# Buyer's Rant



## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

I put an offer on a property that was rejected with no counteroffer because the seller will not take any offers with owner financing despite the listing stating that owner financing was an option.
I feel like I was suckered with a bait and switch.
Is this common?
What recourse do I have?


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Find a different property.


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

yeah, I guess you're right.
It's frustrating though because I see so many mistakes in real estate listings.
I frequently see woodstoves in the pictures but not in the listing details. 
We looked at one property that stated that it had 200 feet road frontage which I thought made for a skinny lot since it was like 30 acres or so. The agent said that she guessed at the road frontage!

There, I feel better now.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Yup, I found such things often myself. But what can you do? People make mistakes, or don't understand or don't have a clue. But, I suppose that's part of our due diligence when we are looking to purchase. And having a buyer's agent seems to mean nothing. However, once you find a place my advise would be to never close without a closing lawyer on your payroll.

Good luck.


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## ganoosh (Dec 6, 2009)

Unfortunately not much recourse except pick a different home. 

As an agent myself it does get very frustrating when items are incorrect in a listing both for the agent and the buyer as I at least do my best to provide information to my clients that is both accurate and something they would want.

Mistakes do happen and at least in the MLS that I belong to its just a box you click to include what type of financing but homes are placed all the time that are out of the area, in a different state, bogus info to get traffic and hope that someone will bite.

Wood stoves in Northern Nevada are a big issue due to emissions. If the wood stove does not meet current emissions standards it can not be included in the sale and has to actually be removed from the property, not just disconnected, hidden, ....

The road frontage issue should definitely not be guessed and very easy for the agent to figure out. If it was 200 ft road frontage and rectangular the sides would be 6534 ft long an extremely long narrow property, over 1 mile on the sides. 

I feel your frustrations and keep at it you will find something that you like and that is meant to be. I'd say work with a buyers agent if you can as it shouldn't cost you anything and if they are good will look over things and help with the inaccuracies/negotiations.


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

yeah, i forgot about the emissions thing. actually, that is a federal rule, I think. 
I can oviously forgive errors, but when they admit that they guessed, I have a serious issue with their credibility. 

we submitted another offer with owner financing. the seller has asked for more time to consider offer, so maybe he has changed his mind again. 

yes, I do have an attorney ready to go if we come to agreement.


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

2old2playftball said:


> I put an offer on a property that was rejected with no counteroffer because the seller will not take any offers with owner financing despite the listing stating that owner financing was an option.
> I feel like I was suckered with a bait and switch.
> Is this common?
> What recourse do I have?


I only know what I would do as a Buyer's Agent. Since you aren't using one, it will be up to your Lawyer... As a Listing Agent, that is a mistake I haven't made during my entire decade of working in real estate.

The mistake may simply have occurred due to the Seller changing his mind after instructing his Agent (or not...). I consider that a serious mistake that should lead to consequences.


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

Christie,
You are right about the seller changing his mind. According to the real estate agent he has now changed his mind back and forth a couple of times now.

We are just talking cash prices now and seem to be inching towards a conclusion although we are still $30K apart. 

The price is right for the land thus the reason for my patience.


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## Michael W. Smith (Jun 2, 2002)

2old2playftball said:


> You are right about the seller changing his mind. According to the real estate agent he has now changed his mind back and forth a couple of times now.


Some people "want" to sell, but really don't "want" to sell.

I've seen the same house for sale by the same owner for quite a while. Some owners just have a set price in their mind for what their property is worth, and they aren't going to sell it for any less. 

These people refuse to lower the price, so they just continue to have it sale - waiting for the right person to come along that will pay them what they want and then they will sell it.

Good luck.


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

Michael,
He has dropped the price from $189,900 down to $125,000 before I even looked at the property the first time. Now that I have made an offer he seems to have stiffened up. I made an offer for $85,000 last thursday. The real estate agent called me back friday afternoon to say that seller will not counter. I said ok, if he changes his mind in a couple of weeks to give me a call. 
So, the next day the agent calls me and countered with $120K. I countered with $90K. Have not heard back since.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Stick to your guns on the price you want. If it's at all supported by the sales in your area an agent will be doing what they can to get their seller to accept. Our current property was listed at 275k we got it for 185k because I did my research and was able to support my numbers. They also did 17k in repairs to get the place to pass inspections as well.


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

cratercove;
agent told me if the seller doesn't accept $100k, agent will discontinue working for seller. I was surprised that the agent would say that as he is representing seller, but I guess he is getting frustrated with seller too.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Yeah, you can only waste a good agents time for so long. There are loads of little places right near me for sale but the people think their land is on a gold strike or something, lol. One agent has quit already and one has a sign still but they don't actively show the place anymore or advertise.


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## Michael W. Smith (Jun 2, 2002)

2old2playftball said:


> cratercove;
> agent told me if the seller doesn't accept $100k, agent will discontinue working for seller. I was surprised that the agent would say that as he is representing seller, but I guess he is getting frustrated with seller too.


Perhaps the agent was hoping you would "read between the lines" and up your offer to $100,000.00. It sounds like that is what the agent thinks it should sell for.

Once you up your offer, tell the agent this is my final and last offer. I'm thinking the agent is going to tell the seller - "It's time to sell if you really want to sell."


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## KentuckyDreamer (Jan 20, 2012)

I am quite surprised at the numbers I see here...I thought it was an insult to offer less than 15% of the listed price. Interesting information for when I finally do put in a bid.


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## DAVID In Wisconsin (Dec 3, 2002)

My bids are generally 25 to 50 below asking. I am surprised when when someone accepts. But I am generally working with banks and estates.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

2old2playftball said:


> Michael,
> He has dropped the price from $189,900 down to $125,000 before I even looked at the property the first time. Now that I have made an offer he seems to have stiffened up. I made an offer for $85,000 last thursday. The real estate agent called me back friday afternoon to say that seller will not counter. I said ok, if he changes his mind in a couple of weeks to give me a call.
> So, the next day the agent calls me and countered with $120K. I countered with $90K. Have not heard back since.


You wanted owner financing and offered a bottom of the barrel price? I would not have countered either.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

If the property isn't selling the person is asking more than his market will bear, that's it, plain and simple. Some people add their sentiment to a price and if they don't really need to sell then fine... but you can't ask someone to pay for your feelings as well as the property. It's not rational.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

The realtor certainly should not be listing a place for that much more than it is worth. If someone has to sell quickly they may take a low offer, but you are going to spend lots of time shopping. To ask for owner for owner financing, on top of a extremely low offer is asking way too much, IMO. And if the owner takes an extremely low offer, probably because he needs the money, I would not want to buy a property and have him finance it. He may not make mortgage payments if he still has a mortgage, or liens could be filed against the house as it still owned by the seller.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Maybe one of our resident professionals can answer a question of some curiosity to me. Can one offer and provide owner financing on a property with a mortgage still or liens in effect?


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

CraterCove said:


> Maybe one of our resident professionals can answer a question of some curiosity to me. Can one offer and provide owner financing on a property with a mortgage still or liens in effect?


No, but one can offer a Lease Purchase or Lease Purchase Option. Title would not be clear... Of course, that is when the Sale is Recorded. I had a family member buy a home with Seller Financing. The Seller's wife got cancer and he mortgaged 6 homes without the Buyers knowing. All those homes were lost to Foreclosure with all those families losing their homes (despite making their payments on time every month). 

I am a Realtor and was a Loan Officer for 7 years.

I would tell all to beware utilizing Seller Financing without the Sale being Recorded. That prevents the Lien Holder (Seller) from mortgaging it.


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## CraterCove (Jan 24, 2011)

Thanks for the answer. I was wondering because one person I was considering buying from, he still owed on his mortgage but he wanted to have me assume his loan instead of offering a lease to own or owner financing. Unfortunately his loan was still for more than the property was worth in this market (mobile homes are bad investments) and was with a sub-prime company and the interest was horrendous.


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## itsb (Jan 13, 2013)

first off,I am speeking of a few NOT all,realestate agents are a lot like lawyers,they wamt the money,however they can get it.
selling realestate,may be easer than a real job also . just a sayin:facepalm::facepalm:


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## ganoosh (Dec 6, 2009)

CraterCove, Christie is definitely right be wary, very very cautious to the point I would never myself, or advise any one of my clients to purchase a house/property if the sale is not recorded with a Title Company as at least in Nevada, the first person to record the sale legally owns the house regardless of who it was "sold" to first.

Assuming a loan is a different deal all together, basically you are just taking over their loan with the terms that the seller agreed to with the bank. Very uncommon right now with interest rates so low and the loan would also have to be assumable which most are not. Most often done with VA loans in the past that have a below market interest rate, but almost unheard of right now unless the property is substandard and over priced and the seller is looking to sell to someone who would otherwise not qualify. Even with that, most lenders will require the new buyer to qualify to some extent so generally best to just go get your own.


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## tommyanunnaki (Apr 30, 2014)

I just looked at 64 acres in southern GA yesterday. It has 25 acres of beautiful bermuda hayfield, which I would use for pasture, and the remaining acreage was listed as "wooded".

When I got there the hay field was gorgeous...looked like a golf course...but the "wooded" area was just shy of what I would call cutover. They had raped the woods of every good tree and just left the crumbs everywhere. So, not only do the woods hold no cash value, but there is probably thousands and thousands of dollars worth of clean up to be done before it can be used for anything.

SIGH


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

itsb said:


> first off,I am speeking of a few NOT all,realestate agents are a lot like lawyers,they wamt the money,however they can get it.
> selling realestate,may be easer than a real job also . just a sayin:facepalm::facepalm:


Since this comes up fairly regularly, I'll respond and add a bit more.

I thought it was a cake walk to get my license as an Agent, then began to take the paperwork and responsibility very seriously. As a Managing Broker, who is a Realtor, with hundreds of hours of classes, heavy on Real Estate Law, and a BA in Organizational Management? This IS a real job and one I take very seriously! I am also an avid Photographer and would never say their work is "easier than real job." 

It is imperative for an Agent to be very familiar with the Real Estate Contract, all Addendums, and Real Estate Law in his own State. That said, we do NOT act as Attorney's in any way, however, we are legally required to understand everything and follow the Letter of the Law. Those who don't take this seriously are risking a much higher risk of lawsuits, not to mention, offering poor representation. To add to that, a Listing is posted online. Many Buyers come from all of the World. What do they see, if they aren't local? The Listing. That makes this critical. It must feature excellence in every way, but also in a realistic fashion. The pictures should be high quality and honestly showcase the home/property. Yes, there are Agents who take terrible pictures. With over 90% of Buyers utilizing the Internet for Real Estate Searches, posting an Accurate Professional Listing is critical. I see a lot of bad quality photography, poorly written descriptions, and plenty of errors. This should all matter to Sellers, when they choose an Agent or Realtor. The bar really should be higher :facepalm:


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## 2old2playftball (Sep 19, 2014)

Molly Mckee said:


> You wanted owner financing and offered a bottom of the barrel price? I would not have countered either.


molly;
first offer was for full price.


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