# Border collie help wanted



## homedad (Feb 19, 2008)

We are new border collie/aus shepherd owners and are looking for your best training suggestions. We raise sheep,pigs,chickens, and one very pregnant goat. This dog is 6 months and has a 1 1/2 yo blk lab companion. They are best buddies. He shows good instinct and we would like him to be more disciplined. He has some bad habits such as herding tires on moving vehicles. We have used a shock collar for these dangerous situations and are starting to see some improvement. Any words of advice would be great. Thanks.


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

Border collies can be a little obcessive so the best approach is to redirect that drive with basic obedience lessons to get control of the dog. Theres a reason this breed rules the agility course that drive energy and inteligence all comes together for a purpose. You might have better luck with a lunge line and oral correct to stop wheel chasing the line gets control and the stop.command given can be enforced shock collars give mixed results and you dont really have control with one. Consistancy matters in dog traing


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## BarbadosSheep (Jun 27, 2011)

Your best bet is to find a good herding dog forum. If you mess up now, it may not be fixable. Like Ross said, these dogs tend to be obsessive and need a job. With no job, he will herd what ever he finds that he thinks needs herding. You may think you are breaking him from herding just cars but you may be breaking his desire to herd anything. Shock collars must be used VERY carefully. I recently spoke to a border collie trainer and competitor and he said he does not sell his dogs as pets, ever. They have such a strong working instinct that people who buy them for pets are unhappy with them. They need to be working. And when not working, they need to be kenneled and not running loose. Look for a good trainer now or find a good herding dog forum. Good luck!!


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## olivehill (Aug 17, 2009)

The forums at bordercollie.org seem to have some really knowledgable people and there are several threads in the archives dealing with obsessive behavior. We just recently brought home a BC pup for use with our hog herds and there is a definite difference between him and all the dogs I've raised of other breeds so I've been surfing their archives often.  

Have you had him all along or did you just get him now at six months?


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## rileyjo (Feb 14, 2005)

I've been a member at bordercollie.org for many years. Take time to read and feel free to ask questions. Be prepared that you wont get much support for using a shock collar on such a young dog.

Your pup doesn't sound at all obsessive, just busy and looking for direction from you. Maybe limit his off leash freedom until you have better control of him. A border collie doesn't want to just chase a car tire, he wants to control it's motion. He will grip that tire if he gets frustrated and the outcome will be horrible for you, your kids and that pretty dog.


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## homedad (Feb 19, 2008)

Thanks for all the info. We are not big fans of thw shock collar either. We have been primarily lab owners for years with good discipline. A very different dog for sure. Honestly the shock collar was only used once at the road and he has not gone there since. He no longer has it on for many of the same reasons folks have said. We are having a good time with him. I dont think we are looking for him to become a competition dog but we would like him to help around the farm. I guess I need to keep him on a leash at all times eh? How do you get the farm work done then? Ww do crate him with the lab when we are gone and that works fine. He seems very intelligent and I just to fgure a.way to channel his energy so it is beneficial and I can still get work done. He is young and I know he will grow out of some bad habits. I will look into the bc forum. Thanks again


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

While growing up, and in training I like a fenced yard for pup to run in to keep him out of trouble. Training is in controlled settings with a line dragging whenever around stock or any place the pup can get into trouble. Once the dog is well started in training with a good recall and stop, then I take them out off line. If you want pup to help with farm chores I highly recommend finding a mentor/trainer to help you get started. Look for stockdog trials in your area. Some trainers aren't so good, so try to get around a little and ask lots of questions. Watch other dogs work. For border collie trials in your area you might also check out USBCHA.org. Even though you aren't looking at trialling your dog, it's a good idea look at what your dog is capable of and learn more about how to get the best out of him. Here's a link to some videos of one of my dogs as she is progressing in training. She's a year and a half now(border collie) . Scroll down the page, the bottom videos are the oldest starting when she is about 8 months old, to last February. In the Feb, and a few before, videos you will notice she no longer has a line on and is trustworthy around stock. Early on you can see where she is a little more erratic and doing some chasing and gripping. She is now a good all around farm dog, besides a competition dog. Car chasing: If you have a good relationship with your dog, meaning they stop whatever they are doing "now" when you tell them, it becomes much easier to squash unwanted behaviors. If you can't stop your dog from chasing a car, you probably won't have much luck stopping him from chasing a sheep or goat into a fence either. Lots and lots of training! Just to add, I never ever use a shock collar on any of my dogs.
Link http://claycreekfarm.info/GRETA.htm


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## Davymax (Aug 27, 2007)

6-7 months is very young to train. I agree with an earlier post, you should go on a border collie website and learn as much as you can.

Actually, that should have been done before you got the dog. If you don't have the time to spend with this dog, you will be doing the dog a disservice.

I don't mean to sound harsh, just real.


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

I agree with Davymax, 6-7 months is too young to start serious stockdog training. You can work on obedience and manners though. Don't take him out around the stock and teach him not to chase if you are going to want him to be a herding dog.


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## spinandslide (Jun 6, 2008)

Get their OB down pat..all stockwork is based in OB. Look into a good local club that offers OB classes and start in the puppy class. solid OB skils are a must before you introduce stock work evetualy. Look into finding a BC mentor..not a stockdog, but a BC..many stockdog trainers dont know how to train BC's..they function and work differently then other stockdogs like aussies and heelers.

Find ways to mentally and physically challenge the dog. They need mental work and physical exercise or they can develop neurotic destructive behavior.

"I cant" is not in a BC's vocabulary..they are bar none the best dogs out there..(yes, I am biased!)..


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## homedad (Feb 19, 2008)

Thanks spin and slide thats the kind of info I am looking for. We coni


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## homedad (Feb 19, 2008)

We continue to work on the basics but how do you not intro sheep when they are right in front of him all the time? He wants to herd everything, chickenz, which are free range, cats and kittens, ect...he actually helps when the animals get out. He knows they live behind the barn door and helps get them back there. Like I said be fore he showz good instinct.. I like the suggestions of a mentor and will look into it.


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Starting a pup younger on stock can be done, but very risky if you don't know what you are doing. If something charges him, or stands up to him much he can be permanently turned off stock or wishy washy. If pup isn't fast enough to get around the stock and runs straight in to control, this can be a lasting habit, hard to change. Younger puppies don't tend to make as good of choices as a little bit older pup who's talents and minds are more mature. I can't stress enough to keep puppy put up if you aren't with him. Don't let him run fences chasing stock from the other side, don't let him sit and stare at stock for hours, etc. He's best put up somewhere near, or in the house where he can't see the stock all the time. One of my dogs I started at about 12 weeks, along with his half brother. They both have turned out to be amazing farm and trial dogs. Here is a blog I created with thoughts as I brought them both along in training. It may help you, or may not. Start with the oldest posts first, pictures too. 
Bruce & Murk

One important part of the training on these two dogs what that I always had a seasoned dog on hand to help, and keep pups from getting into situations. I also have sheep that are very used to being worked by dogs.


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