# The frames are falling apart on an active hive!?



## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Bees love old, black combs so I put some in 2 hives and set them out last spring.

A small swarm moved into one. GOOD! It is now a medium sized hive.

I just put my 2 hives to bed for the winter, so to speak. The inspection for the hive from the bought queen went like it was supposed to. I smoked, I looked, they are fine.

However, the hive from the swarm didn't glue the hive together, they CEMENTED it! After a couple of tries I popped the boxes apart. I got the inner cover off by prying: I popped the seams a little but I don't care, I have another. 

Did I mention they were OLD, black combs?!?! Those combs are cemented in so well I cannot get those out without breaking the frames, I heard the wood cracking when I tried, so I simply shut up the hive for the winter. I will have to deal with it next spring once the weather becomes reliable.

Will it work next spring if I give them new comb in the center, and move the brood comb (in large pieces) to one side? I have noticed the brood in a hive is only in the middle, so, if the new brood is laid there on new combs then the old brood can hatch out in what I have set aside and the now-empty pieces of old comb can be removed and replaced with something newer and stronger. If that makes sense.

Other than really cementing in the frames, this has been a fairly good hive so I am not interested in requeening with a bought queen: perhaps I will let them raise a daughter. They are gentle, healthy, and went from a small swarm in May to a medium sized hive in November. I did not try for honey this summer as I was too busy to put supers on, but, their behavior and health has been very good.


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## indypartridge (Oct 26, 2004)

Some bees tend to propolize more heavily than others. Looks like your swarm has this trait. If they're gentle and good producers, that may be acceptable to you.

I'll differ with you on the "old black combs". Nearly everything I've read in recent years has been that it is considered a good practice to cull those "old black combs" and replace with new foundation on a regular basis.

_One suggestion that I always make to beekeepers in the spring is to inspect their brood comb, both comb in active hives and comb that is being recycled from dead outs (hives in which the bees have died). Old brood comb can be a sump for disease. In addition, older brood comb, deformed comb, or comb with holes is not as effectively used for raising brood as fresher comb. Older brood comb may even be more likely for varroa to reproduce in than fresher comb. Old brood comb likely also soaks up pesticides that we use to control varroa and may affect drone and/or new queen viability, so culling old comb is definitely a good idea. When examining old comb in your hive this spring, plan to replace comb that is misshapen, contains lots of holes, or is extremely black, with frames of new foundation. Once the bees start bringing lots of nectar and drawing out new wax in the spring, they will draw out the new foundation very quickly. A good tip is to mark each frame with the year that new foundation is placed in it, then attempt to do a regular rotation of brood comb every four or five years at the maximum._
Phil Craft, Kentucky State Apiarist

_Old combs also have increased disease problems due to accumulations of microorganisms, such as fungi, bacteria, protozoa (Nosema apis Zander) and viruses._
http://www.apidologie.org/index.php...129&url=/articles/apido/pdf/2004/04/M4012.pdf


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## justgojumpit (May 5, 2003)

I agree that the black combs should be repaced. My method is to keep moving these frames away from the brood nest, and when they are filled with honey, I extract and then cull the frame. This way you are not throwing away any valuable resources that the bees could use. Please note that I do not use chemicals in my hives, so I do not have to worry about pesticides in my honey when I keep honey from a brood frame. Culling your older frames will also bring in a steady supply of wax... a much ignored product of the hive!

justgojumpit


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