# How can female goat get pregnant by 'fixed' male?



## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

I have a 5 year-old healthy female goat who appears to be pregnant. Her middle is huge and her teats are huge. But the only male goats in the pen were all 'banded' 5 years ago.

Talked with the vet via telephone, and vet suggested it might be 'false' pregnancy.

Can a male goat that was banded 5 years ago suddenly become capable of getting a female goat pregnant after 5 years? She definately looks pregnant!


:shrug:​


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Has he ever smelled bucky since being banded? Does he have a beard? 

Yes, it is possible. I've had it happen. It's why I castrate with a knife, not the bands.


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

chamoisee said:


> Has he ever smelled bucky since being banded? Does he have a beard?


My vet is a woman, so no beard.

All my goats have beards, female and 'banded' males.


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

If the female goat were pregnant, how to tell when about to give birth? What precautions to take regarding keeping with the other goats?


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Wethers don't usually have beards. Did he have a beard before you banded him? 

And does he smell like a buck?


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

My goats are pygmys. The males were all banded when they were about 2 or 3 months old. They are now 5 years old.

Haven't noticed a 'buck' smell.


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Well, Pygmies are potbellied anyway, so that makes it harder to tell. 

I guess you'll just have to wait and see. 

Or, you could go out and inspect all the wether's anatomy. The one I had that turned out to be intact developed a new (smaller) scrotum, so the testicle dropped down out of the body, where it had apparently been pushed while banding him.


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## Caprice Acres (Mar 6, 2005)

sometimes while banding a teste can be missed. I always count after banding as well.  

If, however, that teste was missed, the wether in question would show buck characteristics, because it is still recieving negligable amounts of testosterone. It would grow horns/beards faster and thicker, pee on it's legs/face, and show mounting behavior and other courtship behavior. It would also be stinky. That goat is capable of reproducing but it's not usually that likely.

If you would be willing to post a picture of the does and wethers in question, we can usually tell wether or not a doe is pregnant. it could be false pregnancy, but it's not all that likely either. It may just be that the doe is a typical pot bellied pygmy. 

For pics of how to tell when a doe will go into labor (aka ligament pictures) and labor pictures, please visit the 'about goats' page of my website www.freewebs.com/capriceacres/ and visit the labor/birthing section on www.fiascofarm.com.


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## RosewoodfarmVA (Oct 5, 2005)

Its possible that one testicle was "left behind" when the banding occured, leaving a male without a scrotum but with full reproductive capabilities. It happens quite often, especially with inexperienced banders (not that I'm saying you're inexperienced!  )


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## trob1 (Jun 18, 2006)

A wethered pygmy buck will look just like a doe with short hair and a thin beard or no beard. An intact pygmy buck has longer hair and a full beard and cape. 

Here is a picture showing some full grown pygmy bucks.










Here is a pygmy wether.










If you could post a picture of your goats we could tell you if one of your wethers looks bucky.


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## goatsareus (Jun 23, 2007)

ANY goat can have a beard; male, female, wether, hermaphrodite. The ability to have a beard is genetic related. It has nothing to do with the sex of the animal.

The only way to tell if the goat is pregnant is to have an ultrasound. Do you live near a vet college? Sometimes you can get an ultrasound on a goat for free at a vet school. 

Within 6 weeks of kidding, I can feel the baby goats in utereo. Feel on the stomach bottom just in front of the udder. Even later in the pregnancy, you can feel them kick on the sides of the doe. If you feel kids low, they are due in about 6 weeks. If you feel them higher up on the doe, then within the month.


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## trappmountain (Jun 22, 2005)

My pygmy wether was cut and he has a beard. Don't think that makes any difference.










This is my wether.

He also displays some buck behavior but no buck smell. He jumps on our girl when she is in season. She knocks him off before he can try anything.


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## Gailann Schrader (May 10, 2002)

How old is she? Precocious udder? Hormone problems?

Or could just be the goat fairy bringing more Pygmy goodness to you...


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## trob1 (Jun 18, 2006)

trappmountain, see how your wether's beard is thin and there is no long cape hair. That is the biggest difference with a buck and a wether. It really should be very obvious to someone if they have ever seen a pygmy buck. That is why I posted a picture of some bucks so she could see the visual differences. Nice looking wether by the way love the color.


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## trappmountain (Jun 22, 2005)

Thanks trob1. Yes they are my 1st. and I don't claim to be an expert. He and my doe were bought an auction. No breeding plans. They were just bought as pets and have definitely lived up to that role. He actually belongs to my son. Our doe is mine and we have a potbelly pig that belongs to my DH.


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## Sweet Goats (Nov 30, 2005)

I have a friend that has Pygmy's. She has one that every year she looks pregnant, all the way to the utter, she fils up like she is going to kid any second. SHe has NEVER beed bred, and she is NO WHERE NEAR a buck.
Post a picture of her from behind if possible, that will help.
I have bought wethers that were only half fixed, and YES he could breed.


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

trappmountain said:


> My pygmy wether was cut and he has a beard. Don't think that makes any difference.
> 
> 
> > Yeah, he has a beard, but compare it to the pictures of the Pygmy bucks. The wether's beard is wispy and thin, while a buck has a full, lush beard and a cape. The hair growth on bucks seems to be testosteropne related. I've heard that when there were more eunuchs, they didn't have beards, either. A full, lush beard on a male goat is usually a beacon of masculinity and the equipment to match!


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

Thanks everyone for your helpful feedback. 

I will try to take and post a picture Sunday afternoon if I can get the camera working and then find a place to upload and save the picture.


​


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

Here are some photos of our goat. She has never looked like this before. She does not ever come into contact with any other males except the ones we had banded 5 years ago. Not ever!
Could she be with kid? We do not know and are very concerned.


This one from front showing bulging left side:









This one from top showing bulging sides:









This one showing her scooting on her belly in the hay. She does that alot!:









This one from behind showing enlarged mammary glands (teats):









This one from low side showing bulging side and enlarged teat:









This one from top behind showing bulging sides:


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## RedneckPete (Aug 23, 2004)

KCM said:


> We do not know and are very concerned.


Hey! Don't be concerned. Every problem is and opportunity in disguise. Maybe a neighboring buck has his way with your doe?

Pete


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## chamoisee (May 15, 2005)

Well, she looks sort of pregnant to me, and so does one of the black does. (I think it was a doe?) I sort of wish I could have seen pics of the wethers.


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## KCM (Sep 26, 2005)

chamoisee said:


> Well, she looks sort of pregnant to me, and so does one of the black does. (I think it was a doe?) I sort of wish I could have seen pics of the wethers.



What is a "whether"?

The black one is a male, was 'banded' five years ago. Again, the white female goat has NEVER EVER been around any other goats except the males we had banded 5 years ago.

Yes, we are concerned. If by some rare chance the white female is pregnant, we do not know if we are up to the 'assignment'. We have never had to experience a goat giving birth, (or any other animal either). We would not know what to do or where to begin.


​


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

"What is a "whether"?

A "wether" is a male that has been castrated. Its just a term to differentiate between one that's neutered and one that's intact Its also used to refer to castrated sheep


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Most of the time the momma goat does just fine without help.

If not, here's some info:

http://fiascofarm.com/goats/how_to_deliver_a_kid.html


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## Slev (Nov 29, 2003)

...now wouldn't that just be a stich if all 5 of the banded boys had one hidden loose nut! (Then they'd all look the same!) I learned a little trick when banding very young ram lambs, to not only push in with my fingers, but to also give a little 1/4 or 1/2 twist to keep them little beggers from popping back up there. Then to rub over the sack to feel both nuts are there. It does require then and extra person to help you band, but most of the time my one friend and I band together. Normally I'm the nut grabber, so I've gotten better at it over the years. 



KCM said:


> What is a "whether"?​


As far as what's a wether goes, ....should I repost my goat story on here, or just have him look it up in the goat archives?


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## trob1 (Jun 18, 2006)

Very nice looking goats. The boys in the picture are wethers for sure. They have no masculine signs at all. The doe is developing a bag but that could be a false pregnancy or precoucious udder. Her sides do bulge some. I would say unless any of your other wethers look different than the two in the picture or your fence lines share with another herd of goats then your doe is not pregnant. How long have you had her? Do you share fence lines with anyones elses goats?


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## mamajohnson (Nov 27, 2002)

Slev said:


> As far as what's a wether goes, ....should I repost my goat story on here, or just have him look it up in the goat archives?


now I am curious!


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## Caprice Acres (Mar 6, 2005)

It is odd that she is forming an udder, and a lopsided one at that (or maybe it's the picture?). I'd be worried about mastitis. Squirt a little out and see what it looks like. She does look like a doe carrying twins. Count 1.5 months from the first time you remember seeing udder change and swelling sides and call that your duedate. Every day feel her for ligaments and notice any changes in udder. Most does will deliver just fine, however pygmies are notorious bad kidders, so you will need to be there for her when she delivers.

Now, I believe it would be worthwile if you would post some pics of your wethers as well. They may be hiding something.


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## Raftercat5 (Apr 14, 2005)

Yeah, he has a beard, but compare it to the pictures of the Pygmy bucks. The wether's beard is wispy and thin, while a buck has a full, lush beard and a cape. The hair growth on bucks seems to be testosteropne related. I've heard that when there were more eunuchs, they didn't have beards, either. A full, lush beard on a male goat is usually a beacon of masculinity and the equipment to match!

Oh gosh...(giggling)...now all the guys reading this will want to grow facial hair (if they don't already have it!) LOL! 

- Kathy (who's enjoying all the pics of the pretty goats)


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## GoatLove (Jun 19, 2006)

chamoisee said:


> Wethers don't usually have beards. Did he have a beard before you banded him?
> 
> And does he smell like a buck?


My 2 wethers do.


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## Starsmom (Nov 7, 2004)

I had a goat go through the false pregnancy and she did the whole thing, swollen udders, looked big and even went through labor. Then..nothing.

I did have a similar problem to yours with a horse. Bought a cute little filly that was 2 and never bred. Exactly 1 year later we had a little foal on the ground. Turns out after alot of investigation...my neighbors stud go in while we were away and they didn't tell me about it. 

Also, I don't know if this is true, but I've heard people claim their does were bred by deer. Seems odd, but if you think about it, is it that impossible?


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## Sweet Goats (Nov 30, 2005)

Can you post a picture of her butt? If I can see her Vulva, I will be able to tell you.


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