# Hive Configuration



## sustainablesam (Jul 14, 2007)

I hive heard many different opinions on how to configure a hive, such as:

Use only one deep hive body, then shallow supers

Use two deep hive bodies, then shallow supers

Use only medium supers for everything so then all of the frames are interchangeable.

Then there is the choice between 8 frame and 10 frame equipment.

As a newbie, I find this confusing, frustrating, and this many choices are holding me back from buying equipment.

Any thoughts?


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## damoc (Jul 14, 2007)

it pretty much comes down to personal preferance i would much rather have
all standard equipment IE all 10 frame full depth hive body and supers but i dont like lifting those full 10 framers full of honey I do it but dont like it much.

if you are going to buy nucs you will likely want standard full depth 8 or 10
frame at least for the hive body.if you keep all the same size gear you can 
move frames from the hive body to the upper honey super which can be handy.

a hive will often build out a half depth honey super better than a full depth
if your hive strength is a little weaker or if it is a lighter honey flow.

one big question to answer for yourself is how do you feel about lugging
around 100 pounds or more of honey super and it can seem even heavier than
that when you first try to crack it from the hive.

if that sounds like its to hard for you then stick with half depth gear or maybee
8 frame gear which is a little lighter.

10 frame gear works well with an inside feeder and 8 frames

most people run 9 frames in a ten frame super.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

damoc said:


> ... it pretty much comes down to personal preferance
> ... most people run 9 frames in a ten frame super.


9 frames in a 10 frame box?

Evenly spaced?

Or pressed to one side and with an open space on one side?

Or an open space in the center?

Won't the bees start building comb in any open space?


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## indypartridge (Oct 26, 2004)

sustainablesam said:


> I hive heard many different opinions on how to configure a hive, such as:
> 
> Use only one deep hive body, then shallow supers


Often done in warmer climates where the bees don't need extensive winter stores.



> Use two deep hive bodies, then shallow supers


Often done in colder climates.



> Use only medium supers for everything so then all of the frames are interchangeable.


A choice of personal preference. 



> Then there is the choice between 8 frame and 10 frame equipment.


As damoc noted, this is usually a weight issue. How much can you comfortably lift?



> As a newbie, I find this confusing, frustrating, and this many choices are holding me back from buying equipment.
> Any thoughts?


Yes, find a mentor. Get connected with a local beekeeping group. Many of the "newbee" choices are simplified if you find a few locals beeks and learn what they are doing, e.g., what kind of equipment do they have and why? where do they buy their bees? where do they buy equipment? is there a beginner beekeeping class available? etc.


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## damoc (Jul 14, 2007)

ET1 SS said:


> 9 frames in a 10 frame box?
> 
> Evenly spaced?
> 
> ...


yes evenly spaced. Normally when you first build out the comb you will start 
with 10 to avoid bur comb building but once the frames have been built with
comb they are spaced out evenly this allows the hive to store more honey
in the frames and also makes for easier extraction because the frames are 
easier to uncap.its also believed it makes frames easier to remove.

i like using a feeder and 8 frames in the ten frame hive body because i can 
normally remove the feeder then slide frames across to make it easier to 
remove the frames without killing the queen.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Since we are in the north we use 2 deeps for over wintering such as the middle colony.










We use shallow honey supers for the honey we are going to extract with 8 to 9 frames. 9 frames for when we install cut comb frames, 8 for the rest. 

I tried the 3 medium brood boxes and didn't like it but many do.

I find that removing a frame at a time and putting them in a box already in the truck saves back acheing labor. But I have help running the frames. Lifting the shallows isn't near as bad as a deep and even a little better than a medium.
Mostly what you do depends on where you are in the world also and how much you want to lift.










 Al


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

damoc said:


> ... i like using a feeder and 8 frames in the ten frame hive body because i can normally remove the feeder then slide frames across to make it easier to remove the frames without killing the queen.



I have used the mason jar feeders at the entrance before.

Then removed them half way through the season.

The feeders that go inside, look like they would work better if you were going to feed through the winter. Do the inside feeders resist freezing?


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## damoc (Jul 14, 2007)

actually i rarely use the inside feeders during winter they are more for spring
and fall because if it is to cold for bees to break cluster the syrup will sour
in the inside feeder wasting syrup harming your bees and making a horrible
stink.any feeding i do during winter is done with quart mason jars on tops
of hives and i normally only do that on days with highs around min 45 and
sunny. the syrup seems to keep better in the jars and it may take them
several days to finish the syrup 1 quart whereas they may never get to finish
1 gallon inside before it sours. 

if its winter and i just have to get food into the hive then fondant bags
or even candied honey right at the cluster is about your only hope
or frames of honey placed right next to the cluster this would be your
best bet if you have kept back some feed honey.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

damoc said:


> actually i rarely use the inside feeders during winter they are more for spring and fall because if it is to cold for bees to break cluster the syrup will sour in the inside feeder wasting syrup harming your bees and making a horrible stink.any feeding i do during winter is done with quart mason jars on tops of hives and i normally only do that on days with highs around min 45 and sunny. the syrup seems to keep better in the jars and it may take them several days to finish the syrup 1 quart whereas they may never get to finish 1 gallon inside before it sours.
> 
> if its winter and i just have to get food into the hive then fondant bags
> or even candied honey right at the cluster is about your only hope
> ...


So no watered down syrup as it will spoil.

Just a frame of honey placed next to the cluster.

You say 'Fondant bags'.

Do you mean:

"Fondant is a confection used as a filling or coating for cakes, pastries, and candies or sweets. In its simplest form, it is sugar and water cooked to a point, specifically the soft-ball stage, cooled slightly, and stirred or beaten until it is an opaque mass of creamy consistency. Fondant is commonly used to decorate wedding cakes. This gives the cakes a smooth appearance. It is also called sugar paste, fondant is an icing sugar dough which can be manipulated much in the same way as pie dough and rolled into smooth sheets and draped over cakes to provide a flawless finish."

I thought that bees needed the water content?


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## damoc (Jul 14, 2007)

ET1 SS said:


> So no watered down syrup as it will spoil.
> 
> Just a frame of honey placed next to the cluster.
> 
> ...


the problem they have in winter in getting rid of excess water any syrup
i feed through winter should be as thick as i can make it.
below is a link to bakers drivert fondant feeding
http://www.damoc.com/beefeed/drifeed.html


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## sustainablesam (Jul 14, 2007)

After doing some more research, I am leaning toward using all 8 frame mediums for everything.

According to Michael Bush, the bees move easier between hive bodies and supers. I also like his idea about using a top entrance (no problems with mice, snow, weeds, skunks etc., and better ventilation), and not using a queen excluder. He says queens don't like to lay in the supers if they have enough room in the hive bodies. He also recommends using the smaller 4.9mm cells although it is hard to find especially for mediums.

So I think I will end up at winter time with two or three medium hive bodies and one medium super of honey for the bees.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

damoc said:


> the problem they have in winter in getting rid of excess water any syrup
> i feed through winter should be as thick as i can make it.
> below is a link to bakers drivert fondant feeding
> http://www.damoc.com/beefeed/drifeed.html


Thank you


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