# Tough times ahead according to one of our state reps...



## illinoisguy (Sep 4, 2011)

My boss who is very high up in the company got info from one of the state reps who is a democrat. In Illinois, there are some big cuts that were recently made. However, he stated that what we saw was just a scratch. He stated that after November, the cuts will be so bad and deep that it will look like the 1920's. He remarked how much money was being spent on welfare and free medical care and those that have it are abusing it and they could not continue it.

My first thought is...am I surprised? Then again, what do you do to prepare? I told my wife about it and she told me there weren't too many places to cut. I figured one of the first places was eating out. Which to this point is a place to start.

But it would seem that November may be more like D-day than anything else. I have often wondered if our govt is just giving our economy a steroid shot to barely gimp to November.....then we're in trouble.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Scranton just cut city employees' pay to minimum wage. At least one Kalifornia city recently declared bankruptcy. China is now exporting its excess capacity as its own economic downturn means much less domestic consumption.


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## Sawmill Jim (Dec 5, 2008)

If not November it will be coming .


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## Guest (Jul 10, 2012)

We quit resturants along time ago. We can buy several meals worth of food for one time at a resturant.
We had a feeling it would be soon, the goverment cann't keep this up. Welfare recipients just don't get it. It will come as a hard shock to them.
they are already showing signs of thinking other people can take up the slack if the goverment cann't take care of them. It's kinda/very, darn scary.


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## pumpkin (May 8, 2012)

It isn't just welfare and social services that are draining the government bank. The huge cost of war always financially punishes or even bankrupts a country.


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

pumpkin said:


> It isn't just welfare and social services that are draining the government bank. The huge cost of war always financially punishes or even bankrupts a country.


 Indeed. Oddly enough it costs more to kill people than to feed them...


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Eat out? What's that? 
We cut that out years ago and try to grow our own as much as possible since the grocery store bill is too high.
What else?
Heat with wood, hunt your own meat, get a water supply backup that will work without the grid, use small LED's for light, 12v battery backup.
How about some more?


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## pumpkin (May 8, 2012)

InvalidID said:


> Indeed. Oddly enough it costs more to kill people than to feed them...


Ain't that the truth!

One thing that really surprises me is how little people have learned from the shocking experience of the 2007 and 2008 financial collapse. I am not refering to what is happening with the economy but rather to their own financial lives - learning to do better for themselves. Paying off debt, living within their means, saving, stocking up and changing to more independent ways of living. In the past year we have 6 friends who have lost their jobs (73 more to go in one business alone) and all of these families are going to be in a worse mess than needed because they did not do anything over the past 4 years to make their lives a little more secure and safe. All were making good incomes but since the collapse did not affect them at the time they did not take it as a personal warning..


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## illinoisguy (Sep 4, 2011)

Its amazing where I live. One checkout person stated that at least 50% that goes through his line is on gov't assist. Hospital employees will tell you the biggest abusers are those with medical cards.

Its amazing that I pay several hundred a month in premiums but cannot get adequate care. My deductible is $2500 for the wife and kids. Yet, a welfare recipient gets everything free and gets to go to the emergency room and many times by ambulance. The ambulance is being called for very simple things in my area.

I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


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## Sawmill Jim (Dec 5, 2008)

InvalidID said:


> Indeed. Oddly enough it costs more to kill people than to feed them...


Not really they just picky how they kill them :hobbyhors 

What would it cost for a few well placed nukes :run:

No bigger than those spots of real estate are they could scoped them up with a track hoe and spread the dirt and sand over Texas and it wouldn't raised the altitude one quarter inch gre: And cheaper too


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## whiterock (Mar 26, 2003)

I do not want that stuff in Texas, thank you very much.
Ed


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## rancher1913 (Dec 5, 2008)

> Its amazing that I pay several hundred a month in premiums but cannot get adequate care. My deductible is $2500 for the wife and kids. Yet, a welfare recipient gets everything free and gets to go to the emergency room and many times by ambulance. The ambulance is being called for very simple things in my area.
> 
> I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


So true. I work in an ER. Folks on medicaid will come to the ER because it's a $3 co-pay. The clinic is $15. You would not believe the things people term 'an emergency'.


Moldy


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## Welshmom (Sep 7, 2008)

illinoisguy said:


> I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


Libraries are free. And I think they must stay that way.


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

I don't know about the card holder. I do know that for my VA, if i am sick, I have three choices. 

1. A clinic appointment takes 30 days to get in.

2. Drive 150 miles to v a hospital.

3. Go to emergency room.


V a clinic usually tells me to go to the emergency room for minor care of it needs to be done before 30 days.

It's the government way.


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## ovsfarm (Jan 14, 2003)

I think one important thing you could do is to do everything you can to optimize your health between now and November. Who knows what will happen with healthcare, however I think it is safe to assume that as usual, the little guy will be forced to pay outrageous prices. 

So anything you can do: quit smoking, get to a healthy weight, suck it up and buy new orthopedic shoe inserts if you need them, have any suspicious skin lesions examined and removed, change your diet, quit drinking pop/soda/Coke or whatever you call it. Get your eyeglasses prescription updated (don't forget about Zenni Optical - Eyeglasses, Prescription Glasses, Bifocal, Progressive Eyeglasses, Rimless Glasses and similar places where you can buy Rx glasses for $8.00 a pair, so you can afford backups). Go to the dentist to get everything cleaned and repaired as well as possible.

Because in my opinion, our health is one of our most important resources. If that fails, who is going to do all that gardening, hunting, or canning? So that is my $.02...


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## illinoisguy (Sep 4, 2011)

Library free? Its paid for by taxes. I lived out of town and had to pay a yearly fee. Unfortunately, the governmentistas don't frequent it often....ours at least. Free food they'll all show....free knowledge...another story....


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## sidepasser (May 10, 2002)

I am seeing my doc tomorrow for a full checkup while I have good health insurance, who knows what will happen in the next few months? I also am stocking up, DH is distraught, I don't think he has ever had so much toilet paper, paper towels and kleen-ex in the house at one time - lol..bogo free, plus coupons works for me!

We are moving my mom up here because gas is getting expensive driving back and forth to GA to make sure she is ok. We can lease her farm out..it's gorgeous and reminds me of a place in Old Kentucky..long winding driveway, pecan trees, gardens, pond, grazing land...just beautiful and our hired hand quit, so time to move her up here and lease the place out. 

We are consolidating our holdings, battening down our hatches and hanging on because I think things are going to get really bad no matter who is in office. Particularly if Obama is on office, but I do think that things will get bad by winter, I believe fuel costs are going to rise, and I know grocery prices will go up *(when have they come down???)..

Stock up, use coupons, buy on sale, and pay off your debt!


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## bignugly (Jul 13, 2011)

illinoisguy said:


> Its amazing where I live. One checkout person stated that at least 50% that goes through his line is on gov't assist. Hospital employees will tell you the biggest abusers are those with medical cards.
> 
> Its amazing that I pay several hundred a month in premiums but cannot get adequate care. My deductible is $2500 for the wife and kids. Yet, a welfare recipient gets everything free and gets to go to the emergency room and many times by ambulance. The ambulance is being called for very simple things in my area.
> 
> I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


I agree that a lot of people abuse the Medicaid system but a lot of the abuse is also done by the suppliers of services. There are no checks and balances at any level to curtail the abuse.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

I have never eaten out at a sit down restaurant with my whole family....my kids are 17, 16 and 11....we have a $5 fast food limit once a month.....debt free and scraping by....plenty of wood to cut and weeds to pull and animals to tend....

The idiots that are called gov't will always just waste and want more....and a lot of lazy people --rich and poor --will continue to take and expect more until it runs out and them they have to steal from you in person!


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

pumpkin said:


> It isn't just welfare and social services that are draining the government bank. The huge cost of war always financially punishes or even bankrupts a country.


Yep.....war making is expensive, but on a national level, the "defense" ( it's really a lot of Offense ) part of the budget is about 25%, and the social programs part of the budget is over 50%.


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

Don't things get crazy every fourth November anyway? 

I do see shtf as an ever looming threat, an inevitable threat/reality. I also see people get real excited around elections.

Either way I appreciate the reminder to prep for any possibility. My prepanoia tends to come and go and I do need to go up a gear here again. Been a nice vacation with my head in the sand but all good things come to an end.

...just ask the Romans. :run:


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## zant (Dec 1, 2005)

Gee,I wonder if the unions and their bosses that control the criminal enterprise known as Chicago have anything to do with it?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Oddly enough it costs more to kill people than to feed them...


It's safer to be in Afghanistan than on the South side of* Chicago*
It won't be long until they start using them as a "reason" to push for *more gun laws*


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

nothing much here to cut out at all. We don't eat out, we are down to the bare minimum of everything. We could cut out interntet but DH brings in a few bucks, enough to cover internet with internet so it would be dumb to cut that out. Can't cut out rent (we barely make it as it is) and we buy clothes from thrift stores when we need clothes. That is when our clothes actually get holes and start to fall apart. Other then that we don't buy at all these days. If it wern't for the veggie garden this summer we'd be in a world of hurt. Kind of afraid of what winter will bring this year but we are saving our pennies so we can stock up the best we can on canned stuff and rice and beans to make it through.

I can't imagine it getting worse, and we don't even qualify for any kind of help as I make more then 150% of the poverty level from working over time. I feel bad for those folks who do have to be on assistance. It must be a grim existance indeed.


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

illinoisguy said:


> Its amazing where I live. One checkout person stated that at least 50% that goes through his line is on gov't assist. Hospital employees will tell you the biggest abusers are those with medical cards.
> 
> Its amazing that I pay several hundred a month in premiums but cannot get adequate care. My deductible is $2500 for the wife and kids. Yet, a welfare recipient gets everything free and gets to go to the emergency room and many times by ambulance. The ambulance is being called for very simple things in my area.
> 
> I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


AND the hospitals don't get paid by medicare too much anymore so they are basically giving away free services, which is why they keep having to lay off people at work.......gre:I work in a hospital, and you would thing healthcare would be the best perk they offer....But I am scared to death to get sick and scared to death of the hospital bills I would recieve.


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## illinoisguy (Sep 4, 2011)

I heard the same things with medicare. Many times the gov't is only paying 10 cents on the dollar for many bills.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

I knew it would have to come this , any state that decided it could tax and spend it's way out of a hole was just prolonging it and making it a deeper hole at the same time 

I am not a fan of politicians , or Gov Walker, Wisconsin's Governor but seeing that austerity was the way is important it hasn't been a pleasant 2 years but i think much better than the next few years will be for our neighbors to the south.

It would be like saying i am deep in credit card debt and i am going to work a few hours of overtime every week but buy lunch out so that my favorite cafe stays in business also, so you make 50 dollars a week more in overtime , but spend 10 dollars each day eating out , you make no progress on the debt and after taxes your worse off , not better.

the bigger you let the disparity get the harder it is to rectify it later.

so you can wash the cut right away and it stings or let it get infected and need 3x the care later 3x the pain and leave a deep scar.


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## KnowOneSpecial (Sep 12, 2010)

pumpkin said:


> It isn't just welfare and social services that are draining the government bank. The huge cost of war always financially punishes or even bankrupts a country.


War is costly. Period. You can't have 10 years of war and not expect the cost to rise. I heard on the news this morning that something like 42% of all returning vets are going to need VA services. That's going to cost us for a long time. What if we had all of that money we spent on the wars in our coffers?


As for IL...it's been a long time coming. I know our schools felt pinched last year when the General Assembly wouldn't release the funds to pay for education until later in the year. Folks have been saying that we need to change funding in this state and now that it's starting people are going to be shocked. Unfortunately it's what the Feds need to do, too. 


As for us....we gave up eating out a while ago. Even the kids said they'd rather have food at home because the stuff you get in the restaurant wasn't that good. We do make exemptions for a certain Chineese Restaurant. They have a really good Prime rib, mashed taters and crab rangoon. The kids all have their favorite things to eat there and I'm particulary fond of their warm apple pie, vanilla ice cream and caramel sauce dessert. 

Other cuts? Might not have as many chickens as we have eggs to spare. Might get another cow on the pasture, but the one going to freezer camp in a few months will be enough to hold us for a while. Expand the garden? I would if the sky would remember to rain once in a while.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

NickieL said:


> nothing much here to cut out at all. We don't eat out, we are down to the bare minimum of everything. We could cut out interntet but DH brings in a few bucks, enough to cover internet with internet so it would be dumb to cut that out. Can't cut out rent (we barely make it as it is) and we buy clothes from thrift stores when we need clothes. That is when our clothes actually get holes and start to fall apart. Other then that we don't buy at all these days. If it wern't for the veggie garden this summer we'd be in a world of hurt. Kind of afraid of what winter will bring this year but we are saving our pennies so we can stock up the best we can on canned stuff and rice and beans to make it through.
> 
> I can't imagine it getting worse, and we don't even qualify for any kind of help as I make more then 150% of the poverty level from working over time. I feel bad for those folks who do have to be on assistance. It must be a grim existance indeed.


People I know on assistance get free health care, $586 a month food stamps and discount housing. For 1 adult 3 small kids. i don't feel sorry for them.
She hangs around all day. No garden, no job. Kids are like wild animals.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

veggiecanner said:


> People I know on assistance get free health care, $586 a month food stamps and discount housing. For 1 adult 3 small kids. i don't feel sorry for them.
> She hangs around all day. No garden, no job. Kids are like wild animals.


Indeed!!! add free heat, free childcare when they go get their free college degree, free lunch at school, free gas from catholic charities.....sheesh!

The same family of 5 was making more than when my husband WAS working...unemployment is half of what local welfare recipients receive and we get nothing because we have enough life ins to bury us (personal responsibility) and some 401k money that after we pay penalty to gov't to meet the $12k limit we'd be out about 12k....or more....
ITS FREAKING CRAZY!gre:
but we'd be "better" off on welfare....


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

I think people have forgotten the point of welfare. It's not to feed and keep people alive in an emergency (anymore?), but to keep the poor from rising up against the status quo. I believe that's something we learned form the communists.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

farmrbrown said:


> Eat out? What's that?
> We cut that out years ago and try to grow our own as much as possible since the grocery store bill is too high.
> What else?
> Heat with wood, hunt your own meat, get a water supply backup that will work without the grid, use small LED's for light, 12v battery backup.
> How about some more?


Cook with wood. Raise as much of your food as you can. Buy second hand items when you can, or make as much as you can.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

illinoisguy said:


> Its amazing where I live. One checkout person stated that at least 50% that goes through his line is on gov't assist. Hospital employees will tell you the biggest abusers are those with medical cards.
> 
> Its amazing that I pay several hundred a month in premiums but cannot get adequate care. My deductible is $2500 for the wife and kids. Yet, a welfare recipient gets everything free and gets to go to the emergency room and many times by ambulance. The ambulance is being called for very simple things in my area.
> 
> I think nothing should be free. When its free, people don't appreciate things and they abuse it.


It's not free, those who work are paying for it. But I know what you mean.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

Welshmom said:


> Libraries are free. And I think they must stay that way.


No they aren't. Our taxes pay for them.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

sidepasser said:


> I am seeing my doc tomorrow for a full checkup while I have good health insurance, who knows what will happen in the next few months? I also am stocking up, DH is distraught, I don't think he has ever had so much toilet paper, paper towels and kleen-ex in the house at one time - lol..bogo free, plus coupons works for me!
> 
> We are moving my mom up here because gas is getting expensive driving back and forth to GA to make sure she is ok. We can lease her farm out..it's gorgeous and reminds me of a place in Old Kentucky..long winding driveway, pecan trees, gardens, pond, grazing land...just beautiful and our hired hand quit, so time to move her up here and lease the place out.
> 
> ...


We enlarged our garden a couple of years ago. I also had 2 surgeries, back and gall bladder. I'm trying to get everything fixed before things get any worse.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

NickieL said:


> AND the hospitals don't get paid by medicare too much anymore so they are basically giving away free services, which is why they keep having to lay off people at work.......gre:I work in a hospital, and you would thing healthcare would be the best perk they offer....But I am scared to death to get sick and scared to death of the hospital bills I would recieve.


And this is one of the reasons that healthcare costs are so high. Those who pay pay more to cover those who don't pay. Plus we live in a nation where litigation is a constant threat, so medical professionals have to pay more to cover the costs of fraudulent lawsuits they have to deal with.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

mpillow said:


> Indeed!!! add free heat, free childcare when they go get their free college degree, free lunch at school, free gas from catholic charities.....sheesh!
> 
> The same family of 5 was making more than when my husband WAS working...unemployment is half of what local welfare recipients receive and we get nothing because we have enough life ins to bury us (personal responsibility) and some 401k money that after we pay penalty to gov't to meet the $12k limit we'd be out about 12k....or more....
> ITS FREAKING CRAZY!gre:
> but we'd be "better" off on welfare....


Dh and i are basically working for food now. By the time we pay for fuel for work, what's left is for food. We do keep a pantry. But if some thing happens that won't last. And what we spend on food isn't enough. Think goodness for the garden.
Thing is we are working harder than ever. Used to be you worked less and made less, now you work harder and get even less.
So Dh found a way to fix the rotor tiller so i won't have to hand dig the garden any more. that is a relief.
I won't go on welfare, i refuse. I'll eat grass first.


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

veggiecanner said:


> Dh and i are basically working for food now. By the time we pay for fuel for work, what's left is for food. We do keep a pantry. But if some thing happens that won't last. And what we spend on food isn't enough. Think goodness for the garden.
> Thing is we are working harder than ever. Used to be you worked less and made less, now you work harder and get even less.
> So Dh found a way to fix the rotor tiller so i won't have to hand dig the garden any more. that is a relief.
> I won't go on welfare, i refuse. I'll eat grass first.


Least you can afford food. After I get done paying rent, health care, meds, and gas for the car to get to work...lets just say I am blessed to have my garden. I laugh to myself when people say they go out to the fast food place for a cheap $5 meal. All I can think is that $5 can go to some eggs, ramen noodles, peanut butter and a little bit of bread and feed us for way more then just one meal. Eating out is a long and distant memory for us. And i miss cheese. Hahahaha. The food I miss the most right now? Is dairy stuff which of course I can't grow in my garden. I feel very blessed to have my garden, and I have done more this year to keep it healthy and well weeded because we do have to depend on it. Today's meal was almost exclusive from the garden (as are most meals these days) Fried taters with peppers, and a cucumber salad. The oil to fry them and the cucumber dressing (oil and viniger) were the only things not home grown.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

NickieL said:


> Least you can afford food. After I get done paying rent, health care, meds, and gas for the car to get to work...lets just say I am blessed to have my garden. I laugh to myself when people say they go out to the fast food place for a cheap $5 meal. All I can think is that $5 can go to some eggs, ramen noodles, peanut butter and a little bit of bread and feed us for way more then just one meal. Eating out is a long and distant memory for us. And i miss cheese. Hahahaha. The food I miss the most right now? Is dairy stuff which of course I can't grow in my garden.


Nickie..do you really not have money for food?


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

We buy the basics, DH gets enough now and then from repairing computers to go buy oil, eggs, and flour. Sometimes it gets a bit slim but if it wern't for him doing his best to go out and find computers to repair we would be in really bad shape., and the garden too, and the scrap copper we salvage from old computers and things. We are saving up our change to stock up for winter, when the garden is not producing so we will have enough then. I've never had to work so hard for so little but I think that is just a taste of the times ahead for everyone~ at least dh and I will be practiced at making do. I fear for those who aren't used to it becasue that will be a huge wake up call. I'll tell you what, I will celebrate with all the cheese in the world though when DH finially finds a job!


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

NickieL said:


> Least you can afford food. After I get done paying rent, health care, meds, and gas for the car to get to work...lets just say I am blessed to have my garden. I laugh to myself when people say they go out to the fast food place for a cheap $5 meal. All I can think is that $5 can go to some eggs, ramen noodles, peanut butter and a little bit of bread and feed us for way more then just one meal. Eating out is a long and distant memory for us. And i miss cheese. Hahahaha. The food I miss the most right now? Is dairy stuff which of course I can't grow in my garden. I feel very blessed to have my garden, and I have done more this year to keep it healthy and well weeded because we do have to depend on it. Today's meal was almost exclusive from the garden (as are most meals these days) Fried taters with peppers, and a cucumber salad. The oil to fry them and the cucumber dressing (oil and viniger) were the only things not home grown.


Well i guess we are in the same boat then aren't we. i buy just what can go with the garden produce.
If you've gotten that low, you need to find a food bank.


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

veggiecanner said:


> Well i guess we are in the same boat then aren't we. i buy just what can go with the garden produce.


YUP. I'm just glad DH is having a good week this week with the computers. We stocked up on oil, eggs and I bought a bulk bag of flour last weekend. We were so excited about 75 cent packs of hotdogs the other day. HA! I do notice that I take the garden much more seriously now. This year I'm on the ball getting falll crops started! Will likly have enough cucumbers by this weekend to get some pickles done so gotta go get canning lids. I'm glad I planted so many.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

Do you have enough seeds? You save yours right?


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

I have loads of seeds, and yes, I always make sure to save some. I just harvest my kale seeds a couple weeks ago....a 1/4 lb of them! I can feed an army in kale and they are spouting up by themselves in the garden from dropped seeds hahaha. I will have to move them to a propper bed. I figure if we can survive now, we will survive anything  We are actually better off then we were 6 years ago when I was sick without insurance, didn't have a garden then and we survived off DH's lower paying job though we lost the house to it. We can survive, its those folks that don't know how to make do that likly will have a worse time of it.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

NickieL said:


> We buy the basics, DH gets enough now and then from repairing computers to go buy oil, eggs, and flour. Sometimes it gets a bit slim but if it wern't for him doing his best to go out and find computers to repair we would be in really bad shape., and the garden too, and the scrap copper we salvage from old computers and things. We are saving up our change to stock up for winter, when the garden is not producing so we will have enough then. I've never had to work so hard for so little but I think that is just a taste of the times ahead for everyone~ at least dh and I will be practiced at making do. I fear for those who aren't used to it becasue that will be a huge wake up call. I'll tell you what, I will celebrate with all the cheese in the world though when DH finially finds a job!



What is the name of your grocery stores in your area? do they double coupons up to .99.......I ask this because I get quite a few coupon's from various sources that might be of help to you.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

I tryed to send you a pm, But as you know i can't.
do you grow parsnips? I have a 12 oz jar of seeds. I could send you a start of them. They are bi-enial. Very easy to save seeds.

I am sure you all ready do free samples on the computer, right?


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

mythreesons said:


> What is the name of your grocery stores in your area? do they double coupons up to .99.......I ask this because I get quite a few coupon's from various sources that might be of help to you.


I buy some stuff (oil and the like) at aldies.

I buy eggs (I get 3 doz for 2 bucks) at the local farm.

Get meds as CVS. Other then that, we don't shop. We have a walmart and a strack n van till close buy but they cost a whole lot more then aldies here and the farms.


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

veggiecanner said:


> I tryed to send you a pm, But as you know i can't.
> do you grow parsnips? I have a 12 oz jar of seeds. I could send you a start of them. They are bi-enial. Very easy to save seeds.
> 
> I am sure you all ready do free samples on the computer, right?


Thanks, I have parsnip seeds. Over the years I've gained quite a collection of seeds and I renew them quite often by seed saving so they stay viable. I am very glad that I tought myself before this how to raise a productive and healthy garden with no imput of bought fertilzers or chemicals to control weeds and pests. That knowledge comes in handy so my garden really costs nothing except in water (this year, usually never have to water but this year is diffrent). We know how to find free meterials for building soil and how to recycle nutrients back into the soil.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

NickieL said:


> Least you can afford food. After I get done paying rent, health care, meds, and gas for the car to get to work...lets just say I am blessed to have my garden. I laugh to myself when people say they go out to the fast food place for a cheap $5 meal. All I can think is that $5 can go to some eggs, ramen noodles, peanut butter and a little bit of bread and feed us for way more then just one meal. Eating out is a long and distant memory for us. And i miss cheese. Hahahaha. The food I miss the most right now? Is dairy stuff which of course I can't grow in my garden. I feel very blessed to have my garden, and I have done more this year to keep it healthy and well weeded because we do have to depend on it. Today's meal was almost exclusive from the garden (as are most meals these days) Fried taters with peppers, and a cucumber salad. The oil to fry them and the cucumber dressing (oil and viniger) were the only things not home grown.


Can you keep chickens where you are? How about making your own bread? Can you keep goats? The chickens will provide meat and eggs. Goats will provide meat, milk and cheese.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

Our town just pasted an ordinance so we can have a few chickens. But they cost dearly. Not to mention what it would cost for feed and housing.
Dh thinks he knows some one who will give us a couple of older laying hens.
Not to old, i hope, we will feed them on scraps, and bugs. Then this fall they will go in the soup pot.


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## shelljo (Feb 1, 2005)

rancher1913 said:


> So true. I work in an ER. Folks on medicaid will come to the ER because it's a $3 co-pay. The clinic is $15. You would not believe the things people term 'an emergency'.
> 
> 
> Moldy


And when I went to the ER, thinking I was having a heart attack...my insurance paid exactly nothing. Told my assistant that next time, I'm just gonna die in my office, cause the insurance wasn't helpful at all...

(And, what I thought was my heart was actually acid reflux.)


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I belive the Goverment is giveing so many Foodstamps away because people are more Quiet with full bellies. A false sence of security.
I'm disgusted that local goverments are cutting wages for people that WORK. Cut benifets to loosers, not people that are doing the right thing.


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## Guest (Jul 11, 2012)

7thswan said:


> I belive the Goverment is giveing so many Foodstamps away because people are more Quiet with full bellies. A false sence of security.
> I'm disgusted that local goverments are cutting wages for people that WORK. Cut benifets to loosers, not people that are doing the right thing.


That's true, i don't think they want to deal with the riots yet.

It's getting bad enough people even have a problem with you having food , even if you earn your own money to buy it.


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## cnichols (Jan 5, 2010)

Well, the OP makes me wonder. I recall a while back reading a story on SHTFplan.com about something happening around the September/October time frame. *IF* something is going down around that time (and it wouldn't surprise me if it did) that means we don't really have much time left.

Here's a Link to the story ... Watching the Clock: Will a Total Economic Collapse Occur in September-October?

If, according to the OP, Illinois is indeed getting ready to cut welfare, medical, etc. be prepared for an uprising. 

I don't think that this is only going to be limited to Illinois, however. I think these types of things are going to be happening country wide.

From the above linked story ...



> âThe frequency with which the world goes to hell in September seems hardly random.â Unfortunately the authors provide no explanation for this beyond observing, âAn interesting pattern emerges: banking crises tend to start in the second half of the year, with large September and December effects.â


If the pattern holds true and September is when things begin to collapse, I believe that it will take a month or so for it to totally sink in with most folks. All I can say is ... do what you can *now* before it's too late!


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## rags57078 (Jun 11, 2011)

NickieL contact your local sheriff dept and see if you can get put on a deer road kill list . I did that a long time ago and ended up with several deer , just make sure they are fresh kills


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## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

Sawmill Jim said:


> What would it cost for a few well placed nukes :run:


and we've already paid for them, might as well get our moneysworth out of them. :thumb:


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## Explorer (Dec 2, 2003)

mnn2501 said:


> and we've already paid for them, might as well get our moneysworth out of them. :thumb:


Plus it cost about $50,00 a year to maintain each bomb.


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## Deacon Mike (May 23, 2007)

Sonshine said:


> And this is one of the reasons that healthcare costs are so high. Those who pay pay more to cover those who don't pay.


Nice to know that your in favor of the individual mandate


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## Guest (Jul 12, 2012)

Deacon Mike said:


> Nice to know that your in favor of the individual mandate


Your assuming that insurance is the only way to pay for health care.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

this thread is not for arguing the "healthcare bill" it's for hard times coming and working to get through them.


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

Sonshine said:


> Can you keep chickens where you are? How about making your own bread? Can you keep goats? The chickens will provide meat and eggs. Goats will provide meat, milk and cheese.


lol even though this town allows 6 chickens, and I did have 4 for a while, the particular neighborhood I am in had issue with it and told me I had to get rid of them or else be fined...this was after a year of having them!

I do make my own bread though. I make everythign from scratch.


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## Win07_351 (Dec 7, 2008)

In CT. when things get bad, they just raise taxes and the public complains, then they go to the polls and re-elect democrats. Go figure.


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

NickieL said:


> lol even though this town allows 6 chickens, and I did have 4 for a while, the particular neighborhood I am in had issue with it and told me I had to get rid of them or else be fined...this was after a year of having them!
> 
> I do make my own bread though. I make everythign from scratch.



If its not illegal, how could they make you get rid of them or fine you?


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

terri9630 said:


> If its not illegal, how could they make you get rid of them or fine you?


HOA, thats how. They say you can have pets. So they were pets. But they claimed they were not 'domesticated' animals:bored: and the hoa only wants 'domesticated' animals like cats and dogs. But, its probebly a good thing anyway, the cost of thier feed would be too much for us now and they went to a very nice family who are organic and have a nice little farm.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

my post was lost in never never land....i guess...

Rabbits are super quiet pets and can be litter box trained! Great fertilizer too! Effecient producers of lean meat...

I've made about $1200 since oct'11 doing swagbucks, and the others in my sig line....3 hrs a day playing online...getting paid for looking at ads taking surveys etc.....its mindless but its been a lifesaver with food, clothing, college textbooks...an extra $150 a month is a great help for us.


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

NickieL said:


> HOA, thats how. They say you can have pets. So they were pets. But they claimed they were not 'domesticated' animals:bored: and the hoa only wants 'domesticated' animals like cats and dogs. But, its probebly a good thing anyway, the cost of thier feed would be too much for us now and they went to a very nice family who are organic and have a nice little farm.



Ah. I refuse to even look at a house with a HOA.


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## edcopp (Oct 9, 2004)

Welshmom said:


> Libraries are free. And I think they must stay that way.


A part of my Real Estate taxes support the library. I usually pay in cash. So the library is free to the user, and that's fine; but somebody is paying for it.


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## Mutti (Sep 7, 2002)

Actually glad to live in a state that requires a balanced budget. Yes, the cuts have been deep and will probably get worse but won't be declairing bankrupcy. People with less to spend contribute less to local/state taxes so everyone ends up pulling in their belts. But that's as should be. If you don't got it don't go shopping. Do instead of buy. Shop at home first.Buy what you need....want what you have.


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## shannsmom (Jul 28, 2009)

I told DH that we have had so much practice being poor, we're good at it! Makes it easier to deal with the coming times in my opinion. Some people will have a very hard time. 

My big question when I saw the news story on the pay cuts in Scranton is: how long before firefighters and police officers decide that risking death is not worth it when you don't even get paid enough to feed your family? And how much did the politician's pay get cut?


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

I know this may sound strange but my happiest tims in life have been when I had to make do with less. There is something about the challenge of being thrifty and resourceful that keeps my mind and body occupied. I spend more time (and love) planning menus etc. I LOVE to bargain hunt and take pride in finding nice stuff for cheap. I very often get compliments on things we have, I will proudly tell people that I got it at a thrift store or on clearance. Often they are amazed.

When I have less to work with life seems to be less complicated???? Simple things become so much more fun. Popcorn and disney movies from my thrift store VHS collection. Going on a picnic to a park so the kids can have a new place to play. Simple pleasures come easier.

Life just seems to slow down in a really peaceful way. Maybe I just thrive on chaos, I dunno? When times are good I seem to stress more easily and get preoccupied with meaningless things. I seem to forget about the simple joys.

Weird, huh?


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## Guest (Jul 12, 2012)

I do a little e-bay work. Pick a few items from where ever I can find them and sell them. The fees are high on e-bay, But I make sure my over head is low. so i make a little profit each time. 
Helps buy things for the garden and socks.
I thought abought going back to work, but not much sense in even looking for out side work. i do more good for our family growing food.


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## tarheelbilly (Jun 10, 2011)

After a lot of deliberation, I have decided to go back to work to pay off my student loans. DH is retiring from the military next year and we're moving to his family's farm. In the meantime, we've converted most of the backyard to a garden, can and dehydrate a good deal of it, and shop sporadically. I've had to sell the milk cow to cover the cost of hay for the milk goats, and we're planning to hunt more often this fall to fill the freezer with meat. There are 4 houses sitting empty around us, and everyone around here seems to be growing food and just trying to get by. I see the writing on the wall and I'm concerned. I am glad to see that people see things are going south, too. I pray for us all.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

I read a similar article to what the OP said. 

The gist of it seems to be that the sudden budget cuts and tax increases at the first of the year will cause a second recession, possibly because they are so sudden? At any rate, Warren Buffet, Erkine Bowles, and former Senator Simpson are agreed that if the two parties would stop bickering long enough to address the situation that a second recession would be averted. But, they don't think they will.

Erskine Bowles: 'We Are Going Over the Fiscal Cliff' - Yahoo! News


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

This thread has inspired me.

Kansas does not double crop well, not even in the vegetable garden. But, greens are possible, and once the electric company gets out of my back yard (In a week? everything is done except replacing the fence) there MIGHT be time to bring off some short season bush beans. The summer has been so hot that I believe it will not freeze before our usual October frost. 

The game plan is to raise cabbage greens in 3 empty flower pots on the deck, and as soon as the fence is back up I will plant all of my bush bean seeds. The cabbage greens will be harvested cut and come again to stretch the store bought lettuce, and I should get at least 2 pickings of green beans out of the bush beans before winter shuts them down. 

The above will reduce the grocery bill, and the money applied to our debts. And, yes, we do have debts because we had to do some expensive house repairs. And, both of the windshields are cracked on our cars, and I intend to get that taken care of as well. 

DH's office reduced a year ago by folks leaving and not being replaced, by changing the insurance, and by not giving raises until further notice. I can only hope that if there are layoffs again that he will not be affected, but during a recession there are no guarentees. By putting up a lot of beans now we will need less grocery money next winter, and money always gives more security.

I am off to plant those pots on the deck!


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

We had to do in the loose 2 momma bunnies and the dad tonight...one was in the garden eating our broc. so...DD16 is butchering #2 right now and hopefully DH will find the brown dad that was shot but ran under an outbuilding...
The 9-10 baby buns are about 6 weeks now so they should be fine...we hope to live trap them ASAP
DD11 was a cry baby.....this is not her first go round either....its really all she knows about where meat comes from (we hunt and farm 99% of our meat) but I reminded her that it was ok to cry but there was work to be done and the bunny would taste good in a few days.....I have to be a little gruff now and then with all of them about sucking it up as times get tougher....I can't afford for them to not be on board...or have a rabbit chew up my nearly mature garden...Honestly I'm looking forward to some truly free range rabbit meat.


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

Some people have had a sudden, catastrophic event like job loss or crop failure. Others have seen their wages stagnate while the rising cost of living slowly but surely moves them down the ladder toward poverty. Still other people weren't doing that well BEFORE the recession and now the vice is squeezed tighter. If you put together all those categories, it encompasses a LOT of people. And I think the trend will only continue. There is no recovery like we have had in the past. There isn't enough steam left to even build up a new bubble somewhere. If the economy doesn't re-invent itself around small and micro-business instead of corporate giants, and the goobermint doesn't get itself together and cut spending, well, there just isn't a happy thought in there anywhere. 

We had planned for years to build a new house on this property. We can't seem to get enough saved up to build what we want and it is getting more and more scary to think about having a mortgage again. But at least we have land, livestock, an old, small but very livable house and hardly any debt. I can still be grateful for that.


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

My youngest dd is 41 and works but has always leaned on welfare for food stamps, medical and heating. I've told her over and over again that the gravy train is going to end and she should be prepared. She was complaining about not having free dental. I pointed out to her that we raised 3 kids and paid for all their dental, eye glasses, and medical ourselves. We had medical insurance but as has been pointed out by others that doesn't cover everything. 

I agree that those of us who have learned to be frugal, thrifty, tightwads will fair much better thru the hard times than those who have never had to do without. 

Lately I've been thinking about the Depression. What isn't talked about as much is the drought that accompanied it or the extreme heat that killed hundreds or the dust storms. We haven't had any appreciable moisture in over a year. Our soil is turning into powder. We're fortunate in that we always chop all our leaves and store them over winter to use as mulch on the garden. Its so dry the leaves are not breaking down but are protecting the soil from the wind and preserving the little bit of moisture. If we do not get rain before the winds pick up this fall, we will be seeing dust storms. 

The corn and soybean harvests are looking questionable which will result in increased food prices and possibly shortages. Also, if there is no corn for the ethonol gas prices will go up.


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## edjewcollins (Jun 20, 2003)

Welshmom said:


> Libraries are free. And I think they must stay that way.


Not free, tax supported and many municipalities are closing them if special millages are not voted in to support them.

Ed


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## NickieL (Jun 15, 2007)

The Library here requires a cash "donation" yearly from those who are members.


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