# fear of poop



## cathleenc (Aug 16, 2007)

well, fear is an overstatement but the liquidy nature of cow poo keeps scaring me away from having a family cow. We have goats, sheep, chickens, ducks, turkeys, geese, rabbits, cats, dogs, little boys.... lots of poop all over the place. So why does cow poo seem twelve times more intense? It's just so liquidy and HUGE.... or so it seems to me from a distance.

So - will I always feel this way? Is it really much more poop-intensive to care for one cow? Is a family cow really going to be poop-encrusted and need a bath every time we milk? Is the barn going to be wet and soggy and full of ammonia?

I know my statements are all overblown but well, that's what fears and trepidations are like sometimes. Help me find reality, please!

thank you
Cathy


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## commonsense (Jun 1, 2008)

Do you have pasture space for a cow, or will the cow have to manage in a barnyard/mudlot? I don't have "poopy" cows, but they have a two-acre pasture to themselves and they keep very clean. 

I have an indoor shelter for them as well, and as long as I clean it regularly, they don't make much of a mess of themselves in there either. 

Maybe consider getting a smaller breed of cow, like a jersey, so the "pies" are smaller? 

I know what you mean though, I'm still a little amazed sometimes by the messiness of cow pies. I'm more accustomed to horse/goat/chicken messes.


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## tailwagging (Jan 6, 2005)

This is a picture of my mini-zebu bull's poop. I thought at first something was wrong but I found out later that this breed seem to have poops likes these. My cow's is wetter but still not a flop and I wet her feed to get more water in her since I milk her. Our larger bull's is like the cow's but a little dryer and well, larger. The calf's is like goat berries. I like the dryer poop =)


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

A normal, runny-like poop means a cow's getting lots of protein.

Poop like tailwag posted, means the animals not getting much protein.


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

A cow is actually clean just so long as she has a grassy pasture and/or has fresh straw to lie down in her stall. The only time she'll get poop on the hide is if she's in a muddy area all the time, which is never good for any animal, or if she's sick and scouring.


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## Tiffin (Feb 23, 2006)

That picture is like what my goats did, not cows. Perhaps because it is a mini. I have Dexters and they have the true cow pie stuff: green, rounded, size depends on the animal size. This type is actually easier to deal with which I only do in the barn with a barn cleaner. If they become loose then it is a green splatter which is quite messy and the cow will show this on their backside until this subsides for such reasons as too wet grass in the morning, frost, introducing something new. If they stay outdoors in the pastures and barnyard then it's fertilizer; go for it.
I have to add though that keeping animals of any type is dealing with poop, whether it be dogs, cats, birds, pigs, cows, horses, doesn't matter it's what to do with the poop. lol


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## farmergirl (Aug 2, 2005)

I have been dealing with horse poop for over 20 years now, but I will admit that some poop is more yucky than others. Cow poop is liquidy and hard to get off your boots if you happen to step in it. The other thing is that because it is more liquidy, if you step in it just right you might end up sliding and falling down :cow: If you are not going to be keeping the cow indoors all the time, the poop factor shouldn't be too bad. The only time I have to clean up cow poop is if I stall one of the cows for some reason and then I just wait for the poop to dry out some I can pick it up with the poop fork. Really, poop is a GOOD thing. It is a way for us to capture nutrients and return them to the soil through composting. Just this morning I scooped up llama poop to put around my roses for fertilizer 

Don't fear the poop; embrace the poop.


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## tailwagging (Jan 6, 2005)

Karin L said:


> A normal, runny-like poop means a cow's getting lots of protein.
> 
> Poop like tailwag posted, means the animals not getting much protein.


Really???
I was told that they are a dryer breed and didn't on their own drink a lot of water. My cattle get 16 % dairy feed, alfalfa cubes with calf manna along with their hay. I was told I was giving too much protein so was getting too much growth of hoofs by the cattle extension office rep and by the vet. They are beef cattle poeple so would that make a difference in what they would do?? But even then their poop has been like that.


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## cowkeeper (Feb 17, 2007)

Haha, don't get a Jersey if you want less poo, and less liquidy poo! They can outpoop a Holstein. When I had Jerseys I couldnt believe the sea of poop in (and all around) the gutter. I never had any luck tying up the tail either, so I used to get it smacked around my head regularly. (That's why we have 'barn clothes'). Jersey people have all kinds of strategies for dealing with it; ya gotta suffa if ya want lots of milk and cream (LOL) ck.


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## BDB (Feb 26, 2005)

I thought that was the best part of keepin cows. go out early in the morning to milk and get smacked up side the head with that poopie tail . thats wakes you up more than coffee kinda feel bad for the cows I see now at farms with there tails cut off


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## doodles (Sep 27, 2002)

I have several Jerseys,all of which I have trained to milk on their first freshening. They come in from the pasture and are milked in a 12x12 stall with rubber mats. They are just loosely clipped to a ring on the wall . No stanchions or other restrictions. 
I have never had one that pooped or peed inside after the first week of initial training. They are exceptionally clean and do not lay in poop or mud unless confined to a dirt lot. I never get messy when milking them. 
I can't imagine where these horror stories about Jerseys come from.....honest I am very serious about how wonderful they are. My youngest daughter just turned 9 in August and she handles them with no issues. She even leads them back to pasture up our driveway in the dark when we do night milkings. I find our 7 Jerseys exceptionally kind and tolerant especially with my children. 
Even our 4 yearold mini bull is super sweet and leads like a dog.( No bad bull stories please.. I was raised with many bulls and know the dangers)
Anyway,I totally recommend a Jersey to anyone who wants a cow that will squeeze their heart.


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

tailwagging said:


> Really???
> I was told that they are a dryer breed and didn't on their own drink a lot of water. My cattle get 16 % dairy feed, alfalfa cubes with calf manna along with their hay. I was told I was giving too much protein so was getting too much growth of hoofs by the cattle extension office rep and by the vet. They are beef cattle poeple so would that make a difference in what they would do?? But even then their poop has been like that.


Well I think my reference to that is associated with beef cattle. I dunno much about the poop differentiation between dexters and the mainstream beef cattle, but I do remember reading that somewhere a while ago, and seeing it made sense because when they're out on pasture with grass that obviously is rich in protein, their poop is less solid than if they were on poorer quality hay. But I'll have to look into that a little more...and maybe find the article where it says the difference between solidity in cowpies.


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## tailwagging (Jan 6, 2005)

Karin L said:


> Well I think my reference to that is associated with beef cattle. I dunno much about the poop differentiation between dexters and the mainstream beef cattle, but I do remember reading that somewhere a while ago, and seeing it made sense because when they're out on pasture with grass that obviously is rich in protein, their poop is less solid than if they were on poorer quality hay. But I'll have to look into that a little more...and maybe find the article where it says the difference between solidity in cowpies.


OH please if you could!
I was just trying to start a topic on what I should feed and lost it =( 
I want to feed my cattle what they need and though I have worked at dairys, I only milked,fed cavles and helped with vet care. I am a newbie to feeding cattle.

Not to argumentative! when cattle are on grass they are getting a lot more moisture then on hay.


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## cjb (May 2, 2006)

I agree re. the Jersey's - they're awesome. It took me a bit to get used to the copious poos when they let loose but my quickly learned to never poo or pee when in the milking stall. I don't even tie ours up - she just stands there and eats while I milk. 

We have chickens and they go out and tear up the cow pies to look for bugs. This helps in the breakdown process.


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## francismilker (Jan 12, 2006)

They are what they eat. Just like us! Their manure reflects their diet. Feed them hay only and it comes out dry. Feed them lots of high protein grain and they can shoot it through a key hole from six feet away!


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

On pasture the height of the poop is reflective as to the value of what they are consuming. A tall cow pat is indicative of lots of roughage and little nutrient. During the recent drought with the low quality of feed that I had the pats had lots of height. Today, with the lush growth the pats are almost non existent.


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## cowkeeper (Feb 17, 2007)

Ok, if we were talking about concrete, we would call it 'slump'. We need a word for cow plop height...


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## gone-a-milkin (Mar 4, 2007)

Actually I like 'slump' too. The only time I am scared of cow poop is when I am chasing cows in the dark and risking hitting a skimmed-over plop at high-speed. It is EXACTLY like stepping on a banana peel, treacherous.

Otherwise ~ rubberboots, barn clothes, and it washes off too.


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

tailwagging said:


> OH please if you could!
> I was just trying to start a topic on what I should feed and lost it =(
> I want to feed my cattle what they need and though I have worked at dairys, I only milked,fed cavles and helped with vet care. I am a newbie to feeding cattle.
> 
> Not to argumentative! when cattle are on grass they are getting a lot more moisture then on hay.


Well, here's a couple articles I found, though I don't think they're the ones I was looking for...although they should of use to you.

http://www.das.psu.edu/dairynutrition/documents/manure.pdf

http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1194&context=rangebeefcowsymp


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## steff bugielski (Nov 10, 2003)

We have one cow for the freezer. She is usually outside so poop is not a problem but it was so hot and humid here one night that I left the barn door open so the goats would not steam to death. Cow spent the night in with them. OMG! I have never seen so much poop in one place. Now I have had 20 horses, 20 goats 100 chickens and nothing compares to that one night worth of poop and pee. I will never have dairy cows because of that. I don't mind poop but that was a bit much.


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## Calfkeeper (Feb 1, 2006)

No matter what the amount, viscosity or whatever texture of the poo, you will get used to it eventually.

My husband cracked me up when he told me about how he was before he started the dairy here. He used to go visit his friend who owned and operated a dairy. Said friend would use his hand to wipe poo off of the milk hoses...etc and hubby would totally gross out. 

Then hubby started his own dairy; after a very short time he was used to the poo and would use hands to wipe poo off hoses himself and not think anything about it, just washed hand off and went about work. Said he used to eat out in the milk barn.


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## tailwagging (Jan 6, 2005)

Karin L said:


> Well, here's a couple articles I found, though I don't think they're the ones I was looking for...although they should of use to you.
> 
> http://www.das.psu.edu/dairynutrition/documents/manure.pdf
> 
> http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1194&context=rangebeefcowsymp


THANK YOU!!!

I have read the first and I think this might be what the rep and my vet was talking about.
"The consistence of feces largely depends on water content and is a function of feed moisture content and the amount time feed remains in the animal."
Zebu as a breed is known to tolerate heat and drought and not on their own consume a lot of water. 

How should I handle this? Should I increase their grain? If so how much should I increase it to daily? They weren't given any when I got them so I have been afraid to give too much

The cow is now (according to a dairy tape) 550lbs she was 480 when I got her. Giving 1 1/2 to 2 quarts with one milking and calf on her the rest of the day. She gets 3lbs of 16 % dairy, 2lbs of A cubes and 1/2lbs calf manna at milking. 1 lbs dairy at lunch. 2 lbs of dairy at night.


The big bull I dare not tape so would say 800 lbs
he gets 2 lbs of dairy in the morning 1lbs at lunch and 1 at night

The little bull taped 240lbs
2lbs dairy in the morning

and the calf 270lbs.
1lbs of A cubes at night.

Should I change this?


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

tailwagging said:


> THANK YOU!!!
> 
> I have read the first and I think this might be what the rep and my vet was talking about.
> "The consistence of feces largely depends on water content and is a function of feed moisture content and the amount time feed remains in the animal."
> ...


Your welcome. 

I was reading that a dexter can do well on 15 to 25 lbs of hay per day, so maybe you don't need that much grain from what you think. I dunno about the calf manna, but I tend to think they don't really need that either, or as much as they are getting. So I think I'd increase their hay rations and back off on the protein supplements, especially with your mature animals. The calves, they need the protein, so they should be getting the calf manna and alfalfa cubes, and the cows and bull getting hay with maybe 2 to 3 lbs of cubes per animal per day as supplements. I'm assuming when you say "dairy" you mean purely alfalfa hay? 

Like I said I know very little about dexters, as those answers are just guesses on the nutrition requirements of dexter cattle...though I'm sure the nutrition plane for dexters is the same or similar as beef cattle, and they can do fine on forage with lower protein. So please don't take my response here word for word because I could be wrong.


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## tailwagging (Jan 6, 2005)

Karin L said:


> Your welcome.
> 
> I was reading that a dexter can do well on 15 to 25 lbs of hay per day, so maybe you don't need that much grain from what you think. I dunno about the calf manna, but I tend to think they don't really need that either, or as much as they are getting. So I think I'd increase their hay rations and back off on the protein supplements, especially with your mature animals. The calves, they need the protein, so they should be getting the calf manna and alfalfa cubes, and the cows and bull getting hay with maybe 2 to 3 lbs of cubes per animal per day as supplements. I'm assuming when you say "dairy" you mean purely alfalfa hay?
> 
> Like I said I know very little about dexters, as those answers are just guesses on the nutrition requirements of dexter cattle...though I'm sure the nutrition plane for dexters is the same or similar as beef cattle, and they can do fine on forage with lower protein. So please don't take my response here word for word because I could be wrong.


NO LOL I have mini zebu not Dexter. 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebus

When I say dairy I mean feed made for milk cows. It is 16 %.


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## Karin L (Oct 5, 2006)

tailwagging said:


> NO LOL I have mini _zebu_ not Dexter.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebus
> 
> _Oh whoops! I'm so sorry!_
> ...


Okay, I got that, but I don't understand what you mean by 16%... is it 16% protein?

Now that I see what you have, zebus are a different subspecies from the european breeds I see as beef cattle. So in that case, I think the zebu would have a different fecal consistancy than the Bos taurus species, probably like that of deer. But to be honest, I know far less about the Bos indicus species than Bos taurus like the Dexter. So maybe the poop consistency of your zebu shouldn't be much to worry about, as it could be because of its genetic make up.

At least, I hope that's what I think what it is.


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## genebo (Sep 12, 2004)

I keep Muscovy ducks to break up the manure piles so they dry out quickly. The ducks follow the cows around, waiting for a new pile. As soon as it hits the ground, they are into it with their bills. When they finish with it, there is usually just a scattering of small pea-sized pieces.

The manure dries out quickly. Flies don't readily hatch in the remainder, so the fly problem is greatly reduced.

I like to ask visitors to look at all the cow piles in the pasture, and wait for the response, "There's not any!"

I haven't had to drag the pasture for three years now. Ever since I got my Muscovies.

I try to keep 4 ducks per Dexter cow.

Genebo
Paradise Farm


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## 65284 (Sep 17, 2003)

If your okay with having goose and duck droppings around you should be able to easily deal with cow pies. I've always thought geese and ducks were some of the nastiest critters there are.


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