# Can a horse be taught to be nice to goats if she hates 'em?



## Ark (Oct 5, 2004)

We have a new horse and she HATES goats! HATES HATES HATES, wants to kill, charges at them. Etc. :huh:

We're keeping her in a pen for now, but need to let her out to graze. She charges at the fence when the goats get close, but that mainly just seems to be when I've just fed her. 

When my daughter was riding her she once got too close to a goat and she charged at the goat and slashed out with her front hoof, with ears penned back.

HELP!!!!!!!!! Is this something I can teach her NOT TO DO??????


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## CheerfulMom4 (May 21, 2008)

I never had any luck. My problems have been with minis though my big horses have always tolerated them okay.
The 2 minis I had wouldn't quit, ended up selling both of them. I've had my goats with other minis and horses over the years with no problems what-so-ever.


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## Nina (May 10, 2002)

Would it help to hobble her while in the pasture? Just a thought, I don't have any experience with this.


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## SFM in KY (May 11, 2002)

I've not had goats, so no clue there but I have had a couple of horses over the years that were absolute death on dogs and I never had any luck at all changing the mindset.


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## mountainwmn (Sep 11, 2009)

You should be able to teach her not to go after them while being ridden, but I don't think anyone has been able to teach a horse better manners in a field.


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## jennigrey (Jan 27, 2005)

If it's very important that you have both animals, you can try a shock collar on the horse.


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## tinknal (May 21, 2004)

jennigrey said:


> If it's very important that you have both animals, you can try a shock collar on the horse.


This is the only thing that I think would have even the slightest chance of success. Even then I doubt it would work long term.


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## Ark (Oct 5, 2004)

We've had her a week. 

One day when my daughter was riding her she went after a goat. That's the only time she has been in the same pasture as the goats. The rest of the time there is a fence separating them. 

We have to keep her in a pen because she's never been turned loose on pasture before and I need to get her used to eating grass gradually. Don't want to cause and kind of stomach upset/colic. When she's in the pen and I give her her feed, is when she charges at the goats if they get too close to her fence. 

So, when I let her out of the pen for 30 minutes of grazing today, she went right down to the fence line where the goats are and "hung out" with them the whole time! Grazing along, but staying nearby with that fence in between. Showed no aggression whatsoever.

So, is that encouraging or is it just a coincidence?? LOL


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

One of my two mares chases goats although I can't say she hates them. So I just let the goats out from morning til early afternoon, then let the horses out til evening. Sometimes I confine the goats in a smaller paddock and give the horses the rest. Depends.

You might try hot wire on temporary posts to seperate the two, moving the fence as needed. Done that too.


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## Ark (Oct 5, 2004)

UGH!!!!!

That is something I really don't want to do. 
But, it's not the end-of-the-world, just inconvenient. 

My daughter really likes this horse and wants to keep her, and I really like the goats and want to keep them. :grin:


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Forgive me if my wheels turned so slow but it just arrived in my brain that the horse charged a goat while your daughter was on her.
This is a red flag. Horses should (and most do) know that when a rider is aboard, the rider makes choices. The fact that this horse didn't could lead your daughter into a real unsafe situation. 
I'd check the horse out with dogs, toddlers, babies in strollers, etc. 
Then I would work hard to make sure this mare knows that charging anything that isn't attempting to eat her is not to be allowed. Just for your daughters's safety.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Something else is that this mare is new and probably very worried about the new world in which she lives- this is a problem that may mellow out in a couple of months when the mare is more secure and knows she's the boss of goats.


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## Ark (Oct 5, 2004)

This mare will be 3 in July. 
She's lived her WHOLE LIFE in a pen. The only animals she is familiar with are dogs and horses. 
So, yes, being here is entirely new to her. The previous owners did take her down to a nearby arena on a regular basis over the last 6 months for training. 
So, she met more horses and people there. 

All that to say, is that her training is still a work in progress. My daughter was able to quickly react and turn her before she could connect with the goat, who bolted of course! 
She yelled NO at her and slapped her on the neck to let her know that was unacceptable. 

But yes, you are right, we need to use much caution in introducing her to new situations! I will be especially careful when my little nieces and nephew come over here. 

And given her young age, we feel that the previous owner is incorrect in urging us to do more than just light riding until she is a little older.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

With her young age, you do stand a good chance of things improving. Good for your daughter and her fast reactions. Always been my opinion that speed in correction is more important than force. 
Good luck with both your youngsters.


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## farmergirl (Aug 2, 2005)

Year's ago, I got the wild idea of buying a goat as a companion for my OTTB who was stabled by himself for a couple of months. My horse decided that goat needed to go to heaven, and quick! There was no convincing him that the goat was his friend. To be fair, I think the fact that the goat was VERY noisy (Nubian) added to the horses contempt for him.
After a couple weeks, when it was obvious that the horse wasn't going to change his mind, I gave up trying to get them to be buddies and just rehomed the goat.

Now (~12 years later) the same horse lives on our farm and has exposure to all sorts of critters that he never tries to attack.

So it is *possible* that the mare will outgrow it. She's quite young, and in a totally new environment. I'd limit her exposure to new things to just one or two new things at a time so you don't overwhelm her.

Good luck!


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## wolffeathers (Dec 20, 2010)

I wouldn't get rid of her just yet, nor would I jump to the shock collar. She's young and this is all new to her. If she's charging the goats because she doesn't know what to think, than shocking her probably would only make her fear/hate them more. At this point there's no telling whether she is afraid or simply hates them at this point. I would give her the benefit of the doubt and say that she fears them.

I would graze them seperately for a few weeks longer. Explore the possibilities of crossfencing the pasture, luckily goats and horses compliement eachother in grazing preference. Just rotate the grazing.

If crossfencing is not an option, I would train the mare to hobbles. That way if she goes to charge, the goats are able to outrun her. You can always give the goats an area to get away by using a single strand of hotwire or a board just high enough for the goats to get under.


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## Joshie (Dec 8, 2008)

where I want to said:


> Forgive me if my wheels turned so slow but it just arrived in my brain that the horse charged a goat while your daughter was on her.
> This is a red flag. Horses should (and most do) know that when a rider is aboard, the rider makes choices. The fact that this horse didn't could lead your daughter into a real unsafe situation.
> I'd check the horse out with dogs, toddlers, babies in strollers, etc.
> Then I would work hard to make sure this mare knows that charging anything that isn't attempting to eat her is not to be allowed. Just for your daughters's safety.


There are other horses, horses that won't go after goats. While the horse is new, before OP's daughter falls too much in love, it'd be a good time to find a goat-loving horse.


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## fellini123 (Feb 2, 2003)

It does seem interesting that the horse charged the goats AFTER the horse was fed?? Is it possible the horse was just defending its food?? If the horse grazed comfortably with the goats later it is a thought.

Alice in Virginia


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

My experience with this was not good. However, the horse involved was a young (1.5 yo) stallion, cryptorchid. He killed a VERY valuable doeling. I got rid of him but by then the damage was already done. I will never again trust a horse around goats. :-(


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## GrannyCarol (Mar 23, 2005)

On another note, if this mare charges anything while being ridden, she could use some serious groundwork/natural horsemanship. She needs better respect for her rider, which will give her a lot more confidence around new things. She is a baby, she needs more training to be safe. 

As for the goat situation, if you want to work with her, then give her more time as mentioned, across a fence. She might be food guarding, if so, will she be a problem with people when she's eating? Something to think about - and back to the issue of respect. Be sure she doesn't crowd anyone space and is respectful to start with.


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## Ark (Oct 5, 2004)

Well, actually, yes! She is food aggressive with humans. We've never had a horse that is food aggressive, so I am not sure how to handle it, other than to keep a rope or whip or something in my hand to convince her to stay back until I put the food in the dish! I just swing it around and she stays back. 
chamoisee, I am so sorry about your doeling!!  OMG.... that is awful.

GrannyCarol, she definitely needs ground work, but she's young so we are trying not to over do it. 

Alice, because of what seems to be food aggression, I have NOT let her out to graze with the goats. I *HOPE* it's "only" food aggression, but until I know for sure, I will not risks my goats. 

Due to the drought we sold all but our very best Nubians. I only have 6 does/doelings, and they are the best of the best. Yesterday, they all ran after me as I went to get the horse and move her from one pen to the other. She leaned her head over the gate and sniffed at the little ones who came close, and showed no aggression at all. So, that was encouraging!

Now I just need to figure out what to do about the food aggression...


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

Sorry, I would never trust this horse with a goat.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

She's not too young for groundwork and she needs quite a bit right away if she's agressive with humans.


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## SFM in KY (May 11, 2002)

After 50-plus years of dealing with horses, I have to say that the one thing I absolutely will not tolerate is aggression towards people, whether it is food aggression, dominance/aggression or simple lack of respect.

I have a good selection of buggy whips and I will use them with serious intent on any horse that indicates they do not respect me as 'boss hoss' ... turn your rump to me and I will put stripes on it. I have had several horses in the past that were food aggressive and they spent several sessions in a round pen with grain or hay in the center, learning to stay back on command until *I* allowed them to come forward and eat, just like a boss mare would do in the same situation.

Working with horses can be risky enough without having to deal with this and the ones that live here learn it quickly and thoroughly or they are gone. I can be tolerant and understanding of a number of problems and issues, but that is not one of them.


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## GrannyCarol (Mar 23, 2005)

I agree, she is NOT too young to be taught manners and it is very important. To let this go will be to ruin her entirely. Along with the other good suggestions here, I'd recommend checking out Clinton Anderson (I hate his commercialism, but he is very methodical and knows how to teach such a horse safely) and his natural horsemanship methods. There are also others with similar methods that are very good, but she needs to respect you sooner, rather than later. Remember that the mamma horse would use her teeth and hooves to gain respect, you can't really harm your young horse with a good correction.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Actually training a horse to do what you want when feeding is the easiest thing I do with horses- it's the one time when you have the upper hand with a loose horse.
All you have to do is have the food box/trough/mat within about 10-15 feet of the gate to start. Then you bring the hay to the gate and start to unlatch it. The new horse will immediately head to the gate. You then take a step or two away from the gate. The horse gets irritated and starts moving around anxiously. 
When she approaches the place where you want her to be to be fed (a place where you can approach safely) you move right away to the gate and start opening it again. The horse come to the gate again- you go away again, etc. 
What you are doing is letting her teach you to bring food when when she puts herself in "the food place."
Every horse I have owned has learned to stand where I wanted them to get fed and the slowest of the lot learned reliably within a week. You just have to spend time for the first couple of days and never make an exception (until they are very confirmed in the habit.)
This works to prevent food snatching or crowding. I hate a horse who grabs stuff from me. 
It works so well that my older girl asks for food by running to her trough and standing in front of it- she repeats as often as needed.
I have done this with up to three horses although it is more difficult because all have to get it right at the same time. With one it is totally easy.


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