# What are we supposed to do with this information ?



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/pove...e-homeless/ss-BBOkOOB?ocid=spartanntp#image=1


In an effort to get a better understanding of what it's like to be homeless with children, Sara Easter, a photographer from Arlington, Texas, decided to walk a day in the shoes of the Henderson family, who have lived in a shelter called Union Gospel Mission of Tarrant County since July 2017. She spent the day with parents Jared and Dallas and their four children – Sadie, 8; Xoi, 5; Zander, 3; and Mila, 1 - and documented their every move. The final product was a photo series called "Sheltered," and it's beyond eye-opening.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

We are supposed to get all weepy eyed and send our money to these poor folks.


----------



## Wolf mom (Mar 8, 2005)

It would be more meaningful if questions like *"What was the decision making process that rendered this family homeless?*" were answered.


----------



## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

shawnlee said:


> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/pove...e-homeless/ss-BBOkOOB?ocid=spartanntp#image=1
> 
> 
> In an effort to get a better understanding of what it's like to be homeless with children, Sara Easter, a photographer from Arlington, Texas, decided to walk a day in the shoes of the Henderson family, who have lived in a shelter called Union Gospel Mission of Tarrant County since July 2017. She spent the day with parents Jared and Dallas and their four children – Sadie, 8; Xoi, 5; Zander, 3; and Mila, 1 - and documented their every move. The final product was a photo series called "Sheltered," and it's beyond eye-opening.


They have been in the shelter for 17 months. And have a 12 month old child. I would suggest they stop having children until they can provide for them as a start.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

I imagine it's to invoke the struggle that some Americans have in life- homelessness, food insecurity, and not having the stable base that others have taken for granted. 

It's up to the individual to decide how they feel about hungry, homeless kids.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Irish Pixie said:


> I imagine it's to invoke the struggle that some Americans have in life- homelessness, food insecurity, and not having the stable base that others have taken for granted.
> 
> It's up to the individual to decide how they feel about hungry, homeless kids.


True, for my part I think those kids need a real home with real parents.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> True, for my part I think those kids need a real home with real parents.


First, what is a "real home" and "real parents"? Please explain how American kids can be taken away from their American parents legally for being poor?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> I imagine it's to *invoke the struggle* that some Americans have in life-


That sounds a lot like nonsensical psychobabble to me.


----------



## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

I thought homeless was when you wandered around, sleeping in the park and stuff. Although living in a cinderblock room isn't the best home, it looks like a home to me. 4 walls, a roof, food, clothes, baby cribs, and so on. I can't see this as homeless.


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

That would be the definition of a hobo.


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

nchobbyfarm said:


> They have been in the shelter for 17 months. And have a 12 month old child. I would suggest they stop having children until they can provide for them as a start.


12 plus the usual 9 means they quit having babies BEFORE they were in this shelter.
Perhaps at that time their situation was better?


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

GTX63 said:


> That would be the definition of a hobo.


HoBo is usually train related in most peoples minds.
They have a home, its on the railroad.


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Hobo meaning homeless vagrant, not these folks.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

http://www.fwtx.com/articles/fwtxmag/features/sheltered-ugm-familys-story

From the story

_These photos and the accompanying quotes are from November 2017. As of March, Dallas and the children remain at the shelter, but Jared is living elsewhere._
_
Hopefully Jared is getting established elsewhere so that his family can quickly follow him to a home of their own.

_


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Irish Pixie said:


> First, what is a "real home" and "real parents"? Please explain how American kids can be taken away from their American parents legally for being poor?


Most people understand what the terms home, parents, and neglect mean. I really don't feel the need to educate anyone who doesn't grasp those basic concepts. I would never suggest taking kids from anyone based upon their financial status.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> HoBo is usually train related in most peoples minds.
> They have a home, its on the railroad.


Hobo's also worked for their livings, meager as it was. Not to be confused with today's railroad bums.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> We are supposed to get all weepy eyed and send our money to these poor folks.


That was not the photographers intention, and nowhere in the story are there requests to send money, only to extend a bit of compassion.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

doozie said:


> That was not the photographers intention, and nowhere in the story are there requests to send money, only to extend a bit of compassion.


In my opinion, compassion is in short supply in a country where "I got mine, screw you" prevails.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> That was not the photographers intention, and nowhere in the story are there requests to send money, only to extend a bit of compassion.


I have lots of compassion for those children. Their useless parents? Not so much.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> *In my opinion*, compassion is in short supply in a country where "I got mine, screw you" prevails.


I've heard opinions aren't fact.
I can't remember who says that all the time.



doozie said:


> That was not the photographers intention


I don't remember her stating any "intentions".
Why is your guess correct but others are not?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> I have lots of compassion for those children. Their useless parents? Not so much.


What do you know about the parents? 
You don't think helping out the parents benefits the whole family, or they'd be better off in street somehow?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I've heard opinions aren't fact.
> I can't remember who says that all the time.
> 
> 
> ...


Here we go again, I'll ask you directly, but I don't expect an honest answer. (Pattern psychobabble in play)

What did the photographer hope her project would accomplish?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> *What do you know* about the parents?


Just as much as you.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Just as much as you.


Are they useless, as YH claims?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> What did the photographer hope her project would accomplish?


I already answered that.
You should read more and question less.

I mostly think she hopes it will get her business some attention.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> *What do you know about the parents?*
> You don't think helping out the parents benefits the whole family, or they'd be better off in street somehow?


Only what I read in the article and witnessed in the photos. I saw two able bodied "parents" (using the term loosely) who couldn't be bothered to provide a home for their children.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Are they useless, as YH claims?


20 Questions deja vu.
What I think won't change what you think nor what he thinks.
For all we know the guy has abandoned the family, since he found somewhere to live without them.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> (Pattern psychobabble in play)


Get your own material instead of just parroting what others say.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Only what I read in the article and witnessed in the photos. I saw two able bodied "parents" (using the term loosely) who couldn't be bothered to provide a home for their children.


Because you "know" why they found themselves homeless at that particular point in time? There is no situation that would be acceptable to you for loosing your home or apartment?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

No


Bearfootfarm said:


> I already answered that.
> You should read more and question less.
> 
> I mostly think she hopes it will get her business some attention.



No, you didn't really answer the question "already" LOL.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> 20 Questions deja vu.
> What I think won't change what you think nor what he thinks.
> For all we know the guy has abandoned the family, since he found somewhere to live without them.


Are my questions too hard? LOL

I certainly hope that is not the case, it would be nice to have a story follow a family up and out of homelessness though.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Because you "know" why they found themselves homeless at that particular point in time? There is no situation that would be acceptable to you for loosing your home or apartment?


I don't care "why" they lost their home or apartment 17 months ago. I'm far more interested in why they haven't gotten off their lazy backsides and done something about it. Those children deserve better.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> No, you didn't really answer the question "already" LOL.


And there's the usual denial.
You're going through the whole routine again, thinking it will turn out different this time.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Are my questions too hard? LOL


They are pointless.



doozie said:


> I certainly hope that is not the case, it would be nice to have a story follow a family up and out of homelessness though.


Write one.
Feed the family.
Give them a place to live.
Nothing is stopping you aside from the fact you want someone else to do it all.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> I don't care "why" they lost their home or apartment 17 months ago. I'm far more interested in why they haven't gotten off their lazy backsides and done something about it. Those children deserve better.


I'm not sure how long they have been in the shelter, or if they are still housed there. 

I would think, guess, assume, that finding affordable housing could be holding them back, but that does not make them lazy or useless parents.


----------



## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

GTX63 said:


> Hobo meaning homeless vagrant, not these folks.


Actually a hobo was a lifestyle decision, they were willing to work when they needed something and normally did not beg and usually had a relative with a home that they could go back to. A Hobo was not the same as what we call the homeless today.
My great uncle was a hobo, he rode the rails for years. He always had great stories when he stayed with us. He was a house painter by trade and was a darn good one - but he had 'the wanderlust' and didn't like the 9-5 work world.


----------



## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

Living in the Dallas area myself (Arlington is a suburb) there are places begging for employees, no reason for anyone with an ounce of gumption not to be employed.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> They are pointless.
> 
> 
> Write one.
> ...



I have not asked "someone else" to do it all for this family, but you know that...

I don't see them as useless or lazy as others have posted.

I could donate to the organization that helps them and others like them though.
https://www.ugm-tc.org/


----------



## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

They might not be unemployed.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I'm not sure how long they have been in the shelter, or if they are still housed there.
> 
> I would think, guess, assume, that finding affordable housing could be holding them back, but that does not make them lazy or useless parents.


Right, so get in touch with them, bring them into your home and take care of them. See how long you still sympathize with their plight.  here, I'll make you an even better deal. Track them down, let me take care of the kids here in my home, and you just concentrate on getting mom and dad back on their feet. I have a feeling you still won't have much sympathy for them after a couple years.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

painterswife said:


> They might not be unemployed.


I am going to take this good point and run with it. While near-full employment is a much better situation than high unemployment, that doesn't make all jobs good or even good enough. The current situation is the point where wages and conditions start to improve with labor scarcity serving as a driver. It is NOT the point where we have "arrived" and happy says are here again for everyone.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> *I have not asked* "someone else" to do it all for this family, but you know that...
> 
> *I don't see* them as useless or lazy as others have posted.
> 
> *I could *donate to the organization that helps them and others like them though.


Denial

Opinion

Give as much as you like.
Nothing and no one is stopping you.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

painterswife said:


> They might not be unemployed.


And they "might" not be employed either. All we really know is the parents have not provided a home for their children for an extended period of time. That in itself tells me they have issues. Serious issues that their kids should not have to live through.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Right, so get in touch with them, bring them into your home and take care of them. See how long you still sympathize with their plight.  here, I'll make you an even better deal. Track them down, let me take care of the kids here in my home, and you just concentrate on getting mom and dad back on their feet. I have a feeling you still won't have much sympathy for them after a couple years.


Looks like the shelter housing them has hope for their residents, getting training, housing, counseling, and jobs in line. They don't automatically consider them to be "useless parents"

It's interesting that you seem to take the position that the parents would be better off with me, or that you would make a better parent for the children than their own based on a story that gives so little information.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

mnn2501 said:


> Living in the Dallas area myself (Arlington is a suburb) there are places begging for employees, no reason for anyone with an ounce of gumption not to be employed.


I believe the father was employed, from the link I provided on the family. Is getting an apartment or affordable housing easy in the area?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Looks like the shelter housing them has hope for their residents, getting training, housing, counseling, and jobs in line.


Most learn that stuff before getting out of high school.
I rode the school bus to my first real job.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Most learn that stuff before getting out of high school.
> I rode the school bus to my first real job.


I am old enough that most of my recollections of high school aren't necessarily relevant any more, and I believe you're older than I am.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Looks like the shelter housing them has hope for their residents, getting training, housing, counseling, and jobs in line. They don't automatically consider them to be "useless parents"
> 
> It's interesting that you seem to take the position that the parents would be better off with me, or that you would make a better parent for the children than their own based on a story that gives so little information.


The only qualifier I have to offer for me being a good or better parent is the fact that I never allowed any of the kids in my care to be hungry or homeless. We may have been poor, we may have not lived a life of luxury, but my kids were always tucked in at night with full tummys and the knowledge that we had a home. Even when that home was nothing but an off grid 16' x 16' a frame cabin built out of some cedar poles and lumber and used tin roofing salvaged from a long since collapsed barn on the property. I beleive kids deserve that level of security at the very least.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Most learn that stuff before getting out of high school.
> I rode the school bus to my first real job.


Well, good for you!


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Most learn that stuff before getting out of high school.
> I rode the school bus to my first real job.


Yeppers, maybe mom and dad shoulda had that training and counseling before they opted to have a family!


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> The only qualifier I have to offer for me being a good or better parent is the fact that I never allowed any of the kids in my care to be hungry or homeless. We may have been poor, we may have not lived a life of luxury, but my kids were always tucked in at night with full tummys and the knowledge that we had a home. Even when that home was nothing but an off grid 16' x 16' a frame cabin built out of some cedar poles and lumber and used tin roofing salvaged from a long since collapsed barn on the property. I beleive kids deserve that level of security at the very least.


And, these children have a roof over their heads too, right?
The parents know it's not ideal, and say they need a place of their own.
Is asking for help a disqualifier for being or becoming a better parent?


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

You've obviously missed not only my point, but the point of the article itself.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Yeppers, maybe mom and dad shoulda had that training and counseling before they opted to have a family!


Just where do all the people go for parental training and counseling, is that a new thing for youth now? 
I'm pretty sure most families started without it LOL!


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> You've obviously missed not only my point, but the point of the article itself.


Your point, from what I can tell, is the parents are useless.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Your point, from what I can tell, is the parents are useless.


Very observant! Now can you explain "why" they are useless?

Hint:it involves personal responsibility and critical thinking skills.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

doozie said:


> Because you "know" why they found themselves homeless at that particular point in time? There is no situation that would be acceptable to you for loosing your home or apartment?


 Assuming they great people on hard times is as foolish as assuming they are druggies and deserve it.



doozie said:


> No
> 
> 
> 
> No, you didn't really answer the question "already" LOL.


 Yes, you do not like the answer....



doozie said:


> Are my questions too hard? LOL
> 
> I certainly hope that is not the case, it would be nice to have a story follow a family up and out of homelessness though.


 Nope, serves nothing but to make you feel good, you feeling good helps no one.



doozie said:


> I'm not sure how long they have been in the shelter, or if they are still housed there.
> 
> I would think, guess, assume, that finding affordable housing could be holding them back, but that does not make them lazy or useless parents.


 Everyone else in a house affords it, perhaps there is a reason they can`t afford it when many others can.



doozie said:


> I have not asked "someone else" to do it all for this family, but you know that...
> 
> I don't see them as useless or lazy as others have posted.
> 
> ...


 You can see whatever you want, it changes nothing...….you can donate if it makes you feel better, but it does nothing to change what lead them there, so there will always be more there as soon as you help that one out...…

Many people have wasted entire lives mopping up water, instead of fixing the leak...….but as long as it makes you feel good...


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Just where do all the people go for parental training and counseling, is that a new thing for youth now?
> I'm pretty sure most families started without it LOL!


Most folks pick it up from gramma, their own parents, siblings, schools, observing others as they are growing up. Some even picked it up in places like Sunday school.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> Many people have wasted entire lives mopping up water, instead of fixing the leak...….but as long as it makes you feel good...


This bears repeating!!


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> Assuming they great people on hard times is as foolish as assuming they are druggies and deserve it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nothing about the story makes me feel good.

Passing judgement on parents that find themselves homeless, when no one knows the whole story, (or even if they did) solves nothing and helps no one either.

And no, BFF is appearantly incapable of answering questions I ask, it's a pattern...just ask him LOL.

(You can't answer a question before it's been asked, it's all in the context of his answer, or what he is calling an answer.)


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Very observant! Now can you explain "why" they are useless?
> 
> Hint:it involves personal responsibility and critical thinking skills.


I don't think they are useless though...


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> This bears repeating!!


….if nothing else it makes great fodder for the minstrels to write songs about their gallant exploits, even if most do not understand......


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I don't think they are useless though...


What sorta purpose are they serving in your mind? Beyond teaching their children how to live out of their neighbors pockets of course?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> What sorta purpose are they serving in your mind? Beyond teaching their children how to live out of their neighbors pockets of course?


First things first

Is asking for help a disqualifier for being or becoming a better parent?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Is asking for help a disqualifier for being or becoming a better parent?


Why ask questions when you ignore the answers?


----------



## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

What do you think San Francisco will look like in a few weeks with the 10,000 asylum seekers they have opened the town too? We can't house, cloth and feed our own homeless and vets. Yet we are taking in non americans.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Why ask questions when you ignore the answers?


You haven't even answered if you think they are useless as YH Claims....


----------



## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

17 months is a long time. Even if only one parent worked at min wage, seems like they could have saved up to re-launch by this time. 

We never had a lot of money when I was a kid, and at one point we shared a home with another family. The husband had been off work taking some kind of schooling and they were about to lose their house. So their good friend, my dad, agreed to move in and split expenses so all could live cheap for awhile. It ended up being about a year, until the schooling completed and resulted in a job. 3 kids, one couple, 2 other adults in a 3 bedroom house. My husband's family growing up had 5 kids in a 2 bedroom house for quite awhile. You do what you gotta do. Everybody had food, clothing, shelter, just not much personal space. Builds character when you tough it out and solve your own problems.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> *You haven't even answered* if you think they are useless as YH Claims....


I answered it.
It's not my fault you choose to ignore it.
It's what you always do.
Then you ask more questions.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> First things first
> 
> Is asking for help a disqualifier for being or becoming a better parent?


Nope, I remember asking for work lotsa times.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Nope, I remember asking for work lotsa times.


And the father is/was employed in the link provided on the family. Nice avoidance of answering the question though...


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I answered it.
> It's not my fault you choose to ignore it.
> It's what you always do.
> Then you ask more questions.


No your didn't, not at all, as usual. It's what you always do....you gave a few sentences, but didn't actually answer the question asked.

Do you think they are useless parents? it's a SIMPLE yes or no answer.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> And the father is/was employed in the link provided on the family. Nice avoidance of answering the question though...


I answered your question quite honestly..... Which part of "nope" gave you trouble?
Now that we have that out of the way, (hopefully), what useful purpose are these "parents" actually serving?


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Most folks pick it up from gramma, their own parents, siblings, schools, observing others as they are growing up. Some even picked it up in places like Sunday school.


What do they do when there are no responsible people filling these positions?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> I answered your question quite honestly..... Which part of "nope" gave you trouble?
> Now that we have that out of the way, (hopefully), what useful purpose are these "parents" actually serving?


Ok, you did answer the question. Asking for help is OK.

It appears through the pictures the family is doing what most families do together, just in a different environment. 
Parents being parents, watching over and caring for their children.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

IndyDave said:


> What do they do when there are no responsible people filling these positions?


Quite often, too often in my opinion, they fall into a miserable plight, and become victims of those who will profit from their misery under the guise of "helping" them.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Ok, you did answer the question. Asking for help is OK.
> 
> It appears through the pictures the family is doing what most families do together, just in a different environment.
> Parents being parents, watching over and caring for their children.


awww, ain't they sweet.... There is a wee bit more to parenting than kissing skinned knees and wiping noses. There are things like providing a home, good food, financial security, education, proper medical care and all the other things that most responsible parents manage to do. 
These are the things these kids do not get, and should be.


----------



## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

doozie said:


> I believe the father was employed, from the link I provided on the family. Is getting an apartment or affordable housing easy in the area?


The area around arlington has many apartments and its one of the less expensive areas. They have a number of "all bills paid" 2 bedroom apartments starting around $650 - thats; electricity, water, garbage all included. Arlington is also close to the main TV towers for DFW and you can get about 20 over the air channels with a set of rabbit ears - my brother lived there for a couple years.
And yes, there are also more expensive places in Arlington too.


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Just a note- Section 8 will qualify a family of 5 for more than that.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> No your didn't, not at all, as usual. It's what you always do....you gave a few sentences, but didn't actually answer the question asked.


And there's the endless repetition...



doozie said:


> Do you think they are useless parents? it's a SIMPLE yes or no answer.


I already answered that one.
Scroll back if you are still confused.

Or ask again if you think the results will be different if you ask one more time.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> awww, ain't they sweet.... There is a wee bit more to parenting than kissing skinned knees and wiping noses. There are things like providing a home, good food, financial security, education, proper medical care and all the other things that most responsible parents manage to do.
> These are the things these kids do not get, and should be.


Since there is no update on this family, it is possible the help they received gave them the opportunity to move on and up.

It is entirely possible their situation was only one of finding housing they could afford, but some seem to want to kick em when they're down just because it fits some pre conceived notion of what kind of parents they must be.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> And there's the endless repetition...
> 
> 
> I already answered that one.
> ...


You took all that time to post, but can't type yes or no. Clear up my confusion.... I won't hold my breath.LOL


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Clear up my confusion....


That's not possible.
I gave you answers.
I can't make you comprehend.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

doozie said:


> Since there is no update on this family, it is possible the help they received gave them the opportunity to move on and up.
> 
> It is entirely possible their situation was only one of finding housing they could afford, but some seem to want to kick em when they're down just because it fits some pre conceived notion of what kind of parents they must be.



 Its not them specifically, but like the court ruling the other day, they are just being used to make a example of the situations that exists...…


I could put you on to the reasons why they are in that shelter, but it would do no good...….I think Charlie Daniels said it best with …..


*but i couldn't believe it, i just had to find out for myself
and i couldn't conceive it, i never would listen to nobody else
no i couldn't believe it, i just had to find out for myself
that there's some things in this world you just can't explain.*


I learned a hard earned lesson long ago....

People have to see things for themselves, its super rare anyone listens enough to change, they hear it alright, but they must see it for themselves before change happens.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's not possible.
> I gave you answers.
> I can't make you comprehend.


It's really a yes or no answer...help me comprehend.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> Its not them specifically, but like the court ruling the other day, they are just being used to make a example of the situations that exists...…
> 
> 
> I could put you on to the reasons why they are in that shelter, but it would do no good...….I think Charlie Daniels said it best with …..
> ...


I think many people are just one accident, injury, illness or job loss away from being homeless, were those some of the reasons you were thinking of?

What court ruling are you talking about?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> It's really a yes or no answer...help me comprehend.


Over and over and over......thinking it will turn out different *this* time...



doozie said:


> What court ruling are you talking about?


Google can be your friend.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I believe the father was employed, from the link I provided on the family. Is getting an apartment or affordable housing easy in the area?


You tell us.... Thousands of others manage to find affordable housing in the area... Why not this hard working industrious couple?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Over and over and over......thinking it will turn out different *this* time...
> 
> 
> Google can be your friend.
> ...


Its not them specifically, but like the court ruling the other day, they are just being used to make a example of the situations that exists...

Ok smarty, help me figure out this vague statement, and how any recent court ruling, "the other day" relates to the " situations that exists".....

Yes or no.....


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Its not them specifically, but like the court ruling the other day, they are just being used to make a example of the situations that exists...
> 
> Ok smarty, help me figure out this vague statement, and how any recent court ruling, "the other day" relates to the " situations that exists".....
> 
> Yes or no.....


Yes


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> You tell us.... Thousands of others manage to find affordable housing in the area... Why not this hard working industrious couple?


I don't know their specific situation,do you?, maybe he's been paying off debts, maybe his credit or lack of it prevents him getting an apartment.
And, perhaps they have moved on after receiving some help.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Yes


Are you answering for BFF now...hahahah.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> Are you answering for BFF now...hahahah.


Might as well, you don't seem to comprehend him... Or me.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I don't know their specific situation,do you?, maybe he's been paying off debts, maybe his credit or lack of it prevents him getting an apartment.
> And, perhaps they have moved on after receiving some help.


That's entirely possible, might have changed his name and is now holding a seat in the newly elected House of Representatives.


----------



## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

maybe they got more ink


----------



## Wanda (Dec 19, 2002)

It is very ironic that the generation that raised them are the ones that complain about them.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Wanda said:


> It is very ironic that the generation that raised them are the ones that complain about them.


I had nothing to do with the raising of these folks. Don't even try. Three of the four I raised have managed to raise their own families. Will have to wait and see about the last one but so far he's doing very well for himself. He's young yet, early twenties, works long hours, has payed off his student loans, supports himself and a beautiful young lady, has no vehicle or credit card debt. I think he will be fine. Me and his ma are looking forward to playing with the grands but they are in no hurry.


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Hobo's also worked for their livings, meager as it was. Not to be confused with today's railroad bums.


How do today’s railroad bums make their livings ?


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Tagging


----------



## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

GTX63 said:


> Tagging


Hate to say it, but I enjoy watching train cars go by to see the graffiti.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

keenataz said:


> Hate to say it, but I enjoy watching train cars go by to see the graffiti.


You rebel!


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Seems like in the day if they caught you in the cars or around the yard you got a brick bat to the head and run off.
I'm surprised they haven't figured out those are rolling billboards just waiting for paid advertising.


----------



## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

yes indeed! as Shawnlee said people have to see for themselves and I've seen the light! I spent a couple months at a community food centre lately thinking I could do some good. (other than what I do for people that I know are in need)

I wont go into what all I've seen and heard but I will say they were the most useless lazy bunch i've ever come across. not everyone but a good 90% of them or more. needless to say I've been out of there for the last couple weeks. I don't intend to spend another cent of my husbands hard earned money and my time on people like that. jmo. . ~Georgia


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> How do today’s railroad bums make their livings ?


By whatever means available. Mostly by feeding at shelters, panhanhandling, I'm quite sure some engage in criminal activity as well.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Denial
> 
> Opinion
> 
> ...


Denial reply, is simply deflection, as usual.

Opinion reply, yes I have opinions on the subject in the thread like others here do, what's yours? 

The shelter they are/were at is supported by others giving as much as they want in donations.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> The shelter they are/were at is supported by others giving as much as they want in donations.


How much have you given?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Are you answering for BFF now...hahahah.


No, and you never pay attention to the answers anyway, because you just keep asking the same pointless questions again and again. hahahah


----------



## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Wolf mom said:


> It would be more meaningful if questions like *"What was the decision making process that rendered this family homeless?*" were answered.


They got some sweet tats, though. 

I wonder if the journalist ever asked dad if he felt that the ones on his hands that couldn’t be covered with long sleeve shirt, or, heck, I don’t know, the ones on his head and neck, hurt his prospects at getting a job to keep his family out of a shelter.... you know, in a time of record-low unemployment... and whatnot.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> They got some sweet tats, though.
> 
> I wonder if the journalist ever asked dad if he felt that the ones on his hands that couldn’t be covered with long sleeve shirt, or, heck, I don’t know, the ones on his head and neck, hurt his prospects at getting a job to keep his family out of a shelter.... you know, in a time of record-low unemployment... and whatnot.



That's racist talk now a days...….employers now would be forced to hire manson with his forehead tat, or be charged with discrimination.....


----------



## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

shawnlee said:


> That's racist talk now a days...….employers now would be forced to hire manson with his forehead tat, or be charged with discrimination.....


Maybe he has a job. 

Unless his trade is custom motorcycle fabrication, or vape pen consulting, I do have to wonder whether they made the difference between a job that could afford housing for his family or one that couldn’t. 

Sweet dead guy peeling through that lightning bolt on his leg, though- you gotta admit. I’d compliment him on it if I noticed it while he was installing a super-charger on my car.


----------



## Hiro (Feb 14, 2016)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> They got some sweet tats, though.
> 
> I wonder if the journalist ever asked dad if he felt that the ones on his hands that couldn’t be covered with long sleeve shirt, or, heck, I don’t know, the ones on his head and neck, hurt his prospects at getting a job to keep his family out of a shelter.... you know, in a time of record-low unemployment... and whatnot.


I have had to evict too many renters that couldn't afford their rent that had nicer cars, furniture, TV's and several thousand dollars worth of tatoos or taxidermy to believe it is coincidental. That is obviously not applicable to people that I have never met; just an observation of poor decision making that is too typical.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

.


Bearfootfarm said:


> How much have you given?


How is that relevant?


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

doozie said:


> How is that relevant?


It's not at all relevant, but it's all they've got. Sad, huh?


----------



## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Hiro said:


> I have had to evict too many renters that couldn't afford their rent that had nicer cars, furniture, TV's and several thousand dollars worth of tatoos or taxidermy to believe it is coincidental. That is obviously not applicable to people that I have never met; just an observation of poor decision making that is too typical.



I have numerous tatoos, not sure how that is poor decision making?


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

keenataz said:


> I have numerous tatoos, not sure how that is poor decision making?


I so want multiple tattoos, but it's unclear if my immune system will react to them in a negative way. Both of my very well employed daughters have multiple tattoos too. No problems with decision making either.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Irish Pixie said:


> It's not at all relevant, but it's all they've got. Sad, huh?


And He thinks *I *ask pointless questions!


----------



## Bob M. (Nov 5, 2018)

newfieannie said:


> yes indeed! as Shawnlee said people have to see for themselves and I've seen the light! I spent a couple months at a community food centre lately thinking I could do some good. (other than what I do for people that I know are in need)
> 
> I wont go into what all I've seen and heard but I will say they were the most useless lazy bunch i've ever come across. not everyone but a good 90% of them or more. needless to say I've been out of there for the last couple weeks. I don't intend to spend another cent of my husbands hard earned money and my time on people like that. jmo. . ~Georgia


I did the exact same thing, woke up about 12 yrs ago. at the time I raised a lot of crops and on purpose raised way more with the intention of donating and helping, which I did, I then decided to spend time volunteering to help at one of the centers I brought food and....really opened my eyes, and no way I will ever do it again. and it wasn't just the 'clients' that were the issue I will say that, it was also the place itself and management. I brought in literally hundreds of lbs of produce, and seen one person come in and take almost all of it in a truck for themselves, and then later learned this person traded much of it for money, in which they bought drugs and alcohol with. This guy did this repeatedly every week. management just allowed it. I seen people fighting over stuff even, when there was plenty there right net to what they were fighting over, when all of it was a gift anyways. and some of the people I knew in the area and knew they chose not to do even the simplest things they could of done to help themselves. So I hear what you are saying and know it to be true.


----------



## Hiro (Feb 14, 2016)

keenataz said:


> I have numerous tatoos, not sure how that is poor decision making?


Are you homeless and can't afford rent, but can afford tatoos? That was my point, but I suspect you could discern that. Tattoo yourself from head to toe, if that is your desire. I do not judge personal choices from sexual orientation to piercings to tattoos. It is none of my business. 

If you can't afford your rent or to feed your children, but can find money for cigarettes, booze, tattoos or piercings...it is none of my business either. But, don't cry poor me.....


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

keenataz said:


> I have numerous tatoos, not sure how that is poor decision making?


 Moral of the story is..... ?


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> It's not at all relevant, but it's all they've got. Sad, huh?



Its always a "us" VS "them" thing with bigots......


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

shawnlee said:


> Moral of the story is..... ?


Know your priorities.


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> Maybe he has a job.
> 
> Unless his trade is custom motorcycle fabrication, or vape pen consulting, I do have to wonder whether they made the difference between a job that could afford housing for his family or one that couldn’t.
> 
> Sweet dead guy peeling through that lightning bolt on his leg, though- you gotta admit. I’d compliment him on it if I noticed it while he was installing a super-charger on my car.


I would think tat shop jobs haven't been completely saturated with illegals yet.


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> By whatever means available. Mostly by feeding at shelters, panhanhandling, I'm quite sure some engage in criminal activity as well.


 So pretty much things haven’t changed ?


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

With humanity? Not since that first bite out of the apple.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> So pretty much things haven’t changed ?


True, we have always had bums, ner do wells and theives. My point was that label doesn't fit the hobo of days gone by. They were poor by most anyone's standards, but we're proud honest and decent, paid their own way in life.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> How is that relevant?


That's not an answer to the question I asked.



doozie said:


> And He thinks *I *ask pointless questions!


I only think that because it's true.
It's what you do in most threads.
Patterns never change.



> Irish Pixie said: ↑
> It's *not at all relevant*, but *it's all they've got*. *Sad*, huh?


That's all highly *biased* opinion, but why would today be different?


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's not an answer to the question I asked.
> 
> 
> I only think that because it's true.
> ...


I have not given anything to that particular shelter or organization as of yet, but to others I have given monetary amounts, cases of baby food, like new children's clothing, furniture, etc.

I thought about what YH said about learning lessons from your grandma, parents and church...that's where I learned to give to others.
Ironic huh?

Whats your point?


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I have not given anything to that particular shelter or organization as of yet, but to others I have given monetary amounts, cases of baby food, like new children's clothing, furniture, etc.
> 
> I thought about what YH said about learning lessons from your grandma, parents and church...that's where I learned to give to others.
> Ironic huh?
> ...


That where I learned to be generous as well. I come from a long line of givers in my family.


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> True, we have always had bums, ner do wells and theives. My point was that label doesn't fit the hobo of days gone by. They were poor by most anyone's standards, but we're proud honest and decent, paid their own way in life.


Lol I think desperate hungry people have always done whatever they could for food. 
You may have a impression of hobos improved with age. 
After all the classic stereotype picture is one stealing a apple pie from a windowsill!


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

AmericanStand said:


> Lol I think desperate hungry people have always done whatever they could for food.
> You may have a impression of hobos improved with age.
> After all the classic stereotype picture is one stealing a apple pie from a windowsill!


Don't confuse railroad bums with hobos. They are two separate breeds of pups.


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

I’ve heard that and am trying to find out the difference. 
So far railroad bums simply seems to be the current PC term for hobo.


----------



## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's not an answer to the question I asked.
> 
> 
> I only think that because it's true.
> ...



Every time you put someone down for SSDD you do realize you're doing the same thing, right ?


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

shawnlee said:


> Its always a "us" VS "them" thing with bigots......


You and I agree on this point. Which one of us is the bigot?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Whats your point?


It's self explanatory.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> Which one of us is the bigot?


The one who assumed it was about them.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It's self explanatory.


I think your falling back on one of the patterns you talk about just about now......


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I think your falling back on one of the patterns you talk about just about now......


We see a lot of that here, and no single member has a patent on it.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> I think your falling back on one of the patterns you talk about just about now......


You think lots of things that are incorrect.
That changes nothing I've said.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> You and I agree on this point. Which one of us is the bigot?



I would say both, as it is with most people...…...its pretty common...….with some it is every single thing and others not soo much. I would venture a guess at everyone at some point, some times. Some more than others, some less than others.

Like most things, it has been weaponized and demonized, but it is a fairly normal thing...…


Society has attached meanings that are not in the dictionary definition...…. Its simply intolerance of things you do not like...…….....it is not negative or positive,...good or bad.....


Same as any of the other popular weaponized buzz words....


----------



## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Seems like we hashed out the meaning of bigot a while back. 
Didn’t it mean someone who is firm in their beliefs ? Seems like the definition included most everybody and was thus meaningless.


----------



## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's not an answer to the question I asked.
> 
> 
> I only think that because it's true.
> ...





oneraddad said:


> Every time you put someone down for SSDD you do realize you're doing the same thing, right ?


Nothing really to add, Rad. Just quoting because it’s so true it deserved to be said twice.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

shawnlee said:


> I would say both, as it is with most people...…...its pretty common...….with some it is every single thing and others not soo much. I would venture a guess at everyone at some point, some times. Some more than others, some less than others.
> 
> Like most things, it has been weaponized and demonized, but it is a fairly normal thing...…
> 
> ...


Bigot is not a weaponized "buzzword". It's always been a prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinion different than their own, and it always will be. I'll agree there are degrees of bigotry.


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

Ummmmm....no story to go with the pics? What's the deal? Why aren't they taking care of themselves? The guy looks able to work, so does the mom, and they are sure as hell capable of popping out kids.

Pure propaganda/clickbait.


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

Irish Pixie said:


> In my opinion, compassion is in short supply in a country where "I got mine, screw you" prevails.


In my opinion, the lesson here is "Stupid should hurt" and "Some people need a good ass-kicking".


----------



## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Assuming without knowing all the facts and then judging. Not a good look for some of you. For all you know one of them has a serious illness or is recovering from an accident. There are many things that could put someone is a financial hole.


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

painterswife said:


> Assuming without knowing all the facts and then judging. Not a good look for some of you. For all you know one of them has a serious illness or is recovering from an accident. There are many things that could put someone is a financial hole.


The fact that they didn't tell me the story so I don't "know" gives me a real good clue....


----------



## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Alder said:


> The fact that they didn't tell me the story so I don't "know" gives me a real good clue....


Making more assumptions, I see.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

painterswife said:


> Assuming without knowing all the facts and then judging. Not a good look for some of you. For all you know one of them has a serious illness or is recovering from an accident. There are many things that could put someone is a financial hole.


Absolutely. There could be a lot less judging of other human beings without a shred of information to go on as well. 



Alder said:


> Ummmmm....no story to go with the pics? What's the deal? Why aren't they taking care of themselves? The guy looks able to work, so does the mom, and they are sure as hell capable of popping out kids.
> 
> Pure propaganda/clickbait.





Alder said:


> In my opinion, the lesson here is "Stupid should hurt" and "Some people need a good ass-kicking".


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

painterswife said:


> Making more assumptions, I see.


I trust my own judgement and life-experience when I'm given *no other information* to go on. That's not my fault, it's the "writer's" and the subjects' decision. I generally resist being emotionally manipulated by people with an agenda.

As far as judgement goes, how do the "nice" people make decisions? Gathering what (little?) info is available and weighing the evidence is my usual method.


----------



## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

I saw a guy, I just didn't like the way he looked. Rough, ugly, wild. But I was determined not to be scared of him, so I gave him the finger. Amazingly, he gave me the finger almost immediately. like it was a reflex action for riff-raff like him!! Son of a biscuit-eater!! Well, I didn't much care to get in a physical altercation and end up in jail for whipping that boy's hiney, so I stepped away from the mirror.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Alder said:


> I trust my own judgement and life-experience when I'm given *no other information* to go on. That's not my fault, it's the "writer's" and the subjects' decision. I generally resist being emotionally manipulated by people with an agenda.
> 
> As far as judgement goes, how do the "nice" people make decisions? Gathering what (little?) info is available and weighing the evidence is my usual method.


Your posts indicate that you are making a judgment on a family without a shred of information, based only on your opinion (based on pictures) of what has happened to them. Which is fine, if you're OK with judging others without knowing a thing about them.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Clem said:


> I saw a guy, I just didn't like the way he looked. Rough, ugly, wild. But I was determined not to be scared of him, so I gave him the finger. Amazingly, he gave me the finger almost immediately. like it was a reflex action for riff-raff like him!! Son of a biscuit-eater!! Well, I didn't much care to get in a physical altercation and end up in jail for whipping that boy's hiney, so I stepped away from the mirror.


I heart you Clem.


----------



## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

Clem said:


> I saw a guy, I just didn't like the way he looked. Rough, ugly, wild. But I was determined not to be scared of him, so I gave him the finger. Amazingly, he gave me the finger almost immediately. like it was a reflex action for riff-raff like him!! Son of a biscuit-eater!! Well, I didn't much care to get in a physical altercation and end up in jail for whipping that boy's hiney, so I stepped away from the mirror.



Is that when you sent me those blackberries ?


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

Irish Pixie said:


> Your posts indicate that you are making a judgment on a family without a shred of information, based only on your opinion (based on pictures) of what has happened to them. Which is fine, if you're OK with judging others without knowing a thing about them.


As I explained...I'm judging _because_ they didn't give me a shred of information. There's a difference.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

.


Alder said:


> As I explained...I'm judging _because_ they didn't give me a shred of information. There's a difference.


And you think a ass whooping is the answer, all without knowing a thing....


----------



## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

doozie said:


> .
> 
> 
> And you think a ass whooping is the answer, all without knowing a thing....


Although I can't say for sure, I think he meant figuratively. 

But then again, as a writer, he really didn't make himself clear on that one.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

mreynolds said:


> Although I can't say for sure, I think he meant figuratively.
> 
> But then again, as a writer, he really didn't make himself clear on that one.


Yes, I made a statement without knowing if the ass kicking was meant for some people, or the family in the story.
EIther way, I'm not sure it would help the situation.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

painterswife said:


> Assuming without knowing all the facts and then judging. Not a good look for some of you. For all you know one of them has a serious illness or is recovering from an accident. There are many things that could put someone is a financial hole.



I will take that bet....lol

Its like Vegas odds, I have been around long enough to see from those pictures there is a high probability they are deadbeats...…...there is a chance they are fine upstanding people, but the inverse is also a chance...…...given the look, the situation, the amount of kids and a few other things I can eye out in those pictures......odds are in my favor .


People who end up in hard times and it was just truly out of their control, a random chance event are far and few between...……..usually there is at the minimal some culpability and the norm is they simply just did not think that could ever happen to them, so they proceeded in such a manner.


I have seen too much, been around too much and been thru too much in my life...…...the majority of the time peoples situations are a result of their own actions.


So odds are highly against them being innocent and without blame......HIGHLY against them.


But, I think this thread has been a clear answer to what are we supposed to do with this information...……….


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

I would point out that any health coverage available via the ACA that is in fact affordable to people in any danger of landing in a shelter comes with deductibles higher than most of those people have ever spent on an automobile. It doesn't tax my imagination to where 1 ER visit would be financially devastating.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

shawnlee said:


> I will take that bet....lol
> 
> Its like Vegas odds, I have been around long enough to see from those pictures there is a high probability they are deadbeats...…...there is a chance they are fine upstanding people, but the inverse is also a chance...…...given the look, the situation, the amount of kids and a few other things I can eye out in those pictures......odds are in my favor .
> 
> ...


My husband and I are well off financially and have excellent health insurance, but a serious long term illness or injury could still take a hard toll on us. It would have been much worse had it happened when we were young and had small kids. I don't think medical emergencies are few and far between. 

Then again, I try not to judge people even if they've made a few poor choices, because I have as well.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> I will take that bet....lol
> 
> Its like Vegas odds, I have been around long enough to see from those pictures there is a high probability they are deadbeats...…...there is a chance they are fine upstanding people, but the inverse is also a chance...…...given the look, the situation, the amount of kids and a few other things I can eye out in those pictures......odds are in my favor .
> 
> ...


I have to ask, what it is you see in those pictures that shows you they are deadbeats, based on your vast experience.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Is it just me, or does anyone else "snort" when they laugh?


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

doozie said:


> I have to ask, what it is you see in those pictures that shows you they are deadbeats, based on your vast experience.


Can't speak for Shawnlee, but I see four kids living in abject poverty for an extended period of time. How much more do you need?


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

I can't speak for the family in this "article". So I won't. But those who say that all it takes is one financial disaster to land someone in a similar situation, is correct. 

All it takes is one wildfire, to destroy your farm and your home. Boom, you are no longer able to produce your own food and will be very lucky to have a roof over your head. Worse, as in my case, when you also lose your job and your safety net (parent's home) in the same disaster, where does that leave someone? Taking this a step further, what happens when nearly TEN THOUSAND homes in your part of the state burn down? In an area already in the midst of a housing crisis? (this figure is just for single family homes and does not include multi family homes such as apartment complexes). Would you still kick a family who is down and staying in a shelter? Do you begrudge those who would need assistance following a life shattering event of this magnitude? Are they terrible parents for having merely lived through such an event?

If you would still look down your noses at these folks, then what would your suggestions be to prevent this from happening to other families?


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

The tattoos might have something to do with it. Priorities, and all that.


doozie said:


> I have to ask, what it is you see in those pictures that shows you they are deadbeats, based on your vast experience.


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

ShannonR said:


> I can't speak for the family in this "article". So I won't. But those who say that all it takes is one financial disaster to land someone in a similar situation, is correct.
> 
> All it takes is one wildfire, to destroy your farm and your home. Boom, you are no longer able to produce your own food and will be very lucky to have a roof over your head. Worse, as in my case, when you also lose your job and your safety net (parent's home) in the same disaster, where does that leave someone? Taking this a step further, what happens when nearly TEN THOUSAND homes in your part of the state burn down? In an area already in the midst of a housing crisis? (this figure is just for single family homes and does not include multi family homes such as apartment complexes). Would you still kick a family who is down and staying in a shelter? Do you begrudge those who would need assistance following a life shattering event of this magnitude? Are they terrible parents for having merely lived through such an event?
> 
> If you would still look down your noses at these folks, then what would your suggestions be to prevent this from happening to other families?


Spot on, and thank you for explaining better than I could. I'm also sorry, which is totally inadequate, for what you experienced.


----------



## Alder (Aug 18, 2014)

doozie said:


> .
> 
> 
> And you think a ass whooping is the answer, all without knowing a thing....


I said ass-kicking, ( any reason you misquoted me?) with the meaning of "inflicting some incentive and responsibility" into someone. With all that I _don't know because of the intentional lack of any information here_, my BS detector is screaming red.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

ShannonR said:


> The tattoos might have something to do with it. Priorities, and all that.


I would consider this a good guess. I would also point out that it is entirely possible that he acquired them before the relationship or the children or at least before their personal episode of the S hitting the fan. Take that in tandem of with the potential of a less than serviceable upbringing and I am not going to judge even though I am no fan of tattoos even on someone who can afford to burn green cash in the fireplace instead of wood.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Alder said:


> I said ass-kicking, ( any reason you misquoted me?) with the meaning of "inflicting some incentive and responsibility" into someone. With all that I _don't know because of the intentional lack of any information here_, my BS detector is screaming red.


Sorry for the misquote, don't see much of a difference though. 
"A kick in the ass" might be a better choice of words....

The program the shelter has tries to provides such, without the kick though.

*Family Program:*
Our families program serves mothers with children, fathers with children and intact families with children. The family program focuses on keeping families together and providing them with a safe, whole and supported environment. The onsite case managers encourage, educate and empower parents while helping them develop critical skills for a healthy strong family foundation. Life skills classes are provided including parenting classes, early childhood reading classes, cooking a healthy meal, more than budgets, personal social adjustment groups, grief and loss groups, and numerous other classes as needed.


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

Irish Pixie said:


> Spot on, and thank you for explaining better than I could. I'm also sorry, which is totally inadequate, for what you experienced.


Sometimes, you have to experience something like this for yourself to fully understand. 

I think I've been here long enough for many others on this forum to know that I'm big on self sufficiency and doing for yourself in a normal situation. Like building my own housing (whether or not it's up to California "legal" standard), producing my own food, working, attending college, basically all of that fun stuff that people here have been bagging on this family for not doing, lol.

All it takes is one wildfire (or hurricane, or whatever) to wipe all of that out for someone. And it takes literally years to rebuild all of that. When the water or electric infrastructure to entire communities is wiped out, you can pretty much count on folks staying in shelters for extended periods of time. 

I was lucky in that while the farm is pretty much gone, my RV sustained only moderate damage (stuff melted, windows broken) so I do have a roof over my head. Unlike so many thousands of others in the area right now. Fortunately, I'm handy and have most of it fixed (the RV, not the farm), I even popped the windows out myself and took them in for repair, then re-installed. But not everyone has that kind of skill or the blind luck that I experienced with the roof over my own head.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> You tell us.... Thousands of others manage to find affordable housing in the area... Why not this hard working industrious couple?



Here ya go....
http://ahomewithhope.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/2018-SoHo-Report-FINAL.pdf
All the way near the end.

Housing Gap

The Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington metropolitan area falls in the “10 Most Severe” with a shortage of affordable rental homes, there are approximately 19 affordable and available homes per 100 renter households. Additionally, nationwide, the number of homes renting for $2000 or more per month increased by 97% from 2005 to 2015 while numbers renting for $800 or less declined by 2%, only further burdening those in need of stable and secure housing.18 This report makes it no secret that Tarrant County is lacking in permanent, affordable housing options and population increases create more competition for those existing options.


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

doozie said:


> Here ya go....
> http://ahomewithhope.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/2018-SoHo-Report-FINAL.pdf
> All the way at the end.
> 
> ...


This is becoming the status quo across much of nation. I think that much of the blame for homelessness lies in the regulatory powers that be. Once upon a time, anyone could build anything they wanted for their family to live in. Many times these days, even if you do have the skill and ambition to do so, many don't have the money to cut through all of the red tape involved in building a structure of any sort. In California, regulation central, it's near impossible to build anything in even an economically depressed area of the state for less than half a million. And so much of that cost is "impact fees", permit fees, multiple inspections, and ect. So much of the money involved isn't even going towards housing a family, it's going into various government coffers. 
It's my opinion that this contributes very greatly to the state's homeless problem. Average, poorer citizens are quite literally prohibited from building a roof over their family's head.


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

Oh, and I forgot to add: permitted or unpermitted, built "to code" or not, they all burn the same. Even the ones with metal roofs and fire resistant measures taken. Buildings made from 100% metal, just twisted masses of rubble after the ashes cool.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

I agree with much of what is being said.....but it seems most want to post of a valid situation, then portray everyone in the same light, when many people deserve the consequences of their actions. 


Its just as silly to say no one deserves it as it is to say everyone deserves it...….


Make poor choices get poor results...….make good choices, get poor results...…...one has a much higher probability of a likely outcome. Both happen.

Life is also random and happen stance......we are not in control and never will be, but people still fixate on control and grasp at it thru laws and justifications......its not and never will be, no matter what we do.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> I agree with much of what is being said.....but it seems most want to post of a valid situation, then portray everyone in the same light, when many people deserve the consequences of their actions.
> 
> 
> Its just as silly to say no one deserves it as it is to say everyone deserves it...….
> ...


I know there are people that for some reason or another are opportunists at taking what someone else is giving for as long as they can, with no intention to change, but how some can make that distinction from only a group of photographs is really what puzzles me.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> Nothing really to add, Rad. Just quoting because it’s so true it *deserved to be said twice*.


Say it as much as you like.
It doesn't make anything I've said less accurate.

It describes most everyone here.
Some like to pretend *they* are different.

But you're really not.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> I have to ask


Of course you do.
20 Questions deja vu.


----------



## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Say it as much as you like.
> It doesn't make anything I've said less accurate.
> 
> It describes most everyone here.
> ...


No, but one feather unique to your cap is the daily pointing out to others that they’re saying the same stuff...on a different day. 


If only Alanis actually knew what ironic meant, she surely would have included BearFootFarms in one of her verses.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

ShannonR said:


> I can't speak for the family in this "article". So I won't. But those who say that all it takes is one financial disaster to land someone in a similar situation, is correct.
> 
> All it takes is one wildfire, to destroy your farm and your home. Boom, you are no longer able to produce your own food and will be very lucky to have a roof over your head. Worse, as in my case, when you also lose your job and your safety net (parent's home) in the same disaster, where does that leave someone? Taking this a step further, what happens when nearly TEN THOUSAND homes in your part of the state burn down? In an area already in the midst of a housing crisis? (this figure is just for single family homes and does not include multi family homes such as apartment complexes). Would you still kick a family who is down and staying in a shelter? Do you begrudge those who would need assistance following a life shattering event of this magnitude? Are they terrible parents for having merely lived through such an event?
> 
> If you would still look down your noses at these folks, then what would your suggestions be to prevent this from happening to other families?


you make a very good point. I commend you for your courage for hanging in there after your personal disaster and horrible loss. My problem with this couple is not that they may have suffered a catastrophic loss. That can happen to any of us. It's how they are not dealing with the problem that concerns me. It's been 17 months since they moved into the shelter, with no progress made as to rebuilding, relocating or fixing their lives. They seem content to lay around in this shelter remain homeless day after day, month after month.... Year after year. When are they going to do something to fix their situation?


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

doozie said:


> I know there are people that for some reason or another are opportunists at taking what someone else is giving for as long as they can, with no intention to change, but how some can make that distinction from only a group of photographs is really what puzzles me.



No one can....the same as no one can say they are not deadbeats, but that never stops anyone.

Which lesson do you think is best to take from those pictures.....

OMG, I better do everything I can to not end up like that, some people waste money or blow cash in trinkets and end up in that very sad situation....lots of times preventable, I better try to prevent it.

Or, they were probably doing all they could and there are people who will take care of you if you do end up that way, so no worries,...buy another pair of nike airs or another apple phone or get another tat, even if that rainy day comes some,..._____...will foot the bill, so carry on my wayward son.....make mine a double.


If half the people who could have prevented it did, there would be more than enough money left for those who could not...….but until we acknowledge there are deadbeats and users, we will never get anywhere when people believe that no matter what people are deserving.


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> you make a very good point. I commend you for your courage for hanging in there after your personal disaster and horrible loss. My problem with this couple is not that they may have suffered a catastrophic loss. That can happen to any of us. It's how they are not dealing with the problem that concerns me. It's been 17 months since they moved into the shelter, with no progress made as to rebuilding, relocating or fixing their lives. They seem content to lay around in this shelter remain homeless day after day, month after month.... Year after year. When are they going to do something to fix their situation?


That's a good question. I don't have the answers for this family, all I know is that there are a lot of other places I would be living before I spent that amount of time in a homeless shelter. To each their own, I suppose.


----------



## doozie (May 21, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Of course you do.
> 20 Questions deja vu.


Well, of course, It's what I do, why you feel compelled to point it out, time after time, makes no sense...


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> I know there are people that for some reason or another are opportunists at taking what someone else is giving for as long as they can, with no intention to change, but *how some can make that distinction from only a group of photographs* is really what puzzles me.


You're making lots of assumptions with no more knowledge.
Their assumptions are as valid as yours, and don't blame anyone else for their situation.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

doozie said:


> Well, of course, It's what I do


See?
We do agree on things after all.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

One life lesson I still need to deploy,...keep it short and sweet....


But,.....


----------



## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain.


----------



## Poriggity (Nov 8, 2018)

nchobbyfarm said:


> They have been in the shelter for 17 months. And have a 12 month old child. I would suggest they stop having children until they can provide for them as a start.


That was the first thing I noticed. If you made enough bad choices to not be able to provide for your currently family, why on earth would you bring another child into the world?


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Poriggity said:


> That was the first thing I noticed. If you made enough bad choices to not be able to provide for your currently family, why on earth would you bring another child into the world?


As someone pointed out- the baby is 12 months, pregnancy equals 9 months so she was pregnant prior to living in the shelter.


----------



## Poriggity (Nov 8, 2018)

Irish Pixie said:


> As someone pointed out- the baby is 12 months, pregnancy equals 9 months so she was pregnant prior to living in the shelter.


Valid point.. but I'd also venture to guess that whatever led them to homelessness did not just happen overnight. The mother was roughly 4 months pregnant when they went homeless. I'd venture a guess that they knew they were struggling to pay their bills way before they got preganat with thier last kid..


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Poriggity said:


> Valid point.. but I'd also venture to guess that whatever led them to homelessness did not just happen overnight. The mother was roughly 4 months pregnant when they went homeless. I'd venture a guess that they knew they were struggling to pay their bills way before they got preganat with thier last kid..


We're all guessing, and that's kinda the point.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> As someone pointed out- the baby is 12 months, pregnancy equals 9 months so she was pregnant prior to living in the shelter.


She was pregnant prior to them having enough assets to provide for emergencies.
They already had three kids to worry about, and I doubt his income could support them in any comfortable lifestyle before.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> She was pregnant prior to them having enough assets to provide for emergencies.
> They already had three kids to worry about, and I doubt his income could support them in any comfortable lifestyle before.


So, if you don't have at least $100K parked in savings, you should consider yourself barred from having children? Maybe $200K?


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> So, if you don't have at least $100K parked in savings, you should consider yourself barred from having children? Maybe $200K?


You should have enough saved along with having enough income potential to not have more kids than you can easily support without relying on charity for over a year.

That benefits everyone.


----------



## Hiro (Feb 14, 2016)

Clem said:


> Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain.


That is just great, Clem. Now, I have to go dig through boxes of my early adolescent books to find that one again.......where is that dust mask.


----------



## Poriggity (Nov 8, 2018)

Bearfootfarm said:


> You should have enough saved along with having enough income potential to not have more kids than you can easily support without relying on charity for over a year.
> 
> That benefits everyone.


I completely agree with this.


----------



## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

painterswife said:


> Assuming without knowing all the facts and then judging. Not a good look for some of you. For all you know one of them has a serious illness or is recovering from an accident. There are many things that could put someone is a financial hole.


It wasn't reported in the article. So either extremely lax journalism or not a factor in this couple's case. I'm leaning towards door number 2.


----------



## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)




----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> You should have enough saved along with having enough income potential to not have more kids than you can easily support without relying on charity for over a year.
> 
> That benefits everyone.





Poriggity said:


> I completely agree with this.


I suppose you both were sitting on enough money to live for a year or more and/or a catastrophic financial event like an expensive hospital stay before having children, or did you just get lucky?


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

IndyDave said:


> I suppose you both were sitting on enough money to live for a year or more and/or a catastrophic financial event like an expensive hospital stay before having children, or did you just get lucky?


By their logic, their wives would have had old and shriveled up eggs and wouldn't be able to produce children by the time they had saved "enough" cash anyway. Unless they are independently wealthy, in which case maybe they had some extra money


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

ShannonR said:


> By their logic, their wives would have had old and shriveled up eggs and wouldn't be able to produce children by the time they had saved "enough" cash anyway. Unless they are independently wealthy, in which case maybe they had some extra money


Yes. I would emphasize that it is easy to go all Pharisee and judge others AFTER having passed the threats faced by young parents in some cases by preparation but far more often by dumb luck.


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

IndyDave said:


> Yes. I would emphasize that it is easy to go all Pharisee and judge others AFTER having passed the threats faced by young parents in some cases by preparation but far more often by dumb luck.


It aint perfect.... and life has certainly happened to me. Fortunately, I did have a very small nest egg to work with when disaster struck but NOTHING like 100k!! But, I have a nice warm home for me and the kid(s), everyone is healthy, clothes and home cooked food and all that stuff. 
The money isn't what is important in life. People's opinions aren't what is important either. This is.


----------



## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

Irish Pixie said:


> As someone pointed out- the baby is 12 months, pregnancy equals 9 months so she was pregnant prior to living in the shelter.


I missed someone pointing that out. 

My response to that point is that their problems had to begin before her pregnancy. It takes much longer than four months to evict a tenant or take a house back is almost all cases. And without a significant savings, having additional children is neglect IMHO.


----------



## lmrose (Sep 24, 2009)

Clem said:


> I thought homeless was when you wandered around, sleeping in the park and stuff. Although living in a cinderblock room isn't the best home, it looks like a home to me. 4 walls, a roof, food, clothes, baby cribs, and so on. I can't see this as homeless.


Homeless to me is exactly what the name says. I always thought shelters were temporary solutions until the person could find an apartment or room and had some income to pay rent. Sometimes I read posts on HT that dredge up memories from long ago. This is one of those times. Imagine being abandoned at 14 yrs with no parents or anyone else to look after you. Alone in the big world, emotionally warped, physically sick, basically unschooled with only sporadic grammar school, afraid of people and faced with the reality there is no one to turn to for help. That was me the day when what was left of our little house was gone. Daddy had borrowed money and now sick couldn't pay so he lost the only home we had. My sisters were older and gone. My Grandma was sick and gone and now my Daddy was sick and gone. I was left and no one seemed to notice. 

I may have been invisible but my stomach told me I was very much alive and desperate. I slept in an unoccupied camp, stole food from a farmer's garden and corn field. I exchanged my wore out shoes for new ones at a discount shoe mart leaving a note that I would pay for the new shoes as soon as I had some money. Wearing my only dress and with new shoes on I gathered my courage and went to a Mel's Burger and asked for a job as a car-hop. Being extremely shy this was so hard for me to do. But it is amazing what a person can over come when they are hungry. It was my first job other than baby sitting and paid 60 cents an hour. I was under age and was fired when they found out but that was a couple of months later.

I find it hard to describe in mere words the hopelessness I felt coupled with fear and desperation at that young age. Still I could connect the dots! I knew I had to work to survive. I went from Mel's Burgers to A&W to Burger King always getting fired when they realized I was under age. Luckily these places had a food allowance so I lived off what they allowed me for lunch and what I salvaged from dumpsters. With the money I earned I rented a two room apartment in an old ladies house. One room was a kitchen. The other a sitting room with a pull out bed. The bath room was shared with other tenants. That place cost me $12.50 a week of my $26 a week take home pay. 

Back then it never occurred to me to ask for help from welfare and I definitely would not stand on a street corner and beg for money. I was alive and had common sense to know I had to work to take care of myself.

When the jobs run out I had to give up my apartment and I moved to the country except without a place to go to. Call it luck or mercy from God that someone told me about a cabin for rent for $40 a month. There was no running water or inside bathroom and it had an old stove that used oil for heat. So I wasn't homeless very long this time. I used what money I had saved and rented the cabin and promptly found a job washing dishes at a truck stop 2 miles away. I walked the four mile round trip six days a week . That job lasted three months and I was fired again. I was 16 yrs by then but my visual impairments made me slow working. The boss's wife didn't want to let me go but her husband did. I couldn't pay rent and was homeless again. 

This time I went by Greyhound bus to visit my sister in Mississippi and stayed there with her and her husband. It was 1962 and civil rights workers were in the South. Me with my uneducated self didn't know folks were upset at my presence because I had been spotted talking to and walking with the very friendly local black people. A sheriff and deputy followed me and tried to coerce me to go with them but I refused. By the time I arrived back to my sister's home the sheriff had been there and my brother-in-law told me I had to go back north in the morning. People thought I was a civil rights worker. So the next morning I was on a bus and this time I got off in Memphis Tennessee. Homeless again.

Too shorten an already too long story I did end up back in Toledo Ohio eventually . I married at 19 and had four children by 25 yrs. and left with the kids when I found out it was a fraudulent marriage . I fled to California and was with out a place to live for a few months. We were helped by strangers for a time. Being homeless with kids is a whole lot harder than being homeless by ones self. A year later I was in Michigan and had a place to live and was one of those people receiving food stamps and welfare for a very short time until I could work. Sometimes what a person wouldn't do for themselves they will do for their children.

What I learned from all this is; most all of us make mistakes when we are young that sometimes have long term consequences . Our path in life gets set when we are young and sometimes it takes great effort to change that path. I learned regardless of how poor you are you can still retain values and moral standards. You can be homeless and still maintain your dignity while trying to change your situation. Being homeless sucks regardless of how you got there. If you are able to work there is work available . Even minimum wage is better than no wage. For myself ; my faith in God instilled in me by my Grandmother sustained me through a very hard beginning in life. I knew God would show me a way if I kept looking for it. I could hear my Daddy's words ringing in my ears when I was hungry and homeless, " Never give up. Life is hard but never quit because if you do you will miss out on the good things ahead. Never give up." 

And yes I did pay for the shoes I took from the store. I wrote a letter apologizing and enclosed the money in an envelope and left it with a cashier. My conscience wouldn't allow me to do otherwise.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

ShannonR said:


> It aint perfect.... and life has certainly happened to me. Fortunately, I did have a very small nest egg to work with when disaster struck but NOTHING like 100k!! But, I have a nice warm home for me and the kid(s), everyone is healthy, clothes and home cooked food and all that stuff.
> The money isn't what is important in life. People's opinions aren't what is important either. This is.


That is an adorable picture of the little man!


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

IndyDave said:


> That is an adorable picture of the little man!


Thanks, he sure is getting big!


----------



## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

IndyDave said:


> I suppose you both were sitting on enough money to live for a year or more and/or a catastrophic financial event like an expensive hospital stay before having children, or did you just get lucky?


Well, I fathered a child with my high school fling. We have raised him without the aid of others. And did whatever it took.



ShannonR said:


> So was she supposed to have an abortion or something, just to please you?


Actually you haven't and will not hear me advocate for anyone to have an abortion. I am here and was adopted prior to Row v Wade. Or I most likely wouldn't be here.

She should not have allowed herself to get pregnant because she already had 3 children dependent on her and couldn't afford to properly provide for them in an emergency as proven by her ending up in the shelter. Period!


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

They obviously blew thru that 30K nest egg for just in case, more than likely it was check to check like most people with a...... it can not happen to me attitude.


I like to keep 10-15K tucked away, but I am under no illusion I could have more, much more....so when that event happens to me and I burn thru that cash, it is 100% my fault, not circumstances or trumps or the worlds or big business or Russia or whatever lame duck excuse people make up.


I have seen what doing 100% looks like and it is super uncommon.....I know I certainly fall short.


This is a dear subject for me...…..

I had a lady, we were together for 7 years, had purchased house, she had purchased a new car, I had a cheap used work truck and like most young couples, I was in my early 20`s, at some point you want kids. In this case it was her, decided she had to have a kid immediately, I suggested we wait 6 months to a year and at least get around 5K saved as we had minimal in the bank.....probably around 1K.


She went into overload about it...it had to happen now or never and she did not care, we would find a way with no money if we had to...….realizing this was foolish and heat of the ovulation talk. I said no, we parted ways, I gave her the house and in less than 6 months she was married and pregnant...…moved in with him and let the house go into foreclosure.....


I am glad she got what she wanted, I guess, I have no idea if it was smooth sailing or not for her......I hope she had a wonderful life, but when I started mentioning I did not mind being broke on Thursday, but having a hungry kid is not acceptable and she said that stuff does not matter, I knew it was over for me. I am happy she was upstanding and did not trick me or intentionally get pregnant …..she was upstanding in that way and many others.


Some people just think it will magically all work out or it can never happen to me...…..


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> I suppose you both were sitting on enough money to live for a year or more and/or a catastrophic financial event like an expensive hospital stay before having children, or did you just get lucky?


I had enough money and enough earning potential to support the one child I had. I never went a year without job if I wanted one.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I had enough money and enough earning potential to support the one child I had. I never went a year without job if I wanted one.


How many times did you find yourself unexpectedly out of work, find a shortage of jobs available, or have a catastrophic incident?


----------



## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

IndyDave said:


> How many times did you find yourself unexpectedly out of work, find a shortage of jobs available, or have a catastrophic incident?


He didn't.... he just simply didn't WANT a job. At least those are the words I read.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> How many times did you find yourself unexpectedly out of work, find a shortage of jobs available, or have a catastrophic incident?


 The place I worked closed 60 days after they gave us notice. 
Does losing half of the family income count? We paid cash for most things we bought aside from the house and vehicles and always made extra payments on those to pay them off early. Maybe there was luck involved but there was also planninģ and not having multiple kids.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> The place I worked closed 60 days after they gave us notice.
> Does losing half of the family income count? We paid cash for most things we bought aside from the house and vehicles and always made extra payments on those to pay them off early. Maybe there was luck involved but there was also planninģ and not having multiple kids.


You do realize that the prevailing trend is zero notice, don't you? The civility of reasonable warning went out of fashion a very long time ago.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> You do realize that the prevailing trend is zero notice, don't you? The civility of reasonable warning went out of fashion a very long time ago.


Federal law requires at least 60 days notice if you exceed a minimum number of employees. 

That's actually happened to me twice, first around 1990 and the second time around 2002.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Federal law requires at least 60 days notice if you exceed a minimum number of employees.
> 
> That's actually happened to me twice, first around 1990 and the second time around 2002.


1. Not everyone works above that threshold. 

2. Not everyone follows the law. Most laws have ways of being circumvented, and the WARN Act has more holes than a Swiss cheese 

3. Just because the law is apparently your personal religion, that doesn't mean everyone feels the same.


----------



## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

lmrose said:


> Homeless to me is exactly what the name says. I always thought shelters were temporary solutions until the person could find an apartment or room and had some income to pay rent. Sometimes I read posts on HT that dredge up memories from long ago. This is one of those times. Imagine being abandoned at 14 yrs with no parents or anyone else to look after you. Alone in the big world, emotionally warped, physically sick, basically unschooled with only sporadic grammar school, afraid of people and faced with the reality there is no one to turn to for help. That was me the day when what was left of our little house was gone. Daddy had borrowed money and now sick couldn't pay so he lost the only home we had. My sisters were older and gone. My Grandma was sick and gone and now my Daddy was sick and gone. I was left and no one seemed to notice.
> 
> I may have been invisible but my stomach told me I was very much alive and desperate. I slept in an unoccupied camp, stole food from a farmer's garden and corn field. I exchanged my wore out shoes for new ones at a discount shoe mart leaving a note that I would pay for the new shoes as soon as I had some money. Wearing my only dress and with new shoes on I gathered my courage and went to a Mel's Burger and asked for a job as a car-hop. Being extremely shy this was so hard for me to do. But it is amazing what a person can over come when they are hungry. It was my first job other than baby sitting and paid 60 cents an hour. I was under age and was fired when they found out but that was a couple of months later.
> 
> ...


Your story will always be with me. I would only hope I would help if I saw someone in such a state. God bless you. You are strong beyond words.


----------



## Poriggity (Nov 8, 2018)

IndyDave said:


> I suppose you both were sitting on enough money to live for a year or more and/or a catastrophic financial event like an expensive hospital stay before having children, or did you just get lucky?


Actually, I have been fortunate enough to have a nest egg that was established within 6 months of my wife and I getting married. We made it a priority to scrimp and save to have a cushion, and we continue to build on it. I'd venture to say we have enough in savings to get by for at least 2 years, living conservatively.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> 1. Not everyone works above that threshold.
> 
> 2. Not everyone follows the law. Most laws have ways of being circumvented, and the WARN Act has more holes than a Swiss cheese
> 
> 3. Just because the law is apparently your personal religion, that doesn't mean everyone *feels* the same.


You mistakenly think I care how you feel.

You asked about *my* experience and I answered it.

You're still just rambling empty rhetoric.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> You mistakenly think I care how you feel.
> 
> You asked about *my* experience and I answered it.
> 
> You're still just rambling empty rhetoric.


You are very wrong. I never made the mistake of thinking for one second that you gave a damn about anyone.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Now children....


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> You are very wrong. *I never made the mistake* of thinking for one second that you gave a damn about anyone.


I wouldn't expect you to say otherwise.


----------



## IndyDave (Jul 17, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I wouldn't expect you to say otherwise.


Of course not. You have been remarkably clear.


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

IndyDave said:


> Of course not. You have been remarkably clear.



Is that not the best way to be, like it or not?


I much prefer a brazen ____ to a deceptive ___. 

I like to know where I stand, good or bad...……..and where others stand....wishy washy is no good.


----------



## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

shawnlee said:


> Is that not the best way to be, like it or not?
> 
> 
> I much prefer a brazen ____ to a deceptive ___.
> ...


I can tell you a couple place I don't stand if that will help, I don't stand in front of a charging bull.... Or behind a manure spreader!


----------



## shawnlee (Apr 13, 2010)

Being old enough to have loaded a manure spreader by hand with a pitch fork and operated the spreader, I am not sure its that much different from just standing behind it.....


----------



## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

IndyDave said:


> You are very wrong. I never made the mistake of thinking for one second that you gave a damn about anyone.


Remember that some are so unhappy, bitter, lonely, whatever that they can only feel well when upsetting others. You have a good life, with good people in it, focus on them and ignore the unhappy.


----------



## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

Yep(You should bold the"ignore"). After a while, you just have to accept that some people don't appreciate their lives any more.


----------



## siberian (Aug 23, 2011)

Why isn't soap and birth control permitted on welfare? Why are almonds subsidized. This may sound strange when I say I am a conservative. Compassion is needed among folks and it varies at age, time in folks lives.... . Simple mental health issues and lng term family expenses could be reduced drastically for pennies rather than dollars.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

IndyDave said:


> Of course not. You have been remarkably clear.


And yet you've still managed to misconstrue everything I said.



Irish Pixie said:


> Remember that some are so unhappy, bitter, lonely, whatever that they can only feel well when upsetting others.


That's quite ironic coming from you, but I'm not surprised you would say it.
If you're upset by things I say, that's on you.


----------

