# Ahh My Doe Ate Oleander!



## Kye022984 (Apr 23, 2010)

So my pregnant doe just ran by a stack of oleander my husband forgot to trash and snagged three or four of the leaves before I ran her off. Is this bad??? I gave her some baking soda but wasn't sure how much. Any ideas on what to do or what could happen???


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## Oat Bucket Farm (Jul 28, 2006)

I don't have any advice for you. I know Oleander is poison but I don't know how much or how little it takes to cause problems. You might dose her with activated charcoal if you think she got enough to hurt her.


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## Kye022984 (Apr 23, 2010)

Yeah see that's where I am unsure. She only grabbed about three or four leaves before I ran her off. I'm considering giving her some balled baking soda. But since she is pregnant I don't want to induce vomiting unless I have to.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

I would give a hefty dose of activated charcoal for sure...do you have any on hand?


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## Kye022984 (Apr 23, 2010)

No I only have some baking soda. So, what exactly is a "hefty" dose? She is a two year old oberhasli, pregnant and weighs about 150 pounds?


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

3 ml per 2.2 lbs of goat so you need 75 ml. You can't over dose on charcoal. I have read that it can be found at walmart in the fish supply section. I don't know anything about that, I have the tubes on hand. Time is critical...how is she acting now.


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## Kye022984 (Apr 23, 2010)

Minelson said:


> 3 ml per 2.2 lbs of goat so you need 75 ml. You can't over dose on charcoal. I have read that it can be found at walmart in the fish supply section. I don't know anything about that, I have the tubes on hand. Time is critical...how is she acting now.


She seems to be acting fine. She's eating her hay and approaching me for pets and everything. That's the thing, how long does it take for symptoms to kick in??? Its been two hours since she ate the leaves.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

I know that Tallbred lost a goat to Azealas which are part of the Oleander family. I would get your hands on some activated charcoal asap....I don't know how long before symptoms of distress would start showing.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

Here is an informative thread on poisoning...
http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/showthread.php?t=372085&highlight=activated+charcoal


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

*FROM *"Field First Aid For Goats (A Portable Guide To Health Care For Your Goat) 2007 _Alice Beberness and Carolyn Eddy_*

Eagle Creek Publishing Group
P.O. Box 755
Estacada, OR 97023

:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:
National Animal Poison Control Center:
1-900-680-0000...$20.00 for first 5 minutes, then $2.95/ea. minute after...charged to phone bill.
OR
1-800-548-2423 $30.00 per case (Visa MC,Discover or Am Ex)...includes follow up calls and consult with your Vet if desired.

Symptoms of Poisoning:Symptoms of poisoning can occur as soon as 2 hours and up to 14 hours after ingestion.

*Symptoms Include:*
Frothing at mouth
Vomiting
Staggering
Trembling
Crying for help

*TREATMENT:*
Treatments are varied but generally it's a good idea to give all of the recommended ingredients. In case of ingestion where you are present shortly after, the best course is to first induce vomiting by giving tablespoons tablespoons of salt on the back of tongue. After goat vomits give activated charcoal, 1/4 to 1/2 pound of powder to a 1/2 cup mineral oil, or Toxiban(tm) used per directions, and as much water as you can get into the goat. Use a drench syringe. Recommended up to three or four quarts if possible.

*Treatment One:*If your goat is not in distress, but has overeaten, instead of the above treatment give Pepto Bismol 2 tablespoons or 2 tablets, crushed,to coat their stomach, followed by 1/8 cup (for #100 lb goat) to 1/4 cup ( for #200 lb goat) of mineral oil or salad oil, along with some baking soda or Gas X (never Immodium never!) and observe carefully.

Be careful with mineral oil as it has no taste and can be inhaled quite easily, causing possible further complications of aspiration pneumonia. Mixing it with pepto Bismol (tm) will help prevent this. This will coat the stomach and move the feed through the gastrointestinal tract. This will give them diarrhea: so don't be alarmed the next day.

IF goat is already showing symptoms of toxins or poisoning and is vomiting, wait til he stops for a minute, then get the oil, Toxiban, or charcoal and Pepto Bismol into him. this goat is further along in the toxic process and will have to be monitored carefully. try to administer first aid, and get to the Vet as soon as possible. The use of Toxiban is indicated over activated charcoal because the charcoal is irritating to the rumen and may be vomited up more easily for up to an hour after first vomiting episode occurs. Toxiban is more effective than the vomiting in removing toxins.

After you have given him the Toxiban, oil,baking soda, and Pepto-Bismol, if necessary go one to treat with the Rhododendron Antidote. Combining treatments will NOT cause harm, but will give the best chance of making sure that you have covered all possible treatment options.

_*RHODODENDRON ANTIDOTE Treatment TWO* _

This antidote works for any andromedotoxin and can be used for first aid for any toxic plant, as it counteracts toxins and coats the stomach. The sooner you do this the more likely you will have a positive outcome.

This formula has been recommended by several vets and is worth carrying if you go into rhododedron country but it will help in the case of almost any plant toxin.

The best way to carry it is to mix all the dry ingredients in a plastic bag. When you need to use it, fill a 60 cc drench syringe with the powder, fill with water to 3/4 capacity and shake well and drench by pouring slowely into corner of the goats mouth. Carrying a large drench syringe in your first aid kit will make this easier. 

_Ingredients:_
2-3 tablespoons Epsom salts
1 teaspoon ground ginger
1teaspoon baking soda
1 teaspoon salt
2 Tablespoons or 2 tablets of Pepto Bismol (crushed)

Dosage:
Six Tablespoons of powder (including powdered pepto) for 50 lbs of goat. OR, four Tablespoons of powder plus two Tablespoons of liquid Pepto Bismol.

This dose is for a 50 to one hundred lb goat. Increase the dosage apporpriate to the animal's weight. A slight over dose will not be a problem. 

Administer every 2 hours for 12 hours and then every four hours tapering to six to eight hours the next four days.

This antidote can and should be administered for first aid in any type of plant poisoning. Carrying all dry ingredients makes it easier to pack a lightweight trail first aid kit. *(This book focuses on the needs of working goats/packgoats out on hikes-scrt crk)

A further complication of poisoning is that the rumen may shut down in the beginning phases and then restart later causing another load of toxins to be dumped into the system. treatment should be continued for at least 4 days. For the first 2 days, every 6 hours or at the first signs of distress, and later going to twice a day. *See how to start a rumen...page 111*

NOTES:
If you don't have all the ingredients, first induce vomiting with the salt and then give charcoal. Even burning a few small sticks (make sure they are non toxic such as fir) and powder it. Add it to water in the drench syringe. *(Charcoal briquette's are not Activated charcoal-scrt crk)

_ If you can, feed a goat hay before you let them free to browse or run the yard...they are less likely to eat forbidden foods. 

*(The rest does not apply to OP)
*This book is AMAZING! A goat keeper's MUST HAVE (COSTS ABOUT $25.00)...
-SCRT CRK


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

Wonder if my post that is a copy out of a goat field first aid book can be a "sticky" so the hotline emergency ph #'S and antidote recipes/dosages can be found easy in an emergency???
-scrt crk


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## LFRJ (Dec 1, 2006)

secretcreek said:


> Wonder if my post that is a copy out of a goat field first aid book can be a "sticky" so the hotline emergency ph #'S and antidote recipes/dosages can be found easy in an emergency???
> -scrt crk


I second, if the contact info is still current. I live in Rhody country, and while I will do everything possible to prevent it, I can see the possibility of our goats getting into a set of shrubs, and I'm frantically looking for the copy of this post.

Thanks for your consideration.


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## BackfourtyMI. (Sep 3, 2007)

When a couple of my girls got into a bush late last summer that caused them to be sick it was 2-3 hours before I noticed them crying & vomiting everywhere. I immediately started giving them the activated charcoal out of the fish dept. at Walmart, I mixed it with yogurt to get it down them.

Also if you see her throwing up, etc. She needs a shot of C & D ANTITOXIN, not the one you give for vaccine but the antitoxin, 20 cc.
Also if you do end up having to give her the charcoal you'll want to give her Probios paste everyday for a few days too as the charcoal pulls the bad & good from their bodies.

It may be she didn't get enough to make her sick, How is your doe doing?


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## AuntKitty (Oct 25, 2004)

I think the goat Tallabred lost was a doeling though - no where near the same weight. And it happened really fast, IIRC.

Good luck with your girl!

Kitty


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## nigeriandwarfs (Jan 23, 2011)

hows she doing??


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## Kye022984 (Apr 23, 2010)

She's doing great! I checked on her a bunch before bed last night, once mid-night, and this morning. I gave her a couple more baking soda balls before bed last night just to be sure. 

She's eating, drinking, and acting like her normal self 15 hours later! Yay!:happy0035: I had a huge smile this morning.

Now we are just looking forward to babies in a couple days.

Boy that was quite a scare.

Thank you all for the help as well. I did end up getting activated charcoal from Petsmart last night. But as it is I also had two stomach flu children at the same time and was overwhelmed. So, I decided to stick with the baking soda until I saw some signs.

Anyway, thank you again. I'm going to keep the charcoal on hand from now on.


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## nigeriandwarfs (Jan 23, 2011)

Glad to hear she is doing well. Good luck with the kidding can't wait to see picts




http://2012youdecide.blogspot.com


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## saanengirl (Apr 7, 2009)

Goats are amazingly good at handling toxins as long as they don't consume too much. A mouthful of leaves in most cases isn't enough to hurt a goat.


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