# New at bees need help



## sv.maple (Feb 16, 2014)

I dont know if this will help me but cant hurt. Ive tried keeping bees 3 times and each time they die by winter. I said im not good with bees and didnt try last yr said was done. Guess im not a quitter and theyre not goinna beat me! Im going to order another 4-5 frame nuc for spring. The hive boxes i use are prob 30+ years old put new wax things in them but the bees only seem to use one part of the box each time. They seem to be doin good then they die. Any help be great. Im in northern vermont


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Well it could be several things. What hive set up do you have them in? 1 deep, 2 deeps? You may be giving them more room than they can keep warm. Do you get them early enough in the season for them to store enough honey to eat through the winter? Are you insulating your hives for winter. While I have no experience with that, it is my understanding that it is necessary in your location.

Watch thefatbeeman's videos. https://www.youtube.com/user/fineshooter/videos I also suggest checking out www.beesource.com

I strongly suggest that you find your local bee club and get some advice for your specific area. Beekeepers are always willing to help other beekeepers. Many of us are addicted and justify out addiction by getting others hooked


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## sv.maple (Feb 16, 2014)

I do one deep box and the last yr i tried it was full of bees n frames on one side full. I put another deep box on hoping theyd use whole box but only used one side then they swarmed on me in july. That attempt the bees made till about november and died. Had the box wrapped in tarpaper for it to be little warmer. I get the bees about end of april as early as i can get them. I wondered if the one side thing was cause of the sun for some reason. The side they use would be the side sun hits all day but id think warm durin summer. Maybe i have in bad spot not sure. I actully found a bee keepers club and im going to thier meeting tomorrow night and its only 7 miles from my house so hope can find someone willin to help me


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## sv.maple (Feb 16, 2014)

Also wonder if new boxes would help


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

New boxes would be a good idea. You may have a build up of some kind in the old ones. You never know....maybe at one time there were wasp nests in them and someone sprayed. You just don't know when you are using used equipment. I am really glad that you found your local bee club! I feel confident that someone will be able to help you there.

As to the bees only using one half of a box. There are several things it could be. The first that comes to mind is a honey barrier. The brood nest will generally be basket ball shaped. Sometimes new beekeepers don't realize that since we are dealing with flat rectangular pieces in the form of the frames, but if you could make a 3D image of where the brood is being laid it will be a sphere....or an oblong sphere. The edges of the brood ball will take up a smaller and smaller area on the outer frames and often times the very outer frames are full of honey and pollen with no brood at all. Now, if you were to remove the middle frame from your brood nest and replace it with a frame of honey, you would discover that the queen will only be laying new eggs in whatever half the brood chamber she was in when you inserted the frame of honey. She will not cross the 'honey barrier' to go lay in the frames on the other side of the frame of honey. If the bees have room they will remove the honey from that frame and move it up in the hive to give the queen room to lay. It is possible that your bees created a honey barrier and that is why all of the box wasn't utilized. You could have also had a very low producing queen which seems unlikely. Usually the bees will rear a new queen and supercede a failing queen. 

Hope you don't give up and that you can find a mentor at your bee club!


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Since they are only using one side of the box I got to ask if all the frames have the same type of foundation? Have you moved full frames to the opposite side of the hive body? If you did what did they do? If they left that side abbanding the full frames I would say some thing is wrong with you hive bodies, burn them. Probably be a good idea any way if they were only using one side and swarmed to just burn the mess and start all new.

 Al


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Are you using plastic or wax foundation? I assume that the frames you put in were foundation and not drawn comb.


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## sv.maple (Feb 16, 2014)

I think im going to make new boxes and frames. I do have some wood and some plastic ones not sure now where the plastic ones were but i might have had on one side. Ill have all wood ones this time just to be sure. Thanks for the advice


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## GeoCitizen (Feb 24, 2014)

I'm going to stick my neck out and say that new boxes are not going to help, although I agree it surely won't hurt and affords you the best chance. I don't think they will help because you said your bees "die *by* winter". What does that mean? October? November? If that's the case your boxes are either very contaminated with something (new boxes will help) or you are doing something very systemically wrong! I would not buy a 4-5 frame nuk. You are wasting your money. Instead, buy a queen and a 3 pound package of bees. Don't plan on harvesting any honey. If you are using 10 frame deeps (I'm moving to mediums this year!) you should be going into to winter with two deeps. The upper deep needs to be 100% full of honey and pollen. The lower will have a couple frames and brood area. 

Join a beekeepers group! Ignorance is so very expensive. http://www.vermontbeekeepers.org/resources/beekeeping-clubs/vermont-beekeeping-clubs

Good luck!


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

I lost a lot of bees when I first started out because I wasn't smart enough to feed them in Aug-Sept. when it's dry around here. It could be something as simple as their not having ample food supply. Unless you're in them on a regular pasis it takes a while to be able to read the bees and fully understand what's going on at any given time.
Another thought is the use of pesticides on crops near you at that time of year. Or the info thaat's out there about how the gmo plants maintain a pesticide through out 6 generations of seed. France banned this practice in 1999 and has recovered from their CCD.


Wade


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