# Carrers in linux



## IDwoodsman (Oct 11, 2009)

So Ive been learning to use Linux for about 7 months now and absolutely love it. I am now researching careers in Linux to see what sort of schooling is needed for different jobs.
My situation in looking for a new career is somewhat unique. I have had this dream of living in the remote Alaskan bush since I was about 18. As I work to put my plans for Alaska into effect I am Looking into Careers That I can do with a high speed internet connection. My mom dose Medical record codeing from home and is helping my fiance find the schooling that will help her do the same.
I do realize that any job I could do remotely in Alaska could just as easily be done remotely in India so that would affect job availability. 
I am looking for a career not the type of getting paid to take online surveys or typical work from home for practically nothing jobs (kgb, cha cha, ect.) That pop up when you search for information on jobs that you can do over the internet.
The reason I mention Linux specifically is because I want to do something that I enjoy. 
I don't need to make killer money But I would like a career that pays enough to make me feel that i am getting Fair pay for my efforts. 
What types of careers do you think will work in this situation. What schooling would be needed and which schools would you suggest?


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

Not to rain on your parade but 7 months of experience isnt gong to even get you in the door. Depending on what you man by career in linux. Linux is an OS so OS administration is what I am assuming your referring to. Loading up Ubuntu on your home PC isnt linux admin. If you want to learn about linux/unix get rid of the graphical interface. Learn how the system works, not what buttons to press. I have 30+ years as Unix admin and have been work with Linux since it came out in the early 90s. There is a LOT to learn about systems administartion/managment that has nothing to do with the OS.

A good unix/linux admin needs skills not only with the OS, but databases, web servers, application servers, mail servers, print servers and dealing with users.


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## IDwoodsman (Oct 11, 2009)

what i meant is what kind of schooling would you recommend. That would teach things like Apache or a mail transfer agent like post fix. Im not thinking that I can get a job just from running ubuntu.


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## fratermus (May 11, 2009)

I'd say the next best step would be to set up another box as your test server, and run apache, postfix, mysql, samba, web proxy, forum software, iptables, etc on it. Install gcc and learn to roll your own code from source (not hard, usually). The box can be whatever you have lying around.

Make it, break it, fix it. Offer logins to your friends so they can use the box for linuxy fun or to access your http proxy over ssh from work... assign them quotas and given them virtual servers on your apache setup. Get a free dyndns account so you can test your box and the various router configs from the outside.

Start reading along in some admin forums, mailing lists, and newsgroups so you can see what it's like. Although *nix courses do exist, experience and ability to hack (understand the internals) is key; *nix people laugh and point at things like MS MCSE.

Gary's advice about the command line was spot-on; remember if you're logging into a box from AK it's going to be over SSH and not something like VNC.


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## IDwoodsman (Oct 11, 2009)

good idea on setting up another box. Ive got a few things I did want to play around with.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Just thinking outside the box a little. 

How about creating a blog about Alaska with lots of great pictures and stories. Then do advertising on the blog. You won't make a fortune, but certainly you could make a few thousand a year if you have a great blog and build up traffic. (Any mention of Sarah Palin is automatically going to get traffic). Once you build up traffic, you could start soliciting ads from Alaskan tours, guides, etc.

You night also be able to sell Alaskan crafts - maybe on eBay, maybe on your own site, maybe through an existing Alaskan site. 

I think you might be better off learning php, xhtml, css, mysql and the top blogging platforms. Throw in javascript and you have most of the development side covered. Now when you build your blogs, you are also creating a portfolio you can show to potential employers.


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## OntarioMan (Feb 11, 2007)

Another reality is that the large majority of business does not use any *nix... its a Microsoft world.

Databases and any ability to create, design, maintain databases, including interfaces, appears to be a decent direction for someone that wants to work remotely. Ironically, the database and all "code" could actually be on a Unix server... ala "web based software". Almost every business on the planet has "information"... and they like to store, retrieve, create reports... from that information.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

OntarioMan said:


> Another reality is that the large majority of business does not use any *nix... its a Microsoft world.


While a lot of smaller business have nothing more than a pC to run there business but any reasonable sized business will have unix boxes and with the cost of MS going up and up I susepect you going to see Unix/Linux on more desktop int he next 5 years as well as lots of unix boxes in the midteir and backend systems.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

MoonRiver said:


> Just thinking outside the box a little.
> 
> 
> I think you might be better off learning php, xhtml, css, mysql and the top blogging platforms. Throw in javascript and you have most of the development side covered. Now when you build your blogs, you are also creating a portfolio you can show to potential employers.


I thin we to defined what a "career in Linux" means to you. Do you mean management of Linux boxes (system admins) or just using a Linux box as a tool (Development). Big difference in skill sets for each. Also need to define what marketplace you want to work in. The skill set for someone managing or developing in a small shop is going to be vastly different than someone managing hundreds of systems in an enterprise system.. 


If your going to be a sysadmin in a large enterprise system then "top blogging platforms" is a waste of time If you want to create and manage web sites then css,xhtml, java and mysql are good primary skills. Having the skills are not bad in ether case but you should put your main effort in learning about what you plan on doing. 


As I noted before stay away from how to do stuff in the windowing system. 
You end up with to much release specific stuff that way. Know what the underlying commands are actually doing. I manage several hundred unix and linux boxes and not a single one has a graphics console on them. 99% of everything i do is via the command line from a vt100 terminal session. 

If you want to learn about Unix/Linux start walking through all the files on the system and know what they do, learn how they are used. LEARN how do to shell scripting... sh/bash/ksh scripting is a MUST.. Write scripts to do things. Much of the system management tools are already scripts. Look at what they are dowing and how they use scripting.


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## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

Just remember; remote locations don't have high speed internet.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

mnn2501 said:


> Just remember; remote locations don't have high speed internet.


Remote locations MAY have high speed internet.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Gary in ohio said:


> I thin we to defined what a "career in Linux" means to you.


The reason I recommended the web development side is because he said _jobs that you can do over the internet_. Can you think of a single company that would hire someone in remote Alaska with no formal training or paid experience to administer their Linux servers? Someone with several years experience would have trouble pulling that off from remote Alaska. 

My thought was that if he could get real good at web development he could bid on some of the little jobs that show up for php development or putting a web site up for some of the businesses in his remote village.


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## IDwoodsman (Oct 11, 2009)

What I meant by Linux jobs are ones similar to these http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/
If You look at specific jobs Such as: Ubuntu Kernel Developer &#8211; Hardware Enablement or Ubuntu Desktop Engineer They are work from home. 
Also what is your opinion of certification courses such as this one http://http://www.ubuntu.com/training/certificationcourses/ucp/objectives
It looks to me like it contains a lot of the information that I am interested in learning.
Is there any Books, Forums or websites that anyone would recommend. I have found several books on Linux Kernel Programing. They do tend to be rather expensive so any recommendations would be appreciated. 
Right now I would like to find materials to get a firm grasp on programing in the BASH Shell.
As far as Alaska goes I will be miles out in the bush Not even close to any village. I have checked Satellite internet is probably My only option and I would probably need to mount it on a small tower to clear the tree line. 
I guess I should be even more specific. as far as jobs. ideally I'm looking for something that I can do from time to time to supplement my income. Like working as an independent contractor on projects that come up here and there. I'm going to the bush to escape the 9 to 5 not recreate it once I am there. Now that said I am looking to work jobs such as those posted above until I can make Alaska Happen In order to Have a resume that will land me those independent contractor type jobs. 
At this point I am open to all suggestions for job direction weather it be web development or software engineering or server maintenance. I realize I will have to be flexible due to the unique situation I am proposing. I am just looking for what will work best for me once I am in Alaska.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

MoonRiver said:


> The reason I recommended the web development side is because he said _jobs that you can do over the internet_. Can you think of a single company that would hire someone in remote Alaska with no formal training or paid experience to administer their Linux servers?


But same question can be said of web developers. About any high school kid can build a web site. The easy part of building a web site is the HTML coding, The hard part is getting requirements.


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

IDwoodsman said:


> What I meant by Linux jobs are ones similar to these http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/


I am sure every job on that list is going to require 5-10 years of computer experience.



> If You look at specific jobs Such as: Ubuntu Kernel Developer &#8211; Hardware Enablement or Ubuntu Desktop Engineer They are work from home.


Kernel development is not something you read a book and learn. Unless you have extensive experience with programing fundamentals and computer hardware interface specifications design then this is NOT for you.

Desktop engineer is also one of those that your going to need lots of skills to be able to handle that job. 




> Also what is your opinion of certification courses such as this one http://http://www.ubuntu.com/training/certificationcourses/ucp/objectives


Certifications mean you can pass a test you studied for. They are usually based on homogeneous system design and most business dont operate that way. When I interview people as potential hires certifications alone will not get you even in the door. If you dont have the experience to back up the test then your a no-hire. For smaller companies without a lot of technical staff onsite CERTS can help, but you still need to be able to do the job.



> It looks to me like it contains a lot of the information that I am interested in learning.
> Is there any Books, Forums or websites that anyone would recommend. I have found several books on Linux Kernel Programing. They do tend to be rather expensive so any recommendations would be appreciated.


Books and websites are not going to teach you everything you need to know. You need to get hands on experience. You need to get a few computers, setup a network at home and start working with them. Setup your own web server and learn how to manage it. Write scripts to repeat task you do over and over. Load and reload systems and learn why your doing what your doing. 



> Right now I would like to find materials to get a firm grasp on programing in the BASH Shell.


here are a few help guides.
http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Bash-Prog-Intro-HOWTO.html
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/library/l-bash.html
http://www.freeos.com/guides/lsst/

DONT get hung up if its bash, ksh, tsh or sh scripting. What your learning is programming logic. SYNTAX is what changes with languages, but programming logic are very similar.




> As far as Alaska goes I will be miles out in the bush Not even close to any village. I have checked Satellite internet is probably My only option and I would probably need to mount it on a small tower to clear the tree line.
> I guess I should be even more specific. as far as jobs. ideally I'm looking for something that I can do from time to time to supplement my income. Like working as an independent contractor on projects that come up here and there. I'm going to the bush to escape the 9 to 5 not recreate it once I am there. Now that said I am looking to work jobs such as those posted above until I can make Alaska Happen In order to Have a resume that will land me those independent contractor type jobs.
> At this point I am open to all suggestions for job direction weather it be web development or software engineering or server maintenance. I realize I will have to be flexible due to the unique situation I am proposing. I am just looking for what will work best for me once I am in Alaska.


I would find out if you have a high speed reliable connection before you start anything, without that your pretty much out of the picture. As for independent contractor you will find that your typical contract jobs is an all or nothing job. You get a job have X days to do it and do it to completion. While your working on the job its 12hr days for a month then your gone. Your not going to find to many spend a few minutes a day jobs around. Since its going to be hard to find work you most likely going to need a "manager" to find jobs for you, He will take a cut of what you make. 

OVerall you need to get several computers start networking them together and start learning about linux and its tools. Web design, sql admin or what ever way you go will need that local cluster of networked machines.

I dont want to discourage you, but inexperience linux people are a dime a dozen. With your remote loacation an lack of skills your going to need o stay out BIG TIME.... As someone else suggested sell your services once you have some skills built up locally. Build a market for your skills, find something to draw people to you. A collection of norther lights photos, A live photo of the frozen wilderness, something to get you noticed.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

I sold my training company at the end of 2002, so my info is a little old, but I think still valid. I personally have trained over a thousand students and with my staff, many thousands. We taught NetWare, Windows Server, databases, all the +s (A+, Network+, Inet+, etc), web development, Linux, security, etc.

In the late 1990's, if you had the aptitude and about $4k-$6k, I could probably train you for an entry level job. That would have given you a couple of baseline certifications. I had several students who had a little desktop experience and with the baseline certifications were able to get jobs paying $40k+ to start. I had a couple of guys with experience that literally doubled their salaries by getting certified. But those days are long gone. 

Starting around 2001 the market started shrinking. The Internet bubble burst and then there was 911. I was in Richmond, VA and I saw hundreds of computer programers, analysts, engineers, techs, and project managers laid off. The market and salaries kept shrinking throughout the 2000s.

The market now has lots of laid off $70k+ experienced people who will take a job for $40k. If there were jobs that you could do over the Internet whenever you felt like it, you can bet these guys would be doing it. Plus with modern communications, you are up against India, Russia, Eastern Europe, etc. I have more certifications than I know what to do with, but certifications without current, paid experience are worthless, and even then it is a very tight market.

I was always blunt with my potential students, and I'm being blunt now. In my opinion, the possibility of you being able to do what you stated as your goal is close to 0. Spending months and even years learning skills for which there may not be a market doesn't make sense (or cents).

If you want to live in the bush, then you need a new job plan. Earlier I laid out one possibility that has a very low cost to start out. If it doesn't work out, you would probably be out less than $100. Even if you bought a few books, your startup would probably be under $100. 

If you want to live in the bush and make a living doing a computer related job, you are going to have to create the job yourself.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

IDwoodsman said:


> what i meant is what kind of schooling would you recommend. That would teach things like Apache or a mail transfer agent like post fix. Im not thinking that I can get a job just from running ubuntu.


For employment, you should look for a certification in a server platform. Probably Red Hat is the best for that.

http://www.redhat.com/certification/rhce/

Their training is pretty expensive, maybe $3000/discipline, but just testing and certification is a lot less, maybe $400/discipline. There are books available that will help prepare you for Red Hat certifications that are a lot less expensive than training from Red Hat. 

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=rhce

Here's a RHCE training video from eBay for $15.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Red-Hat-Certifi...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item35a36ef4a1


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## OntarioMan (Feb 11, 2007)

MoonRiver said:


> If you want to live in the bush and make a living doing a computer related job, you are going to have to create the job yourself.


I think the above is very good advice. An operating system doesn't do much, and potential customers/clients don't actually care how a system works, only what it can do for them. If I were trying to work with computers, remotely, I'd concentrate on a computer related product/service, something which I created/controlled.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

What Gary said.

I bow to my betters. I have linux books and discs, and a rude understanding of the command line. Like I said, Gary knows what he speaks of.

Like you originally mentioned, your work could just as easily be done by someone in Mumbai... and I daresay a whole lot less than you could live on... especially in the Alaskan Bush.

I think working for a company, in house, maintaining the machines personally, would be the only way for job security, and as you know, there taint too many businesses that'd need their own linux IT guy in AK, outside of Anchor, Bearflanks, or Juneau.

Also, being open source, if you code the next to die for widget for linux, where would the income stream come into play?

If I were a programmer, I'd work on a program that has a clear source of continuing revenue, such as some mindless program for the iphone... read where people are getting rich writing tiny apps.

Good luck... any work you can do and get paid for, out in the Bush, is good work.


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## WindowOrMirror (Jan 10, 2005)

As far as Microsoft vs *nix/BSD goes... many large businesses run their internals on Microsoft platforms, but I'd wager that not too many successful ones run their externals on it. I work for a large multi-channel retailer, and we run on MS Server / MS SQL Server / Active Directory internally; even have some .Net custom code... but our eCommerce websites run on Red Hat / Apache with ColdFusion scripting layers and Solaris back end servers. Why? Because _even if we trusted MS Datacenter and SQL Server_, you still can't get NEAR the same power for the same money in the MS world. When you build an infrastructure to support internal business, you build it in pieces and the ease of integrating with everything else (desktops) overtakes your fiscal sense. You buy a MS Server, then another... because it's "easier". In the eCommerce world, you are upgrading by "forklift" every 5 years. When you have to buy it all at once, you can *really feel* the impact of one platform vs another in terms of price/performance.

Who do you want to work for? We employ an external company to do most of the engineering and support of the eCommerce environment and I have 1 *nix admin internally (AIX). He does some scripting but has just general knowledge outside of that.

R


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## Kung (Jan 19, 2004)

I'd agree with WoM, even though I've not been in that position for over 3 years, because I do assist with and run several webservers and such. Just about every single worthwhile business I know who has an external website (and works for a fairly large company) runs on RedHat (centOS) using Apache, simply because while it's not quite as 'easy' neither is it hard as heck, and it saves one HECK of a lot of money.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

WindowOrMirror said:


> As far as Microsoft vs *nix/BSD goes... many large businesses run their internals on Microsoft platforms, but I'd wager that not too many successful ones run their externals on it.


Personally, I wouldn't use a Windows server for internal or web use. Speaking for myself, I haven't had good luck with Microsoft servers, at least from a reliability standpoint. But then again I haven't fooled with Microsoft servers for over 10 years.

I work with one company right now that's Microsoft server based, both internal and external. I don't know a lot about the specifics of their operation, but I've been impressed with their performance & reliability. I've tried to talk to their server operator to learn how they maintain reliability but he's not very personable.

My first and only Microsoft server was on NT 4.0 back in 1996. Even with all of the service packs and hotfixes applied it was pretty buggy. It was never really reliable enough for my needs. As soon as I became familiar enough with Red Hat Linux I migrated (I started with the version 6 series), I've never looked back.

At the time I concluded that since Microsoft servers can't be installed without the bloated graphical interface, unreliable operation was inherent to Microsoft server products. Command line Linux, together with a light graphical overlay like webmin, seemed to be a much better server solution.


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## OntarioMan (Feb 11, 2007)

Although MS server is not the area I work in, I do know that their reliability has come a long way in 10 years. Microsoft products are impressive. I don't think its the reliability or ability of MS anymore, its just the high price, but regardless of the price, most busineses, big or small, are indeed MS internally.

MS Office is a great example of business "philosophy" - there are many capable open-source and free products which are very similar to Office, and most folks don't use Office to even a fraction of its ability, but business still continues to pay the huge bucks for the MS product. 

10 years ago everyone was claiming that *ix would crush MS - not even close. MS probably has a stronger hold on business now than they did then.

IMO, if I were looking for a job, and the choice was between learning *ix and MS, I'd choose MS.



Nevada said:


> Personally, I wouldn't use a Windows server for internal or web use. Speaking for myself, I haven't had good luck with Microsoft servers, at least from a reliability standpoint. But then again I haven't fooled with Microsoft servers for over 10 years.


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## Nevada (Sep 9, 2004)

OntarioMan said:


> Although MS server is not the area I work in, I do know that their reliability has come a long way in 10 years. Microsoft products are impressive.


That may very well be, but they blew it with me a log time ago. I have no motivation to give them another chance.

The problems I had were very serious. Without going into detail, if I hadn't been the only Internet provider in town at the time I would have lost a lot of customers, and maybe lost the entire business.

In trying to resolve some of those issues, Microsoft support told me that I couldn't expect their product to be as reliable as I needed it to be. That was fatal in my opinion. I swore that I would never place the fate of my business in the hands of Microsoft ever again. Why should I?


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

Where I work we have close to 800 unix/linux servers and an 600 MS boxes. 
We also have far more applications moving from MS to unix/linux than the other way around. The MS web server problems can be managed with a good DMZ, but most of our sites are unix/linux. Any large enterprise is going to need both platforms there are few ways around it. Some corporate apps and specialty apps just dont run anyplace else.

MS is going to face tough competition for the desktop in the coming years. Linux is slowing coming upto the standard needed in the corporate world. Desktop managment tools are slowing coming of age. The corporate desktop will not be ubuntu, but will be linux, most likely Redhat or SUSE, but its coming. With the current economic climate MS is pricing itself out many budgets combined with OVERLY complex license structures Its hard to tell if what you have is licensed properly or not at the large corporate level. 

The big thing that has to happen with Llinux to make the desktop take off is a SINGLE cross distro desktop window manager. You cant give people a choice.. Yes I know that goes against the linux mindset but to work in a corporate world it deosnt fly. Everyone has to look the same, applications needs to work the same, tools need to look and be accessed the same.


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## MoonRiver (Sep 2, 2007)

Gary in ohio said:


> The big thing that has to happen with Llinux to make the desktop take off is a SINGLE cross distro desktop window manager. You cant give people a choice.. Yes I know that goes against the linux mindset but to work in a corporate world it deosnt fly. Everyone has to look the same, applications needs to work the same, tools need to look and be accessed the same.


Hasn't Novell/Suse offered that for years?


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## Gary in ohio (May 11, 2002)

MoonRiver said:


> Hasn't Novell/Suse offered that for years?


Hard to have a cross platform system on 1 platform. WHile SUSE is one of the top contenders in linux desktops, you still need a multi distro desktop standard.


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