# Spinning Info??



## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

Hi everyone. I'm new here, and pretty new to country life. My husband and I are considering getting a couple of alpacas in the next year. I feel like if I'm going to "raise" the fleece, I want to handle it from start to finished project. Problem is I know NOTHING about getting what's on an animal to turn into yarn.:help:

Can anyone recommend some good books that could break this down for me? I figure I have at least a year before I might have fleece to work with, and it will probably take me that long to figure out what I'm doing.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Hello and Welcome to The Fold MamaRed! We have a few Alpaca raisers here, I'm sure they can help you with some good book titles. In the mean time you can poke a round in the stickies at the top of the forum. The one that says something like, 101's, also if you try doing a search of this forum with the word Alpaca in it you will find lost of info I'm sure.


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## bergere (May 11, 2002)

Look for a Spinning Guild in your area. They can normally be very helpful.
That is how I started out, oh so many years ago. 
Where the guild met up was a handspinners shop... they had every wheel out there at the time... so one could spin on the wheels and figure out which one worked best for each person. Was great!


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

Welcome aboard, MamaRed! And congratulations on your new adventure into the country life! There is a wealth of information here...but I will warn you...this place is inhabited by unrepentant enablers. I am newer to this fold myself and have found a warm welcome and quickly turned into an enabler right along with the rest of them! 

One of my good friends raises alpacas. She has this one that is so utterly hilarious I could spend hours with her. She will saunter up behind you and then tuck her head under your arm...and then snake her head around so she is looking right at you...cock her head and say, "Meeep?" If you say "meeep" back she will, too...and on and on it can go...this strange little conversation of meeeps meeeps meeeps. 

You might want to start doing a bit of research on the types of alpacas there are because the fiber has different characteristics. Suri fleece hangs close to their body and is more "slippery" than huacaya. Huacaya alpacas have that poofy look to them because their fleece stands out more. Suri's have wavy locks but shouldn't be crimped and huacays have defined staples and are crimpy. Waves in a suri are desired but crimps are considered a fault, at least as I understand it from her long ago lessons. She raised suri's for more outter wear and huacaya for things close to the skin.

I've been pestering everyone here with my questions - everything from processing fiber to equipment like carders and wheels. Feel free to jump in on any of those threads and add your own questions! 

I picked up Three Bags Full, which is a two disc CD set about selecting and processing wool. Not sure how applicable it is for alpaca fiber but I've learned a lot from it.


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

Wow. Thanks so much for your responses! This is like the tooth fairy - I ask a question at night, and wake up to answers.

I already looked up "spinners guild" and there is one in the town next door. Not only do they have spinning wheels to try out there, I can even rent one! I'll definitely contact them after the holiday.

I'll also check out the stickies and Three Bags Full. For now, its off to tend the flock!:cowboy:


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## foolsgold (Jun 8, 2013)

I am going to keep a close eye on this thread. I am already a spinner but I received two alpaca blankets from helping a lady sheer her alpacas this spring and while the fiber is SO clean and SO soft (OMG think a fuzzy cloud of heaven) I'm scared as to how to proceed from the blanket to spinning. Do I treat it like sheep fleece and card it? Or can I work it straight from the blanket? I'm drooling to work with it but I am scared lol this is a LOT of fiber and I don't want to waste any of it.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

I just finished spinning two blankets for other people. The one had already been washed and picked. The other was a raw fleece. Don't be fooled by how clean it looks, Alpaca and Llamas like to take dust baths. The raw fleece I soaked in my rain barrel over night and dunked it up and down gently to release some of the dirt before removing it. Then I dried it, carded it via my drum carder, and spun it up. It was a very dirty fleece, my hands were dirty after spinning it. But I spun it all up and then washed the heck out of it and I wasn't very gentle with it either. It took 2-3 washes in hot soapy water and rinsing to get it more or less clean. Then I thwacked it and hung the skeins to dry. It was beautiful yarn if I do say so myself. You can wash it before spinning but be careful, that's one reason I like to wash it after spinning, you don't have to be careful with it at that point. This is how I process Alpaca and there are as many ways to process it as there are people on this forum . Good luck!


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

I raise alpacas. I invested in a tumbler this year now that the price is coming down. What a dream!! There's a book called Alpaca Field Manual. Its expensive, but maybe you'll get lucky and find a used one over the next year. 3rd edition is the best. Might check out Facebook group Paca This and alpacanation.com. Also Openherd.com is a neat place to shop. 

Kasota - MEEP! Ha ha! 2 meeps and that alpaca would be like the roadrunner, "MEEP MEEP!" When I first got my alpacas, they were afraid of EVERYTHING, especially small creatures like rabbits and squirrels. A squirrel would go running by and they would sound the alarm, which sounds like a donkey, Hee Honk, in the high pitched voice of a dog's squeaker toy. The squeaker toy hee honk went off about 4 or 5 times a day for a long time.


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

RacoonBreath, LOL! Oh, I swear she scared me to death the first time she did it. She would "meep" and blink her eyes slowly with her nose about an inch away and then she would move her head back a little and cock her head and meep meep meep again. She could literally go on like this for a half hour. She looked rather like an alien from space trying to break the language barrier. 

Her alpacas were for the most part very tame. She went to a LOT of shows and purchased a van to haul them in if she was just taking a couple. It was a conversion van and she had taken everything out except the two front seats. People would drive by and see an alpaca face in the window and about freak out. hahahahahaha! Her alpacas would hop in and out of that van like it was no big deal. Very strange. I think they got to be like dogs and liked going for rides.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Ha ha ha!! Mine do not load up well. I've got older girls, 7 to 9 years old, lots of issues. I got kicked in the face loading a pregnant one about 6 months ago. That was pretty awesome!! A have a friend that went to pick a fancy angora goat buck up in another state. She had her little hatch back and it was fall so the goat was covered in pee and smelled pretty rank. She put a diaper on him (don't know how she did that with a mature buck), spread a tarp out and off she went. LOLLLL!! I bet the car still stinks. 

Next time that paca Meeps at you, let her smell your breath a little. Just gently blow for her to smell and see what she does. I learned that llamas smell breath and started doing it with the pacas. They sniff my hands and smell my breath like a greeting..sort of.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

You think I'm kidding about the breath huh?? Alpacas do this too.

http://shangrillama.blogspot.com/2013/09/how-to-greet-llama.html

I just gently blow tho. I need to blow from the gut!! lol


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

LOL!!!! 

My heart-to-heart horse, Eli, always insisted on sharing inhales and exhales. It was just proper manners. Kind of like "Here I am. There you are." I sure do miss him. 

I do confess I am glad alpacas don't partake of the canine method of getting to know you. Meeping of the nether regions would be decidedly peculiar.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

ROFL..pee my pants funny! lol I hope my nethers don't get meeped! You now have something to put in the signature area of your posts. Talk about meeping nethers. Something like:

Kasota
Meeping Nethers Ranch and Fiberworks
"Don't let your nethers get meeped!!"


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

raccoon breath said:


> I raise alpacas. I invested in a tumbler this year now that the price is coming down. What a dream!! There's a book called Alpaca Field Manual. Its expensive, but maybe you'll get lucky and find a used one over the next year. 3rd edition is the best. Might check out Facebook group Paca This and alpacanation.com. Also Openherd.com is a neat place to shop..


Thanks! Since you raise alpacas, I used your message as a checklist.:clap: I joined the Paca This FB page, put Alpaca Field Manual on my Amazon wishlist (cuz, yeah, that's super expensive!), I've already checked out alpacanation.com, and I'm opening up Openherd.com right now. I'm kind of glad the sun isn't supposed to shine here for the next couple of months - gives me lots of time to research everything.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Hi Mamared. Through Openherd, you can search for farm/ranches in your area. As you contact them about alpacas (and see if any offer tours), take note of the ones that don't mind talking with you, educating you and are willing to walk you through things even after your alpacas come home. I contacted my breeder and told her I was looking for some healthy fiber animals. She helped set me up with 6 alpacas, all rescues, registered, and I got them for free. After I brought these girls home, I was contacted by 2 other alpaca farms offering animals they no longer needed for free. As they aim for the perfect herd, the less important animals have to go and for a fiber farmer, this can be a great situation. But, you'll have to learn about what to look for as far as the fiber you want and health problems to avoid. I have one girl with pastern problems. She should never be bred. No problem. Another girl's babies never live past 2 weeks. I don't plan to breed and just want the fiber so I get one fawn ultra fine girl and the other is a beautiful rose gray. YAY!! My others are all white (one with cute orange freckles and loves bananas) and they don't have any big problems so if I ever wanted to breed, I could. The rancher that helped me get them offered a stud service for free, but I don't know enough to take that step yet. Its good to have the option though.


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

Well, this will keep your car or van from getting stinky inside:









Saves the bother of buying a trailer, too! (Does it look like they are held down with bungee cords?)

We have 'pacas that live uphill from us so we help with the annual shearing. It is a lot more work to shear 'pacas than sheep! At least, the ones around here, maybe other folks do it differently.

You could get some alpaca fiber or alpaca roving to practice on until you get your own. Then, when your own showed up, you'd be ready to go.

Alpaca is a somewhat slippery fiber since it doesn't have the same crimpy pattern that wool usually does. It also doesn't make a yarn that stretches much. Makes a soft lovely feeling yarn, though.

I'll spin 'paca raw and then wash the yarn. Or feed it into the carder (alpaca works really well in drum carders), spin it and then wash it. Alpacas are dusty beasties! They must _bathe_ in the dirt, the yarn is so dirty! The yarn water looks like mud after the first wash of alpaca yarn.

You could try a bit of 'paca fiber and a drop spindle if you are looking for a starting point. Less expense, although it takes a lot longer to spin with a spindle than a wheel. But the basics of how the fiber twists is similar and what you learn on the spindle will migrate nicely to a wheel.

Basically, you get a handful of 'paca fiber. Or any other fiber, for that matter. Pull a bit out from the handful and start twisting it. As you draw the fibers out from the handful, the twist that you are putting into the fibers will follow the tension in the fibers as you pull them out of the bundle. It's a combination of the twist and the tension for the twist to follow. If you want fatter yarn, pull out more fiber and let the twist get into the fiber when there's more of it in the "draw" zone. (That's the space between the bundle of fiber and where the twist gets into it). If you want skinnier yarn, pull out less fiber. Keep twisting until the fiber will twist up on itself somewhat if you relax the tension. Then wind that around the bobbin or shaft of the spindle or what ever you're using to hold the twisted fibers. Once you get a bundle of twisted fibers collected on your bobbin, the make another bobbin full and then twist the fibers from the two bobbins together by _twisting them the other way_. That's the secret to making yarn, so don't tell anyone.


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

I spent some time on Openherd today. Cool site! I had already found a farm animal rescue that has a couple of alpacas, but its good to know something could also be worked out with breeders. My sister in law grew up with horses and tried breeding them several years ago. It was one disaster after another, and she gave it up. After watching her struggles, I know I don't want to breed - at least not for a loooong time.

There are a few breeders here who encourage visits and make a point of saying they WANT you to call with any questions. My husband spoke to a breeder for quite awhile at a Christmas event -she had her little furry ones in deer antler headbands and my husband fell in love with them. She invited us to come visit her ranch, so we'll be doing that now that the holidays are over. I have to say, I've seen and LOVE the purply color of the dark rose grey.

I looked into the spinners guild, too. They meet once a month, have frequent classes and workshops, a library of books and Dvds to check out, and a variety of equipment to rent and try at home, and if you're new, one of their experienced spinners will sit with you and walk you through all the steps. I can't wait for their January meeting. I'm very excited to see how this all works.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Mamared - I just saw the price on that book at Amazon. UNBELIEVABLE!! And it's not even the new edition! :grumble: The new edition is supposed to have more information and not so loaded down with pics. It amazes me how some sellers will associate something with wealth and price accordingly. Alpacas are a prime example of that. Here's a much better price, however, I hope you find a price that's fair when the time comes because this is still too much. 

http://www.lightlivestockequipment.com/proddetail.php?prod=FIELDMANUAL


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Sounds like your headed in the right direction with things.  YAY!! I'm happy for you!


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

If you Google his name, you can find this message and perhaps you could send him a message and ask if he has a copy you can buy directly from him?

Dr. Evans message with maybe email address


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Pics of some of my kids  I've included some angora goats (mohair coats). I almost included sheep pics but the baby goats might have caused cuteness overload!

**GONNA TRY TO MOVE THESE PICS OVER TO MY PROFILE IF I CAN SO I DONT DISTRACT FROM THE TOPIC


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

Oh...those pictures are wonderful! They look like they could be be a bit of a dickens! Thanks for sharing them!


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Thank you


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

Your goats are too much! So cute! PapaRed and I went out bright and early and got to work on the future animal yard.


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## Miz Mary (Feb 15, 2003)

CUTE goaties !! Made me want to see the sheepies too !!


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

Will there be room in your future animal yard for goaties as well as 'pacas? Tuck a few angora bunnies in the back? Oh, and a sheepie or two.


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

Land is like a yarn closet. The tendency is to fill up what you have. LOL!


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## DragonFlyFarm (Oct 12, 2012)

Welcome MamaRed! I am fairly new to the world of fiber myself. The guild in my area meets during the week when I'm at work. I learned quite a bit watching You Tube videos, and getting my hands on some wool to play with. I don't have any alpaca to spare, but would be happy to send you a couple chunks of raw fiber -- this would let you practice a bit with washing, carding/combing (you can start with dog slickers or fine dog combs) and drafting. PM me with your address if you are interested. Fiber is fun....and addicting!


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## frazzlehead (Aug 23, 2005)

MamaRed, I hafta tell you that rose gray is my favourite alpaca fleece colour too. 

and I'll add to DragonFlyFarm's offer of wool - you should start with wool, it's much easier than alpaca to spin - I do have some alpaca here, I can put a few tufts in an envelope if you want to try some. Just PM me.


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

Wow! Wow. You guys are wonderful! DragonFly and Frazzle, I'll send you my address. Thank you so much for your generosity. I'm really excited to go to the spinners guild meeting. It's not until the end of the month, so I have to be patient!

Hotz, we're starting with mini goats for dairy, and to get our feet wet with something smallish. We also want to see how the space works out. Once we're settled in with the goats and know we can manage the 'pacas, we'll move forward - at least that's the plan. I came across a rescue that has a pair of goats and a pair of alpacas that are all friends. We'll see how the stars align at the time. (My husband wants rabbits, but they may have to wait until spring 2015) What is a good amount of space for alpacas? I've had trouble finding an answer.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

So funny Kasota. Very true. I'm reducing my numbers trying to get focused fewer directions for this year. That's my intention anyway but goat babies start arriving next month. Yay babies!! 

Mamared - I understand starting small. That's good that the alpacas already know goats. I don't have pasture for mine so I need less space. At first, the 6 had access to 5 acres and they checked the place out when they first got here but didn't use it for grazing. Now, they have 2 acres to roam in during the day and I bring them in at night into 6' high chain link pens for safety. I'm very rural and we have mountain lions, bear, bobcats, coyotes, etc out here. All animals are locked up at night. The paca girls go into a 24'x24' pen to sleep, then I let them back out in the morning. They don't use the 2 acres. They'll go exercise in the morning a little but most of the time, they lounge around or hang out by the feeders.


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## featherbottoms (May 28, 2005)

So what's an "alpaca blanket"?


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

featherbottoms said:


> So what's an "alpaca blanket"?


Ooh, I think I've learned this one! The big, top section of fleece after it's sheared off. Did I get it right?


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Yes. This pic might help. When they are being sheared, there's a bag for prime, a bag for 2nd, nice fleece sometimes shorter and mixed with coarser hair (neck, going down the legs, and belly), and then where they are just coarse hair (right at the bottom of the belly and low legs) I tossed out but now that I've been working with churro sheep and learning what the coarser fiber can be used for, I might save some of that longer coarse hair for weaving rugs or something of that sort.


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

Here the shearer's do the first skirting and then a couple of us will pick over the rest and sort them. We can usually get half the fiber sorted and ready to send to the mill by the time they are done shearing them. There's only about six 'pacas so it's not that grueling of a task.

There is a big frame with chicken wire screen on it which is used to support the blankets for picking.

MamaRed, the folks we know with dairy goats keep Nubians since their milk is very close to if not indistinguishable from homogenized store bought cow's milk. It's much more "milk" like (if you are used to store bought milk) than raw cow's milk is. There are other breeds of dairy goats and apparently the milk tastes different depending on the breed of goat. Some are for goat cheese and some are for drinking milk. At least, this is according to my friends who keep goats.

Bunnies don't take much room! There should be room for a few fuzzy buns in there somewhere?


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

Another milk goat is a Saanen. That's what I had. My friend nearby had Nubians. Lots of milk fat in Nubian milk. 

Goat milk is more naturally "homogenized" than cow's milk - at least to an extent. And it has a real tendency to pick up flavors depending on what the goats are eating. It will even pick up odors from a milking area. Do not let milk goats get into wild onion or garlic. It does make interesting cheese, but is not suitable for drinking. Ask me how I know.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

I bought a little manual milker to help my bad hands keep up with the milking. It helped with that, but the perfect thing was that it helps someone with just a couple goats keep everything perfectly clean. Nothing gets in it, exposure to open air is limited and it gets immediately capped pulling off the udder. Stay CLEAN, CLEAN, CLEAN with it and it's amazing, especially just before bed in a tall glass of ice with a snack:spinsmiley:


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

How does the milk from cashmere or angora goats taste?


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Burning the midnight oil too? lol I've been spinning. Don't know about cashmere. My doe had some health problems right after birth so meds and drying her off. My angoras have creamier milk, but there isn't much of it.


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Forgot you're in Hawaii.


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

raccoon breath said:


> I bought a little manual milker to help my bad hands keep up with the milking. It helped with that, but the perfect thing was that it helps someone with just a couple goats keep everything perfectly clean. Nothing gets in it, exposure to open air is limited and it gets immediately capped pulling off the udder. Stay CLEAN, CLEAN, CLEAN with it and it's amazing, especially just before bed in a tall glass of ice with a snack:spinsmiley:


So many people on the goat forum were talking about the Jeffers catalog, I had to go check it out. I saw the little hand pumper. It looked like a nifty little gadget. My catalog should be arriving soon.:happy2:
We're not big milk drinkers. I was planning on using goat's milk for cheese and soaps. I've heard about what they eat affecting the flavor of the milk. Blackberries may not be so bad, but onion? Yuck! (When I was a kid I accidentally used garlic butter in buttercream icing. :huh: Not something I ever want to repeat.)


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## raccoon breath (Aug 5, 2010)

Mamared - Gross! ha ha I've experienced the flavor thing Kasota spoke of too when goats got into chicken scraps including onion. YUCK! Around here, there's a lot of mountain mahogany growing. Its smells good and the goats love it, but unfortunately it doesn't taste good flavoring milk. It's not as bad as garlic or onion though. I'm kinda wondering if you were going to make a cheese that was good flavored with garlic or onion, would flavored milk be good for that? I might try it in the spring with one of the easy, soft cheeses just to see. Maybe I'll make my husband taste it first though! :hysterical:

About that hand pumper, if you get the Udderly EZ, be careful about the two plastic rails that come out from the pump to support the parts that thread into the bottle. Those rails are VERY fragile. Be careful not to try to untwist the bottle from the parts above it while connected and not to do anything that stresses those rails unnecessarily. They'll snap right off..very fragile. I love mine


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## Pinehollow (Oct 15, 2013)

was going to start a thread...


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## hotzcatz (Oct 16, 2007)

raccoon breath said:


> Forgot you're in Hawaii.


I think that's why when we do everything slow, they call it "Hawaiian Time". We are always behind everyone else. By the time I'm awake with coffee and ready to chat with folks on the mainland, they're already past lunch and busy with their day.

Garlic butter cream icing? Well, that's new, isn't it? Hmm, maybe spaghetti and meatballs with garlic butter cream cake instead of garlic bread?


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## MamaRed (Dec 18, 2013)

You only make the garlic mistake once! I was wondering if the garlic would help flavor cheese, too. Let me know how that works out.


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