# Best breed for grass-fed



## gabbyraja (Feb 27, 2012)

Maybe I need to ask this question, because I'm stumped. I've mentioned grass-feeding my milk sheep twice on this board (my only 2 posts thus far), and more than twice been told I'm an idiot for thinking I could (not quite in those words, but the sentiment was there). However, I know that you can grass-feed anything. What do you think sheep ate when they were wild? Were there large grain fields that they browsed themselves? Of course not. Grazing animals are meant to eat grass, by nature's design. Does output increase with more calories/unnatural nutrients? I'm sure it does. Does that have to come from grain? I don't think it does. If lambing is timed correctly ewes give birth during the time of rapidly growing green grass, that with higher protein and nutrient content. From everything I've read, that is supposed to be enough.

Now, I've been allowing myself to be called an idiot, because frankly, I don't know a whole lot about raising an animal for milk. I've raised Katahdin sheep for a short time (through a particularly insidious bout of bottle jaw, no less), so I'm not totally new to sheep in general. However, what I know about grass-fed animals comes from the nutrition-to-humans side, not as much on the nutrition-to-the-animal side.

I _do_ know that an animal fed the diet intended for it by nature is a healthier animal. And nature certainly never intended corn or soy for my sheep. So, I find it hard to believe that I must feed them commercial grain. There must be something I'm missing...?

"Milk from exclusively grass-fed animals has nearly five times the amount of Conjugated Linoleic Acid, and the perfect balance of Omega-3 and Omega-6 fatty acids. (Grain-fed cows produce milk skewed heavily towards Omega-6). Grass-fed animals give a lower output of milk. Hence, it has a much higher concentration of vitamins and nutrients than that from animals pumped with growth hormones and fattened on grain."

This is absolutely 100% true of any milk or meat-producing animal. And what's healthier for us, is healthier for them, too. You HAVE to be able to exclusively grass-feed your sheep. HAVE to. 

So, the only thing I can think is that maybe it's the breed that most milk-producing sheep farmers raise? Maybe because these breeds have been bred to produce many lambs and large quantities of milk, which is only sustainable through supplementation? Corn and wheat in most of the world are no longer self-sustaining, because we have hybridized and GMed it so badly it cannot live without us. Perhaps the same has been done to sheep?

So, if this is the case, I need a non-modern milk breed. I need a traditional/heritage breed that can live on grass and give my children nutritious milk. Please direct me toward a good breed for this! (Leicester maybe?) Then I can come back with the missing piece of knowledge and know what I'm talking about and feel like less of an numbskull. I just don't understand how a natural creature could REQUIRE an unnatural diet...


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## gabbyraja (Feb 27, 2012)

I found this on Icelandic http://www.kindhornfarm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=73&Itemid=120 100% grass-fed, even when milking. I knew it could be done. Any other heritage breeds like this?


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## J.T.M. (Mar 2, 2008)

"Milk from exclusively grass-fed animals has nearly five times the amount of Conjugated Linoleic Acid, and the perfect balance of Omega-3 and Omega-6 fatty acids. (Grain-fed cows produce milk skewed heavily towards Omega-6). Grass-fed animals give a lower output of milk. Hence, it has a much higher concentration of vitamins and nutrients than that from animals pumped with growth hormones and fattened on grain."

I know nothing about this scientific stuff, nor do I want to clutter my brain with it. I think there are more then a few people here that do not feed any grain AT ALL- myself included .
Plant plenti of lugumes in your pasture and your set to go.Maybe shop around for choice geanatics as well ( pardon the spelling ) .


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## Ronney (Nov 26, 2004)

Gabby, I don't milk sheep (although I breed them for meat and wool) but I do milk cows - and they are 100% grass fed other than supplementary hay over winter.

I don't get into the scientific stuff either, I drink my own milk because I prefer it and it tastes nicer However, as with cattle where there are beef breeds and dairy breeds, sheep are the same. There are meat breeds and milk breeds although the only one that comes to mind at the moment are the Friesian but there are many more. 

If you have good boardband connection, do a bit of research on milk breeds and look at what is available that will do well on grass in the area that you live. 

Cheers,
Ronnie


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## RedTartan (May 2, 2006)

gabbyraja said:


> I found this on Icelandic http://www.kindhornfarm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=73&Itemid=120 100% grass-fed, even when milking. I knew it could be done. Any other heritage breeds like this?


I'm raising Icelandics right now. The article you posted by Susan Mongold of Tongue River Farm is why I bought Icelandic sheep. (In fact, one of my rams was born at Tongue River Farm. His fleece is coarse, but I'm breeding for milkiness and that's one of the things she bred for.) This is my first year with them so I can only speak with with authority for winter living so far. 

I fed nothing but hay all winter long. Free choice as we use round bales. They've held their condition beautifully. In Iceland they feed the pregnant ewes fish meal during the last 6 weeks of pregnancy. To replicate that, I just started feeding my girls sheep feed mixed half and half with soybean meal. I'll be scoring them constantly to make sure they don't gain too much on it. If you object to soy, you may want to find something else high in protein for those last weeks of pregnancy. Traditionally, they have had some supplementation at this time. After they lamb, I plan only on giving the small amount of grain necessary to get them willingly to the milk stand. 

My flock is very small right now (10 ewes and 2 rams) They are all registered though. I won't be selling any ewes for years, but keep us in mind for your ram if you decide to go with icelandics.


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

Do you want to start a sheep dairy or just have a bit of sheep milk for the house from time to time? The two things are entirely different. 

Yes, animals used to be able to get along without grain. They grazed in perfect pastures to their heart's content, skipping joyfully over the flowery hills to the fresh-water stream. They never got worms and their fleeces were perfect too if you want to believe that. But at the same time, they were not asked to produce copious amounts of milk. *That's the difference.* You're asking them to eat what they naturally eat but do what they normally don't do. They naturally produce enough milk to feed their young for a few months and then it's over. A dairy not only asks a sheep to produce as much milk as possible, but for as long as possible. And that's what you're asking us, right? can that be done on grass? I'm not a nay sayer..... *It probably can be done *with the right sheep, the right pasture, the right care and the right amount of money and time to invest into breeding stock that can do it. But I would wonder how easily and how profitably unless you invest in a dairy-type sheep. And of course, profitabililty depends on market.

Think of sheep more like beef cattle raising their young. Can they do it on grass alone- yes. Beef cattle aren't like dairy cattle that have been bred to produce 10x what 1 calf a year can drink. Today's dairy cow isn't anything close to what cows used to be when they naturally fed on grass alone. Neither is today's dairy sheep. 

Yes, there are milky lines of primative sheep. I raise Finnsheep. They produce a LOT of milk. They have to to support 4 babies at a time. To get that milk for myself, I'd have to either feed milk replacer to the lambs ....or feed grain to the mommas so they produce enough milk for all of us. Either one is going to cost me. Feeding the mommas the grain is the better bet than milk replacer. Even then, my sheep won't produce milk for 10 months of the year like a dairy cow will. To get my sheep to produce milk for a longer amount of time, I'd have to feed them grain. In fact, I get them to wean their lambs naturally by stopping the grain supplement. I bought finns because they can be raised without the grain. But,I see no reason not to help the momma though their difficult last months of pregnancies with a little grain. It takes 1-2 lbs a day per ewe. It's more profitable for me to have healthy mommas and lambs than worry about it. Their grain - a mix of wheat, oats, corn and sweet feed costs me $20 a month.

If you come to a public forum asking questions, you are going to get answers. They may not all be what you want them to be. Criticizing others for trying to help was in poor taste. You can take advice you get or leave it. I find that most people on this forum give an honest opinion. They are so very helpful. Unless you're down in general chat, I doubt that you've were called an idiot. If you think you can have a grass only sheep dairy go for it. Why come back and ask the same question over again expecting to get a different answer?

Grass fed is all the rage now. It's a good thing in my opinion. But it might not work in every circumstance. Grain isn't the big, bad monster everyone makes it out to be. It does have a purpose. It's has definately been over used. I've found that when people try to sell you on something, they usually use the two extremes of each side to illustrate their point. I find the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. Not all soil will support good grass growth. Not all areas of the country get enough rain to support grass growth. We don't know your location so the question of if YOU can do it or not remains to be seen.

I disagree that just because an animal produces less milk, that milk has to be filled with more nutrients. Are there GMO wheat varieties? Isn't that kind of like the gardeners that are determined not to have any GMO veggies in their gardens but are totally unaware thatt AREN'T any GMO tomatoes, potatoes, celery or lettuces or any other home vegetable crop out there? But because they've been told to avoid GMO, the beat the GMO band wagon..... I'm not GMO fan, but I'm not opposed to the truth either. I'd worry more about that GMO alfalfa in the hay you'll be feeding than the wheat.

http://www.gmo-compass.org/eng/grocery_shopping/crops/22.genetically_modified_wheat.html
"Right now, no genetically modified wheat is being grown anywhere in the world. Plans to introduce GM wheat in North America were abandoned in 2004. Nevertheless, scientists are still exploring ways of improving wheat using genetic engineering. "


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## cshire (Feb 1, 2011)

Some basic dairy sheep info. Not much discussion of feeding regimens grass or otherwise.

http://www.sheep101.info/dairy.html

Stockman Grass Farmer is a monthly publication that deals with grass feeding. I am only 3 months into my subscription so far, but will keep my eye open for any info on dairy sheep.


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## lambs.are.cute (Aug 15, 2010)

I have a suffolk ewe who will feed 3+ lambs on grass. I bought from Utah out of a range flock. The only feed they got was if the snow got too deep and then they got hay. A ewe fed her lambs or she was shipped. She is supreamly happy on my pasture mix. 

The indiviual matters more than the breed I think. There are going to be ewes that are more milky than others. If you bought from a flock that grass feeds and rasies twins and triplets then you will get grass fed milk ewes but....... You also need to relise that any ewe probably won't produce more milk than for triplets on grass.


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## SilverVista (Jan 12, 2005)

I don't think anybody here is trying to tell you you're an idiot, and I don't think anyone wants you not to succeed toward your sheep milking goal. BUT I do think that you've asked questions over your 3 introductory posts that indicate that you have some textbook learning, but no hands-on experience and now you want to jump straight to something that has a great many variables even for an experienced farmer. Before you even start looking for sheep to buy, you need to become as hands-on familiar as you possibly can with the soil profile, fertility and sustainability of the acre that you propose to use to support your dairy sheep. Anybody with enough money and research ability can buy the right sheep for what you want to achieve, but it's quite a different story to manage the elevated nutrient levels needed by high-milking livestock. Although it may turn out that you have enough rain and enough growth for an animal to keep filling its mouth every day does not mean that the animal is receiving the level of protein, carbs and minerals that it requires to sustain your purpose.

The average sheep has a rumen that can handle about 4 lbs of dry matter per day. Many of the milkier breeds are smaller-framed, so you may be working with less rumen space. Makes every bite count even more. Unless you know without a doubt that you can produce forage rich enough to meet your stock's nutrient needs, you will see rapidly dwindling returns in both milk and body condition unless you supplement. Have grass that has half of what your ewes need? Well, you can't just feed them twice as much because there's no more room to stuff it into them. This is where making good friends with a sheep dairy and picking their brains about stocking rates and forage growth and fertility would get you better answers. They could probably give you some pointers about what to do with the lambs, and how to sustain lactation so that you have milk for your own children for more than a couple of months a year.

I sincerely wish you the best in this endeavor and would enjoy following your experience, but I hope you realize many of us are skeptical not because of any presumed idiocy, but because we already know what it takes to manage the usual flock with experience, and we see you wanting to jump straight into the deep end without any. Hope you understand that this is said with kindness and sincerity, and a full grasp of how frustrating it is to get all the answers put together to move forward sometimes!


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## thequeensblessing (Mar 30, 2003)

I don't think anyone has suggested, even remotely, that you're an idiot. You asked a question and those who have had some experience with it, are giving an answer. You seem to have come wanting a specific answer and are somewhat upset that you didn't get the answer you were looking for. 
We have tried to raise our sheep on grass alone as "grass-fed" is all the rage now. Our meat sheep, Katahdins and Dorpers, just didn't gain as well as they did when fed grain in addition to their grass diet. We sell for market, so we want maximum gain at market. Grass alone just doesn't do that for our sheep. Perhaps if we fed them on primarily alfalfa they would, but then, according to your own statement, sheep wouldn't just find a whole field of alfalfa in the wild. But, as I said in another thread, grass IS grain. Oats, corn, wheat, they are all just grasses. Soybeans are legumes, somewhat akin to clover, which sheep also eat in nature. Grain gets a bad rap, but it's not that grain is bad. It's what we add to the grain and how we feed it that can be bad. 
Grass-fed means pasture raised instead of feed-lot raised. Our sheep get about 1 lb of grain a day, not a lot compared to what feed-lot sheep get, however, enough to make a nice difference in market size. 
Because we live in an area where we usually have snow covered ground in the winter months, we feed hay, albeit our own hay that we cut from our own hayfield, through the winter as well as grain. The only time they get no grain is when they are open, and/or dry.
Even with grain, they produce just enough milk for their own lambs, but then, they are meat sheep, not milk sheep.
So yes, as Callieslamb said, it all depends on what you're looking for. Are you going to sell the babies as bottle babies, or keep them for meat? I think you mentioned keeping them for meat, and if so, are you going to spend the money on milk replacer or are you going to try to get enough milk for your family AND the lambs from this ewe? That's asking a lot from a ewe, whether on grass or grain. 
I suppose the best thing to do, since you truly believe you can do it, is to try an experiment and do it. Let us know how it goes. We always welcome successful and unsuccessful experiments as we all can learn something from them. If you do try it, keep us all posted, with pictures, from time to time. 
Best of luck in this endeavor!


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