# Fencing - Making Drive in Wood Fence Posts?



## Homesteader73 (Sep 20, 2011)

Was wondering if anyone here has tried this before. I'm clearing some of my land for pasture. It is covered with small white oaks, Mulberries, and Sassafras. Most are around 3" in diameter. I was thinking of cutting many of them fence post length, seasoning them in the barn for a few months, stripping the bark from them, and then sharpening one end to be driven into the ground with a post driver.

My question for those who have done this is, what would you suggest treating the wood with?


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## DanielY (Aug 25, 2011)

Treat them for what? Splitting, bugs, weathering?
I will assume you are concerned with them splitting as they dry. Just paint the ends of them with any old paint. it slows the moisture loss int eh end grain and prevents most of the splitting. You would actually be better off driving them while they are green though. wet wood is not as brittle as dry wood. It is also likely to be more work to drive them unless you have a pile driver than just digging a hole and planting them. Otherwise I am envious of such a source of posts. All we have here is scraggly sage brush. On our farm in Kansas we used to just cut the fence posts as we moved down the fence line building the fence. Trees of all kinds grew thick as grass if the tree was to large we just cut a branch.


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## Homesteader73 (Sep 20, 2011)

Thanks DanielY,

I am more concerned with making them last once planted in the ground. I now native americans used to to scorch the the ends before planting to prevent bug decay. Otherwise I was considering a good once over with a water repellent like Thompsons. I've had experience with using red cedar, osage, and black locust for posts and have never seen where they needed treating. I have know idea what to expect from white oak, mulberry, or sassafrass. I've never used any of these woods, though a farming reference I have states they are useable. 

Anyhow, 
Thanks again for the reply.


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

Soak the ends in Diesel and Used Motor Oil.I've even used Oak Green just strip the Bark.If you can get the Sap Wood off makes it even better.

I think Sassafrass won't work,its too soft.

big rockpile


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

paint the ends in tar makes em last longer. Dont really think sassafrass will work either .


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## Homesteader73 (Sep 20, 2011)

thanks guys for all the input. 

I tend to agree on the sassafrass, I've tried making bows from it in the past and it is very soft (perhaps brittle when dry is a better way of describing) I was surprised when one of my farming references suggested it as a possible fence post!

Big rock, How long have your oak fence posts lasted? Just curious.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Sorry, I think any of the species you mentioned will rot away in just a year or two. Now, if you cut down a huge white oak, split it, throw away the sapwood, "it" "might" last... for a few years. 3" trees? Good for nothing, only firewood, and even then, only if you have absolutely nothing else to burn.

You need rot resistant species... and even then, the sapwood on those trees will rot away very quickly. It's the heartwood of those species that'll last. I have split post (from post oak) that are over 60 years old, and still hard as steel. My 35 year old cedar posts are mostly solid, but lots of them have rottage.

Now, if you have these 'trash trees' on your boundary, let em be, and use them as living fence posts.


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## Homesteader73 (Sep 20, 2011)

Texican,

That may be the best advice yet. A small investment in insulators and I can string electric wire (already have) on living fence post. Funny when the solution is staring you right in the face and you can't see it.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Homesteader73 said:


> Was wondering if anyone here has tried this before. I'm clearing some of my land for pasture. It is covered with small white oaks, Mulberries, and Sassafras. Most are around 3" in diameter. I was thinking of cutting many of them fence post length, seasoning them in the barn for a few months, stripping the bark from them, and then sharpening one end to be driven into the ground with a post driver.
> 
> My question for those who have done this is, what would you suggest treating the wood with?


Penta... if you can still find a source... creosote... if you can still find a source, Salt water which you should be able to get or used motor oil if you can find it.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

I've got some barbed wire fence, nailed directly into trees. A few years later, after the trees have grown, there's just a stretch of wire coming straight out of a tree over to the next one. 

Pine trees don't 'like' nails/screws, whatever going into their bark.

If you want to protect a tree, you can place a couple of 2x2 scraps around the tree, and loosely wire it to the tree (so that no steel touches the bark)... the natural growth of the tree will push the wood 'out', unwinding the wire wrapping. This way your trees don't get damaged.

Personally, I staple right into the tree... I can't 'trust' my fencerow trees anyhow, and the trees are cheap....


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## PlicketyCat (Jul 14, 2010)

My Gramps in PA had a the living fence row as well. He just cleared out all the smaller trees in between the largest and healthiest and then strung a wire between them. Every year he'd fill in the gaps between trees with stones from the field (it was PA after all  ); and once the stone wall was complete he could take the wire off if he wanted. He used to tie scraps on with untreated hemp twine or cotton rags, they'd usually rot off right about the time the tree grew big enough for anything to start cutting into it.


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## goodhors (Sep 6, 2011)

I am going to second that the trees named will not make good fence posts. Even soaking the Oak in oil, will not give it a long life. Can't think the Mulberry and Sassafras will even make a year.

We have driven posts, the smallest were 4". They were purchased, pressure treated with creosote. They have lasted a LONG time, so worth the cost to us. Our fence is Hi-tensile, so they have to be able to take the pressure of the pulling wires. You SURE don't want the posts moving or jumping out of the ground! The posts driven into the ground were done FAST, stay very solid after. We had two installers, one just puts posts in with the flat end going down, while the other had sharpened posts on one end. Both went into the heavy dirt pretty well. Do protect yourself, a couple of the posts shattered in the pile driver, so you don't want the debris coming out at you! Maybe a cage for protection around the pile driver. 

The other trees named, Osage, Locust, Cedar, are more naturally resistant to rot and insects. I know some Osage posts that were about 100 years! Locally they call it "Hedge" and it was planted for producing posts and windbreaks in the past. Our local Cedar is pretty wispy, so posts would be little, not up to animals pushing on the fence. Not all wood is created equal. 

I have seen the "living fence" tacked into trees, wandering around the pastures. Hard on the trees, which get deformed. You can't sell them later, with metal inside to break saw blades at the Mill. Hard to keep the tension consistant or do servicable repairs later on. Guess it is cheap though, hoping some trees are where you want them.

Getting posts is an expensive business. Illinois has much the same kind of weather as we do, so posts get wet, stay wet in the ground. They have a limited life, wood or steel. These creosoted posts have been the best of any I know, except the old cement posts. Not sure if cement would be an option for you, but they are solid once installed! Never rot!!


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## PlicketyCat (Jul 14, 2010)

I'm currently doing trials on a few treatment products with the common trees in my area: black & white spruce, paper birch and quaking aspen. Aspen is notoriously horrible outdoors and no on in their right mind would consider using it for a post unless desperate. The birch isn't much better, and the spruce is the best we have but nothing like osage, etc. 

So far, two years in, all the test posts treated with CedarShield are still holding up perfectly, even the crappy aspens. The test posts treated with LifeTime are faring well, but the aspen is starting to look a little suspect right at the ground line. Boiled linseed, creosote and charcoal mixtures are working wonderfully on the spruces, but not as well on the birch and aspen.

So, there may be a way to treat your on-site timbers to be adequate posts even if they aren't the best of woods. A lot depends on how long you really expect them to last. If you need a quick & cheap fence that you only need to last 3-5 years until you can obtain/afford more resilient posts, then it's not really a big deal.

And I do second the issue with living fence trees being a danger to saws. Anytime I come across a tree that even had the remote possibility of being used for nailing or wrapping fence wire, I use my most trashed chainsaw bar and blade and extra safety gear... one snag on an old nail or wire and bad things can happen!!


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## shebeen (Oct 21, 2011)

If you ask the old time Downeast Maine lobster boat builders they'll all tell you the same thing regarding the best wood preservative....ethelyne glycol....ayuh.....plain old anti-freeze.

When I looked it up on this new-fangled internet found lots of substantiation for anti-freeze being *extremely* effective at repelling/displacing water.

Ayuh


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

Homesteader73 said:


> thanks guys for all the input.
> 
> I tend to agree on the sassafrass, I've tried making bows from it in the past and it is very soft (perhaps brittle when dry is a better way of describing) I was surprised when one of my farming references suggested it as a possible fence post!
> 
> Big rock, How long have your oak fence posts lasted? Just curious.


10 years.Where I last lived we had so much fire just went to T Post.

big rockpile


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

texican said:


> I've got some barbed wire fence, nailed directly into trees. A few years later, after the trees have grown, there's just a stretch of wire coming straight out of a tree over to the next one.
> 
> Pine trees don't 'like' nails/screws, whatever going into their bark.
> 
> ...


Seen a guy use Trees for all his Post through the woods,put Stays in where it was a Long Strech.

big rockpile


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## Homesteader73 (Sep 20, 2011)

Well, 

Here we are almost a month out and I still haven't run the wire. I have all the materials. But things just keep getting in the way. I installed a new woodstove in my shop and am hoping to cut a load of firewood yet this morning. If everything goes well I'll start on the fence this evening. 

thanks everyone for the great advice.


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## MtnRob (Oct 4, 2011)

drift wood works great, find a dam and look down stream, usually debarked too.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

PlicketyCat said:


> I'm currently doing trials on a few treatment products with the common trees in my area: black & white spruce, paper birch and quaking aspen. Aspen is notoriously horrible outdoors and no on in their right mind would consider using it for a post unless desperate. The birch isn't much better, and the spruce is the best we have but nothing like osage, etc.
> 
> So far, two years in, all the test posts treated with CedarShield are still holding up perfectly, even the crappy aspens. The test posts treated with LifeTime are faring well, but the aspen is starting to look a little suspect right at the ground line. Boiled linseed, creosote and charcoal mixtures are working wonderfully on the spruces, but not as well on the birch and aspen.
> 
> ...


I don't know of any native rot resistant trees in AK...

I'm guessing t-posts are hard to get and rarely used? Never saw much in the way of fencing, when I lived up there...

If I were going to paint the posts, I'd want to have 'control' posts without anything on them, to see if they lasted the same as the treated.

I know where all the old fences are around here, and anything even close to it, I cut six feet up, leaving tall stumps.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Homesteader73 said:


> Was wondering if anyone here has tried this before. I'm clearing some of my land for pasture. It is covered with small white oaks, Mulberries, and Sassafras. Most are around 3" in diameter. I was thinking of cutting many of them fence post length, seasoning them in the barn for a few months, stripping the bark from them, and then sharpening one end to be driven into the ground with a post driver.
> 
> My question for those who have done this is, what would you suggest treating the wood with?


Oops, already posted this one.


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