# Composite Ammo



## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

I know it is just getting started with very limited production. What are the Pros & Cons of composite ammo?






True Velocity .308 WIN – HPBT







tvammostore.com


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

I don't see much selling at that price 

if they want people to adopt poly case ammo it needs to be cost effective get it to a buck a round and all you can buy and a lot of people would jump on it right now.

for the reloaded , not good 

for the basic it needs to go boom and work , price will probably decide if they adopt 

if you can get a 20-30% weight savings the soldier will be able to carry that many more rounds


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

I know the TVA guys well, and have been in the plant a couple times over the last couple years.

The polymer design has a couple advantages, beyond the weight savings. In mass production, it should be cheaper than brass.

Because it’s molded, you can tailor the internal dimensions to suit particular needs. In particular, if you wanted to load with small amounts of fast burn-rate propellant, or small charges of slower burn-rate for subsonic loading, you could intentionally make the internal volume smaller.

Last, the bullets are essentially glued into place with neck sealant. Neck sealant, when applied to a case with minima neck tension, can provide sufficient pull-force for rugged ammunition but provide a more consistent pull-force than relying on neck tension alone. Using sealant, you can theoretically achieve levels of neck-tension you can only get by hand loading and tuning your brass.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

I have to think the inability to reload is a big negative.

Will composite occupy a major share of future ammo?


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

HDRider said:


> *I have to think the inability to reload is a big negative.*
> 
> Will composite occupy a major share of future ammo?


only if you are a reloader , anyone buying bulk 7.62x39 steel case would have no concerns about poly cases they leave them lay where ever they go any way.

It very well could , copper is getting very expensive

if you could run a polymer coated zinc bullet and get them back to shooting for 30 cents around the masses would buy the stuff in huge quantity might even see cartridge's based around poly case with zinc bullets


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## Drizler (Jun 16, 2002)

Grossly overpriced and for what, to be the first one on your block. And got what actual purpose.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Drizler said:


> Grossly overpriced and for what, to be the first one on your block. And got what actual purpose.


It is expensive, now. The development costs were quite high (it’s more difficult to make plastic ammo work than one might think), and it was designed to a military program-of-record where reloadability is not desired but reduced weight is. So, in the military sphere of influence, it’s worth the premium.

For the commercial market, weight isn’t as critical and reloading is a concern, so it doesn’t make as much immediate sense. But, because of the sunk-costs of bringing it to market, they need to command premium prices. That’s why, at first, you’ll see it loaded for accuracy and with premium projectiles.

Once the technology is fully rooted, and one of the several manufacturers that have their foot in that arena (MAC, Gorilla/PCP, TVA and probably a couple we haven’t heard about yet) decide to chase the price-point, it should be a cheaper alternative to brass-case about on par with steel.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I think I'll write "I wanna grow up to be an ammo casing" on my Mtn Dew bottle before I toss it into the recycle bin.


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## Drizler (Jun 16, 2002)

Danaus29 said:


> I think I'll write "I wanna grow up to be an ammo casing" on my Mtn Dew bottle before I toss it into the recycle bin.


Well they do make shirts out of them and they’re damned comfortable and warm. Turtlefir .


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Posted 11/19/21 1:57 A.M. CST

I guess ammunition producers see the disposable product consumers willing to pay more for convenience also. Odds are the composite ammo while retailing at high cost is less expensive to manufacture or by not being re-loadable , as food sellers who say a poop after dinner ensures a repeat sale, the ammo producers know many don't police brass for reuse.now and see an opportunity.


I still have the shotgun shell , center fire re-loaders and nut shell brass polisher my father bought decades ago and reload to reduce my ammo costs but only have 4 friends now who save brass for me from their range outings to save us some money and keep our ammo stores up.

As a teen after my father had trained me to reload, some weekends 5 or 6 of us would save and collect brass and shotgun hulls to reload and up to about 20 years ago 15 or 16 guys brought brass by and gave me a cut of the reloads in exchange for the primers , wads and projectiles loads. Now it is only the 4 of us who reload.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

We collected brass from a range a few times. I don't know anyone who reloads now or I would still collect it.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Danaus29 said:


> We collected brass from a range a few times. I don't know anyone who reloads now or I would still collect it.


Many gun shops will buy it to resell if it’s sorted and relatively clean. Not to mention that a 5-gallon bucket full is worth about $150, scrap. To a reloader, that bucket, if one caliber, is worth closer to $400-500. If you have a source and the time, it’s worth collecting.

Just make sure you (and especially the little ones, if they’re helping) wear gloves and wash up after handling it. Most of the lead exposure from shooting comes from the primer, and that residue is worst in the brass and on the ground directly in front of the firing line, where you’re most likely to be collecting.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Hmmm, might be worth visiting the range again. We picked up about a gallon of casings last time in less than half an hour. A lot of what is left is .22 but there would be enough reloadable brass to make it worth the effort.

Last time I picked up a handful of unspent .22 rounds also.


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## Grafton County Couple (Sep 20, 2018)

Saw some of the Federal 9mm Range (red) offering at the local Bi-Mart a couple of weeks ago. I'll wait for the price to drop before I give them a try.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Grafton County Couple said:


> Saw some of the Federal 9mm Range (red) offering at the local Bi-Mart a couple of weeks ago. I'll wait for the price to drop before I give them a try.


that is a polymer coated bullet 
I have been running powder coated or Hytech coated bullets for several years , cast or swagged lead bullet coated. they glide down the barrel easier than copper you get basically no build up , no leading , and not that 9mm was hard on barrels but these coated bullets have to be even less wear. 

my home powder coated bullets and the high tech bullets glide right through a push through sizing die with no lube 

this is a little different than the polymer cased ammo that this thread was about 

these have been around a while , Acme bullet makes and sells hytech coated bullets for reloading it is a good way to save cost on components , you do need to treat them like lead bullets when loading , meaning flare the case mouth and don't over crimp as you can squeeze them down under size


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