# Things we can't replicate



## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

I wonder about things we can't make. If it all goes south, how would you get along without these things, or what do you replace them with?

I am thinking stuff like salt, baking powder and soda, cream of tartar, vinegar.

What are some other things?


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

I guess one would just have to live without. I doubt if the pioneers used baking soda, baking powder or cream of tarter (I;m not sure if we current use cream of tartar LOL!)

BTW, you can make vinegar.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

sourdough would work for bread leavening

salt can be obtained from sea water and also occurs naturally (Salt Lake UTAH)

Mother of vinegar is used like culture just like yogurt

Baking soda is fairly cheap so my guess is there isn't much processing involved to make it.


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## thesedays (Feb 25, 2011)

Ever heard of ammonia cookies? Yes, that's a real item. In the old days, some people used powdered deer antlers as leavening! 

Has anyone here seen "No Impact Man"? He made vinegar, although the product went a bit "off".


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## Pink_Carnation (Apr 21, 2006)

Cream of tarter is the scum from wine barrels. They scrape it and do something to make it white again. So technically you could make it yourself.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Vinegar is extremely easy to make. It seems to be what I can produce instead of wine. 

Salt is dug out of the ground, so there's no worries there. You may have to travel and trade for it though. 

As far as baking, people make flat bread everywhere and I don't think it requires any of those other things. At worst, your "bread" will be tortillas using whatever grains are available to you.


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## Wisconsin Ann (Feb 27, 2007)

Did you know...Packaged yeast is a fairly recent invention. In ancient/medieval times bread was leavened by leaving the liquid out for a few hours? the naturally occurring yeasts in the air settled on the liquid and would be enough for the bread to rise.  

Yeasts in the air are different from place to place, so it's not uncommon for the same recipe to be VERY different from one part of the world to another. 

anyway..so that's how I'd make my breads (and anything else needing yeast)

Sodium Bicarbonate DOES occur naturally in a few areas, and there are ways to make it but it's kinda complicated and I think I remember something about condensing it out using ammonia...?

Eventually there would be a shortage of ammunition and powder. I need to learn how to create my own gunpowder.  I've never actually done it. 

Salt is fairly, well, I guess EASY isn't the right word, but....it's not hard in most areas to find the wildlifes' salt lick. Would take some refining, but it's there. Ocean nearby would make life a lot easier for a lot of reasons...salt included.


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## bluemoonluck (Oct 28, 2008)

I think we'd just have to adjust to only having foods that are able to be grown locally. For example, I can't grow pineapple or chocolate in Utah - wrong climate. So things that are not regional would either have to be gone without, or traded for if possible.


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## caroline (Sep 29, 2009)

We'd get along without those things, although viniger is easy to make, like Ernie said.
I am more worried about how we would get along without a competent doctor who also knows surgery. 

But more than all that, we, the preppers, would be overcome with city folk who have no clue!

I've been doing a lot of thinking lately about bugging out and then in...

I rarely use the things mentioned as I don't bake much except for bread. 

I've pretty much decided that since no future partner has raised his here here----I am going to bug in and live happily with my critters. :grin:


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Wood ashes or lye made from wood ash can be used with vinegar for quick rising bread. Baking soda is mined. There is a mine in NW Colorado. I'd probably just use sourdough.

I've made vinegar. It isn't hard to do.

I need to put up more borax. Not any mines for that around here. Probably need more soda too.

Now, how do you replicate white chocolate?


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## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

Vinegar happens to wine when too much air is introduced and the vinegar bacteria gets in.

Honey is a great substitute for sugar


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

kirkmcquest said:


> Vinegar happens to wine when too much air is introduced and the vinegar bacteria gets in.


Dang. I thought I'd been following the instructions properly, but I guess either something isn't fitting right or I'm not cleaning properly to begin with. 

Ah well. We could have an entire 30 page thread on why Ernie is a failure at winemaking.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Vinegar flies will do it too.


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## Spinner (Jul 19, 2003)

Now is the time to either stock up on irreplaceable items, learn what the alternatives are, or go without. 

We are so spoiled to using modern convenient things that we've lost the methods our ancestors used. They ate healthy food, and we can too.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

Like several have said, vinegar is easy to make and sometimes it's difficult NOT to make. I've also had quite a bit of wine turn to vinegar, Ernie. Some of it has been great for salad dressings and marinades. Some is just nasty. Salt has been traded for thousands of years, so I don't see any reason that would stop permanently. It can also be stored in bulk forever. As little baking powder and baking soda as I use, and as cheap as they are, I could probably store enough for two lifetimes in a five-gallon bucket. And production of those things would probably resume at some point after most any scenario that can happen.

I really can't think of much that I currently use that I wouldn't be able to get or make if we were set back 100-200 years or so.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Cabin Fever said:


> I doubt if the pioneers used baking soda, baking powder or cream of tarter (I;m not sure if we current use cream of tartar LOL!)


Cream of tartar is used in making egg whites fluffy (meringue), is a major ingredient in baking powder, is used to clean copper and brass, and last but not least - that fried fish sauce, "tartar sauce"!
<
<
<
<
just kidding...


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

suitcase_sally said:


> Cream of tartar is used in making egg whites fluffy (meringue)....


Now that IS something I cannot live without! Thank you very much!

Have you ever tried WIHH's Lemon Angel pie? It's to die for. The entire crust is meringue. I'm thinking it's made with lots of cream of tartar. I better start stocking up!


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

Canning lids or rather the rubber to make new seals on old lids. Or if I had to go old school I suppose I'd eventually need to make rubber rings for wire bail jars. 

Food wise well everything that is tropical, coffee, fruit, certain nuts, spices like cinnamon, seafood, veggies. 

Besides making bread using natural yeast spores or sourdough there is a method to make your own yeast cakes using hops. Or you can use potato water. 
Here's a good web page that lists 5 or 6 recipes for homemade yeast Recipe for making buttermilk yeast 

I usually make anywhere from a half gallon to a full of cider vinegar both for our use & for gift giving. I bottle it up on green wire bail beer bottles that Woods buys off the redemption center. Since I use cider that we press made with foraged apples it's a very cost effective was to give something unique from our homestead.
One year I score free apple cider and made vinegar.I would love to figure out how to make plain or white vinegar since I must blow thru a gallon every couple months. Cleaning, cooking, & laundry.


~~ pelenaka ~~


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## coalroadcabin (Jun 16, 2004)

Cabin Fever said:


> Now that IS something I cannot live without! Thank you very much!
> 
> Have you ever tried WIHH's Lemon Angel pie? It's to die for. The entire crust is meringue. I'm thinking it's made with lots of cream of tartar. I better start stocking up!


WOW! That looks heavenly.............:goodjob:


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## Beowulf (Aug 27, 2010)

mmmm... pie.

Actually though, the cream of tartar is not absolutely necessary for making meringue. It just denatures the proteins in the egg whites to make the meringue easier to whip up. Just a pinch cuts the time needed to get to those nice stiff peaks by 3/4.


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

For canning lids, I ordered some Tattler lids. They are supposed to be reusable for years. Good reviews and BWH gave them a good mark.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Cabin Fever, for shame! Posting that picture and NO RECIPE! Now, will you go ask WIIH to post the recipe for us please?


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

[[[....I doubt if the pioneers used baking soda...]]]

Pioneers used (see if I can spell it) Sody saleratous. In short, baking soda.

What I see as very difficult to replace are canning lids, prescription meds, prescription eyeglasses, coffee, chocolate. Spices, tropical fruits have substitutes. Not the same stuff, but it'll do.


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## Vickie44 (Jul 27, 2010)

Even the jars themselves will eventually break or become unusable. I would like to get my hands on a dehydrator they used to use, that was meant to sit on top of a wood stove.
If it was local only I would miss coffee , lemons and scotch.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

oregon woodsmok said:


> [[[....I doubt if the pioneers used baking soda...]]]
> 
> Pioneers used (see if I can spell it) Sody saleratous. In short, baking soda....


I stand corrected. Do you know how they used it and how they made it?


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Vickie44 said:


> ... I would like to get my hands on a dehydrator they used to use, that was meant to sit on top of a wood stove....


I bettcha a creative person could easily make one out of hardware cloth.


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

tab said:


> For canning lids, I ordered some Tattler lids. They are supposed to be reusable for years. Good reviews and BWH gave them a good mark.


If you do use them let me know your opinion please.
I'm sorta still on the fence about buying them but I'm leaning toward not. Way too much OEF (operator error factor) both in the canning process and lid removal. 
Check out the preserving the harvest forum, there was a recent thread about the lids concerning a rubber taste. The OP was gonna contact the manufacture. 

~~ pelenaka ~~


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

Cabin Fever said:


> I bettcha a creative person could easily make one out of hardware cloth.


maybe an old metal bread box plastic removed then hardware cloth shelves ?

I use both a mesh pizza pan & a wirescreen skillet cover inverted on long legged trivets on my wood stove. Doesn't hold much but it's usually when I just want to dry a few sprigs of herbs that I trimmed off of house plants.
If I was really seroius about drying I'd bind with twine & hang off my wooden clothes rack. Could use cheese cloth gathered up like a sack & hung with twine. Apples slices can be treaded on twine and hung above the hearth. 

Sorry for the thread drift.


~~ pelenaka ~~


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

If I can sucessfully using the old style jars, which I have, I think the Tattler looks like a piece of cake.  I will let everyone know how it works.

Some of my jars were used by my mother so they very well could have been used 30 plus times. Working on making sure we have enough for lots and lots for canning.

CF, that pie does look good.

Meds worry me, too. Glasses, too as you can only gear for so much change in your eyesight. I did order a couple of magnifying tools in varying strengths. Also a good magnifying mirror. Although it is scarey to see the wrinkles magnified, it is a life saver to be able to see what is in the eye.


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## JuliaAnn (Dec 7, 2004)

Don't y'all know vinegar eels make vinegar? Get some wine and put in some vinegar eels, and walah! vinegar! You can catch these eels in any stream, lake, or bar ditch. You can tell they're vinegar eels as opposed to regular eels because they taste sour. 

Sorry, couldn't resist.

DH used to haul sodium bicarbonate from a mine in Colorado, big one ton plastic bags of it, looked like huge white feed sacks. Had to drive down into the mine tunnels to load, guess it must have been mined pretty much intact? 

NEED that pie recipe CabinFever. Unfair to post a picture and no recipe!!

Lemons? They are fairly easy to grow on trees. 

Chocolate? That will be very problematic. Plants are available, but the process of making chocolate from cocoa pods sounds too complicated for the average homesteader.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Probably the only good thing left in Detroit, is the Salt underneath it. Window screens make great drying racks. One can string fruit on thread with a needle. A Honey mix can be used to prevent darkening. Some kind of Lime was used for pickleing, but don't know what it was. The Foxfire books are good for these things that will be hard to get. My big worry is the jar lids. Thought about using a hot wax on the rubber part of the lid, also thin pieces of rubber from inner tubes. In countries like Russia,a whole lot was pickled. Now for Ernie, don't worry about makeing Wine,just go for makeing that Still.


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

Ernie said:


> Dang. I thought I'd been following the instructions properly, but I guess either something isn't fitting right or I'm not cleaning properly to begin with.
> 
> Ah well. We could have an entire 30 page thread on why Ernie is a failure at winemaking.


do you have those airlock doo hickeys with the bubble of water?? or are you going caveman with the balloon??


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

So I guess we need a lot of baking soda. I wonder what I am going to use to replace duct tape.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

JuliaAnn said:


> ...NEED that pie recipe CabinFever. Unfair to post a picture and no recipe!!....


Sorry for the thread drift! WIHH is gonna kill me for posting this recipe. 

*Betty's House of Pies Lemon Angel*
(Betty's House of Pies is a famous pie shop on the scenic Northshore of Lake Superior - and if we are within 100 miles of the place, we find a reason to take a detour and get there just for this pie!) 

*Meringue Crust:*
4 egg whites (room temp)
1 cup granulated sugar
1/4 teaspoon cream of tartar :bow:

*Custard Filling:*
4 egg yolks
1/2 cup sugar
3 T lemon juice

and 1 cup heavy whipping cream.

Beat 4 egg whites well. Add cream of tartar. Gradually add sugar -2 T at a time until 1 cup has been added. Spread into the bottom and up the sides of a greased 9" pie pan. Bake at 275Âº for 1 hour. Cool with door slightly ajar.

Beat 4 egg yolks and stir in 1/2 cup sugar and 3 T lemon juice. Pour into small saucepan and cook on low heat stirring continuously until thickened. Cool.

Whip 1 cup heavy cream until stiff, (do not over beat or you will end up with butter) and stir into cooled custard mixture. Pour into meringue pie shell and chill. 

Top with whipped cream dollops and lemon zest. 

Serves 8. 

Enjoy!


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

beaglebiz said:


> do you have those airlock doo hickeys with the bubble of water?? or are you going caveman with the balloon??


A cheap plastic airlock thingy. It all came in a kit that was apparently mislabeled. It says wine making but I think it meant vinegar making.


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## Ryan NC (Jan 29, 2009)

Ernie, Try hitting everything with a 10%+ bleach solution before putting it all to work. Scald your fruit before you mix anything else in to kill anything on the outside. Cleanliness and making sure that everything that touches the wine before it hits your lips is sterilized is the best way to avoid vinegar... All in all it's much easier to make good vinegar than decent wine. lol


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Some goods are so incredibly cheap, and hard to replicate, that it behooves one to get lifetime supplies, now, while the gettings good.


Vickie44 said:


> Even the jars themselves will eventually break or become unusable. I would like to get my hands on a dehydrator they used to use, that was meant to sit on top of a wood stove.
> If it was local only I would miss coffee , lemons and scotch.


WhatyoutalkingaboutVickie! Glass lasts forever. We don't mention the B*R*E*A*K word around here.


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## JuliaAnn (Dec 7, 2004)

Thank you for the recipe CabinFever. It looks like a keeper to me. I'm lazy and the meringue crust looks a lot easier to make than an actual pie crust.

About winemaking--- everything must be disinfected. Bleach solution or sodium metabisulfite. I personally like the sodium metabisulfite because you don't have to rinse it off--just drain your brew equipment and let it air dry. Also be sure to wash your hands all the way up to your elbows when brewing anything. Keep your hair tied back or under a bandana for extra precaution. I've seen plenty of instances where someone was bending over their brew bucket, looking down into it, with their hair hanging down in their face. Oh yeah, that's just an absolute shower of dead skin cells, yeast, bacteria, and other microscopic goodies floating down into your must. I even put on clean clothes, or at least a clean shirt. Not only should brew equipment be disinfected, but the kitchen and all work surfaces should be very clean as well as the person brewing. Campden tablets are your friend, too. I'm all for brewing naturally and without a lot of additives, but I also don't want to risk wasting my precious fruit, yeast, and sugar, which is getting more and more expensive all the time.


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## Betho (Dec 27, 2006)

I'd miss coffee and chocolate!

One prep that I made sure to get was a black pepper vine. I also got a vanilla orchid although you really need a good size greenhouse to be able to actually grow the beans. But supposedly black pepper will fruit indoors, so that's a good prep. A good barter material as well, once the stocks run out. We take black pepper for granted, I think.

I also got a bunch of citrus trees, they were cheap at home depot and I have lemons, oranges and limes on my trees right now.

Salt I doubt would be much of an issue since we live reasonably close to the pacific ocean. I'm sure there would be a trade setup eventually, and it's so cheap right now we can stock up on tons.

I could potentially grow coffee, Baker Creek sells dwarf coffee plant beans but in order to have it on any consistent basis I'd have to have a gargantuan greenhouse just for them, and even then I am not even sure about pollination. Cacao needs such specific conditions, I'm sure if I had a greenhouse I could keep one alive but I doubt I could ever get it to fruit.


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## OnlyMe (Oct 10, 2010)

If anyone would like to stock up on vinegar now is the time. Before Easter (on the 24th) there will be some great sales on it since it's used in many instances to color Easter eggs. Heinz has some coupons out now as well. 

Question - does vinegar have a shelf life? I've been using it as a weed killer when the date passes but figured I'd ask. 

Thanks,
only me


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

OnlyMe said:


> If anyone would like to stock up on vinegar now is the time. Before Easter (on the 24th) there will be some great sales on it since it's used in many instances to color Easter eggs. Heinz has some coupons out now as well.
> 
> Question - does vinegar have a shelf life? I've been using it as a weed killer when the date passes but figured I'd ask.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the reminder. Just went down to the cellar to check expiration dates and realized we're out of vinegar.

I know that you can use pH test strips bought @ the drugstore or a test kit for wine from a wine making supply site. I haven't bothered because I don't use my homemade cider vinegar for long term food preservation.

Here's what I found on a swags search - 
How to Test the Amount of Acidity in a Vinegar Fermentation (using common household items)


~~ pelenaka ~~
http://thirtyfivebyninety.blogspot.com/


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Thanks, Cabin Fever! I never thought to use meringue for pie crusts. Daughter will be thrilled as she loves pie and can't have gluten.


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## FourDeuce (Jun 27, 2002)

Modern smokeless ammo would be hard to replicate from scratch.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

FourDeuce said:


> Modern smokeless ammo would be hard to replicate from scratch.


I don't think I could replicate a modern compound bow either. The components, engineering, and tooling are just too difficult to manage.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

Ammo was one of the few things I could think of, but it's something I don't "use" every day. I have it _available_ to use all the time, though, so it is a concern. I think if there was a very long-term supply interruption, I would have to adjust to doing without it. I can make and use black powder, so that would substitute for some uses, but not all. Air rifles (.50 cal) are a decent backup, but still not quite as good. Between the black powder and air rifles, hunting is covered, and they could be used in some cases for self defense, too. But for serious self-defense, there is no equal to modern ammo. I guess I just need to have enough to outlast most of the bad guys.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

[[[.....Do you know how they used it and how they made it?....]]]

They used it to make biscuits and the rare luxury of a cake. They took the buckboard into town and bought it at the local mercantile. Where they also bought the sugar to make that cake.


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## lonelyfarmgirl (Feb 6, 2005)

My big concern with vinegar is because of pickling. I looked at that link of how to test vinegar acidity at home and the recipe uses baking soda! something we can't replicate. Funny.

So would it be safe to use homemade vinegar for pickling? I know its generally not recommended, but so.


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

lonelyfarmgirl said:


> My big concern with vinegar is because of pickling. I looked at that link of how to test vinegar acidity at home and the recipe uses baking soda! something we can't replicate. Funny.
> 
> So would it be safe to use homemade vinegar for pickling? I know its generally not recommended, but so.



I think if everything went south, and you had to make your own vinegar, You would probably just use the taste test to see if the acidity were high enough. When my grandma was growing up (born in 1906), her mom had a barrel of vinegar. they just added apple juice to it when it started getting low. the mother of vinegar would react with it and give her a nice strong vinegar. Why dont you try making some and see how it comes out compared to the store bought (most store bought ones are diluted)? you can always use it for this canning season.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

I think there are other ingredients you can use to test vinegar strength, maybe lye? Can't remember. I've never tested it before use, other than taste test. I think you can also use a brewing hydrometer to test the cider before fermenting to test how strong the vinegar will be. Sorry, I'm not much help, but maybe you can find more about this.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

Ok, everyone is talking about how easy vinegar is to make, could someone explain to me how it's made?

I try to stock up on salt, since it'll be used for so many different things. Guess I need to stock up on more baking soda too because I give it free choice to my goats.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

Simplest way: leave apple cider in an open jar for a few months and it will turn into vinegar. It may or may not be good. You'll get better results by fermenting the cider to alcohol first. And you'll get even better results if you add some already made unfiltered vinegar after fermenting. This just gets the conversion going faster so there's less time for bad stuff to get a foothold and make it taste nasty. There's something called "mother of vinegar" that's in unfiltered vinegar. I don't really know what it is, but it's supposed to be good. Braggs is a good brand of vinegar to use. It doesn't take much. A couple ounces in a gallon of cider will do. And you can use your own homemade vinegar to start your next batch. You can get really into it and make fancy stuff out of wine or other juices, but this is the basic process.


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## bee (May 12, 2002)

Seems most folks think of consumables as just food ...for me it is anything that gets used up like but not limited too:


Things that are consumable that I can not replace as themselves(only use substitutes) are parafin wax, propane gas, matches, canning lids, all forms of paper(writing, toilet, etc) alumimin foil, anything plastic, window glass and zippers.

Fabrics and clothing would take time but eventually(hopefully BEFORE what I have or can scavenge runs out) could be home produced.

Any sort of drugs and toothpaste.

It is historical fact that at an early point of this countries colonization you burned your old home and sifted the ashes for the nails to build newer structures. Wood was available but the metal products were all shipped in.

It is humbling to pick up an everyday object in your home and back track it in your mind and count the raw products and hands it went thru until you got it.


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## campfiregirl (Mar 1, 2011)

Cabin Fever said:


> Sorry for the thread drift! WIHH is gonna kill me for posting this recipe.


Thanks for risking your life for your fellow HT Fans  My DH thanks you.
BTW, my family is from Menahga & Park Rapids, so Paiva Paiva to you, in case you are friendly with the Finlanders around there ;-)


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## Common Tator (Feb 19, 2008)

Cabin Fever said:


> Sorry for the thread drift! WIHH is gonna kill me for posting this recipe.


Thanks for taking one for the team CF! I'll remember you fondly when I eat this pie!


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## Vickie44 (Jul 27, 2010)

Texican: I had hundreds of jars that I got from a woman who decided to stop canning ( lucky me) They were stored in the shed as it was early summer, the same shed I was closing every night cause a raccoon was lurking about and I did nt want it to get into the chicken corn. One night I was late closing up the shed and my " guest "was none to happy about being closed in for the night . The next morning I found inches of broken glass and a **** asleep in the sheds rafters !

CF Thanks for the pie recipe. I am working on putting hardware cloth shelves into an old bread box, we will see what comes of it


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

thesedays said:


> Ever heard of ammonia cookies? Yes, that's a real item. In the old days, some people used powdered deer antlers as leavening!
> 
> Has anyone here seen "No Impact Man"? He made vinegar, although the product went a bit "off".


I've made Lemon Ammonia cookies...and boy are they gooood. I had to go to a pharmacist and ask for baker's ammonia. 

scrt crk


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## Sanza (Sep 8, 2008)

Vickie44 said:


> Even the jars themselves will eventually break or become unusable. I would like to get my hands on a dehydrator they used to use, that was meant to sit on top of a wood stove.
> If it was local only I would miss coffee , lemons and scotch.


Place a window screen on top of some cans (in each corner) for needed height. Make sure the screen is metal and not plastic though or it could melt. The screen can be used on top of a stove, in the oven, or in a window using the sun to dry the food.


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## Pelenaka (Jul 27, 2007)

Sanza said:


> Place a window screen on top of some cans (in each corner) for needed height. Make sure the screen is metal and not plastic though or it could melt. The screen can be used on top of a stove, in the oven, or in a window using the sun to dry the food.


U can't get anymore low tech than that !


~~ pelenaka ~~


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## AmberLBowers (Nov 28, 2008)

I would worry about DDs meds (deathly allergic to almonds and fireants, we carry epipens, benadryl, etc and she has asthma) As far as the baking stuff, I can make sourdoughbread and biscuits. Sweets would go from cakes and cookies to biscuits with a drizzle of honey and homemade candies (stuff we love anyway). I would dearly miss my coffee, chocolate would be missed too. We like citrus, but it wouldnt be a deal breaker. I've been wanting to try the "switchel" drink that was made when lemons were not available for lemon ade. Ammo would be very dear, and high on the barter list. But, oh no, I have yet to find a Diet Dr Pepper tree...:Bawling:


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## Becka03 (Mar 29, 2009)

AmberLBowers said:


> I would worry about DDs meds (deathly allergic to almonds and fireants, we carry epipens, benadryl, etc and she has asthma) As far as the baking stuff, I can make sourdoughbread and biscuits. Sweets would go from cakes and cookies to biscuits with a drizzle of honey and homemade candies (stuff we love anyway). I would dearly miss my coffee, chocolate would be missed too. We like citrus, but it wouldnt be a deal breaker. I've been wanting to try the "switchel" drink that was made when lemons were not available for lemon ade. Ammo would be very dear, and high on the barter list. But, oh no, I have yet to find a Diet Dr Pepper tree...:Bawling:


I know I have yet to find a Diet Pepsi tree :awh:


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## Vickie44 (Jul 27, 2010)

Thanks Sanza~ Vickie
I am trying to do something a bit covered as I live on a farm and the flies, oh my!


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