# We did it!!! Surgical castrating!!



## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

I have been long dreading the deed, fearing blood and guts flying everywhere, screaming baby boys in severe excruciating pain, my daughter crying as she holds the poor baby goat as I torture the poor beast. But, to my great wonderment and surprise, it was quick, and easy!!!:bouncy::bouncy::bouncy:

The only thing the boys complained about, was being restrained!!
It shocked me , and still does that it was so easy, and easy on the boys! I will forever surgically castrate!! Bring em on!!


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

How did you do anesthesia?


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## coso (Feb 24, 2004)

Why would you need anesthesia ??:hrm:


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## madness (Dec 6, 2006)

Our vet wouldn't do it without anesthesia but no one I've heard of that does it "in the field" uses anything.

Do keep an eye on the wound though, as I'm sure you know! We had one split open 2 years ago. Yikes that thing bled a ton!!!


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Surgical castration is cutting off testicles, right?

The vet used anesthesia when he castrated my horse.

I'm thinking she mentioned anesthesia in her plans for this procedure, too. Just wanting to know how she did it.


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## coso (Feb 24, 2004)

> I'm thinking she mentioned anesthesia in her plans for this procedure, too. Just wanting to know how she did it.


 Gotcha


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## Otter (Jan 15, 2008)

You don't cut off the whole works. You make a small, easy-draining slit, pop the testicle out through it and scrape the cord, then do the other side.

With a really sharp scalpel (all of about 69 cents) there is very little to no pain. Trust me, I've cut myself with one and not realized till I felt the blood trickle.
I was actually kind of squeamish about banding my boy, if he had showed the slightest discomfort from being banded I'd have had that sucker off and had him done with a knife. The only reason it wasn't my first choice was summer and flies.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

I've been practicing on bucklings that were already dead and headed to freezer camp. Maybe next yr I'll try it on a living one. One of these days I want to train a couple of wethers to pull a cart.


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## CaliannG (Apr 29, 2005)

~grinz~ That's why I got the boys yesterday, was for carting goats. We're keeping one as a buck though, although I will still train him to cart. I can't think of any reason why a buck can't pull a cart as well as a wether.


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## Fowler (Jul 8, 2008)

Good for you!!

I would have passed out...I think I still might...5 bucks and a trip to the vet works for me....if only I had the stomach for such things I would have been a vet....I feel faint right now.


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## Tallabred (May 23, 2008)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> The vet used anesthesia when he castrated my horse.


The anesthesia is not really for the horse but for the safety of the vet. Imagine trying to castrate a buckling that you could not hold and that could kick! :hrm:


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Yep, it is easy peasy.  Sounds like you did a great job!


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## lambs.are.cute (Aug 15, 2010)

did it to our dairy calves. No anisthesia, just a knife and spray atiseptic/anti fly. Our vet told us to make a cut and then grab the parts and rip. He said it sounded mean but it was easier on them, bled less and made sure that they were casterated. It ripped the cord between the parts and the body and the ripping crushed the veins which meant that they barely even bled.


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## julieq (Oct 12, 2008)

Congrats, but doing our own disbudding is enough for us without anesthesia! I always feel in need of a stiff drink after I put the kids through that. We'll stick with band castrating, which fortunately we don't have to do a lot of and haven't had any problems with. You're a much stronger soul than I am (although I am pretty certain DH wouldn't pull out one of our buckling's testicles and scrape the cord either and he's a retired surgeon!)


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## LoneStrChic23 (Jul 30, 2010)

That's how my Ag teacher did everything....pigs and goats. Never had a problem and they always got over it fast....Don't think *I* could do it though..... I have a friend who will do it for me for free, so next year if needed I may have her do one and band one and compare results.


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Oddly enough, castrating by knife is easier on both human and goat kid (if done at a week old or less) than disbudding. Counter-intuitive, but true.


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## PurpleMartineer (Apr 12, 2008)

i dont think castrating at kess than a week old is a good idea though? more chance of urinary problems


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Wethers get eaten most of the time...long before any stones develop. However, I am unsure of whether there are actually any studies proving that early castration has any impact on the likelihood of developing urinary calculi, since bucks frequently get them as well.


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## bigfoot2you (Oct 3, 2007)

lambs.are.cute said:


> did it to our dairy calves. No anisthesia, just a knife and spray atiseptic/anti fly. Our vet told us to make a cut and then grab the parts and rip. :shocked:
> 
> He said it sounded mean but it was easier on them, bled less and made sure that they were casterated. It ripped the cord between the parts and the body and the ripping crushed the veins :tmi: which meant that they barely even bled.


:runforhills::runforhills:


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## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

Do you have to have someone hold him or how do you restrain him?


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## copperpennykids (Sep 6, 2004)

Congratulations! And it is "Easy-Peasy". Plus kinder to the goat than any other method.

To restrain them - have someone hold them as they sit on their butts. The holder holds the rear legs and if possible, the front legs as well (one rear and one front for each hand). If you can only hold one - hold the rear leg to limit kicking/movement.


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> How did you do anesthesia?


No anesthesia...just a sweet little girl holding..


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

Yep, this is the only way to go for me!!
We always struggled with banding, poor babies ran screaming!
I figure if I have to do it, might as well do it
quick. 
Yep, been keeping a close eye on em too, they tucked those sweet little tails today, but no swelling...I used chlorahexidine (sp??) for scrub before and after..
So I figure they should be fine...sweet little boys they are!!

Now if I could only catch that feral tom cat running out in the woods!!:lonergr:


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

If you do catch the cat....wear old clothes. They pee and poop all over you sometimes while you're working on them. Yech.


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## LoneStrChic23 (Jul 30, 2010)

PurpleMartineer said:


> i dont think castrating at kess than a week old is a good idea though? more chance of urinary problems


I personally think this is an old wives tale.....I've been around way too many wethers that were castrated early who never had a stone issues....and several intact bucks who have.

My friends has twin brothers, 4 years old...one wethered at 8 days old, the other intact. Her intact has had issues with UC, the wether never has....

My personal opinion is to castrate as soon as possible. It's less tramatic to do a week old buck, vs a 4 month old....and every castration I've ever been present for...the older they were the more they fussed and the longer they took to recover.

Circumcision is not pleasant, and though some people claim babies don't feel it, I don't buy that....My son certainly didn't seem happy about his!!! No way would I have waited until he was older to have an unpleasant thing done.....get it done & over with! Feel the same about castration.


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## Laverne (May 25, 2008)

You've got guts Victory. Did you scrape the cord or yank them out? 

I know someone who worked for a small animal vet and he said the vet would put the male cats in a cone and cut and yank the testicles out. No anesthesia.


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## billooo2 (Nov 23, 2004)

I have done baby pigs, but never goats.......if I was not going to keep a buck for breeding, they went to the auction.


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

Laverne said:


> You've got guts Victory. Did you scrape the cord or yank them out?
> 
> I know someone who worked for a small animal vet and he said the vet would put the male cats in a cone and cut and yank the testicles out. No anesthesia.


Just pulled on em, they broke right off.
Seriously, it was no big deal for the boys, which is my only reason for trying it..


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## Astrid (Nov 13, 2010)

chamoisee said:


> Wethers get eaten most of the time...long before any stones develop. However, I am unsure of whether there are actually any studies proving that early castration has any impact on the likelihood of developing urinary calculi, since bucks frequently get them as well.




I had stones develop in a wether I banded. He was about 1 when it happened. Saddest and most painful thing I have seen in a goat. I really need to learn surgical castration. I am a bit squeamish about cutting the little guys and pulling.


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## Caprice Acres (Mar 6, 2005)

CaliannG said:


> ~grinz~ That's why I got the boys yesterday, was for carting goats. We're keeping one as a buck though, although I will still train him to cart. I can't think of any reason why a buck can't pull a cart as well as a wether.


1. Whenever he gets out of the pen, he's going to charge over to the does most likely. I've had mannerly bucks but I still didn't trust them to not try to charge the doe pen as soon as I let my guard down. That includes while harnessed, if he so desires. I do not want to bounce around on a runaway goat cart, then crash into fencing.  

2. Get different harnesses for wethers and bucks - you will NOT want to use them interchangeably!

3. Bucks are not 'people' animals. They will spray on the harnessing or on people if they're around, rut or not. If you're using him just at home, no big deal - just don't take him out and about to public places, if only because you'll help give goats a bad name by taking a stincky, intact buck goat into public places.  Most people will remember how stinky and gross they are, and know nothing else about goats besides.

That's all a little off topic, lol. I'm put off by surgical castration unless it's done young. I've never done it myself, but I know I will eventually. Banding seems less painful in the long run, from what little experience I have. I've seen a buckling that was surgically castrated at like 3.5 months, and he was in pain, bled a TON, and was 'hurting' for a week. Not mine but a friend of mine's. I'm told it's not so bad when they're done young, which makes sense. I've banded kids at 3 months that didn't have much issues past the first day, just discomfort.


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

Astrid said:


> I had stones develop in a wether I banded. He was about 1 when it happened. Saddest and most painful thing I have seen in a goat. I really need to learn surgical castration. I am a bit squeamish about cutting the little guys and pulling.


I know my experience as a Vet Tech has helped so much. Torturing animals seems to be a daily occurrence for a tech...I don't know if I could do it either without having this knowledge...but you tube is GREAT!! That's pretty much where I learned it..although the guy on America's Dirtiest Jobs that does the lamb castrating with his teeth is pretty gross, it shows you how easy the job is..


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## Laverne (May 25, 2008)

Phosphorus causes stones, which is in grass hay and grain. It needs balanced with alfalfa which is calcium rich. So wethers need alfalfa to prevent stones. Unfortunately many wethers seem to end up being put on grass hay, then they get stones.
The type of castration shouldn't matter with Urinary Calculi.


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## Qvrfullmidwife (Jan 10, 2004)

I am wanting to try a burdizzo. We actually lost a buckling to complications from banding, it was hard because he was a sweet boy and would have made a great companion animal.

I would also be open to cutting--but I need to SEE it first and have someone watch us do it first, before I could be comfortable with it on our own.


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## billygoatridge (Feb 12, 2004)

I prefer the burdizzo method especially after doing some surgically today. They barely miss a beat with the burdizzo. These we did surgically today were standing spraddle legged, with their head hung down not wanting to move. We put some 4th cutting alfalfa out and that didn't even entice them to come out of the corner. We wouldn't have done it that way except in 4h they can't show them with the sack intact even if they've been burdizzoed. I think this is the last year we'll sell 4h wethers. I can get more for them as bucks at the auction anyway. I gave them some banamine this evening after I saw how hard they were taking it. I sure hope it helps them, I'm feeling bad for doing it to them and I'm not even a man.


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Ow. How old were they?


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

billygoatridge said:


> I prefer the burdizzo method especially after doing some surgically today. They barely miss a beat with the burdizzo. These we did surgically today were standing spraddle legged, with their head hung down not wanting to move. We put some 4th cutting alfalfa out and that didn't even entice them to come out of the corner. We wouldn't have done it that way except in 4h they can't show them with the sack intact even if they've been burdizzoed. I think this is the last year we'll sell 4h wethers. I can get more for them as bucks at the auction anyway. I gave them some banamine this evening after I saw how hard they were taking it. I sure hope it helps them, I'm feeling bad for doing it to them and I'm not even a man.


Wow, poor fellas!! Sounds like my last experience with banding!!
How old are they??


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## victory (Mar 2, 2010)

Laverne said:


> Phosphorus causes stones, which is in grass hay and grain. It needs balanced with alfalfa which is calcium rich. So wethers need alfalfa to prevent stones. Unfortunately many wethers seem to end up being put on grass hay, then they get stones.
> The type of castration shouldn't matter with Urinary Calculi.


Thank you Laverne for clarifying this!!


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## TroutRiver (Nov 26, 2010)

How old were your bucklings? Last summer, I had to restrain a 2 month old boer buckling on the farm I worked at, while the vet castrated him surgically (he used a local anesthetic, but no sedative or anesthesia). I felt so bad for the poor guy, he screamed and cried so much during the procedure and looked really pitiful for a few days afterwards. 

I gather that the younger they are, the easier it is on them? That would make sense since they're less developed...


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Yeah. Young kids are a breeze. They cry a few time during, and then after, are fine. I had to do an older buck (4-6 months old) once (the buyer had heard that pack wethers should be done late b/c the urinary system, blah blah blah) and....OMG. That poor guy. I did him myself without help, straddled him and bent over to work.....but it was harder than I thought it would be and the recovery was more difficult than I thought, too. I will never, ever castrate late on a customer's demand again. 

Actually I quit castrating altogether, but.....yeah. Never older than a week or two ever again. :-( That poor boy.


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## Cheribelle (Jul 23, 2007)

I banded the first few, but the bucks bring more at sale time, so I quit. 
I have helped my uncle cut pigs, (he did all the cutting) and it looked simple enough, but I've never done it myself.


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## Beef11 (Feb 2, 2006)

I have cut some full grown bucks. Not bad. Cats you roll them up in carpet or stuff them in a boot. same procedure just smaller. I band everything i can as it is easier but if i need to i'll pull out the knife


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## copperhead46 (Jan 25, 2008)

one thing to remember when you castrate with any method, give a tetnus shot. It's a very good precaution.
P.J.


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## billygoatridge (Feb 12, 2004)

They were 3 months old. I had heard (here and from a vet) that they could be cut at any age. Most of our bucks we sell by 12 weeks and leave them intact. When we do wether them on occasion (like holding late kids till the market goes back up in winter) we normally wait until around 10 weeks and use the burdizzo. Not so much for the urinary tract factor as the fact that they grow faster and put more muscle on as bucks. I've seen wethers that were done at 1-2 weeks old (whatever method) and they end up looking feminine like does. Well next year if I do wether any to sell for 4h they are just gonna have to look feminine or better yet I won't sell any for 4h. I don't have the heart to charge an arm and a leg to 4hers, but I don't mind taking the $2.37/lb I got at auction a couple weeks back


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## billygoatridge (Feb 12, 2004)

I forgot, is alot of swelling normal for a few days afterward? They still look like bucks today. Apparently the banamine didn't help much. Though they were up walking some today.


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## Creamers (Aug 3, 2010)

I have only banded one - I was worried sick about it being terrible - I made sure I was slow and very methodical - he seriously did not eve flinch - I sat him down and he didn't walk a bit off - I gave a mini Banamine dose prior - 
he has never even noticed the band and it has been weeks -


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