# The Truth About Botulism



## Ryan NC (Jan 29, 2009)

I've been seeing a lot of concern regarding botulism here recently... Lots of mis-information, general fear mongering, and citation without source. This all leads to an unwarranted innate fear that I feel is driving folks away from canning and trying things because of the unknown...

I'm going to try to dispel some of the more common misconceptions (with citation) that have had folks up in arms lately. 

First off botulism IS NOT as big of a problem as most folks make it out to be! This is a two fold effect of "modern canning guidelines" and proper cooking of major sources of contamination rendering toxins & spores neutral. Simply put, you take even a known contaminated jar of food and boil the contents for a minimum of 5 min at a full boil (cdc recommends 10) and it will be rendered safe to eat.

On average there is a median of 23 cases of foodborne botulism poisoning per year (1990-2000 cdc reports) of these reported cases only 22% were the result of home canned vegetables. (read the cdc report below and do your own math ;-) ) What this means is that 5.6 people a year are affected by home canned foods, while the average mortality rate is now at 2% since the early 1990s, mainly because of the development of artificial respirators. (citation CDC & wikipedia (wiki says 8%)) All in all this means that one person dies from foodborne botulism every 10 years due to home canned foods. Without "modern medicine" this number would still only be 3.36 people per year. (60% mortality untreated) 

Botulisim makes headline news due to the fact that when botulism hits, it almost always hits several people at the same time due to human nature of consuming food in a social setting. In most every case this is the result of improper cooking methods that would have prevented the problem totally.

This highest risk group for foodborne botulism is infants under the age of 6 months with the most common catalyst being raw honey. This does not affect children over 1 year of age as it has something to due with the spores building in the undeveloped (low acid) digestive tract of infants. 

What I'm trying to get across is that home canning of foods is not overly dangerous (you have a better chance of winning that lottery than getting sick) or outa scope for anyone that can cook without making others ill. Follow the longest processing times as outlined for the ingredients you use and you are going to end up with a safe end product. if you are in any doubt what so ever boil the product for 10 min before consuming. You are less likely to contract botulism poisoning from canned foods than you are raw salsa out of your garden stored in plastic containers in the fridge... Enjoy life, try something new, and can what you like to eat! 

Here are a couple of the better sources that I found in a quick google search:
Wikipedia - Botulism
CDC - Foodborne Botulism in the United States


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## olivehill (Aug 17, 2009)

> You are less likely to contract botulism poisoning from canned foods than you are raw salsa out of your garden stored in plastic containers in the fridge...



Can you cite your source for this part? Not arguing, truly curious. I LOVE fresh salsa!


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## Ryan NC (Jan 29, 2009)

olivehill said:


> I LOVE fresh salsa!


Me too! And I'm not going to stop eating it ;-) again better chances of winning the lottery, the citation is in the CDC link. My guess is most likely improperly stored for too long and shouldn't have been eaten to start with.


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## olivehill (Aug 17, 2009)

Ryan NC said:


> Me too! And I'm not going to stop eating it ;-) again better chances of winning the lottery, the citation is in the CDC link. My guess is most likely improperly stored for too long and shouldn't have been eaten to start with.


I'll go take a look thanks. I'm not stopping either, just found it a fascinating tidbit.  

Stored too long? How does THAT happen?  Definitely don't have that problem here. It gets eaten up ... well, we'll just say plenty quickly. LOL!


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I agree as long as the guidelines for canning are met. Lowering the times you pressure can, or water bath canning green beans, corn etc is asking for trouble. Why risk it? Even if you have never been ill from all those years of doing so, why invite trouble?
It's very simple to stick to the guidelines set in the Blue book. My family is worth the trouble.


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## jamala (May 4, 2007)

Our Little Farm--- I love the "My family is worth the trouble" I say that all the time when people ask me why I go to all the work of growing and preserving my own food, my friends all say its easier to buy at the supermarket. I agree but "my family is worth the work and trouble" for me to know where the food was grown and what is in it or more importantly what is NOT in it.


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I agree totally. I 'know' what is in all the foods my children eat and I know it has been processed safely. It takes time to be sure, but as you quoted, my family is worth the trouble, and to be honest, it feels good to know I am providing for them.


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## Ryan NC (Jan 29, 2009)

olivehill said:


> I'll go take a look thanks.


I can't find it right off, I DON'T WANT TO START A DON'T EAT FRESH SALSA OFF SPIN!!!!!! The problem with cdc reports is that they don't contain all the data surrounding the actual problem, just that someone got sick. I had about 15 windows up as I was writing this post and narrowed it down to these two links due to credibility and information provided... 

The only way I can figure is that they'd used fresh unwashed garden goodies and sealed it in a large plastic container filled to the rim (lack of oxegen) and stored it for way to long in to warm of a fridge. From memory (i hate not having a direct citation) it was multiple people hit at the same time leading to a false positive from a one time event during the time frame of the report... It don't last long here canned or fresh so I'm not worried about it at all.


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## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

Ryan NC said:


> What I'm trying to get across is that home canning of foods is not overly dangerous


I'm so glad you posted this. It seems like the government, big business, media, or whoever is almost fear mongering to try to dissuade people from canning. It's a shame too because so many people buy into the fear. We need to be more self reliant and less reliant on Big Business to provide our foods. It's the same with all the fear mongering that goes on with milk, honey, goats, etc. As a society we are all being pushed into buying from big business because we are afraid of our own home grown foods, eggs, milk, or canned goods.


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## chickenista (Mar 24, 2007)

And if botulism was a real threat, then our forebearers would have all croaked eons ago.
And they canned outside on a fire pit with the jars in a big copper pot!
If you do it right it is perfectly safe.
Great post Ryan!


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

It all does make me wonder if a certain amount of this USDA recommended procedures isn't a bit of a exaggeration. Of course I don't hold a lot of faith in our governments recommendations anyway now days..LOL! :runforhills:

I'm not at all advocating unsafe procedures or methods, but science doesn't know everything and we need to allow others the grace to choose their own methods. Both sides present very valid points and I doubt any of us will convince another to do it 'our way'. 

My heart just breaks when people start bickering over it or belittling others. There is nothing at all wrong with saying to someone, "You may want to rethink that because it could be unsafe" and then tell them "facts" of how it is recommended to do it; but then let it go already. Don't argue or belittle.

I think Our Little Farm hit it on the money when she said, "*my* family is worth it". She spoke for her choices for her family; not telling everyone else what's best for _*their*_ family. Respectful words, doing it how she feels best, made her point, yet didn't belittling others for making a different choice or, make them feel she thinks their family is not important enough to them by not doing it her way. Thank you OLF for setting such a good example!


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## jennytw (Aug 7, 2009)

That i canned last fall but I have been fearful also. So I am glad this thread was started. If I boil for 5-10 minutes then all is well, right?


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## fffarmergirl (Oct 9, 2008)

Thank you so much for all the time & effort you put into looking this up.


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## Packedready (Mar 29, 2011)

These cases of botulism, you don't know the sanitary conditions of the kitchens and person doing the processing, or whether the processing time was followed for the longest processing item in the jar.

Think about it, if someone is processing beans and there is fresh meat near by. Any contemination with the meat product would increase the bean canning time.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Thank you, Ryan, for posting this. I have been saying for years that there is too much fear mongering going on. Some people think that "I took a class therefore I'm an expert and we all know that nobody but 'experts' are to be listened to." I made a post earlier this week about "don't drive a car because 42,000 people a year are dying in car accidents." I fiqured you had a 1000-fold better chance of dying in a car accident than food poisoning. I was poo-pooed.

Another point of late is that you can't can food with fat in it. (say WHAT???) How does one explain the recipe for mincemeat that calls for a POUND of suet? (Ball guide). Any meat that is canned contains fat, I don't care how carefully you trim it. What about that skin-on chicken? Fear!! One man's power over another.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

jennytw said:


> That i canned last fall but I have been fearful also. So I am glad this thread was started. If I boil for 5-10 minutes then all is well, right?


If you used the process in the Ball guide (or any other reliable canning book) you are fine. Amish people don't even use pressure canners and you don't hear of amish people dying on the roadside. I'm not advocating not using a pressure canner, I'm just sayin'.....


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## Ryan NC (Jan 29, 2009)

Karen said:


> It all does make me wonder if a certain amount of this USDA recommended procedures isn't a bit of a exaggeration. Of course I don't hold a lot of faith in our governments recommendations anyway now days..LOL! :runforhills:


How does one say they agree more than 100% ???? lol



Karen said:


> My heart just breaks when people start bickering over it or belittling others. There is nothing at all wrong with saying to someone, "You may want to rethink that because it could be unsafe" and then tell them "facts" of how it is recommended to do it; but then let it go already. Don't argue or belittle.
> 
> I think Our Little Farm hit it on the money when she said, "*my* family is worth it". She spoke for her choices for her family; not telling everyone else what's best for _*their*_ family.


I wasn't part of the bickering but that's exactly what prompted this thread. My grandmother was a boil the ever living tar outa it in the jars and then boil it again once you open the jars. Enjoyed some of the best home cooking I've ever known, never got sick, and still here to run my mouth. I personally use a pressure canner for most everything but I'm not scared of WB canning most foods. 



Karen said:


> Thank you OLF for setting such a good example!


Agreed and my thanks as well for setting a tone for how this thread will grow.



jennytw said:


> That i canned last fall but I have been fearful also. So I am glad this thread was started. If I boil for 5-10 minutes then all is well, right?


This is the only sure fire way of killing any botulism toxin that may be present regardless of how unlikely it is to be there... boiling for 10 min at a hard boil will render most anything safe to eat. (This is how they serve rotten meat in other countries, they do boil it much longer but it's still YUCK to say the least btw) The botulism toxin is a protein and rendered harmless at temps above 140-160F and turned into a toxoid. (cooked protein)


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## mare (Aug 31, 2006)

thanks for the post Ryan--i have been thinking the goverment is trying to scare everyone. there has been good advice from everyone on this board and i am most grateful for it but there have been times when i wonder how much is exaggeration also.


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

Packedready said:


> These cases of botulism, you don't know the sanitary conditions of the kitchens and person doing the processing, or whether the processing time was followed for the longest processing item in the jar.
> 
> Think about it, if someone is processing beans and there is fresh meat near by. Any contemination with the meat product would increase the bean canning time.


This is what I'm wondering too. _If _there are any actual documented cases, how would 'the experts' know it was in the inadequate canning method rather than just unsanitary conditions?


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

suitcase_sally said:


> Another point of late is that you can't can food with fat in it. (say WHAT???) How does one explain the recipe for mincemeat that calls for a POUND of suet? (Ball guide). Any meat that is canned contains fat, I don't care how carefully you trim it. What about that skin-on chicken? Fear!! One man's power over another.


I was thinking the exact same thing!


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## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

My grandmother use to can all sorts of meats, chicken/dumplings, etc in an old WBC outside over a wood fire in the hot summer time. And we all lived through it. I've never tried to can meat in a WBC, but I know it was done for many, many years, so it was possible. And she reused the lids too. I've even done that many times. So the newer guidelines are the "ultimate" in safeness, but they weren't always used in the past. And humanity somehow survived. Of course they did all know to boil the food when it came out of the jars too. And we should do that with all canned goods, even commercially canned goods too.


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## Lucy (May 15, 2006)

The difference with mincemeat and plain fatty meats or fat in foods is the added vinegar and sugar. Plus the apples are high acid. Total different pH and density levels. It is not the same as plain meat or bacon without adding any acid to raise the acidity. Also, the size of pieces of food will change how the heat penetrates the foods. Bigger chunks take longer to heat than little diced or minced pieces. It isn't always just fat, it is how it is combined with other things to make it more high acid. Same thing with the marinated mushrooms, or marinated peppers or marinated 3 bean salad. They all have high levels of acid added to them, not just plain vegetables, in addition to the oil. 

I think this is a good bit of information about why homecanned foods can spoil, too. :
http://umaine.edu/publications/4277e/


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## Our Little Farm (Apr 26, 2010)

I just hope everyone stays safe. I would love to can more by water bath, and really don't like my pressure canner, but I do what I feel that I have to do. Maybe I've been brainwashed? Who knows! It might explain somethings 

I have eaten questionable foods and not been ill. My grandparents did not pressure can. 
But the guidelines on canning are there to help us too. I guess tests have been done and to be safe, and to keep my family safe, that is why I do what I do.

I would expect that much of our home canned products (following the Blue Books advice) is a lot safer than store bought stuff. It is certainly tastier!
I opened a quart of canned tomatoes recently and it smelled the same as when I canned them and tasted SO fresh and good. What could be better?

I too appreciate all the advice and research Ryan has done. We all have to answer to ourselves and those we feed as to what we do.


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## Lucy (May 15, 2006)

I love my pressure canners ! I am not afraid of them, especially now that I use the weights instead of relying on the dial gauge. I want to get my stuff canned and done with. Too many things to do other than get the canning done. 
I use a pressure cooker, too, for some foods. Roast is the best in one ! 
Dried beans in a few minutes. Makes my life easier. 
You get botulism from canned foods, not the fresh ones, unless it would be oil with garlic or something to shut the air supply off. Fresh stuff is not airtight, so not the right environment for botulism to grow.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Ryan NC said:


> I can't find it right off, I DON'T WANT TO START A DON'T EAT FRESH SALSA OFF SPIN!!!!!! The problem with cdc reports is that they don't contain all the data surrounding the actual problem, just that someone got sick. I had about 15 windows up as I was writing this post and narrowed it down to these two links due to credibility and information provided...
> 
> The only way I can figure is that they'd used fresh unwashed garden goodies and sealed it in a large plastic container filled to the rim (lack of oxegen) and stored it for way to long in to warm of a fridge. From memory (i hate not having a direct citation) it was multiple people hit at the same time leading to a false positive from a one time event during the time frame of the report... It don't last long here canned or fresh so I'm not worried about it at all.


oh no, I'm in trouble now.saw this thread after my comments on the poll thread.


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