# Vegan Friday in NYC Schools



## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

I hope this does not catch on. I bet more kids start brown bagging lunch. This is not good for farmers and ranchers that raise animals.

In keeping with Mayor Eric Adams' focus on fitness, the nation's largest school system will serve vegan-only meals every Friday starting this week throughout the academic year.​​The dietary practice — which disallows meat and dairy — will scrap staples like mac and cheese and replace them with veggie tacos and other plant-based dishes, the Department of Education said Thursday.​​The agency had already implemented a meat ban on Mondays and Fridays meals before expanding its campaign to target dairy.​​







NYC schools to serve vegan-only meals on Fridays


In keeping with Mayor Eric Adams’ focus on fitness, the nation’s largest school system will serve vegan-only meals every Friday starting this week throughout the academic year.




nypost.com


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

And I though fish fridays were bad! At least those lasted only through Lent.

Several studies have shown the fake meat to be worse for you than real meat.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

Blockade the city, and bring the tyrants to their knees.


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## altair (Jul 23, 2011)

It's not terrible to appreciate different diets, especially when most of us are in calorie-excess. But I would tote raw/lightly cooked, less processed versions of vegetables, since farmers grow produce as well. And I wouldn't advertise it as appealing to vegan sympathies, just making sure kids are exploring ways to diversify their food.

Veggie fajitas are one of my staples and I love meat and dairy.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

altair said:


> It's not terrible to appreciate different diets, especially when most of us are in calorie-excess. *But I would tote raw/lightly cooked, less processed versions of vegetables, since farmers grow produce as well. *And I wouldn't advertise it as appealing to vegan sympathies, just making sure kids are exploring ways to diversify their food.
> 
> Veggie fajitas are one of my staples and I love meat and dairy.


I agree. Generally meat substitutes are healthier but not healthy, per say.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

I think it's a great idea if they do it right. I am willing to bet that most kids in NYC don't get much in the way of fruit, veggies, and whole grains at home. You don't need meat for every meal.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

Removing foods from the menu is never right. Anyone who desires to eat vegan/ vegetarian can just skip eating any of the non vegan/vegetarian food items. But by removing meat/dairy you’re forcing dietary changes on the majority.


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## altair (Jul 23, 2011)

It's not really much different than serving things one doesn't like for any other meals. There were public lunches I skipped on occasion because I didn't like the main course. No bigs. Can't please everyone. It's vegetables, not plutonium. 

(Aye, some kids would be just as offended with broccoli vs. nuclear waste)


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

When I was a kid, we were served tuna salad. We were "forced" to eat it or starve until we got home. No one is forcing anything on anybody. If kids don't want to be "forced" to eat fruits and vegetables, they can bring a bag lunch with a healthy bologna sandwich.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

I like vegetables, in fact I love vegetables. It is certainly within anyone's rights to eat nothing but vegetables.

Wear you mask, take off your shoes before you fly, show your proof of vaccination, isolate at home. You can't have your pudding until you eat your carrot.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Cabin Fever said:


> When I was a kid, we were served tuna salad. We were "forced" to eat it or starve until we got home. No one is forcing anything on anybody. If kids don't want to be "forced" to eat fruits and vegetables, they can bring a bag lunch with a *healthy bologna sandwich*.


🤣


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> But by removing meat/dairy you’re forcing dietary changes on the majority.


Not really. As mentioned already, they can always bring their lunch.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

I too love my vegetables, heck I love food. And this is an interesting concept but it is a bit abrupt. School cafeterias are notoriously ill equipped to do more to prepare for this kind of change. This I fear will end the same as Michelle Obama's foray into school meals.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

no really said:


> I too love my vegetables, heck I love food. And this is an interesting concept but it is a bit abrupt. School cafeterias are notoriously ill equipped to do more to prepare for this kind of change. This I fear will end the same as Michelle Obama's foray into school meals.


Same here.
It's a good idea. But, they'll probably screw it up.


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

For kids that only food comes from school meals.... I would hope it was nice eatables that children like.


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

During the lockdowns of covid the kids had bagged lunches dropped off. All kids got it. Saw some of the canned/boxed food . sardines really how many kids eat sardines ?


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

kinderfeld said:


> Not really. As mentioned already, they can always bring their lunch.


Not necessarily


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

Cabin Fever said:


> When I was a kid, we were served tuna salad. We were "forced" to eat it or starve until we got home. No one is forcing anything on anybody. If kids don't want to be "forced" to eat fruits and vegetables, they can bring a bag lunch with a healthy bologna sandwich.


And if vegans/ vegetarians don’t like what’s on the menu they can do the same.
It’s not about forcing them to eat the vegetables necessarily but the removal of their opportunities to eat meat with their meal.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

sounds good in theory 

issue is fresh vegetables are expensive not just to purchase but also to prepare and store , fresh fruit is also expensive so what will end up happening is a whole lot of carbs will be served , the cheapest cereal grains possible 

so basically the worst possible thing for kids who'd diet is already mostly carbs 

I predict rice , pasta , potatoes , bread in great quantity and fresh vegetable in extremely low quantity 

meat isn't the issue is , feeding kids like they are cattle in a finishing pen all the salt and carbs they can eat with very little movement


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> And if vegans/ vegetarians don’t like what’s on the menu they can do the same.


They probably do the other four days a week.


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

Nothing wrong with healthy food. The alternative will be fried chicken sticks, Mac and cheese or hot dogs. A diet based on mac processed trash creates picky kids that end up with diet related comorbidities.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

kinderfeld said:


> They probably do the other four days a week.


They certainly may do so if they choose, but they’re not forced to do so.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> They certainly may do so if they choose, but they’re not forced to do so.


Same with the other kids on vegan Friday.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

kinderfeld said:


> Same with the other kids on vegan Friday.


No sir it’s not the same… IMHO


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

Just a question, do they still have the snack vending machines in schools?


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

no really said:


> Just a question, do they still have the snack vending machines in schools?


In highschool but its limited use here wv


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> No sir it’s not the same… IMHO


You're right. It's just one day a week versus four.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

kinderfeld said:


> You're right. It's just one day a week versus four.


No, it has absolutely nothing to do with the number of days.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> issue is fresh vegetables are expensive not just to purchase but also to prepare and store , fresh fruit is also expensive


Being only on Fridays, this really wouldn't be difficult logistically speaking. And, not all plant based meals require much in the way of fresh vs frozen.



GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> so basically the worst possible thing for kids who'd diet is already mostly carbs


There's nothing wrong with carbs.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> And if vegans/ vegetarians don’t like what’s on the menu they can do the same.
> It’s not about forcing them to eat the vegetables necessarily but the removal of their opportunities to eat meat with their meal.


Perhaps, the kids should be provided with menus every day so they have opportunity to eat whatever they want. Little Johnny may want surf & turf for lunch.


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

Nothing wrong with a meatless meal to encourage more vegetable/dairy consumption. Tomato soup and grilled cheese is a regular at our house along with bean burritos, etc once every week or two. Just about everyone could stand to eat more vegetables. But going full on vegan is a bridge too far imho. They will likely bring in the over processed, manufactured meat substitutes which I believe are not healthy. 

Young people still growing have to eat very carefully or take supplements to eat vegetarian or vegan and still meet the needs of their bodies. Mass prepared fake meat isn't doing them any favors.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

Cabin Fever said:


> Perhaps, the kids should be provided with menus every day so they have opportunity to eat whatever they want. Little Johnny may want surf & turf for lunch.


🙄


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Some seemed to have missed, "T_he agency had already implemented a meat ban on Mondays and Fridays meals before expanding its campaign to target dairy._"


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Signaling.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

MO_cows said:


> Young people still growing have to eat very carefully or take supplements to eat vegetarian or vegan and still meet the needs of their bodies.


It's really not difficult.



MO_cows said:


> Mass prepared fake meat isn't doing them any favors.


I agree. It's not much better than the real thing.

I don't have much faith in the ability of the schools to not screw this up.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

HDRider said:


> Some seemed to have missed, "T_he agency had already implemented a meat ban on Mondays and Fridays meals before expanding its campaign to target dairy._"


So, vegetarian Monday. Vegan Friday. Omnivore the three in between.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> No, it has absolutely nothing to do with the number of days.


I don't see any other difference.
Bottom line is, regardless of preference, if a student doesn't like what's being served they can bring their lunch.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

I'm sure the majority of parents were on board with the new regime?


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

kinderfeld said:


> I don't see any other difference.
> Bottom line is, regardless of preference, if a student doesn't like what's being served they can bring their lunch.


No, the bottom line is that you don’t have to remove meat/dairy in order to also provide meals for those who choose not to eat meat/dairy.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> No, the bottom line is that you don’t have to remove meat/dairy in order to also provide meals for those who choose not to eat meat/dairy.


The bottom line is they are forcing no meat and dairy


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

I bet a kid could clean up selling roast beef sandwiches on Monday and Friday.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> No, the bottom line is that you don’t have to remove meat/dairy in order to also provide meals for those who choose not to eat meat/dairy.


Perhaps funding only allows for one meal? If not then maybe they could do this.


Cabin Fever said:


> Perhaps, the kids should be provided with menus every day so they have opportunity to eat whatever they want. Little Johnny may want surf & turf for lunch.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

And if people are really upset about it...
Just means we need more....


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

kinderfeld said:


> Perhaps funding only allows for one meal? If not then maybe they could do this.


According to the NYC schools website, this is 3 meals a day.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

kinderfeld said:


> Being only on Fridays, this really wouldn't be difficult logistically speaking. And, not all plant based meals require much in the way of fresh vs frozen.
> 
> 
> There's nothing wrong with carbs.


have you worked an institutional kitchen recently virtually everything is heat and serve.

there is nothing wrong with carbs in moderation !

as a type 2 diabetic Live carbs every day.

Moderating carbs is the hard part. 

so lets say the simplest thing oat meal you would get all of your daily carbs on 5 one cup bowls of oats a day 55grams of carbs per bowl x 5 bowls 275 grams carbs for the day

but what kid is going to eat water and oats of course they are going to add brown sugar or something similar.

so then lets look at brown sugar it is what is commonly placed on oatmeal now the 32 ounce or 2 pound package stats 277 servings at 14gr of carbs per serving , the reality is any kid is going to use more like 1 ounce of brown sugar which is more like 121 carbs per what a kid is actually going to scoop on their oatmeal.

so if 275 is your daily carbs and you have a bowl of 55gr of carbs from your oats and 121 carbs from your scoop of brown sugar so 176 gr of carbs in your 1 cup of oat meal and scoop of brown sugar so now rather than 5 bowls of oats you get 1 1/2 

so that is it all they get to eat for carbs for the day is 1 1/2 cups of oatmeal , so they are going to be hungry about 90 minutes after they ate it 1 1/2 half cups to feel full at 7am by 9am they are hungry again but have already eaten their daily fill of carbs for a moderation diet.

now had they eaten 
a 3 egg omelet with cheddar cheese 4g
a slice of toast 15gr 
a pint of milk 24gr
an apple 25gr
they are now 68gr of carbs into their 275 for the day and are full till lunch


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

HDRider said:


> The bottom line is they are forcing no meat and dairy


Exactly!!!


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

no really said:


> According to the NYC schools website, this is 3 meals a day.


3 different meals in one day? Or, 3 different meal times? Or, 3 different meal options?


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> there is nothing wrong with carbs in moderation !


There's nothing wrong with carbs in general.


GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> now had they eaten
> a 3 egg omelet with cheddar cheese 4g
> a slice of toast 15gr
> a pint of milk 24gr
> ...


Maybe they don't want the 200 mg of cholesterol per egg. Or all the fat and cholesterol in cheese and milk. Most don't mind it though.


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## doozie (May 21, 2005)

__





Menus


Get monthly menus for your child so you can see what's for breakfast, lunch, after school and more.




www.schools.nyc.gov





It is a free lunch for all program.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

doozie said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...



All menus are pork free.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

kinderfeld said:


> There's nothing wrong with carbs in general.
> 
> 
> Maybe they don't want the 200 mg of cholesterol per egg. Or all the fat and cholesterol in cheese and milk. Most don't mind it though.


it was an example of a filling meal that isn't excessive in carbs 

this is the very issue , mandates avoid this avoid that limit this limit that , more this more that , I have sat down and run the numbers with my own professional dietician at the clinic and caught them up in how do you make a meal that meets the requirements for less of xyz and more of abc without making something no kid will eat or a completely impossible meal.

I am not saying don't have a vegetarian day. I am not even opposed to it I am saying you need to look at the actual logistics of it and the labor , food storage , available foods , cost and how it will actually play out. What actual meals can you put toghter and not just a mandate for this or that.


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## doozie (May 21, 2005)

HDRider said:


> All menus are pork free.


I'm surprised they offer peanut butter...due to allergies.

I don't remember pork on my school lunch menu of yesteryear, maybe on sausage pizza day though.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

kinderfeld said:


> 3 different meals in one day? Or, 3 different meal times? Or, 3 different meal options?


Breakfast, lunch and dinner. Same options.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> it was an example of a filling meal that isn't excessive in carbs


But at the expense of cardiovascular health.



GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> I am saying you need to look at the actual logistics of it and the labor , food storage , available foods , cost and how it will actually play out. What actual meals can you put together and not just a mandate for this or that.


Oh I agree that there is a need for planning. This is why I don't have much faith in their ability to avoid screwing this up.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

First world problem.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

no really said:


> Breakfast, lunch and dinner. Same options.


So one option per meal. Maybe one option is all they're budgeted for.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

kinderfeld said:


> So one option per meal. Maybe one option is all they're budgeted for.


Might be, they don't seem to include that on the website.


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## Lady89 (Feb 22, 2014)

Why Vegan, why not Vegetarian? It has been proven time and time again that more Veggies would do all of us good but the Vegan diet is up in the air if it is actually healthy or not.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Lady89 said:


> Why Vegan, why not Vegetarian?


That's Mondays.


Lady89 said:


> the Vegan diet is up in the air if it is actually healthy or not.


Not really. It's very healthy. A whole food plant based diet, that is.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Japanese School Lunches: 34 Day Menu — Domo Daruma


The mythical and romantic notions of Japanese respect, honor, and responsibility can be condensed into their public school lunches. Locally-sourced foods. Served by the students themselves donning proper hair nets, aprons, gloves, and face masks. Balanced meals with full disclosure of food origins,




www.domodaruma.com


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

The Norwegian art of the packed lunch


Could we all learn something from Norway's culture of ‘matpakke’?




www.bbc.com


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## Lady89 (Feb 22, 2014)

kinderfeld said:


> That's Mondays.
> 
> Not really. It's very healthy. A whole food plant based diet, that is.


over all plant based diets are good but the amount of Soy in most Vegan diets is what is up for debate


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Lady89 said:


> over all plant based diets are good but the amount of Soy in most Vegan diets is what is up for debate


Why? If a person has a sensitivity, don't eat it.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Japanese School Lunches: 34 Day Menu — Domo Daruma
> 
> 
> The mythical and romantic notions of Japanese respect, honor, and responsibility can be condensed into their public school lunches. Locally-sourced foods. Served by the students themselves donning proper hair nets, aprons, gloves, and face masks. Balanced meals with full disclosure of food origins,
> ...


Beautiful, clean, nutritious and filling. I love Japanese food.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

no really said:


> Beautiful, clean, nutritious and filling. I love Japanese food.


Agreed. Japanese food is so creative- every dish. Even the things we’ve bastardized and made cheap for the western taste are dishes of art in Japan.

The first time I was told I was being taken to a “Ramen Bar” for dinner (one that was presumed to be a nice dinner), I had kind of a *** moment.… right up until my first slurp. I fully lived up to the glutinous American meme, and had three bowls. I was actually pacing my drinks because I didn’t want to waste space that could be filled with ramen.


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## no really (Aug 7, 2013)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> Agreed. Japanese food is so creative- every dish. Even the things we’ve bastardized and made cheap for the western taste are dishes of art in Japan.
> 
> The first time I was told I was being taken to a “Ramen Bar” for dinner (one that was presumed to be a nice dinner), I had kind of a *** moment.… right up until my first slurp. I fully lived up to the glutinous American meme, and had three bowls. I was actually pacing my drinks because I didn’t want to waste space that could be filled with ramen.


Had the same reaction when I was invited to a Ramen Bar. It was one of those food experiences that stays with you. And yes I was a bit of a pig!


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> The Norwegian art of the packed lunch
> 
> 
> Could we all learn something from Norway's culture of ‘matpakke’?
> ...


From your link -

“In Norway, you’re not supposed to look forward to your lunch,” says Ronald Sagatun, who works in advertising and hosts a YouTube channel about Norwegian culture. “It’s kind of a strict thing. It’s easy to make, easy to carry around, easy to eat, but it should be a disappointment.”

The ‘_matpakke_’, pronounced ‘maadpukke’, with a satisfying emphasis on the ‘e’, consists of a stack of three or four thin slices of wholemeal bread, with a meaty, fishy or cheesy layer on top of each (this is the word’s popular meaning, though technically it can be used to describe any food which is prepared to be eaten outside of the home).

Today the matpakke is much more than just an insipid open sandwich; it’s a national institution, and an understated source of cultural pride.


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## altair (Jul 23, 2011)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> issue is fresh vegetables are expensive not just to purchase but also to prepare and store , fresh fruit is also expensive so what will end up happening is a whole lot of carbs will be served , the cheapest cereal grains possible


Even better if the school had their own gardens to harvest their own food and teach children practical skills.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Late to the party, so I didn’t read all the responses, but when I was in school, Vegan Friday would have turned into “Food Fight Friday”. No guilt if you waste something non edible.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

HDRider said:


> The bottom line is they are forcing no meat and dairy


I am sure that two of our favorite lobbies will fight this, the National Beef Association and the National Dairy Council, both organizations get government benefits.



Alice In TX/MO said:


> First world problem.


What truly is a first world problem are American children whose diets are composed primarily of fast food and snacks, which are high in process sugar, processed grains, fats and oils, and salt. About 20% of American children are overweight, many have diabetes.



kinderfeld said:


> Not really. It's very healthy. A whole food plant based diet, that is.


Yes, a whole food, plant-based (WFPB) diet is quite healthy. For the record, I have not eaten meat, dairy, eggs, cheese, etc. for over four years now. I have lost over 80 pounds and my BMI is 25. Prior to my change in consumption, I was taking five prescribed medications for high blood pressure, Type 2 diabetes, and poor cholesterol panels. After less than a year of eating WFPB, I was taken off all of my meds. I am 69yo and medication free.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Cabin Fever said:


> Prior to my change in consumption, I was taking five prescribed medications for high blood pressure, Type 2 diabetes, and poor cholesterol panels.


I was concerned about heading down that same road when I changed to a WFPB diet myself.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Has anyone here ever tried to keep a cold cut sandwich from getting nasty for the 6 hours it sets unrefrigerated between the time the kids leave home and the time they get to eat lunch? 

Here is a link to the NYC school menu. Some of the offerings don't sound too bad. They are certainly much better than the mac&cheese, chicken nuggets and corn dogs continually offered by our local school.





__





Lunch Meals


school lunch meals




www.schools.nyc.gov





The meals are still loaded with carbs and salt, too many carbs and too much sodium for growing children. If the cheese they are eliminating is that processed cheese it's no big loss. I would be the kid that would bring in shredded cheese to put on my vegan salad.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

I’m certainly not against anyone eating whatever they want to eat… I’ve grown (and eaten) organic fruits and vegetables most all of my life. But I also eat meat & fish, and the lower carb diet that I follow ,the healthier I become. Including having far better cholesterol, losing 60 pounds and completely ending medication for diabetes and hypertension.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

School kids have been eating unrefrigerated sandwiches for lunch since before refrigeration.

I think some folks haven't worked in a field, behind a mule, on horseback for a thousand miles, or logging in a forest, either.

Dang. We are spoiled.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

But the meat in those sandwiches was not the same as the processed stuff you buy now. Kids today are weak. They haven't eaten enough dirt or inhaled enough barn sweepings to build up their immune systems. They are more familiar with hand sanitizer than the use of hand tools.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

altair said:


> Even better if the school had their own gardens to harvest their own food and teach children practical skills.


our last ag teacher tried it on a small scale to supplement the lunch program. we have a green house attached to the AG classroom the issue is growing lettuce for 300 lunches takes space. the greenhouse also needs to serve it's class functions so couple 4x8 boxes are about all the room that can be used for the lunch crop.
school is over in the end of May and starts back up beginning of September , if there isn't anyone to tend it June July and August you have only short time crops like lettuce that can be grown in a month and the entire green house can make enough for a few lunches.

the next issue is institutional salad now comes ready to eat in bags and real lettuce needs to be washed and dried and cut that is labor , labor they are trying to avoid when running a small staff in the kitchen.often 3 people to prepare 300 lunches and 1 more that comes in just for a couple hours to serve and run dishes.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

Forcast said:


> During the lockdowns of covid the kids had bagged lunches dropped off. All kids got it. Saw some of the canned/boxed food . sardines really how many kids eat sardines ?


My nephew eats sardines, asks for them, actually.



no really said:


> I'm sure the majority of parents were on board with the new regime?


I wonder if they were part of the decision. I am guessing not, just based on what happens here.


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

no really said:


> The Norwegian art of the packed lunch
> 
> 
> Could we all learn something from Norway's culture of ‘matpakke’?
> ...


My son went to Norway a few years ago. He said it was beautiful and the people were great but the food was the most God-awful stuff he'd ever had to eat. And he lived through my cooking


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

I never thought I would say this, but My Body - My Choice


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

MoonRiver said:


> I never thought I would say this, but My Body - My Choice


Things have changed since I went to school. Back then, we had two choices for school lunch: take it or leave it.

I am surprised how many here think that kids should be allowed a choice for school lunch. With this "kids should have a choice" attitude, the next thing you know, the first thing kids will do when they arrive at school is fill out a menu for their lunch later in the day. 😆


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

My husband's aunt ran the cafeteria in Ganado, Texas. Her Czech background made for some awesome lunches. 

There was also the dreaded barbecue baloney with spinach.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

MoonRiver said:


> I never thought I would say this, but My Body - My Choice


I don't think anyone is being denied the choice of bringing their own lunch. Under the Michelle Obama program it wasn't unheard of for a kid's packed lunch to be thrown away and replaced with the school lunch.


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

I’m surprised how many here can’t comprehend that meat “and” vegetables can be served with the same meal… That you don’t have to remove meat from one child’s meal in order for another child to have vegetables.


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## georger (Sep 15, 2003)

HDRider said:


> I hope this does not catch on. I bet more kids start brown bagging lunch. This is not good for farmers and ranchers that raise animals.
> 
> In keeping with Mayor Eric Adams' focus on fitness, the nation's largest school system will serve vegan-only meals every Friday starting this week throughout the academic year.​​The dietary practice — which disallows meat and dairy — will scrap staples like mac and cheese and replace them with veggie tacos and other plant-based dishes, the Department of Education said Thursday.​​The agency had already implemented a meat ban on Mondays and Fridays meals before expanding its campaign to target dairy.​​
> 
> ...


I like my vegetables to have either wings and feathers or have 4 legs.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

Kiamichi Kid said:


> I’m surprised how many here can’t comprehend that meat “and” vegetables can be served with the same meal…


I think the focus is on making the main course plant based as opposed to the fruit and vegetable side dishes we normally see.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Kids that normally eat nothing but hot dogs, burgers, chicken nuggets, fries and mac and cheese don't look at vegetables as food. They are those gross things placed on the tray that will be dumped in the trash after the kid is done eating the junk food. Kids today have no idea that vegetable soup is edible and actually good tasting.


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

it will likely go the same way as Michelle's idea. they tried it up here. the kids would take the lunch as they went through the cafeteria and walk to the bin and dump it. i never heard at the time of michelle's fiasco though that the packed lunch from home was being taken away. how did the school get away with that? bet the parents kicked up a racket. they didn't do that here. my son only ever ate the veggies when it was in soup . ~Georgia


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I worked with a woman whose kids were on the reduced lunch program. She got a bill for their lunches and demanded to know why when the bill was paid. Turns out that the students were required to take an apple with their lunch. Her kids did not take the apple (one had no front teeth and couldn't eat whole apples, the other hated apples) so the lunches were no longer reduced. After that day the kids took the apple to satisfy the requirement then promptly threw the apples in the trash. Government waste took on a whole new meaning for those kids.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Someone start a list of things that government does well.

I'll wait,


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

HDRider said:


> Someone start a list of things that government does well.
> 
> I'll wait,


Kill people
Spend money


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## Kiamichi Kid (Apr 9, 2009)

Danaus29 said:


> Kill people
> Spend money


Oppress the people..


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Funny how big government people never help me with my list


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

We're not from the government, we really are trying to help. 😁


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> have you worked an institutional kitchen recently virtually everything is heat and serve.
> 
> there is nothing wrong with carbs in moderation !
> 
> ...


275grams of carb in an adult 2000 calorie diet is the recommendation for a *healthy person*. Less as a part of a lower calorie diet typical of a child. More as a part of a higher calorie diet. If you are T2 trying to control your blood sugar, thats excessive. Really need to keep it down 100gram or less. And yes you can do low carb vegetarian. I think actual Keto vegetarian diet be impossible since all plant foods have carbs, but low carb vegetarian very doable.

Making this poliical is silly. Plant foods as main course is doable. Not going to kill a kid to not have meat at one meal or all meals for that matter. Good to be exposed to different way of eating once in a while. But if school hot lunches are anything like they were when I was a kid (mmm... surplus dinosaur meat) they go as absolutely cheap as possible. I remember being last in line once and they were low on soup for last like ten kids. So cook took pot soup over to the sink and added hot water. Right in front of us. Mmmm... hot water. Back then it wasnt heat and serve, they actually cooked the stuff but from govt commodities rejected by army or something. I took my lunch more often than not through elementary when lunch was supervised and class ate together with teacher hovering. In Jr. High and high school we had modular scheduling and vice principal supervising whole mess hall, kids coming and going every half hour so I just went to library during my scheduled lunch period (they didnt take attendance at lunch). If you eat breakfast and have food available when you get home, its really not big deal. Nothing says three meals a day are necessary to prevent starvation. Lot kids skip breakfast. I ate breakfast and skipped lunch. Save hassle of carrying sack lunch. Hey if you were really hungry and that was your main/only meal of day, then yea suppose school lunch better than nothing, but thats about all you can say.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

AGREE! Silly debate. 

If this is your main topic today, find something else to do.


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## kinderfeld (Jan 29, 2006)

HermitJohn said:


> And yes you can do low carb vegetarian. I think actual Keto vegetarian diet be impossible since all plant foods have carbs, but low carb vegetarian very doable.


Actually, I don't know about vegetarian but there are vegan keto diet plans.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

It depends upon what they are serving. I'm capable of making lovely delicious food that a vegan could eat, so if they are doing some decent vegan food, it won't hurt kids to eat it now and again. If not, pack a lunch for your kids. Kids can learn to roll with the punches and it doesn't hurt them to eat foods from other cultures. Save the fighting for things that matter. Lunch is not the hill to die on.

I think it is an odd policy to make every kid eat the specialized diet of a few kids. It would make more sense to offer a vegan entree every day for the vegan kids instead of feeding them once a week and making everyone go vegan for the day. I suppose one day a week is "Black lunch day"? Well, it doesn't hurt kids to eat whatever it is that Blacks eat every now and again.. although, I would have thought that they are Americans and humans so they probably eat the same things that the rest of us eat.

I might go to the school board and agitate for a native American diet daty where all the kids eat Buffalo jerky and cattail root and pounded acorns. After all, fair is fair and everyone should be treated the same. And a day for sushi and white rice. A lot of schools already have taco tuesday. But there should be a curry day and a peanut and goat stew day. And to be fair the vegan kids should be required to eat lunch on barbacoa day. We are required to eat your food, you ar required to eat our food. Fair is fair.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

@oregon woodsmok, from what I read it wasn't a specialized lunch to fit the needs of a few students. The mayor decided that school kids needed to eat the way he has been eating because of his health problems. Apparently it is not off to a good start.









New Yorkers Take to Twitter to Share Harrowing Photos of NYC’s First ‘Vegan Friday’ Meals


The city’s newly announced Vegan Friday program is off to a rocky start at public schools




ny.eater.com


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

kinderfeld said:


> Actually, I don't know about vegetarian but there are vegan keto diet plans.


It depends how a particular group defines KETO, highest amount carbs I have seen is 25g and still calll it KETO. Some basically try and go lot lower. Thats really going to be hard doing vegan version unless you basically drink olive oil with your lettuce leaves.

IMHO, the law of diminishing returns cuts in pretty quick. Seriously is there a real difference in 10g carbohydrate and 25g? Yea I get it the KETO people want to put their body into ketosis. Different than somebody wanting to lower carb intake to a healthier amount. I suspect average American far surpasses govt recommendation of 275g in 2000calorie diet. Grain is heavily subsidized so guess what, everything is made from such. Sweetners and starchy fillers galore.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Talking about one's eating style rates right up there with discussing religion and politics.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> My husband's aunt ran the cafeteria in Ganado, Texas. Her Czech background made for some awesome lunches.
> 
> There was also the dreaded barbecue baloney with spinach.


There is a school in Ganado? I didn't even know there was a house there.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

HermitJohn said:


> 275grams of carb in an adult 2000 calorie diet is the recommendation for a *healthy person*. Less as a part of a lower calorie diet typical of a child. More as a part of a higher calorie diet. If you are T2 trying to control your blood sugar, thats excessive. Really need to keep it down 100gram or less. And yes you can do low carb vegetarian. I think actual Keto vegetarian diet be impossible since all plant foods have carbs, but low carb vegetarian very doable.
> 
> Making this poliical is silly. Plant foods as main course is doable. Not going to kill a kid to not have meat at one meal or all meals for that matter. Good to be exposed to different way of eating once in a while. But if school hot lunches are anything like they were when I was a kid (mmm... surplus dinosaur meat) they go as absolutely cheap as possible. I remember being last in line once and they were low on soup for last like ten kids. So cook took pot soup over to the sink and added hot water. Right in front of us. Mmmm... hot water. Back then it wasnt heat and serve, they actually cooked the stuff but from govt commodities rejected by army or something. I took my lunch more often than not through elementary when lunch was supervised and class ate together with teacher hovering. In Jr. High and high school we had modular scheduling and vice principal supervising whole mess hall, kids coming and going every half hour so I just went to library during my scheduled lunch period (they didnt take attendance at lunch). If you eat breakfast and have food available when you get home, its really not big deal. Nothing says three meals a day are necessary to prevent starvation. Lot kids skip breakfast. I ate breakfast and skipped lunch. Save hassle of carrying sack lunch. Hey if you were really hungry and that was your main/only meal of day, then yea suppose school lunch better than nothing, but thats about all you can say.


"Pardon me sir, can I have some more?"


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Students at Barrowford Primary School near Nelson, Lancashire, [UK] are only offered vegetarian dinners - and kids are also urged not to bring meat in their packed lunches.

In the letter to parents last week, headteacher Rachel Tomlinson said she had made the decision to offer only vegetarian lunches over a year ago to "stop climate change".

She highlighted that the livestock industry has a huge carbon footprint and meat and dairy products "come at a huge environmental cost".

It concluded: "If you still want to send packed lunches, could you please consider meat-free options to further support us in doing our bit to reduce carbon emissions as a school community?"








Our kids' school has BANNED meat and even told us to make veggie packed lunches


PARENTS have blasted a school’s decision to go permanently “meat free”. Students at Barrowford Primary School near Nelson, Lancashire, are only offered vegetarian dinners – …




www.thesun.co.uk


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Needs to mind her own business. Liberal wacko. Delusions of power and influence.

Set up a bbq stand across the street. Hand out free plates.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

kinderfeld said:


> I think the focus is on making the main course plant based as opposed to the fruit and vegetable side dishes we normally see.


Simple enough, carrots and peas for the main course with a side of mashed taters gravy and meatloaf.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

HDRider said:


> Students at Barrowford Primary School near Nelson, Lancashire, [UK] are only offered vegetarian dinners - and kids are also urged not to bring meat in their packed lunches.
> 
> In the letter to parents last week, headteacher Rachel Tomlinson said she had made the decision to offer only vegetarian lunches over a year ago to "stop climate change".
> 
> ...


I would make the extra effort to feed my kids meat for breakfast and supper.


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## Kellyflip (11 mo ago)

You all that say its fine to have vegan only, can bring a bag lunch. 

OKAY..... how about being fair and having 2 days a week that are "meat and Dairy" only?. Then the vegans can bring a bag lunch.

I bet that would cause a firestorm.

Let the kids and parents choose.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)




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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Kellyflip said:


> You all that say its fine to have vegan only, can bring a bag lunch.
> 
> OKAY..... how about being fair and having 2 days a week that are "meat and Dairy" only?. Then the vegans can bring a bag lunch.
> 
> ...


They are told not to bring meat in their bag lunch.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

HDRider said:


> They are told not to bring meat in their bag lunch.


I think they are referring to posts about NYC schools, not the UK one.


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## Oregon1986 (Apr 25, 2017)

This is just my opinion but I think there should always be meat and vegan options available. School lunches are junk though. Two of my kids are homeschooled but my third is in public and she takes a cold lunch every day.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

joswatson1 said:


> I am applying for a UK visa. Tell me about the requirements for a bank statement for the UK visa right now. Your help would be appreciated.


Can't it wait for a little bit? We are a bit busy right now.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

mreynolds said:


> Can't it wait for a little bit? We are a bit busy right now.


I know. 
His urgency is completely ironic given that his next post is guaranteed to be a response (with a monetized hyperlink, of course) to a question that was asked in a thread that hasn’t been active since 2005.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Don't feed the trolls. Trolls don't need vegetarian meals.


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