# Gas vs. diesel generators



## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

I'm on Long Island and after this storm, I see an issue with generators: gas. People are siphoning their cars, boats, trailers, etc. to get whatever fuel they can to run the generators and the lines are incredibly long to get fuel! We have a broken generator that we're going to try to get fixed but honestly, I'm thinking it may be worth the money to get a diesel one. You can get diesel fuel easily right now - even using other fuels if needed. What do you think? I know diesel is better but if you can't get gas, a gas generator isn't very useful! Anyone have experience?


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Do you have natural gas? Is it still in service? Hawkpower and others offer diesels that have been converted to run on natural gas. If you decide on one that runs on diesel look for an 1800 rpm machine which will most likely be a diesel anyway. By picking a diesel you'll get a fuel that stores much, much longer than gasoline. 

MidAtlantic Engine near Cinaminson, NJ is the dealer for Hawkpower and others.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

Oh that is a great idea!! Yes, we have natural gas - I'll check into it!


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

I have a little diesel generator, and yeah fuel availability is why. It will run on furnace oil or kerosene even lamp oil or veg oils. Its also a more stable fuel and easier to store long term. I still fire it up with the gasoline gennies to keep them all happily operating, but I know the diesel one will be the last one running long after the gasoline is gone.


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## logbuilder (Jan 31, 2006)

I have a 55 gal barrel of gas stored. I rotate thru it. I have a 5500 watt gen but in the spring will be watching craigslist for a deal on a Honda EU2000i or a Yamaha EF2000i. They are both sippers and have enough to power my frig and freezer. I need the big one for the well. I should be able to stretch my gas much further with the little one.


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## zant (Dec 1, 2005)

Diesel-not even a thought about gas.....Rather than type pages why...hook up a meter to a gas genny and see how many volts/hertz it puts out under a REAL load...I know a Honda 5500 goes down to 55hz if more than 10amp load put on it.I know my Yanmar stays at 60hz with a 60amp load.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

So any recommendations if we look at a diesel? There are tons of gas generators around here so I'll have to do some research into diesels ones and see where we can get them. I'll also look into natural gas ones too but any recs on what to look for? If it were for the sailboat, I'd have an easier time! Hey, maybe I'll get one of those! 

Rumor has it that our house is wired for the generator. The woman who owned the house before us was in a wheelchair with a hospital bed so they had a generator (the one that's not working) and a hook-up for it. There is a plugged wire out the back of the garage and a separate box to turn on after the street wires are shut off. They said it ran the furnace, fridge, freezer, range (which we replaced with gas) and one light in every room, although I'm not confident in that last one. The generator that they left us is a 4000 watt Dayton - that's old. We moved in 21 years ago and it came with the house.


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## Old Vet (Oct 15, 2006)

I have a gas generator and one that runes off of propane. the one that runes off of propane or natural gas is a whole house one the little one that runes off of gas is for the time that we only want to run a few things. If I had Natural Gas I would go for that because it is very seldom that the natural gas is shut down and you never have to store any fuel. The bad part is that it must be hooked up all the time and can't be moved like a whole house.If you have a whole house it will run just about anything you have at one time. Mine is a 22kw with 2- 100 amp breaker.


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

I'd say get one with the kind of fuel that you can easily store for a long period of time with as little rotating/handling as possible. We have a propane generator and an extra 500 gallon tank to run it off of. We can last an entire winter in relative comfort. And entire year if we back off the comfort a bit.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

Callieslamb said:


> I'd say get one with the kind of fuel that you can easily store for a long period of time with as little rotating/handling as possible. We have a propane generator and an extra 500 gallon tank to run it off of. We can last an entire winter in relative comfort. And entire year if we back off the comfort a bit.


See, we could rotate gas into our cars with no problem. We have natural gas in the house. We can use diesel in the boat. So any of those would be a good choice for us.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

Diesel has storage problems too.
Alge and gunk will develop in a diesel tank.
There are additives for this

Best is propane . . . much cleaner burning . . .no storage problems.


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## lonelytree (Feb 28, 2008)

Annsni said:


> So any recommendations if we look at a diesel? There are tons of gas generators around here so I'll have to do some research into diesels ones and see where we can get them. I'll also look into natural gas ones too but any recs on what to look for? If it were for the sailboat, I'd have an easier time! Hey, maybe I'll get one of those!
> 
> Rumor has it that our house is wired for the generator. The woman who owned the house before us was in a wheelchair with a hospital bed so they had a generator (the one that's not working) and a hook-up for it. There is a plugged wire out the back of the garage and a separate box to turn on after the street wires are shut off. They said it ran the furnace, fridge, freezer, range (which we replaced with gas) and one light in every room, although I'm not confident in that last one. The generator that they left us is a 4000 watt Dayton - that's old. We moved in 21 years ago and it came with the house.


A 21 Y/O diesel with no hours..... send it to me or get a competent mechanic to inspect it. My friend just had his diesel generator blow up. 40K hours plus..... many overheats, water pump failures etc..... 

Change your bulbs to the 13W version of the 60W.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

lonelytree said:


> A 21 Y/O diesel with no hours..... send it to me or get a competent mechanic to inspect it. My friend just had his diesel generator blow up. 40K hours plus..... many overheats, water pump failures etc.....
> 
> Change your bulbs to the 13W version of the 60W.


No, it's not a diesel but a gas one. It's been run - it runs fine. Just doesn't put out any charge.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> No, it's not a diesel but a gas one. It's been run - it runs fine. Just *doesn't put out any charge.*


This might help:
http://www.endtimesreport.com/dead_gen.html

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]


> [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]RE-ENERGIZING DEAD GENERATORS[/FONT]
> [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Two methods of field flashing generators, one using an existing 110 volt source, one using an electric drill.[/FONT]


[/FONT]​Also, you can probably buy a kit to convert the one you have to run on natural gas


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

Bearfootfarm said:


> This might help:
> http://www.endtimesreport.com/dead_gen.html
> 
> [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]​Also, you can probably buy a kit to convert the one you have to run on natural gas


OK - Hubby is trying to figure out what is wrong with the generator and he came upon this link as well. Have you ever tried this? Does it work???


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Have you ever tried this? Does it work???


I've never needed to do it, but it does work


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## Cheryl in SD (Apr 22, 2005)

My dh wants to buy a propane generator. They aren't portable but the propane lasts a LONG time.


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## oreo (Jan 14, 2007)

Dh and I are looking at a tri-fuel generator conversion kit that allows nat. gas, gas or propane. You can switch between them.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Annsni said:


> No, it's not a diesel but a gas one. It's been run - it runs fine. Just doesn't put out any charge.


It may need to be field flashed. But I would user the drill!

the other option is a bad rectifier.

Field flash if that does not work look into the rectifier.

I would go Internal combustion over diesel.

You can easily modify them to run on propane or natural gas and still have gasoline as a back up.

If you go diesel you can also run on propane,natural gas but you need a spark conversion.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

||Downhome|| said:


> It may need to be field flashed. But I would user the drill!
> 
> the other option is a bad rectifier.
> 
> ...


Thanks. This is an older generator and man is it loud! But hubby said it's an 8 horsepower Briggs and Stratton engine so it's a good quality, strong engine. Just need to get that output going!! He needs to find the corded drill though.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

Briggs & Strattons do tend to be pretty loud, and if I remember correctly the oil change interval is usually pretty low (meaning you have to do it more often). It'll do the job if you get the gen-head working, but I second the suggestion of an 1800 RPM diesel converted for natural gas. Keep some diesel stored properly and you'll have power even if the gas lines are out of service.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

ryanthomas said:


> but I second the suggestion of an 1800 RPM diesel converted for natural gas. Keep some diesel stored properly and you'll have power even if the gas lines are out of service.


Do you have a link to what you might recommend?


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## Welshmom (Sep 7, 2008)

About the only thing to disrupt gas service is earthquakes, or fires. Of course, fires would be a problem for diesel or gasoline, too. Consider those probabilities. I'd think diesel would have worse exhaust fumes, maybe louder... 
But if you already have the transfer switches hooked up, you are set!


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

Annsni said:


> Do you have a link to what you might recommend?


I can't recommend any brand...mine is something I cobbled together myself with an engine that's hard to find in the U.S. now. Somebody mentioned Hawkpower and I've heard good things about their products, but I have no personal experience with them. Another company I've heard good stuff about is Hardy Diesel. One thing you should know...these types of generators are more for long term off grid use than occasional power outages. They'll work great for the occasional power outage, but they cost a lot more than a portable gas generator you'd buy at Home Depot.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

> I'd think diesel would have worse exhaust fumes, maybe louder...


The 1800 RPM diesels actually seem quite a bit quieter. I don't know if they really are, but the tone is very different. Cheap gasoline generators usually run at 3600 RPM...and that speed puts off a whine that I can't stand. The slow diesels are usually water-cooled, which muffles a lot of the valve noise that you'll still hear from the air cooled engines on cheap generators.


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## Snow Hampshire (Nov 11, 2012)

logbuilder said:


> I have a 55 gal barrel of gas stored. I rotate thru it. I have a 5500 watt gen but in the spring will be watching craigslist for a deal on a Honda EU2000i or a Yamaha EF2000i. They are both sippers and have enough to power my frig and freezer. I need the big one for the well. I should be able to stretch my gas much further with the little one.


Nice! I have the Honda and it is a fantastic machine. It is indeed a sipper and it can be twinned with a companion model. It lives up to its SuperQuiet name...I'm in a condo so generator noise is a huge factor. I don't think I could run diesel here without facing some serious wrath. I built a tertiary power source with an inverter and a bank of size 31 Marine batteries so I can run silent at night.

Not worried about long term storage. I have five gallon containers and a couple 1.25 gallon containers and just cycle the gas through my car.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

I was at a Amish farm some years ago. I asked what the clattering noise was ? He took me back to the lean-too off the barn where a China diesel was running. They had made no attempt to cover / sound deaden the unit. . . .that could be done....
I had the feeling that that unit would run for a very long time.......
Far more run time than those 3600rpm gas screamers.....


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Annsni said:


> Do you have a link to what you might recommend?


The link to the North American distributor for Hawkpower is below. They have one version that will run for almost three months, 24/7 before needing maintenance. The units are rated for prime use as compared to the lower rating of standby used for most units you see sold for home use.

Check the warranty of any unit you're considering. *READ THE FINE PRINT.* Running some makes like Generac for an extended period of time voids the warranty.

Lister-Petter Hawkpower Diesel Generator Sets


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## GoldenCityMuse (Apr 15, 2009)

I too would go with propane. It stores basically forever. You want to make sure it has a good sealing valve.


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## zant (Dec 1, 2005)

Jim-mi said:


> I was at a Amish farm some years ago. I asked what the clattering noise was ? He took me back to the lean-too off the barn where a China diesel was running. They had made no attempt to cover / sound deaden the unit. . . .that could be done....
> I had the feeling that that unit would run for a very long time.......
> Far more run time than those 3600rpm gas screamers.....


China diesel TOTAL P O S....run away...


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## halfpint (Jan 24, 2005)

In my experience diesel is easier to get after a storm (it is also sometimes the only fuel left when people are evacuating). We've had two times that this has proven true for us. The first was after the storm Rita (shortly after Katrina), knocked out a good bit of Louisiana that wasn't already out from Katrina. I took a friend to get his mother (who was on oxygen) out of there. We took our diesel van and when we finally got back into areas with power, the lines at the gas stations were several hours long. We found a station where the diesel pumps were off to the side and were able to pull right up and fill up. Then a couple of years ago we were on a business trip to Florida with my husband when a hurricane changed course and was forecast to hit where we were, and we were ordered to evacuate. When we got to the gas station, the only fuel they had left was diesel, so we were able to fill up.

Another plus is that most diesel engines can be modified fairly easily to run on alternative fuels.


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## oreo (Jan 14, 2007)

Dh is planning to add a muffler to our generator.


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

oreo said:


> Dh is planning to add a muffler to our generator.


If we get this generator working, that's my next project. LOL


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

I learned more about the Hawkpower diesel units today. The units converted to run on either natural gas or propane can be run for 1000 hours continuously before needing an oil change. The recommended oil is a diesel rated 40 wgt. The long run version has a ten gal. instead of a 5 gal. oil capacity and can be run for 2,000 hours continuously before needing an oil change. If you could change the oil while the engine was running, the engine could be run continuously for longer than anyone knows. The person I talked to has one with 32,000 hours on it and it still runs fine.


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## GoldenCityMuse (Apr 15, 2009)

If you have dual oil filters with appropriate valving, you can run continuously. Probably some sort of parallel configuration with valves on each side of a spin on filter would do the trick.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

GoldenCityMuse said:


> If you have dual oil filters with appropriate valving, you can run continuously. Probably some sort of parallel configuration with valves on each side of a spin on filter would do the trick.


Normally, you wouldn't have to run a generator long. Even if you get hit by a snowstorm, a Katrina, a Sandy, or something similar that decimates the power grid and takes it out for weeks, the normal thousand hour run time would allow you to go 41 days continuously. In most cases the power should be restored within a month. 

If you're prepping for a SHTF like we haven't seen, then the long run capability would be nice. You should easily be able to run the unit continuously (with the exception of down time for oil changes) for close to four years or more before needing a rebuild. Just make sure you store at least 160 gallons of oil and the filters for the oil changes.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

That is just one more reason to go with propane (Or nat gas if you have it) . . .the engine runs so much cleaner that the oil changes can be stretched out.

Regarding the China diesel; that was just an observation. No way was I endorsing them.


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## zant (Dec 1, 2005)

Bottom line on diesel vs propane/nat gas...

How MUCH fuel does it take to run-my diesel uses 1/2g hr at 75%load....using propane it would use 2.3gph.
Before choosing find out the real facts of gph usage...

When you can't get propane or a delivery or the nat gas pumps are'nt working....how do you carry a 5gal fuel can and scavage???

I ran an old diesel on used motor oil and kero mix in an emergency...


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## GoldenCityMuse (Apr 15, 2009)

You could scavenge all the 5 gal tanks with BBQ pits. I know, not the best, but propane has diesel beat for longevity, and the cost for BTU is probably a bit cheaper.


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## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

Annsni said:


> I'm on Long Island and after this storm, I see an issue with generators: gas. People are siphoning their cars, boats, trailers, etc. to get whatever fuel they can to run the generators and the lines are incredibly long to get fuel! We have a broken generator that we're going to try to get fixed but honestly, I'm thinking it may be worth the money to get a diesel one. You can get diesel fuel easily right now - even using other fuels if needed. What do you think? I know diesel is better but if you can't get gas, a gas generator isn't very useful! Anyone have experience?



Central Maine Diesel Generators | Diesel Generators | Triple-Fuel Generators | Propane/Natural Gas Generators

......................These folks sell quite a selection of gas-diesel and propane gensets . If you click on the diesel icon , far upper left corner you'll see what they offer ! Their prices seem to be very affordable , all things considered ! You really want to purchase a unit that gins at 1,800 rpm(slow means long engine life) regardless of the fuel it runs on . , fordy


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

fordy said:


> Central Maine Diesel Generators | Diesel Generators | Triple-Fuel Generators | Propane/Natural Gas Generators
> 
> ......................These folks sell quite a selection of gas-diesel and propane gensets . If you click on the diesel icon , far upper left corner you'll see what they offer ! Their prices seem to be very affordable , all things considered ! You really want to purchase a unit that gins at 1,800 rpm(slow means long engine life) regardless of the fuel it runs on . , fordy


Thanks! We'll check into it.


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## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

Annsni said:


> If we get this generator working, that's my next project. LOL



................IF , you get that old BS ginny running and think it is going too "keep the lights" on after a bad storm I'll send you a pounnd of 'Pixie Dust' I have left over when I went too see the Peter Pan movie about 50 years previous . You can "Sprinkle" it around too keep the Evil Spirits away until the power comes back on . , fordy:happy:


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## Annsni (Oct 27, 2006)

fordy said:


> ................IF , you get that old BS ginny running and think it is going too "keep the lights" on after a bad storm I'll send you a pounnd of 'Pixie Dust' I have left over when I went too see the Peter Pan movie about 50 years previous . You can "Sprinkle" it around too keep the Evil Spirits away until the power comes back on . , fordy:happy:


ROTFL! Hey, it was supposed to be the back-up power for a woman in a wheelchair! It's awesome!!!


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