# GED vs HS Diploma



## LettucePatch

MY DD is going to be a freshman in HS this year. She has been homeschooled for both 7th and 8th grade. The local HS said that they will not accept any homeschool credits if she decides to attend there as a Sophomore, Junior or Senior. In other words, she cannot recieve a diploma from the HS, she must get a GED from the state. 

We are trying to determine if the HS diploma matters to get into college. She wants to go to a 4 year college and get a vet or ag degree.

How easy is it for a homeschooler to get into a 4 year university with a GED?


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## Ed Mashburn

Lettuce Patch- Good afternoon. A lot of folks- not just homeschoolers but also foreign exchange students- face this same situation. If I were you and your DD and in your situation, here's what I would do:
1. Have your child attend and complete the classes at the public high school. She needs to make the best grades she can- this is important. Credits and high grades on a high school transcript are crucial.
2. As soon as she can- this varies from state to state- have her take the GED exam and pass it. This will get her accepted into MOST colleges- but not all.
3. When she has completed her high school, she should apply to whatever college she wants to apply to and make sure her high school transcript with the high grades is sent to the college registrars and acceptance committees. This can help keep her from having to take a bunch of non-credit remedial classes to cover whatever classes she missed during homeschooling.

Don't overlook junior/community colleges- their acceptance policies tend to be more liberal and flexible than some major colleges- and then she can transfer to a larger four year school after she has proven she can do well on college level work at the JC.

I hope this helps- good luck to her and you- college tuition is expensive- we put three through. Ed Mashburn


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## ErinP

Many colleges (most?) are accepting homeschool transcripts in place of a GED these days...


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## cindy-e

If you are legally homeschooling in your state, you don't have to do either of those things. you can, as her teaching parent, issue her high school diploma yourself. I don't know why high schools are more selective than colleges about these things, but they are! Even ivy league and top tier universities have no trouble accepting these under the following conditions: 
1) Use testing or dual enrollment to prove the level of work that you do at home. If you go the dual enrollment route, you may not be required to do the things suggested below, but there will be some highly competitive colleges that your child may not be able to get into. If she is not interested in a highly selective college that is not a problem for her. so it really depends on the child. If you do not use the dual enrollment option, be prepared for your child to use the SAT subject tests, CLEPs, or the AP testing option as evidence that they actually did the work that you say they did on your transcript (which you make for them yourself). 
2) Work hard to score well on the SAT and/or the ACT. 
3) Keep very good records including a transcript, course descriptions, book and textbook lists, and a page explaining the philosophy of education that you employ. 
4) Have a strategy for using an outside teacher for 2 to 4 high school classes so that the child can have academic letters of recommendation from teachers (besides you) verifying the ability of the child to handle college level scholarship. 
5) Keep a list of the admissions requirements (and scholarship requirements if applicable) of the colleges she is most interested in. Include all deadlines in your list. Meet the deadlines. 

That is how it works for selective colleges. In many cases, selective colleges (which are now using need blind admission) are less expensive than public universities if you can get in. Using these strategies, my kids are actively recruited by very good colleges all the time, and in fact, are eligible for very, very good scholarships at most of them. No GED, nor public school diploma is required. 

FWIW,
Cindyc.


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## Ohio dreamer

My son is heading into 9th grade this year, so I looked at the colleges and universities he's most likely to attend to see what they wanted from homeschoolers. The only thing different for homeschoolers over kids that attended a school is the college would like to see a portfolio of work the student did in high school. Make since to me, since homeschoolers don't have to follow "normal" guideline on what constitutes high school work. So I will keep all math & science finals, reading lists and a sample of writing for each year of high school. Then the college/university can give it a glance over. Glad I looked ahead of time.....I'm not too good about keeping "old papers".

I would avoid the GED at all costs. The only thing it tell people is that homeschooling isn't good enough. Homeschool graduates are not the same as high school drop outs.


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## vicki in NW OH

With my son, it was his ACT score that mattered. Really wasn't asked for anything else. He went to the Josephinum, the only pontifical college outside of Rome. The academics are very rigorous in logic, philosophy, theology, etc. I would find out what the colleges or universities require that your child is considering and go by their requirements.


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## Danaus29

Our experience (Columbus State) was that it didn't matter what they had, it was the entrance exam score that made a difference. 

Now if you want scholarship help the ACT is practically essential but additional to what ever certificate of completion the student has.


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## catspjamas

LettucePatch said:


> MY DD is going to be a freshman in HS this year. She has been homeschooled for both 7th and 8th grade. The local HS said that they will not accept any homeschool credits if she decides to attend there as a Sophomore, Junior or Senior. In other words, she cannot recieve a diploma from the HS, she must get a GED from the state.
> 
> We are trying to determine if the HS diploma matters to get into college. She wants to go to a 4 year college and get a vet or ag degree.
> 
> How easy is it for a homeschooler to get into a 4 year university with a GED?


Does she want to go the the high school, or are you thinking a HS diploma will get her into college more so than a home-school diploma? My niece and nephew both got into 4 year colleges having only been homeschooled since elementary grade. Niece got into a state university, nephew got into a private small college, with a basketball scholarship. Your daughter can't get a vet degree at a four year college, that's obtained after getting a bachelor's degree, and that may not be totally necessary. The NCSU School of Veterinary Medicine will accept students without a bachelor's, as long as the student has obtained all the required credits the vet school requires. Contact the universities that offer the programs she wants to be in, and ask them what their requirements are for entrance. If there's a community college in your area, check if they have classes that HS homeschoolers can attend, or do online. My niece and nephew did that to pick up some of the higher math and science classes. A home-school diploma is far better than a GED, especially if some of the classes were taken at the community college.


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## Laura Zone 5

My son applied at 30 different colleges.
Only 1 'wanted a GED'.

Unless things have drastically changed, the military immediately puts a "GED" person to the bottom of the list (grut status) when they enlist, no matter what his 
'asfab' scores are.
So we did NOT get GED's for the kids.

I kept very detailed records and those were enough not only for every other college he applied, but also good enough to register him for the NCAA.

My oldest daughter and youngest daughter are both enrolled in our local community college. 
My son goes to a private college in IA.

ALL three kids took the SAT and ACT (3) times.
THOSE scores, are really what the colleges looked at.
I highly recommend the PSAT for freshmen and sophomore's because there is a chance to earn HUGE scholarship dollars.


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## Karen

Here's a good short article on GED vs diploma: http://homeschoolcollegecounselor.com/academics/should-a-homeschooler-take-the-ged/

With regards to your high school, join HSLDA (Homeschool Legal Defense Association) ($8 a month and worth every penny). They will help, give you advice on how to handle it and, defend if necessary your child's right for credit and admission to public school.


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## offthegrid

Ed Mashburn said:


> If I were you and your DD and in your situation, here's what I would do:
> 
> 1. Have your child attend and complete the classes at the public high school. She needs to make the best grades she can- this is important. Credits and high grades on a high school transcript are crucial.


But if you are homeschooling, this is not an option...(?) 

(Or, at least not in NY. You are either in school, or you're on your own.)

My understanding from our friends who have kids applying for colleges is that many more schools are open to homeschoolers - whether or not they have a GED. Talk to the schools that you might consider and see what they would require...


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## cindy-e

offthegrid said:


> But if you are homeschooling, this is not an option...(?)
> 
> (Or, at least not in NY. You are either in school, or you're on your own.)
> 
> My understanding from our friends who have kids applying for colleges is that many more schools are open to homeschoolers - whether or not they have a GED. Talk to the schools that you might consider and see what they would require...


schools prefer a well-made homeschool transcript to a GED. And in my state, it is perfectly legal to take classes and do extra-curricular activities at the public school, or even to be enrolled only on a part time basis. It all just depends on where you live. =0)


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## offthegrid

cindy-e said:


> And in my state, it is perfectly legal to take classes and do extra-curricular activities at the public school, or even to be enrolled only on a part time basis. It all just depends on where you live. =0)


You are lucky. In our state most schools won't even let kids participate in extra-curricular activities or sports, even though each district could allow it. But there is no way schools can let homeschooled students take classes. That would be ideal for so many people!

Years ago my district made a big change in math programs and a teacher told a homeschooling friend that they were going to get rid of all the old textbooks. The mom called the district and the school wouldn't give her one - they threw them away instead. :smack:


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## cindy-e

offthegrid said:


> You are lucky. In our state most schools won't even let kids participate in extra-curricular activities or sports, even though each district could allow it. But there is no way schools can let homeschooled students take classes. That would be ideal for so many people!
> 
> Years ago my district made a big change in math programs and a teacher told a homeschooling friend that they were going to get rid of all the old textbooks. The mom called the district and the school wouldn't give her one - they threw them away instead. :smack:


Wow. that's really sad. I came from a state like that before we moved here, though I understand that it is changing and more cooperation is allowed now than used to be. But here, because of the fractious relationship that homeschool and public school has had for a very long time, there are a lot of homeschoolers (Believe it or not) who won't use the public school resources that are available to them (and for which they pay taxes). They don't trust the schools. IDK what they think the schools are going to do exactly. Indoctrination maybe. Or discrimination. ??? Anyway, my kids have done sports at the local school, been on math competition teams at the local school. Next year dd will be on the local robotics team. We have taken AP tests administered by the school. For me, it's a win-win. We might do orchestra through the school next year. The old district didn't have strings, but this one does. Free music instruction! 

FWIW,
Cindyc.


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## Awnry Abe

My DD and I will be looking at the various colleges in our state to see what the requirements are for entry. I will also check out the Homeschool Legal Defense Association. 

I recently found a large homeschool group in my area (30 miles away) that has lots of teenagers, the groups that are close by only have elementary school age. I will be talking to the leaders in that group as well to see if I can glean some advice for the local universities.

Thank you all so much for the encouragement. I did not realize that you can make a home school diploma for your child.

Oops, my DH was logged in on my computer and so I accidentally posted as him. 
LettucePatch


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## Laura Zone 5

Let me know if this attachment works!


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## LettucePatch

Yes, it worked! Thanks for the diploma document. Is this what you are using for your kids?


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## Laura Zone 5

I used it for my oldest, for decoration purposes.....but I have never had one college ask for it.
When I say (between 3 kids) we have put in over 50 college aps, I am not exaggerating. 
Not one, asked to see the diploma.
ALL OF THEM wanted copies of the ACT / SAT scores.


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## ErinP

I don't know about everyone else, but even as a public schooler, not one college wanted to see _my_ diploma, either. 
Transcripts, those were the important thing.


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## KeepingItAtHome

What my husband and sister did, and what we plan to do for our kids thinking about college, is enter the local community college at 16-17 for some basic classes. Ours offers classes like carpentry, astronomy, auto repair, sewing etc... Once you're in college you can transfer just about anywhere with those credits and your highschool diploma and transcripts are moot.


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## halfpint

What Cindy-e said is great. 
My oldest son's University took our transcripts with no questions and knew we home educated. The college my 2nd son went to didn't care much about our transcript as he was dual enrolled - they wanted the transcript from that college and his ACT score, although we sent them a high school transcript anyway.
Most of the schools look more for the ACT or SAT scores. 

Also, before you take CLEP or AP, make sure that the college you plan to attend accepts them. The college my 3rd is planning to attend does not accept CLEP but will accept most AP credits.

Dawn


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## cindy-e

halfpint said:


> What Cindy-e said is great.
> My oldest son's University took our transcripts with no questions and knew we home educated. The college my 2nd son went to didn't care much about our transcript as he was dual enrolled - they wanted the transcript from that college and his ACT score, although we sent them a high school transcript anyway.
> Most of the schools look more for the ACT or SAT scores.
> 
> Also, before you take CLEP or AP, make sure that the college you plan to attend accepts them. The college my 3rd is planning to attend does not accept CLEP but will accept most AP credits.
> 
> Dawn


 This is really kind of maddening, Dawn, but some top colleges do not take AP for credit, but they still require them for admissions to their school. Most of the ivy league and 2nd tier schools are like that. Also some ranked tech schools, like U Chicago or RICE. The rule of thumb is: If the admissions process is competitive at the school, do AP, even if they do not count it for credit b/c it is a way of setting yourself apart from the rest of the applicant pool. I think it was Grinnell who said that their average student (just to get in) has 4 AP classes on record. (People put up with the stupidity of doing AP without getting the credit b/c these are schools with huge endowments and research grants, so if you get in, you pretty much go for free. It ends up being cheaper than cutting a few classes via CLEP or AP. I still think it is dumb, and wouldn't even know or care except one of my daughters has decided to try for one of those 2nd tier schools. Sigh... It's a lot more work for her, but who am I to say no if she wants to go for it?) 

Also, be aware that in 2012, the Doe ruling changed, and legally you have to provide a transcript if you are going to apply for federal financial aid... even if you do dual enrollment, b/c that usually doesn't cover the first two years of high school. They haven't started enforcing that rule yet, but it is a rule on the books, so always have a transcript just in case. You wouldn't want to get caught unawares if the year your kid goes to school is the year that somebody decides to pay attention to that law. 

Anway, FWIW,
Cindyc.


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## Breezy833

Around here it at a local community college it doesn't matter for the GED or diploma, and for the record nobody has ever asked me for mine either. If your child does a community college to take care of the general ed classes, it wont matter when its time for her to go to a major university. They will take the transcripts that she has from the college.


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## Lizza

cindy-e said:


> schools prefer a well-made homeschool transcript to a GED. And in my state, it is perfectly legal to take classes and do extra-curricular activities at the public school, or even to be enrolled only on a part time basis. It all just depends on where you live. =0)


What Cindy said. 

Here is a link to how to write a basic transcript: 
http://donnayoung.org/forms/planners/hs-transcript.htm

This is from HSLDA on applying for FAFSA:
http://www.hslda.org/docs/news/201011020.asp

My oldest went to "early college" and then transferred to the University. My second daughter I am graduating from homeschool.


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## Lizza

cindy-e said:


> Also, be aware that in 2012, the Doe ruling changed, and legally you have to provide a transcript if you are going to apply for federal financial aid... even if you do dual enrollment, b/c that usually doesn't cover the first two years of high school. They haven't started enforcing that rule yet, but it is a rule on the books, so always have a transcript just in case. You wouldn't want to get caught unawares if the year your kid goes to school is the year that somebody decides to pay attention to that law. Anway, FWIW, Cindyc.


Great information Cindy! 

For clarity, for those that do "early college", they will not need a home transcript because one term of math at college equals an entire year of high school math. So it is very easy to acquire 4 years of high school in less then 2 years at a community college. 

This does not count for those doing only a few dual enrolled classes because like Cindy said you will still need all your homeschool transcripts because you won't have enough credits for a high school diploma through the college (or rather your sponsoring high school). 

That said, like Cindy already said, better to have all your transcripts ready then be caught unaware.


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## KentuckyDreamer

Danaus29 said:


> Our experience (Columbus State) was that it didn't matter what they had, it was the entrance exam score that made a difference.
> 
> Now if you want scholarship help the ACT is practically essential but additional to what ever certificate of completion the student has.



My middle son ( now 23 ) enrolled in the Columbus State K - 12 initiative at age 15. At that time it was self pay but I understand things may have changed. My rule was he could take as many electives as he wanted so long as he had two core classes per quarter. As you know, those credits counted towards his associates degree. That degree was transferable to Ohio State.

We had homeschooling friends chose the same method in an effort to get as many core classes for tuition much lower than the University. 

I now have an eight year old and am so excited to see all the opportunities available to us.

Terri


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## jamala

My son is a senior in high school, we homeschool. He will also graduate from a jr. college in August after graduating high school in May. They only wanted a transcript and I have had all the universities that my kids are interested in attending tell me that the transcript and ACT are all they need. He will get a high school diploma issued by me for decoration and job applications at our homeschool groups graduation ceremony. I have a high school diploma from a local public school and 2 college degrees and I have never been asked to see my diploma.


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## chamoisee

Getting into veterinary school is essentially getting into medical school, only harder. She will need advanced math, physics, and chemistry. Three years worth of chem, at least one of physcis, and math through calculus and statistics are the requirements for a TWO year Associates in science in northern Idaho. I don't know what it would take for a bachelors....but the point I am making is that she is going to have a REALLY hard time jumping straight from homeschool to getting a 4 year science degree, unless she has done some serious work in chemistry, math, and biology, including labs. When you go to college, they assume that you've already had a couple of years of these classes, with labs, and if you haven't, then you have to pay out the nose to take classes that all your peers took two years ago for free. 

I would talk to someone else at the school, see if you can get high school credits for her freshman's year work if you have records and documentation of the work she did. Ask to speak to the school counselor.


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## chamoisee

I mean, can you get into college without a HS diploma or a GED, yes, sure...but when you are on a track for med school, which is what veterinary school is, you are up against STIFF competition, people who have been preparing and competing for this during their four years of high school, and possibly before then, too. It would be advantageous for your daughter to have the deck stacked in her favor, as much as possible. If that means redoing her freshman year and getting a 4.0 in it and each subsequent year, IMHO it will be well worth it and save her a lot of money, particularly if it sets her up to get scholarships.


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## ET1 SS

When we returned stateside from my last tour overseas, our eldest was 16 and finishing his 9th grade curriculum. He had homeschooled him from the 2nd grade.

I was not very confident in the quality of the curriculum, as it seemed to be easy for him. I decided to take him to a local community college and have him sit the entrance exam. As I explained to the counselor, I wanted an idea of what areas he needed polishing. The college accepted him that day.

They needed us to print out a 'diploma' just so they could have something on file.

As the college counselor explained it to me, any student who masters the 9th grade curriculum is ready for college. The 10th, 11th and 12th grades are simply a waste of three years. Most high school grads enter college by taking remedial courses anyway.

After 2 years of college, that son entered the US Army. They did not blink at his diploma.

No body cares. Or, if they do care, homeschooling is preferred.


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## backwoods

ET1 SS said:


> When we returned stateside from my last tour overseas, our eldest was 16 and finishing his 9th grade curriculum. He had homeschooled him from the 2nd grade.
> 
> *I was not very confident in the quality of the curriculum, as it seemed to be easy for him*. I decided to take him to a local community college and have him sit the entrance exam. As I explained to the counselor, I wanted an idea of what areas he needed polishing. The college accepted him that day.
> 
> They needed us to print out a 'diploma' just so they could have something on file.
> 
> As the college counselor explained it to me, any student who masters the 9th grade curriculum is ready for college. The 10th, 11th and 12th grades are simply a waste of three years. Most high school grads enter college by taking remedial courses anyway.
> 
> After 2 years of college, that son entered the US Army. They did not blink at his diploma.
> 
> No body cares. Or, if they do care, homeschooling is preferred.


Just curious as to what curriculum it was?


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## ET1 SS

backwoods said:


> Just curious as to what curriculum it was?


CLE: Christian Light Education

There are two Anabaptist [Amish / Mennonite] curriculum published: 'Rod and Staff' and 'Christian Light'.

http://www.anabaptists.org/bookstore.html

My Dw also went through their 'Teachers' course and became a 'certified teacher'. When we began homeschooling in 1991, we did not know anyone else homeschooling. Since my career required a lot of transfers, we were concerned about the legal requirements for homeschooling in different states / nations. By being certified, we assumed that it would grease the wheels a bit in our travels. [It did] 

We bought each grade-level as a separate boxed set, they ran between $100 and $150 per grade-level.

We used each grade-level over and over for each successive child [including our foster-children when the public-funded school system failed them].

After our last child graduated, sprouted his wings and left, we sold all of our boxed sets. I think we got $75/each for them.

Our experience showed us that homeschooling was / is far superior to public-funded education, and it was really not an expensive process.


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