# ? how to remove your self from HOA or subdivision?



## KandCfamilyfarm

I think I may be getting ready to have a issue with my subdivision rules. See when we first moved here and bought the land there were some simple rule laid down by the subdivision no junk yards and no business, Well my hobby farm has started to turn in to a real farm I guess and the man who is supposed to maintain the roads came by and ask if I would cut him a deal for some pigs he basically want free meat. I turned down his offer and he made a comment about how I could be fined for running a business. There are three people who live on my road and we have never seen anyone ever maintain the road or ditches matter a fact we drag the gravel road and buy the gravel for the road ourselves ever since we move in.

So my question is since these people never collect dues from us and never take care of or do anything anyways is there a way to seperate us from their rules?


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## flboisseau

The first thing I would check is to see if the HOA is still active. Who are the elected members of the board? If there is no board, then the argument could be made that it is defunct and I would start there. 

The other option is if there is an elected board, I suggest that you and like-minded people get on the board and then you will basically get to set the rules. Thus you could make exceptions for things like your hobby farm. You could even vote to dissolve the HOA, But since they are supposed to maintain the land, I would think hard about doing that, as you could regret that in the future. 

But from what I know there is no way to remove your self from the HOA, as it is convent attached to the land, except with the permission of the HOA. They would have to give up the rights they have over your property, that were given to them when they were created.


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## hunter63

There was a covenant on our property when we bought it......
Farm divided in to 6 to 10 acre....lots....with quite few rules.

My neighbor and I bought up all but one of the lots...and agreed we wouldn't pay any attention to the rules.

You would have thought be the end of it....but was still in effect on the last lot when it sold last year.....and may still be if I should sell....and they get to looking at deeds and things.

My advice is consult a lawyer....sounds like you hacked someone off.........


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## GTX63

KandCfamilyfarm said:


> ...the man who is supposed to maintain the roads came by and ask if I would cut him a deal for some pigs he basically want free meat. I turned down his offer and he made a comment about how I could be fined for running a business. There are three people who live on my road and we have never seen anyone ever maintain the road or ditches matter a fact we drag the gravel road and buy the gravel for the road ourselves ever since we move in.


This sounds like one of those conversations where you think of all the important things to say after it is over.
That is usually because you don't expect to hear what you heard.
You are a little vague on the details but it sounds like he was asking for a bribe?
Did this conversation start well and end poorly?
Personally, if I were a scumbag that was going to use my local position to make side deals, I would be careful about letting a homeowner "business" know I was going to turn them in. Unless I thought the guy was a weiner or little threat for retribution.
Usually in areas like yours (3 other homes on your road) the board is ran by the original owner or family that parceled the land.
You cut a check once a year and there may or may not be a meeting.
Does this guy work for the county/township or the HOA?


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## Mickie3

About the only sure fire method for getting out of a HOA is to buy all property that is part of it and then dissolve it. 

IMO, all HOAs are like cancer, some worse than others, and each and every one is undesirable. I currently live in yet another one as my wife HAD to live here and I should have refused to buy here. There are less than 15 households in the HOA, we all have several acres, and most back up to a lake that is totally owned by members of the HOA or the HOA. Sounds ok, right? Hint: Its NOT!


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## GTX63

Our daughter and son in law live in one in Indiana. Nice, newer homes with a park and a pool.
No commercial trucks overnight (even your plumber/builder/handyman type), no campers, motorhomes, boats, utility trailers.
No toys left in the front yard overnight. Trash cans to be removed same day as pickup. No siding, shutters, shingles, garage doors other than accepted colors and styles. No sheds, no personal swimming pools, no portable cooking devices, ie grills in view, no animals other than listed dogs. No loose cats. No music or loud noise after 10 pm without permit. No trees other than the pre-approved ornamentals, shrubs and flowers. Gardens must behind the house and enclosed. No containers. Grass must be sod.
Those are the rules off the top of my head. Three people in the neighborhood go door to door each week posting or notifying homeowners in person of violations. Typically are neighbors turning each other in over a push mower left outside, an inflatible kiddi pool, someone parking their Escalade in the yard overnight, burned out exterior light bulbs.
It is Pleasantville with nazis.
However, I get that if someone pays 400k for a brand new home, they want it to remain worth that 400k or more until they sell it.
I don't get owning a piece of property that someone else can so intrusively tell you how to own it, and it isn't even the government!


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## AmericanStand

KandCfamilyfarm said:


> .......So my question is since these people never collect dues from us and never take care of or do anything anyways .....


Is there any money there to do anything about It?

Would anyone take cash out of their pocket to pursue a complaint against you?

That said any friends on the sheriffs Department? One that you could complain to and would make a "friendly" call to the guy saying they are investigating solicitation of bribery?


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## Cabin Fever

There is likely a clause in the title/deed of your property that states you must follow the rules of the HOA. I doubt if you can change this legal document without a fight from the others in the HOA.

Getting out from under the rules of an HOA is somewhat similar to one trying to remove himself from a city because s/he doesn't like the city's ordinances. It is hard, to impossible, to do.


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## fireweed farm

Agree with CF.
But do check your title and see if it mentions the HOA or restrictions. 
I've now looked at two properties that had supposed restrictions, and my realtor mentioned the neighbours will hate you but those rules are not on title so there is nothing legally stopping you.


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## GTX63

Guy about 2 miles up from us had about 60 acres he cut up into 5 acre plots to sell. After about 10 years there are maybe 7 or house houses. He wrote up convents, ie no horses, no more than 2 dogs, no livestock, etc. The realtor didn't bother to include the covenant regs in her information packet and more than a couple potential sales went south over it. I also believe one family bought land and discovered the regs after closing and while digging out footings for their new house.


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## LittleRedHen

My former Father in law has a subdivision around us with all those fancy rules... in country living. His land has been for sale for about 15 years with only selling 4 lots out of 10 and two of the lots are to me because i wanted to maintain some higher degree of privacy. He wanted no livestock, no junk, houses must be a certain size.. no loud equipment.. also cannot offer abortion or euthanasia counseling/advice from the premises.. etc.. I am tempted to pay several grand and turn my land into one parcel which would remove the frontage on my one lot to being his subdivision road. He charges me a yearly fee for road maintainance and i dont use the road.. my driveway is on the main road. SOi think it would remove me from the HOA also but the yearly fee is the only thing that irks me. Good luck on finding a wya out of yours


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## mmoetc

The quick answer is sell the place and make it someone else’s problem. The better answer is to do your research and find the actual HOA documentation which will spell out your responsibilities and the responsibilities of the HOA. If the HOA hasn’t been acting as they should they could be in breach of contract and the covenants unenforceable but only a judge will tell you for sure.


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## jr23

first go to count read the recorded title documents, this could be hoa or cc&r some covenants have time limits, some need to be renewed some auto renew unless owners vote to dissolve many have an association and follow reg voted on and states have various laws. it can be expensive to follow hoa rules from gov if this is a real hoa with mandatory participation the threat of a monthly fee might convince land owners to dissolve the hoa depending on the state i know in fl theres tons of laws and regulations that change with each legislative session so most hoa in fl have lawyers on retainers and professional management 
you can thank the us government specifically fha and the va starting in 1960s for promoting this blatantly unamerican form of housing . and in many states you will not be given the current book of rules until you settle and the seller has you and the banks check they only tell that theres a hoa condo or cc&r so search titles for covidants


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## royB

I had the pleasure of being part of an HOA recently. I chose to help out the guy that was keeping it going. What we found is that the HOA bylaws and covenants have to be registered with the county (in TN anyway), the HOA will have to follow the covenants, meaning they at least do the minimum. In our case, they collected fees and took care of the common areas by paying for lawn care etc. There was no HOA board and they did nothing else, but it stood up in court (yes someone had tried to sue the HOA and the one guy who volunteered to keep it going). So as long as its doing the minimum detailed in the HOA bylaws and covenants it is probably valid, if not then you may have a chance to get it deemed failed and removed from your deed, if its on there.

This is all something I heard/witnessed so it may or may not apply to your situation.


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## Forcast

GTX63 said:


> Guy about 2 miles up from us had about 60 acres he cut up into 5 acre plots to sell. After about 10 years there are maybe 7 or house houses. He wrote up convents, ie no horses, no more than 2 dogs, no livestock, etc. The realtor didn't bother to include the covenant regs in her information packet and more than a couple potential sales went south over it. I also believe one family bought land and discovered the regs after closing and while digging out footings for their new house.


Same here the new folks thought this was the wild wild west. Guns, brush fires, large dogs loose, 4 junk cars trucks. Seller didn't pass on the covenant. They didnt like the un freedom and left. Not sure if this was a rent to own thing or not.


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## ErinP

I never lived anywhere with an HOA. Shoot, the only thing my place has is the power company's easement (which, if I wanted them to bring in power, I guess I had agree to lol)

Why would people voluntarily sign these things??


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## TedH71

It's an American thing apparently. You don't hear about Europeans doing HOAs.....when my wife and I went to look at houses where we lived in Kansas, we skipped the ones that had HOAs. We ended up in an area that was nice and no HOAs beyond city ordinances which stated only one beehive per household.


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## Mickie3

TedH71 said:


> It's an American thing apparently. You don't hear about Europeans doing HOAs.....when my wife and I went to look at houses where we lived in Kansas, we skipped the ones that had HOAs. We ended up in an area that was nice and no HOAs beyond city ordinances which stated only one beehive per household.


Europe is FULL of towns and cities, full of them. Hardly any unincorporated areas (if any) there. 

Not a lot of difference in living in a area with a HOA or a incorporated area (small city, village, town, etc.) In my experience with anywhere I have lived, you always have someone wanting to tell you what to do. I guess you could escape this being a hermit in a place so unlivable that nobody would dare live there (hence neighbors.)


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## ErinP

There are a LOT of very nice, liveable, even pretty places out there that have nearly nothing for zoning regs, code requirements, HOAs, etc.

Im guessing your experience is limited more than anything...


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## Mickie3

ErinP said:


> There are a LOT of very nice, liveable, even pretty places out there that have nearly nothing for zoning regs, code requirements, HOAs, etc.
> 
> Im guessing your experience is limited more than anything...



The area I live in is rural and has a HOA, but that is more about local customs than anything else. On top of that, we have a "township" and county and state, then the feds. All of these have regs, so the HOA is small change in comparison, they are more of a nuisance than anything more. Somehow, I am thinking you are marginalizing the fact you have state, county and other sub-district all telling you what you can and can't do.


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## ErinP

We have no "district." County is as small as it goes.
And the *only* thing any of those entities tell me to do is to get approval from a state inspector if I put in a septic system or dam a natural waterway.
Otherwise, I can do, or build, or raise, whatever I want on my own place.

This is true of every place Ive lived, in 3 different states.


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## TedH71

I honestly didn't know they had it in Europe. I know it started in Florida and spread from there.


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## melli

Mickie3 said:


> Europe is FULL of towns and cities, full of them. Hardly any unincorporated areas (if any) there.
> 
> Not a lot of difference in living in a area with a HOA or a incorporated area (small city, village, town, etc.) In my experience with anywhere I have lived, you always have someone wanting to tell you what to do. I guess you could escape this being a hermit in a place so unlivable that nobody would dare live there (hence neighbors.)


Canada...far north...anything goes...lol
Heck, even in my hood, we have folks with that mindset.
To OP:
But as I hear about HOAs, it reminds me of covenants and Co-ops we have here. Nasty things...however, they do have expiry date (not sure about Co-ops) unless owners agree, via a majority, to keep it going. I think these sort of things are the devils work, and I'm an atheist.
Having your neighbor's dictate what you can or cannot do is setting one up for a lifetime of sniping and bickering from your neighbors. Personally, I'd run.

I did buy a house a while back, and we had an HOA (covenant)...silly, right off the start. I couldn't have a boat in front yard, only backyard, but I had no backyard because my house was on back property line! Couldn't have metal roofs...mystifying, given we get the odd forest fire and shingle roofs here are moss magnets. No high fences either, which nixed any idea of a garden because deer would mow down a garden in a night around here. Thankfully, these ridiculous rules expired...there was no descent into madness...everybody, more or less, kept their place looking good, and kept property prices healthy. 

BTW - we do have district, and provincial regs, but there is nothing terribly onerous about them, especially the further one is away, from the nearest gov office. Actually, one island near me, doesn't allow gov officials to do inspections. 

I'd look into dissolving HOA, if feasible.


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## AmericanStand

LOL north must be the way to go, in Alaska a significant portion of the state doesn't even have a borough ,Alaska's equivalent of a county.


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## dademoss

NEVER buy land/house inside an incorporated municipality or an HOA (In Ohio at least) HOA and cities/villages can make whatever laws/regulations they want, but in Ohio townships have abilities to regulate that are defined by the Ohio Revised Code.


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## Evons hubby

Mickie3 said:


> The area I live in is rural and has a HOA, but that is more about local customs than anything else. On top of that, we have a "township" and county and state, then the feds. All of these have regs, so the HOA is small change in comparison, they are more of a nuisance than anything more. Somehow, I am thinking you are marginalizing the fact you have state, county and other sub-district all telling you what you can and can't do.


No Hoa, county, state, nor Feds have ever shown up at my door telling me what I can or cannot do. They (county), does send me a bill every year for my fair share of taxes, other than that I've been pretty much left alone to build the buildings I want, the way I want, park my cars, trucks, tractors where I want and pretty much do as I durn please. I like it here in Kentucky.


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## anniew

Wait! Is this the same property that you were asking about getting a loan to get the 5 acres back from your relatives?


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## Ronney

Back to comments on Page 1. Believe me, this is not an Americanism by any stretch of the imagination. We have them here but they're going out of favour big time but it's taken 20-odd years for it to happen and for people to wake their ideas up, the result being that many are now sitting on the market as practically unsaleable despite the ridiculous price that was paid for them at the time of initial purchase.

I could never get my head around buying 10 acres of farmland and being told what type of house should be built, what colour it should be, vegetable gardens kept out of sight, no large trees, no pigs or horses, two cows, two sheep that were not allowed to get woolley...... You already have the idea from previous posts.

When we were ready to move on to a larger property ANYTHING that had a covenant of any sort wasn't even considered. While it is a concept that is fast disappearing, I'm still able to subscribe to the idea that my home is my castle. Why on earth would anybody want to subscribe to anything else.

Please people, when it comes to buying your homestead/lifestyle block, make sure it doesn't come with strings. You have a right to put food on your table and to sell/give away any surplus. If you want a purple house with yellow front steps, why not? 

Right, had my little rant about something that gets right up my nose!

Cheers,
Ronnie


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## 1948CaseVAI

An HOA and deed covenants are double edged swords. Of course they can be restrictive, but you should have known that before you bought the property. If you were not informed before you bought the property then you may have a cause for action against the realtor, but it won't likely get you anything but lawyer bills.

On the other hand the covenants protect your property value because you do not have to worry about some hayseed moving a derelict trailer, or worse, on property next to yours. It is not unreasonable to not allow businesses in an area that is largely rural residential. After all, you do not want to live next to a 7-11.


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