# Concealed Carry Holster?



## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I am a woman and looking at what kind of holster to wear. I have a Ruger SP100 .357 magnum, hammerless, and passed the training. 

Any advice would be helpful.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I am of medium build, not thin or fat, wear jeans mostly and t-shirts or shirts.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

That's the question of the century, and even for guys it can be tough to find the "perfect" carry combo.
I like IWB like a Kholster or Crossbreed Supertuck, but some folks prefer a close fitting OWB and a cover garment.
Check out the Cornered Cat website, it's a great source of info for women especially.
If you are like me, you'll wind up with a barrel of holsters and still looking for "_the_" holster.
Good luck:goodjob:


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Appreciate it Cornhusker!


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

How long is the barrel and overall length? I carry my hammerless taurus 357 snub in a belly band rigging under my overalls at times.

http://www.concealmentconceptsholsters.com/Belly_band.html


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I believe the barrel is 3.5" 

Possibly looking at behind the hip carry?


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Cornhusker said:


> That's the question of the century, and even for guys it can be tough to find the "perfect" carry combo.
> I like IWB like a Kholster or Crossbreed Supertuck, but some folks prefer a close fitting OWB and a cover garment.
> Check out the Cornered Cat website, it's a great source of info for women especially.
> If you are like me, you'll wind up with a barrel of holsters and still looking for "_the_" holster.
> Good luck:goodjob:


Cornhusker,
I dont want to hear anything about "the perfect holster". 25 years ago I had a nice .45 and every off the rack rig fell on either side of the"goldilocks factor" for me until finally I went to the cobbler who made my boots and a saddle for me and told him what features of each I liked and he custom built me a rigging for $250 and I was happy.

Three months later a drunk runned all over me in my camaro sending me through the windshield with my seatbelt across my chest like a loop on a calf being cut from the herd when the seat and belt lock sheared from the floor pan as I flipped.

Not only did the EMTs cut my rigging into 3 pieces as they scissor stripped me in the highway , the copshop took my piece into custody and etched a "department I.D. number into the slide (don't ask me why that city did that but to this day if I have to go through there I pack a less valuable weapon just in case).

Bottom line for me was it cost me another $90 to get the rig repaired at my cobbler and $300 to get my 45 filled milled and blued by my gunsmith and to this day whenever I clean and oil it I see that little imperfection in the bluing on the slide and cuss that PD for treating a CCL legal toter like that especially considering the only thing I broke was my nose as I ate the windshield.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

There is no right answer to this question. If you're like most people, you're gonna end up with a drawer full of holsters for that one revolver. IMHO, you're gonna have to try every kind of holster there is until you find yourself the right one....or two...or three!


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## radiofish (Mar 30, 2007)

One of my women friends uses a CCW purse for her hammer less .38 special revolver with a 2 inch barrel.

Behind the hip carry, may work for you. But it will be in the way when you sit in a car seat..

Shoulder holsters - horizontal or vertical carry?? There are umpteen different configurations with them. I tend to like 'Bianchi' products, for shoulder holsters. Yet you will have to wear a bit larger coat/ jacket/ blouse while carrying that way.

Yet being as large and tall as I am, I go with a IWB (inside the waist band) holsters for my large framed semi-auto CCW weapons. My Ruger GP-100 revolvers I carry in a shoulder holster and on my hip in an OWB holsters. 

I also have a whole bunch of different holsters, that are used for different occasions.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Possibly looking at behind the hip carry?


Women are most often assaulted *from behind*.

If you carry the gun in front, in a cross draw position, you'd still be able to access it even if grabbed from behind.

You'll just have to experiment a lot to see what is comfortable for you though


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## unregistered29228 (Jan 9, 2008)

I have a CC purse holster for my Springfield XD .40 and I've been practicing drawing it quickly. The purse is made so you can shoot right through the other end of the purse if you need to. The strap has piano wire so it can't easily be cut. I got it from Sportsman's Guide and it was a good price according to what I saw for sale at a recent gun show.

At home, I have the plastic holster that came with the gun on my belt. I don't bother concealing it at home.

Congrats on getting your permit OLF! It's such a good idea for women to be armed and ready to defend themselves.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

i belive that k holsters might be a good first try even if you don't like it i think they take it back for up to 30 days by then you will know. they seem like a nice outfit out of st louise


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Mom_of_Four said:


> Congrats on getting your permit OLF! It's such a good idea for women to be armed and ready to defend themselves.


Thank you! Daughter and I were serious in martial arts a long time ago, but life got in the way and are now starting again. We have also been offered a self awareness class which we are accepting.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> The strap has piano wire so it can't easily be cut.


I heard about a woman who had one of those.
She was at the Mall and some guy ran by and grabbed her purse, expecting the strap to just break off.

It didn't break, but her ARM did when she hit the ground, and he STILL got the purse.

A purse is the first thing many bad guys go for, so I think it's better to have your gun somewhere else


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## cast iron (Oct 4, 2004)

In addition to the information you receive here, you might consider asking the question on this forum as well.
http://womenandguns.servertalk.in/womenandguns-forum-1.html


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## gwhilikerz (Aug 7, 2006)

I gave up on finding the perfect holster for CCW. Now I use a Hip-Grip on my revolvers. It is more comfortable than any holster I have found while being highly concealable. Just stick the gun into your waistband with the grip hooked over the top of your jeans or belt.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Hip grip? Do you have a link?

WIHH or other women CCW permit holders, what do you use?


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

There are so many options and its going do depend on how often you carry, what you wear when you carry, What your body build is and how you like a holster.. Figure your going to need to try several before you find the correct one. Dont cheap out, spend the money. You may have to resell it if you dont like it and you will loose a little money but when it comes to a holster you need one that works for you.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Im surprised they dont make bra holsters for women. I remember my grandmaw carried a wallet, kleanix, pocket knife, rain bonnet, quiet kid pew candy and I think the bumper jack to my grandfathers Bel Air in her bra in the mid 1960s.

With as much stuff as grannys packed up front back then seems like they should make a sports bra holster combo today :shrug:


Opened a new tab and googled bra holster and what do you know

http://www.forumsforums.com/3_9/showthread.php?t=29869

That rig would probably work with some of us guys past our hard body years with our mid life man jugs :shocked:


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## Texasdirtdigger (Jan 17, 2010)

OMG SHREK!!! ROFL!!!!! What a mental image you just gave me!!! 
I KNEW EXACTLY what you meant! Love the "quiet kid pew candy" comment...we called them Church Mints......although, most of the time they were Lifesavers candy.
I have a concealment purse... my BFF uses the fanny pak.


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## manygoatsnmore (Feb 12, 2005)

Shrek, you have a real way with words, lol! I'm afraid I'm not, um, "built", for the bra holster.  It wouldn't conceal very well. I have a slip in pocket holster that I put in my purse - I can pull my revolver out without bringing the holster with it. If I'm wearing a coat, I can just put the holster and gun in my pocket.


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## cast iron (Oct 4, 2004)

Probably talking about the barami hip grip, but they are not made for Ruger revolvers as far as I know.
http://www.baramihipgrip.com/

My wife occasionally carries in a holster purse. Some available here.
http://www.guntotenmamas.com/


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

Traditionally, women carried the 41 Remington Derringer in a garter. But times change. 

Good luck with your perfect holster. I've been shopping for one for 30 years so far. Still looking. I just ordered this http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/concealment-vest.aspx?a=691307 but it is just so I can ride a 4 wheeler or trail bike with the pistol along. I'm less concerned with concealment and more concerned with keeping the weapon retained until needed. 

Check into slipping a large frame semi auto down betwixt your buns like Magnum PI used to do. It works great until you try to sit down, or walk or move slowly.

Back when fanny packs were in fashion, there were some good holsters made in them and I know a few women who used them. Now you don't see them as often so it might point to being a concealed weapon if you wear one.


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

OLF - For me, it depends on what I am wearing. I have a purse with the holster in it. It isn't that easy to get it out due to the velcro- of all things! But when I am in a dress, it works best for me. You just have to keep your purse ON YOU. When I wear pants, I found the inside holster to be best for concealment and comfort for me. A long skirt opens up the way for a calf holster, but I prefer the purse. 

The holster that rides inside at the waist is my favorite. I can wear it right in front of my hip so it is covered by my shirt and not in the way of shopping, etc. The gun rides well and stays put. I have a 9mm. Anything worn on the outside is going to be seen with women's clothing styles and what we do while we are wearing them. Shirts are too short these days to keep them covered up. I have a harder time getting a gun into position from behind. And also found I was fidgeting with the gun more when it was back there. And as stated - you will almost have to remove it to sit in your car.

I know shopping online is more your thing, but if you get a chance, go to a gun store that and try some. It really is the best way to do it. 

Winter is easy, there are vests that are especially for carrying - and they have lots of other pockets perfect for women on the go too. Shop around, try several and see what you like best.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thanks Callie, Imay just do that. I am interested in the inside the waist band holster too.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Dress around your gun, and remember, guns aren't comfortable, they are comforting.


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## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

My grandma made her own aprons, and she made a "holster" pocket in them that fit a Colt Peacemaker .44. Of course, I haven't seen many women wearing aprons lately, either.


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## Old John (May 27, 2004)

My DSW carries a little 9mm, Keltec PF9. She has an Uncle Mike's pocket holster, that she carries it in. It fits in the side pocket, or the back/hip pocket of her blue jeans.
She also has a couple of the Coronado purses with holsters built in. But, she seldom carries a large purse. So the pocket pistol & holster works just fine. And, 9mm is good enough.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hey,
First Congratulations on deciding to get your CCW license then a big atta girl for deciding you will actually carry. Remember ,practice, practice, practice. With your regular carry gun, holster, belt, clothing you regularly wear. Then do practical tests on the range practice being able to get your weapon out smoothly and quickly (do most of your practice for that with an empty gun (with your ruger you can dry fire till the cows come home without hurting it, unlike a lot of inexpensive automatics). If your paying attention you will pull it a dozen times and never actually shoot anyone (if your lucky).
when you have it so you feel confident that you can safety get it out and pointed at a target. Then start practicing engaging target from 3 to 7 yards, when that's easy move your targets out to 10 yards then 15. 
There are pages I can go into on grip, finger location on trigger how you stroke the trigger on a double action pistol. I recommend practicing double action for the first two shots from a CCW pistol. Reading up with one of Masad Ayobs books is strongly recommended also. He's a smart savy tough guy, a pretty good writer as well.
Figuring out were and how you are going to carry your weapon is tough and it will probably evolve as you gain experience, find new weapons holsters, belts.
As you know but none of the above seem too  Girls is shaped different than guys, something I've noticed and admired for years and years.
The difference between hip and waist measurement and how far apart they are will make huge difference in how you carry and were. If you have a curvy Mediterranean figure a with a short waist belt Cary can be very difficult. If your broad shouldered and not much change from hip to waist. Belt carry might work for you.
Most gals don't care for shoulder rigs, some thing about bulking up the cross section high on the figure.
You are the only one who can say, if you can find a gal who CCW's , particularly if you can find one of a similar figure. (yea tough I know)
Also keep in mind that belts for CCW holsters should be sturdy and stiff that requires them to be thicker. this means they need to be cut on a curve to adapt to your curves.
The more a holster stays in the same place will make it easier to draw.
Hope that helps,
Dutch


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Appreciate it Dutch. I have experience on a range and will be getting more. I am already very comfortable with this gun, but will be going weekly to the range. 

I think I am going to go see the guy that does a lot of my training and see what he says.

Want to look at the pancake holster. Reall like the holster for your back, but have been warned against those. Anyone say any different?


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Any links to what you like, or photos would be really appreciated. This is a hard decision and I really dont like wasting money on something I dont like.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hey,
Unfortunatly, you probably will not get a quick answer to what is the perfect holster for you! I literally have a box full of holsters, and that's less than what I've bought over the years because I give ones I hate away!
See if you can beg borrow from more experianced CCW types see if your instructor will bring his box full along and see if any fit your weapon. Try everthing and see what works.
I won years ago at Second Chance a par of generic belt holsters that are supposed to fit amost anything they have velcro thumb snap that will move around. There the only ones I won't part with. They are not the best but they do seem to work wih most anything.
Your idea of a pancake holster is a good one particularly with your Ruger (superb CCW choice by the way) if it works for you.
The behind the back holsters are experts tools they will have you pointing the gun at your core or leg if you are not very careful. I own one for my Sig 229 I rarely use it as I am very parinoid about the draw. 
My personal preferance is a kidney carry, just behind the hip on the belt (there are at least a dozen ways to describe this carry so don't let a name hang you up).
But I'm a tall barrel chested guy (300 lbs of gorrilla) and can carry a pair of 45's on either side of my belt without anyone knowing .
Remember you need to keep it concealed and ready to use. I regularly here in the high Desert were I live, wear a loose button up the front shirt. Open over a t shirt when its to warm to wear a vest (most of the time) and clip the corner of the right side into my key caribiner I wear on the front right belt loop so if the right side of the shirt dosen't get blown away from my body, its held in place and doesn't scare the blue haired church lady that I've got a gun. (of course the last time it happened she giggled and showed me her purse gun). Oregon away from the left coast can be kinda differant.
Cheers,
Dutch


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## oldmanriver (Aug 1, 2004)

My wife carrys a double barrel 12 ga. under her long dress but i had to shorten the barrell down to 30 inches last you seems she is getting shorter in her old age . Ya'll have that problem to .


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## Gottabenutz (May 11, 2010)

All I can add to this is that having all those holsters laying around could be an excuse to buy a new gun to store in it?! I am short, size 10-12, and wear mine at the waist. Location varies with the outfit; holster clips to waistband. If outfit does not allow that holster; into my "purse" it goes. Could you check with your local store and see if they would allow you to try on the holsters and see which one feels good for you?


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

To help a little more, I am a size 12 in pants now, but a size 14-16 up top due to assets. I am 5ft 7. long legs.
Am happy with the gun I have.


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## tlrnnp67 (Nov 5, 2006)

What does everyone do about the sweat issue with CCW holsters?


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## Pam6 (Apr 9, 2009)

I carry a Kahr 9MM and I have an inside waist band holster. No one has ever said they can see it even on a couple of my clingier shirts.
I am 5'2", 14 on top, 16 on bottom. When I was 15 pounds lighter and wearing the same clothes as I do now it was even less noticeable.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Any links to what you like


The lowest priced good holsters will be Michael's/ Uncle Mike's nylon
The REALLY good holsters will be Galco, Bianchi and Safariland leather

http://www.uncle-mikes.com/um_cat_holsters.html

http://www.usgalco.com/

http://www.safariland.com/DutyGear/concealment/

http://www.bianchi-intl.com/product/ChooseCatlim.php?numCatID=1


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

tlrnnp67 said:


> What does everyone do about the sweat issue with CCW holsters?


It requires more frequent maintenance. Also, a CCW weapon will pick up lots of lint and fuzz and dust from clothes so that has to be taken care of with frequent cleanings, too. This is the one weapon you have decided to bet your life on, you might as well try and take care of it.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

tlrnnp67 said:


> What does everyone do about the sweat issue with CCW holsters?


Hey,
With a blued gun or stainless less (I don't own any stainless guns) but every night when I take the gun off I unload it squirt it with a good quality of gun oil then wipe it down with a rag then run a patch down the barrel and the cylander. This takes maybe a minute start to finish. including the reload. Then I take the rag to the holster and wipe it down if it seems damp I'll put it on top of my old fashioned tv to dry over night.
Any specific questions?
Dutch


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

tlrnnp67 said:


> What does everyone do about the sweat issue with CCW holsters?


Hereâs a picture of my CCW setup, a Les Baer âStingerâ 1911 in a Milt Sparks VMII IWB holster. I've gone to either stainless or plated (hardchrome) CCW guns, and if I don't shoot them and clean, they get wiped done a couple times a month. 










http://www.miltsparks.com/

This holster is made from two types of leather, horsehide on the inside for its moisture (sweat) resistance and cow leather for its formability. It has a âslideâ guard that protects the slide from making contact with your body. The holster is âmoldedâ to the make of the handgun, so no retention straps, etc. are needed. With the optional clips itâs tuckable, meaning you can wear a shirt tucked in over top of the gun, which is what I often do with my little SIG 230 in .380. 

I like IWBs because if your cover garment rides up a little, the weapon is still concealed provided your shirt stays below your beltline. 

After buying about a small box full of CCW holsters, the Sparks VMII is now the one I use and have 3 for different pistols that I carry. Unfortunately these holsters (and all Sparks holsters) are expensive at around $112 for a base holster and thereâs a 22-30 week wait. 

Like the others said, thereâs no way to truly know what holster is going to work for you until you try it. Thatâs how you end up with a box full of holsters that you might use again somedayâ¦â¦

Chuck


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thank you Bearfootfarm for those links. Looking at one right now..









I like this one. I must admit to being drawn to the idea of wearing one slightly back of my hip so that it is covered more by my shirt. Less likely to be seen.

Apprecitate the photo Chuck..that is the position I am interested most in.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I know you have probably hashed all this out before, but it is interesting to read replies and fors and againsts certain carry positions. My initial instinct was to go for the middle of the back, as that is where I tuck it when roaming our property, but the warnings against back injury have made me hesitant to go there, even though it is my preferred place.

In the winter I wear t-shirts with an over shirt mainly, so prefer the hoslter to be to the back of my body.

Anyone else with photos? Ideas? suggestions? 


I really appreciate them all, as I dont want to end up with a box of holsters LOL, I hate spending money on me, and want to spend wisely.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Ideas? suggestions?


There are variations that put the gun either inside or outside your pants.
Some require a fairly sturdy belt

If you look at "paddle" holsters, they aren't *attached *to a belt, and can be quickly removed if it's uncomfortable to wear while driving

http://images.google.com/images?hl=...le+holsters&gbv=2&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=


You STILL might need a good belt to help support the weight


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Lots to think about...


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Lots to think about...


LOL 
You'd think it would be EASY to carry something so simple.
One good thing is it WILL be a lot easier once the weather turns cold


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

That's for sure!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I kind of like the idea of not having to wear a belt, so maybe the paddle holster would work.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Here's a couple I carry now and then.
A cheap pocket holster with a Kel Tec P3AT, and a Taurus PT111 in a Kholster.









Or my Glock in a paddle holster which conceals well with a cover garment, such as a baggy shirt or a jacket.


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## Old John (May 27, 2004)

I carry my Ruger GP100, 3", .357, in a "Simply Rugged" Holster. It's an open top Pancake Holster. These holsters need no thumb strap for retention. They stay right in there.I use the Sourdogh Pancake model for mine. I also have a "Simply Rugged" Silver-dollar Pancake Holster for my Ruger SP101.
I have used them for about 7 years. They are good sturdy, wearable Holsters.
You can't beat them. They make a great sturdy pistol belt too.
The link for them is:

http://www.simplyrugged.com/

Good Luck in finding "Just what you want".
I happily did.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I kind of like the idea of not having to wear a belt, so maybe the *paddle holster *would work.


You might *still* need a belt to help hold it in place when you draw, and to keep the weight of the gun from pulling on your pants too much.

It's hard to imtimidate the bad guy if your gun is still in the holster AFTER you draw


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Appreciate the input everyone. I don't want to have to undo a strap or something to be able to get to my gun. 

I am sure I will end up with more than one holster.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> You might *still* need a belt to help hold it in place when you draw, and to keep the weight of the gun from pulling on your pants too much.
> 
> It's hard to imtimidate the bad guy if your gun is still in the holster AFTER you draw


:hysterical: yeah, I can just see that happening!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I keep looking back at yours Chuck, and thinking that it looks like a very comfortable position for me. I like the fact that an overshirt would conceal it well, being further back.


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## Common Tator (Feb 19, 2008)

I have one of these fanny pack holsters. 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Nylon-Concealme...484?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19bf8f0c6c

It looks like a regular fanny pack, and has regular compartments for your other stuff, and a special compartment for the gun (which was tragically lost in a boating accident).


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hi Guys,
Heres a few places that specialize in concealment holsters, I hope this helps
Dutch



http://www.desantisholster.com/storefrontB2CWEB/browse.do?action=refresh_browse&ctg_id=6

http://www.theholsterstore.net/

http://www.comp-tac.com/product_info.php?products_id=95

http://www.miltsparks.com/

http://rgrizzleleather.com/


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I am looking at this.
http://www.bianchi-intl.com/product/Prod.php?TxtModelID=6

Does anyone prefer cross draw?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Does anyone prefer cross draw


Cross *draw* to me is MUCH more comfortable than a strong side draw, since you don't have to get your elbow so high.

It's not quite as comfortable a CARRY postition as small of the back, since it will limit how far you can bend forward. It's one of those things you'll just have to experiment with and see what works for YOU

One potential drawback to the suede holster is it will collapse when you take the gun out, so it will be harder to reholster than a preformed hard leather holster.

It WILL be a little more comfortable though

I had the big advantage of working in a gun shop for 6 years, and was able to try a LOT of different gun/holster/position combos without having to buy them first.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I like the small of the back carry, but what about the spine injury thing? 

I also think cross draw is less noticeable than having to shove your elbow high to get your gun. Think, arms folded scenaro.

Appreciate your input bearfootfarm.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

The real issue I have with small of the back is that depending on the holster, it may be nearly impossible to draw with you weak or support hand should you need to. An IWB holster worn at about 3:30 or 4:00 can be drawn with your weak hand. 

The other issue I have is that both SOB and cross draw holsters are banned from the matches I shoot in due to safety concerns. Both style of holster either allow the muzzle to sweep the shooters body or bystanders while drawing, so theyâre not allowed. For CCWing it really isnât a concern, but Iâm a believer in âtrain as you fightâ, so I use a similar setup for CCW as I do for matches. 

The reinforced holster mouth is another issue that some folks make a big deal about, but Iâm not 100% sure. 

All of my CCW holders have steel reinforce mouths that keep the holster from collapsing. Itâs for safety, no need to use your support hand to open the holster while your re-holstering, thereby keeping your hand clear from the muzzle. It also allows you a free hand while re-holstering for using a light etc.

Some folks think it's a big deal, others think there will be plenty of time after using the gun to re-holster it. 

Chuck


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## radiofish (Mar 30, 2007)

The question is not only what style holster to use, but what color leather holster? 
That and do you carry the same color magazine/ speed loader pouch?










After a while, one can be colored coordinated with your CCW activies...










I use Saddle Soap on my leather holsters for cleaning and maintaining the leather.

That and I always clean and maintain my CCW weapons everyday. 
I would hate for it to malfunction when needed, due to my being lazy!!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I do hope I can find the right holster before buying that many! LOL Color coordination is really not a concern, when it is going to be concealed anyway.


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## naturelover (Jun 6, 2006)

Obviously I can't advise you in any way on this since we don't do CCW up here but I wanted to ask under what circumstances would you be carrying concealed? Is it for everyday use, even around the home, or is it mainly for when you leave the house?

.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

everyday use.


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## radiofish (Mar 30, 2007)

Even sitting here at my computer I am wearing the black military issue M-7 (aviation/ tanker's) shoulder holster in the upper left of the top photo.. 

When you live in the boonies when going out the door one can be nose to nose with a bear, mountain lion, or tresspassers. All three have happened so far! Then a loaded weapon on the rifle rack inside the house is too far away. Plus I am usually armed while I am in town, running errands, and other activies. 
Unless it is an area that is prohibited by law: such as at a school, bar, jail, court, Federal Building, etc..

Those are just some of the holsters here.. I only pulled out one web gear pistol belt, none of the other military leather issue leather gear, and none of my western leather holsters for the GP-100 w/ 6" barrel revolvers.


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## naturelover (Jun 6, 2006)

Our Little Farm said:


> everyday use.


I have no idea how practical this idea would be for you. You like to sew, don't you? Is there any chance you could look at a variety of holster designs and then design something practical and comfortable from soft leather or lambskin to make for yourself, made to your own specifications? The only reason I mention it is because I'm reminded of when I was working as cook in homeless shelters and group homes and couldn't leave my assortment of chef's knives lying around where they could be stolen. I had to design my own knife holsters for carrying my chef's knives on my person when they weren't in use. I made them, handstitched, out of closely shorn lambskin and clipped onto a lambskin belt. The interior of the holsters were made of stiff cardboard or flexible but hard plastic. The lambskin was soft and comfortable to have against the body either under or over clothing. Also it is easy to wash. Just a thought.

Congratulations on getting your CCW. :thumb:

.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

radiofish said:


> The question is not only what style holster to use, but what color leather holster?
> That and do you carry the same color magazine/ speed loader pouch?
> 
> 
> ...


I'd make fun of your pile o holsters if I didn't have a big pile of my own. 
Nice looking pile though...........
Is that a P38 I see there?
Been trying to make a deal on a P38 myself (AC-45)


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I hope this holster collecting thing is not catching....LOL


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Good thought naturelover, but right now I am looking to purchase.


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## naturelover (Jun 6, 2006)

Our Little Farm said:


> Good thought naturelover, but right now I am looking to purchase.


Yeah, I understand that. Keep in mind the lambskin idea as a potential "_comfort sock_" you can make to fit over the holster you purchase, especially if it has to be in contact with your skin. Like I said, it's easy to wash if you get sweat or dirt on it.

.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

As a NC DOJ certified firearms instructor, I will throw in my 2 cents even though I am certainly a new member to the forums. (1) Congrat's on getting your CCW. (2) Unfortunately the holster collecting thing is catchy. It will take you trying different holsters and wearing them to figure out what fits you and your needs best.

It has been covered here in past post, try to avoid a cross draw holster. Anytime the gun has to sweep your body, you are putting your own life at risk. Practise, practise, practise!!! with the holster and gun that you plan to carry. If it is a pain in the rear to unholster the weapon on the range, imagine when you lose dexterity and have tunnel vision and your heart rate is through the ROOF! You won't be able to do it and you will die with your gun in your fancy fanny pack holster or whatever other complicated holster you can think of.

Lt. Col. Dave Grossman and PPCT founder, Bruce Siddle have this research group called "Killology", it is very much worth reading. It gives you some percpectives into how your body will react, why muscle memory is imperative, things of that nature. They basically looking at killing and break it down into a science that can be studied.

Best of luck in your choice, and remember to carry everyday if you carry one day!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Welcome to HT lawman! I do plan on carrying everyday, just trying to figure out where to carry. Seems like it can take a long time to find a holster/position that works for folk.

What holster position/type do you recommend? I am a female if that matters.


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## hillbillygal (Jan 16, 2008)

Great thread. I have a holster that I hate right now. We bought it when I bought my gun and it's the one dh insisted was better. I've complained about it so much that he's agreed to let me buy another one. We should have taken our time and tried on several. I'd like to get a crossbreed for Christmas but the bianchi you linked to earlier seemed like a good one to try out.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Hillbillygal, what kind of holster do you have now that you hate so much?


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## hillbillygal (Jan 16, 2008)

The tag on it says Bulldog. It's too bulky. Impossible to conceal. It's for outside the pant and there's just no concealing it. Plus, the adjustments I made with the spacing tool included to make the draw secure and comfortable won't stay set. When the adjustment works loose, it takes too long to undo the safety strap over the top. When it's set perfectly it's okay because I can release the strap with one thumb but like I said it won't stay set and tight.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thanks. It's nice to know what does not work for others. I would rather not spend my money on something that I wont use/like.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Our Little Farm said:


> Welcome to HT lawman! I do plan on carrying everyday, just trying to figure out where to carry. Seems like it can take a long time to find a holster/position that works for folk.
> 
> What holster position/type do you recommend? I am a female if that matters.


 I am a sucker for a pistol worn on the hip. I also do not recommend covering the gun with much more than a light coat/shirt. Again, this all will play an important role when you meet the "wolves" and mere seconds will be the difference between you going home or them having sheep for dinner. Galco makes some pretty good holsters for concealed carry. I would look into some form of Paddle back holster if you plan on running into the bank, schools, etc on a regular basis during the day. This way you can take your gun off and stow it away with little problems. If it becomes a headache to remove your holster/gun, you will likely opt to not carry on xx day so you can avoid the hassle.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Our Little Farm said:


> Welcome to HT lawman! I do plan on carrying everyday, just trying to figure out where to carry. Seems like it can take a long time to find a holster/position that works for folk.
> 
> What holster position/type do you recommend? I am a female if that matters.


 Btw, thanks for the welcome!


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## oldasrocks (Oct 27, 2006)

[ It has been covered here in past post, try to avoid a cross draw holster. 
Best of luck in your choice, and remember to carry everyday if you carry one day![/QUOTE]

I disagree. I carry a .45 in a shoulder holster. Very comfortable and easy to draw. I've only had to pull a weapon once. One night in Denver a guy pulled a knife on me. He had stepped out of the shadows. Before he could blink I pulled my weapon and told him to go away. He did. I guess I should have asked for his billfold? He asked for mine.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

oldasrocks said:


> [ It has been covered here in past post, try to avoid a cross draw holster.
> Best of luck in your choice, and remember to carry everyday if you carry one day!


I disagree. I carry a .45 in a shoulder holster. Very comfortable and easy to draw. I've only had to pull a weapon once. One night in Denver a guy pulled a knife on me. He had stepped out of the shadows. Before he could blink I pulled my weapon and told him to go away. He did. I guess I should have asked for his billfold? He asked for mine.[/QUOTE]


In general a cross draw is not a wise decision. Anytime your gun must sweep your body you are putting yourself at risk. I could run you through a number of failure drills with your cross draw and make you reconsider your choice. After that, it is just that.. your choice. I would dare to say that I spend 200+ hours a year on the firing range teaching Officers across the state. I have seen every fancy holster on the market and I always (ALWAYS) make it a point to do a failure drill on them. Same with Ankle holster's, etc.

They certianly have their place, but in general everyday carry you are setting yourself up for death with your gun still in your holster. I am sorry no one has ever bothered to show you the weaknesses of such holsters.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

lawman0252 said:


> It has been covered here in past post, try to avoid a cross draw holster. Anytime the gun has to sweep your body, you are putting your own life at risk. Practise, practise, practise!!! with the holster and gun that you plan to carry.
> Best of luck in your choice, and remember to carry everyday if you carry one day!


Agreed, and here&#8217;s another good reason to avoid the crossdraw and shoulder holsters is that if you ever have a need to fire from &#8220;retention&#8221; at contact distance you may never get the chance due to the required movements to use either of these holsters.

Both of these holsters require the shooter to sweep across his or her body to draw and again to put the weapon into action. IF this is required at &#8220;contact&#8221; distance it&#8217;s easier for a perpetrator to interrupt or stop completely the draw.

Whereas with a strong side holster there&#8217;s no sweeping motion involved. As long as you use a proper draw technique IE not &#8220;Bowling&#8221;: (bringing the gun up as if you&#8217;re rolling a bowling ball) the draw is a pretty compact set of motions all made close to your body.

Here&#8217;s a decent pictorial:

http://www.wikihow.com/Do-a-Tactical-Quickdraw-With-a-Pistol

As you can see from step 3 onward the weapon is ready for use at contact distance. There&#8217;s no sweeping across the body, and the entire draw is done with the weapon and hands close to your body. At no time does the muzzle cross your body and due to the shorter range of movements there&#8217;s a lesser chance of them being interrupted. A quick twist of my strong side upper body and I can keep my strong side away from an opponent while drawing. 

IMHO the goal should be to be able to put the weapon into action as quickly as possible with the least amount of complicated movements. 

Chuck


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

How about some of you people still searching for the right holster do some trading with your wrong holsters? What one might love, another will hate, so it could be a cheaper way to try more models.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thank you Chuck. 

Good point Ed. If anyone has a holster similar to the one I posted I would be interested in buying it.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Iâve already sold/traded some off, but hereâs a couple Iâm willing to trade/sell:

SIG 230-232 Galco SOB Brown (Yup, I tried a SOB holster once, itâs like new, didnât like the concept)

http://www.copsplus.com/prodnum1877.php

SIG 230-232 Ted Blocker IWB Brown

http://www.tedblockerholsters.com/product.cfm?pi=5CB82F6B-EC2D-4A11-0EE368C82AE30EAA

1911 5â RH Bianchi Accumold Black

http://www.bianchi-intl.com/product/Prod.php?TxtModelID=7001

I've also got a SIG P6 Issue Holster and magazine carrier if anybody's interested. 

Unfortunately like most holsters they're make/model specific. The others I have, I use as range holsters. 

Chuck


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> In general a cross draw is not a wise decision. Anytime your gun must *sweep your body *you are putting yourself at risk.





> Both of these holsters require the shooter to *sweep across his or her body *


I don't see how you're figuring that at all, unless you're talking about a right handed person carrying BEHIND the back on the LEFT side.

When I think of "crossdraw", I picture the holster in FRONT, on the weak side with the butt facing forward, and there is NO WAY you would "sweep your body" from *that *position.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I don't see how you're figuring that at all, unless you're talking about a right handed person carrying BEHIND the back on the LEFT side.
> 
> When I think of "crossdraw", I picture the holster in FRONT, on the weak side with the butt facing forward, and there is NO WAY you would "sweep your body" from *that *position.


When I think of typical crossdraw, I picture a weapon carried at the 10:00 position with the butt forward for oposite stronghand draw. IE left side for a right hand draw. 

What you're describing to me sounds like a modified appendix carry, which is a strong arm holster carried in front at about the 1:00 position. 

When you carry your crosswdraw way, where is the muzzle?

Chuck


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

I don't see how you mean they sweep the body either. This is how I picture a crossdraw holster:


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Ed Norman said:


> I don't see how you mean they sweep the body either. This is how I picture a crossdraw holster:


What I mean is the firing hand crossing in front of your body to draw the weapon, then bringing back across to fire. Depending on the position of the holster, the muzzle may or may not cross your body. 

IMHO it's a longer movement to get the weapon into action and if you must fire from a position of retention the weapon must be brought across your body to shoot unless your opponent is standing behind you. There's no way to draw, rotate the gun, and fire at a contact distance. 

If it works for you than that's really all that matters. I can't train that way, so for me it doesn't. 

Chuck


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Guy's, I have been around guns my entire life and have been a certified firearms instructor for 10 years now. I do not consider myself an expert of any sort, nor am I "the baddest" dude around. I have seen ----ing matches over what brand gun shoots best, what holsters work best, etc. 

If you think your cross draw shoulder holster is the best solution for you, more power to you. I know the limitations and have seen them all to well. If you have a free afternoon I would be glad to embarrass your cross draw holster on the firing range, free of charge! She asked what the best holster for concealed carry is, for a female is she going to walk around wearing a "hawaiin shirt" during the summer? Also females have these things called "breast". depending on how gifted she is, this could certainly be an issue with a gun stuck between her arm and breast. I personally have a issue with the safety factor of a cross draw. To put it in perspective, cops tend to buy everything that is "tacticool" just to say " I have it". How many do you think out of 100's of officers carry cross draws off duty, or even on duty? I can't name a single one..

In the end, she will get what suits her just fine and you will wear what suits you just fine. Unfortunately most of us (myself included) will find out the hard way that something doesn't quite work or "If I only had of". As a new CCW holder, she should be concentrating on her shooting more than the holster she is wearing. It is something we hope to never use, but can't afford to go without. Weapon retention and firearm safety is a big stickler, most ranges wouldn't let her use a cross draw holster to begin with as she would be sweeping everyone on the line and even those standing behind her. A book could be written about gun selection and holster selection, she will have to do her homework to find what is good for her.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Lawman. How do you know how much shooting experience I have? Just because I am a new CCW holder does not mean I don't have any expereince, and how about talking to me and not about me. This is a polite forum.

Chuck, thank you for your clarification. Makes sense.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

My only problem with the crossdraw talk was about the gun sweeping the wearer's body. It doesn't. Reaching an arm across to draw is not sweeping, that is reaching for the grip. 

And I'm very wide shouldered and can't reach a crossdraw, it isn't best for me either.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Ed Norman said:


> My only problem with the crossdraw talk was about the gun sweeping the wearer's body. It doesn't. Reaching an arm across to draw is not sweeping, that is reaching for the grip.
> 
> And I'm very wide shouldered and can't reach a crossdraw, it isn't best for me either.


 LOL, well I guess if you want to give it a new name then it just didn't happen huh? What do you think happens once your hand hits the grip and you have to pull the gun back across your body in a sweeping motion?


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## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

Lawman,I'm thinking that the thought is that the muzzle would be pointing toward the body in a sweep, not moving perpendicularly as it come back across. 
Ed


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

whiterock said:


> Lawman,I'm thinking that the thought is that the muzzle would be pointing toward the body in a sweep, not moving perpendicularly as it come back across.
> Ed


Gotcha... I have heard that is well, guess we had different ideas of "sweeping".


As for Our little farm, I was not trying to be rude.. you sure didn't sound entirely to polite either, I will leave that one alone.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

> As a new CCW holder, she should be concentrating on her shooting more than the holster she is wearing.


I fight back when being spoken _about_ like this.

Like I said, you don't know me.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

lawman0252 said:


> LOL, well I guess if you want to give it a new name then it just didn't happen huh? What do you think happens once your hand hits the grip and you have to pull the gun back across your body in a sweeping motion?


If the muzzle is pointing at your body when you pull the gun back across your body, you must have your thumb in the trigger guard or very long arms. You crossdraw, the gun comes out, and the muzzle makes a left to right motion always away from you and nearing your target. It never points at you.

I've played all the gun games in the past, PPC, IPSC, falling plate matches, bullseye, bowling pin shoots, silhouette, etc. I understand the need for safety to spectators and the reason crossdraw isn't allowed. But in defense, it has a place. I see you are in NC. Try wearing a long parka in a blizzard and using your favorite holster up high on your right hip. You'll be hiking up parka like granny lifting her dress to wade a creek. Reaching in the zipper to crossdraw works then. 

Sweeping is painting an area with the muzzle, not reaching for the handle of a weapon.


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Our Little Farm said:


> I fight back when being spoken _about_ like this.


Wow, your kidding right???

That is not even close to being an insult, EVERYONE needs to concentrate on shooting more than what holster it comes out of! I am on the range 200+ hours a year, I still wished I had more time shooting! Either you mislead us with your real world carry expierence by asking a novice question, or it just struck a wrong cord with you. I can't apologize for your high level of sensitivity and calling me rude by answering honestly. I sure hope this isn't a sign of how most people act around here, (edit).


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

So in your theroy no one should be concerned about finding the right holster, but should be out on the range all the time instead. 

You assume I have no experience just because I just got my CCW permit, and need to be on the range instead of looking at CC holsters.

HUH?


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Our Little Farm said:


> Are you a troll?


Come on now, are you kidding me?? You can't be serious!


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## lawman0252 (Sep 26, 2010)

Our Little Farm said:


> So in your theroy no one should be concerned about finding the right holster, but should be out on the range all the time instead.
> 
> HUH?


I never said that, but whatever you decide on is good with me. Best of luck.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

lawman0252 said:


> Wow, your kidding right???
> 
> That is not even close to being an insult, EVERYONE needs to concentrate on shooting more than what holster it comes out of! I am on the range 200+ hours a year, I still wished I had more time shooting! Either you mislead us with your real world carry expierence by asking a novice question, or it just struck a wrong cord with you. I can't apologize for your high level of sensitivity and calling me rude by answering honestly. I sure hope this isn't a sign of how most people act around here, (edit).


What novice question did I ask?


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

lawman0252 said:


> Guy's, I have been around guns my entire life and have been a certified firearms instructor for 10 years now. I do not consider myself an expert of any sort, nor am I "the baddest" dude around. I have seen ----ing matches over what brand gun shoots best, what holsters work best, etc.
> 
> If you think your cross draw shoulder holster is the best solution for you, more power to you. I know the limitations and have seen them all to well. If you have a free afternoon I would be glad to embarrass your cross draw holster on the firing range, free of charge! She asked what the best holster for concealed carry is, for a female is she going to walk around wearing a "hawaiin shirt" during the summer? Also females have these things called "breast". depending on how gifted she is, this could certainly be an issue with a gun stuck between her arm and breast. I personally have a issue with the safety factor of a cross draw. To put it in perspective, cops tend to buy everything that is "tacticool" just to say " I have it". How many do you think out of 100's of officers carry cross draws off duty, or even on duty? I can't name a single one..
> 
> In the end, she will get what suits her just fine and you will wear what suits you just fine. Unfortunately most of us (myself included) will find out the hard way that something doesn't quite work or "If I only had of". *As a new CCW holder, she should be concentrating on her shooting more than the holster she is wearing. *It is something we hope to never use, but can't afford to go without. Weapon retention and firearm safety is a big stickler, most ranges wouldn't let her use a cross draw holster to begin with as she would be sweeping everyone on the line and even those standing behind her. A book could be written about gun selection and holster selection, she will have to do her homework to find what is good for her.


You wrote this right?


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I believe strongly and have for years that practice is VERY important. But it is also important to have the right CC holster now that I have my permit. Hence my thread.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

lawman0252 said:


> Come on now, are you kidding me?? You can't be serious!


Nope, that is why I deleted that post.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

lawman0252 said:


> Wow, your kidding right???
> 
> That is not even close to being an insult, EVERYONE needs to concentrate on shooting more than what holster it comes out of! I am on the range 200+ hours a year, I still wished I had more time shooting! Either you mislead us with your real world carry expierence by asking a novice question, or it just struck a wrong cord with you. I can't apologize for your high level of sensitivity and calling me rude by answering honestly.* I sure hope this isn't a sign of how most people act around here, (edit).*




actually most of the posters here talk TO/WITH each other and not ABOUT each other.

Also, please take some time getting to know us, and us you before you get all expert and judgemental. And I'm sure this group will get to know you, and learn if your information bear merit in their situations.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Ed Norman said:


> Try wearing a long parka in a blizzard and using your favorite holster up high on your right hip. You'll be hiking up parka like granny lifting her dress to wade a creek. Reaching in the zipper to crossdraw works then.
> 
> Sweeping is painting an area with the muzzle, not reaching for the handle of a weapon.


You're right on the definition of sweeping, poor wording on my part. 

Sweeping back the cover-garment as part of the strong side draw does work. If the parka is unzipped then the strong-side holster might be slightly slower, but it&#8217;s still viable. Go with an IWB holster; slide it FWD to the 3:00 position, and your weapons butt isn't near the height of the highride style belt holsters. My Sparks puts my rear sight slightly above my belt line. 

Is it ideal? No, but this is where training comes in. 

IF the parka is zipped, then neither holster style works well, but that's an example of poor situational awareness.

The problem with this as I see it is the cross draw is a lateral version of the "bowling" draw stroke of drawing and bringing a gun up into a target, as compared to drawing, rotating, and pushing outward towards the target (4 Count). If you're opponent is close enough to stop an outward pushing, there's a good chance the muzzle is in the correct direction to hit the target anyway, and you fire from retention or any other portion of the 4 count presentation. That&#8217;s the beauty of the 4 count draw from a strong side holster, at count 2 the muzzle is towards the target. 

IMO, any time the weapon and firing hand moves away from your body you increase the chance of having that motion interrupted. The quicker it&#8217;s pointed towards the target the better.

Another valid reason for sticking with a strong side holster is that the majority of the training and instructors available are geared that way. It&#8217;s kind of like taking a carbine class with something other than an AR platform, many of the drills are geared towards that weapon. With something else, you may not get the full benefit of the instructors knowledge. I've taken 5 combat pistol classes in the last 4 years, and every one spent time on a proper strong side draw. 

I don't have any idea how many steps there are in a cross-draw, if it mirrors the standard 4 count, then it will be either a long 2 step as the pistol is drawn and moved left to right, or there's added steps to bring the muzzle in line with the target. 

Thoughts?

Chuck


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> When I think of typical crossdraw, I picture a weapon carried at the 10:00 position with the butt forward for oposite stronghand draw. IE left side for a right hand draw.


Just like Ed pictured



> Depending on the position of the holster, the muzzle may or may not cross your body.


There is NO WAY the muzzle will sweep your body unless you WANT it to.
You'd have to point your *elbow *at the target to make the gun point at YOU


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Just like Ed pictured
> 
> There is NO WAY the muzzle will sweep your body unless you WANT it to.
> You'd have to point your *elbow *at the target to make the gun point at YOU


So, you're saying it's impossible to sweep your body with a crossdraw holster? 

Chuck


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> If you think your cross draw shoulder holster


No one specified* shoulder *holster until YOU did

The only term used was "cross draw" and all her comments had been about paddle or waist band holsters

Let's don't change the parameters now LOL



> What do you think happens once your hand hits the grip and you have to pull the gun back across your body in a sweeping motion?


We all know "sweeping" refers to *pointing the MUZZLE*, and not moving the entire weapon.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> So, you're saying it's impossible to sweep your body with a crossdraw holster?


Nothing is "impossible" but you'd have to be pretty uncoordinated to do it since it wouldnt be a "natural" movement to point the muzzle at yourself.

Youd have to raise your elbow and move it forward, which is the opposite of what you should be doing.

If you guys are sweeping yourselves, you really need to think about and PRACTICE your technique


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

lawman0252 said:


> Guy's, I have been around guns my entire life and have been a certified firearms instructor for 10 years now. I do not consider myself an expert of any sort, nor am I "the baddest" dude around. I have seen ----ing matches over what brand gun shoots best, what holsters work best, etc.
> 
> *If you think your cross draw shoulder holster is the best solution for you, more power to you.* I know the limitations and have seen them all to well. If you have a free afternoon I would be glad to embarrass your cross draw holster on the firing range, free of charge! She asked what the best holster for concealed carry is, for a female is she going to walk around wearing a "hawaiin shirt" during the summer? Also females have these things called "breast". depending on how gifted she is, this could certainly be an issue with a gun stuck between her arm and breast. I personally have a issue with the safety factor of a cross draw. To put it in perspective, cops tend to buy everything that is "tacticool" just to say " I have it". How many do you think out of 100's of officers carry cross draws off duty, or even on duty? I can't name a single one..
> 
> In the end, she will get what suits her just fine and you will wear what suits you just fine. Unfortunately most of us (myself included) will find out the hard way that something doesn't quite work or "If I only had of". As a new CCW holder, she should be concentrating on her shooting more than the holster she is wearing. It is something we hope to never use, but can't afford to go without. Weapon retention and firearm safety is a big stickler, most ranges wouldn't let her use a cross draw holster to begin with as she would be sweeping everyone on the line and even those standing behind her. A book could be written about gun selection and holster selection, she will have to do her homework to find what is good for her.


Not once did I mention a shoulder holster, as Bearfootfarm kindly pointed out.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Nothing is "impossible" but you'd have to be pretty uncoordinated to do it since it wouldnt be a "natural" movement to point the muzzle at yourself.
> 
> Youd have to raise your elbow and move it forward, which is the opposite of what you should be doing.
> 
> If you guys are sweeping yourselves, you really need to think about and PRACTICE your technique


This is how I picture it. I cannot fathom how you would end up with the muzzle pointing at your body. 

It just does not make sense to me. 

But to be honest, I am looking more towards the inside waistband holsters right now. I really appreciate all your help and advice. I will be looking at some when I head to the range this week.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Our Little Farm said:


> I am looking at this.
> http://www.bianchi-intl.com/product/Prod.php?TxtModelID=6
> 
> Does anyone prefer cross draw?


Bianchi is one of the top US holster manufacturers, so you shouldn't have any problem with the quality of that holster. The Bianchi clip is extremely strong...read "hard"...to open. That's good from a security aspect, it's just harder to slide on and off the waistband/belt.

I like to wear an IWB holster inside my pocket. The clip attaches to outside of my jean's pocket and it's high enough to be concealed by a T-shirt or vest. The handgun's grip rides above the pocket. This style of "pocket carry" is a very comfortable carry location for me and an easy location to draw from. So, if you get this holster, you may want to try it "pocket carry" if you don't like it on your hip.

Here are the other holsters I use depending on which handgun I want to carry and what I'm wearing:


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Appreciate that Cabin Fever. 

Do you know a good site online that sells the Bianchi holster I am interested in?


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Our Little Farm said:


> Appreciate that Cabin Fever.
> 
> Do you know a good site online that sells the Bianchi holster I am interested in?


MidwayUSA

OpticsPlanet

I've purchased various items from both suppliers and have been very satisfied.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Another valid reason for sticking with a strong side holster is that *the majority of the training and instructors available are geared that way*


LOL

That's the WORST reason to do anything.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> LOL, well I guess if you want to give it *a new name *then it just didn't happen huh?


There's nothing "new" about what "sweep" means in relation to firearms and in THIS context.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Cabin Fever said:


> MidwayUSA
> 
> OpticsPlanet
> 
> I've purchased various items from both suppliers and have been very satisfied.


Thank you.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> *I don't have any idea how many steps there are in a cross-draw*, if it mirrors the standard 4 count, then it will be either a long 2 step as the pistol is drawn and moved left to right, or there's added steps to bring the muzzle in line with the target.


The motions are no longer or slower with a PROPERLY EXECUTED crossdraw than they are with a "normal" strongside draw

In a "normal" draw, when you grip the gun, your elbow is pointed AWAY from your body.
The next move brings it back in CLOSE to your body, and the gun is then pointed forward towards the target

In a PROPERLY EXECUTED crossdraw, when you grip the gun, your elbow will ALREADY be close to your right hip, and doesn't have to move any farther out from your body..
Concievably, you could simply bend your WRIST and have the gun pointed forward without ever moving your arm more than a few inches.

With a little actual *PRACTICE*, I think you'll see it's not only much more *comfortable*, but can be MUCH FASTER than a strongside draw.

It's also easier to move clothing out of the way with the LEFT hand (assuming a right handed shooter) on the LEFT side, than to try and move it with your LEFT hand on the "strong" side, or trying to do both NECESSARY actions with one hand

At "contact distances", you never have to move the gun away from your body at all to have it pointing forward, since you can keep it close by simply moving your elbow to the rear OR by* rotatiing your torso *instead of trying to adopt some sort of "aiming stance"


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## radiofish (Mar 30, 2007)

Wow I spend Sunday night watching "Dragnet" on Retro TV out of the SF Bay Area, and miss out on all of this 'fun' concerning CCW holsters and firearms safety....

I believe I was the 1st person to mention shoulder holsters. That is what I would wear for CCW carry with a parka zipped up in the frozen North.. In fact that is how I usually carry a CCW weapon, when I go to Detroit over the Holidays.

Now for the 'sweeping' comments. 
To me that denotes poor muzzle direction control!! 
As in pulling the weapon from an off side holster, and 'sweeping' the area in front of you as you present the weapon to the fire position, at waist/ chest level with it's muzzle. I am wondering how one would wind up with the muzzle pointed at one's self, while drawing your CCW from that position? Even with a revolver that has a 2 inch barrel..

Now I may not be a certifed law enforcement instructor, but the Marine Corps had taught me a thing or three concerning weapon safety.

Part of CCW carry is obtaining a correct and comfortable holster/ carry method. If it is uncomfortable, then it tends to be left at home!!

Then there is also the issue of acquiring range time, in order to be able to accurately and safetly fire your weapon. Besides one standing at the line firing at will at a stationary target, from a known distance while all calm. I train to fire while walking backwards, sideways, from different positions (standing, kneeling, sitting, prone, on my back, and laying on my side), using my dominant and non-dominant hand, from behind cover, rapid-fire, and other ways to make it as realistic as possible.

I found out that one of the local sporting goods stores here, does carry/ can order Bianchi items..


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

> Part of CCW carry is obtaining a correct and comfortable holster/ carry method.


Totally agree, hence my original post!


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Iâll address these one at a time, then Iâm done.



Bearfootfarm said:


> Nothing is "impossible" but you'd have to be pretty uncoordinated to do it since it wouldnt be a "natural" movement to point the muzzle at yourself. Youd have to raise your elbow and move it forward, which is the opposite of what you should be doing.
> 
> If you guys are sweeping yourselves, you really need to think about and PRACTICE your technique


IF you start out with a holster (I donât care what kind) worn close to the body all it takes is 5-10 degrees of wrist cant to âsweepâ part of your body with the muzzle during either your draw or re-holstering. 

I actually tried this last night using a CAS crossdraw holster that I competed with for about 5 years. Itâs not impossible, and it doesnât take any kind of âunnaturalâ movement, and at no time did my elbow leave my body. I could do it pretty easily, especially when keeping my eyes on a target while re-holstering. At no time did my elbow have to be raised; only a slight canting of my wrist was sufficient. It happens with a strong side holster too, as a RSO for IDPA I see shooters do it often; I think itâs easier for me to do it with a crossdraw holster. 

BUT, it may be that I havenât developed the âTerminatorâ like skeletal control that you have. 



> Another valid reason for sticking with a strong side holster is that the majority of the training and instructors available are geared that way





Bearfootfarm said:


> LOL That's the WORST reason to do anything.


Iâll spell it out for you. When people pay money for instruction, they generally want to get the most from it. Some of the professional instructors have spent years doing this under various venues as compared to discussing on the internet. The majority Iâve seen train the strong side holster draw and retention techniques. When you arrive at a class with something different, you will not benefit from that experience. That is not an area they have prioritized theyâre training for and they will not have time to spend with the guy or gal that wants to be âdifferentâ. Some instructiors will not allow a cross-draw holster in their classes, so you'd end up receiving training and carrying a using a different method. 

Again, this probably doesnât apply to you. 



Bearfootfarm said:


> In a PROPERLY EXECUTED crossdraw, when you grip the gun, your elbow will ALREADY be close to your right hip, and doesn't have to move any farther out from your body..Concievably, you could simply bend your WRIST and have the gun pointed forward without ever moving your arm more than a few inches. With a little actual *PRACTICE*, I think you'll see it's not only much more *comfortable*, but can be MUCH FASTER than a strongside draw.


Except with a crossdraw, the muzzle starts out pointing close to 180-100 degrees from the target. 

Thereâs no way to simply rotate your wrist to compensate for this. Something must turn, either your firing hand moves right to left after you draw, or you rotate your body left to right thereby putting your weak side towards the target. Maybe you practice "crab-walk" and move sideways. Itâs an extra step, and it isnât faster. Crossdraws went out of fashion for competition before they were banned simply based on speed. Most start positions require you to start with your hands by your sides or over our shoulders. 



Bearfootfarm said:


> At "contact distances", you never have to move the gun away from your body at all to have it pointing forward, since you can keep it close by simply moving your elbow to the rear OR by* rotatiing your torso *instead of trying to adopt some sort of "aiming stance"


Thatâs provided you ever get the chance to rotate your torso. 

At contact distance (arms length or closer) when squared to an opponent:

First the crosdraw fan is faced with the potential retention issue of having his loaded weapon butt first to his opponent. 

Second he/she then has to either move his drawing hand right to left to get a grip, then draw and either move the weapon right to left, or twist his torso strong side away from the opponent, or a combination of the two. No matter how you do it, the muzzle has to be brought into line with the target, with a cross draw most of the movement is in front of your body. 

Donât believe me, take the time to read this, itâs just another professional instructor/LEO though: 

http://www.policeone.com/police-pro...ody-concealment-holsters-for-female-officers/



> The bad thing (not really the end of the world as long as it is recognized) is the fact that the muzzle-to-the-rear / gripframe-to-the-front orientation does present the butt of the gun to anyone standing in front of the wearer. Situational awareness and functional knowledge of the basic concepts of gun retention can go a long way to minimize this issue but there are other matters as well.
> 
> One of them is the drawstroke. This series does not, and cannot, serve as a primer on âtechniquesâ when it comes to the drawing and firing of a weapon. However, while it can be seen that the steps for doing so are basically the same for both holsters, the production of a firearm from a crossdraw model does involve some different thinking than is used when employing a strong side design. As a result, in addition to the gun grab situation just mentioned, there is also a âgun pinningâ issue that needs to be mentioned here.
> 
> ...


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Appreciate the input from either side on cross draw holsters. I have never used them so have no experience.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Some of the professional instructors have spent years doing this under various venues as compared to discussing on the internet


Don't *assume* to know what others have *experienced* just because they post something on a forum



> IF you start out with a holster (I don&#8217;t care what kind) worn close to the body all it takes is 5-10 degrees of wrist cant to &#8220;sweep&#8221; part of your body with the muzzle during either your draw or re-holstering.


I never said it wasn't "possible" to do it. That's been discussed already, and doesn't prove your theory that crossdraw is inherently more dangerous. 

In fact, a little "wrist cant" from a strong side holster will sweep MORE of your body than a crossdraw could



> especially when *keeping my eyes on a target *while re-holstering.


In a defense situation you *don't reholster *if there is still a target.
You can't blame the *method* for YOUR* inattentiveness*



> Except with a crossdraw, the muzzle starts out pointing close to 180-100 degrees from the target.





> There&#8217;s no way to simply rotate your wrist to compensate for this


Most strong side holsters are angled with the muzzle towards the rear also.
Once the muzzle clears the hoslter in a crossdraw, most folks can move their wrists almost 90 degrees without moving the arm.

It's FAR easier to bend your wrist AWAY from your body than it is TOWARDS you body.



> It&#8217;s an extra step, and it isn&#8217;t faster. Crossdraws went out of fashion* for competition *before they were banned simply based on speed. Most start positions require you to start with your hands by your sides or over our shoulders.


There are no "extra steps" and we aren't discussing "competition"
Crossdraw isn't allowed in competition because the muzzle is not pointed downrange or at the ground when drawn. It has nothing to do with "speed" and even less to do with *this topic*




> Don&#8217;t believe me, take the time to read this, it&#8217;s just another *professional* instructor/LEO though:





> is certainly *possible* to have someone prevent you from drawing and acquiring the target from any holster


There are "possibilities" and "probabilities".
"Professional" simply means you *get paid*. It doesnt mean you're correct or unbiased.
LEO training is geared towards vastly different situations than most *personal* self defense and *concealed* carry.

It's all in the PROPER technique.


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## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

I'm thinking that most instructors are LEOs, are instructing LEOs, that commonly carry openly on strong side, and that affects their training and preferences to concealed carry as that is what they are accustomed to.

In an open carry on the place, with long barrel single action or dbl action revolvers, I find it is much easier using a cross draw as it puts it out of the way of strong hand during normal tasks, allows it to hang comfortably to the side in the truck beside the seat along the door, allows access easier if in a sitting position. For a smaller framed concealed carry revolver, or semi auto, physical properties of the weapon make a difference in the "feel" of a strong side carry.

In concealed carry, shoulder or cross draw allows surreptious access to weapon, as the movement of the arm is more natural, and in cases where heavy clothing is worn, far easier to achieve than in strong side carry.

It still comes down to what is most comfortable, natural to the individual, and accessible under the conditions. Size, build, physical limitations, type and style of weapon and holster, and clothing worn will all have a bearing on what is best for individual situations.

If it ain't comfortable to wear and accessible to the individual, they probably ain't gonna wear it.

Ed


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Very interesting article that covers most of the things discussed here so far:



> The Case for Crossdraw Holsters For Concealed Carry
> by R.K. Campbell





> Robert K. Campbell has a background of over twenty years in law enforcement as a trainer, weapons tester, and a street cop. He is one of the most prolific writers today on the subject of fighting weapons. He has been published in most of the better publications dealing with fighting firearms and edged weapons


http://www.gunweek.com/2005/feature0101.html


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## badlander (Jun 7, 2009)

naturelover said:


> Obviously I can't advise you in any way on this since we don't do CCW up here but I wanted to ask under what circumstances would you be carrying concealed? Is it for everyday use, even around the home, or is it mainly for when you leave the house?
> 
> .


I am female. I have a ccw permit from Utah, I carry 24/7 for personal and property protection. 

As for holsters. I have a S&W snubbie in 38 special. The holster I got for it came from Don Hume leather holsters. I like to wear it for a cross draw and I too like to wear t-shirts and jeans, which makes it harder to conceal unless I am wearing a loose shirt over the t-shirt or a hoody. My husband cringes when I carry it in my concealed carry purse. I'm petite and it wouldn't be hard to get that bag away from me. Bye bye purse, credit cards, money and concealed carry weapon. I wouldn't recommend purse carry for any woman unless you have a back up weapon in the form of a black belt.

Don Hume has a great variety of holsters and they are beautifully made with high quality leather. Can't recommend them high enough.

My favorite CCW weapon is my Ruger LCP in 380. I carry it in believe it or not, a cell phone holder on my belt. Looks innocent, inconspicuous and completely concealed. Bulldog makes this holster and since I am short waisted it is the most comfortable holster I own. 

The belly bands work. If you go this route get one that is a little looser. If you get one too tight by the end of the day you feel like you have been wearing a too tight girdle. I can't wait to rip it off (yeah, I made the mistake of getting one that matched my waist measurement):hrm:

I think most people gather quite a collection of holsters finding the one that is just 'right' for them. Like said here on this thread. Find one that is comfortable for you so you will want to carry your concealed weapon and when you do find that one just right, practice, practice, practice drawing from it and firing until you are comfortable with it and proficient.

Good luck!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thank you badlander!


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## hillbillygal (Jan 16, 2008)

badlander said:


> My favorite CCW weapon is my Ruger LCP in 380. I carry it in believe it or not, a cell phone holder on my belt. Looks innocent, inconspicuous and completely concealed. Bulldog makes this holster and since I am short waisted it is the most comfortable holster I own.


I know someone else who has a holster that looks like a cell phone or pda holder. It looks great and I'd like to find one to fit my gun as well. That's one I'm keeping an eye out for. I'm another who is normally in jeans and a t shirt so it's hard to cover much.


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## badlander (Jun 7, 2009)

Here is the cell phone holster that Bulldog makes.

http://www.bulldogcases.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=256

I wear mine on the right side as I am a right draw. I do not cross draw with this holster. My LCP is placed in the holder so that the butt of the weapon is 'up' and facing forward with the muzzle pointing behind me. That way, I reach down pretty much as the pictures show and draw the weapon. I think I paid about 14 dollars for mine at a local gun shop and it was the best 14 dollars I ever spent on holsters. It comes in several different colors and fits Taurus TCP, Ruger LCP, Keltec 380 pistols. I've worn it in restaurants, grocery stores and just about everywhere else without giving it's presence a second thought.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

neat!


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Wow,
Our little Farm, well you certinly got a lot of discution! I hope it helped.
Boy am I jealous, I cannot get a hold of any those small guns that fit in that pager holster. I hate getting cut by tiny slides of those smallest auto's they just don't fit in my gorrila sized paws. And the way I have fingers and knucles poking out way to close to the end of the cylander of the revolvers.
There a saw going around about a CCW is suposed to be comforting, not comfortable! It has some worth. But If I can find a holster and gun that I can carry comfortably so should you. It just ain't been easy for me! I hope its better for you.
Good luck
Dutch


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

Hey, I've got paws, too. I often carry a Keltec 32 ACP in my pocket. I grip it with my middle finger only and the ring and pinky are curled underneath. Works fine. One other trick with small grips is to lay your left thumb up along the rear of the grip and then grab thumb and grip with your right hand. I usually have my pinky curled under the grip of many revolvers like Blackhawks, etc. I like my trigger finger straight in line with the bore instead of that high grip with the finger pointing downward to get to the trigger. It makes hip shooting and instinctive shooting so much easier. If I am pointing at it, so it the gun. You gotta be adaptable.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Thanks Dutch!


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## badlander (Jun 7, 2009)

Hey Dutch (love that name, my dad was a Pennsylvania Dutchman. Everyone called him Dutch!) have you ever tried one of the compact Concealed Carry Weapons with a finger extension mag in it? It gives you a little more to hang on to.

True, a ccw should be comforting but if you aren't comfortable wearing it, you are going to tend to leave it home next to your bed instead of on your body. I've seen people conceal 1911's. Mostly men. Don't know how they do it and stay comfortable all day with all that weight hanging on them. The heaviest weapon I've ever concealed or want to conceal has been a Walther PPKS. I like the stability the size of the weapon gives me when I shoot it when compared to compact.

Another way to carry an LCP or a small revolver is in a pocket holster, one of the little envelope types. They have a textured surface that makes them cling to the inside of your pocket so you can just reach in and draw, leaving the holster behind. The do not print any part of the weapon in your pocket.

Many times we wear cargo pants instead of jeans. They are loose fitting, lots of pockets and can conceal just about any compact personal protection weapon in one of them. One of the things our instructor told us is that we ladies need to start buying our jeans a little looser so we can put our weapons in a pocket when we need to. That one's been a hard habit to break, thus the cargo pants.

I got to put a word in here. You never know in this day and age if and when you are going to need to draw a concealed weapon for the protection of your self, or a loved one, or for that matter a complete stranger. OR if you will EVER have to draw one. Hopefully not. But you have to be PREPARED to used your weapon if you need to, both physically and mentally.

One of the additional reasons I carry is because three years ago, my nephew was killed by a single gunshot to his chest while living in Denver. He was in the wrong place at the wrong time of day, but to this day I believe that if he had been carrying a ccw he may have had a chance of survival. 

I like the odds to be tipped in my favor.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

Sorry about your nephew badlander.

I agree about wearing it all the time and being prepared to use it, which means time spent training with it.

As for womens jeans, if you have them looser, it also means the waist band is bigger and that is the opposite of what I need. LOL Mine are already all too big on me.


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## manygoatsnmore (Feb 12, 2005)

Goodness, this discussion had grown since the last time I opened it! Keep it coming, folks, I'm learning right along with the OP.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hi Guys,
Uhh well mag extentions don't work for me, I literaly have too big of a pair of hands, if I buy xxl gloves they tend to be a tight fit if I can get them on at all. anything smaller than a Walther PP the slide cuts two little groves in the top of my right hand, definatly screws up your follow thru, when you stick your hand in your mouth while you pluck the gun with the other hand to kep it pointed safe. The cussing always embareses me as I try not to, way to much experiance at it.
I own a pair of 3 inch heavy barreled J frame smths in 38spl, most people think they look like toys in my paws but with the large Pachmeyer grips I can just hang onto them. The 3 inch barrels mean all those nice pocket holsters don't work for me they ballance so well I won't give them up. Someday I plan on making my own custom holster for them.
So little bitty pea shooters don't work for me. People who have heard my rants before know I prefer 45ACP loaded with 200 grain hollow points, friends of mine call flying ashtrays as the minumum for CCW.
I stress thats for me! based on my background and experiance. Add in I can without diffaculty carry a pair of 1911a1 45's in my waistband. Now thats not really a practicle self defense option in my opinion, only on TV or the big screen can the good guys pull that off. 
For most normal persons I will again stress any gun you are confident in, is better than no gun. Even a 22 may convince a bad guy to back down if he figures you plan on putting them all into his right eye ball. How do you communicate that, confidence and practise, practise, practise. 
Wow sorry came allover preachy,
Dutch


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

You sound like a big guy Dutch, so I'm going to listen and take note and not argue. LOL


manygoatsnmore, glad you are getting some ideas right along beside me!

OLF


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