# Ignorant folks



## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Good luck with that


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## Scott SW Ohio (Sep 20, 2003)

Happy Thanksgiving mollymae!


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

mollymae said:


> I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


I wish it could happen, but it seems the divide is too wide, and getting wider.

Happy Thanksgiving.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

I keep trying and trying but those ignorant folks still won't agree with me.

But please, don't take it to heart. I have a couple of friends that are like political Kryptonite to me, but we are still friends. We do nice things for each other. We talk a lot, and sometimes it turns into screaming matches, but they know if they ever need anything I'm there.
It's part of living in a free society.

At least until those darn Liberals and their thought police censure us forever. 

Happy Thanksgiving!


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## Txsteader (Aug 22, 2005)

Trying as hard as I can but apparently there are different goals for the country. We can't even agree on moral foundations of right and wrong these days.


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

I have been reading , where ISIS - violence aside, has become a relatively _well oiled machine, _of young, bright, educated, ambitious young men, setting Government structure, keeping books, managing their growth and planning for_ their future.

I can't help but wonder how it would be, if they were put all that energy to good use.

But they don't want to.

We are nearly the same. Americans could look past our differences and get along better, but we really don't want to, for the most part, IMO.
_
Obamacare is a prime example. Like it or not, it was made law, so instead of saying "let's find ways to work together and make it work well" many don't want it to work at all_ and we _just want to partisan bicker over it_, at every turn. _Could it be make to work?_ Maybe, maybe not, w_ho knows? We never even tried.
You are right, though that we are doing this to ourselves,

Common ground is no more.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.

I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.



mollymae said:


> I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Good luck with that


So you and apparently ip are not in support of TRYING to help folks be a little less ignorant?? 
Would have expected more from at least you....even ip I think would want folks to not be ignorant
Reckon I'm perplexed.......:happy2:


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

mollymae said:


> I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


I think sometimes people forget that the words the read were presented by another human.


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Good luck with that





Sourdough said:


> SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.
> 
> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.


Oh. Ok.
My country...my land...my home...my heritage and family ...will not be taken from me. Can I help you get that feelin back? Be glad to help a fellow American!! 
Don't go down that road....people can and will help


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

wr said:


> I think sometimes people forget that the words the read were presented by another human.


Could you explain please?


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

No......You are welcome to be in denial, and you would have a lot of company in denial. But it is over. Your heritage is gone, your country is terminal, it is only a matter of time. If I had to ball park a time period and cause, it would be the point where televisions became common in America, likely around the late 50's or early 60's. I think they will in the future look back at the massive shift that marketing of "Things" was the beginning of the end. Which led to widespread greed and the slow acceptance of corruption of our ideals, our dreams, our government, our humanity, our pride, and our leadership.




mollymae said:


> Oh. Ok.
> My country...my land...my home...my heritage and family ...will not be taken from me. Can I help you get that feelin back? Be glad to help a fellow American!!
> Don't go down that road....people can and will help


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.
> 
> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.


This is my country. No I don't agree with everything we do here. Yeah some of our history makes me ashamed. But overall this is still the best country in the world and I am proud to call myself an American. And I intend to keep struggling and fighting to make it a country we can all be proud of. 

And you might want to step back and think about what changed because for a whole lot of people in this country like women and people of color and people who are of religions other than Christianity and people who are LGBT this country just finally got to the point of real freedom for all and the true possibility of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. So if it hasn't been your country since the WASP only Utopia died well then I'm going to guess "your country" isn't coming back and hallelujah for that.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

That is a creative fabrication, with no foundation in reality, nor in anything that I have stated. You just reach into your butt and pull out BS, with no supporting evidence. Please support your conclusion with empirical evidence, or stick it back where your found it. 




Patchouli said:


> So if it hasn't been your country since the WASP only Utopia died well then I'm going to guess "your country" isn't coming back and hallelujah for that.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

> Originally Posted by *Patchouli*
> _ So if it hasn't been your country since the WASP only Utopia died well then I'm going to guess "your country" isn't coming back and hallelujah for that._





Sourdough said:


> That is a creative fabrication, with no foundation in reality, nor in anything that I have stated. You just reach into your butt and pull out BS, with no supporting evidence. Please support your conclusion with empirical evidence, or stick it back where your found it.


Support the fact that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50s? Seriously? Or support the idea I don't think it is coming back? I worry about that sometimes, there are plenty of conservatives working doubletime to bring it back but I am pretty sure it is dead and gone.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

mollymae said:


> So you and apparently ip are not in support of TRYING to help folks be a little less ignorant??
> Would have expected more from at least you....even ip I think would want folks to not be ignorant
> Reckon I'm perplexed.......:happy2:


Some people are blissful in their ignorance.
It's easier to chew what the government spoon feeds than to actually think.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Patchouli said:


> Support the fact that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50s? Seriously? Or support the idea I don't think it is coming back? I worry about that sometimes, there are plenty of conservatives working doubletime to bring it back but I am pretty sure it is dead and gone.


Such hateful racist blathering, and mostly untrue


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Sourdough said:


> That is a creative fabrication, with no foundation in reality, nor in anything that I have stated. You just reach into your butt and pull out BS, with no supporting evidence. Please support your conclusion with empirical evidence, or stick it back where your found it.


Consider the source


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## Raeven (Oct 11, 2011)

mollymae said:


> I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


 I&#8217;m continually surprised at the people who assign themselves some imaginary intellectual superiority by characterizing those with whom they disagree as &#8216;ignorant.&#8217; I call that arrogant, and in some cases, delusional. 

Ignorance is, fortunately, one of those characteristics that becomes self-evident. People can figure out who is ignorant and who is not, without need of anyone giving instruction.

If you are truly interested in fostering an environment wherein people attempt to work toward consensus, probably starting a thread entitled, &#8220;Ignorant Folk,&#8221; and holding yourself out to be the sole arbiter of ignorance is a less than auspicious start. Color me skeptical.


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Sourdough said:


> SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.
> 
> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.





mollymae said:


> Oh. Ok.
> My country...my land...my home...my heritage and family ...will not be taken from me. Can I help you get that feelin back? Be glad to help a fellow American!!
> Don't go down that road....people can and will help


Normalacy Bias. Look at history. Every empire falls, It rots from within. This nation is bankrupt, militarily over extended and divided. Our law making bodies are frozen up and our leaders won't work with each other. Through out the world were seen as weak, and our allies secretly hate us, and our enemies are embolden. This is what happens during the decline of an empire. We are coming upon a storm, if we all work together we may survive it, otherwise it could end in dictatorship or the country breaking up into regions. If we have a revolution, we very well could end up under foreign control. Followin is the projections for the year 2025 from.... http://www.deagel.com/country/United-States-of-America_c0001.aspx
Said to be associated with branches of the US government and maybe the CIA 


> Forecast 2025
> Population: -79.7% 65 million
> Density: -79.7% 7 inhabitants / sq. km.
> Gross Domestic Product:-94.9% $882 billion
> ...


Hard to tell who these people are they keep a pretty tight lip. Notice the -79.7 drop in population. Deagle came out and said that they came to these conclusions based on economic disaster, information gleaned from the collapse of the USSR, and US government agencies. In short we are projected to be in big trouble and burying our collective head in the sand isn't going to help anyone.

Found their explanation... in purple at the bottom of this page... http://www.deagel.com/country/forecast.aspx



> The collapse of the Western financial system will wipe out the standard of living of its population while ending ponzi schemes such as the stock exchange and the pension funds. The population will be hit so badly by a full array of bubbles and ponzi schemes that the migration engine will start to work in reverse accelerating itself due to ripple effects thus leading to the demise of the States. This unseen situation for the States will develop itself in a cascade pattern with unprecedented and devastating effects for the economy. Jobs offshoring will surely end with many American Corporations relocating overseas thus becoming foreign Corporations!!!! We see a significant part of the American population migrating to Latin America and Asia while migration to Europe - suffering a similar illness - won't be relevant. Nevertheless the death toll will be horrible. Take into account that the Soviet Union's population was poorer than the Americans nowadays or even then. The ex-Soviets suffered during the following struggle in the 1990s with a significant death toll and the loss of national pride. Might we say "Twice the pride, double the fall"? Nope. The American standard of living is one of the highest, far more than double of the Soviets while having added a services economy that will be gone along with the financial system. When pensioners see their retirement disappear in front of their eyes and there are no servicing jobs you can imagine what is going to happen next. At least younger people can migrate. Never in human history were so many elders among the population. In past centuries people were lucky to get to their 30s or 40s. The American downfall is set to be far worse than the Soviet Union's one. A confluence of crisis with a devastating result.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

If you would read three times what you wrote here.......you will be compelled to conclude that you are not even fully enrolled in your own belief. It is however; full of sound and fury. *Macbeth:*
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
Macbeth Act 5, scene 5, 19&#8211;28​


Patchouli said:


> Support the fact that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50s? Seriously? Or support the idea I don't think it is coming back? I worry about that sometimes, there are plenty of conservatives working doubletime to bring it back but I am pretty sure it is dead and gone.


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Raeven said:


> Iâm continually surprised at the people who assign themselves some imaginary intellectual superiority by characterizing those with whom they disagree as âignorant.â I call that arrogant, and in some cases, delusional.
> 
> Ignorance is, fortunately, one of those characteristics that becomes self-evident. People can figure out who is ignorant and who is not, without need of anyone giving instruction.
> 
> If you are truly interested in fostering an environment wherein people attempt to work toward consensus, probably starting a thread entitled, âIgnorant Folk,â and holding yourself out to be the sole arbiter of ignorance is an auspicious start. Color me skeptical.


Baaaahaaahaaa! So totally off base. My post was meant in a positive...WAKE UP AMERICA...kind of way. You may need to check into the other mess you talking about. Personally. . Best wishes


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

You "FAILED" at your effort to achieve your stated purpose.



mollymae said:


> My post was meant in a positive...WAKE UP AMERICA...kind of way.


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

United States of America may be in some peril.... BUT WE AINT GONE!!!! 
War eagle by the way!! 

Seriously folks... I know it's easy to get wrapped up in politics....which we should...to a point. At some place though you have to decide what's best for you and yours and also your fellow citizens. Citizens being the operative word there in case some missed it.
We have so much going on within our own country....I just can't get my head around knowingly inviting trouble..
Say what you want....that's how I feel about it.
I would help them monetarily or any other way. But not here.
Some don't like black birds but I think they are pretty. Their song is as well . Color me??? Whatever you'd like


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Sorry sourdough. I tried


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Poor baby got feelings hurt I suppose


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

The divides in the composition of this nation are actually the primary factor that has allowed it to continue to exist as long as it has.

The same divide that recently has stalled Congress and some social interactions is the same divide that provides this nation with the legislative /executive branch normally negotiable gridlock that has existed from 1791, allows Americans to culturally travel around the world simply by visiting a large city or immigrant founded communities and enjoy disputes and debates based on that divide.

The many divided cultures swirling within their own little "whatever cultural root towns" also helps keep the 300 million member nation polarizing to extremist in one direction or another.

The only time our nation polarizes is when we are healing from our growing pains within or defending our many facets from outside attacks.

Welcome to the hornets nest infested trash heap called USA. The garbage dump and cesspool of the world where those not wanted by other nations find their way to, but the mixture has worked for us for over 200 years.

On local levels places to bridge the divides are easy to find. You just have to follow the aroma of pie and coffee mixed in with all the other smells of life in the United State of America.


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

I am in my own little world here....but holy snot? Is that we are down to? Seriously.... Small town alabama doesn't seem that way. Although....we got some craZy folk around here. But most folks that I've spoken with personally seem to keep up or at least try to with information. We do have another crowd that just wants what will be given to them. By government


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Sourdough said:


> You "FAILED" at your effort to achieve your stated purpose.


My post STANDS. Don't like it? Don't read it. Simple. Sorry you feel like my post did or did not do something for you. I really am.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

There is some ignorance in this country for sure... Perhaps you could educate us rather than tossing smoke bombs into the crowd.


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## mollymae (Feb 10, 2010)

Sourdough said:


> You "FAILED" at your effort to achieve your stated purpose.





Yvonne's hubby said:


> There is some ignorance in this country for sure... Perhaps you could educate us rather than tossing smoke bombs into the crowd.


What I wanted to say and am saying now for those who cannot infer
Pay attention and do the right thing always. Smoke bombs into a crowd would be a NO!! 
Sorry this post got turned into something it shouldn't have. 
Folks....do what's right. Please? (Does that make it better?)


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

mollymae said:


> What I wanted to say and am saying now for those who cannot infer
> Pay attention and do the right thing always. Smoke bombs into a crowd would be a NO!!
> Sorry this post got turned into something it shouldn't have.
> Folks....do what's right. Please? (Does that make it better?)


I try to do what's right. Hasn't really changed much. Still have criminals running the country into the ground, the more money we spend to eliminate poverty the more poor folks we have. I thought maybe you had some solution to some of the perceived problems that no one else has thought of.


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## Miss Kay (Mar 31, 2012)

Do what's right! Each and every one of us are doing what we see as right. The problem is, one person's right is another person's wrong. That's nothing new.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

mollymae said:


> So you and apparently ip are not in support of TRYING to help folks be a little less ignorant??
> Would have expected more from at least you....even ip I think would want folks to not be ignorant
> Reckon I'm perplexed.......:happy2:


I *try* to make people "less ignorant" but it's been my experience that many refuse to listen to anything with which they don't already agree.

Start a thread about GMO foods, and watch the "ignorant" accuse anyone who tries to educate them of being a "paid shill".

Start another thread about DE, and watch the "ignorant" tell you how it will cure most any ill you can imagine, and how it kills internal parasites, even though it's really nothing more than finely powdered sand.

Ignorance is often a self inflicted condition for which many refuse the cure


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Patchouli said:


> This is my country. No I don't agree with everything we do here. Yeah some of our history makes me ashamed. But overall this is still the best country in the world and I am proud to call myself an American. And I intend to keep struggling and fighting to make it a country we can all be proud of.
> 
> And you might want to step back and think about what changed because for a whole lot of people in this country like women and people of color and people who are of religions other than Christianity and people who are LGBT this country just finally got to the point of real freedom for all and the true possibility of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. So if it hasn't been your country since the WASP only Utopia died well then I'm going to guess "your country" isn't coming back and hallelujah for that.


Glad to see you press on the gas pedal and steer toward the ditch.


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## Declan (Jan 18, 2015)

Sourdough said:


> SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.
> 
> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.


Why do you need to have pride in America and why do you feel that it must be saved on some way? Could you not be the same person and have a decent life somewhere else, of if America looked more like Europe with lots more borders?

Nationalism is a concept that I just do not get. The America is Great crowd and the America is Horrible crowd equally seem like people who are just trying to use emotion to manipulate people.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Sourdough said:


> You "FAILED" at your effort to achieve your stated purpose.


Then the pack pounced on her and rips her to shreds


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Cornhusker said:


> Then the pack pounced on her and rips her to shreds


Pack is a good term for it.

We have all seen this over and over. The pack of rats. I hate it when someone makes a sincere plea and then see it ripped up like raw meat by these rats.


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## Raeven (Oct 11, 2011)

mollymae said:


> Baaaahaaahaaa! So totally off base. My post was meant in a positive...WAKE UP AMERICA...kind of way. You may need to check into the other mess you talking about. Personally. . Best wishes


Your mocking tone belies your true intent. There is no genuine effort here to have an exchange of dialogue, only a requirement that everyone see the world exactly as you do.

We agree on one thing: Your post does stand for what it is.


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## Shine (Feb 19, 2011)

Declan said:


> Why do you need to have pride in America and why do you feel that it must be saved on some way? Could you not be the same person and have a decent life somewhere else, of if America looked more like Europe with lots more borders?
> 
> Nationalism is a concept that I just do not get. The America is Great crowd and the America is Horrible crowd equally seem like people who are just trying to use emotion to manipulate people.


Yeah, I am in agreement with the above. What makes this piece of ground different than the one on the other side of the invisible line. What prohibits you from stepping over that line? What makes you a "different" person because you were born a mile over that way?

I am for America, but you must understand, I stand behind the people and many of the original ideas/behaviors. I am certain that in each country of the world that I could find people whom I would also stand behind and those that I would do my best to hinder their intents, but that is everywhere. 

So, while I have said the above, I firmly believe that almost to the Nth degree, the trouble starts when you give people power and not hold them accountable. 

When people stopped being honorable was when this nation lost it.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Shine, shine on..


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Something I noticed around me is that although most everyone regardless of their cultural/ethnic background or how much they complain or lament about what is reported in print or posted on line, all are going about their normal lives today as they went about the same normal life yesterday and the day before and plan to pursue for tomorrows to come until they choose to retire.

Even the Pakistani descended immigrant who chose James as his American name keeps opening up his gas station/ convenience store although he has had two attempted robberies during the past year.

When he told us about the last robbery attempt, he said the robber traveling from Michigan actually first entered the station to ask if he could fill up his car and pay after while James was in his bullet resistant counter zone.

When the man came back in to pay for his fuel he tried to coax James into the store area and when James told him company policy prohibited him from leaving the register area, the man called him a filthy Muslim and stole some soft drinks to go with the gas he drove off with.

When James told us about it, he said he considered locking the guy inside the store and calling the sheriff but figured the guy would cause less damage if he just left and he never actually saw a firearm and when the deputies stopped the thief six miles away all he was armed with was a 10 inch sheath knife in his waistband, but it was enough to get him a felony robbery charge and an illegal concealed weapon charge due to the blade length. 

I laughed when James chuckled and said the guy called him a dirty Muslim as he left the store after realizing James wasn't leaving the armed safety of his counter area. Before he naturalized 15 years ago and married and became a Southern Baptist as his wife is, he was Hindu not Muslim.

Speaking of James I guess I should go refill my gas can to do a little more mowing before the sun goes down.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

An example of why there is NO HOPE for America........http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-...ntenced-prison-corruption-reelected-landslide


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

I just love these threads that call for brotherhood, and working together as a community to achieve the best compromise possible for the whole.... makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

Wait-- that's probably just the rum, never mind.

And TV killed America? Pfffttt! Try, going off the gold standard. Ya may get more bites with that one.


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

Sourdough said:


> SORRY.......I truly am sorry, but this is not MY country, I just live here. Yes, I was born here in the mid 40's and it was my country in the 40's, 50's and 60's.
> 
> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country, but I am not proud of America today, I am sad for America today. I do not say this for dramatics, I say it because there is no possibility of saving America. And the acceptance of that truth is deeply painful. Very deeply painful, and so very sad.



Spoken like a true American?

So, we enjoyed the good times, but when things get tough and less serene, (much of it caused by those same "good times"), we check out and wash our hands, of the whole mess.

Personally, If I was a Syrian, ISIS would kill me and cut off my son's hands and feet, if they did not join their _team_.

All things considering, as an American, I'm doing just fine.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> If you would read three times what you wrote here.......you will be compelled to conclude that you are not even fully enrolled in your own belief. It is however; full of sound and fury.*Macbeth:*
> To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
> Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
> To the last syllable of recorded time;
> ...


What? I am 100% fully invested in my belief that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50's. And I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who would disagree. I can happily point you to tons of conservative sites that want to drag us all kicking and screaming right back there again. Where women and minorities of all types knew their place and where if you were different you stayed in whatever closet you were stuck in if you wanted to live peacefully in this country. 

I always enjoy a bit of Shakespeare but I don't see how that is apropos to the discussion?


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> An example of why there is NO HOPE for America........http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-...ntenced-prison-corruption-reelected-landslide


Politicians have been corrupt for as long as America has existed. We had some pretty spectacular crooks in the middle of last century. People kept right on voting them in too.


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## Txsteader (Aug 22, 2005)

Patchouli said:


> What? I am 100% fully invested in my belief that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50's. And I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who would disagree. I can happily point you to tons of conservative sites that want to drag us all kicking and screaming right back there again. Where women and minorities of all types knew their place and where if you were different you stayed in whatever closet you were stuck in if you wanted to live peacefully in this country.


No doubt, peoples' opinions run the gamut of extremes, but I'd be interested in seeing those conservative sites you speak of.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Txsteader said:


> No doubt, peoples' opinions run the gamut of extremes, but *I'd be interested in seeing those conservative sites you speak of*.


Good luck with that


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Sourdough said:


> I am not exactly sure when it stopped being MY country.



I think prohibition was the beginning of the trouble. 
Then out outlawing drugs. 
Being responceable was no longer your own choice. 
Then Vietnam when so many showed they would do Wrong rather than face the government. 
By the time 55 mph sped limits and seatbelt laws hit we were ready to accept anything.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

AmericanStand said:


> I think prohibition was the beginning of the trouble.
> Then out outlawing drugs.
> Being responceable was no longer your own choice.
> Then Vietnam when so many showed they would do Wrong rather than face the government.
> By the time 55 mph sped limits and seatbelt laws hit we were ready to accept anything.


Rephrasing what you said, "We became a nation with too many laws and regulations".

We try to legislate everything.


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

Patchouli said:


> What? I am 100% fully invested in my belief that America was a WASP Utopia in the 50's. And I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who would disagree. I can happily point you to tons of conservative sites that want to drag us all kicking and screaming right back there again. Where women and minorities of all types knew their place and where if you were different you stayed in whatever closet you were stuck in if you wanted to live peacefully in this country.
> 
> I always enjoy a bit of Shakespeare but I don't see how that is apropos to the discussion?


Wow, judge much? Did you think Leave it to Beaver was a documentary film?

The social changes of the 60s were already churning in the 50s. Major league sports and popular music were already desegregated. My one grandmother had 5 kids and she had a career in the 50s. I'm sure there were enclaves of "WASP utopia" but that was for the upper classes. Regular folks were likely to be working in segregated factories and enjoying chart topping music from The Platters, Nat King Cole, Little Richard, etc. Now there were differences in different parts of the country but that mythical WASP utopia was not the norm.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

MO_cows said:


> Wow, judge much? Did you think Leave it to Beaver was a documentary film?
> 
> The social changes of the 60s were already churning in the 50s. Major league sports and popular music were already desegregated. My one grandmother had 5 kids and she had a career in the 50s. I'm sure there were enclaves of "WASP utopia" but that was for the upper classes. Regular folks were likely to be working in segregated factories and enjoying chart topping music from The Platters, Nat King Cole, Little Richard, etc. Now there were differences in different parts of the country but that mythical WASP utopia was not the norm.


I guess we have a really different view of integrated. A token few athletes grudgingly admitted and roundly abused by a lot of fans doesn't really qualify as putting a dent in that WASP utopia. How many of them were on a team but couldn't sleep in the same hotel? 

Black music had been listened to, admired and appropriated by whites straight on through the 20th century. Doesn't mean anyone wanted them living in their neighborhood or had them at their cocktail parties.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Patchouli said:


> I guess we have a really different view of integrated. A token few athletes grudgingly admitted and roundly abused by a lot of fans doesn't really qualify as putting a dent in that WASP utopia. How many of them were on a team but couldn't sleep in the same hotel?
> 
> Black music had been listened to, admired and appropriated by whites straight on through the 20th century. Doesn't mean anyone wanted them living in their neighborhood or had them at their cocktail parties.


In the 50s women were only routinely allowed certain jobs outside the home, certainly made much less money, and higher education was discouraged. 

Gays had it even worse, there were sodomy laws in all states and there were prison sentences for those convicted. The stigma of being gay with so strong that most people were tightly closeted and/or simply denied themselves their true sexuality.

Atheists and agnostics were punished too, and many (most?) simply kept their non belief to themselves. 

It wasn't until the early 70s that birth control was legalized for all US citizens.


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

So when a straight kid Beats a gay kid for stealing from him that's a hate crime right?

When a woman starts a lawsuit because she doesn't get paid as much as a man who has been there 3 years longer and cannot do the physical aspect of the job to the same ability? 

When a female Marine who is not married gets preggers intentionally to get out of a deployment they should be punished fully right?

You all fail to understand 1 main thing. When they get their so called equal treatment it's not fair because it's too harsh. 

Food for thought, accept responsibility for your own actions/inactions and maybe life would be better. Stop giving handouts to those who contribute nothing. You think you deserve food stamps? Go clean trash out of ditches if you ain't got a job. People used to be proud in America, now everyone wants as much as possible with as little work possible.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> You think you deserve food stamps? Go clean trash out of ditches if you ain't got a job. People used to be proud in America, now everyone wants as much as possible with as little work possible.



What you fail to understand is most people who are on food stamps don't have the ability to do that stuff. 
You see they are at work. Busy making rich men richer.


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## solar (Feb 11, 2010)

Anyone who disagrees with me is ignorant. I saw it on TV so it must be true.


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

AmericanStand said:


> What you fail to understand is most people who are on food stamps don't have the ability to do that stuff.
> You see they are at work. Busy making rich men richer.


When I stand in line getting my groceries for a family of 5 and watch dirtbags have a buggy full of the good name brand stuff and put a lone star card in to pay for it and then buy a buggy full of beer and wine with cash there is a problem. It's abused more than it is used properly. That's my point, too many have abused it and want something for nothing.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

So you don't belive a working man deserves a beer at the end of the day ? One he pays for with his own money ?


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

AmericanStand said:


> So you don't belive a working man deserves a beer at the end of the day ? One he pays for with his own money ?


Not a buggy full when he can't pay for his family's groceries. Beer and wine are luxuries, feeding your family is a responsibility that you as a parent are responsible for, not the taxpayers while you buy 6 cases of beer and 12 bottles of wine with cash you didn't pay taxes on. Do some need it, yes they do. Do most abuse it, hands down they do. America has become a free rider society.


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## Shine (Feb 19, 2011)

AmericanStand said:


> So you don't belive a working man deserves a beer at the end of the day ? One he pays for with his own money ?


...not if he just bought a buggy full of steaks and Snow Crab on our dime.

The Homeless outreach at our church is unbelievable - most of the homeless crowd there will convene for free food, showers and clothes and try to hawk their food stamp cards for 50% of the value. Then they report them stolen with their free cell phones and get a replacement card printed up.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> Not a buggy full when he can't pay for his family's groceries. *Beer and wine are luxuries, *feeding your family is a responsibility that you as a parent are responsible for, not the taxpayers while you buy 6 cases of beer and 12 bottles of wine with cash you didn't pay taxes on. Do some need it, yes they do. Do most abuse it, hands down they do. America has become a free rider society.


I keep hearing that alcohol and tobacco are luxuries.... Generally from those who do not use these perfectly legal products. Champaign is perhaps a luxury, ripple or mad dog.... Not quite. Marlborough at fifty bucks a carton might be a luxury, several of the cheaper off brands at less than fifteen per carton... Not really a luxury to those like myself who enjoy that after dinner smoke, or having a smoke with the morning coffee, or maybe after a romp in the the sack with that special someone.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Marlborough at fifty bucks a carton might be a luxury, several of the cheaper off brands at less than fifteen per carton... Not really a luxury to those like myself who enjoy that after dinner smoke, or having a smoke with the morning coffee, or maybe after a romp in the the sack with that special someone.


I can remember when a carton of name brand cigarettes were $2.00

You could buy packs from a machine that only took quarters, and there would be 4 pennies under the celophane on each pack.


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> I keep hearing that alcohol and tobacco are luxuries.... Generally from those who do not use these perfectly legal products. Champaign is perhaps a luxury, ripple or mad dog.... Not quite. Marlborough at fifty bucks a carton might be a luxury, several of the cheaper off brands at less than fifteen per carton... Not really a luxury to those like myself who enjoy that after dinner smoke, or having a smoke with the morning coffee, or maybe after a romp in the the sack with that special someone.


I do drink, not near as often or as much as I used to. I used to dip and smoke too. If there was a chance I couldn't feed my family I, personally, would go without because at the end of the day you do not NEED either to SURVIVE. Your kids need food. Luxury or not to you, if you can take care of your family without assistance go ahead smoke and drink, if you can't why is it ok to abuse the system?


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> I do drink, not near as often or as much as I used to. I used to dip and smoke too. If there was a chance I couldn't feed my family I, personally, would go without because at the end of the day you do not NEED either to SURVIVE. Your kids need food. Luxury or not to you, if you can take care of your family without assistance go ahead smoke and drink, if you can't why is it ok to abuse the system?


The point I was attempting to make had nothing to do with abusing the system. Why are these things labeled luxuries if one is poor, but not so much if one can easily afford them?


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> The point I was attempting to make had nothing to do with abusing the system. Why are these things labeled luxuries if one is poor, but not so much if one can easily afford them?


Because you should take care of you family before lighting up or popping a top. It's not something you NEED it is a want.


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## edcopp (Oct 9, 2004)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I can remember when a carton of name brand cigarettes were $2.00
> 
> You could buy packs from a machine that only took quarters, and there would be 4 pennies under the celophane on each pack.


You are old. Probably remember when a three pound can of coffee actually had three pounds in it, too.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> Because you should take care of you family before lighting up or popping a top. It's not something you NEED it is a want.


Talk to the average citizen today and you will soon learn that the majority of them seem to think cell phones are "necessities" too, Along with having running water in the house and electricity to power their A/C and televisions, coffee makers etc. oh and a car for each member of the family. Oddly enough my grandparents not only survived without those luxuries/necessities they managed to take care of their families in the process. One thing that was never missing in my grampas cupboard was his jug of whiskey used for medicinal purposes of course.


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> Talk to the average citizen today and you will soon learn that the majority of them seem to think cell phones are "necessities" too, Along with having running water in the house and electricity to power their A/C and televisions, coffee makers etc. oh and a car for each member of the family. Oddly enough my grandparents not only survived without those luxuries/necessities they managed to take care of their families in the process. One thing that was never missing in my grampas cupboard was his jug of whiskey used for medicinal purposes of course.


Get it got it great. You win.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Irish Pixie said:


> In the 50s women were only routinely allowed certain jobs outside the home, certainly made much less money, and higher education was discouraged.
> 
> Gays had it even worse, there were sodomy laws in all states and there were prison sentences for those convicted. The stigma of being gay with so strong that most people were tightly closeted and/or simply denied themselves their true sexuality.
> 
> ...


You certainly live in a dark ugly world


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Cornhusker said:


> You certainly live in a dark ugly world


I live in an enlightened world because of the work of others to gain civil rights for *all* people.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> I live in an enlightened world because of the work of others to gain civil rights for *all* people.


Except conservatives!


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Irish Pixie said:


> I live in an enlightened world because of the work of others to gain civil rights for *all* people.


The work of others!!! Free rider programs all the way!


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> The work of others!!! Free rider programs all the way!


Can you explain "free rider programs all the way" because I think you are confused on what I said.


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Irish Pixie said:


> I live in an enlightened world because of the work of others to gain civil rights for *all* people.


The work of others, you contributed nothing and get to enjoy the fruits of their labor. Basically you didn't earn it, it was given to you and earned by someone else.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> The work of others, you contributed nothing and get to enjoy the fruits of their labor. Basically *you didn't earn it, it was given to you and earned by someone else*.


Now you sound just like Obama


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Now you sound just like Obama


No that's what that moron promotes! I actually enjoyed paying my dues to this country.

I guess you read that how you wanted to....again!


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> No that's what that moron promotes! I actually enjoyed paying my dues to this country.
> 
> I guess *you read that how you wanted to*....again!


I just read what you write:



> Basically you didn't earn it, it was given to you and earned by someone else.


How else can one interpret that? 

It sounds a lot like BO saying:


> If you've got a businessâyou didn't build that. Somebody else made that happen


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> The work of others, you contributed nothing and get to enjoy the fruits of their labor. Basically you didn't earn it, it was given to you and earned by someone else.



That's what I thought. I was referring to the people that worked so that we all have civil rights.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

God gave these rights to everyone, they were denied to many for a long time by our bigoted society, until some rose above the masses and reclaimed them. No one is riding on anyone's coat tails here.


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## Txsteader (Aug 22, 2005)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> *God gave these rights to everyone*, they were denied to many for a long time by our bigoted society, until some rose above the masses and reclaimed them. No one is riding on anyone's coat tails here.


Careful, you might offend someone.

Do God-given rights apply to those who don't believe in God? Where do their rights come from?


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I just read what you write:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Put your twist on it however you want. Google free riders and maybe even you can understand that. Good Lord surely you cannot be that bitter and senile.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Txsteader said:


> Careful, you might offend someone.
> 
> Do God-given rights apply to those who don't believe in God? Where do their rights come from?


yes, we all have these rights, one does not have to beleive in Santa clause to get Christmas presents either.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Yvonne's hubby said:


> *God gave these rights to everyone,* they were denied to many for a long time by our bigoted society, until some rose above the masses and reclaimed them. No one is riding on anyone's coat tails here.


What rights did God give?


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## OffGridCooker (Jan 29, 2010)

mollymae said:


> I'm just continually surprised by the way some folks think. This is our country....our home we are speaking of. Liberal or republican or independent. Please folks.... Stop your witching and try.... TRY


Ignorance is not such a problem, ignorance goes away with knowledge.
Stupidity is not even a barrier that can't be overcome, it just may take longer to learn.
Foolish thinking is the problem.
One of the building blocks of wisdom is, trial and error, and the experience of understand and correcting errors, 
If you are too foolish to admit error, you don't learn from trial error, 
so narcism can be a problem. An intelligent narcissists may gain wisdom slower than a stupid person with a different personality.
Rigid ideology that does not allow critical thinking, is also a problem, for gaining wisdom and
Letting someone else do the thinking for you, can be a problem.
The stage of life your are in has an effect on thinking, all the circuits don't connect until you are 40 years old. As smart as you are at 20 you will be wiser at 30, that is if you are not a fool.
And those are just a few wisdom blockers.


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## Miss Kay (Mar 31, 2012)

"No one is riding on anyone's coat tails here"

We are all riding on someone's coat tails here, lots of someones. As a woman, I am able to vote because of the effort and fight of previous generations. I just retired from a very lucrative career that was all male just a generation ago. Someone paid a personal price to pave the way for me to do that. I owe my safety to those in the military and law enforcement who serve for the greater good. I owe my life to the doctors and nurses who saved me at least twice. I owe neighbors and teachers, family and friends who have helped me all through my life. No matter how self made you think you are, you need people and people need you. My goal is to leave this life helping just as many people as have helped me. They are welcome to ride on my coat tail! Now, get back to your discussion of ignorant people.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> Not a buggy full when he can't pay for his family's groceries. Beer and wine are luxuries, feeding your family is a responsibility that you as a parent are responsible for, not the taxpayers while you buy 6 cases of beer and 12 bottles of wine with cash you didn't pay taxes on. Do some need it, yes they do. Do most abuse it, hands down they do. America has become a free rider society.



So in your special world what do you approve of them spending their own money on ?


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Miss Kay said:


> "No one is riding on anyone's coat tails here"
> 
> We are all riding on someone's coat tails here, lots of someones. As a woman, I am able to vote because of the effort and fight of previous generations. I just retired from a very lucrative career that was all male just a generation ago. Someone paid a personal price to pave the way for me to do that. I owe my safety to those in the military and law enforcement who serve for the greater good. I owe my life to the doctors and nurses who saved me at least twice. I owe neighbors and teachers, family and friends who have helped me all through my life. No matter how self made you think you are, you need people and people need you. My goal is to leave this life helping just as many people as have helped me. They are welcome to ride on my coat tail! Now, get back to your discussion of ignorant people.


Excellent post. Thank you.


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## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

AmericanStand said:


> So in your special world what do you approve of them spending their own money on ?


In my special world he can buy some of that food with his own money and take less food stamps .......


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Texaspredatorhu said:


> Put *your twist* on it however you want. Google free riders and maybe even you can understand that. Good Lord surely you cannot be that bitter and senile.


I haven't "twisted anything". That's why I copy and paste.

Those were your words and his words, which are identical in meaning.

Why must you resort to the name calling and insults?


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## Texaspredatorhu (Sep 15, 2015)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I haven't "twisted anything". That's why I copy and paste.
> 
> Those were your words and his words, which are identical in meaning.
> 
> Why must you resort to the name calling and insults?


Identical in your interpretation. Once again you are right, most highly intelligent one.


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