preferred speed for peak torque and the tractor transaxle would get the input shaft speed it was designed for. I know not many people are wanting to re-engineer stuff to this extent, but it would make the thing cheap to repair, even be using a much cheaper automotive clutch. Old automotive carbureted 4 or straight six is about as cheap as it gets to keep running and get parts for.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

mightybooboo said:


> Diesel.Stronger ...easy to work on....


Have you worked on a tractor diesel? I had to replace water pump on my diesel MF65 this summer. Tractor made like 1961 or 62. The engineers that designed things on this engine would be right at home with modern cars where you can barely stick your hand into the engine compartment and everything has to be disassembled in reverse order of how it was assembled at factory. I had to do lot disassembly to get enough room to change pump out. I was not best pleased. I'd rather the tractor had been little less compact and lot more friendly to repairs. 

And I wont even go into the crazy complex power steering system this thing has. I ever find a cheap orbital valve, it gets modernized/simplified. Already got brand new steering cylinder for super cheap off ebay, but jeep people keep the size orbital valve I need bid up as they use them in their rock climber jeeps. And I dont live in farming area to scavenge one off some old combine.

Oh and the brakes. You get to disassemble the entire rear transaxle to get to the brakes and parts are super expensive. Crazy engineers. Brakes and power steering really would be just as complex on a gasoline version MF65, but just pointing out that old tractors are not necessarily easy to work on.


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## Beeman (Dec 29, 2002)

Many farmers like to have both. Diesels burn less fuel for the work done. Gas tractors start easily on cold days when needing to feed cattle.


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## Windy in Kansas (Jun 16, 2002)

Since "older" is relevant to each individuals thinking I'm not sure what general age range of tractors you are thinking on.

As an example when I think of older tractors I think of those from the 1940s, 1950s, and somewhat into the 1960s.

Older might also mean those with a lot higher hours. Unless rebuilt at some point or perhaps several times a worn diesel engine will be harder to start than a worn gasoline engine since it depends upon compression to fire the fuel.

Because of higher compressions of diesel they will require more electrical power from a battery or batteries meaning some extra replacement cost every few years from either a larger capacity battery or from buying two.

I really don't remember your basic need for a tractor but I do remember your wanting a front end loader. Expect you will surely want a 3 point hitch system to make the tractor more usable. What my thinking is that you might find 1960-1970s tractors around 100 h.p. for about the same money as a smaller tractor more in the utility class. The old wheatland models sans 3 pt. don't bring much but as less usable.

Fuel filters, injector cleaning, pump cleaning, setting and repair----compared to points, condenser, rotor, cap, plugs, etc.---you can buy several sets of the latter for less money.

However if you will actually be farming a fair amount of ground than you will need to take into consideration the topic of fuel conservation mentioned by other posters. Gas consumption will be much greater than diesel for the same amount of work. 

If I were looking for an older tractor for limited use I'd probably look at gas or LPG models for the pure simplicity of them---not that diesels are complicated, but most don't have the means to test injectors, pump pressures, etc.


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## Curtis B (Aug 15, 2008)

Ok, I'll narrow a bit. I have seen a (60's if I remember) JD 3010, JD 2030, and newer 39HP 3cyl diesel (brand I'm not sure, colors of a MF, but I think it is an off brand, I haven't checked yet), all three are in the 6K price range and have loaders (lets not get into the PS with loaders). I do not plan to do any big farming, more like pasture renovation, post holes, dirt and rock moving, and maybe in the future some haying. I have way more experiance with gas engines, but I have spent quite a bit of time working on diesels.


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

Well you'll be shocked how much gasoline you'll burn and its far far easier to get colored tax free diesel than tax free gas. It's just down to basic cost to operate. As Windy said if you have three tractors the forth could be gas for sure winter starts..... but I think I'd buy a LP engine heater for the diesels before I bought a gas tractor. JMO.


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## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

Yup,worked on both,the diesel was easier hands down,and injection beats carb and points any day of the week IMO.Injector pumps,mechanical,are hugely reliable.Injectors last a LONG time.Like decades.Stronger internals,no points plugs condensers,timing,leaky carbs,wet electrical issues.....diesel all the way for me.


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## taylorlambert (Jul 4, 2010)

Diesel Diesel deisel. I hate a gas burner. I like them for somethings light or small cultivations machines. Take my completly rebuilt Farmall Cub I love that tractor for cultivation and light plowing for nostalgia or running other equipment. But be working in yard and a rain hit or any moisture in the air and the dang thing misfires and dies. The new Carb leaks Low grade fuels we get now dont let them run right. it gets 1 gallon per hour working. My 35 HP Yanmar 3 cylinder runs up to 3.5 hours per gallon depending on the work. Starts easily, Hot or cold and will burn diesel or a bio diesel blend. On the older diesels Like my Ford backhoe the brakes are internal wet brakes They are a bit of a pain to fix but out last the older band type gas tractors. In the winter the Ford does require a little sniff of either to start. Newer tractors have Glow Plugs or hot resevoirs that pre heat a little fuel bowl and drips it into the intake for a fast winter start. 


LP tractors have their place not as cast effective to run now, Here you have to rent or buy a tractor tank or buy 100 gallons of fuel to get them to deliver it. They dont run as long per gallong as a gasoline burner. Fewer folks are around to fix them now. The plus side they are safer in an inclosed space and the lack of solvents from the fuel diluting the oil. On top of the Coils,magnetos, plugs, wires, and such. You have on and LP system Regulators, flow governors, evaporators, and a few other things key to LPG. Backwhen LPG or NG was super cheap it was effective to run. A friend of mine rebmers running his JD for 6 cents per gallon.


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## clovis (May 13, 2002)

Curtis-

Can you run a guesstimate on how much you'll use the tractor for your own use, therefor giving you a cost analysis?

If I were buying, I'd strongly lean towards gas tractors. This is a tractor cost vs. fuel savings vs. use thought, and for me, it would take years and years and years to justify the cost of a diesel.

As well, I'd be looking at old tractors like the Allis WD or Farmall H. I just like them, and could most likely resell the tractor for what I had in it if I ever needed to upgrade to a bigger tractor.

BTW, it is very hard to find a good price on any diesel tractor in our parts, big or small. The big AC, IH and JD diesel tractors from the late 60's through the 70's are bringing big bucks...almost unreal prices for good tractors.


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

A 3010 Deere in Diesel would use about 2 gallons an hour of diesel, it'll be close to 4 in gasoline. Colored diesel is about 2/3 the cost of gasoline. So a gasser is 33% more expensive to run roughly just on fuel price. So it's using twice as much and it's all 33% more expensive, that'll add up fast doing hay. I find tractor prices are a little depressed right now.


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## foxtrapper (Dec 23, 2003)

Sounds like you want to buy diesel, and are just asking for reassurances that it's an ok decision. It is. It's not a clear cut case of diesel superiority, just that diesel is perfectly acceptable. 

Understand that diesels of that age and era are not as easy to start in cold weather as a modern one, nor as fuel efficient. With that kind of age, injectors and pumps and such are all worn, so it's not going to be as easy going as a new modern diesel. But, one on good shape will certainly fire up readily enough and run just fine.


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## sammyd (Mar 11, 2007)

I've never had a problem with the modern gas in my older tractors so that's not a concern with me, and I work them pretty hard.
But for economy I'd look at a diesel. I can run a Leyland 270 all season on what I put through an International 756 gasser in a day. (maybe a slight exageration )
Plus if you're in warmer climes you could pick up used veggie oil and have practically free fuel.


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

If your wanting a general all around tractor I would go with a gas engine. They will start easier in cold weather without plugging the engine in to keep it warm. And for the amount of time a homesteader uses on you will never wear it out.

Bob


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## Old Vet (Oct 15, 2006)

Curtis B said:


> Ok, I'll narrow a bit. I have seen a (60's if I remember) JD 3010, JD 2030, and newer 39HP 3cyl diesel (brand I'm not sure, colors of a MF, but I think it is an off brand, I haven't checked yet), all three are in the 6K price range and have loaders (lets not get into the PS with loaders). I do not plan to do any big farming, more like pasture renovation, post holes, dirt and rock moving, and maybe in the future some haying. I have way more experiance with gas engines, but I have spent quite a bit of time working on diesels.


Then you know that a diesel engine is the best. The John Deer is also the best because of the features they offer. The thing to take into consideration is If you need to rebuild the engine will you take it to a dealer or do it your self? The rest of it is up to you and your likes.


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