# So our 2 doelings are 5 months old and in with their 5mo old bro



## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

This is an extension of my "getting goats this week thread" (I guess it will be next week then, I am sooo excited)-
Other than the usu newbie goat care queries I have (which I will look up on the forum) the owners are pretty newbies too -- not sure why they have a registered Nigerian Dwarf buck (penned up nicely in a seperate pen to one side of the doe run)....== I had 2 concerns-- 
1)when we arrived today, the mamas clearly had smaller milk bags (so there is some weaning happening) but the kids arent seperated and were nursing!!!! They were born May 20th.... and did eat the Alfalfa hay offered eagerly... but will they be ok Tues to go home with us cold turkey off milk completely? (we bought orchard grass hay and there are some berries to browse on in the chicken yard we will start them out in, as well as a goat mineral block)
and 2) I hear that the bucklings are fertile as early as 7 weeks and this one is 20 weeks... is he likely to have bred his mama, her sister and the doelings (same age, one is a full sib, one is a cousin)....?

Just not sure about 5month old pregnant doelings! Is that even possible? They are from Nigerian/Toggenburg moms (sisters) and sired by the above Nigerian Dwarf buck so are pretty small....

Ok that is all for now....(Help pls)...


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## Doug Hodges (Jul 22, 2013)

Highly likely he bred them all.


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## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

I once had a doeling that was accidentally bred at 5 months old. She was healthy & stocky, so I decided to allow the pregnancy to go to kidding, keeping a careful eye on her & her nutrition throughout, and was with her when she kidded out. She did beautifully, was a good mama, and is a super-duper milker to this day.

I'd bet the buckling bred EVERYTHING in poroximity. So, you most likely have a couple of BRED 5-month-old doelings.

Nutritionally, they should be fine, going cold-turkey-weaning, except for voicing their displeasure!


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

Correction. They were born 5/20 so are all only FOUR months old (cant do math at night apparantly)....
Does being 4 months old make it any less likely (he is pretty ummm well developed)...


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## Doug Hodges (Jul 22, 2013)

CAjerseychick said:


> Correction. They were born 5/20 so are all only FOUR months old (cant do math at night apparantly)....
> Does being 4 months old make it any less likely (he is pretty ummm well developed)...


No. I wouldn't think so.


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

HMmm ok will def be monitoring them for signs of pregnancy then....


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## Caprice Acres (Mar 6, 2005)

I wouldn't let a pregnancy like that go to term, and chances are you won't know they're pregnant until there's a baby hanging out the back end. Probably won't end well. 

I'd pregnancy test them when you get them, and pregnancy test them again in 30 days. That will cover all your bases as they could have been bred a month ago or bred yesterday - impossible to say. 6.50 per goat per test. Cheap, easy, effective. If they are bred, I'd terminate the pregnancy.


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## Waiting Falcon (Nov 25, 2010)

Doe kids can breed at 3 months kidding at 8 months.........


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## anita_fc (May 24, 2008)

I have a friend who raises pygmies and she had a buckling breed his sister at 8 weeks of age. :-(

While experienced breeders might be able to deal with this, I would probably follow the advice to check and terminate pregnancies. Learning can be a steep curve without adding this kind of complication. It's hard enough with a little experience knowing when to go in and help. If you're brand new and miss something, it could cost the lives of your does as well as their babies.


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

Where do you get the pregnancy tests and the abortion meds?


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## Frosted Mini's (Nov 29, 2012)

mygoat said:


> I wouldn't let a pregnancy like that go to term, and chances are you won't know they're pregnant until there's a baby hanging out the back end. Probably won't end well.
> 
> I'd pregnancy test them when you get them, and pregnancy test them again in 30 days. That will cover all your bases as they could have been bred a month ago or bred yesterday - impossible to say. 6.50 per goat per test. Cheap, easy, effective. If they are bred, I'd terminate the pregnancy.


This. If you don't know how to draw blood, this may be the perfect time to get the vet to show you how. You will need that skill later for preg checks/CAE testing. Might as well have Biotracking do a CAE test while they're at it-uses the same tube of blood. The pregnancy tests are sent to Biotracking (biotracking.com) and the medicine you want from the vet is called Lutalyse ("lute" for short), or prostaglandin/prostaglandin f2 alpha.


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

Ok I will call the vet when I get back into town ...


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## JBarGFarmKeeper (Nov 1, 2011)

Frosted Mini's said:


> This. If you don't know how to draw blood, this may be the perfect time to get the vet to show you how. You will need that skill later for preg checks/CAE testing. Might as well have Biotracking do a CAE test while they're at it-uses the same tube of blood. The pregnancy tests are sent to Biotracking (biotracking.com) and the medicine you want from the vet is called Lutalyse ("lute" for short), or prostaglandin/prostaglandin f2 alpha.


I think CAE tests are pointless on 5 month old doelings. My vet said 8 months, I've heard others say a year. Save that much and do it before you breed or kid them. Whatever your timeline may be!


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## Frosted Mini's (Nov 29, 2012)

JBarGFarmKeeper said:


> I think CAE tests are pointless on 5 month old doelings. My vet said 8 months, I've heard others say a year. Save that much and do it before you breed or kid them. Whatever your timeline may be!


Well.

The CAE test that Biotracking does is an antibody test, checking for antibodies in the goats system. If they have never been exposed to CAE, they will test negative. HOWEVER, if they were fed heat-treated colostrum and pasteurized milk from CAE+ goats, they could potentially test positive and still be negative. Or, of course, if they were fed + raw milk, they will test positive and be positive. Personally, I wouldn't risk buying a kid that was even fed pasteurized CAE+ milk, because who knows if that person really did a good job and was careful in handling the milk.

And can you please inform your vet? It is not "worthless" to test those kids. You can find out if they have been exposed in their life at the least. Most people test their goats annually anyway, even ones have been previously tested, since CAE can also be a dormant virus and become active later. If that is the reason he says it is worthless, then might as well think of it as a worthless test for any age goat...


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## Caprice Acres (Mar 6, 2005)

Draw blood from the girls and send it to BioTracking. Here is the form: http://biotracking.com/pdfs/Goat And Sheep Sample Submission Form - 7-7-11.pdf

drawing blood from goats is extraordinarily easy. Watch your vet do it and have him teach you. I've been doing it since I was around 12 years old.  

You will need blood tubes from your vet or that you can buy from places like PBS supply. I use 3cc tubes. Be sure that they are RED TOP or marbled top (red/grey). Do NOT use yellow or purple topped tubes!! http://www.pbsanimalhealth.com/details/Monoject-Blood-Collection-Tubes/396-350.html

Pack them well - I wrap each in a strip of paper towel. I also label the tubes with a sharpie and then cover the label with a piece of clear tape so that if the label gets wet, the tape keeps it dry. Always label the tube with the animal ID (name or number) and then a TUBE number as well, which will correspond to the form. So if you have "1. Daisy" on the form, you'll write "Daisy" and "1" on the tube as well. Put them in a bag, and pack them well in a box. I always ship blood with an ice pack in an insulated shipper, but some people do not. Ship priority to biotracking to address on the top of the form, send the form along with them. I believe they ask you send payment with the samples. If the post office asks if there's liquids or anything hazardous in there, say NO - they are 'exempt animal specimines'.


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