# Friends! Help Me Figure This Out, Please!?



## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

Friends, I need your input. Based on the collective experiences & wisdom among all of you here, I think I can expect some accurate insights.

Here's the situation: I *think* my long-distance romance, the "Love Affair of the Century" with the cowboy from Oklahoma has fizzled, or rather, has come to a screeching, crashing, fatal halt. 

Last week, I suggested that I might be able to afford a bus ticket & go to see him. His immediate response (via email) was "Not right now Sweetheart." Since then, NO communication WHATSOEVER. My phone calls to him go right to voice mail. Phone calls go unreturned. Emails not responded to. 

Keep in mind, this fellow vowed that I was "heaven sent", that I was his partner & life mate. *HE* said the "L" word first! A silver-tongued devil? I guess!

My own spidey senses tell me there is something he didn't want me to know/see/witness; something deeply ugly, nasty and dishonest. The only other reasonable explanation would be that he had a heart attack, or some other fatality? Perhaps he's keeping another woman (or multiples!) a secret?

What on earth could it be??? Have I been duped? Made a fool of?

I'm thinkin' I oughta give this one up for lost, and disentangle my heart, no? At the very least, I think I should un-commit myself and resume dating, no?


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

Resume dating. If he explains himself before you find a better companion closer to you or someone who spends his money to come visit you, then resume talking if you wish but keep in mind that he's flaked once. Do I think he's hiding something? Maybe and maybe not. It could be he's scared but, then again, sissies don't normally toss out the "L" word 1st. (Creeps do--sissies, no.)


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

I would say you answered you own questions Nehi. So sorry! You deserve better.


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## starjj (May 2, 2005)

Have you visited before this? I think my spidey senses would be spelling W I F E if I had never seen him on his home turf.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Remember you said Okla cowboy, and most ive seen born raised here in Okla seem to be of the nature as you have described him. The ones who ive thought better of, have come from somewhere else and moved here.
Just for anyone elses record, Im a Okla farmer. NOT A COWBOY lol


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

FarmboyBill said:


> Remember you said Okla cowboy, and most ive seen born raised here in Okla seem to be of the nature as you have described him. The ones who ive thought better of, have come from somewhere else and moved here.
> Just for anyone elses record, Im a Okla farmer. NOT A COWBOY lol


So you're not Nehi's e-mail buddy? Is that what you're saying? Just checking....


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## Guest (Jul 26, 2013)

Awwww gee.. 
When person drops off the face of the earth , there are only a few explanations:
1. They want to
2. They passed away suddenly
3. They want to
4. They want to
5. They want to

I'd not look back in wonder..
You deserve SO much better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## sherry in Maine (Nov 22, 2007)

Go and have fun (without him) 
If he shows up again (and who knows? It could be a 'real' explanation) have some more fun.
Rely on yourself. You already know how to do all of the above stuff.


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## arcticow (Oct 8, 2006)

Nehi, let that sucker go to blazes. He deserves 'em...


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## Terri in WV (May 10, 2002)

Sounds as if he was telling you what you wanted to hear. Find someone that deserves you.

I would google him though, just out of curiosity, to see if I could find out what he's hiding(and maybe stir up a bit of trouble ).


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## Pearl B (Sep 27, 2008)

I think your spidey senses are right on! Sounds to me like you know what the answers are & answered your own questions.

I dont like lavish sweet talkers. In my experience, thats just a player.


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

send him a dozen dead roses.

i hate it for you my friend....i really do.


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

A lot of men put on they are more than they are. When it comes time to prove up, they poof instead. It doesn't mean he doesn't love or like you, it means he's scared. He'll probably show up again.

Date on, date local and don't take them so seriously.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

"Not right now" is given with a good explanation at the time, if there really is a good reason.

If there is a good reason, it is often followed immediately with " But it would be a good time after the first" or " as soon as calving season is over, which should be by the end of *whatever date*" or something similar.

Sometimes men don't deserve a second chance.

Have you seen him face to face before? If not, I would guess that he has been misrepresenting himself, or possibly is married.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

I read your original post and all up to this one. Up until tht phone call of you saying you could get together funds to go out there, how has things been? Like when was the last time you and he had a decently long conversation?
Were things normal as in regular conversation and no weird feelings?

Do you know anyone where he lives? Not to spy on him, but to see if he's hurt or ill?

The part about you "think" there may be an end to your romance is bothering me. I would wonder about a romance partner that chose this first time (if first time) to disbelieve in me - to take it to the internet for people to feed her disbelief. Etc.

Now for what it's worth, I believed in my ex- a LONG long time after others did not, so I may not be the best in believing the worse in people when it first shows. 

Good luck on this or other relationships.


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## Jaclynne (May 14, 2002)

Nehi - Sorry to hear this. 

I'd back up, and see what follows. Could be miscommunication, could be legitimate excuse not well explained, but when the 'spidey senses' start tingling - there's usually a reason. Unless you are abnormally paranoid (and I don't think you are), I'd pay attention. We were given 'spidey senses' for a reason.

But I should also confess - I know nothing about men, don't understand them at all - I just like 'em.


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## arcticow (Oct 8, 2006)

Miscommunication certainly happens, and not infrequently. This, though, doesn't sound so much like that...


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## Tommyice (Dec 5, 2010)

Nehi it's been my experience (unfortunately and fortunately) that if your gut is telling you something--Listen!

Remember women's intuition. The more you listen to her, the more she'll reward you with the correct course of action.

It pains me to read this too. I think in the online world we have all experienced this and it sucks.

:grouphug: :buds:

But don't give up trying--just look at BostonLesley and arcticow.


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## homefire2007 (Sep 21, 2007)

He's got some explaining to do, for sure. That is if you hear from him again. I would stop all e-mails, telephone calls, etc. Resume dating. Don't hide your light under a bushel and move on to greener pastures. If he can't tell you what is going on...it can't be good.


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## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

homefire2007 said:


> He's got some explaining to do, for sure. That is if you hear from him again. I would stop all e-mails, telephone calls, etc. Resume dating. Don't hide your light under a bushel and move on to greener pastures. If he can't tell you what is going on...it can't be good.


Thanks for the input, Friends. My major downfall is that I trust wa-a-ay too much!

I've stopped all attempts to contact him, and have entered the dating world again, and I AIM TO HAVE FUN! Basically, I live a rich, fulfilling & rewarding life. I plan to continue to do so!


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## homefire2007 (Sep 21, 2007)

nehimama said:


> Thanks for the input, Friends. My major downfall is that I trust wa-a-ay too much!
> 
> I've stopped all attempts to contact him, and have entered the dating world again, and I AIM TO HAVE FUN! Basically, I live a rich, fulfilling & rewarding life. I plan to continue to do so!


You rock, Nehi!!! You truly live up to your sig line


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

Go girl!


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

Jaclynne said:


> Nehi - Sorry to hear this.
> 
> I'd back up, and see what follows. Could be miscommunication, could be legitimate excuse not well explained, but when the 'spidey senses' start tingling - there's usually a reason. Unless you are abnormally paranoid (and I don't think you are), I'd pay attention. We were given 'spidey senses' for a reason.
> 
> But I should also confess - I know nothing about men, *don't understand them at all - I just like 'em.*


Amen sister!!


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

you rock nehi...keep on keeping on !!!!!!


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## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

Actually, I sorta feel like Delta Dawn, in the Tanya Tucker song


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

I'm not so sure I like them at this point in my life. I like those Y guys as friends but otherwise? Not so sure.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

In 91 I sent a gal in Ken plane tickets to come here a week. She came and stayed the week, then went back and packed. I rode a bus from Tulsa to there by way of indianapolis, and drove her pk back home. She stayed round 3 or 4 mos, then left one day while I was at work.


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

FarmboyBill said:


> In 91 I sent a gal in Ken plane tickets to come here a week. She came and stayed the week, then went back and packed. I rode a bus from Tulsa to there by way of indianapolis, and drove her pk back home. She stayed round 3 or 4 mos, then left one day while I was at work.


Sorry it didn't work out but at least you met and it seems she tried for a little while so it wasn't all for nought.


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

Nehi, I'm sorry  A favorite quote of mine would be this one (sorry guys, sometimes one can prove this out and then you have to overcome the hurdle)

The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything.

The true men, are truly rare. You are better than that. Being alone is better than being with someone who doesn't value you.

((hugs))

~ST


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## COSunflower (Dec 4, 2006)

I suspect that 99.9% of however he represented himself to you is false and when you offered to come visit...that was just to close for comfort of you finding out the TRUTH. He might not be married and just live in an old bachelor's hovel with a weedy yard and an old dog tied to a tree...not a nice (woman ready) place to bring you to, nor may he have a garden although he TOLD you that he liked gardening etc. and had one. Maybe he still lives with his mother!!! Who knows??? He may be totally embarrassed to have you visit him. I would suggest just carrying on as you do - date, have fun, live life....and who knows what the future might bring?


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## COSunflower (Dec 4, 2006)

Nehi  I also have to tell you that when MY gentleman friend and I started getting closer this summer that he went on an all out cleaning frenzy of HIS place! LOL He cleaned out things that hadn't seen the light of day in YEARS! He told me that he hated house work and I imagine that is TRUE seeing the accumulations of JUNK that he got rid of. We share my garbage and recycle cans and he keeps his spare pickup here so that I can throw dump stuff in with his. He mows my lawn for his half of the garbage can usage.  Men are like that - they let things go inside and then panic if a woman wants to come in.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

You got out cheap, Nehi, but I really hate it for you. You deserve way far better than that. You are some kinda special. Leg him go eat rocks.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

My favorite quote is, "Women think men who suck at being true men are true men, and then they talk bad about true men for being true men and not sucking at it, but they're really bad at choosing men and would rather blame the men than blame themselves for being poor judges of true men."


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## willow_girl (Dec 7, 2002)

I've found the Internet is a good place for introductions, but it's unwise to invest too much into online "relationships." Meet ASAP, and determine whether there is any chemistry, before you waste a lot of time and set yourself up for heartbreak.


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## katydidagain (Jun 11, 2004)

vicker said:


> My favorite quote is, "Women think men who suck at being true men are true men, and then they talk bad about true men for being true men and not sucking at it, but they're really bad at choosing men and would rather blame the men than blame themselves for being poor judges of true men."


Phhht. Men in person or on the Net always need fixing. How do you like me now? Guess what? I don't care. So how do you like me now? Like it matters.....


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

Now you're just being a flirt.


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## Jaclynne (May 14, 2002)

COSunflower said:


> I suspect that 99.9% of however he represented himself to you is false and when you offered to come visit...that was just to close for comfort of you finding out the TRUTH. He might not be married and just live in an old bachelor's hovel with a weedy yard and an old dog tied to a tree...not a nice (woman ready) place to bring you to, nor may he have a garden although he TOLD you that he liked gardening etc. and had one. Maybe he still lives with his mother!!! Who knows??? He may be totally embarrassed to have you visit him. I would suggest just carrying on as you do - date, have fun, live life....and who knows what the future might bring?


 
This occurred to me, and might very well be true. But if it is and even if it did not matter to you what he lived in, he did misrepresent - so liar, liar pants on fire.


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

vicker said:


> My favorite quote is, "Women think men who suck at being true men are true men, and then they talk bad about true men for being true men and not sucking at it, but they're really bad at choosing men and would rather blame the men than blame themselves for being poor judges of true men."


I'm sorry if you thought my quote of Nietzsche, who is a man speaking about men, was a form of man bashing. That wasn't my intent. As with humor, philosophical quotes often contain an element of truthfulness that's difficult to process. It's only a negative quote if you read it from a negative perspective, imo. 

But I confess, I know so many ladies, and a man or two, that are hurting so much due to relationships, that it is coloring my normal 'facts combined with feeling' approach to issues lately. So if I was offensive, I apologize.

I just want to know when relationships became so dang difficult? Some men and women are so hurt, so walled in, it's like they can never trust, never relax, never just 'be' with someone anymore. And heaven forbid if you do actually trust that someone is being honest with you, and be honest in return with them. I see people getting smacked pretty hard. This week at work, twice already, I've watched people just falling apart over someone's treatment of them, and the despair.

In order to get to know someone, you have to get close to them. By the time you get close enough to them in order to determine if they would be a good choice, you're already emotionally invested. To pull up stakes is to confess that you have wasted your valuable time and emotional energy on a wrong thing. So most will try to muddle through and make the best of it with what they are in, rather than throw all of that heart energy away and start over.

Nehi had met this guy, spent time with him already, she was emotionally invested; I remember the photos. So I hurt for her, but I don't think men are all the pits. Right now I think there are about as many women with anger and trust issues as there are men, and it isn't getting any better. I'm trying NOT to become one of those, and to retain my trusting nature. I don't know that it is serving me well at this point.

Again, I meant to support Nehi, not to blame men for all the wrongs in the world and I hope this clears up my perception of your perception...

~ST


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

I was just spouting off too.  All you have said is true.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

U got me pegged to a T ,,,itty lol


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

Well have you tried to call him and find out why he is hiding out? May not be what you think. I am really sorry that happened to you and I hope you are feeling ok. 

I do have to say that I have found that when men disappear like that it is usually for a very good reason....like they have a wife and don't want to get caught or they have been lying about something in their life and don't want you to know

I think simplertimz has it pegged....I have big issues trusting and the more I date the more they grow...just don't want to invest myself and my time just to get feelings of hurt and being used


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## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

Phone calls not returned!


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## Fair Light (Oct 13, 2010)

I happen to be messaging someone that I would like to get to know better.. Neither of us is in a position for a real relationship and that's fine...but I can't imagine getting that close to someone I really don't know from that far away..especially to be talking about the future and love and all..if that happened to me I would "run" the other way...I am too old to be getting involved with Mr Wrong.... Even though I like the messaging thing I am aware that he and I will probably be nothing more than "friends"....at least that's the view from where I stand... If anything more develops in the future it would be a big surprise as far as I am concerned..,I say just drop him and just go on with your life...he obviously has something to hide....


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## Ardie/WI (May 10, 2002)

Move on! And, next time, don't trust too soon.


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

Or, you could always show up dressed like this, with a private investigator in tow, and a lawyer or two I guess.

View attachment 12915


I think if I ever date again, I'll go with this option:

View attachment 12916


Sorry Nehi, had to inject some levity into really, a sad state of affairs betwixt men and women 

Be strong, do what feels right. Don't worry about what we think!

~ST


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

[quote
The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything.

~ST[/quote]
I'm sorry, I swear I'm not picking on you, but, who ever said this, it is a sick view of what a true man is. That man will want another conquest after this one. He will never be content. I can't see any other view than negative. Perhaps you could show me the positive?


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## willow_girl (Dec 7, 2002)

I dunno; I kinda like the idea of being a dangerous plaything! :grin:


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

vicker said:


> [quote
> The true man wants two things: danger and play. For that reason he wants woman, as the most dangerous plaything.
> 
> ~ST
> I'm sorry, I swear I'm not picking on you, but, who ever said this, it is a sick view of what a true man is. That man will want another conquest after this one. He will never be content. I can't see any other view than negative. Perhaps you could show me the positive?



Okay, I'll tell you why I do not necessarily think it is negative. I don't feel picked on at all.

Men often do thrive on an element of danger - that's why you find them racing vehicles at high speeds, shooting off fireworks, climbing water towers, skydiving, running around in front of bulls, etc.

Yet the most dangerous thing to most men that I have seen, is to truly give his heart to someone. It is the greatest risk he can take. A lot of men will jump out of a perfectly good airplane with no hesitation, yet keep themselves isolated from revealing their true self to a woman, from getting involved in love, from the potential of feeling hurt. A woman is the greatest of dangers from that perspective.

And the play part? Men do like to play - how many sports channels are there these days now anyway? They love to joke, to tease, to have fun. Many of them will toy with a woman, get her attention, joke around, be silly. The thrill of the chase is part of playing and part of the danger. Remember pulling some cute little girl's pony tail when you were little, that little girl whose attention you wanted? That's playing.

Therefore, when a man engages with a woman, whether it is intellectual play or romantic play, he puts himself in danger. For he just may find himself captivated, engaged, and opening up. For both parties' sake, let us hope that it is all for good as there are hearts and minds on both ends. The greatest damage that can be done by a woman is to wound a man's heart. 

And if he is playing with no intent of following through? Well, there's another quote that can be apt of _some_ women: "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned."

So yes, we can be dangerous to play around with. With woman, just like fire, you can either be warmed and comforted - or you can get burned.

ETA: Women know this about men, this song references it:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnkpA3CQQ-E"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnkpA3CQQ-E[/ame]

~ST


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

vicker said:


> My favorite quote is, "Women think men who suck at being true men are true men, and then they talk bad about true men for being true men and not sucking at it, but they're really bad at choosing men and would rather blame the men than blame themselves for being poor judges of true men."


Dang... that one makes my brain hurt! LOL!!


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## Bellyman (Jul 6, 2013)

Fair Light said:


> I happen to be messaging someone that I would like to get to know better.. Neither of us is in a position for a real relationship and that's fine...but I can't imagine getting that close to someone I really don't know from that far away..especially to be talking about the future and love and all..if that happened to me I would "run" the other way...I am too old to be getting involved with Mr Wrong.... Even though I like the messaging thing I am aware that he and I will probably be nothing more than "friends"....at least that's the view from where I stand... If anything more develops in the future it would be a big surprise as far as I am concerned..,I say just drop him and just go on with your life...he obviously has something to hide....


Hey, friendship is the ultimate way to start a relationship. It can be online, texts, phone calls, visits, whatever. Friendship is awesome!

My wife and I started out online. We were both watching a singles type website that was run by people that didn't do such a good job of it. (It no longer exists.) I had gone to watching it for entertainment purposes as there were some real humdingers in there. She had just found the site and was asking some questions about getting a singles group going. We wrote back and forth as friends with no intention of there being anything more. Well, as things would happen, it developed into more than emails. There came phone calls, and a spike in AT&T stock prices because of us. And then a couple of visits. And before ya knew it, we were married. And to think it all started out as just one person to another being a friend with nothing more in expectation. 

(We celebrated our 12th anniversary a few months ago. Married life is good. And she's still my best friend.)


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## Fair Light (Oct 13, 2010)

Bellyman I totally agree...I have had relationships that started out as romantic from the beginning.., I actually married two of them and non of them worked for me...I'm not looking for a serious relationship at this time... As he is one of my Facebook friends I am able to get to know more about him through his interactions with others as well as his family... He is very intelligent and an all around great guy... But I doubt that he is interested in me any more than casual friends... And I like that..maybe one day I will meet him and then maybe not..don't know...if he ends up being nothing more than what he is today then I can enjoy the friendship of a really great guy...and I am totally happy with that.., if something serious develops later .,, that would be awesome...but I am happy to stay right where I am today..your story is inspiring,,, so glad you found your best friend ..,,I wish you many blessed years together.,,


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## Fair Light (Oct 13, 2010)

Nehi...when I started dating my ex..I dated him for 6 months before I introduced him to my kids... They were 10.,11 and 13 at the time... Because my 3 little granddaughters live with me now.,, I wouldn't feel comfortable bringing a man here.... BUT... I would definitely TELL the guy why I wouldn't bring him here..,if your guy had a good reason not to want you to visit there... He should have told you..something like not now because .,, my house is a mess or whatever the reason ., its the fact that he is keeping that reason from you that makes me suspect that he has another woman there..if the reason was legitimate he would have told you... So sorry you are going through this..,


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

ST, I think you nailed the truth. Most men like to Sport like a dog chasing cars. Wouldn't know what to do if he ever caught one, a dog doesn't know how to drive!

Mixed in with the Sportsmen are True Gentlemen looking for ladies who are not Sporting Women.

How do we sort them? My best guess is stop being such a Good Sport. 

Or recognize they're sporting and play it well.


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

Guys just a tidbit of info from a womans point of view. If you aren't interested in a woman you have dated a few times be kind and just tell her. It is what it is. I would have more respect for a man who was honest and kind enough to let me know.

And the same thing goes for women.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

Nicely said, ST. I begin to see.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

I can see where IF I was doing whatever with a woman, that I would be hesitant to bring her here. My house is in bad shape. Id be ashamed of what she thought of me once she saw it. I would worry that the shape of the house would do me in before she even bothered to find out about the kind of guy I was. I wouldn't know how to articulate this to her in a way that would keep me from shame in my situation, and I just KNOW that trying to talk about it either on the ph or in pms, would likely make the actual situation much worse in her mind.
Just saying, There could be a reason for no pleasing you with a ph call that he is embarrased to talk about.

Tambo. Most guys who have tried to follow your advice, and have lived as long as I have would never do it nowadays.
SO< A guy has dated a gal for a month or so. Hes decided she just aint cutting it, OR he dosent wanna cut it lol, WHATEVER. so he politely tells her that he thinks that its not gonna work.
SHE, on the other hand thinks things are going swimmingly, since he seems to be a good guy, with feelings, and he isn't rushing the sex, or much of anything else, just taking it slow and easy. THEN she gets the BOMB dropped on her. Here she may have been trying his last name against her first. She may have been doing some future mental planning, She may have thought that its just a short walk down the garden path to the church ect. THEN She finds it aint gonna happen. Her whole world has crashed. She is crushed. She cant see why he dosent see/feel what she saw/felt in the relationship for the month. She thinks it must be her, but what could it be that she did wrong? She thinks that she did all that she could to be the pleasing date/person/woman that he could want. THEN she might think that hes just a player. Maybe hes already got somebody else on the line. Maybe hes had somebody on the line for a week or 2. THEN, she gets hatful. She wants to defend herself. She wants an explanation, but dosnt want to hear it, and wont buy it. She ends up screaming about all men being total worthless jerks that only want to get to know a woman so that they can have sex with her while there lining up mrs Next.

Been there, Done that. WONT do that again.


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

I know online dating sites are supposed to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and it works well for many people. I'm not knockin' it for those comfortable cruising and dating the fiber-optic superhighway at the speed of light. I'd rather bump along the dirt tracks stopping to smell the flowers and cast my lure in a nice bend in the river.

It's difficult enough sorting princes from frogs in person in the light of day. Almost impossible for me to do sort in the dark on the internet without a huge time investment. They all SAY they're looking for a real relationship and spout how wonderful they are. I don't know how many women I know who've found their husband's profile. Quite a few.

It didn't take me long to get sick of men being all into me, invite me to bed on the first kiss, then be all hostile when I decline the offer. 

I use the dating sites differently now. I have a really lame profile and no pic. Very few hits. What I have access to is who is single, looking and online in my area. I get to observe them in their natural habitat. Who they SAY they are and who they REALLY are would send Satan running for Holy Water! 

No, not all of them are that bad. I know many of them, they are nice guys but their pain and fear runs deep. They try, but they're hit and run and women get hurt.

I'm sticking to local guys who aren't online. Put on a walking sinker, good bait and a smile, cast upstream and enjoy my day in the sun. Wave at the boats as they drift by.


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

Laura said:


> I use the dating sites differently now. I have a really lame profile and no pic. Very few hits. What I have access to is who is single, looking and online in my area. I get to observe them in their natural habitat. Who they SAY they are and who they REALLY are would send Satan running for Holy Water!
> 
> No, not all of them are that bad. I know many of them, they are nice guys but their pain and fear runs deep. They try, but they're hit and run and women get hurt.


Yeah, I did a bit observing in the same way and yeah, they were not the same as their profile. I don't think in most cases it was totally intentional as we all want to put our best foot forward and most of the ones I know are really decent guys. There are a couple that I would say, that is not the case and if you have been dating for anytime at all the warning signs are there. 

Online dating is just another way to meet people. Like hanging out here. But for a romantic relationship you need to meet and see the person. Really soon after making contact works the best. That is the difficulty with long distance relationships. I know a few that did not do that...to the point of marrying. It was a complete disaster and they were very hurt. On both sides. 

Anyway, to have a meaning relationship with someone takes time and a mutual desire. Oh, and the ability to communicate what you want which seems to be the biggest barrier. I know I can't read anyone's mind but I sure hear what they say and watch what they do. Online kinda limits how we communicate since we can't hear their voice, see their expressions, or see their actions. So what we think they are saying may not really be what they are saying...lol. IMHO.


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

FarmboyBill said:


> I can see where IF I was doing whatever with a woman, that I would be hesitant to bring her here. My house is in bad shape. Id be ashamed of what she thought of me once she saw it. I would worry that the shape of the house would do me in before she even bothered to find out about the kind of guy I was. I wouldn't know how to articulate this to her in a way that would keep me from shame in my situation, and I just KNOW that trying to talk about it either on the ph or in pms, would likely make the actual situation much worse in her mind.
> Just saying, There could be a reason for no pleasing you with a ph call that he is embarrased to talk about.
> 
> Tambo. Most guys who have tried to follow your advice, and have lived as long as I have would never do it nowadays.
> ...


So how would you do it Bill?


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## Guest (Jul 29, 2013)

Skype...Arcticow and I spent 2 hours every day, 7 days a week for 3 months.. I saw him more often than my married friends saw their husbands..l
You cannot see how the other person behaves in a real-life social setting..i.e. how do they treat the waitress? Yet as far as internet dating, Skype is the way to go until you can meet


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

I havnt done it since 74, but then I just walked away. Maybe immature, but it was clean, quiet, and quick.


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

FarmboyBill said:


> I havnt done it since 74, but then I just walked away. Maybe immature, but it was clean, quiet, and quick.


I guess you just left her wondering to huh?


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

yuppa


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

FarmboyBill said:


> Remember you said Okla cowboy, and most ive seen born raised here in Okla seem to be of the nature as you have described him. The ones who ive thought better of, have come from somewhere else and moved here.
> Just for anyone elses record, Im a Okla farmer. NOT A COWBOY lol


So I guess some Okla farmers are cut from the same cloth as an Okla Cowboy.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Like I said, that was in around 73 or 4. I was a Kansas farmer then.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

AND, What if I am the way I am. IF women wernt the way they are, the way I described them, Im sure most men wouldn't mind giving notice when their time had expired. No0 guy wants to go through the hilacious hell that most women put up when they've been dumped as it were, or displaced. Theres no kind way of doing it.


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## nehimama (Jun 18, 2005)

FarmboyBill said:


> I havnt done it since 74, but then I just walked away. Maybe immature, but it was clean, quiet, and quick.


It was NOT clean, quiet & quick! For YOU, maybe, but NOT for her! Cruel!


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

FarmboyBill said:


> AND, What if I am the way I am. IF women wernt the way they are, the way I described them, Im sure most men wouldn't mind giving notice when their time had expired. No0 guy wants to go through the hilacious hell that most women put up when they've been dumped as it were, or displaced. *Theres no kind way of doing it*.


This is where you are wrong Bill. You must have had a guilty conscience is all I can say!!


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## bowdonkey (Oct 6, 2007)

I went through this whole topic and no posts by swampman! There's more fish in the ocean, no worries nehimama.


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

Laura said:


> ST, I think you nailed the truth. Most men like to Sport like a dog chasing cars. Wouldn't know what to do if he ever caught one, a dog doesn't know how to drive!
> 
> Mixed in with the Sportsmen are True Gentlemen looking for ladies who are not Sporting Women.
> 
> ...


I don't know that _most_ men is accurate. I think some men really take to it, and others appear to be sporting because they do catch a car and then don't know what the heck to do with it. They *thought* they wanted a car, looked cool while whooshing past with all that turning wheels and thrumming under the hood but yikes, now he's got it, what to do, what to do? Especially when you get into our age bracket. 

I personally stink at 'sporting'; I say what I mean and mean what I say when I am one on one (joking in here doesn't count...lol!) And I'd prefer to stay that way. This is one place where "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em" doesn't feel like a good fit for me.

~ST


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

bostonlesley said:


> Skype...Arcticow and I spent 2 hours every day, 7 days a week for 3 months.. I saw him more often than my married friends saw their husbands..l
> You cannot see how the other person behaves in a real-life social setting..i.e. how do they treat the waitress? Yet as far as internet dating, Skype is the way to go until you can meet


Good grief, I'd have to stay presentable when I came home from a long day of being dressed up at work. Maybe I could point it towards the ceiling fan and they'd get dizzy and fall asleep and I could still be comfortable in the evening 

~ST


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

FarmboyBill said:


> AND, What if I am the way I am. IF women wernt the way they are, the way I described them, Im sure most men wouldn't mind giving notice when their time had expired. No0 guy wants to go through the hilacious hell that most women put up when they've been dumped as it were, or displaced. Theres no kind way of doing it.


Actually, between two mature people, there are very kind ways of doing it. What is unkind is to drop someone with nary a word. Closure helps one move forward with dignity.

I would surely rather know something about what I did or didn't do that contributed, particularly since it has been a very, very long time since I have dated anyone. Even in my short time dating, the few guys I went out with I was clearly honest about a)not wishing to see them again and b) if they asked why, I told them, and thanked them for their time and wished them well. One took it well, two didn't and I had to tell them again, more than once, thanks but no thanks.

So this brings up a question for men (maybe I should start a new thread?):

What do YOU guys want to hear when we are not interested? Do you want a reason, or just "Thanks, we don't have enough in common?"

~ST


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Your statement, Between 2 mature people. says a lot. I would bet, generally, in any 2 people in a relationship, one IF NOT BOTH is immature.
As to your question. If its only been 2 weeks to a month, Id rather take what you said. IF its a month to 6 mos or longer, Id like a reason.


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## Shygal (May 26, 2003)

tambo said:


> So I guess some Okla farmers are cut from the same cloth as an Okla Cowboy.



To be fair, Bill said he did it in 1974 and has never done it since. Thats 39 years ago. How many of us have never done something that wasn't very nice, in our lives? Something we regret doing?

It doesn't sound like Bill is gloating over doing it, and I'm sure he probably felt guilty over it, yes. The past is past, from what he said, he hasn't done it since and wouldn't do it again. Thats the point of it, learning from mistakes and all that


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

SG, Your going to have to quit posting positive remarks about me. Im out of my heart medicine, lol

BUT your right. AND, this is exactly why I don't get near women, NOR encourage them to get near me. I just cant handle breaking up with a woman. One broke up with me in 91, and I couldn't handle that either. Im extremely vulnerable myself, and I hate to think I have hurt someone else, so, I guess it is what it is. Life goes on the way it keeps going on. I have a strategy, but its VERY slow, and so far, hasn't been working, But then, I don't really care if it does. Maybe, probably, that's why its so slow.


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## wyld thang (Nov 16, 2005)

Laura said:


> ST, I think you nailed the truth. Most men like to Sport like a dog chasing cars. Wouldn't know what to do if he ever caught one, a dog doesn't know how to drive!
> 
> Mixed in with the Sportsmen are True Gentlemen looking for ladies who are not Sporting Women.
> 
> ...


Or...Sport back with an intensity that makes their head spin...weeds out the players and gives the gems a chance to have something they can sink their teeth into without having to treat you like a glass emotional drama basket case princess

I know I need someone as wild as me, I find them out there on the edge, DOING the edge, not on the internet posting a profile to impress. 

PS by wild I do NOT mean ----ty

And another thing, I start with friendship. Been really blessed with a bunch of real friends who will be there the rest of our lives.


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## wyld thang (Nov 16, 2005)

rrr, I mean hoe-ey


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

wyld thang said:


> Or...Sport back with an intensity that makes their head spin...weeds out the players and gives the gems a chance to have something they can sink their teeth into without having to treat you like a glass emotional drama basket case princess
> 
> I know I need someone as wild as me, I find them out there on the edge, DOING the edge, not on the internet posting a profile to impress.
> 
> ...


 Totally agree with sporting back with intensity! Most players are obvious to me. They're up in your space quickly with their masculine energy giving you the Feel Goods, lavish praise, promising love, security, protection, fun, blah, blah, bah while sticking another drink in your hand. Well, I'll be razzle dazzled! I call End Game with, "Nice 4x4, I wanna trash your truck!" (poof)

Not a Player if he tosses you the keys.

Perhaps most men are not sportsmen, but I think most men like to play. I live in sportsman's paradise, but there's internet gamers and workshop tinkerers. It's the same concepts. A lot of my unhappy women friends don't understand Guy Play and get blown up by men's attempts to connect through play. They absolutely HATE some of my guy friends.

Some dogs chase cars just to water your tires even though they have a perfectly good minivan parked in their own yard. They can't do it if you don't stop.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Well, P on that lol


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

Well an article that I read keeps coming to mind....It basically said:
Men are hunters and women are gatherers

Not sure why....but it did


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

I just don't think men and women are all that different, a good person wants the security of one person that they can count on. There are just as many women players as there are men players. If you have a history of being dissatisfied by the quality of men or women you have had, you might want to look at your own responsibility in choosing that person to start with. There are far more quality people than there are schmucks, in my opinion, the ones complaining just aren't interested in the good ones. 
Not meaning you, Nehi, we've all been burnt, but there is just not a genetic reason why some men suck. It is a character flaw that should be somewhat obvious at some point early in a relationship. The question should be, why don't I see it?


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Men are always hunting for other women.
Women are always gathering what a man has.
Neither has good implications.


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

Bill....thats one way of looking at it...lol


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

vicker said:


> I just don't think men and women are all that different, a good person wants the security of one person that they can count on. There are just as many women players as there are men players. If you have a history of being dissatisfied by the quality of men or women you have had, you might want to look at your own responsibility in choosing that person to start with. There are far more quality people than there are schmucks, in my opinion, the ones complaining just aren't interested in the good ones.
> Not meaning you, Nehi, we've all been burnt, but there is just not a genetic reason why some men suck. It is a character flaw that should be somewhat obvious at some point early in a relationship. The question should be, why don't I see it?


Sometimes I don't think it is just the choosing but also the attracting. If you are using an online way of meeting people you may not be aware of their character until you have met them and spent some time with them. So I believe that sets up an increase in more problems, especially with filtering out those that really do suck.


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## SimplerTimez (Jan 20, 2008)

vicker said:


> I just don't think men and women are all that different, a good person wants the security of one person that they can count on. There are just as many women players as there are men players. If you have a history of being dissatisfied by the quality of men or women you have had, you might want to look at your own responsibility in choosing that person to start with. *There are far more quality people than there are schmucks*, in my opinion, the ones complaining just aren't interested in the good ones.
> Not meaning you, Nehi, we've all been burnt, but there is just not a genetic reason why some men suck. It is a character flaw that should be somewhat obvious at some point early in a relationship. The question should be, why don't I see it?


The bolded part - possibly. What means quality varies from person to person just like we saw in the 'ideal mate' thread. 

~ST


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## foaly (Jan 14, 2008)

vicker said:


> I just don't think men and women are all that different, a good person wants the security of one person that they can count on. There are just as many women players as there are men players. If you have a history of being dissatisfied by the quality of men or women you have had, you might want to look at your own responsibility in choosing that person to start with. There are far more quality people than there are schmucks, in my opinion, the ones complaining just aren't interested in the good ones.
> Not meaning you, Nehi, we've all been burnt, but there is just not a genetic reason why some men suck. *It is a character flaw that should be somewhat obvious at some point early in a relationship*. The question should be, why don't I see it?


Unless that person is a fabulous actor/actress. Some folks can keep up a good front for years (as I learned the hard way).


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

I think it's our own issues and desires, perhaps some media driven Magical Thinking, that keeps us from seeing a person's character flaws early enough to not get blindsided. My BPDxh is a chameleon, presenting as The even tempered, prince charming godly man. He is the opposite, I learned too late.

My responsibility is to myself, to not let myself be in such a place of vulnerability where I can fall prey to such illusions again. I won't let myself get lonely or isolated again. I have no intentions of going "exclusive" with any man until he throws marriage on the table and I am agreeable. 

I date for fun, to make friends, to be friends, not to find an exclusive lover. Sex is not on the table. That relationship won't happen without friendship first. I'm not out to change a man to fit my agenda. A lot of men in my age bracket are looking for a woman less unencumbered than I. Their kids are grown and gone, the dog died and they were blindsided when their perfectly good wife took half. They're ready to travel. They aren't a-holes because they're pursuing a different track than I. Eventually there will be a Guy Friend who aligns with me.

I like men, all kinds of men. If I didn't I woulda' become a hairdresser instead of an equipment operator. I don't FEAR men because I don't measure all men according to what my BPDxh is. I can have good conversations with men, have fun, play, watch them work, be their friend, men talk relationship stuff with me, and still say, "Thank God he's not my husband."

Meanwhile I'm out there with DD finding the opportunities to meet new people, learning what I like and don't like, finding new friends. I don't go to social events with the agenda of meeting The One. That doesn't sound fun, but full of disappointment. There is no box to put him in anyway and I certainly wouldn't fit in his box.

Yes, we all have the desire to Love and be Loved, to know the security someone has our back no matter what and we can trust that beyond measure. We've all felt the knife plunged into our hearts of human betrayal. Follow in the footsteps of Jesus Christ of the Bible, the One who supped and drank wine with whores and fishermen.


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

foaly said:


> Unless that person is a fabulous actor/actress. Some folks can keep up a good front for years (as I learned the hard way).


Yep...I've experienced that too


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## Jaclynne (May 14, 2002)

Laura said:


> I like men, all kinds of men. If I didn't I woulda' become a hairdresser instead of an equipment operator. I don't FEAR men because I don't measure all men according to what my BPDxh is. I can have good conversations with men, have fun, play, watch them work, be their friend, men talk relationship stuff with me, and still say, "Thank God he's not my husband.


 
Help me out here Laura, what's the dif between a hairdresser and an equipment operator? One of them likes all kinds of men and the other doesn't? Does operating machinery take all fear of relationships away or magically make a person understand all of the opposite gender and like them? What if if you were a hairdresser that could also operate equipment? Would you be like superwoman or just confused?

That doesn't even make sense.


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

Jaclynne said:


> Help me out here Laura, what's the dif between a hairdresser and an equipment operator? One of them likes all kinds of men and the other doesn't? Does operating machinery take all fear of relationships away or magically make a person understand all of the opposite gender and like them? What if if you were a hairdresser that could also operate equipment? Would you be like superwoman or just confused?
> 
> That doesn't even make sense.


What I'm saying is very few women can be in large groups of men without, a) getting seductive - b)getting intimidated/fearful - c) getting mad - or d) making the men angry by acting like a prima donna.

Absolutely nothing against hairdressers and their clients. I played Beauty School Dropout with all my daughters. Spending my days indoors gossiping about people with insecure women and listening to how men are all alike would make me not trustworthy with scissors. They are not happy places to me.

I don't get why you are triggered, but that's okay too.


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## Jaclynne (May 14, 2002)

I'm 'triggered' because you took an entire group of women and essentially labeled them insecure and gossipy too. 
We can't make broad statements as if they were fact because of a small sampling of our personal experience. That's like saying every girl from Texas dipped snuff when she was a teenager just because you knew 3 that did. There's a lot of girls from Texas and they don't dip snuff and never have. See what I'm saying.

Oh, and I do know some women that in a group of men will get flirty, get irritated, and/or get insecure - but they do not all work in the same industry or even have the same backgrounds.


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## Fowler (Jul 8, 2008)

Jaclynne, think about it....... giving advice, lives on ST, and is their only social outlet to tell people what to do, think, and live. I'd listen to them, hair dressers are trying to rule the world, one bad hair cut at a time......LOL!!!!!


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## skeeter (Mar 23, 2013)

Laura said:


> What I'm saying is very few women can be in large groups of men without, a) getting seductive - b)getting intimidated/fearful - c) getting mad - or d) making the men angry by acting like a prima donna.
> 
> Absolutely nothing against hairdressers and their clients. I played Beauty School Dropout with all my daughters. Spending my days indoors gossiping about people with insecure women and listening to how men are all alike would make me not trustworthy with scissors. They are not happy places to me.
> 
> I don't get why you are triggered, but that's okay too.



I know lots of women that work with men everyday and they do not act that way nor would they think that is a way to get their job done. Makes me kinda of wonder where you work and why people would act like that around you. Just sayin...


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Some workplaces are full of catty people and some are not.

It works that way.


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## Fowler (Jul 8, 2008)

Heck there's a lot of chatty people here too.....LOL


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