# Commission - would I legitimately owe one?



## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

The situation is as follows. A good friend of ours (a young 81 years old) owns a house on several acres. About 3 years ago, she married another of our good friends and they make a wonderful couple. They both owned property and decided to move in to his house since they didn't need both. She sold it via land contract once and ended up with the house again because the person went to prison and failed to make payments for the better part of a year.

We were aware that the place was for sale and were very well acquainted with the place well before it was ever listed. It just wasn't quite what we were looking for so we continued to look at other places. (It's not a bad place, just a little closer to the neighbors than we'd like.)

They've had it in a Realtor's hands for the last year or so and have shown it numerous times with a few nibbles but no one has made a serious offer.

Since we haven't found anything yet, we really haven't taken their house out of consideration. There's nothing planned or any "intent" to purchase at this point. But IF, and I do mean "IF" we were to decide we might like to have the house after all, well... 

Here's the issue. The real estate agent I have been working with, on one of our trips to see several properties, wanted to see this house. I told him that I had no interest in seeing the house with him because my wife and I already knew the owner, we'd already seen the house, and her and her husband were practically our best friends. He insisted on seeing it on our trip looking and we did stop in and look around. At the time, I was figuring he wanted to see it for himself as it does have an attractive price. (It does have a particular feature of the house that is not attractive to many buyers, it has low ceilings. Otherwise, it's a very sound, though dated, structure.)

Anyway, the question is, am I now obligated to pay this real estate agent a commission since he insisted on stopping in to see the place? He did not bring me to the seller. I knew the place was for sale before it was ever in a Realtor's hands. I had been in the house before it was ever for sale. I knew it was for sale before it was ever listed. I wasn't so sure I wanted it at first but am now thinking that maybe it could work, at least for a while. Neither the listing agent or the agent that's been showing me stuff have had anything to do with facilitating anything. 

So IF we buy it, and I don't know yet whether we'll make an offer or not, do we legitimately owe a real estate commission? If I legitimately owe one, I have no problem paying it. I just don't quite know for sure whether we would.

Interested in your thoughts.

EDITED TO ADD:

Yes, I know that a real estate commission is normally paid by a seller. Realistically speaking, though, I already know that the seller, our friend, wants to walk away from closing with a specific amount. The price that we pay has to build in the cost of the commission if there is one. As I said, I have no problem with paying enough to cover that if they are entitled to a commission. If they are not, I don't feel like paying an extra $5k just for grins and giggles.


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## FarmerKat (Jul 3, 2014)

Do you have a contract with your realtor? What does it say?

Do your friends have it listed with a realtor? If so, the commission is the same whether there is one or two agents involved, so it would not cost you anything more - the agents split commission. 

Also, if your friends had it listed in the past, their contract may require them to pay the commission if the house sells within a certain time frame after contract expires. 

As a side note, I think it is a little odd that your agent insisted on seeing the house even though you said you did not want to (and explained why).


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## Belfrybat (Feb 21, 2003)

In Texas the seller would be obligated to pay the commission if the real estate agent showed it to the person who buys it within 90 days of the listing's end. That is written in the contract and there is no provision I know of to get around it. Even though you specifically said you didn't want to see the property with the agent, the fact is he/she did show it to you.


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

FarmerKat, I do not have a contract with any real estate agent. The seller, our friend has the property listed with a local Realtor so they do have a contract. I believe I need to find out just what that contract says because I have been told that the language could vary significantly. And yes, I did find it a little odd that the agent (from another agency) insisted on seeing that house. Whether it was a back-handed way of entitling himself to a commission despite my objection, I don't know.

Belfrybat, you may be right about what is normal and customary in TX but I think I do need to have a chat with our friend and see if we can figure out the contract that she signed as it could vary considerably, and that could definitely affect the situation as it is.

Thanks for the input! Much appreciated. I may not have an exact answer but I think I have a better idea where to find the answers.


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## BohemianWaxwing (Sep 13, 2014)

If the only contract is between the seller and their agent, you don't owe your agent anything. If the house has been on the market for some time and isn't generating a lot of traffic, your friend may very well be able to get a release from her contract with her agent and then you guys could put together your own deal and neither of you have to pay commission. That's the route I'd go in this situation. You and the seller can "split" the commission.


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## itsb (Jan 13, 2013)

first off,why did you let the realitor push you to go to the property!2nd if it were me I would go to said realitor face to face and point blank ask if he expects to get a comm.if he say no then no problem,if he says yes then it is time to deal with him! until you know what he is expeting how can you know what to do.depending on what said realitor says it would be time for a attourny to advise you.How ever the lawyer may end up as much as comm.But first have a chat with realitor and don't let him push you AGAIN. good luck and I hope things work out for you


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

itsb said:


> first off,why did you let the realitor push you to go to the property!2nd if it were me I would go to said realitor face to face and point blank ask if he expects to get a comm.if he say no then no problem,if he says yes then it is time to deal with him! until you know what he is expeting how can you know what to do.depending on what said realitor says it would be time for a attourny to advise you.How ever the lawyer may end up as much as comm.But first have a chat with realitor and don't let him push you AGAIN. good luck and I hope things work out for you


It was like this...

I showed up in his office one morning because he said he wanted to spend a few hours and show me some properties. He laid out about 5 papers on the desk, each of which was a summary sheet for each of those five properties. I looked at them and told him I didn't want to see the particular one in question and said why.

We got in his car and the very first property he drove up to was said property. He says he didn't know what it was like inside and proceeded to get out and go in. Being a rather laid back person, I went along in with him not really thinking about it at the time. 

It wasn't something I perceived as an aggressive situation at the time.

I guess I could go to said real estate agent and ask. That would imply intention, though, and if he said, "yes", it might not be so pretty. I'd really rather have an idea of where the situation is legally before such an encounter.

Thanks for your input.


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## 1948CaseVAI (May 12, 2014)

I hired a realtor to find a house for me once and paid him a commission, but we had a clear contract up front.
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AFAIK you are governed by two things: 1) any contract you signed between that realtor and yourself, and 2) your conscience.

If you had no contract then I doubt you owe him anything. Realtors typically split commissions if there is a selling realtor and a buyer realtor. That is not your issue and you do not need to get into that.

If you think the realtor made an honest good-faith effort to help you and in your heart of hearts think he earned something them maybe a token like a $100 gift card to a good restaurant is in order. If he tells you that you owe commission and you don't have a contract and think you do not owe then do not give any gift as that would be an insult.


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## FarmerKat (Jul 3, 2014)

Since your friends have it listed with a realtor, whether you involve your realtor or not will not cost you and the seller any extra money. The commission rate is set. Your friends have a contract that they will pay this commission to the realtor. The question is whether the selling agent and your realtor get to split it or if the selling agent gets the full commission. 

Only you know your realtor in person ... you also know how much your realtor invested in you - have you spend hours driving around looking at properties together? Has this been the first time you and the agent went to look at properties?

I would say that the only way to avoid the commission is to wait until the seller's contract with their agent expires (and any period of time during which they are obligated to pay commission after its expiration - I am not sure what is customary in TN but it is very likely spelled out in the seller's contract). Of course, you are running the risk that someone else may buy the house in the meantime. 

The only other way your friends could get a bit more $$ is if their contract spells out that the commission is % is lower if they bring the buyer themselves. I do not think that most agents put that in the contract automatically anyway but I am sure they can tell you.

Personally, this is what I would do ... If I have been working with the agent for a while, I would make the offer through him and allow him to earn his half of the commission. If it was the very first time we went to look at properties together and it was very clear that I did not wish to see this house (and why), then I would just make an offer directly myself without using the agent. Of course, I would have to do the leg-work myself as well. 

Best wishes. I know you have been looking for a while and I hope you find the right place for you


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## Fishindude (May 19, 2015)

You have no contract with anyone, this is a non-issue.
The seller is obligated to pay the realtor, generally 6-7% of the sale price.

If you want to get around the realtors 6-7%, the seller will need to let the realtors contract run it's course, and then terminate that deal. In all likelihood there are terms to prevent exactly this from happening for a certain period of time after the contract terminates. It can be done, but the seller better read and understand the terms before doing anything, so he doesn't get in trouble.


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## LuLuToo (Dec 19, 2015)

If the contract expires and an offer comes after however many days are specified in the contract, it seems like a non-issue. But what do I know? I'm not an attorney and I'm not a realtor. 

LuLu


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

Will get to see my friend later today. Not sure whether we'll get to talk about the contract or not as it's more of a social event and I don't want to drag private things out in public, so to speak.

I've no idea what a customary contract says in these parts. Hopefully, I'll find out.

Yes, we can wait for the contract to run out, or, if I remember right, the seller has the option to end said contract at any point (according to previous statements). I do not know the length of time after the contract expires or is canceled that the realtor is entitled to a commission. When we sold our place in Mississippi, it was 1 year. I've heard other, much shorter, time periods mentioned so it will be whatever the contract says. 

No one wants to get anyone in trouble. I appreciate the discussion. It has been helpful.


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## Declan (Jan 18, 2015)

Just depends on the deal. Usually the seller realtor splits their commission with the buyer realtor and it all comes out of the seller side, but it is possible to contract around all that when negotiating the sales contract to shift around who pays what so you would have to be careful not to accept responsibility for anything the seller normally would pay.


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