# gift refused by amish



## wishomesteader (Sep 11, 2005)

I have an aquaintance who is Amish. I visited her yesteday. She seemed sad so I asked what the matter be, she told me her buck had died recently. Now she has 2 females, not bred and no milk. I purchsed my first Nubin cross saanen buck and while i was there, they had another for sale, so I bought it and took it to her as a gift for the loss of their older buck. this baby is going to be two months old on 11/24. I know, it isn't ready to breed, but this was a gift. She told me she didn't want it, they want a pure Nubin...i told her, they are expensive and I would be happy to take her to see some and use my phone to find price. They were costly, she has no money and still refused my gorgious little buck...as I wrong for being hurt???? :shrug:


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## Shazza (Nov 20, 2004)

....hmmm...some people need to help themselves before they are ready to be helped by others....sorry your gift was refused. Maybe the buck died because of their ignorance and therefore a blessing for you little buck. I have no idea about Amish ways...but people are people the world over, and we all still need to learn the same lessons. 
You tried, you offered, cant do any more than that.


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## deaconjim (Oct 31, 2005)

It is understandable that she would not want a cross if their intentions are to keep their herd pure. The question you should ask yourself is, did she refuse politely? If so, then no, you shouldn't be hurt. Your intentions were good, but it would have been wrong for her to accept it if she knew that they would not be able to use it.


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## Shazza (Nov 20, 2004)

The old saying....shouldnt look a gift horse in the mouth...they cant afford to buy one and yet knocked back the free one....that is not understandable at all!!


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## tinknal (May 21, 2004)

What Deaconjim said. I can't fault anyone for wanting to keep thier herd pure. If you raised purebred dogs would you want someone dropping off a mutt for breeding purposes?


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## MaineFarmMom (Dec 29, 2002)

I agree with Jim. 

I don't think I'd have accepted an animal I knew nothing about, especially since it didn't fit into my breeding plan. I want to know its history, especially in a milk line, and what it might have been exposed to before it comes here. 

Don't doubt yourself! You did good! You had the best of intentions and were very very generous. Can you use the little guy? Or is there someone else you can bless with him?


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## Ralph in N.E.Oh (Sep 14, 2006)

You're intentions were good and I'm sure you meant well, but like the others said, you have to admire her honesty and candor. 
Don't let this misunderstanding cloud your vision or screw up what can be a great relationship.


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## MorrisonCorner (Jul 27, 2004)

You know, there may be an undertone to this that you're not aware of as well that has nothing to do with your little buck and everything to do with what is and is not considered "appropriate gift giving" or "acceptable to accept" in the Amish culture. It may be your gift was shockingly inappropriate, as in perhaps too valuable, for her to accept.

For example, we're having a friend who is going through a divorce come for Thanksgiving dinner. Let's say for arguement sake that when he left he took the $5000 engagement ring with him (he didn't, but we're going for example here) and he showed up and presented it to us as a gift to show his gratitude. It would be completely inappropriate for us to accept this gift on so many levels it is almost comical. And, of course, since he and we share the same cultural background it would never occur to him to make such a social faux paux.

You, however, don't necessarily share the same cultural background as this woman and may have inadvertantly offered something she can't accept, regardless of how cute the little guy is, and she grasped at an explaination which seemed to her "polite" as a reason for the refusal. Rather than saying "How RUDE!" ;-)


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## Sher (May 10, 2002)

I know you had the best of intentions with your gift. And it probably hurt like heck to be refused. But maybe the poster is right when she talks about customs and what they can and can't do.

I don't know for sure what their beliefs are on crossing breeds either. Maybe you could find someone else who needs a good little buck. Don't be discouraged on good works..you did good.

Happy Thanksgiving!


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## Cara (May 9, 2002)

Another thought on all this...maybe she has in her brain so much that she MUST have a Nubian that she needs some time to rethink. I've done that so many times, and after a time, rethought my absolute-ness. Even with goats! What I had to realise is that mixed babies for meat market (possibly) still put my doe in milk. 

Your friend might feel differently down the road....and she'll be thankful to have such a thoughtful friend then.


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## AllWolf (Dec 27, 2005)

Your friend maybe thankful for you getting her a buck but she may just want to keep her herd pure. Some people may act like they are not thankful for the thought but deep down they really are. Like me I have some mixed breed goats but I also have purebred so my purebred I want to keep pure not mix that is why I have a certain buck to bred my gals. She later might come around you never know. Some people just have different ways of showing it. You might later find her a pure bred Nubian not so high on price a purebred Nubian with papers would be very high but one without may not be so high on price. 

I know Amish have different beliefs than us. I know of a Amish pair here where we live and they believe in a different way than us. Maybe the Amish belive not to mix animals who knows. I know these Amish that lives close to me does not believe in having tv because it bad. So maybe the Amish believe mixing a goat breed with another goat breed is bad. Just a thought. Other than that it is the thought that counts that you had. Do not feel bad just think of it like this maybe their belief is not to mix a purebred goat with another type of goat.


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## Sweet Goats (Nov 30, 2005)

Shazza said:


> The old saying....shouldnt look a gift horse in the mouth...they cant afford to buy one and yet knocked back the free one....that is not understandable at all!![/QUOTEAMEN.
> I do understand about wanting to keep her herd oure but if you don't have the means to get a PURE one, then be thank ful for what you are given. I :goodjob: pat you on the back and say GOOD JOB to you. I wish there were more people in the world like you. God Bless you for trying.


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## moonspinner (Jul 2, 2002)

I'd be interested in knowing just how she turned you down. Was she surprised by your offer? Did she seem grateful for your help? I know many "plain" people are uncomfortable dealing with we "English" so maybe she felt it was an awkward situation? If you had a pure Nubian do you think she would have accepted it? You did a great thing, so don't worry about the reaction.


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## wishomesteader (Sep 11, 2005)

deaconjim said:


> It is understandable that she would not want a cross if their intentions are to keep their herd pure. The question you should ask yourself is, did she refuse politely? If so, then no, you shouldn't be hurt. Your intentions were good, but it would have been wrong for her to accept it if she knew that they would not be able to use it.


They have no pure breds to begin with and polite was not exactly the word I would choose. she said she didn't want it because she wants a nubin, but has not got the money nor the means to get the money she said but has no way to breed her 2...confusing, Huh?


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## wishomesteader (Sep 11, 2005)

tinknal said:


> What Deaconjim said. I can't fault anyone for wanting to keep thier herd pure. If you raised purebred dogs would you want someone dropping off a mutt for breeding purposes?


Their goats are pure bred either...just mutt goats. the one I brought to her was fathered by Nubin and Mother was Sannen (?spelling).


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## wishomesteader (Sep 11, 2005)

MorrisonCorner said:


> You know, there may be an undertone to this that you're not aware of as well that has nothing to do with your little buck and everything to do with what is and is not considered "appropriate gift giving" or "acceptable to accept" in the Amish culture. It may be your gift was shockingly inappropriate, as in perhaps too valuable, for her to accept.
> 
> For example, we're having a friend who is going through a divorce come for Thanksgiving dinner. Let's say for arguement sake that when he left he took the $5000 engagement ring with him (he didn't, but we're going for example here) and he showed up and presented it to us as a gift to show his gratitude. It would be completely inappropriate for us to accept this gift on so many levels it is almost comical. And, of course, since he and we share the same cultural background it would never occur to him to make such a social faux paux.
> 
> You, however, don't necessarily share the same cultural background as this woman and may have inadvertantly offered something she can't accept, regardless of how cute the little guy is, and she grasped at an explaination which seemed to her "polite" as a reason for the refusal. Rather than saying "How RUDE!" ;-)


The 3 goats she had was given to her by another one of our friends...so it is not a mtter of that. I felt so bad for her when she said she now has 2 does that are not bred and no buck. I had my Nubin there that I paid quite a bit of money for and she wanted him, I told her sure, but it would cost because he was an expensive baby buck---3 weeks old and I could not just give him away. I paid much less for the other. I know this may sound selfish, but I have been saving for months to get a Nubin.


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## wishomesteader (Sep 11, 2005)

moonspinner said:


> I'd be interested in knowing just how she turned you down. Was she surprised by your offer? Did she seem grateful for your help? I know many "plain" people are uncomfortable dealing with we "English" so maybe she felt it was an awkward situation? If you had a pure Nubian do you think she would have accepted it? You did a great thing, so don't worry about the reaction.


We are not "English" we are Chiristan fellowship which is a branch off the Amish/Mennonite. We too follow MOST, not not all of the same customs. She plainly stated that she didn't want it becasue she wanted a Nubin. I had picked up my Nubin at the same time and I ams ure she would of wanted it and I offered it but for the cost I paid for it, it took me months to raise the money to purchase it.


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## marytx (Dec 4, 2002)

Well, I doubt I would have accepted, either. First, I would not bring an unknown animal bought at auction into my goat herd. Too much risk of bringing in cl or something. Secondly, a two month old buck is not even weaning age. She's got to supply milk for it for another month or so, if she can even get it to take a bottle. It's going to be a lot of trouble, and not even breeding age until next spring, when her does may or may not come into heat. I can't actually think of a reason why she would want to take it on.
Fine as I'm sure your intentions were, I hardly see how it would have been helpful to her to take it on, and no, I don't think you should be mad at her for turning it down. I'm sure she was embarrassed to have to tell you no. In my opinion, it is always best to ask before showing up with an animal as a gift.


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## midkiffsjoy (Sep 29, 2005)

What's REALLY weird is that she whined and complained about her does not being bred, and having no milk, and not having money for a buck. If I were in that position I would have done summersaults just to have buck SERVICE offered, let alone a buck!!! If she wants a Nubian she could always bred them now, and then next year save up and buy a Nubian buck. The world is not going to end because of a one year set back!!! *shake head* A buck that's not exactly what you want can be used, while one saves up, and can even be sold later to add to the money saved when the "right" buck is found. 
Heck, I want Buff Orphingtons.....just BO's but since the wolves tore through my cross breds that were giving me eggs in the meantime, leaving my family homegrown eggless, I'd not care HOW crossbred the hens were if I could find some I could afford, and I sure as heck would NEVER throw free hens back in someones face.
The only thing I can think is that she was whining and complaining to get it out and clear her mind and then focused on how to replace it and was completely surprised by such a huge gift. I wsa raised that it is not appropiate to accept such HUGE gifts, and maybe she felt like she could not pay you back for it. Few people (well....no longer all that few) can except a big gift and not feel "beholdin" and she just didnt know a polite way to convay that. I've been known to be rude when I'm shocked....not that I mean to, just comes out wrong when I'm surprised like that. Who knows. Don't feel bad. List the buckling for sale, and in a couple of months, if she complains again offer buck service. Smaller gift, she might be able to accept that. Heck, if you list it in a local feed store or paper, she might try buying it from you. Then you'd know that it was just too big a gift for her to accept!!!

Heck....when Rachel sent Dumpster home with us (a sad harrassed broiler hen) I tried several times to pay for her, because I just didnt feel it was right to get Dumpster and not pay SOMETHING for her!!!!

Dont feel so bad. You tried, and that was very very sweet of you!!!! If you ever move to Bedias, let me know. Youre the kinda neighbor thats hard to find!!! grin

Joy



wishomesteader said:


> They have no pure breds to begin with and polite was not exactly the word I would choose. she said she didn't want it because she wants a nubin, but has not got the money nor the means to get the money she said but has no way to breed her 2...confusing, Huh?


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## marytx (Dec 4, 2002)

Okay, maybe I misread. Was the buck offered not two months old?
Being offered a two month old buck when you already don't have milk is hardly buck service.
mary


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## moonspinner (Jul 2, 2002)

I cannot figure it - if she has mixed breeds then why would she balk at a nice cross you were offering? I think she might have this one idea stuck in her head and she hasn't been willing to expand her options. Although maybe the real issue is the buck's age and he can't breed for the upcoming kidding season? Though if it was that, then why didn't she simply say I can't use a buckling that young. Regardless, I think she could have been more gracious when turning you down.


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## Key (Apr 2, 2005)

This isn't an Amish thing as much as it would be a Luthern, Catholic, Baptist, etc. thing. A gift was offered, but she refused. Nice gesture, but she wasn't interested. I think I may have refused a young 2 month old with unknown health status as well, but I would be flattered that someone cared to offer it. Some poeple, Amish and non-Amish, are more reserved and will not thank you as much as you expected, but do we give gifts for the graititude we hope to receive or just to make the other person happy? I agree with the other peron who responded...never give an animal as a gift before contacting the person first and asking specifically if they want it. A friend bought me a pal hamster for my orginial hamster one time without asking, and my first hamster was killed that night by the new one.


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## Kimon (May 2, 2005)

Was the buck disbudded or dehorned? I beleive the Amish will not take an animal that has been altered.


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## Shazza (Nov 20, 2004)

Sorry to quote another cliche...but beggars cant be choosers.


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## Jillis (Sep 11, 2005)

It does seem strange. Perhaps she was hoping you'ld give her the Nubian buckling instead...


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