# german short hair pointer, attacking my chickens help?not a lgd



## theemon (Jan 14, 2013)

ive had my dog 2 years, alittle longer then my son(22mo) well my dog totally ignores my son, even though my son trys to show him love all the time. my dog also sneaks food off of counters, hes now attacking my chickens... im at a loss, if i cant fix these 3 problems with him he has to go, and i cant stand to let my dog go... i know this is the wrong forum... but where else could i put it? help?


----------



## CageFreeFamily (Jul 19, 2012)

These issues are all fixable with consistent correction. I recommend contacting your local dog obedience club (if you have one) and checking your library for a basic obedience and behavior modification book. There are some good ones out there. If you don't feel able to train him yourself I would look for a trainer in your area. Some will offer help with behavioral modification as part of the cost of basic obedience. Some will work with just the behavioral mods. A good trainer will train you as well as your dog. You should be learning to work with your dog. If your dog only learns to behave for the trainer than the work is ineffective.

The food thieving is the easiest. You know that he's going to do it, so you create the opportunity when you are available to catch him stealing. Give a strong correction and place the food back on the edge of the counter to give him the chance again. Repeat as necessary and remove the food as soon as he loses interest. In the mean time take the extra care (and inconvenience) to make sure that you leave no opportunity for him to counter surf without getting caught. He will learn that it is an unacceptable behavior that holds consequences.

Similar situation with the chickens. He will have to be caught and made to understand that the fun is not worth the consequences. Your dog's personality will determine the kind of correction he will need in order to come to this conclusion. Do not allow possible interaction with the chickens in your absence, and do not allow him near them without a leash and training collar.


----------



## Haven (Aug 16, 2010)

Trying to keep a breed that was bred to hunt fowl with your chickens? Bad choice of breeds imo... It's not the dog's fault.


----------



## CageFreeFamily (Jul 19, 2012)

Haven said:


> Trying to keep a breed that was bred to hunt fowl with your chickens? Bad choice of breeds imo... It's not the dog's fault.


I don't think she's trying to use the pointer as an LGD. I think he's gaining access and killing in other situations. Theemon? Did I understand this correctly? Because if he is being used as an LGD then my suggestions do not hold appropriate.


----------



## theemon (Jan 14, 2013)

no he is not a lgd. he is my pet. see how do i explain this... my dog is smart, while we could "set him up" with the food thing, hes smart and knows not to take it while were in the room. he will wait till we're not paying attention(different room etc) then take it, all sly like too, 

on the side note, the birds are my fault, hes trained, understands a pet cat, understands other animals, just chicken=a bird. but how do i fix that?

we use a spray water bottle as sevre punishment, he hates it.


what about my dog ignoring my kid? hes jealious of my kid


----------



## CottageLife (Jul 20, 2009)

Tie a sting of pop cans together - put a few pennies in each can and tape off the tops of the cans. Tie the cans to something 'tasty' on the edge of the counter for him to grab when you leave the room. The 'can monster' will get him when he pulls the meat/bread/treats off the counter. Hopefully it will scare him away from the counters after a few tries.

My much bigger concern is the fact that your dog is telling you he doesn't love your son to hang on him, hug him, love on him and you are letting the child / forcing the issue? The dog very well may nip or bite your child to get the kid to learn to back off. Instead of 'teaching' the dog to take the hugs, teach the child to pet the dog and leave him alone when the dog goes to his 'safe spots' to be away from the child. I'd also be sure the dog is getting a lot of exercise - mental and physical due to the breed. 

No chicken experience, sorry  

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## CageFreeFamily (Jul 19, 2012)

Yes, German pointers are very smart dogs, but in my experience as a private behaviorist and trainer, there was not a dog in 20 years that I could not break of such issues. My grandmother (wife to the President of the local obedience training dog club) had a Whippet that could clean a butter dish of every last particle of butter, without moving the dish, or ever being seen. Even this level of stealth is not a barrier to training. 

CottageLife's suggestion of what is commonly referred to as a 'shaker can' is excellent. Used in this way you can create a set up that allows you to walk away from the situation. You can use the same tool in an active way by putting a few pennies in a single can and throwing it into the room (or the chicken scuffle) when your dog is breaking a house rule. This works for an infinite list of behavioral issues, from inappropriate barking to door scratching. 
After their first experience with a shaker can, many dogs will respond equally to a slight rattle of the can in your hand, and in the case of my grandmother's Whippet, the mere placement of the can near the off limits object - be it the sofa or food on the counter.

As for your dog's disinterest in your son, I agree again with CottageLife. Forcing this issue endangers your son and sets your dog up to fail in a life altering way. You cannot force a dog to love your child, but you can foster respect over time as your son ages by including your son in the feeding, grooming and training of your dog. When it comes to dogs, respect often equals affection. If you can trust your dog completely, allow your son to give your dog food treats, and fill his food bowl. When he is old enough, teach your son to work obedience commands with your dog, exercising the Come, Down and Sit commands. 

Rewarding eye contact with food and praise is an effective tool in creating an obedience relationship with your dog. You would do this by putting food up near your nose and giving the 'Look' command. When your dog makes eye contact reward him with food and simple praise of 'Good'. This trains your dog to pay attention to you and wait to find out what you want. You will see this eye contact in the most highly trained dogs in the world, from Schutzhund to Herding.


----------



## theemon (Jan 14, 2013)

wow thx for the info


----------



## aart (Oct 20, 2012)

Training the dog _owner_ is _*SO*_ important!! This is a great thread.


----------



## earthkitty (Mar 3, 2011)

Why is it an issue if the dog ignores your son?

As to the other issues, just don't set the dog up for failure. I have a Lab that has those two issues; food stealing and chicken chasing (I have no doubt that she would kill one if she caught it).

As a result, I don't leave her unattended around food or the chickens.


----------



## Lazy J (Jan 2, 2008)

We have a Deutsch Kurzhaar, a Geman Shorthair bred to the German standard, which has a greater prey drive than the typical American GSP. We have no problem with her chasing our chickens. We simply worked on her avoidance of them with a pinch collar.


----------



## saritamae (Jun 2, 2012)

My older dog is 13 and STILL ignores my son, who is 6. He will come for treats, and takes food from DS very nicely...just has zero desire to play with him. When your son is older and can throw a ball and can speak clearly enough to give your dog commands and treats, you have a better chance of seeing them interact. At this age, there is just the chance that your son will (accidentally) hurt your dog and your dog could react in a negative way. When my son was about that age I would just set him up in his high chair or at a small table with dog safe food, knowing that he would spill and/or give some to the dog. That way the dog associated my son with positive things (food) and it became a positive experience. When DS got older, I would have him give the dogs their treats when they came inside, but not until he was over the age of 3. Again, my whole goal was to make sure that the dogs experiences with DS were positive. I know you want your dog to love your son as much as you do. With time and training he will, or he will at least respect him. Start off by showing your son that he HAS to respect the dog and his personal space and then show your dog that when your son is around the dog gets goodies. It will take time, but eventually they will get along. 
I know that it is possible to train your dog not to kill chickens, but he IS a bird dog. Why tempt him? We have a dachshund who is the picture of her breed. They were bred to kill badgers and other vermin. She has gotten a rabbit cage open and pulled out a rabbit that weighed twice as much as she did with every intention of killing it. Rather than take any chances, we just make sure that the rabbits are locked up or she is on a leash. It isn't fair to be mad at her for doing what her instincts are telling her to do, so I just make sure not to rub it in her face. The positive side to that is that in the winter when we get mice in our garage she can take care of the problem in just a few short minutes. 
Good luck - everyone here has had some excellent training ideas that will help you out. With some work you will be able to keep your dog and you will both be happy.


----------



## JPiantedosi (Apr 23, 2012)

I own a handful of GSPs they all have alot of prey drive. the quickest and easiest way to break you dog from chasing/killing chickens is to set him up to fail. Your dog needs to understand that the action of catching the chickens is not nearly as memorable as what happens next.

Introduce a little Edison medicine.

I would break your GSP the same way thousands of gundog owners have trash broke thousands of dogs. Get a Training collar and cut the dog loose, when he gets close to the chickens and makes a move COOK him. High setting untill he makes a move to leave the area of the chickens. as soon as you dog reacts accordingly release the pressure. Any time the dog makes a move towards the chickens hit him again.

Now.... for the issue of counter surfing (grabbing food). set some tasety morsel on the counter, just back from the edge. set a half a dozen mouse traps along the edge of the counter, it shouldnt take more than a couple incidents to teach your dog the counter is a scary place. 

As far as your child goes, I wouldn't worry about it. I have 1 washed out GSP (3yo) in the house and he is not overly affectionate to my 13mo daughter, we don't push the issue and dont make any bones about it. One day I looked up and my daughter was using my dog as a junglegym. He now follows her from room to room, and ALWAYS knows where the kid is. However, he is not necesarily affectionate and doesn't "play" but it is obviouse that they are buddies. I would just let it bee and see what happens (within reason)

I realize some wont agree with theses methods. If you have an questions you can PM me.

Jim


----------



## Rock (Jan 5, 2009)

Old Bill Kohler had a way you set up the chicken on a cardboard, with a fence charger, the dog got zapped in his mouth. END OF PROBLEM.
The mouse trap thing I use for trash can surfers, for toilet drinker I use mono fishing line and just drop the seat on them when they go to get a drink:shrug: Always works for me?
For the kid, have him spit in the dogs bowl and you stir it in before you give it to the dog.



JPiantedosi said:


> I own a handful of GSPs they all have alot of prey drive. the quickest and easiest way to break you dog from chasing/killing chickens is to set him up to fail. Your dog needs to understand that the action of catching the chickens is not nearly as memorable as what happens next.
> 
> Introduce a little Edison medicine.
> 
> ...


----------



## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

Haven said:


> Trying to keep a breed that was bred to hunt fowl with your chickens? Bad choice of breeds imo... It's not the dog's fault.


You should either fence the chickens or the dog.


----------



## unregistered41671 (Dec 29, 2009)

On demand shock collars work well.


----------



## Tommyice (Dec 5, 2010)

We have always had GSPs. We never paid extra to get one with a brain though

To keep ours off the back of the couch (he would go up there to look out the window), we put old fashioned mouse traps. He triggered one or two and then we put them there without being set. Never did he climb on the back of the sofa again. 

My pit used to steal stuff off of my dresser. I used balloons to keep him off of that. They would pop and scare him and he stopped climbing on the dresser.


----------



## Terri (May 10, 2002)

Until my dog was steady with the chickens, he stayed on a leash when outside. That was a long 4 months. I scolded him every time he pointed at a chicken or showed any real interest in one.

And, with my toddlers, the dogs were never alone with them. Ever. A kid might not MEAN to hurt the dog by touching an eye or putting a finger down an ear, but they can injure the dog. The dog will then very possibly bite in self defense. So, if I went to the bathroom the dog came too! And, if I was going to be too busy to supervise, the dog was shut in a bedroom. 

The children outgrew the touch-everything stage when they were 3??? and I was very relieved! Since they were no longer a risk to the dog, who would then be a risk to them, I no longer had to hover.

A bird dog has a high prey drive. They do take quite some training to be around chickens.


----------



## terradura (Mar 19, 2012)

The approach of CottageLife is great. We used it when one of our dogs started sneaking onto the couch (not allowed here) when we weren't around. Scolding just wasn't working, so I rigged a string of old cans and plastic bottles so when she jumped on the couch all the stuff came crashing down. Very startling. This dog wouldn't even go in the same room as the couch for weeks and never got on the couch again. Dogs are superstitious. If something dramatic happens that they don't understand it makes a big impression. And the bonus of this approach is that the dog doesn't associate the correction with you -- you are still the best buddy.


----------



## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

So, which came first, the bird dog or the birds?

Mon


----------

