# Doesn't someone here have angoras?



## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

I'm thinking about adding them to the flock and I'd love to know more about them from the real world perspective. I've spoken with one breeder who is also an acquaintance and knew I wasn't going to be buying from her and felt like I got a lot from that.

I was thinking too that it would be worth while discussing the relative benefits of using angora in fibre arts. I had no idea how important it was to bohus knitting until my knitting class at OFFF.

Thanks in advance!


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Several of us have angoras. I raise them on a very small scale for fiber and for fiber pets. Lisa Somerhill has a more professional herd, and I believe shows hers as well. A few others have some, but the names escape me at the moment.

I recommend a search of the forum using angoras as a keyword. We've had lots of topics on them, and you may get some of you questions answered...or end up coming up with new questions!

Meg


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

Thanks Meg.


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

You talking the bunnies or the goats?


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

I only have one now but used to have a good sized herd once upon a time.


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

The bunnies.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

What exactly do you want to know?


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

Well... I think the main question I've got is - how much work is the coat, really. I've kept bunnies before so I get the basics. There's a great breeder just a couple of hours west of us and I really like her as well as her flocks (she's got more than just the buns) so I'm feeling like we're going there but I am paranoid a bit about wool block. My plan is to offer hay morning and night - have to do it for the sheep anyway!

So, that's the main thing - how much work are the coats.

Thanks.


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## rabbitgeek (Mar 22, 2008)

flannelberry said:


> So, that's the main thing - how much work are the coats.
> 
> Thanks.


Hay is good. 

If you like playing with the wool, you won't mind the grooming every couple of weeks. If you have a blower to blow the tangles and webs out of the coats it will help.

Check out these site
Angora Rabbit Online Technical Manual
http://www.angorarabbit.com/angora/angora-rabbit-manual/index.htm 

Betty Chu's Angoras - Good angora care tips
http://home.pacbell.net/bettychu


Have a good day!


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## RiverPines (Dec 12, 2006)

It depends on the breed. I have French and English.
The French can get by with once a week grooming.
The English, everyday! LOL Actually I get by with once every 2-3 days. 
English have no guards hairs and mat fast if you slack off.
They also grow the wool everywhere except the head.
French have guard hairs and matting is minimal and they dont grow the wool underneath or on the legs/feet like the English do.
The English has better and longer and a overall, more fiber than the French. 
I get 3 French rabbits of fiber off one English.

I have been raising Angoras for 5 years now and never had wool block. I give hay to prevent it.
A good, course grass hay with a lot of thick stems. It prevents wool block and wears down the teeth which always grow.
I give hay once a day all they can eat. I make sure they have a little left over when I feed it again.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Or you can take my theory on angoras which came from several years of experience of both my friend's and myself.

Once I groom/pluck my rabbits I really don't lay hands on them much again until it is time again for the next grooming/plucking. I do a cursory hands on once over daily to check for various type of things that effect rabbits, clean up any loose hair in the cage, check for fur mites, sore hocks, poop problems you get the idea.

My theory behind this is that every time you handle your rabbit the immediately begin grooming themselves, licking. When they lick they ingest hair and this collects in the stomach. Rabbits cannot throw-up hair balls like cats do and passing the hair can cause a problem and result in death if they get too much hair in their stomach. This is called wool block and it is very tragic and can be difficult to detect until it is too late.

But compared to the average rabbit, angora's are a LOT of work. I have always had French or German angoras. Get a routine going and you will be fine. One nice French will give you a lot of wool to work with throughout the year.


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## Somerhill (Dec 13, 2005)

Dittoe - Marchwind. The only time my French or Satin angoras get groomed is the morning of a show. I do keep an eye on the junior (under a year) coats to make sure they are not matting at the elbows and lower hips, because the softer baby coats do take more care. And I check the adult coats off and on. But I expect a FA coat to stay mat free until it starts to molt out. Then, you really do have to be disciplined to remove it; don't tell yourself -0h, I don't have time this week, I'll wait until next week. 
Can't tell you the last time I dealt with woolblock.........
I feed hay sporadically, and daily greens in the summer. They get a seed mix once a week, and banana slices 2-3 times per week. More of a treat than a treatment. 
Lisa


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Mine have free-choice hay available at all times. Nice coarse Timothy usually, although I'm out of that right now and they've got the Coastal Bermuda the sheep eat until some more Timothy comes in. I've never had a severe case of wool block, but I have had one buck who invariably had issues every summer. For some reason he groomed more summers. 

Mine all get something fresh daily, and pellets for the main diet. Papaya or banana is on the menu at least once a week, for the enzymes.

For grooming, with my French, I mostly limit it to molt time as well. On the young ones, though, I let them mat. How they mat when they're young often tells me what to watch on them as adults. Sounds weird, I know, but between groomings I know to watch Rumplestiltskin for mats in his ruff, Bonnie for armpit and rump mats, Roman on his haunches, and Persephone on her butt. Saves me time in the long run.

Meg


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Their diet is important for good quality/quantity wool production. Not all proteins are alike and an angora needs a good high protein meal. Corn is a no,no, yes it is high in protein but only adds to the weight/fat content of the animal and not to the wool production. Alfalfa, and roast soy beans are good protein sources. The roast soy beans can be hard to find, also linseed and cotton seed are good too. If you have cows and feed Calfmana (sp) you can add a few pellets to their daily feed. Right now I am feeding a combination of 100% alfalfa pellets mixed with, show quality rabbit food and black sunflower seeds. I also feed hay but not very often, I need to get a bale and wild greens and tops and tails of fruit and veggies.

For bedding I like oatstraw, it is soft and doesn't cling to their wool.


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

Thanks you. This is really useful. Our plan is a well sheltered outdoor hutch with rabbit wire flooring. Straw for bedding - I have great straw that I use for lambing. I have tonnes of alfalfa - are the blocks better than alfalfa hay? We snack on roast soybeans and so do the sheep so that will be easy. We have BOSS as a treat for the ducks - rabbits are overlapping very nicely with everything else that we have going on. 

I definitely understand about the molting - the Icelandics do that and if you miss it, you're shearing a mess AND you've lost the wool.

So - here's the other question that came up after all of this very useful info. We're looking at angoras for pets as well as fibre. The idea that handling can increase mats makes perfect sense to me but will playing with them then be a bad thing?

Thanks so much you guys - this is invaluable!


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Just keep in mind that handling them may not cause matts so much as it will cause them to groom themselves, lick their fur. This may will result in them swallowing wool. This is naturally a part of them as rabbits but you want to try to keep it at a minimum. So my philosophy is the less handled the better. You can design an outside pen for them to hop around the yard in the grass and to get some sunshine. Rabbits love to lounge in the sun :baby04:

I would also advise you get them young so they will be used to being handled. l got a rabbit last May and she was an adult when I got her. She isn't like my old rabbits, she bites and isn't used to being flipped over on her back. When I groom my rabbits I like them to be compliant. I like them to be able to lay on their backs without panicking, I like to trim their nails while they are on their backs and groom their bellies then too, and check their nether regions at the same time. There is nothing worse than a panicked rabbit. Their back feet can inflict some serious damage to your arms, be warned. I have had my forearm ripped open a number of times.

Does that help? They are also much healthier if kept outside. I think I live in a similar climate to you and an angora does very well in -40 if they can get out of the wind.


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

This is great you guys. Thanks for the links RG. 

Marchie - I still have a scar on my forearm form one of the bucks I had about 20 years ago! I soooo know what you mean. 

It is so great to get angora specific advice. I had short haired guys and didn't have to think about things like wool block. The breeder I'm getting them from breeds (kindles?) in the house and her daughter is integral in handling them so they're used to it. One breeder I was in contact with had a huge rabbitry and no kids and no real exposure to people. I handled one of hers at OFFF and wasn't impressed.

There's two litters - one's eight weeks and one's twelve. I keep checking my emails for the photos that are going to be coming.

I am so excited - and dh is actually just fine with it. I may have forgotten to mention we are likely getting an unrelated pair but.... shrugs. It's me - what else would the man expect?!

I think I forgot to say we're getting Frenchies. We only get down to about -5-10*C for most of the winter and then usually a cold blast of -30* for two weeks in January. Easy peasy for an angora in a good hutch with straw. I was wondering about wind. The sheep can take anything except cold+wind - that's the only time they head for shelter. 

Lisa - I loved the photos on your page. I have to say - this has made me really glad I didn't opt for the career change - I'm much happier about this than I would be about developing a new policy everyone will gripe about! Now when everyone gripes about a policy it's just a staff of 40 and I can speak to them about it, get their opinions and involvement in the process - and then go home and play with ds and the animals. Speaking of which....

thanks again you guys.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

If you can go for the younger ones. If you have had rabbits before and bred them you know that they can breed at a VERY young age. Once I didn't get the mom separated from the her sons and they bred her, akkkk  I never would let that happen again. So be aware of getting older rabbits you never know what you will end up with, even if the people swear they haven't been exposed to a mate, ha!!!!!!

Make sure you post pictures when you get them.


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

I will definitely get photos going.

So here's one thing - I had never heard that the mum can be separated from the babies except one feeding a day. Is that true? I don't recall the mum's being overly maternal but that seems a bit much. I was just reading that online.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

I'm not sure why you would want to separate the mum from the babes. The only time I ever bothered either one what if I wanted to check out the babes and do a head count or check color. I always waited for the mum to get off the nest and to be occupied with some food then I would look at the babes. But I never handled them until they were a few days old, maybe a week. Some mums were much more attentive and protective of the babes then others. I left them alone as much as possible. I figured if they were that nervous then I didn't need them abandoning the litter or killing the babes. I was also very careful to document breedings so I knew almost to the day when they would have them. I made sure I had the mum set up with the nest box and plenty of straw for nesting at least a week preferably two before the babes were due and then I never moved her or changed anything when she was about two weeks out. I had litters reabsorbed or births go awry and lost the whole lot. I don't know how other rabbits are when it comes to breeding but angoras can be touchy, you gotta know your does well.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

I've talked to breeders who take the nest box out and return it morning and evening for nursing. I don't. I do check my nest boxes daily. None of my does are the least bit bothered by my checking the kits. And just that tad of handling makes for sweet, curious babies. Especially as soon as their eyes are open and your hand starts bringing nibbles!

I'm not in cold country, but my rabbits are kept outdoors, and each has a wooden hide box to get in if they want. The bottom is open, so I don't have to worry about them soiling it. But it holds in body heat in winter, and certainly blocks wind or blowing rain. I can come out after a storm has blown across the rabbit house, and every bun will be dry, even though their food and hay will be soaked.


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## Somerhill (Dec 13, 2005)

I think there are 2 main reasons some people remove the nestbox and only take it to the doe once/twice a day. 
One is that the babies get handled a lot more, and are more socialized.
The other is that you don't take the chance of having a kit get dragged out of the nestbox and chilled before its found, or accidently stomped by mom, or eaten by a rat/snake etc.
It seems to have become a "fad" with angora breeders after one very well known breeder started doing it. With some show quality stock selling for $300-400 each, it makes sense to protect your investment.

I've never done it - its not in my nature to interfere that much. 
Lisa


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

That's good to know you guys. Lisa - I'm with you. I have selected for animals I don't have to interfer with! It seems contrary somehow.


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