# Please help me..owner financing



## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

i am so desparate for asssistance. this is such an unusal situation and i need others input. here it is:

i have cash 35k to put down on a 95k house with owner financing. i can't have it in my name due to IRS issues with my ex and if they can't collect in 1 more year, they have to write it off. i have a friend that will put it in her name. i have no intention on defaulting on the house. my question is.... has anyone ever been in this situation? how do i do this without it being traced in my name? and not financially hurt my friend. i know it's an odd senerio, but it seems to be where my life has been for the last 8 years. needless to say, i doubt that i will ever marry again!! this man has dragged me to hell and back. 

all input is welcome. i live in WA state.


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## dahliaqueen (Nov 9, 2005)

I am certainly no expert but you might look into forming a Revokeable Realty Trust.
My x and i had one of these- very easy, you can find the paperwork relevant for each state online, i am sure- and this protected us from any encroachment from his x wife.

You fill out the paperwork and pay a lawyer a couple of hundred bucks and it is done- you may be required to pay state tax stamps, but all in all, this is a very affordable solution.

Good luck.


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## Micheal (Jan 28, 2009)

Word of warning 
What would stop your friend, once the property is in her name, from telling you to "kiss off" and ............ That is other than you just know it wouldn't happen?????
Another thought - Since it is "owner financing" could you maybe work out a "rent with the option to buy" deal with the owner? Something like a year lease or such.


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## kritter8888 (Jun 8, 2009)

Im not sure your situation but when my dad was going to get ready for his divorce (they were living seperately) he wanted a camper so he put it in my name after all was done i gave it back to him just remeber you have to pay taxes each time property is sold or given away. Have you talked to the owners of the property maybe you can do a land contract. You live in the house for 1 year and pay the mortgage and alittle more and then after a year you buy the house. In todays economy alot more people are willing to do this to get out from under their mortgage. Just a ? how do you know that the IRS will right the issue off in a year? Best of luck!


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

dahliaqueen said:


> I am certainly no expert but you might look into forming a Revokeable Realty Trust.
> My x and i had one of these- very easy, you can find the paperwork relevant for each state online, i am sure- and this protected us from any encroachment from his x wife.
> 
> You fill out the paperwork and pay a lawyer a couple of hundred bucks and it is done- you may be required to pay state tax stamps, but all in all, this is a very affordable solution.
> ...


thanks for the info. i will look into this. what is a 'state tax stamp'? i never heard of it.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

Micheal said:


> Word of warning
> What would stop your friend, once the property is in her name, from telling you to "kiss off" and ............ That is other than you just know it wouldn't happen????? yes i have thought of this. our intention is to go to a lawyer so that we would both be protected.
> Another thought - Since it is "owner financing" could you maybe work out a "rent with the option to buy" deal with the owner? Something like a year lease or such.


 do you think this would keep my name off any records? i really don't know how that all works. the real estate agent mentioned that the only reason the buyers name would be recorded was for property tax reasons. i really didn't ask about it at the time because at that point i had someone that would put it in their name. then that fell thru, thus explaining where i'm currently at. i will see if the owners are willing to do this. thanks for the advice.


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## dahliaqueen (Nov 9, 2005)

Mooselover said:


> thanks for the info. i will look into this. what is a 'state tax stamp'? i never heard of it.


Whenever you transfer ownership of real estate, to a new owner or into an entity, like a trust, 

the state you live in usually collects a small fee- i think it amounted to less than $200.00 when i put my house into a realty trust.

The other posters who suggested a rent-to-own situation had the best idea.
This is how i bought my house- rented for a year and then purchased, with owner financing.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

thanks so much to everyone for the suggestions. I LOVE THIS PLACE!!! up till friday afternoon, none of this was a concern because i had someone that would put it in their name. and, as everyone knows, people leave early on fridays. (at least, they do around here!!) i see a common thread here about talking to the owners. i'm thinking that if i pay the property up front for a 2 years, this could allevate any concerns the sellers would have. the way i see it is that if i default, they walk away with 35k AND have the property taxes paid for 2 years. the way i see it is that i'm taking a larger risk then they are. would you guys turn down an offer like that? 

kritter8888....the irs ?... this was personal taxes (1040) that my ex and i filed together. he was supposed to pay it and didn't. i didn't even know about it for about 3 years. if the irs can't collect within 10 years of the 'tax-assessed' date they have to cease all collection effort. for me that will be 10/10. i can't remember if i heard it from my CPA but i did research it and it is true.


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## Dutchie (Mar 14, 2003)

I sell my properties contract for deed (rent to own) and keep them in my name until the whole thing has been paid for. Just make sure you have a solid contract.


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## MN Gardener (Jan 23, 2008)

remember if you put it in your friend's name, what happens if she dies unexpectedly? People often forget that. I would also consult an attorney about that IRS thing. I thought those liens were good for 10 years and if they don't collect they can refile the lien for an additional 10 years. I also check with a title co to see if they will insure it against the debt, they might not and if you go to sell there could be issues.


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## lamoncha lover (Mar 1, 2009)

i'm thinking that if i pay the property up front for a 2 years, this could allevate any concerns the sellers would have. the way i see it is that if i default, they walk away with 35k AND have the property taxes paid for 2 years. the way i see it is that i'm taking a larger risk then they are. would you guys turn down an offer like that? 

GOODNESS...if you want a nice large brick house on a little over 4 acres in TN , with a barn etc i WOULDNT turn you down.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

MN Gardner...i've thought about that. if i have to go in that direction, i will definitely be addressing that concern and we'll be speaking to an attorney. i will check into the irs thing. i think i heard the same thing but i wasn't sure if that was irs or other liens/judgements. i guess if the irs refiles, well, i'll just be screwed forever and have to die in the house. 

lamoncho lover....i would be so all over that but i really don't want to move from this area. what i'm hoping for is that the owner's see that i am serious about this and sort of make them an offer they can't refuse. 

this is driving me crazy cause i can't do anything till monday. moosedrool to all for sharing. i truly appreciate it. feel free to throw anything out there. i'm sure there are things i haven't considered.


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## blufford (Nov 23, 2004)

How much are the taxes that are owed to the IRS?


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## goatlady (May 31, 2002)

If you are purchasing on a contract the Deed to the property WILL stay in the Seller's names until you complete the purchase contract. You name would only appear on the Purchase Contract as a buyer agreeing to the terms. NOTHING would be changed on the ownership of the property leagally - it still belongs to the Sellers UNTIL you totally complete the contract by paying it in full. I don't think IRS can attach any property you swould buy via Contract as the property does NOT belong to you until totally paid for in full. That's most usually how an Owner finance sale works. Your realtor may not be explaining this good enough or may not understand it her/himself!


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

blufford said:


> How much are the taxes that are owed to the IRS?


with penalities and interest, about over $50k. :grump:


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## cindy71 (Jul 7, 2008)

If you are renting now keep doing that. You sad that you have $35,000 keep saving until next year you will have more to put down.


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## Lizza (Nov 30, 2005)

If you are sure that it expires 10/10 (have you seen a tax attorney about that?) then honestly I'd sit and wait until 11/10 to buy my house. If you've flown under the radar all this time, no need to pop up at the last minute. Before I did anything though I'd see that attorney to make sure everything you think is true, is true, don't take internet searches as gospel or just a call to a CPA, you need someone qualified to look at YOUR specific case. If you have $35K in savings, spend a few hundred making sure all your ducks are all lined up, then I'd wait it out and buy next year. 

I'd never put my property in anyone else's name, ever, I don't care how related or how good of a friend. Too many things to go wrong.


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## Step (Aug 4, 2005)

You have $35,000 saved up? I hope it's not in a bank.. or anywhere else they'd be able to find, when they go looking.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

rose2005 said:


> Can you form a company that would then purchase the house? Not sure if this is feesable here in the States.


thanks rose, i thought about that but i can't risk my name being attached to anything.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

cindy71 said:


> If you are renting now keep doing that. You sad that you have $35,000 keep saving until next year you will have more to put down.



thanks cindy. not an option. i'm not renting. i've been living with my bf for over 7 years. i'm ending the relationship (even though he doesn't know it yet) and that's why i'm trying to buy a house. i've got a place to go to but i really don't want to bright the bullet and put my stuff in storage.


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

Step said:


> You have $35,000 saved up? I hope it's not in a bank.. or anywhere else they'd be able to find, when they go looking.



it was a blessing inheritance that's been in my sister's name for over 2 years. traceable back to me? yes, i'm sure it was cause i had to pay taxes on it. the irs has never questioned nor contacted me wanting any of it. and, if they do......i went to reno:nana:


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

morningstar said:


> If you are sure that it expires 10/10 (have you seen a tax attorney about that?) yes, i have. that's how i found out about the 10 year thing. then honestly I'd sit and wait until 11/10 to buy my house. If you've flown under the radar all this time, no need to pop up at the last minute. i know and i truly agree with this. that WAS my plan before my bf went all sideways on me. seems like i'm always a day late and dollar short on everything. Before I did anything though I'd see that attorney to make sure everything you think is true, is true, don't take internet searches as gospel or just a call to a CPA, you need someone qualified to look at YOUR specific case. If you have $35K in savings, spend a few hundred making sure all your ducks are all lined up, then I'd wait it out and buy next year.
> 
> I'd never put my property in anyone else's name, ever, I don't care how related or how good of a friend. Too many things to go wrong.


 i agree, shows my desparation doesn't it?!


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## Mooselover (May 4, 2009)

goatlady said:


> If you are purchasing on a contract the Deed to the property WILL stay in the Seller's names until you complete the purchase contract. You name would only appear on the Purchase Contract as a buyer agreeing to the terms. NOTHING would be changed on the ownership of the property leagally - it still belongs to the Sellers UNTIL you totally complete the contract by paying it in full. I don't think IRS can attach any property you swould buy via Contract as the property does NOT belong to you until totally paid for in full. That's most usually how an Owner finance sale works. Your realtor may not be explaining this good enough or may not understand it her/himself!



that's EXACTLY what i thought goatlady!!! i briefly spoke to an attorney today. (he didn't charge me) and he told me that the deed would be in the buyer's name. he explained that even if the owners don't owe anything on the house, it would be the same if they were making mortage payments and the irs could lien it. now, that makes no darn sense to me!!! but then again, i am in WA!!!! i'll be going to see a real estate attorney, for sure. thanks a lot.


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## Gercarson (Nov 2, 2003)

I think I would challenge this IRS "thing' and get it resolved in some way. What about your "ex"? I would think he would bear a great deal of this responsibilty and you could assign the tax burden back to him. Have you thoroughly explored the chances of eliminating this albatross he has put on your shoulders?


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## ihedrick (May 15, 2005)

Not sure of what the requirements or conditions are, but the IRS does have an "injured spouse" thing where the taxes owed are assigned to the person who actually accrued the taxes; not the innocent spouse.


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## pfaubush (Aug 17, 2009)

I don't know the situation of when you left your ex in contrast to when the non-payment of taxes took place, but the IRS has an innocent spouse rule. If you can prove that you weren't at fault and had nothing to do with it, they will let you off the hook. Personally, this is what I would look into. The IRS is not your average Joe collection agency and not someone you want looming over you. Just a thought.

I should add they can re-file several times. 20 years ago, when I was 15, I went to the hospital and 20 years later they are still trying to collect money from my father. If a hospital can do that, the IRS can too.


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## mygreenacres (Sep 22, 2009)

I cannot stress this enough - TALK TO AN ATTORNEY! Or better yet, talk to two - one about the taxes and one about the property. If the land isn't in your name, you don't own it and getting possession could become impossible for a number of reasons already mentioned by others.

Can I safely assume that the "innocent spouse" clause doesn't apply to you re the taxes? None of my business, of course, but if you haven't already looked into that see an attorney!

And good luck! My ex screwed me royally when we divorced but I got even. The best revenge, as they say, is to live well! I paid off our debts (to which he refused to contribute a cent!), kept my stellar credit rating and bought, not one, but two homes and made a sweet profit off the one I wasn't living in. I was a debt-free homeowner while he was still renting a substandard shack.


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## quietstar (Dec 11, 2002)

Am I the only one with an inkling that the ex-husband may have another story to tell? Now, after seven years living on the BF, she sneaks around, looking after her interests while she plans to dump him when it's convenient. Admits to planning to have her "good friend" commit a very serious crime to protect her investment until someone here warns that the friend might be able to take advantage of her. 

I find it interesting how many females here reacted like kindred sisters. A new study found that most women will sink to mean, unethical treatment of men for their own benefit. Shame!...Glen


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## Gercarson (Nov 2, 2003)

quietstar said:


> Am I the only one with an inkling that the ex-husband may have another story to tell? Now, after seven years living on the BF, she sneaks around, looking after her interests while she plans to dump him when it's convenient. Admits to planning to have her "good friend" commit a very serious crime to protect her investment until someone here warns that the friend might be able to take advantage of her.
> 
> I find it interesting how many females here reacted like kindred sisters. A new study found that most women will sink to mean, unethical treatment of men for their own benefit. Shame!...Glen


You are the only one who was blunt enough to say it. Most replies referred the OP to check into attorney advice for proper procedure - we are all acutely aware there are "two sides" of any situation. Apparently there is some "legal" roadblock that has driven the OP to ask for more advice to continue this "owner financing" (go around legalities) quest. Sometimes it does some good to say it like it is.


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## bruce2288 (Jul 10, 2009)

Go talk to acorn they give good advice about tax evasion.


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## huck (Feb 11, 2008)

> Go talk to acorn they give good advice about tax evasion.


..LOL


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## quietstar (Dec 11, 2002)

Ok..I've expressed the critical questions and will offer a possible solution. Buyer pays agreed down payment and gives note for remainder of purchase. Receives Warranty deed and Title Report(not Policy) from Sellers. Buyer does not record deed and Sellers do not record note and securing instrument until possible tax cloud on title is resolved. Everyone in this transaction has some risk/exposure. Buyer has paid a big down, does not have a title policy, but a "report" which is only as good as the Title Company. Buyer's deed is not recorded and seller could double sell, give another deed and skip out. Sellers security instruments not recorded which would make certain the note is paid as agreed. 

Oh what a tangled web we weave when...etc. Good luck...Glen


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## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

Ok, and people ARE aware that the banks report to the gov when right at $10,000 and above is removed from an account?

I'd say, if you managed to save $35,000 , pay the IRS 25,000, arrange lowered payments or forebarence, then contact a lawyer and sue the ex for what is owed the IRS. 

I worked for the IRS, and out of ALL the "alphabets" (ie, FBI, CIA, DEA, DIA, etc...) they actually scare me...

Mon


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## marvella (Oct 12, 2003)

much good advice here.

however, your problems with the irs will NOT just go away. ever. if you work, they will find you. if you draw any kind of benefit, they will find you. bank account, they will find you. go to school, they will find you.

my best advice is, after negotiations, just give the 35K to the irs that you owe. suck it up and get your life straight. at least then you can start over with a relatively clean slate.

not what you wanted to hear, i know. but as long as you are doing underhanded things you will never be able to have a reasonably peaceful life.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

The injured spouse rule doesn't apply in community property states---they will tell you to file but turn you down. WA is a community property state.
If there is any fraud involved, there is no ten year rule, the IRS will take the money from whoever they can get it from and the debt will never go away. If you signed the tax return you are equally responsible for the full amount of the tax. The fact that you have hidden assets you could have paid the tax with will not help you if they are found. I would go to a tax lawyer and get this straightened out. You will be looking over your shoulder the rest of your life. Molly


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## 2ndmouse (Jan 16, 2009)

I think you should rent an appt. until your credit and records are clean.

Getting friends involved in money deals is the best way to make enemies.


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## salmonslayer (Jan 4, 2009)

> my best advice is, after negotiations, just give the 35K to the irs that you owe. suck it up and get your life straight.


 Best advice of the day Marvella...we should sic the IRS on Al Queda.


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## Rocky Fields (Jan 24, 2007)

Hey.

Rent With Option To Buy. Enact the "Buy" when time is right. Maybe you will have a change of heart after living there and finding defects...

RF


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Rent to own instead? 

No fuss, no trouble, no playing (dangerous) games with the IRS.


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## brreitsma (Jan 14, 2003)

I know New Mexico has something called bearer shares which is basically a state LLC that is not in any particular name. Therefore not able to be traced. You want to keep close track of one of these and not lose it because it belongs to whoever is holding onto the physical certificate at the time but it is a good way to do business and other transactions where you need identity not to be revealed.


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## brreitsma (Jan 14, 2003)

About New Mexico LLC's www.keepyourassets.net/crashcourse.html


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## caroline (Sep 29, 2009)

Mooselover said:


> with penalities and interest, about over $50k. :grump:


How are you getting the IRS to write off that much in taxes??

I have never heard of that...

Also, Put 20% down, not all of your 35K. 20% is normal in a real estate deal and if you do that you will not have to have mortgage insurance----weather or not that would be a factor in a lnad contract but i would have it if I had any kind of a loan.

Good luck.


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