# I am wanting to buy another sks



## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

but the prices have went through the roof for them. I have been searching the web but haven't found anything reasonable yet. Well, actually they are for what the rifle is truly worth but they are way higher than the last time I bought one. I thought hard about buying two then but was stupid again and didn't do it. 
I am also wanting another case of ammo for it Plus some .22 LR's. 
Does anyone have a good site??? I have a dealer I can have it shipped to but he wants 30 bucks for the paper work. I might be better off to just get a FFL. 
I'd appreciate any ideas here. 

Thanks 

Dennis


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

WHY an SKS?


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## Morning Owl (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok Dennis, now I REALLY want a pic. You standing with your sks and a love struck baby chic in your pocket. :lookout:

Sorry couldn't resist posting that.


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Gary in ohio said:


> WHY an SKS?


I agree, I guess I don't understand the attraction of old/new foreign military stuff.

I guess I could when it was cheap, and you didn't have the bucks to buy a decent firearm, but paying top dollar for an sks?????????


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

hunter63 said:


> I agree, I guess I don't understand the attraction of old/new foreign military stuff.
> 
> I guess I could when it was cheap, and you didn't have the bucks to buy a decent firearm, but paying top dollar for an sks?????????


In today's market, I wouldnt call $250 "top dollar". Even a good single shot new will cost that much


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## WolfWalksSoftly (Aug 13, 2004)

Why an SKS ? Because they are reasonable in price for someone on a budget. Are reliable and a box of shells only runs 5 to 6 bucks for 20. I just bought another after selling one I had purchased in the late 80's (I paid 89.00 then).


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## cchapman84 (Jan 29, 2003)

We've got an SKS and love it. I prefer shooting it over the AK that we have. Not sure of the best place to get one online, we bought ours locally.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

I have an Ak and its fun and has the "LOOK" but the SKS is to big for varmint and cant hunt deere with it so not much use for it.


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## tyusclan (Jan 1, 2005)

Gary in ohio said:


> cant hunt deere with it so not much use for it.


Why not? 

It's not the most powerful cartridge in the world, but it's more than adequate for deer-sized game. While they're not exactly tack drivers, they're accurate enough for deer at least out to 150-200 yards.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Don't the SKS and AK47 both use the same 7.62x39 ammo?

Mili issue 7.62x39 is designed to wound humans, not kill them, or kill deer. Yes you can kill a deer with one... but how many will you wound first, allow to run off and die. I finally shamed one of my neighbors publically, to stop using his SKS for deer... after two years of shooting and 'hitting' deer, but never finding the carcass... I'd 'splained' it to him several times, but after other folks started ribbing him, he stopped.

You can kill deer with .22 rifles (Inuits take polar bears with their .22's.... shoot em in the eye or the ear, out of the boat, while the bear's swimming) but it's not very humane...

Personally I'm in need of a new MBR (main battle rifle)... I'm leaning to a FN/FAL copy, something like a CETME. But good lordie, they're pricey... have found some in the 700$ range.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

texican said:


> Don't the SKS and AK47 both use the same 7.62x39 ammo?
> 
> Mili issue 7.62x39 is designed to wound humans, not kill them, or kill deer. Yes you can kill a deer with one... but how many will you wound first, allow to run off and die. I finally shamed one of my neighbors publically, to stop using his SKS for deer... after two years of shooting and 'hitting' deer, but never finding the carcass... I'd 'splained' it to him several times, but after other folks started ribbing him, he stopped.
> 
> ...


Typically you don't use military issue FMJ for deer hunting...


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

tyusclan said:


> Why not?
> It's not the most powerful cartridge in the world, but it's more than adequate for deer-sized game. While they're not exactly tack drivers, they're accurate enough for deer at least out to 150-200 yards.


Not legal in Ohio. deer slugs ONLY! You can go into PA and think MI, but the cartridge really takes good hit to take down most deer.


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

So what is considered a good fair price on a SKS these days?
I do remember the under $100 buck ones, awhile back.


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## alabamared (May 23, 2005)

Gary in ohio said:


> Not legal in Ohio. deer slugs ONLY! You can go into PA and think MI, but the cartridge really takes good hit to take down most deer.


So, in Ohio, you can only legally take deer with a shotgun?

The ballistics for an sks are the same or better than a 30-30. But, you have to use mushrooming ammo for a legal kill.


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## dixiecaveman (Apr 1, 2008)

Dennis as far as wanting a good deal on an sks or any other gun I would check out www.gunbroker.com .That is like e-bay for guns and its where I've bought several and found the people I've delt with to be honest,but be careful,you can find a crook anywhere.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

seedspreader said:


> Typically you don't use military issue FMJ for deer hunting...


Wise hunters don't.

People (notice I did not say hunters) that shoot at deer with SKS's instead of a regular old hunting rifle, probably don't know any better... a bullet's a bullet. [An SKS hunter saying to 'hisself'.... I've got this SKS, a couple cases of bullets and I know what it'll do to a metal barrel, why don't I go and kill a deer...]

Who can't afford a used .30-30, a .243, .270, 30.06? I know a few fellers who buy a good used rifle before hunting season, use it a month or two, then resell it after the season, and lose very little money on the transaction.

I only use quality ammunition... I also reload all of my calibers... I don't think I even have any kind of FMJ in the house.

When I shoot a deer, I want it to fall right then and there. Bullets are cheap (relatively speaking) even at 1.50$ a shot for my MDR (main deer rifle)...


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

alabamared said:


> So, in Ohio, you can only legally take deer with a shotgun?
> l.


Correct. SKS are considered inhumane since you cant guarantee a good kill with the smaller round


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## Gerald Messer (Nov 21, 2006)

an sks is every bit as humane as bows and arrows just go get lead nosed bullets for hunting and full metal jacket for plinking and youll be fine.


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## tyusclan (Jan 1, 2005)

Gary in ohio said:


> SKS are considered inhumane since you cant guarantee a good kill with the smaller round


HUH?

7.62 mm is 30 caliber. That's more than adequate for any deer in this country. It does have a smaller powder charge, and that limits you to about 200 yards on your shot, but so does a .30-30. Outside range on a shotgun slug is about 150.

I understand that there are states that require shotguns for deer hunting, and that would preclude using a rifle, but to say that the SKS is inhumane is simply not true.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

That's cute Morning Owl. I don't think I could be out in a war zone situation with this loud mouthed chick screaming in my ear, LOL. He/she is setting on my shoulder now. Actually the back of my neck, :lookout:

Gary, you can't find a better weapon for the money than a sks. I have found one place to get them, unissued for $299 but that's way more than what I paid for the two I already have. It seems like I paid $109 and then $149 for them but I am not sure. I have had them for a few years.

Texican, to start with, I don't appreciate someone trying to make me look like a fool and I tend to turn the tables on them when they do so set back. 
If you can't kill a deer with a sks you shouldn't be hunting to start with. 
Then you need to start writing letters to all the families of the boys that got "REAL DEAD" from the same round they are using in IRAQ right now against those boys and tell them the round wasn't supposed to kill there sons, or daughters. And get them all together and sue the people that didn't know they could kill our troops with them and that they were only supposed to injure them. That is one of the dumbest things I ever heard. 

And again to Gary, since when is a 7.62 mm (a smaller round)??????? :doh:
It's the same size round as the .308. Our M-60 machine gun fires a 7.62 x51mm round and it will kill you at 2,000 yards. 
The sks fires a 7.62 x 39mm round. 
It doesn't have as much powder as the .308 but it's the same 7.62 round. 

And who in the H--- said I wanted it for deer hunting to start with?????????
I have a Remington 30.06, model 700 with a 6-24x40mm Leupold scope setting right there on top of it. 

And JFYI I was a sniper in the 3rd Battalion of the 325th Infantry Brigade, 82nd Airborne Division. Hey, I even completed Rangers training. How about that.

So I guess I am the dummy here. So how about that Tex?? If you care to put some money up, I will scrape every single penny I can together and show you how to shoot. I I am hand-i caped. I can't see as good as I used to. 

Now go back and read the OP. If you can help me find out where I can get a good, "CHEAP" sks, I would appreciate it.
:flame::flame::flame:
Dennis


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

tyusclan and Gerald, I didn't see your post before I posted my last one but thanks for the input. But the thing is I never said anything about hunting deer with it to start with. I just want another sks. Lets just say I have more than a few rounds and 20 and 30 round mags for them. I would like to have one for my wife, (It's the only thing she can hit the broad side of a barn with, LOL.) my 
daughter, and myself. 
I would just like to have three of them in the house. 

Look, Tex and Gary, I am sorry I blew up like that. I just don't like someone trying to make me look like some idiot. 
I assure you I would never shoot a deer and let it run off and die instead of getting in my freezer. I have had a few shoots at deer with my cross bow but wasn't sure it would kill them and simply didn't take the shot trying to inch my way closer. I am almost sure I could have dropped them but there was a little doubt in my mind. I just didn't shoot and they all have ran before I got to where I was 100% sure I had the dead to right. 
The way you talked on your post I am some lucky go lately wanta be hunter. That ain't me. 
And just so we see straight, I told you about the 30.06, but if I could, or was in shape to go hunting around here (which I am not,), I would indeed use one of the sks's. 
Since I broke my back I hate my 30.06 but I will never part with it. I can shoot it if needed, and I assure you it will reach out there and say good night, but God that thing hurts. 
With either of the sks's I can put 3 or 4 rounds in the heart/lung area in a deer at 300 yards with open sights before it can move. 
Sure, I will loose a little meat doing so but he would drop like a stump and look at what would be left to eat. . 

But you are welcome to your own thoughts. Just leave me out of them.

Dennis


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

crafty2002 said:


> And again to Gary, since when is a 7.62 mm (a smaller round)??????? :doh:
> It's the same size round as the .308. Our M-60 machine gun fires a 7.62 x51mm round and it will kill you at 2,000 yards.


While the 7.62x39 can kill, its main role was to wound. And while it may be physically similar in size to the 308, there is a big difference in stopping power.

The 308 has over 1/2 inch longer area for powder, the 308 fly about 500-800ft/sec faster and hits its target with over 1000ft/lbs more force than the 7.62x39


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## PhilJohnson (Dec 24, 2006)

I haven't come across a site yet that will sell you fire arms with out a FFL. I have seen places that will sell you a SKS "kit". They sell you a bunch of parts and you have to put it together. There was one website out of Texas I think that was selling these SKS kits for like 150 bucks. However the web address escapes my memory now. I have no idea why some people think you can't use an SKS for deer hunting. I have seen people deer hunt with a .223 which is legal in this state. Seems that a SKS would be at least as powerful as that. I am no fire arms expert but from personal experience I know people who have taken down a deer with an SKS in one shot. I don't see how an SKS is designed to wound over kill. Aren't all fire arms designed to kill?

I think there are a few people here suffering from bigger is better mentality here. It used to be in the old days, okay the way old days, when people would hunt elephants with a 303. Now that is only merely adequate for a deer? How is hunting with an SKS any more inhumane than a bow? 

An SKS may not group within a silver dollar at 300 yards, but I think at under 150 yards you'll be fine. If that is what your comfortable and accurate with I see no reason why you shouldn't use it. As a plinker it is cheap to shoot, which sounds like that is all your after any way.

I also know they do make hunting rounds for an SKS, they aren't as easily found as hunting rounds for a 30-0-06 but they are out there.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Gary in ohio said:


> Correct. SKS are considered inhumane since you cant guarantee a good kill with the smaller round


Thats not why you cant use them. The reason is it's shotguns or muzzleloaders only. Try to stick to FACTS


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

crafty2002 said:


> tyusclan and Gerald, I didn't see your post before I posted my last one but thanks for the input. But the thing is I never said anything about hunting deer with it to start with. I just want another sks. Lets just say I have more than a few rounds and 20 and 30 round mags for them. I would like to have one for my wife, (It's the only thing she can hit the broad side of a barn with, LOL.) my
> daughter, and myself.
> I would just like to have three of them in the house.
> 
> ...


I want to apologize for my comments, earlier.

All you did was ask a simple question, "does anyone know where to get a reasonably priced sks" or words to that effect.
I guess everyone got off on a tangent with out really answering your question, rather relaying their own opinions of the sks, 7.62X39, cartridge instead.


You like what you like, and deserve to treated with respect.
Sorry


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Hmmmpff...

I posted earlier this evening on this thread, and it vanished... nothing controversial, no name callin or bad... maybe it's just a glitch...

So, again,
Crafty, you haven't hurt my feelings...

you're obviously a knowledgeable person... my experiences with 'bad hunters' with SKS's was with unknowledgeable people... never hunted before in their lives, and had an SKS and figured it'd work for hunting. The kind of kids that figure you hit a deer anywhere with a bullet and it just falls down.

In a survival situation, after the TEOTWAWKI, I'd have no problems using an assault type rifle going after zombies or deer.

I like SKS's... I'd like to have a couple in storage, even a couple of AK's, a FN/FAL, whatever...

I can't remember much more of the original post...

As far as finding one, I'd be looking for the next local gunshow! I know I've got my eyes open for our next local one...

happy gun huntin!


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Thats not why you cant use them. The reason is it's shotguns or muzzleloaders only. Try to stick to FACTS


The sks issues has been ask many times at deer/hunting shows and the answer is alwasy the same. Its not humane to hunt deer with the small calibre gun. Deer slug in modern rifle or you can throw some big lead with the muzzleloader


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

Gary in ohio said:


> The sks issues has been ask many times at deer/hunting shows and the answer is alwasy the same. Its not humane to hunt deer with the small calibre gun. Deer slug in modern rifle or you can throw some big lead with the muzzleloader


Yeah, that "small caliber" .243, .270, 30/30 30.06 should never be used to hunt deer.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

seedspreader said:


> Yeah, that "small caliber" .243, .270, 30/30 30.06 should never be used to hunt deer.


:rotfl::rotfl: Yea, that what I was thinking too. Maybe I should get a .375 H&H or maybe even a .458 Win. Magnum, Or would they be big enough Gary??? 
I sure wouldn't want to just "wound one" and have it just walk off and die. 

:baby04:
Dennis


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

Hey, Gary talked me out of buying another SKS, does any one know where I can buy a "RPG"???????????????????????

Gary, that stands for " Rocket Propelled Grenade " !!!! Would that be big enough to kill a deer with??? 
I hope so because I know I don't have enough money to buy a tank. :nana:


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

crafty2002 said:


> Hey, Gary talked me out of buying another SKS, does any one know where I can buy a "RPG"???????????????????????
> Would that be big enough to kill a deer with???
> I hope so because I know I don't have enough money to buy a tank. :nana:


NO that would be inhumane as well, not to mention wasteful of a RPG and a deer. I also said nothing about a 30.30/30.06,370,343 or any other round. I said a 7.62x39 has been deemed inhumane by Ohio dept of wildlife for hunting deer and the only thing in ohio legal is deer slug or if you go black power then muzzle loader. I have seen the yahoo's in PA hunting deer with SKS, most couldn't hit a barn let alone hit a deer in a vital organ to have it quickly bleed out. Most picked the SKS not because of the cartridge but because it was cheap and they heard there buddies where going hunt'n and needed a gun. If your outside of ohio and in a state that allows rifles and you really can do a 1 shot kill on a deer more power to you, MOST people cant do it and the deer will suffer. Heck I had to put orangle blaze vest on my llama's each year so the hunters would shoot them. How you could think a full size llama next to a barn in an open fenced pasture is a deer is beyond me but the idiots will shoot at anything that moves.


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## PhilJohnson (Dec 24, 2006)

Gary in ohio said:


> NO that would be inhumane as well, not to mention wasteful of a RPG and a deer. I also said nothing about a 30.30/30.06,370,343 or any other round. I said a 7.62x39 has been deemed inhumane by Ohio dept of wildlife for hunting deer and the only thing in ohio legal is deer slug or if you go black power then muzzle loader. I have seen the yahoo's in PA hunting deer with SKS, most couldn't hit a barn let alone hit a deer in a vital organ to have it quickly bleed out. Most picked the SKS not because of the cartridge but because it was cheap and they heard there buddies where going hunt'n and needed a gun. If your outside of ohio and in a state that allows rifles and you really can do a 1 shot kill on a deer more power to you, MOST people cant do it and the deer will suffer. Heck I had to put orangle blaze vest on my llama's each year so the hunters would shoot them. How you could think a full size llama next to a barn in an open fenced pasture is a deer is beyond me but the idiots will shoot at anything that moves.


If your a bad shot any gun is inhumane. In my experience it doesn't matter what gun someone has in their hands, if they can't shoot at what they are aiming at they shouldn't be hunting. An SKS isn't the world's best hunting rifle, but it'll kill a deer. It is certainly better than a .22, and much better than the old time muskets of the 1800s. 

There are a lot of retards that come up from the big city to hunt here in the north woods and they'll shoot at anything that moves, no matter what their weapons choice is. Someone I knew told me a story of how they were talking to another hunter in the county forest. Asked him if he got anything, to that the guy replied,"Didn't get deer, got a few sound shots off though." Guy was from Milwaukee. 

Gary, I think you are confusing the idiot behind the gun with the gun. Hunting with an SKS doesn't automatically make you a crazy idiot who can't hit the broad side of a barn any more so than a .470 makes you a expert grizzly hunter.

I fail to see how a SKS is less humane than shooting a deer with a bow, and then having to track it. At the very least if your first shot with an SKS was a bad one you could quickly shoot the deer again before it ran off. It is pretty hard to do a follow up shot with a bow quickly enough if your first one doesn't go where you planned it to.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

Gary in ohio said:


> NO that would be inhumane as well, not to mention wasteful of a RPG and a deer. I also said nothing about a 30.30/30.06,370,343 or any other round. I said a 7.62x39 has been deemed inhumane by Ohio dept of wildlife for hunting deer and the only thing in ohio legal is deer slug or if you go black power then muzzle loader.



Do you have a link concerning the 7.62x39 from Ohio's D O W? I personally think that Ohio outlawed High Powered rifles due to their travel distance and not their caliber. 

What's the pistol rules for deer hunting in Ohio? (I think you will find your answer to why SKS and other high power rifles aren't used in Ohio with this answer)


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

Finally (this is what I was getting at earlier when I said not to use FMJ) here is one perspective of the sks on deer hunting.



> Expert: Steven L. Ashe
> Date: 1/4/2007
> Subject: Deer rifle
> 
> ...


http://en.allexperts.com/q/Hunting-1633/Deer-rifle.htm


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

BTW, usually the "SKS isn't a deer rifle" argument is used by the gun control crowd (I know that's not you folks here) and that's where a lot of that rhetoric comes from... I am sure it's also emboldened and reinforced by people using the wrong load for their rifles also, but THAT PROBLEM (wrong load) can happen in almost any gun/hunting issue.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

Case closed. Now Does any one know of the best place to buy a SKS????

Dennis


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

A few days ago, one of the gangbangers down in Florida was caught with a WW2 era rocket launcher (rpg).

__________

Does anyone here own just one rifle? Don't answer that if you don't want to (for security reasons). Does anyone here own just one screwdriver, one pocket knife? I have different tools for different jobs (dozens of different types of screwdrivers (hundreds of bits), but they're all screwdrivers.) I have different guns for different purposes. I don't use the .300winmag on snakes in the henhouse... and I don't use the .22 Ruger pistol on elk at 400yds. The right tool for the right job. I have a 30.30 and an 30.06 and a .300 win mag. They all shoot the same bullet, literally. It's the powder, and ballistics, inherent in each gun, that separates them. I'd never dream of using a 30.30 elk hunting. The 30.06 will get er done, most of the time... the 300 win mag will get er done every time.

If I were to go hunting in Africa (and I had the chance at an all expenses paid hunt back in 85,) I would have a .458 magnum in my arsenal now... but I wouldn't go deer hunting with it. I might go hog hunting, just to get some value out of it. Logic would say sell it... but I don't sell guns...

O, did I mention earlier I like SKS? I'd love to have some extra zombie rifles... something with cheap clips and cheap ammo, to hold off the hordes?


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## Tom Bombadil (Mar 25, 2008)

crafty2002 said:


> And JFYI I was a sniper in the 3rd Battalion of the 325th Infantry Brigade, 82nd Airborne Division. Hey, I even completed Rangers training. How about that.


I took a trip or two with second brigade.

I had an SKS - bought it for $75 (from another trooper at Bragg, coincidently) used back in the late 80s. My buddies and I put about 800 rounds through it - a lot of fun. But at the end of the day, it was a "fun gun". I ended up trading it as part of a gun swap.

Have you talked to your local gun store? Last year, my local store asked if I was looking for one because a whole cargo container had come in and the dealer was trying to unload them to all the gun shops. The were asking for $150-170 for one, which isn't a bad price around here now.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

Tom Bombadil said:


> I took a trip or two with second brigade.
> 
> I had an SKS - bought it for $75 (from another trooper at Bragg, coincidently) used back in the late 80s. My buddies and I put about 800 rounds through it - a lot of fun. But at the end of the day, it was a "fun gun". I ended up trading it as part of a gun swap.
> 
> Have you talked to your local gun store? Last year, my local store asked if I was looking for one because a whole cargo container had come in and the dealer was trying to unload them to all the gun shops. The were asking for $150-170 for one, which isn't a bad price around here now.


:happy::duel::goodjob: That's cool Tom. I was starting to think I was the only one here that even knew what the 82nd was all about. I pray you didn't take any trips like I did. I still wake up sweeting every now and then. Ain't fun is it?? 

Tex, a WWII rocket launcher was a bazooka. There weren't any RPG's back then that I know of. The first one the US had was a LAW rocket and that came out if I am correct, in nam. It was a shoot one time, and through away piece of plastic, but it did make a big bang. 
I might be wrong about that now. The bazooka was a rocket launchers too, I guess. I never looked at it like that. 
I know back in 76 or 77 our battalion was put on red alert and we went to Green Ramp, which is at Pope Air Force Base connected to Ft. Bragg and they gave every swinging !!!! there a two pack of them.
Almost a thousand troops with a two pack. :bouncy:
I forget whether it was Korea, I just forget where it was but it was all because some troops cut down a ----ed tree somewhere and we nearly went to war over it. 
We stayed at Green Ramp for better than two weeks before they sent us back to base. 
But that taught me something tho. Now I look back and will say it this way, "OUR KIDS ARE READY TO GO TO WAR AT A MOMENTS NOTICE" !!!! I say that because I was a Kid at the time!!!!
Same way it is today and they don't even know what they are getting into. Not in the least. 

Dennis


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## Tom Bombadil (Mar 25, 2008)

I took two official trips to Green Ramp - Operation Just Cause and Operation Desert Shield. The rest of my "fun" was training and helping out the DEA with the War on Drugs down in South America.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

That was after my time Tom. I was in after the whatever they want to call it was supposed to be over with in Nam according to what the gov put out, But It WASN'T OVER. I know that for a fact but was scared to say a word for years. I didn't like the thought of 20 years in the stockade but I ain't much scared any more. 
Tell me what the deal was with the war on drugs. ???? Was it anything like the bull s--- with Nam???? 
They just wipe out the ones they wanted gone and buddy buddy with the ones that they liked?????????
That is what I figured. No need to even answer that. I know how Nam went. 
Hey, the training was fun when you look back at it, but it dang sure wasn't at the time. I thought they were trying to kill us, LOL. 

I am still looking for an SKS. 
Dennis


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## Tom Bombadil (Mar 25, 2008)

The War on Drugs thing was back during Daddy Bush's reign. The military would assist the DEA in finding the bases of operation for the drug lords and provide logistical support while the DEA, the local military, and the local police went in and made the arrests. Then they would destroy the place and move on to the next one. Sometimes it was airstrips, sometimes it was the collection facilities where the farmers dropped off their crops, sometimes it was the processing plants where it was made into coke. Mostly it was ELINT and DF work as far as my personal part was concerned.

But hey, long range surveillance is long range surveillance no matter what you are gathering intel on, right?


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

Tom were you kinda kept in the dark on some of it to where you didn't know about operations that they would just leave alone or did you find out about any of them? 
I have a cousin that did about what you are talking about and he said several times they knew of operations that were sort of hands off. He said someone up above selected the the ones to take down and which ones to stay away from but he never knew who gave those orders.

Let me ask you this. Did you ever know of a single operation that they didn't try to take out just because it was hands off this one? 
I forget if Gary was a Staff Sargent or a First Sargent. I think he was a Staff Sargent when he was doing that and made First Sargent before he retired. Anyway he said the whole thing was a game. He said Bush was just a big joke with the War on Drugs. Not saying it was not dangerous, because I know he got shot twice in one raid but as far as them truly trying to stop the drugs he said it looked they just took down the ones they couldn't deal with. 

I would just like to hear it from someone else that was there and seen it also. 
He said they flew over homes that you had no doubt that were drug lords and go get one miles further and never touch the first one. 

I know I had some crazy experiences in the army myself. 

Dennis


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## Tom Bombadil (Mar 25, 2008)

Hey, we just pointed out where things were - it was up to the powers that be to make things happen from there. Overall, I found my military experience to mostly great with an occasional near overdose of suck.


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## symple-lyfe (Dec 17, 2005)

OMG...does nobody know where to get a cheap SKS?

My local FFL has good Yugo's for $245. Here's the page where it is, scroll about half-way down. 
http://www.fountainfirearms.com/Store_Sale2.htm

I got my SKS there, and it was in very nice condition, just had cosmoline everywhere. In fact, the wood surrounding the gas tube still sweats cosmo after a day at the range.
Anyhoo...hope this helped a bit.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

symple-lyfe said:


> OMG...does nobody know where to get a cheap SKS?
> 
> My local FFL has good Yugo's for $245. Here's the page where it is, scroll about half-way down.
> http://www.fountainfirearms.com/Store_Sale2.htm
> ...


Hey thanks. :happy: That looks like a new and never been issued rifle. If it's loaded with cosmo it probably is. Am I correct here??? 
That wouldn't be a bad price at all for a new rifle. So far what I have found has been good at $199 and very good at $229 and unissued for $299. But the picture didn't look that good. 
Does the range you go to have 300 yard targets or is yours like ours had to cahnge to because of the laws and drop all the way back to 100 yards??? 
If so, what kind of groups do you get at 300 and do you consider your self average, expert or ?? at shooting ???? 
I could buy that and sell the one I have that shoots low and only be out well less than a hundred for the deal. I have a couple people that wants to buy mine even knowing you have to shoot high with it out past about 150 yards. But I figure if it drops 6-8" at 300 yards it has got to be loosing it's knock down power coming out the barrel. The barrel looks good but it has to be loose.

Thanks again for the help.
Dennis


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## symple-lyfe (Dec 17, 2005)

I've only gone to the 100 yd range once, and was shocked to hit 80% at that range (I can't see that far typically...just lined up two black things between two white things and held still). I'm definitely still new at this, only had the rifle for a year, and been to the range about 12 times with it. When it comes to distance shooting, I'm thrilled to hit the oblong 8" Shoot'n'See in the middle of a paper target's center mass, so I couldn't tell you anything about grouping. I nearly fell off the bench with excitement when my first shot ever on the 100yd range hit 1 1/2" left of dead center.

I think my rifle was never issued, I made sure to pick one that looked as unabused as possible. It shot straight the first time out, didn't need to sight it in, so I really don't know...is that common?

Last time I was at that store, there was a '57 russian SKS there for $450. If I'd had the money, I would have snatched it up real quick. It was smaller and a little lighter, with a darker and more expensive wood, and the handgrip behind the bolt housing smelled like it had been in a firefight. Didn't have the launcher, and I don't remember if it had the bayonet, but it did have the lug for it. 

The guys at that store really take pride in their firearms, they don't knowingly sell crap. Its a shame you're in Virginia, otherwise I'd say go have a look and fondle...I mean handle their stock. They always have lots of SKS and Nagants in stock.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

symple-lyfe said:


> I've only gone to the 100 yd range once, and was shocked to hit 80% at that range (I can't see that far typically...just lined up two black things between two white things and held still). I'm definitely still new at this, only had the rifle for a year, and been to the range about 12 times with it. When it comes to distance shooting, I'm thrilled to hit the oblong 8" Shoot'n'See in the middle of a paper target's center mass, so I couldn't tell you anything about grouping. I nearly fell off the bench with excitement when my first shot ever on the 100yd range hit 1 1/2" left of dead center.
> 
> I think my rifle was never issued, I made sure to pick one that looked as unabused as possible. It shot straight the first time out, didn't need to sight it in, so I really don't know...is that common?
> 
> ...


It is something when a person admits to the world he isn't a great shot, but it's something else on a site like this that he is the only one that answers a question as well as you did. 
Thanks a lot for the info. 

Tex, I have two SKS's, one Rugar .22 semi automatic, and the 30.06.
I would like a model 7400 Remington in a little smaller caliber than the 30.06. Maybe a .270 but I can buy 2 brand new SKS's for what one of those cost and have change for ammo. 

I am trying to prepare for what I feel is ahead of us. I pray I am wrong but I don't think so. I would love to have enough firearms to put one in my sons hand, my three BIL's hands along with 4 SIL's hands. 
Counting the pistols, I am there, but I want rifles in everyones hands if I can make it before TSHTF.

Dennis

.


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## symple-lyfe (Dec 17, 2005)

If you want cheap horde-stoppers, look at the Mosin Nagant. I've heard they kick like mules, but they are bolt action, use 7.62x51mm, and only cost about $150. Used for sniper rifles in their day. My FFL stocks lots of those, too. 

If you wanna streamline the ammo demand, have you looked at the AK-clones? I know you can get 30-40 rd mags for those (the SKS ones tend to suck royally).

_P.S. I'm a girl_


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## PhilJohnson (Dec 24, 2006)

symple-lyfe said:


> If you want cheap horde-stoppers, look at the Mosin Nagant. I've heard they kick like mules, but they are bolt action, use 7.62x51mm, and only cost about $150. Used for sniper rifles in their day. My FFL stocks lots of those, too.
> 
> If you wanna streamline the ammo demand, have you looked at the AK-clones? I know you can get 30-40 rd mags for those (the SKS ones tend to suck royally).
> 
> _P.S. I'm a girl_


I own two Mosin Nagants a M91 and a M44. One fifty sounds pretty pricey, I paid 90 bucks for my M91 and I thought that was high when I went to Durham sports and seen em goin for 75 bucks. Love em, ammo is dirt cheap, just bought 1200 rounds for 200 bucks. The M91 is pretty dang accurate, I can group within a foot at 100 yards with the iron sights. I started a little Mosin brigade around here, three of my friends bought em too. I believe that the Mosin fires a 7.62x54r cartridge not a 7.62x51mm. For the money you can't beat em. The kick isn't too bad with the M91 but the M44 will leave you sore after a while. The M44 is a carbine with a fold out bayonet, I use it for when I go camping in the deep woods or huntin in brush.


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## symple-lyfe (Dec 17, 2005)

Oops, my bad...you're right on the cartridge size. I thought that sounded wrong as I was typing. I would love to pick up a Nagant for $75, where do you find them that cheap? Is it a local store? How many rounds will it hold at a time?


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## PhilJohnson (Dec 24, 2006)

symple-lyfe said:


> Oops, my bad...you're right on the cartridge size. I thought that sounded wrong as I was typing. I would love to pick up a Nagant for $75, where do you find them that cheap? Is it a local store? How many rounds will it hold at a time?


They hold 5 rounds. Around here you can find the at Gander Mountain, Dunham Sports, or Fleet Farm. Century Arms is the biggest importer/distributer of them in the US. You can go to their website and find a dealer/store that sells them near you.


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## diamondtim (Jun 10, 2005)

crafty2002,

Check out AIM surplus for their Yugo SKS':
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/copy_of_SKS_Yugo__Yugoslavian_M59_66_SKS_7_62x39_Rifle.html

you'll have to pay a transfer fee to your local 01 FFL or you can use an 03 FFL to order yourself.


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Most of the sks's are brought into the U.S. by :
http://www.centuryarms.com/Century/home.htm

I did a dealer serach and found Duhams Sporting Goods locally.
Standard sks's about $250.


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## Rickydink (Dec 26, 2005)

Here is a list of SKS from $169.99 for shooters grade to $239.99 for new.

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=101


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

Dunhams in store special $198.
Thats in South Milwaukee. WI.


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## Gideon (Sep 15, 2005)

My nephew is doing his SF trainiing at Camp McCall as we speak and my son is in his twelvth year and presently stationed at Bragg. Dennis/Tom, if you gents are anywhere close to NC please PM or E me. We have gatherings you would love. 
I have done ballistic tests on '39 rds that you might find interesting. I set up some dry 4X6 timbers. One Sweetgum and one Oak. The mil ball ammo punched clean holes but the hunting ammo blew chunks out the back. I used an SKS folder as a truck gun for years. It served me well and is very accurate. I shot a floating piece of firewood sized wood at 200 yds several times. After it passed under the bridge I continued hitting it till it rounded the bend about 200 yds out. Nothing wrong with an SKS's accuracy or hitting power. I keep an M1A as a truck gun now and sometimes a 742 carbine length in '06. 
Dennis, IF you can find a Sporter(uses AK mags) SKS you will like it better. My daughter has mine-gave it to her for her 14th birthday. That gal can shoot rings around most guys. My son used to shoot squirrels in the head with his-so as not to mess up the meat. 
Our next get together is mid summer-make an effort to make it-would love to meet even if you are an old dogface. wc


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

symple-lyfe said:


> I've only gone to the 100 yd range once, and was shocked to hit 80% at that range (I can't see that far typically...just lined up two black things between two white things and held still). I'm definitely still new at this, only had the rifle for a year, and been to the range about 12 times with it. When it comes to distance shooting, I'm thrilled to hit the oblong 8" Shoot'n'See in the middle of a paper target's center mass, so I couldn't tell you anything about grouping. I nearly fell off the bench with excitement when my first shot ever on the 100yd range hit 1 1/2" left of dead center.
> 
> 
> 
> .


I sent you a PM Gideon. Thanks for the invite!!
symple-lyfe, I owe you an apology. I some how missed the 1 1/2" in what you said. That is not bad shooting for a beginner at all. That is good enough to kill a deer (WITH HUNTING AMMO) easy at a hundred yards. :lookout:

Well I found what I want if I can get the money together for it. It grew from trying to find another 100 buck SKS to nearly $500 but if it will do what I think it will I can sell the .06, pay for this one and then still have enough for another SKS and a case of rounds for this rifle. :rock::banana02:

It's an AK-47 Sniper clone, but I think it is in 7.62 x 54 mm instead of the 39mm round. I haven't called them yet. No need to with out the cash in hand but from what I have read at other sites that is what an AES10-B is chambered in. I sure hope this one is. 

With it being a semi automatic most of the kick is gone so I can play with it where as the Remington sets put away all lonely, LOL. 

I have a couple that would buy the .06 whenever I want to sell it. I'm just wondering if the scope will fit this rifle with the right mounts. I haven't seen any AK's with scopes that looked like they were as big as the 40 mm on the Remington. I would really hate to part with that at half of what I have in it. 
I guess I'll find all this out if I scrape the money together to buy this one. If it's not a 7.62 x 54mm I doubt I will buy it. I have my fingers crossed. 

I just had an idea. I have all the paper work for everything on the Remington. Shows everything I put into it and what it cost me. Maybe I should call them and see if they would make a right out swap. I know the .06 is worth more in dollars than this rifle, a SKS, and heck, even two cases of ammo. 
I think I'll do that right now...... I can dig up the receipts and get them faxed to them and try to get Debra, my sister to take a picture of it and fax that too. Heck, it's like brand new except it was built when they built guns right. I haven't fired , shoot, maybe 40 or 50 rounds from it. 75 to 100 rounds tops. 
I know if I settle down and forget about the mule getting ready to kick me and slooooowly pull the trigger I can knock quarters of at 100 yards with it on a sand bag. 

Dad blame-it I just changed my mind again. Lord have mercy. I won't ever get rid of that rifle. Well, something else just came to mind. I haven't made any bets on shooting for a while. Maybe I can find someone new that doesn't know about me and my sweetheart. 
I'll see if I can get something stirred up there. 
Oh well, here we go again, LOL. 
I better get out on my toy tractor, :shrug:

Dennis


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

Does anyone have one of these rifles???? It is at www.classicarms.us .. 

I just called and it is a 7.62 x 39 mm. :Bawling: Boy I was hoping it was the 54 mm round. I hate to spend that much money on a 7.62 x 39 mm rifle. A 54 mm would have been worth it. Ouch. Foiled again. 

It is the first rifle you come to down the page with a bi-pod. If anyone owns one let me know what you think of it. 
I am sure it would reach out at least another 100 yards passed where my best SKS will, but it will never get close to the .06. Dad gum it. 
Well, come to think of it 440 yards is a quarter mile. I have no doubt I could kill a deer at 300 yards with the better of my two sks's. And wound or kill a man on out to 500 yards. I have never tried the really long range with either of them but the rear sights has setting out to 1,100 meters. :shrug: 
With the 24 or so inch barrel I would be willing to bet the farm, "THAT IF" this is an accurate rifle with a good barrel (and it is a long bull barrel) I can kill a deer at 400 yards and wound or kill a person at 600 yards.
Well I am really going to the tractor this time. That gives me a long time to ride around and think, LOL. 
Dennis.


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## WolfWalksSoftly (Aug 13, 2004)

No disrespect, but room for error is a lot different shooting 300 Yards, as opposed to 100.
And at 500 yards.......BIG difference. I hit 13 bulls eyes in a row at 500 yards in BC with the M-16. Then got kicked in the head for missing the 14th.
According to the Army training circular that came with my SKS, the practical range is 400 meters ( no Scope of course).


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

WolfWalksSoftly said:


> No disrespect, but room for error is a lot different shooting 300 Yards, as opposed to 100.
> And at 500 yards.......BIG difference. I hit 13 bulls eyes in a row at 500 yards in BC with the M-16. Then got kicked in the head for missing the 14th.
> According to the Army training circular that came with my SKS, the practical range is 400 meters ( no Scope of course).


Well the tiller just whipped me again so I am back on the gun thing again until I feel like getting back at it again.
Wolf, I didn't see anything you said disrespectful at all. 

I am not sure how good I will be at trying to explain this but it's what I learned in sniper training.
There is 360 degrees in a circle. Each degree has 60 minutes in it. If I am lucky enough to get a rifle that is within 1/2 M.O.A., I will be super happy. Super, super happy that is!!!! :bouncy: But they do have the 23.75" bull barrels. So I might cross my fingers and take the plung. I can probably sell it for 6 or 7 bills if it's not accurate and I don't like it anyway, so I will end up making a little for buying it. Most people don't even know where to find them. I didn't for a while. Heck I was looking for another SKS when I found this site. 

OK::: At 100 yards the circumference is 628 yards. That equals 22,608 inches. 
There are 21,600 minutes of angle in a circle so a rifle that will shoot one minute of angle at 100 yards will be within 1.046 inches from where the rifle is pointed at. 
The shooter has everything in the world to do with where it is pointed at, but where ever the rifle is pointed at, if it truely has a 1 M.O.A. ability it will be within 1.046" of dead center.
That is not counting any wind you have blowing and that gets more compicated fast the further the shot is because the bullet is slowing down it's complete trip and the wind will blow it ever so slightly off course and the slower the bullet gets the more the wind blows it which means the further away from point zero it gets.
According to what you are shooting, wind can blow a bullet off a foot or more at 500 yards where as if there is no wind at all it would hit within the 1M.O.A. That is if you compensate for the drop. Some bullets can kill a deer at 500 yards but will drop 20 or 30" from your line of site before it gets to the deer so you must compensate for the drop.
The difference in drop between 500 and 600 yards may be 18" on some rifles and only 5" on others, such as my 30.06. That is where a range finder comes in handy. 

Now if I am lucky enough to get this rifle with 1/2" M.O.A. accuracy and I have a good scope on it, along with the bi-pod, even with the 39mm shell, I would not want to be the person I was shooting at even out to 1,000 yards. 

Plus the 1.046" at 100 yards is only .523" with a rifle with a 1/2 M.O.A. accuracy. It is the shooter that opens up the spread on the target. I just had the shooters nack. That's why they sent me to school for it. Of course I grew up hunting squirrels with a single shot .22 ,.

So if you have a true 1/2" M.O.A. rifle and can do the calulations for the drop and the wind, you can hit within 5.23" at 1,000 yards if you can shoot that good. For some people it takes practice on top of practice but for me, at least a few years ago I didn't need it. 
I can't see the broad side of a barn now, LOL
JMHO once again
Dennis


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Crafty, are you talking about an sks with a bull barrel? I haven't heard of those.

I've seen bull barrels for .223 and .308 rounds rifles. Also bull barrels for .22's and Thompson Contenders.

When hunting in CO, after elk, I'd have my bullet coefficients, bullet drop, and wind data on a small sheet of paper, laminated onto my rifle butt... I pretty much knew the drops, but knew under duress I'd hate to forget...


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## CGUARDSMAN (Dec 28, 2006)

Gary in ohio said:


> The sks issues has been ask many times at deer/hunting shows and the answer is alwasy the same. Its not humane to hunt deer with the small calibre gun. Deer slug in modern rifle or you can throw some big lead with the muzzleloader


what planet are you from that a 7.62x39 won't take a deer humanely? that is a load of bunk they are essentially equal to the 30-30 whichhas taken more deer in this country than any other....
as far as the op i would suggest looking in pawn shops as they tend to always have 1 or 2.


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## crafty2002 (Aug 23, 2006)

texican said:


> Crafty, are you talking about an sks with a bull barrel? I haven't heard of those.
> 
> I've seen bull barrels for .223 and .308 rounds rifles. Also bull barrels for .22's and Thompson Contenders.
> 
> When hunting in CO, after elk, I'd have my bullet coefficients, bullet drop, and wind data on a small sheet of paper, laminated onto my rifle butt... I pretty much knew the drops, but knew under duress I'd hate to forget...


tex, After you said that I went back and looked. I called it a bull barrel but actually what the add says is heavy barrel sniper rifle. I guess I just associated heavy barrel with bull barrel not thinking. You can see it at www.classicarms.us Just scroll down the page about 1/3 the way until you get to the first AK with a bi-pod on it.
I'd like to have it but I am thinking over $400 for a 7.62 x 39 is just too high. If it were the 7.62 x 54mm that I thought it was to start with I would buy one as soon as I could scrape the money together. 
Yea, it would be harder keeping all that data in this in this empty head of mine now, LOL. When I was in the army my spotter knew more about that than I did and I was pretty good but he was like a dang computer. But then the range finder he was issued probably cost a grand way back then. Maybe two or three time that. My rifle was my baby and his RF was his.
The scope on my .06 has , well it has, I just had a brain freeze as my daughter calls it. The lines below the center line for compensating drop???? Dang it. Well shoot. Anyway, if I know where the 4- 5- 6- 7- and 800 yard taget is, meaning I do know the correct distance I can bust milk jugs at any of them. 
But the .06 doesn't drop as much, not nearly as much as the 7.62 x 39 does plus I don't need to worry nearly as much about the windage either. 
And even if the AK was a 54 mm round it is simi automatic so you loose a little get up and go there. 
You know, I just thought of something, maybe I should spend the money on a really heavy bull barrel and a muzzle brake for it and get ussed to shooting it again. I thought about that a few years ago but never did it and forgot about it. 
I wonder how much reduction in recoil I could get going that route. 
I know normally a 30.06 wouldn't need this, but keep in my I only weigh about 115# and my back has been broke twice plus my shooting shoulder and when I bought the rifle and started spending money to get it just right I was in pretty good shape.
I don't know what I'll do yet if anything. I have a lot of things around here I need to spend what money I have on instead of another gun. What started out looking for a hundred dollar SKS has turned into a nightmare, LOL. 
I think I'll put it on the back burner and let it simmer for a while. 
But thanks for all the sites. At least I have a quick reference if I need it. 
Dennis


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## ricky (Jul 31, 2006)

crafty i have 2 sks here in lynchburg area ill swap for some thing else will throw in ammo and other stuff. let me know thanks ricky


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## WolfWalksSoftly (Aug 13, 2004)

crafty2002 said:


> Wolf, I didn't see anything you said disrespectful at all.


Good, because you have a lot more training than I do.


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## Gideon (Sep 15, 2005)

Glad to see the dust settle. I have a few SKSs/AKs but my deer rifles are -06s in bolts. My mainstay is a Ruger 77 synthetic and sighted in at 220 yds. I have downed deer with an SKS and have no qualms about using them again. Nothing to sneeze about and even have one with scope/bipod that hits well at 200 yds. I do have a couple of 7400s in -06 that I have used for deer but I much prefer the bolts. Way back in 69-70 I shot comp. a bit but my hands were much steadier and eyesight much clearer. Now I just enjoy plinking a bit but still like "putting 'em in the black". If you are close to Sou. NC I know where an SKS "sporter" is for $300(takes AK mags). I have one and like it. We did a range test on -39s a few yrs back. At @ 75 yds we were punching holes in Oak and Gum 4X6s. The hunting rds took out large chunks but the FMJ just punch holes. Again, 39s are nothing to sneeze about. Hope you find a good one-if it is not accurate, don't buy it. Gid. aka 06


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## hunter63 (Jan 4, 2005)

O.K. Y'all talked me into one, 
Yugoslavia SKS M59/66A1 manufactured by the Zastava Ordnance /Red Banner Works from 1967 to 1970.

Been cleaning the whole thing, did find the firing pin sorta garfed up, so am ordering one from Murry's.
http://www.murraysguns.com/sksown.htm

Supposed to prevent popped primers (reloads have softer primers?) and slam fires.
This one apparently did have a problem at one time as the metal was scored where the pin fits into the bolt.

This forum is costing me some money!

Other useful sites:http://will.mylanders.com/shot/sks/index.php3

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu23.htm

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info....ts_id/1377?SID


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## WolfWalksSoftly (Aug 13, 2004)

hunter63 said:


> Yugoslavia SKS M59/66A1 manufactured by the Zastava Ordnance /Red Banner Works from 1967 to 1970.
> 
> ]


Thats the kind I have, not sure where it was made, haven't looked it up.
I'm going to cammo mine soon.


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