# Bees dying fast....heeeelp!



## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

I got my bees on monday afternoon, installed them tuesday early afternoon. I had a feeling that these bees weren't doing well. I've seen no activity around the hive except for a few bees flying out and then dropping to the ground dead.

Today there was a lot of dead bees on the floor near the entrance so I felt that I should open it up and have a look. I first checked the feeder ( the bucket type that sits on top of the inner cover) and there was a huge block of dead bees packed in front of it. I then opened the hive to find dead and dying bees everywhere. I'd say about half the hive appears dead or barely moving. I removed a couple of frames and none of them even flew. The live ones are moving slowly. Their feces is everywhere, all over the inside, the outside and the frames (not sure if thats normal).

I have removed the bucket type feeder and I'm brewing up a new batch of syrup to put in a top feeder. Maybe that'll help IDK.

Weather has been cold, it dropped to freezing last night...these are louisiana bees so maybe that had something to do with it, IDK. Any advice? I'm about to call the guy who sold me these bees and tell him what happened.

This is very disappointing.



PS

I thought the bees seemed weak when I installed them...it went a little TOO easily, none of them flew and they all just kind of flopped into the hive.


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## Cascade Failure (Jan 30, 2007)

I'm pretty new at this but I wouldn't open my hive if it was too cold. Some dead are normal. So is limited activity in cold weather.

I would leave them alone until a warmer day (45+) and see how they act then.

Good luck. I'm sure those with more experience will be along soon.


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## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

OK I think I just panicked a little. I called the apiary that sold me these bees. The guy advised me to roll a sugar ball and put it between two of the frames in case they weren't getting to the food.

I rolled the ball and as I was coming back I noticed the bees were buzzing all over the place ( I removed the pale feeder and they were all over that ). I reopened the hive and put in the ball ( they were very lively ) and replaced the pale feeder. It is about 46 degrees now and sunny...going up to 57 today.

I think that they were just in a tight ball and sluggish because it was so cold last night. I know I'm not supposed to be fussing with them or opening the hive so soon....rookie mistake. I'm going to leave them alone now for a full week.


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## mare (Aug 31, 2006)

glad to hear that---i can see myself doing that when i get mine. how did you "roll a sugar ball"?


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## charmd2 (Apr 14, 2011)

Take the pail feeder out if it is getting that cold. It contracts in the cold dropping cold water on top of the bees. Until temps are above 55 consistantly I only feed fondant or outside the hive feeding.


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## blaineiac (Jan 10, 2010)

I really agree with the outside the hive feeding. I've had some bad robbing situations feeding in the hive, especially when using honey bee healthy. I think the extra condensation killed one last year. I only feed in the yard now and have been getting by pretty good. I'm learning too. Keep us posted so we can all learn. Thanks Blaine


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## AverageJo (Sep 24, 2010)

I'd be interested in your rolling a ball as well. Never heard of that but it seems pretty cool to be able to stuff it between a couple of frames if necessary. Would like to hear from more experienced folks as well.


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## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

I roll the ball like a dough ball. i'm using powdery sugar that I got from the apiary that sold me the bees. Its like 'confectionary' sugar its great because it dissolves almost instantly in hot water.

He is in a slightly colder climate than me, and he said that in the very cold, the bees cannot move from their tight ball to reach the food sometimes. He rolls a ball ( little bit of water in the sugar and roll it like dough ) and places it in between the frames where they gather mostly.

Anyway, i put one in so it can't hurt. Now I'm gonna leave them alone until next week.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

*DO NOT OPEN THE HIVE WITH TEMPS BELOW 45F.* Even with temps of 45F you should not open the hive if there is a cold wind.

The weather here in the northern areas of the country has been very ugly. Lots of rain and cold, keeps the bees in their cluster, to wet to have them flying potty breaks.
I would find it odd finding they had went potty inside the hive. I would have alarms going off big time over that, since in the winter they go many weeks with out doing cleansing flights.

In the winter of 2008 we lost 66% of our bees and a friend lost 287 colonies out of 500 to Nosema Creana. Potty all over in & outside the hives, sluggish bees that were not eatting syrup.

I would gather up some of the dead bees and send them to Beltsville Maryland and have them checked out by the USDA bee lab. Your taxes pay for the service, shipping cost is small when you use the cassett flat rate box.

http://www.ars.usda.gov/Main/site_main.htm?modecode=12-75-05-00


 Al


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## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

alleyyooper said:


> *DO NOT OPEN THE HIVE WITH TEMPS BELOW 45F.* Even with temps of 45F you should not open the hive if there is a cold wind.
> 
> The weather here in the northern areas of the country has been very ugly. Lots of rain and cold, keeps the bees in their cluster, to wet to have them flying potty breaks.
> I would find it odd finding they had went potty inside the hive. I would have alarms going off big time over that, since in the winter they go many weeks with out doing cleansing flights.
> ...


Hmm after looking it up the symptoms do appear to resemble nosema apis. The spotting on the outside of the hive, the large amount of dead bees out front, and so many of them crawling not flying.

This is very distressing. Thanks for the link, but really if they have nosema what can I really do ( besides suing the apiary)? I've read that by the time it shows it can be difficult or impossible to treat.

What can be done for Nosema? I've read the Fumigilin is more of a preventative thing.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Nosema apis can be treated by feeding Fumigilin B in a syrup mix.
Nosema Creana how ever requires a totaly different method of treatment since they have stopped eatting.
You have to let their hygiene trait to take over. Mix syrup and Fumigilin B per instructions, place it in a spray bottle and spray the bees heavely & the frames and comb. They will start cleaning each other off and injest some of the mix while doing so. You have to do that every week for at least 3 weeks. Even then there is nothing to say they will make it. I have had better than 80% make it.

As far as sueing you would need proof the bees are indeed sick. Only way to establish that is have witnesses as you collect a sample of dead bees. Package them per instructions per the Beltsville web site and send them in. Last I knew Beltsville did not inform you if your bees died from Nosema Apis or Creana just Nosema.

 Al


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## Durandal (Aug 19, 2007)

The Beltsville Bee Lab does list Nosema A. or Nosema C. It did not used to but does now and I think has been for at least the last two years. I send samples every year. Its free other than shipping and shipping isn't all that bad.

Never positive for either. Spotting happens a lot and does not mean its Nosema. I've had the bees so cramped up inside that they relieve on the top of frames. Very bad dysentery but not Nosema....yet. Hate to curse myself.


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