# The Most Efficient Cartridge



## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

What is the most efficient centerfire cartridge?

For the purposes of this discussion, let's mandate a few factors:

1. We're only considering cartridges capable of effectively dispatching deer-sized game, at +/- 200 yards.
2. The cartridge should be able to use a wide range of bullet weights, including cast bullets.
3. The cartridge must be able to use several powders and use them very efficiently.

Which cartridge wins?


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## SectorSteve (Nov 29, 2003)

My choice would be a .308


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## wogglebug (May 22, 2004)

You've set it up so nothing can win.

To judge efficiency, you must be able to maximise or minimise something, and measure it - cost, energy, velocity, penetration, something.

At best, I think your question is asking 
"what is the most _*effective class*_ of cartridge" 
(according to some subjective criterion); rather than 
"what is the most _*efficient single*_ cartridge".
(according to some criterion yet unspecified).

More detail needed.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Jolly said:


> What is the most efficient centerfire cartridge?
> 
> For the purposes of this discussion, let's mandate a few factors:
> 
> ...


1 efficient normaly means small cases so lets just look at some volumes looking at usefull case capacity

30-30 = 2.45cc
223/5.56x45=1.87
6x45=1.87
6mm br rem=2.18
357=
7.62x39=2.03
30 carbine=1.00
7-30 waters=2.55
32-40=2.20
32 win spl=2.54
357 mag=1.15
44 rem mag=1.63
454 casull= 2.19
300 aac blackout= not sure but less than 1.87

so you can see the 30 carbine and 357 have the smallest cases but are real borderline on the effectively dispatching deer sized game at 200yards

efficency in a cartridge often also means high preasure but one must consider more than just powder into the efficency of a round what about brass life brass can go brass price is often 3-4 times the cost of the powder so if you need just a touch more powder and a bit less pressure you brass may be reloaded longer 

44 mag from a rifle can take a deer at 200 
as could 454 casull but a bit of a step gets you into rifle territory 

1.87 for a 223 and probably use a heavier bullet taking up more case capacity 

2 get it in a wide range of bullets weights and cast well cast helps exclude any thing under 30 cal or at least under 7mm for the most part 

so 44 mag , 300 blackout, 7.62x39 454 casull ,30-30 and 32 win spl are still in the running 

3 available loads in lots of powder and bullet choices , well 300 black out is making fast progress in this area , bot 30-30 and 44 mag have the most available data for the most powders and bullets including cast lead 

I would go 30-30 because you dont have to fill the case and 30-30 does very light loads well all the way from a tiny charge on 2.7 to 3gr of bullseye and a 90gr swc or 7-10gr unique or full powder stuff with 3031 or 4895 or several others 

most anything black out can do 30-30 did a long time ago , well except that auto loading thing i am not aware of any of those

so if you are thinking auto a 300 black out otherwise a 30-30 looks good from the availability angle


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## tarbe (Apr 7, 2007)

I know this is just for fun....

I would start on the small end with the 6x47 or similar, and go up to the .358 Win on the large end.

There are a whole bunch in between!


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

The most efficient cartridge is the one that has the most efficient shooter doing the hand loading and pulling the trigger after plenty of practice and having the proper sight picture.

 Al


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## BadFordRanger (Apr 26, 2014)

In my book, the most efficient cartridge is the one that will get the most of the jobs done that might pop up for it to do, and do it well.
In order to do that, the shooter has more to do with whether the cartridge will do what it is suppose to do or not. 
Plus there is a list of other things that will come into play also. 
For instance, 
#1: Are you going to have to back pack you ammo for a day?

#2: Are you going to be forced to grab what you can and run for a week, a month, or longer? 

#3: What are the targets going to be during this time? 

#4: Are you going to need to reload? be able to reload as you fire them?


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

If not for the cast bullet requirement, I would have said 250 Savage...Produces a lot of velocity for powder used, is fairly good on brass life and will make an effective varminter with the right bullets and powder, but is also good on deer with the heavier bullets.

The 30-30 is a good choice, for all the reasons mentioned above. And, if you have the right kind of rifle, a hot 30-30 can get pretty close to a .308 with spitzer bullets.

No, right now I'm leaning old skool, either the 6.5x55 or 7x57 (or their modern equivalents, the .260 Remington or the 7mm-08). Neither sucks a lot of powder, both tend to kill better in the woods than they do on paper, they're easy on brass, easy on barrels and will do well on even elk at 200 yards. I think I'm going to land on the side of the 6.5, just because of the long range ability of the bullets.

My pick? The 6.5x55, just because of the extra case capacity with large cast bullets, as compared to the 260.


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## moonwolf (Sep 20, 2004)

My choices would be .30-06 or .270


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

one important thing to remember is you don't to go full speed all the time so ther is efficency of case by nature and there is efficency of case by use 

lets say you have one rifle and you just sat down in a location where you can't see beyond 50 yards , you can achieve a load capable of taking deer sized game at 50 yards with say 7.5 gr unique in a 30-30 with a 170 gr bullet if you know where it is going to go 

like wise you are sitting on your back porch and spot a bunny in the garden range 35 yards , slide in a bunny buster this is a 90gr swc with 2.7gr or so of bulleseye or other fast pistol powder in proper amount , and pop you have a bunny dinner o go with the beans it was trying to eat

rimmed cartridges head space off the rim , you never worry about pushing the shoulder forward with repeated use of very light rounds like in a rimless case 

so lets say you have a lee loader in 30-30 a 30-30 rifle some 170gr cast round flat and some 90 gr swc so any place a 22lr would have worked the 90gr bunny busters work as well or better for similar recoil and cost , you could have a bunny buster worked up that shoots to your sights to 50 yards a mid range 100 yard load and a 200 yard load worked up 

many guys work up loads like this for their rifle silhouettes shoots 

so when you take this into account , and also that with marking brass then opening the flash channel for use in ultralight loads with small amounts of pistol powder to may your bunny busters work in a much larger case lie 30-06 and not have shoulder set back , there is a lot you can do 

303 brit , 7.62x54 , 30-06 , 30-40 all have some very cool abilities they are not small but can be very efficiently used when not taking larger game , and all will take a bear , deer , elk , moose , but can also be used with reduced to take wood chuck , rabbit , squirrel and such


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## Jluck (Jul 26, 2014)

The 6.5 Grendel is my favorite for powder consumption vs. Performance. Effective on game to 400, awesome on paper to 1300 and doing it on under 30 grains powder!


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## MichaelK! (Oct 22, 2010)

One way of quantifying efficiency would be calculating how much power you can get per grain of gun powder. In this case, I'd say that straight-walled pistol cartridges are the most efficient in terms of raw power/grain.

I'd vote for the 44 magnum.

Here are some numbers comparing the 44 with a 30-30. Taking some data out of my Speer manual, 35 grains of H335 pushes a 150 grain bullet to 2400fps, with 1919 footpounts of energy.

1919fp/35g= *54.8fp/g*

For the 44 magnum, 25 grains of H110 pushes a 240 grain bullet to 1900fps (in a rifle) with 1922 footpounds of energy

1922fp/25g= *76.9fp/g*

My own load pushing a Lyman 245 grain SWC with 16 grains of Blue Dot gets 1800fps and 1761 footpounds for a fp/g of *110*.

Getting back to the real world now, I have used my .44 to harvest a deer, and I can attest that a 240 grain hollowpoint will pass completely through a deer's chest at 100 yards, so I have no illusions as to the potency of the .44 magnum. I've yet to take one with my own hard-cast SWC, but that's on my list of things to do, just not in the Condor range of California. Because the .44 is so powder efficient, I can load twice as many cartridges with a pound of powder than I could with any bottlenecked cartridge.

One additional plug for the .44. Any pistol cartridge can be utilized with plain-base cast bullets that don't require a gas check, which broadens bullet selection more.


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## Silvercreek Farmer (Oct 13, 2005)

45/70 

You might get it done with a little less lead or a little less powder but it'll do it all...


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## cotton45c (Jun 23, 2014)

.308
many bullets to pick from, easy to learn to shoot.
ifin i could only have one centerfire rifle it would be a .308


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## tarbe (Apr 7, 2007)

Silvercreek Farmer said:


> 45/70
> 
> You might get it done with a little less lead or a little less powder but it'll do it all...


I had to "like" this, just because I love the 45/70. 

I agree...it sure uses up a lot of lead! Especially when casting the really big boolits.

But it is very satisfying to thump something...anything, with a 430+ grain boolit!


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Jolly said:


> No, right now I'm leaning old skool, either the 6.5x55 or 7x57


As I read your OP I was thinking these very same two.... Two of my most favorite guns are in this cal..


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## oldasrocks (Oct 27, 2006)

I had a loader friend heat up some 30-30's and put in a 115 grain bullet. It shot flat out to 250 yards and YES it would drop a deer even farther out.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

.243 Win would be on the top of my list. DO most any hunting on the planrt I'm likely to do (my chances of affording the big 5 in Africa or Grizz hunting are pretty small)
Dutch


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## Pops2 (Jan 27, 2003)

MichaelK! said:


> One way of quantifying efficiency would be calculating how much power you can get per grain of gun powder. In this case, I'd say that straight-walled pistol cartridges are the most efficient in terms of raw power/grain.
> 
> I'd vote for the 44 magnum.
> 
> ...


You might want to start learning how to cast bronze bullets.


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## MichaelK! (Oct 22, 2010)

Pops2 said:


> You might want to start learning how to cast bronze bullets.


Gotta lathe now, so how about custom turned instead?


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## Vahomesteaders (Jun 4, 2014)

By far the 30-06 is the most versatile round ever. Many choices to choose from. It has taken more game then any other round on the planet. Love mine. Though I primarily hunt these days with a 300 wsm and a 7 mm mag. Both awesome rounds as well. I would stay away from 270 and down. They are good rounds and I've taken many deer with Em, but at 200 plus yards if the shot is a hair off, they run a long ways.


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