# Hiding cash



## WoolyBear (Nov 9, 2011)

I have a friend that wants to hide some cash in their house. While talking about hiding places we also talked about "what if there was a fire". What type of containers are fire proof? When I did a google search I found a fireproof bag - are these adequate to protect paper money from fire?
http://www.amazon.com/FIRE-PROOF-POUCH-Resistant-fire-retarding/dp/B00FIXOIWK/ref=pd_cp_hi_0


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## farmerDale (Jan 8, 2011)

A safe?


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## JoeKan (Feb 4, 2006)

I believe your frig will work fine, especially the freezer.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

Not much will protect cash from a fully involved fire. Besides, when your house is on fire is a time that you're going to want the cash and not be able to get to it. Hide it outside the house.


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## palm farmer (Jan 3, 2014)

unless the freezer thaws, had some local dopers lose a couple hundred k when their meat freezer defrosted and sat for a week or two in the south Tx heat.
if i was of a mind to hide cash, id seal it in some pvc pipe with some sillica gel and bury it, set potted plant or garden gnome on top


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## unregistered29228 (Jan 9, 2008)

Thieves make a living from stealing, and they know to look in freezers, underside of drawers, toilet flush box and any other "clever" place we think of hiding things. Lots of handy tips are on the Internet, which thieves can read just like we do.

http://www.thesimpledollar.com/twenty-places-to-hide-money-at-home-besides-under-your-mattress/

I agree with the "hide it outside" advice - nobody will be able to check all the places you could use outside, especially if you bury it. Just make sure the container is totally weather proof and have the money double sealed in ziplocks just to make sure.


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## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

Having lost a house to fire, I can tell you freezers, fridge, etc ain't a good place. I didn't have any money in em, but everything inside was destroyed, as was the fire boxes I had, the boxes and contents were holding shape until touched and went to ash.
A house in the country is just not likely to be put out. No less than four fire depts responded to mine, in less than 2 hours there was nothing but a good hot bed of coals.
If something had been buried close to the house it would have been gone too I think. Shrubs and trees within 50 feet were killed or damaged or consumed.
Plus, after a fire, landmarks are lost or destroyed. After a major storm same thing happens." Under the Oak" don't work when the Oak is gone.
I see a need for ready cash as well, just don't know a really safe place to hide/put it where it can't be lost, stolen or destoyed.
Ed


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## ovsfarm (Jan 14, 2003)

Thanks, Whiterock. That is what I remembered hearing from somewhere, but couldn't remember where. Seems like I also read that the US Treasury will replace mutilated money if you can provide enough of the ash and damaged bills for them to verify how much was there. I think they can "read" the little metal filaments that remain or some such other traces and see how much was lost.

If you are going to store cash away for a good, long period of time, you might want to actually launder it first. In the laundry, I mean. Because a disgusting amount of food, bacteria, fecal matter, and other nasty stuff is on cash. And if you put that in a dark place with little ventilation, hideous germs multiply and the whole stack starts to stink to high Heaven over time. 

However, most money is well able to stand up to a spin through a typical laundry cycle. Try it with a $1 bill first to be sure your water and detergent won't hurt it. I discovered this with the many small bills that have hidden in pockets that I have accidentally washed. They come out much cleaner and don't reek after a few years in storage like the unwashed stuff does.

I even wash my pm coins before storing them because I can't stand the smell they give off if stored unwashed for a long period of time either.

Maybe I am just too sensitive to gross smells, but barnyard odors, butchering, normal cleaning, dealing with sick kids, etc, doesn't bother me at all. But for some weird reason, stinky money turns my stomach. So I'm all for laundering it!


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

I do have a hiding place in the house that is very unusual. Most people do not have this option as it is part of the building process. 

I&#8217;d keep a certain amount, say a few hundred, in a medium secure place in the house. The rest outside. The inside money is for readily available cash for you as well as bait for any thieves. Hopefully, they have found what they are looking for and will leave. The remainder would be outside and a five minute walk from the house. Most people will look in the buildings and under big rocks. They won&#8217;t wander off the house and shed area.

I like the idea of laundering money before hiding it. It should also be counted and sorted like they do at a bank. You can even get the bands at a bank.


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## Bret (Oct 3, 2003)

My cash is hidden between by hand and my mouth. It moves so fast as to be nearly invisible from my own eyes. Occasionally I catch a glimpse of it going in to TSC.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

If you have a survey pin on a corner of the property, not much will destroy those. You could bury something close to one or so many feet in a certain direction.


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

Gypsum is the material that makes fire"proof" boxes and safes work. When it gets to a certain temperature it gives off steam, and that has the effect of cooling. Unless it is at least four or five inches thick and the area in the safe is limited, it isn't reliable.

A sealed METAL pipe driven about two or three feet into a basement floor or crawl space should work. Heat rises, and the thermal mass and insulative properties of soil would be effective.


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## WoolyBear (Nov 9, 2011)

Thanks for the info. Friend has a bit of cash in the freezer and a firesafe for papers. I never realized those things could go crispy critter like that. I'll look into the pvc pipe idea and let friend know.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

palm farmer said:


> ... if i was of a mind to hide cash, id seal it in some pvc pipe with some sillica gel and bury it, set potted plant or garden gnome on top



I like the idea of PVC pipe with threaded end caps.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

under the concrete floor , what you put over isn't of that much concern , I am no expert on money or hiding it but I was the electritian on a rebuild after a very hot fire , i was able to reuse some of the wiring under the floor to get things going till the new building was built , in one case there was a romex cable that came in through the concrete slab a 6 inch hole and some fiber glass insulation stuffed in the hole , the wires were fine below the fiberglass insulation , yet above the floor it was so hot the heads from the big air compressor that had been there were a solidified puddle on the concrete floor with rings and steel parts melted into it


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Threaded end caps will leak on a PVC pipe buried in the ground.. Use glue on end caps.. Some of us add a gun to our stash pipe.. if you do, even with sealed caps, be sure to use a bag designed for long term storage. ... the pipe can sweat inside, and there will be moisture trapped in it.. Use silica moisture absorbent..


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

On the smoke shelf in the chimney...just not if you plan on using the fireplace.

Matt


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## unregistered29228 (Jan 9, 2008)

whiterock said:


> Having lost a house to fire, I can tell you freezers, fridge, etc ain't a good place. I didn't have any money in em, but everything inside was destroyed, as was the fire boxes I had, the boxes and contents were holding shape until touched and went to ash.


We have important documents in a fire-resistant safe, but I've scanned all of them and keep a copy on my computer, on a backup drive kept at a relative's house, and also on Carbonite. I figure if they all get stolen or burn up in a fire, it will be easier to replace them if I have a copy with the serial number and info on them. I also have a paper copy of important docs in a ziplock bag in our BOBs, for the same reason. If we have to run from our house, we'll still have proof we at least once did have birth certificates, marriage license, driver's license, etc.


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

One thing to remember. Put your "fire proof" safe on an outside wall. If your house burns the outside will not burn as long nor as hot as the interior.


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## Ohio dreamer (Apr 6, 2006)

I would consider something other then cash if they are thinking more the a few hundred dollars. Paper money and coins are losing there value quickly do to inflation. I'd consider some "junk silver" as they can afford it, it will hold it's value......also stands up to a fire better then paper money


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## Aintlifegrand (Jun 3, 2005)

I have a close friend who converted all his paper cash to coin/ silver and gold. He buried them in his backyard in coffee cans..the money was in bags inside the can..they have been there awhile something like 20 Years and he pulled one out awhile back and the coin was fine and worth a whole lot more..lol


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

Harry Chickpea said:


> A sealed METAL pipe driven about two or three feet into a basement floor or crawl space should work. Heat rises, and the thermal mass and insulative properties of soil would be effective.


This isn't entirely true. Hot fluid (air) rises, but heat radiates in all directions. In a fire there is a LOT of radiant heat. The large thermal mass does act as a heat sink and MIGHT keep money in such a setup from turning to char cloth, but if the house burns down, a lot of the debris falls into the basement, making it difficult and possibly dangerous to get to your stash.


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

jtbrandt said:


> This isn't entirely true. Hot fluid (air) rises, but heat radiates in all directions. In a fire there is a LOT of radiant heat. The large thermal mass does act as a heat sink and MIGHT keep money in such a setup from turning to char cloth, but if the house burns down, a lot of the debris falls into the basement, making it difficult and possibly dangerous to get to your stash.


I agree, especially about the danger (and wait) until things cool and stabilize. My point was that compared to many other ideas, it has a much higher chance of success. Money buried outside is vulnerable unless you are incredibly secretive when you bury it.


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

I created a hole in the ground specifically for my important papers should anything happen to the house. It has about 3" of concrete on the bottom. Then I placed an old fish container inside on top of that floor and poured about 3" of concrete all around that container. Then I placed the lid on that container. 

All the sides/ends of this concrete hole are higher than the hole itself and sloped so no water can run into the hole. Then a treated piece of wood is used as a roof for this area and both soil and growing grass (shallow root systems) cover this. The only problem I've had is moisture; so when I put my valuables in there, I added silica moisture items (quite a few) both inside zip locks as well as loose inside that fish box. 

This little area is located where nothing could touch it should a fire (or storm damage) occur to my home and/or existing structures; so I feel quite secure about it's not being damaged. And I know no one would suspect it ever being where it is; so I feel quite secure.

As for hiding "money", I organize mine in batches of the same amount, wrapping and securing each batch individually; then placing them together for easy use when necessary. I add those silica items to this as well; and this is actually in a similar but different location from my important papers.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

If you save your currency in coinage, less troubles with fire. Also inflation or currency changes. Paper has zero intrinsic worth, except as tp (and it's nasty for that) or firestarter. Coinage, especially nickles, before they change the metal content, will still have worth, even with inflation or currency changes.... last couple of years, a 5c piece has had up to 7c worth of metal in them. 

Of course, silver junk coinage is even better... or, keep some gold on your person at all times....


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

One of the slickest "slick" hiding places of valuables I heard of as a teenager was a burn barrel. Not in it but buried under it.

A local felon was arrested and the investigators sifted through his burn pile for evidence and an old timer officer suggested they dig under it and after moving the burn barrel and digging a couple feet down they found water tight ammo cans packed with drugs, stolen items and cash.

About 10 years ago a friends grandfather passed away and her family knew he had saved silver coinage since the 1930s and he always told his wife and children it was well hidden but he never told them where before he passed away. They only knew that when something came up that they needed emergency money , the next day or so he would produce a glass topped sealed fruit jar of silver coins worth more as collector pieces than the silver weight or face value.

Six or seven months after he died I was with the granddaughter at her grandparents farm and she said that her and her grand mother had searched every building on the place and even walked the 12 acres with a metal detector.

As I looked around the property I noticed a cutout burn barrel behind the house, another behind the barn and three more behind the tractor shed and shop building and asked her if they checked those and she said "what for? The drums , tin cans and junk in the burn piles sets off false positives with my metal detector."

Remembering what I had heard about the old deputy, I asked her to get a shovel and dug out under one of the barrels and about a foot down we hit a vault box made of concrete capstones with a dozen fruit jars or so of pre 1960 coins and I explained to her what I had heard of in my teens.

The next time she visited gf and I she said her , her parents and grand mother dug out all of her grandfathers burn barrels and cleaned off the scrap pile behind his shop finding six capstone vaults buried one to 2 feet down and fruit jars of old coins in all of them.

When them old folks lost faith in the banks after 1929, they really lost faith in them. Ironically I would guess the collectable value of the coinage her grandfather hid under his burn piles probably equaled or exceeded bank interest increases and even back in the 1930s there were coin collectors and I bet he probably kept that in his mind too because she said when he did produce a jar of old coins he never spent them for face or took them to a pawn shop for scrap weight cash out but instead took them to the area coin dealers just a few at a time to each.


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## Andy Nonymous (Aug 20, 2005)

*sigh* This topic comes up with regularity, and apparently most people just don't get it...

As Ohio Dreamer pointed out, cash put away for any significant length of time is like storing water in a pail with a pinhole leak. At least at present it's a pinhole leak. A few tomorrows from now, and the whole bottom of the pail is likely to fall out because the presses have been running at a good clip for quite a while, and without fail, when that happens, the volume of George, Abe, Ulysses, Ben, etc, no longer fill the pail as much as when put in. Left for any significant length of time, and rolls of Scott tissue will be worth more per sheet. Perhaps much more.

I heard just a couple nights ago that Argentina is having currency problems. Their official stats claim an annual inflation of 25%, but the reality to the average consumer is closer to 70-75%. For reference, that would mean that every piece of Argentinian paper put away there today, will purchase 1/4 as much a year from now. Lets say that the gov there institutes "cost of living wage increases" according to their official stats - your income goes up 25% per year, but with real inflation at 75%, it still only buys half of what it did a year previous. Only idiots would keep funds in a bank, or even worse, a mason jar. Put on your thinking caps and follow what happens when banks have no deposits; when to keep them solvent, the gov prints more paper, which accelerates inflation, which makes what you 'hold' do what?

As financial problems go, that's nothing. In some cases a currency loses faith (and credit) so fast, that inflation can exceed 2000%/yr. Tipping points are things like an extreme imbalance of trade over a long term, or when total unfunded obligations exceed GDP by 150% or more. Sorta like the Estades Unitas.

Perhaps the poster child of runaway inflation is the Zimbabwe dollar - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimbabwean_dollar In 1981, it traded about 1:1 with the USD. By 2009, when it was officially declared dead, it had been revalued (12 zeros dropped, with new paper issued) 3 times. IOW it got too impractical even in 100 trillion dollar denominations to be functional, so they'd shave zeros to make 100T=1 (again) but they still had to keep the presses running to keep paying bills they could not afford. In justifying 600 and 900% raises (6 and 9 times increases) for civil servants, it was stated that a person making 1 billion a year would starve. At one point, even AFTER revaluing, a 100,000,000 (yep, one hundred million) note, would buy 3 eggs. In a matter of months (or days), it would take 100,000,000,000 (100 Billion) to buy those 3 eggs. And the person who set aside a few billion dollar notes for an "emergency fund", would have been much better off trading them immediately for a few rolls of Scott tissue while they still had some value (however slim and fading). 

_Again, it may or may not take years to get to that point. It only takes a collapse of faith that "I as a creditor, will be paid in something of value". It will hit first internationally, and that can take mere hours, say when teh dollah is no longer the reserve current C. Then it appears on everything imported (think oil, food, clothing, other common consumer goods), and then it ripples through every other product and service, because everyone else has to cover the increase in their cost of living, but it will never really catch up, because the only way an investment banker sees to stay ahead of the snowball coming down hill at him, gaining mass and momentum, is to print ever more cash, ever faster.
_
The u s dollar, and indeed, ALL fiat currencies (without exception) are headed the same way, because there is no end of them: whenever 'need' dictates, more are printed, and the more that are printed, the less each one is worth. It is the ONLY way out of debt when it becomes greater than GDP - those who control the presses pay off old debts with worth less paper (in the US that includes SS and gov pensions), because even with COL increases, they don't really keep up with the Cost of Living.

Putting any more than a few fiats out to interest (at what, 2% or less), when inflation is running at about 10%/yr is only stupid. Setting them aside in a mason jar (or other container) for a 'rainy day' some indefinite time in the future, is insane.

I'm with Bret - any funds I acquire go to pay bills first, and beyond that, get invested in things like fencing from the likes of tractor supply. IF i ever ran out of things to capitalize on the farm to increase our long term sustainabililty, or got enough usable trade goods, like nails and deck screws, I'd invest in junk coins - the ones pre-65. If I ever had more to play with than I knew what to do with, I'd invest in gold coin - not the numismatic 'collector' stuff, but the circulated 'common' ones. 

I would not keep more paper around than I can spend tomorrow, or that I'd be willing and comfortable using to start a fire with the day after. It's already that worthless, it's just that most people don't realize that yet. Soon enough, they will.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Only cash I keep at home is a few $20 for emergency cash , the silver dollars and half dollars my grandfather gave me and the small coin collection I inherited from my father. All other money remains in interest bearing financial accounts to fund my retirement years as long as the fiat is viable.

As Andy said its better to invest extra cash at home in home improvements . Well home improvements and fishing and hunting gear in my opinion as those will give you the most current use and future value for most of us.

Since 1964 if folks really want to keep "hard currency" at home for after shtf, the majority of participants on sites as this are going to be more successful at saving their small pre 1964 coinage and gold and silver heirloom and maybe occasionally purchased reasonably priced estate auction jewelry in a fire resistant jewelry case.

That way you have a bit of "gold and silver standard" hard value currency available for snipping some chain links or putting a ring up for assay weight trade if the time comes (plus you could possibly retain a few precious stones if you and the buyer are of the mind) and until then, you have jewelry you can wear if you care to or sell for a slightly inflated ascetic jewelry value to an individual shopping for an engagement ring or such or in worse case still sell at scrap price at a pawn shop for current fiat currency value to cover any unexpected home improvement or maintenance issues that may arise in your life.

Also jewelry and if your lucky enough to have a small pre 1964 coin collection are covered under your homeowners insurance against theft as long as it is properly listed and documented.

That is why when all the scrap gold and silver vultures were in high gear a few years ago I advised women with heirloom jewelry from their grandmothers that they said "was out of style" to keep it or if I could afford it purchased for gold buyer scrap price plus % to 10 percent and put in my own jewelry box.

Here in Alabama one of the most advertised scrap gold and silver buyers commercials touted they offered more and cut out the middle man because they had their own refinery to smelt the gold and jewelry into bullion back when the current scrap buy craze started around 2005.

That advertised precious metal bullion refinery for the last year or so has rebranded as a jewelry store and a woman I knew who sold a distinctive heirloom piece at one of their motel banquet room scrap buys because she didn't believe me when I gave her the latest quote and offered 5% above the scrap quote as that was all I had in disposable investment cash at the time, was appalled to find the piece she sold at a gold buy back for sale in one of their jewelry stores for almost three times what she was paid scrap for it a few years earlier although gold prices were down and all that was done to the piece was that they cleaned it.

Sadly the scrap plus 5% I offered her was about $30 more than what the bullion scrap buyer paid her and just as I would have, they simply figured the gem weight into the scrap weight.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

Ever seen an Indian bride? (Asian Indian). She has silver earrings, necklaces, all kinds of silver and possibly jewels. This is her dowry. The value of silver and gold fluctuates, but it always has some value. When my uncle became upper upper middle class he bought my aunt jewelry with large gems. Same thinking. It never came to that because he understood business and money and enjoyed his retirement with no financial problems. But, I think it doesn&#8217;t hurt to have some cash saved, especially if you aren&#8217;t a financial genius.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

I keep about a thousand in cash stashed outside my home. I'm not concerned about inflation's effects on that cash because I consider it disposable. It sure would come in handy if I had an emergency tonight though. I could buy some necessities to get me through for a bit while I sort things out. Sure, I could keep all gold, but then I have to go to the gold dealer or pawn shop before I can get readily spendable "money." Around here, there's no dealers open 24 hours that I would want to deal with, so cash is more convenient.


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## ovsfarm (Jan 14, 2003)

Emergencies come in all sizes and durations. Back a few summers ago, when a big derecho wind storm swept across the Midwest, 6 million homes were without power and mine was one of them. None of the local stores could accept any kind of check or credit for transactions because they were unable to verify balances, limits, etc. Cash was king. This lasted for seven days in my area, just over a month in others near me.

To the best of my knowledge, none of the stores would have refused to accept silver or gold, but they weren't giving one bit above the face value either. So I think precious metals would have been a bad choice to use during this crisis.

I think we have to be smart and realize that it doesn't have to be all or nothing. People should keep enough in cash to get them through a short term, local or regional disaster/emergency. This is not the same thing as storing excess wealth for the long term, for use after the US dollar has crashed and is terribly devalued or worthless. I believe there is a need for both in any well-rounded prep situation.


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