# Should we separate buck and doe about to kid?



## Alice In TX/MO

Our dwarf/pygmy goats are soon to be the proud parents of kids. They have always been kept together, and we have no other goats.

Is the buck a danger to the kids or mom as she gives birth? Do we need to separate them? Should the be kept separate after kidding?

I've go *so much* else going on that I just don't have time to do a bunch of reading and research on this. Thanks for helping me out here.


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## marvella

i separate mine as soon as she kids. the buck smells the blood and thinks she is iniheat. he chases her so bad, she can't take care of the baby. only lasts for a few days, then it's back to normal. just beware, bucks with breeding on thier minds are REAL hard to pen up.


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## dezeeuwgoats

Separate them.

Niki


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## KSALguy

i had a friend who had a pair of pygmes that she had running loose at her farm they kept the lillack bushes trimmed up and ate with the horse, and slept in the hay feeder. the doe would drop her kidds once or twice a year depending on her mood and the buck was always around and they had no problems, 

i had my first buck in with the herd when everyone started kidding and he was a nubian in with a bunch of grade meat does. and my Boer buck was in with them too the first season, after that he was separated only because he was a Fence Distroyer and let the whole herd out to terrorize the neahbors


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## Sweet Goats

I would NEVER keep my buck with my does year round, much less with new kids.


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## marytx

Sweet Goats said:


> I would NEVER keep my buck with my does year round, much less with new kids.


Same here. A doe can get rebred pretty quickly after she kids. But even more, I would be concerned about his behavior during kidding. Maybe he'll be good, but maybe he won't. Why take a chance? Also, if she has doe kids, you run the risk of them getting bred way too young if the buck is running with them.
mary


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## Alice In TX/MO

I know most folks keep theirs separate, but they are the only two we have, and they've been together since we got them. We'll need to get the buck a wether friend, I think for long term. They are going to go bonkers apart.


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## marytx

I'd think about selling the buck, and keeping the doe and her offspring.
mary


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## Alice In TX/MO

Oh dear. Sell Billy Bob? That hadn't even crossed my mind.


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## dirtundernails

May be BB should be "the wether"?
I have the same setup, only with 5 does, so I have to think along these same lines.
dun


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## stanb999

dirtundernails said:


> May be BB should be "the wether"?
> I have the same setup, only with 5 does, so I have to think along these same lines.
> dun


Let the goats be goats. If you continually treat them as pets and not a herd you will have pets and not a herd.
Goats wish to live in a herd, young/old/doe/buck. They all want it that way.


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## Spinner

If they have plenty of room to run, the female will most likely go off by herself to kid. My neighbor has a huge herd that runs free in the mountains. All the does go off alone to kid, the bucks leave them alone. His bucks have other herd members to hang out with so that probably makes a difference. Your buck might want to stay with the doe since she's the other half of his herd. You might put her in a pen alone where they can see each other so neither of them feel alone.


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## Alice In TX/MO

Yes, she has a lot of brush and autumn olive trees to hide in if she wants.


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## Caprice Acres

stanb999 said:


> Let the goats be goats. If you continually treat them as pets and not a herd you will have pets and not a herd.
> Goats wish to live in a herd, young/old/doe/buck. They all want it that way.


Yes, but often the way they want to be isn't in yours or thier best interests. they WANT free access to grain, but it's not good for them. they WANT to wander everywhere they want but then they wouldn't stick around and would have predator problems. they WANT to rebreed soon after kidding but that's too much stress on the doe and can cause small litters and a shorter lifespan. allowing them free breeding rights by keeping them all togeather is NOT a good idea at all. the buck should be separate untill breeding season, once a year (or twice a year if you want it that way, but I never suggest that.). He should not be in with his daughers that are really young (or ever unless you know about what inbreeding will do to your herd), as they CAN become bred VERY VERY early and young bucklings should be separated from mother and sister at a young age too. Also, you won't ever know when the doe is due to kid, and if you aren't there for it, the doe could have problems and you could loose the kids and the doe. Not a good scenario.

Hope this helps, I hope I didn't sound to preachy.


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## Caprice Acres

Oh, I ment to say, your buck will be fine alone for a while, actually, untill your doe's kids get older, and then if she has a buckling you can wether him and put him in with your buck. If you're really worried about it you can build his pen alongside hers. That's also helpful when watching for heats in the breeding season; IT's what I do and breeding season is EASY! And I get exact duedates, lol.


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## Alice In TX/MO

We have prepared another pen to move mom and kids to when the time comes. For the long term, we may have to cut their big pasture/brush area in half with electric net fence so they can see each other close by but not get frisky. 

You know, this was a lot less stressful before my friend's mom fell and broke her shoulder and came to live with him (where the goats are) and before my granson became ill (and I've been on the road not able to help much.) Sigh. Oh, well, we'll get it done.

Thank you for the advice. I truly do appreciate it.


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## ozark_jewels

stanb999 said:


> Let the goats be goats. If you continually treat them as pets and not a herd you will have pets and not a herd.
> Goats wish to live in a herd, young/old/doe/buck. They all want it that way.


Yes, then you have 6-7 month old kids giving birth to more kids, you have worn out does getting bred back the same month they kid in a perpetual cycle and they die young. :grump: You must use common sense in these situations, and common sense is to separate the buck from heavy pregnant does and young kids to prevent these things from happening. You can have a herd of just does, you can even have a herd of just bucks. Keeping the buck separate from the does is practical, NOT treating them as pets.


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## stanb999

ozark_jewels said:


> Yes, then you have 6-7 month old kids giving birth to more kids, you have worn out does getting bred back the same month they kid in a perpetual cycle and they die young. :grump: You must use common sense in these situations, and common sense is to separate the buck from heavy pregnant does and young kids to prevent these things from happening. You can have a herd of just does, you can even have a herd of just bucks. Keeping the buck separate from the does is practical, NOT treating them as pets.


Well not exactly right. The little girl wont go it to heat at 2 months. She will hit her first heat at about 7-8 months if not forced with grain. Then she will give birth at about 1 year. This is the natural order of things. The goats not forced to give doubles and triples but do so naturally are alot less likely to have these problems with dieing young. Feed the goats natural goat feed (browse, a little hay, even less grain) they will perform well. Our older ladies came into heat in mid-oct. How do I know the boy got stinky....... I mean stinky. He could tell. In the last week he has gotten stinky again. So I figure it must be for the little girls now. In between you could pet hit again without that stank. I just feel bad for him as he gets no petting when he has that stank.


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## ozark_jewels

No, kids that are on no grain, *still* can come in at two months of age....how do I know?? It happens here. And my adult goats are on hay, 30 acres of browse, and very little grain. They still come in heat as early as July and then come in heat again right after they kid. So what works in your herd, doesn't work in everybodies. And same goes for my herd.  My boys live in their own herd and my girls live a separate life. My doelings breed at around 8 months for kids at about their first birthday, and I usually get twins and triplets. A doe in good condition(not fat, just healthy) will naturally have multiples. Singles are a sign of poor nutrition in anything older than a first-freshening kid.


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## PygmyLover

I have a "herd" and they are pets. I totaly agree with Emily on this one. The goats in question are pygmies. They can and WILL breed back right after kidding (with in that first week they have a small heat) adn the young does can and WILL quite possibly go into heat as young as 2 months! A responsible person will separate for the health of the herd.

I do things as naturally as possible, but I will not leave a buck in with young or pregnant goats about to kid, not at responsible thing to do.


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