# Feeding Dehydrated/scouring/weak calves



## Guest

Figured I would do this in another thread. Easier for anyone who is interested to read.

First off let me start off with a bit of background on myself. I have been involved in the cattle industry for over 15 years, 10 of those I have been raising my own animals. We (DH and I) run 150 cow/calf pairs at the moment, and have calved over 300 at times. So I have a lot of experience with dealing with weak/dehydrated calves. Scours are not a real big problem for us, but when dealing with that many animals in March/April in our climate we always see a few cases. 

If the case is bad enough the only thing you can do, that MAY save the calf is to take him to the vet, where it can be put on IV. That is expensive, but we have done it. If it is viral scours, it may be your only choice, unless you know how to do an IV, which we don't.

We have saved a # of calves with the following routine.
Depending on how bad and how young they are, we may/may not stop feeding milk. Personally I think they need milk, when they are down and out as bad as some of them can get, electrolytes just don't give them the energy they need to fight. I will reduce the amount I feed though.
So, 
1. If it is scours get the calf on some sort of antibiotics. I prefer Sustain III boluses, but we have used Nuflor with success (on the vet's advice). There are other good scour medications out there though, so find one.

2. Reduce the amount of milk you are feeding, and preferrably, water it down some. But continue to feed on the regular schedule. Tube if you have to. 500 - 1000 ml (1/2 - 1 quart) is a good amount for these weak calves

3. Get them on electrolytes, but DON'T feed the electrolytes as the instructions tell you. 

Instead, divide the electrolytes into 1/3 - 1/4 doses. Mix according to instructions. I find it best to mix as needed, rather than mix the entire batch at once. If you divide most of these electrolytes by 4 the amount you should be feeding will be about 500 ml (1/2 quart)

I find it best to feed every 2-4 hours depending on the calf. If you are feeding milk at 8 am, 3 pm and 10 pm (which is our schedule) continue that schedule. But, in between feed a dose of electrolytes at at least 11 am and 6 pm. If possible feed 2 doses between each feeding. And if possible give them a dose about 2 hours before the first milk feeding.

Remember, that if the calf is very weak, you will HAVE to tube it. If it is cold weather, do your best to keep the calf from getting chilled. Once they get chilled it is very hard to bring them back. Cover them with an old blanket at the very least. On the other hand, if it is hot outside, make sure the calf does not get overheated either, that will just exacerbate the dehydration problem.

My reason for dividing the electrolyte dose is this. And I learned it the hard way. Most packages of electrolytes tell you to mix them with 1500-2000 ml (1.5-2 quarts) of water. On really sick calves, their digestive system is already stressed, and I believe that by feeding them that much liquid, the digestive system will shut down. I have lost numerous calves when fed that way, since I have changed to feeding many smaller doses, we have saved most of the calves. It is a lot of work, but you can save those weak calves.....


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## Guest

Thought that I had posted this on here before, but I guess I didn't.....

Got the new Canadian Cattlemen Calving issue yesterday. It has a really good article on dehydration, so I will try to paraphrase the important stuff. 

Conditions that increase the need for water(liquids) 
- scours 
- high environmental temperature 
- feeding milk replacer with MORE than 15% solids 

Mild scours may only cause the calf to lose an extra litre of water, but a severe case can lose as much as 8 litres (2 gallons) in one day. Since the calf is only drinking milk he cannot replace that much of a loss. 

Signs of dehydration 
- depression 
-slow to get up at feeding time 
- tacky mucous membranes 
- nose is drier than normal 
- skin tents and doesn't snap back in less than 3 seconds 
- 3-5 seconds = mild dehydration (5% dehydration) 
- 6-7 seconds = moderate dehydration. Eyes will also be sunken in (7% dehydration) 
- more than 7 seconds = severe dehydration, eyes are quite sunken, no suckle reflex, cannot stand. (10% dehydration) 

Treatment 

For mild dehydration the calf needs at least 2 litres (100 lb calf) of liquids which can be given orally as long as the calf can stand without assistance, has some suckle reflex, and has no abdominal distension. 

A calf with moderate dehydration needs at least 3 litres (100 lb calf) of liquids. These can be given orally if it can stand, suckle a bit, and abdomen isn't distended. If those requirements aren't met the liquids can be administered sub cutaneously with sterile liquids designed for IV use. 

Severely dehydrated calves will require 4.5 litres of fluid to be given IV. If the calf responds well to the initial IV treatment can be continued orally. 

Besides correcting the dehydration the calf will also need enough liquids to maintain hydration. A calf needs 10% of his bodyweight every day in liquids. A 45 kg(100 lb) calf needs 4.5L of fluids every day. This is in addition to anything given to combat dehydration. 

Fluids can be milk OR electrolytes. If electrolytes are given orally as well as milk separate the feedings by at least 2 hours to allow the milk to clot and digest normally. 

Finally, dehydrated calves are usually hypothermic as well, so it is a good idea to warm the electrolyte solution to body temperature before administering them. This will combat hypothermia, and will likely make the calf feel better faster.


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## topside1

Randiliana, you have a PM


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## vintage mom

I have used this same treatment, only I use water as opposed to electrolytes, cutting the milk to half and replacing the liquid with water as well. In the really bad cases I have had some succes using about one tablespoon of cinnimon added to the milk. Dont ask me how, but it does work.


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## Valmai

I realise you do things differently in the US but I would NEVER mix milk and electrolites. Be it viral or bacterial, scours are caused by irritation to the stomach and 'plumbing', and milk is the most common cause of onset of that irritation. You need to cure the irritation before putting more milk in the calf's gut. A calf will die of dehydration more quickly than it will die of starvation. The calf can survive without milk for the 1 or 2 days required to cure the irritation. If the calf is getting weak I mix honey and or glucose in warm water to give in conjunction with the electrolites. 
Cinnimon is a 'carrier' and helps other 'things' to be absorbed more quickly into the blood stream.
BTW I have never given a calf antibiotics for just scours, there has to be another health issue before I will do that. And yes I have yet to lose a calf to 'just' scours.


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## Ronney

I have just read this thread and would agree with Valmai. On the rare occasion I have a calf with scours it comes off milk completely and under no circumstances do I mix the two together. 

Cheers,
Ronnie


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## topside1

I'm undecided on this issue, I used to be a strong believer on, no dairy products period for 48-72 hours. But after reading countless articles by Vets, and University groups around the country they concur that you should continue to serve milk at regular interval, but to water down the amount and cut the quantity back. Also feed any type of hydration fluid throughout the day, noon would be best....the jury is still out on my farm.


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## Guest

Valmai said:


> I realise you do things differently in the US but I would NEVER mix milk and electrolites. Be it viral or bacterial, scours are caused by irritation to the stomach and 'plumbing', and milk is the most common cause of onset of that irritation. You need to cure the irritation before putting more milk in the calf's gut. A calf will die of dehydration more quickly than it will die of starvation. The calf can survive without milk for the 1 or 2 days required to cure the irritation. If the calf is getting weak I mix honey and or glucose in warm water to give in conjunction with the electrolites.
> Cinnimon is a 'carrier' and helps other 'things' to be absorbed more quickly into the blood stream.
> BTW I have never given a calf antibiotics for just scours, there has to be another health issue before I will do that. And yes I have yet to lose a calf to 'just' scours.




I am afraid that you are incorrect that scours are just a result of milk. The vast majority of scours are caused by bacteria, or virus. If you are dealing with bacterial scours, you should be treating with antibiotics. They will help the calf to fight the bug. If it is viral, all you can do is to treat the symptoms, in which case the biggest problem is dehydration. Scours can also be caused by Neospora, Coccidiosis and other hard to treat bugs. And of course by milk, although, IMO milk scours really aren't anything major to worry about, so long as the calf is still acting healthy.

I am a firm believer in feeding milk. Especially if the calf is very young. A young calf won't last long without food. We had a twin calf born this spring, that did not get enough colostrum. He ended up with scours before he was a week old. Had I cut out the milk we were feeding him, he would not have made it. He was to the point of being limp, and when I fed him his milk you could see the difference, he would gain strength. I certainly don't see how you can expect a calf to gain strength while you are starving it.


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## menollyrj

First, let me say that I am still learning about calves, but have been sitting at my MIL's knee (figuratively speaking) for about 5 years now, raising calves. Here's her (and now my) take on scours...FWIW...

If possible, catch it early. Dose with LA-200 or other antibiotic. Make a 2 qt bottle using half the recommended milk powder amount & add the recommended electrolyte for 1 qt of water (basically a half milk/half electrolyte 2 qt bottle). To this bottle, add a crushed Lomotil (yes, human medicine from drug store) to slow the gut (and slow water loss). Sometimes we also add Sulmet (appropriate portion of a crushed bolus for calf's weight) to the milk/electrolyte bottle. Feed this mixture for at least a day, looking for the stool to firm up to within reasonable limits (sometimes, calf stools are a bit on the loose side but still within normal range). Return to milk bottle, but mix at 3/4 strength. If severely dehydrated, offer 1 qt of water once or twice during the day (between the twice-daily feeding). 

IMHO, treating calves with scours is as much an art as a science, and everyone likes different types of art, so there are many different ways to effectively treat scours. Do what works.

-Joy


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## Valmai

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on not mixing milk and electrolites. I should have expressed myself better regarding the cause of scours. Milk expecially 'off or sour' milk is an excellent media for growing bugs of all types. So to me it seems wasteful to pump a calf full of antibiotics to kill the bugs, electrolites to keep it hydrated, then add more milk to keep the bugs alive. The longer the calf must battle the infection the more energy it uses, and the weaker it becomes. I cant remember the times for calves, but for humans - a person can die of dehydration in 48 hours but take something like 40/50(ish) days to die of starvation.


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## topside1

Joy, well said.

IMHO, treating calves with scours is as much an art as a science, and everyone likes different types of art, so there are many different ways to effectively treat scours. Do what works.

-Joy[/QUOTE]


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## Pallyshire

I'm still really new at this but I've had good luck with two milk feedings and an electrolyte feeding in the middle of the day. When I tried the no milk thing my calf just got worse and almost died on me so I switched him back to having milk with electros in the middle. I think it depends on severity and the calf. 

Now quick question pertaining to the antibiotics. Does it affect the meat when we treat them. I usualy use scour and pneumonia treatement for mine. Does that count as an antibiotic?


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## rniare

Good luck with your calf. We have had so many tough times with the bottle calves we have bought and lost from the sale barn. I have to share the first baby we dont have to bottle feed. Mama is gonna do it for us. This pretty little girl was born just yesterday, of course in a nasty cold snow storm. Is it really Spring? I have seen all the cute pics of everyones babies. I finally get to post one of my own!


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## bigmudder77

i use to feed one day responce and no milk for 12 to 24 hours but now i feed dump milk from a dairy farm and one day responce but i tested it out on 2 calves that were very bad with scours and just feed dump milk one drank the whole bottle the other drank half a bottle for 2 days 4 feeding by the 3rd day the one that drank only half drank the whole bottle for the am feeding and by the pm feeding drank the whole bottle and was up jumping had solid normal calf poop and is doing great now the other one that was drinking the whole bottle was better in a day 

we had a rough winter and we lost some calves but we thought it was the milk replacer so we swiched to a better one same problem so we switched to dump milk from 3 dairy farms havnt lost one calf when feeding that and they seem to get bigger faster and get off to a way better start than when on milk replacer 

some people told me im killing the calves slow cause of it being dump milk others have said it should be fine if you get it cooled fast enough so bactera dont form and others have said they would rather feed store bought milk before they feed dump milk 

well it works for me and knock on wood i havnt had any looses since we started doing that and its whatever milk new moms treated whatever and these calves go crazy for it and seem to do great with no added scour stuff


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