# German Shepherd,Bernese Mountain Dog or other?



## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

First off, my apologies because I'm sure this topic has been covered and is buried somewhere on here. Second, thank you all for the information on many topics as I've been on here for a little bit but officially signed on just days ago.

My Wife and I recently purchased a home on a very large track of land (mostly dense timber) at the base of Mount Rainier here in Washington state (about 20 or less minutes away from the border of the National Park) We have two small kids ages 10 and 5. We know we have bears that frequent the area and I can "assume" mountain lions are around but I personally haven't seen any signs yet but I still haven't been able to checkout the entire property (just installed trail cameras) Again, my apologies but just wanted to give you an idea on the area, however, my question is pretty basic. I'm looking for a dog that is great with a family, especially kids that will alert them and myself/wife as well to potential dangers. So far the german shepherd gets the highest praise but I'm open to suggestions. I've also become a fan of the bernese mountain dog but it has a shorter life span. I do have a small garden but will be adding to it next year. I don't have any livestock yet but kicking the tires on chickens in the future. I suppose I only mention that as I feel it could make our home a bit more curious to a predator and only adds to the idea of needing a good dog. 

Thank you
Kevin


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## Oregon1986 (Apr 25, 2017)

I've always had labs and love them


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Any medium to large mutt will make a good "yard dog".
Don't get hung up on breeds unless you want very specific traits.


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## Undeaddiva (May 28, 2017)

My family farmed for years when i was a child with Rottweilers. I was very small and they never offered to bite or snap (except once when i was being a bad child and was harrassing our older female. She didn't get anywhere near hurting me but let me know i was screwing up. Consequently my mother tanned my butt for it and i knew i deserved it!) Ours did great with horses, goats, sheep. We had one issue with rabbits but that was largely our fault for improper introductions. They were family pets and very effective working dogs (Rotts need a job to be happy and ours certainly had plenty of jobs!) It all came down to their breeding, the ***** and sires have to be patient and friendly and then ya gotta raise um right! Side story: my cousin lives in the mountains and his Rott got into a fight with a black bear and won (bear ran off!) And now large predators arent really an issue. Just like any dog though its all in handling!!! Its good to see you doing thorough research, different breeds work well with different farms and families. A mutt might be right up your alley or you may need an instinctual breed for those exact jobs.
Good luck! Keep us posted as I am ever so curious to see the resolve of this question!!!


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## In The Woods (Apr 27, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Any medium to large mutt will make a good "yard dog".
> Don't get hung up on breeds unless you want very specific traits.


This. While I have loved my purebred Mastiffs over the years, there is nothing better than a good mutt.

While a lot of dogs carry certain traits from their breed, the most important part with any dog that it knows it is part of a loving family - not just chained out by itself all day. Just about any dog is going to be a great alarm and protector if given the opportunity to be one of the family. Dogs are pack animals and need the structure even if from us humans.

With that said, I am still biased to bigger dogs - no yippy ankle biters around here.


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## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

Thank you folks. I suppose to some degree it's almost embarrassing asking this question. I grew up in a small logging town on the Olympic Peninsula and had a few dogs when I was young but we later moved to the South Puget Sound (Suburbia) and we no longer had dogs. Basically, quality dogs are now somewhat foreign to me. I now realize that their is an introduction topic and I could have used that for most of my original post. Thank you for the information, I suppose I'm not dedicated to a specific breed, just in the early stages of gathering information for the dog or dogs I seek. Even though I watch my kids like a hawk, I also know that kids will be kids and have the desire to explore, especially when my wife and I are at work. I actually encourage this....I want my kids to have a similar childhood as mine,...exploring the local woods, building forts etc. Sorry, not a big fan kids playing on the computer all day. The dog I seek doesn't need to try to fight a mountain lion, bear etc. Just enough to try to alarm a predator to vacate the area and get my kids home safely. Thanks again, it's much appreciated!


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

I have always been fond of the German Shepherd, preferably the short-haired. I did get a long-hairred one a few years back and, after a bit of training, she not only guarded the farm, she also guarded (and even helped raise) the goats. Here is a pic of her. She was bit multiple times one night by a copperhead; so she's gone now.









I replaced her with an LGD and chose the Bulgarian Karakachan. I cannot say enough good things about this dog and you can read my experiences with her (from pup to 3 yrs) here: https://www.homesteadingtoday.com/threads/made-my-choice-a-bulgarian-karakachan.483238/

I also have a labradore and he is not only good with guarding the farm but never harms the animals here, i.e. goats and an assortment of fowl (guineas, chickens, ducks, geese) all of which free-range.

As others have said, your researching at this time is smart. If you pick out a breed that has the characteristics you want, that dog still needs training to be the type of dog you want; and if you get a "mutt" from the pound, it too will need training. (What I'm saying is that, whatever dog you get, the most important part is owner's training.) Good luck!


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## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

I appreciate the feedback. Sorry about your german shepherd. You all have given me some great insight. I will look in more detail at the options and keep you posted. Much appreciated, thank you!


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## thekibblegoddes (Jun 24, 2014)

Google English Shepherd. My dream homestead dog.


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## redcarsonly (Jun 13, 2017)

Here's my GSD! Love these dogs!


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## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

If there is any chance whatsoever of them having to take on (or even scare away with physical presence) a bear or mountain lion, get 2 dogs. Either of those 2 predators can take on one dog, but will think twice about 2.


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## cfuhrer (Jun 11, 2013)

Ridge backs or mountain curs?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhodesian_Ridgeback

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_Cur

I like, among other features, that they are both short haired and less likely to end up with fox tails, Cheet grass, burrs, etc.


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## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

I'm extremely happy with the Pyrenees mutt. She guards flock, stock and children exactly like she does her own puppies. She works as a team with the Heeler to keep the place predator-free. She even chases off hawks!!


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## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

mnn2501 said:


> If there is any chance whatsoever of them having to take on (or even scare away with physical presence) a bear or mountain lion, get 2 dogs. Either of those 2 predators can take on one dog, but will think twice about 2.


This question has been weighing on my mind. I'm not opposed to having two dogs but since my knowledge of dogs is rather limited, I thought I'd start with one. However, I do feel that having two is by far the better option. For the record, their hasn't been any issues with bears (bear/human encounters) but it's pretty clear that they are active on the property. We only have a few homes in the area. The neighbors have said they don't leave any bird seed out in the Spring and other than a single bear getting into a trash can many years ago, the bears tend to keep there distance. On the flip side, the neighbors are mostly elderly and aren't as mobile in the backwoods. Our family is much younger and I'm certain our odds are much higher for potential wildlife encounters as we tend explore more of the trails around our home. (Still haven't explored the whole property as it's very large and filled with thick timber) Anyhow, I'm rambling but wanted to thank everybody for the information.


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## krackin (Nov 2, 2014)

Akita. Same northern spitz heritage. Bear dogs, sled dogs, family dogs, watch dogs, companion dogs, tracking dogs, and all around best buds.


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## [email protected] (Sep 16, 2009)

I have a pair of purebreed Maremma.
we have all the preds you mentioned except mountain lions. however there have been a few spotted over the years. I saw one about two years ago crossing the highway..

go on utube and look up Maremma or 
Wolf dogs..
I only have chickens and geese anymore.
but I do not even have to close up the coop door at night..

I have had many breeds of dogs over the years. none were as good as these ..

......jiminwisc......


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## krackin (Nov 2, 2014)

Beeeyoootiful dogs! I'll bet they like to roll in stinky unidentifiable things. They seem to have that underlying look in their eyes, seen it before, big joke to them. LOL.

Yeah, I know the real reason for it. Light colored dogs seem to need the cover more as is instinct. Pun intended.


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## ScotchCollies (Apr 23, 2017)

Scotch Collies worth looking at as well. http://scotchcollie.net http://www.scotchcollie.org https://www.scottishcolliepreservationsociety.org

Blessings Darren


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## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

My apologies on the delay but wanted to thank everybody for all the information. The search continues as we've been very busy with a variety of projects with the new home and work etc. I have checked shelters and even a few breeders (expensive) but still a possibility. The urgency increased a few nights ago as we had a bear no more than 20 yards away from our back deck eating grubs from an old tree stump, however, I was pleased to see the bear bolt the other direction when he saw me. I still have more exploring to do on the property but we do find all kinds of game trails. As I said earlier, we seem to be the only people utilizing the woods around here. The couple neighbors we have are less mobile (elderly) so I assume the animals are use to having more free range.


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## kevinb (May 31, 2017)

Update- My search continues for the "perfect" dog but we did get a new dog that has a good nose and a loud bark. He's no more than a foot and a half tall. He's half shih Tzu and Pit bull (don't ask.....I don't even know how that happens, my eye's have gone cross eyed multiple times trying to figure out that pairing) I can only describe this breed as a Bullsh*t, but he's been good at sniffing deer, elk and today alerted us to trespasser's on our property. (Trespassing is a topic for another day) The search continues but I've been pleasantly surprised by this little dog's nose. I appreciate everyone's input. Thank you!


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## Wolf mom (Mar 8, 2005)

One of my favorite dogs was a mix of Australian Shepherd and Australian Cattle Dog. I too researched different dogs, their temperament and intelligence, and decided upon this mix. If you can see the parents more the better. They both are intelligent, working breeds and the mix makes for great family dogs. The Cattle dog is more aggressive and protective, the shepherd seemed to mellow that out some. I found the mix to be everything I wanted in a farm and family dog. And when I lived alone in a very rural area, backing up on a state forest, I had no fear of two or four legged intruders with my Jake around.


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## Jerrodnrx (Oct 11, 2017)

We got a GSD puppy shortly after moving on to our homestead, and added another rescue GSD this summer. They get to run with the chickens and goats, and so far everyone gets along great. The 1 year old occasionally will chase a chicken, but hasn't harmed anything.


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

We have many friends and colleagues who live with their families in the real wilderness on their gold claims. They all have guard dogs because of the huge bear population and the usual percentage of human thieves.


The successful dogs that they have had (and always in pairs) have been great at one or more of the required things - family friendly, loyal, guard the property border, independent, chase off prey but not prey oriented. They have had Akitas, Bernese Mountain Dogs, Great Pyrenees, Karelian Bear dogs, German Shepherds, Australian Cattle dogs and Komondors. Also mixed breed Huskies that have been exceptional.

We found that the best all round dog for us was the Anatolian Shepherd. Discovered him by accident as a rescue dog from the Humane Society. The gentlest, smartest, lovingest, loyalest huge dog imaginable. 


His history was not know to us but it was clear that at some point he had someone who loved and trained him completely. Then something happened and he was lost and down to 70 kg when found - should have been at 150kg. No one claimed him so probably a death. 


This is a dog that does need training because 6000 years of working independent of human direction means they analyze and make decisions for themselves. They are fantastic with any child or adult or animal that they accept into their family (best to start as pups if you have kids) and their entire life is devoted to being on guard. Very hard to get them to leave their charges. And laid back. If you have one of these in a city or suburban setting they don't require a lot of exercise. And don't both playing catch. You will do the running. 


They patrol their territory , memorize it and then nothing comes on to it that they do no know about. They are very energy efficient - and completely capable of deciding on the exact level of interference or force is needed given any situation. They eat about half of what other large breeds eat. They do not have a strong prey drive which makes them ideal for guarding animals as well as the fact that they will chase off a bear or wolf until satisfied that it is leaving but will not hunt the bear or wolf leaving the homestead unprotected which has happened to other friends with the Akitas and the Bear dogs. They will kill prey that will not leave.


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## BH English Shepherds (Oct 27, 2017)

kevinb said:


> First off, my apologies because I'm sure this topic has been covered and is buried somewhere on here. Second, thank you all for the information on many topics as I've been on here for a little bit but officially signed on just days ago.
> 
> My Wife and I recently purchased a home on a very large track of land (mostly dense timber) at the base of Mount Rainier here in Washington state (about 20 or less minutes away from the border of the National Park) We have two small kids ages 10 and 5. We know we have bears that frequent the area and I can "assume" mountain lions are around but I personally haven't seen any signs yet but I still haven't been able to checkout the entire property (just installed trail cameras) Again, my apologies but just wanted to give you an idea on the area, however, my question is pretty basic. I'm looking for a dog that is great with a family, especially kids that will alert them and myself/wife as well to potential dangers. So far the german shepherd gets the highest praise but I'm open to suggestions. I've also become a fan of the bernese mountain dog but it has a shorter life span. I do have a small garden but will be adding to it next year. I don't have any livestock yet but kicking the tires on chickens in the future. I suppose I only mention that as I feel it could make our home a bit more curious to a predator and only adds to the idea of needing a good dog.
> 
> ...


Hi Kevin,
I raise English Shepherds and they are considered an all-around farm dog because of their ability to multitask. They are a rare, heritage breed that is the foundation of the collie family. They have an off-button and are able to settle once their job is done, alll the while keeping an eye on things. They are wonderful guardians, herders, and vermin eradicators. I would love to share more or you can visit my website at www.englishshepherdspa.com. All the best, Renee


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