# Upgrade



## doc623 (Jun 7, 2004)

I need to upgrade from MS Melllenium/2000 to something more current.
Suggestions?
XP - home or professional?
Vista?
And where would I find the best buy?
Tks


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## OntarioMan (Feb 11, 2007)

A few thoughts :

- depending on the specs of your computer (speed, memory, drive, etc.), it may not be a wise investment to upgrade the operating system
- purchasing an operating system, whether its XP or Vista, on its own is extremely expensive
- the most affordable way to get a new operating system is to purchase another system (either off-lease or new)
- many older systems are simply too underpowered to even run Vista


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## pixelphotograph (Apr 8, 2007)

if you are using the same computer and want to upgrade from millenium its doubtful your computer could handle vista not to mention the hardware problems.
I would stick with xp home its good simple and should be no problems from millenium to xp home.
i wouldnt get pro unless you need the extra networking capabilities it has.


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

Unless you have to run a specific program that requires Windows, it might be a good time to switch to Linux. The learning curve is similar to going from Windows 2000 to XP, it's much more stable than Windows, and Linux and tons of software for it are all free. The software that's included on the CD reads & writes all the usual Windows file formats -- Word, Excel, etc. You don't have to trash your Windows to install Linux, you can install it in a "dual boot" setup so you can boot either Windows or Linux.

http://www.pclinuxos.com


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

doc623 said:


> I need to upgrade from MS Melllenium/2000 to something more current.
> Suggestions?
> XP - home or professional?
> Vista?
> ...


If your using the computer that came with the ME or 2000, my bet is your computer is to old for either XP or Vista. You may find that its cheaper to buy a computer with XP already installed. Unless your computer is just a year old, vista isnt an option without an upgrade, you might squeeze out a XP load on your existing system but your going to need at least 256mb of memory, MORE is better.

A full legal copy of XP or vista will cost you $125 or more. 

Depending on what you do with your machine Linux is an option, but being a little computer savy helps if you go this route.


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

backwoodsman7 said:


> Unless you have to run a specific program that requires Windows, it might be a good time to switch to Linux. The learning curve is similar to going from Windows 2000 to XP,


No its not. I have been on computers since the late 1980s and I consider myself very, VERY adept at them. I put Mandrake on one of my older systems and I couldn't find ANYTHING and I couldn't make ANYTHING work (especially printers and modems). It was the biggest exercise is frustration I have ever experienced in connection with a computer. I deleted the program and never looked back.

Linux is NOT all it's cracked up to be. Sorry. I am not a big Windows fan either (I cut my teeth on DOS), but at least it WORKS (most of the time, anyway), and you can find what you are looking for.

donsgal


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

donsgal said:


> No its not. I have been on computers since the late 1980s and I consider myself very, VERY adept at them. I put Mandrake on one of my older systems and I couldn't find ANYTHING and I couldn't make ANYTHING work (especially printers and modems). It was the biggest exercise is frustration I have ever experienced in connection with a computer. I deleted the program and never looked back.


With all due respect, it's a bit imprudent to make such blanket statements based on such extremely limited (and outdated) experience -- especially on a forum such as this, where less knowledgeable folks are looking for advice. Several Linux distros have come out in the last couple years or so that completely solve the problems you had with Mandrake.

I use & recommend PCLinuxOS because it's arguably the best regarding ease of installation, hardware support, multimedia support, etc. The user interface (KDE) is pretty similar to Windows -- icons, mouse, menu, taskbar, etc. -- and all most users have to do is learn 3 or 4 different places to click to do their tasks. I've switched a number of non-computer-people friends to it, and none have had any problems finding anything or doing anything they want to do on their computer. Most didn't even have to call me with questions.

One caveat regarding modems: If you use a modem, and it's a winmodem, then Linux may or may not be able to use it. So you may have to buy a new modem. But a _real_ modem (not a winmodem) can be had on Ebay for $10-$15 including shipping -- a small price to pay for all the advantages Linux offers over Windows.



> Linux is NOT all it's cracked up to be. Sorry. I am not a big Windows fan either (I cut my teeth on DOS), but at least it WORKS (most of the time, anyway), and you can find what you are looking for.


A very short time reading this forum will leave any Linux user wondering why on earth so many people still put up with all the problems & aggravation they have with Windows, when they can get a stable, dependable operating system like Linux for free.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

backwoodsman7 said:


> The learning curve is similar to going from Windows 2000 to XP, it's much more stable than Windows, and Linux and tons of software for it are all free.


Most Linux people confuse learning curve with using curve. True, Linux is pretty easy to use and the using curve is similar to windows. The Learning curve of how Linux or windows works is much harder and I think windows wins out on this area because every users with windows XP has the same look and feel. Not so for Linux, one flavor of Linux use kde, one uses cde another gnome. The users and management interface is different and can causes issues. Do you use rpm, tar.gz or zip for your installs. Lots of differences between distros.

I have been managing Unix boxes of one flavor or another for 27 years and currently mange over 300 Unix boxes for a financial company. Linux is not Linux. Linux has advantages and disadvantages and they are both the same, flexibility.


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## pixelphotograph (Apr 8, 2007)

please do not switch to linux unless you are a power user and like a challenge. It will only make you frustrated.
I use both linux and windows have for years. I keep up on the latest and greatest and beta and alpha test things when they first come out.
For the average user that is not a good idea.
if you know windows stick with windows.
I'm not knocking linux I like it but use what you already know and are comfortable with.
Windows XP is very stable and has been around for many years.


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## Labrat407 (Aug 24, 2007)

I do most of my work on Windows systems, and from what you are asking I would recommend a new XP system (new or off lease) You can get some great deals on XP Pro machines. If you are a Gamer then you might have to get a Vista machine with the new Graphics cards.
Look to a company like Newegg or TigerDirect. They have some great deals and sometimes have free delivery.

Now for LINUX, If you tried Mandrake many years ago I think you will be surprised by things now.
I would recommend you look for a distrobution called Ubuntu. This is an easy to install (Even a Live CD) OS. It would probably boost the performance of your old system a lot. Updates and application install is point and click now, no more TAR and such unless you are really hacking the Kernel.

If you can download and burn a CD (Live version: this means it will install only in Memory and be gone when you turn off the computer.) See how you like it.

Ubuntu


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

Gary in ohio said:


> Not so for Linux, one flavor of Linux use kde, one uses cde another gnome.


So what? Install Linux, use KDE, and be done with it. All the software most folks will need comes right on the CD, installs when you install Linux, and is on a well-organized menu where everything is easy to find. If you're so inclined, try some of the other interfaces & software; if you're not, don't. What's the problem? It's not like there's some law that says every new Linux user has to wade through a morass of choices, and try every option available.



> Do you use rpm, tar.gz or zip for your installs.


No, I use the point & click software package manager, just like every other Linux user who wants to _use_ his computer, not make a hobby of hacking it. Find the software you want, click it, click OK, and you're done. Same with updates.



> Lots of differences between distros.


Again, so what? You only need one, and it's right here: http://www.pclinuxos.com



> I have been managing Unix boxes of one flavor or another for 27 years and currently mange over 300 Unix boxes


Then you certainly know Unix a lot better than I do, but with all due respect, your knowledge of the current state of Linux is quite outdated.

These days, anyone who can put a CD in a drive and go through a few simple menus & dialog boxes can install and use Linux (but of course, you have to start with the right Linux). With the live CD, you don't even have to install it to try it out. So there's not a reason in the world why just about anyone shouldn't at least take a look at Linux.


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## doc623 (Jun 7, 2004)

I am now where I can add info to see if this helps the original question.
I currently have:
MS Windows ME
4.90.3000
Intel(r)
Celeron Processor
63.0 MBRAM

If this helps any?
TKS in advance.


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

doc623 said:


> Celeron Processor
> 63.0 MBRAM


You'll need a lot more memory than that to upgrade to anything. 256MB is a practical minimum for either XP or Linux. You can get by with somewhat less, but you don't really want to.

You didn't say how fast the processor is; if it's much less than around 500mHz, you won't be happy with the performance, even with a memory upgrade. In any case, you don't want to put more than a minimal amount of money into that machine.

The least expensive thing you can do: Upgrade the memory to 256MB, because the memory modules for that computer are basically throwaway items and a computer store might just give them to you, although they'll charge you something to install them. Then install Linux, specifically PCLinuxOS because it does better than most I've tried on slow machines, among other reasons.

If you want to do more than that, it's time for a new (used) machine. But, if you want XP, make sure the XP CD comes with it, or you won't be able to reinstall XP when it crashes or gets all choked up by viruses etc. (and it _will_ do one or the other, sooner or later -- probably the best reason to move to Linux now, when it'll be easiest).


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## pixelphotograph (Apr 8, 2007)

You definately need to buy more memory no matter what you do.
63 probably 64 mb of ram isnt enough to run most newer operating systems.
Forget Vista unless you are buying a new computer.
XP will run fine with 256 so will most versions of linux.
I would probably go with 512 mb of ram because it is so cheap these days and you will notice the performance boost.
stick with what you know.
go with XP Home


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

doc623 said:


> I am now where I can add info to see if this helps the original question.
> I currently have:
> MS Windows MECeleron Processor 63.0 MBRAM


Your machine will not support XP. I also bet your disk is to small as well.
By the time you add memory, disk and buy XP you have a system with a bare minimum speed CPU and have spent more than a new system would cost.

YOU MIGHT get buy with running linux but your still memory short for any usagle graphics based linux.


I just picked up a used P4, 2.8ghz, 40gb disk, 512mb ram, XP pro COA shipped for under $130. If you want to play the rebate games Tiger direct has $240 shipped systems new and for under $400 new from dell with a monitor.


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## Labrat407 (Aug 24, 2007)

If you are looking for a deal look at Dell Auction , Most have a valid warranty and support options for people looking for a low cost machine with support. Read the FAQ to see if you would benefit from this offer.

You should be looking for a system that at least has:
1.8 GHz processor (AMD or Intel)
40 GB HDD (maybe a larger secondarry drive)
512 MB Ram
Extra PCI/PCIe slots
Extra SATA or IDE (allows extra DVD drives and HDD's)
built in Video (256 MB or better) and Network (10/100 or 10/100/1000) (although it would be worth it to have seperate cards added for redundancy and speed (les work on the CPU))
USB2 (should be standard on all new Motherboards)
DVD Burnner (will do CD's as well)
Recovery CD or original XP Pro CD

Hope this helps


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## comfortablynumb (Nov 18, 2003)

you need a new system.
or at the least, just an new motherboard, processor and memory.
that upgrade will cost you @ $200

the XP home basic (which can be upgraded with add ons) is generally the most stable average user Os you will find.

price now.... look on Ebay for an second hand original disk with a cerificate, you can get oone for @ 30 to 50 bucs or less.

I Just gave away a XP home disk I had around here..

and, there is always WaReZ, they are free.

however, linux is quickly coming to the front of the user market so..... it might not be a bad move to go linux.

try "PClinuxOS" it looks and works very much like windows 98/me/xp.

and no virus or malware/trojan problems.


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## OntarioMan (Feb 11, 2007)

You need a new computer - with a Microsoft operating system (either XP or Vista).

Off-lease computers are also an option - if you go this route, be sure it has some kind of warranty. Some off-lease systems come ready to run with the operating system already installed, and some come with a COA only (Windows certificate of authenticity = license) and there is nothing actually loaded on the hard drive. 



doc623 said:


> I am now where I can add info to see if this helps the original question.
> I currently have:
> MS Windows ME
> 4.90.3000
> ...


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

doc623 said:


> I am now where I can add info to see if this helps the original question.
> I currently have:
> MS Windows ME
> 4.90.3000
> ...


 One very important thing here people are forgetting to add. Is your system is small and old, Which Probably means your printer maybe also that old? If so No printer, scanner, or copier that is that old will be able to be upgraded to XP say nothing about VISTA,~!
No Drivers will be available IF and I say IF Your Other pieces of equipment is that old also.
So that may mean not only getting a new machine either XP or Vista, but most new machines are with Vista not XP anymore, but even finding one with XP no drivers for older printers may not be available so you may have to get a new Printer, etc.


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## doc623 (Jun 7, 2004)

WaReZ?


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

> doc623]WaReZ?





> "Warez" refers primarily to virtual copyrighted material *traded in violation of copyright law*. The term generally refers to illegal releases by organized groups, as opposed to peer-to-peer file sharing between friends or large groups of people with similar interest using a Darknet.


 Not worth it in my book~!


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## Mechanic Intern (Jun 10, 2007)

backwoodsman7 said:


> Unless you have to run a specific program that requires Windows, it might be a good time to switch to Linux. The learning curve is similar to going from Windows 2000 to XP, it's much more stable than Windows, and Linux and tons of software for it are all free. The software that's included on the CD reads & writes all the usual Windows file formats -- Word, Excel, etc.


I know that's right!!:rock: LINUX RULES!!!:rock:


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

backwoodsman7 said:


> Then you certainly know Unix a lot better than I do, but with all due respect, your knowledge of the current state of Linux is quite outdated.
> 
> These days, anyone who can put a CD in a drive and go through a few simple menus & dialog boxes can install and use Linux (but of course, you have to start with the right Linux). With the live CD, you don't even have to install it to try it out. So there's not a reason in the world why just about anyone shouldn't at least take a look at Linux.


I am fully aware of what distro out out there and my comments are still accurate. Yes you use a live CD and see what it looks like and yes you can load it with just a few key strokes. As I said user curve is pretty easy. Actually supporting it is much harder for the average joe. NONE of the instruction that come with devices will work since they are windows based, none of the friends help is any good (unless they know your distro) of unix. your online help must be for your distro or the average person is going to be even more confused. As for point and click application installs, again that is great if you get the one bunded for your OS, but if find one out in the wild, forget it for the average user. The average user is fine until something isnt right then linux desktop falls apart. It takes someone with knowledge to fix the problem. I have rolled out hundred of linux desktops for people who are well educated and versed in how to use windows. It can be a support nightymare. Even with pclinux pc look there is still going to be issue the average user isnt going to fix.

I have said many times, the stenght of linux is its fault, There are to ways to do the same thing, two many window manager options, to many admin manager tools, to many different programs that do the same thing.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

comfortablynumb said:


> you need a new system.
> or at the least, just an new motherboard, processor and memory.
> that upgrade will cost you @ $200
> 
> ...


Seriously looking at PDLinuxOS for an old laptop. What kind of specs does it take to run it effectively? Any ideas? How would it run on a P3?


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

ZealYouthGuy said:


> Seriously looking at PCLinuxOS for an old laptop. What kind of specs does it take to run it effectively? Any ideas? How would it run on a P3?


A friend of mine runs it on a 533mhz Celeron with 192MB RAM. It's a bit sluggish, but useable. That's not really enough memory -- you really want at least 256MB. If it's useable on a Celeron 533, I'd expect it to do about the same on a 400mhz Pentium 2, but that's pretty close to the extreme low end. I use it on a couple P3's at 800mhz & 1.2ghz, and it works great.


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## comfortablynumb (Nov 18, 2003)

http://www.pclinuxos.com/

requires:
An IBM PC with:

* 8 GB of free disk space
* 512 MB of memory
* a CD or DVD drive
* a network card (NIC) 

given that it will run on pretty much anything.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

comfortablynumb said:


> http://www.pclinuxos.com/
> 
> requires:
> An IBM PC with:
> ...


XP will load into that config.


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## backwoodsman7 (Mar 22, 2007)

comfortablynumb said:


> http://www.pclinuxos.com/
> requires:
> * 8 GB of free disk space
> * 512 MB of memory
> * a network card (NIC)


I've seen this in the wiki, but I don't know why they say so much memory & drive space are required. It runs fine with 256MB, although of course more is better. And 4 or 5 GB of disk is plenty if you're not going to store a lot of large files on the same partition. The old version would install on a 3GB partition, but I haven't tried that with the current version. And, a network card is NOT required unless, of course, you have broadband.


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