# Brian Williams



## Miss Kay (Mar 31, 2012)

I love the news so was surprised to learn that Brian Williams has been telling lies to make himself seem heroic. Anyone following this? He was given 6 months off without pay. Do you think he will come back or should he be allowed to come back? If not, who do you think will replace him?


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Yes I've been following it.
I have heard he even tracked down Lena Dunham's college rapist.

These type of people lie like a rug, it is all about image and it finally comes back to bite them. As far as I'm concerned he is washed up, he will be the butt of jokes from now on.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

I don't think he'll be back. If he comes back in six months, the story will be about his lying again. No getting away from it.

I kind of doubt this "without pay" thing, though. I bet his contract doesn't allow for that. They're probably just holding his pay for six months and then paying him.


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

No reason he can't come back and be welcomed by liberals. Hillary did the exact same thing when she claimed her plane landed under fire and it was proven to be a lie but she is still the dem front runner in 2016. Think about it.


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

poppy said:


> No reason he can't come back and be welcomed by liberals. Hillary did the exact same thing when she claimed her plane landed under fire and it was proven to be a lie but she is still the dem front runner in 2016. Think about it.


There is a difference, sheeple expect politicians to lie, but the majority still trust the main stream media. Maybe this might wake a couple up. Secondly, a lot of the sheeple are not liberal and wouldn't vote for Hillary so the comparison isn't exact. In reality, It is about marketing and is up to those buying advertising on the news whether he stays or goes.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I do not expect politicians to lie. They should loose their job and pension ect. when they do.


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

BlackFeather said:


> There is a difference, sheeple expect politicians to lie, but the majority still trust the main stream media. Maybe this might wake a couple up. Secondly, a lot of the sheeple are not liberal and wouldn't vote for Hillary so the comparison isn't exact. In reality, It is about marketing and is up to those buying advertising on the news whether he stays or goes.


I do not expect politicians to lie and it is sad that so many folks have gotten to the point they expect them to. I also expect them to do their very best to keep their promises. When we as a country fail to enforce those values on our politicians, we get.....well, you see what we get. I understand how people misspeak but what Hillary and Williams did was far worse. They were outright lies and they knew it. Everyone should ask themselves if they lied to you about these things (and they did), what else will they lie to you about?


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

Miss Kay said:


> I love the news so was surprised to learn that Brian Williams has been telling lies to make himself seem heroic. Anyone following this? He was given 6 months off without pay. Do you think he will come back or should he be allowed to come back? If not, who do you think will replace him?


Heard Couric was polishing up her resume. Then she can take NBC down the road like she did that other network.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

I did not really think Brian was all that hot, but I still feel sorry for him. A man who has to puff himself up by telling lies is much smaller and less secure than he appears. 

He may as well get a job as a greeter at Walmart now.
Ox


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

It doesn't really matter if he comes back or not.

NBC is now completely destroyed as a creditable news source. If they had fired him immediately, they might have been able to survive this latest episode.

Remember their edit of the Zimmerman 911 call?
How about Dateline's exploding truck scandal?
Lies told on MSNBC are too numerous to list.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

He's toast.

Lester Holt will be the "interim".

Kinda like _Starship Troopers_, he's the guy unless he gets killed or they find someone better.


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## Bret (Oct 3, 2003)

Miss Kay said:


> I love the news so was surprised to learn that Brian Williams has been telling lies to make himself seem heroic. Anyone following this? He was given 6 months off without pay. Do you think he will come back or should he be allowed to come back? If not, who do you think will replace him?


That's what I use HT for. Near and far...


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

No one should be counting on any one person, news outlet, website for the facts.

The news changed when we went to a 24 hour news cycle. It became about making money and fame for so many. We all need to be reading and researching all sides of the story and then making our own informed opinions. Too many people on both sides of the political spectrum put news outlets and their talking heads on a pedestal and let them slant their view of the world.


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## DAVID In Wisconsin (Dec 3, 2002)

Love this one!


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

"If you like your health care,you can keep your health care"

I'd say that deserves fireing and Levenworth.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

poppy said:


> No reason he can't come back and be welcomed by liberals. Hillary did the exact same thing when she claimed her plane landed under fire and it was proven to be a lie but she is still the dem front runner in 2016. Think about it.


But that is different. She is a politician and they are allowed to do what is needed to win an election.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

7thswan said:


> I do not expect politicians to lie. They should loose their job and pension ect. when they do.


Can you name one that hasn't lied to get elected?


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## Miss Kay (Mar 31, 2012)

Like someone else said, it's an insecure man who has to lie to puff himself up. It's not like he was living a boring life. He was right in the middle of the action (Iraq, Katrina, etc.), what more needs to be said than the truth for goodness sakes!


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

poppy said:


> No reason he can't come back and be welcomed by liberals. Hillary did the exact same thing when she claimed her plane landed under fire and it was proven to be a lie but she is still the dem front runner in 2016. Think about it.


But liberals aren't the only people who watch NBC News (believe it or not) so that wouldn't work out so well for their ratings, which are already dismal. Putting a laughing-stock back on as anchor would accelerate their slide into irrelevance.

Besides, Williams apparently wants to be an entertainer. There are stories that he was lobbying to host the Tonight Show when Jay Leno retired. He might have been good, too. He's a funny guy. But it would have made NBC News look bad to have their anchor move to comedy...not as bad as he has made them look now, though.

He's going to make out like a bandit by getting fired and then he'll get a job he likes better.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

These are good:
http://www.infowars.com/best-of-brian-williams-memories/


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

The guy makes (made) $10 million/yr, to read the "news", which is really just a scripted drama, hashed together for our own entertainment.

They slip up and remind us that this is all phoney to start with and now we act hurt and outraged. 

I heard rumor that his producers dreamed up his story, but he can't _throw them under the bus_, by naming them and just eating it himself.

Is the rumor true? who knows? who cares?

Most "news" is just Hollywood-type actors, telling what we want to - and don't want to hear, for our own entertainment.

Edward R. Murrow died 50 years ago.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

"Most "news" is just Hollywood-type actors, telling what we want to - and don't want to hear, for our own entertainment."

Episodes such as Williams' gaffe and the exploding pickup truck certainly make the above sound as if it might be fact.


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

Oxankle said:


> "Most "news" is just Hollywood-type actors, telling what we want to - and don't want to hear, for our own entertainment."
> 
> Episodes such as Williams' gaffe and the exploding pickup truck certainly make the above sound as if it might be fact.


It's really never been about news, as much as it is about money.

It's worse now days, that we can get news from 800 different sources. It's like a bunch of street-walkers, trying to look the prettiest, to attract attention.

Personally, I like how every snowfall is now treated like "the storm of the century". They want people to check in to their sponsor paid programing, every 5 minutes.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

I'm surprised that I agree with Plowjockey but I think he is spot on. Major news organizations are in the rating game as much as any TV drama. 
Frankly the compose the face to deliver bad news with an appropriate sympathy, while feeding a few lines of producer vetted news, was pretty off putting anyway. 
The whole art of asking the penetrating question to get information has been lost and is now only asking the pandering or insulting question depending on whether the interviewer likes or dislikes (or thinks the viewer does) the person.


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

Ands Brain is all washed up now, he will not be back as they undercover a few more things that he may have lied about. I sure miss the days of Cronkite or Huntley Brinkley Reporting NBC News


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

arabian knight said:


> Ands Brain is all washed up now, he will not be back as they undercover a few more things that he may have lied about. I sure miss the days of Cronkite or Huntley Brinkley Reporting NBC News


They may try him somewhere else to test the waters. People's indignation is usually short lived.


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Now he was at the Brandenburg gate when the Berlin wall came down. (even though he arrived the day after.) He also said during Katrina he saw a body floating down the street outside of his hotel room, though the hotel owner says it never flooded there. (maybe it was voodoo and the body floated in air?)
Next he'll be telling how he escaped the Titanic sinking. Probably swam to the ship California. If he had known they were going to collide, he would have pushed the iceberg out of the way.
At least the Pope blessed him.
He should go into entertainment, he has been the butt of a lot of jokes.
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/brian-wi...ting-the-pope-watching-berlin-wall-come-down/


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

This is a good one a newscast that the anchor can't stop laughing while trying to report on Brian. LOL

http://www.mrctv.org/videos/anchorman-can-t-stop-laughing-over-latest-dubious-claims-brian-williams


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

> They slip up and remind us that this is all phoney to start with and now we act hurt and outraged.


The vibe I get is more delight/schadenfreude than hurt and outraged.

I couldn't care less one way or the other about Williams. I did like him before this, from seeing him being entertaining on late night shows, but rarely watched his news program. No loss.


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

jtbrandt said:


> The vibe I get is more delight/schadenfreude than hurt and outraged.
> 
> I couldn't care less one way or the other about Williams. I did like him before this, from seeing him being entertaining on late night shows, but rarely watched his news program. No loss.


Good point.

People tend to show great favor for the laughing-stock these days, but there seems to be a tinge of resentment, since the tale was of military courage.

I don't care either, but then my expectations of the media, were pretty low to begin with.


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## JillyG (Jan 6, 2014)

Amazing how folks who watch, and surprisingly believe everything Fox-so -called News says, are outraged by Williams lying!
I think the same rules should apply to Fox. 6 months off the air for every lie!


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

JillyG said:


> Amazing how folks who watch, and surprisingly believe everything Fox-so -called News says, are outraged by Williams lying!
> I think the same rules should apply to Fox. 6 months off the air for every lie!


Personally, I don't believe Fox News really lies, they just _distort the truth_, to tell the story, their viewers want to hear.

And yes, all other media, does the exact same thing!


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

where I want to said:


> They may try him somewhere else to test the waters. People's indignation is usually short lived.


I don't know now with so many other things that might catch him in a untruth. Same thing goes for so many of the MSM stations, how they splice tapes together to make the R's look bad in a interview they are shameless, and should be help responsible for their actions. They just crucified that interview wit Sarah Palin a few years back but nobody was the wiser as those media outlets just lie like a rug all the time with their untruths that the uninformed and low information voter is getting. No wonder O got elected for a 2nd term. And what a shame that is now that his lies are coming to the forefront.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

JillyG said:


> Amazing how folks who watch, and surprisingly believe everything Fox-so -called News says, are outraged by Williams lying!
> I think the same rules should apply to Fox. 6 months off the air for every lie!


Again with the outrage...I just don't see it. I see a lot of people amused by the misfortune Williams has brought upon himself, but outrage? Where?

And I don't often watch Fox News, but I suspect I would hear about it non-stop if their reporters or anchors claimed to have witnessed things they did not. Do you have examples for us? There is a HUGE difference between: (a) spinning the news to support a viewpoint; and (b) outright lying about personal experiences.

It isn't a matter of opinion whether Williams experienced all those things he said he did. It's a matter of fact. It is not particularly laudable for a newsperson to inject their opinion into a story, but when a newsperson intentionally and repeatedly reports untrue items of fact, it completely destroys their credibility.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

jtbrandt said:


> Again with the outrage...I just don't see it. I see a lot of people amused by the misfortune Williams has brought upon himself, but outrage? Where?
> 
> And I don't often watch Fox News, but I suspect I would hear about it non-stop if their reporters or anchors claimed to have witnessed things they did not. Do you have examples for us? There is a HUGE difference between: (a) spinning the news to support a viewpoint; and (b) outright lying about personal experiences.
> 
> It isn't a matter of opinion whether Williams experienced all those things he said he did. It's a matter of fact. It is not particularly laudable for a newsperson to inject their opinion into a story, but when a newsperson intentionally and repeatedly reports untrue items of fact, it completely destroys their credibility.


Post of the day award.
I was trying to put together much the same but gave up! Beautifully said!
How is it that opinions are not seen as opinions? You'd be hard pressed to find out & out lies on most other news, especially FOX. 
Anyone who listens to Hanity, fi, should know he is very conservative & shows it. He's show is NOT a nightly news report, Brian Williams' show was.


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## Bret (Oct 3, 2003)

I forgive him.

Next?


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

jtbrandt said:


> Again with the outrage...I just don't see it. I see a lot of people amused by the misfortune Williams has brought upon himself, but outrage? Where?
> 
> And I don't often watch Fox News, but I suspect I would hear about it non-stop if their reporters or anchors claimed to have witnessed things they did not. Do you have examples for us? There is a HUGE difference between: (a) spinning the news to support a viewpoint; and (b) outright lying about personal experiences.
> 
> It isn't a matter of opinion whether Williams experienced all those things he said he did. It's a matter of fact. It is not particularly laudable for a newsperson to inject their opinion into a story, but when a newsperson intentionally and repeatedly reports untrue items of fact, it completely destroys their credibility.


Google much?

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=brian+williams+outrage

Americans love the pillory - provided _someone else_ is locked in it!


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

I only get one station and, you can guess, it's NBC. So I do watch the local news and I occasionally watched a bit of the national news. His demeanor was always timed poorly enough that it was clear he was acting sorrow or outrage, like flipping a switch, to appear sympathetic, which was off puuting anyway. Not good in a journalist, ok for an actor.
Actually the bits I've seen of Lester Holt, not too much yet, I might actually start watching the news again. At least he seems more straight forward. I'll see if their reporting is more useful and less agenda ridden.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

JillyG said:


> Amazing how folks who watch, and surprisingly believe everything Fox-so -called News says, are outraged by Williams lying!
> I think the same rules should apply to Fox. 6 months off the air for every lie!


Really? Since I have never seen it, I have never had the opportunity to be mislead by them. But I have watched NBC do a poor job for years . So bad a job that I'm shocked anyone could be mislead by them either.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

plowjockey said:


> Google much?
> 
> https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=brian+williams+outrage
> 
> Americans love the pillory - provided _someone else_ is locked in it!


No I don't Google much...especially for things I don't care about...I figure if there's that much outrage I'll hear about it without having to search for it. In this case I keep hearing about it, but not seeing it. But perusing a few of those stories in the Google results you linked to, it seems like more of them are about how stupid the outrage is...and granted, it was a quick skim, but I didn't see a single example of actual outrage being expressed by anyone I would think watches Fox News and believes everything they say. Perhaps the mass outrage was dreamed up so pundits and bloggers would have something to condemn.

Anyway, I assumed the comment about outraged Fox News viewers was directed toward the majority of the crowd here in the forum, but perhaps I was wrong about that. I certainly hope that poster wasn't insulting members of HT....


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## plowjockey (Aug 18, 2008)

jtbrandt said:


> No I don't Google much...especially for things I don't care about...I figure if there's that much outrage I'll hear about it without having to search for it. But perusing a few of those stories in the Google results you linked to, it seems like more of them are about how stupid the outrage is...and granted, it was a quick skim, but I didn't see a single example of actual outrage being expressed by anyone I would think watches Fox News and believes everything they say. Perhaps the mass outrage was dreamed up so bloggers would have something to condemn.
> 
> Anyway, I assumed the comment about outraged Fox News viewers was directed toward the majority of the crowd here in the forum, but perhaps I was wrong about that. I certainly hope that poster wasn't insulting members of HT....


You are right, as a lot of the "outrage" is mock outrage anyway. Ther is seems to be something about putting someone on a pedestal and taking great personal enjoyment when they fall off.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

where I want to said:


> I only get one station and, you can guess, it's NBC. So I do watch the local news and I occasionally watched a bit of the national news. His demeanor was always timed poorly enough that it was clear he was acting sorrow or outrage, like flipping a switch, to appear sympathetic, which was off puuting anyway. Not good in a journalist, ok for an actor.
> Actually the bits I've seen of Lester Holt, not too much yet, I might actually start watching the news again. At least he seems more straight forward. I'll see if their reporting is more useful and less agenda ridden.


Not a chance. Its the Obummernetwork.


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

plowjockey said:


> You are right, as a lot of the "outrage" is mock outrage anyway. Ther is seems to be something about putting someone on a pedestal and taking great personal enjoyment when they fall off.


 Ever hear of a morality clause?
Well that is what his contract has in it. And lying like that he could very well get fired because of what is in his contract. LOL


Suspended NBC* News anchor Brian Williams has a "morality clause" in his contract that means he could be fired by the TV news organization,* according to the New York Post.

Read Latest Breaking News from Newsmax.com http://www.Newsmax.com/Newsfront/brian-williams-nbc-iraq-lies/2015/02/16/id/624985/#ixzz3S0s62dN2


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

Well, he did 1 thing right, resigned from the medal of honor board.
http://www.newsmax.com/US/Brian-Wil...il_job=1609364_02202015&s=al&dkt_nbr=lwyhqmc2


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

So how long should Bill's hiatus be? http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6727988


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

It should be permanent, but I don't expect he will be suspended at all. There's been a thread about it in politics for a couple days...I know you don't venture there anymore.


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

jtbrandt said:


> It should be permanent, but I don't expect he will be suspended at all. There's been a thread about it in politics for a couple days...I know you don't venture there anymore.


So which defense of Bill is winning?

He's just an opinion giver not a news anchor so its not a fair comparison.

It's just a left wing media conspiracy to deflect attention away from Williams.

That was then- this is now.

Or my personal favorite- I didn't pay attention to politics, world affairs, media, .... back then but I do now so I can't possibly be held responsible to be able to put events like this in context.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

A combination. At first, there were several "Mother Jones can't be believed" statements with no comment on the actual allegations. Most of the people who have defended him have said they don't like him. One or two may have come around to my point of view upon seeing more evidence...although that evidence was cited by the Mother Jones article linked to in the OP...which was posted by a conservative. There aren't many people participating in the thread anymore...mostly Nevada and myself...Nevada is of course loving it...I don't recall him being this interested in the Brian Williams story.

I don't really care about O'Reilly. I'm not a fan and I'm not concerned whether he gets fired or not, but just trying to be fair...what's good for the goose and all that. And the "war zone" characterization really does annoy me. I am a non-combat vet and I make a point to make that distinction when talking about my service. I saw combat, but was not engaged in it. To have some two-bit reporter puff himself up talking about a combat situation in a war zone 1200 miles away from the actual combat just rubs me the wrong way, having known many good men who were in REAL combat.

Hey, I just realized that I'm reporting about what happened in the politics forum...does that qualify as a war zone? Yes, I feel like it does. I have now reported from a war zone! I am right up there with the best of them....


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

The two are miles apart as far as a lie goes.


> Don Browne, spent 30 years with NBC and NBCU, joining the company in 1979 as Miami bureau chief, where O&#8217;Reilly said he oversaw NBC News&#8217;s coverage of the 74-day Falklands War between the UK and Argentina.
> 
> &#8220;At first, Buenos Aires was a pretty nice place to be if you were covering the war, but as it turned out, it got progressively more intense,&#8221; Browne said. &#8220;These were veteran correspondents, we saw the situation escalating,&#8221; he continued, describing the situation as &#8220;business as usual, what they were sent there to do.&#8221;
> 
> ...


https://tv.yahoo.com/news/bill-o-reilly-want-stop-022939420.html


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

I smell a book. He will be on all the talk shows and his book will become a best seller. From there he will spin himself into another another career where he will have a large audience to admire him.


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## TRellis (Sep 16, 2013)

jtbrandt said:


> There aren't many people participating in the thread anymore...mostly Nevada and myself...Nevada is of course loving it...I don't recall him being this interested in the Brian Williams story.


Very interesting....

You piqued my interest, so I went back and looked. Two threads about Brian Williams and Nevada posted once remarking something about, "memory being the first thing to go."

In the single thread about Bill O'Reilly he found the time to post 19 times.

Too funny!!!

TRellis


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

arabian knight said:


> The two are miles apart as far as a lie goes.
> 
> 
> https://tv.yahoo.com/news/bill-o-reilly-want-stop-022939420.html


Maybe 30 years from now these young reporters can talk of their exploits in the war zone of Ferguson , MO. http://www.newsweek.com/journalists-arrested-assaulted-and-teargassed-ferguson-264610

Too bad Bill didn't rush to the front lines.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

Saw on the news this morning the man who was appointed to work wonders with the VA has gotten in on the story telling. It sure didn't take him long to come out with a few lies of his own.
It is so easy to lie when there are those people who will believe anything their party member says then defend them for telling a lie when they are caught.


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## TRellis (Sep 16, 2013)

pancho said:


> Saw on the news this morning the man who was appointed to work wonders with the VA has gotten in on the story telling. It sure didn't take him long to come out with a few lies of his own.
> It is so easy to lie when there are those people who will believe anything their party member says then defend them for telling a lie when they are caught.


Just so you know...

The VA Secretary (aka the latest liar caught in D.C.) is a Republican.

Just saying...

TRellis


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

TRellis said:


> Just so you know...
> 
> The VA Secretary (aka the latest liar caught in D.C.) is a Republican.
> 
> ...


I don't care what political party a person is. A lie is a lie. If he was a democrat it was a lie and if he is a republican it is a lie. If he was a frog it was still a lie.
I am not one of those people who let a political party tell me what my morals should be.


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## TRellis (Sep 16, 2013)

pancho said:


> I don't care what political party a person is. A lie is a lie. If he was a democrat it was a lie and if he is a republican it is a lie. If he was a frog it was still a lie.
> I am not one of those people who let a political party tell me what my morals should be.


And I agree with you!!!

I was just pointing out that he is a Republican appointed and now being forgiven by a Democratic White House. Many Republican politicians are also forgiving and forgetting.

TRellis


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

pancho said:


> Saw on the news this morning the man who was appointed to work wonders with the VA has gotten in on the story telling. It sure didn't take him long to come out with a few lies of his own.
> It is so easy to lie when there are those people who will believe anything their party member says then defend them for telling a lie when they are caught.


My first thought on seeing that was that maybe he was special forces of some type, but it was classified and he screwed up by saying it. Probably not, but it's just crazy to me that someone would lie so blatantly with a news crew right there.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

jtbrandt said:


> My first thought on seeing that was that maybe he was special forces of some type, but it was classified and he screwed up by saying it. Probably not, but it's just crazy to me that someone would lie so blatantly with a news crew right there.


Politicians have that right. Just another difference in the ruling class and the peons.
They are about the only people I know that can swear in court and get caught in a lie and get away with it.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

Define politician...anyone who works for the government at any time? Or something else. I don't see this guy as much of a politician. I think he took the job to serve his country in his retirement from his business career.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

Politicians can be anyone who is elected to the post thy serve in.
A politician can also be a person selected for a job by a politician.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

But does that mean everybody appointed to a position by a politician is a politician?

I'm kind of coming around to your belief on McDonald, but I still believe some people serve in those positions for selfless reasons. He might be one of them.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

jtbrandt said:


> But does that mean everybody appointed to a position by a politician is a politician?
> 
> I'm kind of coming around to your belief on McDonald, but I still believe some people serve in those positions for selfless reasons. He might be one of them.


Could be, I don't know much about him.
Usually a politician has to have a reason to appoint a person to a job. Very few times that reason has to do with the person's experience, knowledge, or honesty.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

That's why the last guy had the job. I suspect they hired someone they really thought could do it this time, since there was such a public uproar about the bad situation. But them thinking he can do it and him actually being able to do are two different things. I don't know how good of a job this guy has been doing, but I've read articles that say he gives his personal cell phone number to vets who are having a particularly difficult time dealing with the bureaucracy so they can call him directly to get things sorted out. Whether that's really helpful or just a gimmick, I have no idea.


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

My biggest problem with this story isn't that the director lied to bond with a homeless soecial forces vet but that there's a homeless special forces vet to bond with in the first place.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

Do you mean SP shouldn't be or that they shouldn't be vets or that they shouldn't be hurt & in the VA system?


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

Tricky Grama said:


> Do you mean SP shouldn't be or that they shouldn't be vets or that they shouldn't be hurt & in the VA system?


I'm saying we should value our veterans and there should not be one of them living homeless on the streets.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

mmoetc said:


> I'm saying we should value our veterans and there should not be one of them living homeless on the streets.


I'll second that!


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

jtbrandt said:


> That's why the last guy had the job. I suspect they hired someone they really thought could do it this time, since there was such a public uproar about the bad situation. But them thinking he can do it and him actually being able to do are two different things. I don't know how good of a job this guy has been doing, but I've read articles that say he gives his personal cell phone number to vets who are having a particularly difficult time dealing with the bureaucracy so they can call him directly to get things sorted out. Whether that's really helpful or just a gimmick, I have no idea.


I am a vet. I wish I had his number. I would call him the next time I went to the VA hospital and let him hear the way we are treated when there isn't anyone around.
Try calling a VA hospital sometimes and see if you can even talk to a real live person.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

mmoetc said:


> I'm saying we should value our veterans and there should not be one of them living homeless on the streets.


I agree.
I had to go to a VA hospital years ago. It was in Biloxi, Ms. in 1980. The treatment was good enough I spent a year working with the homeless veterans program to pay them back. 
It is very hard for people to understand why and how there are homeless veterans. Since 1980 I have seen the quality of care drop to the low it is now. People treat dogs much better than they treat our veterans.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

mmoetc said:


> I'm saying we should value our veterans and there should not be one of them living homeless on the streets.


I agree. It is the goal to get them off the streets, and I believe that's the purpose of the count they were doing when this happened, to get a number so they know how big the problem is and what resources they will need to deal with it.

But at the same time I think there is only so much you can do for some people. There's a lot of mental illness among the homeless population, including vets...and yes, probably a lot of it comes from service related issues, but in a lot of those cases to keep them off the streets you would actually have to lock them up. Are we willing to lock up vets to help them?

It's not as simple as it seems. We can't just give them a place to live and a job because there are underlying issues that keep many of them from being able to function normally in society. We can get them the mental health care they need, but we can't necessarily force them to take the medications or to show up for counseling sessions. It's a tough situation we've gotten ourselves into, which is a big part of why is has been swept under the rug for decades.


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## unregistered353870 (Jan 16, 2013)

pancho said:


> I am a vet. I wish I had his number. I would call him the next time I went to the VA hospital and let him hear the way we are treated when there isn't anyone around.
> Try calling a VA hospital sometimes and see if you can even talk to a real live person.


Hopefully this liar guy is effective at getting the VA working again (or finally...I don't remember it ever being very well-run) because apparently they're keeping him on at least for now. I've never used VA services because I feel the stress would be worse for my health than the care could possibly be worth, but I have a good friend who is a VA doctor in Wyoming. It beats him down to see how horribly it operates, and he's past time to retire, but he won't do it because he knows if he leaves then many of his patients will simply be ignored and won't get the care they need. He often goes in on his days off (90+ minute commute) to make sure they're OK. If we could get him in charge of the VA, things would change quickly because he'd be out there kicking butts until things are right.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

jtbrandt said:


> Hopefully this liar guy is effective at getting the VA working again (or finally...I don't remember it ever being very well-run) because apparently they're keeping him on at least for now. I've never used VA services because I feel the stress would be worse for my health than the care could possibly be worth, but I have a good friend who is a VA doctor in Wyoming. It beats him down to see how horribly it operates, and he's past time to retire, but he won't do it because he knows if he leaves then many of his patients will simply be ignored and won't get the care they need. He often goes in on his days off (90+ minute commute) to make sure they're OK. If we could get him in charge of the VA, things would change quickly because he'd be out there kicking butts until things are right.


There are a few good ones there but most will leave just to get away from the place.
Last year my regular doctor went on an extended vacation. My prescription ran out about a month later. They would not refill it until I saw my doctor. My doctor wasn't there, no one in her office was there, and all the administration would say was I had to see her. She stayed on vacation several months more. Finally one day I decided I would stay on the phone all day until I got someone to help me. It took the full day and I had to go outside of the hospital to get help. I finally worked my way up to the governor of Ms. I couldn't talk to him but left a message. Next day they called to say my medicine was in the mail.


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