# freedom disintagrates in New York



## michigander (Mar 26, 2008)

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...ns-new-york-sending-gun-confiscation-notices/


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Welcome to Obamanation, the leftist's dream world where you and I have no rights and Obama's mobs of fan boys can prey on citizens at will.
A government that disarms it's citizens is no longer of the people, by the people or for the people, it's tyranny plain and simple


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## Hollowdweller (Jul 13, 2011)

I would never live in NY.

However it has nothing to do with Obama.

It has everything to do with the state of NY and the representatives that the people have elected there.

The other thing is has to do with is people feeling unsafe because of the spate of mass shootings.

The people of NY have the power to stop or reverse laws like this. All they have to do is to go to the polls. The people in Colorado sure sent a message didn't they?

The biggest danger to the right to own and use guns is not "liberals" or "Obama" .

It is people who shoot people with guns, either mass shooters or just plain criminals.

When a certain critical number of citizens feel unsafe due to guns there is a call for gun control of some kind.

Also even if they are not really unsafe in urban areas people really have no history of recreational or sporting uses of firearms and therefore are more willing to enact controls that those of us who enjoy guns would oppose.

Many on the gun owning side give the reply that if more people had guns then there would be less of this stuff and that is their answer.

However this is not borne out by the facts nor do the majority of people in more urban states accept this argument.

Recently the bill expanding back ground checks failed. To me a gun owner this was not a bad bill and might have resulted in one or two less mass shootings, but with republicans having the ability to block it it did not pass.

A lot of gun owners thing this was a good thing but I'm not sure. I think if we in the gun community totally ignore and try to explain mass shootings as statistically insignificant and a blip we are unwittingly contributing to a political enviroment that could see more states enact such laws.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Background checks won't stop mass shootings
Registration won't stop mass shootings
More laws won't stop mass shootings
This miserable excuse for a government doesn't want to stop mass shootings, they are good for business.
Mass shootings gives them the excuse they need to clamp down on out rights, it squeezes votes out of simple minded dimwits who don't know anything about guns.
It's about votes and control, this "government" doesn't give 2 poops about who gets shot as long as it's not them.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

OK! Where do I start. I live in New York. It is, in my opinion, one of THE most beautiful States there is. Last summer I camped in the 1000 islands and then spent a few days in a lakeside lodge in the Adirondacks. It is a fantasic place with fantastic people. If you are into the outdoors the hunting, fishing, hiking, camping, boating, skiing is all at your doorstep. I was born here, my family is here and I love it here (sort of). Heres the problem. Our government sucks. We are the least free of all the States. We are drowned in regulations and taxed to death. This is liberalism beyond anything you could imagine. 100%, let me say that again, 100% of all of my county property tax goes to the deptartment of social services. New York is actually two States. There is upstate New York and downstate New York. Upstate is pretty much everything not New York City. Downstate is the Big Apple. New York city and its imediate surrounding area have the bulk of New Yorks population. They have all the political pull and pretty much treat us poor upstaters as redheaded step children. We have vertually no political voice and our only purpose is as a revenue source to fund the downstate social programs. In New York we have been saddled with Governor Cuomo's "SAFE" act. Part of the SAFE act which is supposed to go into effect on Jan 15th calls for background checks to buy ammunition. At this time the State has not set this program up but it is on the books. The opposition to the Safe act is overwhelming, but our voices fall on deaf ears. To understand what it's all about please check out a website started by a member of my gun club. 

http://www.wnytalks.com/


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## michigander (Mar 26, 2008)

Laws don't prevent crimes from happening, just makes crimes illegal.
If a criminal wants a gun he'll get one with out a back ground check and not be concerned if it holds more than 5 rounds.
The point of the New York law is it's one more step to the infringement on our second amendment rights.
If any one is in the wrong it would be liberal media and it's exploitation of crime in America to scare the living bageesus out of an uninformed public and turning a blind eye to responsible gun ownership and self defense


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

michigander said:


> Laws don't prevent crimes from happening, just makes crimes illegal.
> If a criminal wants a gun he'll get one with out a back ground check and not be concerned if it holds more than 5 rounds.
> The point of the New York law is it's one more step to the infringement on our second amendment rights.
> If any one is in the wrong it would be liberal media and it's exploitation of crime in America to scare the living bageesus out of an uninformed public and turning a blind eye to responsible gun ownership and self defense


The only thing the leftist "laws" do is disarm the innocent and makes life easier on the bad guys, Obama's followers


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

JJ Grandits said:


> OK! Where do I start. I live in New York. It is, in my opinion, one of THE most beautiful States there is. Last summer I camped in the 1000 islands and then spent a few days in a lakeside lodge in the Adirondacks. It is a fantasic place with fantastic people. If you are into the outdoors the hunting, fishing, hiking, camping, boating, skiing is all at your doorstep. I was born here, my family is here and I love it here (sort of). Heres the problem. Our government sucks. We are the least free of all the States. We are drowned in regulations and taxed to death. This is liberalism beyond anything you could imagine. 100%, let me say that again, 100% of all of my county property tax goes to the deptartment of social services. New York is actually two States. There is upstate New York and downstate New York. Upstate is pretty much everything not New York City. Downstate is the Big Apple. New York city and its imediate surrounding area have the bulk of New Yorks population. They have all the political pull and pretty much treat us poor upstaters as redheaded step children. We have vertually no political voice and our only purpose is as a revenue source to fund the downstate social programs. In New York we have been saddled with Governor Cuomo's "SAFE" act. Part of the SAFE act which is supposed to go into effect on Jan 15th calls for background checks to buy ammunition. At this time the State has not set this program up but it is on the books. The opposition to the Safe act is overwhelming, but our voices fall on deaf ears. To understand what it's all about please check out a website started by a member of my gun club.
> 
> http://www.wnytalks.com/


Illinois is the same way all their population is in the north east corner , and so vastly outnumbers the rest of the state that every one west or south of cook county and it's 100 miles of sprawl , is treated like a red headed step child , north west Ill is some beautiful country.

in Wisconsin we have just enough of us outside Milwaukee and Madison to not be completely pushed around but it usually makes for a very close election.

the system of the electoral college was set up to protect small states from big states , we may now need a system to protect small counties from big cities.


but the real sell outs that should be beaten call thems selves sportsmen and will sell pistol or rifle or even semi auto shotgun owners down the river so they can keep their fancy over under shotguns . little do they realize their diversion tactic is working against them , those single tigger double barrels have been semi autos since Bill Clinton administration.



I feel if the police need it then there is a justifiable need for the citizens to need it also , after all cops are just too inconvenient to carry with you all the time.


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## littlejoe (Jan 17, 2007)

Hollowdweller said:


> I think if we in the gun community totally ignore and try to explain mass shootings as statistically insignificant and a blip we are unwittingly contributing to a political enviroment that could see more states enact such laws.


 No one in any community has tried to dismiss any shooting as statistically insignificant. The "mass" shootings you refer to are a pure tragedy Those you refer to have offered facts to contradict the liberal medias reporting though.

Sick, demented, and weak minds have been here since time began, and you will not prevent a insane person from doing such horrific things with legislation. They have also used knives, swords, clubs, and any manner of things.

These people need to identified and removed from society. Making it harder for the law abiding citizen to procure a firearm will do nothing to deter a criminally minded person from preying on those he perceives as weaker. Which is exactly what has happened in those cases!


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## I_don't_know (Sep 28, 2012)

I was born in NY. An 80 yr old man put a knife to my throat when I was 5. Three days after I picked it out of a line up; they turned it loose. It sat on a bench for two years and waved to me. I have no faith in the "Ill-legal" system. We moved.
FL is no better, 3 rapes (oh but he is your husband so it is OK) I was unconscious while the "Gutless Wonder" had his fun. Two assaults, the police-farce walked away. 
I was getting my life together, had a job, then my transportation was stolen. The police-farce said it was only worth $600, so it was not worth going after the thieves, in spite of the fact that I got the address of one from a witness, a mailman.
The police protect the criminals. The courts protect those can afford an attorney. The rest of us have the right to bare arms. They will not protect us; we must protect ourselves.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

First thing that AMERICANS should get thru there heads is the people do not elect the politicians. It is mostly corporate American that elects all but the very local level pollinations. Popular vote for president NO way it is the electoral college that does that.
When was the last state level politicians in your state elected with less then several millions in TV, Radio and print ads? Very few of those millions come from the honest hard working AMERICANS. They come from companies like Wal Mart Home Depot Lowe's GE and Wall street.

So who's butt is going to get kissed when bills come up for votes? Sure isn't mine even though I write letters a lot.
I know a bunch of Tea Bagger types that are big *anti hunting and gun rights types.*

 Al


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Al makes a good point 144,000 people or corporations or pacts provide for all meaningful political spending 

that is 144,000 entities and not necessarily American citizens decide who will even get to the primary much less the general election 

it isn't about the top 10 issues , it is about how they can get contracts or favors , or influence laws in their favor 

the one thing you can be very sure about is the majority of them do not care about you me or any other middle American


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

Right now our fight is to remove Governor Cuomo. If we can pull this off it will send a shockwave through the Country. I guess I'll send Rob Astorino another check.


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## redhead89 (Jun 3, 2014)

That's disturbing. While I love the look of upstate New York, the way the laws are presently, I wouldn't consider living there.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

redhead89 said:


> That's disturbing. While I love the look of upstate New York, the way the laws are presently, I wouldn't consider living there.


if you like the rolling hills and fields with stands of wood at the back of fields or whether you like vast country side of hardwoods Wisconsin has a lot of the same look and climate without the majorly restrictive gun laws


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## redhead89 (Jun 3, 2014)

I'll have to check Wisconsin out.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Then there is Michigan pretty much the same as Minnesota, Wisconsin but right smack between the great lakes so winter temps are usually a little warmer in the winter. Those same lakes however make it a bit more humid in the summer but not like Florida.
:banana: Part of Michigan at one time was Wisconsin too. Another thing our governor isn't owned by the Koch brothers of New York either, like Walker. He is a millionaire in his own right .

 Al


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

Just found out that there have been gun confiscations happening in the State from law abiding citizens. Not many yet. I guess they are testing the waters.


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## unregistered168043 (Sep 9, 2011)

Upstate New York is a different world from NYC. You can see that the notices sent in the OP's link are for residents of NYC as part of city ordinance, nothing to do with the safe act ( which is an outrage in its own right ).

Some here mentioned Wisconsin or Michigan but those places do not have the sheer wilderness acreage that New York does. Not even close. It's funny how when people hear "New York" they think "New York City" but when they hear "Michigan" they don't think "Detroit".


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## Twobottom (Sep 29, 2013)

Darntootin said:


> Upstate New York is a different world from NYC. ....
> 
> Some here mentioned Wisconsin or Michigan but those places do not have the sheer wilderness acreage that New York does. Not even close. It's funny how when people hear "New York" they think "New York City" but when they hear "Michigan" they don't think "Detroit".


I think thats true. I don't think there is a state east of the rockies that has the raw wilderness that New York offers, in terms of acreage. I do believe that NY suffers unfairly from a national stigma as people who don't know better believe it's just a giant city.

It's a shame that the city voters ruined it for alot of good states, Illinois has Chicago, Michigan has Detroit, etc, etc. I don't think NY is any different from most states, its happening all around the country. The Safe Act is just the latest.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

JJ Grandits said:


> Just found out that there have been gun confiscations happening in the State from law abiding citizens. Not many yet. I guess they are testing the waters.


But but but....Obama fans swear they are not taking guns away


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

As I understand the situation as it was told to me. A guy registered his so called "Assault weapon" with the State. The police came to his house and told him there was a mistake on the serial number of the gun. He allowed them into the house (big mistake). They then told him that he had a misdemeanor 15 years ago and confiscated all of his guns. He has passed numerouse NICS checks, and a misdemeanor does not limit your right to possess a firearm but he is currently sueing to have his guns returned. So far there are only a handful of similar cases in the State. Like I said, they are testing the waters.


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## Catalpa (Dec 18, 2011)

And I wonder what would have happened if he had refused to let them inside? Massed SWAT teams, tanks, and the 6:00 news bleating about a mad gunman barricaded against the helpful, oh so kind police?


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

Remember the line "I'll huff and I'll puff and I'll blow your house down."
If you don't let us in this is what we will do . . . . . . .

Please remember . . while you are considering. . . all our beautiful thugs carry a ration of "strike anywhere" matches . . . . . .

"Still want to deny us invading this worthless shack?????"


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## dltasig7 (Feb 5, 2015)

JJ Grandits said:


> OK! Where do I start. I live in New York. It is, in my opinion, one of THE most beautiful States there is. Last summer I camped in the 1000 islands and then spent a few days in a lakeside lodge in the Adirondacks. It is a fantasic place with fantastic people. If you are into the outdoors the hunting, fishing, hiking, camping, boating, skiing is all at your doorstep. I was born here, my family is here and I love it here (sort of). Heres the problem. Our government sucks. We are the least free of all the States. We are drowned in regulations and taxed to death. This is liberalism beyond anything you could imagine. 100%, let me say that again, 100% of all of my county property tax goes to the deptartment of social services. New York is actually two States. There is upstate New York and downstate New York. Upstate is pretty much everything not New York City. Downstate is the Big Apple. New York city and its imediate surrounding area have the bulk of New Yorks population. They have all the political pull and pretty much treat us poor upstaters as redheaded step children. We have vertually no political voice and our only purpose is as a revenue source to fund the downstate social programs. In New York we have been saddled with Governor Cuomo's "SAFE" act. Part of the SAFE act which is supposed to go into effect on Jan 15th calls for background checks to buy ammunition. At this time the State has not set this program up but it is on the books. The opposition to the Safe act is overwhelming, but our voices fall on deaf ears. To understand what it's all about please check out a website started by a member of my gun club.
> 
> http://www.wnytalks.com/


Well said! They are still not tracking "large" ammo purchases because the database software is glitchy, and they have yet to define a "large" purchase anyway. We should cut Downstate off just below Albany, and set it adrift - LOL!


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## dltasig7 (Feb 5, 2015)

Hollowdweller said:


> I would never live in NY.
> 
> However it has nothing to do with Obama.
> 
> ...


Agreed. Emperor Cuomo and his goons rammed the SAFE Act through overnight.


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## dltasig7 (Feb 5, 2015)

redhead89 said:


> That's disturbing. While I love the look of upstate New York, the way the laws are presently, I wouldn't consider living there.


I'm leaving NY for VT


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

I'm going to stay and fight. This is my home. I'll be damned if I'll let some liberal elitist run my life.


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## dltasig7 (Feb 5, 2015)

JJ Grandits said:


> I'm going to stay and fight. This is my home. I'll be damned if I'll let some liberal elitist run my life.


I admire that, and I hope my fellow NY'ers don't think I'm a sell-out, as I really DO believe that you CAN "fight city hall." However, until we saw off NYC and set it adrift, we're bound to see things get much worse before they get better.

It's not just the SAFE Act, and I know I can find "rural" right here in NY, but I just don't want to.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

The other day I was reminded of the provisions of the SAFE Act. If I was shooting at the range and offered you to try my gun I have broken the law because there was not a NICS check before handing you the firearm. If we were hunting and I gave you a couple of shotgun shells I broke the law because I am not a registered dealer.

On another note I heard from friends that the police are stopping cars leaving the reservations and issuing tickets and even arresting people for being in possession of un-taxed cigarettes.

So remember, vote Democrat, and vote often, while you're still allowed to.


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## MJsLady (Aug 16, 2006)

Idiots and criminals with guns legally will still be idiots and criminals with guns illegally.
The only difference is there won't be enough intelligent, decent folks with guns to stand between them and the victims. Plus more law abiding citizens will become victims.


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