# A Little Disappointed with Grainmaker Company



## calliemoonbeam (Aug 7, 2007)

A little over a year ago, there were several discussions on the HT boards about the Grainmaker mill. At the time, I did a lot of investigating and was really talking it up as a good thing and said I planned to buy one as soon as I could. It sounded like my findings and discussion had talked several other people into buying one also when their time came.

For quite a while, that particular HT discussion came up as the second Google hit for "Grainmaker", and it's still listed at number five. So I figure they got quite a bit of free advertising out of those posts.

Fast forward to today (well actually about a month ago). I had several issues come up, and it took me a little longer than I planned to buy my mill, but I went to the website to order it. The exact same mill that was $425 in February of 2010 (and still when I checked about six months ago) is now $675!  That's a 59% increase in price, in case you don't have a calculator handy. And the prices on every attachment and accessory have gone up that much too.

I sent an e-mail three weeks ago, telling them how much I liked their product and had been looking forward to buying it and asking (politely) if they would please explain the justification behind such a huge increase. I also mentioned that I knew a couple of people who were having to save up for it, but with price increases like those they might never reach their goal. They have still not even bothered to respond to my e-mail. 

Don't get me wrong, I realize companies have to increase prices to keep up with inflation, but a 59% increase in one fell swoop? It stinks of price gouging to me. A year ago, they were barely getting known and had few customers, and the economy food-wise was still a lot better. Now that they've gotten well known and times are harder they're cashing in.

I really thought they were a conscientious, family-oriented company, but apparently I was wrong or their success has gone to their heads. They could take a lesson or two from My Patriot Supply and charge a decent price while still making a decent profit, fair for everyone while building a good reputation and word of mouth advertising instead of getting to the top by trodding over the bodies of the little people.

I may still end up buying one in the long run, because as of right now I do still think it's the best made and best choice for what I want, but I honestly don't know if I can bring myself to do it or not, and it will gall the heck out of me if I do. So what do y'all think...am I being unreasonable? Would you still buy one anyway? If not, what would you do as an alternative? Let me have it, good and bad, lol.


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## Becka03 (Mar 29, 2009)

59 percent is insane!


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## Just Cliff (Nov 27, 2008)

Just checked the web site. WOW! I was looking for another mill and was torn between that one and the Country living. I guess that about makes the decision for me..


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

It is simply impossible to gauge what factors go into pricing as an outsider. I'm not justifying, but simply pointing out that too many factors are involved to be judging like you are.


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## Spinner (Jul 19, 2003)

They may have kept the price down as long as they could, possibly absorbing the increased costs until they had no choice but to make one big jump. Their cost has probably jumped considerably too. 

It's not a lot different than if they had made small increases over time. Everything has inched up, and continues to inch up daily.

It'll be interesting to find out if you get a reply. Please let us know what they say when you hear from them.


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## Plainswalker (Sep 24, 2009)

Changes to tax and health care law may have increased their overhead. The government can close a profitable, honest business overnight with regulations. Also, I doubt Grainmaker has a monopoly on grain mills and I doubt that there is collusion between the competitors to jack up the prices. You may be able to find a comparable one for less than $675 or a better one for $675.


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## Gabriel (Dec 2, 2008)

calliemoonbeam said:


> Don't get me wrong, I realize companies have to increase prices to keep up with inflation, but a 59% increase in one fell swoop? It stinks of price gouging to me. A year ago, they were barely getting known and had few customers, and the economy food-wise was still a lot better. Now that they've gotten well known and times are harder they're cashing in.
> 
> I really thought they were a conscientious, family-oriented company, but apparently I was wrong or their success has gone to their heads.


I think you're being pretty harsh, considering that there's no way you can know all the facts involved. The commodities markets are extremely volatile right now and you can't simply let your prices fluctuate with them, you have to set a consistent price and you'll sometimes make more, sometimes less. 

If I was to be as quick to judge as you apparently have been, I could say that your first post read like this: "I gave them free advertising, so they owe me". No personal offense intended, just calling it the way I see it, which brings us to the written language, as opposed to the spoken word. It's easy to read things into a situation, when they're not there, or at least not meant to be there. What did your letter to them convey? Not asking you to post it, just think about it. I've gotten letters from customers that I never replied to, because I decided they were in that 20% of people that take 80% of your time.


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## thequeensblessing (Mar 30, 2003)

Wow...listen to some of you. You are some of the same people who are quick to jump at other price increases at grocery stores, oil companies, et al., yet because this is a "homesteading" type of business, you go on the attack regarding someone who is equally disappointed with a higher percentage price increase than I've heard some of you gripe about, even though you may not know the causes behind the price increases you take issue with. It sounds rather hypocritical, to say the least.


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## bee (May 12, 2002)

Trying to look at this from both directions. I can see Callie contacting the company in frustration, after all she has put the company and it's product forward to others so that any dissapointment that these others suffer she may feel partially responsabile for. It is like my friends saying what a great resaurant they discovered and when we get there we have bad service and the food was no great shakes either. My friends were dissapointed and embarrassed for having caused me to spend money and be less than impressed.
Then there is the "spoiled anticipation" factor. Saving ,scrimping and planning only to find that the bar has been raised so massively you/they may never get there. Half again the goal you were working toward?? If it took you 2 years to get to the old price could you/would you save for another year only to anticipate further increases??
Absolutely it is unreasonable to expect NO increases. But,59% is crushing all at once.
Being "only human", I can see myself feeling that the company owes me a reply in consideration of my unpaid endorsement that can be demonstrated to have driven interest at least and sales perhaps. It must be considered that those who deal with the e-mails like Callie's may not be aware of her prior endorsement and never bothered to inform the owners of her recent e-mail..
Only Callie knows wether she feels strongly enough about this to persue it further. I certainly feel she has the right to vent her dissapointment and frustration. Oh, and she may just be in the 20% of the people who bother to tell everybody she meets her reactions to a company/product..both the good and the bad!


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

There's a little Mom and Pop cafe I go to who had to raise their prices, slightly. Being in a farm community even a slight increase is met with great scorn by the farm folk. In my area these guys pinch a penny so tight that Lincoln cries, even if they have 100k in the bank.

Anyway...the cafe put an apology in their menu that says their food costs increased and they had to pass it along. 

I see the same thing on various websites about shipping costs all the time. The only places I don't see that COURTESY is in mega suppliers that care not for employee or customer. (no names here) 

My guess is that IF the email was politely drafted and there was no response that customer service after the sale when it comes to parts/questions/warranty will be along the same level. You don't just buy a product you also buy customer service.

With a purchase in that cost level I would expect a certain degree of service before, during and after the sale. I am sure there are comparable products elsewhere where you also get a personable transaction.

Personally, I won't ever make a transaction that makes me feel upset before I even conclude my purchase. I have been burned too many times to want to invite more shopping angst. I'm either 100% happy or I and my money walk away.


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## kasilofhome (Feb 10, 2005)

I am having to do a bit more looking around. I found a site that had a grain mill that I was going to buy. I live in the contentent of North America. The ad said FREE SHIpping to the Continental America yet excluded only Alaska And HI. I called I spoke with the people there. I explained that Alaska was in the continent. They laughed and I stated that All that would be required of them for me to purchase from them would be for the to discount from the shipping the average amount of shipping that they spend on shipping to the rest of the lower forty eight. They agreed and said that they would need to have me order on line while on the phone and to capture the order number so that they could handle that for me. I was to get and email in just abit. Well that did not happen. Once the order and cc info was there it was too bad for me.

I contacted the cc and explained. the siduation after the company breached thier word. So Still looking One hundred dollars just to ship. 30 dollars discount. (I checked the cost from the shipping point and came up with an average cost, the cost did not vary as much as I thought.) It really is a pain when free shipping in the USA and it excludes any of the 50 states.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Welcome to the New World.

You don't 'save' money to buy something, thinking you'll come out ahead. Inflation will kill you.

Your money is worth less and less all the time. $1 six months ago might be worth 59% less today.

This is a textbook example of hyperinflation lite..... A FRN loses value, so companies raise the prices appropriately. At some point, a loaf of bread will require an entire paycheck.

If you have money, buy stuff you need now... those dollars will be worth less later if you wait.

That 59% increase is only ~10% a month...

Don't get me wrong... I hate it... just realize it's the path our Dear Leader's have chosen for us. If it were me, I'd raise interest rates into double digits, put a hamper on free money, tighten things up, and get back to realityville.


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

Simple supply and demand.

Preping/homestead is not a mainstream fad yet but it is growing fast.

Sorry, but there are allot of "green" and "free energy devices" and yes, even homesteading(think the "urban homesteader" copyright crap) people out there with the goal of making money. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just that it is business.


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## thequeensblessing (Mar 30, 2003)

time said:


> Simple supply and demand.
> 
> Preping/homestead is not a mainstream fad yet but it is growing fast.
> 
> Sorry, but there are allot of "green" and "free energy devices" and yes, even homesteading(think the "urban homesteader" copyright crap) people out there with the goal of making money. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, just that it is business.


While this may be true enough, what harm does it do to put up a sincere apology for having to jack up prices? What harm does it do to send off an email? Are they perhaps inundated with irate emails because they just upped their prices without warning or explanation? Do they even owe their customers that much? I say yes! It's our dollars they are courting, they need to explain to us why we have to part with even more of them. 
True, inflation is more rampant than the feds want to acknowledge, but stating simply that "our costs have increased substantially, and we have no other option but to pass along these costs to our customers" is more than just a politeness. It's a business ethic. Their website is silent about any price increase, however they do brag about greatly increased sales demands and assure folks that supply is adequate and orders will be filled upon receipt.

This is how businesses get a bad name.


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## GoldenCityMuse (Apr 15, 2009)

What Texican said.

It is sad to say, but right now, you are better to purchase on credit, than to save up, because inflation will KILL you purchasing power.

Now, that is easier said than done, especially if your income is variable.

Regarding shipping to Alaska & Hawaii, well, that is the truth, they are much more costly to ship to. May I recommend that you have afriend available to ship to in the lower 48, and than have them reship via USPS. See what the real cost turns out to be.


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

Maybe a phone call is warrented. Have you tried other suppliers?


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

thequeensblessing said:


> While this may be true enough, what harm does it do to put up a sincere apology for having to jack up prices? What harm does it do to send off an email? Are they perhaps inundated with irate emails because they just upped their prices without warning or explanation? Do they even owe their customers that much? I say yes! It's our dollars they are courting, they need to explain to us why we have to part with even more of them.
> True, inflation is more rampant than the feds want to acknowledge, but stating simply that "our costs have increased substantially, and we have no other option but to pass along these costs to our customers" is more than just a politeness. It's a business ethic. Their website is silent about any price increase, however they do brag about greatly increased sales demands and assure folks that supply is adequate and orders will be filled upon receipt.
> 
> This is how businesses get a bad name.


My guess is that they do not HAVE to increase price that much. 59% is a bit of a stretch to attribute to inflation.

More people are wanting it, thus they can charge more for it.

I think they owe their customers a product that the customer wants for a price that the customer is willing to pay. If they are still selling the product at the higher price then it must be priced right. If the product does not sell at the higher price, the price will go down. Supply and demand.

No, I don't think they should apologize for having a product people want and making money from it.


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## NewGround (Dec 19, 2010)

I was thinking of Country Living mil. Guess I'd better buy that one quick...


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

Just wait 6 months for all the trendsetters to decide that making fresh ground breads is a pain in the grits and their mill takes up too much counter space when the next techno-gadget comes out. 

Pick a near new one up on ebay or craigslist for a fraction of the price.

Seriously, fresh ground bread making is an art form and an acquired taste. I doubt that the customer volume needed to jusyify a 59% price jump is made up solely of the hardier of the thrifty set. Lets be real here folks...

That price jump will run them right out of and alienate a potential customer loyalty base as soon as the average people go back to their regularly televised comas. 

I practically stole a gem of a grain mill for the very same reason. Guy who sold it to me had no clue what it was worth and found it left behind by the previous owner in his attic when he moved into his house.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Call country living ask if they have any of thier cosmeticly blemished units , thats what we did i am pleased with the country living mill it is cast but i fail to see how a proper machined sturdy cast alluminum that serves 4 functions , be bolted to the table , hold the grain in the hopper have the staionary disc mounted to it and hold the bearrings is a bad thing , get the auger and power bar 

i looked at the grain maker but felt their was insuficient information to set them apart from the country living that i have heard many good and very few bad reports on.
country living is made in the USA also washingtion state is where the company is based out of.


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## thequeensblessing (Mar 30, 2003)

time said:


> My guess is that they do not HAVE to increase price that much. 59% is a bit of a stretch to attribute to inflation.
> 
> More people are wanting it, thus they can charge more for it.
> 
> ...


Money trumps manners? As long as a business is making money, or selling a product people want, to heck with customer service? Uhm...yeah. Ok. I can see you are one of those "capitalism at all costs" type of people. Me? I'm all for capitalism, but when civility and decency go out the window in favor of the mighty dollar, I have to draw my line in the sand.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

A nice return email would have been the proper thing to do. 2 seconds to say "sorry, costs went up" would have prevented hard feelings.

Find an equivalent mill for less money elsewhere and buy it elsewhere. There are other people to do business with. There are many good grain mills.

It could be a lot of things. They may rely upon a foreign supplier and the dollar has lost a huge amount of value, making imports much more expensive.

They might have purchased a cargo container of the product and not realized how prices were going up until they sold all they had and ordered a new supply.

Costs have gone up substantially: heat, electric, government regulated expenses that must be paid for employees, shipping to get the product from the manufacturer to them. Possibly their rent went up, or their business loan payments.

If you can't find a mill for less money, then that is what they now cost with todays inflated dollars. If you can find a good mill for the old price, buy it elsewhere.


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## whitbywattles (Apr 6, 2011)

Not posting this to defend GM because I was also surprised after I procrastinated in Dec. and ended up paying $675 in March. I did call and they explained that they held out on steel prices as long as they could. I understood and gladly paid the increase before they get more expensive like everything else I'm buying. There volumes are through the roof with a 4 week lead time.


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## calliemoonbeam (Aug 7, 2007)

Gabriel said:


> I think you're being pretty harsh, considering that there's no way you can know all the facts involved. The commodities markets are extremely volatile right now and you can't simply let your prices fluctuate with them, you have to set a consistent price and you'll sometimes make more, sometimes less.
> 
> If I was to be as quick to judge as you apparently have been, I could say that your first post read like this: "I gave them free advertising, so they owe me". No personal offense intended, just calling it the way I see it, which brings us to the written language, as opposed to the spoken word. It's easy to read things into a situation, when they're not there, or at least not meant to be there. What did your letter to them convey? Not asking you to post it, just think about it. I've gotten letters from customers that I never replied to, because I decided they were in that 20% of people that take 80% of your time.


Sorry it took me so long to get back folks, had a reeeaally long day at work, lol, but thanks for all your input, good and bad. That's what I asked for!

I've only quoted one post because I feel it is the most important, but will try to respond to all in general. Gabriel, I'm sorry you think I'm being "too harsh" and "quick to judge", but I did try politely contacting them specifically because I don't know all the facts involved and was just hoping for a little enlightenment. Instead, I got totally snubbed. As HintonLady said, if a company treats you badly before you even buy from them, then what can you expect in the way of quality merchandise and/or customer service after they've already gotten your money? As you said, sorry but I'm just calling it the way it sounds. It seems like your post is based on sour grapes, maybe from getting some bad feedback yourself, and your negative attitude may be costing you more customers than you realize.

As to your allusion that I feel like they owe me or that I expect a discount, both are totally wrong. I wouldn't take a discount if they offered me one, unless they were going to lower the price across the board for everyone. I'm not looking for an unfair advantage and never would. If you followed any of my posts at all, you'd know that I bend over backwards to see things from both sides and to be fair to everyone involved in any situation. 

As Bee said, I only mentioned all the conversations and eminence of those conversations on Google because I feel responsible for other people having purchased one of these mills, and if they have problems in the future I feel it will be my fault. I go out of my way to post and discuss good sellers or companies and definitely do that many, many times more than I complain or say something negative. Yet you don't think I should mention the ones who turn out to not be so good? I feel that would be pretty hypocritical and irresponsible on my part. 

I do see both sides of the issue and agree that they have a perfect right to raise their prices as costs go up, of course! But again, I find it hard to believe they could have gone up that much and if not then I feel they're taking advantage of the current political and social climate, when they advertise as being a caring, homesteading type business, and the two just don't mesh in my mind. As others have said, it's getting to be the new world order to just expect to pay more and get less, but in my mind a little good will goes a long way toward enhancing your reputation and costs nothing but a few seconds of your time. I specifically sent an e-mail instead of calling because I thought that would be less interruptive of their day and would give them time to compose a reply at their leisure, since they claim to be a small, family-operated business.

There's an old saying, and I can't remember exactly how it goes, but something like "Make a customer happy and they'll tell 10 people - make them unhappy and they'll tell 100." That is definitely not my philosophy, but it does seem to hold some truth in general. As I said, I go out of my way to promote companies with good prices and service, but I have to live with my conscience (something not many people seem to have any more unfortunately). The posters here at HT restore my faith in humanity when I feel like I'm the only one left with one, lol. However, I do feel like I gave the company adequate time for a reply, any reply, and didn't get one. 

I've decided I'll definitely be purchasing from another company, and I post this as an open apology to anyone who may have purchased a mill from them based on my recommendations, in case you have problems in the future. I can only hope their product is as good as their claims so that will never happen. Thanks for your input everyone, I truly appreciate it!


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

Nice post.  I purchased a Country Living Mill. Unknown if they have spiked in price. As gcp, iirc, posted, not imported either.


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## Gabriel (Dec 2, 2008)

Callie, I hope you know that no offense was intended. My only intent was to show that the internet lends itself to misunderstandings. Having run a business where customers constantly complained about rising prices (and refused to accept the honest explanations given) I'm basically out of patience. Was it nice of them to do what they did? No, of course not. But I think the lions share of the blame lies with the Federal Reserve jacking the money supply out of sight. I'm pessimistic enough that it never occurred to me to complain online, I just grit my teeth and move on. 



> I can see you are one of those "capitalism at all costs" type of people. Me? I'm all for capitalism, but when civility and decency go out the window in favor of the mighty dollar, I have to draw my line in the sand.


Drawing your line in the sand *is* capitalism.


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## thequeensblessing (Mar 30, 2003)

Gabriel said:


> Drawing your line in the sand *is* capitalism.


Hence my statement that I'm all for capitalism.  I'm also all for customer service that goes above and beyond. 
We too have an internet-based business, and without bending over backward for customer satisfaction (which doesn't equate to getting screwed, but does equate to good ethics, communication, and decency), we'd be no different than the competition.


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## calliemoonbeam (Aug 7, 2007)

Gabriel, no offense taken and hopefully none given either. I asked for all opinions and I meant it. I didn't expect everyone to agree with me, and I was honestly interested in all opinions, or I wouldn't have posted.

With the way things are going and as things get worse, there may come a time when I'm forced to just accept the "pay more, get less" concept due to no other alternatives, but for now since I DO still have those alternatives, I choose to spend my money with companies with quality merchandise, fair prices AND good customer service. If I had a business selling to the public, that's how I'd handle it myself, and it's what I expect from companies I purchase from...at least as long as there are still companies like that around, lol. 

Thanks again everyone, I really appreciated all your input!


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## Owldancer (Jun 24, 2010)

calliemoonbeam which one are you going to purchase instead?


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## calliemoonbeam (Aug 7, 2007)

I'm going to do some more research to see if anything new has come out since my last bout, lol. I research every large-dollar purchase to death before making a decision.  

But if I had to pick right now today, with no further info, I'd probably go for the Country Living mill. It's the one I had pretty much picked before I discovered the Grainmaker. But please...don't buy it based on my statement! 

Do your own research! Everyone's needs and expectations are different, and of course everyone's budget is different. Plus I haven't read a word about it in a year, and a lot can change in that time (see above, lol). 

Pleasant Hill Grain is a good site to look at mills and compare, if you haven't been there before: http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/index.aspx

Hope this helps.


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## NewGround (Dec 19, 2010)

I bought CLGM. The cost was up about $50 since I last checked. I'm sure it'll do the job based on other reviews I've read.


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## survival (May 20, 2011)

I was just doing some research on these mills, and found a blog post directly from the company explaining the price increase and the reason. It is directly due to increased steel costs, and why is that of any surprise in a commodities bull market.

I agree that maybe the company should have emailed you back, but on the flip side it's really easy to lose or miss an email. Why not just phone them? - they have an 800 number advertised on their site.

The blog post where they talk about the price increase is here.


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## GrainMaker (Jul 20, 2011)

> "I sent an e-mail three weeks ago, telling them how much I liked their product and had been looking forward to buying it and asking (politely) if they would please explain the justification behind such a huge increase. I also mentioned that I knew a couple of people who were having to save up for it, but with price increases like those they might never reach their goal. They have still not even bothered to respond to my e-mail.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I realize companies have to increase prices to keep up with inflation, but a 59% increase in one fell swoop? It stinks of price gouging to me. A year ago, they were barely getting known and had few customers, and the economy food-wise was still a lot better. Now that they've gotten well known and times are harder they're cashing in.
> 
> ...


In response to economic changes and price increases for steel and other materials in the past decade we could no longer keep the GrainMaker and its accessories at their previous prices. The welfare of our labor force had to be included in this decision because it is their hard work, labor and expertise that go in to each mill we create by hand. We have even switched to full in-house production to save on costs and increase the quality of these mills. We did strive to make this as painless a process as possible, and the no interest layaway option is still available on all the new mills. Each mill is still serialized and meets all ISO standards. 
There were improvements to the mill over the last 12 years that were not compensated by the price and finally we did reach a breaking point. However we did not feel comfortable changing the price without improving the mill again. The only changes that were made were at the requests of our customers. We have increased the Hopper from 4 cups to 6 cups as well as increased the pulley from 10" to 12". We did not want to increase our prices without adding some value to the mills.
We did our best not to shock or surprise our customers. We did not rush into this decision nor did we take it lightly. If you had previously contacted us (up to three years prior) for a brochure we sent out post cards/fliers. It was posted on our website for over a month beforehand as well as on our blog. When people called in we talked to them about it over the phone and the response was massive. There was such a massive amount of traffic coming in to the shop we added a phone line, hired a new customer service agent and crashed our email server twice and the company that handled our email server was also responsible for a crash to the email sever as well as on our website and we extended the date at which we raised our prices by five days due to these unforeseen events. 
These will still be the sturdiest, heirloom quality grain mills you've come to know and expect from us here at GrainMaker and Bitterroot Tool & Machine. This guarantee still covers the ENTIRE mill including the burrs. 

To CallieMoonbeam of Oklahoma: 
Within your short message the only request was for an explanation on the price jump. Also, within this message you made a statement that you had already recommend our product on message boards of over 20,000 members. You expressed your great disappointment in no longer being able to afford one yet you never called or contacted us about any payment plans that we could have worked out for you at no interest or extra cost to you. You closed your first and only short message with: "Just very disappointed and will not be recommending your mill to anyone else, sorry." 
You initially sent a brochure request form on our website, not a direct email to Bonnie. It was placed at 9:25:21PM on 4/21/2011 Bonnie sent a 2 page response on 4/22/[email protected] 10:04:31AM. In Bonnie's detailed response she outlined the price increase in its entirety starting with the original idea for buying her own grain mill in 1998. 
You did not contact us again after that according to my database as well as Bonnie's. I do have copies of these emails at your request. I can even post them on our Blog or Website if you like. With contact info removed for your privacy of course.

We do understand that emails to get lost and had more than one attempt been made to contact us I'm sure we would have been able to answer your questions more fully as well as been able to work with you in a way that was comfortable for all parties. We love encouraging people to keep an open dialogue with us. We work with many people to make sure they can afford one of our grain mills and we keep in touch. 
We encourage anyone who reads this to please feel free to email or call us. 
~ Wendy 
Webmaster
Email: Bonnie: [email protected] or Wendy: [email protected]
Toll Free: 1.855.777.7096 
Local: 1.406.777.7096


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## GrainMaker (Jul 20, 2011)

Also please note; We are in the process of building an Economy Sized Mill. We have had many requests for a smaller mill over the years and we wanted to make it as affordable as possible while maintaining our high standard of quality. You can read more about it if you follow this link to our site GrainMaker.com. You will find information on the new #35 Mill. It is available for pre-order. If you would like to pre-order it with a clamp please call or email us.


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## mypatriotsupply (Jan 21, 2009)

I try to remain un-opinionated a lot of the time on the forums because chances are someone will always disagree with your opinion and when operating a business you don't want to rub anyone the wrong way.

But I have to say something in my gut just doesn't feel right about the way GrainMaker responded to the issue. 

There are times where you have to publicly address customer concerns/complaints. There are also times where customers may be way out in left field.

The beginning of your reply made a lot of sense. You spoke of economic changes, the improvements you made to your product, and as I was reading along I was fairly impressed. Then it changed tones and almost sounded like you were trying to not address the original question/concern but that you were trying to make Callie appear stupid or uninformed.

What really bothered me was the offer to post email communications on your blog or web site. You did offer to remove personal information, but I see nothing in this entire exchange that would need a public appearance on your web site. It really bothered me that a company would even offer to post emails from its customers in a public forum like that. What would be the purpose of that offer, except to further display to the customer or any anyone reading what I initially felt which is that you were trying to discredit and condescend this person. 

Offering to post a statement regarding the reasons for the price increase, similar to what was done here, would have been great. But offering to post email exchanges...that reeks to me in the sense I can only compare to a newbie eBay seller who insanely responds to their first negative feedback and goes on the offensive.

One thing I know about the user in question is that she does a great service for the internet community and fellow online shoppers by reviewing a lot of her purchases online. Like any reviews these are her opinions, and they are bound to be positive at times and at others negative. 

Perspective and professionalism should be maintained.

These are just my humble opinions.


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## teresab (May 25, 2005)

Well said Mypatriotsupply .


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## GoldenCityMuse (Apr 15, 2009)

I thought grainmakers response was good. They were addressed by the OP, and then replied to her. 
I'm not in the market for a mill either way, so again I say, look to the CONgress and Whitehouse and Federal Reserve for those who are destroying the USD.


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## NicoleandBrian (Feb 1, 2006)

Agreed, Mypatriotsupply. The explaination of the price increase was nice to post but the rest should have been a personal correspondence between the company and Callie.


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## mightybooboo (Feb 10, 2004)

OK,so I'll chime in too,it could have been better handled,to be honest my thought was I can go elsewhere,so maybe she should reconsider in the future. 

I know I can get my buttons pushed and respond harshly,*SOMETIMES* I go back and delete entire posts,so I see and understand the frustration.


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## Stephen in SOKY (Jun 6, 2006)

GrainMaker said:


> In response to economic changes and price increases for steel and other materials in the past decade we could no longer keep the GrainMaker and its accessories at their previous prices. The welfare of our labor force had to be included in this decision because it is their hard work, labor and expertise that go in to each mill we create by hand. We have even switched to full in-house production to save on costs and increase the quality of these mills. We did strive to make this as painless a process as possible, and the no interest layaway option is still available on all the new mills. Each mill is still serialized and meets all ISO standards.
> There were improvements to the mill over the last 12 years that were not compensated by the price and finally we did reach a breaking point. However we did not feel comfortable changing the price without improving the mill again. The only changes that were made were at the requests of our customers. We have increased the Hopper from 4 cups to 6 cups as well as increased the pulley from 10" to 12". We did not want to increase our prices without adding some value to the mills.
> We did our best not to shock or surprise our customers. We did not rush into this decision nor did we take it lightly. If you had previously contacted us (up to three years prior) for a brochure we sent out post cards/fliers. It was posted on our website for over a month beforehand as well as on our blog. When people called in we talked to them about it over the phone and the response was massive. There was such a massive amount of traffic coming in to the shop we added a phone line, hired a new customer service agent and crashed our email server twice and the company that handled our email server was also responsible for a crash to the email sever as well as on our website and we extended the date at which we raised our prices by five days due to these unforeseen events.
> These will still be the sturdiest, heirloom quality grain mills you've come to know and expect from us here at GrainMaker and Bitterroot Tool & Machine. This guarantee still covers the ENTIRE mill including the burrs.
> ...


I've read this post 3 or 4 times and still fail to see an actual apology for the breakdown in communication. I do see that Grainmaker feels Callie should have tried more than once to contact them: "...had more than one attempt to contact us been made..." But I don't see anywhere that Grainmaker indicates they're sorry for their failure to respond to an email they obviously received.


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## partndn (Jun 18, 2009)

I'd have to agree with MPS and the others with that opinion.

We even have private messaging here in the forum if GM had no other contact method.

What's really sad is.. I found this forum completely by accident several years ago while searching the web for ginding wheat berries. At that time I had my heart set on a Country Living Grain Mill. Expensive, but looked like a life long worthy investment. (I still don't have a mill yet, but it's on my list!

Unfortunately I had missed the Grain Maker and didn't even know about it until recently. I was just thinking it looked even more long lasting and able than the CLM. Even if it's just a wish list, I was gonna change my choice. Now I have a sour taste due to that post above.


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## melco (May 7, 2006)

Wow, I would have to think twice about doing business with a company that would respond to me in the manner displayed here. The way I recall being told by a boss of many years gone by is "The customer is always right, or at least act like they are". Wow.


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## kirkmcquest (Oct 21, 2010)

A business exists for one purpose...to make money. They will charge as much as people are willing to spend. Supply and demand dictate prices, not family values or conscientious intentions.

They are free to ask whatever they want, and we are free to buy elsewhere.


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## partndn (Jun 18, 2009)

kirkmcquest said:


> A business exists for one purpose...to make money. They will charge as much as people are willing to spend. Supply and demand dictate prices, not family values or conscientious intentions.
> 
> They are free to ask whatever they want, and we are free to buy elsewhere.


You didn't read page 2 didga?


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

mypatriotsupply said:


> I try to remain un-opinionated a lot of the time on the forums because chances are someone will always disagree with your opinion and when operating a business you don't want to rub anyone the wrong way.
> 
> But I have to say something in my gut just doesn't feel right about the way GrainMaker responded to the issue.
> 
> ...


I used to have to write response letters and respond to calls to people who complained about their experiences in theatres. While I would have been less detailed, I am not seeing anything terribly unprofessional, just someone a little new at the task and rough around the edges.

My best guess is that the company email in response went astray or went un-knowingly into a spam folder. The thrust of the original complaint was twofold - price increase, and lack of response to an email inquiring why.

The price increase was explained quite well. The response to the "missing" email, would have been much more simply covered by stating that a response was sent to the email of such and such date, on thus and so date, and asking if a second copy was needed.

I have a customer in the Caribbean who regularly does not get all my emails. If I send an attachment of any kind, non-delivery is a given. Stuff like this happens. The "you didn't" "I did" argument can seem justified on both sides, but it really is irrelevant. The OP jumping on it without a second attempt to communicate was a little premature, IMO, but I can understand the frustration.

There ARE times when a company is better off disclosing what they know and even telling the "customer" to take a hike. I had to deal with a family who had made a habit of ripping off movie theatres by a clever way of swapping auditoriums, getting kicked out, complaining, and threatening. I happened to be at one location when they pulled their stunt, and watched how the management team handled it, and then I grabbed copies of the computerized audit trail and made some notes. When the inevitable letter came, I fired off with both barrels, not only suggesting possible legal action of our own, but banning them from our theatres and giving notice that I was notifying the competition of their ruses. Many customers don't understand how much audit data is available to many companies. I myself keep copies of every business email for at least seven years. Obviously, a single missing email does not rise to that level of response.

I don't see major fault from either of the parties involved, just miscommunication and some hard feelings based in that and economic realities. Wonder what they should do... :kiss:


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## FarmerGreen (Dec 11, 2007)

I bought the CLGM last year just before I heard of the GM. I believe the prices were $409 and $475. The GM looked a little better for the difference in price, but I'd already got the CL. Right now the CL is still $409, although you can get it from many distributors for $395 shipped. I've read somewhere that the CL is going up a little shortly, but they haven't yet. We have no complaints at all with the CL. Just my 2 cents worth.


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## GrainMaker (Jul 20, 2011)

If my response seemed unprofessional I apologize. It was my heartfelt desire to defend the company that treats it's workers with such respect and care. I have been in retail for nearly a decade and I have not found anyone who puts such importance and pride in the customer service as Bonnie and Randy. I respect them greatly and I feel very loyal to them as I always know I can trust them. 

Bonnie and Randy Jones have the utmost respect and care for their customers and Bonnie tries to reply to every email personally. The only times she does not is when she is out of the office ill or taking care of her family. Therefore: We save all communications such as email so we can stay informed of customer's want's needs and concerns. I remember the email specifically and was hard pressed to find it. It took a while but I was able to pull it up. I wanted her to see that we had not snubbed or slighted her in any way and that she did receive a detailed, timely and considerate response. I only offered to provide them to calliemoonbeam in case she would like to see them and make sure they were hers, it would have been private and set up so no one could publicly view it and then promptly removed from the server. 

I sent the reply on the public forum when I should have sent that directly to her in a PM and that is my mistake as I rarely use forums and I am learning this particular form of communication. I apologize for the tone that was inferred from that statement and any poor reflection that may have cast on my self or my company. Please know that I truly meant no disrespect but to simply address the issue head on and in a direct manner.


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

more options you might try here.

http://www.csbellco.com/hand-grist-mill-2.asp


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

heres the model i have and it does wet stuff.if you wanna do corn like in lime water you need a mill that does wet materials.

http://www.csbellco.com/grist-mill-la-milpa-packages.asp

this one is adjustable and can hull sunflower out too..not sure waht price is on them now .


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

tons of toys here for us do it ourselves people

http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/


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## Trisha in WA (Sep 28, 2005)

GrainMaker said:


> If my response seemed unprofessional I apologize. It was my heartfelt desire to defend the company that treats it's workers with such respect and care. I have been in retail for nearly a decade and I have not found anyone who puts such importance and pride in the customer service as Bonnie and Randy. I respect them greatly and I feel very loyal to them as I always know I can trust them.
> 
> Bonnie and Randy Jones have the utmost respect and care for their customers and Bonnie tries to reply to every email personally. The only times she does not is when she is out of the office ill or taking care of her family. Therefore: We save all communications such as email so we can stay informed of customer's want's needs and concerns. I remember the email specifically and was hard pressed to find it. It took a while but I was able to pull it up. I wanted her to see that we had not snubbed or slighted her in any way and that she did receive a detailed, timely and considerate response. I only offered to provide them to calliemoonbeam in case she would like to see them and make sure they were hers, it would have been private and set up so no one could publicly view it and then promptly removed from the server.
> 
> I sent the reply on the public forum when I should have sent that directly to her in a PM and that is my mistake as I rarely use forums and I am learning this particular form of communication. I apologize for the tone that was inferred from that statement and any poor reflection that may have cast on my self or my company. Please know that I truly meant no disrespect but to simply address the issue head on and in a direct manner.


Well said.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

I believe you have spent plenty of time and effort explaining things! Although i can't afford one of your mills, it don't keep me from respecting a good company and their products!


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## debbiekatiesmom (Feb 24, 2009)

i have the wonder junior deluxe grain mill(?). it is well-made, has both stone and steel burr heads. and the price is very reasonable, $219, for anyone that can't afford those rocketing prices of the other mills. 
got mine from breadbecker's from another ht'ers recommendation.(http://www.breadbeckers.com/store/pc/Wonder-Junior-DELUXE-Grain-Mill-9p1887.htm) 

no way could i afford to pay that other price when there are so many other things i am needing right now. i am not affiliated in any way w them either. i can buy a lot of wheat w that extra money.


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## ghmerrill (Feb 22, 2011)

elkhound said:


> tons of toys here for us do it ourselves people
> 
> http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/


I just purchased a bosch mixer from them, and the grain mill attachment. I had a question, so had to call them after I placed the order. Fantastic company.


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## partndn (Jun 18, 2009)

I believe GrainMaker's response in post 47 was excellent.


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## DENALI (Mar 25, 2008)

Anyone ever done a head to head comparison of the CLGM and the grain maker? Which one will produce the best bread flour?


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## GrainMaker (Jul 20, 2011)

DENALI said:


> Anyone ever done a head to head comparison of the CLGM and the grain maker? Which one will produce the best bread flour?


http://homeplaceearth.wordpress.com/2011/05/03/grain-mill-comparison-country-living-vs-grainmaker/

This is a good one that we received. Cindy used a CLGM for years and now has a GrainMaker. I also created a page just for reviews. There was a great customer who wrote a couple of reviews and informational word documents. 

This is our page: Independent Reviews

The Milling Documents Direct links(These are word documents on our server):
Grain Mill Comparison Word Doc.1
Why Grind your Own Flour? Word Doc.2

Also we have a comparison chart. Here: Why GrainMaker? There is a response to the Good and Ugly Blog post below that chart. I know that is a lot of links to follow but I hope that it can give you the information you are looking for.


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