# Whats going on with my goat?



## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

One of my bucks has something going on with him. Im guessing he is 2 1/2 year old, boer buck. I have 3 bucks in the herd with three does and he is the dominant buck. For the last week I have noticed his rumen no longer looks like he swallowed two basketballs which is hhow he has looked since I got the herd during the summer. They are eating grass and browse out of an 8 acre pasture, get pellet feed every couplee of days, have loose minerals available, have two ponds for water. 

So, to the buck. Aside from his rumen going down so much that his sides look sunken in now, he seems to be meaner to the otheer goats butting them real hard on their sides, even the females. I do have one doe that is due in the next few weeks. He also for the last week or so has had grass hanging out of the side of his mouth that he is always chewing on. Havent noticed that with any of the others. He hasnt lost his appetite as he seems to be at least trying to graze and eat feed and such. I got out there today and caught him and opened his mouth and pulled all the grass and such out of his mouth and it was a solid mass going down his throat. I pulled out as much as I could down his throat. It was kind of packed in there butt looked like regular grass and browse.

So, what do yall think? Thanks!


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## rootsandwings (Apr 20, 2004)

Is he pooping? Are you sure that he is consuming feed? It sounds like some kind of blockage.

Alternately have you done a fecal to check his worm load?


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## cayenne47 (Nov 7, 2004)

Worm him quick!! That was exactly the first sign when our buck went down(and died)  He went from looking 18 months pregnant to sunken in, seems like almost overnight.


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

They were treated with safeguard fenbendazole back in june/july. I retreated the does with this stuff a few weeks ago as they should be bred. But havent retreated the males. The safeguard is what the previous owner of the goats gave me and said its waht he has always used. Possibly its not effective anymore. Not sure how to do a fecal? 

Just went out there and his mouth is full yet again with grass hanging out. He is constantly chewing it and going down for more grass, if I put feed out, he is all over it. I dont know for sure if its making it to his rumen but he is actively at least trying to eat. I forced his mouth open and pulled out the wad of grass and stuff as far down as I could reach. If its a blockage, how should I handle it? Is it something I can take care of or is a vet required? This is my first experiences with goats. Makes is ahrder that he is so strong and not very friendly.

I have this male sold and is supposed to be picked up today or tomorrow, but I cant send him like this. He seems healthy and is active other than the symptoms I described.


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

Oh, the only other wormer I have is Ivermax(Ivermection)5mg/ml Pour on for Cattle.
It doesnt say anything about goats on it.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Safeguard doesn't work.


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## prairiedog (Jan 18, 2007)

Worm him with the ivermec if that's all you have cydectin would be best. Or take a fecal to the vet. If he has been in heavy rut and covering quite a few does he may need built back up.


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

Would I use the Ivermax pouron as a pour on for him or a drench? Ive read so many different things about using everything for goats orally and triple or double dosage Im not sure what to do with this stuff with them as the info on it only talks about cattle. 

If Im supposed to give it orally, Ill have to dig all that gass and stuff out of his mouth and throat again. Is there any way to find out for sure if its a blockage or not? From what Ive read online looking up a blockage most of what I read shows a blockage would cause him to be bloated instead of sunken in like he is.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

You give it orally. 1 cc per 25 pounds.


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## saanengirl (Apr 7, 2009)

I think what you pulled out of his throat is normal. Goats make a ball with their food and swallow the ball whole. It is later regurgitated for chewing. He may have made a ball a little too big to go down, but swallowing a ball of forage is normal. Part of his problem could be the fact that he is in rut and is the dominant buck. Because of his hormones he is spending more time beating up the other bucks and courting the does. Worms could be an issue since his body is under more stress as a result of being in rut. 

Check his inner eyelid color and have your vet check a fecal sample for parasite eggs before deworming. If his eyelid membrane color is pale or if there are a lot of parasite eggs in the sample, ask breeders in your area what dewormer works best for them, and use that to deworm. 

I would provide another water source in addition to the ponds. Goats don't like dirty water, and pond water can carry lots of bacteria.


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## Homesteader1 (Oct 19, 2011)

My first step is to worm him. I'm wondering why you have so many bucks? I have one buck that services 8 to does. I normally do not keep that many but lately we've had a lot of calls for milk and soap. Normally I keep 2 does. Get your goat inside feed hay from a hanger and worm him.


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

We will worm him with the Ivermax orally tomorrow. Dark and raining right now. 

The goats were a spur of the moment thing. Guy had a heart attack and couldnt take care of them. I had an empty pasture and figured they could help clear it. Fence was already in place so I stuck them in there. He had 4 bucks and three does. I just sold one of the young bucks yesterday and this buck is also sold and should be picked up in the next couple of days. This herd was basically a big family unit. The old buck we are keeping is the father of the buck this post is about and HE is the father of the young buck I just sold. So, had three generations of buck in this one group. One of the does is the twin of the younger buck we just sold and she is pregnant and should kid in the next couple of weeks. Her mom is another doe thats in the group LOL, like a soap opera. 

So, then we will be down to two bucks and three does. 

He was rutted up pretty hard but its winded down quite a bit the last several weeks. He has looked pretty good the whole time but the last 10 days he all the sudden lost his big belly sticking out of both sides and has had a chunk of grass in his mouth every time I see him which is a first. Even when I give them feed, he chews it with the big glob of grass hanging out the side of his mouth. And I noticed this at the same time as his sides looking sunken in when he has looked like he had two basketballs in him the whole time Ive owned him, and he seemed to get very abusive with the does at the same time. 

But, I will worm him tomorrow with the ivermax, and if they come to pick him up tomorrow, Ill explain whats going on and tell them if he dies Ill give them their money back. I only sold him for $100.


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## BackfourtyMI. (Sep 3, 2007)

I would have the new buyer re-worm him again in 10 days. You can give them enough medication but if they can get a fecal from the vet that would help them determine what wormer to use.

I don't know if a heavy worm load would make him mean to the other goats, even the girls. I'd be worried about him causing one of your pregnant does' to abort.

I also 2nd the fresh drinking water. I don't think pond water is a good idea for the goats.


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## prairiedog (Jan 18, 2007)

Can you get a look at his teeth? Make sure he doesn't have something going on there that needs attention.


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## rootsandwings (Apr 20, 2004)

I was thinking an upper blockage because his throat was "packed full" up to his mouth and the forage was hanging out, but if he is swallowing pellets that would be a no.

Hopefully the worming will work. If it does, you should know within a couple of days. I would put a limit on how long you will refund the money since you can't control his care after he leaves.


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

Thanks for all the info. I will check his teeth when I worm him tomorrow. Will also use a flashlight to get a good look as far as I can see down his throat. 

I had been filling two water troughs for them up until the last few weeks as we got enough rain to put a good amount of water back in the ponds. Ill go ahead and keep filling the water troughs though, thanks for the info on that. 

Ill have them reworm him and tell them if anything happens or he gets worse within a week, Ill refund their money once I confirm the problem. 

Thanks for all the info. Will post tomorrow after I check histeeth and throat when I worm him. 

Im going to go ahead and worm the rest of my goats with the ivermax this weekend as well since the safeguard apparently isnt working right. One of my does is going to be kidding very soon though, her bag is very full and this is her first kidding. She is the only one I havent seen him hit real hard and "attack". I know he bred her as he wouldnt let any of the other goats near her when she was in heat. I dont believe our other mature doe was bred, as I havent noticed her bagging up but its kind of hard to tell as her bag already hangs from kidding before.


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## mpete (Mar 4, 2008)

BTW: Don't freak out when you see that he only has teeth on his lower jaw in the front... A lot of people don't know that they are born that way!  They do have upper and lower teeth in the back of the mouth... But watch out... They are SHARP!!!!!

I really suspect worms... That is how a lot of people stated how their goats acted before they ended up loosing them... Goats acting normal, just not "as full" ... it's always a good idea to have a fecal done... good luck


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## nathan104 (Nov 16, 2007)

Goat update:

I was at the feedstore today and they reccomended the Manna Pro Positive Pellet wormer for goats. Said most poeple around here are switching to that. So, I got out there and clear his throat out and could not feel anything as far as I could stick my fingers down his throat(yuck). I tried looking at his teeth but I was doing it myself and he is very strong so didnt really get to see very much. I felt around the outside of his jaw and didnt feel any swollen up places or anything. I fed him approx 2 lbs of the pellet wormer and he ate it. He ate half of it and then stopped and hada bunch of foam come up and was kind of heaving. I could see hissides contracting. He had some foam/mucus drooling from his motuh and some pellets were mixed in. He did thisand heaved for about a minute and then quit. After that he finished the pellets. Another thing I noticed is that his tail is down and all the other goats have their tales up. Not sure if that is a sign of anything. 

Also went ahead a fed the wormer pellets to my other goats as well. Hopefully tthat will work. 

We are going to be out there with them today or tomorrow to trim hooves for the first time. Hopefully all goes well.


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## cayenne47 (Nov 7, 2004)

Someone else wanna jump in here?:hair


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

That wormer is crap. Useless. Go back and get the right stuff.


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## ccfromnc (Jul 23, 2011)

Why is it crap?


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

because it doesn't work

because you can't be sure they eat enough to get the full dose


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## prairiedog (Jan 18, 2007)

duplicate


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## prairiedog (Jan 18, 2007)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> because it doesn't work
> 
> because you can't be sure they eat enough to get the full dose


nuff said


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

Barring a positive fecal, could it be that the buck has lost condition from being in rut? My boys will lose weight when their entire being is focused on breeding the does.

I wish you all the best with your boy, and look forward to reading updates.


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## Laverne (May 25, 2008)

Wow, being in Texas and not being wormed right, he probably needs Ivermectin for Meningeal worm, Cydectin for condition eating worms and Valbazen for Liverfluke.
Offer baking soda also.


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## rootsandwings (Apr 20, 2004)

What color are his eye membranes? (the insides of his eyelids?)


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## jessiesue (Jan 24, 2011)

We had a month old baby do the same thing. She was fine then one day notice she was standing humped up foaming at the mouth. Pulled her from the Mom, she would take the bottle fine. But just kept going down hill. Would pick grass and eat hay but it all just packed in her neck, and I would have to pull it out. With our work schedule we didn't have the time to bottle feed so a couple stopped by and wanted her, said they could fix her, so we sent her with them. I doubt they did anygood. I thought she had a growth in her neck or something. Have never seen anything like it


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## mpete (Mar 4, 2008)

worms can cause rumen failure. 

You might as well give the people their money back. He probably won't live unless you:
1. See a vet or get a fecal sample ran... fecals cost maybe around $20 to have a vet do it...
2. Listen to the experience of many people here. We are trying to help because we know everyone is short on money and a lot of things can be done at home by you... but only if you tell us everything and do what we suggest.

Sorry to be so blunt,,,, but when so many people are telling you what works, it's because they have experience and with you posting here it tells us that you are looking for help. The stores are going to tell you anything and everything. They are selling a product. We are trying to help you help your goat.

A buck and doe (different farms) was recently lost due to humancus contortus (barberpole worm). They both "lost their rumens" and quickly went to drooling, not eating everything in their mouth.... etc. Your goat will stop drinking soon and that will cause dehydration and that itself can cause death.


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