# Harassed by neighbor



## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Why do these 3 neighbors(one we considered a VERY good friend) feel the need to continue harassing us? Once again they reported me to Animal Control for neglect. I came home from a wonderful day spent with my daughter Alison to find a yellow note from Officer Baird asking me to call him...I spoke with him about why I didn't have water in Miss Bess's trough..I refuse to keep her trough full of water after losing Waldo last summer..we believe they poisoned their water. I water her 3 times a day 30 plus gallons of water..they reported she has no shelter...my horses have never had shelter other than balsams they can go under and a good wind break of trees...Officer Baird told them that in Michigan there isn't a law requiring shelter..but she has plenty to keep her happy..then they went on to say she had hay gut and could die from it... yup she is a little wide but not obese, has good muscle, could use a little more but I don't ride her nor work her...she's my beautiful pasture ornament that I love to spend time with...both Waldo and Bessie were PMU rescues on their way to slaughter when I found them..she shows no sign of suffering..anyone can come and see her!
These people have once again trespassed on OUR property and there isn't a thing we can do about...and once again harassed us...and there is nothing we can do about it...I do fear for Bess...most of the time I am here but you see they are sneaks & chickens....they will only go over there when I am not home..and who is to say what they will throw out to her...she loves her treats..We are 99.99999% certain who it is...one day they will be found out...in the mean time I have gut rot on a daily basis, hate being watched by these people...Officer Baird found no neglect on my part and he understands why I will not keep water in her trough..and once again I ASKED to be given a ticket so I could find out 100% who these people are...once again the officer told me he couldn't w/o cause....
They reported me the beginning of the year 3 days after my horses got out of their corral..reported that they were loose(horses were back in within a couple hours), neglected, without food or water...they HATE horses...say they carry diseases...Officer Baird came and I showed him my horses..he actually chuckled when Miss Bess & Waldo came trottin' up to see us because they were a bit chunky..he found no neglect what so ever...my electric fence has been unplugged numerous times & wires connecting the fencer taken OFF over the summer after I lost Waldo...I've put out trail cameras but never had anyone show up on them...thinking of installing a security camera...IMO I don't feel it's right for these people to continue calling animal control on me, having them come up to check out the situation (I realize this is their job and they have to follow up on the call) but what about what I'm going through worried that something could happen to Miss Bess...Oh btw...this person was caught on our landlords trail cam snooping around here and peeking in the windows..this was before we started renting here..these neighbors are new to the area....here is a picture of Miss Bess right after we loss Waldo..I'll post a new picture of her tomorrow...


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I'd get a motion activated security cam on a recorder.. several of them. Then I'd also put up laser motion detectors. The kind that you'd use on a drive way what has a buzzer in the house to alert you when someone is coming up your road or driveway. I'd place those where you believe they are entering the property.

Depending on how close to the house you think they are entering, you could set up trip wires with noise makers. Even if something like that doesn't alert you, it may be enough to start discouraging them. Make it as hard as possible for them to get on your land without being noticed, and also make it as clear as possible to them you are going out of your way to catch them.. 

I'd also start wearing a very prominent holster with a very prominent gun on my hip... When we bought this place I did that, and the couple people that did start coming around I had heard were bad news suddenly stopped after they saw me a few times. I also did a LOT of shooting at the beginning... Let them know you have guns and know how to use them... 

Once you catch them on your land, all bets are off for them... Then you can take your complaints to the Sheriff with proof..


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

They are right across the county road from her but they have to follow my path to get to her corral which is in front of my kitchen windows...they are kiddy corner from us...I like the idea of the laser along with the security camera...where do they sell them? They know we have guns and we both hunt...I like the trip wire too but I would worry they could come after us if they fell and got hurt?? Thank you so much for your help!!
I have a report filed with the Sheriff Dept. already with everything that has happened in the past...I'm going in again tomorrow to report this..


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## Rosepath (Feb 18, 2011)

What a pretty girl she is! I would be worried like you are, some people are crazy. Is there some way you can "pretend" to leave, so they think you're gone, then come back to see if they've trespassed? Camera would be good. Can you re-arrange things with a padlocked gate that protects access to your mare? What is wrong with people these days?!
or maybe get a lot of guineas


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## secuono (Sep 28, 2011)

Get game cameras up for sure.
Press charges every.single.time. they trespass and you have camera proof. 
Pretend to leave, but stay and shoot up in the air when you see them?


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## Use Less (Nov 8, 2007)

Are you keeping a running record when anything happens? You should mark down that the officer came to your house and asked you to call, then write out the gist of the conversation. Date and time of everything. Any time. Every time. Make sure you have plenty of posted signs on every side of your property. I know they won't keep people off who want to trespass, but no one can claim you were OK with hikers/wanderers. You may want to put one camera where it seems obvious, and back it up with something else hidden. Good luck.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Check your state laws. I don't know what they are in Michigan, but here in WV, if someone is trespassing and gets hurt on the property they are trespassing on, they can not sue you.

A trip wire doesn't have to be anything solid that will trip something. I can be a thread that will break easily. You just have to rig it to something that will set off a lot of noise, like tin cans, or snap caps, or mice traps with a primer set up in there. 

Lots of video on Youtube how to make simple noise maker traps.

As far as alarms, check Amazon for Driveway alarms and security systems. I have a Night Owl system that's a very reasonable price and has pretty decent quality video. I can read a tag that pulls into my driveway, and I can easily make out faces at a fair distance.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I could put up a gate but they would probably climb over it...at first I thought about it thinking they would have to go around the gate and leave fresh prints in the snow...I'm going to talk to the sheriff tomorrow and ask about the trip wire for sure..If I do get the opportunity to fake a leave I sure will!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Oh you bet I have a record of everything that has happened, conversations too and the Sheriff dept. has record of everything too....


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Make it clear you are not setting booby traps, but rather alarms. You can not booby trap anything, but you can set up alerts... Anything that is meant to do bodily harm is illegal. You can not string wires neck high. 

I would put up a gate. Nothing says DO NOT ENTER more than a gate. Putting a DO NOT ENTER and a PRIVATE PROPERTY sign on the gate helps that much more to enforce your case when you do catch someone on your property. If they cross or go around a gate, then that is more proof they are intentionally trespassing. So long as it is your property and there is not an easement where you put the gate, then you have all the right in the world to put it there.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I will talk to the Sheriff tomorrow about all of this...thank you again everyone!


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Best of luck. I hope you get it resolved.. Myself, I'd probably end up on the wrong side of the laws because I don't like to deal with the law. I just don't trust them, but I am not afraid to deal with the one I'm having issues with. At least I know for a fact they are being underhanded..


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

My son-in-law is going to build me 2 gates :thumb:


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## TheFarmerMommy (Mar 21, 2014)

What a poor, neglected horse! 


I'm kidding, of course. What is wrong with people? I don't have any suggestion beyond what PP have mentioned. But good luck!


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

We had AR Person living next to us like this. We lost our Hunting Dogs because of her finally came to us moving.

big rockpile


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I've had neighbors like that BRP.. Manmade Karma won out and they moved..


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## HOTW (Jul 3, 2007)

I suggest you get inve tive about how youbplace your game cameras. They probably see them and are avoiding them, make one obvious then put the second nearby in a not typical placement, very low focused up high or string it across on a string above the trail. Or place it on the opposite side of the trail behind the other camera.


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## Selena (Jun 25, 2005)

Did you have a necropsy done when Waldo died? Tough to talk about (I have zero tolerance for animal neglect/abuse) but if not, is it still possible? Knowing the exact cause of death might provide helpful evidence if the same poison is found in the cretins possession. 

Another thought is to some how let the know you're not at home and then double back to your secluded vantage point. Might enlist a friend or two. Get proof they are on the property then file charges.


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## michael ark (Dec 11, 2013)

Put your trail cam in the trees looking down.


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## nobrabbit (May 10, 2002)

HappyYooper said:


> They are right across the county road from her but they have to follow my path to get to her corral which is in front of my kitchen windows...they are kiddy corner from us...I like the idea of the laser along with the security camera...where do they sell them? They know we have guns and we both hunt...I like the trip wire too but I would worry they could come after us if they fell and got hurt?? Thank you so much for your help!!
> I have a report filed with the Sheriff Dept. already with everything that has happened in the past...I'm going in again tomorrow to report this..


We got our driveway alarm at Harbor Freight. If I remember correctly it was in the $15 - $20 range last year. We've not had a bit a trouble with it and it really works to alert us when someone or animal (loose cows!) crosses our front yard.


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## Buffy in Dallas (May 10, 2002)

Ask about stalker laws too. Thats what they are doing.

I had a neighbor harass me like this once. She called the animal control/welfare guys on me like 6 times. Every time they came out...nothing wrong. Sometimes she even made a lot of stuff up. Example-we were breeding dogs. Ya right. Our female pup was 4 months old. They finally told her if she called again they would get her for harassment.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

Put several large laminated signs up in conspicuous places where they can't possibly be missed by anyone:

".... THIS PROPERTY IS MONITORED BY 24 HOUR VIDEO SURVEILLANCE ...."


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## vixcottage (Feb 12, 2013)

I currently have a neighbor worse than this. He and another neighbor (has since moved) continued reporting me for abuse/neglect of my goats-rabbits-dogs. This went on until 1 day I went to work. My property is double fenced. I have a small fenced in area around my back porch with 2 Livestock Dogs patrolling. They shot my teacup poodle 2.5 pounds in my fenced in area and killed her while I was working. I have found dead animals in my yard. It is a felony to shoot a dog in Virginia and the police investigated. They told me they knew they conspired but it could not be proven. I have tried many things but the harassment continues. I started having the livestock vet come yearly to give shots to dogs which eliminates frequent calls from animal control. Police said "maybe you should think of moving" I can't. Houses aren't selling here so I have to stay. My neighbor is verbally abusive. Very frustrating!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

We plan to move come late spring...sad to say but as far away from people as possible...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

simi-steading said:


> I've had neighbors like that BRP.. Manmade Karma won out and they moved..


I don't see them moving however we plan to move come late spring


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

big rockpile said:


> We had AR Person living next to us like this. We lost our Hunting Dogs because of her finally came to us moving.
> 
> big rockpile


Did you have to get rid of your dogs? So sorry....we plan to move too...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

simi-steading said:


> Best of luck. I hope you get it resolved.. Myself, I'd probably end up on the wrong side of the laws because I don't like to deal with the law. I just don't trust them, but I am not afraid to deal with the one I'm having issues with. At least I know for a fact they are being underhanded..


I had a fire inside me so hot I was about to go pay them a visit...I called Officer Baird (Animal Control) first and when I told him I planned to go over there he told me NOT TO! So I didn't...


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## soulsurvivor (Jul 4, 2004)

I'm going to say something here that sounds a bit far-fetched, but I don't think I'm too far off base when I say that major corporations involved in fracking wells and pipelines are not above setting up scenarios for making people want to move off their land, especially if that land is needed for its' right of way. 

So, I've said it and you or anyone that's having a "neighbor problem" can do some background investigation of your own to make certain there aren't hidden agendas ongoing.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Selena said:


> Did you have a necropsy done when Waldo died? Tough to talk about (I have zero tolerance for animal neglect/abuse) but if not, is it still possible? Knowing the exact cause of death might provide helpful evidence if the same poison is found in the cretins possession.
> 
> Another thought is to some how let the know you're not at home and then double back to your secluded vantage point. Might enlist a friend or two. Get proof they are on the property then file charges.


Unfortunately no...the cost would have been too much...we would have to ship him 200 miles..he is buried on our property so I guess it still would be possible? I did ask the vet if they could do a blood test for poisoning but their office isn't set up for this...


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## aoconnor1 (Jun 19, 2014)

How rotten! I had neighbors that had an older son living with them, he was about 20 I think. He got upset when I asked his father to make the kid stop shooting into their pond, which was right along my pasture fence line. A couple weeks later he and his pals were at it again, and oops, they "accidentally" shot and killed a three year old Thoroughbred mare of mine. They weren't even cited. We moved.

Because I do a ton of horse rescue and get in a lot of really neglected or starved animals, I have a good relationship with our county sheriff and animal control officers. But I do have to call them and tell them when I am grazing my top pasture with a rescue, that way when all the nosy neighbors report a skinny horse, the sheriff already knows it's me and can tell the caller that. In your case, the animal control people should already know you and your situation and tell the callers they will be fined for falsifying a report!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

vixcottage said:


> I currently have a neighbor worse than this. He and another neighbor (has since moved) continued reporting me for abuse/neglect of my goats-rabbits-dogs. This went on until 1 day I went to work. My property is double fenced. I have a small fenced in area around my back porch with 2 Livestock Dogs patrolling. They shot my teacup poodle 2.5 pounds in my fenced in area and killed her while I was working. I have found dead animals in my yard. It is a felony to shoot a dog in Virginia and the police investigated. They told me they knew they conspired but it could not be proven. I have tried many things but the harassment continues. I started having the livestock vet come yearly to give shots to dogs which eliminates frequent calls from animal control. Police said "maybe you should think of moving" I can't. Houses aren't selling here so I have to stay. My neighbor is verbally abusive. Very frustrating!


I'm so sorry! It's pretty sad when we are the ones that are suggested to move...we have planned on moving before this started and we will sell the acre..closing this chapter in our lives will be a blessing....I wish you the best..hopefully one day they will get caught and charged....


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

aoconnor1 said:


> How rotten! I had neighbors that had an older son living with them, he was about 20 I think. He got upset when I asked his father to make the kid stop shooting into their pond, which was right along my pasture fence line. A couple weeks later he and his pals were at it again, and oops, they "accidentally" shot and killed a three year old Thoroughbred mare of mine. They weren't even cited. We moved.
> 
> Because I do a ton of horse rescue and get in a lot of really neglected or starved animals, I have a good relationship with our county sheriff and animal control officers. But I do have to call them and tell them when I am grazing my top pasture with a rescue, that way when all the nosy neighbors report a skinny horse, the sheriff already knows it's me and can tell the caller that. In your case, the animal control people should already know you and your situation and tell the callers they will be fined for falsifying a report!


I don't understand how they can get away with something like shooting your horse?? I angers me so...I will bring up the false reporting to them today and see what they have to say..are you happy you moved though? We are looking forward to it!


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## TheFarmerMommy (Mar 21, 2014)

I was going to suggest a farm dog like an Anatolian. They don't like strangers much. But I wonder if they'd try to poison it. 

The fracking thing is interesting. I'd see what I could find out.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Thank you everyone for your support and suggestions! It's time for me to get ready and head to town....have a blessed day!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

soulsurvivor said:


> I'm going to say something here that sounds a bit far-fetched, but I don't think I'm too far off base when I say that major corporations involved in fracking wells and pipelines are not above setting up scenarios for making people want to move off their land, especially if that land is needed for its' right of way.
> 
> So, I've said it and you or anyone that's having a "neighbor problem" can do some background investigation of your own to make certain there aren't hidden agendas ongoing.


smh..interesting..how would one begin? But I believe this IS neighbor related...but thanks!


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## soulsurvivor (Jul 4, 2004)

HappyYooper said:


> smh..interesting..how would one begin? But I believe this IS neighbor related...but thanks!


If that's your location you have listed then you might want to read some of these links:
https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=upper+michigan+proposed+land+development+or+pipelines


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

I would like to say be careful adding "trip wires"

I read a story about some people who were trespassing on ATVs so a landowner put up trip wires. A boy came flying through and caught him around the neck and killed him. Landowner got in trouble.


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

HappyYooper said:


> They are right across the county road from her but they have to follow my path to get to her corral which is in front of my kitchen windows...they are kiddy corner from us...I like the idea of the laser along with the security camera...where do they sell them? They know we have guns and we both hunt...I like the trip wire too but I would worry they could come after us if they fell and got hurt?? Thank you so much for your help!!
> I have a report filed with the Sheriff Dept. already with everything that has happened in the past...I'm going in again tomorrow to report this..


Use plenty no trespassing signs registering them at the court house and send them a registered letter, if necessary from a lawyer. If you catch them file charges.


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## jlxian (Feb 14, 2005)

Set up some motion activated radios or something that makes noise at full blast. And/or a motion activated sprinkler or some such thing that will soak the so and so when he/she comes near it. 

Sorry you have to fear for your animals. That stinks big time.


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

I had a neighbor in the city that filed complaints with the Code Enforcement Dept. on my property. 

When I finally figured out who was filing the complaints I tried to reason with him. When that didn't work I told him that he would get a complaint for every one that I got. The complaints stopped. 

If your neighbor doesn't have critters to complain about there must be property code violations. With luck, a threat will stop the complaints.

Only threaten them once. The next time you talk to them they may be recording so don't ever repeat the threat.


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## OUVickie (Mar 8, 2003)

HappyYooper said:


> They are right across the county road from her but they have to follow my path to get to her corral which is in front of my kitchen windows...they are kiddy corner from us...I like the idea of the laser along with the security camera...where do they sell them? They know we have guns and we both hunt...I like the trip wire too but I would worry they could come after us if they fell and got hurt?? Thank you so much for your help!!
> I have a report filed with the Sheriff Dept. already with everything that has happened in the past...I'm going in again tomorrow to report this..


You can get an inexpensive camera set-up at Harbor Freight Tools, if you have one near you. 

I hope they leave you and the horse alone. There's nothing worse than trying to be a good neighbor and having those who you worry about all the time.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

SarahFair said:


> I would like to say be careful adding "trip wires"
> 
> I read a story about some people who were trespassing on ATVs so a landowner put up trip wires. A boy came flying through and caught him around the neck and killed him. Landowner got in trouble.


I was thinking of using a light weight fishing line and put it between ankle and shin level...something that would break easily..NEVER put anything at neck, chest level...we had a local that was beheaded while riding on a snowmobile going into private property that had a cable going across the driveway..


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

First take get some one to make you some silhouette cutouts, like a guy standing and one running, ect.
Use them for a little target practice, Gun and Bow, leave the arrows in.
Put them around the place. Might strike the right nerve.

Part two...

Screw the Game cam, if they are watching for you to leave, enlist some Friend/s.
Have the Friends stay at your place incognito, Leave when your sure that they are watching. In the mean time don't go to far just out of sight. If you Get any company friends call you and confront them and document on film the trespass.
Once there you tell them they are not welcome and are trespassing,call the sheriff.
Part of my conversation Just after they are told they are not welcome, and the cameras off, would be did you notice my targets, I would really hate to mistake you for one well your sneaking around over hear, I forget exactly how many I have...

Of coarse you need the property posted to the letter of the Law, but once formally told and reported as well... They can not claim they did not know.

Second time is when the Authoritys will be bound to take action.


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## TRAILRIDER (Apr 16, 2007)

Your horse looks well fed and well cared for to boot. In KY you are not required to have a building for shelter for a horse (horses are considered livestock), but in MD where I grew up they are very picky about shelter and amount of acreage too.

Now on the other hand....I have a distant neighbor that has two goats, without proper goat fencing. The goats are tied by their neck collars to cement blocks that they drag around the pasture. Its not against any code or law, (but in my opinion cruel treatment). I know someone that works on the farm and I let him know, when ever the guy gets tired of trying to keep those goats in to let me know. I don't want them, but I would take them to get them out of that situation. 

I try to mind my own beeswax, just happen to know someone involved. Oh, and I have had to catch said goats loose on the road in the dark and put them back in. Sometimes the goats are on one side of the fence and the cement blocks are on the other. I seriously hope no coyotes discover them!


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## Janis R (Jun 27, 2013)

Definitely talk with the sheriff he isn't a lawyer so I would talk with a lawyer about what is and isn't legal for you to do to discourage the neighbors.


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## Jlynnp (Sep 9, 2014)

Do a lot of target practice when they are home, I know ammo is pricey but they may well rethink things after a solid half hour of shooting. We have little problem where we are now but we do practice. We do have some new neighbors including one who lives in a house made of plywood and black plastic. No heat as the plastic would melt.


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## Michael W. Smith (Jun 2, 2002)

I wouldn't even mess with any kind of trip strings or noise makers.

I would immediately get "No trespassing - violators will be prosecuted" signs and put up a lot more than necessary.

I would then get some game cameras and put them in places the trespassers don't notice. As soon as you have the proof of who was on your land, call the State Police and press charges to the fullest extent of the law.

In the meantime, find out from a lawyer who you need to talk to for the records of who is making the calls. Once found out, tell Mr. Baird that one more visit from him and you will be getting the name and prosecuting them for harassment.

I understand that Mr. Baird needs to follow up on the calls, but he also needs to grow a set and tell the callers that he has been over to investigate X amount of times, and remind the person that HE can prosecute them for giving false information - even if he can't.

I'd also be inclined to get some friends to come over (unseen by your neighbors) and then when you leave they can be watching and video recording (or calling the police that your place is being robbed).

Or have a friend over (unseen by your neighbors) have them dress and look like you to and drive your car away. Meanwhile, you watch and wait and as soon as you see them heading towards your property line, start video taping. Once they are way over your property line, go outside, insist they get off your land and go back inside and call the police. One visit from the police and the harassment should stop.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

||Downhome|| said:


> First take get some one to make you some silhouette cutouts, like a guy standing and one running, ect.
> Use them for a little target practice, Gun and Bow, leave the arrows in.
> Put them around the place. Might strike the right nerve.
> 
> ...


My husband likes the silhouette idea :thumb: If I had a friend or family that lived right by me the idea of having them stay here would be good but they would pretty much have to live here because they don't go over there on a regular basis... Appreciate your help!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Michael W. Smith said:


> I wouldn't even mess with any kind of trip strings or noise makers.
> 
> I would immediately get "No trespassing - violators will be prosecuted" signs and put up a lot more than necessary.
> 
> ...


Hubby & I have discussed contacting a lawyer to see what our options are...to me it seems something could be done! Thank you!


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I wasn't able to meet with the Deputy yesterday..he was out on a call. I stayed in town as long as I could before I had to leave to pick up my husband but he will be calling me this morning. Not too fond of phone calls, I'd rather talk face to face but I will be able to give him the information to add to my report.
I will call a lawyer to set up an appointment today also...
Heartfelt thank you's to all!


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## dizzy (Jun 25, 2013)

Not sure about your neck of the woods but here, AC is not allowed on the property unless you allow them on-unless they have a search warrant. So, the next time they show up, refuse to allow them on your property. Tell them that you're tired of being harassed, and if they don't stop it, you will be filing charges against them.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

TRAILRIDER said:


> Your horse looks well fed and well cared for to boot. In KY you are not required to have a building for shelter for a horse (horses are considered livestock), but in MD where I grew up they are very picky about shelter and amount of acreage too.
> 
> Now on the other hand....I have a distant neighbor that has two goats, without proper goat fencing. The goats are tied by their neck collars to cement blocks that they drag around the pasture. Its not against any code or law, (but in my opinion cruel treatment). I know someone that works on the farm and I let him know, when ever the guy gets tired of trying to keep those goats in to let me know. I don't want them, but I would take them to get them out of that situation.
> 
> I try to mind my own beeswax, just happen to know someone involved. Oh, and I have had to catch said goats loose on the road in the dark and put them back in. Sometimes the goats are on one side of the fence and the cement blocks are on the other. I seriously hope no coyotes discover them!


Michigan doesn't require shelter either but she does have a stand of balsam she can go into and a good windbreak around her corral. I understand how you feel about those goats..just reading about them I feel bad. 
One of these neighbors uses hounds to hunt '**** and bear. Every year he has a group come up from Georgia with their dogs. This year 2 of the Georgia guys dogs were torn up bad by bear...when they got back to camp they stapled up the injuries and tied them to trees and went back out hunting. We heard 2 gunshots before dark as we were stand hunting...I'm not against using dogs for bear hunting as a matter of fact I got my first bear that way with these guys but after hearing from that neighbor (he is the one we considered a very close friend) how these Georgia guys take care of the dogs made us sick...another thing he told us was they are breeding their hounds with Pit's for their jaw strength...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

dizzy said:


> Not sure about your neck of the woods but here, AC is not allowed on the property unless you allow them on-unless they have a search warrant. So, the next time they show up, refuse to allow them on your property. Tell them that you're tired of being harassed, and if they don't stop it, you will be filing charges against them.


What is AC?


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## Grandmotherbear (May 15, 2002)

I believe AC stands for animal control


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

Michael W. Smith said:


> I wouldn't even mess with any kind of trip strings or noise makers.
> 
> I would immediately get "No trespassing - violators will be prosecuted" signs and put up a lot more than necessary.
> 
> ...


This requires way to much time and has to targeted. It is very impractical. How could you get a neighbor over at the right time? The violator would have to be a very frequent visitor.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Well. I spoke with the Deputy and gave him my report...I asked him for advice on what I can do or if they can do anything...didn't get anywhere with that other than set up a camera. I called an attorney..got a bit more help with the secretary. She did say to set up a camera and I need to know/get pictures of who is doing the harassing..but she also told me of the Freedom of Information Act and to request by letter the copies of the complaints and names...she said they don't have to give it to me but it's worth a try...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I called AC and spoke with Officer Baird. I asked him if I could get copies of the complaints..they don't keep any records of complaints that come in if there isn't any neglect/abuse


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

If Officer Baird ever gives you a ticket then you have a right to a trial. At that point you can demand to see the complaint and know who filed it. You have a right to face your accuser.


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## badlander (Jun 7, 2009)

I've been following this thread with interest. 

My advice is in agreement with those who have said set up game cameras or security cameras.

We've dealt with employee theft. When we found out what was going on we fired the employee and contacted the local law enforcement who eventually turned the case over to the state police. At that point the damage done to our business was to the tune of 50,000 dollars.

The first thing they told us was it was too bad we fired her, they would have loved to have set up some hidden cameras in the office and catch her in the act. Videos are iron clad proof and impossible to disprove in a court of law.

Second, although it would involve shelling out some cash. I would contact ADT security systems, have them send a rep out, tell them what is happening and tell them you want to catch the so and so in the act. Trust me, they can do it. I was told by a rep that their security cameras and videos submitted in court had a 100% conviction rate at that time. The trespassers would never know they were being filmed. IMHO It would be worth the expense considering what you have gone through.

Also, they told me that sometimes, just putting up the 'This Property Protected by ADT Security Systems' signs is enough to deter trespassers. They never know what type of system you have for sure.

Good luck. Nothing worse than living in an area where you have neighbors who are nightmares to co exist with. That's why we live on a gravel road with the nearest neighbors a mile away.


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## TRAILRIDER (Apr 16, 2007)

HappyYooper said:


> Michigan doesn't require shelter either but she does have a stand of balsam she can go into and a good windbreak around her corral. I understand how you feel about those goats..just reading about them I feel bad.
> One of these neighbors uses hounds to hunt '**** and bear. Every year he has a group come up from Georgia with their dogs. This year 2 of the Georgia guys dogs were torn up bad by bear...when they got back to camp they stapled up the injuries and tied them to trees and went back out hunting. We heard 2 gunshots before dark as we were stand hunting...I'm not against using dogs for bear hunting as a matter of fact I got my first bear that way with these guys but after hearing from that neighbor (he is the one we considered a very close friend) how these Georgia guys take care of the dogs made us sick...another thing he told us was they are breeding their hounds with Pit's for their jaw strength...


Wow. I have an old TB horse (pasture ornament) and he does have a run in shed he can get in and has round bales he can reach inside there too. I personally like all my critters to have a building if they care to use it. But the proof is in the pudding as they say. If horse is fed and cared for, looks good and has a bright eye, I say leave it alone. I mean....wild horses (I did have a BLM mustang) don't have buildings, do they? 

I've heard of people using pits and pit/crosses for hunting wild hogs and bear. From your post mentioning "hearing 2 shots", it sounds like the two injured dogs might have been the ones shot. Is that right? Wow. That's just harsh. 

I sure am glad I have good neighbors on all sides. And no matter how "good" they are, I'm still glad we all have 1/2 mile between us each way!


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Nimrod said:


> If Officer Baird ever gives you a ticket then you have a right to a trial. At that point you can demand to see the complaint and know who filed it. You have a right to face your accuser.


Problem with that is that Officer Baird will be the accuser not the complainers.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Nimrod said:


> If Officer Baird ever gives you a ticket then you have a right to a trial. At that point you can demand to see the complaint and know who filed it. You have a right to face your accuser.


This is right Nimrod..only if I am charged with neglect/abuse...I will have to pray that my cameras catch them on our property..


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## Coco (Jun 8, 2007)

you also should file a complaint against your neighbors for trespassing, Then you will have a right to look at what was field against you.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

badlander said:


> I've been following this thread with interest.
> 
> My advice is in agreement with those who have said set up game cameras or security cameras.
> 
> ...


I appreciate your advice..I found their website and will apply for a free quote...I'm thinking that the signs just might work b/c these people live right across the road from our property and they would see the company van..but in the meantime I have my cameras set up...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Coco said:


> you also should file a complaint against your neighbors for trespassing, Then you will have a right to look at what was field against you.


I can only press charges if I have proof of them trespassing..


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

TRAILRIDER said:


> Wow. I have an old TB horse (pasture ornament) and he does have a run in shed he can get in and has round bales he can reach inside there too. I personally like all my critters to have a building if they care to use it. But the proof is in the pudding as they say. If horse is fed and cared for, looks good and has a bright eye, I say leave it alone. I mean....wild horses (I did have a BLM mustang) don't have buildings, do they?
> 
> I've heard of people using pits and pit/crosses for hunting wild hogs and bear. From your post mentioning "hearing 2 shots", it sounds like the two injured dogs might have been the ones shot. Is that right? Wow. That's just harsh.
> 
> I sure am glad I have good neighbors on all sides. And no matter how "good" they are, I'm still glad we all have 1/2 mile between us each way!


When we heard the shots that was the first thing we thought...we lost any respect we had for these hunters..it is harsh...granted, the dogs are doing what they love to do but take care of them if they get hurt! We do have vets around here...we're looking forward to our move in the spring..deep into the woods


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Nothing usually comes from the first trespass complaint.

They can claim all sorts of things and well prosecutors prefer a airtight case.

That first complaint will be documented and it should be made clear to the Officer that You have communicated to them (Neighbors) that they are not welcome on the property and that if they are on the property they are trespassing. The officer should be made clear that it is a ongoing issue. Don't go into a lot of detail just that the trespass is ongoing and a problem and ask that he make it clear to the trespassing party they are in violation of the law should they be caught trespassing again and that you do have full intentions of prosecuting, and that he document this in his report.


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## Coco (Jun 8, 2007)

||Downhome|| said:


> Nothing usually comes from the first trespass complaint.
> 
> They can claim all sorts of things and well prosecutors prefer a airtight case.
> 
> That first complaint will be documented and it should be made clear to the Officer that You have communicated to them (Neighbors) that they are not welcome on the property and that if they are on the property they are trespassing. The officer should be made clear that it is a ongoing issue. Don't go into a lot of detail just that the trespass is ongoing and a problem and ask that he make it clear to the trespassing party they are in violation of the law should they be caught trespassing again and that you do have full intentions of prosecuting, and that he document this in his report.


I would have done this at the time of the 1st horses death ( if I thought a neigbor could have been responsible for said horses death),( killing an animal is the first step in most serial killers) Paper work is despised by all but needs to be done, use the system to document, document the stuff you are dealing with, also post your property now as some minorities are let off for not reading English. 

good luck and stay aware of what you really might be dealing with.


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## M5farm (Jan 14, 2014)

I been following this thread . If I was going to Civil and did not know who was doing it I would go to each neighbor and explain that the next time I received a complaint I was going to call DEA and tell them I seen Pot growing or if they have small kids threaten them with calling DHR. but in reality I would most likely get to spend a night in jail for beating someone tail.


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## Coco (Jun 8, 2007)

HappyYooper said:


> I can only press charges if I have proof of them trespassing..


you have a dead horse, use that


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Coco said:


> I would have done this at the time of the 1st horses death ( if I thought a neigbor could have been responsible for said horses death),( killing an animal is the first step in most serial killers) Paper work is despised by all but needs to be done, use the system to document, document the stuff you are dealing with, also post your property now as some minorities are let off for not reading English.
> 
> good luck and stay aware of what you really might be dealing with.


I have been in contact with the Sheriff department since we lost Waldo...everything that has happened since that day has been documented with the Sheriff Department..the Animal Control (here) doesn't keep any complaints that don't "pan out" ..I wasn't very comforted by the reply I got from the Deputy..He told me I shouldn't be so concerned about this..I told him I'm sick to my stomach every day..not knowing if when I go out to feed my Bess will she be sick or dead, people trespassing on our property, throwing metal and nails in our driveway and them watching...watching..watching...the Deputy told me NOT to talk to the ones we are 99.99999999% sure are doing this..our other neighbor is aware of this..
I have signs and will be putting them out...

Here's a picture of my big boy...


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## Coco (Jun 8, 2007)

Good luck and don't let your Gard down, and get everything in place. And tell the police that you intend to film every day 24 hrs a day.


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## Tinga (Jul 24, 2011)

Go pick a friend up and have them duck down in your back seat... Pull around your house out of site. You go sit in a hidey hole with a camera and have your friend drive your car off. SIT & Wait....


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

If your neighbors keep making unfounded complaints they can be charged with harrassment. Animal control people might be the ones making the charge. I don't know if open access to public records laws would allow you to get a copy of the complaints made against you, but its something to consider requesting. If you can get info, then you can file your own harrassment charges.


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## Rosepath (Feb 18, 2011)

If they are watching you, set up a camera in plain sight, watching them. all the time.
Might be enough to make them uncomfortable.
And if they were pulling this on previous tenants, it might be that they're on a mission to drive out anyone who lives close enough to see what goes on at their place (meth lab? drug trade? )


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

Consider that if the officer writes you up, there will be a record that you neglected your horse. This could bite you in the rear later. Even if you were found innocent, the record would still be there.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Ann-NWIowa said:


> If your neighbors keep making unfounded complaints they can be charged with harrassment. Animal control people might be the ones making the charge. I don't know if open access to public records laws would allow you to get a copy of the complaints made against you, but its something to consider requesting. If you can get info, then you can file your own harrassment charges.


I asked Officer Baird if after getting so many unfounded complaints would they press charges on the one calling ..his answer to me was no b/c people would be afraid to call in..I tried to make a point saying that once those people who make harassment calls find out charges could be filed against them for making these calls maybe then this wouldn't be a problem anymore...IMO I don't see a person not calling if there is an actual neglect/abuse case! If there aren't any charges against me the dept. doesn't keep the complaints...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Rosepath said:


> If they are watching you, set up a camera in plain sight, watching them. all the time.
> Might be enough to make them uncomfortable.
> And if they were pulling this on previous tenants, it might be that they're on a mission to drive out anyone who lives close enough to see what goes on at their place (meth lab? drug trade? )


These people are in their late 60's/early 70's...they are the new ones on the road..We were the first ones to live on this road almost 18 years ago..they moved in about 2 years ago...hubby & I, a single man and the "Jone's" are the only ones who live on this road year round..others are camps/weekenders...the "Jones" are just downright mean...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Maura said:


> Consider that if the officer writes you up, there will be a record that you neglected your horse. This could bite you in the rear later. Even if you were found innocent, the record would still be there.


This is true...Don't ask for what I really don't want! As much as I want to know for sure who it is it's not worth that...only 5 months and we'll be off this road...


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

Maura said:


> Consider that if the officer writes you up, there will be a record that you neglected your horse. This could bite you in the rear later. Even if you were found innocent, the record would still be there.


Yep it is true. I am adversely affected by the system.


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## TRAILRIDER (Apr 16, 2007)

Aw Happy, that is a beautiful horse! Obviously well loved. Sorry you are going through all this mess.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

TRAILRIDER said:


> Aw Happy, that is a beautiful horse! Obviously well loved. Sorry you are going through all this mess.


Thank you so much! This is Waldo...the one we lost last summer...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I was just served papers for 3 separate PPO's....I have an appointment with a lawyer tomorrow afternoon...my court date is December 23 @ 1 p.m.

This is what all 3 put down:
I make this petition under the authority of MCL600.2950a (1) and ask the court to grant a personal protection order prohibiting the respondent from

following me or appearing within my sight.

approaching or confronting me in a public place or on a private property.

entering onto or remaining on property owned, leased or occupied by me.

sending mail or other communications to me.

contacting me by phone.

placing an object on or delivering an object to property owned, leased, or occupied by me.

threatening to kill or physically injure me.

purchasing or possessing a firearm.

posting a message through the use of any medium of communication including the internet or a computer or any electronic medium, pursuant to MCL750.411s.

I request an ex parte order because immediate and irreparable injury, loss or damage will occur between now and a hearing or because notice itself will cause irreparable injury, loss or damage before the order can be entered.

I guess until this is it for now...your prayers and support are much needed!!


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

3? From three different people? All living at the same address or all of your neighbors?


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## starlady (Sep 9, 2009)

HappyYooper, you should stop posting on this thread until after your meeting with your lawyer and probably until after the hearing. If they have an ex parte order it may already be in effect. It could be that they found this thread and felt threatened by what some others were suggesting you do, so they went to a judge for a temporary restraining order.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

These where served on you or you had them served?


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## arnie (Apr 26, 2012)

I saw several signs on farm gates lately .one stating if your saw here ater dark you will be found here in the day light . we won't call 911 only need the coroner and next of kin .a friend bought the house and yard off a farmer he kept the grazeing n hay land .yet he still thought he could tell my mechanic uddy not to have a couple autos in the drive way while being repaired as he thought they were an eye sore ( more than the mud hole created by the cattle his renter had on his side of the fence I suppose ) my friend called his buddie with a junk yard and lined his property with real junk autos for a couple weeks . ending the former owners complaining . mabe you could borrow a few barking, snarleing ,biteing ,junk yard dogs for a week or so and give em something to complane about 
:kiss:


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

If animal control is not keeping copies of complaints, they are failing in their responsibility. Whoever is the supervisor of AC should be contacted about the failure to keep proper records. I'd also discuss the harrassment by making false complaints with the supervisor. I'd almost bet (if I were a betting person!) that they do keep the complaints. They would be in their files as "unfounded", but not destroyed.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Explain to me how filing a Protective Order against me could prevent me from my constitutional rights to posses or buy a gun? What, would I have to give all my guns away because of the order? Then the people filing the order would know I'm unprotected... . LUDICROUS... 


Yeah, I'd stop posting about this.. there's some way/reason that got filed, including the part about communicating... Creepy freakin neighbors..


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## HOTW (Jul 3, 2007)

Got to court and explain away also mention the fact you are going to have your horse exhumed for poison testing.....


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## M5farm (Jan 14, 2014)

simi-steading said:


> Explain to me how filing a Protective Order against me could prevent me from my constitutional rights to posses or buy a gun? What, would I have to give all my guns away because of the order? Then the people filing the order would know I'm unprotected... . LUDICROUS...
> 
> 
> Yeah, I'd stop posting about this.. there's some way/reason that got filed, including the part about communicating... Creepy freakin neighbors..


I wandered the same thing about the gun. If they were my neighbors I would make their life a living he'll. I would buy as many hogs as I could and put them as close as I could to their property. Then I would start sleeping days a work out side running a chain saw from midnight to 6 am and in order to see properly I would erect about 6 light poles and attach ballpark lights to it so when I was running my tractor without the muffler I could see. I would also site in all my guns every night. I would also make sure the police dept did a welfare check every morning. Because was concerned about them . There are alot of other ways to be a nuisance but I will save those for later.


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## TRAILRIDER (Apr 16, 2007)

I agree that Happy should no longer post. For a while anyway. But we still can ; )
I also wondered about the request that Happy not keep fire arms. Makes no sense.
However, it does look like he/she will have their day in court and I'm sure all will work out in the end. Seems like a no brainer to me.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

People are not given PPO's just willy nilly. I wounder what these people are claiming you have done to Them.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

The gun Restriction is part of the law here at least.
they will have to show due cause why a PPO is required,and its a little harder to get one in a non domestic relationship.


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## manygoatsnmore (Feb 12, 2005)

A temporary restraining order is issued without anything more than the word of the party requesting it. They then have a court date when both sides are allowed to state their case, and the judge will decide if the restraining order will be upheld. I think Yooper should request one against her neighbors.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

starlady said:


> HappyYooper, you should stop posting on this thread until after your meeting with your lawyer and probably until after the hearing. If they have an ex parte order it may already be in effect.* It could be that they found this thread and felt threatened by what some others were suggesting you do,* so they went to a judge for a temporary restraining order.


I guess that could be possible but if it's true then it means they are members of HT forum because people have to be registered members and logged in to read here on Countryside Families forum.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I met with my lawyer yesterday and will be meeting with her again today. She is confident that this will not happen. She explained to me that the ex parte was denied 
To explain just a little as to why this is happening..First..
My husband and I have never done anything to these people..I know..it's our word against theirs..we do not go onto their property, make lewd gestures, name call..have always kept to ourselves...but NOT unfriendly. 
I DO take blame for using FB to vent out my frustrations against them...some of you probably have seen comments made (NOT threatening just upset because of how we feel that our horse was poisoned and we believe they had something to do with it..and that they have trespassed on our property many times) Well, my niece made a comment jokingly (not so funny now) :
Have your vehicle gone, but you're home. When you see this person on your property go out with your loaded gun. Carry the dead carcass in your house, call the cops saying he was breaking in. You were defending yourself. Problem solved! Make sure you carry the body. With snow you don't want to drag his sorry (you know what)...
Someone on my friends list was following me and gave this to one of the PPO persons..I have deactivated my accounts...
They also brought this post to the State Police but nothing became of it.
Other than them bringing up the fact that we lost our home due to foreclosure in 2012, we lived in a camper for 2 months, now renting a hunting cabin and I have a bi-polar daughter there isn't anything that is threatening...however the 3 have all commented that I am showing clear signs of mental health issues, that I need an urgent mental health evaluation , need to see a psychiatrist..one stated that I could very easily take this further..I have guns in my home and feel I am crazy enough to use them on a person!!
I am ashamed to admit it but this Yooper girl does hunt but doesn't know how to load a gun :ashamed:...my dear husband does that for me..
So this is part of what is going on..
Thank you again for your support! I do read your comments


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Wow.. that's a drag.. But here's a few thoughts about that.. 

First off.. with friends like that who give the PPO people the info.. who needs enemies?

Secondly... if these PPO people aren't guilty of trespassing, then why do they think you were talking about them?..


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I am sorry. We went thru this with our last place. We had sold the house and kept most of the farmland. We were going to build a house far back on the land. One day we asked the new owners kid to stay off the field we cut hay off( 4 wheelers). It was nonstop trouble after that,shooting ect. we sold,moved here. The people that bought the land after that had constant troubles until one day the troubler make did one last thing. He was confronted with the evidance . Now, all is quiet.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I have a cabin in the upper lower. I made a thread in Survial and Prep. Peeping Creep in the wilderness. It looks like a neighbor has put up a tree stand on my land and is treating it as his own. I'm just imagining what I'll be dealing with from here out....


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## unregistered358967 (Jul 17, 2013)

Happy Y I'm glad you closed FB and pray you won't have any more trouble. I agree with keeping a low profile on here as well. I wish you the best of luck.....


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Yes, PPOs can be filed and even temporarily granted with no proof or anything more than the complainant going and paying for them. I know of a person who did it and their concealed carry permit was actually confiscated with nothing more than one person's word. 

HY, you have my prayers and sympathy. I know what it's like to be accused of something and having to pay for an attorney to defend yourself against someone's wild accusations.


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## Wanda (Dec 19, 2002)

If people were accused of poisoning a horse with NO PROOF maybe they think they should be concerned! People using Facebook, forums,twitter ect., should realise there conversations and postings are not private.


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## JoePa (Mar 14, 2013)

I have always lived a life with the thought that I don't bother anyone - I mind my own business and pretty much keep to myself - but - if someone goes out of their way to bother me they are going to have a war on their hands - I would make life so miserable that they would have to move - not me - if they try to retaliate I would only up the response to the nuclear option - they can't win - 

In your case you and your husband should start harassing them until they get the idea that they ain't gonna win - there is no end to the things you can do - it just takes a little planning - in fact you can make a game out of it - often times getting the law involved takes too long to resolve a problem


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## Lilith (Dec 29, 2012)

"I know someone who" has a nasty neighbor that is harassing their animals. They have lost two herding dogs (not aggressive at all) to .22 bullets both dogs were found dead in their yard. Several times they have run unknown people off the property in the dark at gun point after hearing the pigs going nuts. Two instances with the pigs, the fence was cut, and there was evidence of a truck and trailer having been backed up to the fence. Yesterday, the neighbor came over to cuss about the pigs for about the 30th time - calling them filthy nasty creatures of the devil. This time, he threatened to drown the pigs and perform an exorcism on them. My friend says that she is sick of the religious intolerance, tired of the police refusing to investigate, and that it would just be a shame if one of their cows got a bullet in the head every-time one of her animals shows up missing or hurt at the hands of a human. Sometimes things escalate to the Hatfields and McCoys.


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## Jlynnp (Sep 9, 2014)

Having lived most of my life in Michigan and being involved with animal rescue/cruelty, etc I can assure AC has no right to enter your property without a warrant despite the complaints they may get. More than once I insisted that an AC officer get a warrant to enter my property, they don't unless the can reasonably articulate the need for one to the judge and back that up with proof.

I agree with ADT or a private investigator to document what it going on. It is almost iron clad proof.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

HY you need to File a PPO against the complainants as well.
At the least if your held to such they will be as well.
I went through this with the Ex, while I was restrained by her ppo she was not, so it actually put me at odds as she would show up and that put me in violation, but once I had a PPO on her it was a bit different.
In fact she got a night in the Jail for Violating it.
The local cop did not want to enforce it, I made it clear that he would or I would have another agency handle the matter.
After all the Law is the Law.


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## am1too (Dec 30, 2009)

Paumon said:


> I guess that could be possible but if it's true then it means they are members of HT forum because people have to be registered members and logged in to read here on Countryside Families forum.


post yes, read, I do not think so.


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## manygoatsnmore (Feb 12, 2005)

This forum and S&EP are private - you can't see them at all unless you are logged in.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

am1too said:


> post yes, read, I do not think so.


It use to be visible when not logged in, but a few weeks ago, it when seen only when logged in, along with the S&EP forums.


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## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

What makes you think the horse was poisoned? The neighbors shouldn't be trespassing either way. Get cameras up and press charges for every infraction. Be sure you have up plenty of No Trespassing signs or they will claim they didn't know they were trespassing.


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## farmmom (Jan 4, 2009)

Post the "No Trespassing" signs and take pictures of every one, just in case they tear them down, you have proof that they were posted. I had this trouble with former neighbors.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

We were granted our request to reschedule the court date! 
In the meantime hubby & I have been flipped off by one of them and one of the others is now taking his big tractor and dumping snow from his property onto ours....:facepalm:


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

HappyYooper said:


> We were granted our request to reschedule the court date!
> In the meantime hubby & I have been flipped off by one of them and one of the others is now taking his big tractor and dumping snow from his property onto ours....:facepalm:


So, he must be trespassing. Could you place something that would week his tractor? a fallen tree, a big rock?


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Oh, No, they are putting snow on our property! In most regions that normally get 100 inches of snow, snow isn't trespassing. November brought 65 inches. Sometimes trouble finds us, sometimes we go looking for it.
Never before have people been as concerned about animal welfare. They see an empty water trough and get worried. You speculate that the horse died due to foul play, but nothing to prove it. Sometimes horses die. 
How close are these neighbors and how much pasture do you provide? All any of us are hearing is your side of it. Based on that, you are fully in your rights and all your neighbors are jerks. But, really we don't know. 
Mackinac County had an animal neglect case a few years back that was mostly minor stuff, yet the Court Room was packed and the County Prosecutor got a thousand emails and phone calls. 
Is that a single strand of nylon fence in the background in your photo?


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Um who cares what kind of fencing a person uses if it does the job?

I sure would be put out if someone was shoving piles of dirt, leave, snow, manure off of their property and onto mine. Any violation of another person's land ownership is serious.


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## mrs whodunit (Feb 3, 2012)

HappyYooper said:


> We were granted our request to reschedule the court date!
> In the meantime hubby & I have been flipped off by one of them and one of the others is now taking his big tractor and dumping snow from his property onto ours....:facepalm:



Did you get video of that?


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

cranbrook said:


> Oh, No, they are putting snow on our property! In most regions that normally get 100 inches of snow, snow isn't trespassing. November brought 65 inches. Sometimes trouble finds us, sometimes we go looking for it.
> Never before have people been as concerned about animal welfare. They see an empty water trough and get worried. You speculate that the horse died due to foul play, but nothing to prove it. Sometimes horses die.
> How close are these neighbors and how much pasture do you provide? All any of us are hearing is your side of it. Based on that, you are fully in your rights and all your neighbors are jerks. But, really we don't know.
> Mackinac County had an animal neglect case a few years back that was mostly minor stuff, yet the Court Room was packed and the County Prosecutor got a thousand emails and phone calls.
> Is that a single strand of nylon fence in the background in your photo?


I guess I didn't explain my point of the snow...we have no problem with it at all..but the fact is if WE put snow onto his property he would have a conniption fit. The difference between us and them is we would have asked them if it would be alright...he does whatever he wants to do..
I don't have anything to prove that Waldo was poisoned..just a gut feeling after our other horse Bessie refused to drink the same water Waldo was drinking from...and she was thirsty. The only way to find out for sure would be to bring his body up and have tests run. 
We have the corral fenced with1 strand of electric wire and 2 strands of electric tape but the tape is just there for when the kids come over to remind them that their is an electric fence and it's hot.
Another point on the snow dumping..he has 2.5 acres he can put it on with his dump tractor..when these huge snow banks melts the ground will turn into one wet mess...he has the snow banks the length of our property...


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

mrs whodunit said:


> Did you get video of that?


No..I was driving..


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## mrs whodunit (Feb 3, 2012)

HappyYooper said:


> No..I was driving..


Bummer


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Did You take my advice on reverse PPO's on them?

I'm sure they will rethink their actions,when the shoe is on the other foot.

You can have it all in one court date.

Ask the Judge to send the Sherrifs out for their guns.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

||Downhome|| said:


> Did You take my advice on reverse PPO's on them?
> 
> I'm sure they will rethink their actions,when the shoe is on the other foot.
> 
> ...


I did bring that up with my lawyer. I was told that it was no longer allowed..to put a PPO on the person/people who place one on you...


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## dizzy (Jun 25, 2013)

Even though you didn't get video of them putting snow on your property, can you take a video of the tracks coming off of their property and onto yours?


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## soulsurvivor (Jul 4, 2004)

I'm glad to know you have a lawyer. You are a renter, not a land owner and the rules change because of that one fact.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Is there a chance you had a short in your trough someplace? It wouldn't be the first time someone had a horse die from it? 

As a renter, there are rules to protect you but you're a bit at the mercy of your landlord and perhaps he has allowed the snow dumping in the past and the neighbour assumes it's still okay or your landlord has consented to it even though he doesn't live on the property. 

Things like this generally start off small and it's a whole bunch of little things that escalate them to as ugly as this is. 

You vented in a way that wasn't a good idea and while you deleted Facebook, those comments aren't gone. They may have been printed off or screen shots taken. 

I hope you can resolve the situation but at this stage, it might be a good idea to simply move before this goes really wrong.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

dizzy said:


> Even though you didn't get video of them putting snow on your property, can you take a video of the tracks coming off of their property and onto yours?


Yes, I can..


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

soulsurvivor said:


> I'm glad to know you have a lawyer. You are a renter, not a land owner and the rules change because of that one fact.


We rent the cabin we're staying in but own the acre across the road from it where we have our 30' camper, storage building and Bessie.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

wr said:


> Is there a chance you had a short in your trough someplace? It wouldn't be the first time someone had a horse die from it?
> 
> As a renter, there are rules to protect you but you're a bit at the mercy of your landlord and perhaps he has allowed the snow dumping in the past and the neighbour assumes it's still okay or your landlord has consented to it even though he doesn't live on the property.
> 
> ...


WR, I admit it was wrong for me to reply to my niece the way I did and wrong for me to vent my feelings on FB..a hard lesson learned. 
We own the acre Bessie is on..we bought it from our landlords...they have had their share of run ins with the neighbors too...they will be witnesses in my defense..
My hubby commented the other day about the snow and the finger..If they are so afraid of me..why would they continue to antagonize me?


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

and yes, we will be moving in a few months


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## Joshie (Dec 8, 2008)

dizzy said:


> Even though you didn't get video of them putting snow on your property, can you take a video of the tracks coming off of their property and onto yours?


That might not be a good idea. Please ask your lawyer before doing this or at least before showing the video to anybody but your hubby. They might just easily say that the tire tracks show you going onto their property unless you have a forensic specialist say otherwise. 

I would recommend that you don't talk about this here or elsewhere, even to relatives. While there is no excuse for what is happening your actions have fanned the fire, even if you only consider fb. Considering how many HT members recommend escalating and antagonizing an issue way out of the league of the initial problem (Examples can be found all over HT.) your neighbors may actually fear retaliation. 

Just because they are fanning the flames does not mean you should. Be better than they are. Be a whole lot better. For your own safety I think you should put the cameras up. I recommend telling the judge you are scared yourself. If your lawyer says it's OK I would tell him that they beat you to it because you planned to get a restraining order yourself. You might ask if the current order prevents them from antagonizing you. I would also admit any poor behavior on your side. 

How do you know your horse was poisoned or that they did any of the bad things that have happned on your property? Could they truly think you have done similar things to them? Are you planning to sell the land you do own? Would one of them purchase it to get you out of their hair?

Please lie low and avoid them at all costs. Please don't post about this anywhere, including here. If they looked at your fb they might know you like homesteading sites. From your posts they could easily recognize your posts and use them against you. They could always join HT to see what you're saying. 

I am really sorry these things are happening to you. I hope you can move really soon.


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## PTNTEXAS (Mar 15, 2006)

Hate to see anyone forced to move. Will you have a hard time selling your acre? I would think so, it does seem possible that your thoughts on here are being shared. Maybe you could find someone to keep your horse so it would be out of any danger till you get your new place. Hope you can find an annoying owner for the acre when you leave.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

HappyYooper said:


> I did bring that up with my lawyer. I was told that it was no longer allowed..to put a PPO on the person/people who place one on you...


I think I would be consulting another Lawyer, Its a old boy network with a lot of favors and back scratching. 

They also like to do as little work for as much money as possible.


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## manygoatsnmore (Feb 12, 2005)

I don't think that asking for an injunction against them dumping snow on your place and making threatening gestures is the same thing as asking for a PPO against them just because they asked for one against you.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

In a previous post you indicated your horse had seen a vet and it died of colic. I'm curious as to how you have come to feel your vet is misinformed. 

Has there been something else come to light that would lead your vet to reverse that opinion? Horses will go off feed and water for a bit if they are mourning.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

wr said:


> In a previous post you indicated your horse had seen a vet and it died of colic. I'm curious as to how you have come to feel your vet is misinformed.
> 
> Has there been something else come to light that would lead your vet to reverse that opinion? Horses will go off feed and water for a bit if they are mourning.


Our vet couldn't give an definite diagnosis while in the field. She called it colic. I have been in touch with the vets office and asked what the symptoms of antifreeze poisoning in a horse would look like. Her answer was; muscle twitching, looking, acting drunk, stiff legged walking, colic & convulsing. All of which Waldo was showing. Shortly before he died he was following me in the corral..he wanted to be close to me but I had to keep my distance because I was afraid he was going to fall onto me..all I wanted to do was put my arms around his neck and comfort him but it was too dangerous..after he went down and died I gave him my love...
I do NOT agree with any return harassment on my part..the snow is plowed across a county road from their home onto our property..
I will keep reading any posts on here but will take advise and not post anymore until this is over...Thank you all again for your advice, support & prayers! Have a Happy New Year!


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

HappyYooper said:


> y return harassment on my part..the snow is plowed across a county road from their home onto our property..


That is against the law, you can't legally plow or plow across a county road.
The county road commission would be the one you contact on that.

They went gonzo on you with that PPO.
It really is a major thing, I would use any legal resource I had at my disposal.
I'm pretty sure you can take out a reverse PPO on them.
It was the Law when I dealt with it and I'm more then sure it is still viable.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

HappyYooper said:


> Our vet couldn't give an definite diagnosis while in the field. She called it colic. I have been in touch with the vets office and asked what the symptoms of antifreeze poisoning in a horse would look like. Her answer was; muscle twitching, looking, acting drunk, stiff legged walking, colic & convulsing. All of which Waldo was showing. Shortly before he died he was following me in the corral..he wanted to be close to me but I had to keep my distance because I was afraid he was going to fall onto me..all I wanted to do was put my arms around his neck and comfort him but it was too dangerous..after he went down and died I gave him my love...
> I do NOT agree with any return harassment on my part..the snow is plowed across a county road from their home onto our property..
> I will keep reading any posts on here but will take advise and not post anymore until this is over...Thank you all again for your advice, support & prayers! Have a Happy New Year!


Interestingly enough, those are also the symptoms of severe colic and colic is also a diagnosis. 

I'm not sure how much you have shared publicly but if it is found you accused someone of something as severe as killing livestock/animal cruelty without solid proof, you are in a strong position to be sued so it might be a good idea to see if you can have the carcass tested as soon as possible.


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

Today is the day....court hearing at 1:00.


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

Good luck!


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I know you're there now but I said a prayer for all to go well for you.


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## myheaven (Apr 14, 2006)

How did it go?


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I am PPO FREE!!!! 
The Judge had each plaintiff stand and give their testimony...
Then he had my lawyer ask the plaintiff's questions...
He called me to the stand for my answers to the plaintiff's testimony..
My lawyer asked me a few questions then the Judge made his decision.
In a nutshell he told us to behave & get along with each other. He found there was no threat against them...I will be able to hunt  
An interesting point I made to my lawyer, which we didn't bring up in court,
is that as soon as the plaintiff's were notified I hired a lawyer to represent me there hasn't been any calls to Animal Control, no cords unplugged, no ground/hot wires removed....it has been very quiet!
I slept like a baby last night and it felt so good to wake up without the thought of up coming court :sing: 
Thank you everyone for your support & prayers!
However, I will keep my trail camera set up....just in case.


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## COWS (Dec 23, 2012)

Well that raises my opinion of the legal system. I have been following this but haven't posted because I have had nothing to add system thankfully I have had no experience with most of these problems due to having generally excellent neighbors who don't live close. Had a few problems with vandalism which went away, probably kids. Had a few problems with theft which ended so far after i tracked stolen scrap to junk yard and called the cops, then called the magistrate and asked to be advised as to when the case came up and let her know I would be there to press charges. Case was resolved.

This being in SC i have had no experience with snow being piled on my property. I'm having trouble imagining the neighbor's thought processes on that. 

Any way, best wishes for the future.

COWS


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## HappyYooper (Jan 26, 2005)

I am so excited I can hardly contain myself!! We close on our new property
And cabin on the 23rd of this month!! We will put the acre we own on this road & once its sold we will no longer have any connections to this road...since the court hearing there hasn't been any visits from animal control & Miss Bess's fence has stayed plugged in!


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