# Horse dewormer for cats?



## Seeria

Anyone have experience with using horse dewormer for cats? We have a big cob cat that we can't get dewormed using other methods (at least not without half doses, spilled stuff and a lot of blood/wounds on humans), so a neighbor gent said they used to give horse dewormer (tiny doses) back when he was on the farm. 

Seems that might work since it is a very tiny dose he said they used, and might save a lot of scratched body parts (and one near my eye). He won't eat food or drink anything with the various dewormers we've used. 

Given how meds have changed, I'm looking for current information, experiences doing this for cats.


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## doc-

I've never tried it on a cat, but the typical dewormers used n horses have low toxicity because they are so poorly absorbed, so they probably could be given to a cat too. But wouldn't you have the same problem trying to get a cat to eat something that doesn't smell just right?


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## Forcast

I use it on cats a pea size


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## haypoint

I have a bottle of injectable ivermectin. Fill a syringe, without a needle and squirt it into the horse's mouth. Do the same with a cat.

I'd guess a few cc of injectable mixed in tuna the cat would eat it.


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## Farmfresh

I just use a sweat shirt. 

1. Place your arm into an inside out sweat shirt sleeve.
2. Get kitty on your lap and start petting.
3. Grab kitty by the scruff and pull your arm out of the sleeve while at the same time pulling the sleeve over the cat's head and onto it's body. (It might help to have a helper handy.) 
4. If you do it correctly the cat's head will be sticking out of the sleeve cuff and the cat's entire body will be inside of the sleeve. With a few twists of the sleeve behind the kitty... he ain't going no where. Nor can he scratch.

5. At this point you are totally free to ... de-worm, give a pill, clean ears, treat eyes or anything else that needs done to a cat's head.


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## Teej

I've always heard to use Panacur and that even a tiny dose of ivermectin will kill a cat.


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## haypoint

Teej said:


> I've always heard to use Panacur and that even a tiny dose of ivermectin will kill a cat.


 http://aspcapro.org/sites/pro/files/zc-steenbergen-tox_brief_0.pdf

perhaps this will help.


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## haypoint

Cats often get tape worms, from eating mice, that takes a wormer that you may need to get from the Vet.


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## Agriculture

Seeria said:


> Anyone have experience with using horse dewormer for cats? We have a big cob cat that we can't get dewormed using other methods (at least not without half doses, spilled stuff and a lot of blood/wounds on humans), so a neighbor gent said they used to give horse dewormer (tiny doses) back when he was on the farm.
> 
> Seems that might work since it is a very tiny dose he said they used, and might save a lot of scratched body parts (and one near my eye). He won't eat food or drink anything with the various dewormers we've used.
> 
> Given how meds have changed, I'm looking for current information, experiences doing this for cats.


 You must realize that "horse dewormer" is a dangerously broad category to be basing both questions and recommendations on. Not all medications are the same, have the same doses or can be tolerated the same by different species. This is really just common sense if you think about it even a little bit. Chocolate for instance is great for humans, yet toxic in many animals. Same principal. You must specify exactly which _medication_ you are asking about in order for the answer to have any value.



doc- said:


> I've never tried it on a cat, but the typical dewormers used n horses have low toxicity because they are so poorly absorbed, so they probably could be given to a cat too.


 This is an interesting concept. I wonder what information it is based on? If they are so poorly absorbed, then why do they work on horses? The rate of "absorption" has little to do with it anyway.



haypoint said:


> I have a bottle of injectable ivermectin. Fill a syringe, without a needle and squirt it into the horse's mouth. Do the same with a cat.
> 
> I'd guess a few cc of injectable mixed in tuna the cat would eat it.


 If we're talking the 1% injectable, the most common form, "a few" (say, 3) cc would treat about a 330 pound animal. There are other formulations with different strengths, but all are used on large animals and would still require a much smaller dose. That is a good article. People should read it.

Medicine is not a hobby folks, either human or veterinary. It's based on proven facts, not hearsay and certainly not on what "someone said online".


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## Bearfootfarm

Wrap the cat in a towel and give it a wormer approved for felines and in a form that allows easy, accurate dosing.

You'd be upset if your Dr wanted to experiment with your medications without doing any research.


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## Seeria

We're trying to help our cat. Two vets here won't touch him due to his violent reactions. This cat is 30lbs and strong, big, like a Maine ****. He spits medicine, pukes it, won't touch any food with medicine in it, no matter the flavor. We even wear safety glasses now. We did find one vet the next county over but he wants $250 to "knock it out" then he'll charge us for deworming. The last time he went to a vet it took him six months before he'd let us touch him again.

We are currently researching ways to aid him. Horse dewormer in a tiny dose would be a lot easier to get down him than the large doses of cat dewormer, no matter what end it has to go into. 

We appreciate the comments and suggestions. We understand the risks, with and without being dewormed by various means. Research continues. 
Thank you kindly for sharing!


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## Lisa in WA

Has your vet not suggested *Profender*? Controls hookworms, roundworms and tapeworms and you simply apply it to the skin at the back of their neck. I use it on my cats.

http://www.1800petmeds.com/Profender+Cat+Wormer-prod11220.html


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## doc-

Agriculture said:


> This is an interesting concept. I wonder what information it is based on? If they are so poorly absorbed, then why do they work on horses? The rate of "absorption" has little to do with it anyway.


When "treating animals for worms," we're usually not talking about therapy for a pathological condition, but about prophylactically reducing the intestinal population of worms in the host. The chemical does not need to be absorbed into the host's blood stream to accomplish that. The vast majority of the chemical passes thru the host without being absorbed. (If you put your finger thru the hole of a donut, is you finger "in" the donut, or still outside the donut but surrounded by it?)

Dewormers are given to horses, dogs,cats, etc to reduce the populations of round & pin worms which are picked up from their food. Dogs and cats are also subject to heartworms which are transmitted via mosquito bites. The GI tract is not part of the picture. While ivermectin, commonly used in horses, is used prophylactically for heartworms in dogs & cats, it must be given by injection to be effective. http://www.dogheartworm.org/dog-heartworm-treatment.php


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## haypoint

doc- said:


> When "treating animals for worms," we're usually not talking about therapy for a pathological condition, but about prophylactically reducing the intestinal population of worms in the host. The chemical does not need to be absorbed into the host's blood stream to accomplish that. The vast majority of the chemical passes thru the host without being absorbed. (If you put your finger thru the hole of a donut, is you finger "in" the donut, or still outside the donut but surrounded by it?)
> 
> Dewormers are given to horses, dogs,cats, etc to reduce the populations of round & pin worms which are picked up from their food. Dogs and cats are also subject to heartworms which are transmitted via mosquito bites. The GI tract is not part of the picture. While ivermectin, commonly used in horses, is used prophylactically for heartworms in dogs & cats, it must be given by injection to be effective. http://www.dogheartworm.org/dog-heartworm-treatment.php


I disagree.
Ivermectin is rapidly absorbable and does flow through the blood stream. It so completely envelops the animal that a blood sucking insect will die from biting an animal recently injected/ingesting ivermectin. 
Well, to be completely factual, the ivermectin doesn't kill the flying insect. It paralyzes half of the body, wings and legs. Unable to walk or fly, it parasite starves. 

In either paste or liquid form, ivermectin is absorbed through the lining of the mouth and throat as it moves to the digestive tract. As an injection, it is placed in deep muscle to be absorbed with blood flow, including both sides of the digestive tract.

In a week's time, the digestive tract has removed the chemical, the liver has filtered the blood and expelled the chemical and in a couple weeks, none of the chemical remains.

If the animal, large or small, has a massive load of worms, a dose of ivermectin, or any other wormer, can trigger a gob of parasites that could create a blockage in the digestive tract or circulatory system. That's why dogs are tested for heart worms before treatment.


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## doc-

While oral ivermectin is certainly absorbed into the blood, it's not absorbed well enough to treat for heart worms in dogs or for liver worms in humans.

Back to the OP's question about cats, a quick search revealed this:
http://parasitipedia.net/ind ex.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2344&Itemid=2996 Scroll down to :
 "Cats, including exotic breeds (e.g. Siamese, Persian) usually tolerate well doses up to 1 mg/kg. But cat intoxications have also been reported.
Oral pastes for horses are not recommended at > 0.5 mg/kg."


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## Caprice Acres

Some dewormers don't taste bad and can be dosed in wet food, like fenbendazole. (Safeguard for goats and cattle, but available labeled for cats as well). Some can even be applied to the cat and due to their fastidious grooming activity, will remove it by licking. 

Why are you sure he needs dewormed? Is he showing clinical signs of parasitism? If you're seeing tapes - most tapeworms in most species are totally asymptomatic, and are nothing but gross. Most will self cure. I'm no cat expert, but I'd decide if deworming does need to be done if he's such a pain.  

Ivermectin is the same drug as what is in Heartguard. It is perfectly active oral. 

That being said, cats are fun because they lack many metabolic enzymes and this includes those that metabolize drugs. Depending on the drug, cats can be overdosed at much lower doses than other species. Pilling cats is no fun, I agree. 

Profender, as discussed, is also a topical dewormer. 

The dose makes the poison, however - and literally everything has a lethal dose including water. No matter the drug, make sure the route is effective that you choose, and that the DOSE IS CALCULATED. If you really must use other species dewormers off label, I would not use a horse paste. I would use a liquid livestock dewormer with a low enough concentration that you can accurately calculate a dose and dose it.


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## Bearfootfarm

> While ivermectin, commonly used in horses, is used prophylactically for heartworms in dogs & cats, it *must be given by injection to be effective*


That's incorrect

Your own source says it works in many forms, most being oral

http://www.dogheartworm.org/ivermectin-for-dogs.php


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## Bev

Seeria said:


> Anyone have experience with using horse dewormer for cats? We have a big cob cat that we can't get dewormed using other methods (at least not without half doses, spilled stuff and a lot of blood/wounds on humans), so a neighbor gent said they used to give horse dewormer (tiny doses) back when he was on the farm.
> 
> Seems that might work since it is a very tiny dose he said they used, and might save a lot of scratched body parts (and one near my eye). He won't eat food or drink anything with the various dewormers we've used.
> 
> Given how meds have changed, I'm looking for current information, experiences doing this for cats.


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## Bev

I have used the old one that came in a huge tube for cats. Took a pea size or smaller,I gave according to size. Too little I decided was better than too much, rub it on their leg in a smear that will not easily be shaken off. They will promptly lick it off!


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## Alice In TX/MO

Ivomec is NOT safe for cats.


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## Bev

Bev said:


> I have used the old one that came in a huge tube for cats. Took a pea size or smaller,I gave according to size. Too little I decided was better than too much, rub it on their leg in a smear that will not easily be shaken off. They will promptly lick it off!


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## Bev

Not sure what brand it was I used


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## Forcast

For the cost of the horse wormer now just buy cat wormer.


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## holymeansother

Agriculture said:


> You must realize that "horse dewormer" is a dangerously broad category to be basing both questions and recommendations on. Not all medications are the same, have the same doses or can be tolerated the same by different species. This is really just common sense if you think about it even a little bit. Chocolate for instance is great for humans, yet toxic in many animals. Same principal. You must specify exactly which _medication_ you are asking about in order for the answer to have any value.
> 
> This is an interesting concept. I wonder what information it is based on? If they are so poorly absorbed, then why do they work on horses? The rate of "absorption" has little to do with it anyway.
> 
> If we're talking the 1% injectable, the most common form, "a few" (say, 3) cc would treat about a 330 pound animal. There are other formulations with different strengths, but all are used on large animals and would still require a much smaller dose. That is a good article. People should read it.
> 
> Medicine is not a hobby folks, either human or veterinary. It's based on proven facts, not hearsay and certainly not on what "someone said online".


The problem is, we don't trust those folks calling themselves "doctor" or "nurse" anymore than we trust the politicians and big pharma that has purchased their loyalty so cheaply. It sucks for the genuine folks out there really doing their best to help but none of them can be trusted anymore. Not after the last 2 years of all their lies and propaganda. All, the wealth redistribution, all the people dying from the "medicines" they lied about and shoved down everybody's throats, not after so many elderly perished alone and afraid. Not after all of the pain, sorrow and oppression we have been put through at the advice and command of those who say they are there to help. We are done believing those folks are going to keep their oaths.


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## NRA_guy

Yep. Topical Ivermectin (apply to their skin).

I calculated the amount based upon my 15-year old cat's weight and it was about half of an eye dropper of Ivermectin.

Not sure what he had, but he had been to the vet 3 times at a cost of about $400 total. The vet said that he had incurable feline something (something like aids in humans) and that he would die from it soon.

My cat was almost dead. He had not eaten or moved for over 36 hours.

And hour after I put the Ivermectin on his back, he was up and drinking water and eating chicken my wife cut up for him.

That was about a year ago. He is pretty much back to his old self but he has a chronic runny nose.


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## wr

haypoint said:


> Cats often get tape worms, from eating mice, that takes a wormer that you may need to get from the Vet.


The product my daughter uses for her cat is sold by her vet and takes a few drops on the cat’s neck.

It’s simple, bloodless and very effective.


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## Forcast

Im not seeing at least listed on my tube of ivermectin that it treats tape worm. Yea cat tapeworm pills are expensive.


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