# Personal carry weapon



## PrettyPaisley

I'm trying to decide between a .22 magnum and a .38 as a carry weapon. I'm reading that a .22 doesn't have enough power to stop the way a .38 does but I don't know what to think. 

Another concern is having a revolver as they never have a safety. I can't help but worry about that having little ones around. 

Can I have some expert advice on this ? I want something small enough to carry on my waistband behind my back all the time.


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## unregistered41671

Spend a little time reading here.

http://www.corneredcat.com/contents/

http://www.corneredcat.com/article/choosing-firearms/trying-on-a-handgun/


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

22 mag really gains very little over 22lr in a pistol 

38 is not hard to shoot , a 38 target wad-cutter is actually not a bad self defense load because it is flat and dumps all it's energy and the lead is soft and will deform also less likely to ricochet of hard surfaces 

there was a time when the FBI carried wad cutters loaded to full velocity about 950 fps from a 4 inch barrel 38 
target loads would be about 750 fps 

revolvers tend to have a very firm trigger pull in double action and they can be easily unloaded if your concerned 

if you have kids that are going to be an issue with a gun in the house you should have it on you in a holster that covers the trigger or you should secure it in a way the kids can't gain access to it , lock box , speed safe what ever works in your situation


you would be wise to try a few different guns go to a range that rents them and start with what fits your hand , then try them

some guns to give consideration , 

revolvers
a smith and Wesson J frame revolver 
a Ruger LCR light carry revolver 

semi autos 
a S&W body gaurd 380 acp auto 
a Ruger LCP light carry pistol 380 auto 
a Ruger LC9 light carry 9mm
a Beretta Nano 9mm
a S&W shield 9mm


I carry the Ruger LC9 my son shot it well when he was 10 years old with me supervising , he started on other 22 cal pistols but once he had pistol shooting down fairly well on the 22 he tried the 9mm and really liked to shoot it he is not 10 any more but still likes it always start shooters new to pistol shooting with only 1 round in the gun so that it is unloaded as soon as that round is fired 

some will have a reaction to drop the gun because of the recoil

always get a good firm grip , get the web of your hand as far up the back of the gun as you can reasonably without interference from the slide or hammer 

there are a bunch of good classes and instruction geared toward women offered by a few different groups


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## citxmech

The only way I'd consider a .22 mag is if you decided on something like an NAA mini-revolver.

The nice thing about those is that you might be more likely to keep it with you (assuming you have a CCP) than a larger firearm (on my wish list for someday).

My personal pocket pistol currently is a S&W J frame .357. It's a bit heavy (stainless model) so in hindsight I think an alloy frame might've been a better choice for everyday carry - but the recoil is manageable (if a bit stout) with full-power loads with the extra weight. With .38 spc loads it still has some snap to it - but nothing that would should be too unpleasant for its purpose.


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## oldasrocks

Check out the Rugar LCP .380. Light, small and double action so its safer.


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## RonM

P.P. I am a retired State Trooper, my entire career I carried a .38 Spec , a 4 inch Colt when in uniform and a 2 in Colt in civilian clothes, I felt secure with it at the time a few years ago.. I continue to qualify with the 2 inch and carry it now.....One of our female retirees qualifies with a 5 shot .38 cal, mine is a 6 shot. In your case a .38 Spec. 5 shot would suffice as an ample weapon for you to carry.....


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## Janis R

Taurus TCP, light weight, easily concealable, the only problem with carrying in the small of your back is that is might flip out since us women are built different than men. I usually don't have a problem with higher waist pants but lower ones don't seem to hold my pistol in place.
I have a NAA 22lr with changeable cylinder 22mag. I can wear it tucked in many places on my body and it never shows, can even wear it with strapless dresses and such so I ALWAYS have some type of protection, I use it a lot in the summer.


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## sniper69

If you want to go with a .22 WMR (magnum) then first I'd make sure ammo availability wouldn't be an issue - and second I'd consider the .22 WMR Hornady Critical Defense http://www.hornady.com/store/22-WMR-45gr-Critical-Defense/ 

You might want to consider something in 9mm. There are many good ammunition choices that way.


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## CJofWolfcreek

Any gun you own is dangerous to the extent you allow it to be. A safety is a button easily pressed. Sure it's another step but it doesn't take the place of the best safety, your common sense and diligence.

Go to a local gun shop and ask about and handle as many different ones as you can. If it doesn't feel right in your hand and on your body you won't carry it. 

How old are the little ones? I started our son out early. Got him a nerf gun and hammered it into him it's to be treated as if it were real. He's now nearly nine and wont touch his nerf gun or bb gun without asking first.

He knows what guns can do. I've had him look at the game animals I've brought home. The deer isn't cute any more it's dead and going to be made into meat. Same with partridge, grouse and pheasant. We've hiked and he knew what they were like alive when we came across them. So he's fully aware of what dead means and he knows in no uncertain terms that even a bb gun can kill.

For personal defense I recommend a revolver, especially if you're not going to run several hundred rounds through a handgun to smooth out the action and ensure it's reliable. There is also no "limp wristing" a revolver. With a semi auto that can lead to jam ups. Smith and Wesson J frames (small) also have integrated lock systems. Something I don't use on mine but if you're worried about someone getting a hold of it when you aren't carrying it., it takes key to unlock it. But you could forget to unlock it and find it useless when you need it.

Also make sure that the caliber of ammo is available in your area to meet your needs. A 380 that fits well in hand and rides great on your body is just a paperweight if you can't find ammo for it.


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## MOSSYNUT

Since I do not know you I wrote this as if you didn't have any gun experience. 
You didn't say how old your kids are. It is very important to take them shooting as well It demystifies the gun.My daughter had her first rifle at 6 a hot pink and stainless 22. a few years later she wanted a 22. pistol. They need to learn very early that it is not a toy or something to ever touch when an adult isn't around. Do you have any firearm experience? It makes a difference if you are just now getting a gun for the 1st time. If that is the case I would recommend that you start with a 22. long rifle to practice not for carry. get used to shooting with a 22. lr that way there is no recoil and also a great time for the little ones to shoot as well and you can learn as a family. as far as what should you get put your hands on allot of different guns and see what fits your hands. Do not get to caught up in what does or does not have a safety. most carry guns don't or they might as well not have like the Glock 19 that I carry or the Taurus 380 that my wife carries. The biggest thing to remember is to be responsible and keep away from the kids and never point it at some thing that you don't want to destroy, That includes someone or a body part as you pull it from the holster to put it in a drawer or whatever.
Also an unloaded gun has killed allot of people. Treat every gun as if it was loaded.
I say all of this because when I was a kid I had never been taught how to use a gun but I knew where there were at:gaptooth: In typical ******* fashion under the mattress without a lock. Luckily I didn't shoot anything other than the wall. As was stated earlier get some training from an instructor.


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## montysky

AN old style SW 586 and buy a trigger lock when you're not carrying it. would be my first choice. or Have your SO help if I recall right, he is a police officer? and would be a great asset.


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## PrettyPaisley

Yes but my SO isn't "in" to guns. I don't get it ... But whatever. This isn't my first gun and the girls have been around when we were shooting or cleaning and have seen us carry but only at home. 

This is like another language to me.  

I get the idea of shooting before purchasing but I'm also okay with learning to like what I have. Money is an issue - the .22 is a better price but I don't want something without stopping power. The gentleman at the shop said he did not recommend it for personal protection as it would only "tick" off anyone who's intent was to do harm. I'm okay with recoil - or okay with learning to expect it. 

My girls are 8 and almost 5. And they do both believe I will sell them to the gypsies if they touch any gun but a bit too young to be taught anything else. As much as I'd like to say my 8 year old wonder child is nearing the age of responsibility - she doesn't have the beys judgement. I have *no* idea where she gets that. 

Okay - off to read and research. Thank you.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

cost is an issue yes it is for me also but a few dollars more can buy a lot more comfort or features or reduction in size 

38spl is almost neck in neck with 22 for cost of the gun , ammo is about 20 dollars for 50 rounds 


some ideas 

charter arms 38spl these come hammerless for just a few more dollars http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/.../Charter+Arms+73820+Undercover+5RD+38SP++P+2"

s&w more cost but , they are the easiest to get a holster to fit , you can walk into almost any store and they have a smith J frame snubby holster or several
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/.../products_id/26309/S&W+M637+5RD+38SP++P+1.87"

however the charter is close enough that it fits most s&w J frame holsters 

I am using the term J frame , smith an Wesson gave their handguns specifically revolvers letter designations for size J being the smallest N being large

if you are really on a budget this http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_876/products_id/411541849 is about as low a price revolver as can be had , you give up the +P rating (can take higher pressure +P 38 spl ammo) and american manufacture but the Philippines based arms-corp does a decent job of building the lowest cost 38 on the market , I recently bought one of their 4 inch barreled guns same frame same internals I was curios could a low cost gun hold up to my regular shooting , the first one did have an issue and had to be sent back to the manufacturer but they have a Nevada based service department that is very easy to work with , the frame is almost a copy of the Colt detective special so that is what you look for when looking for holsters and grips replacements if you want a different grip , the rest of the gun is more uniquely arms corp but it does have a hammer block internal safety so that it is safer if dropped while loaded I really an't comment on how they hold up till i have a few hundred rounds through mine but it was 252.65 dollars out the door 

keep in mind depending on where you buy your gun many states have an additional charge for a pistol background check my state has 9 dollars and then i had to pay tax at 5.5% the gun started at 230 dollars my dealer brought one in for me from his distributor he had never had a M200 revolver in his store before but RIA Rock Island Armory aka Armscorp Philippines is known for their good 1911 pistols and he does stock the 1911s 

for autos 

the Ruger LCP is just that a light well made carry pistol that fits just about any where they even make a holster that looks like a smart phone belt holster but when the flap is flipped out of the way you can access your pistol http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_924/products_id/54585

the LC9 http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/21_49_1815/products_id/73923 I really like my LC9 and it carries very easy 


with any gun before you buy it shop for holsters , common guns even if they cost a bit more are much easier to get a holster for , if you limit your options for holsters it can end up costing you the same in the end if you have to order a holster or find a custom holster maker


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## Gray Wolf

I have 'several' handguns but the ones I like best for carry are 380's. Usually a LCP or a PPKS because they are small and flat. 

Your build, height, usual way you dress, summer, winter all factor into making a decision. I'm 6'-4" and 195, like loose clothes, so I could carry almost anything. 

One thing about 22's, they are going to loose a lot of stopping power, which they are not long on in the first place, when the weather gets cold and people bundle up. I carry hollow points in the summer and FMJ in the winter in an attempt to adjust to how people dress. I also switch to 357 when it gets really cold.

Have fun and stay safe.


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## PrettyPaisley

Gray Wolf said:


> I have 'several' handguns but the ones I like best for carry are 380's. Usually a LCP or a PPKS because they are small and flat.
> 
> Your build, height, usual way you dress, summer, winter all factor into making a decision. I'm 6'-4" and 195, like loose clothes, so I could carry almost anything.
> 
> One thing about 22's, they are going to loose a lot of stopping power, which they are not long on in the first place, when the weather gets cold and people bundle up. I carry hollow points in the summer and FMJ in the winter in an attempt to adjust to how people dress. I also switch to 357 when it gets really cold.
> 
> Have fun and stay safe.



I'm 5' 7" - totally average weight but super short waisted but always wear my clothes loose. My height is in my legs so my 380 is too bulky to carry anywhere but on my hip but I don't wear my clothes *that* loose. If I wear it in front (like I wish I could) I sit down and it jabs me in the chest.


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## OHmama

I'm glad to read that some of you are saying a 5 capacity revolver would be fine. I recently bought my first gun of my own and was told by so many that I needed an automatic with 7+ rounds. I ended up buying http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57768_757767_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y


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## littlejoe

PrettyPaisley said:


> I get the idea of shooting before purchasing but I'm also okay with learning to like what I have. Money is an issue - the .22 is a better price but I don't want something without stopping power. The gentleman at the shop said he did not recommend it for personal protection as it would only "tick" off anyone who's intent was to do harm. I'm okay with recoil - or okay with learning to expect it.
> 
> .


 Definitely shoot different guns and calibres. Beg, borrow, whatever.

22 LR ammo is getting easier to come by, and despite what some say, is nothing to sneeze about as a defensive round. Having confidence in your gun and your ability to hit with it are paramount! Generally speaking, a 22 will offer you more practice time/for cost. It takes time and ammo to build confidence.

I've carried 22's,38's 9's, 357's, 44 spcl, 44 mag, and a 45acp, as carry guns. Most of those weren't for CC, but just pack alongs. I've shot them all a fair amount, but the 22's far exceed the rest.

My CC gun is a little S&W 637 in 38. It shoots extremely well for me! I've also a S&W kit gun in 22LR the same size. It also shoots extremely well! Being as they/I shoot both good, I take the 38 as a CC. I wouldn't hesitate carrying the 22 tho. I learned with 22's and I have confidence in my ability with what I have.


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## alleyyooper

I own a Ruger single 6 with both the long rifle and mag cylinder, I carry it with the hammer on a empty chamber to be extra safe but really don't think one has to do so. Around here we have been able to buy 22 mag ammo all along and I would not feel unsafe using the mag to defend. Lots of practice and putting the round in the right place is key with any thing you use. 

I also have a Smith and Wesson 38 Special, also carry it with the hammer on a empty chamber. It is nice and on the smaller size but were it me I would go with a 357 Mag and use 38 Special rounds and be able to jump up to the 357 Mag rounds if need be.

single six.


Left S&W 38 special
Middle 45 Cap and Ball Remington
Right Ruger black hawk 357 Mag


 Al


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## idigbeets

I have the hammerless S&W .38 short nose revolver, I love that thing !! So easy to pocket carry, or a small holster.


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## motdaugrnds

Well, I may be overdoing it; but my weapon of choice is a 37 Glock because I have no doubt it will take down any intruder with one shot.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

motdaugrnds said:


> Well, I may be overdoing it; but my weapon of choice is a 37 Glock because I have no doubt it will take down any intruder with one shot.



here i have to give you a hard time but i want you to know this is a light hearted not mean hard time. 


If you were that sure about the 45 only needing one shot for any intruder , wouldn't you have bought the single shot ?

but seriously no pistol is a death ray , some of the hardest hitting pistols take more than one shot to stop 

some of the evidence of this is from police shootings , one that comes to mind was a cop that was a part of a task force , they knew they had a pair of guys robbing convenience stores so they put cops in what they figured was the next store based on their pattern to get robbed , they were right and when they confronted the robbers they one robber pointed his gun at the cop the cop let him have a round center mass from the 12ga shot gun loaded with Breneke slugs these were and probably are some of the hardest hitting 72 caliber slugs you could get the robbers arms dropped to his sides with that shot he was ordered to drop his gun , he did not he was shot with a second slug center mass he turned and headed for the door when he got to the door he collapsed dead against it 

this reminds me of some deer i have shot , they were dead they just didn't know it yet , this last year i shot a buck , from 50-60 yards with a 12ga slug I knew i hit him i knew it was a good shot , he kicked and off he went I got up to where he had been standing , i could clearly see i had gotten the double lung shot i was aiming for there was white tissue on the the ground and a good spray of blood , unless you have been smoking a lot lung tissue is white in every animal i have ever butchered it has a unique texture , i looked over a the tree he ran past a few feet away a birch , covered in blood the buck had rubbed against it , i still followed that blood trail for about 150 yards to where the deer had collapsed not laid down he was front legs under body head forward collapsed

one of 4 things needs to happen , for a stop ,
1 the person decides they have had enough and retreats or surrenders this is most common and why about 80% of gun shot victims survive
2 central nerviness system hit , brain or spinal cord hit almost instant incapacitation , however the mussels still flop around a lot , if you have ever seen a chicken run with it's head cut off you get the idea 
skunks still spray when shot in the head often
3 loss of blood , the body is in many ways a hydraulic system you need fluid to keep going spring a big enough leak and you run out of fluid fast
4 structural , bones the frame is needed to move , break the frame enough and the movement stops 


1 being most common 2 and 3 next , shock the incapacitation to shock of the nerviness system rather than actually hitting the spine or brain is more common and what many self defense rounds are aimed at doing , creating a shock wave of energy that upsets the nerve system without killing being the intended effect 

you want the biggest round you can shoot well in the smallest package you can shoot well 
1 is most common so carry what you will keep with you the most
but your trying to find a balance a gun that has some power behind the round yet carries easily 

*because hard to carry guns get left at home or in the car where they won't help*


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## PrettyPaisley

What about a 32 mag ?


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## PrettyPaisley

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> *because hard to carry guns get left at home or in the car where they won't help*



Yep. It's a very rare outing when I have it with me. Like, the only time is at home when I'm alone with the girls. Otherwise it's locked and unloaded. But everybody told me it what what I needed. I should've gone to shoot it and wear it before I bought it.


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## sniper69

PrettyPaisley said:


> Yep. It's a very rare outing when I have it with me. Like, the only time is at home when I'm alone with the girls. Otherwise it's locked and unloaded. But everybody told me it what what I needed. I should've gone to shoot it and wear it before I bought it.


What did you end up buying?


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## PrettyPaisley

I bought a 380 a few years ago. I've not bought anything else just yet. Still considering options.


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## sniper69

I sometimes carry a .380, is the one that you have uncomfortable to shoot? Just curious as to what you like/don't like about it.


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## PrettyPaisley

It's not uncomfortable to shoot. It's uncomfortable to wear. It's heavy and bulky and I just don't dig it.


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## sniper69

Ahh, understandable. 

I would recommend going to a range where you can rent guns to shoot, or find some people close by to let you try some different guns. That way you'll know what you want, and can see how the weight of the various handguns are, etc. Just my opinion of course.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

PrettyPaisley said:


> It's not uncomfortable to shoot. It's uncomfortable to wear. It's heavy and bulky and I just don't dig it.



do you know the make and model there are a lot of 380s , the thing is a lot of 380s are blow back , this means the slide does not lock to the barrel just the pressure of the spring holds it there so the slide has to weigh more than it would if it locked to the barrel for the initial firing , the other option is delayed blow back this is where the barrel and slide move together for about an 1/8 to 3/16 of an inch before the the barrel unlocks from the slide and the slide continues back while the barrel does not ejecting the spent case 

part of what makes the Ruger LCP 380 so popular is that it is 9.4 ounces , thin and works 

holsters can do a lot to help the comfort of carrying even heavier guns , it is amazing the difference between a good and a cheap holster


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## PrettyPaisley

Oh yeah. It's a Kel-Tec. That's all I know off hand. The paperwork and box are somewhere ....


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## unregistered41671

PrettyPaisley said:


> Oh yeah. It's a Kel-Tec. That's all I know off hand. The paperwork and box are somewhere ....


You won't find many smaller and slimmer than a Kel Tec P-3AT


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## Dutch 106

Hey, 
People have given you a lot of other stuff to readup on and think about. One thought I see missing, is that you get a 357mag you can shoot 38 spl as well with everything from very light target 38 spl ammo to very powerful 357mag.
I can highly recomend Mossad Ayoubs carrying a concealed weapon. a paperback that will get you tuned in!
Hope that helps good luck,
Dutch


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

if your Keltec is a P-3AT http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/p-3at/pistol/

possumbelly is right it doesn't get lighter or slimmer and I have a strong suspicion you need a different holster 

the only complaints i have ever heard about the P-3AT is that some find it's plastic trigger uncomfortable or that thier finger gets pinched between the trigger and trigger guard , the other complain is that if it is dropped on the muzzle from greater than 3 feet it can go off , but they may have updated the internal firing pin block to keep that from happening since i heard that complaint 

the RUGER LCP is basically a refined copy of the Keltec in several ways , and it is the hottest selling small concealed carry pistol in the past several years. because at just over a half pound empty there is nothing lighter or easier to conceal

I would try a IWB holster like a crossbreed super tuck or some thing similar worn about 3:30 or 4 oclock think of yourself as standing on the center of a clock your nose looking strait forward is 12 the center of your back 6 strait right 3 oclock so just behind strait right , this should sprea the weight out and get the gun in a more comfortable place , then try an tucked button down shirt that will go a few inches below your belt , I am in no way qualified nor do i understand womeans clothing but try a casual outfit like jeans and a t shirt with a untucked button up shirt over thqat will hide even big guns 


most people pocket carry the P-3AT and Ruger LCP in a pocket holster but i understand often women's pants pockets can hardly hold a credit card let alone a pistol

i think the gun you have will work fine if you find the right holster combo for you see I saved you a bunch of money on a gun , now you can spend it on holsters there are some good videos out there by women who understand clothing and how to hide a gun in women's clothing 

sorry my cargo shorts , jeans , or overalls just don't take any work to pocket carry a gun twice weight and an inch longer little thicker and taller than your gun if it is a p-3AT what i carry is almost identical in weight and size to the PF-9


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## Shrek

P.P.

Those who know my preference of the .38 detective special wheel gun as my choice of carry weapon jokingly call me a firearms dinosaur but when our LEO auxiliary gets range time all of the jokers are pretty quiet when I generally only shoot my target three times and put 2 center mass within 2 inches of each other and the third above them within an inch if the "goozle " area of the throat area.

During one of our shooting outings our range master asked me why I put the goozle shot in and I told him because we are shooting B 27 silhouettes but if I were shooting at a breathing meat target coming at me the goozle shot should be the head shot of the Mozambique Drill triple tap shooting discipline I prefer to practice for self defense.

When he heard me call the triple tap my retired military friend had taught me as the Mozambique Drill, the deputy who was supervising me as range officer replied that I had no intention of wounding in a defensive shooting scenario and he didn't have to worry about stressing center mass targeting, to which I replied "dead men don't come looking you up for revenge". 

A good heavy frame revolver can shoot +P hot loads if you desire and revolvers don't jam and generally have adequate capacity as long as you practice your aim. As was mentioned above, wad cutters are good loads although I prefer +P hollow points to better destroy the aorta and brain stem if I had to do some close quarter defensive combat shooting.

Only .22 I carry is a North American mini revolver as a hideout piece that would be my last shots as I was pushed through the gates of Hades and my empty .38 had been thrown at my adversary as a distraction as I try to empty the minimag to take them through the gate with me.

Although I hope to never find myself in a code red situation as this , I often practice going through my .38 load and .22 mini mag just to see how accurate I can be with the 12 shots and how fast I can deliver them in a 25 foot close range scenario.

BTW if you can only afford one hand weapon for personal defense and plan to use it as a bedside weapon, revolvers are easier to control from a laying down position and there is no hot brass ejecting in unintended trajectories if you have to fire.


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## RonM

Familiarity is a big thing with me and that is why I have the wheel gun, I can shoot it in the dark, as I have had to practice that over the years..So, like Shrek call me a firearms dinosaur, but it's a valid choice....


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## simi-steading

I've over time lately come to some new conclusions about what to carry and why...

I used to be all about the 45.. not saying a 1911, but a .45.. like a bond arms derringer even.... But that attitude has changed a lot lately.. 

Now I'm of the mind, carry what you like... I've been carrying a 9MAK gun for a while now... If I can't stop a person with the 12 +1, then I'm either doing something wrong, or messing with the wrong people.. 

I've also got to thinking a lot about a .22... If you can unload 5 shots into a person, and they keep coming at you, then a couple shots from a .45 aren't going to do a whole lot more.. 

Also, about being able to aim at 7 yards and such... If you're shooting a person from 7 yards, you better hope like heck the cops are your friends, because that's WAY too far for fearing for your life, unless a person is pointing a gun at you from a long distance.

My wife recently bought a .380 at my displeasure.. But then I got to thinking about it.. .It's really not much smaller than the 9 Mak I carry.... and it is 6 + 1, so she has 7 shots to get business taken care of... I don't know many people who can take 7 shots in their body AND want to keep attacking.. 

As far as her shooting someone at 7 yards with it, that's not what a CC is really meant for. they are more meant as a "get off me" kinda deal.. Yes, she is a fairly good shot at 25 feet, but at 2 feet, I know she won't miss...

I would rather her carry a .22 with 10 shots, than a .45 with 2 shots... 

So, my thinking any more is, carry what you want, carry what you like, just be sure that you are able to use it if the occasion arises... More than likely what ever you use, if you fire off 4 or 5 shots and all are hits, no matter what caliber it is, more than likely the attacker will want to stop attacking.. 

This isn't rocket science, or the movies... I don't know many men that would still keep coming at you after being hit in the chest or face or even stomach after a handful of shots hit them..


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## simi-steading

Just to add... because I was just talking to my wife about this.. 

A lot here carry a .38 with +p.. With 5 shots from a .38, not even +p, are you really going to want to keep coming at the person that hit you with those 5 shots if they don't kill you?

I carry a .38 around the property with shot shells in it for copperheads... but stop and think about this a second.. If a person shoots you even twice with that shot shell, more than likely it's not going to kill you, BUT, you are going to be hurting so bad you won't even keep going.. .

Stop and think, what happens when you stir up a hornets nest? you RUN.. because getting stung hurts... now think of say 30 little pellets hitting you... IT HURTS... you're going to run...


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## sniper69

About .38 or any other caliber - shot placement is key. The Mozambique method mentioned above by Shrek (and I've call it that too, but many give me a blank stare with the name, so I use the old saying associated with it - of two to the chest one to the head makes sure they're good and dead), will definitely stop someone - but practice is key. 

Here is an article that might be of interest from last year where a perp was shot 5 times with a .38 and lived. http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/woman-hiding-kids-shoots-intruder/nTm7s/

LOGANVILLE, Ga. â 
A woman hiding in her attic with children shot an intruder multiple times before fleeing to safety Friday.

The incident happened at a home on Henderson Ridge Lane in Loganville around 1 p.m. The woman was working in an upstairs office when she spotted a strange man outside a window, according to Walton County Sheriff Joe Chapman. He said she took her 9-year-old twins to a crawlspace before the man broke in using a crowbar.

But the man eventually found the family.

"The perpetrator opens that door. Of course, at that time he's staring at her, her two children and a .38 revolver," Chapman told Channel 2âs Kerry Kavanaugh. 

The woman then shot him five times, but he survived, Chapman said. He said the woman ran out of bullets but threatened to shoot the intruder if he moved.

"She's standing over him, and she realizes she's fired all six rounds. And the guy's telling her to quit shooting," Chapman said.

The woman ran to a neighbor's home with her children. The intruder attempted to flee in his car but crashed into a wooded area and collapsed in a nearby driveway, Chapman said.

Deputies arrested 32-year-old Atlanta resident Paul Slater in connection with the crime. Chapman said they found him on the ground saying, "Help me. I'm close to dying." Slater was taken to Gwinnett Medical Center for treatment. Chapman said Slater was shot in the face and neck. 

In February, Slater was arrested on simple battery charges, according to the Gwinnett County Sheriff's Office. He has been arrested six other times in the county since 2008.

Kavanaugh was the first reporter at the scene as deputies investigated. The victim's husband told Kavanaugh he's proud of his wife. He was on the phone with her as the intruder broke in. 

"My wife is a hero. She protected her kids. She did what she was supposed to do as responsible, prepared gun owner," Donnie Herman said. 

He said he's thankful for his family's safety.

"Her life is saved, and her kids' life is saved, and that's all I'd like to say," Herman said.
Channel 2âs Amy Napier Viteri learned from Chapman late Friday night that slater has been placed on a ventilator and suffers from punctured lungs, a punctured liver and a punctured stomach.
He said if Slater survives the night, doctors will try to operate in the morning to repair the damage.
Chapman said Slater has four exit wounds.
Slater is currently being charged with burglary.


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## PrettyPaisley

Okay I was wrong. I followed the links y'all posted and knew that wasn't my gun. It's a Bersa. With a dirty grip. Oops....

I'll catch up on all the reading tonight. Thank you.


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## CJofWolfcreek

In reading your replies and the additional information, my suggestions have changed. You already have a handgun, shooting it is no problem. The carry is the issue. Try as many different kinds of holsters as you can, inside waist band, outside waist band, shoulder holster...etc

See if there is a different carry method that will work for what you already have. If nothing does, then look for a different firearm.


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## PrettyPaisley

CJofWolfcreek said:


> In reading your replies and the additional information, my suggestions have changed. You already have a handgun, shooting it is no problem. The carry is the issue. Try as many different kinds of holsters as you can, inside waist band, outside waist band, shoulder holster...etc
> 
> 
> 
> See if there is a different carry method that will work for what you already have. If nothing does, then look for a different firearm.



So you don't think it's the gun, but the holster ? A smaller weapon wouldn't be easier to wear ?


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## Sam Boggs

What about a purse holster and/or fanny pack?
Sam


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## PrettyPaisley

sniper69 said:


> About .38 or any other caliber - shot placement is key. The Mozambique method mentioned above by Shrek (and I've call it that too, but many give me a blank stare with the name, so I use the old saying associated with it - of two to the chest one to the head makes sure they're good and dead), will definitely stop someone - but practice is key.
> 
> Here is an article that might be of interest from last year where a perp was shot 5 times with a .38 and lived. http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/woman-hiding-kids-shoots-intruder/nTm7s/
> 
> LOGANVILLE, Ga. â
> A woman hiding in her attic with children shot an intruder multiple times before fleeing to safety Friday.
> 
> The incident happened at a home on Henderson Ridge Lane in Loganville around 1 p.m. The woman was working in an upstairs office when she spotted a strange man outside a window, according to Walton County Sheriff Joe Chapman. He said she took her 9-year-old twins to a crawlspace before the man broke in using a crowbar.
> 
> But the man eventually found the family.
> 
> "The perpetrator opens that door. Of course, at that time he's staring at her, her two children and a .38 revolver," Chapman told Channel 2âs Kerry Kavanaugh.
> 
> The woman then shot him five times, but he survived, Chapman said. He said the woman ran out of bullets but threatened to shoot the intruder if he moved.
> 
> "She's standing over him, and she realizes she's fired all six rounds. And the guy's telling her to quit shooting," Chapman said.
> 
> The woman ran to a neighbor's home with her children. The intruder attempted to flee in his car but crashed into a wooded area and collapsed in a nearby driveway, Chapman said.
> 
> Deputies arrested 32-year-old Atlanta resident Paul Slater in connection with the crime. Chapman said they found him on the ground saying, "Help me. I'm close to dying." Slater was taken to Gwinnett Medical Center for treatment. Chapman said Slater was shot in the face and neck.
> 
> In February, Slater was arrested on simple battery charges, according to the Gwinnett County Sheriff's Office. He has been arrested six other times in the county since 2008.
> 
> Kavanaugh was the first reporter at the scene as deputies investigated. The victim's husband told Kavanaugh he's proud of his wife. He was on the phone with her as the intruder broke in.
> 
> "My wife is a hero. She protected her kids. She did what she was supposed to do as responsible, prepared gun owner," Donnie Herman said.
> 
> He said he's thankful for his family's safety.
> 
> "Her life is saved, and her kids' life is saved, and that's all I'd like to say," Herman said.
> Channel 2âs Amy Napier Viteri learned from Chapman late Friday night that slater has been placed on a ventilator and suffers from punctured lungs, a punctured liver and a punctured stomach.
> He said if Slater survives the night, doctors will try to operate in the morning to repair the damage.
> Chapman said Slater has four exit wounds.
> Slater is currently being charged with burglary.



I understand that should have had a different ending.


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## sniper69

PrettyPaisley said:


> I understand that should have had a different ending.


Yes it should have. 
Basically, things could have went different, the guy she shot is a big guy. But shot placement, regardless of caliber, is key. Also ammo selection can help too (though some might disagree with me about the ammo). But even though he didn't die, he did break off the attack and tried to escape in his SUV - but blood loss caused him to go off the road and crash.

Here is the story with more information. http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/10/us/home-invasion-gun-rights/ She had only went to the range for the first time two weeks before all of that went down because her husband wanted her to know how to use the families two firearms in case she needed to defend herself.

IIRC - there was a firearms club in Georgia that was going to pay for Mrs. Herman's training and/or IIRC they got donations from people to buy her a Glock with more rounds. Of course I'm going from memory and can't find a link to that information, and trying to remember where I read that.


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## CJofWolfcreek

Yes a smaller gun would be easier to carry. However it's cheaper to get another holster than another handgun if a holster or carry position change will work.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

I think we need a picture of the holster before we go any further 

yes a 8.5 oz gun would be easier to carry as would a 17.2oz gun that is thinner and shorter in the grip

but depending on your current holster and how your carrying , you may do well to just tray a different holster or you may do well to sell the bersa and buy a smaller lighter gun or keep the bersa and get another gun 

I would hate to be discouraging another gun , just it should be an educated decision and not just tossing money at the issue


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## PrettyPaisley

The black one is the one I bought for the Bersa but really don't care for. The lighter suede one is the one I hook with the strong clip against my body. So the metal clip, which is like because it holds things in place, is on the outside of my jeans and doesn't scratch me, but it's all just so bulky. It wasn't bought for my gun but for some humongo number SO uses as a police weapon. I'm just the one that uses it because the police weapon has a heavy belt it's attached to or it's locked away when not on SO's body. 

I'm gonna go ahead and assume you guys have some great options in the way of holsters for me. And I'm super excited to find out what they are !


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

seeing your holsters are a Uncle mikes nylon one size fits half a dozen or more guns in the same category and a structureless IWB sleeve that also is intended to carry a range of guns , these holsters do cover the trigger and keep the gun with you but not very securely and they do nothing to distribute weight so they flop or slip around not moving with you 


to use up my extremely limited knowledge of women bras , my wife tells me if you got nothing to hold up almost anything will work , but if you got something to hold up you need the right fit , right structure , support in the right places or you will be a saggy bouncy floppy mess. this applies to holsters also

a budget option that helps distribute the weight is a paddle holster , the paddle slips inside your pants and belt and it helps to be wearing a tucked in shirt or under shirt 
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/50111
paddles do a good job of distributing the weight but they stick out a ways 

if you have a hands worth of room in the waist of your pants a IWB is good to really get the gun in close , the cross breed style holsters do a good job of being thin contouring to your body , and distributing the weight also the closer to the body and less movement the gun makes the less it will flop , bounce and pull 
http://www.crossbreedholsters.com/
check out the mini tuck and the super tuck deluxe

if you choose a new smaller lighter gun the cross bread or copies of the cross breed are still going to be the hostler to get 

pocket carry works fine if you have the right pants , but finding pockets that are big enough can be hard , not something you find in woman's clothing very often , even a majority of the mens clothing the pockets are often to small

with any IWB holster you typically want something between you and the holster like an under shirt


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## sniper69

I use a Bianchi IWB leather holster for my concealed carry. 

In searching holsters for the Bersa - it seems the name Ugly Bald Guy comes up as holster people like for them. I'm not sure as I don't have a Bersa - but here is the site http://www.ubgholsters.com/iwb.htm


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## littlejoe

Shrek said:


> A good heavy frame revolver can shoot +P hot loads if you desire and revolvers don't jam and generally have adequate capacity as long as you practice your aim. As was mentioned above, wad cutters are good loads although I prefer +P hollow points to better destroy the aorta and brain stem if I had to do some close quarter defensive combat shooting.
> 
> .


Revolvers can and do jam up, as well as fail! That's a myth that they don't. I've now experienced jams twice. They might not be prone to jam on feed/extraction failures, but mechanically they have the possibility to fail.

Mt first failure was with a new CA revolver. It would completely lock up, where a hit on it would not free it. It was the XGF's revolver, and I immediately sent it back without investigating it.

My next failure was with my now favorite carry. A 637 that went thru S&W custom shop. It has a hook on the grip that I REALLY like! Don't need a holster for it...or do I? I love the setup, easy to carry, very accurate for me, simply disappears, and available one handed. My belt covers the triggerguard. It's with me all day everyday!

I often sweat heavily doing physical work. I checked my little gun one night and the trigger had a failure to return forward. A slap with the hand was good, or a coax with the trigger finger returned it, but still a fail. I havn't removed a sideplate to look, but apparently some reaction took place? A short shot of penetrating oil cured it. I'm not one to spend time every evening cleaning, or checking. There are other things to do!

I love revolvers, heck, I love guns! Revolvers might offer fewer functions to go south, but they're not infallible!
....

Someone said pick the biggest you can shoot well, which is sound advice. It's gonna take time to have confidence in your ability with a handgun or a rifle or a shotgun, however. Some people say they're naturals, but I havn't seen one? Handguns are hard to shoot, much less a bad situation!

A near miss only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades. Shoot them often, and shoot them well. There are so many differing facets of protection involving a firearm, or just simply protection, and being aware of those around you, as well as the situations.

Carrying, won't immediately give you an upper hand. It takes training, practice, awareness, thought, and more, to give you a minute edge over a common thug, I believe.

I'm just a beginner, and if I'm wrong it wasn't the first time.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE

I agree little Joe everything fails , but maintenance is a good idea with anything 

I would alway use a holster for carrying a DA revolver or auto , and it is even a good idea on SA guns 

of course your big single action guns like a colt peace maker you want a holster but the little SA derringers a holster or pocket holster is still a good idea it helps keep the pocket lint out 

and if you pocket carry - nothing else besides the gun in that pocket any time the gun is in the pocket, no change , keys ,anything ever 
I make one acceptation to this , I carry a second wallet , only a few bills in it it is a bi-fold wallet very flat I carry this outside of the pocket holster if I thought i could make out the gun in the mirror "printing" the wallet breaks up the shape so look like nothing more than a bill fold in my pocket


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## Shane57

I use a s&w bodyguard .38. Double action so it doesn't go off in your pocket, hollow points for stopping power, laser sight for intimidation. Fairly accurate up to 20 feet.


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## Malamute

PrettyPaisley said:


> View attachment 34721
> View attachment 34722
> 
> The lighter suede one is the one I hook with the strong clip against my body. So the metal clip, which is like because it holds things in place, is on the outside of my jeans and doesn't scratch me, but it's all just so bulky....
> 
> I'm gonna go ahead and assume you guys have some great options in the way of holsters for me. And I'm super excited to find out what they are !


If I'm understanding you, you have the leather holster outside your pants, and use the clip over your belt? That isn't how they are intended to be used, they are supposed to go inside the pants, with the clip going over the belt towards the outside. They aren't very good holsters in any event.

Theres another thread going,
http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/co...ense-guns/521968-holster-recommendations.html

I posted some female reviewers that had some good reviews. Not just the individual reviews I posted, but they have other reviews also. Look around some. a good quality holster is an investment, and isn't cheap, but can completely change the carry picture from a nuisance to a pleasure, or at least something that isn't uncomfortable and irritating.

There are various carry positions that some like, some don't, some depending in different circumstances. Many like the appendix inside the waistband, meaning in the front just slightly to the right of the center of your body. Many guys are carrying full size guns like this and can do it comfortably. It isn't comfortable to me*, but many like it. Body type plays some part in it, and the type and quality of the holster as well.

Regarding holsters, many that carry much end up with a box of holsters they don't use any more, even though they got rave reviews and recommendations from others. Holsters can be very individualistic things. Once in a while you luck out and find something you like right off. Often, its a process that works itself out over time.

*ETA: I just saw something that may change my thoughts on appendix inside the waist band (IWB) carry. Some are putting foam wedges on the lower third of the holster to push the muzzle away from the body some, making it more comfortable, and pushing the butt of the gun into the body, making it more concealable.


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## tnvarmint

I tend to agree with the latest consensus...try a decent holster. Quite frankly, a $20-$30 holster typically doesn't cut it. Not saying that you absolutely have to, but expect to pay $50-$75 for a good quality holster to be comfortable. Your best bet is to goto your local gun shop and try on several holsters. Walk around the store with each one for a bit before purchasing and check with the shop about their return policies. Any decent gun shop worth their salt will be more than willing to work with you on finding the right holster.

You might also Google the flashbang holster. A lot of women really love those. 

As for caliber and all that. I have often made this offer to friends of mine who say X caliber is the only one! Let me take a six shot 22 mag and you take your pistol of choice. We stand 5 or so feet away and I unload my gun into them first. Once I have emptied mine they are free to shoot me with theirs. We will see which one has the best killing power. No one has taken me up on that offer yet.

That being said, do some research and read the FBIs report on ballistics. They compared the 9mm, 40 and the 45 (may have been others included). Their findings were that ballistically speaking, they were all fairly similar. Ultimately, however, they stated that the bigger chunk of lead that you can send down range is your best bet. You can't deny physics. 

The most important thing to remember though is that the best gun to own is one that you will carry with you at all times. If it is at home, it is pretty useless.


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## tnvarmint

Oh and for the record, my gun of choice is a Glock 26 in a crossbread style IWB holster at the 4 o'clock position. I have a grip extension which gives me 12 + 1 loaded with Hornady Critical Defense. I carry an extra mag on me and have multiple extra mags in my vehicle. I am confident that this will take care of me when it is needed and most of the time I forget I even have it on me it is so comfortable. I am 6' 4" and 230 lbs though.


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## Batt

I too carry a Bersa .380, in a paddle holster. But only when wearing a coat to cover it. During the summer I carry a KelTec P3AT with a side clip. Looks just like you are carrying a large folding knife. Goes well with jeans. And at 7 shots, and only about 11 Oz. I hope that and accuracy will be enough if ever needed.


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## topside1

Of course I haven't read any of the comments, but would like to add that I carry a Ruger LCP in my vehicle bag or in my front pocket inside a pocket holster. I really do forget it's even there, lighter than my wallet and my wallet is usually empty. I have many other pistols that I could carry but would rather not be strapping on a typical holster for the day....Look up pocket holsters if you're interested.


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## weapons_762

P.P. here is a link from midway for holsters for ya, they run cheap to pricy, you choose

http://www.midwayusa.com/find?sortb...ble&statuses=Closeout Special&searchscope=all

Weps Out!


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## unioncreek

I carry a Springfield XD9 Service, it's a full size with a 4 inch barrel. I'm left handed and carry it in a Alien Gear IWB at 8:00. Never have had trouble keeping it covered or people seeing.

Bob


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## Old John

PrettyPaisley said:


> It's not uncomfortable to shoot. It's uncomfortable to wear. It's heavy and bulky and I just don't dig it.


It is not supposed to be Comfortable to Carry or Comfortable to Shoot"

It is Supposed to be Comforting!


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## Guest

Old John said:


> It is not supposed to be Comfortable to Carry or Comfortable to Shoot"
> 
> It is Supposed to be Comforting!



True, but if it hurts to carry, then the carrier will cease to carry it. 


OP:
I had this same issue, and being small have few locations that are "concealed" and little padding on myself to keep them from grinding into my bones... LOL!

My solution was to put out an APB to all my friends and family - and _borrowed_ a variety of holsters. 

I would never had been able to purchase them all, nor would have wanted to justify having 15 holsters in the drawer! So, I was allowed to test drive a variety... For free! And found one that I kinda liked. 

Just a thought.


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