# Goat Labor Questions Need Help



## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

My doe's ligaments are GONE and she has been groaning moaning since 3 p.m. yesterday. At 11:00 p.m. that night she was having contractions and was pushing. All was well and coming along. It was around 1 a.m. this morning my dad and mom switched off. She was having contractions and pushing for me and my Dad. Good ones. Then Mom comes in and she didn't have any more. So question is can they keep themselves from going into labor if something bothers them? I know this may seem crazy. This goat already had at least 8 pushes not big but big enough to know for sure she IS pushing. And they were getting worse. At the time that Mom got out the dog was also barking. I thought labor was labor once you in labor your going to have that baby. Also how long should labor be? I researched and it said 4-5 hours. But I mean safely how many hours can pass before we are having problems? If she stopped pushing is something wrong? The babies are still moving a great deal. It takes like 10 seconds to see movement when she is laying. She has been nudging her side, pressing her head up against the wall, will push her feet off the wall, will unnecessarily groom herself like the same foot as if to try and find relief. All symptoms are gone except the moaning and nudging of the side. Her udder has grown like crazy. Today you would never be able to tell she had ever been in labor. Please help!


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## xoxoGOATSxoxo (Jul 29, 2006)

I would call the vet. 

Also, someone more experienced than me will come along and try to answer your question, but still call the vet! 

Good luck...


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## prairiedog (Jan 18, 2007)

wash, lube up and go check


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

I have been checking on her since 3 p.m. yesterday constantly. Or are you telling me to go in? I have never had to that before and I am not sure really what to do. Please help!


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## farmmom (Jan 4, 2009)

Scrub good (I use betadine surgical scrub), lube (if I'm out of J-lube, I use hand sanitizer), insert your hand until you meet the cervix (feels like a ring if not dilated or may not feel it if it is). If she is dilated go further in. Feel for the baby. You want to feel a nose or teeth and two feet. If you feel anything else, you need to try to locate the head and front feet and turn the baby the right direction. Having your hand in there may stimulate contractions to restart. Gently but firmly pull the front feet with each push.

It would definately not hurt to have a vet or experienced goat person to help.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Some additional information I forgot to add is she is a second freshener and was due March 10th. So it's not that she's late obviously. Just her having gone into labor last night has me worried. I do not know anyone that can help me in MD the only person I knew moved. All others that I know have never had to go in. It is looking more open than last night. Would a picture be of any help?


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

A picture always helps. Is this doe stringing any goo? Goo is usually a sign of impending labor but it can happen without it.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

She does not have goo and did not last time either. I will get a picture on here for you all.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Doesn't show how swollen it is that well so I put the below picture on as well.









Sorry the pictures are so big!


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## BackfourtyMI. (Sep 3, 2007)

If she seems alright and if nothing is wrong today, do you think it could have been false labor? Is there such a thing with goats. If she's not actually due till March 10th & she's acting normal otherwise? Can you still see the babies moving around or kicking? The streching & pushing against the wall, etc. I always think is the doe trying to posistion the kids for delivery, like she's getting ready.
Is it a bad idea to go in to check if she's not really ready? I'm asking some of these questions hoping someone that knows might answer since I have never had to go in on one of my doe's either, so maybe the answers will help you & me as well as others here.
Good Luck & I hope all goes well for all of you!


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

In a false labor wouldn't there be nothing there to be kicking and moving around? I can see babies moving. All the questions you have are what I have been wondering as well. There is something like pushing at her backend. I am so scared to hurt her.


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## picklespickles (Nov 3, 2007)

no matter what. mine always kid while i'm at work. no matter what. so at least i come home to pretty, fluffy licked dry ones. lucky to have good mama. it happened yesterday, actually. lol. 

so, not sure what you should do. i'm a watcher and waiter, less of an intervener. but that's me. someone else might disagree. 

good luck


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## BackfourtyMI. (Sep 3, 2007)

Well my doe that's due 1st this spring is not due for 3 more weeks & another 4 weeks, & I can see movement like today, it looked like to me while I was cleaning & of course they all want to be right under my feet.
I have always been lucky enough that my doe's have delivered on there own other than helping to pull a big baby a few times & drying off, etc. So I don't really want to tell you to do something if I have not been in that situation myself or know pretty much for sure. I would hate to tell you something & be wrong.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

This may seem weird but would castor oil get her going? Also would it be safe?


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

False labor just means shes acting as if in labor, having braxton hicks like contractions but its not really time for babies. I call them practice contractions. When she goes into real labor you will know it. Its unmistakeable. To me it looks like she still has a bit to go, but if in doubt take her to the vet or have him come out and check.


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## luvzmybabz (Sep 8, 2008)

KittenMittens89 said:


> In a false labor wouldn't there be nothing there to be kicking and moving around? I can see babies moving. All the questions you have are what I have been wondering as well. There is something like pushing at her backend. I am so scared to hurt her.


When you say pushing at her backend. Does it look like a softball behind her opening does it stay out or in and out. Maybe a better description is it looks like some one is inside of her and is trying to push a gigantic fist out from her hole? I guess the ? backend ? are you talking about the entire skin area in the first picture. When Jordan had her baby just before presentation it looked like she was trying to pee a softball out. I hope I did not just confuse you.


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

I would not give anything to start her labor. It just may not be time and you could cause death to the babies and the doe.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Okay thanks for answering that I was just curious because I know women use it hehe.


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

Before our doe delivered, like weeks before, you could see the babies kicking in the tailhead area. She was not in labor. It looked really odd and it worried me as this was the first birth I had had on my little farm. Movement in the tailhead before birth is totally normal.


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## BackfourtyMI. (Sep 3, 2007)

I wouldn't give her castor oil either. If you can see movement inside from the babies & she's eating, peeing, pooping, etc. all fine then I would wait a little longer. Like dragonchick said, maybe she's just not quite ready yet.


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

Can you get a udder picture. Udders will usually tell you if shes ready or not.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

I can try she is a fluffy goat. Last night though she was pushing. She would groan and moan then it would get louder and louder then she would stiffen up and push. So she was in labor doesn't that mean she's ready?


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

Not always. Actual labor will not stop. She will keep pushing and you will see the bubble or some sort of something coming out.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

I know she was pushing though. That is why it is SO shocking it just stopped. One thing to keep in mind with her is last year she had no milk and her baby was one month premature. So her getting any milk at all is a miracle.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Here is her udder picture:


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

For a second freshener I would expect a much larger udder if she was this close to delivery. I would say you have a while to go yet. Do you have another possible due date on her? She could have taken at a later time if she was with a buck at all. What breed of goat is she?


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## Freeholder (Jun 19, 2004)

I have a second freshener who is going through pretty much the same things. She was having false labor on Monday and Tuesday, sufficient that I curtailed my time in town (at work) so I'd be home just in case. Then she stopped, and has been 'normal' ever since, except for being big as a house, of course! In this case, she was 'pasture-bred' so I don't know her exact due date, but her ligaments are totally gone, and she had a discharge from Feb. 27 (Friday last week) until about the time the false labor stopped. Her udder hasn't really tightened up (you can't take that as an absolute sign, by the way, because sometimes it doesn't happen until after the birth), but is definitely bigger than it was. So I'm checking on her several times a day, but it could be a few days yet (be really nice if she'd get it over with this weekend, though! Otherwise I'll have to mess up my work schedule again next week -- am very thankful that I can pretty much set my own schedule!).

Kathleen


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## steff bugielski (Nov 10, 2003)

From the looks of both pics I do not think she is ready. I have first fresners due Apr 8 and their back end lookd puffier than that.


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

She's not ready. I've had does that had false/prelabor for a month or two before they finally delivered. Drove me nuts.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Thanks guys I am going to leave her alone till March 10th at least.


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## Beulah Gardens (Feb 26, 2008)

The other idea might be to give her a little calcium.. tums, CMPK, Goats Prefer calcium Drench~ something. IF she is in labor and it has stalled this will help. IF she is not in labor it will not hurt.


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## waygr00vy (Aug 7, 2005)

Where in Maryland are you? I am outside of Hagerstown. If you ever needed help and aren't too far I could always try and help. I have had to go in and rearrange more kids than I would have liked to!


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

I am in Nanjemoy MD which is about an hour and a half a way. So quite far unfortunately. Thank you so much for offering though!!! I will do the calcium thing just in case. Rolaids will work to right? That's what we have.


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## ShyAnne (Jun 18, 2008)

My goat had a false labor so to speak, about 3 weeks ago. The babies were moving and kicking, she even had a bit of goo. But it turned out she needed a tums. She was straining while laying on her side, it was her tummy upset. 
The straining can appear to be pushing but all the does I have ever seen push did it in the urinating position. So I was a bit confused.
I was thinking therefore what position was your doe in when she was pushing?


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## dragonchick (Oct 10, 2007)

I was told Rolaids have something other than calcium that wasn't good for goats. I stick with Tums or the generic store brand that says calcium only in the ingredients.


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## marytx (Dec 4, 2002)

Strictly from the photos, she doesn't look ready to me. This year is the first time in ten years I have had this happen, but I did have a doe distinctly appear to be in labor like that a few weeks before her kidding date this year. I thought I had it wrong. She was VERY convincing. Then it stopped, and she carried three kids to term.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Shyanne she was laying on her side when she was pushing. It just occured to me we do have tums got some free from CVS as did I the rolaids. Mary her due date is in just 3 days. There is no way she has any other due date. She was only with the buck one time for 4 days. That's longer than I like but it was out of my control at the time I can't remember why. She had a dab of goo on her backend today. It was clear in color.


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## marytx (Dec 4, 2002)

I'm sorry; I didn't mean to imply that you had the due date wrong, only that my goat's false labor was convincing enough that I thought I had it wrong.


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## christij (Mar 5, 2006)

I have two girls due sometime in the next week. They have been bagging up since the first part of Feb. They have been pawing, streching - the works. In fact Mayflower called to me when she saw me at the back door - she was laying down in the field... so I walk to the gate.. meh... okay, I say and go to check her -- nothing! She makes noises when she chews her cud now. I think they are having a contest to see how long they can keep me around the barn looking at their backsides. 
My husband says I should write a book called Goat Butt Diaries or Goat But Memiors!


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

mary said:


> I'm sorry; I didn't mean to imply that you had the due date wrong, only that my goat's false labor was convincing enough that I thought I had it wrong.


Your fine and thank you for bringing it up because if I had I may have not have thought about it and that would have been helpful! I think she did go through a false prelabor thing. I noticed tonight she was breathing heavier.


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## ShyAnne (Jun 18, 2008)

I bet thats what is was. The goo is a good sign that things are moving along. This doe of mine has had all sorts of colored goo from amber to clear and white. Sometimes she has even had long strands of it,still no babies.
Her ligs are almost gone, and she waddles like a duck. 
I will be looking forward to your baby pics.:baby04:


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Okay we just had another false prelabor thing. She was acting like she was in labor and just quit. She is now a day over due. Should I be worried? Is it stuck?


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## picklespickles (Nov 3, 2007)

it's almost like she's a birth mother for a movie star who hasn't been paid yet.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Tell me about it. The next time I am not gonna believe her and she'll have it.


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## dkluzier (Mar 22, 2009)

I got my first 2 goats in December and Babs was to be due 3/12/09. She has an enormous udder now and every morning for the last week she has laid down and moaned and groaned. She is a mini nubian.:shrug:


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## moonspinner (Jul 2, 2002)

I just saw this thread today. What ever happened with your doe?


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

She is still hanging in there moaning and groaning. Getting more milk than I thought this doe could get. We have a all day thing at church Sunday she go then you wait and see!


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## Sweet Goats (Nov 30, 2005)

WOW, I believe she is just trying to drive you totally crazy.


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## wisconsin_917 (Apr 3, 2008)

I am a little confused so her due date was march 10th? Day 150? just curious. Its safe to let them go to day 163 right?


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## hoofinitnorth (Oct 18, 2006)

If a doe is ready and is really truly pushing, I would not let them go for more than about 15-20 minutes without progress (shorter if they are struggling or tiring out or just looking distressed without progress). If this happens, I go in.

The first set of quads we had Friday did not require *any* assistance whatsoever. But I had to go in on the second set of quads born this past Saturday. The dam was lying on her side, pushing, and pushing hard, even yelling, and she was not progressing. I could even hold one back leg for her to brace against and I would see the contraction of her tail and she would push and yell. At this point, I could easily enter as she was fully dilated, but I was very careful since she had not been "naturally" stretched by an exiting baby. With plenty of lube and long gloves on, I sort of ringed around the labia gently stretching it until it was big enough for me to easily enter. Cervix was fully dilated and just beyond I could feel a kid in a bad presentation.

I worked to rearrange the kid for several minutes. Eventually I let her rest and pulled back to see if she could deliver him breech. The doe then expelled two empty sacks of fluid (which usually contain a kid with feet presenting) so I had to go back in and continue to work to get the kid turned. There just wasn't any room, which is probably why she didn't get up and stretch as I've seen other does do when they are trying to rearrange babies on their own.

I was worried I'd break his cord prematurely or hurt him as he had his legs tucked up under him and his rear was tucked up under the edge of her pelvis. All I could feel was rump and back and the feet of other kids. Not good. I FINALLY found the two back legs and delivered the first buck this way, happy to discover I had not injured him nor tangled him with another kid, nor broken his cord. It is important to note, however, that I never *pulled* on the baby, just oriented him and held his feet so that he would not go back in between pushes.

Shortly thereafter, the doe rocketed out a little doe in perfect presentation. Then more trouble with a GIGANTIC buck that barely passed his head through her pelvis (I know because I had to take my hand off his head to get him through the pelvis). Then she quit pushing and got up like she was done.

She spent several minutes cleaning babies and did not lie back down. I never leave a doe until the placenta is delivered so I gave her some time. Then I went in and checked and voila, the fourth was still there, waiting to be pushed out. I oriented her and delivered her back feet first. Soon after the doe delivered her placenta and a clean sweep showed no more babies.

Sometimes (especially with multiples or with difficult presentations or with inexperienced does or with does that are weak) they just stop pushing, even if contractions continue. As long as the cervix is open and the date is right, you want to go in and find out what, if anything, is holding things up. JMO.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

He was finally born making new thread on the new one!


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## suzyhomemaker09 (Sep 24, 2004)

not to derail the thread *too* very much
OMG Castor OIL !!!!!!!!!

not a bad thing but way back once upon a time when trying to induce to avoid a potential trip to the hospital during an impending hurricane.....

The thought still makes me cringe.


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## KittenMittens89 (Apr 18, 2008)

Sorry I didn't know. I guess everybodys upset with me today. Thanks!


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## shiandpete.1 (Aug 13, 2008)

I remeber being sick and my mom made me take a spoon full of cod liver oil....I can only assume castor oil would be just as bad...ewwwww! Congrats ont he new baby. I am jealous! Still no babies here.


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## hoofinitnorth (Oct 18, 2006)

KittenMittens89 said:


> Sorry I didn't know. I guess everybodys upset with me today. Thanks!


? (I only wanted to post one ? but the silly forum won't let me submit a message under 5 characters in length.)


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## suzyhomemaker09 (Sep 24, 2004)

Not upset with you at all....
just recalling past horror...
I'm guessing you're getting some nasty PM's in your mail.
take them with a grain of salt...as some people just want to spread misery...
I'm sure you've been here long enough to know who can give you sound advice.


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## hoofinitnorth (Oct 18, 2006)

That would be awful if you are getting angry PMs. Hope that is not the case! I asked because I didn't follow anyone being upset with you here. :stars:


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