# Got a doe yesterdayâ¦



## Lionrose (Jun 4, 2006)

Iâm so excited. I got a big doe yesterday. Wasnât hunting but the opportunity presented itself. All I had with me (was on the 4 wheeler) was the 22 rife. She was at about 75 yards, so, I took aim and fired. I knew I had hit her, so I went looking, praying I had made a good shot and Iâd find her not to far. Sure enough. she had ran about 200 yards before collapsing. She was a big one, thought I was going to just pick her up and put her on the front of the 4 wheeler lol, uh, no that wasnât happening. Luckily I had a small lasso on the 4 wheeler so I put it around her hind legs and dragged her back to the house behind the 4 wheeler. 

It was late in the day and cleaning and cutting her up took me quit some time. I was glad to see upon butchering that my shot was nearly dead on through the lung an grazing the heart. 

I have a question or two for you experienced folks. 

I have heard um talk about leaving them hanging over night. It would be much easier on me if I could do that. The temps are low enough now it would be fine. My question is what has to be done to the deer to be able to let it hang over night? Iâm pretty sure it would need to be gutted, right? But am unsure if one would go ahead and skin it or not. Seems to me it would get pretty dry hanging over night if skinned.

Thanks 
D


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## Gregg Alexander (Feb 18, 2007)

When its real cold all I do is gut and hang


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## Tad (Apr 2, 2003)

Yes gut ASAP, it is up to you if you want to skin or not but they do skin easier warm. The silver skin keeps the meat from drying out. Some people leave them hang a week. I skin them fast when it's cold nothing worse than trying to get a hide off a frozen deer, but it is probably much colder up here.


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## pheasantplucker (Feb 20, 2007)

Not to be a negative one, but I disagree with your use of a .22 on a deer. I'd have passed on it for sure. Is that even legal where you live? Too risky to just wound her and have her get away only to die hidden somewhere for nothing, if you ask me, but I understand, you didn't ask me. See that you're from Arkansas, and looked up regs. You can't use rimfire ammo on a deer. I'll assume you used a centerfire round, then.


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## Gregg Alexander (Feb 18, 2007)

I have never taken a deer with a 22 but I am sure if I had the chance while say squirrel hunting a freezer full of deer is better than a freezer of tree rat's. 
When I hang a deer it will be over night maybe 2 if staying cold enough. Around here that would be normally in the 28-32 degree range. Deer will still skin out easy.


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## gunseller (Feb 20, 2010)

If I had to take a deer with a 22LR it would be head shot or nothing. One of the 22 centerfires with the right bullet is OK for deer with the right shot. That said congrats on the deer. It will not hurt anything to hang the deer over night. Deer unlike beef do not have enough fat in the meat to improve taste by hanging for several days. I gut and skin right away. If leaving over night the slight dry layer that will form on the meat will not be noticed when cooked. Skinning helps the meat cool faster. 
Steve


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## Lionrose (Jun 4, 2006)

Tad said:


> Yes gut ASAP, it is up to you if you want to skin or not but they do skin easier warm. The silver skin keeps the meat from drying out. Some people leave them hang a week. I skin them fast when it's cold nothing worse than trying to get a hide off a frozen deer, but it is probably much colder up here.


Thanks Tad, 
I was pretty sure it needed to be gutted ASAP, yeah it makes sense that warm is easier to skin then frozen. We are cold enough to keep the meat from spoiling but not cold enough to freeze, here yet. I donât think I could leave it hanging a week lol. Just when its late in the day I would like to, so I wouldnât be up late tending to it. Much easier on me in the light of day etcâ¦



pheasantplucker said:


> Not to be a negative one, but I disagree with your use of a .22 on a deer. I'd have passed on it for sure. Is that even legal where you live? Too risky to just wound her and have her get away only to die hidden somewhere for nothing, if you ask me, but I understand, you didn't ask me. See that you're from Arkansas, and looked up regs. You can't use rimfire ammo on a deer. I'll assume you used a centerfire round, then.


Hi Pheasantplucker,
I assure you, by my states law, I was legal in taking the deer. I was trying not to brag, when I said, (âpraying I had made a good shot and Iâd find her not to farâ). I am a very skilled marksman (woman), and I was 100% sure I had made a great shot. I use this gun nearly daily to dispatch predators. Were overrun with wolfs, coyotes, fox, etcâ¦that I catch stalking my place for an easy meal, thatâs why it lives on the 4 wheeler. I guess thatâs just the difference between you and me, Iâm skilled enough to not pass on the opportunity to put meat in the freezer, even if its with a 22 rifle.



Gregg Alexander said:


> I have never taken a deer with a 22 but I am sure if I had the chance while say squirrel hunting a freezer full of deer is better than a freezer of tree rat's.
> When I hang a deer it will be over night maybe 2 if staying cold enough. Around here that would be normally in the 28-32 degree range. Deer will still skin out easy.


Thanks Gregg Alexander,
Good to know. LOL âtree ratâsâ never heard um called that. 





gunseller said:


> If I had to take a deer with a 22LR it would be head shot or nothing. One of the 22 centerfires with the right bullet is OK for deer with the right shot. That said congrats on the deer. It will not hurt anything to hang the deer over night. Deer unlike beef do not have enough fat in the meat to improve taste by hanging for several days. I gut and skin right away. If leaving over night the slight dry layer that will form on the meat will not be noticed when cooked. Skinning helps the meat cool faster.
> Steve


Hi Gunseller,
Thanks, Yeah I constipated a head shot, (behind the ear) but didnât have a clear enough shot, tree branches in the way. I was very confident with the shot I did take, at the distance I was from her. Yeah thatâs what I was wondering about, the drying out part of it. I left her hanging for a couple hours, after skinning and gutting, while I ran to town after freezer bags an it had dried out some. This one is going to be mostly for jerky so I wasnât to concerned about it slightly drying. 

Thanks for the help ya all.
D


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## gunseller (Feb 20, 2010)

Lionrose
With a 22LR it sounds like you got good performance out of the bullet. What brand of ammo and what type of bullet were you shooting?
Steve


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## Oldcountryboy (Feb 23, 2008)

Hi Pheasantplucker,
I assure you, by my states law, I was legal in taking the deer. I was trying not to brag, when I said, (&#8220;praying I had made a good shot and I&#8216;d find her not to far&#8220. I am a very skilled marksman (woman), and I was 100% sure I had made a great shot. I use this gun nearly daily to dispatch predators. Were overrun with wolfs, coyotes, fox, etc&#8230;that I catch stalking my place for an easy meal, that&#8217;s why it lives on the 4 wheeler. I guess that&#8217;s just the difference between you and me, I&#8217;m skilled enough to not pass on the opportunity to put meat in the freezer, even if its with a 22 rifle.[/COLOR
D[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

Still yet, regardless of how good a shot you are, if it's illegal to use a 22 rimfire rifle in your state for deer hunting then you just broke the law. You might consider deleting the part of your thread that mentions the type of rifle used for just incase. You don't want the gamewardens knocking on your door.


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## TnTnTn (Dec 23, 2004)

Lionrose, congrats on making meat but(and a big but) it was a foolhardy decision to shoot a deer at 70yds with a .22lr if that is what you used. You are indeed fortunate that you recovered that deer imo. Are you in AR and do you have wolves running around in AR? TTT


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## jandersen (Jul 11, 2011)

Congrats on the deer, I live in Nebraska and it is legal to harvest deer with a 22 here.


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## coso (Feb 24, 2004)

Nebrasaka regs


> Rifles* .22-caliber or larger that deliver at least 900
> foot-pounds of energy at 100 yards


None of the ballistics I see even get close to the 900 foot lbs of energy at 100 yard for the .22 rimfire cartridges. 
http://www.ruger1022.com/docs/22lrballistics.htm
Even the 22 mags are only getting about 160.

A .223 will get about 950 at 100 yards, which would be legal. The .222 gets a little over a 1000. The 22 Hornet does not even have enough coming in at 747. The 22-250 and the 220 Swift would also have enough energy.


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## farmerDale (Jan 8, 2011)

Uhh Yeah, we still have not been told what sort of a .22 it was. If it was a rimfire, I am sorry, I cannot congratulate you. If it was centerfire like a 22-250, good job! A lung hit deer running 200 yards though makes me think a .22 rimfire. I hope not. that would be like taking a .222 remington moose hunting. Doable, but illegal and potentially cruel.

I hope we get a caliber... There are several .22's. As far as skinning, yes I would skin, but up here our deer are way bigger, and so cooling is paramount. 

Regardless, you got your venison. Enjoy!


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## littlecleo (Mar 6, 2009)

Having been born, lived and hunted in AR most of my life, .22 rimfires are not legal for deer hunting in the state of AR. Shooting a deer at 70 yards with a .22lr is simply irresponsible/unethical as a hunter. And there are no wolves running wild in Arkansas, unless someone in recent years has started releasing timber wolves into the wild in Arkansas.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

.22 may not be legal but it can be quite effective in the hands of someone who knows where to take a deer. I learned from a man who shot 23 deer in his life and only tagged one. His shot was to have the deer looking at him. He wanted to see the white chin straight on. Aim was just below that. Result was a deer simply collapsing in a heap. His choice of bullet was solid .22 LR, never a hollow-point. That was my father. 

When I could finally put a tag on a legal deer about 35 years ago, all I could think of was if that were the 15th or 16th deer that I'd shot. Not afraid to say so now as I've told it before. Cousin was a warden and always said that he was going to catch someday. My reply was that he might catch me but never catch up to me. (There's a side story about that which I may put on record here some day.) He had the honor of registering my first legal deer in woods since wardens could do that then. Now his son and grandson are my "designated shooters" since Lyme's wrecked my legs. 

By the way, my deer rifle is a "magic" .222 Remington. I can carry that for hunting rabbits and squirrels if I wish. The "magic" part is a converter which allows .22 LR to be fired in it! 

Martin


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## tarbe (Apr 7, 2007)

I wish this whole thread could be deleted.......


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

tarbe said:


> I wish this whole thread could be deleted.......


Why? I rather like this thread. 

Shooting a doe with a 22 LR seems to be a contentious issue for some, not so much for others.

Some folks can kill a deer with a stick and string, others a spear, and for some others it only takes a 22 LR with a well placed shot, not to mention all the recognized favorite deer calibers of rifles or shotguns. Lots of room here for diverse opinions.

Wounding a deer and letting it get away to suffer needlessly is a primary concern I think. But that happens thousands of times a year with those stick & string, spear, or rifle calibers in use. What it boils down to is how good you are at what you do. If you are doing something you shouldn't be doing in respect to inflicting misery on your quarry and not closing the deal, then you shouldn't be out there doing it no matter what your favorite weapon is.


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## coso (Feb 24, 2004)

I could take a deers eye out at 50 yard with a .22 LR. Still does not make it legal, anywhere that I am aware of.:doh:


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## tarbe (Apr 7, 2007)

foxfiredidit said:


> Why? I rather like this thread.
> 
> Shooting a doe with a 22 LR seems to be a contentious issue for some, not so much for others.
> 
> ...



Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. It is illegal in most every place (every place I know of anyway). 

You said "What it boils down to is how good you are at what you do."

Do you really think proficiency makes right? Regardless of the law??

I didn't think so.......


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Crossbows used to be illegal just about everywhere. I can legally use one if I wish. .22s are rifle which survivalists want to have at hand as their all-purpose meat supplier. .22s have fed a lot of poor families in both the North and South during hard times. Justin Wilson used to tell some good poaching stories and a lot of it still goes on among the swamp people. There's legal ethics, which are artificial, and there's survival, which is real. I adhere to both.

Martin


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

22lr has probably killed more deer then any other gun. But a public forum isn't the place to be telling about it since it is illegal in most all states.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

The "Dudleys have gotta do their DORIGHTS":teehee: Anananananananannnnnn....
The Dawgpilers have gotta drop their dawgpiles whenever they get a chance!ound:


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Allen W said:


> 22lr has probably killed more deer then any other gun. But a public forum isn't the place to be telling about it since it is illegal in most all states.


I ain't worried about telling about mine since the last one was 25 years ago. Times and needs change but still goes on. Unwritten rule says that if a farmer wants to take a deer each year, nobody going to say a word. For many years, fine for possession of an illegal deer was $100 and the subsistence hunter wasn't worth pursuing if the hunter wasn't caught. Thrill and market hunters were the ones never tolerated no matter what type of firearm they used and still aren't.

Also, it's been long said that there were several .22s which were made strictly for poaching deer and they were the .22 Hornet and .22 Special. When they fell out of favor, .22 Magnum came along with about the same capabilities. 

Martin


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

tarbe said:


> Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. It is illegal in most every place (every place I know of anyway).
> 
> You said "What it boils down to is how good you are at what you do."
> 
> ...


You can surmise what you will about my post, makes absolutely no difference to me at all. I care little about what you think, whether that is pro or con. How I view the law is also of no concern to you.

I don't think deer care one whit about what law abiding mistake anyone made in their undoing. And since the concensus is that using a 22 LR is illegal everywhere, then I'd also say that most of the misery and slow death scenarios with deer are administered legally.


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## farmerDale (Jan 8, 2011)

Well, we still do not know which .22 was used. But upon re-reading the op, I realize the deer in question was shot "through the lungs and grazing the heart". If this was a .22 rimfire, it is not the best choice of shot placement. But the fact it killed the deer, and obviously got some penetration at 75, I am thinking it may have been a centerfire rifle. If it was a rimfire, ethics of choosing this shot placement is very dubious indeed. I agree with Martin, a .22 is an indispensible tool, and in an emergency, is light, efficient, accurate, and effective. IF THE HUNTER USES DECENT SHOT PLACEMENTS! 

The world record grizzly in the 1950's I believe was shot with a .22 short behind the ear. I know a trapper friend who has taken his moose with a behind the ear shot with a .22 rimfire in a sawed off rifle, while on patrol. Not ideal, but it can work in the right hands. My dad shot his first deer with a .22 rifle in the late 30's. I still have the antlers; they are my extension cord holder.

This thread is confusing, as the author has not confirmed the caliber used. But again, aiming for the chest with a .22 rimfire on deer sized game, is pure ridiculous.


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

I think it was a very lucky shot if indeed that was the case farmerDale.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

> Since this topic has come up a few times recently I decided to look up and read all the states hunting regs and see what calibers were legal in each state. I even added a few places up north.
> 
> If you live in a state and think I got it wrong feel free to correct me. I would like to know where the information came from though.
> 
> ...


http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/whitetail-deer-hunting/227252-legal-rifle-calibers-state.html


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

I think that what we have here are a lot of jealous men who won't admit that Annie Oakley wasn't the only woman who could handle a .22. She has stated that she's an expert marksman and obviously expected the bullet to hit where it did. Choice of location may not have been what mine would have been but then my first one was taken through the liver while firing from the hip. (Ran maybe 100', jumped a fence and came down in a heap!) I saw my mother take a pheasant on the fly through the neck with a .22. Women in the woods became less fashionable over the years and now some states DNRs are trying to get them back out there. I tip my hat to any woman who can prove that she's as good as I was at bringing home the wild game. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Also, *it's been long said that there were several .22s which were made strictly for poaching deer *and they were the .22 Hornet and .22 Special. When they fell out of favor, .22 Magnum came along with about the same capabilities.



Lots of foolishness gets repeated.
It doesn't make it less foolish


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Lots of foolishness gets repeated.
> It doesn't make it less foolish


.22 Hornet may have seemed foolish to some now but it had its purpose 80 years ago and probably fed a lot of people during the Depression years. If one has one in Wisconsin, it's now legal for deer. Looks like it would also be handy in NC if you could find one. In the right hands, it's just as lethal as any .30. First shot one when I was about 11 or 12. I tried to buy it years later but owner had given it to his son who turned around and sold it. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> .22 Hornet may have seemed foolish to some now but it had its purpose 80 years ago and probably fed a lot of people during the Depression years.
> 
> *In the right hands, it's just as lethal as any .30*.


See what I meant when I said this:?



> Lots of foolishness gets repeated


It doesn't matter whose hand a 22 LR, or really anything less powerful than .223, is in.

It's not a *wise* nor *ethical* choice for deer hunting



> I tip my hat to any woman who can prove that she's *as good as I was *at bringing home the wild game.





> my first one was taken *through the liver while firing from the hip*


I think you're confusing "good" with "lucky"


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## pheasantplucker (Feb 20, 2007)

Paquebot said:


> I think that what we have here are a lot of jealous men who won't admit that Annie Oakley wasn't the only woman who could handle a .22. She has stated that she's an expert marksman and obviously expected the bullet to hit where it did. Choice of location may not have been what mine would have been but then my first one was taken through the liver while firing from the hip. (Ran maybe 100', jumped a fence and came down in a heap!) I saw my mother take a pheasant on the fly through the neck with a .22. Women in the woods became less fashionable over the years and now some states DNRs are trying to get them back out there. I tip my hat to any woman who can prove that she's as good as I was at bringing home the wild game.
> 
> Martin


You're reading into it far more than most...this has nothing to do with "men being jealous"...Put 200 deer at 50 yards...Shoot half of them with a 12 ga. slug and half of them with a .22 lr. Which is going to have a bigger pile of venison when the smoke clears. I'm all for women taking to the field hunting, trapping, fishing...if someone practices smart, ethical, and legal means to hunt, I'm the first one to congratulate them. I don't care what gender they are.


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

The legality of using a 22 LR (rimfire) doesn't seem to be in question. The OP didn't say if she was using a rimfire or centerfire, so assumptions are what they are as to whether or not what she did was legal. Same for the ethical questions surrounding the issue. The statements made on this thread about the legality of using rimfire ammunition are pointedly just preaching to the choir as no one I see here was born yesterday.

The law was written to protect the deer. It was not written because it is unfair to a neighbor that someone might take a game animal illegally. No one owns a deer unless they have a high fenced area and have some captured. I'm not going to point my finger at anyone while standing on a soapbox. I'm not a cop nor a game warden, nor a judge.

The case for ethics is one that on the surface is pretty much cut and dry. Hunters are conservationists who are directly responsible (through sound ethics) for providing a platform which provides the abundance of hunting opportunities we have in America. Of course that goes hand in hand with the laws. 

Gray areas between the two do exist for me on the issue of using a 22 LR on deer, and that's the reason I wouldn't call anyone out unless it involved the wanton waste or wanton cruelty to the animals. I personally know several folks who live below the poverty level, in a rural environment. That single lone shot of a 22 late at night, the harvesting of that yearling for the table in a household that needs the meat is not something I'm obliged to complain about. Anyone who needs it and doesn't tresspass on another's property to get it won't get called in around this neck of the woods. Also, that's the only place I feel baiting deer with corn or whatever is ethical....to feed one's family. If I were in their shoes with a family to feed, I'd do it in a heartbeat, and I'd use a 22 LR as the weapon of choice, daylight or dark.


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## braggscowboy (Jan 6, 2004)

foxfiredidit said:


> The legality of using a 22 LR (rimfire) doesn't seem to be in question. The OP didn't say if she was using a rimfire or centerfire, so assumptions are what they are as to whether or not what she did was legal. Same for the ethical questions surrounding the issue. The statements made on this thread about the legality of using rimfire ammunition are pointedly just preaching to the choir as no one I see here was born yesterday.
> 
> The law was written to protect the deer. It was not written because it is unfair to a neighbor that someone might take a game animal illegally. No one owns a deer unless they have a high fenced area and have some captured. I'm not going to point my finger at anyone while standing on a soapbox. I'm not a cop nor a game warden, nor a judge.
> 
> ...


AMEN BROTHER! Wrong legal, but I would side with the family and would do the same if I needed it. I happen around where I live, but I don't have a problem with it if it is for food and they are hungry. I am thankful here at Thanksgiving that I nor my family needs that deer and I am thankful there are not many around where I live that do, but I know there are many out there that do. That is one of the good things about the sportsman for hunger programs in some states.


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## pheasantplucker (Feb 20, 2007)

If you've got a computer and the internet, I doubt if you're scraping the bottom of the barrel. I grow weary of hearing people tell of "hard times, and for their survival." Yes, I could use slave labor too, if I hit on hard times, but it doesn't make it right. Perhaps people are sure shots, and I have no doubt that some people have successfully brought down deer sized game with a .22. It doesn't make it right,legal, or ethical IMO.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I think you're confusing "good" with "lucky"


At 10', it wasn't luck! Used to practice taking insulators off fence posts at 15'. Took a running grouse through both eyes and stopped more than one squirrel in its tracks. Yes, one can actually be that good. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> At 10', it wasn't luck!


Shooting "from the hip", it was luck



> Yes, one can actually be that *good*


One can tell oneself that, but shooting *from the hip at running game *has nothing to do with either hunting or marksmanship.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> One can tell oneself that, but shooting *from the hip at running game *has nothing to do with either hunting or marksmanship.


The only thing wrong was that I aimed the rifle at where I thought the heart should be but was off by about 2". She was stretched out in her first leap from a bed in a windfall tree. The bullet, incidentally, passed all the way through the deer. 

Martin


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

Alot of people underestimate the killing power of a 22. I've killed wild hogs with one because that was what I had and the hog didn't now the 22 couldn't kill it.


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## jandersen (Jul 11, 2011)

I personally think you all are looking for something to ***** about. The lady took one shot and put down her deer. It doesn't matter what she shot it with it doesn't sound like it suffered. Whats the big deal. Now her family can eat for the winter. Once again I say congratulations and happy hunting.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> The only thing wrong was that *I aimed *the rifle at where I thought the heart should be but was off by about 2". She was stretched out in her first leap from a bed in a windfall tree. The bullet, incidentally, passed all the way through the deer.



LOL
Shooting from the hip has nothing to do with "aiming"


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> LOL
> Shooting from the hip has nothing to do with "aiming"


You definitely are picayune today! Three years later I did learn that firing from the hip was aiming but that was with an M1.

www.thefreedictionary.com/aim

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> You definitely are picayune today!


Nope

Just realistic about *proper* terminology



> Three years later I did learn that firing from the hip was aiming but that was with an M1


.

That's "point shooting", or "reflex shooting", not "aiming"



> Quick fire is a method previously used by the US Army for teaching *point shooting.*
> It is described in the following excerpt from US Army Field Manual FM 23-9:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Point_shooting

True "aiming" involves actually seeing the sights and the target at the same time.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bff, we've already established the fact that the definition of aiming a rifle is a prelude to delivering the bullet to the target. Use of sights is not in the definitions. The rifle was aimed at the deer and the bullet directed both at and into it. That aim was quite good, as the outcome proved. One may aim their finger at someone without having to affix a pair of sights to it. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> One may *aim their finger* at someone without having to affix a pair of sights to it.


Once again you are confusing "aim" with "point"

No matter how hard you try to rationalize it, you won't convince me your lucky reflex shot was somehow "good *marksmanship*".


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Once again you are confusing "aim" with "point"
> 
> No matter how hard you try to rationalize it, you won't convince me your lucky reflex shot was somehow "good *marksmanship*".


In case you did not see the link to the English definitions of "aim", I shall do so again. The first definition will be: "To direct (a weapon) toward an intended target. 

www.thefreedictionary.com/aim

Without a doubt, were it you in the same situation, you probably would have been too startled to even think of taking a shot. Besides, you would not have been practicing such shooting for over 4 years after having attended a trick shot exhibition. Firearms in the hands of those people were merely an extension of their hands and arms. After being able to hit a 1" target at 15-20 feet, a 2-year old doe at 10' was like shooting at a barn! You are half right in that it was reflex action since there was little time to think. That's why I aimed the rifle at the general area of the heart. It worked. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> In case you did not see the link to the English definitions of "aim", I shall do so again.


I saw a generic definition of a general term.
*In this context *it's about as accurate as your point shooting



> Without a doubt, *were it you in the same situation*, you probably would have been too startled to even think of taking a shot. Besides, you would not have been practicing such shooting for over 4 years after having attended a trick shot exhibition.
> 
> Firearms in the hands of those people were merely an extension of their hands and arms. After being able to hit a 1" target at 15-20 feet, a 2-year old doe at 10' was like shooting at a barn!
> 
> You are half right in that it was reflex action since there was little time to think. That's why I aimed the rifle at the general area of the heart. It worked.


Were it me, I wouldn't have shot without *actually* aiming, and I wouldn't be deer hunting with a 22 LR in the first place.

When I hunt I use a weapon with a high probability of making a *humane* kill, and I don't take "reflex shots" at anything other than some types of birds, and even then I never shoot from the hip.

One shouldn't play Annie Oakley with *live* targets, no matter how convinced *you* are about your " trick shooting" skills.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I saw a generic definition of a general term.
> *In this context *it's about as accurate as your point shooting
> 
> 
> ...


I guess when you make over 25000 post in a few short years that helps to become an internet expert, do you ever find time to actually do any of the things you are always expounding on?..:yawn:


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## snake35 (Jan 24, 2011)

When poaching deer with a .22lr always take the head shot. Limit your range to 30 yards. Also use C.C.I. Mini-Mags.

As far as the .22 magnum and .22 hornet goes I love them both, but both have been replaced by the .17hmr as the poachers weapon of choice.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

snake35 said:


> When poaching deer with a .22lr always take the head shot. Limit your range to 30 yards. Also use C.C.I. Mini-Mags.
> 
> As far as the .22 magnum and .22 hornet goes I love them both, but both have been replaced by the .17hmr as the poachers weapon of choice.


Headon head shots could have the bullet deflected by the skull. That's why I was taught to shoot just below the chin. Actually seen that happen when my son shot a buck straight on with a .30-06 and the bullet never entered the skull. Killed the deer but the skull was entirely intact. 

Haven't shot the .17 HMR but bet that the penetration would be more than sufficient to do a lot of damage. I've got a Gamo .17 air rifle at 1,000 fps for use on squirrels and rabbits in the city and very careful about where that pellet goes. That's about what .22 shorts are. CCI CB shorts are only 710 fps. At 2,500 fps, .17 would definitely put meat in the freezers. 

Martin


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I guess when you make over 25000 post in a few short years that helps to become an internet expert, *do you ever find time *to actually do any of the things you are always expounding on?..


I've been hunting and shooting for about *55 years*

I've been reloading for over 30 years

My Dad was an NRA certified Rifle and Pistol instructor, and took 2nd place in the state in 22 LR competition

One of my best friends owns a gunshop where I worked for 6 years, where I heard ALL the stories about what "expert marksman" some *think* they are, so YES, I do know what I'm talking about

How about you?


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## TnTnTn (Dec 23, 2004)

Paquebot said:


> I think that what we have here are a lot of jealous men who won't admit that Annie Oakley wasn't the only woman who could handle a .22. She has stated that she's an expert marksman and obviously expected the bullet to hit where it did. Choice of location may not have been what mine would have been but then my first one was taken through the liver while firing from the hip. (Ran maybe 100', jumped a fence and came down in a heap!) I saw my mother take a pheasant on the fly through the neck with a .22. Women in the woods became less fashionable over the years and now some states DNRs are trying to get them back out there. I tip my hat to any woman who can prove that she's as good as I was at bringing home the wild game.
> 
> Martin


What you been smoking paquebot? Hitting a deer in the chest at 70 yards with a .22 is no problem even for us 'jealous men'. If she used a .22 rimfire that was a foolish act without a doubt and she is indeed very fortunate to recover the deer. (I know, I know, Uncle Buck used .22 rimfire rounds he found in the mud at the carnival shooting gallery to feed his family of 14 during the depression so his family would have meat on the table and he never lost a deer or needed more than one shot) If she used a .22 centerfire well then that is no big deal and also easily done and quite lethal.

As far as BearfootFarm- I have seen his posts on here and they are all sensible, well written, and spot on with the info he provides. Don't care if he has 25 or 25000 posts-the info is right-which is often a rare occurence on these internet forums. TTT


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

poorboy said:


> I guess when you make over 25000 post in a few short years that helps to become an internet expert, do you ever find time to actually do any of the things you are always expounding on?..:yawn:


Right. The last thing we need on a discussion board is a whole bunch of posts.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

TnTnTn said:


> What you been smoking paquebot?


Used to be Captain Black Supreme. Really prefer one of the MacBaren's but can't get that particular flavor in the US. Of late, mostly Walgreens Burleigh & Black but will settle for Peach if they're out of B&B.

Martin


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## Oldcountryboy (Feb 23, 2008)

braggscowboy said:


> AMEN BROTHER! Wrong legal, but I would side with the family and would do the same if I needed it. I happen around where I live, but I don't have a problem with it if it is for food and they are hungry. I am thankful here at Thanksgiving that I nor my family needs that deer and I am thankful there are not many around where I live that do, but I know there are many out there that do. That is one of the good things about the sportsman for hunger programs in some states.





jandersen said:


> I personally think you all are looking for something to ***** about. The lady took one shot and put down her deer. It doesn't matter what she shot it with it doesn't sound like it suffered. Whats the big deal. Now her family can eat for the winter. Once again I say congratulations and happy hunting.


I congradulate her also for making a good shot and putting food on her table. The meat will not be wasted. I really don't care how she killed it, legal or illegal. Just as long as she does use it. But, if you do something illegal, you shouldn't post it on the internet unless your wanting the gamewardens to come knocking on your door. I don't know if they search the web looking for illegal deer kills or not, but if it was me, I wouldn't take the chance and post it on the web. 

Just my 2 cents worth. She doesn't have to pay any mind to what I say if she doesn't want to. Nor anyone else.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

DNR people are human, too. One irony of this is that the Thanksgiving Day feast that my wife and I enjoyed today was at the home of a WI DNR employee. Before that, she was a Wisconsin State Patrol officer. 

Martin


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Take notice the lady hasn't been back to clarify the 22LR or 22 center fire. Wonder if it is due to a OOPS shouldn't have said deer was shot with *a 22 of some sort.*

Personally I have a problem with poching and those claiming down and out with todays food banks and all sorts of help even for those home less persons.

Yesterday there were so many chruches in the sorrounding area the wife commented if you had a car and fuel for it you could eat turkey from 10:00AM to 5:00PM. and several even gave a bag of food to those who showed up at the door to take homewith them.

 Al


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Take notice the lady hasn't been back to clarify the* 22LR or 22 center fire*


I've NEVER heard anyone use the term "22" alone to refer to anything other than a 22 Long Rifle unless they were discussing projectiles or ballistics only.

In this context it's obvious what was meant.

The biggest clue was saying "*all I had with me* was the 22", implying the fact it wasn't a "deer" rifle


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

alleyyooper said:


> Take notice the lady hasn't been back to clarify the 22LR or 22 center fire. Wonder if it is due to a OOPS shouldn't have said deer was shot with *a 22 of some sort.*
> 
> Personally I have a problem with poching and those claiming down and out with todays food banks and all sorts of help even for those home less persons.
> 
> ...


Sounds like some really good folks in that area to give to the needy to that extent. But Thanksgiving doesn't roll around but once a year. What needs to happen is that anyone who has completed the approved hunter safety course and wants to hunt, gets a free hunting liscense from the respective state in which they reside.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Interesting little tidbit. Depending upon where one lives, a .22 magnum is legal for deer! Somewhere else, a .223 would not be. 

Martin


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## snake35 (Jan 24, 2011)

Alleyyooper, Would you rather kill a deer or depend on the kindness (welfare) of others? If my family is low on meat I would see no problem with poaching the kings deer.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

So how do you determin which laws are ok to abide by and which you can break. Robbing a liquer store or a bank, those rich people can spare a few dollars I would presume is OK if you needed money to buy food. the couple in jail for robbing and killing the 80 year old woman Wednesday sould be let out of jail too they were home less and needed money.

I sure read a lot of bitching on here about people drawing welfare of one sort or another all the time go get the help if needed. As for Thanks giving only being once a year that is true but nearly every church in the surrounding area haqs a feed at least every week for those in need and the food bank provides a daily feed for them in Flint & Grand Blanc too.

 Al


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## jandersen (Jul 11, 2011)

Everyone is entitled ti there own opinion I personally don't see any comparison to shooting a deer and robbing and killing. If there is a needy family with the skills and means to harvest there own food then the government should have no right to tell them otherwise. As opposed to going to a food bank or welfare they could encourage doing something for yourself. If for some reason " for instance we have a poor economy and an even worse government fixing it" welfare and food banks were not there. How many of those families would survive. I'd say not many. I'm not saying that a needy family shouldn't receive help that's what it is there for. I'm just saying that another form of help could be letting them help themselves.


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

jandersen said:


> Everyone is entitled ti there own opinion I personally don't see any comparison to shooting a deer and robbing and killing. If there is a needy family with the skills and means to harvest there own food then the government should have no right to tell them otherwise. As opposed to going to a food bank or welfare they could encourage doing something for yourself. If for some reason " for instance we have a poor economy and an even worse government fixing it" welfare and food banks were not there. How many of those families would survive. I'd say not many. I'm not saying that a needy family shouldn't receive help that's what it is there for. I'm just saying that another form of help could be letting them help themselves.


Well said.


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## Silvercreek Farmer (Oct 13, 2005)

Funny how most people don't get too worked up about shooting a deer with a 35-40 lb bow but tell them you killed one with a 22lr and they freak out. Certainly on the small side, but as Jack Sparrow says "All that really matters is what a man (or woman) can do and what they can't do."!


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## jandersen (Jul 11, 2011)

Speaking of bow weight this year Nebraska lifted all weight restrictions. Poor judgment I think.


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