# Newbie here... got questions about skirting a fleece



## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Hello y'all,

Please help me as I embark on the wonderful adventure to get you high quality Merino/Suffolk cross sheep.

Right now, I've got three bags (from 5 ewes and 1 ram) of recently shorn fleece (June 2007).

My questions... is it ok to work on them in pieces?

How much VM is too much? 

How hard should I be able to shake them without having the fleece start to come apart?

How do I measure the staple? and the crimp?

Here's what I have to work with:

I'm working on a folding "craft table" and have a an old squirrel-cage fan housing 36" in diameter with 1/2" hardware cloth.

I've looked all over the Internet for some "step-by-step" instructions and I see pictures of people standing over their fleeces... but I never see pics of what they discard... can y'all be of assistance, please?

Once I get this stuff into a decent condition, I'll be asking for more help... like offering samples to folks for feedback.

We have plans to send to Texas A&M for micron testing once we know what we're doing. 

Also, we understand we may have sheep that should be covered to produce the best possible fleece, and we're looking into that, too.

I'll be looking for your answers... in the meantime, I'll go start a page on m server with pics of what I've got so far.

Back in an hour or so with a link for you


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Here is a link on skirting fleeces I found. I'm feeling too lazy to type out a bunch of stuff right now. Maybe later I can come back to answer some of your other questions. In the mean time Im sure others will have plenty of answers for you.

I haven't read it through but what I did read looked good.

http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art19230.asp


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

It sounds like you have some wonderful wool there. 

I'm not quite sure what you mean by working it in pieces? 

Most all fleeces have some VM in it, it's hard to feed hay and not get any, unless you can have them on pasture year round and don't have to feed hay. A feeder where they can't literally jump up in the feeder, which they always do, helps. I'll see if I can find a photo of one. Too much VM is when you take out a chunk of wool and 
here's more VM than wool, lol!

I'm not sure what you mean about shaking them and having them come apart? Are you shaking it to put on the skirting table? The shorter stapled fleeces will come apart easier than the long wools. 

I guess I'm not sure about this either -- "an old squirrel-cage fan housing 36" in diameter with 1/2" hardware cloth." Not sure what that is. Our skirting table is basically a frame with PVC pipe going across it so that you can put the fleece on the table and the short cuts and some of the VM can fall through. 

You measure the staple after it's sheared. Don't pull the staple to measure it, just let it lay and measure that. Most people prefer a staple length of at least 3 inches or so. 

The crimp can be tight, such as you probably have with the merino, to loose crimp which you get with Romney or something like that. 

As far as skirting goes, that's just laying the fleece out on a surface (skirting table works the best) and removing tags or wool that is heavily soiled with manure, usually just around the tail area and around the edges of the fleece, removoing any short belly, face and leg wool, and removing any wool that is heavily contaminated with VM or burrs or manure and shaking out any second cuts (those short little pieces) that you can get out. Just shake the fleece a bit and they'll fall out. Spinners just don't like second cuts. If you shake them out, they'll be much happier with your fleece. 

Really, all you can do though is to do your best to have a clean pasture, free from burrs, feed your sheep so they get as little VM as possible over themselves, start with a good shearing job and after sheared, remove the obviously bad parts of the fleece. 

I can't wait to see your pictures and learn your progress! And, keep asking questions, that's how we've all learned. If you have any neighbors who have sheep, ask them if you can come help with the shearing. It's a great way to learn and people always appreciate the help.

Here's a couple feeders that work well. A friend has the six-sided feeder and her sheep have the cleanest fleece I've ever seen. 
http://www.cps.gov.on.ca/english/sh4000/sh4625.htm
http://www.cps.gov.on.ca/english/sh4000/sh4611.htm


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Thanks much for that link... it helps quite a bit.

Here's a link to a "quickie" page that shows what I've got.

http://dhaenterprises.com/skirtingfleece.html

I really appreciate y'all's help. My "sheep mentor" never did any of this as she didn't really market her wool. Not sure why... but around here, everyone is pretty down on Merinos. The co-op won't take anything but white... and you don't get paid for a very long time.

Also, I'm very new to this area, and am finding that while folks are quite friendly... you really have to hunt them down to pick their brains. Also, we're not Mormon, so don't have a "ready-made" network, if you know what I mean.


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## jerzeygurl (Jan 21, 2005)

pictures are still loading im on dial up

ok they do look pretty dirty, but if you are feeding hay that is what you get

i found shearing while they are on pasture only made for easier cleaning, but as we are having to feed already those who get sheared this fall will be fairly dirty

i tend to skirt as i shear as i hand shear, removing all the dung tags and badly felted knoted bits

i also wash the lock instead of whole pieces, it come out cleaner for me that way

by washing in the lock i mean i remove it in sections and separate out the indivdual locks holding the shorn end dip in hot soapy water and rub the lock end, then let it all rest in the hot as can be stood water with lots of dish soap or wool shampoo. DO NOT AGITATE it will felt. You may be able to move it a little bit if you are careful. it sits in each wash 10 -20 min and moved to the next pan that is ready for it( dont run water directly on it). dont let water cool down or the lanolin will redeposit and will never come out. the shorn end will felt if you rub it so dont. most of the vm will come out in the wash esp if it is loose like what it looks like in your pics. some times it takes 3 washes and 3 rinses. 

let dry on towels, change them so no mildew, i usually do this under cieling fan to speed it up.

the longer locks i comb

the shorter stuff i card

both processes remove quite a bit of vm

i would recomend the book HANDS ON SPINNING, by lee raven. i got mine on ebay

there are great sites on the web that show how to wash in the machine..


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Thanks jerzeygurl,

These sheep were all pen-raised on hay/alfalfa and were shorn professionally with electric clippers. It was all I could do to keep up with the shearer as he completed each sheep. 

They're not the tamest animals on our farm, although I'm working on that. 

I gather that it is perfectly acceptable then to separate individual fleeces into smaller, more manageable pieces to work the dirt and VM out of them. 

At this point, I'm hoping to not to wash but to sell as skirted, greasy fleece with some VM... looking for balance of price vs labor here.

In the future, I may venture into a wee bit of processing. That depends upon the market.

I'll look into that book... at this point I need to learn all I can.


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

therealshari said:


> Hello y'all,
> 
> Please help me as I embark on the wonderful adventure to get you high quality Merino/Suffolk cross sheep.


That is quite a combination. What does it feel like? Can you use it against the skin?

I have experienced Rambouillet/Dorset and it was more like Rambouillet, but Suffolk can be itchy. I'd be interested in a sample if you don't mind. I'll pay postage.

Donsgal


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Donsgal,

Now, you know you're on someone elses "list" and are supposed to be at the bottom of mine... (just joking). 

Hold on and I'll get some more pictures up of some of the cleaner stuff... maybe you'd prefer that. I should have enough to go around.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

I looked a the link you provided. Pretty color, I like colored fleeces. That first one had a LOT of VM but that doesn't mean it is impossible to be used. I can't really tell about the other fleeces. In my experience which is limited. If you have the sheep in with other animals taller than them they get lots of VM and grain on their backs and in their fleeces in general. If you can feed them on the ground that is best instead of over head hay racks. Straw for bedding is easier to get out than hay. If you can't control these things you should coat the sheep. You will more than double your money if you coat the fleeces, thats my guess.

Make sure your shearer is only using one pass when shearing. If he aims for a clean, to the skin sheep he may be making more than one pass to remove the fleece. This is where the second cuts come in and to a hand spinner second cuts are really frustrating to have to deal with.

By all means you can separate out smaller pieces of the fleece to make it easier to work on.

When you skirt just pull off the hunks that are questionable or bad. They make great compost.

I'm interested also in what this cross will be like. Will it be resistant to felting? How soft will it be? How greasy? Merino is known for being really, really greasy.

Can't wait to see more pictures :dance:


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

therealshari said:


> Thanks much for that link... it helps quite a bit.
> 
> Here's a link to a "quickie" page that shows what I've got.
> 
> ...


That is going to be more VM than most hand spinners are going to want to deal with. Have you considered sending them out to a mill and selling roving instead of fleece? Even so, the VM is still going to be an issue, even for a processing mill. Covering them is a good idea. 

I would keep the fleeces together if you work on them in pieces (do not mix up the pieces), because some people do not want to mix fleeces due to minute differences in texture or color.

BTW most shearers, coops, etc, won't take naturally colored wool because it is harder to market. That is not unusual. I can always get a killer deal on naturally colored (especially black) wool. If you can possibly sell fleeces yourself you are way ahead of the game, but if you are planning on marketing to handspinners you are going to have to get as close to perfect as you can vis a vis VM. 

Gosh, I can't imagine that people don't LOVE Merino. It is the best wool in the universe. I would think that you could always find a handspinning market for it (especially white).

donsgal


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

Your fan cover looks like it'll work well to get the small VM out. Here's a picture and instructions for a skirting table like the one we and everyone else around here uses. My DH made it for me. You can buy them but they're about $400. They're really easy to make. 

Skirting table -- http://www.gfwsheep.com/pastfarm/wint.00-01/news12.html

This kind of table also helps get rid of the second cuts and bigger pieces of VM cause they fall out through the table. Then, you can sweep them up and from under the table and use that for mulch.

BTW, that whole website has great information about wool.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

therealshari said:


> Donsgal,
> 
> Now, you know you're on someone elses "list" and are supposed to be at the bottom of mine... (just joking). .


Yeah, keep that girl at bay! :frypan: 

That really is a lot of VM in there, but this is only one shearing, and you're looking at making changes that affect years to come. I'd also love to see what the texture is like, but I'm not the best judge of fiber types...others on here are much better than I am. 

Meg


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Hello y'all,

Sorry I didn't get back to everyone yesterday. We're in the middle of our 2 or 3 week monsoon season. That means daily afternoon and evening thunderstorms. We lose "a clear view" of our southern sky for the Internet satellite.

I'll get a few more pics up today including one of the total bags (I've been sorting out as I go).

At this point, if you want a sample send me a PM. 

Now, because I'm asking you to provide me feedback (that means actually do something with the wool other than look at it), I'll pay the postage. The samples will be 1/2 pound (I know you can't make anything with it). 

If you want more than 1/2 pound, then I'll ask you to pay the postage... fair enough?

What I will ship will be primarily the cleanest stuff I can sort out. After all, I'm wanting to build on next year. 

Once y'all can tell me how you feel about the staple and crimp, and how well it washes up, then we can decide what to do with the less than optimal fleece.

I may not be around this afternoon as we're under flash flood watch and will most likely get knocked off the satellite.

Back with more pics on my link page shortly.


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Ok, updated pics are up including one of the quality I'll send out for samples.

Go to http://dhaenterprises.com/skirtingfleece.html


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

Gee, no one thought of me when they saw all that VM? I _am_ the 2007 VM Queen, ya know :Bawling:. 

Seriously, all (so far) the raw fleece I've gotten this year has been heavy VM - of course, I didn't pay much per pound (for obvious reasons) but the wool itself was nice otherwise, so wasn't too awfully displeased - just frustrated as all get-out at times!

My pointers:

*If you have the option, cover your woolies!

*Do not airdrop hay or other edibles on top of your sheep. I feel sure that's how so much gets so deep into the fleece.

*Reassure your sheep that they will indeed eat tomorrow and thus there is no need to store food away for later in their fleece.

*Be ruthless when skirting. No handspinner wants to deal with unexpected 'goodies' that smell suspiciously of barnyard sweepings. Oh, and burdock burrs = evil.

*If the wool is otherwise high quality, there are always buyers (*ahem, raises hand*)

_Sorry, every time I read the OP, I think "baa baa black sheep, have you any wool? Yessir, yessir, 3 bags full."_ :shrug:


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

FalconDance, 

Thanks for the excellent advice. 

Believe me, I'm getting many very good lessons here, as I'm actually attempting to clean this fleece of a lot of the VM. 

Next year's fleece crop WILL be in far better condition, as we're committed to quality as long as there is a market. Remember, our "mentors" here are not interested in marketing to niche markets, so they've never really taken much care of their wool.

I've just posted what will probably be the last picture updates until I actually take pictures of what will be sent as samples. I apologize for not reducing the density of the pictures.

For those of you who want samples, I will get to work on them tomorrow. We're expecting serious storms here, and my "skirting" area is not well protected. (I do store things in a well protected area, though).

If you want a particular sample (from the ram, the matriarch, or the Polypay), please be sure to let me know. The other fleeces (yesterday's pictures) are all from yearling ewes, daughters of the matriarch, bred to a Suffolk ram (not Algernon).

If you want "history" of this flock, be sure to check out my blog at Shari's Gone Country and go into the archives... roundup time was in March.


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

As of last night, I have five requests for samples. I have now separated those and will be taking pictures of them, getting them boxed, and shipped tomorrow. That is, if Bev is able to get boxes while she's in St. George today.

If there are other's of you who would like to participate in this evaluation, please be sure to send me your name and mailing address, as well as any special request... like wanting to try the ram's wool, or the older ewe, or the Polypay.


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

FalconDance said:


> *If the wool is otherwise high quality, there are always buyers (*ahem, raises hand*)


Also raises hand, waves it back an forth while jumping up and down going "ew--ew---ew--ew--ew" (which is *not* the same as ewwwwwwww, but it didn't look right when I spelled it oo-oo-oo).

donsgal


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

Would that be a :bouncy:, donsgal?


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

FalconDance said:


> Would that be a :bouncy:, donsgal?


That would be it exactly! :bouncy: :bouncy:

donsgal


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Ok, so far FalconDance and Donsgal have received samples. 

Initial responses are very much appreciated. I'm glad you were surprised by the quality. What's that about pictures always exaggerating flaws? Maybe that's what it did with the VM.

At any rate, there are two more samples en route to Meg Z and Oceanrose. You girls should get your samples tomorrow or the next day.

Your initial responses make me want to start skirting the remaining fleeces... but since Bev is building me a beautiful skirting table (the one shown Gleason's Fine Woolies page), I'll bide my time. We've got the dowels and the PVC cut, now it's a matter of building the frame, drilling the holes, gluing the dowels and building another set of 4 sawhorses. 

Whew! That's all... oh, and watch for lambs as we're officially on "lamb watch" for two of our ewes. Got the lamb pen and lamb jug built this weekend.


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

therealshari said:


> oh, and watch for lambs


If I see a lamb, whatcha want me to do?


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

If this fleece is as good as you think it is right now... you may want to lend your name to any lamb you happen to see.

What would you think about owning the "fleece rights" to your own Merino/Suffolk cross lamb? I'm always looking for "outside the box" ways to market products.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Folks who raise spinner's flocks usually take reservations on next years fleece.

One of the farms where I habitually put in 1 to 2 reservations for the next year (I've gotten Clover's fleece for the past few years - for 2008, I'm getting the fleece from Finis!) are meticulous about their sheep year around. 

The are covered all year. They heavily skirt the fleece. If there is something they suspect you won't like, they'll tell you before hand. In 2006, Clover's fleece had heavily lanolin. Kris told me about it and sent a couple of locks of before/after she had scoured them so I could let her know if I wanted it sent or not. She has a 30-day guarantee if you're not satisfied.

Customer service to handspinners such as this are highly treasured!


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## flannelberry (Jul 14, 2005)

FalconDance said:


> *Reassure your sheep that they will indeed eat tomorrow and thus there is no need to store food away for later in their fleece.



Alright FD - I tried that. They don't believe me - ever. 

The other things is - no air dropping. Nice theory but when they (the ewes I mean) keep on breaking the feeders because they are under the mistaken impression that it's a food dispenser rather than a feeder and they keep on butting it to get more food out... one ends up being forced to air drop. Oh, that plus the mobbing factor. I'm hoping to build a feeder that I can reach from outside the fence and will be strong enough to hold up to head butting.

The brats!


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Flannelberry,

Go to http://premier1supplies.com and get their set of plans for a "drive by" feeder that actually replaces part of your fence line. That's what we're building and it's pretty sturdy.

It looks like you can build it for about $100.

I've got a picture of ours on a recent blog post, if you want to see what it looks like.


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

therealshari said:


> Ok, so far FalconDance and Donsgal have received samples.
> 
> Initial responses are very much appreciated. I'm glad you were surprised by the quality. What's that about pictures always exaggerating flaws? Maybe that's what it did with the VM.


Shari,

I have washed up the sample. It has a little VM but not bad. I've seen lots worse. It is the CLEANEST wool I have ever seen!!!!! :bow: There was a little sandy dirt at first, but NONE of the mud and gunk that I am used to! WOWIE

I am noticing something interesting. You can feel a Suffok influence in the wool. The texture is actually a lot more like Romney (very, very fine Romney). It is very springy! I love that. And I think it is going to be soft enough to be against the skin. I will let you know when I start working it up.

Stay tuned for further developments.

donsgal


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Thanks donsgal,

We are in the desert... hence the sand. I kept the tumbleweed here, as it's really nasty stuff.

Just in case I disappear for a week or so, we're having satellite connection issues. For whatever reason, after nearly two years, our "dish" is out of line and support said we'd get a call in 3 to 5 business days to set an appointment to come out and fix it. Believe me, I'm just a little more than ----ed about that!

I've got stuff to order, posts to put up, etc... and may or may not have a connection. :flame: 

Thanks for keeping me up to date as you progress.


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Hello ladies,

Just a quick note...

I've received all your evaluation replies and really appreciate them. Last night, another of our mentor's came over and spent several hours. She's also a spinner. She took samples home for further feedback for us.

Our internet connection issues still are not solved. Yesterday, I couldn't hardly do anything... and still no service call. We're gonna change providers within the week (we hope).

Just as soon as I get the comments all compiled along with her feedback, I should have some pricing, as well as what we think will be the best market... maybe fiber artists as opposed to pure spinners.

Thanks for all your help... I'll be back!


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

therealshari said:


> ... maybe fiber artists as opposed to pure spinners.
> 
> Thanks for all your help... I'll be back!


Sorry, I find this a curious turn of phrase. 

What do you consider a "pure spinner"? Many/most spinners are also fiber artists ........


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

Hi FalconDance,

Call it my "newbieness"... I'm thinking in terms of people who will spin the fleece for something other than clothing... like rugs, wall-hangings, purses, etc.

With the suffolk influence on the fleece, as well as the lack of lanolin, there just isn't the "softness" necessary for next-to-the skin use.

Now, I'm still at a loss as to whether or not that severely impacts the pricing... so am still researching.

Can you see I'm still confused?


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

Ok, was just curious--since most of what I do with my _own_ spinning tends to be the non-clothing stuff you mention . But I sell to knitters and others who do the "close-to-the-skin" stuff. 

Any ideas surfaced on the lanolin problem? Maybe covering them will help retain it? (Can arid air dry lanolin the way it does other liquid?)


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

I'm beginning research on the lack of lanolin issue. Our "other mentor", the previous owner of our new ram was over a couple nights ago and we discussed this. She took samples home to work up, as she is a spinner.

Since this is our very first shearing, and none of these sheep are from our breedings, we're really at a loss as to the lack of lanolin. 

I am starting our research with a call to our local extension agent and will go from there. 

Y'all's feedback is precisely what I was looking for... it's best to discover deficiencies early in the game. Whether it's feed, weather, water, or genetics, we now have some clues (lack of lanolin) to work with.

Thanks!


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

I'm not sure what you mean by a "serious lack of lanolin" but I do know that suffolk are a breed that naturally has little lanolin. That trait of the suffolks may be coming through in the breeding? 

Little lanolin isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's a lot easier and less expensive to wash wool that doesn't have as much lanolin. 

Suffolk is also a down wool breed so is not as soft as some, such as merino, but it also doesn't felt, whereas merino felts VERY easily.

Every breed of sheep is different and even every sheep in a breed is different. You may need to look at each individual sheep and it's fleece and market for the characteristics of each one.


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

MTDeb, the problem with the no discernable lanolin in her _otherwise gorgeous_ fleece is that it is resulting in high breakage (even after spinning) and waste. It also is making it unpleasant to work with.

On the up side, it does make it really easy to get the fine VM out .

So, it can be traced back to the Suffolk, then? Hmmmm. There you go, Shari! Start breeding more Merino (or other) back into the lines and voila!, problem aleviated. :bouncy:


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

This is an option we've discussed. 

Our initial issue is that the previous owner of these sheep didn't keep the best records. That means we're really having to do a lot of "digging" to determine their genetics. 

Does anyone know what it costs to have the DNA tested? 

Fortunately, we have the flock dam, and her last two years offspring and an unrelated flock sire. We have one ewe (not related to the flock dam), who is the daughter of the flock sire.

We know the flock sire is a Merino/Suffolk cross. His dam was a suffolk. His sire was a Merino.

We believe the flock dam is also a Merino/Suffolk cross. What we don't know, is whether the dam or the sire is Merino or Suffolk, or if either or those was also a cross.

We know the lone ewe who's sire was a Merino is probably at least 7/8 Merino as her dam was either a Merino or (remotely probable) a Merino cross, but not sure if/or crossed with what.

These ewes are currently pregnant (sired by our Merino/Suffolk cross) and are expected to lamb in early fall. We had hoped for at least one earlier natural breeding, but that doesn't appear to be the case.

I really appreciate all the input as we have no really "direct teacher" but folks who drop by occasionally to help.


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## donsgal (May 2, 2005)

FalconDance said:


> MTDeb, the problem with the no discernable lanolin in her _otherwise gorgeous_ fleece is that it is resulting in high breakage (even after spinning) and waste. It also is making it unpleasant to work with.
> 
> On the up side, it does make it really easy to get the fine VM out .
> 
> So, it can be traced back to the Suffolk, then? Hmmmm. There you go, Shari! Start breeding more Merino (or other) back into the lines and voila!, problem aleviated. :bouncy:


Gosh, I have a Suffolk fleece from a sheep that had not been sheared for two years (poor thing), and it has about four inches of "yolk" on it, which I have always understood to be a combination of lanolin and sweat (yum). It does have a completely different feel, but as I recall the last time I touched it, there was plenty of lanolin there. Of course fleece will vary from one sheep to the next and this particular fleece was from a big old ram, which might make a difference, I don't know.

donsgal


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

Well, it shouldn't break. Wool is very strong and if it breaks easily, there was probably something wrong with that sheep at some time. If they get an illness or even the stress of a move or something like that, they'll get a weak spot in their fleece and that'll cause it break.

Do you know what kind of care they got and what kind of feed? Were they getting minerals? 

Those kinds of problems can be easily corrected with the proper care and feed and next year will be better. 

Suffolks have less grease, but they still have some, but you can definitely tell the difference. Merino probably has the most amount of grease that a fleece can get and suffolk probably has the least amount, besides a hair sheep. Alpaca and llamas also have very little grease. 

Isn't it fun!


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

MTDeb, about all I really know is they were fed once a day, on a local alfalfa/grass hay. This person got her hay from a larger sheep (Polypay) producer in the area.

She kept a mineral/salt block for them at all times. 

The biggest stress that I could observe was the "handling" or "roundup" when time to crutch (we helped with that) and time to move the to our place. Again, we were in on that, too. 

These sheep are pretty flighty, and definitely have a high flocking instinct. It was a chase I don't care to repeat. We're establishing ways to move our little flock into confinement without chasing, or tackling.


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## FalconDance (Feb 4, 2007)

Betcha now that they're with Shari, they calm right down . Even flighty sheep will calm under her care, guaranteed!


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

The breaking is a sign that there is or WAS something wrong with the sheep, whether it's in their feed, or if it's disease or worms or an infection or medication for some reason or just plain stress or who knows. Lots of breeds have little lanolin but it should never break easily. 

Wool is just like our hair, your body changes show up in your hair and you can read the health of a sheep through its wool. If you look at a lock carefully, you can see where any kind of change has occurred in the sheep's health. 

The lack of lanolin may be a symptom too but the breaking is really a sign of something going on.

BTW, make sure that the mineral block is specifically for sheep and not for goats. Goats mineral blocks have too much cooper in them. 

I bet with Shari's TLC they'll be just fine next year.


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## Liese (Dec 12, 2005)

therealshari said:


> MTDeb, about all I really know is they were fed once a day, on a local alfalfa/grass hay. This person got her hay from a larger sheep (Polypay) producer in the area.
> 
> She kept a mineral/salt block for them at all times.
> 
> ...


Hi, Have read thru this thread with interest since I'm hoping to cover some of the sheep costs with fiber sales too. Our climate is alot more humid than yours but there are still differences in lanolin content from sheep to sheep so perhaps climate has little to do with it and it's mostly genetic but I can also tell differences between fleeces of sibs too! Not sure why you would be doing DNA testing, I guess I'm thinking that you would just intro a new ram and work from there. Perhaps an different breed with the colour genetics still there so you don't lose that? It does seem we have to have a goal in mind but then that goal keeps changing as we gain experience. Me - I wanted to milk sheep at first! That's why I have a few Dorsets so my goals really have changed...LOL. But my Dorset girls do have nice fleece - Meg concurs, so it's not just my partiality, lol.

Anyway, wanted to share some things I do here. Firstly on the mineral - I have found for my flock loose is preferred, and boy will they go for it all the more with a little kelp, which is suppose to help improve fleeces and those micro nutrients may help your brittleness issue. Also I don't know how large your flock is but you may want to train them to a grain bucket. Bob is the bucketer and I am the flock follower bringing up any stragglers with 4' long white PVC pipe batons - just to extend my size, not to hit them! But this method works for us because 1. we used electro netting and kept the area small. 2. I spent a lot of time with them giving massages after they got used to me. They love to have their back hips massaged. 3. anytime we moved them it was using the bucket and they know it contains treats. So this winter when you want their ration improved anyway, why not get some grain (cracked corn is the fav here) and just call and feed. I believe Deb (Eieiomom) makes the point well "sheep are pigs in wool"! 

I have to laugh about the hay feeding comments, I just haven't figured out why one ewe has to pull out her mouthful and then turn to eat over her neighbor's back...argh! Anyway we fed from round bales last winter and tho I need to change to panels rather than the field fencing, since Fay got her head stuck, otherwise it worked well. Alfalfa is wonderfully leafy but shatters so well too. Here I can get mixed grass hay and since I'm graining a bit anyway it works, plus last winter grain was still cheaper to feed than hay. I've seen those feeders made from Premier's plans - very nice but since we move the girls around and don't have a "home paddock" we feed either the round bales or if using sq. I put them into plastic tubs - never feed off the ground if I can help it since it supposedly increases parasites. Another interesting idea I saw was a sq. hay feeder with a panel over the top that followed the hay downward as they ate. Naturally in my senility I can't tell you where I saw this but it's within the realm of DIY.

Well, as you tell I really like sheep, sorry this has gone on for so long - hope you got something useful out of these ramblings!


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## therealshari (Jul 10, 2007)

I can tell you that our sheep are really p'o'd right now. The wire panels arrived and we installed them day before yesterday. I'm thinking maybe we should re-order and modify the feeder to the "large sheep" size, as they're really having a tough time getting to the hay.

I've not seen the loose mineral, but will research that as an option. In fact, I'm using the remainder of the salt/mineral block that was with these sheep at the other farm.

Since most of the girls are pregnant, I'm supplementing the hay ration with a little "sweet feed", which is the grain supplement of choice in this area. Typically, the entire flock gets about 1/4 cup each per day right now. Since the two meat lambs are advertised for market, I'm not bothering to put them into a separate pen.

I've pretty much got the flock used to me, but they're still particularly skittish of Bev (retired cop and walks like one). She's not quite "in tune" to being really quiet, patient, soft-spoken, etc.


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