# Angus Dexter Cross



## HDRider

Is anyone here pursuing a Dexter / Angus breeding program?

Are you Dexter Bull on Angus Cow? Or, other way around??

How has your birthing worked out? How many times do you assist? 1 out 10, 1 out of 100, or never ever?

Please tell me how things are going. Any regrets?

Howâs the beef on the table? What are your customers saying about taste and tenderness?


Thanks


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## ramiller5675

I've got no experience with Dexters, but why even bother with trying something like this?

If I had a herd of Dexter cows and I used a LBW Angus bull, I would worry about pulling a bunch of calves and having losing a few cows. I'd be better off selling the Dexters to someone else that actually wants straight-bred Dexters and buying a different breed.

If I had some Angus cows, it would be easier to find a good moderate-sized Angus bull to breed them than a Dexter bull. And, the calves would probably be worth more as weaned calves, replacements, and beef.

If a severe drought hit and I had to start selling cows, a straight Angus or a black baldy cow should be more valuable than a Dexter or an Angus/Dexter cross cow. 

How would I raise replacements? Or, would I need to buy some more Dexter cows to produce those Dexter/Angus calves?

A good moderate-sized Angus, Hereford, or Red Angus cow herd with a LBW Angus bull (which should be easy to find and buy) would give you more options. Sell some weaned calves, raise your own replacements, have a better market for cull cows, and still have the option to raise beef from part of your calf crop.


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## G. Seddon

Perhaps genebo will chime in. He has a friend who quite successfully uses a Dexter bull on his Angus cows. Most will advise you NOT to use an Angus bull on Dexter cows...just asking for trouble.

ramiller5675 raises some good points.


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## genebo

My friend doesn't post on the boards, but I can tell you a lot about his operation.

He has used a Dexter bull over Angus cows to get "Dangus" calves for several years. Never a birthing problem.

It all started over a Dexter cross bull calf he served at a political gathering. The people raved over the beef. I sold a couple of Dexter bulls to people who tasted him and wanted to raise their own such beef and he got a long, loyal customer list.

He didn't think the pure Dexter calves were big enough, so he crossed his Dexter bull with every breed he had on the place: Charolais/Hereford, Highland, Devon and Angus. They all tasted good, with the Dexter taste and tenderness. The Angus calves were the biggest, so he bought 30 Angus cows and went into business.

He sold every calf he could raise to his customer list except for a few times when his timing wasn't just right. Then he took his beef animals to market.

With Angus mothers, all the calves were polled and had black hides. They even met the proper description of an Angus: at least 1/2 Angus and black hide. They were in great condition and brought good prices, although not as much as he got in private sales. This was just an escape route he had for unsold calves.

Pure Angus steers didn't fatten and finish as well on grass as the Dangus. Angus weighed 1200# at market age while the Dangus weighed 900-1000#. The Dangus graded higher, though, and he always put pure Dexter or Dangus in his freezer.

His Dexter bull passed on and he switched to a Devon bull. That didn't last long. After pulling calves and losing some, he switched to a "miniature" Devon bull. It didn't help. The calves were still too big and he still pulled too many.

He even tried a Jersey bull, but that didn't work.

This year he went back to a Dexter bull. No calves yet.


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## HDRider

ramiller5675 said:


> I've got no experience with Dexters, but why even bother with trying something like this?
> 
> If I had a herd of Dexter cows and I used a LBW Angus bull, I would worry about pulling a bunch of calves and having losing a few cows. I'd be better off selling the Dexters to someone else that actually wants straight-bred Dexters and buying a different breed.
> 
> If I had some Angus cows, it would be easier to find a good moderate-sized Angus bull to breed them than a Dexter bull. And, the calves would probably be worth more as weaned calves, replacements, and beef.
> 
> If a severe drought hit and I had to start selling cows, a straight Angus or a black baldy cow should be more valuable than a Dexter or an Angus/Dexter cross cow.
> 
> How would I raise replacements? Or, would I need to buy some more Dexter cows to produce those Dexter/Angus calves?
> 
> A good moderate-sized Angus, Hereford, or Red Angus cow herd with a LBW Angus bull (which should be easy to find and buy) would give you more options. Sell some weaned calves, raise your own replacements, have a better market for cull cows, and still have the option to raise beef from part of your calf crop.


You seem a little irritated.


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## HDRider

genebo said:


> My friend doesn't post on the boards, but I can tell you a lot about his operation.
> 
> He has used a Dexter bull over Angus cows to get "Dangus" calves for several years. Never a birthing problem.
> 
> It all started over a Dexter cross bull calf he served at a political gathering. The people raved over the beef. I sold a couple of Dexter bulls to people who tasted him and wanted to raise their own such beef and he got a long, loyal customer list.
> 
> He didn't think the pure Dexter calves were big enough, so he crossed his Dexter bull with every breed he had on the place: Charolais/Hereford, Highland, Devon and Angus. They all tasted good, with the Dexter taste and tenderness. The Angus calves were the biggest, so he bought 30 Angus cows and went into business.
> 
> He sold every calf he could raise to his customer list except for a few times when his timing wasn't just right. Then he took his beef animals to market.
> 
> With Angus mothers, all the calves were polled and had black hides. They even met the proper description of an Angus: at least 1/2 Angus and black hide. They were in great condition and brought good prices, although not as much as he got in private sales. This was just an escape route he had for unsold calves.
> 
> Pure Angus steers didn't fatten and finish as well on grass as the Dangus. Angus weighed 1200# at market age while the Dangus weighed 900-1000#. The Dangus graded higher, though, and he always put pure Dexter or Dangus in his freezer.
> 
> His Dexter bull passed on and he switched to a Devon bull. That didn't last long. After pulling calves and losing some, he switched to a "miniature" Devon bull. It didn't help. The calves were still too big and he still pulled too many.
> 
> He even tried a Jersey bull, but that didn't work.
> 
> This year he went back to a Dexter bull. No calves yet.


I have heard stories like this before. Raising these seems to a good way to sell for freezer beef. It also seems to bring about a good hybrid. 

Hopefully we will hear a few more Dangus success stories.


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## ramiller5675

HDRider said:


> You seem a little irritated.


Why would you say that?

Everything I commented about should be considered by someone who is thinking about using a Dexter bull with a set of Angus cows. 

I hate to pull calves, which I'll bet is pretty common with an Angus bull and a Dexter cow.

I want to make a profit on the cattle I raise, it seems like it would be harder to make money with a Dexter/Angus cross calf.

It doesn't irritate me at all if someone thinks differently.


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## Dusky Beauty

It seem to me (granted, I am a backyard cow novice) that a good dexter should be truly dual purpose-- passable beef, passable dairy. 

Why wouldn't you breed all the good qualities from a dexter bull into a quality beef cow if you want efficient beef, or breed that same bull into a jersey cow if you desire a more efficient dairy animal?
Seems perfectly logical a jump to me.


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## HDRider

ramiller5675 said:


> Why would you say that?
> 
> Everything I commented about should be considered by someone who is thinking about using a Dexter bull with a set of Angus cows.
> 
> I hate to pull calves, which I'll bet is pretty common with an Angus bull and a Dexter cow.
> 
> I want to make a profit on the cattle I raise, it seems like it would be harder to make money with a Dexter/Angus cross calf.
> 
> It doesn't irritate me at all if someone thinks differently.


If you will notice my original post, I lead off saying Dexter bull on Angus cow for the very reason you said, small bull on big cow means better calving ease.

Now I just want to hear from people that do it.


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## pancho

Most people who are in the beef cattle business sell their calves by the pound.
It isn't very good business sense to breed for a smaller calf. If you sell by the pound you want a larger animal.
Dexters are for those who don't have much experience and believe some of the sales talk given by those with dexters to sell. Much like the emu farmers.


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## HDRider

pancho said:


> Most people who are in the beef cattle business sell their calves by the pound.
> It isn't very good business sense to breed for a smaller calf. If you sell by the pound you want a larger animal.
> Dexters are for those who don't have much experience and believe some of the sales talk given by those with dexters to sell. Much like the emu farmers.


So you are saying the bigger the better? How big is too big? 

Again, if one is selling mostly to folks that want to fill a home freezer , with a whole or half, smaller might work better for them.

Plus, if that smaller bull is on a large cow, just how small do you think a slaughter animal might weigh? Maybe 700# to 1,000#? Is that too small??

I would also think that combo would produce incredible calving ease, and Dexter are well known for their high milk production.

Calving ease & Good milk production sounds like a good thing, along with that good ole hybrid vigor of the cross.


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## pancho

HDRider said:


> So you are saying the bigger the better? How big is too big?
> 
> Again, if one is selling mostly to folks that want to fill a home freezer , with a whole or half, smaller might work better for them.
> 
> Plus, if that smaller bull is on a large cow, just how small do you think a slaughter animal might weigh? Maybe 700# to 1,000#? Is that too small??
> 
> I would also think that combo would produce incredible calving ease, and Dexter are well known for their high milk production.
> 
> Calving ease & Good milk production sounds like a good thing, along with that good ole hybrid vigor of the cross.


You are looking for a niche market. Notice I said people who are in the beef cattle business.
People who raise cattle for a hobby can afford to do what they want. Those who are really in the business have to do what is best for the business. Weaning smaller calves is bad business.
People in the beef cattle business do not have many problems with calving. Again, people who are in it for a hobby do not take the time to learn the business. They can breed for smaller calves and a niche market.


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## Gabriel

Within a reasonable weight range, smaller calves not only don't hurt your profit, they boost it. Ranchers need to stop thinking of pounds produced per cow and start thinking of pounds produced per unit of land. Smaller cattle are more efficient producers, so while the income per calf is lower, the number of calves sold more than offsets that.


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## HDRider

pancho said:


> You are looking for a niche market. Notice I said people who are in the beef cattle business.
> People who raise cattle for a hobby can afford to do what they want. Those who are really in the business have to do what is best for the business. Weaning smaller calves is bad business.
> People in the beef cattle business do not have many problems with calving. Again, people who are in it for a hobby do not take the time to learn the business. They can breed for smaller calves and a niche market.


Maybe I forgot what board I was on, or maybe you should be schoolin' on the cattle biz on Cattle Today follow Cattle Forum & Cattle Discussion Boards at Cattle Today


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## HDRider

I wanted to quote something from Stockman Grass Farmer - March 2010 Front page

*"Using smaller phenotype cows, pasture stockpiling and rotational grazing, per cow profits increased from a loss of $191 in 20001 to a profit of $252 in 2008. A different of $444 per cow!"*

Now I am no expert, just trying to learn from those that are, those with experiences with the subject of my post.


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## myersfarm

Gabriel said:


> Within a reasonable weight range, smaller calves not only don't hurt your profit, they boost it. Ranchers need to stop thinking of pounds produced per cow and start thinking of pounds produced per unit of land. Smaller cattle are more efficient producers, so while the income per calf is lower, the number of calves sold more than offsets that.



This makes no sense to me you will still have a herd of ANGUS COWS eating the grass and breeding them to a dexter bull which will give you smaller calves but the angus cows will still be needing the same amount of acres but producing a smaller calf


with your formula how will that make more profit ...
.thinking of pounds produced per unit of land.


..the angus cows will need same amount of land raising a 500 pound dexter cross as a 700 pound full angus.....only difference would be what the calfs eat....plus we all know what will bring more when sold at price per pound even off the farm


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## myersfarm

HDRider said:


> I wanted to quote something from Stockman Grass Farmer - March 2010 Front page
> 
> *"Using smaller phenotype cows, pasture stockpiling and rotational grazing, per cow profits increased from a loss of $191 in 20001 to a profit of $252 in 2008. A different of $444 per cow!"*
> 
> Now I am no expert, just trying to learn from those that are, those with experiences with the subject of my post.


THIS ONE LINK WILL EXPLAIN THAT doing nothing to the farm at all prices of beef in 2001 and prices in 2008

Beef price chart, 2000-2011


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## Dusky Beauty

When I was shopping dexters I was more concerned about the dairy side than the beefer side.... but I seem to recall the dexter breed is known to keep fine condition on light feed. 

As a beef rancher, your profit margin isn't only made in the price per pound, but your FEED conversion... If it takes less grain or grass to make a pound of beef, it makes better economic sense no matter if the animal's frame is smaller or larger. 

It may not make fiscal sense to a breeder who's business is feeding angus cows to sell the weaned calves at a per pound price because to that breeder it's the same amount of work and expense as a heavier calf...

But to a Beef Rancher who brings a steer up to slaughter weight, the feed conversion of a dexter hybrid is a lot more advantageous.


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## pancho

For many years farmers worked to raise the size of weaning calves.
Selective breeding for larger calves.
It is simple math.
If you are selling by the pound a larger calf will bring more.
Anyone who is in the business can do simple math.
Those who have never been in the business can come up with all kinds of web sites that will prove a smaller calf is more profitable but simple math shows that is false.

For a hobby it is possible to breed any way you want. Making a profit is not that important. If your livelyhood depends on making a profit you want a larger calf to sell.

People tend to forget and think a hobby is the same as a business.


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## agmantoo

For the buyer you must produce what the buyer wants at good value.

For the seller you need to produce what the buyer wants with the best net margin feasible for the seller.

IMO that does not exist in a Dexter. The market is too small.


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## G. Seddon

I raise registered Dexters so I've never crossed them with anything else. Yes, it's a niche market, yet I've not had any problem selling steers at weaning (I say that after having 4 spring bull calves and 1 spring heifer calf...hope that's not the kiss of death for me...I've always said that having bull calves is far less work and easier to sell than heifers). Twelve years ago, there were just a few Dexter people in Virginia, and now there are way more than a few! 

Folks like having their own beef animal to feed/finish as they want. Dexters take a little longer to get there, but the flavor is absolutely wonderful, and you get manageable amounts of meat for a family. I doubt they'll ever challenge commercial beef animals as far as size and finishing age, but they do have a place in the market, especially with more and more people on their own small farms. If the guy who crosses Dexter/Angus does well, then so be it! He has forged his place in the area. 

HDRider, you'll never get full agreement on this plan (Dexter bull covering Angus cows), but you could try it and see what happens. If it doesn't work out, then sell or eat the Dexter bull and buy an Angus bull.


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## Gabriel

myersfarm said:


> This makes no sense to me you will still have a herd of ANGUS COWS eating the grass and breeding them to a dexter bull which will give you smaller calves but the angus cows will still be needing the same amount of acres but producing a smaller calf


Not all cows, even within any given breed, are the same size. But you are correct, getting large brood cows would defeat the size advantage that I believe is available. 



> with your formula how will that make more profit ...
> .thinking of pounds produced per unit of land.


Beef cow efficiency article.

Here's another, by Oklahoma State University.


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## myersfarm

Ok Gabriel I read your link 


The first herd (52 cows, range 856 to 1395 lbs) averaged 1216 lbs. The
second herd (50 cows, range 1350 to 1935 lbs) averaged 1571. The weaning weights of calves
from cows by weight class are reported in figure 2.

NOW LOOK AT THE CHART figure 2.
BELOW WHAT I COPIED

WERE DID THE OTHER 67 COWS GO ? Since there are 169 cows on the charts...and only 102 in the herds that does not make a REPORT i WOULD PUT MUCH FAITH IN


and who decided which herd a cow that weighted in the 1350 to 1395 since the herd was devided and cover by both of herds


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## myersfarm

YOUR SECOND LINK from the Pharo Cattle Company 

The top line
represents the energy needs of 1250 pound heavy-milking beef cows versus the lower line which
represents the needs of 1100 pound moderate-milking beef cows. The values graphed are the
megacalories per day required to maintain body weight throughout the year.
yes I agree a HEAVY milker will require more tan a MODERATE MILKER.....but why is the WEIGHT DIFFERENCE IN THERE.... why is this not a 1250 heavy milker compared to a 1250 pound Moderate milker...or a 1100 pound compared to a 1100......

BTW I see no where did it say what size calf they weaned or how much the calfs brought at sale


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## wstevenl

We have a herd of mostly dexter cows. We breed to a Lowline Angus bull. The cows are much more beefy and we finish them for grass fed beef. We have had almost no birthing problems with the Lowline Angus bull. Right now I plan on keeping all the heifers and having a herd of half Lowline half Dexter.


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## ramiller5675

wstevenl,

If you didn't already have Dexter cows, would you suggest that someone cross Dexter cows with an Angus bull? Or, use a Dexter bull with some Angus cows?


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## CIW

I've listened to what has been said here. Thought I would add our personal experiences to whats being said.
We run a medium framed F1 cow. We cross them with Limosine bulls (black). Simple fact- Black sells higher.
Those cows will wean calves weighing more than 50% of thier body weight at approx. 240 days.
My calves are already contracted for an early November delivery.
I usually keep back what won't fit on the load. We finish them. This year it will be about 4 or 5. Those calves will finish about 1430 lb. at 17 or 18 months of age. This years calves are already spoken for and they aren't even weaned yet. This may sound a little bit bias but I sure like my own beef. And others seem to also.
My brother is running the same setup on 600+ pairs. The only difference is that he is running on prairie hard grass, where I'm running on cultivated pasture. His wean weights are about 15 lbs. less but will finish at slighly higher weights. He carries his steer calves to finish and sells direct to the packer. Many of his hiefers are sold as brood cows. Giving him another premium.
His cattle will always grade prime and prime +. I don't know what mine grade at, other than the butchers opinion, of which he is impressed.
We feel fortunate that we can sell on the high end of the market prices.
I'm not seeing anything crossed with dexter being able to sell any large #'s at those rates.


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## thestartupman

Does anyone have any new experiences with crossing a Dexter Bull, to an Angus Cow? I know this has been a rough topic too discuss, but I would like to know if there are any new experiences good or bad. Thanks


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## o&itw

pancho said:


> For many years farmers worked to raise the size of weaning calves.
> Selective breeding for larger calves.
> It is simple math.
> If you are selling by the pound a larger calf will bring more.
> Anyone who is in the business can do simple math.
> Those who have never been in the business can come up with all kinds of web sites that will prove a smaller calf is more profitable but simple math shows that is false.
> 
> For a hobby it is possible to breed any way you want. Making a profit is not that important. If your livelyhood depends on making a profit you want a larger calf to sell.
> 
> People tend to forget and think a hobby is the same as a business.


What you say is only half the story. Yes, 12 angus steers may sell for more than 12 dexter steers, They will weigh almost twice as much. However, one can raise almost twice as many Dexters on the same acreage that it takes to raise a given number of angus cattle.

So the pounds of meat produced will be about the same. Yes, one will have additional costs for shots, etc. But purebreed Dexters will sell for breeding stock at about the same price as pure bred Angus, and in a niche market their meat will sell for more. Purebred Dexters also have less problems and are easier to handle than purebred Angus.

Dexters, in the past, sold at premium prices as "show" and "hobby" animals, but they aren't exorbitant like they used to be. In certain situations, on certain farms the Dexter is the best choice.

Now, as for a Dexter Angus cross, (standard or lowline?) I personally can't see using a Dexter bull on an Angus unless it is for heifers, one has a gaurenteed market for the cross, or one has a Dexter bull and not an Angus one


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## Ironbutt

I am in a niche market so I don't normally sell at the sale barn so circumstances are different for those like me. I intensively graze my herd just like agmantoo as the factors he encounters I encounter also. 
I have a Dexter bull that has bred Dexter cows, red angus heifers & black angus heifers. They are due in November. With the cross I hope to improve the quality of meat and accomodate the needs of the average consumer, freezer wise. A full grown angus steer is alot of meat for most families freezers. My customers come out to the farm and see the herd and pick the angus steers I currently raise.
While their is some contraversity on angus beef verses other breeds of beef. My customers can't wait to try dexter-angus beef .. 
Plus with a Dexter bull on Angus birthing problems are elimated from what I have read.
My dexter bull overcomes most breeding problems as I have seen him manuver the heifers to a depression where he is able to mount and breed the taller heifers. Guess where their is a will their is a way ! 
I still buy angus steer calves from the sale barn for the customers who want the norm, but for me the trend seems to be the dexter-angus cross for the most profit...
My plan is to build my herd to angus-cross dexter heifers on a Dexter bull as my angus cows out eat my dexter cows. My angus cows & heifers are rowdy at times and can be a pain in the ass, where the dexters are gentle and give no problems. 
My dexter bull to the dexter cows I sell either bulls or heifers to small homesteaders who want something to raise for their personal use which I get a premium on as purebreed stock. 
Also I am retired so being profit driven is no longer a factor for me like it was 5 years ago. I figure with what I hope to have in a dexter angus cross herd of brood cows & a dexter bull will be easier for me in the long-run...


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## genebo

Review the definition of an Angus. In order to be an Angus by the Certified Angus Beef program, a bovine must be:

At least 50% Angus
Polled
Have a black hide (except for black baldies, which are permitted)

A Dexter/Angus calf from an Angus cow will fulfill all of these requirements. Therefore it is in fact, an Angus. AS much so as all the rest of the "Angus" that pass through the sale barns.

However, passing through a sale barn is not the purpose of raising Dangus beef. The beef you get is better that the sale barn Angus beef. Customers can tell that and are willing to pay for it.

The only reason for taking a Dangus to the sale barn is if you raise more than you can market.

When one does go to the sale barn, it's lower weight puts it in a higher price bracket. Check the prices of 450-550# steers VS 600-750# steers.

The virtually non-existant loss rate of calves gives you more animals to take to market.

The higher feed efficiency on grass makes them gain weight AS A HERD on grass better than the traditional Angus, which has been bred to be more efficient on grain. You get more grass fed beef to sell.

If sold on a proper plan, Dangus beef isn't sold by the pound. It is sold by the animal, preferably by the half-animal, which better suits the beef buying public.

The best way to sell a Dangus is to sell it on the hoof, to two buyers. Each buys a side. The Dangus is delivered to the slaughter house, where each buyer provides his own cut list. All this can be done for a package price, possibly even including picking up the processed beef and delivering it to the buyer.

It has worked so weel for my friend that every year he increased the number of Angus cows he keeps, buying or leasing land to raise them on.

He is so successful that he has attracted the Arby's folks to measure the yield and fat content of his cattle, with a view to buying grass fed beef from him.

He had a lucrative job in town that he gave up to devote himself to his newfound business and is happier and on his way to becoming a big landowner.

All the arguments against his plan are based upon doing things the traditional way, ending with a sale at auction. A way that accepts a nominal calf loss each year as the cost of doing business. A way that rides the ups and downs of feed costs. A way that requires a lot of input to get the maximum out of each animal to hold a decent profit margin.

Meanwhile, My friend is studying new ways to raise grass. Not a very demanding task. Plus he gets to plan his sales in advance, so he always knows what will be coming in.

It's not the plan for everybody. If everybody did it, it would crush the demand for Dangus beef. Then my friend would be forced to sell his cattle at the same prices everybody else gets. For now, he's offering a superior product at a worthwhile price. The demand exceeds the supply.

Incidentally, my friend has experimented with using other bulls to see if he could produce the same quality beef, but in greater quantity. He has also used different bulls in an attempt to raise the fat content of his beef. He got more beef out of some and he got fattier beef out of some, but the Dangus beef tasted the best and that is what his customers ask for.


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## Ironbutt

pancho said:


> For many years farmers worked to raise the size of weaning calves.
> Selective breeding for larger calves.
> It is simple math.
> If you are selling by the pound a larger calf will bring more.
> Anyone who is in the business can do simple math.
> Those who have never been in the business can come up with all kinds of web sites that will prove a smaller calf is more profitable but simple math shows that is false.
> 
> For a hobby it is possible to breed any way you want. Making a profit is not that important. If your livelyhood depends on making a profit you want a larger calf to sell.
> 
> People tend to forget and think a hobby is the same as a business.


 Maybe most people think that way. but being in cattle business since 1972and seeing the changes in the consumer and the animal industry I think changes are coming..
Until the internet came along I have really learned alot more about cattle farming than what was the industry taught. 
Most people I talk with now see profit in different ways, pounds produced and money saved. Even most hobby cattlemen or women can tell you their profit is raising a high quality steer for the freezer over what they could or feel comfortable buying at walmart. I see profit in my herd from sale of quality beef with tenderness & flavor & in amount of grass and the time it takes to produce it. 
Buying hay or baling hay cost money, alot of big cows eat alot of hay. So growing grass makes more sense and smaller cows are more efficent at converting grass to beef in less time. So with current trends I think smaller cows will become the norm as beef prices for the consumer increase....
Anyone who raises cattle does so to make a profit even the hobby catteperson , like I said that profit is saving money at the grocery store in quality & taste or dollar bills for the wallet. If not they would go broke eventually !!!!! 
I have seen changes in the beef industry since my grandfathers time and think the days of big cows & calves are numbered. Grass conversion to beef is where the industry is headed as ranges & pasture land dwindle due to population growth around the world. As the cereal crop profits increase and more pasture is put into production sure makes it hard to raise one cow per acre rather than two dexters or two lowlines per acre. Like I learned from this site I'm no longer a cattleman but a grass farmer if I don't have grass I can't have cows as I can't afford to feed $7.00 a bushel corn or $ 50.00 a bale hay. I have to become more efficient at growing quality grass & have more efficient cattle that makes me a profit to survive.... 

I know this is funny but years ago I saw a space movie and one space ship was hauling square hogs as they were more efficent as to cargo space. made me think with smaller cuts at the grocery store as price has increased why not just raise smaller cows with smaller cuts?????


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## lakeportfarms

Genebo and Ironbutt have it right on the money.

We had our Dexter bull covering Angus and Hereford cows for several years before switching primarily to an all Dexter herd. Our bull (a chondro carrier at 39" tall at the hip) had no problem breeding the largest Angus and Hereford cow on the property that were probably better than 50". The calves they had were larger than a Dexter, but did not have the size of the 100% Angus calves they had the year prior to being bred by our bull.

We have a nice market outside of the sales barn for our Dexter beef, and we're moving toward a herd of chondro carrier cows with a non-chondro carrier bull. I should get a photo of our 600 lb. cow at 36", with her about to get processed 2yr. old non-chondro steer of 46" and 800 lbs. and her 8 month old non-chondro steer about to be weaned at probably 400 lbs. that's as tall as she is, and she's going to calve again in 3 months. If she has a heifer she'll be registered and we'll either retain her or sell her for a fair bit of change to a hobby farmer/homesteader. She is still fat on grass alone. I'd love a whole herd of her and that's where we're headed as we adjust our herd over time. Greater numbers of cows on a given acreage, and heifers that sell for more money at a young age than nearly any other breed. It just takes some extra work to start, and "word of mouth" referral sales after you've been established a while and there is no problem finding your customers. And we have about 60 Dexters right now.


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## copperhead46

pancho said:


> Most people who are in the beef cattle business sell their calves by the pound.
> It isn't very good business sense to breed for a smaller calf. If you sell by the pound you want a larger animal.
> Dexters are for those who don't have much experience and believe some of the sales talk given by those with dexters to sell. Much like the emu farmers.


 Whoa now, don't be lumping all Dexter breeders into a category like that, not a fair statement. I've raised cattle for over 40 years and I chose to raise Dexters, no one talked me into anything. I needed a smaller beef for the freezer and found Dexters, I needed something I could handle a little easier, and found Dexters, I needed something I could run on a lot smaller acreage and found Dexters, I needed something that would do well on a grass based diet, instead of grain and I found Dexters. 
Now that I have a few extra I sell "by the pound" and get a good price, and have my freezer full of good beef.
So please, don't put me into a group that you have distain for, simply because I chose to raise a different breed of cattle than you.


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## G. Seddon

Save your breath, copperhead. Pancho has never said one good thing about a Dexter. Those of us with Dexters know their worth.


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## genebo

Copperhead, I love your fire.


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## linn

We use our young Angus bulls on our Dexter cows. You can't tell the calves from this cross from the rest of the calves. They are small at birth and grow well.


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## Copperhead

So my friend has a short legged Dexter Bull. Cute little guy stands at 42". When my friend's neighbor lost his bull because it went through his fence and trotted down the road, the neighbor cut my friends fence!

For the next 5 weeks, that little bull bred every one of the neighbor's 20+ Angus cows. Those were the chunkiest little steers you ever saw!


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## WAHAR

HDRider said:


> Is anyone here pursuing a Dexter / Angus breeding program?
> 
> Are you Dexter Bull on Angus Cow? Or, other way around??
> 
> How has your birthing worked out? How many times do you assist? 1 out 10, 1 out of 100, or never ever?
> 
> Please tell me how things are going. Any regrets?
> 
> Howâs the beef on the table? What are your customers saying about taste and tenderness?
> 
> 
> Thanks


I have Dangus bull (Dexter X brangus) over Brangus X fresuian cows my caring has been 100 % 3 cow cave every with out fail!! the cave amazing . Tanya Bailey


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## haypoint

genebo said:


> My friend doesn't post on the boards, but I can tell you a lot about his operation.
> 
> He has used a Dexter bull over Angus cows to get "Dangus" calves for several years. Never a birthing problem.
> 
> It all started over a Dexter cross bull calf he served at a political gathering. The people raved over the beef. I sold a couple of Dexter bulls to people who tasted him and wanted to raise their own such beef and he got a long, loyal customer list.
> 
> He didn't think the pure Dexter calves were big enough, so he crossed his Dexter bull with every breed he had on the place: Charolais/Hereford, Highland, Devon and Angus. They all tasted good, with the Dexter taste and tenderness. The Angus calves were the biggest, so he bought 30 Angus cows and went into business.
> 
> He sold every calf he could raise to his customer list except for a few times when his timing wasn't just right. Then he took his beef animals to market.
> 
> With Angus mothers, all the calves were polled and had black hides. They even met the proper description of an Angus: at least 1/2 Angus and black hide. They were in great condition and brought good prices, although not as much as he got in private sales. This was just an escape route he had for unsold calves.
> 
> Pure Angus steers didn't fatten and finish as well on grass as the Dangus. Angus weighed 1200# at market age while the Dangus weighed 900-1000#. The Dangus graded higher, though, and he always put pure Dexter or Dangus in his freezer.
> 
> His Dexter bull passed on and he switched to a Devon bull. That didn't last long. After pulling calves and losing some, he switched to a "miniature" Devon bull. It didn't help. The calves were still too big and he still pulled too many.
> 
> He even tried a Jersey bull, but that didn't work.
> 
> This year he went back to a Dexter bull. No calves yet.


Reminds me of a neighbor that bought a dozen starved Black Angus calves. He fed them good and got them looking good. Sold at Auction. The buyer thought they were just younger, didn't know they were stunted. 
I think the same thing for someone selling Dangus. The buyer may be mad when he discovers that they just won't grow to the size the butcher cattle buyers seek.


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