# Unreplaceable items



## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

I hear many people prep to have all the "comforts" of modern life. Now while I don't blame them, in a TEOTWAKI situation eventually your toilet paper will run out. Sure, we don't just prep for the EOTW, but for all of life's little messes. However, my question to you is what do you prep that you could not replace that would be real necessities. The old depression adage, "Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without" will never be so important as when you can't replace your stocked items. For instance, I could replace toilet paper with corn shucks. But I don't know what I would do for thread--maybe cannibalize older garments/sheets/items of clothing, the way they used to do with nails. What necessities in your stocks could you not replace? Maybe as we list them others will help us to flesh out unthought of ideas for replacement. Pamela


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## stickinthemud (Sep 10, 2003)

Prescription drugs necessary for life or at least comfortable life.


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## bee (May 12, 2002)

your brood stock for your live stock..no rooster= no more chicks, etc.

prescription glasses or other orthotics.

ammunition..most of us don't reload.

propane regulator..do you have a spare?


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## 10kids (Jun 24, 2010)

A couple good knives and sharpening stone, flint, seeds. This is a great question!


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Stick in the mud--I understand that worry. Without my thyroid meds, my goiter would get huge over time, eventually leading to suffocation (ever seen a huge goiter?) My only hope is to stock as much synthroid as can, and ration it while I lose weight. The idea is that the less of me there is, the less thyroid med I should need. It should at least buy me a couple of years as Mom to help my family get settled through the transition years of a post-normal world. That's my hopes anyway.
Bee--I don't stock propane stuff yet. Propane also seems to be a transition item to help families adjust during those first awful months/years after a societal collapse. Ammunition I've wondered about too. Been researching salt-peter, bullet making, ect. I don't think it would be beyond my DH, but you would need to have the muzzle loader guns now. Guns are honestly something I don't know much about. But I keep coming back to the idea that if our forefathers could do it--without computers, internet, factories, ect--then so can we. As to brood stock, my rooster and layer mommas would become housepets :gaptooth:


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

10 kids--There is a lot of flint-type stone where I live. I believe with work we could replace knives to be used for cutting/scraping meat or hides. I do try to buy good quality knives that I can resharpen. Good sharpening tools aren't cheap, nor are good knives.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

If there is any one single thing in your possession that you will die without, then you need to start rethinking your strategy.


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## whiskeylivewire (May 27, 2009)

My thyroid meds and DS11's Imuran that keeps him alive. He goes back to the Dr. on Monday, I'm going to ask for a 3 months script and pay for it out of pocket somehow. Someone on this board told me I could get it refilled every 2 months and create a stock pile. Great question and another thing I will be thinking about.


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## Ohio dreamer (Apr 6, 2006)

bee said:


> ammunition..most of us don't reload.


And those of us that do, still only have so much powder.

Other things that will run out for us:
fabric
wood (we live in town and only have room for 1 winters worth at a time-and we have to buy that)

There's more but need to scoot...kids need me.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Some tools, knowledge cannot be replaced. There would be alot of scrappen going on. I do not prep. a lot of common household things. Learned to do without when I had no electricity and was pretty poor. Even now, have found that many modern things I just don't like. Know it sounds strange, but actually it is fun to me. Watching old westerns-since I've seen them all-the best part is looking at all the old stuff, the old stoves, cabins,my favorite is the General store scenes.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

7thswan said:


> Some tools, knowledge cannot be replaced. There would be alot of scrappen going on. I do not prep. a lot of common household things. Learned to do without when I had no electricity and was pretty poor. Even now, have found that many modern things I just don't like. Know it sounds strange, but actually it is fun to me. Watching old westerns-since I've seen them all-the best part is looking at all the old stuff, the old stoves, cabins,my favorite is the General store scenes.


I've been known to pause a movie showing some medieval or old-west setup and then run and grab my notebook to sketch out a quick picture of how they have things laid out.


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## Trixters_muse (Jan 29, 2008)

DUCT TAPE!!

I have a huge supply of it but if it runs out it would be a sad day for me


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Trixters_muse said:


> DUCT TAPE!!
> 
> I have a huge supply of it but if it runs out it would be a sad day for me


ot...I used some the other day, some of the stuff has gotten pretty usless, just how bad are things when even Duck tape is carpy?


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

I still have my carpentry and mechanic tools. I also have good supply of hand saws (which I can sharpen) shovels; picks; hoes; axes and hatchets.

Any kind of tape will be in short supply after a short time. Tarps and roofing supplies will be gone but how much can you store?

I agree about ammo. Those that do reload will run out after awhile and not want to barter any of it away. 

I have the means and knowledge to make a hand washing unit for clothes. It doesn't take much. A large tub with a drain; a red plunger or home made bucket lid made into an agatator. Black plungers come off on clothes. Lehman's sell washer plungers BTW.

As was said: medications would soon run out and some are hard to stock up on or are illegal to stock up on. BTW: There are only a few prescription medications that become toxic after a few months. Most have a shelf life of years regardless of what the drug companies want us to believe. Older drugs are re-packaged and sent to countries that don't have drug the laws we have here. My doctor told me that! 

I know I am missing a lot of items but I think I should make a list of every item I use in the next month. That includes the clothes I wear; soaps and detergents I use; food I eat; what I drink; etc. That will give me a better idea of what I use and need on a regular basis.

I have a thing about not throwing old but serviceable shoes and boots away. If I know I can get some more time out of them or patch them up I save them just in-case the SHTF. 

I still have a large can of thread and buttons my mother saved from old clothes. Nothing was thrown away without taking off the buttons. LOL 

Thanks bourbonred for starting this thread! :clap:


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## fancy1 (Dec 15, 2010)

We wouldn't die, but... these would make it tough:
Axe Handle - just broke it and now I know that I need to buy two.
Coffee - won't die without it, but I'll sure whine a lot!
Chocolate - again, I'd sure miss it.
Ammo - tough without, but we'd have to make do.
RX - very tough without the necessary meds....


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Ya'll stop movies to study...wow...you're over the top (Why didn't I think of that!!!) LOL

Ohio d-- wood is not a problem for us, although I don't think we have enough tools to lumberjack without a chainsaw. Leather may become the new cotton. Tanning is probably a skill I should move up my list of things to learn. BTW, I love my new sewing awl. It would be great for leather.

Trixters M--What can't you do with duct tape! Sure would miss it.

I have a theory, though, that in this situation with massive societal collapse, a large number of hungry people would die off. I expect to see empty houses where people grab their valuables and go looking to "civilization", AKA town, to feed them. These people probably won't take their thread, or duct tape, or toothpaste with them. I'm expecting that folks won't stay home hungry. And over time, "gleaning" from these dead houses will increase our supplies and allow us to transition to a new way of life. Is that stealing? I don't know. Would that be any different than growing corn or wheat on a neighbor's property that doesn't live in the state? These are things I would not do now, but in a TEOTWAKI lifestyle it seems to only make sense. Huh! Situational ethics....


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

NJ Rich said:


> I agree about ammo. Those that do reload will run out after awhile and not want to barter any of it away.


Actually something I have put away JUST for barter. Kegs and kegs of powder, lots of primers.....lots of bullets. 

You bring your box of brass and a dressed chicken and a bushel of potatoes, and you leave with a box of ammo ! ( Prices may vary  )


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## Tracy Rimmer (May 9, 2002)

Thread and fabric rot over time. It's better to have a spinning wheel and a few fiber animals.

For us, the biggie would be glasses. Three of the four of us have pretty extreme vision issues -- if anything happened to our glasses, or if (inevitably) the prescription changed dramatically, that would be an issue.


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## megafatcat (Jun 30, 2009)

Transport. All of it.
Shoes.
How many trips to town do you really think the kid's red wagon will survive?
Can you make/repair a pack?
Can you maintain a transport animal?


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Tracy--that's a big skill to learn. I have a big old loom that belonged to my ancestors, it's complete except for a harness. I even have a scrap that was woven on it. Also have 2 spinning wheels from the same side of the family. Maybe the kids and I could go and do a fieldtrip and watch for a day. I have books on it, but I think that's something I need to see done. Now glasses, that's a problem. Most of us would just have to squint.


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## Txrider (Jun 25, 2010)

fancy1 said:


> We wouldn't die, but... these would make it tough:
> Axe Handle - just broke it and now I know that I need to buy two.
> Coffee - won't die without it, but I'll sure whine a lot!
> Chocolate - again, I'd sure miss it.
> ...


Ohh I'm with you...

Coffee... would be tough..

Personally I have an air rifle I can hunt most small game with, and could get on even for large game. Makes ammo a lot easier as you just need lead or similar soft metal and a mold.

I use fiberglass axe handles now, tougher to break.


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## PyroDon (Jul 30, 2006)

Ok folks here ya go some helpful info concerning gun powder .
I would suggest a flint lock back up 
http://www.skylighter.com/mall/product-details.asp?id=49
http://www.skylighter.com/mall/product-details.asp?id=674
http://www.skylighter.com/mall/product-details.asp?id=586
http://www.skylighter.com/mall/product-details.asp?id=590

If you run out of powder well these will help you figure out how to make your own


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

We don't have any prescribed medications that we couldn't survive without in our house. We do store a lot of TP because we have the room for it. Probably the biggest hole in our preps is the lack of a grain mill and grain. I do stock grain seeds that we could use to grow certain things like amaranth, broom corn, corn, etc...but we don't really prep for that event that would last for a number of years with no respite. Instead, we would expect to rely on our stored items and spend our time working to produce other stuff that would then become our new storage, if you know what I mean...


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## 10kids (Jun 24, 2010)

Tracy - regarding glasses...last year I bought a pair of the reading glasses from Walmart, I think they were $7 per pair. I have prescription glasses for close up, so I don't wear them all the time. I wanted a pair to leave in my sewing room and they have worked beautifully. Next time I'm in the big city, I think I'll get a couple more pair of them and just put them away...thanks for the great point!


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

I buy magnifying glasses of varying strengths from the dollar store. Yup, for buck. My eyes may change for reading but distance isn't a problem ...........yet! DW would have a problem if she lost her distance glasses or her script changed. I think eye glasses are now on my list if "gleaning" is necessary.

TnAndy, Yes, ain't the Franklin Gun shop a nice place for old country boys? A bit pricey but you can usually find it here.

bourbonred says "gleaning". A far nicer word than "looter". I would be "gleaner" to. Hey they are gone and may never come back. Those in need may as well take what they need when it is apparent the owners are long gone. Hey we are talking serious SHTF aren't we?

People hide stuff in case they do come back. We would need to search very well. Let's hope it doesn't comes to that.


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

I had to laugh about the fabric and thread. You don't know sewing enthusiasts! 

I'm pretty sure Angie alone could supply half the nation for 3 generations from her fabric and thread stash - including every type of fabric and thread known to mankind. Run out of jeans and want something different? Angie can whip you up the cutest ice skating costume - along with a matching outfit for your All American Girl doll!..LOL! :thumb:

Plus, that's pretty typical of most sewing enthusiasts. We enthusiasts have in our home, stashed in box, closets, and every conceivable place in the house, fabric and thread stash that would make the Joanne Fabrics store chains look like amateur. Any one need 43 different types of thread in 200 different shades of blue? How about 200 cases of fabric scraps put away 25 years ago for to make that scrapquilt one day?

What would be a disaster is having no electricity and having to 'hand' or treadle sew everything. Goodness, I can't even imagine no computerized sewing machine, no serger, no embroidery machine, no blindhemmer, no automatic button holers or auto rufflers!! :run:


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Deodorant and chapstick


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## TJN66 (Aug 29, 2004)

Cabin Fever said:


> Deodorant and chapstick


Oh...I didnt think about chapstick. I need to add that to preps. Deodorant too but not so much as chapstick. I am addicted to it and have a tube on me at all times!


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## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

NJ Rich said:


> I have a thing about not throwing old but serviceable shoes and boots away. If I know I can get some more time out of them or patch them up I save them just in-case the SHTF.


 You too? I have a box of old shoes that I no longer can/would wear out to work etc, but figure if TSHTF I'd be glad I hung onto them.


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## PyroDon (Jul 30, 2006)

TJN66 said:


> Oh...I didnt think about chapstick. I need to add that to preps. Deodorant too but not so much as chapstick. I am addicted to it and have a tube on me at all times!


lard or beacon grease works for chapstick and your more likely to get your guy to kiss beacon :smiley-laughing013:


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## Astrid (Nov 13, 2010)

bourbonred said:


> 10 kids--There is a lot of flint-type stone where I live. I believe with work we could replace knives to be used for cutting/scraping meat or hides. I do try to buy good quality knives that I can resharpen. Good sharpening tools aren't cheap, nor are good knives.




My brother in law also makes knives out of old leaf springs and he hand carves the handles. He gave DH one a few years ago and it is one of the handiest tools we have.


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## Nature Man (Nov 5, 2009)

Good Health, Eye Sight, Sound Dental

Bill


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

oil
salt
Pepper
sugar
rice
potatoes - keeping seed potatoes is something I have never done
anything biennial


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## Astrid (Nov 13, 2010)

Soo many things...

gas and oil and all other petroleum products.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

TJN66 said:


> Oh...I didnt think about chapstick. I need to add that to preps....


I forgot, fresh cat oil makes a great lip balm.


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## Spinner (Jul 19, 2003)

Meds is about the only thing many would die for lack of. Some wouldn't die, their health may actually improve with lifestyle changes, weight loss, eating healthier, more physical exercise, etc.

I have a years supply of natural thyroid. Thyroid meds can be home made from pigs, but it's kind of yucky thinking about it. Lots of meds can be replaced with herbs. Now is the time to study on what herbs for your medical condition. 

Clothing can be made from many things. Flax, fleece, cotton, to name a few. It's not too hard to make a simple loom to weave blankets. A thinner yarn would make cloth for clothing, and thread to sew with. 

Shoes could be made at home too. They wouldn't be fashionable, but they could be durable. Tires can be soles, skins or fabrics can be the uppers. 

A friend sent me the plans to make a "thing" that grabs static electricity out of the air. The claim is that it works better than solar panels. It was invented many years ago by some guy named Tesla. If anyone wants a copy, I can email it. She also included plans to convert an engine to run on water, and plans to make your own solar panels. I haven't read them yet so have no idea how informative they are. 

Cabin Fever, Do you have any apple trees in the area? You can make vinegar from apples and vinegar makes a fine deodorant. 

There's a lot we could do to replace or repair much of our life comforts. It would take time and knowledge, but it would happen.

Callieslamb, Hot peppers can be grown, dried & powdered. Sugar can be made from either sugar beets or sugar cane, or replaced with stevia. Rice & potatoes can both be grown. Rice is harder, but doable. Potatoes are easy to grow depending on what part of the country you live in. I've never lived up north but they grow in Idaho, so maybe will grow in MI too. Oils can be gleaned from various places. Butcher a hog and render the fat to make lard, chicken fat, goose grease, bear grease have all been used over the centuries. 

For most things, where there's a will, there's a way.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Spinner said:


> ....Cabin Fever, Do you have any apple trees in the area? You can make vinegar from apples and vinegar makes a fine deodorant....


Ask WIHH, I have to leave the house whenever she cans anything that includes vinegar. I have a primal replusion to the odor of vinegar. Really, I do.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I would miss sugar. It wouldn't take long for my tiny little supply to run out. Sugar cane doesn't grow here in the US and I don't know how to get sweetness from sugar beets. Yes you can tap trees for some sweet stuff and raid hives for honey but nothing replaces good old cane sugar.

Kind of OT but a friend of ours told of his mother who lived through the depression and the was rationing. After she hoarded sugar. Every time she would go to the store she would buy a small bag. When she passed away he found sugar all over the house, even wrapped in fabric in a built-in window seat.


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Many have said that they'd miss coffee. I think I read a while back that someone had a coffee tree growing in a pot on their counter. My biggest loss might be rice. We don't eat beans but do eat a lot of rice. I have a ditch that's wet year round, wonder about some wild rice Would that grow in KY?
Cabin Fever--you'll have to explain "fresh cat oil".


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

you could always use cat oil...its the same..really


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

irreplaceable?

post SHTF....a pressure canner and a saw to cut wood....black powder rifle


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

bourbonred said:


> ...Cabin Fever--you'll have to explain "fresh cat oil".


No, you have to go rent the movie "Book of Eli."


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## machinist (Aug 3, 2010)

Karen, 

FWIW. We bought our DD a 1916 Singer treadle machine WITH a buttonholer attachment. We have a 1960's Singer treadle machine (made in Scotland!) that will swap parts with my wife's old Singer electric. 

Yeah, there are lots of things I wouldn't want to do without that I can't come up with myself. Eyeglasses and my wife's blood pressure meds are a couple that stick out. I have a stash of misc. glasses that would get us by in a pinch, but they aren't perfect, just better that nothing. 

I have spent most of my 65 years learning how to make and fix stuff, so there is a lot I can do, but not everything. We have addressed the medication thing with an herb garden, and that would help a LOT. But there are other things. 

I would eventually run out of materials for my metal shop, if lack of power had not already stopped it. So, I put together a host of manual tools and a blacksmmith shop that I can fire with homemade charcoal, if needed. But, there are nuts, bolts, screws, paint, glues, caulking, rubber products of many kinds, breakable dishes, and I can't imagine how many more things I'd have to do without, long term. 

This is one of the things that keeps my mind going in circles. What have I forgotten?


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## kasilofhome (Feb 10, 2005)

SD said to add
Shoe goop
glue
flint
BACON -store not your Homemade stuff

DH
meds
shoelaces
gas

Me
building supplies
animal feed
lids
bleach
meds and ot drugs
paper
ele
gas


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

Perscription medicines are our main concern; plus how to keep my husband's insulin cold.


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## ejagno (Jan 2, 2008)

Danaus29 said:


> I would miss sugar. It wouldn't take long for my tiny little supply to run out. *Sugar cane doesn't grow here in the US *and I don't know how to get sweetness from sugar beets. Yes you can tap trees for some sweet stuff and raid hives for honey but nothing replaces good old cane sugar.
> 
> Kind of OT but a friend of ours told of his mother who lived through the depression and the was rationing. After she hoarded sugar. Every time she would go to the store she would buy a small bag. When she passed away he found sugar all over the house, even wrapped in fabric in a built-in window seat.


I will have to disagree with this statement. We do grow tons of sugar cane here in Louisiana. We export alot of it.

Having been through a really difficult situation during Katrina and Rita I learned very quickly that some of lifes simplist things sure makes life easier. I drove for over an hour to find bed linens and bath towels. With fuel being what it is now I would not have that choice. Water was the most critical item. People would have given their arm for a simple hand can opener. Teenage girls and young women would literally beg for tampons. Believe it when I tell you that some wonderful folks with musical instruments played some of the most amazing tunes I'd ever heard to lull the thousands of frightened evacuees to sleep each night so if you play an instrument be sure to keep reeds, strings and whatever else you need to keep it in good shape. Hair cutting supplies were instrumental in not only boosting the self esteem of many but it changed their whole attitudes. 

With the advent of electric swiffers and such I think I'm the only person around here that still ownes a real honest to goodness broom and mop. Also a purchase of one of the carpet sweepers would help if you have carpet, area rugs or even throw rugs.


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## halfpint (Jan 24, 2005)

Tracy Rimmer said:


> Thread and fabric rot over time. It's better to have a spinning wheel and a few fiber animals.
> 
> For us, the biggie would be glasses. Three of the four of us have pretty extreme vision issues -- if anything happened to our glasses, or if (inevitably) the prescription changed dramatically, that would be an issue.


Do you have a way to manually shear your animals? Everyone I know uses electric for this now. One neighbor has two spinning wheels, but no animals, another neighbor in another directions has goats, so I guess that could be spun. We do have a drop spindle.

Glasses are about the only prescription problem for us. DH would have to get used to his glasses rather than wearing contacts. Youngest son and I only wear glasses, and we usually keep our last set or two as a backup, although only get glasses about every two years. 

Dawn


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

hp, I have shone my sheep and angora goats with scissors, it takes alot of time,but because of my back it it better for me to sit and have them just stand there. Sold them tho(sheep). I do still keep angora rabbits and those are done with scissors also. My neighbor currently uses my elec. shears on his mules, guess i should sell em.


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## Rainy (Jan 21, 2010)

my son's meds... I have about a three month supply but after that i don't know... they keep pulling off and putting him on these so i never have a chance to get it together.
socks- we destroy socks quickly.. i have also heard that alot of things like that are going up quickly.need to get some extra now.
shoes- i buy extra everytime there is a clearance
blankets- have some, but right now there on clearance at the store. need to buy more.


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## bajiay (Apr 8, 2008)

I would die if I had no soap or water to take a bath, or toothbrush and toothpaste to brush my teeth, or supplies for menses, I have therefore stocked up a ton on these!
As far as other living essentials, chocolate and popcorn are my comfort foods, so I have a lot of cocoa powder and popcorn on hand. For husband; chewy and hard candies. Daughter's comfort food is cucumbers, can't store those. She's gonna' have to pick something else. Comfort foods/supplies are important.
We have a small camping trailer and I have loaded that thing to the hilt with what it would take to live in there. I keep feeling like that day is going to come eventually. I keep wondering if I am forgetting anything. 
I feel like I will never have enough medical supplies. I go through them as fast as I buy them. (Other people calling for help.) I would miss not having those.


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## bajiay (Apr 8, 2008)

NJ Rich, thanks for the tip about the plungers! I didn't know that about the colors. They are on my new shopping list so I will remember to get red!


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Refrigeration is another thing which I could survive without, but would be very difficult. There's another thread running about that very topic right now. I've been playing with the idea of a very deep root cellar with large "ice cubes" in buckets that we freeze in the winter and make last as long as possible. This is close to what the old timers did with cutting ice blocks. If you froze them like ice cubes, then when they melt they wouldn't make a mess. HMMM.


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

bajiay and those wanting to test out plungers for washing clothes. I suggest testing on a piece of clothing or material you don't care about. I have found the older red plungers don't stain clothes. The key words here are: *"older plungers".*

Look at washing plungers in Lehman's on-line catalog for some ideas. I did see someone post on another web site similar to HT how they modified a plunger to work better. One suggestion was to use a piece of PVC pipe to extend the handle so you don't have to bend over to do the wash. 

Hey, every step you take to prepare for loss of power or worse, the better off you are. If some one tries this plunger method please post your results for the rest of us. 

If you use a large plastic container to wash the clothes look into making a drain so you don't have to bail the water out or risk breaking the plastic container while trying to pick it up. The plastic/PVC area of your hardware store will provide what you need without breaking the bank. :thumb:


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## PyroDon (Jul 30, 2006)

The only thing that will actually cause you to die is if you lose the will to survive .
everything else is replaceable . Humans survived for centuries with nothing more than rocks and sticks .
Yes the weak and ill will die off without meds rather quickly , like it or not its natures way .
those with the will to survive will adapt . Might not be very pleasant or fun but you can survive . 
to be honest the most important thing would be a safe supply of drinking water .


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

Rainy, what about buying a 3 month supply from canada. Is this a med that you could buy a higher dose and split?
Machinist, in that situation i think we'd have to adopt the building skills of earlier years. My old tobacco barn was put together with nothing but wooden pegs. If the bottom of the posts would have lasted, it would stand forever. It's amazing what they were able to do with nothing but a little skill.


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

PyroDon, I think you're right about adapting. Most all these things we've listed will be sorely missed. Stocking up on them, would just buy us time to make the adjustment easier.


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## Mutti (Sep 7, 2002)

The worst thing about the treadle sewing machine is you have to wind the bobbin soooo often. Wouldn't it be great to have bobbins that work off cones? Can't they invent that? 

Anyhow, I never throw away old shoes. Gorilla glue will put any sole back on forever. A barefoot person would gladly barter for those old tennies. Someone cold won't care if that hoodie is raggedy. Lucky for me I have huge storage garage!

And lucky for me my son's inlaws are bigtime re-loaders. My son has my spare room closet full of ammo cans and won't say how many guns he has. Only moaning 'cause he hit a dog in the fog and has to repair his car instead of picking up the gun he ordered! DEE


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## jd4020 (Feb 24, 2005)

When my brother was out on the glacier in Alaska doing military camp training, he told me that ear wax can make chapped lips more bearable.  
I guess I'm of the thinking that 1. It all belongs to God. 2. If He blessed me with it, He can also take it away for what ever reason & I'm o.k. with that. 3. He gave me a brain and hands to work with. 4. I have faith and know from first hand experience that He will help me to find the solutions for the problems I come up against.
I love the old treadle sewing machine my mother gave me. I have also learned to sew garments completely by hand, even button holes and if I am so inclined, eyelets. I have a loom big enough to make fabric or make fabric scraps into rugs like my fil made. He spent many a winter, cutting fabric strips and making rugs. Oftentimes my source of fabric are my local thrift stores. Those old prom gowns can make some cute Christmas dresses for little girls--velvets, taffetas and satins. I use a lot of denim for different projects and cabbage on to skirts and dresses for those.
If I need baskets I can make my own from the natural growth I have here around me, mainly stands of cattails, I can even make sandals. I want to make some sleeping mats for when we go camping and I want to make some baskets out of the small willow saplings that grow on our property this summer.
I have been learning about herbs and building on this knowledge. Learning also which plants can be used for cleaning and disenfecting.
Learning to work with hides and leather has been an enjoyable and satisfying venture. Clothing, moccosins, bags, all useful. Decorating them with porcupine quills is something I want to try. I gathered some quills from a fresh roadkill when we were out in Montana one time. I threw a blanket over the animal and the quills pulled out. I know, we're just talking about irreplaceable things here, not the extras to make pretties, but what will stay with me, even if I lose everything, is the knowledge to start replacing some of the items.
As far as weapons, most think of guns, but have you thought of bow & arrow, slings and smooth stones, spears? No, they don't have the power that guns do, but they can be used quietly and efficiently. One can learn to make any of these and one must also put in hours of practice. Some have to put in hours of practice to use the firearm. Plus, I don't need a permit to use a sling or turn my farm implement into a useful weapon. (small smile thinking about taking on the worlds' enemies with a pitchfork and corn knife)  If they take me out first, my worries are over. shrug.
A lot of materials can come from one large animal. Meat of course, horns & bones for tools or weapons, hides for clothing or shelter, sinew for sewing clothes or shelter, hooves for glue, fats for food, soap, lamps, even mane and tail hairs have uses. I remember in old yellar how the Mother used a hair from the mules' tail to stitch up the leg wounds on the boy and the dog too. I know, I'd rather have sterile stitching materials: I can just see me--oh wait, let me run that hair through this baby wipe to be cleaner.  but, you never know what you might be faced with.
I think I would be lost with out my needles, my pliers and my hammer and nails. But in those events, they would either be replaced or perhaps other materials would come along to work with. So many possibilities.
thanks for the thread.
jd


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## Fowler (Jul 8, 2008)

My husband reloads his own ammo and has a flint lock pistol...I would also suggest getting your bow hunting and trapping skills in order. As long as I can hunt and have seeds to garden the rest comes easy with a lot of hard work.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

My weakness, or unreplaceables, were eyeglasses and shoes. I can see far off, but reading??? need the specs now, for about a decade. I can read just fine with the 3/7.88 readers... I have at least a dozen virgin pairs, and keep all the broken ones... figure if I need them, I'll have the time for rigging up a pair out of whatever... the lenses are the hard part.

Shoes? I 'could' replace them, with moccasins, but have read where in the real world, moccasin wearers were always mending and replacing them, sometimes in as little as a week, if worn daily over rough ground. For most of my life I've had a pair of work boots, a pair of hiking boots, and sometimes a pair of wedding/funeral boots. Never more than three pairs. Once I caught the bug, and realized how awful it'd be to not have real shoes, I bought one good pair of all three types... work/hiking/wedding-funeral. Then got four pair of heavy duty (double leather layered) German army boots. 9 pair of Swiss hikers. 4 pair of leather based sandals. 3 pair of Herman Survivors, and several pair of throwaway wally world specials. I've been wearing a pair of the heavy duty boots for over two years, without any sign of wear. Figure I can go over a decade without needing shoes... probably several decades.

Some super duper battery bank would be awesome... one that'd last 20 or 30 years. If I could afford one, I'd dare not want to lose it. As it is, I'm suffering along with just a dual deep cycle battery backup for my solar panel backup.

I've seriously tried to double and triple up on stuff that is irreplaceable.


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

We try to duplicate all "can't do without" tools. In the last two years we've bought a second of each gardening tool. However, I have to tell you the new expensive tools are carp compared to the 40 year old stuff!! I have several hand can openers. I am still using stainless steel kitchen utensils I received for a wedding gift 50 years ago. However, I have purchased replacements (which again are carp in comparison). I try to buy extras at auctions so I can get the old quality and at a low price.

Used clothing and linens (new or used) are fairly inexpensive so we keep stocked up on those without spending much. Again, duplicate things. Two coats, two pair of shoes, two pair of boots, etc. Twenty pairs of gloves!! 

Its key to buy best quality, most quantity and then take very very good care of what you have. 

Its also key to be adaptable and think outside the box. It makes more sense to buy a non-disposable item and reuse rather than stock piling 1000 disposable items. Instead of tampons perhaps a Keeper. Or cotton fabric for homemade resuable pads.


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

Stay away from Home Depot and probably Loew's when it comes to garden tools. They are all carp or worse....

The local mason supply will probably have much better quality: shovels; rakes; hoes; axes; etc.

You will pay more but I am using tools my grandfather had. He would be 112+ were he still with us.

I am lucky to have a good Flea Market close by and find a lot of good tools and more.


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## Trisha in WA (Sep 28, 2005)

NJ Rich said:


> bajiay and those wanting to test out plungers for washing clothes. I suggest testing on a piece of clothing or material you don't care about. I have found the older red plungers don't stain clothes. The key words here are: *"older plungers".*
> 
> Look at washing plungers in Lehman's on-line catalog for some ideas. I did see someone post on another web site similar to HT how they modified a plunger to work better. One suggestion was to use a piece of PVC pipe to extend the handle so you don't have to bend over to do the wash.
> 
> Hey, every step you take to prepare for loss of power or worse, the better off you are. If some one tries this plunger method please post your results for the rest of us.


I bought the tin plunger (Rapid Washer) from Lehman's several years ago. I have used it several times and I really like how well it really shoves the water through the cloth. It is work, but the cloths come out really clean...I dare say even cleaner than in the regular electric washing machine. I see they have a plastic version available now. If you get the tin one, you have to dry it after you use it or it will rust, but I would think the plastic one might be prone to breakage.


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## PyroDon (Jul 30, 2006)

Ok farm auctions are where you find good quality old garden tools , its also where you find old kitchen ware , hand crank slice& dicers that are bullet proof . 
if your lucky you can find an old maytag washer thats belt driven ( and you can use it like my granny did by belting it to a bike and puttin the grand kids to peddling), better get your books out for some of the old tools so you can recognize a bit and brace protractor and mortase set , corn sheller , and grain mill that are just as functional as they were 130 years ago when the farmer great grand dad ordered them from the catalog.


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## ldc (Oct 11, 2006)

For those w/LOW thyroid, you might want to stock up on kelp meal. It is loaded w usuable iodine, and brought my numbers up a little, so don't need RX. Sardines can do this too, for mild cases. ldc


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## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

Let me tell you something, but earwax for chapstick!? My lips would bleed first. Earwax, I would have to say, is one of the top three most disgusting flavors of all time. Right next to poop.

4020 said he/she would die without pliers, my husband wears a leather man on his belt all the time. I wear a folding blade with a mini flathead screwdriver in the case beside it. We both wear mini mag lights.


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## mamakatinmd (Aug 21, 2005)

I have a Janome 712T "modern" treadle sewing machine that I put on an old singer treadle base. It does 11 stitches including a buttonholer! It also has a bobbin winder. Totally non electric. Something for the sewers out there to think about. Not super pricey either


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

mamakatinmd said:


> I have a Janome 712T "modern" treadle sewing machine that I put on an old singer treadle base. It does 11 stitches including a buttonholer! It also has a bobbin winder. Totally non electric. Something for the sewers out there to think about. Not super pricey either


I've wondered about one of those to go with my other Janome machines.
Right now, my electric machines would run off the ac outlet in my car dash -
But, I keep lots of fabric, patterns, hand needles, lots of threads - and I've got some fabrics since early 1980's that still good, so I thing 30 years would be enough time to get some thing re-established for making clothing/fabrics.


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

_What necessities in your stocks could you not replace ?_

Canning lids - the ablitiy to either make new from scratch or re-rubber lids that are in great condition. Need also to make the rubber.

Canning rubbers - those red rubber rings used in wire bail canning jars. I have even toyed with the idea of using old bike inner tubes cut to fit (bad taste).

While I do have a good two to three year supply of canning lids there is no way that I could stock 25 + years worth. Eventually there would come a time that I'd either would have found a way to make a suitable replacement or learned to live with out.

Before canning there was dehydrating, fermenting, smoking, pickling, cold storage (root cellar) ect.
So it's not like I'd die without a pantry of filled mason jars but I would dearly miss my home canned produce.


~~ pelenaka ~~


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

NJ Rich said:


> Hey, every step you take to prepare for loss of power or worse, the better off you are. If some one tries this plunger method please post your results for the rest of us.
> 
> If you use a large plastic container to wash the clothes look into making a drain so you don't have to bail the water out or risk breaking the plastic container while trying to pick it up. The plastic/PVC area of your hardware store will provide what you need without breaking the bank. :thumb:


Hubby made me a washer outta a plastic bucket & a plunger - 

Later on when daughters & I were playing tourist @ Lehman's I bought the rapid washer which has a longer handle, does make it easier to plunge.
Other than that no real difference except the $. 
Socks washed out cleaner using my urban washing machine than my front loader washing machine. Added bonus was my biceps toned up a bit & since I do tend to drip water everytime I did the wash my kitchen floor was mopped at least until Spring then I enjoyed my patio.


~~ pelenaka ~~


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## Ruby (May 10, 2002)

Mutti said:


> The worst thing about the treadle sewing machine is you have to wind the bobbin soooo often. Wouldn't it be great to have bobbins that work off cones? Can't they invent that?
> DEE


I have one of the '50s treadle singer machines. Did you know you can wind your bobbin while sewing. Just put it on the winder and push it against the wheel. Instead of loosening the hand wheel to wind just leave it in the sewing position and start sewing. You only have to loosen it to keep the needle from going up and down without sewing. But if you have fabric under the foot and sewing it doesn't matter.


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

bourbonred said:


> I hear many people prep to have all the "comforts" of modern life. Now while I don't blame them, in a TEOTWAKI situation eventually your toilet paper will run out. Sure, we don't just prep for the EOTW, but for all of life's little messes. However, my question to you is what do you prep that you could not replace that would be real necessities. The old depression adage, "Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without" will never be so important as when you can't replace your stocked items. For instance, I could replace toilet paper with corn shucks. But I don't know what I would do for thread--maybe cannibalize older garments/sheets/items of clothing, the way they used to do with nails. What necessities in your stocks could you not replace? Maybe as we list them others will help us to flesh out unthought of ideas for replacement. Pamela


The surged -sewn part on a sweatshirt unraveled in the dryer and I considered how good a source serged hems would be for sewing thread. Break it just right, and it comes udone like the sewn top of a feed bag...especially so in a dryer :hrm:
-scrt crk


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

megafatcat said:


> Transport. All of it.
> Shoes.
> How many trips to town do you really think the kid's red wagon will survive?
> Can you make/repair a pack?
> Can you maintain a transport animal?


Pack Goat!! Go to: www.northwestpackgoats.com to look at the gear. Go to www.napga.org to learn more about packgoating. Goats were used for years to pull small carts...and good for children to learn to harness and train to pull with...usually they are very patient, if treated kindly.

A bonded/trained, conditioned, large breed goat wether in it's prime can carry 30-60 lbs. for 10 miles easily. They are so sure footed they can go where a horse or llama can't or won't, are easy to train if they are bonded to humans(you)...they don't run away, and make a great companion animal. On the trail, they can eat natural browse so you only need to bring some feed ration if you push them hard...and of course they'll need some water...hopefully you'd not have to haul that.

-scrt crk


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

Cabin Fever said:


> Deodorant and chapstick


Deodorant...can't help you there..maybe those "crystal" salty/mineral "rocks"? They probably have alum in them. But, if your lips grow chapped, if it's been a few hours since you showered, just rub an index finger along your nose, or behind an ear ...there's enough of the same body oil to replenish your lips, usually. As long as you are clean, and have access to some fatty foods once in a while..it'll be there- the same oil. 'course shortning, butter, vaseline,mineral oil will work til you run out of that stuff.

-scrt crk


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

PyroDon said:


> lard or beacon grease works for chapstick and your more likely to get your guy to kiss beacon :smiley-laughing013:


Is beacon some kind of ~light~ grease? (bacon...couldn't pass that one up...sry).


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## machinist (Aug 3, 2010)

bourbonred said: "...in that situation i think we'd have to adopt the building skills of earlier years."

I'm thankful that my Dad taught some things about barn framing like you described. He and Grandad did that sort of construction back about 100 years ago. 

Yes, I sure that most of us will have to do a lot of things the old ways, eventually. I want to put it off as long as I can, since that is a LOT of work, but I also want to have what it takes to do it the old ways. We do, however, do things that use some old skills now to assure we can make them work and get some practice. 

For instance, today we are making soap. Not something we really NEED to do now, but it saves some real money, and wife and I want to refine our ways of doing such things. 

The more things we do the old ways, the fewer are the items that we can't live without, shortening my list of irreplaceables. We will use modern conveniences as long as they are affordable and it makes sense, but by having one foot in the older, simpler ways, when the new stuff isn't available, we won't really feel too bad about it. 

Also, most of the old stuff is easier to fix than the new stuff. Our 100 year old hand water pump is easily repaired with simple hand tools, and requires no high tech parts to function, unlike the electric pump.


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## Andy Nonymous (Aug 20, 2005)

Deodorant: Sodium bicarbonate, aka baking soda. Still only about 50 cents a pound, and at a damp finger dip per freshly washed 'pit, a pound would go for about 10 years. I've been using it for years, and it works very well for me. Rub on gently, not rub in, as it can be 'abrasive' to sensitive skin. Also works with or without salt and or peroxide as toothpaste, and as a scouring powder, and for neutralizing sulfuric (car battery) or other acid spills, as a poultice on bee stings, oh, and in the kitchen as a leavening agent. 

Next time out, get the Big Box.


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## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

oops mistake


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Ohio dreamer said:


> And those of us that do, still only have so much powder.
> 
> Other things that will run out for us:
> fabric
> ...


you dont need to use smokeless to make your loads you could do cowboy loads with black powder, would need to get use to the difference though.
sulfur is the only thing that maybe hard to come up with, but not 100% necessary here is a good read

http://www.musketeer.ch/blackpowder/recipe.html

eventually though caps will run out depending on how much you need to shoot and cases will start fatiguing and oxidizing also.


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## Cindy in NY (May 10, 2002)

Besides meds for DH, the dog and I, I'm not sure what I could use as a replacement for dental floss and arch supports for my very flat feet!


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Cindy in NY said:


> ....I'm not sure what I could use as a replacement for dental floss....


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## Cindy in NY (May 10, 2002)

That might be a bit much. Maybe a single strand of horse hair would do the trick!


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

OH MY! Will it really come to that!  Seriously, only God knows what it will come to. So many of our modern "necessities", we make look back and laugh on.


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## gideonprime (Oct 17, 2007)

Cloth, nice machine made cloth soft strong and clean.

Shoes. Oh sure could I make something to wear on my feet . . . Yeah I think I could. WOuld thay be a comfy adn wear and well as a good pair of post EOTW shoes . . . . I doubt it.


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

MNN2501 and you other shoe and boots savers......

I just repaired two pair of leather shoes and a pair of sneakers. I used Gorilla Glue. Now I will warn you the repair is far from stylish. Gorilla Glue expands as it sets. It will ruin your clothes and stick to your fingers until the skin wears off or you sand it off as I do. It bubbled out all along the repair. I trimmed some of it off but I need to do more work. Your repaired dress shoes will not be those you would wear to the office or church.

Mine are for wearing in the yard or shop. But I now have three pairs of shoes I would have thrown away. Po-p hits the fan blades I don't think you will care what they look like either. 

BTW: The sneakers didn't need to much repairing and you can hardly tell they have been glued.

*Read the directions carefully before you use Goruilla Glue. Wear Gloves!*


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## jd4020 (Feb 24, 2005)

oh CF I never thought about horse tail hair for floss. Good one! I do have lots of sewing thread tho... 
And Secret Creek---I tried the "oil from behind the ear" on my lips. 
Not bad, better than ear wax (recommended by my military brother), which by the way--having cleaned out hog houses with a power washer and have inadvertantly tasted poo---ear wax would be a step up I think.  Sorry, couldn't resist.  lol
I love the versitility of baking soda. I've used it for deodarant for years now. I also clean with it along with vinegar. I don't particularly like brushing my teeth with it, but it does freshen breath very well. Vinegar is good for rinsing hair and skin after a shower. It helps balance the bodys' ph of the skin. If you grow herbs, parsley is also a good breath freshener, I don't know about how well it cleans the teeth. I read somewhere about chewing the ends of small twigs to soften and brushing with that. I don't remember if it was a particular type wood, but I would think apple or willow wood would work. Oh, and maybe ya'll already know this but willow trees are a sorce of aspirin, it really works. We were out on a walk and I got a headache. We passed a willow tree so I broke off a young branch tip and chewed it for oh--2-3 minutes and spit it out. Our lane is a half a mile long and by the time we got back up it to home, my headache was gone.
I have one of those metal clothes plungers from Lehmans. It does work real nice but like another poster said, it does tend to rust if not dried between washings. However to be true to the op, if my usual clothing tools and cleaners were now gone & all I had were the rocks and a stream, then, if I wanted to have cleaner clothes that's where I would be. There are plants that have cleaning abilities. From what I understand, they aren't very sudsy, but they do the job. I have some growing in our roadside ditch. It's common name is bouncin bet.
jd


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## Pack Rat (Nov 9, 2006)

The one thing that would be irreplaceable if the manure really hit the ventilator? 

Spare time.

Think about it: even if you could make your clothes from fibers or skins; even if you could garden and raise critters to fully feed yourself and family; even if you could eternally put up enough for 2 years without glass jars and tin lids; even if you can cut firewood without any oil inputs; even if you could cast your own iron and forge your own tools from scraps; even if you could make your own powder and balls for your flintlock you would still be hard pressed to do everything needed to maintain your life even working 20 hour days most days of the year. 

I certainly wouldn't have time to surf the internet, or make make extraneous trips to town, or have extra money for utilities (if available) to make my work more efficient. It would be the 1300's all over again, only worse, because then there were fewer people clamoring for raw materials, communities had thriving artisans and barter, and taxes (in many places) were relatively low.

Life back then was hard, and made harder by those who lived off the labor of others, such as the lord of the Manor. Now, there are far too many living off the labor of others, and they won't just disappear, nor can they be overthrown - they'll appear with guns and demand their fair share - they are called "your government". You already pay them to do that to deadbeat taxpayers, just be prepared to pay a lot more of the far less you will have.


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## PyroDon (Jul 30, 2006)

NJ Rich said:


> MNN2501 and you other shoe and boots savers......
> 
> I just repaired two pair of leather shoes and a pair of sneakers. I used Gorilla Glue. Now I will warn you the repair is far from stylish. Gorilla Glue expands as it sets. It will ruin your clothes and stick to your fingers until the skin wears off or you sand it off as I do. It bubbled out all along the repair. I trimmed some of it off but I need to do more work. Your repaired dress shoes will not be those you would wear to the office or church.
> 
> ...


You do realize whitelightning polyurathane will work as well as and remains flexable. you still want to wear gloves and avoid clothing and skin


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

"The one thing that would be irreplaceable if the manure really hit the ventilator? 

Spare time." (Quote by Pack Rat)

There's the post of the day! And my kids think I work them hard now, sheesh...


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## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

And that is EXACTLY why families had 10 or 12 kids...every family. And those kids worked as soon as they were old enough to follow a simple instruction, and life was still hard, and a teen/young adult who wasn't married stayed home. And those that did marry, stayed close. Everyone worked, or everyone suffered.


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