# what would you suggest ?



## Miz Mary (Feb 15, 2003)

I'm a woman, I want something for target practice, small varmits ( '*****, possums ) ..... Dont know enough about guns !! Which would be better , 

BB gun 

Pellet gun 

air rifle 

.22 

????????????????


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## Pops2 (Jan 27, 2003)

Depends on where you want to practice & what the laws are there. If you want to be able to shoot in your backyard & your backyard is forty acres in the country, then go with the 22. If its in town and not illegal look at one of the air guns.


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## Slongest (Oct 8, 2012)

agreed 22. unless for some reason you cant shoot that. good luck finding ammo for that right now hopefully you have better luck where you are.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

I would go with the 22 rifle , you asked about **** and opossum they are usually more than most air rifles can handle 

most any where it is not legal to shoot with a 22 it is not legal to use an air rifle either 

as for specific models of guns 
a savage MKII rifle is a very good gun and reasonably priced http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/MARKIIF

the other gun worth of notice is the Marlin 795 http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firearms/selfloading/795.asp

the savage is a bolt action , accurate , easy to use and care for 

the 795 is semi auto , still fairly accurate . but a bit more particular about ammo used 

the bolt will take almost any ammo and be more accurate than an auto , autos are more particular about ammo to feed and eject 

both benefit from a sight upgrade either Tech Sights or a scope but are ok with factory provided sights

both make very good LTR's Liberty Training Rifles 

you should take your states hunters education course if you have not already then take your new gun to an Apple seed shoot  http://www.appleseedinfo.org/


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Rural, ruger 10/22 or any .22 long rifle for pests.
Confined area (i.e. sensitive neighbors) Pellet gun in .177. Just got these for our boys; Crosman Fury, 1200 feet per second, 3/8 OSB, 2" of drywall scraps, and 2 groundhogs didn't stand a chance, and the neighbors didn't complain.
Heck, I have fun with them for target practice.
$68 to $98 at walmart with a decent 4x scoe included.










Matt


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## arnie (Apr 26, 2012)

i'll agree with the 22 LR for varmits and target practice and also the need to be carefull get some training or take a corse in gun safety . air rifles are good because they are quiet and cheep to shoot . there are also many merits to the shotgun though louder and more exprncive o shoot they do have much more knock down power and have a large choice in shot size to be used on differint game .


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## arnie (Apr 26, 2012)

a 22 rifle is hard to beat ;and pretty good advice from all . i'd like o chime in with a vote for the 410 shot gun .though louder and more expencive to shoot your knock down power go's up greatly and with a wide choice of shot size it becomes more versatile as a homestead varmit gun .


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## wogglebug (May 22, 2004)

Run a search, and look at Colonel Jeff Cooper's original laws of gun safety. (He used the term "gun" as a recognised shorthand term for the proper "firearm"). Their big strength over other ways of stating firearm safety rules is that you'd have to break _*two*_ of them at once before an accidental or negligent discharge would hurt someone.

Briefly:


The gun is *always* loaded.
Never let the muzzle of the gun cover anything you are not prepared to have destroyed.
Never allow anything inside the trigger guard until you are ready to fire.
Always identify your target, what is beyond it, and what surrounds it.
Absorb those safety rules until they are as automatic as breathing.


Ask around about, and then *attend, an introductory* shooter's or hunter's or firearm safety *course*. Doesn't matter what it's called, but it will cover safety aspects, and get you shooting safely under knowledgeable supervision. Some of them provide firearms for you to practice on, so you can have some experience before you buy. Find out in advance if the course you're considering does this.


For practice, the single-shot break-action air-rifles Roadking showed are good, cheap to use, and the price is just about impossible to beat. If you can find them at that, I'd jump on it before it goes away. Single shot teaches you best practice while learning as well - you shoot, then look at the result, and think about both shot and result, and how to produce a better result. People who learn on self-loading ("semi-auto") .22's typically learn bad habits - they just blaze away until they get a result rather than making the first shot count. 

If you've got a shed or barn, you could set up an indoors shooting range for an air rifle. Then you can practice anytime, in any weather, whenever you have five or ten minutes spare, without having to travel to a range.
http://blogostuff.blogspot.com.au/2013/01/super-cheap-silent-pellet-trap.html is a link to how to make a cheap good pellet trap for an indoor range.

Air rifles (pellet - not those el cheapo toy BB guns) are also good on small game up to about thirty yards.

A .22 rifle is a better, more versatile weapon for shooting animals - the air rifle is somewhat underpowered. However, you can use the air rifle to get started, that price can't be beaten, and you can wait and shop around until you can get a .22 at a good price - shop yard sales and garage sales, watch pawn shops and department stores, learn the market and the prices. With second-hand firearms, avoid rust. Inside the barrel repair is too costly to even contemplate, but anywhere is an indication that the firearm may not have been cared for. The traditional learner's firearm (as opposed to air arm) is a single-shot bolt-action .22, and it may be all you'll ever need. .22LR ammunition (LR for long rifle, but used in pistols as well these last eighty or ninety or so years) is certainly a big step up from the air rifle, good for raccoons and foxes and even coyotes. You can decide whether and what repeating firearm you want with the benefit of experience. You may actually stumble across something before you find a suitable single-shot - if so, grab it. Anything under $50 with barrel in good condition is a deal verging on steal. Removable magazines can be expensive to replace if lost, though.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

we and most civilian firearms instructors are using TABK

T treat every gun as if it was loaded 
A always keep your your muzzle in a safe direction 
B be sure of your target and what is beyond 
K keep your finger out of the trigger guard 


same rules easier way to remember them for many they all have longer explained understanding and reasons but this is what we drill on so they can repeat it and understand it and remember it and live it. 

lots of courses around most places , take one the people you meet can help you in many ways and introduce you to the local shooting community and it's many resources.

we are happy to answer questions here but there is only so much we can say in the short posts we can write here , if a picture is worth a thousand words , proper instruction and demonstrations are worth millions.


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## wildcat6 (Apr 5, 2011)

You could get both. BB Guns are very inexpensive and is a very cheap alternative for practice on safety, sight picture etc...


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## wogglebug (May 22, 2004)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> we and most civilian firearms instructors are using TABK
> 
> T treat every gun as if it was loaded
> A always keep your your muzzle in a safe direction
> ...


TABK, huh? That's useful. Neat, makes it easy. 

I learnt before that was formulated, I guess. Before Jeff Cooper publicised his rules, too, which I'd guess were re-formulated to become TABK. 
When I learnt the "K" element was left to commonsense. I learnt safety, and I learnt safely, but I was never drilled on that one. I took the four rules on when I heard them because of the aspect of needing two strikes to be out - i.e. breaking half of the rules was more than I thought most anyone with a whisker of commonsense would do if they'd been drilled in them.


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## Miz Mary (Feb 15, 2003)

wow !! You guys ROCK !! I have learned alot ! Thank you SO much ! I have a place to start now , doing more research and learning !


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

AR-27 (I think is 27 - might be 47). Is a .22 semi automatic rifle with a clip (get extra clips for it too. Clips hold 8 rounds each.). Box of 500 rounds of hollow point ammo was $10.00 at WalMarts.

Rifle is extremely light weight with no kickback. Everything comes apart and fits in slots in the stock.

Extremely accurate if the sight is adjusted right for you. Can hit a 1 gallon milk jug easily at 300 yards. Can fire as fast as you can pull the trigger.


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

I am a woman and I would only want to use a "shotgun" with pellets as I'm not a real good shot; and the pellets would spread so I would be more likely to hit the target, i.e. snake, ****, etc.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

22-23 years ado it was just TAB when i took hunters safety , but K was added since even though it was always taught to keep your finger out , it reaffirmed the need for people to remember it.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I am a woman and I would only want to use a "shotgun" with pellets as I'm not a real good shot; and the pellets would spread so I would be more likely to hit the target, i.e. snake, ****, etc.


Shotguns have more recoil, and a shorter EFFECTIVE range than rifles.
You can LEARN to be a "good shot" with a little practice


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

let's get past the myth , shotguns at 7 yards =21 feet , the FBI's justifiable shoot distance have a spread of inches not feet 

only in Hollywood do shotguns have an 18 inch pattern at 8 feet

in real life around 90% of the shot is still in or with the shot cup at 8 feet 

every one should pattern their shotgun at real in you house distances 

why is a shot gun so effective , be it shot #6 , #7, #8 or a buck shot #4 #3 #2 #1 0, 00, 000, 0000 because it carries approximately a 440 gr or 1oz payload at around 1200 fps this is huge buffalo gun huge the 45-70 with 405gr bullet was used to take many a buffalo the difference is as a solid 45 cal projectile it has the penetration to go thru most new houses end to end , and while at close distance the shot being so close that it carries the sum if each pellets individual mass it breaks up as it gets farther or hits something reducing it to a lot of smaller lighter projectiles 


here is a site that gets into penetration and spread http://www.shootingillustrated.com/index.php/20447/buckshot-basics/


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## gimpyrancher (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm 60+ and just bought my first decent .22 Air Rifle. I have a collection of center fire but don't go out and shoot them much. Even at dear hunting time, it's usually 3 rounds before I go. Often, it's no shots during the season. So I needed something to refresh my skills.

Good for practice and great for small game. The fact that it's a single shot makes each shot viewed as a challenge of accuracy.

But that may just be me.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

as a teaching tool , an air rifle is an excellent tool , for small game up to the size of a rabbit they are good at close ranges 50 feet or less 

I have and we use daisy 853 rifles in our youth program , an indoor range in your garage or basement is one of the best things you can do for your shooting

for a back stop a piece of sheet metal we use old de-comitioned road signs with a piece of plywood behind it then 2 2x4 screws to the metal and plywood so that it creates a cavity the depth of the 2x4 on edge then staple some heavy card board to the 2x4 as a front then staple targets to the card board , remember to wear safety glasses and enjoy 
this is fine for target speed guns like the daisy 853 but higher powered guns may need thicker metal or a box with rubber mulch in it , also use wad gutter pellets they don't dent the metal like pointed pellets.

my of hand shooting was good enough for some hunting but was nothing to write home about , after a half a box 600 or so pellets on the indoor range , i can take my success to the outdoor range , I an not ready for any competitions but tin cans at 75 yards best watch out. and if you can hit the standard cambels soup can at 75 off hand regularity any rabbit you can see hasn't got much of a chance


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## gimpyrancher (Jun 6, 2010)

Just want to share that my Benjamin .22 air rifle puts out a pellet at a maximum of 1100 fps. That is faster than most rim fire. Trust me, it's good at well over 50 feet. It's not intended to be used indoors unless it's a full fledged range. It's scope is extreme overkill for just 50 feet. However, at 62, it's also too heavy for offhand shooting.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

the benjerman and Sheridan and gamo and other air rifles like them have definitively changed the game for hunting with an air rifle 

and they may be good for farther than 50 feet , but not 3-4 times farther 

22 cal pellets weigh in at 15.5 gr while 22lr weigh in at 40 gr and most bulk ammo is high velocity clocking in at 1280fps at the muzzle , with 3 1/2 time the energy and more than double the weight it makes rolling a wood chuck at 75 yards 150 feet possible
a 15.5gr pellet at 1100fps has an energy of 41 foot pounds , while a 40gr bullet at 1280fps brings 146 foot pounds of energy so that when it has slowed down to 1000fps at 100 yards it is still bringing 89 foot pounds of energy to the target , that is the penetration needed to take down a **** , wood chuck , or possum 

that doesn't even get into the mini mags and stingers available for the 22lr 36gr at 1600fps 205 foot pounds of energy.

22cal air rifle good , for small thin skinned animals close , but 22lr is a better choice for larger thicker skinned vermin at greater distances , also the 9-10 pumps needed for max velocity from a air rifle makes for some slow reloading , where a repeating 22lr is fast.
the other draw back to air rifles is the seals , if they dry out while the gun sits in the closet for a few years , you need to rebuild it , 22lr you pull it out of the closet after a decade of sitting check for barrel obstructions wipe it down with an oil rag , load up your decade old ammo and it goes bang right away.


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