# Thoughts on sir rifles



## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

Been thinking about picking up an air rifle.
Something in the $150 range. The local shop has some Benjamin's and Rugers . the .177 cal. Is listed at 1,200 ft/sec. The .22 cal at 1,100 ft/ second.
Which would have the most stopping power at say 50ft for small game.
Long ago as kids we had Crossman 760 power masters and would drop squirrels at 50 ft. After putting 20 pumps into it.
I know airguns have come a long way since I was 12.
Hoping the last 55 years have made some serious changes.
Anyone have any experience with modern airguns?
.177 or .22?


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

for hunting or targets ?

if you want to do targets I really like the Avanti 853 it makes a good pump 10 meter 3 position gun they can be rebuilt and last a very very long time


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## Big_Al (Dec 21, 2011)

Benjamin used to make great air guns, I don't know their quality today.
We were over run with large Norway rats when several old chicken barns were demolished nearby.
The wife's Crosman CO2 BB pistol was not enough, so we got her a Walmart special Crosman .177 cal pellet rifle, a spring gun. It proved too hard for the wife to cock, it ended up with me, for plinking pine cones and such.
I used a Ruger Single Six with 22 WMR shot shells on the rats in the horse stables and feed room.

The Crosman spring rifle (I don't know the model number off hand) would be adequate for squirrels if you got a head shot. I don't think it would be humane for something rabbit size. Rabbits are tough little creatures.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

for game shooting 5mm is the way to go
it doubles the weight of the pellet and you need that weight to get penetration

the multi pump Benjamin and Sheridan 5mm guns do well on small game.


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## Digitalis (Aug 20, 2021)

.22 carries more energy, but you can take squirrels with either. .177 is faster and flatter shooting. Air pumps were cool as a kid as you could charge it more than a gutless red rider bb gun, but good spring guns are more powerful and consistent. They also kick harder so you need a scope rated for them.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Digitalis said:


> .22 carries more energy, but you can take squirrels with either. .177 is faster and flatter shooting. Air pumps were cool as a kid as you could charge it more than a gutless red rider bb gun, but good spring guns are more powerful and consistent. They also kick harder so you need a scope rated for them.


It’s not that spring guns have more recoil, it’s that their mechanism has its own recoil, it’s stronger than the tiny amount of recoil that firing a pellet produces, and the spring mechanism produces forward recoil rather than rearward. The net recoil of a spring air rifle is actually negative.

The reticles of most optics are mounted on the rear side of a focal plane lens, so “regular” recoil has the heavier lens pushing the lighter reticle rearward- like why you bias scope rings forward in a pic rail; the heavier rifle pushes the lighter scope to the rear.

With forward recoil, the heavier lens tries to pull the lighter reticle forward, and can easily break it loose.


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## Big_John (Dec 1, 2021)

Nearly 20 years ago I invested in an RWS Diana .177. Paid $180 for it back then and now they are double that. Just last year, I harvested nearly 50 tree rats. They came under my wrath, as I was tired of them scratching and chewing nearly everything around my house. I ate none of them, as Fish and Game had a warning in my locale about some sort of illness in squirrels that freaked out the wife. They did make great bait for Coyotes.

Anyway, today's airguns are incredibly capable. Mine will hit a quarter at 50 yards. It did take me a while to find the right scope mount and proper scope for the funky airgun recoil, but landed with a Barska 3-9x32, specific for airgun. It holds zero well.

Anyway, I think an airgun is a great prep. Once I found the pellet my gun loved, I purchased $25 of pellets, which will cover me for the rest of my life. Don't forget oil... as these guns need regular lube. I also purchase 6 little bottles of oil.










.........


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

Anything that can be hunted and killed with an air rifle, could be more productively caught in traps. I can buy a lot of snare wire for the cost of one air rifle.


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## Digitalis (Aug 20, 2021)

In a survival situation a 22 air rifle could take a deer with a head shot.


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## muleskinner2 (Oct 7, 2007)

Digitalis said:


> In a survival situation a 22 air rifle could take a deer with a head shot.


Yes it could. And in a survival situation I have taken deer with snare wire.


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## Grafton County Couple (Sep 20, 2018)

Rules/regulations for hunting with air rifles (caliber, game species) vary from state-to-state.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

This gun will have several purposes.
Target mostly but possibly hunting too.
The other reason is hunter training. In NY you have to be 12 years old to handle a firearm. In the hunter training course there is a target shooting exercise however 11 year olds taking the course can not handle a firearm.
They can handle an air gun.
I know its a stupid law and to be honest nobody follows it, but as a training instructor I have to follow regulations.
So I figure I'd kill three birds with one stone.
I do like the added power of the .22 but by the same token I'm a real ***** when it comes to accuracy.
Is there much of a significant difference between the .177 and the .22? Effective range is also to be considered. I imagine limiting myself to say 25 yrs but farther shots may be possible.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

I have a Texan LSS .50 






TexanLSS .510 Caliber


AirForce Airguns, the first manufacturer of Pre-Charged Pneumatic Air Rifles (PCP) in the U.S., has been making precision rifles for many years, developing the most technologically advanced airgun shooting system in the world. Known for their flexibility and legendary accuracy, AirForce Airguns...



www.airforceairguns.com





I am pleased with it.


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## Kelly Craig (Oct 10, 2021)

The people I know have around six air rifles between them. The include 177's and 22's, single pump, multi pump and PCP's. One old boy is at the top of his class with relatively inexpensive rifles.''

In the end, for actual work, they all chose the slower 22, for hitting power. It's like taking a 45 over a 9mm for the same reason.

I have a Walmart 177 break barrel that's pretty impressive for the money, but I'd go with a 22 if I had to work with it.

My buddy had my shoot his PCP at a walnut about 100 feet away. It exploded, leaving me VERY impressed. But they do require special pumps, which can be expensive if you want the electric version.

Lewis and Clark had one, of a bigger caliber, and it was said to take down deer.

One advantage of them is, you can get, say, 12 shots off before you have to re-load.

Any of the good ones, break barrel, pump up, PCP can do the work of a twenty-two and with far less noise.



JJ Grandits said:


> Been thinking about picking up an air rifle.
> Something in the $150 range. The local shop has some Benjamin's and Rugers . the .177 cal. Is listed at 1,200 ft/sec. The .22 cal at 1,100 ft/ second.
> Which would have the most stopping power at say 50ft for small game.
> Long ago as kids we had Crossman 760 power masters and would drop squirrels at 50 ft. After putting 20 pumps into it.
> ...


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

Kelly Craig said:


> Any of the good ones, break barrel, pump up, PCP can do the work of a twenty-two and with far less noise.


They can do the work of any caliber you choose.


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## Fishindude (May 19, 2015)

Well, if you find one that's accurate, I'd like to hear about it.
I've purchased several in last few years including quite expensive ones as well as experimented with numerous types of pellets and scopes and cant find one that is anywhere near as accurate as a .22 rimfire.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

I think a i-inch grouping at 100-yards should be tight enough.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Fishindude said:


> Well, if you find one that's accurate, I'd like to hear about it.
> I've purchased several in last few years including quite expensive ones as well as experimented with numerous types of pellets and scopes and cant find one that is anywhere near as accurate as a .22 rimfire.


the spring air guns especially have negative recoil so they have to be shot much different 

we use Daisy 853 single pump pneumatic for youth 3 position air rifle at 10 meters they will make one ragged hole if you can do your part 

they however are not good for game , just targets 

going fast with a small bearing surface , a light pellet may be an issue.

all of the extremely accurate air rifles I am aware of are in the 600-900fps range


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

I bought some .510 bullets that weigh 300 grains, and I have been making .510 bullets that come in at 550 grains. Any weapon that will move so much lead at 1000 fps, should do reasonable damage.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

Got the gun. Was looking at .22 vs .177.
Candles wanted more than I wanted to spend and the .22 at the local gun store did not feel right so I went with a Benjamin Prowler .177.
Has a very cheap scope but we shot it yesterday (50 ft) and was pretty accurate. Rated at about 1,200 fps but who really knows. Picked up some different wt. Pellets for it. I could see the 10.5gr putting a serious hurt on the red squirrels around here.
Will be teaching my class today so will see how it does.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

JJ Grandits said:


> Got the gun. Was looking at .22 vs .177.
> Candles wanted more than I wanted to spend and the .22 at the local gun store did not feel right so I went with a Benjamin Prowler .177.
> Has a very cheap scope but we shot it yesterday (50 ft) and was pretty accurate. Rated at about 1,200 fps but who really knows. Picked up some different wt. Pellets for it. I could see the 10.5gr putting a serious hurt on the red squirrels around here.
> Will be teaching my class today so will see how it does.


what class?
hunters ed?


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