# Well Water Pump Question



## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

DH thinks that watering the garden is going to "burn out" the water pump. I think that it just may be sturdier than he thinks it is.

How long can you water the garden before you have to worry about harming the water pump? I remember playing with the garden hose all day as a child, and mom never said anything.


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## rambler (Jan 20, 2004)

What kind of pump? There are 1/2 dozen common different types, and a few rare types.... Some might not like the steady use, but most are designed to handle it.

Basically if the well continues to provide water to the pump, it should be ok. Using the pump adds wear to it, but it will pump 500,000 gallons or whatever in it's life; if you use that much water in 5 years or 40 years, you didn't 'burn it up' just wore it out over time is all.

But if they run dry or suck a lot of air you can do them harm, don't use more water than your well can regenertate.

--->Paul


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

It's out in the back yard. Where would I look on it or what would I look for to determine type or brand?

I think he's afraid of an electrical issue.


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## Spinner (Jul 19, 2003)

We've always used the well pump to water gardens for as long as I can remember (at least 50 years.)

ETA: I better change that to 40 years. The first 10 we used a manual hand pump.


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

When I had our pump installed the well guy said it was 'rated for continuous use'. Contact who ever put you pump in and ask them.


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## HockeyFan (Jul 27, 2007)

We're on a well. We have a pressure tank with our pump. We water every day in the summer. We've done so for years. We haven't had a problem. I haven't had anyone tell me that this is bad.
Bear in mind, the pressure tank has to be set up correctly so that the pump isn't turning on and off so often, but the reality is that we've been watering and it hasn't been a problem.

I could be wrong, but everyone out where I live, are also on wells and they water too.
If it continues to concern you, I would suggest a second well, and have this set up similar to how stock tanks are set up for cattle. Get a windmill and have it slowly pump water into the stock tank. And then have a hose from the tank to your garden. You can water from the tank and since your well is pumped the old fashion way (with wind), it wont affect your well pump.


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## rambler (Jan 20, 2004)

Cloverbud said:


> It's out in the back yard. Where would I look on it or what would I look for to determine type or brand?
> 
> I think he's afraid of an electrical issue.


Is the pump on the surface, with 2 pipes running down the casing? Is the pump down at the bottom of one pipe in the casing, with 2 or 3 wires going down to it? How deep is the well? Where is the pressure tank located - is it a simple tank or a bladder type of tank? Deep well, shallow well, in between? Four inch casing, bigger, 3 foot wide shallow well, 2 inch sand point? There are so many different combinations......

I/we don't need to know all that, but any home owner should know these things. It _really_ helps when you turn on a faucett & no water comes out, and you have to get help from someone. They can fix the problem a lot easier the more they know.

Typically the original well digger has records of all this, as well as if their is a screen at the bottom, pump type, age of the casing, etc. Many states also keep a record of wells for the last 20+ years, and store much of this info.

When my well went funny a few years ago, the fellow that dug it 40 years ago came out to diganose it. He knew it was 260 feet deep, he knew it put out 50 gallons a minute (but my pipe/pump can only allow 20), he knew it has a size x 10 foot screen at the bottom, he knew that the metal 5 inch casing was older than 1974.

So he could figure my screen had plugged up with magneese and that an acid treatment might clear it up and my older casing is less likely to get harmed by the acid and he knew what type of pump would be on the end of the 250 feet of pipe he pulled out....

Knowing all that, he could get my well working again in 24 hours.

If I had to call a new place & had no info on the well at all other than 'its over there' it would have been much more difficult to get a good fix.....

Something to think about, prepare for. Easier to search out this info now, rather than after the tap goes dry & you need the help.

--->Paul


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

The worst thing is if the pressure switch makes the pump turn off and on over an over.

There should be a silvery plate attached to the side of the motor. Look for the words continuous duty. That means it can run without stopping for years if it's a good pump. 

I've got a little 1/2 hp shallow well pump that I use to pump out ponds. It has pumped literally millions of gallons. I set it up and let it run for weeks on end.


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

rambler said:


> Is the pump on the surface, with 2 pipes running down the casing? Is the pump down at the bottom of one pipe in the casing, with 2 or 3 wires going down to it? How deep is the well? Where is the pressure tank located - is it a simple tank or a bladder type of tank? Deep well, shallow well, in between? Four inch casing, bigger, 3 foot wide shallow well, 2 inch sand point? There are so many different combinations......
> 
> --->Paul


The pump is on the surface. I have no idea about anything else. All I can find on it is that it's made by the Morrison Co., Milwaukee, WI.

We bought the house from an estate, and the gentleman's sons were pretty clueless. I can't even tell you where the septic is, and DH doesn't seem inclined to find out, but I'm not going there.

Assuming the pump should sometime need to be replaced, what does one run, ballpark?

Also, is adjusting the pressure thing on the pressure tank something I can do myself? I'd like to have it go longer between pumping cycles, if possible.

It also seem to have a fair amount of air in the lines, even during periods of low usage. Is this a diy fix or a call-the-man?

Thanks so much for your help!!


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## Old Vet (Oct 15, 2006)

Cloverbud said:


> The pump is on the surface. I have no idea about anything else. All I can find on it is that it's made by the Morrison Co., Milwaukee, WI.
> 
> We bought the house from an estate, and the gentleman's sons were pretty clueless. I can't even tell you where the septic is, and DH doesn't seem inclined to find out, but I'm not going there.
> 
> ...


You can get a new one for about $100 on up to$400 You can replace it if you have a little plumbing experance. Air in the line is a problem and may be easy to fix or not. I would call a well man to find out where the air is coming from. This is probily the reasion that your husband saie not to use it for wattering. There may be severial reasions to get air in the line and some of them can be dangerious to use the water for too long.


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

We've lived here, with air getting into the lines, for 6 years. That hasn't even reached his radar in that whole time. Nope, he's just telling me I'll fry the pump.


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

Cloverbud,
What color is the tank? I want a little info so that I may help a bit. What I want you to do is to have a 5 gallon bucket and be near the pump and a faucet. Turn the water on until the well starts running then turn the faucet off. With no water being used anywhere let the pump run until it shuts off on its own. Then, start catching water in the 5 gallon bucket and listen for the pump to start. At the pump start, immediately shut the faucet off and determine how much water you collected and post the results. PS...At the pump , how big is the biggest pipe going into the ground?


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## rambler (Jan 20, 2004)

Cloverbud, you well/pump could be showing some signs of trouble. It might be very easy to fix it now - cost you nothing or 20 bucks or so - and save a costly repair (new pump) down the road.

Follow along with Agmantoo, he is going down the right path on this, and can help figure out what is going on. There are several possibilities.

Air in the pipes is not really a good thing....... Most of the time.

--->Paul


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

I don't know how big the pipe is at the pump. The pump is flush with the ground. The tank--hold on, let me run downstairs.

Whew, took 2 trips (2nd one was for the flashlight.) The tank is a purple-ish brown Permatank Water Systems Glassline Perma-lin'd Hydropneumatic pump tank, model # PL42T, max pressure 75. (Gotta love labels)

Oh, yah-from cut off to cut on is 9 gallons. Pressure drop from 58 to 40.

Is there any chance that the air is coming from the unused but not bypassed water softener?


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

Ok, after some research I now have some pertinent information. Regarding the tank, it is a non bladder type. A non bladder type tank has the water and the captive air in contact with each other. It is common from time to time to get some air in the delivered water. Your system has some type of device for adding air to the tank to replenish what air is lost through the absorption of air into the water. Usually the device is called an air volume control and it is mounted on the tank and connected through a small tube to the pump itself. These devices are somewhat problematic. However, with the drawdown of 9 gallons reported yours is great! From time to time you need to perform this test to ascertain that you continue to get not less than approximately 5 gallons. If the drawdown amount gets below approximately 5 gallons the system needs serviced. For the type of pump you have and to get the cut in and cut out pressures of 40 and 58 also indicates the pump itself is performing admirably. You need to do a "happy dance". Your husband's concerns about problems should only stem from the recharge rate of the well itself. Recharge rate is the amount of water that would be available to pump after the amount of water that is stored above the bottom of the pipes and jet that extend into the well are expelled. For example, if you were to pump out of the well 5 gallons per minute and the recharge rate is higher than 5 gallons you could pump indefinitely. If the recharge rate is lower than 5 gallons the pump will suck air and in you situation the pump would suck air and lose its prime and continue to run while not pumping water. This would be bad on the pump and someone would have to physically reprime the pump to get it started provided the pump to motor seal did not destruct. You obviously need to attempt to determine the type of well and its recharge rate if possible. PS.....if you have adequate recharge rate using the well will not have a negative effect. Actually it will improve the well and the pump can run continuously and is less destructive than frequent start and stop conditions are to the motor.
Your tank http://www.dafehr.com/Perma Tank/perm-lind_specifications.htm


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

Thanks so much for your help, agmantoo! 

So, just after you gave me the thumbs up on this, we lost power yesterday. All was good until I heard air spewing, no, make that *exploding* into the toilet tank. There's a leak around the seal for the flapper/flushy device from the tank to the bowl that dh has known about and not fixed for longer than is excusable (over a month.) I forgot about the leak until I heard the exploding air. Yee haw. I'm picturing a huge bill which could have been avoided by a small repair. DH says that the air in the line problem seems to have resolved itself, though.

He's still on my manure roster for not fixing the toilet, though.


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

Cloverbud,
Since you are on a well can I accurately assume that you are on septic? If so your hubby has been concerning himself on the wrong service to the home. He should have been fretting over the saturated drain field of the septic system and the consequences. It is unbelievable how much water can be wasted and how much of a draw the wasted water can be on the well and the power bill. That unnecessary use of the well got you nothing in return whereas a similar use with less frequent starts on the pump and no damage to the septic could grow you a garden.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

The first thing I would do to cure the air leak is to carefully tighten all the joints from the ground up to the pump.

Agman is right about fixing the leak that is needlessly filling your septic system and wasting your electricity.


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## Cloverbud (Sep 4, 2006)

I agree. The sad thing is that he grew up with a well and a constantly overfilled septic system. They had to drain the bathtub and washer out the basement window.

The truth is that this is Pony's and my market garden, and he torpedoes any effort I make at improving our financial situation. This is like the third or fourth time. But at least now I can point out that his argument is like our septic system...full of carp.


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## GraciousGranny (May 25, 2015)

@cloverbud Next question:..H0W can we 'fix' our 'dear husbands' who have no clue but demand to 'lead' anyway..? ..MADDENING!....


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## ninny (Dec 12, 2005)

Cloverbud, is there some way that you could fix up a rain catch system and use that water for the garden instead of the water from your well? You can get some fairly large containers fairly reasonable, run a gutter to the container, fill it with rain water and you should be good to go, make your husband happy also. He won't be worried about the pump.

.


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## JoePa (Mar 14, 2013)

If you are going to water your garden it is best to have the water coming out of the hose match the amount of water being pumped from the well - that way the pump will run continuously and not start and stop - to do this turn on the hose to a certain flow and watch the pressure gauge at the storage tank - adjust the flow from the hose so that there is not change in pressure -


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## RichNC (Aug 22, 2014)

The OP posted this question in 2008, not that there is not good information in the post.


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

Since the OP has probably figured out by now if they can water the garden continuously, I am just going to throw in my 2 cents worth for those that got sucked into reading a 7 year old thread.

My well pump on a sand point well and above the ground. The instructions say don't run it for longer than 30 minutes or it will overheat. The motor side does get almost too hot to touch if I run it that long, even if it is turning on and off. If your well pump is above ground you should water the garden for half an hour and then check the temp of the pump motor.

My watering is on a timer that turns it on for a half hour every 2 days.

If you have a submersible well pump, it is down inside the well casing in the cold water and won't overheat.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

I used a 1/2 hp Red Lion shallow well house pump to empty my commercial fish ponds. It ran nonstop for weeks at a time. The pump moved millions of gallons of water and it even ran dry overnight a few times. At least twice the intake plugged with algae and it sucked flat about 40' of thin wall 4" pvc pipe. The pump was still going strong until I didn't get it drained well enough one fall and it froze and broke the housing.


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