# Cow Down for a week



## SCRancher (Jan 11, 2011)

Last Monday my wife found the mamma cow of our newest calf (3 weeks old) down in the woods feet tangled in trees.

My cows are in very rough shape from the winter - worst I have ever had them - no excuses my fault totally and I'm very upset with myself for letting them get in such poor shape.

Vet said she was probably just too weak to get up when he first examined her. He tried lifting her to standing after we carried her out of the woods with the tractor but she wouldn't stand.

He gave her a bunch of shots - told me to feed her hay and grain - roll her from side to side at least twice a day, water - etc.

After 3 days he tried to lift her again and said she has nerve damage in a foreleg maybe from the initial down time or one of the other 3 times in the first 3 days she kept flopping down onto that same side. Vet is unsure if it's going to be permanent or temporary.

We moved her closer to the house in a nice soft grassy area and have been caring for her all week.

She seems stronger now but we have not tried to lift her in 4 days so I am hopefully going to lift her tomorrow without the vet's assistance. - if nothing else to move her to a clean spot and long enough to let her air out a bit.

We have kept her calf with her and have been bottle feeding him.

Along with food, water, grain, shifting her the vet left me with an anti-inflammatory injection to give her daily - last does he gave me went into her yesterday.

I would lift her today but we are supposed to get 2 inches of rain today and I think it would be safer for the cow and us if I waited until it was not raining in buckets.

So anyone have any thoughts on what else I may do for the cow?


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## G. Seddon (May 16, 2005)

No personal experience with this, but I found these articles that may have some suggestions for you; sounds like your vet is helping you though.

Scroll to page 13 for Non-Ambulatory (Downer) Cattle
http://www.bqa.org/uDocs/Guidelines%20for%20the%20Care%20and%20Handling%20of%20Cattle.pdf

Merck:
http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/mus.../overview_of_bovine_secondary_recumbency.html

Another article:
http://www.downcow.com/pubs/dairyjournals/reasons that cows go down.pdf


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

We had this happen last year. A first timer had a too large calf, she rolled arround down near our drinking pond to deliver it. It died but she had a nerve in her back get pinched. She kept trying to move herself to the stream. We knew if she got there she would die. We blocked her from getting to the stream with the truck and logs. I had to go down a number of times a day to water and feed her and I covered her with a sheet and wet it(it was very hot and no shade). About 8 days I looked down and saw that she had moved enough ,That I knew she had gotten up, but so week she fell. After 10 days , I kept tending to her,she finaly made it up the hill to hang with the rest of the herd. The best thing you can do is keep trying to get them up, even if you have to get her into a barn and use straps to help her stand. I've had to do this with horses long time ago(when I worked at a couple of breeding farms).


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## DaleK (Sep 23, 2004)

Shoot her. You may save the odd animal after being down a week but it's more than offset by the drawn out suffering of those you don't. If she gets that wet she's going downhill fast.


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## topside1 (Sep 23, 2005)

Dale has the logical answer, no other choice. I've seen owners and animals miserable for weeks and then the outcome is always the same....Topside


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## SCRancher (Jan 11, 2011)

Yup calling browns packing today to see if they will take her - it's my understanding they take alive but down animals for pet food or something like that.

We stood her up last night and still the same problem only seemingly worse and after putting her back down she was spent for the rest of the evening. I think she's starting back on a downward slide.

Thanks for everyone's input!


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Let's see if I've got the facts right. We had a rough winter and you weren't prepared for it. The cow suffered malnutrition, worst you've ever seen. She gave you a healthy calf and used the rest of her reserves nursing the calf. Collapsed and laid in the woods an unknown amount of time. Cow hauled to a location outside, still unable to stand. The cow has had no shelter. South Carolina had rain Monday night.
Darn Vets are a waste of money.


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## JD in SC (May 17, 2007)

I had my Guernsey go down after calving and I was out of town. The person helping me tried to assist her but she remained down. Never got up again. Had to shoot her. I gave her a week. Hope your cow does better, but the odds are against it.

JD


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## Lazy J (Jan 2, 2008)

haypoint said:


> Let's see if I've got the facts right. We had a rough winter and you weren't prepared for it. The cow suffered malnutrition, worst you've ever seen. She gave you a healthy calf and used the rest of her reserves nursing the calf. Collapsed and laid in the woods an unknown amount of time. Cow hauled to a location outside, still unable to stand. The cow has had no shelter. South Carolina had rain Monday night.
> Darn Vets are a waste of money.


And people think CAFO's mistreat animals?


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## SCRancher (Jan 11, 2011)

Haypoint - not quite the facts - but thanks for making up total BS to add to an already piss poor situation!

We put 4 cattle panels around her the day we found her with a tarp over the top and along the side nearest to her to keep her out of the sun and the rain.

She was nice and dry all through the rain storm unlike us who were tending to her - she is also keep in the shade.

It is not the "Wost I have ever seen" thanks for trying to put words into my mouth instead I said "worst I have ever had them" - this is a far cry from your butchering of my statement. Again thanks for adding to an already piss poor situation.

Your implications of mistreatment are very wrong and highly offensive.
Next time instead of making up a bunch of stuff then telling someone how they are wasting their money why don't you discuss what was said instead of trying to make what you think of the situation into "facts".

Lazy J - instead of relying on what others make up about a situation and then making statements about mistreating animals instead read what I wrote about the situation and go from there.

Browns does NOT take downed animals so we are going to struggle on longer in the hopes that she recovers. The vet was out again yesterday and will be here tomorrow to check on her again - the vet is not yet ready to give up on her so neither will I.

My situation precluded me bringing in Hay to my farm - the court order that allows me to even access my cows did not include any provisions except to walk into the farm and to bring in cattle equipment to transport the cattle. Not to bring in Hay, supplies, vet, or any vehicles of any sort other than for the transport of cattle.

I was hoping that through rotational grazing I would not have had to rely on outside hay however the weather precluded this and I eventually had to have them hauled out to a new place I purchased that had stockpiled hay but bad fences. I fixed the fences and was hoping the stockpiled hay would have lasted longer than it did but unfortunately it ran out and due to my inexperience with telling just how bad off a cow is I let them get too far and the nursing pressure possibly caused this one to go down.

When the vet educated me I took immediate and costly action for both this cow and the rest of the herd. They are now being stuffed with hay and grain and are fenced out of the pastures on a sacrificial area to allow the pastures to recover.


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

What in the world?????

_My situation precluded me bringing in Hay to my farm - *the court order that allows me to even access my cows* did not include any provisions except to walk into the farm and to bring in cattle equipment to transport the cattle. Not to bring in Hay, supplies, vet, or any vehicles of any sort other than for the transport of cattle._

In light of this it was very premature to start running cattle on the land. Or did the land squabble come after the cattle were there? Either way, you should buy that judge (and your lawyer!) a book about cattle if he/she didn't permit the movement of hay or access by a vet in the court order! That was a whole 'nuther level of ridiculous. 

Sorry for the hard lesson you have learned here.


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## Lazy J (Jan 2, 2008)

If she has not stood for over a week she won't, time to put her out of her misery.

Cows don't go down if they are simply a little underweight, they go down from being malnourished, except in the case of milk fever. It sounds like your cow was in BAD shape if she has been down for over a week. You need to reevaluate your situation and if you have the resources to be a responsible livestock owner. If you can't provide for you cattle, then back the trailer up and send them down the road.

It sounds harsh, but as a professional in the livestock industry I take animal welfare seriously.


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## WildRoots (Nov 24, 2013)

If she hasn't been shot up with meds you could shoot her and butcher her instead of just sending her for dog food


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Lazy J said:


> If she has not stood for over a week she won't, time to put her out of her misery.
> 
> Cows don't go down if they are simply a little underweight, they go down from being malnourished, except in the case of milk fever. It sounds like your cow was in BAD shape if she has been down for over a week. You need to reevaluate your situation and if you have the resources to be a responsible livestock owner. If you can't provide for you cattle, then back the trailer up and send them down the road.
> 
> It sounds harsh, but as a professional in the livestock industry I take animal welfare seriously.


Careful. I was criticized for questioning feed amounts given for 10 month old pigs weighing 30 pounds, living on grass alone, when their question was about keeping nose rings in to prevent rooting.
Then when a 30 year old horse was hanging on with ground feed, I mentioned that teeth may need floated and it might be time to consider quality of life. Shame on me. When I detect inhumane conditions, I tend to be harsh. We all should be. IMHO.


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## notwyse (Feb 16, 2014)

I worked in a feedlot back in the day. It is possible even for a fat healthy animal to get down in a position and be unable to rise. After a certain point the animal develops muscle atrophy. Think of your leg going to sleep when you sit wrong....now think of not being able to move for a week. I ate for months off a steer that had gone down. No one else wanted the meat because of the antibiotics the steer had been receiving. I needed the food.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

MO_cows said:


> What in the world?????
> 
> _My situation precluded me bringing in Hay to my farm - *the court order that allows me to even access my cows* did not include any provisions except to walk into the farm and to bring in cattle equipment to transport the cattle. Not to bring in Hay, supplies, vet, or any vehicles of any sort other than for the transport of cattle._
> 
> ...


I am sorry for the cows. 

I am curious too how you got into this situation. What a mess.


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## Brighton (Apr 14, 2013)

Please, please put this cow down, it is not going to recover, and what kind of life is that, being turned from side to side each day.


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

SCRancher

It is your animal and your call.

I will share the following. 
I loaned a 2+ year old bull to a person that wanted "new" blood for his herd. Unfortunately the man became ill and was unable to attend to his animals. His sons took over that responsibility. Exactly what happened is uncertain. The input that I got was that the loaned bull was down but they were "taking care of the animal". The explanation that I got was that the person that borrowed the bull had a group of yearling bulls, 6 to 8 animals, and that there was a confrontation between my bull and the group. The group managed to abused my bull to where he could not get up. I visited the place and my bull certainly was beyond being able to stand. I did get medication plus advice from a person that raises rodeo bulls. The medication failed to improve my bull. He could and would eat and drink but could not get up regardless of how hard he tried. This went on for some time but I did make sure the animal was fed and watered daily. This routine went far to long and I finally decided to put the animal down. I took my gun to the location where the animal was kept with the intent of putting him down. When I got there the bull was the same as I had seen him on each trip. As I was getting into position to dispatch him HE GOT UP! He had been incapacitated for nearly a month. On the other hand, I have had a few cows get a pinched nerve attempting to give birth and I sent them to the dog food processor. Over time I have come to realize that if you have live stock you will at some time or the other have dead stock. Roughly 5+ years ago lightning got 7 of my cows in one strike. One never knows.


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## SCRancher (Jan 11, 2011)

Thanks Agmantoo.

Regarding the land access issue - it developed about 18 months ago - I have had my cows on the land tending them bringing in hay, vets, supplies, etc for several years.

Vet was out Saturday - we lifted her again - he reconfirmed that she had nerve damage in her front right leg and that it had not gotten any better so I should put her down which I did right after he left and my wife and daughter left - perhaps 30 minutes after his recommendation.

For those bashing me about poor conditions - again while the cattle are in bad shape (getting in better shape now) we do not know if the cause of her going down was malnutrition or if she simply laid in a bad spot and got tangled up in the trees. Laying on her side for too long is what the vet thinks caused the nerve damage.

The vet didn't detect the nerve damage on his initial visit but 3 days later when he came out for the second time and we lifted her again.

The vet came out 4 times in 13 days.
Within 24 hours of the first vet visit I had 10 5x5 bales of hay at my farm and a ton of grain.
Within 72 hours I had an additional 24 4x5 bales of hay at my farm
As of last Friday I have an additional 35 4x5 bales of hay.

The 23 head of cattle receive 2 round bales and 100 pounds of grain per day.

It's not a matter of my resources it's a matter of experience - I have received an education through my vet and the current situation won't be repeated.


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## gwithrow (Feb 5, 2005)

we all learn more from our mistakes than from the 'easy' regular happenings with the animals...this winter was awful....I was sure it was to be my year to not buy hay, well we used more than ever...the cows are ok, but I can see now that planning for winter starts as soon as it is over....I am sure what you have learned will stand you in good stead in the coming years...


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

I don't know if it contributed or not but we have had an incredible winter that started way too early and is still hanging on. Everybody has been right for feed and bedding this year and even with feed, it's still been tough because our snow was so deep that getting feed to them has been a huge challenge.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

It is common for Animal Control Officers to arrive at a farm with starving cattle or starving horses to find freshly delivered hay and grain. Generally it isn't intentional abuse, just a lack of cash and an under estimation of the amount of feed they need.

When you wrote what the Vet said upon observing her condition, worst you'd ever seen, she was likely too weak to stand, it sounded like long term starvation/malnutrition. 

But, it is over for that one cow. No sense beating......

Do you know what good hay looks like? Can you identify low quality hay? Managing 23 head is a lot and not identifying malnutrition during the daily feeding is troubling to me. If money wasn't the problem (often is) then you need to be better equipped to observe your livestock. Do you supply minerals? 

I know how bad I'd feel if I had to put down a suffering cow. I write this not to make you feel worse, but so others that read this thread will be better prepared and not put their cows through such misery. None of us are without blame.


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## SCRancher (Jan 11, 2011)

Haypoint,

Until I started feeding hay I did not have a daily feeding - the new place that I moved them to is just 2 big pastures.

Yes I do feed loose minerals and have them available to them at all times.

I am a beginner at identifying good quality hay - I have questioned my vet and others about what to look for but still have doubts.

For example the initial 10 bales - I took a look at them and knew the top 6 inches was going to waste but since they were 5x5 bales they were worth the price. Other than that they were mixed grass - Johnson, fescue, common bermuda, weeds, etc.... but no briars. The Johnson was not in seed but the crabgrass was - just your basic mixed grass that looked like it was put up dry but sat outside on the ground.

The next 24 bales were pristine Coastal Bermuda - net wrapped, put up dry, stored under shelter, smelled fresh and still had green visible. Cows waste very little of this and took to it like it was sweet feed.

The last 30 bales are close to my place - have been sitting under trees from the first cutting last year and have suffered a lot of deterioration. I asked the vet about them and after describing the condition of the bales and the price he said "there is at least 7 good square bales left in each 4x5 round, @ 10 per round where can you buy 7 square bales for 10 dollars?"

He was not concerned about the outer layer of bad hay on the cows saying they simply will pick through eating what they like and trampling the rest. I made sure to specifically ask him about it. They too look like they were put up dry and just suffered from sitting out in the weather.

I did "buck" hay - square bales when I was 15 and 16 for a farmer - alfalfa - from this I learned the difference between put up dry and put up wet. Basically baled in a proper moisture content VS baled with too much moisture. 

When you pickup a bale of hay and toss it onto the trailer you get into a rhythm - until you get to a bale put up wet and you can't even lift it - these we had to cut the strings and spread them back out - mold already forming inside the bale even though they had not been rained on.


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