# Camping in Grizzly country questions



## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

I'm hoping to take an extended camping trip to Wyoming, Colorado and maybe Utah this summer, especially in the Yellowstone area. I've never lived anywhere that has bears, so I am unfamiliar with them and what precautions to take. I'd like to do some of my camping in some pretty remote areas. I'll have a couple of miniature schnauzers with me and I'll be preparing food at my camp site. 

What precautions should I take? Would a portable electric fence be a good idea? I'm also going to be doing some hiking. Suggestions? Thanks!


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## rags57078 (Jun 11, 2011)

take someone with that you don't like and tell them by smearing bacon grease on thier clothes will keep the bears away . While they are being lunch to the bears you and your dogs can slip away


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

LOL! Don't tempt me....I have ex-husbands


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## bajiay (Apr 8, 2008)

You definitely need bear spray, as black bears will also be an issue. A high calibur pistol is also a good idea. We camp there every year and there are always bears around. If you camp at a site, they like you to put your food in a box and lock it, or hang it from a tree. I am glad you are not one of the ones thinking, "Oh, they won't bother me!" Those are the ones that end up dead every year. DO RESEARCH!!!


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## bajiay (Apr 8, 2008)

You can have my ex too!


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

How about using an electric fence? Will that deter them at all?

OK ladies....there are only so many of your ex's I can take on this trip due to space constraints.

Hmmm, I may have stumbled upon a new business! I could charge a fee to take ex-husbands camping


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## LonelyNorthwind (Mar 6, 2010)

On a more serious note:
Bears can smell from miles away, even through an insulated cooler, so take along prepared foods you don't have to cook and keep all your food supplies away from your campsite, hang it from a tree limb if possible but definitely do NOT keep your food in or near the tent. 
Make noise when you're hiking, just holler "hey bear!" occasionally to let any bears know you're in the neighborhood. They don't want anything to do with you either but you don't want to surprise one. I keep an airhorn when I'm wandering the woods for bears that get too close but have never had to use it. Carry a cannister of bear spray handy on your belt and know how to use it. Don't let those dogs wander off or make a ruckus, they'll bring an angry bear right back to you.
If you see small paw prints, leave the area. You do not want to be near a mama and her cubs. 
Relax, enjoy your adventure, just stay alert.


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## unregistered41671 (Dec 29, 2009)

TxMex said:


> How about using an electric fence? Will that deter them at all?


It would have to be mighty hot in order to get their attention. It would be difficult to get through all that hair. Maybe, if they touched their nose to the fence, it might help. Portable electric fences are not usually that hot. I would not want my life depending on an electric fence. I would depend on a dog to alert me and a large caliber gun.


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

Make sure Bear Spray is pointed in the right direction :smack:yuck: Don't ask!

Keep all food up High where they can't get it,keep Camp Clean,do not leave any Food in Vehicle.

Make sure they know you are there if you come up on one.

big rockpile


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## tgmr05 (Aug 27, 2007)

You need to try and get a bear proof container to store food in, especially in areas known for bear. Depending on where you go, they may give you one... Check into it. Store your food in the container, away from your site, possibly up high, and not easily accessible. 

Make sure to clean up around your site thoroughly after each meal. Do not eat odorous snacks in the tent or wherever after you bed down. Take extra precautions to keep food odors away. AND remember trash is highly attractive to bears, as well.....


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## RonM (Jan 6, 2008)

Take at least a .357 Magnum with you, something bigger if you have it,take plenty of Ammo........


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Don't do what I did when I hiked the backcountry of Glacier National Park. The book I brought with me to read during the evenings after we set up camp was, "Night of the Grizzly." 

User:Haruth/Night of the Grizzlies - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Wintergrower_OH (Sep 21, 2010)

The general rule if you see cubs , momma isn't far away and will charge you . If food is in short supply they will attack anything that looks like food . A 357 might be too big to handle . Get something that you can handle and have the right type of bullets . Know the firearm rules for where you are camping . You have to know where to aim if a bear charges you . Hit the bear in wrong place and you are dead meat . Too many people think that if you shoot a bear and wound it . That good enough . It isn't . This is why placement is so important . when you have a few seconds to react is key . Mountain lions are another problem . Talk with the park ranger to see what kind of trouble they have been having and where. Most of time bear spray is good enough .


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## Guest (Jun 2, 2012)

When I went to Glacier and Yellowstone the dog could not come out of the car except at a campground. They were not allowed in the backcountry of the parks. The reason given was that with a bear chasing them they would run to mommy for protection, leading the bear directly to you. Schnauzers would make a tastey snack for a bear. Second the 357.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

Dogs are only permitted in some campgrounds, on leash, and not on trails. Some areas of the parks are hard side camping only, and any area of the park can be closed for various reasons. I don't think guns are legal, so if you take one don't advertise it. Be sure to bring warm clothes, a winter jacket and a warm sleeping bag, summer nights in the mts. can be cold. There are often burn bans during the summer so bring a camp stove and easily prepared foods. If you do not live at a similar elevation the altitude may make it hard to breath so give yourself a few days to get acclimated. I would not plan on hiking alone, it's just not safe. And remember pack it in, pack it out, so your pack doesn't get to much lighter going home. And don't forget a camera!


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Forget the .357, I'd be more inclined to carry my wife's .454 Casull...


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## TriWinkle (Oct 2, 2011)

Because there's no such thing as too much firepower!!


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

How about a 12 gauge? I really wouldn't have a use for that large of a pistol after I got through with my trip, but a 12 gauge pump is always useful.

My schnauzer will NEVER be off of his leash. His majesty has no common sense at all and needs his Mommy to protect him. I have a carrier that he rides in that I carry on my chest like a baby carrier. Yes....he is incredibly spoiled.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Research your area... if grizzlies are definitely known to exist in the area, then certain hard and fast rules need to be followed.

Generally, you'll be safer in National Parks than National Forests... simply because NPS areas have dedicated bear interaction rangers, that monitor bear safety interactions for a living. Crap can still happen, but it's rare. USFS has staff, but (to my knowledge) don't monitor their grizz full time.

First, never ever ever cook where your going to be sleeping. Stop an hour or so before camp, pull out your cooking gear, and cook 'there'. Make sure you get zero food odors on you or your clothes. Treat your dogs with the same odor regimen.

Once in camp, store your food, preferably in BRFC's, (bear resistant food containers) if you can afford them (bears can't get in, and your food is safe), at least a 100 yards away. Hang in trees with ropes if you don't have the brfc's. Keep your camp clean. If you have food odor'd clothes, plastic bag them, and store with your food.

Imho, most people that get into trouble with grizz are hikers not making noise, and hunters........ by definition, stalking quietly through the woods. If you let them know your in the area, you won't 'surprise' one up close and personal. Walking along noisy streams is dangerous, cause your voice won't carry far, and there's lots of grub for bears along creeks and rivers.

IF you smell something dead, immediately determine wind direction, and vamoose the other way. Run into a grizz on a carcass, and your in trouble.

Bear spray is a deterrent... trouble is, you have to get close. Great for tent encounters (unzip tent and spray).

Weapons are great, if you want to commit suicide. IF you depend on any weapon stopping a charging grizzly, and don't use bear safety protocols (noise, banging pots, etc.), you'll probably die in a charge. You "might" kill the bear, if you can get to your 50 cal. pistol, or pull out your 300 winmag. Trouble is, grizzly bears if they're 'excited', don't just roll over and die... if they charge, you might mortally wound them... but in the meantime, they rip your scalp and guts out... then die on top of you.

Make noise, avoid brushy 'enclosed' areas, areas that smell of carcasses. See a bear, it hasn't seen you, slowly back out of the area, and get out of Dodge. Bear sees you, make lots of noise, waving your hands... look BIG! Slowly back away. If the bear charges, stand your ground. At the last second, drop to the ground, in fetal position, leaving your pack on. Try and hush your dogs as much as possible. If you Run, you will be Caught.

I was an NPS backcountry ranger in AK for ten years. I've had dozens of up close and personal interactions with grizzlies, and never gotten hurt. Also worked with bear tech rangers, capturing and hazing 'bad' bears.

I've slept with grizzly bears within 200 yards of my tent, and felt safer than I do when I have to visit an "impoverished" zone in a city.

One summer, I worked at Bering Land Bridge, and we carried shotguns... first four rounds slugs, last three 00 buckshot. Bears out there were hunted, so if one saw you, it ran... thinking you might be hungry for bear meat.


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

Some good advice in general, tho I think the "weapons are suicide" is completely off base. I know several people that have succesfully used handguns on bears in bad situations, and there's plenty of instances in the news from all over.

Are you going to be in developed campgrounds? In the park or not? 

Most problems are avoidable, tho the person killed in the campground just out of the park was reported to have done everything right, as did the other 2 people attacked that night in the same campground. Been 4 fatalities in the past year or so in the Yellowstone area, 2 in the park, 2 out of the park, and several "encounters" that didnt work out well for the people involved, other than they survived.

No problem having a gun in the park. The laws are the same in the park as out, and all the states encompassing the boundaries and interior of the park, especially Wyoming, aren't hard to live with.

Shotguns are ok for bears, but not easy to have ready. Not all slugs are created equal. The common deer slugs are soft and lose penetration when they expand. The Brennekes work much better, and there may be other slugs that work well, but the Brennekes have a very good reputation overall. I keep the short magnums around, in the classic type, but I'm not really a shotgun fan.

A 357 is a bit light, but with the right loads seem to work. Hollow points are NOT the right load, a hard cast or full jacketed, heavy for caliber bullet gives the best penetration in any given caliber. Phill Shoemaker, an Alaskan bear guide, considers a 357 as being capable of killing large bears when proper loads are used. Shoemaker used one for a while, then gave it to his daughter for her bear gun. She's a guide also. I reckon he'd know, and what he says is backed up my many others experiences. 

I've lived around grizzlies for 20-some years. I've never had any trouble with them, but they have been getting much more populous, and much more frisky the past few years. Pay attention to the basics, keep a clean camp, and have a good time.

Forgot to mention earlier, bear spray is good stuff (buy quality stuff). It works often enough to be a good option for most, especially those that aren't very proficient with firearms. I keep some around, but it isn't my first or only choice. There are situations and conditions that limit the effectiveness of it, like windy conditions in particular, but in general it's a defensive good layer to have available. Just keep in mind, it does NOT repel bears when used on things, it only works when sprayed in their face directly.

Keep in mind you cannot shoot a bear because it scares you. They are often curious, and sometimes bluff charge. Many online make comments that they plan to shoot any bear that even looks at them cross-eyed, or comes within X distance. It doesnt work that way. You will be in a world of federal legal red tape if you choose that option in the lower 48. Study bear behaviour. They have some cues they exhibit when they are agitated. Learn about them.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

texican said:


> First, never ever ever cook where your going to be sleeping. Stop an hour or so before camp, pull out your cooking gear, and cook 'there'. Make sure you get zero food odors on you or your clothes. Treat your dogs with the same odor regimen.


This will be kind of hard to do when I am in public campgrounds. There would be no way of stopping other folks from cooking. 

Since bears are omnivores I'm assuming they will be attracted to vegetables just as much as they are to meat? I don't eat meat or dairy and I'm working on making up a bunch of dehydrated soup mixes. I plan to vacuum seal meal sized portions so that I only open enough to eat at that time. I'm hoping that will lessen the things for a bear to be attracted to. I'm also going to do the same with the dogs food and vacuum seal it into daily portions.

Do the campgrounds in or near Yellowstone have fencing? I'd think that would be one of the simplest ways to limit bear access.

I'm beginning to think that maybe sleeping in the van may be a good idea. Yes, I know they can rip into a vehicle, but it would take them longer than ripping into a tent!

Would urine deter them? I have no problem with peeing into a container and then sprinkling it around the perimeters of my camp site.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

If you haven't already seen it, I'd recommend you watch this program before going on your camping trip *devilish grin* It will make for some interesting fireside chat between you and your friends. 
Glacier Park's Night of the Grizzlies | Full Program Â» Video Â» Iowa Public Television


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

No fences around the campgrounds.

Caribou, a poster on another forum that lives a subsistance lifestyle in northwest Alaska, says they make a "pee fence" around their camps. He believes it works. I think he said his native relatives do it, and is where he learned it. 

I've never tried it.

Sealing your food up is fine, but it will still emit some odors. It can't hurt.

Sleeping in the van may be good in some areas. Many campgrounds are "hard side only", meaning no tents are allowed where there's a lot of bear activity. This sign was posted at a place that wasn't a developed campground, but was a few miles from one that had an attack. Same campground that the guy was killed at last year. (Soda Butte, a Forest Service campground near Cooke City Mt)











It's easy for me to say, but don't get too hung up on it. Many make too much of it, just as many dismiss the chance of a problem too easily. Go, have fun, be aware, but not paranoid. Get some quality bear spray and keep it on you. Take your gun if you have a decent one, and know how to use it, and are willing to get good loads for it. Good loads are expensive if you don't load your own. Cor-bon, and Buffalo Bore load heavy stuff in various calibers. Use the rest room before they tell you the price.

One note, when women are having their period, is believed to be an attractant to bears.


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

This discussion about bear fences came up recently, there's some good vid of bears interacting with bear fences. Looks like a good idea, but I don't know anyone that use them around here, and there's no shortage of grizzlies in the mountains and around the edges of them. The "official" numbers of bears are generally laughed at by people that get out in the mountains much.


bear Fence - Bushcraft USA Forums


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Thank you for posting that link. I may take along a compact electric fencing set up.

Also thanks for the other posting you made. I put my foot down about my friends little female dog that will be going on the trip. She is getting spayed next week. I would assume it would be the same if a human came into season or a dog. I've been after him to get her fixed anyhow.

I'm also thinking about postponing my trip until September. My reasoning is that: 
#1 The number of tourists will be less at that time.
#2 Bear cubs will be older and maybe mama bear won't be quite as likely to kill a person for being in the same area.
#3 Hopefully there will be an abundance of natural food sources at that time and they may be more likely to be further back in the woods.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

I wouldn't carry the electric fence. I've seen log barns and cabins that grizzly bears have torn out the corners to get into. I have had a black bear chased by a dog in our yard and the bear ran through 3 electric fences before it turned on the dog. The dog ran for the house and didn't chase a bear again but the electric fence didn't slow down the bear. You probably won't have a problem with bears in a camp ground, or anywhere else the dogs are allowed.

I have found carrying a camera and being ready to shoot bear pictures is the best way to keep bears far away!!


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

TxMex said:


> ....I'm also thinking about postponing my trip until September. My reasoning is that:
> #1 The number of tourists will be less at that time.
> #2 Bear cubs will be older and maybe mama bear won't be quite as likely to kill a person for being in the same area.
> #3 Hopefully there will be an abundance of natural food sources at that time and they may be more likely to be further back in the woods.



No 1 is OK. There's many less tourists at that time, and the trees are starting to turn in the higher country, and bugs are less (you havent lived until you've enjoyed the skeeters in the mountains in the summer).

As to the other points, at that time of year (fall), the bears are extremely focused on cramming as much food into themselves as they can before they hibernate. I don't know if that makes them less wary, more prone to be cranky, or more possesive of food that they have, like a carcass. Just be wary of berry patches, they like them, and don't like to give them up. I don't think there's much difference in safety, I've heard of people getting mugged in the summer and fall.

There really isn't much more "back in the woods", all the country in and around Yellowstone is good bear country, and all the surounding country that nobody used to think of as bear country (like the fringes of the mountains, even out into the sagebrush country) is now good bear country also.

Don't overthink it too much, just go when it's good for you. I'd choose the first couple weeks of June, or after the last part of August, because of the lesser numbers of tourists and bugs, and the fall colors starting up high in Sept.

There's definately more bears, bear activity, and conflicts with people the past few years, but it's still very unusual to even see bears, let alone have trouble with them.


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## EDDIE BUCK (Jul 17, 2005)

Cabin Fever said:


> If you haven't already seen it, I'd recommend you watch this program before going on your camping trip *devilish grin* It will make for some interesting fireside chat between you and your friends.
> Glacier Park's Night of the Grizzlies | Full Program Â» Video Â» Iowa Public Television


Here's one more to keep you from falling asleep until all your bear guards are up and working properly.[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcX8yVFGY5A]bear attacks stephan miller - YouTube[/ame]


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## unregistered41671 (Dec 29, 2009)

Brown bear mauls hiker near Bird Creek: Bear Attacks | Alaska news at adn.com


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

When we were in Colorado the closest campground encounter we had was with a bunch of curious camp dancing cows. I was soooo glad we weren't in a tent!

Avoid smelly food like sardines and tuna. Marty Stouffer had a close encounter with a grizzly because of a tin of sardines. 

No, you can't keep food smells away from you if you are in a campground where other people are cooking and are lazy about cleaning up their campsite. Best you can do is watch out for yourself. 

Agreed that fall is when the bears are stuffing themselves in preparation for hibernation. Young bear are more likely to be hungry and inexperienced because that is about the time mamma runs them off.

Noise is your friend. I make a lot of noise when hiking including singing out "please don't eat me bear, I'm tough and boney". Never seen a bear on a trail or in the woods. I have seen them on the road and one eating the remains of a poached moose and did have one in my back yard (EEP!) but never seen one while hiking.


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## bajiay (Apr 8, 2008)

We went through West Yellowstone yesterday and it was snowing!!!
We saw a bunch of elk and three bears (in different areas). I also saw a dead moose beside the road. 
Bears are everywhere...
Have fun but be careful...


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## oth47 (Jan 11, 2008)

Black bear or grizzly? How to tell the difference..if you come up on a bear,climb a tree.If the bear climbs the tree and eats you,it's a black bear.If the bear pulls the tree up by the roots and eats you,it's a grizzly.


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

Actually, grizzlies can climb trees if they decide to. Mostly they decide not to, tho there's always the chance there's a comedian in the crowd that likes to break the rules.

Still, be aware, be smart, but dont let worrying about it ruin your trip or scare you off.


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