# Doe having trouble giving birth!



## Shade26000

I have a rabbit in my colony that is pregnant. This will be her first litter she has dug a hole and made a nest. Today I went out to check on every one and I seen that she is having problems getting around. She is also breathing very funny. I think she is having trouble giving birth to the babys! What should I do? I when ahead and moved her inside the barn to a cage where we can keep an eye on her. Any advice?


----------



## MaggieJ

I've never actually seen a rabbit in labour, so I'm not sure I'll be much help. Most rabbits give birth while you are looking the other way.

I wonder if you could give us a bit more detail. Trouble getting around and breathing very funny don't give us much to work with. When you moved her to the cage, could you see any sign of a kit stuck in the birth canal? When you went to pick her up, how did she act? Is she alert? Does she seem to be in pain? Sorry for all the questions, but the more information we have, the better chance of someone being able to offer good advice.

Hope by the next time you go out to check on her that she has finished birthing and looks at you with that look that says: "So what was all the fuss about?"


----------



## Shade26000

No, please ask away. I just got back from checking on her. Her breathing is just very fast as if she has been running. When I moved her she was very easy to handle, which is not like her. She normaly runs when every you get around her. While I was out there a second ago I gently pushed her hip so I could get her to roll and give me a good look at her back end. She just layed flat with her front and her back just turned to the side. I did get a good look her butt is very red but there was no sign of any kitts poking out from any where. She dosen't seem to be in any pain she just acts like she is very sick. This whole ordeal my not have anything to do with the babys but I do know she is pregnate and after I moved her I dug open her hole and checked the nest she built, it was empty. I'm just putting two and two together.


----------



## jil101ca

I don't know how to get a kit out if it is stuck. The only thing I can suggest is to watch her and if she dies and you want to save the kits, cut them out very quickly, you have seconds. I really hope that someone else comes along that can help. It is horrible to watch you doe suffer and not be able to help.Been there and done that. Maybe she is just confused at what is going on and is lost on what to do and everything will be ok...sending good vibes your way...


----------



## Beaniemom

Sounds like she's in labour, but having trouble passing the kits. If you have any raspberry leaves, that should help (if she'll eat them) You may try getting some Pedialyte or gatoraide in her, the electrytes should help.

I did read about putting them into a warm bath to help with labour, but I've never done it. You could take her to the vet, but that would probably be very expensive


----------



## MaggieJ

If things get to the point where you know there is a kit stuck, there are some things you can try. In a previous thread about Meg Z's doe, Terry W posted this advice:


> grease up your smallest finger and use it to help reposition the baby. Don't forget to cut the fingernail real short so as not to tear up the canal. Sometimes, a 'massage' can also help turn the baby into the correct direction-- even breach, there is a better chance. Rub one side towrds Mommas head, and the other towards her bum-- helping Momma relax will help turn the baby, as well.


Raspberry leaves, as Beaniemom mentioned, may help. Lavender or sage are said to aid in expelling the contents of the uterus (i.e. dead kits and/or placental material), but lavender especially is a strong medicinal and could have risks. Just give a pinch of lavender if you have any or a couple of leaves of sage -- and only as a last resort.

If she seems to be suffering and making no progress, you may have to either take her to the vet or put her down. Do you have another doe with young kits if she dies but the kits survive? Newborn rabbits are almost impossible to hand-raise, but often another doe will accept them if they are about the same age as hers. Tough decisions, especially when you're starting out, I know. Good luck.


----------



## Meg Z

I wish you luck.

With my doe that Maggie mentioned, there was a heavy discharge. I'm hoping you're simply seeing early labor, and when you turn your back she'll pop out her kits.

I failed in saving my Aura Lee. I hope you have better luck with your girl. It's a tiny space to work in.

Meg


----------



## Shade26000

Well not much has changed. Like I said she don't seem to be suffering at all, she just seems wore out. Doesn't seem like she's went into labor eather, not that I would no what to look for. If need be I do have another doe I could put the kits with. I just don't see thats she's suffering or in any pain. Just awkward breathing and she's verry sluggish. Like I said earlyer she norrmaly runs from us (she's very shy), but now she just lays there.


----------



## Shade26000

Ok just walked out and she was in mid way of pushing out a dead baby. I pulled it the rest of the way out. We brought her (the whole nest box) inside were we could work under better light. She is having contractions as we speak but none seem to come out. I don't know if the others are stuck or if this just takes time? The dead baby was really odd...long and streched out and didn't look like it was formed all the way. Any advise?


----------



## Meg Z

I'd give her a few minutes to allow time for another kit to move down into position. I'd even step away and give her some space. Hopefully, the dead kit was plugging up the works, and now the rest can come.

I'd guess you'll know in 15-30 minutes which way it's going. To keep yourself busy, trim those fingernails, and get the oil warmed up a tad. The bunny equivalent of boiling water. 

And relax. You are going to do all you can do. But that's all you can do. 

Let us know as soon as you know, please! Good luck.

Meg


----------



## MaggieJ

Hang in there, Shade26000! Sounds like you're doing really well. I agree with Meg about giving her a little space. Rabbits, being prey animals, are secretive about birthing, so she may find it difficult to relax. Hope now that the dead kit is out that the rest will go easier.


----------



## Meg Z

Shade, I'm hoping that the litter was delivered and you're sleeping soundly. I was kinda hanging out to see how things went, but I'm going to head off to bed and leave the vigil in Maggie's capable hands, as I see she's still hanging out.

I hope all went well. If it didn't, we know you tried your best. And you know you did, too. Let us know, please!

Meg


----------



## MaggieJ

I'm off to bed too... nearly 1 AM. EDT. Hope all went okay, Shade. Please update us in the morning... I've been hanging out hoping to hear how your doe is doing, but getting very tired now.


----------



## Shade26000

Well I can't say all is good because there's no babys. The mother is in great spirits and moving around alot, also she's eating and drinking. Could the ordeal be over? Like I said she had that one long baby stuck that I pulled out and along with the baby a clump of...... organs (I guess) came out along with the baby. The mother still has some ozzing but nothing worth going into detail about. I moved her back out to the barn to keep an eye on her for another day. If all is good I'll move her back out the to the colony. I think that would be better for her to be with the rest of her friends. What you think? Could it be over? Just one dead kit?
I want to thank everyone for all the help and for staying up so late. I need to find out how to tell who's still online. I would have posted again if I thought you guys were still up. I can't thank you all enough. We are so new to all of this breeding we would be so lost if it wasn't for the internet and frineds like you guys. Thanks again!!


----------



## MaggieJ

The mother bun is naturally your main concern, so your report is good news. It is possible that only one kit developed. She's young and her ovulation might still be a bit unreliable. Or there may have been others conveived but died during development and were re-absorbed. Regarding what you describe as "a clump of... organs (I guess)" --- Could that have been simply the placenta that the baby was attached to by the umbilical cord? Did it look sort of like a piece of raw liver? If so, that is probably normal... So hard to be sure of anything without seeing it.

When you get only one or two kits, they frequently grow so large that they cannot easily pass through the birth canal. They are usually stillborn, I think due to suffocation but there could be other causes. As I said before, I'm no expert when it comes to birthing problems.

I would think it might be best to keep an eye on her for several days. There could be complications: unexpelled placental material, uterine infection, mastitis if her milk comes in and then cakes in the teats. I'm not saying these things will happen... just that you need to be aware of the possibility. Now would be a good time to feed a little sage or lavender to help expel anything left from the uterus. Some mint would be excellent too... It will help dry up her milk and (since it is not recommended for pregnant rabbits) it should also be good for a momma who has lost her babies and may be retaining placental tissue. Watch the discharge... if it develops a bad odour, it could indicate an infection in the uterus. Watch her nipples... if they become engorged, inflamed or hot, there could be a problem with mastitis. I hope other people will chime in on this... My advice is coming solely from my reading here and there. I've only once had problems with a rabbit kinding, a first timer who delivered two large dead kits and several live ones that were smaller. She either didn't or couldn't feed them and they died. Other than that, kindling here has always gone tickety-boo... and in spite of this incident, you will find that is the case most of the time.

You were asking how to tell who is online. Just below the box where I am typing there is a box headed: Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread and under that it lists you, Chickenista and me at the moment. There is a similar box on the index page where the titles of the threads are located. It will tell you everyone who is currently viewing the rabbit forum. Of course they may have gone to get a snack or throw a load of clothes in the washing machine... but they are still signed in.

Hope this helps some... You did well. Next time should be much less eventful and more enjoyable.


----------



## Beaniemom

The stretched out kit is due to the pulling (the doe was probably pulling to get it out)

I second everything Magie said.

Do you have your bucks out in the colony? I was going to say next time you breed her to do it in a cage/pen, since you know she's prone to large kits, you want to try to increase her litter size (larger litters=smaller kits) But if the bucks are out there, chances are they've already bred her by now.


----------



## LFRJ

Good morning.

I fired up the ole dial up soon as I could this AM to get the update. I've been watching this story so closely. I'm so happy to hear that Mum is doing well, but sorry to hear that there are no kits. Sound's like you took excellent care of the situation. I hope everything goes well from here. We're so blessed that our doe is far more experienced in these matters than we are. SO far, we've not had any complications. I hope, if we ever do, that I handle it as well as you have.

Good luck from here forth.

LF


----------



## turtlehead

Missed the whole thread until just now.
I'm very glad the doe seems to be doing well; I know that was an anxious time for you. You got great advice. 

Another way to tell who is online is when you're looking through a thread, there is a little piece of paper and a star beside the posters' names. A green star means they're online.


----------



## Shade26000

Well just did a recheck and all is well still a little ozzing but she's doing great. I think I'll still wait a day or so till I put her back with all her friends in the colony. What do you think about her breeding again? I do keep the buck in the colony all the time. I know once she gives him the opportunity she'll knocked up again. Would you let her breed again?


----------



## General Brown

In my experiences, the first time a doe kindles is her smallest litter. I would give her a couple days to recuperate, and then breed her again. If you could cage your buck and put the doe in with him in the morning and then again that evening I believe you would see a larger litter. Thats the method I have been using. My buck is very aggressive and will normally service the doe 2 or 3 times within just a minute or two. I just had a first timer kindle 11 kits 3 days ago. Fortunately, she is a great mother and all kits are surviving.


----------



## MaggieJ

Under the circumstances I would give her a little longer, but that's just me. There could be complications and while early rebreeding would tend to help to head off mastitis, it could exacerbate any infection. What I would do would get a bunch of mint from the grocery store (good ones usually have bunches of fresh herbs) and feed her some for the next few days. Mint will both help clear out anything left in the uterus and help suppress lactation. Some rabbits don't like it fresh, but I have noticed that most rabbits will eat something that helps them even if they don't like it normally. Must be instinct inherited from their wild European ancestors. Most rabbits really enjoy it dried and it retains its medicinal effects well.


----------

