# What Trees Are You Planting For Firewood?



## 45n5

Just curious if anyone else is planting trees to one day be used as firewood?

I know there is a bunch of stuff on the internet about growing trees for firewood,I don't want to hear about theory (unless it's really good :thumb: ), but *would love to hear if anyone is actually putting things in the ground or planting seeds right now for firewood in the future?*

I've taken about 100 black locust cuttings, put them in a pot just 2 weeks ago and they are already getting small roots on them. I will keep them protected from wind all winter and plant them out in the spring.

I'm thinking of doing another hundred since these were so easy. 

I think the black locust can also double as fence posts/building material so they are dual purpose for me.

I also have a couple pounds of sweet chestnut in the fridge crisper stratifying for the spring planting.

I'm new to growing my own firewood so I'd love to know what you are planting now or soon.


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## 45n5

i forgot to mention I'm also cutting up hedgeapples and planting them to grow osage orange

also, if this is the wrong area for this i apologize, let me know, i wasn't sure if it should go in energy, plant propogation, or general homesteading


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## norcalfarm

I tried starting eucalyptus from seed this spring to use for firewood in the future but failed miserably. There are many groves of eucalyptus here that are cut at the base when harvested. A year later they are six or eight feet tall again. This year I'm going in search of cheap eucalyptus starts and also looking at osage orange. Good luck. 

Jason


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## Ross

Awesome topic for the forum!  We havn't planted anything but we do try to cut out trees and shrubs to let the younger ones grow better, and protect them from the animals. Every little bit helps.


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## TnAndy

Personally, I've spent 30 years trying to beat the woods back, but they are growing faster than I can keep up with. Only thing I've ever planted is white pine for some screening, and fruit trees for their fruit.

My understanding is one can cut a cord a year off an acre of timber ( here, anyway, where we have decent rainfall ) forever. I have about 65ac of timber, and I'm loosing the fight.


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## Micheal

Humm, interesting..... I've never thought about planting for future firewood; in my case I just let the forest do it on it's own. Ma-nature has always supplied me with enough trees for firewood that I can let the better ones grow for timber.

Although I have been known to toss/throw black walnuts most everywhere on the acreage. Figure that if'n the GGkids (both are now 1 yr old) are lucky enough to own this place, well after I'm gone, mature black walnut trees would give them some decent retirement money.....


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## stanb999

45n5 said:


> Just curious if anyone else is planting trees to one day be used as firewood?
> 
> I know there is a bunch of stuff on the internet about growing trees for firewood,I don't want to hear about theory (unless it's really good :thumb: ), but *would love to hear if anyone is actually putting things in the ground or planting seeds right now for firewood in the future?*
> 
> I've taken about 100 black locust cuttings, put them in a pot just 2 weeks ago and they are already getting small roots on them. I will keep them protected from wind all winter and plant them out in the spring.
> 
> I'm thinking of doing another hundred since these were so easy.
> 
> I think the black locust can also double as fence posts/building material so they are dual purpose for me.
> 
> I also have a couple pounds of sweet chestnut in the fridge crisper stratifying for the spring planting.
> 
> I'm new to growing my own firewood so I'd love to know what you are planting now or soon.


I tried those hybrid popular... the few that took were eaten by the deer or debarked by rabbits over the winter. I did 400 and not a one survived 2 winters. But YMMV.

Your doing good with those black locust. Watch them tho. In some areas they get attacked by bark beetles when they are more than 6" around 8-10 years old. So what you wanna do is cut them then. They will be nice poles and grow in short order. The other benefit is most if not all will just sprout back and grow even faster the next time. Like this you will get tons of firewood fast. The key is planting enough so you can harvest every 7 years or so on a rotating basis.

With good water they will grow 3-4' a year even with deer eating them a bit at first. Then the second growth (with the root) they do 6-7' a year. Really amazing.


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## texican

Imho, if you have to cut a single live tree on your place, for firewood, you've massively failed.

If you live in a tree growing region (and last time I was in Kentuck, it had a lot of trees), somebody somewhere has logged their land recently.... or a storms' come through... and theirs lots of dead timber for the asking.

We're in a mega drought right now, and millions of tons of timber is standing dead. I alone have probably 20 cords of dead oak within a hundred yards of the house.

Ask around... wood is usually to be had for free... Lived closer, I could show you some of my dead oaks that'd fill up a good sized trailer.


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## boiledfrog

Here in sagebrush country we have no trees and less rain. I've planted poplar and pine. I've tried transplanting locust, but they keep dying on me. I might have to learn to grow them from cuttings. I hope to get a wide variety of trees rather than a single crop. Maybe even try coppicing.


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## 45n5

@boiled frog, to propogate black locust i just take a branch and break it off the tree

if I see some green in it I know it's alive

i break it up into 8 inch pieces, scrape up the bottom a little with a knife a couple of inches and stick it in soil

so far that's it, no rooting hormone, nothing, it's amazing to me really, they get little white hair like roots in just 2 weeks



> Imho, if you have to cut a single live tree on your place, for firewood, you've massively failed.
> 
> If you live in a tree growing region (and last time I was in Kentuck, it had a lot of trees), somebody somewhere has logged their land recently.... or a storms' come through... and theirs lots of dead timber for the asking.


failed at what? isn't this a homesteading/self sufficiency type of forum?

I'm trying to be self sufficient in heating fuel, i think growing my own firewood is a win. I live on 6 acres of an old hayfield, I don't have a single tree live or dead to cut up.

I don't want to depend on other people's trees to heat my family in the winter.


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## texican

45n5 said:


> @boiled frog, to propogate black locust i just take a branch and break it off the tree
> 
> if I see some green in it I know it's alive
> 
> i break it up into 8 inch pieces, scrape up the bottom a little with a knife a couple of inches and stick it in soil
> 
> so far that's it, no rooting hormone, nothing, it's amazing to me really, they get little white hair like roots in just 2 weeks
> 
> 
> 
> failed at what? isn't this a homesteading/self sufficiency type of forum?
> 
> I'm trying to be self sufficient in heating fuel, i think growing my own firewood is a win. I live on 6 acres of an old hayfield, I don't have a single tree live or dead to cut up.
> 
> I don't want to depend on other people's trees to heat my family in the winter.


I'm thinking most folks on this forum don't own hundreds of acres, and can 'afford' to plant enough acreage to plant 'fire wood' trees, and wait a minimum of 15 years, more likely 25 years, to get decent sized timber to cut into little firewood chunks.

If you have the luxury of waiting a couple decades for firewood timber to grow, my hat's off to you. Like TnAndy said, you can roughly get a cord of wood off an acre of mature timbered forest... and he 'can't' keep up with the dead and dying. I have a 170 acres, and I'd say 1/2 of it has old forest, and another 1/4 has 24 year old plantation wood. IF I chose to burn wood, I could never utilize all the dead wood that happens each year.

IF you could get your wood for Free! why in the world would you ever want to cut your Own?

Homesteading isn't solely about being self sufficient (Everyone here is connected to the outside world [we're communicating via internet, so there you go}), but also about being smart, ambitious, far-sighted, with a feel for the barter/trade/salvage and scrounge.

If I offered you ten cords of firewood for free, would you say No??? I've got my own, thank you very much? Hmmmm.... think about it. {Unless you have dead timber that needs harvesting/utilizing, imho, it's best to let your 'firewood bank account' grow another year's worth 'interest'} I never use my own resources if offered someone else's, especially if it's free for the taking. I could have went to town and bought trailerloads of metal roofing (if I'd wanted to part with a sackful of hundred dollar bills) but I thought it was wiser to simply ask the guy down the road what he was going to do with all the metal roofing he was throwing away on his new barn project.


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## ChristieAcres

We aren't relying on others for our firewood, but never miss a chance to get it FREE. That is one year we don't have to cut any of ours. The only trees we are planting are fruit varieties, at the moment. We have Maple, Alder, Fir, and Cedar on our property. Yes, it all plants itself here and trees grow rapidly in our climate!


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## Durandal

Grow trees FOR firewood? We only ever need to use what we thin out, comes down in the storm, or scrap from the saw mill. Lately, if dried well, the silver maple and cotton wood has been doing quite well even if it burns fast...it grows fast too and every flood gives us a nice harvest from up stream.


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## swampyoaks

I've planted Hybrid poplar and had limited success. The ones planted in the wetter areas have done well and the ones in the dry areas poorly. I assumed that because the Balsam poplar reseeds itself quite well in the dry sandy areas that the Hybrid transplants would do fine in the same areas, but it doesn't work as I thought. The Green Ash coppices well but the Ash borers kill them before they get to harvest size. Red Maples also coppice well. The Norway pines have done excellent and burn quite well if dried a couple years. They grow fast in our sandy soil. Of course the squirrels seem to have a better handle on growing trees than I do as the various Oaks they are planting are doing very well but of course slower growing.


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## Ross

We've got about 20 acres of tress and fence rows. If I tried to heat off of dead fall I'd freeze by the second winter. I really can't see why planting trees is a bad idea. Planning for future generations is prudent if nothing else, at least my kids will appreciate it.


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## Habitant

They used to say that a house could be kept warm perpetually from a well managed 10 acre bush. Thanks to better insulation and more efficient wood burners maybe you need less now. If you have your own bush already, I think you are better off cutting the dead and the unacceptable growing stock i.e. low quality species like Manitoba Maple, willow, poplars and poor specimens of good species this will increase the quality of your bush over time by getting rid of lower value trees while making room for better stuff and it will keep your house warm. A pound of wood has the same # of BTUs no matter what species, some take up more volumn (i.e. less dense) than others .

If you dont have a nice hard wood bush then I believe the best way to get one is to plant a conifer plantation and thin it every 25 years or so. The thinning will keep your house warm and make room for hardwood seedling brought in by birds, squirrels and wind. Sounds nice on paper but will YOU be living there in 25 years ? In my neck of the woods there are lots of unthined conifer plantations that badly need it but new owners would nt dream of cutting a tree down . They want to save the planet. " We need more trees not less!" as they warm their toes by the Natural Gas simulated wood fire.


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## MichaelK!

What Texican means is that you should be putting more effort into finding already dead wood that would otherwise rot on the ground without being used. Much better than killing a still living tree.

I too have not cut down a single live tree for wood yet. All my wood is from storm kills that got knocked over in the winter.

However, planting trees is always a long term path to success. In truth, you might never cut down trees that you yourself planted, but your children might.

I personally think that Black Locust is a very good choice, and I selected that species myself for my own land. The deer however like Black Locust even more than I do and stripped each and every tree right to the ground, killing every single one. Oh well, my homestead is still a work in progress.


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## Sonshine

We have a lot of pecan groves around us and during storms there's always a lot that come down. So we usually get it free just for getting it. We also have some pecan and oak trees on our own land. We use pine when we cook outdoors and the pecan inside.


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## sevenmmm

swampyoaks said:


> I've planted Hybrid poplar and had limited success. The ones planted in the wetter areas have done well and the ones in the dry areas poorly. I assumed that because the Balsam poplar reseeds itself quite well in the dry sandy areas that the Hybrid transplants would do fine in the same areas, but it doesn't work as I thought. The Green Ash coppices well but the Ash borers kill them before they get to harvest size. Red Maples also coppice well. The Norway pines have done excellent and burn quite well if dried a couple years. They grow fast in our sandy soil. Of course the squirrels seem to have a better handle on growing trees than I do as the various Oaks they are planting are doing very well but of course slower growing.


I think you should explain that coppicing idea! Otherwise, I have white & black ash and soft maples more than could ever be used. The stand of poplars tend to spring up around the stand and I think they are all part of the same root system. They coppice very well too.

I have planted a few swamp white oak saplings and acorns. One particular from an acorn is growing and has taken 10 years to rise up 6 feet. But hopefully these trees aren't used for firewood for another 700 years...


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## swampyoaks

Coppicing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coppicing

Google coppice and there's many hits.


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## ChristieAcres

Coppiced Lg Leaf Maple w/3 of our 5 children (DH's bio, and my bio DS & DD). DH's DS is far right, 6'2". This was taken three years ago. Hardwoods coppiced are typically best suited for firewood. We have multiple 2nd growth coppiced tree due to the logging done many years ago here.









Same tree, looking up...









Coppiced Pear, growing at my best friend's place. In Permaculture, many are adopting this method to increase fruit! This one hasn't been pruned, yet.


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## 45n5

cool pictures lorichristie

coppicing is really cool, black locust does this well and i didn't mention but that is one of the reasons i chose it, the sweet chestnut is recommended for coppice also and provides good nuts

i read the trees grow back even quicker after they are cut to the ground because they already have a huge root system

i also heard of "short rotation coppice" if anyone needs a term to look up


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## norcalfarm

Can locust trees be coppiced? Anybody have a list of trees that this applies with? Wikipedia had a few but I'm sure there are more.

Thanks, Jason


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## ChristieAcres

There are plenty of resources out there on coppicing. I plan on doing more research myself. Lots of info online, inluding youtube videos.

The picture of the Coppiced Pear, above? That is only 3 years old and bore fruit! That is an example of the rapid growth. In Permaculture, it is common to Coppice fruit trees.


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## allisonhome

Awesome pics! I haven't planted anything yet. I'm cultivating


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## 45n5

norcalfarm said:


> Can locust trees be coppiced? Anybody have a list of trees that this applies with? Wikipedia had a few but I'm sure there are more.
> 
> Thanks, Jason


i searched google but i can't find a list anywhere of trees that coppice

i can find a few names on one site, then a few names on another, site and on and on

but i can't find any page that has a list of all trees that coppice, anyone else have any luck?


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## francismilker

norcalfarm said:


> Can locust trees be coppiced? Anybody have a list of trees that this applies with? Wikipedia had a few but I'm sure there are more.
> 
> Thanks, Jason


I would guarantee they can be coppiced. In my area you can try all you want to kill them and it can't be done. No matter what type of stump killer you use on them after cutting or burning you do, they keep sending up sapplings from the stump and/or roots.


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## francismilker

Off topic here.........................How long does Osage Orange/ Bois d'arc/ hedge have to season before it's good for firewood? I'd figure that stuff is a real pain to split with a maul by the way. I've got lots of it but have never intentionally burned it for firewood. (always been afraid of it's high btu output and afraid of burning the house down due to chimney fire.)


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## AverageJo

Another question as I just saw this thread....
Are the Locust trees y'all are talking about those nasty trees with the thorns all over them that can puncture tractor tires?? They grow like weeds along here and we do our darndest to get rid of them!! Now the Osage Orange/Hedge are wonderful shade for the cows. The cows even eat the hedge apples. If you get straight limbs, they make great fence posts and last forever, although it's hard to get staples or fencing in them. I've heard the best time to get fencing attached is when it's green cut as it gets harder and harder as it dries.

Personally, my daughter has been gathering acorns that fell under the HUGE oak trees in the parks as she loves them. We have some growing.... slowly.... Perhaps her grandchildren will like them some day.... 

We're like most here... We have so much deadfall that we keep a good stock of firewood. We're about to start asking for others to clean out our fence lines for us. Some have even offered to help on the farm for the wood they cut! Talk about a win-win... WIN!


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## InvalidID

Hey Lorie, that looks like my back yard! Same trees and all. I'm told those big leaves can be tapped for syrup BTW.

As to the OP. Here in the PNW we don't really need to plant trees for firewood they just kinda take over. I do thin out the coppiced maples after they've had a little time to recover. I try to pick the pieces I think will grow best and still share light. 

Those maples grow fast and are my favorite firewood as they lose big branches every year when the wind and rain start up.


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## Mossyoak

I like the idea of planting trees for use one day. Even if it takes many years for its use it brings shade,wildlife, and trees just look good on your own property. I always go to our local sutherlands at the end of the year and but there discounted trees.5 foot oaks for $8. I buy as many as I can and plant them.


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## Harmless Drudge

texican said:


> I'm thinking most folks on this forum don't own hundreds of acres, and can 'afford' to plant enough acreage to plant 'fire wood' trees, and wait a minimum of 15 years, more likely 25 years, to get decent sized timber to cut into little firewood chunks.
> 
> If you have the luxury of waiting a couple decades for firewood timber to grow, my hat's off to you. Like TnAndy said, you can roughly get a cord of wood off an acre of mature timbered forest... and he 'can't' keep up with the dead and dying. I have a 170 acres, and I'd say 1/2 of it has old forest, and another 1/4 has 24 year old plantation wood. IF I chose to burn wood, I could never utilize all the dead wood that happens each year.
> 
> IF you could get your wood for Free! why in the world would you ever want to cut your Own?
> 
> Homesteading isn't solely about being self sufficient (Everyone here is connected to the outside world [we're communicating via internet, so there you go}), but also about being smart, ambitious, far-sighted, with a feel for the barter/trade/salvage and scrounge.
> 
> If I offered you ten cords of firewood for free, would you say No??? I've got my own, thank you very much? Hmmmm.... think about it. {Unless you have dead timber that needs harvesting/utilizing, imho, it's best to let your 'firewood bank account' grow another year's worth 'interest'} I never use my own resources if offered someone else's, especially if it's free for the taking. I could have went to town and bought trailerloads of metal roofing (if I'd wanted to part with a sackful of hundred dollar bills) but I thought it was wiser to simply ask the guy down the road what he was going to do with all the metal roofing he was throwing away on his new barn project.


This is excellent advice, not necessarily only as an alternative to "growing" your own, but to buy time as your own matures through pole wood size.

I have 15 acres and it's all oak-hickory forest. I can barely keep up with the trees that need to come down because they imperil the house (only two left and I'm good), or they have hangers, or they are shading a garden, etc. Still, I take firewood where I can get it. My motive has less to do with the fuel resource, though, than it does with soil nutrients and acid neutralization.

I live on a rock, and the oak trees make what little soil there is very acidic. If I can neutralize the acid and nutrify the soil with ashes that result from burning wood I secured from another source for free, that's just free soil for me. And I need all I can get.

To the OP: while locust trees are good, they don't burn with the same BTU/cord as some of the other hardwoods. Oak, maple, and hickory contain far more energy per cord than locust. They also tend to grow straighter (assuming sufficient competition) and can be used for timber as well. The highest BTU/cord is apple, though typically you would be limited to the few worthwhile prunings you might have from your orchard in any given year. If you spur prune or pollard your trees, this is even less likely to be a good source.


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## Harmless Drudge

45n5 said:


> cool pictures lorichristie
> 
> coppicing is really cool, black locust does this well and i didn't mention but that is one of the reasons i chose it, the sweet chestnut is recommended for coppice also and provides good nuts
> 
> i read the trees grow back even quicker after they are cut to the ground because they already have a huge root system
> 
> i also heard of "short rotation coppice" if anyone needs a term to look up


If you cut in late fall / early winter you will get the best return vigour because the sugars are still in the roots, and so remain, after the trunk is cut, to feed the new growth. Coppices are excellent for pole wood, if you manage them correctly, and for firewood if nothing else.

The downside to coppicing is that it exacts a toll on the soil. If you are in the habit of returning the nutrients from the wood ash to the soil to nutrify and neutralize acid accumulation, this helps a lot.


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## swampyoaks

_"while locust trees are good, they don't burn with the same BTU/cord as some of the other hardwoods. Oak, maple, and hickory contain far more energy per cord than locust."
_

According to this study Black and Honey Locust are near the top in BTU's.
http://worldforestindustries.com/forest-biofuel/firewood/firewood-btu-ratings/


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## reubenT

on my place (80 acres) if I don't cut lots of live trees I will not be able to plant anything to eat. Been selling trees by the truckload for 25 years, saw logs, pulpwood, trying to get some land cleared and make an income at the same time. Finally getting a track machine working to help me do the job. Trees plant themselves and if I leave a clearing unmowed for more than one year the saplings get too big to mow.
The black locust is one of the faster growing hardwoods here, and the hardest. about equal in BTU to hickory. Amazing how dense it is for it's speed of growth. And if I didn't already have way more than I need, now many hundreds of acres around us is getting logged, endless tree tops for firewood.


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## Qhorseman

I selectively cut each year. The oaks will re-seed themselves.


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## dizzy

I know this is an old thread, but I was wondering if anyone has tried coppicing, and if you've had any luck w/it?


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## John_Canada

Micheal said:


> Humm, interesting..... I've never thought about planting for future firewood; in my case I just let the forest do it on it's own. Ma-nature has always supplied me with enough trees for firewood that I can let the better ones grow for timber.
> 
> Although I have been known to toss/throw black walnuts most everywhere on the acreage. Figure that if'n the GGkids (both are now 1 yr old) are lucky enough to own this place, well after I'm gone, mature black walnut trees would give them some decent retirement money.....


My granddad always said if I wanted to retire rich, buy 20 acres and plant them with black walnut and in 20 years sell the wood!

In our area, poplar is a super fast growing tree. Maples seed just about anywhere (especially in mulch!) and last the winters no prob). I may try Empress (Paulownia) trees later but you have to be really careful not to get the weed type. The wood is SUPER valuable, light and salable to Japanese. Not firewood tho. Also apple wood is pretty easily available. Ash just dies with ashbore beetle. Pines are everywhere but no use as firewood.


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