# Famancha Cards



## Jcran (Jan 4, 2006)

Does anyone know where I can buy the FAMANCHA cards that show where you can compare eyelids/gums for worming?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

You cant get the cards without taking the class.
(Unless youre a Veterinarian)
http://www.scsrpc.org/SCSRPC/FAMACHA/famacha.htm


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## lyceum (Oct 20, 2006)

We got ours from our Vet.

Carisa


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## Liese (Dec 12, 2005)

Try a AG college, especially the small ruminants dept. Altho' last time I talked with the folks at VA Tech, they were having a hard time getting them in any quantities; but it's worth a call. If you can't find a card, try doing a comparison amoungst your herd or flock. I have several older resistant ewes with lovely red/pink, then I look at everyone else- eyes and gums.


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## Jim S. (Apr 22, 2004)

You can also get the cards reproduced on Web sites.

Like this one:

http://www.uky.edu/Ag/AnimalSciences/goats/newsletter/faugustseptembernwsletter01704.pdf

Have fun! It's the best way to control worms without making them resistant, and without using up the available array of effective wormers. I have done this for 16 years, since back when eveyone locally thought I was nuts to do it. You really don't need the card. They never HAD a card when I started. LOL.

Oh, by the way under edit, you can do the same thing looking at the color of your dog's gums for worms.


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## chris30523 (Jun 11, 2005)

I look at the gums and tongue.Are the eyelids better?Do they show anemia sooner.I lost a doe kid last year to anemia One day she looked okay the next her gums were almost white We got rid of the worms but she never did recover I think they damaged her rumen.


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## BlueHeronFarm (Feb 9, 2007)

Just a caveat - you might not want to use the online or self-printed version as the color on your screen or printer may be off from what the actual color on the FAMACHA chart is.

I do beleive eyelids show change before gums, but don't quote me. 

We check eyelids a few times a week - even without a chart you can get an idea of what is "normal" for your goats and recognize change before it gets out of hand.


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## Jcran (Jan 4, 2006)

Ok, being special needs when it comes to following directions, and a tad bit "off-task"(I prefer multi tasker) I don't always read the fine print. WHEN I did, the FAMANCHA foke(wouldn't life be a lot easier if we all spelled foneticly) noted in their "Read this first" section that the FAMANCHA program is for barber pole worm. Now, do any of you FAMANCHERS out there find it at all useful for OTHER types of internal parasites? We don't have the barber pole worm here in No. Cal-at least not yet.


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## chris30523 (Jun 11, 2005)

It is a test for anemia.I am sure if anyother type of worm were causing anemia the results would be the same.


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## Jim S. (Apr 22, 2004)

Yes, eyelids show color change before the gums. Watch a vet, they will do the eyelid first.

You don't even need a chart at all. Really, I never used one for 16 years. 

Here's your guide! If the eyelid or gum area looks like the color of raw pork chops, you need to worm. The lighter it appears than a raw pork chop, the more worm load there is (the more anemic the goat is). If it is white, you'd better be feeding wormer down the throat right now. 

On the other end, the closer it gets to the color of raw sirloin steak, the better off you are. In between means it is time for watchful waiting. 

Not rocket science...but it does very much work. I use this, along with poop watching (clumpy poop is a sign) and careful observation of the coat (roughness, dullness, loss of color) to see which individuals need attention. 

I also cull goats that the worms seem to like to colonize too much. 

Every once in a long while, I do a fecal on herd poop at random, to see the herd worm load. I have a low overall worm load on my place.

The main reason I have done this so long is, I am scared as the dickens of selecting for resistant worms that ivermectin will someday not work on, and I will have to go to Cydectin, which is both high-dollar and also the last resort wormer, since there is no new wormer in development after that.

So far...knock on wood...generic, cheap ivermectin still does the trick after 16 years of using worm management before using chemicals. I'm loving it now, cuz the patent ran out and I can buy it like a commodity, on price alone.


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## Jim S. (Apr 22, 2004)

Jcran, barber pole worm is the one that hits goats first and multiplies in goats fastest. They like goats better than all the rest of the worm kinds. So that's the best one to use as an overall worm load marker. The fact they cause anemia quickly in goats when there is an overload is tremendously convenient to the goat herder!

When you worm, you'll wipe out all the other strains, too.

Oh yeah, FAMACHA is how it is spelled. Look at Page 5 here...

http://www.ricecrc.org/reader/ttwne...nt&MItypeObj=application/pdf&name=/ttw-13.pdf


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## chris30523 (Jun 11, 2005)

I have a question for those who use this method.Do you still worm a doe before she breeds whether she needs it or not ,and after she gives birth whether she needs it or not?What about the kids do you do a first worming and then only when they need it?


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## southerngurl (May 11, 2003)

I thought this was about some kind a lamancha cross or something.


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## Jim S. (Apr 22, 2004)

chris, I do not worm a doe before breeding or after she gives birth. Far as I know, the worming after birth practice started with valbazen, which MUST be given when the doe is not pregnant, to prevent abortion. Best time to be sure she isn't pregnant is right after she kids. With ivermectin, which I use, you can give it anytime it is needed. So there's no need.

I know this may cross some people, so let me just say I am not criticizing what others do. But I worm using FAMACHA, coat condition and poop as my indicators, and I only worm when those show it is needed. I do herd fecals every once in a great while, and I have a low level of worm exposure in the herd. I keep one goat who is more sensitive as a "canary" to any buildup problems.

The key phrase to me in what you wrote is "whether she needs it or not." That is what the drug companies tried to instill when they told people to worm to a strict schedule, as it uses more of their product so they make more money. And that is what cutting-edge worm management techniques are trying to get around. I want to worm ONLY when she needs it. Every time I worm "whether she needs it or not," I am at higher risk of breeding resistant worms.

Under this line of thought and research, I want to monitor worm levels on a herd basis, not an individual basis.

OK, so then people say to me, "But then your kids are getting worms!" And I say, "Exactly. I want that to happen." Then they sometimes get very upset. But if my herd has a low level of worms that are easily killed by ivermectin (which is the case) then allowing some low infestation I believe builds tolerance in the kids. 

It goes back to what Nature would do. In a natural setting, there'd be goats roaming all over the countryside with low-level infestations, eating tannins in old leaves and acorns and woody weeds, etc., to self-treat to keep levels low. 

I just help mine a little more than that with ivermectin when they need it, because they are confined. In my opinion, confinement more than anything else creates the worm "problem" for goats. In wild goat herds, worms only very rarely become acute.

Shrug...works for me.

*BTW, Jcran -- * Barber pole worms are distributed worldwide in warm, wet locations. My grandparents lived in Redding. Conditions are right there for at least half the year. See

http://ivomec.us.merial.com/cowcalf/parasites/haemonchus.asp


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## chris30523 (Jun 11, 2005)

Thanks Jim.I live in upper NE Ga so our conditions should be similar the only difference is I am in a high cattle area and our worms are resistant to ivermectin and quickly building immunity to cydectin.I would like to worm only when needed.I have two goats that have not been wormed in two years they are the healthies two I have.


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