# double rifles,africa and gunsmithing



## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

anyone ever built a double rifle? i got a book about how to build one from a side by side shotgun action.it takes you through the whole process but it is a bit techincal to me.....duh....over my head a bit...lol.i would like to have a double in 450 nitro or something like that.maybe a 45-70 govt sxs???have any of you hunted in africa?if so waht caliber did you tote?did you have a double rifle or bolt action? any gunsmithing advice would be nice to hear.its jsut something i am bounceing around in my brain today.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php

Maybe you can ask that on these sites. Lots of knowledgeable people on each one


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Anybody been to Africa ?, hunting animals I mean.
That would be intresting.

If I was going to Africa, I guess I would ask "them", who ever booked the trip, what and how many of what to bring. They do it for a living
If I was going, I should be able to afford it once.
Don't know if I would fool around with "making" something like a double rifle, at least that big.

Thanks for the sites;
Getting back into re-loading, so doing some research.


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## moonwolf (Sep 20, 2004)

waya back when I was a kid, my uncle was a fantastic gunsmith and had a fabulous gun collection. I remember one double barreled rifle he dubbed an 'elephant gun', which I know little about, was about the biggest beast I ever saw. I believe it was a 600 nitro bullets. BIG! I'm sure it would knock down anything that would charge at it, but I'm not into killing African big game, so I really can't say much exept recalling now that big heavy gun. oy, I don't know how anyone could carry such a weapon very far for very long in the African bush. Not me, anyway. lol.


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

hunter63 ....i got a buddy that was a gude in alaska for 10 years.he has been going multiple times a year to africa for a good bit now.he envited me to go this fall.not sure i will go....but you never know.the double rifle question is just somehting of interest fo me.i seen several double rifles built on sxs shotgun actions.the reason i wanted to build one was just for fun and to have something personal in that department.

thanks for the links......a nice double rifle is in the $10,000 dollar department for something like 470 nitro......i can do alot of homestead projects for than.

but i have a nice action for a double rifle that would be fun to have the barrels built for.it has single trigger that you can select either barrel and has cocking indicators on top of the tang where the safety is.


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Elk, I hear ya, no disrespect intended, seems like a cool project, would be interesting no doubt. I did check out the links for that reason, but didn't see anthing, so far.
But like I said, would trust the guide( if I were going) to steer me in the right direction.
It's gotta be a gas firing a big cal, sorta like "who gets up first, you or what you shot at."

Actually, I am surprised that there aren't many dbl on muzzle loaders, with all the work on in-lines, higher velocities, sabots, breach loading, etc, you think someone would think of the "second shot".

Have seen dbl rifles, both sxs and swivel breach, but only in .50/.54 cal.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

I've looked into it. The hardest part is regulation. What method does your book recommend? I think easiest would be eccentric muzzles with collars. 

I always thought I needed three of them. I need a 30-30, 357 Maxi, and 45-70. Alright, toss in a 25-20 while we're building them. I don't want the old nitro calibers with brass that costs more than gold. 

If I was making a double muzzle odor, I would go with an over under swivel breech flinchlock 54. Now we're talking. That way you have a set of sights on each barrel for easy sighting in. Of course, you also have a set of sights waiting to lacerate your left hand, so be careful.


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

hunter63...no disrespect thought about.i just wanted to ask a question out loud and see what answers i got.thinking out loud is good for others thoguths on subjects.i also would like a muzzleloader in sxs,you see the sxs bigrockpile has on this sight.??i think i would love a sxs blackpowder.work up some slug loads that thing could be like a double rifle.also you ever hear of a paradox rifle made back in old days in england and germany.they were smooth bore sxs bu had rifleing in the last few inches of barrel.alot of people hunted africa with these guns.you could shoot birds and elephant with sam gun.i am not into hunting elephants...more just plains game..but if on charged i would have no problem in protecting myself.but i have no need to hunt a elephant.

ed....my double i have has a eccentric collar.if that is what you call it.you use a scrw driver to turn screw to regulate barrels.but all of the big calibers i have seen use a wedge system.so you spend alot of time soldering and redoing after shooting.i know it is a pain to do but not sure if a collar would hold up to high power.the rifle i have ...the biggest rifle/rifle barrel made for it is a 9.3 x 73r or 9.3x 74r.....something about the size of a .338.so dangerous game is out for that caliber.it has to be at least a .375 to hunt most dngerous game.you can hunt leopard with a .338 though.ed the 45/70 can be loaded the same as a .458win.that should stop about anything???....my buddy has the 450nitro but it costs something like $13 a shot for the thing.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

Yeah, I know those Germans don't mind soldering the barrels, test firing them, unsoldering, moving, soldering again, test firing... I'm not that good at soldering. That's why I like the collar. 

You might think about a big revolver caliber, 454 Casull, 500 etc. Or try a 375 Falnged Nitro Express, you can get brass that isn't too high priced. Maybe a 450 Marlin would work. 

Make sure you bush the firing pins.


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Was reading one of the gun forums about the action "stretching" when the loads were "hot rodded", can't find the site just now, but the subject was the H&R/NEF single shot in 45/70.
Was looking it up as I have one and was looking into re-loading it for the first time.
If your going to build one.I would imagine you would need a pretty hefty action for any of the "african" loads.
Will see if I can find the thread.


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## longshadowfarms (Nov 27, 2002)

Remington was supposed to be importing their Spartan Brand (Baikal Gun Works in Siberia) in a side by side which went up to 45-70 I do not know what happened to that.

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http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire_rifles/SPR_models/SPR22_specs.asp
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EAA makes barrel inserts for there side by side shotguns.

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http://www.eaacorp.com/parts-more-access-EAA-riflebarrel-inserts.html
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If you are serious I would look at the Valmet 412/512 O/U

Also most African countries recognise the 9.3 x 74 as equivalent ballistically to the .375 H and H. it is a very good all around medium cartridge like the .375 H and H.

RW


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

longshadow...that's the action i have...a 412...it is tops in my book.just need to get a set of barrels made/make or what ever for it.they made a 9.3x74 double rifle for the gun.but have not found a set yet.found a whole gun..but not a set of barrels.thanks


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## longshadowfarms (Nov 27, 2002)

They are now being produced under another name. I think you can find the info at http://doublegunhq.com. If you do not find it I will look it up. Valmet was sold to Tikka (a Sako Subsidiary) who in turn were purchased by Beretta.

They are now being produced as the FinnClassic.

RW


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## bgak47 (Sep 4, 2003)

Double rifles are certainly interesting & they are Highly collectible. So are the cartridges like the .600 Nitro. I can't afford the rifles, but I have two of the cartridges for my collection.


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