# Treatments that are working or not working on Covid



## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Please no politics.

I have read that Remdesivir is promising. Has anyone heard of any others? I have read that Hydroxychloroquine is not.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

Remdessivir is the first treatment I've heard of that I trust.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

painterswife said:


> Please no politics.


Why now and not an hour ago?


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

I heard that in the failed Hydroxychloroquine test that zinc was not given. Now supposedly Hydroxychloroquine makes you absorb zinc better, and zinc has long been known as an anti-viral


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

I have read that the damage that Hydroxychloroquine does is not a good enough reason to use it as a ionophore for zinc. Intravenous zinc is being tested in Australia but even then Zinc is not supposed to be a magic bullet against Covid.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

SRSLADE said:


> Remdessivir is the first treatment I've heard of that I trust.


Mr. Pixie sent me some great information on remdessivir, and it does look hopeful. 

Convalescent plasma is working as well.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Irish Pixie said:


> Mr. Pixie sent me some great information on remdessivir, and it does look hopeful.
> 
> Convalescent plasma is working as well.


Yea listened to Arkansas governor's daily spiel yesterday. Some person in really bad shape for couple weeks, they gave the plasma from recovered person and it worked darn miracle. Person on ventilator that was close to being in a coffin, recovered. I just imagine this isnt in plentiful abundance. And corporations havent figured out how to mimic it in factory imitation they can patent. Silly to find a cure that you cant make money from.... right?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

HermitJohn said:


> I just imagine this isnt in plentiful abundance.


There are at least 706,636 people who have recovered and could be a source.

Some studies are suggesting the true numbers would add hundreds of thousands to that total.

There are at least 10 drugs being tested now, and 2 vaccines, along with other treatments.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

HermitJohn said:


> Yea listened to Arkansas governor's daily spiel yesterday. Some person in really bad shape for couple weeks, they gave the plasma from recovered person and it worked darn miracle. Person on ventilator that was close to being in a coffin, recovered. I just imagine this isnt in plentiful abundance. And corporations havent figured out how to mimic it in factory imitation they can patent. Silly to find a cure that you cant make money from.... right?


Yup. It's not a "cheap" treatment by any means.


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## MFSuspect (Apr 22, 2020)

Rx


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

The Ohio State University is starting to do studies on the effectiveness of giving people nitric oxide.
https://www.10tv.com/article/ohio-s...l-trial-potential-treatment-covid-19-2020-apr


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

painterswife said:


> I have read


Links would be nice.
I've read lots of things that say lots of things.
Often people get confused about what is really stated. 
Many times articles are simply too biased to be accurate.
Here's an example, with editoral comments included.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Looks like the most promising treatment is still exposure, and the gradual buildup of human antibodies. It has worked for the majority of those infected.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

painterswife said:


> Please no politics.
> 
> I have read that Remdesivir is promising. Has anyone heard of any others? I have read that Hydroxychloroquine is not.


Whether or not hydroxychloroquine works depends on the patient, the comorbidities, and the stage of the disease. There are accounts of people surviving with hydroxy after being put on a ventilator. Elderly in the 90's and even over a hundred have survived with hydroxy.

A neighbor is on hydroxy at home and recovering. The VA tried it as a last ditch for people with no other options and saw most die. If the virus wipes out the red blood cells to the point hydroxy can't interfere with the process in time for the body to generate new red blood cells you'll be DRT. 

The microemboli are also symptomatic of the red blood cell damage in some people.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Irish Pixie said:


> Yup. It's not a "cheap" treatment by any means.


A hospital not to far away saved someone with the plasma treatment. The patient was lucky the hospital was collaborating with the Mayo Clinic and got the infusion.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Why now and not an hour ago?


painterswife did not turn the last thread political.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

wr said:


> painterswife did not turn the last thread political.


It was political when she started it. It was political because Trump touted Hydroxychloroquine and she wanted to discredit its possibility as a treatment as a dig on Trump. Her very first post was political. 

Making so many of her post political, subtlety, that is her little trick. Maybe you and others don't always see it, but it is there nonetheless. Plus it gives her deniability.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Danaus29 said:


> The Ohio State University is starting to do studies on the effectiveness of giving people nitric oxide.
> https://www.10tv.com/article/ohio-s...l-trial-potential-treatment-covid-19-2020-apr


I was reading some studies with it and SARS. It looks promising.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

For whatever reason, *cough, cough*, good news of recoveries and successful treatments are not on the network media. I run specific searches to find the info on local TV stations and on the websites of local and regional newspapers. 

On another site I've been posting many excerpts and links to those stories daily. Most of them show a perilous near death experience and then a recovery after treatment using either the two or three drug treatment including hydroxychloroquine. 

More stories are emerging about recoveries using remdesivir. The recent news about a 26 y/o athlete, Jack Allard who was on a ventilator for several weeks couldn't say whether his recovery was due to remdesiver. 

He was moved from a hospital in NJ while in a medically induced coma to a hospital in PA. Did he receive the drug? Because he was included in a trial the news source indicated no one knows *cough, cough, *if he was given the drug. 

A TV station, to their embarrassment, reported he had died then rolled the tape showing him leaving the hospital.

You can draw your own conclusions about whether or not the network media is biased. I haven't watched TV for over ten years. I check a couple of obscure websites not supported by advertising daily to get news and opinion that I have relied on for over twenty years. 

Those made it easy to ditch the TV.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

HDRider said:


> It was political when she started it.


I saw it that way too, as did a couple of others, based on their comments.
Patterns.......


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I saw it that way too, as did a couple of others, based on their comments.
> Patterns.......


Yet @wr did not


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

HDRider said:


> Yet @wr did not


Opinions do vary sometimes.
It's all good.

The pattern isn't likely to change.


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

Seven years ago French doctors who specialized in treating older patients and all pneumonia patients discovered that if they turned them on their stomachs they did much better and recovered faster. This position allows more oxygen to enter the lungs. It is being used all over the world now and is one of the treatments that is aiding in treating covid-19 patients, including those on ventilators. This is working on many including the elderly to make them more comfortable as well as healing faster - but deaths are still happening.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

I bet turning them on their stomachs helps not have your sinuses draining into your lungs. I wonder what else it does for the lungs?


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

The VA "study" showing that hydroxychloroquine didn't work was flawed in several ways. Most importantly it was given to patients that were elderly and about to die. No wonder most of them died. The French doctor reported good results when Hydroxychloroquine was given to younger patients early in the disease. 






The media jumped all over the VA "study" because it made Trump look bad because he supposedly was touting Hydroxychloroquine. Trump is for trying drugs that show promise on beating the covid virus and cutting through the red tape. Better to try something than let the patient die. 

This whole topic is political and the OP knew it when she started the thread. It should be banished to the dark room.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/14/health/coronavirus-prone-positioning/index.html

"Critical care specialists say being on the belly seems help because it allows oxygen to more easily get to the lungs. While on the back, the weight of the body in effect squishes some sections of the lungs.
"By putting them on their stomachs, we're opening up parts of the lung that weren't open before," Hibbert said."

Sounds good.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

"At Rush University Medical Center, they're studying whether the stomach position is helpful for patients who are not so sick that they need a ventilator to breathe for them, but sick enough that they need supplemental oxygen delivered through a tube in their nose.

In their clinical trial, patients are being randomly assigned to be on their stomachs or backs, according to David Vines, chair of the cardiopulmonary sciences department at Rush.

"*We'll see *if proning helps, and if so, how long should they be in the prone position," Vines said."


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

msn news
powered by Microsoft News 



*SA scientists make important Covid-19 discovery*



2020-04-06








© Provided by Independent Media Graphic: Thor Deichmann/Pixabay
Cape Town - Scientists around the world have been tirelessly working to find a cure for Covid-19. A group of South African scientists and researchers have contributed to the cause and have made a vital discovery.

A team from the National Institute for Communicable Diseases (NICD) and the South African National Bioinformatics Institute (SANBI) at the University of the Western Cape (UWC) have successfully sequenced South Africa’s first SARS-COV-2 genome.

*What does this mean?*
A genome is the genetic material of an organism. The team of researchers were able to sequence the first SARS-COV-2 genome in South Africa, which will provide a genetic “fingerprint” that can help scientists understand and contain the spread of Covid-19.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Darren said:


> Whether or not hydroxychloroquine works depends on the patient....


Yep good ole fashion dose of kerosene probably help some people too. I got a quart I will sell you for $100.... LOL

Snake oil sales always been profitable. Just want to move on to the next town before anybody gets wise.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

HDRider said:


> It was political when she started it. It was political because Trump touted Hydroxychloroquine and she wanted to discredit its possibility as a treatment as a dig on Trump. Her very first post was political.
> 
> Making so many of her post political, subtlety, that is her little trick. Maybe you and others don't always see it, but it is there nonetheless. Plus it gives her deniability.


I'm very aware of the intent behind most things but it's not my job to establish intent.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

wr said:


> I'm very aware of the intent behind most things but it's not my job to establish intent.


Really? Do you just go on the level of agitated discourse? 

What are your guidelines for censure?


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

wr said:


> I'm very aware of the intent behind most things but it's not my job to establish intent.


So that gives some free reign to flaunt the rules. I understand you are not a mind reader. 

GC has become an open challenge to people sneaking in innuendo, dancing around the rules with varying degrees of subtlety, and feigned innocence.

Many want to bring in politics, but refuse to do it where it is supposed to reside.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

painterswife said:


> I have read that Remdesivir is promising.





SRSLADE said:


> Remdessivir is the first treatment I've heard of that I trust.


Another one bites the dust:

https://www.cnbc.com/video/2020/04/...ivir-flopped-in-coronavirus-trial-report.html



> CNBC’s “Halftime Report” team discusses a report that says *Gilead medicine flopped* in a trial. The Financial Times said—citing documents accidentally published by the World Organization—that *Remdesivir did not improve patients’ condition or reduce the coronavirus pathogen in their bloodstream*


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

Real scientist are working for a cure all over the world. A cure may be found or a cure may not be found.
Those that choose to ignore distancing and lock down may be the subjects of ongoing studies.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

During Trump's daily talk today he brought up a scientist who says that sunlight will kill the virus in minutes.

That does not do sick people any good, but it might slow the spread this summer


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Terri said:


> During Trump's daily talk today he brought up a scientist who says that sunlight will kill the virus in minutes.
> 
> That does not do sick people any good, but it might slow the spread this summer


The scientist also just said that on that same surface, where the sun does not hit it, it will live.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

painterswife said:


> The scientist also just said that on that same surface, where the sun does not hit it, it will live.


Yup.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Just don't inject alcohol or bleach. Not a good take from the info presented.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

No, bleach does not belong inside the human body.

Neither does sunlight!


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

HDRider said:


> So that gives some free reign to flaunt the rules. I understand you are not a mind reader.
> 
> GC has become an open challenge to people sneaking in innuendo, dancing around the rules with varying degrees of subtlety, and feigned innocence.
> 
> Many want to bring in politics, but refuse to do it where it is supposed to reside.


I'm not a mind reader nor am I nearly as dense as some believe. We know who's pushing boundaries and what boundaries they're pushing. 

Quite often, those who push the rules to the limit will claim innocent intent while hollering loudly that someone else is 'obviously trolling.'


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Dont inject it, chug it...


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

State imposed quarantines are not working. Emerging evidence proves this. Antibody testing is showing that models have been wrong from the beginning, and death rates are much lower than projected. Antibody testing also suggests that this disease has been in the US populace much longer than supposed. Death tolls are highest in places where the most draconian quarantines can be effectively enforced. This is the common denominator in all places where death tolls are high, well that and a high population density.

We failed miserably in 1918. We are making the same mistakes a century later. You can't take an organism that is RNA based, and has a high replication rate, and give it unnatural, preferential selection input. Creates a disaster. Mutation is not a possibility with an organism of this nature, it is an absolute certainty. It won't change into a different organism on a broad scale, but it will develop different traits. 

Suppose viruses were cows, you see cows are DNA based, instead of just getting color mutations, or no horns, happening once every century or so, if they were RNA based (which they couldn't be, cows are too complex for RNA) you would be seeing cows with spines down their back, cows with wings, cows that hopped like a frog. Instead of mutating once every hundred years or so, shorten the gestation rate from nine months to every few minutes, you would see these mutations happening much more frequently.

Cows that mutated enough to milk like holsteins probably wouldn't survive in the wild, unless they also mutated enough simultaneously to increase their multiparousity. But human intervention does wonderful things to mutated organisms that wouldn't last long in nature. Most respiratory diseases only have a short window of reproduction. Either their host dies, or develops antibodies to wipe out the virus. They must infect new hosts to survive. Some diseases build in incredibly long incubation periods, but this is tricky, because they spread more effectively with a high infection rate, and it is hard to achieve this in respiratory infections without debilitating the host. Some disease develop a vectored life cycle to achieve a high infected death rate in one species, and then use an unaffected host. But for the most part, human to human spread respiratory diseases achieve somewhere in the neighborhood of a 0.1 to 0.2 percent infected death rate, often much less. This is the sweet spot. Any more virulent, and it impacts effective spread. Hosts die or deteriorate too rapidly to effectively spread the disease. The disease needs people to walk around not feeling good, but still able to function, to almost but not quite die, before no longer being a suitable host (death or antibody development).

This is where human interaction comes in. The same selectivity that can make a cow give enough milk to feed ten calves can also give preferential selective input to virus populations. If you make all of the people that may have mild virus symptoms stay home, and you take the most severe cases to a hospital, surround them with people taking care of them, that go home to their families, stop and get gas, order take out, pick up a new toilet plunger at lowes, you are spreading the most virulent manifestations of the virus. A virus which ordinarily would adjust, through mutation, to that sweet spot of infectious, but not too infectious. Quarantine is good for some diseases, but it appears to fail miserably for infectious respiratory viruses, not only fail, but make the problem much worse.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

Very well said @barnbilder


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

Light therapy:


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Uncle Fester's light bulb might still be found in the Cincinnati Museum Center next year.
Don Poynter, who sold many of those backpage comic book items, has quite a story.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Re the hydroxychloroquine: Giving it to dying patients is stupid nonsense. Treat early, use the z-pack and take the zinc as given by the NY doctor who saved 700 patients. Some quack who waits until an old man is critical is not doing his patients any favors. The medicine is cheap and available. The risks of z-packs are known, but death is final and the risks are bearable.

As for politics; there are biased people all over, most no smarter than the rest of us. Form your own opinions. I wear a MAGA hat and don't apologize for it but I see no reason to quarrel with those of differing views.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

barnbilder said:


> Looks like the most promising treatment is still exposure, and the gradual buildup of human antibodies. It has worked for the majority of those infected.


Russian Roulette has a one in six chance in death. Your proposed "treatment" is slightly less fatal method. Way to go. The majority of people are not killed in Russian Roulette, either.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

An excerpt from a piece in Town Hall Daily As I remarked earlier, the Hydrochloroquine treatment should be started earlier AND THE TREATMENT IS CHEAP!!!!

the most effective treatment for CoVid19 became a political football. Even the supposed “negative” trials that were reported on this past weekend, had cherry picked subjects that were mostly late stage victims of the virus. As Dr. Vladimir Zelenko pointed out on my show this week, doing so created the negative outcomes “purposefully & by design.” When used under a physician’s care, in the primary care basis, and early on after testing or onset of symptoms, the hydroxycholoroquine, azithromycin, & zinc cocktail reduced the rates of deaths and long term infectious stages. Zelenko’s numbers to date: 1,450 patients treated, two deaths, four ventilator cases (all fully recovered,) and all others recovered.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

haypoint said:


> Russian Roulette has a one in six chance in death. Your proposed "treatment" is slightly less fatal method. Way to go. The majority of people are not killed in Russian Roulette, either.


Based on the antibody test results surfacing, the Russian roulette analogy is mathematically challenged. A firearm with a cylinder that large would probably not function well. And your finger would get tired, most people would quit playing before they found a live round.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Darren said:


> Whether or not hydroxychloroquine works depends on the patient, the comorbidities, and the stage of the disease. There are accounts of people surviving with hydroxy after being put on a ventilator. Elderly in the 90's and even over a hundred have survived with hydroxy.
> 
> A neighbor is on hydroxy at home and recovering. The VA tried it as a last ditch for people with no other options and saw most die. If the virus wipes out the red blood cells to the point hydroxy can't interfere with the process in time for the body to generate new red blood cells you'll be DRT.
> 
> The microemboli are also symptomatic of the red blood cell damage in some people.


Jeez looks like the FDA is disagreeing with you. I guess they might know mote


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

And it turned out to be true.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Like I said it depends on the patient and the stage of the disease. With no "official" trials on a drug that has been known in some form or another since the 1600's, the FDA has nothing for substantiation.

The virus has confounded medical personnel because they've been faced with a range of symptoms in combinations they didn't learn about in school. 

Between the bruising, high ferritin and hemoglobin levels, low O2 levels that still allow people to function when they should be comatose, microebolii, and the triggering of co-morbidities plus seemingly random indications of organs starting to fail they are beyond extremely challenged.

It's any port in a storm and Hydroxychloroquine is one of those ports.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

FYI, warnings may sound like a better term but they do count and some of you are awful close to finding yourself banned. 

Someone else's 'attitude' about an unsuccessful drug is not for another member to correct , but it might be helpful to remember to mind your own tone when you 'like' an blatant insult that would be quickly reported if someone else made it. 

Before you waste time speed reporting my comments, please remember countless demands for greater clarity.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Oxankle said:


> An excerpt from a piece in Town Hall Daily As I remarked earlier, the Hydrochloroquine treatment should be started earlier AND THE TREATMENT IS CHEAP!!!!
> 
> the most effective treatment for CoVid19 became a political football. Even the supposed “negative” trials that were reported on this past weekend, had cherry picked subjects that were mostly late stage victims of the virus. As Dr. Vladimir Zelenko pointed out on my show this week, doing so created the negative outcomes “purposefully & by design.” When used under a physician’s care, in the primary care basis, and early on after testing or onset of symptoms, the hydroxycholoroquine, azithromycin, & zinc cocktail reduced the rates of deaths and long term infectious stages. Zelenko’s numbers to date: 1,450 patients treated, two deaths, four ventilator cases (all fully recovered,) and all others recovered.


You know he is a bit of a fraud?


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

Not a "treatment", but 6 foot social distancing is doing almost nothing at all. By my calculations it should be 40 feet.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

mreynolds said:


> Not a "treatment", but 6 foot social distancing is doing almost nothing at all. By my calculations it should be 40 feet.


I say 1,000 yards, no line of sight


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

"You know he is a bit of a fraud?"

Details????


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

HDRider said:


> I say 1,000 yards, no line of sight


 40 feet is pushing the limits but much better than 6. I am not the only one who had seen the I'm sure. I wonder if 6 feet is just a carrot to the masses so they will be comfortable enough to go out and get infected so there will be herd immunity.


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

mreynolds said:


> 40 feet is pushing the limits but much better than 6. I am not the only one who had seen the I'm sure. I wonder if 6 feet is just a carrot to the masses so they will be comfortable enough to go out and get infected so there will be herd immunity.


I like the way your brain works.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

Mish said:


> I like the way your brain works.


I conducted several experiments on exhalation this week (tax free so y'all are welcome). Measuring how far it would go indoors and outdoors. Both with the AC on and off. I found that normal exhale can travel 35 feet without a cough or a sneeze. 

Since heat rises then depending on the temp of the breath and the room it could stay airborne for up to 2 minutes. If a covid patient had a fever I would assume their breath is hotter. I know mine feels like it when I have fever. But it's at least 98.6 minus a few when it is exhaled. Most thermostats are set in the 70's. 

Outdoors, even with very little wind, it doesn't get that far.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

mreynolds said:


> I conducted several experiments on exhalation this week (tax free so y'all are welcome). Measuring how far it would go indoors and outdoors. Both with the AC on and off. I found that normal exhale can travel 35 feet without a cough or a sneeze.
> 
> Since heat rises then depending on the temp of the breath and the room it could stay airborne for up to 2 minutes. If a covid patient had a fever I would assume their breath is hotter. I know mine feels like it when I have fever. But it's at least 98.6 minus a few when it is exhaled. Most thermostats are set in the 70's.
> 
> Outdoors, even with very little wind, it doesn't get that far.


What were you smoking


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

HDRider said:


> What were you smoking


Wasn't. Can't. I'm allergic to ganja. 

Unfortunately


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

mreynolds said:


> Wasn't. Can't. I'm allergic to ganja.
> 
> Unfortunately


How did you see your breath?


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## 101pigs (Sep 18, 2018)

mreynolds said:


> Not a "treatment", but 6 foot social distancing is doing almost nothing at all. By my calculations it should be 40 feet.


It may depend. If wind is blowing a bit to carry
Also all people in public should be wearing a paper suit like a lot of folks are wearing.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

HDRider said:


> How did you see your breath?


There is a guy at work that vapes with one of those cloud makers. You can see it travel for up to 2 minutes. I had him exhale normally and not blow like they usually do. It was pretty eye opening. Just the initial exhale went over 6 feet in less than 5 seconds.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

101pigs said:


> It may depend. If wind is blowing a bit to carry
> Also all people in public should be wearing a paper suit like a lot of folks are wearing.


A _Tyvek suit in every closet._


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

mreynolds said:


> There is a guy at work that vapes with one of those cloud makers. You can see it travel for up to 2 minutes. I had him exhale normally and not blow like they usually do. It was pretty eye opening. Just the initial exhale went over 6 feet in less than 5 seconds.


Maybe everyone needs to breath visible air, they could flavor it if you like


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## Mish (Oct 15, 2015)

HDRider said:


> Maybe everyone needs to breath visible air, they could flavor it if you like


I've often suggested this for other airborne bodily functions. So you know which areas you should definitely avoid walking through.


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## Lisa in WA (Oct 11, 2004)

Mish said:


> I've often suggested this for other airborne bodily functions. So you know which areas you should definitely avoid walking through.


kind of like the mythical pool chemical that will turn colors and rat out who is peeing in the swimming pool!
But in air and with...(as my grandson says) toots?


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## po boy (Jul 12, 2010)

Mish said:


> I've often suggested this for other airborne bodily functions. So you know which areas you should definitely avoid walking through.


My basic training run, dodge jump, and low crawl training could save my life!


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Keenataz; I am still interested in the basis for your feeling that Dr. Zelenko is "a bit of a fraud"---That information is crucial to our analysis of fact.

Also, the latest report on the short life of the virus in sunlight and low humidity is important---this would signal a lower infection rate come Summer.


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## manfred (Dec 21, 2005)

Trumps remarks about disinfectants is not really that far off. Isn't chemotherapy the same thing? Maybe there is some meds that could be injected into our bloodstreams that could kill the virus.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

On Disinfectants injected: Iodine is certainly a disinfectant. The wife's mother was dying of sepsis in 1932; The doctor told her husband that she was dying and that there was one last chance, but that it might kill her. Since there was no other choice the husband, wife's father, told the doctor to try. The lady was given an injection of iodine and lived another 50 years. Bleach, probably not a good idea.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

manfred said:


> Trumps remarks about disinfectants is not really that far off. Isn't chemotherapy the same thing? Maybe there is some meds that could be injected into our bloodstreams that could kill the virus.


Is chemo a household disinfectant? Because that is what was advised, "Commonly available disinfectants"


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Irish Pixie said:


> Is chemo a household disinfectant? Because that is what was advised, "Commonly available disinfectants"


No, actually that was not advised. But I can see how you would believe very strongly that it was.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> Is chemo a household disinfectant? Because that is what was *advised*, "Commonly available disinfectants"


No one "advised" anyone to do anything.
Please show a link to the entire quote in context.


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## StL.Ed (Mar 6, 2011)

manfred said:


> Trumps remarks about disinfectants is not really that far off. Isn't chemotherapy the same thing? Maybe there is some meds that could be injected into our bloodstreams that could kill the virus.


Well, ethanol is a pretty commonly available disinfectant, maybe it should be used; but, instead of injection, inhalation might be a preferred route of administering it.

https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/2003/2003.12444.pdf


> Possibility of Disinfection of SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19) in Human Respiratory Tract by Controlled Ethanol Vapor Inhalation
> 
> The author suggests that it may be possible to use alcoholic beverages of 16~20 v/v% concentration for this disinfection process, such as Whisky (1:1 hot water dilution) or Japanese Sake, because they are readily available and safe (non-toxic). By inhaling the alcohol vapor at 50~60°C (122~140°F) through the nose for one or two minutes, it will condense on surfaces inside the respiratory tract; mainly in the nasal cavity. The alcohol concentration will be intensified to ~36 v/v% by this process, which is enough to disinfect the corona virus on the mucous membrane.


Also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_inhalation


> Inhalation of vapor obtained by nebulization of water and ethanol in oxygen has been used in treatment of pulmonary edema in humans.[10] Alcohol vapor acts as an anti-foaming agent in the lungs, so the sputum becomes more liquid, and can be easily expelled. The method has also been used to reduce the alcohol withdrawal syndrome in patients who had intestinal tract surgeries.[11] The use of ethanol vapor has also been proposed as a potential method of inactivating respiratory viruses, such as SARS-CoV-2, which are present in the respiratory tract.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Oxankle said:


> Keenataz; I am still interested in the basis for your feeling that Dr. Zelenko is "a bit of a fraud"---That information is crucial to our analysis of fact.
> 
> Also, the latest report on the short life of the virus in sunlight and low humidity is important---this would signal a lower infection rate come Summer.


Do you really believe he treated 1300 virus patients , as he claims?


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Some people will defend anything


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

keenataz said:


> Some people will defend anything


And some people just can't resist hurling insults. I believe the GC rules are pretty clear on respectful discussion and unsults are neither respectful or productive discsussion.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

keenataz said:


> Do you really believe he treated 1300 virus patients , as he claims?


What's your rating? 
His is pretty good:
https://doctor.webmd.com/doctor/vladimir-zelenko-d0172276-3207-4517-a08c-629eafd8c8a4-overview


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## po boy (Jul 12, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> What's your rating?
> His is pretty good:
> https://doctor.webmd.com/doctor/vladimir-zelenko-d0172276-3207-4517-a08c-629eafd8c8a4-overview


I listened to an interview with him a few days ago and seems to know his stuff. The left is painting him as something he isn't. Smear is what they do and some believe them.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

W


wr said:


> And some people just can't resist hurling insults. I believe the GC rules are pretty clear on respectful discussion and unsults are neither respectful or productive discsussion.


Who did I insult? I deliberately did not mention anyone


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## Grandmotherbear (May 15, 2002)

I know you want links but I don't remember the source- memory defects. But I do remember it was reputable, (WebMD? acs? ama?) Since most cancers have been proven to be viral in nature (I didn't know that, but DID know of he link between genital warts and cervical cancer) there is much evidence to show that lysine is preventative (I took lysine for genital herpes, another gift from my promiscuos (sp?) ex) I have GFB and myself on 1000 mg Lysine daily. 
I wish I could find Lysol anywhere. I am terribly allergic to molds and mildews and here I am in dank & humid S FL for the summer  
wr thank you for doing what you do. It's thankless, isn't it?


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

keenataz said:


> W
> 
> Who did I insult? I deliberately did not mention anyone


I didn’t realize that you were offering a compliment. I suspect that person would be happy to be named.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

wr said:


> I didn’t realize that you were offering a compliment. I suspect that person would be happy to be named.


Anyone who would believe that disinfectant stuff.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

keenataz said:


> Anyone who would believe that disinfectant stuff.


That would likely be the same people who've injected cooking oil into their lips or eat tissue as a filler when they're on the 300 calorie diet. 

Regardless, I haven't heard of anyone here suggesting members try injecting or consuming disinfectant so other than making repeated backhanded political statements, there's no reason to bring it up and it simply gets threads tossed in the Dark Room, where other members can't or don't want to participate. 

Does that seem fair?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> Because that is what was* advised*, *"Commonly available disinfectants"*


I'm still not finding that quote.
Do you have a link?



keenataz said:


> *Anyone who would believe* that disinfectant stuff.


Didn't you *believe* he "advised" it?


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## Lisa in WA (Oct 11, 2004)

wr said:


> Regardless, I haven't heard of anyone here suggesting members try injecting or consuming disinfectant so other than making repeated backhanded political statements, there's no reason to bring it up *and it simply gets threads tossed in the Dark Room, *where other members can't or don't want to participate.


I think that might be the whole point.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

I see we're on the buddy system when it comes to backdoor political comments.
I for one don't like having to hide in backrooms.
I find it all distasteful and sneaky.
We are adults not gerbils.


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

SRSLADE said:


> I see we're on the buddy system when it comes to backdoor political comments.
> I for one don't like having to hide in backrooms.
> I find it all distasteful and sneaky.
> We are adults not gerbils.


That is why you get others' threads tossed.


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## po boy (Jul 12, 2010)

SRSLADE said:


> I see we're on the buddy system when it comes to backdoor political comments.
> I for one don't like having to hide in backrooms.
> I find it all distasteful and sneaky.
> We are adults not gerbils.


The darkroom is set up because some members don't want to see politics, reliion etc in the normal newsfeed. 
Some of us are adult enough to understand those rules.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

SRSLADE said:


> I see we're on the buddy system when it comes to backdoor political comments.
> I for one don't like having to hide in backrooms.
> I find it all distasteful and sneaky.
> We are adults not gerbils.


It’s not a matter of “hiding”. 

The Politics, Religion, Debate, and Controversy sub-forum is for topics as described in its title. The rules are a little more relaxed there because the allowed topics naturally end up a little more heated than the ones that are allowed in General Chat. 

Most members don’t care for/about that sub-forum, so they don’t participate. A small group of members have labeled it “the pit” or “hate-filled” because they can’t handle their views being challenged, and have chosen not to participate. A few have been kicked out for one reason or another- at least one for taking their online beef to real-life (I know, disgusting and childish, right?). 

Those few who so desperately want to participate there (as in, would devote hours of every day to it if they could) but can’t or don’t, for whatever reason, now use GC as a sort of waiting room for the forum they really want to post in. They post topics that they know belong in the other forum, as a way to get their digs in before it goes into the proper room, and their ideas can’t be challenged. 

The administration (nor the membership) are too dumb to see exactly what’s going on. It’s just not a problem that can be solved unless the ones abusing GC grow up (probably not going to happen) or they get banned (no body wants to see that- and a couple have proven they would just come back as sock-puppets, anyway). 

This isn’t that hard to figure out. All it takes is a little intellectual honesty.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Who took their online beef to real life? That should have gotten the member banned from the site altogether.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

painterswife said:


> Who took their online beef to real life? That should have gotten the member banned from the site altogether.


Yes. It probably should have.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Other members have been banned immediately for doing that. I am very surprised that someone got banned only from the dark room for doing that.

In fact I suspect you don't have all the facts. I don't believe the mods would allow that.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

painterswife said:


> Other members have been banned immediately for doing that. I am very surprised that someone got banned only from the dark room for doing that.
> 
> In fact I suspect you don't have all the facts. I don't believe the mods would allow that.


Mods would have to know about it before they can do something about it.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

wr said:


> Mods would have to know about it before they can do something about it.


Exactly. That would mean that it would not be a reason for banning someone just from the dark rooms.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

painterswife said:


> Other members have been banned immediately for doing that. I am very surprised that someone got banned only from the dark room for doing that.
> 
> In fact I suspect you don't have all the facts. I don't believe the mods would allow that.


It’s not the one I was specifically speaking of, but there’s an active member on here who threatened to “dox” me and call my employer because she didn’t like the rhetorical corner I backed her into in a discussion PRDC. 

So, no, that sort of behavior doesn’t necessarily get you banned. 

I’m sure you and the rest of the clique can figure out who the one (more?) who took this silly forum to real-life, when you discuss it later today on your FB group.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

po boy said:


> The darkroom is set up because some members don't want to see politics, reliion etc in the normal newsfeed.
> Some of us are adult enough to understand those rules.


I agree, some of us are.


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> It’s not the one I was specifically speaking of, but there’s an active member on here who threatened to “dox” me and call my employer because she didn’t like the rhetorical corner I backed her into in a discussion PRDC.


That has to do with their issues rather than you, but you already knew that.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

SRSLADE said:


> I see we're on the buddy system when it comes to backdoor political comments.
> I for one don't like having to hide in backrooms.
> I find it all distasteful and sneaky.
> We are adults not gerbils.


Perhaps it’s time to act like adults. The rules are pretty simple and can’t be all that hard to follow. The Dark Room was created because members requested it because they’d like the majority of HT to be family friendly. 

Is it respectful to those members to write a different set of rules for certain members? 

Mods have have been pretty fair and we were cleaning up threads multiple times, only to find more of the same.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> It’s not the one I was specifically speaking of, but there’s an active member on here who threatened to “dox” me and call my employer because she didn’t like the rhetorical corner I backed her into in a discussion PRDC.
> 
> So, no, that sort of behavior doesn’t necessarily get you banned.
> 
> I’m sure you and the rest of the clique can figure out who the one (more?) who took this silly forum to real-life, when you discuss it later today on your FB group.


We’ll talk.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Keenatz; have you any information to contradict what has been reported? He had treated some 700 when the story broke a couple of weeks back, and he IS in N. Y. where the cases are.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

Pixie!!!!! Behave!!!! (And what is an outside avenue?)


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Folks,
Please remain civil and don't toss unfounded personal attack accusations at each other. Baiting and / or taking school yard style pokes at others will get you points against your account and some members can't afford many more active points.

As some in their replies said. GC is for adults to participate in civil discussions free of factors of politics , religion , debate or controversy . Those four categories belong in PRDC,

Here in General Chat, participants can post their opinions on topics in adult fashion without dragging the discussion through the barnyard.

We moderators only try to keep the barnyard mud from being slung around GC too bad.


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## Oxankle (Jun 20, 2003)

I should think that anyone stupid enough to take an on-line disagreement to "real life" would see either police or a lawsuit. On the other hand, one cannot keep idiots off the net, so there is some risk. Fortunately, most of us can take care of ourselves on or off line


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## GTX63 (Dec 13, 2016)

Oxankle said:


> one cannot keep idiots off the net, so there is some risk. Fortunately, most of us can take care of ourselves on or off line


Their spouses probably appreciate the venting they do here.
I have experienced a couple cases and one was as a mod.
The first was an upper income, 40ish single guy. Any mention of pro life, anti illegal immigration, climate, or pro police would set him off into fits.
This of all places, was on a firearm 2nd Amendment website. It started off with him sending rage filled pms about once a week which in time escalated to personal invites and intimidation. He quit the forum just about the same time he wore out his welcome.
The 2nd was as a mod. A woman would not stop the baiting and OT thread bombing. Private warnings by another mod threw her into fits and she went after all of us, threatening this and that. She was banned, came back as another entity repeating the same stuff. We matched her IP and gave her the boot again. Then she came back claiming to be her husband...


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

There was more than one occasion where the nastiness left the forum and came out into the real world. The ones being harassed left the forum.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Oxankle said:


> Keenatz; have you any information to contradict what has been reported? He had treated some 700 when the story broke a couple of weeks back, and he IS in N. Y. where the cases are.


Ok. Use simple math. He says he treated 700 patients at an average of 30 patients a day that is 23 days that he treated nothing but virus patients. And how did he know they had the virus, did he test all of them. 
If you want to believe that fine. I don’t. And once you lie about something..,.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/02/technology/doctor-zelenko-coronavirus-drugs.html

In New York’s tight-knit Hasidic community, Dr. Zelenko’s sudden fame has caused tensions. Shortly after he posted on YouTube, a group of village officials wrote an open letterpleading with him to stop. They said he had exaggerated the extent of the coronavirus outbreak in Kiryas Joel, using a small sample of his patients to predict that as many as 90 percent of village residents would get the virus.


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## melli (May 7, 2016)

keenataz said:


> Ok. Use simple math. He says he treated 700 patients at an average of 30 patients a day that is 23 days that he treated nothing but virus patients. And how did he know they had the virus, did he test all of them.
> If you want to believe that fine. I don’t. And once you lie about something..,.
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/02/technology/doctor-zelenko-coronavirus-drugs.html
> ...


Most of his patients had mild symptoms. Whose to know if their own immune system was doing the job already. 
Again, the side effects of anti-malaria drugs are another thing to consider. 

I found the French Study intriguing...https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-smokers-at-lower-risk-of-getting-coronavirus


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> There's an active member that *repeatedly stated* that I sexually assaulted them in a Tractor Supply bathroom after I stated that all sexual assaults should be investigated.


There's one active member that has *repeatedly* accused me of "stalking" them and their family just because I remember things they themselves posted many times before.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

I may agree with you today and disagree with you tomorrow. Don't take it personal. It's only life.

Life happens.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

keenataz said:


> And *once you lie* about something..,.


You said:


keenataz said:


> *He says* *he treated 700 patients* at an average of 30 patients a day that is 23 days that he treated nothing but virus patients.


Your source says:


> *He said* *his team* had seen about 900 patients with possible coronavirus symptoms, *treating about 350* with his regimen.


Did your source lie?


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## HDRider (Jul 21, 2011)

painterswife said:


> Who took their online beef to real life? That should have gotten the member banned from the site altogether.


It should have. I figured you'd know who it was


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## melli (May 7, 2016)

If you have the patience, scroll through this list of possible treatments...quite the laundry list of therapies under study. 
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results?cond=COVID-19

I think the key is to stick around long enough until one of the studies bear fruit. The whole world is throwing everything at this. I am trying to take the tact, I'd rather not be an experimental lab rat, but instead be a recipient, if need be, of something that has been tested and peer reviewed. I.e. hold my breath the longest.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

After testing 3000 prisoners, it was reported 95% were systematic. A test of 800 sailers on a Navy ship, found 60% aystematic. Initial reports had the death rate as high as 10%. Blacks are dying at 300% higher rates.

How can anyone determine a "cure" when the rate of deaths vary wildly? If I were pushing my version of a cure, I'd refuse to treat old black men. If I wanted to disprove a treatment, I'd wait until it had advanced in a group of old retired folks. 

Leaches and blood letting had enough successes to be popular for a thousand years.


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## HermitJohn (May 10, 2002)

haypoint said:


> Leaches and blood letting had enough successes to be popular for a thousand years.


Throw a virgin into a live volcano lately? Sure that will be next recommendation. Course biting head off a live chicken always popular.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

considering the place and times lets step back a bit.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Fauci annouces good results with Remdesivir

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/29/health/gilead-sciences-remdesivir-covid-19-treatment/index.html

"Patients with advanced Covid-19 who received the experimental drug remdesivir recovered faster than similar patients who received placebo, according to preliminary trial data, the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases said Wednesday.

"The data shows that remdesivir has a clear-cut, significant, positive effect in diminishing the time to recovery," said the institute's director, Dr. Anthony Fauci."


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

painterswife said:


> Fauci annouces good results with Remdesivir


Others have announced "good results" with other drugs too.



> The World Health Organization said *it's too early to comment on the remdesivir trial *results released on Wednesday.





> It had *not yet been peer-reviewed* but was being submitted to a journal for review, Fauci said as he previewed the results. Experts interviewed by ABC News urged caution until the full data was released.


https://www.westernjournal.com/thou...virus-patients-treated-hydroxychloroquine-ny/



> This weekend, Mend Urgent Care CEO Dr. Anthony Cardillo told KABC he has seen very good results when using hydroxychloroquine along with zinc.
> 
> “Every patient I’ve prescribed it to has been very, very ill and within 8 to 12 hours, they were basically symptom-free,” Cardillo said. “So clinically I am seeing a resolution.”


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

I really respect DR Fauci a healer and honest man.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

It is good news when they have the data to support even small buts of good news.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

He's a man that cares for and about others.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

SRSLADE said:


> I really respect DR Fauci a healer and honest man.





painterswife said:


> It is good news when they have the data to support even small buts of good news.


LOL
That's not what you said before about hydroxychloroquine.


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

I don't have any facts to prove what you say.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

SRSLADE said:


> I don't have any facts to prove what you say.


Do you have any facts to prove what you say?


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## SLADE (Feb 20, 2004)

Only what DR Fauci says.
All the media carries it. Some with spin and some without.
A man of science.


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## macmad (Dec 22, 2012)

One should dig a little bit deeper before designating him for scientific sainthood.


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