# Goat Polio?



## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Around 5 weeks ago, my yearling doe started to stiffen in one back leg. The stiffness progressed to the other over the course of a few days, then she went down. All extremities were stiffened, leading a vet to diagnose her with tetanus. We gave her anti-toxins and antibiotics, and a round of the injectable wormer as well as banamine. (The animal was placed on my farm without her shots). Well, her condition worsened to where her head was pulled straight back over her spine. Still down. She was in no apparent pain, and continued to eat though we had to give her water from a syringe. She never went blind, never had a convulsion, but had tremors on occasion as if she was cold. The vet then took her off the atibiotics calling it overkill. He placed her on muscle relaxants. At this point, red flags were up everywhere, and I began to suspect that he really had no idea. I started her on pennicillin the day he told me to stop the antibiotics, it just didn't seem right as she got no better. Then I called in an old (and I mean OLD) vet who said she had a brain tumor or fractured spine, but since he agreed she was in no pain and was still eating, he gave her long acting tetracycline and dex. Within an hour of the dex, she was moving her head about normally, bright and alert as could be. The results wore off quickly, within two days, and I begged him to PLEASE give her a thiamine injection as well as the other stuff. Her neck once again loosened and she began to move her front legs again. He insists it cannot be Polio since she never stopped eating. I insist it IS as she had gotten into some old hay right about when her symptoms started. This time, the results lasted 5 days, and he came out and gave her another round of shots without her ever having reverted to her neck arched back over her spine. Heartened, I got B complex injectable vitamins and started dosing her, though the only kind I could find was the 12.5mg. I have ordered the higher dose Fortified B vitamin and should receive it early next week. The vet didn't want to leave me any since he is so sure it isn't Goat Polio. Subsequent research led me to realize I was only giving her a margin of what she needed, and I am now giving her 5 shots of 6cc at a time to equal the doses needed for an 80 pound goat of the 12.5mg. It stinks, but she takes it in stride. She is now able to maintain sitting up on her brisket for a few moments at a time. All this time she has been down, I have laid and propped pillows under her to keep her from being flat out on her side. She only has one side she is comfortable with laying on, luckily it is her right side so her rumen is up. I try to prop her onto her brisket during the day. Her back legs remain useless but not paralyzed, she can in fact move them but has no strength in them. Her front legs are regaining use and she tries valiantly to stand up. Through out all of this, she has remained alert and happy, she loves the attention. Two days ago, we fashioned a sling for her with great results, she placed her front legs flat down and her left hind leg, which had been contracted, dropped to the ground. Unfortunately, they put her back into the sling yeaterday and left. She had probably used her front legs, lost balance and was found by my husband hanging pretty much upside down with her poor neck bent onto the ground. He stayed with her and reported that she was snug as a bug when he left her, having eaten and seeming no worse for her ordeal. But today when I went to check on her, she seemed a bit less happy then she has been, though she ate voraciously. Then this evening we tried the sling, no go. I took her back out and laid her back into her bed. She ate lots, but just seems a bit less happy. I know the odds are against her recovery, but I am sure trying everything as long as she isn't in pain and is bright, alert, happy, and eating. I just started high dosing her today with the B1 as per a formula I found somewhere.

Any thoughts, advice, success stories? Does this sound like Polio or am I way off base? She doesn't fit the category neatly, but she has no obvious pain in her spine or neck. I had also noticed she was scraping or pressing her head into the stall walls prior to going down. Please do not flame me, she is in no pain and her eyes do not say she is ready to give up yet. Please help us!


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## thatcompchick (Dec 29, 2004)

Head pressing also leads me to think listeriosis, but she would have been dead by now, so back to polio.

Have you checked her eyelids for anemia? Profound anemia can also have this type of effect on an animal, although they go a bit more listless.

Probably best to 'throw the book' at her - but be very careful with the banamine.

What is her temperature???

Andrea


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## hoofinitnorth (Oct 18, 2006)

WOW! You are really working hard for this doeling.

Head pressing can be pain/discomfort. I would offer her electrolytes and probiotic, especially in light of the recent round of antibiotics. If you are still giving antibiotics, try giving the probiotic several hours after the antibiotic so it has a chance to work. Are you injecting the b vitamins or are you giving them orally?


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Yeah, her "never give up" attitude has really worked on my heart. When the first vet was here, he said she didn't have a temp. I confess to not having checked it since. The only thermometer I have is a digital, I assume it should work. As you can tell, I am new to the goat world though I have quite a bit of horsie experience. She was drinking gatorade but I ran out. I have another type in the fridge, I will give her that. What type of probios do you suggest? And she is getting the injectable B complex, the strongest I could find was 12.5mg/ml so I started giving her 5 shots of it at once to try to high dose her. I ordered the stonger on-line but have no hope og getting before early next week.

I was thinking Listeriosis, too at first. But the "stargazing" (there is a big fancy word, opth something or the other) leads me to believe Polio. Her head was arched straight back with her horns touching her spine and very tense neck muscles. 

I am amazed that she hasn't passed yet, with being mis-diagnosed in the beginning and being recumbant for a month. I have her bundled in blankets, laying in a doggie bed or saddle pads, propped ever so slightly off her side. She has in the past couple of days taken to kicking the blankets off with her front feet, which was way more than she could do last week. The real improvement only seemed to start after the Thiamine.

I hope it is not too late, though all I am reading says it is PAST too late, no matter what she has, it should have done her in by now. I'll come back on after her night shots/feeding and let you know about temp. It will be dark to check her eyelids, but I will let you know in the AM.

My girl is a fighter, that's for sure.

ETA: What should I use if she appears anemic?

Thank you both!


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## needstoknowmore (Feb 6, 2005)

The stiffness started in one back leg. Did it then move to the other hind leg and then to the front end?? Starting at the back and moving forwards? 
Just a thought. There is a vitamin dif. that causes that. For the life of me I can't remember what vitamin. And don't have time to look it up. I will in the morning.

edited to add.
I just read your last post. and the gator ad triggered my brain, well maybe. It is a dif. of electrolytes that causes it to start at the hind legs and work forewards. At least I think. 
If hubby wasn't dragging me out of the house I would look it up now.


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## susanne (Nov 4, 2004)

was this doe tested for cae? although not very common, some cae+ animals can show neurological signs like this. normal temp would be typical too.
another possibility is an abscess along the spinal cord. the dex helped with releasing pressure and that is why she improved for a little while. next question would be did she come from a cl negative herd?
is she in a pen with other goats? got bullied and got hurt on the head?
i think a doe with listeriosis or polio would be dead by now. your vets are right about that.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Hi Suzanne. She tested CAE negative. She was destined for someone's dinner table and my friend fell in love with her and bought her, so I am not certain of her heritage or possible exposures. I do agree she should be all accounts be passed on already, no matter what the disease. I am terrified I am dead wrong and it is in fact a tumor or something horrible on her spine/brain. But she has no pain during palpation of her spine or neck, and no facial paralysis or drooping, or abnormal eye movement (nystagmis, I think it's called?) to indicate a brain tumor, unless she has something right at the brain stem. She was initially housed with a sheep. There was moldy hay on the other side of the fence (I know, sheer stupidity) and we suspect that the sheep was trying to get at it and got zapped by the single strand of electric along the top of the fence, falling over backward and having an x-ray confirmed spinal fracture. I do not think it was predatory, as he had no signs whatsoever of mauling, and I am sure a predator would have finished the job (Bandit was still alive at the time of the X-Ray, naturally we had him put down ((sob)) ). It is ironic that within days of this incident, Sandy started with the hind leg gimpiness. In answer to Needstoknowmore, it was progressive...one back leg, then the other, then the front end, then down. It is in keeping with Goat Polio, or Thiamine Deficiency. I suspect she got a hold of the hay at the same time Bandit tried to. Stupid stupid stupid, we thought they wouldn't get to it on the other side of the wire fence and were waiting to throw it out into the woods. We will never know what really happened to Bandit. They got along great, very gentle with each other, never any roughhousing. The friends did in fact get another little goat to keep Sandy company, but her symptoms had started prior to his getting here. We kept them totally seperated after she began to really go down hill, but they were together a few days when she was just gimpy (we thought it was an injury). I am a bit baffled by the whole sequence of events.

Thank you all for your concern for my little girl.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

I'm no help, but just wanted to say that you are in my thoughts and prayers. I sure hope she can pull through...


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## powderhooves (May 11, 2008)

I will also keep her in my prayers. Your post brought tears to my eyes. These past two years of raising goats has brought me so much happiness but also many tears shed. They so touch our hearts.


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## Sue (Jul 22, 2002)

You are doing the right thing with the B complex. The one case I personally have had was with a sheep. The fortified B complex worked within 12 hours ~ I gave three big doses of 12 ccs to a 60 lb lamb in one day. B vitamins are water soluble and they basically pee them out.

Since our local vets don't seem to want to educate themselves on sheep or goats, people call me because I take the time to research. This year I have received two calls describing what you are going through with your doe. Both these people saw their vets and they were told them to put the ewes down. In both cases, the ewes looked near death but both were brought back by B complex (12 ccs 2 to 3 times a day until the ewes got up) and dex (10 ccs every other day, three times). Granted, it took time but it worked with both and you can't tell now that anything was ever wrong with them. One ewe, I told the owner to prop hre up between hay bales daily so she was setting on her brisket. She eventually got up on her own.

Keep up the good work and I do hope your doe comes around.


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## Sue (Jul 22, 2002)

You are doing the right thing with the B complex. The one case I personally have had was with a sheep. The fortified B complex worked within 12 hours ~ I gave three big doses of 12 ccs to a 60 lb lamb in one day. B vitamins are water soluble and they basically pee them out.

Since our local vets don't seem to want to educate themselves on sheep or goats, people call me because I take the time to research. This year I have received two calls describing what you are going through with your doe. Both these people saw their vets and they were told them to put the ewes down. In both cases, the ewes looked near death but both were brought back by B complex (12 ccs 2 to 3 times a day until the ewes got up) and dex (10 ccs every other day, three times). Granted, it took time but it worked with both and you can't tell now that anything was ever wrong with them. I told the owner of one of the ewes to prop her up between hay bales daily so she was setting on her brisket. He did and she eventually got up on her own.

Keep up the good work and I do hope your doe comes around.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

You can buy probios at the feed store or you can give her active yogurt that you buy at the grocery store.

Good luck!


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

What about deer worm?


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

You guys are so awesome. I will be going to a feed store later today and will check to see what probios and iron stuff I can find. Does anyone recommend the Kid Saver type of thing, even though she is not a kid anymore? I tried yogurt, she hated it.

Last night I went out, gave her her 5 shots plus some Banamine due to her horrible experience of the day before, and she drank tons of water, dove nose first into her grain (I am trying to limit how much grain she gets) and set her up with her hay within reach. I put her usual treat on top of the hay, handfuls of yummy leaves. She took her nose and buried it into the leaves up to her eyes and started throwing the leaves around. Then she ate a few of them and tossed them around again. I think she was playing, it had a definite playful feel to it.

I think I figured out why she isn't dead yet. The first vet that diagnosed her with tetanus had given me 5 shots of B complex to be given once per day. I suspect it was enough to keep her going, but nowhere near enough to cure her. Now that I am racking my brain trying to put it all together, it was a day or two after we ran out of the B complex injections that her neck arched back. She went about a week and a half with no further B injections. I hope it isn't too late. It is so upsetting that the one thing that *might* (still not sure I am right, just hoping) have helped her was so simple. I will always have a bottle of fortified B complex around and will give it at the first sign of anything goofy with these guys. I hope I didn't learn too little, too late. She is the sweetest personality, much like a cat, very loveable. I have gotten way too attached to her to just give up.

Sorry for rambling. ANyhow, anyone recommend the Kid Saver or anything like it that I can get at Tractor Supply?

Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers. Keep 'em coming. And thank you ALL for not flaming me for keeping her alive. Trust me, if she seemed stressed or in pain, I would do the right thing.


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

I don't think I would be giving her any grain.


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## susanne (Nov 4, 2004)

i would not give grain either. just good quality hay and plenty of water. 
save-a-kid is not beneficial at this point either. i would not change anything that could upset the rumen. hay is the best until she is better. 
i don't believe there would have ben any signs of improvement if it would have been meningal worms. 
still think the dex was the reason for improvement because keeping the swelling in the neuro system down.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Thanks for the advice, no more grain for Sandy...will you guys come over and tell HER that?!

I was highly suspicious of the menigeal worms, too. We DO have lots of deer around here. Would it hurt to give her the IM wormer? I am trying to get a list together for Tractor Supply, I have to go over and get more needle tips. If it is the dex helping her, then I am probably facing something way more than I can fix. I really hope it is not that, but am worried it might be. I just don't know, her symptoms don't fit neatly into one category but DO fit into lots of different scenarios. I don't want to over-medicate her, but want to give her what she might need to combat this. I do have Banamine and gave her a hit last night, but I don't want to mask the symptoms of a severe nuerological assault (tumor, etc). In other words, I had said if her neck arches back again, I will know this is more than I can fix and will have to put her down. I agree, the initial improvement occurred after the Dex with more improvement after the Thiamine. I am hoping the Dex is keeping the swelling down so the thiamine levels can get back to normal. I also believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus...I am grasping at straws, I know. I can't bear the thought that I will lose her, but in the back of my mind I know this is the probable outcome. I have seen miracles before in my animals, I hope she will be another one.

Thank you guys for making me feel like I am doing the right thing by fighting for/with her. I promise that when SHE gives up, so will I, and if I see any discomfort/pain, I will make the right choice. Other than hating life because she can't get up, she seems fine.


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## susanne (Nov 4, 2004)

don't feel so bad. sometimes there are things we can not fix.
one possibility is necropsy if she dies. that might be the only way to get conclusion.
i'll send good thoughts your way and hope for better outcome.


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## millie (Nov 23, 2008)

Sorry you have had to go through this ordeal. I had a Nigerian buck that was housed with another for many months. Eventually I think the larger, more dominant one put the other off his feed. I found him in the corner, head pressing. He never exhibited the stiff arched neck, but did walk and stumble in circles 'stargazing'. He would bump into the wall. He was down in the rear intermittently although never over on his side. He was also misdiagnosed at the vets, but eventually went on Thiamine therapy and semi-recovered. He was never quite right in the head after that and I ended up putting him down since he couldn't figure out what he was supposed to do with the does. He was the first buck I bred and was special in my herd. No moldy hay involved here, so hope you don't beat yourself up over it. If I remember right, the vet told me ruminants have to make most of their thiamine, it isn't just absorbed, and that is why they can get deficient rather quickly. anyone can correct me on this... Also wanted to confirm what you all are talking about as "dex". Not familiar with this acronym. Best wishes for your does full recovery (and yours). Sounds like its very possible with the treatments you are giving. Its a stressful time when our animals are very sick.


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## KimM (Jun 17, 2005)

Yes, it sounds like advanced deer worm infection to me too, from the things I've seen firsthand. If I see any of my goats off in the rear I'll be treating for deerworm right off. 


southerngurl said:


> What about deer worm?


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

She is a pet, so hopefully she can recover enough to eat, poop and romp on her own.

Millie, I am sorry things turned out badly for your buck. Dex is a short term for dexamethazone, or something along those lines. It is a steroid given to ease swelling, similar to prednisone. The fear I have with the Dex having worked is that it is treating the symptoms of brain/spinal swelling without having treated the cause. In other words, a tumor (for instance) is growing but the Dex is allowing the blood flow to get around it by reducing the swelling of it.

I can't believe I was stupid enough to allow the hay in their reach. I was thinking, like horses, that if it wasn't appealing they wouldn't touch it. A horse will eat moldy hay if he is starving, but will otherwise usually leave it alone. I never counted on the goat going to the trouble of reaching through the fence to nibble at yucky hay when her pasture was full of lush grass and such. (if that is what happened). The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, I suppose!

Now I read something interesting and would like to share it with you. I read that goats and sheep do not play well together as they play differently (again, too little, too late). A sheep will charge and butt, whereas a goat will rise and butt. Therefore, a goat can rise to butt and the sheep will just plow him/her over. I wonder if Bandit's mystery spinal fracture was something as silly as Sandy being a little too hard? And (more frightening) I am dealing with an injury with Sandy from that same incident?

Sorry to keep taking up space here, but I am trying so hard to get some answers for my heart. I agree, a necropsy is needed so I will know if I ever have to deal with this again.


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## goatkid (Nov 20, 2005)

Sorry you have to be going through this. I'd suspect either deer worm, tumor or an injury. With polio, she should be back up walking by now with the thiamin treatment. If you can afford it, an Xray would show a tumor or spine fracture. Deer worm is treated with injected Ivermectin. I don't know how long you have been using the Banamine, but be aware that using it for more than a few days can cause liver or kidney problems.
I've never had a goat with those symptoms, but a couple of my friend's goats had similar problems a few years ago. One was pregnant, so the vet induced her with lute. She had healthy twins, but never could stand so they put her down. A vet had told her it's too dry in our area for deer worm, but vets can be wrong and that's what I suspect from what I observed.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

Here's a post on of Vicki's on deer worm that I saved. 

"Because of the stress of the move on your goats I would give them their Cydectin for stomach worms and inject Ivermectin 1% injectable...it's the only time along with lice, mites and nosebots that you do give a wormer anyway but orally. We used 3cc per 100 pounds on a doe who had menengial worm, "

I lost a wether to listeriosis. The day before I put him down his head was rotated left side down. The next morning his head was over his back. He started out with a temp of 106.5 and I gave him (40 lbs maybe) 5 cc of Pen G. Days 2+3 I gave him 1 cc of Pen G. He was 90% better on day 4 but I had stopped treatment too soon and on day 5 he was a completely different animal, head twisted, hungry and thirsty but he couldn't swallow. Poor little guy.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Thanks, I just added Injectable Ivomec to my shopping list. She had a few rounds, but again, nowhere near as aggressive as she should have if this is the culprit.


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

> I can't believe I was stupid enough to allow the hay in their reach. I was thinking, like horses, that if it wasn't appealing they wouldn't touch it. A horse will eat moldy hay if he is starving, but will otherwise usually leave it alone.


Tell that to my horses. I had a bale of hay that was a few years old. I put it in the garden because I was going ot use it for mulch. It stayed there for months and didn't get used, got rained on etc. When I opened up the garden for my horses to let them eat the grass and stuff down and put the bale of hay in the yard. Later they got out and were in the yard eating that nappy hay with green grass around them.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Bummer, Southergurl! Hope they didn't colic. Horses are probably both the most beautiful creature God put on this earth, and the stupidest! I could write a novel about how mine get into the dumbest troubles! I am sure my Equine Vet has bought a yacht from my bills alone!


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

What injectible wormer did the vet giver her?


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Not sure. The only kind I found at tractor supply was for cattle. I didn't get it because it didn't seem right. I can certainly run down and get it if it was the right thing. I bought some heavy duty sawhorses and eyehooks, and a small stall guard for a different sling. I noticed she was very chipper tonight. i was doing some goatie-calisthencis with her legs and her front legs are definitely regaining strength, she could push back at me pretty well. Her back legs, the best I could feel was one tiny push back one time. Still better than it was, I guess. Thanks for checking in on us!


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

beccachow said:


> Bummer, Southergurl! Hope they didn't colic. Horses are probably both the most beautiful creature God put on this earth, and the stupidest! I could write a novel about how mine get into the dumbest troubles! I am sure my Equine Vet has bought a yacht from my bills alone!


Nah, they were fine.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

beccachow said:


> Not sure. The only kind I found at tractor supply was for cattle. I didn't get it because it didn't seem right. I can certainly run down and get it if it was the right thing. I bought some heavy duty sawhorses and eyehooks, and a small stall guard for a different sling. I noticed she was very chipper tonight. i was doing some goatie-calisthencis with her legs and her front legs are definitely regaining strength, she could push back at me pretty well. Her back legs, the best I could feel was one tiny push back one time. Still better than it was, I guess. Thanks for checking in on us!


I think that's a good idea to exercise and massage her legs.


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## crazygoatgal (Jan 15, 2008)

How is she today? I hope better.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Last night when I checked on her, she was stargazing intermittently. It has been 5 days since her last Dex shot. She stops, looks at the ceiling, snaps out of it and goes on about her business. This is a huge difference from the last time, when her neck ws locked backwards, head over her spine. I gave her banamine and have a call into the vet. I am so unsure about the next move; give her a little more time, or end it now. She had been making a lot of progress, she is able to stay on her brisket unsupported, definite attempts to stand, huge improvement in front leg strength, greater pain reaction to shots in the back legs, even pushed a tiny bit with her back leg when I pushed on it last night. Eats, drinks, plays with her food, poops and pees normally. Still no apparent pain or discomfort other than being aggravated that she cannot get up. I had just bought the makings for a new, better sling last night. She has been on 5 shots of 6cc each, 12.5mg B complex since the 22nd. Still waiting for the fortified B complex to come in the mail.

So torn as to what to do. We are all on board with doing whatever it takes IF she can get better. I read success stories all the time of goats/sheep that were down this long and made recoveries. But...

I'll let you know what we decide when the vet gets here.


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## crazygoatgal (Jan 15, 2008)

Thanks and I will keep you all in prayer.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Vet was here and gave her another round of "the works," injectable wormer, Baytril, Dex, thiamine. He said she is still holding her own. No temp. He repeated that as long as she is not suffering, give her some time. But he is not holding out much hope at all, though he says the minute steps forward are good signs. He still thinks it's mechanical, he is probably right. My two biggest hold on hopes are an injury from which she will recover with time, or the Polio which, now that I am treating more aggressively, might reverse itself. She bought herself a few more days. Poor baby, she looks for all the world as if she will just hop right up, shake herself off, and walk away.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

QUESTION: Is the Cattle Ivomec the correct thing? I forgot to ask Old Vet when he was here. If so, I am reading that the doage is 1/cc per 40 pounds, given three days successively. I am happy to shoot her up with yet another needle if this is the right stuff. All the posts I am reading/articles I am researching simply state Ivomec, but the only one I find is for cattle and is "not approved for use in goats."


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## susanne (Nov 4, 2004)

yes, cattle ivomec is correct.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Back to tractor supply tomorrow...I am sure it is way too late if it is worms but worth a shot (pardon the pun). The clincher was the abnormal neck posturing, head bent straight back over the spine, but that has also been reported in polio...as well as brain injury. Her recent "stargazing" was the more normal kind, staring at the roof for a few seconds before shaking it off.

She will probably die from needle shock before the disease/injury gets her!!!

IM, right? Poor little leggies...

Thank you!


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## oberhaslikid (May 13, 2002)

beccachow said:


> QUESTION: Is the Cattle Ivomec the correct thing? I forgot to ask Old Vet when he was here. If so, I am reading that the doage is 1/cc per 40 pounds, given three days successively. I am happy to shoot her up with yet another needle if this is the right stuff. All the posts I am reading/articles I am researching simply state Ivomec, but the only one I find is for cattle and is "not approved for use in goats."



If you are giving the wormer for intestinal worms it needs to be given Orally
You inject SQ only for Mengial worm or lice.
I went and read your original post and if she got into old hay and is pulling her head to the side or throwing it back .This sounds Like Listerosis to me been there done that.Thats why when the vet gave the Dex it helped with the swelling of the brain as soon as it wore off shes right back into it again.
Please go read this page .This was my letter I wrote to the previous owner when I had this happen to my goat.this is how to treat.
http://www.goatworld.com/articles/listeriosis_gwmf.shtml


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Unfortuanately I might be dealing with meningeal worm based on all her symptoms (or polio, or an injury, or...). If so, it is pretty late in the game. Old Vet (I call him that because he remembers delivering a cow by c-section in Sandy's stall 45 years ago!!!) has been giving the injectable every 5 days, but like everything else, if it IS this nasty bugger, the treatment has not been aggressive enough. From what I am reading she needs at LEAST 3 days straight of the injectable Ivomec.

He has been giving her long lasting antibiotic and Dex shots as well. I have NO idea what we are really dealing with, and I am throwing the "book" at her in hopes that something *might* work, but my hopes are slimming down daily.

Thank you all for your continued support for my little girl. I appreciate any and all suggestions as I am new to all this.

Sadly, the goat and the sheep (the one we lost to a spinal fracture 5 weeks ago) were a 4H project for a friend's son. He is sure learning more about health than he ever wanted to.


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## oberhaslikid (May 13, 2002)

here is the treatment for the deer worm.
I have a doe that made it threw her ordeal with this worm Still messed up in the rear.She walks side ways but still gets around with the herd.

Treatment of meningeal worm infection is most successful when instituted early in the course of disease. A treatment regime (Table 3) which has proven successful at the Ohio State University involves fenbendazole (20 to 50 mg/kg body weight, PO, q24h for 5 days) and flunixin meglumine (1 mg/kg, IV, IM, or SC, q12h for 5 days) or dexamethasone in non-pregnant females and males (0.1 mg/kg, IV, IM, or SC, q24h for 3 days). DMSO (1g/kg given in 500 ml of 5% dextrose solution, IV, q24h) given to effect is useful in some cases but may cause severe appetite suppression. Discontinue DMSO if inappetance or anorexia occurs. Vitamin E, selenium, Vitamins B-complex, and Vitamin A are useful to assist healing of neural tissues.

Dexamethasone should not be administered to pregnant females because this drug may induce abortion. Alternatively, we have used prednisolone sodium succinate (0.5-1.0 mg/kg, IV, IM, or SC, q12h) for no more than three days in pregnant females without subsequent abortion. Prednisolone sodium succinate may have a reduced risk of abortion compared to dexamethasone because it lacks a carbon-16 substitution. Corticosteroids lacking a C-16 substitution may not cross the blood-placental barrier and large doses for prolonged periods of time may be required to terminate pregnancy.10

Ivermectin is most effective against larval stages prior to their entrance into the spinal cord, since it does not readily cross the blood-brain barrier.1,2,11 However, damage to nervous system tissues during larval migration may alter the blood-brain barrier. Although no clinical problem has been identified to date, we have been concerned for the possibility of ivermectin toxicity in these cases. The antiinflammatory drugs are critical to reduce the inflammation associated with the presence of the migrating larvae and the subsequent inflammatory response to the killed larvae. Use of antiinflammatory drugs is important to prevent the clinical signs from becoming more severe after instituting treatment.

In addition to drug therapy, supportive care and physical therapy are essential to aiding recovery. Using slings to support llamas that are unable to stand and performing physical therapy for muscles are beneficial. We also have used hydrofloatation therapy to facilitate recovery after prolonged recumbency (Figure 1). A great deal of perseverance is required to care for severely affected llamas; recovery may take several weeks to months to years.2

http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/meningealworm.html


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

I would happily settle for any kind of wobbly walk she can give me, as long as she can get up!

Thank you so much for the info. I might as well give it a whirl, maybe her baby steps towards progress were because of the wormer. My poor wallet is hurting me; my bank card is smoking these days! I just wish I knew exactly what I am dealing with here! you know, now that I think about it, the first vet gave her a shot of it, too.

Supportive care is not a problem. I have people teasing me that she is actually all better but faking it for the attention.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

What is her name? Sorry if I missed it and I'm too lazy to go back and read through everything. I think you are real troopers and wish only the best for you both.


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Awww, thank you! Her name is Sandy and she has been recumbant for 5 weeks after a gradual paralyis. She is regaining the use of her front legs, but her back ones are still weak. She CAN move them a bit, but not much. She is showing an increase in pain reflex back there with her shots. We fear brain/spinal injury, polio, or meningeal worm. Her most disturbing symptom was her neck arched all the way across her back in a perfect "C" shape, horns touching her spine. She responded to the Dex within hours and had her neck relaxed again, but 2 days later we needed another round. Then she made it 5 days and was given another round without relapsing, but last night marked 5 days again and she was satrting to stargaze again, but without the awkward arch. She is making tiny improvements, but we are in it for the long haul or until we run out of options, or until she shows signs of pain. She has remained eating, drinking, peeing and pooping like a trooper.


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## wooly1s (Apr 5, 2006)

We a neighbor that is raising a house goat that had very similar issues as a kid...and only responded to Thiamine, despite it being "past the point where it was doing any good." They also used liniment where muscle contractures were forming, and she even regained the flexibility in her joints (she had a stiff gait for months - no ankles) of course she got worse before she got better - once the joints "let go" she had to re-strengthen and retrain those muscles. They have taken her to a verterinary acupuncturist (at great expense) but it has been miraculous to see the difference...She celebrated her 1st birthday in April, and has bever been able to lay like a goat - always lays on the right side. She requires pretty intensive care - and is never left alone as she cannot get up if she rolls too far onto her back. They feel that it has been worth every bit of their effort to keep her! I'm sure she would be happy to talk to you if you are interested...


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

How is Sandy doing today? I hope she is ok..


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## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Hi guys. After HOURS and HOURS on the internet, I think we are dealing with meningeal worm. I started dosing her with Ivomec yesterday, 2cc every 12 hours. Her front legs are definitely improving, her hind legs are showing more reflex to pain but still pretty useless. If she pulls through this she will definitely be left with a head tilt.

Her signs were: hind limb paralysis starting with one leg, going to the next, followed by inability to get up. Stiffened extremities. A bald spot (didn't think it was relevant) where her collar used to be. Arched neck. No temp. Tremors. Bright and alert, eating the whole time. Back legs rolled under at the...errrr, ankle? Sorry, lacking goat terminology. 

She is definitely stengthening her front end. The roll in her anklles has disappeared. I will continue to dose her with Ivomec and see where we stand. Or don't stand. I know we are in for a long difficult road. I am keeping her on the high dose B complex since I read somewhere that B6 was beneficial in these cases. I have Banamine, should I start her on it 1cc x2 a day? Vet had given her a dex shot a few days ago. I understand that as these buggers die off she might start arching her neck again from inflammation.

I do have white tail deer everywhere, and not being sure where she came from, she might have had the infection already. We have only had her 3 months.

I do not think this will end well, but she sure is fighting. I was trying to get her comfortable and she kept reaching out and nibbling at her bowl, the water bottle I brought with me (she hates cold water), and everything she could get her lips around.
Her attempts to get up to her chest are getting more definite, sometimes I think she could almost do it on her own.

Anyhow, that's the latest. I believe she is "too far gone" for the treatment, but we'll give it a heck of a shot. Again, as long as she isn't in pain, and she shows no signs whatsoever of discomfort other than being angry she can't get up.

Thanks, and any more advice woul dbe appreciated. I have combed over all the meningeal worm related threads here.


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## Minelson (Oct 16, 2007)

Thanks for the update...you and Sandy are in my thoughts and prayers


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## hoofinitnorth (Oct 18, 2006)

I presume you are using Ivermectin, the active chemical in the brand name Ivomec you are mentioning?


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