# Here's another reason to NOT to use a CCW purse



## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

I've over and over and over told people not to use these stupid things. My main reasons were it takes a LONG time to access your weapon and if some punk snatches your purse you have just armed a criminal.

I never thought about something like this happening.

_Blackfoot mom killed by toddler_

_Veronica typically left her Blackfoot home with her gun nestled at her side. So on Christmas morning last week, her husband gave her a present he hoped would make her life more comfortable: a purse with a special pocket for a concealed weapon.

An inquisitive 2-year-old boy reached into the purse, unzipped the compartment, found the gun and shot his mother in the head_
Read more here: http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/12/30/3566139_khq-woman-shot-at-wal-mart.html?rh=1#storylink=cpy


Read more here: http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/12/30/3566139_khq-woman-shot-at-wal-mart.html?rh=1#storylink=cpy​
Full story here.

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2014/12/30/3566139_khq-woman-shot-at-wal-mart.html?rh=1


Please NEVER think about using one of these things.


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## Zimobog (Aug 31, 2013)

Alternately, if you use one of these- remove the pistol to a close carry rig in the home. Unattended firearms are a bad idea period. It ain't the product it's the application.


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

Zimobog said:


> Alternately, if you use one of these- remove the pistol to a close carry rig in the home. Unattended firearms are a bad idea period. It ain't the product it's the application.


I completely disagree. It *is *the product. It is specifically designed in such away that your firearm is not totally in your control and easily accessible if you need it even when used 'correctly'. 

Watch how quickly and easily a criminal could go from being a strong arm punk to an armed punk.


[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECHlTCvOUeg[/ame]


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## FireMaker (Apr 3, 2014)

This video demonstrates that it is not the equipment but the operator. She should not have entered the elevator with an unknown. She should not have had her back to him. She should not be on the phone or later playing with her hair. She did not have the (what we call) "officer safety mind set". The need to be in condition yellow.

We had an officer 25 hrs ago that was killed with his gun. He was in a secured facility and turned his back on the suspect. Suspect took the gun out of the level one holster and killed him. The agency jumped on the bandwagon and purchased level three holsters. The issue was not the equipment, but the mindset. The failure to follow basic safety skills caused his death, not the equipment. 

Weapon retention training is as important for civilians as it is for police. Even after the agency shooting, the only time there was weapon retention training was when you got hired. It was not required. There was no effort to stress it's importance. 

We had another officer that had a gun removed. The only thing that save him was the gun was pressed into his side. The slide was pushed back enough to disconnect and the the trigger would not function.

While I do not like off body carry, the responsibility for its proper use and placement is with the operator. The greatest firearms safety is between your ears


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

I know this goes against popular opinion, but I also never, ever carry a gun with a round in the chamber. I can chamber a round in under two seconds. I know that there are situations where two seconds would count for a lot, but I don't feel comfortable walking around with a round chambered in my 9mm which has no built in safety. Accidents happen and I don't want to be that guy.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Watcher,

I agree with you . The only weapons intended to be carried in bags or cases are those unloaded and stored.

While I consider it sad for this woman and family at her accidental death at the hand of her toddler, the blame unfortunately primarily lays with her and her husband for deciding on a CCW purse and to a lesser degree the manufacturer who in the quest of profits from unthinking consumers chose to market a weapon carry case in a women's purse.

For 35 years I have advised women interested in CCW to pack it in their pants or otherwise under their clothing just like we men do.


A pistol concealed in a purse in addition to risk of losing the weapon in a purse snatching eliminates the basic concept of loaded weapon security that on the body packing affords.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

V-NH said:


> I know this goes against popular opinion, but I also never, ever carry a gun with a round in the chamber. I can chamber a round in under two seconds. I know that there are situations where two seconds would count for a lot, but I don't feel comfortable walking around with a round chambered in my 9mm which has no built in safety. Accidents happen and I don't want to be that guy.


In my eyes, you might as well be carrying a hammer... Have you practiced enough that you have muscle memory built? do you know you will remember to rack a round under stress? How do you know it won't jam as you are?

Maybe you need to be silent, and racking a round is going to ruin that... 

What kind of modern gun doesn't have some sort of safety? All of my 9mm's have a safety of one sort or another. If they have a hammer, most have a disconnect or a bar that will keep the hammer from striking the pin even if dropped.. Even my .380 that has no safety, has a built in safety as far as it's a DAO and has a strong trigger pull.


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## Welshmom (Sep 7, 2008)

I read the linked news article, but it never mentions what type of firearm it was. I can't imagine how a 2 year-old could manage the trigger pull on a revolver unless it had been modified. Was she carrying something like a semi-auto with one in the chamber?


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

That's fair enough Simi, I am comfortable with your choice to carry with one in the chamber. However, if you have a gun in your purse and a two year old right next to it, you probably shouldn't.

I have a Kahr CW9... no safety, but a strong trigger pull. It is the only gun I ever carry and 75% of my range time is spent with it. I am not sure how my muscle memory would be if I ever needed it in a pinch, but I'll definitely take my chances over carrying it with one in the chamber. This way, I know that no accidents will happen. I won't have to live with it if I die because I spent two seconds chambering a round. I will have to live with it if it accidentally goes off and hurts someone.


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## unregistered41671 (Dec 29, 2009)

V-NH said:


> That's fair enough Simi. I have a Kahr CW9... no safety, but a strong trigger pull. It is the only gun I ever carry and 75% of my range time is spent with it. I am not sure how my muscle memory would be if I ever needed it in a pinch, but I'll definitely take my chances over carrying it with one in the chamber. This way, I know that no accidents will happen.


Do you carry it in a holster that covers the trigger and trigger guard?


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## DEKE01 (Jul 17, 2013)

simi-steading said:


> In my eyes, you might as well be carrying a hammer... Have you practiced enough that you have muscle memory built? do you know you will remember to rack a round under stress? How do you know it won't jam as you are?
> 
> Maybe you need to be silent, and racking a round is going to ruin that...
> 
> What kind of modern gun doesn't have some sort of safety? All of my 9mm's have a safety of one sort or another. If they have a hammer, most have a disconnect or a bar that will keep the hammer from striking the pin even if dropped.. Even my .380 that has no safety, has a built in safety as far as it's a DAO and has a strong trigger pull.


Glocks do not have a safety (against accidental trigger pull). I think they are great guns, arguably the best, but I prefer my Springfield XDM, because of the grip safety.


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## idigbeets (Sep 3, 2011)

Possum Belly said:


> Do you carry it in a holster that covers the trigger and trigger guard?


Why yes, yes I do. Blackhawk Serpa.

This woman should have had her firearm on her person, not in the purse. Not a lot of help when she's being purse snatched... or leaves it in the car or w/e...


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

the sad part is she had apparently been carrying for some time on body and had just made the change to the newly gifted CCW purse , and probably did what she always did with her purse


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

Possum Belly said:


> Do you carry it in a holster that covers the trigger and trigger guard?


Yes, but I still feel superstitious about it


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

My mother and girlfriend routinely pack either low profile revolvers or semiautomatics under their blouses with belly band type holsters. To draw their weapons requires only a quick unbutton of a single button and a reach in and draw as fast as a man drawing a similar profile weapon from a pocket holster.

If I happen to be wearing jeans with pockets or waist band not optimal for concealed carry and can't wear a shoulder rigging with over jacket without drawing attention, a belly band and slightly over fit shirt worn outside my pants affords adequate draw accessibility and ensures secure control of my weapon on my person.


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## Gabriel (Dec 2, 2008)

Allowing a toddler access to a weapon is a software problem. She hadn't made the connection about the importance of keeping the purse on her, rather than in the cart. 

I'm extremely careful now to not chamber my pistol unless I'm about to enter a "less than savory" area. It's because I know that I might forget and leave my gun where my children might get it. I'm also continuing to teach them that "we don't point guns at people". Finger guns only. Anything resembling a gun is not allowed to be pointed at people.


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

Yah, we won't allow toy guns or finger guns. We have too many of the real thing in the house.


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

I would never recommend a purse for concealed carry. Because a purse is a target for purse snatchers. Second in some states if that purse is not on you, your permit does not cover it as a concealed weapon and you broke the law.

Bob


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

It takes half a second for someone that is going to shoot you to get their first shot off. It takes at the quickest 1.5 seconds for you to respond if you have to chamber a round your already out of the gun fight.

Bob



V-NH said:


> I know this goes against popular opinion, but I also never, ever carry a gun with a round in the chamber. I can chamber a round in under two seconds. I know that there are situations where two seconds would count for a lot, but I don't feel comfortable walking around with a round chambered in my 9mm which has no built in safety. Accidents happen and I don't want to be that guy.


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

Welshmom said:


> I read the linked news article, but it never mentions what type of firearm it was. I can't imagine how a 2 year-old could manage the trigger pull on a revolver unless it had been modified. Was she carrying something like a semi-auto with one in the chamber?


I live about an hour away from where the shooting happened. It was a S&W Shield, this pistol comes with and without a safety. None of the news articles said if had a safety or not.

I carry a Springfield XD mainly because of the grip and trigger safety

Bob


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