# Homesteading on the West Coast of Canada (BC) - from scratch



## melli

HI All,

Didn't know of this forum until a week ago. I would post certain aspects of my work on other sites. This site encapsulates everything I am doing.

Short Story: as a wee one, I have always been enthralled with the idea of living off the land. Someone gave me book about being a survivalists in the great outdoors. How to build shelter, find edible plants, and snare food. Well, time passes by, and passing middle age, I found my postage stamp. 5 acres of heaven on Sunshine Coast of BC. Very rural, spotted with small towns. I actually found the property by trolling the neighborhood, and figuring out where I'd like to be. I wanted a vacant lot, untouched by humans. Well, it really came down to money. A vacant acreage lot was the most I could afford. And since I had lived up here for while on a 1/2 acre lot, I got to know the neighbors. While chit chatting one day, a neighbor mentioned a lot down the road used to be for sale, but the market tanked, and it sat. Well, I'll have to take a peek. I was sold on the driveway. 









The driveway was blasted in several decades prior, and then time took over. I don't think a car ever went up it for all those years. At the top, the forest took over. There was one game trail, but it was a slog getting around. Having been logged in 1950's (guess), it was a mixture of old and new. But the bulk of property was on top of hill (lots of light, and private). 
I hustled to the local muni hall, and ask for owners info. I call up owner and ask if he is interested in selling. He was, but there was a catch. I had to sell my place to purchase his...and the market was anemic to say the least. So, I had a lawyer draw up a contract, and I paid the owner a grand to hold it until I sold my place. It took almost two years to sell my place. What a waiting game. I almost gave up, resigned my fate to having weekend warriors partying on their deck, 30ft from my deck (1/2 acre lots were 60ft wide). At any rate, I finally sold, and moved all crap in a shipping container I bought (wise move!). Plopped it on my new piece of heaven and rented out a cottage nearby.


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## melli

These are a few pics...first one is at top of driveway. 








The game trail









And the only clearing on lot (at very top). It was here, I thought, would be perfect for a home. Could get the most light and survey my estate from inside the house or on the porch. As you can see property is a mess of varying trees, and deadfall. One thing I never fully appreciated, was that I was on rock, and nothing but rock (the moss sure made it look nice though). Would require many many truckloads of dirt to make it viable, as I wanted a lawn, garden and fruit trees.


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## painterswife

Curious where on the coast you are located? My brother lives in Gibsons. I spent all my summers in high school in Pender Harbour. That looks like it is maybe at the north end


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## melli

painterswife said:


> Curious where on the coast you are located? My brother lives in Gibsons. I spent all my summers in high school in Pender Harbour. That looks like it is maybe at the north end


Your good....lol
North Side of Pender.


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## melli

So, after purchase, I plop my shipping container on property. 
Oddly, my insurance company wanted pictures of it. Getting insurance for a vacant lot with stuff on it was a hassle and it cost more than my previous home, which had a house on it (a new one). 
They call these containers, 'one trippers', in that they were made in China, filled full of crap and shipped to our shores, then emptied and sold to me. Was $4500 $CDN delivered. Tad pricey, but virtually a new box. It has been sitting in the same spot in a rain-forest for 4 yrs, full of my worldly possessions, and no leaks, nor moisture. I was going to put in some desiccant, but never got around to it.


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## melli

Next on the agenda was clearing the land. I had a mini skid steer from my other place, and figured it might do the job. The first tree I run into was a 4" fir. I came to an abrupt halt, tires spinning. Was rather jarring, as I took a run at it. 








Well, that wasn't going cut it, so I sell the SS, and seek out more suitable land clearing equipment. I found this guy (aka Bobby);


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## melli

Now Bobby is the real deal...don't honestly know what I would have done without him. I'd still be hand picking the 5th stump....
Note: if you shop wisely, you can pretty much sell your machine for what you paid for it, as they do hold their value fairly well, especially in homesteading country. Bobby is a 2003 331D, a mini excavator. He has power to burn with a 2l Kubota engine. The thumb is so important in rocky or forested terrain. 

So, I start clearing. Initially, I just put in a few hours a week, whenever I get the chance. I would chainsaw down trees and use Bobby to haul the pieces to either a log pile or the slash pile. After a while, I realized chainsawing is dangerous work. Why not just get Bobby to fell them, and when they are laying on the ground, dice them up (root ball, log, top). Much safer chainsawing when they are horizontal.


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## melli

Should note the technique for felling trees with Bobby (since he isn't a heavyweight that can topple trees with a push - albeit, he can rip 4" trees right out, root and all, 6" - 12" he can topple, then rip out root ball, but anything more, requires root digging on one side (thumb comes in handy), then he can topple and more root digging ensues). 
Douglas Fir has a root pan, so the roots extend outward. They are a pain. Cedar has more of a root ball (easier to fell). Arbutus are just plain dangerous, but roots easy to rip out. The problem with Arbutus is they have no bark like firs, so they are really slippery, and the trunk goes up at odd angles, so felling placement is difficult. Since they are slippery, I cannot haul a big chunk as they slip from my grasp and I got limbs of tree wanting to bust a hydraulic hose or windscreen. 








A year passes, and I am making progress (the high flat spot in pic, is where there was a natural clearing - see earlier pic). 
Not sure where I am going, in terms of clearing. It may not seem obvious, but I was trying to keep the 'healthy' looking trees. Problem is, they all had some defect or they were too close to dead trees (leaving stumps all over, wasn't an option). 
And I'll admit, at first, felling trees with Bobby was too easy. Feels like your in an Iron Man suit. Nothing really stops you. 
But after a while of wanton destruction, it becomes work, and a lot of it. I have to step outside the machine and hand pick all the itty-bitty branches and rocks. You fall a tree, and you get a pickup of bits. 
Then it came time to slash burn. Never liked fires, and never will. Around here, you have to get a permit from the local fire hall. I bought a tiger torch to get the pile going. Since we are required to be there while the pile is burning at all times, it is best to start in the wee hours of the morning, because a machine pile will burn all day....and the next...and the next. Then it will smoulder for two weeks. Since I'm in a temperate zone, the risk of a slash pile spreading is very low in the late fall. I did do a burn in May, and sure enough, a ember started a living tree on fire. With no water other than 2-20l water jugs, I was frantic. Multiple trips to the lake to refill were in order that day. 

Here is the end result of the this particular burn


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## ShannonR

Wow!! Great job on your property cleanup.


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## melli

Thanks Shannon. 

As the clearing was well under way, I began to get antsy for power. There are three things I needed; Power, septic system and a well. With power, I could pull out the power tools, and build stuff. 
So, I needed to get power onto property. I had many options. I decided to build a power shed a 100ft from road (where power lines passed), so I could get our utility to string a line to it (they will only go a max 100ft from road). And they insist on a bone fide electrician to do the 200amp mast/meter/main panel. I eagerly start building an 'electrical shed'. I don't do half measure...lol


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## melli

If you live in an area with a fair amount of excavator companies, it is always wise to meet them and in my case, let them know I need fill, and lots of it. I figured I'd need 150 loads of fill to create arable land. And if I went to the local gravel pit, I could be paying $200-$500 per load (material and trucking). That was way out of my non-existent budget. At times, excavator guys are doing a job, and they just need to get rid of the spoils. If they are close enough to me, it makes sense for them, and I only have to pay $50/load. Sometimes, I get prime dirt, and other times I get glacial till (a mix of rock and dirt). To me, it is all good, as I need a base from which to work with. Here, I got some 24 loads of 'shot rock' (blasted rock).


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## melli

Ok, back to the electrical shed...busy busy. 






















Once the shed was built and water tight, I got a trench dug from electrical shed to a temp kiosk I was going to build up top (place to plug into). 
Can see electrician on my electrical shed roof doing his thing. 






















You'll notice I have two lines...why you ask? Well, I had 100ft to electrical shed, plus another 250ft to temp kiosk...for a 350ft run (voltage drops the longer the run), I had to either go high voltage, which meant transformer at both ends of line (big money), or get a huge cable or have multiple smaller cables...I priced it all out, and went with ACWU 250MCM (last bit denotes size - big cables). ACWU = Aluminum conductor, weather proof and underground rated...it also is amour coated. Compared to copper, it was cheap ($3500 for the cable).


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## melli

A couple more pics to finish off electrical install. BTW - I had a brain cramp...no idea why I didn't put a couple of 2" pvc elbows in floor for power run to temp kiosk...meant electricians had to drill through wall to run cable...oh well. 






















After the electricians did their thing, I covered up the cable (note I used clean sand - code is 6" all around cable), then some caution tape, then fill. Coming up steep part, I had to use concrete, as fill would just slide off. That was a job, humping pails of concrete up a steep slope...I remember that day well.


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## melli

Since the electricians took all my money...:grumble:
I had to become one. Having done electrical work in my old trade, it wasn't a big deal. The problem was doing it to code. 
Each detail has a chapter in the code book...from what clamps to use, to how tight each nut has to be. Usually, the item comes with specs, but many a time, I would be scouring the net for the proper torque of a lug nut. One of the biggest hassles, was finding the proper splitter boxes I needed at both ends of the double run of cable. I needed monster boxes. Not too pricey, but I needed specific ones, that could handle the rather large cables. If I was to do it again, I'd just stick with one cable...go with lower amperage for house. 




























My 'plan' is to build a 'shed' (garage home) by temp kiosk, then when I win the lottery, build a real home up top (convert garage home to a garage/workshop).

It was so sweet to flick on the 150 amp breaker in electrical shed, and get power up top...power!


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## melli

Now that I had power, I needed a septic field, as one cannot get a building permit without one up here. I also needed a well, which needs to be 100ft away from septic field (min). I had sited my septic field in a low spot, as I wanted a gravity field (that is, one that requires no power). So, should the need arise, I can install a toilet anywhere, except electrical shed (too low). 
I did a write up on that at DIY...was one of the easier things I had to do. There was a manual, and it covered all the bases. Since I had no native soil, I had to do an engineered field, which meant getting an engineer to spend a half hour looking over site and saying ok. Once done, I gave him a form, and money to file the paperwork. 

http://www.doityourself.com/forum/w...eld-1000g-2-chamber-septic-tank-complete.html

For the well, it was a tad tougher than septic. But having Bobby helped a whole lot, as he had to dig more power and water lines. I got a driller to dig the well. There goes another 8k....

http://www.doityourself.com/forum/w...35648-new-well-setup-options.html#post2331739

I didn't have to build another shed, but I did. I figured the well gear (pressure tanks and whatnot) would cramp my garage home. And I needed another place to put junk. As luck would have it, it was a great idea, as a neighbour gave me a near new washer and dryer...betty crocker versions, but I am not one to complain. So, the well shed has a washer and dryer...


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## melli

I am catching up to the present day....
Since I was burning through money on the three services (septic, well and power), I was finding it difficult to rent and pay a mortgage. So, I found a half decent RV, and last summer or maybe the summer before, I parked it by the temp kiosk. I hooked up the power, septic, and later water. 
Words cannot describe the feeling of having a property that is totally private and quiet. I wake up in a RV (that sucks, as I am not the roughneck kind), and look out my window and see trees and moss. No nosy neighbors, noise, traffic etc. I can putter around property at all hours, make noise, which I am apt to do, and nobody hears me. I ask them, and their response, is do I hear them? lol
The trees are a great filter. 
I even managed to get fibre optic up to RV...that was luck. The local cable company was hooking up anybody who wanted fibre optic for free. We were a test area. I hand dug 250 ft of trench for that in a couple of days:bouncy:...I couldn't have Bobby treading or digging where I put the power line. It was fall, and with a 40" flat screen crammed into RV, I was watching TV and surfing. 







As you can see, the clearing in back has expanded...I had a wet winter, and the low spot right of RV filled up with water, until I had a small pond. Then the winds came and blew over several trees. RVs and trees don't mix.
You can just make out truck with 250 gallon water tank in back....I had to use that for water, until I got the well up and running. If one is miserly with water, 250 gallons could last me a month.


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## melli

Fast forward to this past winter (Feb). I had just gotten about 20 loads of fill from an excavation. Plus I got another 12 loads from the pit (finer stuff). I was thinking I ought to halt landscaping this spring and focus on building myself a home. I am going to build one like the electrical shed, only super size it (19x30). Shed style buildings are probably the cheapest style to build. 
So, I get the loads of fill leveled, and resign myself to having half a yard. I had come a long way, and in time I would get the rest covered. 
Mid March, I was having lunch, and up my driveway rumbles a super sized dump truck. I am what the hell, I didn't order any fill. I step out the RV and see what is up. The trucker, in a total country drawl goes, "you wanna buy some dirt."
Well, I had to have a look. I climb up and peer in the box. Glorious dirt! :bouncy:
How much I ask. "50 bucks", he says. Well, I am jacked now. How much do you have? "About 20 loads." 
So, for the next month I am leveling the dirt and buying more fines from the pit to cover some of the rocky stuff I got. Lost ten pounds in one week because I had to hand rake the dirt, so I could plant grass. 
Meanwhile, I am also bucking up firewood to sell, to pay for the dirt. 
I hate bucking firewood, but I especially hate splitting it. Turns out, folks want to split their own firewood, as most around here have electric splitters. Win win. See all those vehicles in distance...they are having a feeding frenzy at my wood pile...lol


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## melli

Now it is April, and I am killing it. I feel like a farmer who has to get the seed down. Raking and raking, and picking up rocks by the wheelbarrow full...wish I had the dough to just buy really fine stuff, but such is life. By now, I've put on about a 1000hrs on Bobby in four years. He has paid for himself many times over. 
I had to take a spell off raking to burn the last big slash pile I hope to ever do...rather ho-hum burn and safe, as my whole property was one big dirt pit. 














By now, I had accumulated over 200pds of grass seed, and about the same in fertilizer, and spend a couple days planting grass seed. By the way, get grass seed in bulk, save a lot of money. I was paying $3/kg ($1.40/lb) for grade A grass seed (Ketucky/Fescue/Rye mix). I was in a rush, as we start to run into dry spells, and we warm up. Grass likes cool to warm, moist weather. I need the grass to set, as summer weather will brown it out until fall. If it hasn't matured, it will die. No way am I running around with a sprinkler all summer. Irrigation system is for another year....


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## melli

I get mesmerized looking at my yard now...first thing in morning, cup of coffee, and those darn cigarettes, I stare into the green dewy grass...then, I run outside and move the sprinkler...:spinsmiley:















I should point out that I need many more loads of fill to smooth out the rough edges, but as of this date, I have exactly (as well as I can count), 150 loads of dirt on property. I will need about 75-100 to finish it off, I figure....


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## BohemianWaxwing

Amazing transformation! Your hard work is paying off. Eager to follow as you move forward with your building plans as well!


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## ShannonR

I really like your tiny electrical shed!! I attempted to build something similar last year, my carpentry skills really suck though. Still, got all of it done myself except the roof that I needed help with.

Did you use a set of plans for the shed, or...?


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## Raeven

Well, you certainly have a vision for what you want to achieve, along with the ambition and tenacity to make it a reality! I've enjoyed sharing your journey and look forward to seeing what you'll do next. That's a LOT of work you've done there. Thanks for taking the time to give us a peek!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> I really like your tiny electrical shed!! I attempted to build something similar last year, my carpentry skills really suck though. Still, got all of it done myself except the roof that I needed help with.
> 
> Did you use a set of plans for the shed, or...?


No plans per se. While living at my old place, folks wanted sheds and bunkhouses, so I ended up building a number of them. 
I would just visualize where I wanted the doors and windows and go from there. The pad is no brainer...with solid ground or not (we are talking a shed, not home), one can plop down a floating pad. I ensure ground has good drainage, and is compacted. I use 2x6 or 2x8 for formwork, as the stiff perimeter allows me get away with less staking. And around here, the ground is rock or rock/dirt. I have to use rebar (wood would go a few inches then shatter). 
I build the box to dimensions of shed footprint, then spend hours tweaking orientation...lol. I want shed to have max sunlight through side with windows. I want door to be easily accessible etc...
Once staked, and made square (diagonal measurements should equal each other), I put in rebar. I like to use 1/2" rebar in a grid pattern, with two runs of 5/8" rebar along edges to support walls. One can just use mesh in interior, but I recommend rebar along edges. I make sure rebar is at least 2" off ground (those plastic things are called rebar chairs), and away from edges. Although code specific to Australia, there is an Australian concrete manual I found online, which is awesome. Discusses every facet of concrete and concrete work in detail. Don't have link handy. 
I use 30mpa concrete, which is plenty strong. I've done dozen of pads, for sheds, bunkhouses, and carports, and not one has cracked. 
For shed pads, I call in a concrete truck...I've done pads from hand mixing, and one cannot go fast enough (ex 10x10 pad, 6" high will need 50 cubic feet of concrete...using a big wheelbarrow or mixer, one can do 3 cuft batches = 17 batches....ummm, not for me). Say you do a batch every 15 min, you are at it all day log and then some. The first batch has started to cure, and you don't want to mess with it. Plus your dealing with cold joints. I pay just over $200 for a cubic meter of concrete up here...
I use a very straight and long 2x4 to level top...once level, leave it alone until it bleeds...
I loathe concrete, as it is a time orientated task, but I love the beauty and strength of it. Once the pad has cured, working on it, is so easy. A level surface to put up walls makes life simple.


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## melli

BTW - the above is my well shed pad...two poly water lines (one to well, and one goes over to RV and points beyond). Then, there is electrical...a #4/3 ACWU from temp kiosk, and a 10/3 to well. You'll notice I stuck in anchors around perimeter, so I can bolt down walls. I prep edges, where sill plates (bottom of walls) will go, with a layer of blueskin (peel'n stick rubber membrane, then a layer of sill foam tape). Never want to see sill suck up moisture from concrete floor! I will sometimes use pressure treated wood for sills, but I was feeling cheap that day...plus, I'd have root around for PT nails. 

I start framing the walls that support the rafters first (high wall first as I need all the room I can get), as they go from edge to edge. I use generally acceptable framing practices, like 16" oc stud spacing (16" from stud center to stud center). If I got a wall with window or door, I make the header out of 2-2x8 or 2-2x10, nailed a glued together. Sometimes, I'll go crazy and slip a piece of ply in between, all glued and nailed. On the load bearing walls (walls which support the rafters, I go big on headers, but on non-load bearing walls, I can use 2x4's). 
I always have a jack and king studs on either side of window or door. 
For corners, I do what we call, a 'California corner'. Since we get earthquakes, I have one stud at very end, like normal, then I put another stud up against it, but perpendicular to it, on edge facing the wall beside it. 
As you can see I put the high sheeting on before I raise the wall...makes it heavier, but it keeps the wall relatively square and it means I don't have to hump a sheet up high...I do everything solo, and Bobby has helped me raise a really heavy wall on occasion. 
I like having a covered entryway, so I had to put in a beam and post to support the rafters. For a shed, this is overkill by any measure. But my philosophy, is build it once, and never deal with it again. Plus, 2x6 walls means I can really insulate it. I used 2x8 rafters in this one, and 3-2x10 for beam, and the building inspector gave me two 6x6 posts (he is a sweet neighbor). 
I should point out, I am not a contractor, nor do I claim expert knowledge...I just think I am a smartass. Seriously though, I have done a lot of construction, and I am an avid reader of building science, as my background is in physics. Even the building inspector has asked me for advice...
Practice makes one perfect. 




































Fine Print: I use 3-1/4" round head framing nails (pneumatic gun), 2" round head min for sheeting...3 nails per sill to stud to top plate (min), 1ft nail pattern spacing on beam, and 3" perimeter spacing on sheeting nails and 6" interior spacing on sheeting nails. Avoid counter sinking sheeting nails. Your sheeting is what gives your shed torsional rigidity (keeps it up in windstorm etc). I will never use OSB. Ply withstands moisture much better than OSB, and is stronger overall. The only problem with plywood, is at times, it doesn't lay flat. But, I can deal with that...just takes a tad more time. Stagger plywood seams. You can see I notched rafters on ends...I stick 2x4's in them to support side fascia.


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## melli

I still haven't finished siding shed, nor have a roof on it (put on peel'n stick roofing membrane to keep dry). 
I did hook up the electrical and water in well shed...sub panel to power everything, control box for pump, pressure tanks (need lots of capacity for the lawn), and pressure switch, check valve, gauge, etc...
Was nice looking at these pics, as the well shed is full of junk now..lol


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## weedlady

Thank you for sharing. I've enjoyed reading so far. I am impressed. You've done a great job and made unbelievable progress. 

Looking forward to seeing more.
Martha


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## MO_cows

Whew, made my back hurt just to read that. That is an incredible amount of work for one person. Really showing the progress, though. Starting to look like a park.


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## melli

Thanks all for your remarks. I am too optimistic...figured I'd be living in a shack by now. Looks like another winter in the RV. :grumble:
That been said, I am grateful for what I have. Just trying to recover from the past two months. Might take all summer for that...lol
Must get the plans filed. Need to be staring at a permit...that'll perk me up. Building the shack isn't a big issue for me (all about money)...although, I will be giving ICF a twirl (concrete walls sandwiched with foam). Here is an example of what I plan, albeit, twice as long and wide with a carport end (roof line will extend over carport area). It will have transom windows like my well shed (third pic) on the high side. Putting on those staggered Hardi shingles is a pain. I put a couple rows up, then decide I've had enough...lol
Will paint them yellow, like the fascia. Now that, I am looking forward to doing, even though painting is not a fav thing of mine. Will look like a lemon cake with chocolate frosting. The electrical shed reminds me of a Tiramisu cake.


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## Canyonero

Nice. Nothing like working a piece of ground to make it your home.

Awesome place up there in B.C. I did some military work at remote places up on Vancouver island, so I got to see a bit of the coast.

My Bobcat skid steer is my productivity machine. $10K for a 900 hour machine with a trailer to haul it, 16 years ago. I've put another 900 hours on it since then, nothing more than minimal repairs and routine maintenance. I'd have paid a contractor enough to buy a new machine if I hired my work out. I run the crap out of the trailer too.


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## melli

Canyonero said:


> Nice. Nothing like working a piece of ground to make it your home.
> 
> Awesome place up there in B.C. I did some military work at remote places up on Vancouver island, so I got to see a bit of the coast.
> 
> My Bobcat skid steer is my productivity machine. $10K for a 900 hour machine with a trailer to haul it, 16 years ago. I've put another 900 hours on it since then, nothing more than minimal repairs and routine maintenance. I'd have paid a contractor enough to buy a new machine if I hired my work out. I run the crap out of the trailer too.


No kidding! The key is to find a machine that has been cared for...getting a lemon or an abused machine can wreck the finances. A new drive motor for Bobby is 4k. I've had to spend about 4k in four years on Bobby. 4 rollers, one idler, a few hoses (all of my doing - working around slash pile in setting or rising sun - didn't see a big branch and proceeded to rip a hose off machine twice), mess of bushings up front (wasn't really necessary, but I like a tight machine), pails of oil, grease and filters.

The problem with hiring a excavator contractor is your pressed on what exactly you want done. I was able to take my time and decide on a tree by tree basis. Same went for rock work. I figure if I hired a guy, it would have cost me about 20k to do the big clearing, make a big slash pile and burn it. Then I would be SOL if I wanted to move the log pile (great machines for bucking firewood), get some more dirt, regrade driveway after rutting it, etc. Having your own machine allows one to 'organically' develop property. I see how the sun sets throughout the year, and keep or remove trees accordingly. Also, weather played a role. We had some wet weather that created huge puddles, and windstorms that highlighted problem trees. I was able to dig a 300 trench in back area, and put in Big O to take care lack of drainage, and take out trees that threatened to flatten me...lol

I got into the excavator game by renting one about 9 yrs ago...neighbors and I wanted to plant cedars (100 - 6'). At the time, no contractor was available, they were all busy. Since, it was left up to me for some reason, I was frantic. I was driving around looking for excavators at job sites, when I saw a Bobcat excavator with a 'Rent Me' sign on it. It was close to home, so I drove it home and dug a 100 holes. I was hooked...lol
Even had the neighbors over taking it for a spin. Kids had a go, albeit, under close supervision. Guarantee one of them will become a heavy machine operator later in life. Their eyes were like saucers after a go. Two joysticks, like a video game. 

Lastly, I have at least $15k sitting in my yard should I need to:sob:. Very unlikely, but that excavator is almost as liquid as cash around here. 







Had to throw another pic of Bobby up here...a neighbor is at the helm getting rid of alder roots. He was all smiles after that. :goodjob:


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## ozarkansas

I hope to do something very similar to this on my land in the coming years. This was very helpful to read, and I'm sure it'll save me some headache. Thanks for sharing!


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## melli

ozarkansas said:


> I hope to do something very similar to this on my land in the coming years. This was very helpful to read, and I'm sure it'll save me some headache. Thanks for sharing!


Yes, headaches...got a few of those while undertaking this project. I am fairly handy, but many of the tasks, I'd never done before. And being a bit of a perfectionist, it brought a lot of angst. I had never fallen such large trees to dropping a pump down a well, before this project. It started with taking out trees...am I clearing the right ones? As someone said to me, you can't bring them back after you fell them. Then, the electrical shed...did I have it high enough (code states the lowest a service line can get to ground is 3m or so (above a non path area - higher for over driveway), and there was a protruding rocky outcropping between shed and powerpole). The electricians helped ramp up the stress by installing too short of a mast, which had to be swapped out for a taller mast because the Utility wasn't happy with how close it got to ground in one little spot. I put that one on the electricians, as we agreed to go with the tallest mast possible, but those plans never got relayed to actual electricians who installed the mast. BTW - it is $500 to have a service line dropped and reinstalled. In my case, 2 cases of coke smoothed things over...lol
Head electrician took care of the Utility guy. 

The temp power kiosk was stressful because I spent a lot of time looking for suitable splitter boxes...a lot of time. And all the parts specific to a 250mcm ACWU line had to be ordered (not in stock at my local Electrical Wholesaler)

Septic field was the easiest and least stressful, but I initially had the tank too low relative to field, an easy fix. I'd say the Eljen Manual helped a whole lot to placate my hair trigger meltdown mode. 

The well mechanical was another nail biter. Here you are, dropping a used pump (donated by a dear neighbor, as I blew everything on pipe, fittings, and pressure tanks) down a 205ft wet hole with poly pipe, safety wire, and electrical wire that you spliced to be water proof, hoping all would be well, as pulling it back up would require machinery or two folks to bring back up (with very strong backs). Then I worried about the line I put underground (did a rock puncture it when I back-filled?), and possible leaks from 30 or so joints.:spinsmiley:
So many things could go wrong...lol...I was swimming in my thoughts. 
Happily, a year later, the well is running like a top. In the last month alone, in order to establish the grass, I 'may' have pumped out close to 100,000 gallons of water without a problem:gaptooth:. One thing I do need to do, is get a vent fan (controlled by a humidity switch) in well shed, as I am getting condensation on well parts from pumping so much cold water into a warm shed. The well guy was kind to permanently lend me his $2k well logger...lol
Since I use to ply the geophysics trade, I was familiar with seismic equipment, but he had no clue. So, I was learn how to use it, then teach him how to use it...that was two years ago. 
So, I've been able to take well measurements over time. Short story, I'll never run out of water. Must get a reserve fund set aside for a new pump though...I do not want to be humping water again, ever. 

My biggest worry though, was the property. For four years it looked like a bomb crater. If, for whatever reason, I had to sell, I'd get peanuts. Maybe a developer could see through the slash, rock and log piles, and the scarred earth, but could city folk see through it too? I doubt it. In my mind, until I had the bulk of lot looking respectable, I was in the red. Now that it looks greenish, I instantly went into the black by a country mile. Add the fact it is fully serviced, including fibre optic, well, I am in a good position. Especially since there is run on properties up here right now. Things are literally flying off the shelves. Vancouver has gotten so expensive, the outlying areas are feeling the heat. I'm ok with a lackluster market, but this market has me worried....lol. It means more people. Lots that sat for decades are being developed. It means my private lake spot will be have to be shared...


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## painterswife

melli said:


> Yes, headaches...got a few of those while undertaking this project. I am fairly handy, but many of the tasks, I'd never done before. And being a bit of a perfectionist, it brought a lot of angst. I had never fallen such large trees to dropping a pump down a well, before this project. It started with taking out trees...am I clearing the right ones? As someone said to me, you can't bring them back after you fell them. Then, the electrical shed...did I have it high enough (code states the lowest a service line can get to ground is 3m or so (above a non path area - higher for over driveway), and there was a protruding rocky outcropping between shed and powerpole). The electricians helped ramp up the stress by installing too short of a mast, which had to be swapped out for a taller mast because the Utility wasn't happy with how close it got to ground in one little spot. I put that one on the electricians, as we agreed to go with the tallest mast possible, but those plans never got relayed to actual electricians who installed the mast. BTW - it is $500 to have a service line dropped and reinstalled. In my case, 2 cases of coke smoothed things over...lol
> Head electrician took care of the Utility guy.
> 
> The temp power kiosk was stressful because I spent a lot of time looking for suitable splitter boxes...a lot of time. And all the parts specific to a 250mcm ACWU line had to be ordered (not in stock at my local Electrical Wholesaler)
> 
> Septic field was the easiest and least stressful, but I initially had the tank too low relative to field, an easy fix. I'd say the Eljen Manual helped a whole lot to placate my hair trigger meltdown mode.
> 
> The well mechanical was another nail biter. Here you are, dropping a used pump (donated by a dear neighbor, as I blew everything on pipe, fittings, and pressure tanks) down a 205ft wet hole with poly pipe, safety wire, and electrical wire that you spliced to be water proof, hoping all would be well, as pulling it back up would require machinery or two folks to bring back up (with very strong backs). Then I worried about the line I put underground (did a rock puncture it when I back-filled?), and possible leaks from 30 or so joints.:spinsmiley:
> So many things could go wrong...lol...I was swimming in my thoughts.
> Happily, a year later, the well is running like a top. In the last month alone, in order to establish the grass, I 'may' have pumped out close to 100,000 gallons of water without a problem:gaptooth:. One thing I do need to do, is get a vent fan (controlled by a humidity switch) in well shed, as I am getting condensation on well parts from pumping so much cold water into a warm shed. The well guy was kind to permanently lend me his $2k well logger...lol
> Since I use to ply the geophysics trade, I was familiar with seismic equipment, but he had no clue. So, I was learn how to use it, then teach him how to use it...that was two years ago.
> So, I've been able to take well measurements over time. Short story, I'll never run out of water. Must get a reserve fund set aside for a new pump though...I do not want to be humping water again, ever.
> 
> My biggest worry though, was the property. For four years it looked like a bomb crater. If, for whatever reason, I had to sell, I'd get peanuts. Maybe a developer could see through the slash, rock and log piles, and the scarred earth, but could city folk see through it too? I doubt it. In my mind, until I had the bulk of lot looking respectable, I was in the red. Now that it looks greenish, I instantly went into the black by a country mile. Add the fact it is fully serviced, including fibre optic, well, I am in a good position. Especially since there is run on properties up here right now. Things are literally flying off the shelves. Vancouver has gotten so expensive, the outlying areas are feeling the heat. I'm ok with a lackluster market, but this market has me worried....lol. It means more people. Lots that sat for decades are being developed. It means my private lake spot will be have to be shared...
> View attachment 54804


What lake are you on? Hotel was a short walk for us but when I could drive we spent time at all of them.


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## melli

Here is a 'lay of the land' pic...your looking at the 'town center'. I live well away from it. We are blessed to have numerous deep fresh water lakes in addition the ocean inlets and fjords in our hood. Each lake is different, and one lake, is so clear, it reminds me the of clearest tropical ocean I've ever swam.


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## melli

painterswife said:


> What lake are you on? Hotel was a short walk for us but when I could drive we spent time at all of them.


Hotel Lake is bottom corner of above pic...I am less than a half mile from a nice lake...:grin:


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## painterswife

That looks like you might be up in my old stomping grounds above the lake where the bobcat roam. If so It is a wonderful spot. Midnight swims in that lake were the best. The old rope swing is right below where that picture is taken from. My mother and step father owned the marina at Irvings Landing when I was in high school.


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## melli

painterswife said:


> That looks like you might be up in my old stomping grounds above the lake where the bobcat roam. If so It is a wonderful spot. Midnight swims in that lake were the best. The old rope swing is right below where that picture is taken from. My mother and step father owned the marina at Irvings Landing when I was in high school.


No kidding! I remember that marina. The only time I ever visited the Sunshine Coast in my youth was when my parents took us on a boating trip. We stopped at your marina and had a burger. I remember having a burger and staring out the windows at gorgeous Pender Harbour. 
That Marina closed as you may know, and has been tossed around like a bean bag. There were ideas of throwing up condos, then two owners had a fight over it, then septic issues cropped up...lol
No idea where it is now...they finally chained it off. Their launch was perfect when I lived over that way (kayaking). 
You have any ideas what is happening with it?


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## painterswife

No, my brother in law sent pictures of it last week. All the docks are gone and even some of the government docks are gone. They sold it before I graduated highschool in the 70's. I have not been back since the 80's.

Lots of good memories.


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## melli

Remember this? Looks like it has been around for while.


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## painterswife

No. Don't remember that one


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## melli

Ok , this one....easy....








As one can guess, I like taking pictures...not only of scenery, but every facet of the project. Allows me to review things, and plan the next day from the cramped RV...at least it is cozy and warm in winter.


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## melli

Been reading a few posts on journey other homesteaders have taken, and seen the questions a few have asked about it, and it occurred to me, there is no list of tools needed or which make life easier when land clearing and building. 
One can always go old school and grunt their way through it, but I try to limit my grunting per se. 

Truck or trailer (with sides) - probably number one on my list, next to a mini-ex. The truck can haul slash/logs around on property. I don't even have mine insured right now, but it is indispensable. I bought the saddest trailer you ever saw, and both the truck and trailer are slash movers. When truck is insured, I got one of those trailer hitch bed extenders so I can haul all the lumber I need to build my sheds. I can pick up navvy jack (gravel for concrete), mulch, you name it. 

Sad Trailer - hard to find a pic for it...lol. $200 special. The upside is I can overfill, beat it up, and it is all good. The excavator has even done 'repairs' to it. 








I had this one for a while, which had a dump feature and could carry my ex to neighbors place for work on the side, but it really wasn't worth it. I sold it to pay for the septic field. Now, this one I had to be careful with...even though it could carry twice the orange one, it was twice as slow. 









Here is me posing as I scope out the situation (someone gave me a bluetooth clicker for my camera, so I had to test it out). Note, the roots of Douglas Fir...tenacious root system. 








List to continue after this short break...feel like tree trimming today...
No idea how that last pic got in post...old pic of clearing...


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## melli

Homesteader List;

Chainsaw - I'd recommend the biggest, baddest chainsaw you can find if you have trees need felling/bucking. I wouldn't get anything less than 40cc with a 20" bar. I have two Poulan Pros 4620AV and a 5020. They are 42cc and 50cc both with 20" bar. The 4620 is junk next to the 5020 (latter has cast metal brake cover, former doesn't). And many folks would say Poulan is junk next to Stihl and Husq...lol
http://www.amazon.com/Poulan-Pro-PP5020AV-20-Inch-Carrying/dp/B0052EL9YU
Poulan is made by Husqvarna. Many of the parts used in Poulan have Husqvarna labels. It is a rebadged Husqvarna in my mind. The upside, is it costs less than half a comparable sized Stihl or Husq. 
Now, this is important...I flogged my chainsaws, but dutifully sharpened them and cleaned them, but over time a chainsaw chain wears down. I'd go and get a replacement chain, and feel invigorated with a new chain. Then one day, I ran over my chainsaw with excavator...:grumble:
The bar was toast. I start looking at options, and come across the Oregon Chainsaw site. So, I get an Oregon bar with a chisel chain (baddest chain they carry - has a warning label online about it being for expert users). What I didn't realize, not all chains are created equal. All store bought crap comes with low kickback chains. Like a bike with training wheels. Well, I fire up my chainsaw with the new gear, and wow....did I say wow? Wow! :bouncy::bouncy:
Before I was cutting like a bread knife through heavy bread, now I was cutting like a hot knife through soft butter. I was cutting up the small timber for firewood to sell, and with old setup, it was a drag. With the new setup it was almost a pleasure. That being said, I had a chainsaw chain that could slice through me open in a heartbeat. But, if you always stay to the side of the blade, any kickback will carry chainsaw in a line beside you (only had one full kickback situation, albeit, using it in brush). And I always make sure nose of chainsaw doesn't hit anything. The first few years were great practice for when I got the chisel chain. 
I found I could overpower the chainsaw if I had a firm grip...I only ran full throttle in the meat of the tree etc. Lastly, don't use it as a brush cutter...I tried that and it was the only time I had full blown kickback scenario. Scared the dickens out of me. 

An old timer who worked in forestry, said why bother getting a small bar...he liked the longer bar because he didn't have to stoop. I also saw some youtube vids extolling the virtues of a long bar (within reason)...a longer bar has less kickback potential (simple physics - moment-arm).


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## melli

Homesteading List;

Again, it depends on what your dealing with, but my Stihl weedwhacker (bottom of the line) has served me well. The only thing that bugs me about my power tool equipment is the plethora of 2 stroke power tools I have...cough cough. I also have a Husqvarna combi kit (local dealer decided to stop carrying Husq!, but that meant a great deal for me), with hedge trimmer (very handy), pole saw (handy, but rarely use it and it is heavy - I borrow a hand pole saw which reaches higher), and a weedwhacker attachment (backup for when Stihl goes down). 
The local landscaper just uses the bottom end Stihl weedwhacker like mine...to him, they are cheap, easy on back, and disposable ($150). You have to go a few models up to get one that you can put a brush cutter on, although I've heard of folks modding the entry level one for a blade. 

I have a cement mixer, a fancy Italian job, but I rarely use...later on I am sure I will use it heavily. A compactor for compacting foundations for shed pads...it costs me about $60 to rent one, and I figure I will be doing 5 jobs that need it, plus, I use it for driveway when I get crushed granite...with so many trucks and whatnot plying my driveway, don't underestimate the driveway maintenance one must do. 

I stumbled on a garage sale and got a Tory-Built Rototiller...was a must at my old place for turning garden over. At this place, even more so, once I get a garden in. Speaking of which, I plan to fence my whole lot. No more mickey mouse fencing jobs around fruit trees, garden and deer food plants. Fence the works and I can plant whatever I want, wherever I want. Deer around here are worse than squirrels...everyday, they troop through and devour whatever they can get their mouth on. I've even seen them get on the haunches so they could strip a tree of it's leaves (I know I have a pic of that, but cannot find it). Around here, the standard is 6'-6" high (min). And use heavy gauge...they mangled my 'game' fence I had around my fruit trees until it looked like some sort of Origami. 
This guy was looking at me (I can plainly see he is mocking me) while he chomped on my flowers up against house. 









A fence means no running into Coyotes in the dead of night (happened once)...he was as scared as I was and bolted. Also, although not bear proof, a fence will limit their intrusions. Cougars won't be able to get in...we have some, but rarely seen of course. 1500ft of fence will cost a pretty penny, but I cannot wait for the day I get one. Here is a game fence around my garden at old place (game fence is cheap, but the buggers (deer) will still try to stick their heads through it. I went with 4x4 PT posts, and a couple of 4x4 sleepers for bottom. 
Neighbor posing....







View of garden from deck...







The spoils of my labor....I pine for the day I can walk over to garden and pick supper...


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## melli

Not a lot happening on my homestead...watching grass grow, move sprinkler every 1.5hrs...from 7am to 9:30pm...everyday. We might hit a wet spell, which would give me my freedom! :bouncy: We are known for being a rainforest, but one wouldn't know that from the weather we've been having these past years. Winter is wet here, no doubt...from about late October to late March, everything is wet. Then spring, and we hit weeks of no rain, or it rains, but evaporates within hours. We now have a burning ban for the rest of summer, early fall. Been following the Fort Mac fire...thankfully, we are not as dry or hot as them...plus, being on the prairies, the wind.


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## melli

By the way, I did keep a few large logs, and today, I pulled out the 'Alaskan mill' a neighbor gave me. Sorry, didn't take a pic of the whole thing, as I wanted the model number so I could find instructions. 







In this video, mine is exactly like what they show. 
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiiGrbI7bgA[/ame]

Looks fairly straightforward...have to fire up Bobby and mount the logs and get a whole lot of tarp under them...I can see it'll be a sawdust factory. See if my Poulan can cut the mustard. I feel more positive about milling with a chainsaw, with the new chain. Long ago, I made a bench from milling a cedar log freehand...took forever. 

I need big lumber for a carport/shed that will house Bobby and perhaps, shipping container. I need a day where it is cool and preferably breezy before I tackle that fun. 
I still have the well shed siding to finish...:grumble:
And I'm using a tarp for that project. Second wall almost done (pic is behind the times)








Yeah, tarps are much needed item for homesteading! Whether covering your build, or your equipment and materials, you definitely need tarps. I have 6 or so...recommend the thicker ones (black one side and silver on the other). They seem to last a lot longer than the green, orange ones (garbage after one year).


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## melli

Was trying to hunt down a string of pics from security camera that showed a Raven and Deer having a stare off...I'll eventually find them...
But I found this pic...A dear neighbor asked me to come over and fix her soffit. Apparently, over winter these holes appeared in her soffit. So, I haul out my ladder and climb up to inspect. Hmmm...no idea how they got there. Soffit is plastic, by the way. So, I take a piece out...and what I see is squirrels had tunneled into insulation, but I wasn't convinced squirrels had made these holes. So, I take off more soffit...can you guess what animal caused the holes?
Answer below....no peeking!









Well, apparently, her grandson had used the cabin and the fire pit is right beside the house...guess they had a few, and with a pellet gun decided to go after that darn squirrel in the rafters...figured one would stop after shooting a few holes, but not this kid. There were a hundred holes! 
Weekend warriors...:help:
The proof was that I found pellets sitting on top of the soffit. Reminds me of Caddyshack...


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## melli

Found the Raven and Deer pics...timestamp shows order. 
The Raven was not giving up his spot. 
BTW - love the camera...takes pic or vid if it detects movement, day or night, and sends it to cell phone and puts it on my hard drive. From my cell phone I can see real time vid of my place, from anywhere in the world. Very cool...and gives me piece of mind. Knock on wood, we don't get a lot of sticky fingers up here.


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## melli

Now that I am posting in real time, things will go at a glacial pace. 
I got around to throwing in a new GFCI plug in my RV...the one over 'bathroom' sink wasn't working (they eventually give out), so I put a new one in.
I was rather shocked (excuse pun) at what I saw







I'm hoping it was just a poor connection...that it wasn't a GFCI plug trying to catch my RV on fire :shrug:
The oxidation on copper line has me worried...hmm. And I also discovered GFCI plug was the line side power for all my plugs (other plugs used this GFCI protection). So, in essence, I had no GFCI protection for a couple of years...no biggie. The almost burning down my RV is a biggie...have to keep an eye on my new one. 

Doing the Hardi staggered shingles on my tiny little well shed is torture (BTW - I complain a lot). I do about 4 courses in the morning, then I'm outa there. Makes installing cedar shakes seem like a breeze. These things come in two patterns, and you don't want to line up the breaks...plus, I can't use my hardi cutting board because these friggin things are too wide. So, I am stuck using a hardi circ blade...dustorama. 
Makes me want to stain lattice (If you ever stained lattice, you know what I mean...arguably the worst job ever!). We neighbors used to joke that we'd rather be in jail for the whole weekend than stain 8 sheets of lattice. Your chasing drips all day long. 
Anyways, it is looking better everyday. Cannot wait to get paint on it!!!








A money saver tip: Instead of buying a portable sprinkler for your lawn, like most folks do, if they don't have irrigation, buy a sprinkler head for in ground irrigation, make a tripod and use that. Since I will eventually get around to that task in the fall or late spring next year (in-ground irrigation), I figured why buy a sprinkler....I got a couple of rainbird 5000 sprinkler heads (cheaper than the portable jobs and way better). They came with 10 different spray nozzles, they are adjustable out the yin-yan (spray pattern size and 0-360). No idea why I never thought of this years ago...one is setup on a portable sprinkler tripod (rainforest sprinkler or something like that), and the other on my laser tripod (zip straps). Got the adapters/threaded pvc pipe, so they accept a hose, and away I went...one note of caution...the higher you have it, the better the base has to be...the power of the sprinkler head will tip over your contraption (I did some hillybilly magic - duct taped rebar on one, and a small bucket with rocks on the other). 
http://www.rainbird.ca/landscape/products/rotors/5000.htm
I calculated one rainbird, with 3.5 nozzle can do 1/8th of acre...two can cover 1/4acre! So, instead of dawn to dusk watering, just 8hrs a day...:grit:


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## melli

Biggest tree that I've seen in my hood...I'm almost 6' tall. 
That tree has seen a lot...dark marks are from a forest fire. 
I'd have to say that is a 500yr old tree. 
There is nature museum down the road that has a slice of a tree mounted on wall...it was something like 2000yrs old before someone took an axe to it...incredible. They show major world events the tree has seen...if a tree could see...


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## melli

Finally got the hardi staggered shingle siding on and painted. Twice as long to put on as lap or board and batten, plus it used up twice the paint (2 gallons)...those gaps were beyond tedious (suggest one uses a 1" wide stiff bristle brush). btw - A 1" thick nap sliced foam or fiber roller couldn't get in there...
Nice not looking at housewrap...looks like a lemon cake with chocolate icing...been on a calorie tear as of late. Wondering if the VOCs in the paint or stain are responsible. :shrug:
Still needs the copper roof and minor detailing....
btw - yellow is Sico Linden Bud, and trim (cedar) is Sikkens Teak.


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## melli

Got my Alaskan Mill up and running...took a bit of fussing to get it set up...another day and I will have my first post. Not using a ripping chain, so it takes a bit longer, but that being said, the chisel chain does plow through fairly quickly, for a chainsaw mill. 
My first log has a bow in it, and I was using it as a test subject, but since the first cut went well, I'll have a keeper (about 10x10, 11'-6" long). 
Post and beams are expensive, so that is probably all I'll make. Hopefully use them to build a monster woodshed.


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## melli

Not a fast process, about 1/2hr per 12' cut (one gas and oil refill per cut). One has time to calculate it...1 sec per 1/8 inch....thereabouts. First cut takes the longest, as it is the deepest cut. Last cut was quickest...and it had to be...torrential rain storm passed through. Got a 9x9 post out of that curvy log. 
First log I've ever milled. Not so sure about the time it takes, but I am really pumped that I have an awesome post to work with. Priceless...
Notes: really helped having log as high as possible, so one isn't leaning over...I could use my thigh to push. Give my hand a break...not hard to push, but the steady vibrations and firm grip wears one out.


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## Tomjracer

Melli,

If you have enough cut timber, have you thought about purchasing an inexpensive saw mill? You can get the Harbor Freight models down here in the states for under $2000. There are better mills on the market but quite a bit quicker than an Alaskan Mill and pennies on the dollar of buying lumber.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Melli,
> 
> If you have enough cut timber, have you thought about purchasing an inexpensive saw mill? You can get the Harbor Freight models down here in the states for under $2000. There are better mills on the market but quite a bit quicker than an Alaskan Mill and pennies on the dollar of buying lumber.



I looked into getting one from the get go, but I figured I was looking at 4-5k for a good one (with a long track)....was an item nice to have, but I had so many other needs that trumped it. Now, after using the Alaskan mill, I realize I should have had it further up the list. 
Currently, I am just trying to get some big lumber for a monster woodshed/cover for Bobby. Always have my eye out for one on sale in hood. 
That HF one looks interesting....probably 3k in Canadian dollars to get one home. 
Unfortunately, I need every penny for the shed home. Tempting to whip out CC and go for it....lol
But I've been down debtors row before, and I like the no debt feeling I have right now...homesteading from scratch sucks every penny from me. lol


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## melli

Tomjracer - you got me looking at sawmills! 
This one seems to have my fancy.
http://woodlandmills.ca/product/hm126-portable-sawmill/

How to come up with 4k CDN $....hmmm....


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## Tomjracer

Looks like a nice unit, and probably a little better than the Harbor Freight unit too :thumb: 

Also make sure you budget for a few extra blades as it seems the lower end saws get shipped with a less than quality blade.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Looks like a nice unit, and probably a little better than the Harbor Freight unit too :thumb:
> 
> Also make sure you budget for a few extra blades as it seems the lower end saws get shipped with a less than quality blade.


Yeah, been reading up on both...hard to tell what the differences are. As for blades, the Woodland Mills version comes with a primo blade. In the video, at the end (37:20), the guy seemed quite honest about maintenance requirements, and blades etc. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL974E2C25F385BCB0&v=BH_f0ZITmwc

I like the shiny water tank...don't think HF has one...the cant locks, two sizes, wheel cleaner, cant stoppers (so you don't try to mill the cants), ss wire, just looks polished and slick. Hard to find details on HF one.


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## melli

So much for summer...we got a cooling trend with copious amounts of rain, and a few deluges. My steep driveway was becoming treacherous on a scooter, as I'd fall into a rut, and wherever the rut went, I went. After doing a lot of trail riding the past few weeks, I noticed these trench water diverters made out of PT wood. So, at the top of my drive I decide to put one in. I'd have water coming off the plateau of property and it would funnel down driveway...my hope is this will stop the plateau runoff. Having to regrade driveway after every heavy rain gets tedious. Way down the road, I'll concrete the sucker. 
Since there is nothing I could find on net on how to build one, I just used 3 -12' 2x4, and used 3 - 5/8" bolts (3 nuts and 4 washers per bolt). Drilled through two 2x4's, evenly spaced, and bolted them together, spacing them about 2-1/2" apart...there is a 2x4 sleeper on bottom. Dug a trench, compacted, put down sleeper and screwed the sides to it. Backfilled, and compacted with excavator. Excavator doesn't seem to wreck it, so we'll see when the dump trucks roll over it. 
This was long overdue...if it works, I'll throw some more down further down driveway. Fairly cheap fix. 
Aside: really like those cast metal grates one sees at garage entrances etc., whenever I get the driveway done in concrete, I'd like to use those, but it seems all the local stores just carry those plastic ones...I hate plastic. And they will likely crack after a few big trucks roll over them...


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## melli

If I could only have one dessert for the rest of my life, it would be cheesecake...I consider it my specialty (hundreds of cheesecakes worth of practice). Not many ingredients, but preparation and mixing is key to getting that silky smooth, melt on your tongue, texture (not a fan of NY cheesecake or cheesecake that has a cake like texture). Then cooking requires attention...Wasn't sure my RV propane stove could cut it. Gave me a 9/10 cheesecake, which I'll gladly take. 
It has a yellowy hue because I use brown sugar and lemon. 
Cooler weather has me on a sugar rush....







Apparently cheesecake has a history dating back to the Greeks and Romans. Not a fan of their recipe...I'll eat it for breakfast, lunch and supper. I had to give some to a neighbor, lest I eat it all in 24hrs. 
An 1/8th slice, with strawberry compote in the morning powers me until mid afternoon...good stuff! lol


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## Tomjracer

melli said:


> So much for summer...we got a cooling trend with copious amounts of rain, and a few deluges. My steep driveway was becoming treacherous on a scooter, as I'd fall into a rut, and wherever the rut went, I went. After doing a lot of trail riding the past few weeks, I noticed these trench water diverters made out of PT wood. So, at the top of my drive I decide to put one in. I'd have water coming off the plateau of property and it would funnel down driveway...my hope is this will stop the plateau runoff. Having to regrade driveway after every heavy rain gets tedious. Way down the road, I'll concrete the sucker.
> Since there is nothing I could find on net on how to build one, I just used 3 -12' 2x4, and used 3 - 5/8" bolts (3 nuts and 4 washers per bolt). Drilled through two 2x4's, evenly spaced, and bolted them together, spacing them about 2-1/2" apart...there is a 2x4 sleeper on bottom. Dug a trench, compacted, put down sleeper and screwed the sides to it. Backfilled, and compacted with excavator. Excavator doesn't seem to wreck it, so we'll see when the dump trucks roll over it.
> This was long overdue...if it works, I'll throw some more down further down driveway. Fairly cheap fix.
> Aside: really like those cast metal grates one sees at garage entrances etc., whenever I get the driveway done in concrete, I'd like to use those, but it seems all the local stores just carry those plastic ones...I hate plastic. And they will likely crack after a few big trucks roll over them...
> View attachment 55478


Have a similar problem myself. Please let us know how these hold up and work.


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## pairofthrees

Absolutely awesome to see, thanks for sharing. I know it's years of hard work thrown up and makes it all seem easier than it possibly could have been but still just inspiring to see the changes you've already made.


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## melli

pairofthrees said:


> Absolutely awesome to see, thanks for sharing. I know it's years of hard work thrown up and makes it all seem easier than it possibly could have been but still just inspiring to see the changes you've already made.



Thanks! It has been a haul. Being naive at the beginning really helped me...lol
How hard could it be to clear a couple of acres on bedrock, get 150 loads of fill/dirt, install services etc etc....by the fourth year, reality was sinking in. Getting the last big push on landscaping in early spring, really buoyed my spirits. Just need a small home, and I can chill...
But Tom has me salivating over a bandsaw mill....the place from where I want one, will do layaway, but it will be almost two years before I get it! 
The real pleasure in Homesteading is the variety of things to do...one day, I can be excavating/forestry, the next plumbing or electrical, or I can build something....eventually, I'll be into gardening and canning. Never a boring moment. 
I should point out, I've been wholly lazy the past few months...nice change of pace. With lakes, and trails all over, it is nice to take a break. Rebuilt a CT90...what a hoot it is...some days, I just putter around the hood visiting other homesteaders. 







If I didn't buy the bloody thing, I would be 1/3rd to my bandsaw mill purchase!


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Have a similar problem myself. Please let us know how these hold up and work.


Well, your wish came sooner than I expected...got a deluge today. One of those cells that spawned and dumped in the same spot. Now, I have to redo my whole driveway again, after making it all nice a couple days ago. 

The trench gutter worked well, except it was two feet too short (mine was 12'). Also, I used wood blocking at end...will have to throw a bolt there too, as the wood blocking was an impediment to the torrent, and it overflowed, causing the gravel around it to go bye bye....























Should point out, once the waters receded, the sluice box was clean...no gravel or dirt. Having a good slope probably was key. 

Aside: my 320 ft underground Big 0 (4") running along plateau worked like magic...didn't soak up water quickly, except one takeout (drain) I had in a low spot...it was like a bathtub drain...just sucked up all the water without overflowing. I see I need to put in a couple more takeouts (drains) in other low spots in yard (grassy areas). The one drain I did have was in a problem spot, where it would pond until it covered a lane, then sit for weeks. After two hours, not even a puddle to be seen. No standing water...I like that.


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## Tomjracer

That doesn't look bad at all. This has been added to the to do list, thanks Melli!


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## melli

Being in a rainforest-ee type environment, one expects their share of rain. Usually, we get most of it over winter, but it usually is a light rain, day after day after day. Lack of sun is the biggest headache though. 
Anyways, as I mentioned, we got a deluge a few days ago, which is not very common at all. It absolutely overpowered my drain sluice box and did a number on my driveway. Probably the most intense rainfall I have ever witnessed up here, in all my life. Down my road, I noticed all these 'sod rolls'. At first, I thought a grader was to blame, but as I drove down the road, I noticed lots of them, apparently random. Of course, I had to investigate. The shoulder sod had been ripped up and floated, then partially rolled. There were no grader marks...it dawned on me, this was the rain we had. The places where the sod was ripped up, was in places where the river of water would flow into the ditch (like at corners or low spots). The force required must have been quite substantial. For a moment, I thought, wow, free sod! lol
Then, I thought, it was probably contaminated with the road oils etc. Speaking of which, lawns around here are prone to becoming moss lawns, due to the moisture and lack of sun, but the roadside turf doesn't have any moss?! I concluded the iron particles off trucks and cars keep the shoulders free of moss...especially since we use road salt for a few weeks over winter. You'll note how lush the roadside 'lawn' is...lots of iron. That's my guess...lol














btw - for moss control up here, we use iron based solution.


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## Fishindude

have not seen one of those old Honda's for a long time. Neat little bikes!


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## melli

Fishindude said:


> have not seen one of those old Honda's for a long time. Neat little bikes!


On days like today, it is heaven having a scooter. This is view from our local ice cream cone store (also a corner store)...scooter is awesome for those trips. 







I had never seen these CT90s myself until a guy picking up firewood from me wanted to sell me a CT70. It needed work and had no papers, so I wasn't terribly interested, but it got me onto Craigslist, when I saw this one. 8 gears! (4 hi and 4 lo). For only having a 90cc motor, it hauls up the steepest inclines with ease. Apparently, it can also ford a creek up to the seat height, as the intake is through the rear rack. I won't be trying that! Other than the shyster I bought it from (he absolutely messed up everything), it has been a pleasant surprise. No clutch, shift on the fly. Pretty light for maneuvering. A nice diversion. Honda did a good job on this model...apparently, they are used by posties in Australia. 

Just kind of bummed I never clued into the mill I can get for a reasonable cost...had I not got the bike, I'd be almost half way there...lol
The Alaskan mill is way too much work...I suppose if your up in the woods in Alaska, you probably don't have much choice...lol


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## melli

What in the world is that?!! :run:
A bat? We have lots cruising around this time of year...but it is so bright. My Cam has night vision infrared lights....


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## melli

Happy Canada Day! 
Decided to explore, get lost, hear noises in the bush, saw two big elk, and made my way home via gps....


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## Bret

Inspiring. The word is too small.good work.


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## melli

Not exactly homesteading material, but sometimes one has to just bugger off and get lost....I'd still be lost from my last trip into the mountains, if it wasn't for GPS. And logging folks mess up maps with trails going everywhere...is it a dead end or a trail?
For the princely sum of $2.17 CDN in gas, I spent 5 hrs in the hills today. Coming down the powerline trail was interesting...


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## Bret

Great pictures. No excusing a previous pun with the GFI. Only applause. This is a very industrious and pretty place.


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## melli

Bret said:


> Great pictures. No excusing a previous pun with the GFI. Only applause. This is a very industrious and pretty place.


Thanks!

It is coming along, but so much to do....and summer has seriously interceded with my agenda. I've decided to call my Honda CT90, the Woo-Woo. I wanted to call it the Yellow-Woo, but that might seem politically incorrect. My plate starts off with WOO. Wish it was WEE...lol. 
Poor thing, I really took it through it paces yesterday. Climbed a 3500ft old copper mining rd, that is more of goat trail now...one section just fell off the cliff. But, I've found a route that takes me to the top from the west side of Caren Range in fairly short order (closer to home). Had to give Woo-Woo several breaks, as he was smoking. The 8 gears makes all the difference. And to think hiking clubs walk that! 




































That logging road pic makes it look like a Sunday drive, but that is the absolute best of the road...anytime the road dips or goes up a hill, it is boulder field. Plus, that is the main road running on top of the spine of the range. Apparently, some of Canada's oldest trees are up there, and I am intent on finding them. Not sure how old, but I'm guessing at least a thousand years old. That would be a thrill to see a living thousand year old tree.


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## Bret

Get a picture of said trees.


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## melli

No picture of the elusive thousand year old cedars...weather too crappy to try another ascent, plus I want to re-jet Woo-woo, as he had a rough time climbing the Old Mine Rd. 
Not sure if I mentioned, but I've been talking to the birds...Ravens to be specific. Momma had two youngins come my way this spring in early May. What a loud bunch. The kids would kaw from dawn to dusk for food from Momma. Momma and Dad would feed them every 15 minutes it seemed. I'd help out with peanuts and whatnot. One of the youngsters, I called 'Hello' was a vocal Raven. She (likely a female, not because she was a loud mouth, but her size relative to her sibling) would sit in a tree above my RV and try out new vocalizations. Like a kid going through the alphabet. Pretty funny, some of the sounds she would make. At any rate, I heard they are pretty smart, so I decided to see if could get Hello to say 'hello'. I worked on her for weeks. Eventually, I got a vid of her saying 'hello'. Not perfect, but a good try. 
I'm saddened both siblings have disappeared. Not sure if Momma and Pappa had enough, or they found greener pastures, or coyotes got them...
Although, a neighbor 5km from my place thought he was hallucinating when he thought he heard a bird say hello one morning...so maybe Hello is ok after all...
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AvT6Go48kE[/ame]


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## melli

I haven't been BBQ'ing for some time...living in a RV just doesn't elicit the BBQ feeling...at any rate, I have to move the RV, and my two BBQs (one a gift from a neighbour) were in need of TLC. I pop out the cast iron grates, and the iron was peeling off the grates. I drop them onto the gravel wondering what to do....after dropping them, I notice a lot of flakes came off, so I use my foot and kick and rub them into the gravel...some more flakes came off....hmmm.....how to speed the process up. A brush would have taken forever, never-mind the sweat. 







In comes my stead...







A few laps around my place on the gravel and dirt...and voila!
Rinsed them off and put lots of oil on them so I am not doing this again in the near future...really pleased with results. No chance of eating iron bits that would stick to burgers or steaks. 














Note: I am never buying cast iron grills in the future...


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## Raeven

LOL, I enjoyed your raven video (no surprise, eh?)!

I live with a flock of them, several mated pairs that live in my trees, so I've had more than a few raven experiences. I'm fond of them but try not to interact with them too much. They can be real troublemakers. We've coexisted quite peacefully for nearly a dozen years, except for when they decided for reasons unknown to tear apart a brand new hot tub cover (that looked exactly like the old hot tub cover), or when they decide to tappy-tappy-tappy on my bedroom windowpane at 4:00 a.m. Happily, it's an infrequent occurrence.

Once I was walking through the woods and I heard someone say, "House! House!!" Freaked me right out. Then I remembered that was the command I used to give my old German shepherd when I wanted him to go to his doghouse before I'd set down his food each day. One of the ravens had learned to imitate the command. I only heard him/her do it once, but it was unsettling when it happened. I still wonder how much fun that raven had making my dog go into his dog house when I wasn't paying attention.

They're fun to have around.


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## melli

Raeven said:


> LOL, I enjoyed your raven video (no surprise, eh?)!
> .............


Never would have guessed...lol

I only ever have the two around here, Momma and Pappa. Momma can be a bit irritating...they definitely have emotions and they squabble with each other from time to time. 
It is easy to tell them apart, as Momma lost a feather in her wing, and then she had one sticking straight out of her for weeks. I was like, pull the bloody thing out! 
And Poppa is a monster...when he lands, everybody defers to him, except Momma will half-heartedly try to get a piece of food out of his mouth. 
I miss the kids...especially Hello, as she was a smart one and always in the mess of things...plus, she had little fear of me. 

Oh well, I've been having better sleeps with the kids gone....peace returns to the woods.


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## melli

Hard to get motivated when your living accommodations (RV) is sitting on top of where you want to build. The plan is to build a 19x44 uber shed style garage home. Try to make it financially feasible...then years down road, build a house up top. 

Moving a RV takes some time...removed all skirting and blocking the day before yesterday, then moved RV over yesterday, and proceeded to spend a number of hours leveling house site. 
Today, I had to dig a trench to run a power cord and the Fiber optic over to RV. I already had a septic take-out off building site (which will eventually continue on towards house site on top of hill). Also had a water box over where I parked RV. A real grind...thankfully, the lake was there after hooking everything up. Nice to see the area uncovered...just a matter of pushing paper till the cows come home, and a number of weeks later, I'll get a permit. 
Should note, putting power cable through PVC drain pipe is not legal per se. Even though I was using portable cable (10g RV extension cord), it should be above ground, but I am not going to have an extension cord running across building site. I'll eventually destroy it by driving over it or whatnot. BTW - I looked at the price of 3" Electrical conduit...which wasn't too bad, but the sweeps were more than the pipe! (sweep is like an elbow). Glad I got 4" drain pipe as the plugs barely fit through that...

Cheap and relatively easy, until I hit granite at less than a foot. 






























Here is a vid of me grinding my teeth on the granite...apologize for jerkiness, and it is hard to hear me over the engine...
Hard to hold camera and dig at the same time....
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMJ0cXoTTmU&feature=youtu.be[/ame]


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## melli

Got my Sewerage System Filed! Means I can get a permit, but first, the engineer has to sign off on my shack. Also means I can legally be here...lol
One of the bludgeons the muni hall has for those wanting to 'camp' out on their property is if one has no septic disposal. 
So, I legally have septic, water, and power. You can build a home without water or power, but not septic. Sort of makes sense...one doesn't want their neighbors excrement running through their yard....
But seriously, I am in the dead centre of my property...even if I dumped all my raw sewage onto the ground, it would never reach the property line...be smelly though. 

Here is a photo of the south side of my plan I submitted to engineer. It really is the meat and potato side...the other sides are boring. ICF walls to 10' all around...on carport side, I will frame in garage door, until such time I use it as a garage. I've seen some rad garage doors but I have yet to see one with a high R value. Be kind of silly to have an uber insulated shack, with one side having an R value of 5. For now, whenever I get around to building it, it will be my bunker. 44' long and 20' wide...and a metal roof....lol
Might even do a side or two in metal roofing...see how much that is. And, as much as I hate doing it, I will do some staggered hardi shingle siding like my well shed. Just looks visually interesting. I liked the cedar trim I did on well shed, but I'm not sure about it's fire resistance. Want to make this shack as fire resistant as possible. Besides, it will be so quiet inside, a forest fire could rage by and I wouldn't even hear it or smell it (split air heat pump, filtration unit, electric solar and solar hot water panels are on my wish list). 








Really tried to get pic as big as possible, but this was the best I could do...wish they'd allow larger pics so folks could see the details???


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## AnnieinBC

Really interesting reading this and you live in a beautiful place. We used to live in Sechelt and built a place on the inlet side. There is nowhere as beautiful as the Coast in the summer!

Looking forward to reading more as you make more progress. Great job!


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## melli

Blackberries grow like weeds on the coast...they are everywhere, and I mean everywhere. I was recently told the blackberries I've loved since a kid are not native. Himalayan blackberries are not native to BC. They are considered an invasive species. I guess they like our lowlands, because they are everywhere. At any rate, they do taste delicious, and are prodigious producers. A kind neighbor who has a summer property gave my friend and I unfettered access to pillage his 400ft hedgerow of Himalayan blackberries. We like it as he cuts the grass to the edge of the hedge, so it easier than navigating the usual roadside ditches. 
They have just started to ripen and I picked a tad over 3 quarts in 45 minutes. I throw them in my pot and boil them down, then add minimal sugar. Once the concoction thickens (many hours later), I pour into jars. 
I decided to google how others make jam and it seems I am out to lunch. Apparently, one just boils them for 15 minutes, uses 50/50 - sugar/berries, adds some cornstarch/spices/lemon to thicken/taste. 
I'm like whoa....I always boil mine down. Do other folks do the 15 minute recipe with good results? Or do you boil them down too? 
For those in BC, we 'should' be planting these guys (grow me instead booklet at bottom):
http://bcinvasives.ca/invasive-spec...species/invasive-plants/himalayan-blackberry/
















Had to throw in a yard pic...lol
One of those perfect mornings...


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## melli

I guess about 1.5 liters of jam out that...big jam jar!


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## melli

Woo-woo was back in running order, after a week of hair pulling. So, I head for the hills. I get to the top of Caren Range and check out the old copper mine...spent an hour looking for shiny rocks (I wish that was gold! Pyrite, with some silver and copper). Have to admit, the mine site would be a homestead dream...waking up to that view everyday (when not cloudy). I then head over to a mountain lake and bump into to some folks on a quad. They pull off their helmets, and they must be in their 70's...I start chatting with them, and it turns out they've reconnoitered the whole coast. They've been to places I know are serious back country trails...rather charming, as they settled down, pulled out their lunch at the mountain lake like it was old hat. 
They gave me a tip, that if I just rattle a few minutes around the mountain, I can get a stunning view of the coast mountains. I follow their directions, and off I go. A bum bruiser 20 minute ride and I get my view. Gorgeous...
View is of Tzoonie Mountain complex...
BTW - I found a nice collection of shell casings...seems folks like the spot for the seclusion (that side of mountain is pretty desolate, insofar as to folks living on that side). Ground was absolutely covered in casings. Maybe they shot 'Lords of War' there? I know 12g shotgun shell casings, the luger casing, but the two other metal casings are foreign to me? 












































BTW - powerline pic is a westerly view back towards my home....that long island is Texada Island.


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## melli

When they call a trail AC/DC, I am compelled to check it out. Not my fav band, but several of their songs are on my playlist while I jog. Great songs to motivate one to keep on pushing forward. 

AC/DC trail cuts across a smallish creek canyon. It is really the only creek bed that limits (easy) full flank access to the west side of the Caren Range (Sunshine Coast, BC). 
On the map, it looked like a small traverse, but once in the trees, the trail, being made by hand, really zig-zags around trees and topography. Seemed ok at the beginning, but I knew there was the creek crossing in the middle somewhere. A tad apprehensive. I could always turn around I thought. Well, I get to the edge of 'canyon', and start the switchback descent. My bike couldn't make some of the turns. Off I get, and I drag the bike around the switchbacks. The bike sort of got away from me on one switchback, and fell over (thankfully, on high side). Unfortunately, I broke my front brake lever off. I can't turn on these goat trails, so down I go to creek bed. I come to the 'Bridge'. As you can see in pics, it is a classic. A huge thousand year old cedar is in the center, and smaller logs are used as beams. There are several sections, and leveling the bridge was optional. The pictures don't really show how far one would fall if they went off the bridge. Maybe one wouldn't break a leg, but with a bike...
I hummed and hawed how to do it. Walking it across would be best, but it wasn't really wide enough. I decided to coast to the middle, then gun it the rest of the way. I pre-walked it to make sure it could withstand woo-woo and I. The way the bridge canted over had me worried. 
Well, since I am typing this, my plan worked. Also, I will never cross that bridge again with woo-woo. 

Looking back at pics, it is quite beautiful...wish I had time to enjoy it. I was too preoccupied how to cross it, to take it in.


ps - I am waiting for engineer to stamp my plans, hence the fun and games in the woods...


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## melli

A friend is eco-homesteader....she likes to do everything with the environment in mind. She also is on the lookout for things I may be interested in, like solar arrays, living off grid etc. 
This video is of a family living way up in northern BC, which piqued my interest, as at one time, I was very interested in living up north in the wilds. 
However, reality sunk in and I'm a bit soft when it comes to bugs chewing on me (notice Mom is wearing a bug hat), and there is snow on the ground for a good 4-5mths. Limits outdoor activities. Lastly, I like a long growing season. 

But these folks are so cute! They look like they have thought about it in details, and to excuse my French, they have their **** together. 

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8Pe_u_4q5M[/ame]

They have some great ideas...like the straw bale gardening. Nice to see Lithium Batteries coming into use...battery storage is largest impediment in my mind for off grid living. Getting power from solar arrays is easy...it is the storage that is the problem, as you can see by their banks of lead acid batteries they were using. Lead acid batteries don't like deep drawdowns, whereas Lithium batteries are more robust in that regard. 
I would fork over for a well, but to each their own. 
Obviously, they are way up there somewhere in the sticks, as I am pretty sure, nothing they have done is permitted...lol
They really put together a great video...the scene of them hiking through the low autumn brush is breathtaking...


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## CSF-NY

NICE. As someone who's a few years off from doing what you're doing, this is very helpful! Thanks for sharing your project with us all!


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## melli

CSF-NY said:


> NICE. As someone who's a few years off from doing what you're doing, this is very helpful! Thanks for sharing your project with us all!


Your welcome. I got the inspiration from a dude down the road, who did pretty much the same thing as I am doing. He bought 2 wooded acres, got a much smaller RV and built his home (with no power! - well, he used a genny). His order of things is different than what I'm doing. He got it cleared just enough to stick in a house and septic field. He did the septic field so he could get the building permit. Ran a long hose to a kind neighbor for water. Got in a pro to build his field (he regrets that, only because he paid a lot, and results were so-so). He then built the home. I don't think he has 'Final inspection' yet, but he lives in the home. He paid as he went, so no insurance...brave man. Last year, he finally got power. This year, he got the well drilled, but it isn't hooked up yet. 

I couldn't go without all my services for so long, so I got those done first. Albeit, it means I have to wait for the house (an extra year I suppose). That being said, I don't have neighbors really close enough to run a garden hose or a power cord. I did run a garden hose to a neighbor when I burned my first slash pile out of an abundance of caution, but I didn't really need it, and they didn't seem thrilled to do so...plus, after 400ft of hose, all I got was a trickle. My feeling was they had a marginal water supply system. 

Well, with summer nearing an end (relatively speaking), I needed to do the annual RV exterior clean and caulking. RVs are like tin cans, they swell and contract throughout the year, and all the caulk seams need inspection, preferably when we have good weather (nothing like trying to caulk in the dead of winter when you've sprung a leak on the wet coast). 

The roof was my prime focus. I researched the web as to which cleaner would do the best job on EPDM (rubber roofs) roofs. I ran across this site, which list just about every chemical cleaner you can think of, and the results. 
http://www.sanidumps.com/faq/faq_41.php
Very handy resource for homesteaders having to cozy up in a RV as they build their estate (or RVers). 

I haul out all my chemical cleaners that I have and one-by-one do test cleaning on spots on my roofs. Sunlight dish soap, ok, but didn't get the grime embedded in rubber. Same went for Pine-sol, TSP, Baking Soda, Laundry Detergent (Arm and Hammer HE with baking soda), Spray 9. Out of the lot, Spray 9 did well on the plastic bits (vents, skylight). The Laundry detergent was the best overall (I used that on siding). But the winner by far, was '30 Second' (sodium hypochlorite), which only got a B rating on above list in link. For starters, I did it this morning when it was cloudy, so everything stayed wet until rinse. I used full strength, but was careful not to allow any to dribble off roof until rinse. It literally turned a grimy, grayish, greenish hued roof white in minutes (not in 30 seconds....lol). I don't have before pics...here is after. 






















RV is a 2003 (?) 25' Fleetwood, Northwest Edition. Not as fancy as the new smooth sided jobs I see nowadays. But they all seem to have similar components. Mine has dual fridge (electric or gas), gas range, gas HWT, gas heater (I use an electric DeLonghi Oil Heater (1500w) for base heat in winter, and for times when I want to get toasty I have a fan cube heater (1500w). Gas heater is one thing a person should avoid using as it can drain a propane tank in a week. BTW - I have two 30 pound tanks. I go through one a month to the day! 
I could get by with one heater, but I have at least one window open all year around because I smoke (darn cigarettes!). Mine has three waste tanks (one black for toilet, 2 grey for kitchen sink, and 'bathroom sink'/shower. 
And it has a 40 or 60 gallon fresh water tank, which thankfully, I no longer have to use. It is powered by a 12v pump if I needed to use it. 

Although these pics don't show it, I skirt the RV with plywood (makes a huge difference in winter). Although, now I have water plumbed in from underground, I did have a utility light turned on underneath when it got below zero (C). I was worried about the fresh water tank or water pipes freezing. I never had an issue with frozen pipes, but our winters are pretty mild to continental dwellers. With skirting, and the light bulb, I'm sure I'd be good to -10 to -20C. This unit is well insulated for an RV. 

I got some special caulk, called Dicor...will see if it better than all the others I've tried. I've tried marine caulk, Geo-flex, Dap, Lexel...and they all eventually peel. Rubber roofs are notorious for rejecting caulks...hard to get them to permanently stick, hence the yearly routine. 
If one does some research, Dicor seems to be number 1 rated caulk for rubber roofed RVs. Never use silicon based caulk...won't stick.

As you can see in pics, my RV is 'hardwired' to spot. Waste plumbing, electric, water line (with heat trace) and Fiber Optic is all set up so I don't have to much in terms of anything. It is like a house, except it is small, and the walls are thin enough to hear the windstorms in winter (my biggest gripe/fear). With it skirted, the winds don't budge this thing at all. I have it supported in 7 spots (4 corner jacks, hitch jack and I put 2 jack stands under frame between tires). Makes it a solid platform...doesn't shake when I thump around in it. In summer, it is quite pleasant, especially with killer AC unit. I'm solo, so I can imagine if two folks were living in one these, it could get dicey...an extra few feet of RV, one can get another room per se. 
But, I have what I have, and this RV is performing admirably. Able to get my queen bed in here, so I don't lack comfort. The push-out is a couch, that converts to a bed if need be. It could use some more cushion. I use lots of pillows as I cocoon in front of my 40" TV...lol. It takes up one side of my kitchen table bench seating.


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## melli

If anyone is curious, this is what it looked like when I first got it...interior shots. Cost me 7k I think. 



















































Very cosy...a tad dated on style, but pretty clean RV. Sort of amazed how one can cram in everything a house has, except washer/dryer and dishwasher. And it has the killer AC unit....:banana: Don't want to jinx myself, but hopefully, by next fall, it will be finding a new home in the woods...

Forgot to mention why I posted this...for those that can handle RV living, I think this is the perfect way to economically live on the land you bought while you build. While I did have to fork over 7k (not bad when compared to rent), I've lived in it for two years, and I'll be able to get 5k easy when I sell it (maybe more). So, for about a thousand dollars a year, I have accommodations on my property. Plus, when we have power outages, which we seem to have a few over winter, I am not left freezing or in the dark (it has two deep cell batteries for lights and fridge, propane cooktop and a propane furnace). With two large pressure tanks, I have (hot or cold) water (I am good for a couple of days without power to well pump). I do have to fire up the genny for TV/Internet...btw - get fiber optic if you can! Lines don't go dead in power outages (cable does)...just need genny to power computer and modem/router.


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## melli

I do odd favors/barters/tasks/jobs for neighbors...like cutting grass, weed-whacking, plumbing and roofing repairs, electrical, cleaning, laundry, turning on heat so they don't have a cold cottage when they arrive in winter, but the one I always dislike is removing dead mice from traps...sometimes they've been dead for a while, and have mummified or carpenter ants have gathered around for a feast. Ick!

Anyways, one neighbor I do stuff for (mice patrol being one), sent me a text message...he said he left me a toy to play with, that was in his cottage closet...hmmm. I knew exactly what he was talking about! I had seen him play with his uber expensive drones and even got to try out his VR goggles (feels like your up in air flying around - can be a bit unsettling as the resolution is full HD). 

I take the drone home, but it was too late to play with, but I'm up til 2-3am inspecting it, and reading up on how to fly these things. This morning, I get up and down a cup of coffee and proceed to take a $1500 drone for a spin...:huh:
Ideally, one should get a cheap drone and practice before playing with an expensive one, as one will likely crash a few times before they acquire the skill set. So, here I am, firing this drone up and it has this button that does auto take-off. I rises to about 4ft, and is supposed to hover. Well, mine wasn't hovering...it was drifting towards the trees, so I toggle the altitude lever to get high enough so I won't drift into an 80ft Douglas Fir. My cellphone is hooked up to controller so I can see through the HD camera mounted on drone. It also displays the drone's status, like battery time remaining, and other important details. Well, it starts flashing red, telling me the compass is out of calibration. This is why it is drifting away (bye bye drone)! So, I try to bring it down without hitting any trees. I'm thinking, geesh, first flight and I'm going to roast this drone. I've never flown a drone before and the two toggles can be a bit awkward to the uninitiated. I had no clue...sure, the instructions tell you what they do, but until you get on a bike...

Wasn't a perfect landing, but a landing where nothing breaks is a good landing. I figure out how to calibrate compass and try again...but first, I needed to find a more open space and puff a few cigarettes. 

Take off number 2 went perfect...drone held stationary on auto takeoff, so I crank up altitude to max ceiling of 400ft (apparently, drones are limited from flying over 400ft lest they collide with real planes). Although the drone is rather large, at 400ft, it seems tiny, and being mostly white is hard to see in morning sun. 
I play with dials on controller that pan the camera wherever I want to see...take numerous pics, and HD videos. 
First pic is looking South (lakes, ocean), and second, is looking North (mountains). Then I look straight down at my place...doesn't look very good from above...
The south view gives me a perspective I've never had before...if I take out a few more trees, I might be able to get a southern partial view. Food for thought...must get drone down as it is beeping and talking to me (through cellphone), telling me my batteries are getting low. Without moving drone sideways for duration of flight...just rotation, I descend to the exact spot I took off from...how cool is that!:banana:
Well, I must take drone on woo-woo rides up into the hills and get some serious pics of the mountains and terrain in my hood. That North pic...that small mountain ridge in far background on far right side is the Caren Range, where I mostly go on my jaunts...be really hard to get lost with a drone as one can just fly above it all and survey the area....





















I've been very lucky to have such generous neighbors (and I have to thank them!)...let me see, I've been given a washer/dryer, a stove (SS two part job), kitchen cabinetry with the sink, greenhouse, tool chest...and now a drone...:kiss:


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## melli

Better Aerial shot of my homestead...


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## AmericanStand

melli said:


> View attachment 56261
> 
> View attachment 56262
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [/SIZE][/FONT]



Does anybody else see the wolf in this picture ? Try holding it upside down.


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## melli

I can't see it Americanstand...I sort of see a Raven...but since they bug me all day for peanuts...

I've put the drone away for a bit, pressure washed the deck of the guy who gave me the drone (trying to balance the ledger as it were...I'll need to do a lot more). His deck is what I call a pump killer. If one has to spend more than a hour pressure washing anything, one puts the pump under a lot of strain. I've already roasted one pressure washer pump on a neighbour's deck, and when I started on the guy's deck, I was thinking, geesh, I'll be here for hours and I'll roast the pump...and I was...3.5hrs to do 400sqft. And sure enough, my pressure washer pump decided to leave oil behind...thankfully, I caught it. I think it is just a bad seal on sight glass (I hope). 

It got me thinking about my Orange machine, my Husqvarna lawnmower's hydro-gear transmission oil hadn't been changed in ten years! oops. 
I cannot afford to replace a Hydrostatic Transaxle, so I went to work dissembling it. I have to remove transmission to change the oil, which means jacking it up, removing tires, linkages, bolts etc. Got it out, drained it, and refilled. As you can see in pics, I left it too long. 
However, once I got it back together, I could do burnouts. What a difference! Anyways, I recommend one not ignore their ride-em lawnmowers transmission. With so many toys, I feel like most of my time is spent changing oil. Hopefully, I'll get another ten years out of Husq...then maybe I can afford an electric one, if they ever come out with a good one. 
My grass sort of needs a cut...half dead, half alive thing...strange summer. Started off hot, then two months of rain/sun and cool temps, then late August we get a hot spell.


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## melli

I'll tone down the drone pics/vids, but I had to post this one last vid....

I need to work on my pan and tilt skills while flying drone. Rather hard when your staring at your phone (hooked up to controller so you see what drone is seeing), then looking up at drone, and if drone is facing you, the controls are in reverse. At any rate, made this vid of my bud swimming our usual route across lake (which is 700m from my homestead). We pretty much swim everyday, from May to October in the evening. She is a very good swimmer...me, not so much. I cheat, I use flippers. I needed a swim after this vid, as I was sweating something fierce with the thought one false move on controls, and I've just sunk a $1500 drone. I added a little music to vid, so put on audio. 

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9oq75W3tMPU[/ame]


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## melli

I am a picture hound...love them. In a discussion in another thread, we were chatting about sculpting an acreage and the work involved. 
My first 'homestead' makeover started almost ten years ago...in that case, I just got 1/2acre, but the developer included a newly built house. The development consisted of 40 or so cottages nestled on a hillside, each about 1/2 acre. I showed up late to the land rush, and although I could have got a view lot, I was interested in flat land. Flat land is rare around here. I wanted sun and a garden with fruit trees. Oh, and a lawn. My budget was very limited, and sometimes the ugliest looking lot in the development is the best, at the end of the day (was for me). Plus, it was cheap. The developer actually thought he'd have to turn the lot I bought into a communal garden plot, because if you look at the pics, it didn't have a lot going for it. My lot and two others on either side used to be a rock quarry. However, I loved that it was flat...that was something I could work with. With every other lot, to get anything flat required blasting, and oodles of money (5k per day). 
The first two pics were taken about two months after I moved in...
You can see some work was needed. I was thinking, what have I got myself into! Oh my, I couldn't even send pics to my family and friends...lol
The contractor felt sorry for my lot and actually planted maples for me, for free...I suspect I was depressing land values...lol
















Early spring, I managed to get a small line of credit and I got busy...first I had sort out property boundaries, as my neighbor felt my driveway was theirs...
Once we surveyed it, I got more land and my driveway back.
I then rock picked all the big boulders for a couple hours everyday for a few months. I arranged to get 10 loads of soil. My neighbors and I decided to get a 100 cedars...but to get them in the rocky ground, we needed an excavator. All the contractors were busy, so I stumbled onto a rental (Bobcat 331 - I own one now). I had to dig a hundred holes, and plant them. While I did that I spread the dirt I got and dug holes for garden posts. Spring of 2008 was go-go time. Within two years I went from wasteland, to my version of utopia. 








After all the landscape improvements, neighbors told me they regretted not buying my lot...they didn't 'see' it. 
One even sold their place because it was too much expense to blast their lot level to put in a garage! My neighbor to the North of me (see pic - one with pond - excavator beside it) was so impressed he got me to landscape his place. See finished result below. 







I was the only one with a garden for years, until I made one for a neighbor (my swimming partner and one who was in vid I posted earlier). I had sold my place by then and other than the acreage I own now, the first thing I bought was 'Bobby' - Bobcat 331.

Landscaping is a lot of work, and in some respects, I enjoy it more than building things...you get to see the fruits of your labor everyday, and watch it grow and morph into something spectacular. I still go to my old place, and the new owners enjoy my old place as much as I did. Those 6' cedars I planted are now approaching 20' high. The privacy they have now is incredible compared to the first pics I posted above. 
I also planted wild saplings I acquired on the roadside around the house, and they too are now huge.


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## melli

On the wet coast, it can be a challenge to get a clear view. This is from my neighbors deck (behind my place)...one of the few folks sitting on top of a big hill. And on sunny days, the view is breathtaking. But living on top of a small mountain has it's issues, like driving up it in winter after a snow, lack of flat areas to garden etc. Still, the view...picture doesn't capture how close those monster mountains are in distance. Pics make things seem farther away and flatter. 
Our volunteer fire department having a little fun...I need a sprinkler like that! One cycle of sprinkler, and that would do it...


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## melli

I really didn't want to take down anymore med-big trees, but this one had a lean, and the tree was leaning in direction of proposed woodshed site. 








So, in comes Bobby. I've rambled on about Bobby's prowess in taking down trees, and this was a textbook takedown. I dug out roots opposite side of where I want to fall tree...as you can see, it is a lot of rock, and the roots burrow in the cracks. But, with a little patience, I can use bucket teeth to rip out the bigger roots by pseudo 'sawing' them with the teeth, as some root endings will be left behind (some tap straight down).








I check the direction of fall by pushing on tree up high (looks like a cat's scratching post when I'm done). A huge chunk of ground wants to come up with root pan. Two baby cedars went along for the ride. Unfortunate, as I wanted to keep them, but their root system was intertwined with the Douglas Fir. 














Then, I ready my machine, full throttle and drive forward real quick, tipping the works over...I have to be careful the large root pan doesn't rip off hoses on it's way over, so I quickly raise boom and back up before the tree hits the forest floor with a thud. 








Once on ground, chainsawing the root ball off is easy peasy, and about as safe as one can get. What surprised me was the hallow core of tree! Very odd. I've got a few rotten cores, but never hollow. Well, glad it came down, as time or a fall windstorm would have brought it down soon enough. 
There must be something I can make with a hollow core....
















One of the biggest reasons I like having Bobby around for clearing is not the ability to fell trees (very nice of course), but to get out root ball/pan. A stump will stick around for decades up here. And by falling trees this way, I get the stump out, by using the tree's own leverage as it falls...I am only digging half a root pan out. Bobby has a grader on front to level everything afterwards, like it was never there...


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## melli

Odd, I got contacted by a casting producer to see if I would be interested in being on the show....felt I would be a good fit? :drum:

For starters, do I need rescuing??? 

Secondly, being on TV isn't why I found my little gem...eep:
I came to live off the land, find solitude and peace. An added bonus was the researching, land clearing (to a point) and building parts. Making stuff. 
Also, a day well spent to me, as of late, is spending a couple of hours in Bobby molding the landscape....I feel fulfilled (aside: I'm not just playing a video game in a machine. I do have to get out and chainsaw, pick up bits, load trailer, unload it, do maintenance on Bobby, chainsaw, etc etc.)

As for the first part, sure, things are not moving along as I'd hoped. I am ridiculously optimistic when it comes to timelines. If anyone had told me I would have to put in at least three winters in a RV, I would have bailed. It wasn't until this spring I actually felt at home, given the state of my property. There is so much to do...and money is always the sticking point. 

That being said, I haven't stalled. I am just not making the progress I envisioned. All of us Homesteaders probably feel the same way. The details of Homesteading can seem daunting, once you realize what they are...lol
Ignorance is bliss when I first started. Then once you get into it up to your neck, you have to keep going. I see myself nowhere else. I fancied thoughts of selling out and buying a condo or a house somewhere cheaper. But I wouldn't be happy. 

A friend, on a road trip, sent me an iconic postcard of a Vermont old timer sitting on his porch with roosters milling about on the grass. Although, his place looked a tad decrepit (being generous...lol), with a rusty freezer on porch, porch stairs about to crumble, and hastily hacked together porch tin roof, the old timer looked content. I do hope I find myself in better digs, but I do hope to be 80+ and sitting like he is, taking in the scenery, and farm animals milling about. 
Found pic! http://www.ebay.com/itm/Modern-View-Free-Range-Chickens-Old-Back-Country-Farm-Vermont-/291667764624

I haven't watched any episodes other than what they have youtube. 
I'll have to see if I get Discovery in my TV package. 

From what I've seen, those folks seem to be in dire straits. And a couple of them looked to be in way over their heads or picked absolutely the wrong locale. 

Then there is the idea of being on TV....hmmm....I moved out here to find solitude. Sure, I talk to the Ravens on a daily basis, and would likely do so if I had farm animals, but other than Kaw-Kaw back at me if I don't get them their peanuts quick enough, I don't feel that counts as 'face' time...lol
If I need that, I hang with a neighbor friend at the lake or visit another. 
Plus, it seems to me they want 'characters.' Folks who embellish their lot in life. 

At any rate, the casting producer never got back to me, so maybe they've dismissed me. 

Although, the idea they could somehow quicken the build of my shack would be enticing...
Then again, watching me curse and fret for days on end would get boring. Although, I wonder if they have experience building an ICF shack?


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## PermaAMP

First of all your area looks gorgeous. It makes me want to visit Canada. Secondly. A friend of mine was on the Homestead Rescue show. Unlike some of the others he doesn't regret it. Obviously some of what he said on the show was taken out of context and things slightly rearranged but overall he(and I) think it turned out fairly well. Things were not fixed exactly as he wished because let's face it. It's a TV show they really aren't there for you.

It's all based on you. Will you care what some people will say about you if the shows somehow makes you look a fool? Are you the type of person who can make sure you don't say or do some thing that could be misconstrued? Will you be willing to have them do things that aren't exactly how you pictured them if you would have done it yourself? I'm not sure if you saw the thread we had here. Somone from the show replied on their take. http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/ge...0-anyone-watch-new-homestead-rescue-show.html


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## melli

xymenah said:


> First of all your area looks gorgeous. It makes me want to visit Canada. Secondly. A friend of mine was on the Homestead Rescue show. Unlike some of the others he doesn't regret it. Obviously some of what he said on the show was taken out of context and things slightly rearranged but overall he(and I) think it turned out fairly well. Things were not fixed exactly as he wished because let's face it. It's a TV show they really aren't there for you.
> 
> It's all based on you. Will you care what some people will say about you if the shows somehow makes you look a fool? Are you the type of person who can make sure you don't say or do some thing that could be misconstrued? Will you be willing to have them do things that aren't exactly how you pictured them if you would have done it yourself? I'm not sure if you saw the thread we had here. Somone from the show replied on their take. http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/ge...0-anyone-watch-new-homestead-rescue-show.html


Yeah, I figured I'd be edited to look like a pumpkin missing a few seeds. 

As for speaking in forked tongue, that could be tough. Living in the sticks, one forgets 'city talk'. Who knows...I have a bad habit of using trash farm lingo...lol

Well, if they get back to me, we shall see. A BF called me and we came up with a good pitch...Melli must get into a concrete bunker shack before winter wind storms wreck havoc on her tin crush can RV. Huge trees abound everywhere...will it be that one or that one? Stay tuned...lol
Truth is, that is how I feel when the windstorms come, and I still have wind fallen trees in the forested part of my spread.....fallen monsters with root pans 20ft tall still grace the edges of my property. 

As for the 'picture'...that would have to be discussed for sure...


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## melli

Finally had a day off to head for the hills...with Buzzy (drone). Managed to get a shot of the Forest Fire Lookout (Historical site now) sitting atop Mt Hallowell. Last nice day of summer I expect...also ran into a bear up top. He was heading in the same direction I was...a real big fella. Watching him run, given his mass, pure shiny black coat, was something...eventually he took a left turn. If only he knew that one quick quick swipe with his paw, and Woo-woo (1978 Honda CT90) would stop puttering. Without Woo-woo, I doubt I would be the intrepid back country traveler that I am. Not only can it get me places, it tells all bears, cougars, wolves, to get lost. 
PS - I did some white balance filtering so one can see the inlets in background...









After that shot I headed back to base (I was at abondoned copper mine), but took this one looking east of Sechelt Inlet, and Narrows Inlet. I'm told the water color is unusual because of some type of algae bloom. 









And this one is looking back from Mt Hallowell...I am station at that light tan blotched on second rise. 








My homestead is to the right in the lowlands. You can see a cut line made by the big powerlines...as it goes right, it veers around a ridge. I am just over that ridge.
My next stop was to see the waterfall coming off the Caren Range that I can see from my home...unfortunately, being the tail end of summer, the waterfall was a trickle...and the pics were less than ideal. Took me a day to recover from that trip...I am getting smarter in using my legs to absorb the punishment of the 'trails', but I guess age is catching up to me. It feels like I need knee replacement surgery. At least my back didn't suffer...


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## melli

Being the weekend, and a beautiful Sunday morning, I figure I ought to some yard work. Put in a few hours before the afternoon games start (big NE Fan...sorry). 
So, I am thinning out the small cedars, which doesn't require Bobby. Everything is going swimmingly, until I get the bright idea to take out a tree I've been meaning to take down for some time (get a corridor view of Caren Range waterfall). Problem is, it is on a slope (kind of a cliff). As Bobby can't access it, I have to do it the old fashioned way. So, I trundle down this slope, and scope it out. It isn't particularly tall...maybe 80ft. I actually have a pic of it...








The tree sits right on the edge of the outcropping. On the far side, it drops straight down about 10ft to another outcropping (about 100ft down in all). I want to fall it to the left, as the crown won't get caught up in anything. So, there I am on this precarious ledge doing my wedge cut, and my chainsaw starts smoking. The oiler is plugged. So I clean it up, and finish wedge cut (I am sweating now, because climbing up and down with chainsaw does that...). I do felling cut very carefully, as I am on this ledge with no real escape route once this sucker falls. I spend some time making a route to the right, hacking brush and branches. I figure I'll play it safe, and not do a chainsaw fell cut until tree falls. I'll stop, and wedge it. By wedging, one can make sure tree falls in the right direction and can hear it start to crackle (more time to escape). 
I put in wedge and pound away...nothing! I am soaked. I pound some more, still nothing. Darn, I guess I never did a deep enough fell cut. My options are limited...can't get wedge out to chainsaw anymore, and being in precarious position (balancing on boulders), I am spent. So, I give up. Don't like the idea of leaving a tree ready to fall, but I need a swim/wash. 
What I'll probably have to do, is tomorrow, rope it up and drive Bobby over my nicely landscaped yard so he can pull on tow rope. Bugger. gre:

Or maybe wait for a windstorm to take it down...lol
Just take a small breeze I'm sure...I'll probably hear a thud overnight...
Thankfully, it isn't where anybody would accidentally walk by, unless they are Ninjas, rock climbers coming to pay me a visit. Man, that really rankles me! Ugh. A nice day too...


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## melli

After my flurry of 'Bobby rampage', I have some firewood for sale. It helps defray some of the costs of running Bobby (Diesel hog), and it appears I need some chainsaw parts. 
If you live in a forested area with a winter, and your clearing, fire wood sales can add up. Folks really go for the 'rounds'. They save a few bucks as I don't charge full freight (split wood price), and most folks have those plug in hydraulic splitters. Within hours of posting on Craigslist, I had some folks pick some up, and tomorrow, I have two large trucks coming in morning. :nanner:
Every little bit counts. 
Have my place pretty much winterized as far as windstorm potential goes...last winter I had a few larger trees threatening my tin can RV or my tarp sheds.


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## ForestToFarm

melli said:


> After my flurry of 'Bobby rampage', I have some firewood for sale. It helps defray some of the costs of running Bobby (Diesel hog), and it appears I need some chainsaw parts.
> If you live in a forested area with a winter, and your clearing, fire wood sales can add up. Folks really go for the 'rounds'. They save a few bucks as I don't charge full freight (split wood price), and most folks have those plug in hydraulic splitters. Within hours of posting on Craigslist, I had some folks pick some up, and tomorrow, I have two large trucks coming in morning. :nanner:
> Every little bit counts.
> Have my place pretty much winterized as far as windstorm potential goes...last winter I had a few larger trees threatening my tin can RV or my tarp sheds.
> View attachment 57146


Great idea. We have piles of logs everywhere. I may just have to give this a try.


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> Great idea. We have piles of logs everywhere. I may just have to give this a try.


If you live in an area where folks use wood stoves/fireplaces to heat in winter, I can pretty much guarantee you be able to make a buck selling rounds. And if you have a splitter, you can make even more...you and your Dad? seem motivated from what I've read on your thread, so bucking up the logs you cannot use in building stuff will pay dividends. I put an ad on Craigslist. I have regulars now, so it was silly easy this time around...I sold out in 18hrs! No kidding. Folks in the biz, sell bucked and split fir delivered for about $225-$250/cord. I sell U-pick rounds for $1/cubic foot. Which is about half the split delivered price. A typical truck with 5x6 box with 2' high load is $60 (unseasoned Fir is heavy, so a big truck is needed for those looking to go crazy). 
They fill up, I pull out tape measure, and add it up. Everybody has been very happy with the arrangement. 
I kept the names and numbers of those who bought in spring, and just texted them this fall. Didn't really need CL ad. 
One regular who was tardy in replying said they will come by in spring and watch me fell trees, as they missed out this time around...lol
Best. Melli


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## melli

ForesttoFarm - one thing I've surmised, is many folks have chainsaws, but few actually use them to buck firewood. You've got this machine spinning a chain with teeth at god knows how fast, and it can be extremely dangerous. Folks are put off by it, especially if they have experienced kick back or a close call etc. Folks out here, have no problem operating a hydraulic splitter...not much danger using a plug in splitter. 
I hate splitting. Plus, I have no desire to load my truck and deliver...back breaking work. At least with Bobby, I can hold a log up high, so I am not stooping to cut. Still, the fumes and dust annoy me...lol
But, to be able to get rid of the pecker poles, and make a buck doing it, it is worth it. 
Long ago, I would invite folks to come and get it for free (buck it up themselves)...I actually had a harder time getting rid of the timber for free than I do now selling it bucked...lol. 
Wish I aware of that back then...


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## Tomjracer

Melli any progress on the septic permit?


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Melli any progress on the septic permit?


I didn't mention that I got it approved? Yeah, the engineer finally filed the septic and I got confirmation...another step done. I need that to even file a permit to build....that was key. 
Still waiting for engineer to give me stamped plans back...that is the last piece of the bureaucratic puzzle I need to get a permit to build.


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## melli

I suspect there are many folks out there who dreamed of homesteading but time slipped by and it was not to be. I still keep in touch with the original owner of the plot of land that I now own. He bought it from the developer who punched a road in through our neighborhood. Back then, in late 80's/early 90's, my area was a backwater (maybe it still is...haha). Well, the developer went bankrupt from what I heard, because he had to build a bridge across a salmon bearing stream/creek. It is no ordinary bridge...it spans a gorge (a good 100ft down to creek). Solid bridge! Cost him close to a million dollars back then...
And all along the road, he just punch in driveways to 5 acre+ woodland lots, of which, the previous owner of my place, now in his 80's, bought one. Well, time slipped by for him, and his wife was concerned about wildlife, especially black bears. So my piece of paradise sat. 
Since it took several years to consummate the deal (I explained the situation in earlier posts), I got to know John. By then his wife was very ill and his dream of homesteading this plot had passed him by. 

I sort of feel an obligation to keep him in the loop as my place unfolds. Not a burden at all, as I understand he wanted to do what I am doing now. I feel this is his dream too. 

So, once ever year or so, John visits my neighbors with whom he keeps in touch, and I promptly invite them over to have a look at my progress. I enjoy showing John around, and explaining what I've done, and what still needs to be done. I think he lives vicariously through me. I think this year was a shock to him, as the place doesn't look like a bomb crater, and is carpeted in grass...a huge park. He still remembers the big boulders (erratics), and the game trail that once went through here. We talked homesteading 'shop talk', and my mini excavator...lol. 

In spirit, I still consider my place to be partly his...I bet he will be by next year to peruse my progress. It gives this place a 'history' to have him come around. 

He is the one on the left:








I had to go in to Vancouver for an appointment...I absolutely dread the trips into the city, as it consumes the whole day (takes me almost 4hrs to get there, as I have to drive a ways, plus take a ferry). Vancouver has become a metropolitan city, always busy. Roads are congested 24/7. And Vancouver, being the home of the founders of Greenpeace, has a California type mentality that roads are evil because polluting cars use them. So, the city grew, but they resisted putting in any highways. One of the few cities of the world, where there is not one highway going through Vancouver proper. So, one has to drive through residential streets to get anywhere...argh!
Don't get me wrong, Vancouver is my birth home and was my home town for most of my life. In the last century, it was livable. It actually got quiet at night (shut down). Now, it hums 24/7. Probably not as hectic as New York, but close. This is a shot of one of the main intersections (Granville and Georgia), as I was high-tailing it out of town. Vancouver is probably one of the most picturesque cities of the world. However, a city can be beautiful, but if it chaotic and noisy, it is the antithesis of what I need...peace....lol


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## melli

I thought I'd have to find someone else, and kiss 2 months of waiting down the drain. Seems he is so swamped with work, he forgets jobs...lol
I thought he was ignoring me since I started to text/email/phone him repeatedly as of late. So, I can relax...go for a dip in the lake. 

Foresttofarm got me thinking about Bobby, and the costs involved renting a machine...not a good deal by any stretch. Unless one has a specific task that needs doing, and doing it by hand is not feasible, then sure, rent one. The costs do add up...I rented a machine several times, and at the beginning, they never cared how many hours I put in...later on they did. Plus, I used to get it on Friday, rent it for one day, but in reality I had it for the whole weekend and I'd be pedal to metal (they didn't do machine pickups on weekend). 

The real blessing of owning a machine is not being rushed. When you rent, your trying to squeeze every hour out of it. 

Moving on, I did some maintenance on Bobby today...the guy I bought it from gave me three buckets (very handy), but the main toothed bucket I use (30"), he welded on the teeth (doh). So, when they break off, I lose them easily. Plus, they were of poor design. You want teeth with two prongs that slip over bucket edge, with two bolts! I never lose teeth and they rarely break (stronger). What happens, is a bolt will snap, and it is easy to see, and even easier to repair. I keep spare bolts handy. Slowly, I've been retrofitting toothed buckets with two prong teeth. 







I then adjusted Bobby's main relief valve...love that I can 'mod' pressures...
Felt I wasn't getting enough bucket force, so I amped up the pressure (still within specs...finger pointing at diagnostic port, and right behind it, is the main relief....







We also had some serious rain, but my 320ft Big O drain line sucked it all up...pic of grate...I have three of them. 







My main firewood hog (I mean that in jest...I tell him I have firewood, he comes running over) came over and got the last of the arbutus logs I had lying about...plus, he took the spoilage from Alaskan mill millings. Appreciate that, as it means less stuff in the slash pile. 
Then I had to show him my drone...wasted half the day...wanted to excavate today...just anything. Oh well, there is always tomorrow. Once you have an Iron Man suit, you just feel like using it now and then. 
This is a drone pic from way up high, of my place...just a speck...lol
For some strange reason the drone maker allows higher flights...it auto updates on my phone. Not going to argue, as it was a bugbear being limited to 300ft or so, given I live in mountainous terrain.


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## melli

First, want to wish all those in the SE to keep safe with Matthew bearing down. Hurricanes are nasty things...had the 'pleasure' of working the gulf coast (LA) at the turn of the century, we had a few hurricanes pass by...and they passed by because we ran inland. The surge would flood the coast before we saw the first cloud!

Last night, I had a nap, get up and see we have wind warning! I am ###! 
I had no chance to do anything, as it was dark. Not much I could do, except it would have been nice to pull out genny and get it ready (I had it buried behind behind all my toys). I have two tarp sheds, one for power equipment, and the other for materials. Well, the material shed exploded...







Well, it was a doozy. Max winds near 70mph. Of course, power went out. Nothing like hearing a forest sound like a freight train as each gust would sway Douglas Firs (over a 100ft tall) like a blade of grass. Their branches would mingle with other trees, and the sound is totally unnerving, especially when in a tin can RV. I knew I was safe in RV, as I did a pretty good job removing the monsters that could slice me in half. But hearing all the racket doesn't make for a good sleep. Thankfully, the temps were rather high, so no need to keep genny going all night. Had to take a knock out sleeping pill to get some semblance of sleep. 

But losing a shed really sucks. Spent the day driving to town to buy a new one ($350). I didn't want to spend another penny on tarp sheds. It is wasted money to me. I don't have the area I want to put a woodshed in leveled yet, so I can't rush ahead with that. With another rain event approaching, I need cover pronto. To top it off, the equipment tarp shed has rips...hmmm. And we get the worst storms in November. Even BC Hydro was caught off guard...

Driving to town I noticed several enterprising individuals bucking up the deadfall that fell across the roads. In a bad storm, we can get hundred or so fallen trees across roads, but we have a hundred or so folks with chainsaws eager to buck them up...easy pickings. Much easier than heading to cutblocks in hills. Roads are cleared by the time I finish my morning coffee...lol

So, as I researched tarp sheds this morning, I see some folks have converted them from tarp to metal sheds...buy a few sheets of thin ply, brace shed with 2x and clamps, then throw on some tin. Some nice jobs when I googled it. But, it is money...would rather put it into a real shed. 
I think I am going to see about getting a wood shed built sooner than later...

BTW - that yellow tarp shed survived 3 or 4 years before it blew up. Looks like it ripped seam right at peak, front to back. I installed a $1000 tarp shed for a neighbor, and it is still going strong after 6 years+. Forget name of company, but it is all in the fabric...hers is very thick and slightly rubberized. They had promo videos of folks standing on it. 
Probably should have bought that one...
The key, other than getting one with good fabric, is to have it anchored like no tomorrow. Too often I see tarp sheds sail away...even my building inspector neighbor had his flip because he never anchored it well enough (I screw/bolt it into scrap PT 2x10's (2 layers), then I have about a ton of weight sitting on those PT boards - I have lots of hardi end cuts, and concrete weights sitting on them). I remind him about it...lol
Not much one can do when fabric rips...


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## melli

Well, it looks like we have a few days of sun...those will be in short supply on the wet coast. Shame I have to waste them on building yet another tarp shed. I cleared the land where shed will go...the bugbear is that will be location for my monster woodshed/carport. I changed location of proposed woodshed...more central and out of the trees (trees in pics are on west side - windstorms come from the east). Was hoping I could snuggle it up to well shed, and leave enough room to build woodshed...likely won't happen. 
Oh well, should head outside and build the bloody thing. I got three lumber wrap 'tarps' from the local lumber store...they are cheap (free), and they are perfect to put on floor, so one is not putting their junk on dirt. 















Obligatory Arial view...









After using Bobby to clear and level spot, I decided to do the full oil change (engine and Hydraulics), plus put in 5 new filters....what a disaster that was...oil everywhere. Trying to catch hot oil coming out of pump was pointless. Well, there will be no repeat. I put a quick disconnect on pump, had a hose made up with a male end, so next time I can just plug in a hose and put it in bucket. Then engine came OEM with a similar setup...but for some reason they figured one wouldn't need one for hydraulics, and the five gallons (20 liters) of oil spurting out hole....doh!


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## melli

These things are tedious....Well, I better get a move on as the weather forecasters issued a warning of an impending storm cycle this Wednesday night. Guess that means weeks of wind and rain...hmmm
Rather early start this year...
It was Thanksgiving up here today, so my trucker go-to guy wasn't working. I was thinking I ought to get a couple loads of fill (AKA - screened sand or 3/8" minus - drains well and isn't muddy - very little silt or clay) - while it is still dry out. One to put under and around tarp shed, and the other as a base for my shack home (get it out of the way...plus the rain will settle and compact it). See if he shows up tomorrow, otherwise I'll just slap tarp shed together and fill it up. Going to be tight....









Speaking of fill, those in areas without wonderful native soil like ForesttoFarm should really visit their local gravel pit. Since I've gotten 200 loads or so over the years (this place and my old place), I make seasonal visits to our local pits (2) and peruse their offerings. You get to know the pit operators, and sometimes you can score some primo dirt....lol
Sound like an addict. But when your raking rubble, you really appreciate a load of fine dirt. I like 'Fill' because it is easy to work with. Many years ago, a pit boss suggested I take a couple loads of pit run 4" (basically, hardball to softball rocks), as a base, since it was cheap. What a mistake! Unless you have a hole that you never plan to dig up, then maybe. Of course, I've been digging up that crap and there is nothing one can do with it. Rocks are too hard to crunch, and impossible to level. Imagine trying to level a dump truck full of baseballs....you get the idea. 
And sometimes, one of them will crush rock, and make some fine gravel (3/4"), which is always nice up here (great for driveways). Crushed gravel rock is the best, as the rock has jagged edges, and will compact nicely on a driveway. But it has enough gaps to drain water, and resists being washed away. 
Well, I hope the trucker surprises me in the morning with a couple of loads...I only go with this one guy because he always brings full loads. I've used other truckers only to be disappointed with 2/3 or 3/4 loads. One guy came up my driveway on first load and his truck was steaming...ah! Man, did I feel ripped off. Not only that, I was buying primo material, so it was a double hit. He made some stupid remark about my driveway being steep. I'm 5 miles from pit...if one's truck can't handle that, fix the truck, don't blame my driveway. /rant


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## oldtruckbbq

Love the pics with the drone. I hadn't thought of that before, but it is a really neat way to view your progress and get an idea of what the place looks like without having to wait for Google Earth to update, lol.


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## ForestToFarm

oldtruckbbq said:


> Love the pics with the drone. I hadn't thought of that before, but it is a really neat way to view your progress and get an idea of what the place looks like without having to wait for Google Earth to update, lol.


Agreed!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Love the pics with the drone. I hadn't thought of that before, but it is a really neat way to view your progress and get an idea of what the place looks like without having to wait for Google Earth to update, lol.


Yeah, Google Earth is a couple years behind on Arial imagery...Bing is about one year behind...
Drone does make for a interesting platform to take pics of one's homestead, especially if they have larger acreage than I. Plus, it helps if one doesn't have a forest. Even though I've cleared a fair chunk, I am still a nervous nelly when doing low flights, so I just crank up the altitude so I am well clear of trees. I got a pair of Blitzwolf goggles, which makes a huge difference in the ability to navigate down low. Lighting has to be good though. 
Done a couple of a low fly arounds my property. Haven't uploaded to Youtube yet...actually, I want to do another flight where it is more seamless (no stopping and quicker). But, my time is taken up with the tarp shed business right now...rains coming tonight...
I am totally biased, but I love my locale. It's just these four months coming up that can be a drag (clouds and rain). When sunny, there is no better place in the world (green oasis with mountains, lakes and ocean). When cloudy, windy and rainy, with short winter days, this place can be the most depressing. Take the good with the bad I guess...


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## melli

Just as I zipped the tarp shed door closed, the first rain drops fell. What a haul...3 days to build that inferno, and pull out and sort through all my junk in destroyed tarp shed, and re-arrange shed storage. I have one shed for power equipment, and one for building materials/everything else. 

I need to do a big dump run. I have a habit of keeping building materials from jobs, thinking I could use them down the road. Full length dimensional lumber is a keeper, but a roof vent for a shingle roof isn't...lol. I'll never do a shingle roof again. 

Shame I wasted three beautiful days on a tarp shed. Really wanted to pull out woo-woo and do a mountain run. That being said, nice to see stuff organized a bit better. Even stumbled on stuff I forgot I had....wouldn't call myself a hoarder, as I do go through purges now and then, but I do seem to have a lot crap. 

I got my fill (washed sand), but it came too late to put under shed. Bummer. My trucker went to one pit, and he called to tell me the stuff I wanted is too mucky (this is another reason why I like him...if it looks shady, he won't deliver it to me). And so I decided to get the pit run (stuff straight out of the hill), but the pit excavator battery was dead! That pit is going sideways...I feel bad for my trucker as he wasted an hour messing around trying to get me some stuff. So, next day, I go to other pit, and see the very nice washed sand, but he wanted a king's ransom for it...bleh. 
He gave me a slight discount, so I got two loads sitting in my yard. I love having fresh piles of dirt for Bobby to play with. Nothing better....lol
And playing with sand is so easy. I'll have them both knocked down and spread in an hour. Plus, being washed sand, it'll covers nice, and drains very well...no puddles. One pile will be the base for my shack home. The other a base for my eventual woodshed/carport. I can't build that until I get a permit for my shack home...bureaucratic nonsense. It is the only reason I am stuck with tarp sheds (they are considered temporary structures - no kidding!). 














Had some old hood neighbours show up and get some firewood...he is a firewood prepper...I don't think he will be satisfied until he has a decade or two supply of it. I find it mildly amusing considering he has no place to store it (1/2 acre lot, but only a 1/3 of it accessible). But if we have Armageddon, he will be prepared to keep his cosy cottage warm. eep:
Reminds me of a gold miner...mention firewood, and his eyes light up...lol


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## oldtruckbbq

My wife is that way with toilet paper. Not necessarily a bad thing, but it can take up a lot of space!

I hadn't thought about the tarp sheds. We need something for storing outdoor gear but don't want to invest a lot on a property we are renting until we get our own place. It wouldn't be so hard to take a tarp shed down and move it to our place.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> My wife is that way with toilet paper. Not necessarily a bad thing, but it can take up a lot of space!
> 
> I hadn't thought about the tarp sheds. We need something for storing outdoor gear but don't want to invest a lot on a property we are renting until we get our own place. It wouldn't be so hard to take a tarp shed down and move it to our place.


I used to really stock up on canned sockeye salmon when it was cheaper. Doesn't take up a lot of space, lasts a long time, and is a great standby for lunch and dinner. But now, the world is taking it all, and prices have doubled. 

I have moved my tarp sheds by towing them with excavator, but I build them on skids of sorts (long 2-2x8/2x10). It negates me having to anchor them, and I can stack heavy stuff on edges to 'anchor' them even more. I use lags and metal conduit brackets to hold legs into wood. 

As for moving them to another property...hmmm...doable for sure, but a lot of work. 

If anyone is looking at a the best tarp shed I have come across, and I even installed one for a neighbor, it is this one:
http://www.cover-tech.com/portablegaragepics.htm

This is the tarp shed I was blabbing about where a person could stand on top when complete. 
It is all about the fabric, and these ones have a heavy duty rubberized fabric (very heavy - I had to enlist strong armed help just to pull it over frame). My neighbors tarp shed is perched on a hill, and it has see many wind storms (5yrs with no issues). I did make her a concrete pad to sit it on, and so, was able to anchor it into concrete. 
This is a pic from their site of the exact size I installed for my neighbor. 








It is about double or so, the price of the cheap ones I get from Canadian Tire (Shelter-Logic - Chinese made). I got 4 yrs out of the yellow one before it exploded. The new one I got is from same company but has a thicker fabric. I already have the exact same one placed elsewhere on property, and quite honestly, I can see it lasting 4-5yrs before it rips to shreds (it is about 2-3 yrs old and has small rips on corners). I think the lack of strong UV protection degrades fabric, then the winds do the rest. Time will tell. 
I could have ordered a new cover for yellow one ($200), but time was of the essence...


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## melli

A couple weeks ago, I noticed a rather large deposit from a bear. Normal stuff, grass, berries etc. After last night's windstorm, which is still upon us, I decided to do a walkabout to see if any trees had fallen. I had one little guy fall...no biggie, as I probably would have taken it down since it was too long and skinny. Then I stumble upon this:








Poor bear...that must have been a bowel movement. Odd, as most folks around here have figured out if you leave garbage out and about, a bear, coyote, raven, racoon will eat and leave said garbage strewn all over one's yard. This bear must have been suffering. 
I thought maybe the bugger had broken into my electrical shed, but I don't buy Dairyland milk. Still, I had to check my shed. Nope, the double lock on door has not failed me yet. Plus, the shed is fully insulated and sealed. Although, one winter I noticed bear paw prints on door....thankfully, they are not that savvy to realize if they put all 300+pds of their weight to use, they could break down the door.


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## melli

The hardest thing for me to bear is windstorms in a RV. Power outages, no problem, but it is tough to relax when it sounds like half the forest is going to topple. Storm came through last night (100kmph gusts). I had a couple of small trees topple in my forested area. Was concerned whether my new tarp shed was anchored well enough. It passed the test. 
And of course, the power went out last night...still out. Thankfully, my generator is up to the task. Nothing special, a Coleman 6875watt job. But it does have a Honda GX 390 engine, which is a reliable starter, and it goes and goes. As I mentioned in an earlier thread, having fibre optic is a godsend. Even with power out, and genny on, I get TV and Internet (Fibre optic line doesn't need power unlike a coax cable). Sort of helps to have TV volume on high, to muffle the freight train noise outside. 
















Had to get more gas, so I stopped at a park with a salmon bearing stream. Was too murky to take pics of fish. They are starting to run. In a day or so the creek will calm down and be much clearer. I could see a few monsters hugging the edge of creek. I guess they were waiting it out to swim upstream and spawn.


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## melli

As you can see, my yellow tarp shed is no more...the area has been sterilized...lol
Even though I saw it's destruction as a curse, time and money, there is always a silver lining...that tarp shed was in the way, and I had too much crap. Felt good to purge...albeit, almost a thousand pounds at dump cost a penny. Still, I have a nice clear area that will be suitable for my keeper logs. That is one bugbear of mine, having to move stuff around. If you are starting from scratch, try to find an area your absolutely positive your not going to build on or develop, and use that as your temp storage spot. I've collected thousands of pounds of scrap lumber (scaffolding, concrete forms material etc) and having to move it once a year gets old. 







Since I did a complete oil and filter change on Bobby, I decided to 'push' the tree line back a bit this morning. The last series of windstorms cemented the idea that tall skinny 100fters do not belong anywhere near my buildings. Plus, my woodshed/storage shed location needed some breathing room (going beside/on where grey tarp shed is). I figure a 16x20-24' carport style shed ought to do (might enclose a portion of it). For reference, that grey tarp shed is 10x20. 







Nice to see my 320' of drainage tile is working like a charm...can see the greenish blotch (drain grate location) and trail of a bit of it...it goes all the way back through the trees. I used to get huge puddles that would fester for weeks. Now, within 2 hours after a heavy rain, no puddles!


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## Breezy833

Were all the big rocks on the property already?


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## melli

Breezy833 said:


> Were all the big rocks on the property already?


Yep...the 2-4' diameter ones (ones stacked side by side each other in pic) were dug out of the bedrock (fractures on hillside). There are 3 erratics (glacial term for boulders left behind after last age). They are monsters...Bobby can only roll/push those ones. Thankfully, the glacial action rounded them somewhat, so they roll fairly well. The biggest has to be 7 tons. You can see one in above pic behind the RV. 

I've been collecting the smaller ones as I clear...hopeful to get a nice collection of stackable ones (flat sides) for a retaining wall on the south side. 

Actually had a neighbor ask me if I wanted to part with them...lol
"No friggin way"...lol. BTW - It costs a lot to truck in retaining wall rocks. 

Might get around to building that south side retaining wall over winter...just need a couple more good ones.


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## melli

Sunny days start to become a rarity around here...haha







And of course, I can't pass up a pic of heavy equipment doing their thing on 'my' lake. In summer the road side becomes a parking lot of folks stopping to take a dip. Over time, they erode the banks. This particular section of lake isn't all that deep, but around corner, the lake is almost to asphalt. One has to be careful parking near waters edge there, or they may never see their car again (almost 100ft vertical drop to lake bottom). I suppose they would scuba dive for it, given the lake is a muni water source. 
Only one reason I'd want a monster excavator, is they crunch rocks pretty well. My Bobby does a little crunching, but nothing like what you see in pic. That one is probably just a 20 ton model, but the metal tracks and heavy duty buckets can really pulverize rock. But a big machine comes big headaches if anything goes wrong. For instance, you need another excavator (to lift parts) just to change an idler (similar to an auto wheel rim and hub opposite end from drive motor). Parts are too heavy to lift by hand.







Story: When I first came up here, we had a 'winter'. Heavy wet snow...about a foot. Well, me being me, had to drive around to take in the sights. I had chains on, and I was crawling (hills are like toboggan runs). Well, I pass a lake beside to one above, and I do a double take. I see two red lights under the water! I stop. It took me a sec to process what I was seeing. It was the taillights of a truck. I jump out of car, and see what is up. Two elderly folks are swimming to shore. They get to the steep muddy bank, and we pull them up (some young guys had stopped to). Needless to say, they were in shock. Water was near freezing.
I take the woman, and haul her to my car. I asked her to strip buck naked. I always carry a blanket in car. I wrap her in that, and sit her in front seat, with heat on full blast. Within a few minutes, she is composed/warmer and the boys take them home. Being in a two wheel drive truck, they fishtailed into lake. The next truck they bought was a 4x4. 
I pity the guy that had to fish the truck out of lake...they must have got a scuba guy to hook up chains to it.

For context, this pic was about the time of the truck plunge into lake (should note it seems to happen that about once a year a vehicle becomes a sub in our neighborhood). This stretch of road always sees cars in ditch. Doesn't look steep in pic, but this section is treacherous. After a good snowstorm, one can see half a dozen cars off the road, some on purpose, some not. Even a sand truck got stuck on this section. We don't get the killer cold temps of the interior, but occasionally, it gets cold enough the wet snow freezes on road, giving an icy bottom, topped with wet snow. Once you start sliding, it is game over...


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## melli

Was looking to clean up the area south of proposed wood shed. Moved the pile of slash, bucked up the timber I felled, and did a fairly quick rock planter island. 
As Forrest Gump said, "Life is a box of chocolates and you don't know what your going to get." (something like that). Same applies to rocks dug out of hillside. They fracture differently, and they have slightly different composition which muddles how they fracture. 
If you get pit rocks, they sort them and you usually get nice rocks, with at least two flat sides. Given I get mine from property I have to use what I get. Sort of going for the organic look...lol
Although, sometimes I get some really nice ones, almost perfect rectangular cubes. I save those for the walls (only doing two on property). 
Will get around to pressure washing the bedrock...will look a tad better. And once I plant something in rock planter, it will definitely look better....


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## po boy

Looking good!


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## painterswife

Is that Hotel or Garden Bay Lake. Looks like Hotel but it has been a while. Spent a lot of time in both lakes in my teens.


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## melli

painterswife said:


> Is that Hotel or Garden Bay Lake. Looks like Hotel but it has been a while. Spent a lot of time in both lakes in my teens.


GB Lake....everyone has to drive around it, if they live on North Side. 
The road crew (and I have no idea why they are responsible for it) just did some improvements to the lake edges, and put in new public docks! Really about time, as the old ones were growing things, and half submerged. 
Then they put in another 'Painted Turtle' nesting site. Seems those guys are making a come back. You have to come up one summer....:nanner:


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## melli

I'm sure many of you homesteaders have had to clear out forest undergrowth, and have noticed how much bloody slash there is...I spent hours clearing out behind my latest tarp shed yesterday, and today, I wanted to have 'fun'. 
So, my mission today, was to trail-blaze using Bobby. I wasn't going to get cute picking up slash...just toss it aside and motor on. My forested area is on a north slope, and it is maturing. If I was around in a hundred years or so, this area would be dominated by monsters, and the undergrowth would be minimal as the survivors would have choked out everything on the forest floor. 

Since my forest hasn't fully matured, there are areas where I have stands of dead trees, that didn't quite make the cut (starved of light or they grew on bedrock and then ran out of water). Makes them dangerous...tall dead spires can crumble like daggers. Had to be careful when I pushed them over...

I was aiming for the corner of property (didn't make it as I ran up to the edge of a small cliff). I doubled back taking a different route. I can't just put the blade down and drive (just on small portions), as I run into sloping bedrock along with pockets of dirt. I scrounge dirt to make the path stable for Bobby. While slow, it was fun tooling into the deep dark reaches of my property...and now, I can walk through it without having to bushwhack. I still have one more area to blow a path through, and tie into driveway...for another day. That is the funnest part of having Bobby...being able to bushwack in a comfortable way...no sweat, no exhaustion, just grabbing chunks of forest and slinging it out of the way. Taking out trees is work, even with Bobby, as once I fell a tree, I have to chainsaw it up and haul the timber and slash. But today, the dead trees just crumbled or I used the thumb to snap them into bits and toss them aside. I don't think I had to take out one live tree today. 
I sort of discovered I have some monsters on the dark side...nice to see. Will be a great place to go for a walk in the heat of summer. I am not one to meditate, but I'm sure walking among the giants will bring calm. 

BTW - I have Douglas Fir (bark - thick dark scaly ones), and Western Red Cedars (lighter and sinewy bark). There are a couple of Hemlocks in the mix, but I usually knock them down as most of them are dead and they are not a strong tree (prone to 'topping'). Down by road, I have a couple monster Maples. Up top, I have a mess of Arbutus trees (they only grow within about 8km of the ocean -odd ancient Mediterranean tree - only broad-leaf evergreen tree in Canada - called Madronas/Madrones in the USA). 






















Eventually, I'll either use mulch or fill to level the trail and make it inviting...


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## melli

Felt like years...but I finally got all the bureaucratic papers together and filed for a permit. I will get the 'Yellow' sign in a few weeks. 

I've filed a lot of permits in my life, but the new regs are attempting to discourage owner-builders. The hoops are expensive, time consuming and silly. No wonder we have thousands of folks living in mobile home parks, RV parks, and are building tiny homes on wheels....

*To sum up the requirements for my neck of the woods:*

Had to apply for a owner-builders license $450 (now, one has to write a test, most of which has nothing to do with building, but instead is focused on testing your knowledge of the new rules....lol). 

Sewage Filing Form - $1000+ - need to show proof of septic before you can get a permit (btw - it was close to 15k to build my own)

Fill out multi page Muni (County) form (Free!) stating I will not hold the muni responsible for my screw-ups, not hold them liable for any conceivable issue that might arise. Which begs the question why I need a permit....

Proof of Liability insurance of engineer...

3 copies of building plan with load bearing detail - $1600
(it should be noted this was not always a requirement...but apparently, gov is risk adverse after being sued by homeowners for something an engineer designed...baffles me). BTW - I drew up my plans in Excel and the engineer was going to use it as is, but felt the muni needed some finer details, hence the three month delay. For a real home, one could expect to pay 10k. 

3 copies of site plan showing building site and all outbuilding, driveways etc., with measurements to your neighbors property line (setback requirements being the key thing here) - Free! I did it myself....some folks will be required to get a survey $2k. 

Certificate of Title showing any easements, covenants etc... $20

Once I start building, I will need to get an electrical ($500) and plumbing permit ($?), plus I will be inspected at every stage by both the building inspector and engineer...

In a few weeks, I will get a call from muni saying my permit is ready for pickup...I will then be hit with yet another fee ~ $400

To be honest, I 'almost' got off easy...some folks will have to get a geotech report if they are building on a hill (several thousand dollars), and/or get an archeological team courtesy of First Nations to oversee foundation build. 

-------------------------------------------------------------

To me, the 'rough' stuff is behind me...building it, will be easy....lol
Albeit, I have little money left...:huh:

For some reason I was feeling the weight of the above...in a few days, I can focus on building something...yah! 

May sound odd, but it has been a while since I've fell asleep dreaming of building details...looking forward to that. One of the best remedies for an insomniac.


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## melli

Not exactly sure what type of salmon is running the local (main) creek, but whatever (sockeye, chum, coho, pink), they are lining up for the last push of their life. So odd to know they will never come back...a one way trip. 

There is a park about a kilometer from ocean, which has good viewing access. Wish I had my 'rental' doggie with me, although I'd be quartered and hung if my dog was seen playing with fish (he doesn't hurt them). I ask my doggie if he wants to see 'fish' and he knows exactly what I'm talking about. Like a kid being told she/he can go to a candy store and browse...lol
Well, he browses alright...running around the creek like a crazed maniac deciding which one take...of course, there are so many, it must overload his focusing ability. Poor guy. He sees one, then another moves, and he forgot about the first one....lol. This goes on several hundred times....Once, he managed to get one up out of water (20pder), but another fish moved and he dropped what he had...

It definitely is the start of the run, as there are no carcasses strewn everywhere...after a few weeks, the stench is undeniable. I know a few neighbors who live near creek and that topic is brought up. Plus, every living thing is down these creeks feasting (sounds like a zoo). Bears get so fat, they don't run away from humans...they sort of waddle away...
One massive buffet. 

Hard to get good pics with stream running fast. 















[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0vBPK3-h_c&feature=youtu.be[/ame]


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## melli

Rather befitting of Halloween Day to see dead carcasses starting to clog the creek. And those Ravens/Crows have already gobbled up the eyeballs of the dead fish...rather disgusting, but it is what it is....I hope the dead Salmon did what they came here to do. 

The smell is starting to come on...lol. I heard the carcasses need to rot for a bit, then the coyotes/wolves etc., will dig in. Fresh fish isn't good for them. 

I did a much better video than the last one (still a tad blurry, but it was raining). 
















[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIROAW1p9GE[/ame]


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## melli

Well, with the permit filed, I figured I ought to get a leg up and start digging (Bobby does the hard stuff, then I do the fussing part). First, I need to ensure I have all my conduit/rough plumbing in the ground before I frame up footings. 

Geesh, even that is expensive. We have to use ABS up here for plumbing, and electrical rated conduit for electrical, even though ACWU (armored) is the only thing going through the pipes. If for some miracle, a short could burn through armored cable, it will certainly burn through electrical PVC pipe...rules rules...:bored:

I still have to install 2 more large conduits for line side power from the electrical shed...the 2" conduit I got is too small...hmmm. Well, it would fit, but it'd be a bear to pull it through, and the last thing anybody needs is to have concrete up, and one finds the conduit they installed is too small. I need to make life easy...

Far black pipe is main septic line, then conduit for well shed, the two middle ones (large and small) are conduit for house up the hill (way down road), and closest conduit is water line. As mentioned, I still need to plop two large ones for line side power from electrical shed. Oh yeah, a 1-1/4" conduit will be placed in the thicket for a generator run....
Another wrinkle, is the all the power lines need to be at least a foot away from low voltage, water lines etc. I have them all massed there because of the temp power kiosk. I don't have a lot of spare length to work with...

I also, have a few 3/4" elbows and pipe to place around the building...they will be for landscape lighting, RV run, sprinkler wiring etc. I suggest one never skimps on this task, as a concrete drill bit is expensive, especially a core bit and if you hit rebar...fun
















Cost to date: $200


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## melli

Been meaning to get a water filter installed for some time, but I couldn't bring myself to buy those plastic filter housings (the ones with clear plastic). I researched to death which one to get (some plastic ones have a bad rep), then one day at the local'ish (40km away) plumbing store they mention they have a Stainless Steel model with double O-rings. So, there I am, staring at this 'shiny' stainless steel filter housing, and the typical clear plastic one. Hmmm....
The Stainless was about 3x the price of the plastic one. Hmmm....
Shiny metal won out. Virtually indestructible, although I can't see the dirt collect on filter, I put on a quality gauge, which will tell me when it is getting clogged. The downside of the plastic ones is they have a habit of failing (leaking or cracking) over time. Plumbing store said they typical last 5-10 yrs then fail. Of course, I was skeptical of their claim, but I read online many reviews of plastic ones failing. 

SS one will pretty much last forever...might have to change out O-rings in 20yrs or so, but that isn't an issue for me. Since I live in Canada, my selection is limited or shipping is ridiculous, but if you live stateside, they have SS models with two gauge ports on top (ideal). 

IMHO - If you don't want to spend the dough, and go with plastic, get one with double O-rings and one that has the filter housing screw on, not the half turn click ones. 
Initially, I was collecting a little sand (teaspoon per year) in tap filters...now, after extensively using well, that problem has cleared up. The filter is just for safety sake. Next year, I'll get water tested again. 
Trying to keep the plumbing looking neat is a challenge...I hate messiness. C'est la vie. 









You'll note I have filter installed after irrigation line and well faucet...no sense in filtering irrigation water...unless I want to change filter every week during irrigation season.
I should add...probably self-evident, that I like shiny bits (Building Inspector chides me for that! lol - he was kind enough to bring me a shiny brass fitting that I was missing to complete the filter install - he said he asked the plumbing store to get the shiniest one...lol). Brass and SS fittings etc., are about as best as one can get. Definitely pricey. I could have spent half or less on plastic fittings all-around. I just loathe repairing things...nothing lasts forever, but I do my best to make sure my infrastructure is near bullet proof, and will last far beyond my lifetime. Plus, I sleep better, knowing I did the best I could.


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## Bret

Good work and lots of it. Inspiring. All the best.


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## melli

Thanks Bret! Glad to hear it inspires you, and hopefully others. 
To be frank, my homesteading project has been a 4+ year project...will hopefully be decades (lifetime) in the making, if I have my way (well, I hope the house part is done way sooner...lol). I've done it on a solo shoe-string budget. The education I've received has been one of the best 'side effects' of tackling something like this...talking to folks, researching the web, reading literature, reading fellow bloggers (on this board and elsewhere), all contributed to where I am now. Doing this, while exhausting and stressful at times, gives me a purpose in life and the variety of tasks never leaves me bored. I wake up in the morning eager to do something/anything that moves the project along. Obviously, I want to get out of RV, by building a home, but having a chunk of land really expands one's ability to do almost anything. Sure, I want the garden, the livestock, the park, but one can also do things far beyond that. Once I get into a real home, a workshop to tackle more projects would be in order. This is more than just a farm, it is a way of life. 

Geesh, I remember living downtown in the big city, in my 700sqft concrete box, and I was so constrained. Couldn't do much of anything except watch TV or surf the net....lol. Well, I could jog around the Stanley Park Seawall, which is a must do item for those who visit Vancouver, but here, I can make my own jogging track or bike into the mountains from my backyard. The zen feeling I get here is unparalleled. Sooo quiet too. Sure, I miss the odd restaurant and club, but I eat better now, and I have more human connections out here than in the city. 

I do ramble/rant/pontificate a bit...but I remember getting chided for tinkering on my car in the underground parking lot in my city home! Wasn't allowed. Heck, when I tried to wash my car on the street, a city bylaw officer wanted to give me a ticket because I didn't have a street parking permit (didn't need one because I had underground parking)! That is absurd and rather humorous when I think about it. The simple act of washing my car was forbidden in the city. Now, I can literally do almost anything without Big Brother over my shoulder. Of course, the house permit was an exception. But other than that, one does feel free to do as they wish. 

Best of luck in your journey...


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## thorn653

Quite the slice of heaven you got there!


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## melli

Thorn653- that's the plan...thx! 
Except for my accommodations I feel I am there...not seeing neighbors, just the trees, grass and Ravens...:nanner:

It turns out the two conduits for the power from electrical shed had to be 3" (2" would work, but it'd be a bear to squeeze the 1-3/4" ACWU electrical line through it). So, I inquire at the electrical supplier for 2 elbows and 1 pipe...$160! BTW - conduit pipe for electrical is expensive because it has to be rated for 90C up here. 

Yeah, right...so I am thinking I'll just make 2 elbows with one pipe ($60!). Problem is, I have to make a 2 hr round-trip drive to get it. Not in the mood for a trip (or being ripped off), I install water filter. Well, the Building Inspector shows up and says he might have some 3" lying about at his place. Sure enough, I got a length of 3" pipe delivered. Sweet! So, I try using my heat gun to mold it into an elbow, but it is too big, so I fire up a propane torch and with caution, heat up pipe and make 2- 90 degree elbows. Problem solved. I heard electricians will stick a large pipe on their exhaust and heat up pipe that way. 

I did a rough level...tomorrow, I'll have to pull out laser level and get finicky. The footings have to be near perfect. One of the downsides of ICF (see here for what they are: http://www.advantageicf.com/construction_professionals/what_are_icfs.html ) is they should be mounted on perfectly flat footings. With stick framing an uneven footing is no biggie, especially since one is likely putting up a concrete pony/knee wall (for frost depth clearance). 

Of course, after back-filling, I realized I missed one more conduit...the ground wire...doh! No biggie..doesn't need to be deep, but my collection of conduits has me worried...too many in one spot. Oh well....all of these conduits will come inside the home, up into a 'dummy' wall, so the load bearing wall (ICF) will not look like swiss cheese (it won't have any conduit (piping) in it, other than for an exterior water tap and a couple of electrical outlets).


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## melli

The monsoon rains (not downpours, just light rain, on and on) have really put a crimp in my house building enthusiasm. So, in the midst of the week long rain event, I install an in ground water sprinkler...lol. Get ahead of the curve, as it were. Well, I had a section of irrigation pipe laid when I did the electrical line installed to well shed, so it was a fairly easy thing to do. Also, I had buried some low voltage line for landscape lighting. So I ordered a couple of these...
https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B00Q2I48AW/ref=pe_386430_121528420_TE_dp_2

Very pleased with the units and results. They really throw the light! 12v 6W LED floodlights. Not the typical harsh white light LEDs give off. I need a couple more for this winter (eventually, I'll have about 10 of them scattered about property). We are approaching that time of year, where it is cloudy all the time, and we get 16hrs of dark per day...hmmm. Having these lights really gives the place some 'warmth' in the inky blackness. Plus, I feel more comfortable puttering around in the dark. They are all aluminum housing, with metal legs. I even took one apart to see how well it was made, and how waterproof it was...nice neoprene seal for glass, and wire seal coming in back. I installed some landscape lighting for a neighbor over a year ago, and one of the LED lights was an underwater rated light (threw it in their pond). It is still going! (from same company). I honestly thought it would fail in a few months...even warned neighbor I don't have a lot of confidence in a $20 LED light made in China. This is the underwater version I got, without the colored light option. I did add some liquid teflon to front and back of housing (added insurance- back and front screws off).
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B0..._14?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=KF4WR03CQVMCAQC2K08S

Sorry about pic...greenhouse frame is sitting in front of well shed. 









BTW - I use 12/2 direct bury landscape wiring all around...I have long runs and using heavier gauge wire doesn't limit one to number of lights or length (within reason of course). I buy the Coleman 250ft 12/2 spool for a $100 (best deal I could find). I do solder all connections, then use liquid tape, followed by rubber tape....the press-click connectors they sell for landscape lighting eventually corrode, and one has to fuss with them (I prefer soldering...pretty much bullet proof).
For transformer, I just used one I had from a LED deck light set I had (60w job). They are pretty cheap. They have slick ones nowadays...ones that have a remote control, so when you drive up your driveway at night, you can just press the remote and presto, light! Heck, they even have ones hooked up to wifi, so you can use your cellphone to turn on landscape lights.


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## melli

A compactor really makes things alright...lol
After hours of fussing, I think I have it pretty level. Will double check tonight, as my useless laser level doesn't like full sun (can see it on tripod on far right). 
For those interested - I used a compact fill (a conglomerate of sand, grains, pebbles, small stones). When compacted they pack tight, giving a firm base for the footings (no clay or silt). I am only doing footings 2' wide, but I like to make a 'path' wider than necessary. I may tweak orientation. 

Next up, is finding the money to buy 2x stock to build the footing forms, and buy a mess of rebar. Also, I splurged on a manual rebar bender/cutter last night. This job will require a lot of rebar, and much of it will need to be bent, like me...
I could get the Building Supply store to cut and bend rebar, but they charge a $1 per cut and bend. It is almost a wash in terms of cost...but in my case, I'll have a handy tool at the end of it. 









Note: one doesn't have a perfectly level base...as long as I'm within an inch or two, it is all good. I can adjust footings to correct any unevenness.


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## tomjiggy

Amazing work, and the work in itself is probably really rewarding. You could have paid for a lot of your supplies to build by bringing in a logging company. But, I can see where you get a certain satisfaction from doing the work on your own.


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## melli

tomjiggy said:


> Amazing work, and the work in itself is probably really rewarding. You could have paid for a lot of your supplies to build by bringing in a logging company. But, I can see where you get a certain satisfaction from doing the work on your own.


Thanks! I actually looked into it. Logging companies up here are not interested in 'pecker' poles, never-mind 1 or 2 acres. Tried to get a local outfit to just have look...they never showed up. I did consider getting my own stamp (authorizes me to sell to mills), but any money I make is considered income (taxes = headache). Plus, a logging truck would be hard pressed to make it up drive. Then, they charge a grand to haul it to mill, and the mill decides what to give you. From what I heard, about 2.5-5k per load (depends on quality). Sort of at the mercy of the mill. Plus, if I managed to get a logging outfit in here, they wouldn't be interested in pulling stumps. I suppose if I had some serious acreage, a logging outfit would be the way to go. Speaking of which, I see they are working on a cutblock off the dump road...geesh, they have massive equipment. Biggest excavator I've ever seen up close. My mini-excavator would fit in it's bucket...lol


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## melli

I figured I better hustle into town (hour each way) to get permit before they changed their minds...lol. Another $400 later, and I walk out with permit. 
Kind of funny, as I've gotten permits before, but never for my own house (sheds and decks don't count), and with the new hurdles (regs), it was a stressful experience. Yet, now that I have it, it really feels real. 
Pretty much broke, but there isn't much I can do about it, except gently swipe the CCs....lol
I really feel the need to get footings in before frost. Going to be tight, as we could get a cold spell anytime. 








Just wanted to post a pic of Roxul insulation since we have a thread on it, and perhaps folks haven't seen it. This is a pic of my ceiling in well shed, with 2x8 rafters, 16"oc, 9' span. I am able to get R28 Roxul fitting snug in there. I love the stuff. It really holds it's shape and although I'd like to get vapor barrier up, I don't feel I am putting my lungs at risk by dragging my feet (I have to wait until shed gets inspected by electrical inspector, which could be a while). It really is far superior to fiberglass (pink) insulation in so many ways. http://www.roxul.com/products/residential/products/roxul+comfortbatt

It will not drop or sag. The rock fibers are shorter than pink, but they make it really compact and fibers are interwoven randomly, so it doesn't crumble. And when you cut it, you can actually make rectangular holes for electrical boxes etc. I use an old serrated bread knife. Sort of cuts like a heavy loaf of bread. Your supposed to wear the appropriate safety gear (gloves, goggles, mask), but once up, there are no fibers floating around like pink (they are heavy, and they immediately fall to ground). Ironic, but in windstorms, I prefer to be in well shed, as the outside noise is minimal compared to the tin can RV...lol
If you try to push your hand into a wall cavity with Roxul, it feels like a thick couch cushion. And the insulation rebounds to original shape. Definitely not light or flimsy like pink. If you pick up a batt of Roxul in middle, it won't fold over like pink...

Looking at pic, it reminds me stuffing in old couches, yet it isn't spun polyester or cotton, but rock.


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## melli

Got motivated and started on footings...bit brisk up here, but in between rain-showers, got the perimeter done. I sort of changed the footing spec from what engineer wanted (7"x20") to (9-1/4" x 22"). With a keyway (2x4 slot down center of footing), that spot would only have 5-1/2" depth, which seems a tad shallow. Will cost me a few bucks more in concrete, but it also assures I get max height (headroom) at garage 'door' entrance. In my neck of the woods, from the bottom of footing to the final grade, it has to be 1-1/2' (frost protection for footings). 
I like using 2x for footings, but many folks use 1x. It is a pain to stake in my earth (lots of rocks). If your in clay/silt, easy to stake edges. Plus, I recycle the 2x for scaffolding/blocking etc...
The other upside for 2x, other than less staking, is I find it easier to make it level. This whole box has to be level within a 1/4", preferably 1/8", since I am going with ICF. 
Did a quick diagonal measurement (to check square)...only out 3/8"...easy fix. 
$150 plus electric/plumbing rough-in $200 = $350.


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## Tomjracer

Congrats on the permit and can't wait to see your new project take shape.

Inspiring!!


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Congrats on the permit and can't wait to see your new project take shape.
> 
> Inspiring!!


Thanks Tom! Glad to hear you find it of some use. 
Got the inside box done today...just hiking to lumber store takes some time...I am picky when it comes to sorting through a pile of lumber. A good workout though...16' 2x10s weigh a bit. Some good lumber coming through the yard nowadays...there was a stretch when the lumber was absolute crap...lol. I think the store was buying pine beetle lumber. 

It seems building material prices have lowered a bit. Should note, I get contractor pricing, even though my days of building stuff seem to be over (except for my home and outbuildings). Suggest folks try to get on a contractor account if they plan to buy a mess of building materials...doesn't have to be several houses per year or anything. I think it was like if you bought on average $200/mth from a building supply store, that was enough. Never hurts to ask....10-20% or more adds up. Plumbing store gives me 25-30% off 'retail', and I'm no plumber...lol
The only place I got push-back was the electrical supply store on the coast. Seems they want to exclude everybody from buying except a few contractors...thankfully, I can order most stuff online at half their retail price. I laughed when they tried to sell me an outdoor electrical box (NEMA 3R rated) for $150! Thank you Amazon...$20. The real kicker was the Amazon one was better.


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## ShannonR

That Roxul insulation sounds like some really good stuff! I've been following the insulation thread, along with most of the other threads. Will have to check the stuff out, I know it will cost a bit more but this might be worth it if it's affordable enough! Fortunately my space to cover isn't huge, so maybe I can justify the extra expense. I hate fiberglass insulation, btdt before. Hateful, itchy stuff...


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> That Roxul insulation sounds like some really good stuff! I've been following the insulation thread, along with most of the other threads. Will have to check the stuff out, I know it will cost a bit more but this might be worth it if it's affordable enough! Fortunately my space to cover isn't huge, so maybe I can justify the extra expense. I hate fiberglass insulation, btdt before. Hateful, itchy stuff...


I really haven't found any downside to Roxul...there are no guarantees in life, but it is my opinion, Roxul is way better than Pink by a country mile. I also think Pink will go the way of the dodo bird with Roxul on the scene. Stuff is made out of rock...hard to beat that. Safer to work with too....
Although, I haven't played with any yet, Roxul came out with panel insulation to compete with EPS and XPS foam-board. Now that, I am keen to check out! Plastic based foamboard has a shelf life, but Roxul doesn't. Plus, I like the idea of having non petroleum based materials in my house.


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## melli

Living in Canada sucks....lol
I found these perfect rebar chairs...cleaned the store out of them actually, but they cannot order more because the company went bankrupt. Well, after some searching, they still sell them in states, but can't in Canada because they don't have French labeling. I find that odd, because I got a box with these chairs and they have French labeling. Crazy....
So, I have to order via Amazon, which means it could be mid December til I can pour concrete. By then, it may too cold. Hmmm....
And all the rebar chairs they sell around here are for pads (1.5-2" tall). I need these suckers, as they are 3" high...perfect for deep footings. 
Plus, I hate those plastic ones...these wire frame ones are perfect imho. I can put three lines of rebar down trench, and I can tie the verticals into these chairs. 
I wish I could swear online....lol

C'est la vie.


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## Renegade6

You are doing some fantastic work! I've been watching this from the beginning. 

Hate to hear about all of the fees for permits. I'm lucky here, we build our barndominium and required zero permits!


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## Tomjracer

Melli,

How far are you from the US Border? We have many Canadian customers that will have their orders sent to a "mail box service" in Blaine, Wa. Much quicker taking the items across the border yourself instead of sitting at Canada Post for 2 weeks.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Melli,
> 
> How far are you from the US Border? We have many Canadian customers that will have their orders sent to a "mail box service" in Blaine, Wa. Much quicker taking the items across the border yourself instead of sitting at Canada Post for 2 weeks.


I used to have a mailbox just south of the border when I lived in Vancouver, but now I am a full day round-trip to the states. Gas, ferry fee, and time just don't make it economical anymore. 

I did manage to find a place in Canada, 3000 miles from me...lol
Hopefully, early next week, they will ship a box of chairs to me and I can get the party started. I find it silly that I have to go to such lengths for rebar chairs. 

Thankfully, I managed to get an Amazon order for these chairs cancelled when I found out they were not shipping me a box of them, but one for $25 plus $5 shipping!:huh: For reference, they cost me 60 cents each at my local store. 
It wasn't Amazon's fault, but one of their suppliers are scammers....jmho
Nobody in their right mind would pay $25 for a plain wire coat hanger...

I just got a mess of 5/8" rebar....waiting on my rebar bender/cutter to arrive. Looking forward to seeing how it flies.


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## tomjiggy

Ouch! Sounds like the local logging outfits aren't worth the time. Have you checked into any contractors for salvaged wood, or are you going to do all new? I watch a few different shows that involve remodeling(just for ideas in building)and one gal in Minnesota salvages a lot when she remodels the historical houses there in Minneapolis. It cuts down on costs quite a bit. I think she even salvages nails and screws if possible. 

The work you have done is impressive, and looks like it is necessary when building/homesteading. They seem to be strict on building code there.


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## melli

tomjiggy said:


> Ouch! Sounds like the local logging outfits aren't worth the time. Have you checked into any contractors for salvaged wood, or are you going to do all new? I watch a few different shows that involve remodeling(just for ideas in building)and one gal in Minnesota salvages a lot when she remodels the historical houses there in Minneapolis. It cuts down on costs quite a bit. I think she even salvages nails and screws if possible.
> 
> The work you have done is impressive, and looks like it is necessary when building/homesteading. They seem to be strict on building code there.


Thanks!

I just found out the other day our municipality wants engineered plans for outbuildings! Absolutely crazy (even for a single floor woodshed). Really makes me want to move to a place where such nonsense does not exist. Unfortunately, I've poured my heart into this place not to give it up. 

I did salvage building materials from my old development (multi home build), but it isn't practical with one home builds. Anything of use would be kept by contractor or owner. 

My home will be ICF walls, so that can't be salvaged, and the rest is fairly cheap, with the roof being the exception, and no one will cough up 24' 2x12s....lol...I'll be paying a penny for those. 
Oh, and fenestration will hopefully be triple glazed windows which precludes salvage. 

Maybe Santa will give me a bandsaw mill, and I can whip up some heavy lumber for my woodshed.


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## melli

Well, the elusive rebar chairs are holding up the program...hopefully, I'll get them next week. 
I got some rock 'crush' in the box, and compacted. Got the forms square and level (that is sooo tedious). As you can see in first pic, I just used some scrap 2x4s to hold form bottom from blowing/bowing out/floating (nailed them to bottom of forms). I then pounded in 6-8" chunks of 5/8" rebar (I pre-drilled holes for rebar with 11/16" auger bit - stacked several 2x4s together and drilled through works - easy peasy - nice snug fit for rebar). Usually, with 5" pads, I'll just use rocks and rebar directly up against forms, but with 9" deep forms, I wanted something a little more secure. 
Blowouts are not common (possible) with 2x sidewalls, but occasionally, the form will want to float (lift up, and concrete will flow underneath, especially when giving them a bang with hammer after pour to reduce air pockets) or bow out. I am partial to straight lines...lol








I received my manual rebar bender/cutter today! Sweet. Gave it a twirl. You can see in pic my first 90 degree bend. I'll need to anchor the unit to a 8 foot 2x6, but even so, it did the bend I'll need (lots of them! Like a 100 or so). Discovered a little trick to bending 5/8"...do an easy partial bend first, then stick it in full 90 degree slot. 

I haven't tried the cutting function, as I don't really need that function...plus, I worry I'll stress the bender. I use an old Makita circ saw with a 7" metal chop saw blade for cutting (quicker and easier). The unit was bought at Northern Tool - Klutch. Seems heavy duty - 44 pds according to shipping slip. The handles have solid rod inserts about halfway up handle tubes, so it doesn't appear they will bend when heaving on them. Time will tell. If it gets me through job, it will have paid for itself. I can say this unit will have no problem with 1/2" or smaller rebar.


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## melli

Renegade6 said:


> You are doing some fantastic work! I've been watching this from the beginning.
> 
> Hate to hear about all of the fees for permits. I'm lucky here, we build our barndominium and required zero permits!


Yep, I envy you and others who have no paperwork to navigate. I get 'their' point of view about the need for a well built house. That being said, I feel it should be a right for a land owner to build a roof over their head without roadblocks. The bureaucracy set me back a year, at least, and about $4k. 
In the end, my plans were not materially altered by engineer (he changed a couple of things; downsized footings, and wants 12" oc for rafters). Those changes would not have made a bit of difference in grand scheme of things. I suspect he made those changes to justify his bill...lol
I chatted with a pro in these matters, and he felt the same way. BTW - I used engineer tables for spans, and 2x12 @ 16" oc is suitable for 18' span. 
Not only that, half of the rafters are sitting on ceiling joists, which will be mid-span supported with a knee wall in attic. Not a fan of 12" oc because it is a pain to block and nail up, plus the thermal break issues.../rant


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## melli

Mounted Rebar tool to a scrap piece of PT 2x12. Makes a world of difference! 
I decided to try the cutting feature on 1/2" rebar. Pretty easy. Both bending and cutting do require some heft (weight), but strength isn't required. Might be hard for a 100lb person, but it is all about putting downward weight on handle. No grunting required.


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## melli

After lining up a rebar chair source across the country, I decided to get yet more rebar. As I'm at the store, I start digging in the back for rebar ties (premade wire loops to tie rebar together - fairly cheap and less headache than nipping up a coil of rebar wire - plus, I have a rebar tie tool that uses these premade loops - goes really really quick). I get a roll of those rebar ties, and I notice a ripped plastic bag on top shelf...it was a bag of rebair chairs! Yahoo! I'm pretty sure I didn't miss them last time...I suspect they were a return. 
I'm off to the races....
This morning, I started laying rebar...still need to do corners and tie everything together, then I can do cross supports and keyway, then rebar verticals. Sweet! Although, as stated earlier, I probably won't be able to pour for a month or so, getting it ready for concrete is the battle. Once I'm done that, the actual pour is just a couple of hours of slogging. 







Took me the morning to figure out how to use the rebar bender to it's full potential...and how to make 3-1/2" radius bends in 5/8" rebar...one doesn't want too tight of corners (weakens rebar - general rule is 6x dia of rebar for radius of bend). One can go cheap by using a trailer hitch or two lengths of heavy iron pipe, especially for 90 degree bends.


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## melli

Not much to report...lol
Got the rebar in the box all tied up so I can move onto the keyway and vertical rebar install. An arctic blast just hit us, so it may slow me down a tad. 
The wonderful news is I can pour whenever the weather improves. My engineer sent me a quick note on my progress...called me a 'perfectionist' and 'looks lovely!'. 
When my engineer sends me a note like that I consider it an early Christmas present. :grin:
Obviously, I picked a good engineer...lol
Seriously, it was truly flattering for him to take the time to let me know I am on the right course, as it were. Truly appreciative of his comments. 








Sum total ~ $700 (not exact as I haven't been doing much book-keeping as of late)
Rebar has been the biggest expense driver so far...about half the total. Albeit, rebar is dirt cheap right now, compared to a few years ago,when it was a good 50% more. Chinese have flooded market and they aren't building anymore ghost towns...lol
They are feeling the hurt....


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## melli

This is the time of year where the weekends warriors are not to be seen, and even the full-timers take flight to sunnier climes. 
Yesterday, I did 5 house checks...a tad tedious, given we only have so much sun around and I could think of better things to do...lol. Many insurance companies demand one has their home checked every few days if they are extended holidays etc. I just wanted to show you a homesteader's setup who lives off the grid, specifically, their 'power shed'. Not a lot of panels. Inside are 16-6V deep cell lead acid batteries, and the other half of shed has a diesel genset. After a few days of no sun, she has to fire up diesel to recharge batteries (couple of hours). Inside her home, she has a Xantrac inverter with all the bells and whistles. Her heat is a sealed fireplace, and water, stove and dryer are propane. She is too far away from lines to make a utility hookup. She does have internet via a cell range booster. She really is lost in the deep as it were...driveway is crazy long, and she did little clearing around house (loves trees), and there is no one around her. Very much lost in the woods. And she gets all the game passing by...idyllic. 
Her setup is quite small, yet it does the job. Other than winter, no genny required. And we are above 49 degrees North...







We just got a light dusting of snow, but a lot more is one the way...
When skies cleared next morning...mmm! Hard to see through trees, but Caren Range looks beautiful, covered in a heavy white frosting.


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## melli

We were supposed to get our snow-Armageddon today, but it never materialized (like 10"). Just a couple of inches, if that. I drove over to a friends for our afternoon walk, but was stymied from climbing my driveway on my way home. Doesn't take much in mountainous terrain. I made it almost halfway up this section in pic, then began my toboggan run back down to road (I go backwards, as I have better traction, and when I invariably start sliding back down, I am going forward...lol). Always freaks me out, and I keep trying it:bored:. Wouldn't take too long to shovel two tracks down to gravel so I could get up, but today, I read about someone who filled their yard sprayer with road salt and hot water. So I did just that. Will see what tomorrow morning brings. Very curious....
Not particularly one of those patient folks, but if this works, it will come in handy for those times when we have successive snow days. Spray when there is an inch or so, and it will self clear going forward for a few days as we don't get super cold here. Although, La Nina is bringing it this year. Next week, -12C, which is unheard of, around here....going to be a lot of busted water lines.


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## Steve_S

Waves @ Melli !

Yup, been lurkin in your thread LOL. Gotta ask about your ride, a 4x4 is what it looks like from photo above but what Snow Tires have you got on it ?

I have Cooper Discoverer M+S on my Mazda B4000 (+ 100kg of sand ballast in back of box) and am very pleased with those, I have Rotella Snow's on my PT and they "ain't worth spit" but my Triangle Snow Lions (going back on my PT) were amazing through deep snow... My mechanic put the Rotella's on (they were my spare set) thinking they would be better BUT the cheapo Chinese Triangle brand beets them hands down. Been getting much snow here lately so the "tests" proved to me what is better for my PT. 

Sadly, I seriously broke my ol 86 Chev 4x4 and it's off the road permanently now :-( which was my mainstay for really, really bad weather... be very hard pressed to replace Ol-Blue.

Salt Brine works OK on pavement but that's pretty much it and as it is salt, it's not terribly good for vegetation so consider where the melting run off will take it.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Waves @ Melli !
> 
> Yup, been lurkin in your thread LOL. Gotta ask about your ride, a 4x4 is what it looks like from photo above but what Snow Tires have you got on it ?
> 
> I have Cooper Discoverer M+S on my Mazda B4000 (+ 100kg of sand ballast in back of box) and am very pleased with those, I have Rotella Snow's on my PT and they "ain't worth spit" but my Triangle Snow Lions (going back on my PT) were amazing through deep snow... My mechanic put the Rotella's on (they were my spare set) thinking they would be better BUT the cheapo Chinese Triangle brand beets them hands down. Been getting much snow here lately so the "tests" proved to me what is better for my PT.
> 
> Sadly, I seriously broke my ol 86 Chev 4x4 and it's off the road permanently now :-( which was my mainstay for really, really bad weather... be very hard pressed to replace Ol-Blue.
> 
> Salt Brine works OK on pavement but that's pretty much it and as it is salt, it's not terribly good for vegetation so consider where the melting run off will take it.


Silven (Silver Saturn SUV) has brand new Goodyear Triple Tread Assurances on (not 4x4). 

Funny, but I do have a truck like yours, that I am supposed to be using in winter, and I call him 'Big Blue' (2001 Dodge Ram 4x4 2500 v10). He is a monster. Posi rear end, chunky off-road tires, can climb and pull anything. Just hard to justify insurance and gas for two weeks of snow (plus I am financially challenged right now - and insurance company has a 3 mth min). I use him for slash detail (moving it) on property, and I used to pull Bobby in a dump box trailer I used to own. I am STILL kicking myself for dumping my previous beast of burden, a 1993 GMC 4x4 (extended cab). Was just before manufacturers went crazy with electronic crap. Was a stripped down awesome truck (no carpet, one big rubber floor mat, vinyl seats and manual windows). 
I got rid of it because I felt I needed to tow Bobby around, and the GMC didn't have the tow rating Big Blue has. While I didn't pay a fortune for Big Blue (gov auction), it really is too much truck for my needs, and it isn't the easiest truck to work on. Plus the GMC was in mint condition, rust-wise. Also, it turned out that I only used Bobby off site for a couple of gigs. Wasn't worth the newer truck, nor trailer. 

The problem is my driveway...in all my vehicles I've had issues tobogganing down driveway (having a 90 degree turn on driveway really makes it interesting). This coast snow is usually heavy and wet, and once your tires go over it, it packs it into a hard ice like track. If it gets too thick and you don't reach the gravel, the sleigh ride begins. 4x4 does nothing for me, albeit, when on road, the slopes are less, and I can power my way along. 
Even Silven can do it, when I put chains on. My MO is to spin tires so I can reach gravel and spray some up, which gives me traction. But yesterday, all I did, was create two luge (ice) tracks. Before I pack snow down anymore, I better get out snow shovel. Was/is supposed to warm up to melt snow before we head back to sub-zero temps for week, but it appears we got more snow overnight. Bummer. Looks pretty though...lol

At least my car is near road, and I can get to gym this morning. 









Yeah, I was concerned about using too much salt...I had maybe 2l of salt in an 8l sprayer...was spraying for tracks. Driveway is about 300-400ft long. 
I don't think it'll cause too much of an issue, especially when spring rains come. 
I think your right about salt brine only good for pavement...gravel eats it up, and it doesn't stick around to melt snow. Shovel work is pretty easy with a few inches of snow...guess I ought to get on that. Best. :goodjob: (best wave back emoticon they have...lol)


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## Steve_S

Phooey on ICBC ! What a monstrous organization that is. I KNOW your pains there. Old Blue (mine) runs great and IS a Beast but the cab & box sheared away from their mounts and now only float on the frame... beyond repairable but with a 1/2 million on the Odo what can I expect... Rebuilding my 81 C10 in spring (it only has 108,000 kms) but it isn't 4x4.

I would suggest using Calcium (Ice Melter) in your ruts with a light sprinkle between the ruts. My driveway is 300' up slope and makes for interesting adventures, fortunately my Ariens 28-Deluxe snowblower deals with the nasty fluffy rain (which we get lot's of in winter) and I do have to sprinkle calcium every once in a while as it works to -20C (also too common here). I did use salt 3 times on a previous winter and it did affect the greenery in the spring. were it melted off too... Didn't care that nothing grew on the driveway (packed gravel on pit-run) but the grass 2' off the sloped side was dead.

Snow like Sand does not really handle hard tires that well... Sometimes you have to loose a few PSI to get good traction and no slip. My small truck like 34-PSI but that makes slippery ruts but if I drop it to 28-PSI I get gripping power but not the best on highway / asphalt. One of those "tricks" that's handy to know when in a bind.

Hang in there and hold onto your Bippy as the weather there is gonna be pretty weird for a bit before it goes back to the usual. The High North is pretty warm ATM and pushing the Jet Stream down which is resulting in some nastiness.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Phooey on ICBC ! What a monstrous organization that is. I KNOW your pains there. Old Blue (mine) runs great and IS a Beast but the cab & box sheared away from their mounts and now only float on the frame... beyond repairable but with a 1/2 million on the Odo what can I expect... Rebuilding my 81 C10 in spring (it only has 108,000 kms) but it isn't 4x4.
> 
> I would suggest using Calcium (Ice Melter) in your ruts with a light sprinkle between the ruts. My driveway is 300' up slope and makes for interesting adventures, fortunately my Ariens 28-Deluxe snowblower deals with the nasty fluffy rain (which we get lot's of in winter) and I do have to sprinkle calcium every once in a while as it works to -20C (also too common here). I did use salt 3 times on a previous winter and it did affect the greenery in the spring. were it melted off too... Didn't care that nothing grew on the driveway (packed gravel on pit-run) but the grass 2' off the sloped side was dead.
> 
> Snow like Sand does not really handle hard tires that well... Sometimes you have to loose a few PSI to get good traction and no slip. My small truck like 34-PSI but that makes slippery ruts but if I drop it to 28-PSI I get gripping power but not the best on highway / asphalt. One of those "tricks" that's handy to know when in a bind.
> 
> Hang in there and hold onto your Bippy as the weather there is gonna be pretty weird for a bit before it goes back to the usual. The High North is pretty warm ATM and pushing the Jet Stream down which is resulting in some nastiness.


Yeah, wish I had calcium chloride...that would have worked better I am told than Sodium Chloride (salt). Trucks use CaCl to spray the roads. Expensive, but I wouldn't need much. 
I notice in the news we are getting ribbed from easterners...lol
They can rib us westerners all they want, all day long. I am quite alright with that....lol. Beats getting about 100x less snow every winter, and we are the warmest place in Canada in winter by miles (usually)...
This one was funny:
https://twitter.com/pyannitsos/status/807274765496893440/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
https://twitter.com/hashtag/bcstorm?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc^tfw
(halfway down is a lightly dusted lawn...we will rebuild)

For those stateside (as we Canucks affectionately call you), there is a steady diet of ribbing from Easterners and Westerners in Canada. In the spring (like February around here), we will send pics of blooming cherry trees to Easterners, while they are still in the grip of winter blizzards. Sometimes, we will send November pics of us cutting grass...
Apparently, we Westerners are handicapped when it comes to dealing with snow. We have a moniker....Lotusland. We call Toronto the center of the universe because all we get is a steady diet of Toronto Maple Leaf games (hockey). Funny enough, my fav game is American Football! Really pumped about my team. :nanner:
Even more ironic, my walking partner is an ex-Ontarian, whom we have given a nickname, 'crash'. She lives on a very steep hill (like double black diamond run). A few years back, she decided to give her paved road a twirl with a light dusting of snow. A good 400ft toboggan run in car, across road at bottom and totaled her car in ditch on other side. I have pics to prove it...lol
Other than scaring the crap out of her, the story ended well. She got a brand new car in insurance settlement (her car was 3yrs old). 
I agree though Steve, ICBC MO is to screw everybody with a claim, and why I cannot get one months insurance is beyond me. Silly, as they would make more money, as I can only drive one car at a time (both cars would be insured - would only drive truck in foul weather). 
Shame about your truck....if I ever come across a clean late 80's or early 90's truck, I will keep that forever. These new vehicles chocked full of electronics are a nightmare, albeit, I do appreciate their engine code fault reading ability.


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## melli

Couldn't do much with snow melting and freezing on my forms, so I waited it out. Then we had a melt, and now we are back to subzero temps for a bit. At least forms are clear. Can't pour for a bit, so no rush. 
I got the keyways installed (2x4 indentations in footings - for cold joint). Since the footings and wall will be two separate pours, putting in a keyway will limit moisture intrusion and seismically, keep the wall on footings. I did bevel the 2x4s (a few degrees) so I can pop them out after pour. 
Now, all I need to do is put in vertical rebar. Still debating whether I should put them under horizontal rebar or just resting on top. Been trying to research this issue but no luck. BTW - All ICF manuals have them resting on top of horizontal rebar. I would think having them underneath would be better, provided one has enough bottom clearance, which I do. Really, a silly detail, but I have the time to pour over every detail until I capitulate. Maybe the civil engineer boards can help me...

I've been to job sites, and asked why they do things a certain way and they retort because that is the way it is done! (they probably feel their machismo is under fire). I am just looking for sound science to back up why they do what they do...in many cases, it turns out, they have no clue, and have done it a certain way because it is efficient (handed down from generation to generation), not the best. 
Since I am new to ICF, I view this as a science experiment. Every detail must have scientifically sound purpose, otherwise I have to question it. And since I have the luxury of time (being broke), I can do just that...lol

As I told the building inspector, I want my little bunker to be the last building standing in a 9.0 earthquake. I might be a tad optimistic....


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## melli

Building Inspector was hassling me (in his usual sarcastic humor way) to get cracking to finish footing forms. Well, I've been in no rush, as I can't pour til probably February. So, I started on the verticals...lots of rebar bending ahead.

I also spent several days researching footing to wall rebar 'development' on an engineering site. This thread, if one reads all the links they supply, is a virtual course on rebar footing-wall engineering. Albeit, they still couldn't come to a consensus...lol
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=401855

However, it gave me some insight on what I can do...I have limitations, because my wall is only 6" thick, so I cannot go crazy. Although, I will do my best to do so...

I consider the footing to wall rebar 'development' (engineer speak for how to place the bloody rebar) to be the most important facet of my bunker. A strong connection limits the wall oscillating like a wet noodle in an earthquake and will limit cracking at wall to footing interface (bad thing - as in water can enter and corrode rebar, or worse, detach wall from footings).

Note: the verticals are higher than necessary (26" min is what one wants for 5/8" rebar - for lap joints), but I will cut a few down where the low windows are going. 









We had a sunny day! lol....had to take a pic of that...


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## snaefell

Just finished reading all 9 pages! Well done!
I appreciate your attention to detail, and concise chronicling of your journey.
Happy holidays from central B.C.


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## melli

snaefell said:


> Just finished reading all 9 pages! Well done!
> I appreciate your attention to detail, and concise chronicling of your journey.
> Happy holidays from central B.C.


Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you too...chilly up there I hear (and snowy). 
I try to not only show in pics and words what I did, but how...I enjoy reading how others do it, especially when they show detail. I remember following a few folks on contractor-talk and they'd show foundation, then a completed house...I'd be like, whoa, what about the middle part!? Framing, electrical, plumbing, etc....
The devil is in the details, as they say. 
Best


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## melli

Got a large truck's worth of mulch/chips from a neighbor who got some cedars whacked down by his house. Very nice of him to offer them up. I look at pic, and it doesn't look like much, but it is covering a lot of uneven rock. Nice crisp day to be sitting in a heated Bobby on New Years Day and spread it around...took way longer than I thought though. Was chipped finely. 

Cedar mulch is the best, because it limits weed growth over other tree mulch. Down the road, when money starts falling from sky, I'll get some 'real' landscape fabric and recover. It'll lose the green color and turn slightly grey-dark brown over time. 
Also, there isn't a lot of soil and this heavy layer of mulch will keep the cedars happy throughout a dry summer and feed them. 









Was great I got to meet tree cutter guy....we discussed a standing offer where I leave some 'refreshments' if he drops off load of chips. Save me from ogling at chippers...lol
Although, one day, it would be nice to get a small one for yard maintenance.


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## Raeven

You've shared so much great information about starting from total scratch, *melli*. It's wonderful stuff. Thanks for taking the time and making the effort. There is much for others to learn from you here.


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## melli

Raeven said:


> You've shared so much great information about starting from total scratch, *melli*. It's wonderful stuff. Thanks for taking the time and making the effort. There is much for others to learn from you here.


Ahhh....geesh Raeven, your making me sentimental! lol
Coming from you Raeven, means a lot. Thank you. 
Best. 

btw - my poor Ravens are feeling the chill! This La Nina episode is probably weaning the weak from the strong. Weeks of sub zero temps up here is very unusual. And we have at least another week in forecast. Plus, most of the area has snow cover, which limits feeding. And my pair of Ravens have been knocking on my door, repeatedly, throughout the day for a little help. They took my xmas turkey carcass in 5 minutes! Recycling is not an issue with those two around. They even come back to make sure not a speck is left behind. I'll have to take a pic of the local dump...they all congregate there in winter. Quite something to see a thousand Ravens shoulder to shoulder along the bins/metal gates/trees. And these are huge Ravens. Actually, I find it a bit unnerving to see them up so close. Almost the size of the eagles we have...


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## melli

There is this lake near me that has 1-1/2" of ice (I check it almost daily - gained 1" on a particularly cold night)...just need to double it, and it would be a dream to skate on! 
Froze perfectly...clear smooth ice. Of course, we are supposed to get snow, which will ruin it, but I am hopeful (followed by some rain, then back to cold again). 
Just the thought of skating on this lake would be surreal. Only 'shallow' lake in hood that has a history of being safe to skate on (decades ago). 
I'm not that old, but this lake reminds me of those old black and white romantic musical movies where they skated on lakes in some scenes....


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## melli

I really tortured myself by not buckling down and getting the rebar placed sooner, than later. Just staring at an incomplete job for two months does wear on one (even though I kept telling myself no rush, I cannot pour until it warms up). 115 - 90 degree bends later, and installed with rebar ties, the worst of this phase is over. Just have tidy up, maybe make some box footings for the two posts, and whatnot, and I can pour. 

BTW - that rebar bender is still solid...
















The engineer spec is to have them 16" c/c...I doubled up where all the openings will be (doors, windows, 'garage door') since the ICF manual specs double runs around all openings, and for them to extend past whatever opening by 2' or so. In effect, some double runs would be touching the footings, so why not embed them into the footings. Will make this sucker that much stronger. 
Openings, like windows in concrete walls, are obviously, the weak link. The double run around windows limits cracking at the corners. In many seismic events, concrete at window corners crack and help the building collapse.


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## snaefell

Did you get to skate on the lake?
You could certainly skate on most any lake in these parts this winter, we've had a couple weeks of temperatures colder than -20C, with nights on end of -32C.
On top of that, there has not been much snow this year, less than two feet in this area.
Re-bar set up looks good, should easily withstand earth movement.
Happy New Year!


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## melli

Not quite thick enough for my taste (2-1/2")...although, it didn't stop a gaggle of kids from playing a pickup game of hockey a couple of days ago. Then, yesterday, I caught these folks on it. 
I'd want at least 4", if not more. And now we are above 0C, so the dream skate will have to wait until another year...Very small window of opportunity for this sort of thing around here. Most years, the lake ice doesn't freeze or is just a thin glazing of ice.

I have a 'thing' about thin ice. When I was 10 or so, I plunged into a slough in the prairies in the dead of winter (usual -20C day and I was solo). Ice was likely feet thick, but near a muskrat home, I stepped on their entrance hole. Just like stepping off a dock, I went right up to my neck. Thankfully, I had superhuman reflexes (most kids do) and was a light kid, and I literally popped out of hole like a seal. Soaking wet in snow-mobile suit, I walked a kilometer to a neighbor with no ill effects. I was lucky. Surrounding ice was thick, so I had leverage to haul myself out. You break through thin ice, things could get nasty in a hurry (you try to pop onto surrounding thin ice like a seal, it will likely break, and the cycle begins until you wear out). 














Yes, Snaefell, best wishes to you too! I hope this year brings me some dough....lol. Debating whether I should sell my truck before it becomes worthless. Used it once last year for a dump run and a few around the yard chores (moving slash). Need to buy the ICF lego blocks for my bunker. 

Got one of my slash piles prepped for a burn...great excavator day. Took down two Arbutus trees that were threatening one of my tarp sheds and septic field. Ground was frozen, so I made no tracks, and I could fall tree on septic field. Of course, I smacked off the end of the inspection pipe on drain field. C'est la vie. At least, the tree is gone. Arbutus trees are nasty (but a beautiful tree). They are a hardwood, grow tall and skinny, have tiny root balls and snap or fall in windstorms.


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## snaefell

I always admire those Arbutus whenever I'm at the Left coast, nothing like that grows in the central interior. I wonder, are they useful for woodworking or lumber? 
The practical side speaking here. I like cutting trees, but hate to knock them down without a reason (any reason will do!) 
I bet you would make good use of a chipper.


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## melli

snaefell said:


> I always admire those Arbutus whenever I'm at the Left coast, nothing like that grows in the central interior. I wonder, are they useful for woodworking or lumber?
> The practical side speaking here. I like cutting trees, but hate to knock them down without a reason (any reason will do!)
> I bet you would make good use of a chipper.


I love those Arbutus trees...they add an element to the forest. And being the only broadleaf evergreen tree in Canada, kind of cool. That being said, it is like having a Rhododendron growing to Douglas Fir height. The 'trunk' doesn't grow straight, the tree doesn't care if center of gravity is not over root ball, so they can become dangerous. Trying to cut one down is an exercise in how fast can I run away before the thing kills me (no slow motion felling...more of snap, then whoop). Supposedly, folks use it for woodworking (I haven't seen them). I did have a friend tell me a woodworker wanted a root ball to play with, but he never showed up. I've read folks south of border will travel to buy for firewood (has a higher BTU than most mountain trees). When I read that, I started to sell it with the Douglas Fir I sell for firewood (meaty sections). However, some of my regulars who were initially keen on it, became sour on it, because it doesn't split very easily....:bored:
It is a hardwood, and if I had a mill, I would keep some to mill, but I don't have a mill...
It is an odd tree for sure...and an absolute pain to haul around with excavator, as it has no bark, so it is always slipping out of my grasp. I have to buck it up into small chunks to haul, unlike a 100ft fir, which I can easily haul around yard. 

Yep, if I had a monster chipper, I would be chipping everything. Burning isn't just bad for environment, it is bad on me...


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## melli

One of my two slash piles was staring me in the face too long, so yesterday, I figure I ought to burn it (plus, it was starting to get crowded up there - I need the space cleared in case I get some cheapo fill). Watch football and a fire. Sounded like a plan. Well, four hours later, I couldn't get the slash pile to ignite. I had a tiger torch on it. I gave up in disgust...usually, it takes me no more than an hour with torch to get a slash pile going (half hour in most cases). 

Then this morning, my excavator wouldn't fire up...
Then my friendly Building Inspector shows up. I get my excavator running (bad spot on starter I suspect). He then tells me of his burning finesse. He is a firebug. I hate burning slash, as I am always worried about it. He lights slash piles with glee on his properties, then goes home (20 miles away). 

His method is to buck and split up some cedar and make a campfire of sorts in the slash pile. Once the 'campfire' is roaring, he then starts throwing on slash. Eventually, a good hot spot develops and one is off to the races. Sure enough, we got the slash pile going with his method, and tiger torch, and blower. I was impressed. Took a bit of work, but much better than my previous day's attempt (plus I went through a 20lb propane tank). In winter, everything is soggy, so it takes some effort to get anything burning. Once you get a good ember pile in slash pile, it heats up and dries stuff above it...then it explodes and burns like crazy. 

The pile will burn overnight, and in morning, I will have 'dissolved' the pile. I stir it up with excavator every few hours to help it get every stump. Then it usually stews for a day or two until the rain comes, or I throw water/dirt on it. It gets so hot, it dissolves the rock underneath it...handy, as I have lots of that in pile. One down, one to go...
















Always feels good to clean up yard...I should be happy happy, given my team won:nanner:, but I've had two things to interrupt my usual ok mood. As some of you know, I wrote under Homestead Questions, that BC Hydro wants a Right-of-way (ROW) on a chunk of property near road (see pic above of car parked at bottom of driveway in snowy conditions). To right of car, they want to put in a power pole etc. They will probably want to take out a chunk of forest (not so good). Plus, my title is clean, no ROW, no nothing. They want to give me $500 for it. :bored:

Then one of my rotors on car decides to dissolve...never seen anything like it. A metallurgy imperfection? So, my car is on emergency use only mode. I order new rotors through Amazon, and their third party vender sends me an email wanting 'extra' for shipping! I'm like ###! They advertised free shipping in Canada (no exceptions). Well, apparently, I am outside the 'free' zone. Seemed like a shakedown. Heck, it was a shakedown. If they wanted shipping money, they could have put it in there (Amazon charges me shipping for certain items before I order, not after). 

As a solo homesteader, I suppose one gets used to no distractions...lol


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## melli

Nice thing about having 'Bobby' is the ability to play with the fire. One can stir up the slash so everything burns quickly. It gets so hot, anything you throw into the heart of it vaporizes. One eyesore gone...48hr burn.


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## Gump

Good job Melli!
My kind of lot clearing. Excavator sure helps to get a good complete burn including stumps.
I am also in the process of clearing some land for my homestead and with very little soil ( mainly granite boulders) where we are building, it makes it difficult to bury grubbing without generating a pile of rock!! So I use this method of burning as well!


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## melli

Gump said:


> Good job Melli!
> My kind of lot clearing. Excavator sure helps to get a good complete burn including stumps.
> I am also in the process of clearing some land for my homestead and with very little soil ( mainly granite boulders) where we are building, it makes it difficult to bury grubbing without generating a pile of rock!! So I use this method of burning as well!


Thanks Gump!
Felt like another Bobby day...lol. Warm cab, not much effort required. Was knackered from loading a neighbor's shed with a cord of wood (had to walk it in...). Seems the local firewood guy had a 'moment' and was in no mood to stack the wood in shed (no wheelbarrow, 'stuff' in the way, blah blah blah). So, given I vouched for his product and paid extra for him to stack in shed, I had to run over there and give him a hug (seriously, that is what I did...two in fact). I then had to stack wood in shed, since neighbor wasn't there and he had Airbnb guests in a day. Woe be me...lol
It is all good...didn't have to go to gym today. Strong like ox!

I figure about three dump truck loads of fill ought to round out hill and I can get more grass in there....:nanner:


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## melli

You know when you bury 250ft or so of direct bury CAT 6 cable (Ethernet cable), and make ends for it, then it doesn't work, you get a bit anxious. 
Especially since I grind-ed out 8hrs of digging...I did get a good core workout and sleep though. Trenching is good for the soul. 

Then I google...apparently, it does matter how you wire the connector. T568B is the code for wiring Ethernet cable (can use T568A in some cases). I figured as long as one end matched the other end, all was good. I was wrong. 

I bought one of those cheap Amazon kits ($30) that crimp connectors onto Ethernet cable (crimper, connectors, wire tester). Also got 500ft of Cat 6 Ethernet cable ($50) rated for direct bury. I wanted to put a camera at Electrical shed (close to driveway entrance). Really the best spot for camera, as one really has to come up driveway, unless they are hardcore, and want to bushwhack their way in. 

At any rate, after wiring it properly, the sucker worked! Sweet.  Just have to mount it. I looked into Wifi, but location was not in line of sight of base station. Plus, I had issues with wifi camera being 140ft from station (with no obstructions). I then looked into repeaters, but there were no guarantees. A wire in ground is a guarantee, as long as I didn't go much over 300ft and I didn't break it when back-filling (a possibility in this rock infested place). 

Picture to follow...


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## melli

Nice to have a cam down by road...you turn the corner, and bam, your on the cloud...lol

The other neat thing is I can trigger cam with laser, remote infrared, in road electro-magnetism, you name it...and I could have a red goalie light go off, and Apocalypse Now soundtrack...
Ok, now I am getting paranoid...


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## melli

My cam detected something...
Now I know whether to leave house with snow shovel or not. Sort of a hwy cam...


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## melli

A light snowfall is quicker with shovel, but this dump would be too much with shovel...first time using Bobby this way (we just don't get large snowfalls). Was concerned about sliding on rubber tracks. Just as long as I pointed downhill, with blade and arm in front, no problem. I did spin out on a couple of occasions, but arm can push me out of a jam.


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## snaefell

Nice picture quality. I guess you guys got quite a lot of snow, or did that 60 cm. accumulation bypass your area? Nice to have the excavator for the deeper stuff, I imagine.
Our area's big dump of snow is predicted for this Thursday. If it really piles up I may have to put the snowblower on the tractor. Usually put it on in November, but have not needed it much so far. We have easily kept up with the truck & blade.
Good football game today.


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## melli

snaefell said:


> Nice picture quality. I guess you guys got quite a lot of snow, or did that 60 cm. accumulation bypass your area? Nice to have the excavator for the deeper stuff, I imagine.
> Our area's big dump of snow is predicted for this Thursday. If it really piles up I may have to put the snowblower on the tractor. Usually put it on in November, but have not needed it much so far. We have easily kept up with the truck & blade.
> Good football game today.


It doesn't look like a lot looking down...we got 20cm one day, then 8cm overnight....So, I would say a foot+ over two days. A lot for around here. They didn't make the roads, especially the arterial ones anywhere near level for heavy snowfall. 
Abbotsford got almost double (38cm - Environment Canada). 
The other issue, it is sticking and freezing...so I had to get down to gravel on my driveway or I'd be hooped. Roads have an ice bottom layer. 
You guys live it for months and are prepared...lol. I don't know of one neighbor who has a snowblower. We rely on hwy department to bail us out, and they don't have the equipment interior folks do...
We wait it out until hwy crews do our roads or it melts...couple of days wait. 
Bobby worked like a charm...wish I had blade angle capability...might look into an attachment for blade that can do that. I started motoring down road, but without angle, all I was doing was making huge drifts.

I'm really enamored with those Hikvision HD cams...first 'real' cams I've gotten (I bought those Swann bullet cams long ago, but the resolution was horrible and no IP). HD cams were uber expensive back then. Now, for a $140, you get a great cam, loaded with options galore (IP, Wifi, External Triggers etc). I think I mentioned I bought one a year or so ago for me, then a neighbor saw mine and bought one, but he was technically challenged in setting it up, so he gave it to me (well, I did a lot of favors for him). 

For those technically challenged, get an IP capable cam. Makes life easy. It makes your cam a standalone 'computer' of sorts. You just need to plug it into a router or hook it up via wifi (range is limited). Don't really need a computer, as it doesn't need one to operate. The beauty is you can be anywhere in world and log into it to see what is going on (I use my phone). 
Also, an IP cam will email you pics or vid of any intrusions. If someone steals it, the data of their deed is online. 

As I've said, Pats are my team...the evil empire. That was surreal. I knew they could bounce back and make it close, but win it?! I am so superstitious, I record the playoff games, as I am bad luck if I watch live...lol
Well, in all honesty, my nerves can't take it...I can take bad news looking at score online...one hit, and it is over, but to watch a 3hr+ movie with a bad ending, I can't do. I still can't believe they won. All Atlanta had to do after Jones caught ball in 4th quarter was take a knee three times and kick a field goal. Instead, Matt allowed himself to take a sack, then next play a penalty. Shanahan should take the heat for that. Now, he is off to SF. When Seattle lost to NE, it was just one bad play...Atlanta made two in a row. Funny thing is, they talk about Belichick being the wizard coach, but the reality is, he just stares down the other team, and waits until they make mistakes, especially near end of games, when it counts. Nerves.


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## melli

My drone was giving me the gears about it being too cold...no way it was 15F (lower limit of operation). So, I charged the battery, and in doing so, it heated up, to get a quick flight in. I wanted to capture the snow still hung up in trees...later in day, wind and higher temps pretty much washed the trees of snow.


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## melli

Snow is gone, and rain returned...had a windstorm night where temps soared, and we went from white to green. 
Although we are supposed to get a brief spell of near zero night time temps, concrete pour is almost a 'go'. So, I formed up some concrete post 'footings' for wooden carport posts. Seemed awfully tedious. I got cute and inserted beveled corners...wish I had router template for numbers. Insert a date mark on concrete portion of post footing (those bas-relief ones). These footings will have 5/8" rebar both horizontally and vertically (4), with a heavy duty saddle on top for wooden post. The concrete has to extend 2' from grade as a safety measure...guess folks were bringing down the house, as it were, by hitting their wooden carport posts. You'll know it if you hit these concrete footings...lol

It isn't critical I pour the posts (can pour those on next concrete order - the walls), but I always like to have more formed up than I order in concrete. Nothing worse than wasting concrete, and I always order more than I need. If I didn't need the posts, I would form up a pad, anything I could use (bobby can move it). 

One time, I either under-ordered or the concrete guy can't add (actually he was a knob - had this habit of stepping on my rebar mat, crushing it - that came to a halt on one pour...I barred him from work-site). I was pouring a monster shed pad, and I was short...a nightmare. I had expected to fill pad to rim of form (one doesn't have think when you fill to rim - a long straight 2x4 to level from rim to rim). There I am trying to level this pad (12x16) with no guide, no marks, and the concrete is setting because we had an unusually hot day. And close isn't good enough...I was an inch out or so. I spent a couple hundred bucks on self leveling concrete so I could raise level walls.

This has been a drawn out process, but I missed the Fall window...:bored:









Aside: I actually wasted $25, and bought 16" sonotubes (round cardboard concrete form tubes), and was going to use them when I realized I had a brain cramp...the home has no 'round' features, and having round footings would look 'off'. The posts will be square...


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## melli

Been almost a month since I last blabbed about my homestead! A record. 

Weather has been my foil. Finally getting spring...weeks late. Concrete footing pour slated for next week! A tad stressed as always with concrete pours...want everything to be perfect. Nothing worse than playing with forms with concrete truck idling beside you (time is money - technically, their rule is 20min per 3cu-m of concrete...anything over that time is $2/min - they are easy on the rule if your hustling to get concrete off truck). I'm getting a full truck 5.5 cu-m of 30mpa concrete. Thankfully, truck can pull right up to forms...wheelbarrow-ing 5.5 cu-m of concrete any distance or on uneven ground would be torture. One time I bucketed 1.2 cu-m of concrete up a rocky slope...one never forgets that...lol
I hired a local to help with grunt work. Always nice to have a crew, if possible, as it gives me time to pound forms with hammer (get out bubbles - just an easy tap with hammer around footing forms does the trick), do finish work and install anchors or saddles. With footings, one doesn't need to do much finishing (I do have to make sure it is level though). 

Got quote for ICF blocks for bunker ($4300 CDN/$3300 USD). Will need about a grand in rebar, and another grand for form supports. Still have to line up ICF tackle (adjustable anchor brackets so one can adjust wall after pour). Seems like a lot of money $1300 for brackets...hopefully, I can rent some. 

I am still in negotiation with utility right now (They want ROW on property frontage), and although we haven't come to final number yet, they have conceded that a monster cedar be cut into 20' min lengths, in case I get it milled. Plus, I get a truckload of mulch and a voucher for replanting. I am in a position to negotiate because they have no RoW on my land. Right now, they are seeing if it is cheaper to move line to other side of road, than what I am asking. They will get back to me with that number, as I don't think they want to move line, but who knows...
With what they offered so far, I'm of the mind, yes the extra cash would be helpful, but on the other hand, if they moved it to other side of road, I will still have a clean title, won't have to clear-cut frontage (a lot of clean-up and restore work for me), etc...They haven't offered enough to tip the scales, as it were. One tidbit of info that was comforting, as nobody wants to go to court over a ROW, is they don't invoke their ROW law on residential lines...too much headache all around I suspect. If everybody had to lawyer up, it would be cheaper just to move line. Plus, they would still have to pay me something at the end of it all. I don't think what I am asking is excessive, just fair compensation for what they want. 
Dollars are always helpful, but money is fleeting...a ROW is forever...lol


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## Steve_S

Just a tip that they should always tell you and don't... IF your pouring concrete against wooden forms, wet the wood first before any concrete is poured. The dry wood will suck the water out of the concrete while it is setting which is not a good thing.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Just a tip that they should always tell you and don't... IF your pouring concrete against wooden forms, wet the wood first before any concrete is poured. The dry wood will suck the water out of the concrete while it is setting which is not a good thing.


Yeah, I usually hose forms down before pour, especially when dry out...and in this rainforest, usually not a problem. I am going to try vegetable oil this time around...see if I can get really clean form boards. The keyway is going to be a drag to pop out.


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## melli

Reached a settlement with utility for RoW...thankfully, that is in the rear view mirror. Just have to send in paperwork, and they send me compensation. 

Suggestion: ask yourself what it is worth, not only in terms of them taking a chunk of land forever (you still own it, but you can't really use it), but what effects down the road it may have...for instance, I have narrow road frontage, so any land lost there, limits access (like putting in another driveway if I wanted to subdivide). Also consider cost to beautify frontage (bringing in soil, replanting shrubs etc.) after they clearcut, lumber lost, curb appeal, etc. I added up everything, and came to a number...they initially didn't budge but offered me survey costs, which I am entitled to anyways. Eventually we met halfway'ish. It takes time...I think if you clearly state to them what you are giving up (I itemized everything) and the time you have to spend making the area 'whole' again, they will come around, within reason. While they do hold the 'right' to expropriate land, they do have to offer fair compensation. And naturally, they want to pay as little as possible, and a landowner may want the moon. If you believe your number is fair, stick to it. It may seem like David vs Goliath, but if your number reflects reality, they will come to an agreement. They don't want to drag it out, anymore than you do. Although, I got the sense they were playing the waiting game (seeing if I will flinch). We are entitled to fair compensation. Nobody should give away property 'value' without being compensated.


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## Steve_S

I'm glad you did NOT let them intimidate you either aggressively OR passively !


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I'm glad you did NOT let them intimidate you either aggressively OR passively !


Haha, I've recently dealt with a corporation (not the utility) who, in my mind, are thieving crooks. Unfortunately, the cost to pursue legal action is prohibitive. I'd end up having to go to Supreme Court, their pockets are too deep. I might write a news story on the 'issue', see if it takes flight. 

But the Utility person handling my RoW file was actually very professional, and pleasant to chat with (I'd call her up expecting an acrimonious relationship, but quite the opposite - she was very relaxed and willing to listen). As we discussed the file on many occasions, I was waiting for the hardball attitude to come out, but it didn't happen. Only once did she remind me they have legal right to expropriate (probably to make sure I was aware of their rights). But later in discussions, she mentioned they don't expropriate over a residential line. Make no mistake, she was good at what she does, and I'm just one of thousands of files she handles. They held firm not on the initial offer, but initial offer plus survey. Then, we were at an impasse. 

We basically came to point where they were going to move line across road...but she was going to see what it cost, and get back to me. If the cost of moving exceeded my number, we'd keep line on my side. Unfortunately (poor negotiator I am), I let slip my bottom dollar number...I still feel I should have got more, but since I offered that number, I figured I ought to honor it.


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## melli

4 months of waiting over! Yahoo...First Home Concrete Pour in the books. 
Was a drag waiting through the worst winter in decades to start my bunker build. Was also a lot more effort than I envisioned. Footings are supposed to be easy-peasy...really, the easiest concrete work I've ever done in past, but this job sucked. The keyway, cross members and rebar really made it difficult to pour and finish. I had a helper, but it took the help of the trucker to get it done before the concrete set. I made sure I gave him some good lunch money. He turned what could have been a grinding job into a manageable job, albeit, it still sucked. But once done, I am happy happy...lol
Really feels good to have accomplished phase 1. 
Got an extra post support done, which I will use for monster woodshed. I'll strip post support forms (used screws), reuse and make three more for a total of four post supports (for carport section of woodshed/workshop). Always worried about whether we will have enough concrete, but we had plenty to spare (5.4 cu-m or 191 cu-ft).


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## Tomjracer

Looking good! So what's your plan for getting the keyway out?


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Looking good! So what's your plan for getting the keyway out?


Leave me alone! lol 
Going to be a drag for sure...wish I had one of those rockwell mini saws. Sawzall will have to do...then a lot of fussing. If I can just pop it (even a smidgen) when prying off cross-members, I will be happy. The keyway is beveled, so once it pops a tiny bit...

Update: a few hours later...life is good. A couple of cross members did pop up sections of keyway, but it was the crowbar that did the majority of it. I tapped all the rebar so the concrete stuck to them fell away, (wouldn't restrict the keyway from popping up) then used crowbar to pop up keyway. I think the 'key' was the keyway was beveled, and once it popped up a smidgen, it was easy to pop them up 3-4". Crisis averted. Well, maybe not a crisis, but like you Tom, I was worried about how hard it was to get keyway out. I can use circ saw or sawzall and cut keyway into chunks and easily remove now. 
I've had issues in past removing embedded lumber from forms, so this time, I figured a slight bevel would make life easier...


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## melli

Onward and upward, they say...
Will have to do some minor cosmetic work on posts...then seal and paint. Result of forgetting to tell concrete folks not to give me winter mix! An up-sell item they like to add (also known as hot water). Buggers. I get if one needs a quick set (an approaching rainstorm), but I always need time to play. On the flip-side, the concrete guy pitched in and gave me a hand (I had a helper, in addition to concrete guy). I probably should have had an extra set of hands...
From what I've read, and from my experience, the longer it takes concrete to 'set' the better (stronger concrete). Generally, it takes a week for concrete to reach 95% strength. Thereafter, it continues to set for years....never stops.

Building Inspector suggested I clad the posts with faux rock panels (good idea)...I'm just concerned about adding anymore girth to the posts, as they are carport posts, and any extra width may not be a good thing...have to mull that one over. I had thought about doing bunker with rock cladding up to waist height, so maybe doing posts would tie those into building. idk


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## Tomjracer

Looks like those keyways came out without issue! Nice work on this and I can't to see what's next.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Looks like those keyways came out without issue! Nice work on this and I can't to see what's next.


Thanks Tom...
With a little financial help from my utility  I ordered the ICF blocks ($4300), a 100 - 20' lengths of 5/8" rebar ($1100), and an assortment of lumber (for bracing, scaffold, and window/door bucks - $1100)....hopefully, I'll get the works later this week or early next week. Then I start....
Pouring will the walls will cost a penny...pumper truck, concrete crew (will require several guys and vibrator), and concrete (many cubic meters). But once the walls are done, I can go directly to framing the roof. Great thing about ICF walls, is I am in no rush to clad them (will throw up some Typar to limit UV), yet, I'll have a cosy and dry interior (hopefully before fall). Really 'pumped' to see how quiet and eventually, how efficient the bunker will be. 

I've been perusing windows and doors, and I would like to get quality on both fronts...pointless to spend all this money on ICF and have windows that transmit sound and heat. At my local window manufacturer, I came across a new'ish product;
https://www.saflex.com/en/ArchiAcoustic.aspx
Basically, they insert one layer of Saflex glass into a double pane window, and it can reduce noise by a further 50%! 
Not only that, they can be bullet and blast resistant. Also, a crook would have a hard time getting in via windows, as they are like plexiglass, but without the thickness...hard to find tech specs on this glass, but it is a three layer process. And the panes are not any thicker than normal window glass. 
At bottom of page they have a couple of demos:
https://www.saflex.com/en/ArchiSecurity.aspx

You can see a person could eventually gain entry, but it wouldn't be easy. I think anybody would sleep better knowing their windows are bullet, blast and forced entry resistant. Hopefully, they are not priced out of my reach. My glazing needs are not huge, so I'll be looking to get Saflex. My real hope is I can stand at my windows during a windstorm, see trees swaying and branches flying, but I won't hear a thing...lol
RV living really highlights the need for a quiet house.


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## Tomjracer

I actually have a concrete vibrator here, and if it wasn't so heavy to ship I would send it your way to use.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> I actually have a concrete vibrator here, and if it wasn't so heavy to ship I would send it your way to use.


Thanks for the offer! Problem as I see it, is I need pros for pour. I am capable (in terms of concrete work, albeit, none in ICF), but I need several capable folk (at least 2 or 3), which are not to be found, as they are all working on crews. Maybe I can find one other (he offered to do pad finishing work as he has a power trowel, in exchange for firewood)...I'm guessing since he works on a concrete crew he has pumper truck pour experience. And if he can rustle up another qualified guy, then I could make it work. I can rent a vibrator.
Problem with a concrete crew is they want oodles of money...or at least the boss of the crew does...lol
As long as one does proper lifts (no blowouts), pouring walls is easy...no 'real' finishing work involved.

You got me thinking...lol
Although, a ways off before I need to really think about it. Still trying to come up with a adjustable bracing mechanism. Supposedly, ICF walls should be poured with a slight lean inward, as the pour wants to bow out walls. I find it hard to believe, but that's what the manual says...and getting these adjustable brackets will cost me $1300! I tend to brace everything beyond spec...just my nature. Having a blowout during a pour is the last thing I want. However, I feel confident in bracing walls true, so they won't budge, especially for a 6" wall. Maybe they rent these adjustable brackets...

As I mentioned, I have no experience with ICFs, so without that experience, just getting a crew with ICF pour experience might save me some headache.


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## melli

Got my LEGO blocks! Didn't realize how bulky they are...lol
We have spring windstorms, so I had to strap them down...lest they blow into the forest. Nice to have my fingers on them...
Now, I can begin. 
















Just stuck a chunk of 5/8" rebar in there to see how it fit...snug.


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## ForestToFarm

Those blocks look great! I always loved playing Lego's with my son. Your gonna have a good sound house.

I have heard where termites and ants will bore into those type blocks and make a home. Do you know if that is a real problem or just a rumor?


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> Those blocks look great! I always loved playing Lego's with my son. Your gonna have a good sound house.
> 
> I have heard where termites and ants will bore into those type blocks and make a home. Do you know if that is a real problem or just a rumor?


Not a rumor, but an issue in certain cases. First, for termites, this map tells you if your in a 'hot zone'. I'm not...
http://www.epsindustry.org/building-construction/insect-infestation

If I were to have an issue, it would be with carpenter ants. However, they could only affect the exterior foam, as the concrete wall pretty much stops them and everything else...Plus, most issues, are when EPS foam is used over wood, which won't be much of issue for me. They burrow through EPS to get at the wood (food), preferably damp wood.
Now, we have to rainscreen our homes, and at the bottom, we put on bug screens or rainscreen mesh (similar to roof venting material - bugs can't get through). I'll have to be careful with window box detailing, although mine will be PT.
I've got my bunker sitting high, so water drains away on all sides. I'll do the drain tile thing, then overlay with dimpled membrane, then bury, top of which will be screwed into wall so it meets the siding detail (they won't be able to sneak underneath). I will use blueskin to seal (might use some silicon too as I hear ants nor termites like silicon). Over top of that goes bottom flashing, 2" up a bug screen, housewrap, siding. Not sure if I will need to do the full 10mm air cavity, as foam is considered a vapor barrier.

The roof will be wood...I'll be using Roxul in cavities and metal on top, with a peel-n-stick membrane under metal. As long as I do a good job sealing access points (soffit, trim), I should be good. Real important to not have a food source nearby! A neighbor had carpenter ants, and these ants dutifully crawled along house base trim to a stand of cedars about 10ft from house to get food. It seems they wintered in house walls to keep warm. I found where they entered house...all it took was a tiny hole in sheathing (house was on concrete piers). They literally crawled around half the house to get in.

From my research and experience, carpenter ants test a house every year when they sprout wings. I see them over the course of week flying all over looking for a nesting site. House gets blotted with them. If they find entry, game over. Only 1 house in 38 (in the course of ten years) where I used to live had reported carpenter ants, so they must have done a decent siding job. And they were wood homes...

BTW - I hear carpenter ants eat termites...
Also had carpenter ants get into RV...that was worrisome, but I sprinkled diatomaceous earth around perimeter, and that stopped them cold. Freaked me out seeing these huge ants crawling around inside! I'd be watching TV, and a massive ant would be crawling up my leg.


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## ForestToFarm

Unfortunately we live in one of the worse areas for termites and there are ants everywhere as well.


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> Unfortunately we live in one of the worse areas for termites and there are ants everywhere as well.


Bummer. Will have to seal house well...
I think Hawaii takes the cake. ..I recall seeing homes wrapped up completely airtight, then they'd release a bug bomb inside and wait a day or two. Hawaii has some monster bugs.

Not too bad here as long as one takes reasonable steps to not let them in. Building practices have got a lot better since my youth. I recall looking at a rental home with parents and we opened a bedroom door...corner was floor to ceiling carpenter ants! Will likely never see anything like it again....a moving black mass. Freaked me out...
I find ants particularly disturbing...lol


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## melli

Actually didn't rain today...a miracle!
Decided I ought to dig in and setup some Lego...really hard to find the motivation to start a project like this...seems daunting, and that mindset is not conducive to switching on the motivation center (get cracking and get outside). Well, I got outside, puttered on other things, then thought I'll prep for the Lego job (get tools required for job)....one thing leads to another, and I got a row up. I've read the ICF manual many times, but I'll have to read it again...
Nice to see something up. Getting that 2x4 guide anchored was the time killer...took all of 5min to actually stack the ICF in a row.
Supposedly, I am to do the first row all around, make sure it is square, anchor 2x4 to inside, then proceed to 2nd row. I'm making bunker in multiples of 4' units (20'x36') so I don't have to cut any blocks on first course...and second course, everything is offset by half a block so seams don't line up. Hmmm, it appears I wouldn't have to cut anything, if I had no windows or doors.


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> Unfortunately we live in one of the worse areas for termites and there are ants everywhere as well.


Oh yeah, you reminded of fire ants...not sure if you get them in SC, but I 'discovered' them in some god-forsaken bayou in Louisiana. Got off an airboat onto a dock and put my hand on top of a post to steady myself. I felt the tingling, but figured it was the rough texture on top of post. I pull my hand away, and the feeling wasn't going away...lol
I look at my hand, and see these buggers chewing on my hand...I dispatched them in short order. Was left with a hundred or so red bite marks...thankfully the palm has thick skin, or I suspect it would have really hurt. My first intro to LA bugs...downhill from there...


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## Tomjracer

So are the blocks glued together or taped? 1 row of horizontal rebar per course?


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> So are the blocks glued together or taped? 1 row of horizontal rebar per course?


No, first course is just set cheek-to-cheek...supposedly, I can glue them with spray foam to concrete, but since I am using 'batter' boards (2x4 guides anchored to concrete), I don't have to...I'll probably do both, but with foam adhesive. 
The 2nd course does lock into first course, as does every course after that, so it should be pretty rigid. 

Yep, one row of rebar per course, on alternate sides of center, with two rows of rebar at top. The horizontal rebar location would change if one side was backfilled (ex - in-ground basement). Since this is above-ground, I'll just be alternating on either side of center. 
BTW - I am using 5/8"/15mm rebar which is quite a bit heavier (35% heavier) than spec (1/2"/10mm). The weight of rebar should help when I pour. One issue is concrete wants to lift up ICF and spurt out bottom...I guess that is why they spec foam and/or batter boards. Once I'm done bracing it to kingdom come, I don't think I'll have that issue. 
I will be bracing all openings, and corners with ICF straps.


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## ShannonR

Wow, Melli, your build is looking good! It's amazing to see the progress you've made to your slice of heaven. I envy your building skills... Following the ICF progress closely, hoping to learn something that'll be useful to me later!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Wow, Melli, your build is looking good! It's amazing to see the progress you've made to your slice of heaven. I envy your building skills... Following the ICF progress closely, hoping to learn something that'll be useful to me later!


Thanks Shannon...I'm flying blind here, so hold your praise until concrete is placed...
Nice day to get some more done...got the batter boards done all around and first course laid...I'll have to chop out garage door and door (both are only going to be about a 10" off footing - blocks are 16" high).
Have to make a mess of rebar corners (90 degree elbows), and make framing for doors and windows, so progress will slow a bit.


















Tomjracer - I noticed the bottom course has little notches on outside, which lead to channels inside (interlock mechanism). Will be easy to spray foam in there, and it should hold first course down. You can see a couple of notches on post #212, first pic. I was wondering how in the world I was going to do that without having to lift a block, spray the bottom and stick it down (would be a mess!). Being able to spray with block in position makes it easy.


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## melli

Finished first course, 7 more to go...the first one, I think, will be the toughest, as I procrastinated for hours (maybe days), on high/low the entry points ought to be, and I've never cut ICF blocks before, so was mulling over my options (cut in place with circ saw, or table saw). Table saw won out (of course, it cuts the Styrofoam like nothing is there, but the plastic webbing was a concern...it cut it easily without 'chunking' bits of Styrofoam off). Table saw was used for ripping cuts (long horizontal cuts), and hand saw for cross cuts (vertical cuts - see those indentations in SF...they act as a guide for hand saw).

As for height of entry points...if one goes high, it means a lot of backfill. If one goes too low, it means you can only use so much underslab (concrete) insulation. You want insulation to meet the ICF wall. I think I decided on 4" of XPS foam or Roxul Panelboard for underslab insulation. I might bump it up to 5" of insulation and go with 4"+ of concrete for slab.
The big entrance is in case I want to convert it to a garage down the road...also thought it might be nice to have french doors there in meantime...undecided as to what I'll put in that opening. Whatever I do, I would like a good R value solution.

You can see the plastic webbing (see 2nd pic door opening)...it just terminates near edge of ICF. The wide plastic 'wedge' is used to anchor siding using screws.


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## ForestToFarm

Looking good.

I think its smart of you to take your time and think it through. 

It is taking us way longer than we desired to get started building but on the positive side we have changed our plans for the better I would say.


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> Looking good.
> 
> I think its smart of you to take your time and think it through.
> 
> It is taking us way longer than we desired to get started building but on the positive side we have changed our plans for the better I would say.


Thanks!
I have a tendency to over think things...then after the fact, I regret not thinking of some way I should have done it. In the end, it comes down to whether I want a home now or decades down the road...lol
Ideally, I would like Roxul to come up with an ICF solution. They have panelboards with good psi numbers...just need to figure out how to get the plastic webbing in there. That would be the 'ultimate' solution for me. I was chatting with building inspector about it today. I am just too soon. This Styrofoam solution isn't all bad, as this particular stuff has minimal off-gassing, but Roxul would be one of those solutions that would last lifetimes, and no rodent would ever find Roxul habitable, and ants or termites couldn't destroy it, unless they are rock miners. 

Yep, I would spend most of your time thinking pre-build than during the build....of course, I'm new to ICF, which makes me nervous, but the great thing about building your own place, is the ability to make changes along the way with minimal fuss. Being your own contractor has it's rewards. Plus, I am a stickler. This sucker is way over-engineered, and I'm ok with that. At the end of the day, I want this mini home to feel like a refuge from all mother nature can throw at it. I've been in highrises when earthquakes have struck, and it isn't a pleasant feeling (I was napping and initially, in a groggy state, thought someone was in my closet as the doors were banging) or wood framed home (brand new) that shuddered in windstorms (hard to relax when the whole house vibrates). When I was a kid, on prairies, we had a blizzard that moved the walls like a wave. We have to be careful we didn't pinch our fingers between couch and wall as each gust closed the gap. Surreal. We were kids and thought it as a game, but deep down I was wondering if this house would stay in one piece if we got a real good gust. I want none of that as I approach retirement.


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## melli

3rd row almost up...have to make a decision as to height of windows. I'll likely take a while mulling that one over...want them low enough so one can easily see out while reclining on couch, but not too low that furniture will block a portion of window...hmmm.
I like being able to make things up as I go along...lol, but I will overthink it. How high is a normal kitchen table?
Being in RV doesn't help me...
I marked where all rebar is on interior, so when I insert verticals (when all rows are up), I will know where to put them (they just need to mate reasonably close, but not be tied together).

BTW - I mentioned the possibility of cutting the Styrofoam in situ but take that back...haha...when cutting Styrofoam you leave a mess of shavings, which I don't think you want in forms. Easy to pull them off and cut on side.


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## melli

Lots of mucking about today...I decided to get door bucked in (frame), so I don't damage the foam every-time I step through and to give myself a reference so all the window tops match top of door (supposedly more architecturally pleasing to eye, than windows offset from door) Plus, I want to anchor the buck to the rows as I go up...debating that idea. I could anchor it after the pour. The manual says to put a mess of nails around outside (cross-hatch pattern) so the concrete will lock it into place...I didn't like that idea at all. For starters I want the wood (PT) not in contact with concrete at all (so I wrapped the outside with 6mil vapor barrier). I was going to use long 1/2" 'L' anchors. Drill a hole and stick anchor through bucking, then tie the anchor with rebar wire to the plastic webbing of foam. I will inset anchor, so it isn't protruding from face of bucking. This way, it would be easier to remove bucking down the road if I needed to repair/replace them...plus, anchors are much stronger than nails. 

You can see the bottom of the living room windows have been notched. I used my worm saw this time. Works like a charm, although the foam bits coat the saw...hmmm...hopefully the bits don't get inside saw and melt. I found my Stihl blower cleans up the foam chaff really well. BTW - be careful you don't drop anything in form...can be tricky to get out...

You'll also notice the sills are 2-2x4s...this is to allow the concrete to be poured below window and doors. The rest of the bucking is 2x12 PT wood.


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## ForestToFarm

Looking good.


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## melli

Fourth row...
I better get cracking and get some bracing up before a windstorm blows it all away. 
I took some pics of the anchoring I was yammering about in previous post. Figured this way is more 'elegant' than a pile of nails. 
And it will serve a 'small' service in holding window and door frames in place when pouring concrete....

I'm never happy with quality of materials for building stuff, and the ICF I got is no exception. It seems most of the damage is from poor handling...in my case, they tossed onto a flatbed without sweeping off pebbles/debris, so bottom layer is scored and pot-marked, not to mention full of rust. They accidentally gave me 'adjuster blocks' which had a 2015 date stamp! One can see if these blocks stay out in sun for a few years, they look like crap.


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## melli

Not a lot happening the last few days...just rain, except today. And putting in the interior 'batter' boards, and some vertical bracing was about it...and I went nuts with a can a spray foam first thing to get all the gaps, seams etc. 
Those horizontal 2x4's are not in the manual...I figured since I will have to put them in when I do interior (they will support a 2x4 wall for service runs - electrical, plumbing, etc), why not put them up now and they can act as bracing. Not sure if it is kosher...concrete guys will let me know. 









BTW - those vertical braces are 12' tall...wall will be about 10' max. 

While it was raining, some time in Bobby was in order (full cab with heat). Those forms I used to make the carport posts will be reused to make a workshop carport/woodshed (half carport, half enclosed shed). I will place them properly, anchor them, and get some rebar in them. As I mentioned before, always a good idea to have 'overflow' forms. When I do walls for bunker, I always *over order*, as one never wants to be short...and the excess can fill these forms. 









Instead of strapping (cradling) the completed form (far one) from underneath (I was lazy and it was raining), I just stuck a 5/8" bolt through saddle on top and used chains to haul it into position...heavy concrete block! Bent 5/8" bolt like spaghetti, but didn't break.


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## melli

Finally got the windows sorted....all the bottoms cut out. Really was a head scratcher, in terms of deciding appropriate window heights, especially for Kitchen windows...how far off counter? Did I want a back-splash, and maybe I want to raise counter-tops (as I am a tad taller than average). If I raise counter-tops I have to make sure I have windows high enough....blah blah blah. 
I went to a couple of houses in hood and measured their window heights. I settled on 43-1/2" (finished height). But it depends on what I do with floor as to exact finished height...lol
The bathroom and 'bedroom' window heights are same as kitchen (just easier to be the same as kitchen). 

Took a interesting pic down the ICF row....








In my seismic zone, we are required to have double row of rebar around all openings (windows). They have to extend about 26" past opening (for 5/8" rebar). I screwed up the living room windows, as I was trying to snake rebar with row complete (a real hassle)...I realized one can just put in window pieces (removing rest of row), then it is easy to slide rebar in. Doh! I was wondering what the manual meant when it mentioned this step. Now I know. 









Things should progress more smoothly from here on out...no thinking involved, except making sure window boxes align with top of door. Just need a few nice days (windstorm tonight). Speaking of wind, for those folks on the prairie where it blows 24/7, really secure your works (not only building site, but Lego pieces yet to be used). A good 30mph gust will send these suckers to the next town.


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## melli

Was supposed to be gym day, but when your staring at a construction site and a sunny day, I thought better of playing hooky. Besides, getting window boxes in sort of had me excited, until my back started screaming at me. Those PT 2x12 window boxes weigh a ton, and doing the overhead lift is not my strong suit (hate doing weights - I am a treadmill hamster).
And then I had to secure them, as we seem to be getting minor wind events. Still, very glad I pushed through. Now, it is all lego, and building a scaffold.


















Oh yeah, you can see a tiny drain hole (wet spot) in concrete footing in last pic, about halfway across garage door entrance...no idea if having keyway full of water during pour would really hurt it (probably not), but the water was bugging me, so I drilled a 5/8" hole from keyway to outside.


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## melli

The Lego build has slowed a bit since I got 6 loads of screened sand. Had to cover up a slash burn and hump in hill. I am pushing it for planting grass, but since we've had a late spring, I planted seed. Since my property is on top of a hill, it was virtually all BC rock. I try to scrape enough money together to buy a few loads once or twice a year. Keeps me entertained (with Bobby), and over time, my hilltop will be under feet of dirt. This one spot was bugging me...








Wanted to round out hill...

















Three loads for that spot...makes a difference with screened material. Raking is so much easier...lol

Back to the ICF...got most of the verticals in place...just a matter of making a catwalk at the 5th row level, so the concrete crew can pour (half the building will go to 7th row (to accommodate attic floor), and half to 8th row). 








As you can see, I'm on the fifth row (far end done). Rain day.


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## melli

After getting sidetracked with dirt and rain, back at the Lego build. Had to get up a scaffold....which is so tedious. 
Now that it is done, I can continue...2 more rows to go for one half, and 3 rows for the other half...

BTW - I ordered these adjustable alignment clamps for ICF walls...get them next week. As I was chatting with seller, it turns out he sells Nudura, another maker of ICF. He flips me a link to their product. http://vancouvericf.com/nudura/whyNudura.php
Why I discover these things after the fact or halfway through build is beyond me, but I would have gone with Nudura in a heartbeat. Many pluses with Nudura over Plasti-fab and prices are similar. The one knock I see with Nudura is they use what appears to be XPS (off-gassing foam). Nonetheless, their locking system is what every ICF maker should have (keeps form aligned, no floating and no settling). Just something to mull over if your in the market for ICF. 

















My building inspector will be proud that I made the worksite safe with railings...lol
All these wonderful worksafe regs...
If I wasn't hiring a crew, or was doing a stick frame build, I don't usually have railings, as they get in the way...lol


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## melli

7th row! For half the 'bunker', that is as high as I will be going...the half near garage doors will be 13-1/2" higher so the top of wall will match attic floor height.
A pro would have erected this in about a quarter of the time it has taken me...however, it gave me time to 'massage' the build to my liking.


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## oldtruckbbq

What are you going to use for inner and outer walls? I'm guessing your electrical will be between the foam and the inner wall and the plumbing will be in the floor. No wonder you are calling it a bunker!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> What are you going to use for inner and outer walls? I'm guessing your electrical will be between the foam and the inner wall and the plumbing will be in the floor. No wonder you are calling it a bunker!


Yeah, the 2x4 inner wall will carry electrical and plumbing (mostly water lines)...the floor will carry toilet, tub and washer drain lines. 
Probably Hardi on outside (B&B or Staggered Hardi like I did with well shed). 
Inside...no clue really. Really would like white marble in bathroom...lol
Depending on many things, T&G cedar on ceiling, some white tile in kitchen, and wood floors elsewhere...windows will be dressed with a stained wood.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Yeah, the 2x4 inner wall will carry electrical and plumbing (mostly water lines)...the floor will carry toilet, tub and washer drain lines.
> Probably Hardi on outside (B&B or Staggered Hardi like I did with well shed).
> Inside...no clue really. Really would like white marble in bathroom...lol
> Depending on many things, T&G cedar on ceiling, some white tile in kitchen, and wood floors elsewhere...windows will be dressed with a stained wood.


Hey, you deserve a splurge. White marble in the bathroom it is! My wife and I love white cabinets, black counter top, and white tile back splash in the kitchen. It looks sanitary and ageless.

Just an idea - I helped a friend repair water damage and replace a bathtub. He wanted to do something special for his wife so he decided to do tile for the tub surround. In the center of the side wall he put in a tile mural he bought on eBay. It was a scene similar to this one, and it was pretty neat for under $100. She said it made her feel like she was on vacation every time she took a bubble bath. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-por...753064?hash=item3604eb2428:g:zw8AAOSw0kNXhUZY


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Hey, you deserve a splurge. White marble in the bathroom it is! My wife and I love white cabinets, black counter top, and white tile back splash in the kitchen. It looks sanitary and ageless.
> 
> Just an idea - I helped a friend repair water damage and replace a bathtub. He wanted to do something special for his wife so he decided to do tile for the tub surround. In the center of the side wall he put in a tile mural he bought on eBay. It was a scene similar to this one, and it was pretty neat for under $100. She said it made her feel like she was on vacation every time she took a bubble bath. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-por...753064?hash=item3604eb2428:g:zw8AAOSw0kNXhUZY


That is pretty cool. 
I do like the minimalist look, as I will clutter the space. Whatever I do (can afford), thin grout lines. I did have glass tile back-splash (3x6) I installed on my old place. Liked that, but was a pain to install (really hard not to chip tiles when cutting even with thin kerf glass tile saw blade). This pic is when I had a horrible camera...back in the day. 








I think I'd like off white counter-tops (Corian). I need bright colors in kitchen and bathroom (not a lot of sun in winter). 
Light stained wood accents and maybe wainscotting in living room/bedroom. No painted wood! Never liked the idea of painting wood...give the living room a soft cosy feel with lots of stained wood. 
I can't think that far ahead....lol. Need to finish the Lego and get concrete in there...do the drain tile, and get a concrete floor laid, so I can motor on my own.


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## melli

Getting close to completion...lots of fussing blocking around windows and doors, and bracing. I got these Nudura wall alignment braces...very skookum (as we say up here). Solid galvanized and heavy duty. I practiced with one, and tilted the wall with ease. 
My missing corners will arrive tomorrow, and the walls will be done. 
Be a mad dash to the finish line...


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## melli

In a bit of a holding pattern...it seems they sent me too many left handed corners, and then I messed up and ordered more by mistake, and then they messed up by sending 8" corners (a week per mistake)...doh!
Hopefully, by this weekend, I will have it done less mickey-mouse stuff (plastic and taping things to protect wood from concrete pour). Was hoping to get pour in before June, but not looking good...maybe first week in June. 
As you can see I am trying to make garage door entrance as big as possible, in case I need to slide in RV for another winter (god, I hope not!). Was kinda hoping to sell RV this fall. Best time to sell an RV (not for vacationers, but for folks looking to beat paying rent).


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## melli

DONE! (sort of) - Felt good to get all the missing bits before long weekend, and like a kid at a candy store, I felt obligated to rip them up (on table saw) and get all of the Lego installed (what you see, is all there is). 
You can see the 'step' on top row...the lower part will be attic floor, and the top of that floor will align with higher step. So, when it comes time to put up a wall on the high side, I won't have to mess around framing in a step. The roof will be shed style (single sloped roof). The high side will have 5 transom windows up high for more southern light (1' x 3'). 
My dad thinks I should bump up roof so the attic storage area can become a bedroom. Would be nice, but it adds another 5k or so...where do I stop? lol
Then, with a bedroom, I'd be inclined to have balcony doors and a deck on second floor...another 5k....
The big issue I have, other than spending more money on a 'temp' home, is I will lose a bit of insulation value in second floor, if I bump it up (it will have wood framed walls). Also, it defeats the purpose of having a concrete bunker (upper floor becomes a liability if a tree whacks it). Still, the extra room would be huge (as would having a second floor deck). Hmmm, I just thought a cantilevered deck would be awesome...just 6' x 16'. It would shelter door and kitchen window. 








You can see RV (26') scaled up against build. 


















About a day or so of bracing top, figuring out where to put all the anchors (mark them so concrete guys put them in right spot), spray foaming and gluing all the natty bits, and finishing the corner straps....
I've called a concrete crew and pumper truck dude to have a look and give a quote. $$$$
Initial estimates (my own) for amount of 30mpa concrete required is about 12 cu meters ($2500). Big money day.


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## melli

Things fell into place quickly and the pour is tomorrow. I got a crew and a pumper truck...hopefully, I won't be a spazz. 
Love concrete, jut not a fan of working it. I usually end up completely exhausted, and soaked. 
Fingers crossed...


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## painterswife

How will you be vibrating it?


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## melli

painterswife said:


> How will you be vibrating it?


Apparently they (Concrete crew) won't be...they will add a plasticizer to concrete to make it flow. Speaking of which, I should call them up and ask what type they are using.
Even the pumper truck guy said a vibrator was a recipe for disaster. Yet, the manual specifies it. I have one on hold at rental shop nonetheless.
My #1 concern is voids. I'll probably be banging the walls (have a 2x4 on wall, then whack it with hammer...gently).

Edit: after some quick googling, it appears high slump admixture (plasticizer) is the way to go...looking at this report http://www.icfmag.com/documents/PCA_Consolidation_Report.pdf
it is apparent high slump admixture is the way to go. They did mention using a vibrator helped, but I have no issue paying an extra $11/cu meter for admixture.
BTW - thanks for bringing it up...made me look into it a little more and feel better about the crew...lol.


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## painterswife

A vibratory is recommended. I have witnessed the results when one was not used in icf's. No concrete in areas. Often under doors and windows. Expensive mistake to fix.


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## melli

painterswife said:


> A vibratory is recommended. I have witnessed the results when one was not used in icf's. No concrete in areas. Often under doors and windows. Expensive mistake to fix.


Yeah, I can only imagine...would be a nightmare. So, I've been doing some research, and called concrete company to supply plasticizer info....MasterRheobuild 1000 (can't upload the brochure on it for some reason). 

Was researching ICF void issues last night, and found a report; see page 8 and 9 (pics), 'high slump' concrete (with plasticizer, not water) wins hands down. 

Ironic you should mention voids under doors and windows...it was the areas the concrete guy suggested we vibrate.


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## melli

Concrete Day Over!
What a relief...all that racket. Must have been a dozen folks milling about and all the trucks whirring...not sure what job some of them were doing. Rep from concrete supplier showed up...a gong show. Highly recommend plasticizer in concrete...flowed very nicely. Did have a breach (semi-blow-out), but I frantically threw a good dozen boards on it with clamps. Odd, as the area was well secured. Might have been because they did a 6' lift in one pass...doh! I wasn't happy. Being a Friday, they wanted to fill it up and go home. They saw my grimace and tempered (slowed) their lift rate, and all was good. 
Note - Lift Rate - for ICF the manual specifically states no more than 4' high in one pass. Then, you wait about 15-30min, then make another 4' high pass...this is to allow the concrete below to stiffen so your not exerting to much force on ICF forms. If you do a 10' high pass in one go, the force at bottom will blow out an ICF form in a heartbeat. 

Concrete boss man was apologetic and all, so I can't be too upset (plus he trimmed his bill). Stuff happens. Flipside, is that all the concrete went in the 'hole'...more than I expected, so I doubt I have void issues. Was really hoping for extra to fill post footings. Maybe next time.


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## melli

Post-Mortem - One learns a lot after a ICF concrete pour. First, if you need a crew, find a professional one. I got the sense this crew was more interested in the beer I was serving after job, than the job (hence, the 10 guys who showed up). Actually, one guy mentioned I wasn't serving until 'I' was done, with a chuckle...I smiled. Everybody was loafing around while I washed all the concrete off my ladders and the interior woodwork. 

I'll admit, concrete work isn't glamorous work. I got to chatting with a young gent, and he admitted he liked the job because it paid well. But, I felt like I was watching one person with a partial clue, and 9 folks standing around watching. And using your fist (pounding on ICF to detect concrete) to measure height of fill doesn't work very well, hence the partial blow-out (suggest a long stick, like a 2x2 or 1x1). And the partial blow-out was on a corner double strapped (only a single strap was required per manual). Thankful, as the double strap kept it from completely blowing out...can see pic below - looks natty, but the corner is square. A little shaving, maybe 3/4" off foam, add some foam in crack, and will be like new again (inside shows no signs). However, I was frantic trying to contain it...I get that way with concrete (pedal to metal). A dozen boards later and 50 screws, and 'I' had a pretty good 'finger in the dike' solution. As I finish slapping together a quick fix, I notice not a soul around me...was weird. They had all taken off to find shade under a tree or play on their phones. 

They took it slower afterwards...but we still had issues on top row wanting to float even though it was screwed to verticals...I think what happened is the wall compressed leaving the top 'hanging'. Wasn't serious, but one can clearly see a 1/4-1/2" gap between top row and rows below. Bottom 3 or 4 rows were tight. It didn't seem to change height of wall, and after some measurements today, along the long walls, there is a 3/8" max separation difference, which is pretty darn good in my book. I took a 6' level and got level all around...will take laser tonight and do a better survey. So, all-in-all a fine result. 

I wasn't pleased with the 'finishing' either, and I specifically asked the interior be left as clean as possible...both items were done poorly, but they had time to make a 'shark' out of the pumper truck concrete they were cleaning out (I kid you not). I spent two hours on grinder smoothing out their finishing work (Should have done it yesterday but I needed a light day). Grinding works well within 24hrs of pouring. Need full gear to do that (glasses, mask, earmuffs). 

As I mentioned, a good plasticizer made a world of difference. It allows one to go slower on pour, and on ICF, slow and steady wins the race. Plus, watching the flow in forms was a welcome relief. It was almost like pouring water...the concrete enveloped all the rebar like a glove. I've worked with non plasticized concrete (all I've done until now) and it is a night and day difference. I only paid an extra $10 per cubic meter for it too...food for thought on future pours. 

I also think I over did it on bracing and whatnot...the horizontals were not needed, but I figured since I was going to build a dummy wall on interior, why not throw them up (support both horizontal and vertical direction). Obviously, the corners needed bracing...they are really the weak link (no cross webbing in corners). I still have a few screws to pick up, but so far I've picked up a gallon pail of them from form stripping. The scaffolding will come down...pretty easy work. The adjustable bracing wasn't really needed either...once you brace your walls plumb, and anchor the bracing down, it was all good (that is, I didn't have to adjust after pour which really was the purpose of the fancy adjustable brackets). 

I decided I have to get a floor in there next...will make life so much easier to do the roof. I'll keep scaffolding supports intact, so it will be easy to reassemble. With a clean floor, and easy walking, I can setup shop inside. I'll need to do exterior drain tile first so I can raise grade, and allow Bobby to haul dirt inside...I just need to raise floor height 6" or so. I've scoped out a good deal on 3" EPS Foam. I'll stagger two layers (glued and taped at seams), then poly and rebar. 

Lastly, would seriously consider Nudura for anymore ICF jobs. Since they lock together, separation isn't isn't an issue. Plus, corners are reversible (held me up for almost three weeks waiting for right corners). Just have to research if there is any issues with webbing. 



















I love the solid thump I hear when I pound on walls! LOL


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## AmericanStand

Pretty awsume it looks and went far better than I expected.


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## melli

AmericanStand said:


> Pretty awsume it looks and went far better than I expected.


Thanks!
I don't deny I was pretty stressed about this ICF build...how will it turn out, will it blow up when we start pouring, etc. It is typical of me to expect the worst, then in reflection, realize it wasn't all bad...lol
Of course, no one will ever know if I have any gaping voids (unless they come up with a cheap radar for checking these things), but it seems to me the super-plasticizer, at the very least, filled in everything, and if there are voids, they are minor. And with the 2220ft of 5/8" rebar, I have to think this sucker isn't going anywhere. Had a chuckle with Building Inspector about the poor sap who might have take it down one day, many decades or centuries later...all that concrete infused with a rebar lattice. 
I've done a fair bit of stick framing, but nothing like this. Once I frame in garage doors and get a roof on, this mini home will be a fortress. Yesterday, it occurred to me, I have bullet proof protection (not that it is an issue around here). I also tried to make an echo inside...nothing. Foam deadens any noise. 

Onward to drain tile...I got some damp proofing on curb (bitumen based paint). I'll encircle the house with 4" perforated pvc. Then, add gravel, and cover it with a dimpled membrane coming off wall (for the first foot wall up I'll throw on some blueskin, which will go under dimpled membrane). Water ingress won't be an issue because floor inside will be higher than footings (close to a foot higher). Need to get it done, so I can raise grade so Bobby can haul some fill inside. 










The bugbear of living in sticks is lack of new products, especially for ICF. There are a few 'rubber' type paints that are ICF friendly, so one can just paint the ICF and footing in one go. Make a near waterproof exterior. My route accomplishes the same thing, albeit, slightly more expensive (Blueskin (peel-n-stick rubber membrane) costs a fortune).


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## melli

Drain Tile Install - needed to get drain tiles done, so I can make a dirt ramp into bunker. Pretty easy job, other than wheelbarrowing the gravel around bunker. Bobby did fill wheelbarrow, so it went quick. Most places would put geotextile around pipe or some gravel and pipe to keep out silt and clay....I have neither. I will be putting some dimpled membrane on top, coming off wall. Will be an impervious layer. Since I am on a hill, on bedrock, this sort of thing is kind of silly. I'll never get a flood, unless the ocean rises 300ft. The Building inspector said gravel was good enough, but the pipe was cheap, so why not. I called him to inspect, but he was tardy and I had covered pipe by the time he came...lol. I should have texted him, 'nevermind'. He did seem a tad putoff (an act), so I said he could dig...then he threatened to use Bobby...
Most places, the BI absolutely insists on seeing drain tile, as it is the key to a dry basement. 
Rather curious to know how much the walls weigh so I calculated it...about 80,000lbs (incl rebar), plus about 6,000lbs for footings. Wow.


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## melli

Drainage Part 2 - weather finally broke and it was dry enough to put on blue-skin (peel-n-stick rubber membrane). Once I got that on (tedious), I slathered some more foundation goop (liquid tar) on bottom seam of blue-skin...pretty much making cold joint waterproof (where the footing and wall meet can be an issue since they are poured at different times, setting up a cold joint which can leak.). I had to put on some dimpled membrane to see how it looked. Never worked with this stuff (Superseal). Really like it. Threw in some fasteners to hold it in place, then the top trim piece. Very skookum (and cheap!). I just did the garage door side, as continuing was getting too messy...I need the foundation goop to set a bit. Once I get that membrane installed, I can backfill all around bunker. You can see how any water falling near house will be shunted away from footings and no hydrostatic pressure can form against wall with dimpled membrane, never-mind drain rock and pipe. 

Note: I think this foundation drainage setup is overkill for me, as water will never ever reach top of footings. If your in a place with high silt/clay content, the only thing I'd do differently is landscape fabric around perforated pvc pipe or pipe and some gravel. 


























I'll install drip flashing over the top edge of blueskin and slightly covering top edge of superseal top cap. This way, not a flea can get to ICF foam.


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## melli

Bobby would love this as a home...maybe one day...
Had a track flip off, then noticed I need a new roller and idler....hmmm...
Be nasty if I lost track inside bunker.


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## Steve_S

Melli, your doing an amazing job - very impressive indeed... As for the overkill, like the drainage tile... you are over thinking it my dear, seriously... look at it this way, it's better to plan for a more severe potential than to underestimate (kinda like under estimating your enemy before declaring war)... sometimes dealing with the twists Mother Nature can toss at ya, is like having to do combat... Secondly, this is stuff that you can do now but imagine not doing it as well and two years later your sitting there cursing up a storm with Should've, Could've, Would've and being miserable about it.... Toss all that into the "Peace of Mind" bin and keep tossing goodies in there.

I tell folks that if your pouring a concrete floor, for goodness sake, put in Radiant Pex too ! Even if your immediate plans don't include radiant heat at this time, don't hobble what you cam do... BTW... heated floor in a shop is a God Send, especially in winter when you gotta wrench on some nasty piece of busted machine... Radiant heating in a home is AWESOME when done right and with all your thermal mass - could be a big win. My cabin is Radiant Equipped with 7/8 PEX in the slab, even my pump/powerhouse has 1/2" radiant pex in the slab (both slabs are full FPSF foundations with R20 foam [which is double code requirement]).

BTW: I got my Cabin Radiant System from http://www.radiantcompany.com/ who are out of Vermont. I have to say, the quality of parts, the assemblies / built plumbing headers and everything are TOP NOTCH and borderline artwork... I am still pondering something there (I have a slight steam punk bent). I even got my Takagi TH3M On Demand heater from there for the Radiant System, best deal out there !


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Melli, your doing an amazing job - very impressive indeed... As for the overkill, like the drainage tile... you are over thinking it my dear, seriously... look at it this way, it's better to plan for a more severe potential than to underestimate (kinda like under estimating your enemy before declaring war)... sometimes dealing with the twists Mother Nature can toss at ya, is like having to do combat... Secondly, this is stuff that you can do now but imagine not doing it as well and two years later your sitting there cursing up a storm with Should've, Could've, Would've and being miserable about it.... Toss all that into the "Peace of Mind" bin and keep tossing goodies in there.
> 
> I tell folks that if your pouring a concrete floor, for goodness sake, put in Radiant Pex too ! Even if your immediate plans don't include radiant heat at this time, don't hobble what you cam do... BTW... heated floor in a shop is a God Send, especially in winter when you gotta wrench on some nasty piece of busted machine... Radiant heating in a home is AWESOME when done right and with all your thermal mass - could be a big win. My cabin is Radiant Equipped with 7/8 PEX in the slab, even my pump/powerhouse has 1/2" radiant pex in the slab (both slabs are full FPSF foundations with R20 foam [which is double code requirement]).
> 
> BTW: I got my Cabin Radiant System from http://www.radiantcompany.com/ who are out of Vermont. I have to say, the quality of parts, the assemblies / built plumbing headers and everything are TOP NOTCH and borderline artwork... I am still pondering something there (I have a slight steam punk bent). I even got my Takagi TH3M On Demand heater from there for the Radiant System, best deal out there !


Very nice Steve. I've seen a few homes with similar systems. And the prices don't look too bad (under example quotes). 
I'm sticking 2 layers of 3" of Korolite Type 2 insulation under slab (R24), which is almost silly for a coaster like me. The under-slab insulation will tie into wall insulation, so concrete pad is completed isolated from earth. 
One thing about the Radiant systems shown, is they are gas...no gas in my place. I have a thing about gas...lol
But, you bring up a good point...maybe I'll lay some radiant pex at least...down the road I can hook it up. My budget is toast. Not even sure I can make lockup by winter, which would be a travesty. I don't want to scrimp on window and door package (one of my key must haves - uber quality). No point in putting crap on good. Would defeat all the effort with ICF if I had so-so windows/doors. 
At any rate, I have to face reality...running out of cash/credit...lol
Well, I can always go to bank and get more...god knows they've been pestering me with money offers. Thing is, I've been roughing it in RV so I don't end up grossly in debt. I hate debt. I have a laughable mortgage right now (can pay off in years, not decades), and I like it that way. Folks never like to talk money, or how much in debt they are, as it seems to be verboten to speak about. I know so many folks who are really mortgaged to the hilt, and I used to be like them (maybe not as bad), and life sucks. You don't really own your place if you owe the bank 50% or more, the value of your place. Your renting. Sure, you have equity, but it can only be realized if you sell. This is another reason I started from scratch...pay as I go. 

The real bugbear is I have equity in RV and shipping container, both of which, would put me over the top to get into bunker this winter. But I can't sell either until I have made it to lock-up, plus some some plumbing, electrical, etc done. Well, still early in year, so we shall see...


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## Steve_S

I run LPG (propane) as there is no N-Gas in my region, I chose propane as a future consideration because I would like to have my own biogas generation and that can feed LPG devices without too much furtling. Mind you I have 3 heat sources - 3 power sources etc... Rule of 3 applied to all things... most important when rural & may have to survive without outside assistance for a bit...

You have an advantage that I do not, your in a warmer area than I but that is no excuse to go light... Murphy's Laws will apply and your doing great there ! You may not realize it, but a Radiant System CAN be run from Solar w/o gas.... There are commercial Solar Collectors which are pricey and other means, you do not have to use a gas fired heater... What are you doing for Hot Water ? Not an Electric Tank I hope ! (they should be banned IMO).

You are one handy person and not afraid to tackle a task... May want to look at http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/WaterHeating/water_heating.htm Maybe you can apply / incorporate ideas from there... I have a couple and will be experimenting with more when time affords it.

Re budget... no credit, no financing, nada here.... just cash which has been saved up and a small settlement that is vanishing and soon to be a memory... after that only my small disability pension which should get me through the last few years... You see, I know (roughly) when my Best Before Date expires, they said 5-7 yrs in 2014, seems they got it fairly right as things are going as expected. Everything I am doing / have done is in my sweeties name and all hers, this is my "mark on the world". Whenever I feel down, I peek at the news to remind myself that things could be a heck of a lot worse in my lot, so forward ho, we go !

HUGS Melli, your doing GREAT and remember to pat self on back for your perseverance & every task accomplished. No small feat your accomplishing there.


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## melli

Thanks Steve! May your 'expiry date' be a hoax...
Yeah, I've seen stuff like that...an off grid neighbor was looking into it..even had the tank.
I was looking at pop can solar radiant heating...would be easy and cheap to make. Would be perfect for outbuildings...just keep them above zero in winter. All that stuff will have to wait. I do plan to experiment though...no doubt about it.
Got the scaffolding removed...really makes the space feel larger...I need that! lol
Also, took the time to enjoy why I am here...
















Approximate view from kitchen window.

Need to get fill level to top of footing...








With Bobby KO'd I'll have to go in straight lines only...should be manageable.


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## melli

Bobby was able to limp along and fill my bunker...albeit, he left some metal bits lying on ground...lol
Yesterday, it was the ball bearings, today, pieces of the bearing race. C'est la vie.
Got the Korolite Type 2 foam 3" 4'x8' sheets (will put on two layers) ordered (be aware not all foam is rated for under-slab use - some cheap stuff will compress too much). BI came by and being an ex plumber he wrote down what I need to rough-in the plumbing. I think I drive him nuts with me second guessing him. I like everything above concrete where possible, but he likes everything in the dirt. At any rate, not terribly complicated this plumbing job.








Foam and concrete will put me just at door height to right there...

BTW - I put drain rock along footing under fill. They say it limits hydrostatic lift if water gets under footing.


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## melli

Plumbing rough-in:

Up north we have to use ABS for Drain-Waste-Vent piping (I think down south you can use PVC). At any rate, ABS is pricey, and I was stuck on bathroom layout...spent last night staring at an imaginary bathroom deciding what should go where...tis wonderful being able to choose, but sometimes I get into a run-time loop, and the stress levels climb (having stuff under concrete is a one shot deal, unless you like jack hammering your floor). After a crappy sleep I get to work. 

Sink and Toilet up against far wall, then in middle, the P-trap for tub (one of those freestanding tubs), and in foreground, a P-trap for floor drain (where washer and HWT will sit), and the washer drain to left. The trench off to left is for kitchen sink drain (not installed - waiting for a 22.5 degree coupling). The Building Inspector came by and everything looked good to him, but just in case I pop up attic floor (make it a bedroom or attic with headroom), I might want a toilet up there, so I will extend 3" line (one that reduces to 2" halfway down) so it ends up in bathroom wall (near floor drain). I'll put in a wye and 45 degree coupling, then put a plug on it. 
Even if I never use it, it will make a good clean-out. 
This is an example of tub I'm thinking about;
https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p....on-whirlpool-bathtub-in-white.1000845238.html


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## melli

A better pic...with adjustments (now I have to glue it all together and pressure test it). I need a break...lol. 
Thankfully, it is going rain tomorrow. So hard to step away when my bunker stares me in the face in every morning.


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## melli

When I said pressure test, I was confused...meant to say water test (plug drain end and fill it up with water). So far no leaks...I go a tad crazy with glue. Those orange caps were supposed to be leak proof but either user error or just a bad cap (one leaked). Anyways, doesn't matter as the shortest riser (vertical) if filled to top will check all fittings. Wouldn't say this test is pointless, but being under dirt, 3 layers of poly, 6" of foam and 5 inches of concrete...hmmm. It will self seal eventually...lol
But a tight install means no gas and the water test will highlight any fittings you failed to glue.
Yesterday, I almost had an aneurysm, as I put one of the reducer couplings on the wrong side of a wye (Y). Once you glue these suckers, there is no undoing...well, of course, the store didn't have any left. In frustration I took a sledgehammer to wye...sucker didn't crack! I hack-sawed the wye, then pried the reducer bushing out, sanded off glue, and voila!, I was back in business (how I didn't wreck the reducer is beyond me).

Click on pic to see an enlarged pic (can read the text).









Oh yeah, 'max' slope on horizontals 1/4" per foot...


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## melli

Water still standing in pipes, so I guess I never screwed up. Await foam and rebar delivery on Tuesday...finished off skirting bunker with membrane.


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## melli

My foam must be taking route 66, as I haven't seen it. So, while in town running errands, I figured I better pick some lumber, as there is no way in hell I'd order $50 boards (Douglas Fir 2x12x20') and hope they'll bring me good stuff. We have several saw mills, and the lumber yard orders from most of them, and depending on where they got it, some pallets can have primo lumber, while the next is crap. If the sawmill is getting their stuff from loggers who are razing new or old cut blocks, or even pine beetle forests, it makes a difference in quality. On this particular day, they had a nice pallet to pick through. It makes a difference if your working with good stuff, as you have less crowning, splitting, checking, bowing etc. to deal with.

And since the lumber arrived before the foam, I figured I should put up the attic floor. I wanted to work off a concrete floor for framing, but putting up a floor isn't too bad on compact fill. Plus, attic floor will provide shade/rain protection whenever I get concrete floor placed. Some folks like to do all the framing before putting down a concrete floor, as there is less chance of dinging it with dropped tools etc. I don't care...floor will be covered. I just want the concrete done, as it means no more crews, and trucks...lol

It felt good to do some wood work, even though the 2x12's weighed a ton. Feels like I am starting...
BTW - it looks like I am going to pop up roof over attic so it can become a room, instead of a crawl space. My budget is toast, but it'd be a waste not to utilize that space. It also gives me about 300sqft of extra room. My biggest concern is I have a wood framed second floor, which isn't as stout as main floor. I will beef it up the best I can (both in terms of lumber and insulation).

My hope is to be at or near lockup by fall (roof, windows and doors). I'll have a 'full light' (glass insert) door on second floor for a future deck off high side. This is the problem with building something...you come up with more and more ideas and additions, and what was supposed to be a modest, relatively inexpensive temp home, is turning into a full-on home...lol
My Dad (he has a wry sense of humor) put the bug in my ear over raising second floor roof. I told him if I go bankrupt it is all his fault. He texted me back, and suggested I transfer property into his name before I do...I curtly replied he can go bleep himself...lol


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## melli

This whole stair business has me in a pickle. I never planned for a set of fixed stairs. Was going to go with drop down or sliding librarian ladder, but with a usable room, fixed stairs are sort of required. Thing is, they will block fuse panel, HWT and Washer/Dryer. I can put a door on kitchen wall for washer/dryer, but there are code requirements for electrical panel accessibility, and I have no choice in it's location (where all the pipes come out of ground along wall). You can see gap in ceiling joists, I left for stairs.
Hmmm. 
At any rate, humping of 2x12's is over...lol. Just one more for rim joist, and onto blocking and plywood. 
The two at wall jog (center of building) are LVLs (darker brown), and they were the heaviest. The second floor wall will sit on those. Hard to see in pics, but there are 9 - 5/8" threaded rod poking up along tops of walls (plus a lot of sill anchor bolts). Our building code has a seismic section, and each of those rods will be extended to roof top plate and bolted down. That way if house really shakes, nothing will fall or shake off.


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## melli

Got the foam...but now I've moved in a different direction, so it will have to sit for a bit. 
Upside is delivery guy came in a monster flat bed with crane, and he graciously lifted my ply onto second floor. No biggie, but every little bit counts. Humping plywood sheets 10' up a ladder isn't a lot of fun, solo. Gave him some lunch money....


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## melli

After blocking the second floor roof, I realized I need stairs...up and down ladders suck, and a set of stairs would be nice to haul lumber up. As I've mentioned, installing stairs has caused me some concern about the electrical panel, HWT and washer locations. Up here, the electrical panel has to have 3ft clearance all around, and easy access. With a flight of stairs in front of it, going to be tough. So, I moved floor and washer drain in case I need to have HWT and Washer shifted over so I can access electrical panel. What a pain. 
Plus, I made allowances to move bathroom wall if need be...
You can see gap in ceiling...that is the 'stairway gap'. The stairs will be an 'L' shape looking from above. Up three steps to a landing, then a right turn up 12 more steps to second floor. 
At any rate, if weather clears, I can lay poly and foam tomorrow. See how much fun that is...


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## melli

Yep, working with poly sucks. Now, it isn't required to put a layer below foam, but me being me, didn't like the idea of foam on dirt. Plus, any extra layer of poly is a good thing (restricts wicking, and limits hydrostatic pressure). The downside is if rain is in forecast, which it isn't. Above foam, I believe code is 2 layers of 6 mil poly. As you can see I got the right type of foam, meant for underslab use (some foam compresses too much which can crack slab over time). 
As luck would have it, I was at garbage dump 'share shed' (where folks leave stuff that might be of use to others, instead of making our landfill bigger), and some bugger left a partial roll of poly...enough to do half the floor. Thank you very much whoever you are! (cost me a $1). Occasionally, I come across some neat things in that shed, if the regular trolls haven't beaten me to it. 









I used 'Foam Glue' to seal the poly to ICF (along walls). Special glue that won't 'burn' foam. 









I believe the Type 2 designation is what designates the foam as having a high PSI compression factor. If I recall, this foam can handle 16 pds per square inch, with 10% compression. If my calculation is right, 2304 lbs per sqft. Could drive your car on it, without wrecking it. 
I just looked up specs again, and they say one shouldn't exceed 1% compression load for long term use, which is 835 lb per sqft (5.8 lbs per square inch). And for my 600 sqft main floor, that works out to 500,000lbs. Hmmm, pretty sure I won't exceed that weight. The concrete floor will weigh about 45,000 lbs. 
Pretty sure I don't have 450,000 lbs of furniture...lol. I'll have to limit my dinner party's to about 2500 guests (assuming they weighed 200lbs each). 
And no part of the floor will be load bearing for second floor.


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## melli

Of course it rained...
Not a lot, but enough for me to spend a couple hours using the blower and squeegee. 
Then, I had a nap. Woke up and got cracking. The foam can certainly take the weight of a person walking on it. It sort of crumbles when I cut it (drywall saw seems to work the best for detail work, and handsaw for straight cuts). This is the first layer of two. 
Every seam will be glued and taped. BI came by and gave me the gears for not being done...I knew he would, or I would have filleted him...lol
I seem to be running out of joy joy. Things will improve once I get the slab poured because then I get to build stairs...


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## melli

Done with the foam! In this frantic mode to get concrete down before it rains again. 
Take a nap, let the spray foam cure, so I can trim and lay out poly (2 layers). Beginning to feel like a psych room...padded floor and walls...I'll have to commit myself to it. 
















BTW - red Tuck tape sucks on foam (good on poly). I got some dark grey Tuck tape...seems to be a lot better.


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## Steve_S

Melli, there is a Blue type tuck tape which works well on EPS-II. Something I want to point out, although you likely already know... remember to overlap a minimum of 6" and use a good caulking on the inside and tape down the exposed edge. The caulking will prevent moisture creep. Too many folks only tape and that fails after a while resulting in damp lines eventually appearing in the concrete which is a very bad thing to happen. Looks Great otherwise ! You have definitely been "committed" LMAO and now for that special touch of rubber on the walls, hehehehe...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Melli, there is a Blue type tuck tape which works well on EPS-II. Something I want to point out, although you likely already know... remember to overlap a minimum of 6" and use a good caulking on the inside and tape down the exposed edge. The caulking will prevent moisture creep. Too many folks only tape and that fails after a while resulting in damp lines eventually appearing in the concrete which is a very bad thing to happen. Looks Great otherwise ! You have definitely been "committed" LMAO and now for that special touch of rubber on the walls, hehehehe...


Yeah, I just noticed the stuff I got is blue, not dark grey (bad store light). 
What do you mean overlap 6"? The poly? 
I'm doing two layers of poly on top of foam, no seams...wall-to-wall (it is a mega roll 20' wide). 

The foam on floor has been caulked at all seams and taped (albeit, with the red tuck tape, but I'm hopeful the weight of concrete will keep tape in place). It was more for added protection from air penetration, the glue is the first line of defense....best.


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## Steve_S

Ahh great you can go without seams, that's where I was talking about. I think you'll be fine with the way you did it, hell of a lot more painstaking on the details that matter than any contractor would be.  I was lucky to get a hell of a deal on


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Ahh great you can go without seams, that's where I was talking about. I think you'll be fine with the way you did it, hell of a lot more painstaking on the details that matter than any contractor would be.  I was lucky to get a hell of a deal on


Not knocking a GC, but they operate with labor and material costs in mind, and as such, will do things that minimize labor and material costs. I'm trying to look at it from what is the best option, disregarding costs, to a point, of course. Plus, there would be no fun in doing a standard stick build job. 

Just dreading what it'll cost for super-duper windows and doors. 
Aside: I did a bunkhouse for a friend and we sourced these french doors for $700. An absolute steal (got them from window and door place - guess they were wrong size or something). Metal flange mount (not typical for doors) with 'clear' Douglas Fir interior trim. But the doors were surreal...never seen a double seal door (and not that foam stuff, rubber). Most good cars have them nowadays (double seal), but most house doors have single seal. Was like closing a bank vault. You'd hear the pshhh as you closed them. With heavy duty pins going into metal frame top and bottom when you locked it. Well, my friend just sold his cottage (closing in fall), and I've threatened to rip off those french doors. I'm guessing they are 2k retail or more. I'm a geek for that type of thing, and if had those doors, I'd see them as works of art (like a space shuttle door). One would likely never have to adjust them. Rather comical they are mounted on a bunkhouse.


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## ForestToFarm

melli said:


> Not knocking a GC, but they operate with labor and material costs in mind, and as such, will do things that minimize labor and material costs. ............................................................................................


That may be true of some people but not all. It is a very general comment about a specific group of people. We are all different. 

We (my son and I) refuse to do work less than top quality as electrical contractors. We have turned down many jobs because people wanted us do do a substandard job in order to save them money. We have even been offered top money but they just wanted low quality work done or low quality materials used. Homey don't play that. Now we can not control what light fixtures they purchase and we have no choice but to install them but then that is not a reflection on us but rather a reflection of poor choice on the owner. If they buy junk I tell them it is junk. If they say put it in anyway then that is my job as they have paid for it. We do however only use what we consider top quality stuff when it comes to rough in materials and devices, basically all contractor supplied materials. 

As far as money goes we pay a premium for better quality materials but have to compete with those who do use cheap stuff. That translates into us making less for a particular job than some other people. Profit is always important but for us quality comes first. If we can not profit enough we turn the work down as has been done many times over the years. I have several builder and sub contractor friends who live by the same rules. Don't be so quick to judge all for the low standards of a few. 

I walked away from the last job that I had working for someone else because he asked me to do things I thought were poor quality. He said if I did not do them he no longer needed me. I said so are you saying I am fired if I do not do what I consider poor quality work? He said yes. Without another word I turned and walked out the door, got into my truck, drove away and never went back. That was the best day of my working life prior to starting my own business and it was just what I needed to give me a boost to go it alone. No regrets.


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## Steve_S

Sadly ForestToFarm you are now becoming the Exception rather than the rule. I have watched "electricians" attempt to stretch wires and concrete guys toss junk into the pour (pop bottles etc) and more over the past few decades on an increasing level, therefore I now do most I can and only sub-contract as needed with supervision. Case in point, I hired a "pro" to install my chimney system (Supervent product line) and now it's another 1200 to repair the poor installation and tank goodness that Selkirk (who owns supervent brand) stepped in and is helping out with the issues. Actual real customer support - another rarity these days.


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## melli

ForestToFarm said:


> That may be true of some people but not all. It is a very general comment about a specific group of people. We are all different.
> 
> We (my son and I) refuse to do work less than top quality as electrical contractors. We have turned down many jobs because people wanted us do do a substandard job in order to save them money. We have even been offered top money but they just wanted low quality work done or low quality materials used. Homey don't play that. Now we can not control what light fixtures they purchase and we have no choice but to install them but then that is not a reflection on us but rather a reflection of poor choice on the owner. If they buy junk I tell them it is junk. If they say put it in anyway then that is my job as they have paid for it. We do however only use what we consider top quality stuff when it comes to rough in materials and devices, basically all contractor supplied materials.
> 
> As far as money goes we pay a premium for better quality materials but have to compete with those who do use cheap stuff. That translates into us making less for a particular job than some other people. Profit is always important but for us quality comes first. If we can not profit enough we turn the work down as has been done many times over the years. I have several builder and sub contractor friends who live by the same rules. Don't be so quick to judge all for the low standards of a few.
> 
> I walked away from the last job that I had working for someone else because he asked me to do things I thought were poor quality. He said if I did not do them he no longer needed me. I said so are you saying I am fired if I do not do what I consider poor quality work? He said yes. Without another word I turned and walked out the door, got into my truck, drove away and never went back. That was the best day of my working life prior to starting my own business and it was just what I needed to give me a boost to go it alone. No regrets.


Terry, in no way was I referring to you or the odd trades-person. I was referring to GC who do tract builds. I know several GC's in the hood. Some have given up the cardboard box builds because they cannot build a house they feel proud of, so they stick with high end, no expense spared builds. In some ways, it is better for them, as they get to enjoy what they do and have time to enjoy life.

But one has to admit, most GC's are tasked with building a home on the cheap. Many homeowners cannot afford a top end product. I walk around construction sites (a hobby) and see how they do things...I chat with BI, who gives me the low down.
It is the way of the world, deliver a product as cheaply as possible.

I'm glad to hear you are one of the trades-folk that care about you do, and will not take the easy road. So few of you left.

We have building codes that prevent absolute disasters, but all to often I see screw-ups or things that slipped between the cracks, as it were. Heck, my old home, a tract build, was actually built with decent materials, but I found some things that were a head scratcher, and some things that ended up requiring me to fix. I even had to fix neighbor's homes because they were in such a rush, they forgot things, like vent collar (roof leaked), sheeting underside of tub (squirrels), nailing wires, soffit not secured, house beams not anchored, the list goes on...

I even suggested to GC of tract build he get a quality control person on-board...he looked at me like I was crazy. Meanwhile, just about every owner of their new home was calling builder's insurance company to come fix something...lol

Addition: I feel like I got painted into a corner...Most GC's do build to code...they have no choice, as their work is inspected. And most of them do build to code, no more or less, which is fine, I suppose. What I call a standard build. I was just pointing out that since I am building my place, I don't have those limitations. My labor is free, so the number of hours I spend is immaterial. Also, I do have to meet building codes as a GC does in terms of materials, but I can also look at upping the quality (within reason). 
And I have, in many ways, so far.


----------



## melli

Last concrete of consequence...the floor. All of a sudden we have heat, so I had to cover roof in prep for pour on Monday morning. I'm sure I said laying poly is an absolute pain...I'll say it again. The blue Tuck tape is thicker, and stickier, but it still doesn't cling to foam as well as I hoped. And given the price, I expected better. 
Other than a few extra 5/8" bars for load point areas (bathroom walls and stair landing), this layout is to engineer specs (2' x 2' grid). I've never used 10mm bar before...always 15mm (5/8"). But this pad will see no loads like the sheds I've built. 
Keeping it out of sun while it cures is key. Exhausted but pumped I am getting this taken of before the real heat arrives. 

Those blocks are my attempt to discourage the concrete placers from crushing rebar chairs. They will throw some plywood on top to wheel concrete into the back and corners. It is a bugbear of mine, when placers crush rebar mat. It is meant to be at 2" for reason. You want rebar at least 1-1/2" off ground (bottom third of pad). It supplies the shear support when one adds weight. Concrete, of course, can handle compression load all day long, but is poor at shear strength. Rebar stops concrete from cracking (provided placed right and allowed to cure properly).

Pad will be close to 5" deep (30mpa or about 4500psi concrete). I would have preferred 6", but one can't always get what they want...lol


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## melli

I've got to hand it to the concrete crew...they killed it. They spent pretty much 8hrs power troweling (with hand troweling around the pipes) until the floor feels like a baby's bottom. Granite counter-top feel.
I would have been happy with some good bull float work (2nd pic), and call it a day, but they went at it with power trowel to the point I wonder, if I can cover it up...lol
Definitely looks like a solid 5"....was worried it might be too thin.
Whew...near broke, but a happy camper. Now, I can rest.

























Get some better lighting, and one can see how smooth it is...
There was enough extra concrete to do the carport posts...


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## melli

I just wet'ed the concreted to pace the cure. Not even a 1/8" of water on pad. 
The little bubbles-like spots are just loose dried concrete bits spun off power trowel. 
If I was to seal concrete (which I will), then apply acrylic with a gloss topcoat, I could have this mirror finish. 
I won't...be too blinding...lol


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## Steve_S

Before sealing / finishing let it dry really well and do your research. There are some really amazing epoxies that can be applied to concrete,,, from stains to full on opaque colours and topped with clears. There are DIY kits to do so and at surprisingly affordable costs but of course that can climb if you get carried away. It will take some time for the concrete to fully set & cure so your in no rush. TIP (lessons learned) be aware of what you drag onto that floor prior to sealing it... a little dirt, then boot scuffs, tire/wheel marks (dollies & whatnot) can make one get into using colourful language when it comes time to cleaning and finishing. Laying down tarps & covering the raw floor till you've sealed it, can save much grumbling... just something to ponder.

Have a peek at https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/categories/decor/paint/concrete-and-garage-floor-finishes.html

But many companies make a variety of products that work well.

Some good Ref info here BUT you likely already have this in your bookmarks,. being as thorough as you are... https://www.concretenetwork.com/concrete/interiorfloors/stained.html


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## melli

Funny you should mention sealers Steve...I bought a pail of Siloxane, then I was going to put wax on it (after Siloxaine did it's thing). Or I could go with a polyurethane or acrylic...problem with those is they wear quickly, and adhesion to fairly well polished concrete is iffy. 

Your right, I have time to think it over (and the Siloxane is returnable). 

Really comes down to whether I want to cover it up with Dri-core (R-5) or leave as is...plus, my bank account debt is growing. 
Even doing the stairs require a decision on the flooring...hmmm. 
Well, I have time to think...

Ripped off forms for last of carport post footings (workshop)...turned out better than the first batch (no cosmetic touch up needed...I 'hammered' them a lot more this time - in lieu of vibrator). Plus, we used a stabilizer in concrete which gives a person time to play. Safe to say, the carport will not go anywhere, even in the worst windstorm. 









Then I got to thinking about the stairs...decided I'm going to have partially open stairs. 2-2x12's mated with two of them separated by about 2ft. I'll veneer backside so it looks like two beams holding up stairs. The landing will be a platform with these 4 chunks of 6x8 in each corner (I've been hauling these chunks of lumber for years, thinking I've got to have a use for them one day...lol - they were part of an old development sign that eventually blew apart). I can cut off the natty bits. The idea is to give an airy feeling to a small home.


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## Steve_S

Well, on the point of staining, sealing or whatever... If cash is getting short, a good epoxy will hold up for quite a long time at a reasonable price... < $250. If after you want to cover it over with something, you haven't done anything that will interfere with it. One thing you don't want is to leave it raw, no matter what but I'm pretty sure you know that already, chuckles....


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Well, on the point of staining, sealing or whatever... If cash is getting short, a good epoxy will hold up for quite a long time at a reasonable price... < $250. If after you want to cover it over with something, you haven't done anything that will interfere with it. One thing you don't want is to leave it raw, no matter what but I'm pretty sure you know that already, chuckles....


Yeah, you got me looking at epoxies now too...lol
Too many choices. Yep, definitely want to put something on it, but in my research, you go with one product, your stuck with it. Most of the products don't like each other, much like certain deck stains. 
Due to budget considerations, I will probably go naked (i.e. concrete sealed with something), although Dri-core with wood and tile flooring would give the place a warmer feel (literally and figuratively). These new BC building regs have me pining for the occupancy permit. Technically, we (homeowner builders) cannot sell our place til one year after occupancy permit has been granted. Not that I want to sell, but an occupancy permit turns my place in a home, and I'm eligible for home owners property tax rebate, a real mortgage, and cheaper insurance. 
I'll probably need another 20-30k to dump into my bunker to reach that goal (I've already paid for most of the framing materials arriving Thursday). I need to get one sink and toilet working to get occupancy permit, plus electrical, insulation, drywall. It'll be bare bones 'complete'.


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## Steve_S

I have had a fair bit of experience with Polyurethanes, Acrylic's & Epoxies and I have got to say it, even if some may disagree but Epoxies on surfaces like Concrete, Steel win hands down for wear and durability overall. Epoxies are what they put down on industrial, commercial floors because it does last. Generally I avoid synthetic's whenever possible (says the guy who went to 9 different lumber suppliers in my region (3 towns & 1 city) and cleaned them out of ALL their Shellac)... OK I have a LOT of Red & White Pine & Cedar so, keeping it all natural... The real key for concrete is that it is completely cured, low moisture and extremely clean prior to putting your finish on. Raw Concrete will only make dust forever and that is something I can't / won't tolerate... (I have concrete floor which the concrete guys sprayed with their "sealer" - let's just say that it caused me a huge amount of drunken sailor talk and leave it at that).


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I have had a fair bit of experience with Polyurethanes, Acrylic's & Epoxies and I have got to say it, even if some may disagree but Epoxies on surfaces like Concrete, Steel win hands down for wear and durability overall. Epoxies are what they put down on industrial, commercial floors because it does last. Generally I avoid synthetic's whenever possible (says the guy who went to 9 different lumber suppliers in my region (3 towns & 1 city) and cleaned them out of ALL their Shellac)... OK I have a LOT of Red & White Pine & Cedar so, keeping it all natural... The real key for concrete is that it is completely cured, low moisture and extremely clean prior to putting your finish on. Raw Concrete will only make dust forever and that is something I can't / won't tolerate... (I have concrete floor which the concrete guys sprayed with their "sealer" - let's just say that it caused me a huge amount of drunken sailor talk and leave it at that).


Can you name a clear (satin/gloss) epoxy or perhaps a light stain epoxy brand that has proven to you to last, and resist scuffs? I'll look it up...there is so much product out there, and as we know, they are not created equal.


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## Steve_S

I used the BEHR products last with great success (even after I made a goof because I rushed). A very good friend used Epoxyshield Product in his shop (machining & welding) which has a lot of floor abuse as you can imagine and it held up amazingly well under that extreme environment. I don't know about other brands but I'm pretty sure the top names will all perform as well... BUT... lessons learned, do NOT rush and FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS ! Make no assumptions ... I did and it cost me cause I decided I could rush and well that was simply put, plain stupid on my part...

EDIT / PS: I should point, if you use only a clear, the aggregates used and various tints from the materials in the concrete itself will really pop... once the cement is dry and hard and you wash it over with water, you'll see how it will appear, well fairly close, the shine will make it pop a bit more and reflect too which changes it's character. The aggregates and sands etc affect the colours f the finished product quite a bit.


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## Tomjracer

Prep is very important if you go with an epoxy and I have no doubt you will do the research Mel. I've used the Rustoleom Epoxyshield in a garage and it just didn't hold up to warm tires. 

On my next garage I spent the same amount of time with prep and used UCoat-it. It held up well for a few years and then we started to see some wear where chemicals had been dropped and also where it had exposure to the elements. 
https://ucoatit.com/

A neighbor went with Epoxy-Coat and it was head and shoulders above these two. I will spend the extra money to go this route on my next concrete floor.
https://www.epoxy-coat.com/easy-to-apply

The members over at Garage Journal have a number of threads on flooring and I think you will find quite a bit of info to look at:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=20


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## melli

Thanks guys...just not sure if I want to throw on a clearcoat and call it a day, or go crazy with color and flakes. 
One thing that seems to be needed is a bonding coat. 
The folks really polished the floor, albeit there are imperfections, scratches (they'll probably disappear), it adds character. Plus, I may just end up covering all with dri-core. 
I mean, I've done pads, troweled them well, but nothing like what they have done (not even in the same league). The concrete surface is not rough at all...very little porosity I suspect. Smooth as glass when I run my fingers over it. 
Whatever I use, it has to bond to that.


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## Steve_S

Don't worry about how smooth it "feels" to your touch, believe me, it is still quite porous. Epoxies typically have an etching component in the mix which is a light acid that gives the concrete some tooth. Again though... coating it would be a temp solution till you have the cash in hand to do the nice flooring and you never know, might grow on you and you'll like it. Considering this is in your "house" and not a workshop, wear & tear on it would be minimal and might as well have something nice, easy to clean and that will keep dust levels down.


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## melli

Stairs:

A lot of mickey mouse stuff I had to do to prep for stairs. Had to anchor LVL to wall with 8-1/2" sleeve anchors (still coughing over that), then sister another joist to the LVLs, as it needs to be firm (supporting 2nd floor west wall). What a difference a 3-ply joist (beam) makes. Then I had to throw up a portion of wall so I could have the stair landing rest up against (be a pain to do that afterwards). Then, I procrastinated for days, on how to build stairs to account for 2 possibilities (bare concrete floor or Dricore/wood flooring). The difference is about 1-3/4" which makes a huge difference when your cutting stairs. I had numbers floating in my head for days...lol

Finally cut one stringer and mocked it up to see how it looks. Not too bad, but electrical room access is still an issue. At any rate, I have a cut stringer which will be my template for the 3 left to cut (goes much quicker). 
Whew. Like the table looking stair landing. I will dress it up down the road, but the mission is to get stairs installed so I can access roof and 2nd floor. I won't bother with the three step stairs (from concrete to landing) til later. 


















Went with a 7-1/2" rise and 9" run for stairs. The run will be extended another 1-1/2" when I put on treads (1-1/2" thick).
Stairs will look 'meaty'.


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## melli

Got the stairs tacked up...still need to get some hangers on top ledger (will be triple ply ledger). This is how they will look (open look, no risers), except I just threw on crap boards for treads (will get some nice thick hardwood), and I'll sand and stain (teak stain being my fav). 
Now, I can get cracking on second floor...some blocking left to do, then lay floor. 

















Was mildly impressed how solid the stairs felt...was worried they might be bouncy.


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## melli

One of those procrastination days. I 'just' noticed I had a 2nd floor joist that was darn near 1-1/2" proud (aka crown). You can see notation in picture. And since I had blocked all the joists at both ends, plus 'top blocked', the sucker was planted. Then, there was the fact I had no spare 20' lying around, but I did have 24' (roof rafters). What to do. After piddling around all day, I (gently) ripped the sucker out, cut a rafter down to 20' and stuck it in. Took everything out of me. 20' Douglas Fir 2x12s weigh a ton, and doing it from edge of 2nd floor was a tad dicey.
I've done a lot of decks, and checking crown is automatic for me, yet how I missed such an obvious crap board is beyond me...maybe it grew in the sun. I do recall eyeballing joists after install and happy they were within spec (the tops and bottoms aligned with each). Hmmm. Anyways, relieved I can move forward with a happy face.
Note: if you ever built decks with PT lumber you know what I mean...PT lumber is soaking wet, and one wants to install the joists as soon as one gets them or they will be fighting with warps, cupped, crowns, etc. As they dry out, they go crazy like a potato chip. But kiln dried lumber (what I am using) shouldn't go all wonky on me. I do get the occasional one that warps or the end splits, but nothing like the one I pulled today. I do try to keep the lumber under wraps to avoid surprises.










Where the red line is a mystery...according to the book of codes, I must have 6'6" head clearance on stairs. I want to put a floor over landing, so I can turn that nook into a closet or part of a bathroom. Problem is where the measurement of 6'6" takes place...I think it is from the toe of the steps. If so, I can move red line a bit more out. A 4' wide closet is almost big enough to be a walk through closet (the whole back wall will be a closet with two entrances, one at each end). I have to consult with BI tomorrow. Every square foot makes a difference.








View from 2nd floor is way better than from ground floor....naturally.










Having my chair and umbrella is a must on 2nd floor. Starting to cook.
I have to start enjoying this build...the ICF part just about gave me a nervous breakdown. I know I want to get a roof on ASAP, but I've got to chill...lol
I get too wound up to enjoy the process...must stop setting targets or I'll be in a 'facility' the day I finish my bunker. Should take some days off and go tripping on woo-woo in the mountains. When I finish 2nd floor...


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## melli

Done the second floor subfloor! - just some minor detailing left. Getting hot nowadays...even for west coast Canada. I was guzzling water like no tomorrow, and 2 lake swims to wash off sawdust.
Tomorrow is a day off! I'll go see window and door man to see what he can do for me. Praying he has these French Doors I put on a neighbors bunkhouse (I have a thing for uber quality, preferably at a beggars price).
And I'll look into Saflex glass.

Typical subfloor 5/8" T&G glued, nailed and screwed. Did splurge on 'select' ply, which has one side smooth. Makes putting down flooring easier. I'll go crazy and block plywood seams underside with 2x4s. Saw a builder do it years ago, and thought, that is a good idea (high end home).

These are pics from three corners;


























To get occupancy permit, I may just leave floor as is, or paint it. Finishing is a luxury (not required), in terms of getting that occupancy permit. No way I could live with plywood floors, but the first objective, is that permit...lol

Kind of looks small in pics, but it is quite sizable. It is about 19'6" x 18' (including stairwell opening).


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## MoBookworm1957

I can't offer advice.
But I truly enjoy reading about the progress.
Keep up the good work.


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## Mr Bond

So can you persuade the building inspector that the parasol is a structurally engineered roof?  

Great work on this place, would love to see the concrete polished but that's an even longer process!


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## Steve_S

@Mr Bond, I had planned on having my concrete works polished BUT when the quotes came in and after a few heart palpitations went another route.... Ever since it became "Trendy" with those that have too much money to know better, it raised the price for everyone.... It's a shame as I had a large variety of different coloured aggregates mixed in just for the effect that I wanted (wasted cash for that I guess).

IMO, Melli and her hard work & amazing results are inspiring... Heck if only we clone an Army of Melli's a lot would get done and to very high spec too... Hmmm... .Rent-A-Melli ??? Would you travel 3500kms for two weeks of bush bound construction work ? bet that would make a pretty Per Diem rate... Wink Wink, Nudge Nudge...


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## Mr Bond

Steve_S said:


> @Mr Bond Would you travel 3500kms for two weeks of bush bound construction work ?


 I'm in BC so much closer!!!

Concrete polishing is hard, dirty nasty work and has always been expensive unless you could find someone willing to labour for peanuts: bring on the robots for that job!


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## melli

You guys had to bring up polishing didn't you!? lol
Hmmm....have to look into that. Maybe rental shop has a machine. 

I visited my window and door store....of course, I was griping about the plain-Jane vinyl double pane windows (nothing terribly wrong with them, but Europeans have windows that make our windows look like Betty Crocker stuff)...so the owner drags me over to a corner of store and shows me some tilt and turn Euro windows. My heart dropped...these are windows! Sweetest thing I ever saw. Real SS hardware, triple pane, tilt out at top or turn in like door. Triple seal! 
Manufacture warranty = forever (well, not forever, just 35yrs). 

The same company Innotech http://www.innotech-windows.com/windows-doors/doors/terrace-swing-doors
makes doors too. And owner showed me some french doors...same deal, metal frame, bullet proof, triple seal, yada yada yada. 
He said he was going to dump the floor model but a 'guy' said he would buy them...I wanted to take it on the spot!
So, he has check to see if this 'guy' still wants them...I need a hit man (just kidding). 
I gave the owner a hug...not kidding...haha. I said your killing me by showing me stuff you can't sell me. He gets all the manufacturers miss-sized stuff, and sells them for half price, so one can have the 'best' at a reasonable cost. And all the good stuff had JUST sold. Hopefully, he will get more in. 

I mean these Innotech windows and doors screamed quality and durability. One could fill their home with water and have an aquarium...windows wouldn't burst. 
I guess this how North Koreans feel when they go to these 'display' stores and can't buy anything.


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> So can you persuade the building inspector that the parasol is a structurally engineered roof?
> 
> Great work on this place, would love to see the concrete polished but that's an even longer process!


There are limits...haha. 
Although, a tent roof cannot be all that 'unsafe'. Might be dicey in a hail storm, but we rarely get those. I suppose snow would be an issue, but just pop up another tarp...lol
I mean folks are living in Yurts. How anyone can live in a Yurt is beyond me. One has to be hardy to live in a yurt in bear country.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> @Mr Bond, I had planned on having my concrete works polished BUT when the quotes came in and after a few heart palpitations went another route.... Ever since it became "Trendy" with those that have too much money to know better, it raised the price for everyone.... It's a shame as I had a large variety of different coloured aggregates mixed in just for the effect that I wanted (wasted cash for that I guess).
> 
> IMO, Melli and her hard work & amazing results are inspiring... Heck if only we clone an Army of Melli's a lot would get done and to very high spec too... Hmmm... .Rent-A-Melli ??? Would you travel 3500kms for two weeks of bush bound construction work ? bet that would make a pretty Per Diem rate... Wink Wink, Nudge Nudge...


Haha...I have 'issues' driving 10 miles to local lumber yard. I like my prison. Ample walking area in a park like setting, 700m to local lake. In my career, I globe trotted, and while 'exciting' at beginning, it wore thinner than toilet paper. Come to think of it, this place might be the longest place I've lived in adulthood, and I see no itch to move on....to the contrary, I see so much yet to do. 
I even bailed on my Dad to reno his place about 50 miles away....lol
I feel for him, as his reno has turned into a gong show, 2yrs later, and still not done. Vancouver has one of the harshest and bureaucratic city halls in Canada. Worse yet, because of the delays, they want him to redo half the permits! Kafka.


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## Steve_S

Melli, just saw the news, entire province on wildfire alert with 138 new fires yesterday alone and 39 Celsuis temps in your spot. Thinkin about you and your safety... be cautious & safe, let us know if your in an affected area and how your doing. Did you also build a Fire Shelter for your homestead ? My brother in Kamloops built one a few years ago cause they are on that edge where too many fires happen.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Melli, just saw the news, entire province on wildfire alert with 138 new fires yesterday alone and 39 Celsuis temps in your spot. Thinkin about you and your safety... be cautious & safe, let us know if your in an affected area and how your doing. Did you also build a Fire Shelter for your homestead ? My brother in Kamloops built one a few years ago cause they are on that edge where too many fires happen.


Wow, am I clueless...haha
We have a province wide state of emergency! First time in decades. 
See the map: All those red dots = forest fires
http://openmaps.gov.bc.ca/kml/wildfire/map.html

http://globalnews.ca/news/3584056/bc-wildfire-status/

I am on the coast, and so far so good. Couple years we had a monster fire on the other side of the coast mountain range that subsided over us...a week of fog. The pic below doesn't do it justice, as to how bad it was...film of ash on lakes...bugs could crawl on lake, it was that thick. 
My guess is their equipment and manpower is tapped out, and they can't afford anymore fires. Some good pics in second link above. The interior is a tinderbox. No rain in almost a month. And a chunk of the forest is standing kindling from pine beetles killing them. 

I need hardi on my foam box pronto.


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## melli

Pony wall up....I was in a state of confusion as to placement of transom windows. The old plan had 5 transom windows evenly spaced, up high, all along south wall. With half of it now a second floor bedroom/attic with headroom, my window placements are all messed up. I was going to go with just 2 - 12"x36" windows, but it would have looked odd over the main floor windows (nothing would line up). Then, it occurred to me to go with 3 small windows lined up over living room windows...I like symmetry. 
I haven't put in the bottom sill plates for windows, as I am not sure how high to have them? Part of the issue of having ICF walls, is the walls are thick, and my additional 5" to that thickness (11-1/4"), makes the walls over 16" thick. So, when your standing inside, you have to be directly in front of a window to see out (tunnel effect). Less light enters a home with thick walls. 
The transom windows will be 25" wide, same as living room picture windows. I think I will have them about 16-18" tall so I can see the sky from a seated position in living room. BTW - Pony wall is 4' tall. 
I have seen folks angle the interior windows sills on homes with thick walls so one can see out a window from an angle. I thought about it, but I don't like the look, nor the headache involved. 
I had fab the pony wall on floor...and the length dictated I'd raise it in two pieces...even half a wall was too much for me to raise, so I call a neighbor, and 5 minutes later we have the walls up (Thank You Neighbor!). 
I'll throw another top plate on tomorrow, and put ply on. Then I can begin to install rafters! Oh, forgot I have to throw on a sill plate for other wall...no biggie. My 24' 2x12s are getting funky, and need to get them installed before they get too wonky to use. 
Nice feeling that I am getting close to putting on roof, for at least half the bunker. 


























2x6 wall, 2-2x10s glued and nailed for window headers, 2 king studs on each side of window, jack studs yet to be installed, all sitting on foam sill tape and blueskin (find the latter does a better job of keeping moisture from concrete wall from migrating up into bottom sill plate - an issue I've run into time and time again in odd reno jobs). 
Those anchors will be extended to top plate and bolted down (seismic rules here). Overkill, but I don't have to worry about getting enough insulation in this section of wall (eventually, will be 16" thick).


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## melli

Finished Framing Pony Wall - I will throw on ply now as it will be easier than later, when rafters are up (have to do it from exterior then). Whew, just a sill plate on other side, and rafter time. 
You can see what a pain it is accounting for 2" of foam I'll throw over exterior sheathing. Had to notch cut the jack stud. 
I spent some time figuring out height of transom windows, while I pretended to be sitting down on an imaginary couch in living room. Windows have to be tall enough, as the thick walls 'funnel' the light and view. I think it will look great once done and I can see stars at night through transom windows (more likely cloud/rain here).


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## melli

I've been in contact with CHMC (a Senior Researcher for Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation) about cladding a home with XPS/EPS/etc. My concern has been the sheathing...rigid insulation pressed up against plywood seems like a disaster waiting to happen. I was thinking there ought to be some ply protection as ANY moisture caught between XPS, for instance, and sheathing will rot the ply in a heartbeat. Although XPS isn't impermeable, it is close enough, especially 2" I plan to put on on 2nd floor. 
Then we chatted about drying the wall to one side...since the exterior XPS is effectively an air, vapor barrier, have to dry inward. Up here, we were mandated to used poly behind drywall which is impermeable (waterproof). But he put me onto Membrain, a poly like material that allows the walls to 'breathe' but not so much one loses R value. Sort of like Gortex. It is perfect for me as I heat in winter and cool in summer....
He then did a data dump on me...lol. Some good stuff in here.


http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/vapor-retarders-and-vapor-barriers
https://www.researchgate.net/public...Permeance_and_Condensation_in_Wall_Assemblies
https://buildingscience.com/documents/digests/bsd-106-understanding-vapor-barriers
https://www.scribd.com/document/255114059/CMHC-Vapor-Barrier-Study-Phase-II-Small
http://www.bcbuildinginfo.com/display_topic.php?division_id=8&topic_title_id=15&topicid=873


http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com...m-insulation-cause-mold-and-moisture-problems
http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com...lating-minimum-thickness-rigid-foam-sheathing
https://www.certainteed.com/insulat...tinuous-air-barrier-and-smart-vapor-retarder/

I've read most of the articles long ago, but it made me feel better about slapping on XPS onto sheathing. Looking up my zone, Marine 4-5, as long as I get foam with R10 on there, I will be ok. He mentioned folks in Alaska and the like had issues with cladding houses with foam (sheathing rot), because they put poly on interior and/or didn't have thick enough insulation on exterior.


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## melli

Just slapped up a rafter to see what I am looking at...
Takes everything I got to hoist one up (overhead pull gets me). Problem I see, is which end to start on...Have to mull that one over...
Wish I had more overhang...looking at finished 20-21" overhang. I did 2.5-3' eave on a bunkhouse and it looked kind of cool, plus the more overhang, the less the siding sees rain and well, I live in a rainforest in winter.


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## MoBookworm1957

Good Job!
Well though out, I like that.


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Good Job!
> Well though out, I like that.


Thanks MoBookworm1957! I knew in general terms what I wanted, as I drew up the plans, but with the second floor pop-up, all of that is out the window. Amazing what grief I bestowed upon myself for raising the roof, as it were. Seemed straightforward, but with a relatively small home, space is at a premium, and the mechanical 'closet' is now partially obstructed by stairs, which means things will have to get shuffled. I'll figure something out...

Spent the evening measuring roof sill plates in length, across from each other and diagonally (many times over I might add). My 'plan' is perfection...lol
If I have perfectly spaced sill plates for rafters, I can make a template (for notch cuts where rafters sit on sill plates) and just motor. Because doing each one individually for fitment would be torture and the rafter tails wouldn't line up. Normally, I do a chalk line for rafter tails after install, then cut them. That way, one gets a perfectly straight line for rafter rim board. But, in this case, it would mean installing a mess of scaffolding, which I am not keen to do right now.

I was surfing CHMC website and came across their newsletters. One particular newsletter did an expose of 'Green' Yukon homes. These homes are around 60 degrees north latitude (just shy of arctic circle). Was an eye opener. I thought my bunker was 'uber', but these Green homes go insane on insulation, like R-100 in ceiling. Their energy use is less than me in my RV! Their walls are about as thick as mine - 16" (arctic doors - two doors back-to-back - that must be weird...haha...open a door to leave, and you run into another...), and in some cases use 4-pane glass. Must be quiet in these houses. It is like having a house over top another house, in terms of wall thickness and insulation.
At any rate, I got some neat ideas. Shame I can't do their heat recovery system on septic pipe...so simple and cheap to do, but my septic pipes are all underground.
ftp://ftp.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/chic-ccdh/Research_Reports-Rapports_de_recherche/eng_bilingual/RR_Super_Green_Housing_Yukon_EN_Feb3.pdf


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## Steve_S

Looking Good Melli !

The folks at CMHC can be really helpful as long as you engage critical thinking. They have a heap of info and a lot of valuable resources as you found out. Got a few of the ideas I incorporated from them and their Northern Homes specs... (my foundation for one is for the arctic regions ;-) )

Couple of things, some lessons learned shall we say. You'd like a 24" overhang and for darn good reason ! BUT there's a catch ! You did catch part of it but here comes the loo-loo that will bite you in the rear after... MATH ! Take that 24" and ADD the number of inches your exterior cladding will add. So if your strapping with 1" thick, + siding / finish thickness, + air-space allowance... Assuming 1" strapping, 1" thick siding (I forgot what your using), 1/2" airspace. If your going with the Rain/Weather screen method... Ohh geez this could get mucky in here... Bottom line, if your adding 3" onto the current walls, remember to calc that in for EACH side, so 6" extra overall width.

Your upper Bailey Boxes for the windows... Remember to weather seal the bailey box to the wall and then after your windows are in, ensure they are really well sealed to the bailey box. (Different people use different names for that 2x4 framing). I used that method on my place because of my wall thickness + insulation + strapping & cedar (Board on Board) which added inches beyond the wall sheathing (also have passive airflow between my siding & walls - rain screen of a sort). I like Blueskin Membrane for those things... amazing stuff.

Working out your Birds mouth notches can be a pain BUT there is a simple solution here https://www.blocklayer.com/roof/gableeng.aspx Just punch in your measurements and it will do the number crunching for you PLUS provide a template. NOTE Is using 2x8, when your entering the numbers use exact numbers, so 2x8 = 1-1/2 X 7-1/2 on the form. *WARNING* Physically measure your lumber ! DO NOT TRUST the general rule that a 2x4 is actually 1-1/2x3-1/2... The larger the dimension the more discrepancy. I calculated (bad assumption) my lumber as 1-1/2x7-1/2 for my 2x8's BUT in actuality what I got from the mill was (stamped & graded) was 1-1/2x7-1/4 ! That 1/4" difference caused much drunken sailor talk !

On the Rafters:
Lessons Learned again... to make life easier for you. Once you have the birdmouth's cut and ready to set them in place there's a bit of fiddly work that can make a single person nuts. To align everything with ease, use the Simpson Ties ! It makes it much easier to set the boards in place as these provide the spots. Just make sure you measure in properly for centering the boards. ** Do use the Simpson Screws for that application. They cost a bit more but are Structural Screws, easy to drive in with 1/4 bit (supplied in box) & will pass Building Inspection... you can use cheaper or roofing nails but a good inspector would catch that No No and you know where that would lead. Dang those Sailor Talk potentials.

On my Ridge-board I used these
https://www.strongtie.com/topflangehangersssl_solidsawnlumberconnectors/rr_connect/p/rr

At the Birdmouth to Top Plate I used these Hurricane/Seismic ties
https://www.strongtie.com/rooftruss...truction/s-handh_productgroup_cfs/p/s.h-and-h

Blocking the rafters above the top-plate... The weak point for insulation / thermal transfer. After digging up photo's I'll explain what I did with them, much easier...









ABOVE PIC: BLOCKING: Used 2x8, cut down to fit angle, toe nailed down & cross nailed to rafters. Prior to install I wrapped each one and sealed that to top plate overwrap. 









ABOVE PIC: 4" ISO installed tight between rafters and to the blocking. This fills cavity 100% and spray foam sealed any gaps. The XPS Filler is between the Fly Rafters and against the roof sheathing.









How my insulation is... Helps to explain partly why I did things the way I did... With a Cathedral Ceiling things can be tricky, then add ISO (rigid insulation in) and ohhh boy, what fun. This was a complicated & burdensome experience BUT in hindsight, EXTREMELY WORTH IT. I did a variation of the Texas Cool Roof, the other side of the equation in this combo, but we already talked on that...

I wonder if anyone will get the impression of just how much I hate cold ? BUT by product, is that I am also NOT a fan of muggy hot days... Yesterday, 37C & 80% muggy outside, 22C and 60% inside. NO AC, NO FANS, all natural cooling too ! hint, the roof works !

Hope it helps and that it doesn't confuse, and if the board eats my post again... I guarantee my language will be colourful !


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## Steve_S

Ohhh, grabbed some of my pics of when I did the Bailey Boxes for my windows and made this little collage. I think it's kind of self-explanatory, hope it helps as well.


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## melli

Awesome Steve! Some pics! lol
I like pics. 
Yeah, I calculated insulation/rainscreen/siding in the mix for eave overhang (insulation being the thickest). 
And I will be will packing the blocking 'boxes' between rafters. 
The one thing I am noticing with framing on top of ICF, is I don't have to worry about using too much lumber, as I'll have 16" thick walls to work with. Lots of room for insulation. Plus, the 2" of XPS on outside. 

Like your detailing work with blue-skin on window 'boxes'. I just went with 2x10 to frame window boxes...windows will be nailed to them. It gives me the reach to be flush with foam on outside...from there, rainscreen and siding. 

Very very clean work Steve. Funny you should mention 'cool roof', as I was chatting with BI yesterday about what I plan to do between rafters. He said issue have cropped up about some roofs overheating. I'll be cross strapping top of rafters with 2x4s to allow cross ventilation because my gap to allow upslope ventilation will be minimal. But with my roof facing north (all of it), I won't get an over heated roof. Plus, I will be using a metal LEED roof (one that doesn't act like a heat sink). 

BTW - my roof slope all around will be 1:5....easy to walk on and assemble. Exact same as well shed. 
Not too shallow to have damming issues (hidden fastener metal roof). I've given up on having anything to do with steep roofs...turned down roof repairs etc., as I am getting old, and not as steady as I used to be. Hard to believe some of 12:12 roofs I crawled up not so long ago...seeing these young kids run up a 12:12 roof in runners...gad! 
Bit of a shame roof isn't facing south for solar array, but heck, I don't have the money for that (plus, where I live, we need all the light we can get in winter). I can always throw a solar array on my workshop/carport down the road (better location too). 

Yep, I'll be using hurricane ties on everything. Once the rafters are notched, placement isn't an issue with low slope...it is getting them blocked ASAP, before the timber warps beyond all recognition. One of my peeves is blocking...
I'll block as I lay rafters.


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## Steve_S

To make the roof effective & balanced, you need clear runs from the eave to the peak with airflow in from the low soffit and a venting ridge cap. I can put a piece of paper at the intake slot in the middle of the day and the vacuum tries to pull it into the roof airspace... see below:








ABOVE: 
2x4 Strapping (bottom to top) = 1.5" airspace for air movement. These are nailed through the sheathing to the rafters underneath - before insulation so we could see - only 2 nail misses that were fixed. 
1x4 Cross Strapping for Tin Roof. NB Do order the stuff with the undercoating / sound deadener. Ideal Metal calls it CondenStop here is a link, you may be able to get similar. It's a minimal extra and well worth it. BELIEVE ME !!
http://www.idealroofing.ca/english_canada/pdf/products/americana/CondenStop.pdf









ABOVE:
This is the 3" Air Channel at the bottom, over the soffit area. This allows for airflow in which heats & rises and also allows for any excess condensation which accumulates occasional to flow down and exit. Note that you see a Synthetic Roofing Underlay with gripper texture that allows you to walk on it. It is wrapped around the bottom lip to prevent water issues on the wood or osb. Allows the Sheathing to breath a bit but not let moisture in. But more than Tar Paper or others but again, well worth the extra little bit. It's one of those, "do it right the first time" things... 

OSB on Roof... I was hesitant BUT did go with it because after some checking & lots of discussing, decided to use a T&G Water Resistant version and while a tad heavier, it was the right choice. Apparently this is not avail everywhere, dunno why. It can also be used as floor sheathing in Washrooms because of that (Alas I have concrete).

BTW: I'm an A-Typical Anal Retentive Virgo which I have managed to control for most things but when building my place I allowed it freedom to be picky, fussy and getting it right. Most everything I have done myself & by myself with a few items had been subbed out (concrete work and laying up the roof - I can't do that anymore).

For Readers:
I mentioned cool roofs and I believe somewhere way back in this thread I "may" have put links but darned if I remember and won't go furtling through the history. Here are Two Links which really do explain the concept & implementation very well & simply... This is from a Company in Texas BUT this similar method is described in GreenBuilding Advisor and others but discussion / description can be - well not that readable.

http://www.houstoncoolmetalroofs.com/cool-roof-information/cool-roof-design-texas/
Below a Video @ YouTube which explains it too.


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## melli

BTW Steve- can you hear anything below a roof with 7.5" of ISO/XPS, ply, air gap, etc? 
I use the thickest roof sheet metal they have at Makin Metals. 
http://www.makinmetals.ca/products/galvalume (Copper Penny is my color). 
Haven't noticed much noise in buildings I've done with thick sheet metal. Even with 2x8 rafters. Mind you, we don't get the torrential pours folks do east of Rockies, and rarely do we get hail (if we do, tiny ball bearing size). 

Really like the cold roof design, especially sistering 2x4 on rafters (makes them stronger, like the top of an 'I' beam). 
I won't have the gap you do, given my whole roof is canted north and our summer heat isn't in your league. My ply will go over horizontal 2x4s strapping rafters. Engineer and Building Inspector are stuck on that...I have my reservations, not from their venting concerns, but strength. Ply right on rafters (the skin), is what gives home's their torsional/shear strength, but I like the 2x4 cross members in terms of a tree falling on roof. We had a woman die in a windstorm (in the city last fall) because the tree fell on side of gabled roof, in between rafters. Once it bypassed the rafters, nothing to stop monster tree slicing through second floor. Also why I have aversion to engineered trusses. Light and strong in a seismic event, but forget about anything heavy falling on roof. 
Wish I had the dough to go with LVL's for rafters...be killer strong (and they are perfectly flat). Only 70% more in price...lol


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## Steve_S

Believe it or not, yep, I can hear the rain (albeit very little & it's pleasant), the tin expanding and contracting, well that's annoying somewhat but that's tin... Given that I went with Forest Green which is fairly dark & my place is aligned East to West so I have one side with full south exposure, that makes it heat up, even with the Big Pines shading the roof. I'm in Mixed Forest with mostly Pine & Cedar. When Hail hit's it though... well the first time I heard it echoing I was like *** Is going on NOW ! Thousand Chipmunks tap dancing on the tin ? (9/12 pitch - NOT).

I'm a bit confused about your description... 
Are you talking about a Shed Roof versus Gable ?
They want you to install the Rafters, then lay 2x4 as cross battens and then your Sheathing attaches to the 2x4's ? Leaving space between the rafter top & the sheathing ? And where is air management / venting ?

I've seen that on Sheds where the tin is attached to the 2x4 cross braces at 16oc but where there is no insulation or anything under it so airflow, condensation etc is moot. 

I'm hesitant to ask but what are you insulating your roof with ? That will definitely determine how the venting / breathing / vapour management is handled. I'm hoping that you have no intention of using Fiberglass Batts (Gawd Awful stuff)... Please say Roxul or better.

If using a "Foam Board" I have some painful (couple of $$) lessons learned I can share, especially before nailing any rafters down.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Believe it or not, yep, I can hear the rain (albeit very little & it's pleasant), the tin expanding and contracting, well that's annoying somewhat but that's tin... Given that I went with Forest Green which is fairly dark & my place is aligned East to West so I have one side with full south exposure, that makes it heat up, even with the Big Pines shading the roof. I'm in Mixed Forest with mostly Pine & Cedar. When Hail hit's it though... well the first time I heard it echoing I was like *** Is going on NOW ! Thousand Chipmunks tap dancing on the tin ? (9/12 pitch - NOT).
> 
> I'm a bit confused about your description...
> Are you talking about a Shed Roof versus Gable ?
> They want you to install the Rafters, then lay 2x4 as cross battens and then your Sheathing attaches to the 2x4's ? Leaving space between the rafter top & the sheathing ? And where is air management / venting ?
> 
> I've seen that on Sheds where the tin is attached to the 2x4 cross braces at 16oc but where there is no insulation or anything under it so airflow, condensation etc is moot.
> 
> I'm hesitant to ask but what are you insulating your roof with ? That will definitely determine how the venting / breathing / vapour management is handled. I'm hoping that you have no intention of using Fiberglass Batts (Gawd Awful stuff)... Please say Roxul or better.
> 
> If using a "Foam Board" I have some painful (couple of $$) lessons learned I can share, especially before nailing any rafters down.


Haha, yeah, shed style roof. No gabled roof. 

*Roxul all the way. *Haven't used pink in a decade, except once for a bunkhouse floor because owner wanted to save money. 

The 2x4 strapping gives cross (horizontal) ventilation (BI and Engineer's 'deal', not mine...lol)...there will be vertical ventilation too. 
Of course, it will limit how crazy I can go in terms of insulating the 2x12 rafter bays (need an inch or two for vertical airflow). R-36 no problem...R-40 would be pushing it (Roxul for 2x6 framing is R22, and R14 for 2x4 framing - 5.5" + 3.5" = 9" (2x12 rafter bay is 11-1/4"). Gives plenty of air flow for where I am (plus the 1-1/2" cross flow as ply will sit on top of 2x4 strapping). I might try to stick an inch of XPS up first, act like a stop for Roxul (don't crowd airflow path), plus it acts like a semi-impermeable layer (limit wind washing). You have airflow on top of your sheathing whereas mine will be under sheathing. I prefer your method, but such is life...

I think having 'tin' lay flat on underlay/sheathing, it dampens any noise. Kind of like a drum...if the drum has no depth, limited noise. The standing seam of tin will also allow air flow. And of course, the heavier the tin, less high frequency noise. 
Oh yeah, 5/8" for roof deck (not only stronger roof deck, but quieter). But as I recall, living on Prairies, it didn't matter what was on roof in a severe hail or rainstorm...lol. 
We had shingles, and it still sounded like the heavens were banging on our door. Rarely do we ever get that here. It is usually a light rain that persists for days. And the windstorms...but the walls will take care of that (house won't creak). 

As I think about airflow for roof systems, I sort of like the dual horizontal and vertical airflow. Also, the 2x4s will cause turbulence in 'air cavity' which might not be a bad thing. Too big of airflow channel introduces wind washing, pulling heat out of roof in winter. Not a problem for you, as your ply is below air channel, but would be for me as airflow is under it. 
It is finding the right balance...enough to keep heat out in summer, but keep warmth in winter, and keep things dry. 
Also, I think tin that doesn't act like a black body (low heat absorption) will also help. 

If money was not in play, 1-3/4 x 11-7/8 LVL for rafters (well blocked), then 2" of XPS on top of rafters, followed by a wrap, and strapped down vertically with 2x4s, then roof sheathing (5/8"), underlay and tin. I get a thermal break, plus I could put in ~R48 in rafter bays, plus the R10 in foam = R58. Would double the cost of my roof though...


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## Steve_S

Yeah, I hear you... I'm "persnickety" about things and did my homework and even brought my local building inspector up to snuff on some things.... Fortunately he's one of those that is open minded and accepts that he doesn't know everything and if credible tangible info which is supported by standards and codes is presented, he will look, study & accept it if it is within the guidelines & rules. Lucked out there ! I've dealt with other's in the past and all I can say is "Oivey" how did these folks ever get such positions... 

The new codes are coming out next year from the National Side and trickling down to provinces / territories. There are higher specs and new allowances but also taking into account a lot of the newer building materials as well as recognizing other materials from an Eco-Environmental stand point, including building methods like Cob, Stackwall/cordwood and more... So I'm told but hafta wait and see the end result...

ROXUL is really the only way if using Batts... Rockwool really wins hands down on so many levels compared to Fiberglass batts. Just for Curiosity sake, you might want to get an estimate or two on having the roof spray foamed (non-urethane / synthetic), might be surprised.


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## melli

Started the Rafters...slow going. Just humping them up to second floor takes a bit out of me. I pencil in the notch cuts and cut them on second floor with a full size template. Be nice to have half the home sheathed (can temporarily throw a tarp on it, so I am dry if it rains). This view of rafters was my original plan...all the way to end. But now, the rafters will stop halfway, and I'll put up walls for a full height second floor. 
















Had to make rafter 'tails' thinner because I am putting 2x4 strapping on top, and 2x12 rim joist can't cover a full size rafter tail and strapping (plus, one wants rim joist hanging down an inch or two, to cover soffit).


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## melli

Finished putting up rafters for middle section. Wish that was all of them....
Start on strapping the top of them and see about moving the other footing into place so I can see about raising posts and installing beam for carport. That is going to be fun. Lots of bracing involved in that operation. Will have to come up with serious scaffold so I can do all that.
You can see the pocket for the low beam (two 5/8" threaded rods coming out of wall - first pic)...and you can see the slot in pony wall for higher beam (last pic).


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## oldtruckbbq

That's going to be quite the bunker!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> That's going to be quite the bunker!


Bigger than what I envisioned...Once the carport and second floor pop up, it'll look rather sizable for a 900sqft bunker. Like the roof height from inside...I won't feel cramped. Just a ceiling fan to circulate the heat and/or those tube socks with fan (a rather ingenious way to bring down the heat in winter). Similar to this one:
https://www.treehugger.com/gadgets/...r-floor-warmer-rooms-lower-heating-costs.html
Long ago, I saw a Californian make one out of heavy cloth and a computer fan. Get some nice fabric, and it could look ok (or wrap a metal tube in fabric).

Will probably fire up Bobby tomorrow and move the carport post into position...eager to see if concrete pylon is tall enough so I can use the timber I milled with 'Alaskan Mill' (wrote about it several pages back). Be sweet to use those 9-1/4 x 9-1/4 posts. Not only save some money, but avoid seeing all that milling work go to waste. I know I am within an inch or two of making it work...


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## melli

So, was messing around placing the second concrete pillar that will support one of the carport posts. Always best to place concrete work 'in situ', as fiddling in the x,y,z axis to get the pillar perfectly aligned is silly. A little out of plumb, you fix that and now your out in x or y direction. Fix x,y direction, and now your out in z direction...lol
Mind you, if I had a helper, it would go quicker. So, I get in place, and notice a 1-1/2" difference in height from other pillar. Hmmm....I can't lower the 'moved' pillar or my milled timber is too short. Just wondering, looking at pic, do you think it is a big deal? I suppose I can raise cast in place pillar to left so it matches height of right pillar. 
I hate these decisions...will drive me bonkers knowing one is slightly shorter than another...yet, one has to look for it, to see it. 
And lastly, it doesn't matter if one is higher/shorter than another...


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## melli

Phoned around for 8x8 posts...$100 for a 12ft'er. But, they are really 7-1/2 x 7-1/2 true. Hmmm...not a big deal, but I like beef.
Plus, I have to do a 2hr trip to see them, and pay to get them shipped up to me. So, I take a closer look at my milled posts. Whip out belt sander and router. An hour or so later, I have respectable looking posts. Sort of like the chainsaw marks....
BTW - these suckers are 9+ x 9+.









I've been a bit of routering fanatic this past decade, and I've noticed, doing the edges hides imperfections 
Your eye will notice how straight a board is by looking at edge...take away the edge, and it is harder to see.
I use Sikkens 'Teak' stain...best stuff I've ever run across (they used to have the 'eco' stuff, but it was a disaster, and they went back to the original toxic stuff - lasts a spell, especially posts).


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## Steve_S

Maybe I'm an odd duck but I like to see saw cuts, live edges etc... the "raw beauty" of the wood is important top see, well for me anyways... That Teak Stain really brings out the colours and character. Toxic ?  Apply outdoors only & then your good or not for use indoors at all ?


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Maybe I'm an odd duck but I like to see saw cuts, live edges etc... the "raw beauty" of the wood is important top see, well for me anyways... That Teak Stain really brings out the colours and character. Toxic ? Apply outdoors only & then your good or not for use indoors at all ?


Yeah, can use indoors...once it dries and all the VOCs leave (Eco version was water based I think, limited VOCs). I'd clear-coat with polyurethane if I bring it indoors. Actually, thought of incorporating them inside bunker, as corner posts for kitchen entry or legs for a table/counter top. Part of me was a wee worried, as they weigh a ton.
Glad I can use them outside...although, it means I need to make two more for 2nd floor deck. Posts have to look similar...
A $100 per post (too buy) isn't all bad after the effort I went through to make them. I roasted a bar/chain in the process (didn't have right chain). 
I'm enamored with Teak stain...I've tried pretty much all the flavours. Cedar stain is too red, Oak/Butternut stain too yellow, Mahogany too brown/dark, etc... I'm with you, need to see the wood grain with a stain. Although can't tell in pic, I can run my hand over post, and no splinters...feels smooth.


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## melli

Duplicate


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## ozarkansas

That teak is a nice color! I just bought the sikkens butternut and plan to apply in a few weeks. Hoping it looks good! I guess we'll see. But great to hear that you've been pleased with the overall quality of the product.


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## melli

ozarkansas said:


> That teak is a nice color! I just bought the sikkens butternut and plan to apply in a few weeks. Hoping it looks good! I guess we'll see. But great to hear that you've been pleased with the overall quality of the product.


I've done my fair share of deck, lattice, you name it staining, and Sikkens wins on so many levels. There was a push for environs-friendly stain (water based), but if your redoing it every year, hardly environmentally friendly. Plus, some water based stains wouldn't wear evenly, and you'd be left with a blotchy deck (pull out sander). So, Sikkens went back to old oil based (linseed) formula. I find it really penetrates wood with open pores (dry wood a must). If you can, two coats (brings out a shine). I will likely stain the posts with three or more coats. Bugs will stay off. Generally, the lighter the stain, the more often you will have redo it (more UV protection the darker it is). Sikkens wears fairly evenly, so when it comes to redoing, easy. Although, I did try to stain a deck in late September, and it didn't last...seems wood was too wet, and pitch from overhanging cedars made it blotchy. Get a week or two of dry weather, no morning dew, and your in business. New pressure treated decks need almost a full summer to dry out prior to stain. 
I'm all for enviro products, but wood in the outdoors need good penetration and chemical in stain to resist mold. A neighbor used the enviro stain for soffit, and over one winter (we are in rain-forest clime in winter here), he had massive black blotches of mold munching on stain (soffit never saw rain, just moisture in air). I've even found the toxic stuff is not immune (but nothing remotely close to the enviro stain). 
Lastly, staining with Sikkens I find easy...I use a roller with a thick nap, do a section (heavy application) I can reach by hand, then take a low lint rag and lightly wipe off excess (like your using a chamois). Avoid doing in sun, and avoid drips. The rag can also be used to get in between boards if you have radius edging. I can knock off a deck pretty quickly this way. If your doing lattice, might as well shoot yourself...lol. That is pure torture chasing drips. We (neighbors) decided we'd all rather spend a weekend in jail than stain lattice (just so happened our new cottages all had cedar lattice skirting). Then we found out, one can buy pre-stained lattice.


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## Steve_S

I agree with Melli on the Water Based Environmentally neutral products... I don't see the "value" outdoors as it really doesn't last in my area as well... darned humidity ! I would imagine it would be better in a dry warm climate but that presents other issues which I dunno about... Linseed Oil is amazing stuff & at an amazing price but it is also 100% Natural and non-harmful and it lasts... 

Inside though, I am far more picky, as that is "my air" that I am breathing always... Like the numerous board feet of Red & White Pine which I generously coated with Shellac, or water based primers & paints on non wood surfaces, etc... 

Lattice... Ohhh the memories... ok, could that count as a "Trigger" ? Maybe... Painting / Staining that stuff is, well, an experience... Airless Sprayer is the only way and that needs a heap of prep work... Airless or not, vapour goes everywhere even without a breeze.


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## melli

I am prepping for carport post and beam install...I wouldn't call it a joy, but making a scaffold is one of those few times I can relax. It doesn't have to look pretty, just solid enough so I don't go splat, and the building inspector finds me a few days later pecked over by the buzzards. And the other key is no cutting, just using scrap lumber. Amazingly, it is quite solid, and it solved a question I had about how to hold a 300lb post in place while I hump up the LVLs (beam). 
I will use Bobby to lift post into place. Screw a board to post, then strap it to bucket of Bobby, and away I go. 
I need the stained posts to dry another day though, as I went a tad overboard on coats. Plus, I have to cut them to size etc. 









I also have been trying to relax a bit...I've been pedal to metal since March. So, I went on a sightseeing tour in my hood, specifically to look at building sites. I enjoy seeing what other carpenters do, and I look at every detail. Of course, many new home builds are way out of my league (million dollar affairs), and the views they offer are quite spectacular. Thing is, everybody wants a water view, so all the pretty homes are crammed along shoreline. I am a homesteader, and the thought of having a spectacular waterfront home is appealing, but being 20ft from your neighbor is not. Plus, they have no land from which to grow things. I used to have penthouse view of the ocean from a city high-rise, but all I had was a view. Couldn't play on my own turf, so to speak. 
Still, the view from this new build is compelling...









Just below camera pic is the foundation of home...I suspect they will have paid double for just the foundation work, than it will cost to build my home to completion...lol
And I am not building a shack.


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## ShannonR

Great job on the build, it's turning out fantastic!!


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Bigger than what I envisioned...Once the carport and second floor pop up, it'll look rather sizable for a 900sqft bunker. Like the roof height from inside...I won't feel cramped. Just a ceiling fan to circulate the heat and/or those tube socks with fan (a rather ingenious way to bring down the heat in winter). Similar to this one:
> https://www.treehugger.com/gadgets/...r-floor-warmer-rooms-lower-heating-costs.html
> Long ago, I saw a Californian make one out of heavy cloth and a computer fan. Get some nice fabric, and it could look ok (or wrap a metal tube in fabric).
> 
> Will probably fire up Bobby tomorrow and move the carport post into position...eager to see if concrete pylon is tall enough so I can use the timber I milled with 'Alaskan Mill' (wrote about it several pages back). Be sweet to use those 9-1/4 x 9-1/4 posts. Not only save some money, but avoid seeing all that milling work go to waste. I know I am within an inch or two of making it work...


Those hot tubes look like a great idea. Hope he got a patent!


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> So, was messing around placing the second concrete pillar that will support one of the carport posts. Always best to place concrete work 'in situ', as fiddling in the x,y,z axis to get the pillar perfectly aligned is silly. A little out of plumb, you fix that and now your out in x or y direction. Fix x,y direction, and now your out in z direction...lol
> Mind you, if I had a helper, it would go quicker. So, I get in place, and notice a 1-1/2" difference in height from other pillar. Hmmm....I can't lower the 'moved' pillar or my milled timber is too short. Just wondering, looking at pic, do you think it is a big deal? I suppose I can raise cast in place pillar to left so it matches height of right pillar.
> I hate these decisions...will drive me bonkers knowing one is slightly shorter than another...yet, one has to look for it, to see it.
> And lastly, it doesn't matter if one is higher/shorter than another...
> View attachment 60937


You could always tell people that it is an optical illusion due to the angle of the shed roof on the house.


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## Steve_S

oldtruckbbq said:


> Those hot tubes look like a great idea. Hope he got a patent!


Those aren't a new idea and so patents would be pointless. Several people actually produce commercial versions of these, one such is called "HeatStick". 

These work because your not trying to push a lot of hot air too fast, a slow constant flow makes it work best... even better is that because of that you can use cheap 12V computer fans that use so little juice you won't notice it, even off grid. Tip if building your own, use smooth round tube/pipe 3" min, 4" better, no turbulence or mixing, just move the air smoothly.


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## Steve_S

Pssstttt Sneaking another DIY into Melli's fine thread.... Heat Exchangers / Air Exchangers are an essential part of a healthy & comfortable home. These buggers can drain a wallet FAST and many are actual power hogs... off-gridders hate that but everyone should, it is your power bill being hit.

A DIY Exchanger that works, it's cheap, simple... I built one but used smooth aluminium pipe inside instead of the collapsible dryer vent piping, better heat transfer & used little rubber washers as standoff's to center the 3" pipe inside the 4" plastic one.

Here's the Link !
https://www.wildsnow.com/17884/how-to-build-air-cross-flow-heat-exchanger-budget/


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## Tomjracer

melli said:


> Started the Rafters...slow going. Just humping them up to second floor takes a bit out of me. I pencil in the notch cuts and cut them on second floor with a full size template.
> Had to make rafter 'tails' thinner because I am putting 2x4 strapping on top, and 2x12 rim joist can't cover a full size rafter tail and strapping (plus, one wants rim joist hanging down an inch or two, to cover soffit).


Melli,

Do you have any pictures of this template or when you get to the strapping/rim joist can you take some some pictures of that? Love what you are doing and love the detail.


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## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Melli,
> 
> Do you have any pictures of this template or when you get to the strapping/rim joist can you take some some pictures of that? Love what you are doing and love the detail.


My template is really the first rafter physically measured and cut...I then plop it on succeeding rafters to make my cut marks. I find this to be the most accurate way...as every rafter will be identical to the next. Unfortunately, after a few days, my template was showing signs of warping, so I penciled in a new template (not cut yet - see pics below), and threw up my original template. Ideally, you want to stick with original template all the way through.

One can pull out a calculator to calculate 'bird's foot and beak' for rafters, or do it the old fashioned way...depends on roof. For my shed style roof, easier and more precise to throw a rafter on top plates, and pencil in foot and beak using a hunk of 2x6 (since walls are 2x6). Then I pull out a level to get rafter tails vertical (plumb). Since, I was cutting rafters on second floor, it made sense. Don't want to be hauling a monster rafter with ends cut as you risk damaging them or wrecking woodwork as you hump it up top.

Aside: A gabled roof with 45 degree pitch one can do that easily with a carpenter's square...but even then, I find the physical placement and penciling more accurate, as things are never perfect in framing. An 1/8" can make a difference.

So, I stick uncut rafter on top of top plates (hold in place with a clamp). I make sure the tails are sticking out evenly at high and low ends (doesn't have to be perfect, unless you are using every inch of lumber). I decided how wide the eaves will be (as you can see in pic, I had to discount an inch or two at both ends because of splitting). I use a chunk of 2x6 and set it on top plate and slide it up against rafter...I pencil in foot and beak this way. Now, to get rafter tail, a level held vertically will get you plumb. First, I measure equal distance out from walls using a big square (tape measure will work). From that mark, I put a level (held vertically) on it, and get my tail. I also had to trim my tail underside up a few inches, since I will be strapping top of rafters. That extra height means the rim joist (brushed and primed 2x12) wouldn't hang down and cover soffit. But if I trim 'rafter tail', no problem.

Aside: I should point out the best and most accurate way for rafter tails is to cut them after installation. A chalk line with level to get plumb will get you a perfectly straight line. But, for me, it would mean building a scaffold around perimeter and cutting at height...I am lazy. Once wood is installed, like the douglas fir dimensional lumber I am using here, the tails tend to warp or bow or do any manner of things. Then when it comes time put on rim joist a week or so later, everything is out of whack.

On page 16, you can see the result. The first rafter cut is template, and second I put at far end from where I measured out beak and foot. This will tell me how accurate and plumb my walls are...since I am ridiculously 'uptight' about things being perfect, I had a perfect fit. From there, it is gravy. No thinking involved, just humping lumber, marking and cutting.

The problem I find with calculators is they are perfect and all, but if your measurements are off by even a tiny bit or your angle is off by a degree or two, your screwed. Pro framers I see, use a template like me, except they just have a template of ends, not the whole rafter. And that template can be used for other house builds with identical pitched roofs, like they did for my old place (38 homes with identical roof pitches).

The beauty with this old school way is you will have a perfect mating of foot and beak and your tails will be plumb, until they sit in sun for a few days. With roofs, doing it this way can be difficult if your dealing with great heights or heavy lumber, and some will use a calculator.



















When it comes time to put on rim joist (I call it fascia), I have THE BEST Irwin clamps they make, and they will get those tails in line if they have wandered a bit. A bit of wrangling involved. Of course, if your quick about it, after putting up rafters, throw on fascia pronto. I'm not into 'production', as they call it, so I rely on my clamps.


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## melli

Just wanted to note I ran into a metal roofer whom I've known over the years, as he has supplied all the metal roofing I have done. A real nice guy, and his work is second to none (he has a forming machine that makes the standing seam metal roof with click-lock system - hidden fasteners). He also has a 12ft brake for making flashing, and his work is flawless. 
Ok, enough pumping him, but I was chatting with him about my build and he mentioned an underlay he now uses instead of the very expensive rubber membranes out there (ex Blueskin). He uses Titanium PSU30. It is a peel'n stick membrane that can go under metal or shingles. The real plus, no sandy surface like Resisto. I've been using Resisto because it is waterproof and cheap, but I have to cover it with typar if putting on metal, so it doesn't scratch underside of metal. That costs money. 
Titanium has no sandy surface, but has a non-slip surface. Really excited to try it, as I just got a quote and it compares favorably to Resisto ($100USD for 200sqft). 
The thing I love about these underlays, is they go on super quick (in a couple hours), and instantly, you have a waterproof roof. And one can take their time saving up for metal or shingle roof (which will be the case with me...). And Titanium has a high heat resistance. 
I know some folks still use roofing felt, but this is far and away the better solution. You get double protection on roof (sort of like two roofs in one, in terms of waterproofing). Plus, it seals nails or screws for shingles and metal. 
You can read the specs here:
http://www.interwrap.com/Titanium/psu_30_main.html

I've have Resisto on my well shed, and 2 yrs later, I still haven't got around to putting on a metal roof...the roof is still waterproof.


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## melli

Got one post up! The big one...I've thrown up a few in my day, but this one was by the far, the biggest. Thankfully Bobby assisted.

First, I messed up...wanted to use other post as it looked 'cleaner' but I notched out the bracket slots on wrong side...DOH! Oh my, was I po'd. I even told myself to make sure I don't screw up on that. I even double/triple checked, but my brain had the brackets turned 90 degrees. Of all the things to mess up on...saving grace, is the post will be cut down for shorter side, so in the end, all good.

My mounting post to Bobby strategy worked but was a bit floppy, wanting to turn 30 degrees or so...next post won't be an issue being almost 4' shorter. Something about working under an excavator with a 300lb post had me nervous...it looks like a pile driver. I didn't want to get nailed, as it were.

























Looks a bit scruffy, but I can clean it up later....tomorrow I get to see if 'seat' on post up top is level with bunker seat...didn't want to ruin a fine evening...lol


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## melli

Numero Deux is up....then I fussed because they weren't lined up with bunkers seats. Then I fired up Bobby and prodded the tall one over an inch. I'm done with that...one could fuss over a 1/4", but I'll just tilt the bloody post...lol
I got some T brackets made at local welding shop...very beefy. 3/16" steel plate. Simpson Strong-tie sells tin can brackets, and I just don't see them hanging onto a 9" post, when the going gets rough. Welder was generous...for just few bucks more than SST brackets, I got brackets that will never fail. 
Looks like I need another can of spray paint, supposed to be a tad yellow. 
















3/4" Bolts going through those suckers...


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## melli

Had to get a beam up....was thinking of getting creative for beam 'tail', but I have this push for completing the roof, before I really get cranky. Best summer so far (other than forest fires in interior), but every time I step out of RV, I am soaked in sweat and sawdust within minutes. Other 8mths of year, I am wearing a toque...lol















For scale: That stubby carport post is 8' long (both 9"x9"). Tall one is 12'. The concrete they sit on, is 16"x16"x30"(tall) with 30"x30"x10"(high) footings...when I made the concrete piers, I thought, wow, this is overkill, but these posts almost make them look undersized. Owner of local pit is making up some more 'fill' for me, so I can bury the footings (on sunshine coast time).


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## Steve_S

Sitting, reading, looking at the pictures... you are an inspiration Melli and your details :TwoThumbsUp: !


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## melli

Thanks Steve!
Was working on beams this morning...joy. I manage to drop a 18' board twice...low side requires I lift board over one you saw last night, then wiggle it onto threaded rods coming out of concrete wall. One handing a 18' LVL (Laminated Veneer Lumber - 11-3/4" x 1-3/4") is murder (heavier than 2x12 of same length), and I wasn't about to go down with it. Thankfully, my scrap pile cushioned the blow and no real damage to board. Eventually, got the low side finished (3-ply), and 2 up on high side (easier, because I can scoot board along scaffold from 2nd floor, and they rest on 3-2x6 (no threading them, just lift and sit). Just one more heavy LVL, and beams will be done. I was too spent to even think about getting last one up. And at those heights, another time.
There are 2 LVLs per side...the extra board (Douglas Fir dimensional lumber - 2x12) was thrown up there for 2 reasons (not required as per plans); I can stain it teak (holds stain better), and the extra girth of beam makes them stiffer, and slightly stronger. When I just had two LVLs mated, you whack them, and they'd resonate, but not with three ply (just a thud). I don't want the carport creaking in a windstorm. I might have my RV under it over winter.


















LVL's are uber strong...really just super thick plywood (in each of my LVLs there are 15 layers of veneer glued together).
If I had the dough, I do the roof in LVLs (btw - $5.50 CDN per foot for 2.2E type).

BTW - I have to chat with engineer on deciphering the span tables for LVL. Dimensional lumber span tables are easy, but LVL lists pds per linear foot. Plus, one has to consider deflection tolerances (L/240 for carport as nobody will be living on top of it), live and dead loads, and snow load (which is a paltry 20pds per sqft for our area). If I am reading tables right, the two beams can withstand a combined 32,000lbs before failure, which works out to about 100lbs/sqft. Would take about 6' of snow to cave in roof...definitely not happening here...most I've ever seen is a foot.
Or four Bobby's on roof...again that isn't happening...lol. I have to think rafters will fail before the beams do.


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## Steve_S

I think the only way you'd see 6' of snow IF you got a big blizzard and it drifted, which is possible where your at, although not likely to happen very often... I know, I said it so now Murphy will hear it and apply his laws...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I think the only way you'd see 6' of snow IF you got a big blizzard and it drifted, which is possible where your at, although not likely to happen very often... I know, I said it so now Murphy will hear it and apply his laws...


Haha...never, unless an asteroid hits and we enter an ice age. Just too close to ocean. At elevation, no problem, but down near sea level, it usually is a good snow followed by rain as the pacific front moves in. 
We always seem to get chaos of a snowfall, then next day, gone, not a trace, except snow capped mountains. 

And we just don't get winds in the dead of winter...never a blizzard like prairies. Plus, the trees would keep the snow from drifting I'd think??? The windstorms we get are when we switch over from fall to winter weather...the pineapple express, as we call them, come barrelling in and collide with arctic air.


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## melli

Building inspector came by, expecting I'd be done rafters...bugger. I was being tardy, as I had to mull/procrastinate over things...as soon as he left, I said screw it, and put on top plate, marked it, and quickly threw up a rafter...was really keen to see if I was in ballpark in terms of alignment...can see pic below. Maybe a 1/4" out...no biggie. In framing, that is spot on! LOL
Ignore the seat space...I've been meaning to adjust template to fix that...








Tom mentioned wanting to see detail, so here are a couple where carport beam attaches to bunker. Low side, I made a pocket for beam as I needed top of beam at wall height minus sill plate height. I put in two 5/8" threaded rod during wall construction (3fters), so they are really attached to wall! Not only do they sit on concrete (have wood spacers in case I went with bigger timber), but are bolted to wall. Pretty much indestructible.
















The high side sits on three cripple studs, and I have another perpendicular to the three...I then have beam butting up against a stud. The end wall of bunker will be up against the triple cripples holding beam in place...I will probably put a couple bolts through the works. Still, I am mulling over how to make that high beam end really 'fixed'. It really is the weak link of all four corners of carport roof. The two posts have massive T brackets, and the low side beam attached to bunker is in above pics, and is solid. I'm thinking of having some sort of strut down to top of concrete wall...any ideas, I'm game?










After putting on a top plate on beam, I could mount my first rafter...








I will take a string and from the rafter put up on carport, I will attach it to end of rafter and then string it all the way to far rafter on bunker. This will give me a guide that I am mounting rafters in-line.

The issue I am seeing is carport roof...one big wing. Will see how stout it is once I get ply on it, but I suspect I will have to brace it somehow...obviously, not worried about vertical loads but torsion/shear loads if a gust of wind hits carport roof and wants to twist it. Maybe some knee braces or I may just build a 'box beam wall at end' (fill in triangle at top) or horizontal braces or diagonal strapping underside of rafters...so many options. Will cross that bridge when I get there....


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## melli

So, it turns out the shorter post is about 1/2" off plumb, with a very slight twist. Before I get busy banging on rafters, I was thinking how to move a rather heavy object (concrete pillar, with post and beam sitting on it) a bare 1/2". Using Bobby is iffy, even when I try to apply power slowly...the concrete pillar wants to shift an inch or so, and invariably, makes the pillar not plumb...not ideal for fine tuning. 
I then haul out a chunk of post left over from carport post trimming. Set it up against pillar, and with 8lb sledge, give it all I had. Amazingly, it moved...an 1/8" inch. Doing it makes a rather large noise, and I figure I'll give it a another go in morning (wake up everybody within miles) to see if I can move that sucker another 3/8". Seems kind of silly, but if moved, everything lines up and a plumb post is more solid than one canted a bit. 
Was surprised it moved at all...almost 3,000lbs to move, never-mind the resistance on bottom of pillar. 
Also was thinking a big boulder (~500lbs) with a flat edge might work too...use Bobby like a hammer to tap over the pillar. Will give muscle power a go, as it is a quicker process to fire up. 









Can see square and pencil line...


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## melli

Plugging away on rafters for carport...tedious as all hell. Find crown on 24fter, then hump template onto it, line it up (takes time), pencil it, then hump template off of it, pull and lift penciled rafter onto a board so I have clearance to cut, cut all my lines, pull out handsaw to finish (don't like overcuts), then hump it up over my head so I can rest it on high scaffold, and take other end and lift it onto low scaffold. Climb ladder onto low scaffold to lift it onto beam, then down ladder, and climbs stairs to 2nd floor then scurry like a mouse on scaffold over to rafter, and slide it over into position. Slam in 14 nails (4 through rafter on both sides into blocking on both sides, then 4-5 toenails through blocking into sill plate). Then scurry back down to floor and up ladder to do low side. Repeat....

I think blocking well is the key to a good roof. I will also block at midspan, and maybe 'ladder' block on last two rafters. I keeps the rafters from racking, and the tighter it is, the less creaking in windstorms and whatnot. Just have to be careful you don't overdo it, as too many nails (in a beam for instance, will weaken it - there is plenty of literature on nailing/screwing beams). And Building Inspector gives me crap for sinking nails too deep (flush is best). He has been to job sites where folks have put on sheathing, and he could rip it off with one hand because they over sunk the nails, making the sheathing (most important stress element on a building useless).


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## Echoesechos

Making great time. It must be nice to visibly see your daily results. Great job. Enjoying reading your adventure.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Making great time. It must be nice to visibly see your daily results. Great job. Enjoying reading your adventure.


Thanks! Glad it is of some use.
Your right, I have to stop from time to time and enjoy what I've done (which I rarely do). I'm the type who sees what needs doing, and cannot feel they are going fast enough. Have to enjoy journey and all that... And the flip-side, part of me wants to go slow, as it gives me time to check ALL the boxes. Ironic, but when I was in RV, last summer, well before the build started, I was in a happy place...lol. I had time to enjoy life. Now, it is go go go.
I am hopeful once I get underlay on roof, I can decompress, as there should be no reason to rush. A little rain water never hurt any build, but we've been so lucky to have so little. Knock on wood, if this keeps up (sunny weather), my framing will have seen maybe 1/4" of rain. Note: supposedly, I live in a rainforest.

I took the evening off, and toured a build. This is an Ocean View home. I do like those eaves....mmmm. A bit of an odd roof (inverted). No idea how they are going ventilate the roof deck...a mystery.









Realized my previous post has an old pic in it, and I missed putting in an overall pic. Here it is;


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## melli

I really thought finishing up the last of rafters was a two day job, but on a fresh Saturday morning, not too early , I banged up the rest. Anything else has to be easier than what I just did (except rafters to come, for 2nd floor bdrm).
I take solace in that I've only got 15 - 24' ft'ers left.


















Some neighbors will be coming over in a few days to have a picnic on my second floor...lol
Not quite a house warming, but they do bring good lunches...

Addition: Just throwing this out there, but looking at last pic here, the second floor will share the same roof slope as main floor, but be 10' high on this side, and about 6' high on low side. If that second floor roof eave was an extra foot wider, would that look funny/off? I don't want to go crazy, like in build I took a pic of yesterday, but an extra foot would give an overhead rain protection zone whenever I build a deck off front.


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## melli

I sort of want to hang the Building Inspector and Engineer from the rafters...I never fully thought out soffit. With their insistence on strapping the top of rafters (2x4 perpendicular to rafters 16" OC), it forced me to trim rafter tails so fascia (rim joist) could hang a couple of inches and cover soffit (soffit would be a couple inches inset (up)). I solved the issue on front and back, but the side (end) of carport is the problem. I can't hang the fascia an extra 1-1/2" higher, as I can with front and back fascia. So, when they meet up, problems. 
This problem is unique to 'shed' roofs with post and beam support. If one looks at my well shed below (2x8 rafters), one can see how soffit (3/8" ply heavily stained), rolls around shed at the same height and fascia meets at corner nicely. Not the case with 2x12 rafters. 
It is causing me to stall....how to make it look ok. For starters, the soffit (sheathing underside rafters) will hang lower in between beams in carport, than on rafter tails...that disturbs me. No way to easily fix that. Maybe it isn't a big deal, but when soffit comes to end of carport, I am in a pinch. The fascia will have to hang at same level as rafters, so no 2" 'hang'. Plus, the side fascia will not meet up with front and back fascia. What a cluster...
I was thinking I could add another layer of fascia to side to cover the top (1x4 combed and primed). I've seen it done, just all the way around house...in my case, just the end will have the double fascia. Perhaps, it isn't a big deal, but having soffit at different heights, and fascia mismatch, isn't clean. 









At least the second floor fascia and soffit will look like above pic...clean. Fascia will meet nicely, and soffit will be the same height all around. 

You can see how fascia covers the beam ends (in pic)...looks nice and protects them from elements. Any suggestions, appreciated...not sure if I explained the issue well...lol
And both the engineer and BI are not builders, so they wouldn't have had the insight, and I have never used 2x12 for rafters (builds were all small sheds/bunkhouses, not needing 2x12s). And with gabled roofs, one doesn't have this issue.


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## melli

Details - before I can go crazy and slap on roof sheathing I have to block (pieces in between rafters), strap (2x4's on top of rafters), and stick on fascia (aka - rim joist). I also wanted to make sure low side was anchored to wall. I had a few 5/8" anchors installed during pour, but felt the low wall (where rafters sit on concrete) was key to a stout bunker. If those rafters don't move in a seismic event, then everything else doesn't move either. So, I put in three strap brackets...usually meant to tie wood framing wall-to-floor or floor joist-to-ledger to keep a deck from departing house (installed horizontally). They were a tad long, but nothing a sledge couldn't cure....they not only anchor sill plate, but hang onto a rafter. Note: I will be using hurricane ties later...they can be installed after roof is done...everything I am doing is geared to finishing roof. Obviously, I'd have a hard time installing more anchors/brackets like below if roof deck is on.









Finally finished blocking - mid span - most folks may not be aware that blocking increases load strength of whatever your using to span a roof, in addition to firming things up. Some span tables will allow one to increase span if they block and/or strap. You will also note the blocks are not full height...this is to allow an airspace (~2") so roof deck can ventilate vertically up a rafter channel and the strapping will allow horizontal ventilation. 








Here is the first line of strapping at edge (will be 16" oc up roof slope)...Fascia will be nailed to this one...you can see I beveled the edge so it is vertical.









And this is my playpen for a while...much less stressful and physical environment, than humping up those rafters. The roof slope is 12/2 (engineers! - should be 2/12 - rise/run). For metal roof, no problem...I'd prefer a 12/3 min roof slope for shingles (which I am never doing again). Great thing about this slope, it is plenty for metal roofing, easy to walk on, and as you can see I threw down some 5/8" ply (usual is 1/2") so I can safely and easily walk about and do stuff. I feel safer. Being on scaffold, I don't feel as safe, even when sturdy and has a handrail.
This roof, I will be using T&G, which is not typical. In essence, the roof will be as strong to walk on as my 2nd floor (same 2x12, spacing and same ply as floor).


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## Steve_S

Hey my roof is 3/4" T&G on top of the rafters... *flip the tongue around so it can't catch water* This 2x4 thing has me puzzled a bit... Thinking of the double battens but that's not what your doing... Waiting, Watching & Seeing. TWO Thumbs Up MELLI ! Awesome work !


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Hey my roof is 3/4" T&G on top of the rafters... *flip the tongue around so it can't catch water* This 2x4 thing has me puzzled a bit... Thinking of the double battens but that's not what your doing... Waiting, Watching & Seeing. TWO Thumbs Up MELLI ! Awesome work !


I thought about it....
That 'sounds' like fun, installing T&G backwards...not that I plan to hammer them home, but even with a long block between sledge and tongue sounds like danger. And of course, delivery guys wrapped them really well, crushing groove (G) side on a few.
I don't plan to let the installed ply ever see water...picking up underlay this week.
I was also thinking the tongue (T) would slide nicely onto top of fascia.

I have to wonder how much it matters...as almost every build lays floors with this stuff, and don't fret over rain hitting them.
3/4" T&G?! I saw your roof pitch...you either have Popeye arms, or your crew hates you...lol


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## melli

Here is the first prep for the first 4x8...bit of a slow day, as the one hunk of fascia (18') took an hour plus to install...I couldn't hang one arm it over edge, hang on, and use other hand to secure...so, I came up with tie down straps to lower it into position.
Couldn't afford to drop it, as that piece of board is for show. 
Then, I mucked about putting down some strapping boards...seems I am running out of 2x4's. Hard to believe given the amount I used in ICF portion of build, but many are being used in scaffolding. 
At any rate, I'll glue top of 2x4s and slap down ply, and nail/screw. I walked on it already, and it is firmer than my 2nd floor...hmmm. 

Then, my local Raven couple showed up, and at eye level in small tree near bunker, she starts yapping at me for granola. Seems they like granola cereal. And she wouldn't let up. Then her husband starts in from afar. Petulant birds. Closest she has been to me in a while...15ft away. I gave them their lunch...now maybe I can have a nap in peace.


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## Tomjracer

Looking great Mel

Very much appreciate the detail you are showing, thank you.


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## melli

Not exactly motoring here (another excuse coming...lol)...little heat wave arrived, and the interior smoke (major forest fires in interior BC) has put a dampen on things (suppose it is like working outdoors in Beijing)...Plus, I seem to have lost my enthusiasm for walking on rafters, so I shuffle ply around a lot. My hope is once first course is done, things will pick up. Then I'll be working uphill. Can see first ply has been glued/screwed/nailed. 









I just took this pic....I like it...


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## melli

Thought it might be a good idea to bolt the post to concrete and get the T brackets done on one carport post since all that was keeping the works in place was a few screws. I spent an hour with auger trying to get through a 100yr slice of tree, and the heartwood was like concrete.
Note: I start drilling on side I want the 'nut' on (in this case, inside of carport post)....usually when drilling through thick timber, I may slightly miss hole on other side in bracket. No worries...I then drill from other side enough so I can pound bolt in, and it will follow the shaft I made coming in on first drill (guides it to bracket hole). This way, I can have bolt head on side that looks aesthetically pleasing and the nut on side where it isn't as visible.

It seems my 10" - 3/4" bolts were too short....off to the store I go...
Nonetheless, I got enough 'purchase' to hold everything in place.

The brackets were made by a local metal fabricator...~1/4" steel plate.









Oh yeah, how do I know the post is hundred years old? I amused myself, and took a pic of the cutoff piece and counted....lol
BI dared me...
I suspect the tree was about 120-150yrs old before Melli came along and knocked it over...some very tight rings. Looks like it fared well in first 5yrs, then bad few years, as rings are barely distinguishable...have to zoom in to count. Maybe other trees blocked it from sun, bad weather???
Since the tree grew on top of hill, a slow grower, as there wasn't much soil and it gets hot in summer. 








So tree started it's life in late 1800's...now I feel guilty.


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## Steve_S

You killed an ENT ! How could you, now how are the Hobbits going to get by... ;-) Lookin Good !


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## melli

Travel day....
Love sat pics...this is of my hood today. I'm pretty much dead center of pic. Can see interior fires (Caribou Region of BC) have leaked smoke to coast. Wasn't an issue until a couple days ago when winds shifted from Easterly to South-West. Can see the brown burn scars from fires...huge. The smoke flowed downhill through the valleys till it hit the coast. Some even went over top the Coast Mountains (white blotches running diagonally across pic are glaciers/permanent snowpack). I can see the north slopes of these mountain glaciers have turned brown from soot. 
I am not in the worst of it, thankfully...


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## melli

As I strap the roof with 2x4s it occurred to me that 4x8 5/8" T&G is not really 4'x8' when laid. It is about a 1/4"-3/8" (3' 11-3/4") narrower, as the tongue and groove overlap. So, I was strapping with the expectation of 4x8 sheets true. I got just past the halfway mark, and decided I ought start laying the plywood to see that the long seams lined up over the strapping. Be a real bugbear if they didn't. Glad I did, as eventually, the ply long seam would have landed on 'air'. I can adjust the strapping to account for the difference in ply width. Whew!
Besides, it felt nice to change things up and actually lay the ply...I stagger the ply 2 or more rafters apart, so vertical seams don't line up (they will line up, but after every 3 course - typical framing good practice). As I mentioned, I also strap vertically where ply butts against each other. This is so I have a nailing surface around the whole edge of ply. Plus, I glue, nail and screw each sheet, effectively making the whole roof one solid sheet of ply. There will be no wind driven creaks in this roof.
If I go crazy (may have crossed that line), and I may, I will go over every seam with glue or caulk, so the roof won't leak, even without underlay...lol


















I have to say the joy of building your own home is when you can go overboard, as it doesn't cost me anything (labor is free)...well, maybe a little glue, scrap wood and a few screws. In the grand scheme of things, not a lot, but you get a much better home, than most tract builds. They don't fuss with strapping, gluing, using thicker ply, nor T&G. While those houses are perfectly fine, they build with a labor budget. I don't. Plus, strapping (all-around) and gluing adds more roof strength, and will certainly limit wind shuddering, creaking. And since I live with trees around, there is no way in hell, a tree will end up in my bed from a windstorm. Before it even gets to the rafters, it has to cut through 5/8" ply, and a dozen 2x4s...never will happen. Worse case scenario, I get a puncture in roof.


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## Steve_S

Oh Oh... Melli, ply expands & contracts with heat & humidity, the tongue takes that little bit and the edges less so... too tight & buckling potential increases exponentially. Simply put, they should be snug, not hard & tight - the grove accounts for that in the design. I've likely laid a few thousand sheets of T&G when I worked at Guildcrest for a couple of years, lessons learned within a week. Being overly "precise" can often lead to unpleasant consequences, and I am a Millimetre precision type and had to learn in many areas that is a very bad thing...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Oh Oh... Melli, ply expands & contracts with heat & humidity, the tongue takes that little bit and the edges less so... too tight & buckling potential increases exponentially. Simply put, they should be snug, not hard & tight - the grove accounts for that in the design. I've likely laid a few thousand sheets of T&G when I worked at Guildcrest for a couple of years, lessons learned within a week. Being overly "precise" can often lead to unpleasant consequences, and I am a Millimetre precision type and had to learn in many areas that is a very bad thing...


Yeah, I was going to ramble about that....old school construction methods dictated one puts a gap between sheathing ply/osb all over house (walls and roof). Or use roofing clips. I've been there too (not my first rodeo).

The problem in the past, was twofold. First, they used less than ideal materials. Ply from yesteryear is not the same as today. Resins/glue used in ply is different. Now, I can't speak for OSB, only that I don't use it. And around here, I only see it in tracts builds. Long ago, I had some, and it promptly swelled in some rain, and sprouted mold. So, that was that...and in a rainforest...
I was on Contractor Talk long ago, and we spent dozens of pages talking about the merits of ply vs osb. The simple fact is we ran out of cheap big timber to make ply, and someone came up with an idea to use wood chips, mash them together in glue. Our osb at store is put aside, like a bastard child...lol. Hardly sells...

Funny enough, I've never had ply warping issues, except when it is not installed and gets rained on (usually 1/2" or thinner).
Second, older homes leaked like a sieve. Not so much bulk water, but vapor, and the house needed plenty of elbow room to 'breathe'.
Now, 5/8" T&G ply is the de facto standard subfloor material here. Never have I seen a floor buckle, even when house is built over winter, and the floor looks like a swimming pool (imagine standing in a uncompleted framed house in rubber boots and it feels like your in a shower). I'm sure the ply expands a bit, all wood does when subjected to moisture. I just think we have carried on a tradition because that's what we were told.

In my case, my roof (virtually a floor with a slope) will drain the bulk water right away, so not a lot will be absorbed relative to a floor. Plus, I will be throwing on an underlay asap, which will put an end to wet roof sheathing...BTW - I got the Titanium underlay! So cool. I was sitting at lumber store staring at this new product (for me), humming and hawing. I even called my roofing pro (guy who makes and installs metal roof) to get assurances if I leave it uncovered for a length of time, will it last (UV limitations). He said it would...never had an issue with it.

I am not killing it on the T&G insertion, but I am also not getting panicky about buckling. The edges as you said, are probably more of a concern, since there is no 'give'. I think it is important to use screws in these areas, especially if floor or roof deck will see a lot of rain or be uncovered for a length of time. When the ply expands it will pop nails, but not screws. Also why I glued it.

One thing I do note, is I can tell when a house was built by how many nails pop in drywall and drywall cracks...a wet built house (winter build) will always pop screws or nails in drywall, as the lumber dries out to it's final moisture content.

Aside: speaking of bugbears, nails nowadays are crap. I use a coil gun for sheathing, and strip nail gun for framing. For some reason the nails 'bleed' a lot more now (in coil nails), than in past. Even when I use arguably the best (Paslode nails). I suspect they are all made in China now, and the iron content or whatever is causing them to bleed on a humid day...lol
Of course, when working with PT lumber I use hot dipped galvanized nails.


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## MoBookworm1957

Great job Melli!


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Great job Melli!


Thank you Mobookworm. You seem to read a lot on this board.... You gave me a 'like' on another house build thread where I left a comment, one that I forgot about, so I quickly updated myself as to where they were at. Thanks. Wish I was putting in kitchen sink...lol
I'm still waiting on quote for windows and doors, which I know will be out of my price range (I have no price range right now). So enamored with Euro windows and doors. Not just a cut above typical vinyl fare...more like a digital watch vs an uber Swiss handcrafted watch. 

As I mentioned in previous post, I got this Titanium underlay. Twice as expensive as my usual stuff, Resisto, but as I mentioned, a metal roof can go right over Titanium, whereas Resisto needs a building wrap to isolate the sandy surface from metal (although, while just looking at Resisto site, they have non sanded underlays). 
The other difference is Titanium appears to be butyl based and Resisto is bitumen based. Butyl is like rubber, and bitumen is like shingles (tar with fibers). 
In essence, Titanium is like blue skin, but much cheaper, and may be more tear resistant (along with a host of good points). I cut a piece off the roll to inspect it closely. It seems to have a ripstop weave in it. I cannot rip, nor stretch it with my hands...not even close. The backside (sticky side) reminds me of blueskin, but stickier...going to be interesting laying it down. The joy of laying Resisto over Blueskin type underlay is how bloody easy it is. And it lays dead flat (no wrinkles like blueskin). 
Here are a couple of pics;










In above pic, you can see the square weave. And it isn't a rip there, just a hack job with excato knife as I cut a sliver off.
About as thick as blueskin.


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## Steve_S

Melli, just highlighting some of what we both know but also for other readers - learned long time ago to never assume what someone else knows and is such a forum, who will come along later and read... Even with that I sometimes don't think of the blatantly obvious till I go *** was I thinking and WHY didn't I do that in the first place & FacePalm !

We chatted a bit about the venting and trickery for that & it occurred to me that in one of my references there is good "Pictures" and light explanation for the different roof systems and a pic is worth a thousand words, plus may help others reading the treat when contemplating their own project... I think about the others reading threads today, next year or 5 years down the road and sometimes codes/rules etc change and better to know what we are talking about 'today' versus what might be tomorrow... Hopefully this will be helpful for you & others too...

Have a Marvy Day, check in this evening and see the thread... I have Electrical & Drywall battles to fight today & tomorrow... BTW price of copper wire has gone NUTS ! 4.50 a foot for #6/3 NMWU (just dropped Large & shocked over the increase previous purchase price a year ago)


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Melli, just highlighting some of what we both know but also for other readers - learned long time ago to never assume what someone else knows and is such a forum, who will come along later and read... Even with that I sometimes don't think of the blatantly obvious till I go *** was I thinking and WHY didn't I do that in the first place & FacePalm !
> 
> We chatted a bit about the venting and trickery for that & it occurred to me that in one of my references there is good "Pictures" and light explanation for the different roof systems and a pic is worth a thousand words, plus may help others reading the treat when contemplating their own project... I think about the others reading threads today, next year or 5 years down the road and sometimes codes/rules etc change and better to know what we are talking about 'today' versus what might be tomorrow... Hopefully this will be helpful for you & others too...
> 
> Have a Marvy Day, check in this evening and see the thread... I have Electrical & Drywall battles to fight today & tomorrow... BTW price of copper wire has gone NUTS ! 4.50 a foot for #6/3 NMWU (just dropped Large & shocked over the increase previous purchase price a year ago)


Always a fan of pics. I know the last two 'hot roofs' would never pass muster on the coast here. Always has to be some roof ventilation. And we never use cardboard baffles (foam roof baffles - look like foam egg cartons, but 14" wide). I'll be using standoffs so I cannot crush air cavity when packing it with Roxul. 
Have fun...
Electrical I enjoy, drywall, not so much...


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## Steve_S

"Hot Roof 1" with the foam would pass BUT only if it was completed as a Cool Roof as we discussed previously, likely would pass there too. Also consider that SIPS used for a roof is a solid hardcore block and you wanna prevent the heat of the sub hitting that.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> "Hot Roof 1" with the foam would pass BUT only if it was completed as a Cool Roof as we discussed previously, likely would pass there too. Also consider that SIPS used for a roof is a solid hardcore block and you wanna prevent the heat of the sub hitting that.


Oh, ok, I see, the last two are not a completed roof...the first one's (non hot roof examples) appear to be ok with underlay and roofing.
I see 'now', the first hot roof has open air exposed cathedral framing...drying from one side, ok. The second has insulation on both sides of inner OSB...not so good (that one is a non-starter here).


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## MoBookworm1957

Melli,
I enjoy reading about your journey with your home.
Gives me ideas,running numbers now.
But first things first, have to pay dad off for sales tax loan on new to me car.
Then cousin and I need to come to agreement on plans for the families home place.
My dad has final say as he is last living member of family.
Besides his kids and the cousins.
Right now trying to help cousin bring the homestead back up to par.
Like it was when she moved out there. 
With the condition of home place now, my dad is not happy camper.
No by long shot.
Pipes froze last winter and instead of telling somebody she didn't.
Fences are down all over the place.
Horse weeds are taller than some of the barns.
Needless to say, my dad is peed od.
As it is right now, dad says I can move in the main house.
Start the improvements on the main house.
Fencing,barns,chicken house etc.
Except I don't want the main house, i want one of the barns as my house.
I have been working fencing on two pastures side by side, just about done with both.
Just need to finish on section of fence in one,put the gate up in the other.
Already got the stock tank,hay bunker,feed trough in the one pasture. 
It will be ready for calves in the spring.
Went over and talked to dad tonight, when he goes out to inspect home place don't have another heart attack.
They put stint in last week.
My brother is going with him to inspect the home place.
The barn I want is 5 acres away from my cousin.
Dad is livid.
My cousin will end up with 5 acres if she's lucky.
When I get my part of the home place up to my standards.
Which are Army standards( Army veteran here) by the way.
I will go ahead and help cousin out too.
The pastures are on section of the home place I want.
My barn is built in the side of good side hill, loft is above the hill.


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Melli,
> I enjoy reading about your journey with your home.
> Gives me ideas,running numbers now.
> But first things first, have to pay dad off for sales tax loan on new to me car.
> Then cousin and I need to come to agreement on plans for the families home place.
> My dad has final say as he is last living member of family.
> Besides his kids and the cousins.
> Right now trying to help cousin bring the homestead back up to par.
> Like it was when she moved out there.
> With the condition of home place now, my dad is not happy camper.
> No by long shot.
> Pipes froze last winter and instead of telling somebody she didn't.
> Fences are down all over the place.
> Horse weeds are taller than some of the barns.
> Needless to say, my dad is peed od.
> As it is right now, dad says I can move in the main house.
> Start the improvements on the main house.
> Fencing,barns,chicken house etc.
> Except I don't want the main house, i want one of the barns as my house.
> I have been working fencing on two pastures side by side, just about done with both.
> Just need to finish on section of fence in one,put the gate up in the other.
> Already got the stock tank,hay bunker,feed trough in the one pasture.
> It will be ready for calves in the spring.
> Went over and talked to dad tonight, when he goes out to inspect home place don't have another heart attack.
> They put stint in last week.
> My brother is going with him to inspect the home place.
> The barn I want is 5 acres away from my cousin.
> Dad is livid.
> My cousin will end up with 5 acres if she's lucky.
> When I get my part of the home place up to my standards.
> Which are Army standards( Army veteran here) by the way.
> I will go ahead and help cousin out too.
> The pastures are on section of the home place I want.
> My barn is built in the side of good side hill, loft is above the hill.


Must see a pic of this barn! Sounds intriguing....
It sounds like you have your hands full, with family and a running cattle operation. I liked cattle when we lived on farm, except the butchering part...and I love beef (go figure). We kids even raised a steer each for 4-H. Took care of them better than a horse...lol. Like pets, until weigh-in. 

Unfortunately, I don't have the pasture land for cattle, and it might be a bit much for me. Chickens, goat, sheep are probably up my alley. But, I do have to get a big honkin fence installed...after build is done, that'll be next on agenda. 
All the best!


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## Steve_S

My 4H Cow was called Cucumber and to this day I miss her, she was such a sweetie (to me anyways - she hated my dad, he hit her once with a shovel - never got close to her again). Her Name ? She would find a way of always circumventing any fence or gate and would clean out the cucumbers in our Garden - twas so funny to watch mom chase her with a broom back into the Barn Yard... But if I went out I could just walk up to her, give her a snuggle & scruffle her behind the ears and she'd follow me wherever I went.

Sorry off topic but mentioned 4H Cow and so many good memories... People laughed when I rode her and she'd happily let me, as long as I was in the right spot, otherwise on my kiester I'd go...

@MoBookworm 
Family can be such a ... at times and unlike friends you can't pick / choose family. I hope your dad's health improves and things get better all around. The Idea of converting an old barn into a home was something I had pondered as well, seen a few and such potential... Hopefully you'll start a thread on it as you get going, that would definitely get a lot of watchers I think. There are a few old barns in my area that would make for amazing conversions but building codes being what they are... I could only imagine how many issues a Building Inspector would have...


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> Here is the first prep for the first 4x8...bit of a slow day, as the one hunk of fascia (18') took an hour plus to install...I couldn't hang one arm it over edge, hang on, and use other hand to secure...so, I came up with tie down straps to lower it into position.
> Couldn't afford to drop it, as that piece of board is for show.
> Then, I mucked about putting down some strapping boards...seems I am running out of 2x4's. Hard to believe given the amount I used in ICF portion of build, but many are being used in scaffolding.
> At any rate, I'll glue top of 2x4s and slap down ply, and nail/screw. I walked on it already, and it is firmer than my 2nd floor...hmmm.
> 
> Then, my local Raven couple showed up, and at eye level in small tree near bunker, she starts yapping at me for granola. Seems they like granola cereal. And she wouldn't let up. Then her husband starts in from afar. Petulant birds. Closest she has been to me in a while...15ft away. I gave them their lunch...now maybe I can have a nap in peace.
> View attachment 61358


Do your raven friends swipe shiny objects from you? They LOVE shiny stuff


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> My 4H Cow was called Cucumber and to this day I miss her, she was such a sweetie (to me anyways - she hated my dad, he hit her once with a shovel - never got close to her again). Her Name ? She would find a way of always circumventing any fence or gate and would clean out the cucumbers in our Garden - twas so funny to watch mom chase her with a broom back into the Barn Yard... But if I went out I could just walk up to her, give her a snuggle & scruffle her behind the ears and she'd follow me wherever I went.
> 
> Sorry off topic but mentioned 4H Cow and so many good memories... People laughed when I rode her and she'd happily let me, as long as I was in the right spot, otherwise on my kiester I'd go...
> 
> @MoBookworm
> Family can be such a ... at times and unlike friends you can't pick / choose family. I hope your dad's health improves and things get better all around. The Idea of converting an old barn into a home was something I had pondered as well, seen a few and such potential... Hopefully you'll start a thread on it as you get going, that would definitely get a lot of watchers I think. There are a few old barns in my area that would make for amazing conversions but building codes being what they are... I could only imagine how many issues a Building Inspector would have...


Haha...no worries at all. I like hearing stories of their 'pet' cow. Still, I am soft that way, and although I help put meat on table, butchering our charges...and we fed them mixed grain, which any cow would love. Dad accused us of raiding mixed feed grainery (guilty). No wonder ours tipped the scales at judging. 

But my fav animal (and my pet), and one we actually kept for years, until we moved away, was a ram. I wasn't with siblings when they picked up the baby ewes, and I got stuck with the runt, a baby ram as they figured it wouldn't live. Ha. My TLC had 'Harry' fit as a fiddle in no time, and he naturally outgrew the ewes. Unfortunately, a neighbor's dog killed the ewes, but Harry persevered all by himself. He had a habit of sneaking up on folks, from behind, and bunting them into next week, even me. You'd be staring at something, then wham. Dad got so pissed he took a 2x4 to his head. It was in Harry's blood to test out his ramming ability. Whack him enough, and he'd submit (get on knees). But next day, he'd forget and the bunting started all over again. So, first thing one did after leaving house, was find out where Harry was....and keep an eye on him. A fun ride, a big ball of wool to hang onto. Sometimes he'd oblige and take us for a ride.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Do your raven friends swipe shiny objects from you? They LOVE shiny stuff


No, I haven't noticed that with Momma and Pappa. They do like Granola Cereal though (with mixed nuts) and of course, hot dogs. I say hot dog! And they are on it in seconds.
At Christmas it was chilly here, and I gave them the Turkey carcas, and within a minute or two the whole carcass was gone...
I can hear them, usually around dusk, and they are side by side, talking to each other in cute little grunts and whatnot (pillow talk).
The female is the talker though, and if I don't deliver, she storms off in a huff. And if I retort with a 'haw', she replies with a unhappy 'haw haw haw'. I retort again, and she replies again, until she is like a mile away..lol
She has to get the last word in. I even catch her spying on me. She'll find a roost where she can look in my windows and see what's cooking. Scared the crap out of me one day, when I look up, and see her eyeballing me in RV.
As I mentioned a while back, they are a good early warning system for bears, owls and coyotes. They'll harass them until they move on.


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## melli

Finally got strapping done...about 684ft of 2x4s...
Seems like it was more than that...lol
Now, I get to chop off far end...I'll use a level from beam end, and mark, then do other beam, and mark. Then, I'll snap a chalk line between marks. Run my worm saw up chalk line chopping ends off, so I have a straight line. I'll then have to attach a 2x4 'L' on the underside so I can attach fascia down a bit. Going to be fun, as I'll be messing along edge of roof (heights are not my thing anymore). 
Going to be a slow production day...but once fascia is up, I can motor on the ply, as I'll have edges to work with. 
Supposed to finally get rain on weekend...not sure if I'll get roof sheathed and get underlay down...it'll be close. But if I do, it'll be celebration time, as 2/3 of build will be dry underneath, forever...
I have a tarp big enough to cover 2nd floor portion, so hopefully, I won't see rain on floor.


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## melli

Yep, hangin on edge of roof is not my cup of tea...clears the pores though. 
At least I got the 'hanger' for fascia on. Never been down this road before, so it took some time to figure out how to hang fascia lower than the 2x4 strapping. Made a 'L' shaped bracket out of 2x4s and tucked it under 2x4 strapping...it now gives me a surface to nail the fascia to. I also made blocking (with an 'L' notch) that would catch the bracket as I installed it, and it serves to tighten up the eave (most framers do this on gable ends). 
Crazy...but now I have a edge (know where to stop with ply sheathing). The little 2x4 nubs are spacers, so when fascia is on, I can nail a mini sub fascia to cover top gap, as main fascia will be down lower. Bit convoluted, but it'll turn out well, given my options.


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## melli

It took some doing to get a piece of fascia (2x12 - 18') over the edge and screwed in place (roof rack straps and clamps). Just wanted to post a pic of the 'look'. A very small 'combed' piece (1x3 or 1x4) will cover the top gap.










Now, I can motor with sheathing...


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## melli

A slog with Fascia, but one more big chunk, and two tiny ones, and that nightmare is over. Think I bruised a rib laying flat while I hung onto fascia bracket...felt a rib pop or something...I'm told it isn't cracked, or I'd be in serious pain. Does hurt to inhale deeply. A sharp pain is supposed mean a cracked rib, but a dull pain is muscle/ligament pull...I can't tell the difference, it just hurts. Now, I have to use the other side of rib cage when lying down working over edge, which makes thing awkward...lol

Not going to beat rain this weekend by getting underlay on. I have tarps I'll have to throw over. About 75% done sheathing on main floor roof.


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## melli

My rib cage seems to be getting worse...maybe ligaments/muscles are tightening up from strain. Found a thick full length seat cushion helps when I am laying down with head over roof edge screwing in fascia (should have done that in first place). No more big fascia chunks...thankfully. 
That top fascia is a composite of three chunks as two 18' wouldn't span the rafters tails. Hard to see the seams...a good thing (plus I'll be caulking the screw holes and seams, then painting). 
Have it tarped up for tonight's rain...indoor work tomorrow if the roof isn't leaking too badly.


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## oldtruckbbq

The top picture is absolutely amazing. No wonder you decided to build there. How much acreage do you have?


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> The top picture is absolutely amazing. No wonder you decided to build there. How much acreage do you have?


Almost the same as you, 4.7 acres, to be exact. No building restrictions, no nothing. Mind you, I have no city services other than power and fiber. 
Kinda wishing I had the dough for a 20 acre lot down the road, a few years back (they wanted 225-250k, now double I suspect). Absolutely nothing wrong with my place, but the extra elbow room would have been fun to play with...can have some neat trails in 20 acres of heavy forest, plus I would have some coin off the timber. 

But who am I kidding, I have my hands full...lol
Looking forward to seeing you get your place off the ground.


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## oldtruckbbq

We though about buying a bigger place, but took a look at what we can handle with us both working and heading into our retirement years. The 5.3 acres we have is going to be enough to keep us busy for a long time.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> We though about buying a bigger place, but took a look at what we can handle with us both working and heading into our retirement years. The 5.3 acres we have is going to be enough to keep us busy for a long time.


Yep, as I thought about your statement, it rings true for me...not even sure I'll ever get around to building another house. 
Especially being solo. Almost glad I have an underlying optimism not based on reality...haha...on the surface, I am always cautious or pessimistic. Had I really known what it would have taken, I would have looked for a rundown homestead, a fixer upper. I think with two of you, it will make a world of difference. Not so much getting things done twice as fast, but having help does make life easier (shoulder to lean on). 

A month ago, I was trying to adjust my concrete pylons with Bobby, but with the blade method I couldn't do 'finesse' movements. Then, I tried sledge hammer and chuck of wood method...it worked, but geesh, movement was slow and my joints ached. I then noticed the tall post needed a 1" nudge. Well, I came up with a good sledge hammer...Bobby's cleanup bucket full of gravel. Too jarring to machine to do it without any fill in bucket, but with bucket filled, it acted like a sledge. Tapping the post via wood block allows one to do fine adjustments. No more adjusting...finished. 










You can see how much pylon moved by looking at dirt at base


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## oldtruckbbq

I've thought and thought about buying a mini excavator, but really need to use that cash for getting the house built. I think I'll do everything I can prior to needing a mini excavator, then rent one for a week, especially because there will be times I'll need a skid steer with a bucket instead of a mini excavator. The $750 cash outlay for a week will be easier on my pocketbook than shelling out the $ for an excavator or adding another payment.

Just my opinion, but I would think your construction efforts would be better spent on something other than another house, like a workshop/garage. The bunker you are building is looking really nice, and it is definitely well made. My wife and I would be very happy with that as a house.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I've thought and thought about buying a mini excavator, but really need to use that cash for getting the house built. I think I'll do everything I can prior to needing a mini excavator, then rent one for a week, especially because there will be times I'll need a skid steer with a bucket instead of a mini excavator. The $750 cash outlay for a week will be easier on my pocketbook than shelling out the $ for an excavator or adding another payment.
> 
> Just my opinion, but I would think your construction efforts would be better spent on something other than another house, like a workshop/garage. The bunker you are building is looking really nice, and it is definitely well made. My wife and I would be very happy with that as a house.


Thanks OTB, I also will be building a workshop (~24x26 - half enclosed), but it'll be a quarter the cost and a quarter the effort (have carport pylons already poured for it - see earlier posts). Outbuildings are, orders of magnitude, less paperwork/money headache with local gov (I can whip them up in a night). I admit, I am going overboard with my 'bunker home'. If I had done wood frame construction, I'd probably have my RV on Craigslist this fall. 

If I may suggest; rent a decent mini with thumb first then decide if you need to rent a skid steer. I sold my skid steer to get the mini, as the SS was useless (I wrote about it way back...took a run at a 4" tree and was stopped cold). Sure, it could move a pile of dirt and do light grading on level ground, but it was near useless clearing, unless it was light brush, even then, a mini-ex could do a better job (get the roots without climbing in and out hooking up tackle) and the blade can grade and push dirt better. And if you hit any soft wet soil in a SS your prone to getting stuck...you'll never get stuck in a mini-ex, unless your 'rafting' in the middle of a pond. Looking at your new digs (pics you posted), I'd say that is mini-ex heaven. Small trees, brush, lots of dirt to trench....oh my, I'd be in heaven in Bobby working on that...lol. The amount of land you could clear in a day...do your driveway before lunch. 
Takes about 2-3hrs to get the hang of running a mini's basic functions, then after a couple of days your motoring. 
I've thought about selling Bobby (Bobcat 331), as it would pretty much allow me to move in before Christmas, but I just can't bear the thought. I'll have to put in another winter in this tin can RV, and hopefully, be good to move in late spring. Bobby just does stuff so easily that I am spoiled. Would take days/weeks by hand or be impossible to do by hand (move large boulders, pull large roots, build monster slash piles, trench hundreds of feet really deep in hours, etc). Best.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Thanks OTB, I also will be building a workshop (~24x26 - half enclosed), but it'll be a quarter the cost and a quarter the effort (have carport pylons already poured for it - see earlier posts). Outbuildings are, orders of magnitude, less paperwork/money headache with local gov (I can whip them up in a night). I admit, I am going overboard with my 'bunker home'. If I had done wood frame construction, I'd probably have my RV on Craigslist this fall.
> 
> If I may suggest; rent a decent mini with thumb first then decide if you need to rent a skid steer. I sold my skid steer to get the mini, as the SS was useless (I wrote about it way back...took a run at a 4" tree and was stopped cold). Sure, it could move a pile of dirt and do light grading on level ground, but it was near useless clearing, unless it was light brush, even then, a mini-ex could do a better job (get the roots without climbing in and out hooking up tackle) and the blade can grade and push dirt better. And if you hit any soft wet soil in a SS your prone to getting stuck...you'll never get stuck in a mini-ex, unless your 'rafting' in the middle of a pond. Looking at your new digs (pics you posted), I'd say that is mini-ex heaven. Small trees, brush, lots of dirt to trench....oh my, I'd be in heaven in Bobby working on that...lol. The amount of land you could clear in a day...do your driveway before lunch.
> Takes about 2-3hrs to get the hang of running a mini's basic functions, then after a couple of days your motoring.
> I've thought about selling Bobby (Bobcat 331), as it would pretty much allow me to move in before Christmas, but I just can't bear the thought. I'll have to put in another winter in this tin can RV, and hopefully, be good to move in late spring. Bobby just does stuff so easily that I am spoiled. Would take days/weeks by hand or be impossible to do by hand (move large boulders, pull large roots, build monster slash piles, trench hundreds of feet really deep in hours, etc). Best.


Good info on your experiences with the skid steer and excavator, especially the recommendation for the thumb. That will save a huge amount of time and wear and tear on the body. I'm going to make a pile to either burn or mulch with the small stuff, and since the trees are hardwood I'll cut and buck most of them for firewood. There are only a handful of trees over 12" diameter that I will need to remove. The majority are 8" or less. Based on what I've read in your thread and FtF's thread, the mini excavator will make quick work of stumps that size. Best of all, we are JUST inside the equipment rental company's free delivery with a 1 week rental radius.


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## oldtruckbbq

BTW, I like the irony in your alias.


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## Steve_S

I tried a Bobcat on my property after the big Cat 390 Excavator was done, that lasted a half day & I gave up, as Melli says. I went and rented an Excavator & a small backhoe for a week to dig in my grey water system and a heap more, there is absolutely no way I could have done it without real machines and luckily the local rental place, rents Kubota's which are a real treat to work with... Tough little machines ! I had to clear my land and dig through a lot of deep roots (Mixed bush but mostly Cedar & Pines and various types). It was costly to rent BUT far easier on me and made short work of the big tasks... Gonna have to rent another backhoe and bring in a few loads of cut stone and special fill and there's no way I am doing that stuff by hand, I'm just not up for that anymore...

When the rental Co says a week, they mean 40 hours on the clock, so make sure you know what your signing up for when renting and don't let it idle for more than 5 minutes, they add up fast when your busy and not watching the hour meter.


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> I tried a Bobcat on my property after the big Cat 390 Excavator was done, that lasted a half day & I gave up, as Melli says. I went and rented an Excavator & a small backhoe for a week to dig in my grey water system and a heap more, there is absolutely no way I could have done it without real machines and luckily the local rental place, rents Kubota's which are a real treat to work with... Tough little machines ! I had to clear my land and dig through a lot of deep roots (Mixed bush but mostly Cedar & Pines and various types). It was costly to rent BUT far easier on me and made short work of the big tasks... Gonna have to rent another backhoe and bring in a few loads of cut stone and special fill and there's no way I am doing that stuff by hand, I'm just not up for that anymore...
> 
> When the rental Co says a week, they mean 40 hours on the clock, so make sure you know what your signing up for when renting and don't let it idle for more than 5 minutes, they add up fast when your busy and not watching the hour meter.


A former employer got caught up on that when we rented a scissor lift for a week. They meant 40 hours, we ran it 20 hours a day for 6 days. That was an expensive bill, because the motor was running the whole time the guys were up in the air.

One of the reasons I joined this forum was to learn from others. A smart person learns from their mistakes. A wise person learns from other's mistakes. I figure everything I can learn that will prevent mistakes is money in my pocket and time on my clock.


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## oldtruckbbq

oldtruckbbq said:


> A former employer got caught up on that when we rented a scissor lift for a week. They meant 40 hours, we ran it 20 hours a day for 6 days. That was an expensive bill, because the motor was running the whole time the guys were up in the air.
> 
> One of the reasons I joined this forum was to learn from others. A smart person learns from their mistakes. A wise person learns from other's mistakes. I figure everything I can learn that will prevent mistakes is money in my pocket and time on my clock.


How does $600/week with a $200 deposit sound for renting a mini excavator? Thumb attachment is an extra charge.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> How does $600/week with a $200 deposit sound for renting a mini excavator? Thumb attachment is an extra charge.


Wow! Really? Last time I rented, north of 49, it cost me $275/day plus $150 drop off and pickup (6yrs ago). Exact same machine as the one I own now, except mine is two years newer. I think a week was around a grand. A local business is renting their mini Kubota's for around $1200 per week, plus delivery. Albeit, our dollar has cratered relative to you, it was near par when I rented ($1.27 CDN to USD now). All mini's for rent around here have thumbs given we are rock and trees. 

I did find a loophole (probably long since closed), in that if I rent on Friday, for one day, they wouldn't pick it up till Monday, as they were closed over weekend, and they never took the hobbs hours into account (now they do - 8hrs max per day as Steve noted). Funny, but it was the rental place that let me in on that 'secret'. 

I will say putting in 8hrs in a mini per day is a tough sled. My back and bones cannot take more than 3-4hrs. I'm trying to pry rock, or trying to rip out roots the size of a NFL lineman's leg, and the bucket teeth will slip off, jarring me and machine (even with blade down for stabilization). I am guessing it won't be as jarring for you, but even so, 8hrs of hard going in a mini, in a day, would be taxing, especially if you get canopy version vs a cab version. A cab makes a world of difference up here in winter. Actually, I prefer winter ops up here, as there is less dust (rain-forest), I have heat, and there is usually a breeze to keep diesel fumes at bay. Better than working outside, in the rain...lol. Sort of feels like I am driving a car in winter (an older version). Put in some earbuds and tune my way through whatever I am up to...

Get the thumb.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> BTW, I like the irony in your alias.


A couple weeks ago, I came across it in an article...heard of those words, but never knew what they meant, so I looked them up...


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## melli

This pic looks a bit messy...looks like a whirlwind went through my tools, leaving them scattered all over my roof. Just one more row to do! Laying ply is pretty easy, just all the fussing to get to that point. Plus, I think I will do the hurricane ties (brackets to tie rafters to top sill plate) while last course is not laid...easier/safer to lay down and reach down with palm nailer than hike up a tall ladder or build a scaffold on outside. Eventually, I will have to build a scaffold for soffit install.
As I mentioned, I used 5/8" t&g (subfloor material), and every piece of ply is glued, nailed, screwed and blocked all around every seam (tedious, but there will no roof creaking). Feels stronger than my second floor subfloor because the gaps are smaller. I do about a 3"/6"-4"/8" nail spacing (3"-4" around perimeter of sheet, and 6"-8" inside sheet). Code is 4"/8" around here due to seismic considerations. I use 2-1/2" coil nails for sheathing (ardox nails - spiral nails) which helps minimize popping nails. Inspector gets on folks who overdrive nails...should be flush. I have a mini sledge that I use more than my hammer (almost obsolete for me). It gets any proud nails flush with an easy whack.

While I am at it, spec'ing what I do, tools for roof: I have a Dewalt worm drive saw for cutting up blocking and ply...easiest and safest saw I've ever used...virtually no kickback. I'll admit, I am lazy sometimes, and will drive through a jam with saw like nobody's business. If I had a circ saw, it couldn't do it, and I'd be looking at bucking bronco (kickback). The saw is heavy, but once in play, it slides straight and true (one handed). Pro framers like the light wormdrive Skil-saw, but the shoe is delicate, and one drop, you've bent it. I then have a Paslode stick nailer using strip nails (3-1/2" round head)...it can power a nail through LVL like butter. I then have a Bostitch coil nailer for doing the ply, as it holds a whole lot more nails than a strip nail gun. The Bostitch can do both framing and sheathing, but I rarely use it for framing because it is heavy with a full coil in it.
I have a big and small sledge (big for get t&g in, and the small for getting proud nails). And of course, tape, square, pencil, big glue gun, and drywall square (good for marking ply). Lastly, for roof job, I have my Hitachi driver...best tool I have. I have the big battery on it, and can throw in a 100+ - 3-1/2" screws or 200+ - 2" screws before needing recharging...and the recharger charges the big battery in less than half hour. Oh yeah, I've tried different knee pads, but my leather with felt lining knee pads actually grip whatever I am kneeling on. They keep me safe.










The interior forest fires have jacked up the price of 5/8" exterior grade ply to $42+ sheet! Crazy...wasn't long ago I was getting them for $25 (pro-ad price).


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## MoBookworm1957

Steve_S said:


> My 4H Cow was called Cucumber and to this day I miss her, she was such a sweetie (to me anyways - she hated my dad, he hit her once with a shovel - never got close to her again). Her Name ? She would find a way of always circumventing any fence or gate and would clean out the cucumbers in our Garden - twas so funny to watch mom chase her with a broom back into the Barn Yard... But if I went out I could just walk up to her, give her a snuggle & scruffle her behind the ears and she'd follow me wherever I went.
> 
> Sorry off topic but mentioned 4H Cow and so many good memories... People laughed when I rode her and she'd happily let me, as long as I was in the right spot, otherwise on my kiester I'd go...
> 
> @MoBookworm
> Family can be such a ... at times and unlike friends you can't pick / choose family. I hope your dad's health improves and things get better all around. The Idea of converting an old barn into a home was something I had pondered as well, seen a few and such potential... Hopefully you'll start a thread on it as you get going, that would definitely get a lot of watchers I think. There are a few old barns in my area that would make for amazing conversions but building codes being what they are... I could only imagine how many issues a Building Inspector would have...





Steve_S said:


> My 4H Cow was called Cucumber and to this day I miss her, she was such a sweetie (to me anyways - she hated my dad, he hit her once with a shovel - never got close to her again). Her Name ? She would find a way of always circumventing any fence or gate and would clean out the cucumbers in our Garden - twas so funny to watch mom chase her with a broom back into the Barn Yard... But if I went out I could just walk up to her, give her a snuggle & scruffle her behind the ears and she'd follow me wherever I went.
> 
> Sorry off topic but mentioned 4H Cow and so many good memories... People laughed when I rode her and she'd happily let me, as long as I was in the right spot, otherwise on my kiester I'd go...
> 
> @MoBookworm
> Family can be such a ... at times and unlike friends you can't pick / choose family. I hope your dad's health improves and things get better all around. The Idea of converting an old barn into a home was something I had pondered as well, seen a few and such potential... Hopefully you'll start a thread on it as you get going, that would definitely get a lot of watchers I think. There are a few old barns in my area that would make for amazing conversions but building codes being what they are... I could only imagine how many issues a Building Inspector would have...


My 4H calf was Red Angus born on 4th of July.
Her name was Firecracker.
She ended up at Uncle's house.
Where she lived till she was old.
Had a bad habit of eating spark plug wires though.
But had a bunch of beautiful calves and couple of bull calves.
Actually the Building Inspector is someone I served with in the Army.
I helped him out then, and he's offering free advice now.
This barn was built to last, all the timber was cut on property.
As for building codes the barn/house will be grandfathered in to the new house codes.
New house is where my cousin lives. It's considered the "NEW" House because it's less than 25 years old.
My barn is part of the orginal homestead, first house is in the woods about 2 miles from the barn.
Creek runs between house and barn, it has never run dry in 100 years.
Creek kinda circles around first house then circles around barn which is slightly lower than house was.
Have stocked pond on my section of property.
Already planning the garden and orchard section.
Would like to put up more fence, but will have to check finances.
Want to make sure my cattle, doesn't get near new house.
Also don't want her goats to eat my new orchard either.
You're right we can't pick family.
I will use parts of standing orginal house as my barn for machinery and such.
Both the barn and orginal house look the same, built into side of hills for protection against the elements and man.
Started using organic weed killer on poison ivy,oak and sumac around the barn.
Also started checking foundation on barn, and new to me barn.(old House).


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## Hitch

Hey Melli, I didn't realize this was your build thread. I haven't had time to read the 20 pages of posts but did look at the pictures. Looks like you know your way around a tool belt. Nice job so far, looking forward to following along now.


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## melli

A very light day...got some paint for fascia (same color as well house in background of pic below). Will paint it before I slap on underlay. Painting fascia after the fact is not ideal.
MoBookworm - you ought to start a thread here, with some pics! 
Would love to see the barn house. I bet it has some big timber in it...
Hitch - I live on pics...lol
Speaking of which, here is something I did to pass the time till lunch. Put on some nailing plates, similar to hurricane ties (which I'll put on other side of beam). Aiming for a squeak free home. BI was asking why I was doing what I was doing (nailing plates - 90 cents each plus about 30 cents of hanger nails per plate), since the blocking between joists is plenty in his eyes, then he said, "Melli's way", then he went quiet....lol

With a palm nailer, this took an hour, if that...quicker if BI hadn't showed up. Palm nailer is awesome for hangers and whatnot...









Once I get soffit on, I'll put a trim piece over plates.


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## melli

Finally got the roof sheathing done...seemed like it took forever. A framing crew would have done it before lunch (albeit, not the strapping and blocking). The whitish skid marks are me letting the belt sander go over the seams and pick off any high splinters. When I put underlay down, I don't want a splinter/nail poking through, especially since the underlay will go the winter uncovered. 
I've started to caulk the fascia screw holes and seams...will continue that, and maybe pull out roller and paint it tonight. On the low side, I will put on 2x2 drip flashing (just cheap 90 degree flashing at any building store). The flashing will go under the underlay (limit any moisture creep when rain rolls off roof, gives the underlay a nice surface to seal, and will protect top edge of fascia when I put on gutters).


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## Hitch

Looks like you're on track to have the roof sealed up before first rain.


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## melli

Hitch said:


> Looks like you're on track to have the roof sealed up before first rain.


I hope so...knowing me, I'll probably start on underlay tomorrow even if the fascia isn't completely caulked and painted. 
The second floor roof is what 'now' worries me...lol
Getting it done before we enter rainforest season. Not keen to be squeegeeing the floor after every rain...plus, it would be nice to fill interior with lumber and whatnot, without worrying if it'll get wet.


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## oldtruckbbq

Where did you get the "T" connectors for your carport posts and beams? Also the fasteners you used to connect the posts to the concrete pillars. If you don't mind me asking, what did they cost you? 

We are going to build a post and beam frame and infilling with cordwood. I'm gong to buy prefabricated roof trusses that will attach to the beams at the top, so I will need some sturdy fasteners there to keep everything in place. The house will be 30' deep but I'm going to buy 36' trusses with a 2' overhang. That will give me 5' of roof to protect the house from the elements front and back. The house will be 36' wide so I will go an extra 4' on each end of the roof to have an overhang to protect the wood. I plan on using timbers at a 45 deg angle to support the cantilever at each end. Who knows, I may even try my hand at some chainsaw artistry to give them a little flair!

Your place is looking good. I like the teak stain you used on your posts and beams.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Where did you get the "T" connectors for your carport posts and beams? Also the fasteners you used to connect the posts to the concrete pillars. If you don't mind me asking, what did they cost you?
> 
> We are going to build a post and beam frame and infilling with cordwood. I'm gong to buy prefabricated roof trusses that will attach to the beams at the top, so I will need some sturdy fasteners there to keep everything in place. The house will be 30' deep but I'm going to buy 36' trusses with a 2' overhang. That will give me 5' of roof to protect the house from the elements front and back. The house will be 36' wide so I will go an extra 4' on each end of the roof to have an overhang to protect the wood. I plan on using timbers at a 45 deg angle to support the cantilever at each end. Who knows, I may even try my hand at some chainsaw artistry to give them a little flair!
> 
> Your place is looking good. I like the teak stain you used on your posts and beams.


Thanks OTB...the T brackets/connectors were special made, as the Simpson Strong-Tie T's are paper thin (14ga?). A local welder made up 4 of them for $200 (Tig welded 1/4" steel and drilled all (5) 13/16" holes). The top of 'T' is 16" wide, and the tail is 19" long, and the width is 3". Basically, I copied hole spacing from SST saddle the posts sit in, which were heavy duty. 
I suspect you could find a better deal down south. 
Just noticed SST does have a heavier duty T ('strap tie' is what they call them) - 1616HT
https://www.strongtie.com/shapes_specialtystraps/tandl_productgroup_wcc/p/t-and-l
They also have hidden fastener (post to beam)
https://www.strongtie.com/columncaps_capsandbases/cbt_tie/p/cbtz
Or you could pull out the woodworker in you and do a mortise and tenon joint...

The saddles are the SST column base CB88R
https://www.strongtie.com/nonstandoffcolumnbases_columnbases/lcb-cb_productgroup_wcc/p/lcb.cb
Click on 'view full gallery' to see size options. These are cast in place. $50 a pop, but heavy metal. Made to resist torsional forces. 


I like heavy metal, and I like the look. Plus, there is nothing stiffer/stronger (with T's on both sides of beam). Although, a good M&T joint could be strong too (depends on size of timber). 

What roof pitch are you going with? Second floor? 
I am a fan of eave overhang, especially around here. If you can keep your siding dry, you never have to worry about leaks or rot. One thing though, the greater the eave, the greater the uplift forces in a windstorm etc. I suspect your familiar with hurricane ties etc. to minimize your roof leaving you in a time of need. 
I was a little put off by the fact I couldn't get a full 2' wide eaves (~22" on mine). User error on my part, as I was hoping to use all 24' of rafter (had to trim of ends - splits etc). I could have sistered on rafter tails, but I am done...lol
I might do it on second floor roof, just on one side where porch will be (have 3' eaves). Be an interesting look I think, and will give me a rain free smoke area.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Thanks OTB...the T brackets/connectors were special made, as the Simpson Strong-Tie T's are paper thin (14ga?). A local welder made up 4 of them for $200 (Tig welded 1/4" steel and drilled all (5) 13/16" holes). The top of 'T' is 16" wide, and the tail is 19" long, and the width is 3". Basically, I copied hole spacing from SST saddle the posts sit in, which were heavy duty.
> I suspect you could find a better deal down south.
> Just noticed SST does have a heavier duty T ('strap tie' is what they call them) - 1616HT
> https://www.strongtie.com/shapes_specialtystraps/tandl_productgroup_wcc/p/t-and-l
> They also have hidden fastener (post to beam)
> https://www.strongtie.com/columncaps_capsandbases/cbt_tie/p/cbtz
> Or you could pull out the woodworker in you and do a mortise and tenon joint...
> 
> The saddles are the SST column base CB88R
> https://www.strongtie.com/nonstandoffcolumnbases_columnbases/lcb-cb_productgroup_wcc/p/lcb.cb
> Click on 'view full gallery' to see size options. These are cast in place. $50 a pop, but heavy metal. Made to resist torsional forces.
> 
> 
> I like heavy metal, and I like the look. Plus, there is nothing stiffer/stronger (with T's on both sides of beam). Although, a good M&T joint could be strong too (depends on size of timber).
> 
> What roof pitch are you going with? Second floor?
> I am a fan of eave overhang, especially around here. If you can keep your siding dry, you never have to worry about leaks or rot. One thing though, the greater the eave, the greater the uplift forces in a windstorm etc. I suspect your familiar with hurricane ties etc. to minimize your roof leaving you in a time of need.
> I was a little put off by the fact I couldn't get a full 2' wide eaves (~22" on mine). User error on my part, as I was hoping to use all 24' of rafter (had to trim of ends - splits etc). I could have sistered on rafter tails, but I am done...lol
> I might do it on second floor roof, just on one side where porch will be (have 3' eaves). Be an interesting look I think, and will give me a rain free smoke area.


Thanks for the info. I'll check them out and bookmark them. When I lived down in Texas there was a machine shop we used all the time. The owner liked me and would do stuff like that for me basically for the cost of material. Sometimes he would do it for just a case of beer if he used material out of the scrap pile. Hmm, wonder if he would ship them to me?


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Thanks for the info. I'll check them out and bookmark them. When I lived down in Texas there was a machine shop we used all the time. The owner liked me and would do stuff like that for me basically for the cost of material. Sometimes he would do it for just a case of beer if he used material out of the scrap pile. Hmm, wonder if he would ship them to me?


I probably should have made them myself, but I just have a MIG. The welder is a pro and a TIG weld is just better. 
Funny, but the welder mentioned he forgot to add material costs...really wanted $300! If you can get them made up on the cheap, I'd get them...all of the hardware adds up (not counting several hundred bucks in nails, I'd say, I've bought around a grand in brackets/saddles/ties/anchors, and need another grand to finish). My pony wall and second floor wall need threaded rod from foundation to rafters...seismic codes.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> I probably should have made them myself, but I just have a MIG. The welder is a pro and a TIG weld is just better.
> Funny, but the welder mentioned he forgot to add material costs...really wanted $300! If you can get them made up on the cheap, I'd get them...all of the hardware adds up (not counting several hundred bucks in nails, I'd say, I've bought around a grand in brackets/saddles/ties/anchors, and need another grand to finish). My pony wall and second floor wall need threaded rod from foundation to rafters...seismic codes.


Our home site is less than 100 miles from the New Madrid Fault, so even though the small county we will be living in (pop. 14,001 in the 2010 Census) has no building codes or code enforcement officers, I am building to seismic, NEC, and NFPA codes at a minimum. Yes, it costs more, but it doesn't cost as much as losing the place because you didn't follow code. We have waited too long for this to put up something shoddy.

To answer your other questions, the roof will be 4/12 pitch metal roof. There won't be a 2nd floor as this is our retirement home and my wife already had her left hip replaced. I figure the 3 steps up to the porch will be all we need. My wife has actually suggested we just put in a ramp to start with since our Lab is 7 years old and starting to moan and groan when she gets up and can't leap onto the bed without a running start now. The things we do for our critters!


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## melli

Got started on underlay! I did screw, caulk and paint lower fascia, then put 2x2 drip flashing (aka corner flashing) on. It was the drip flashing install that had me worried, being right on edge, but it went quick with a roofing nailer. 
Then I got interrupted by you know who...lol
Got two rolls down, three to go. Will go quick. First course just went down slow and wrong...sort of drooped in center. The underlay has a sticky strip on top (so it REALLY seals with following rows), with a 'plastic release' strip you pull off. That top part causes the roll to droop/sag when you roll it out. My bad, didn't notice it until it was too late. I even put down a chalk line, but once that roll starts going there is no course corrections...stickier than snot. I did, in following rows, correct the droop...you can see the red guidelines get straighter...not a big deal, just means I have to trim a bit off lower fascia...another day. 
I was skeptical of the non-slip claim on box, but this stuff is non-slip...has raised 1/4" squares that grab your shoe. Felt very comfortable walking on it. This stuff lays out better than Blueskin, with less wrinkles, but Resisto lays out the flattest. But this Titanium stuff is stickier than both. A good thing for sealing, but can be trying for laying. Once it is firmly on ply, forget about trying to lift it off. I left an overhang of material (with plastic release still on!) at this end, so I can roll it up siding (have a 'splash guard' where main roof meets second floor wall). 
Be a joy to 'finish' the main roof, and move onto 2nd floor walls...


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## ShannonR

Melli, how much overlap are you doing between the courses of underlay?

Looks great!!!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Melli, how much overlap are you doing between the courses of underlay?
> 
> Looks great!!!


Hopefully, you can read this...click on pic to make it larger.
3" for horizontal seams (overlap), and 6" for vertical seams...although, it appears I am doing about a 4"-5" overlap. I assumed the red line on underlay was the 3" overlap line, but as I look at pic, it is larger than 3" overlap...I'll pull out a tape measure and see.
Nonetheless, as long as one overlaps the top sticky bit, your probably good.









Another nice thing about this stuff is tear or rip repair. See pt 10. With resisto, you need some bitumen based sealer as the coating is sand. This stuff is so sticky, just 6" patch coverage around tear/rip.

Addition: come to think of it, I bet that is the 6" line...haha. Oh well, I have good coverage...good thing I bought another roll, just in case. I wasn't going to make it with 4 rolls anyways (doing 3" overlap), so getting the 5th roll was a good call.
Good catch Shannon! If you saw it...


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## Steve_S

Lookin Good Melli ! Another 2 Thumbs Up... Geez I'm outta thumbs, so 2 hands a wavin !

I know we may have talked about it & I forget... What are you going to clad the bunker & accessory buildings in ? I know it's probably posted somewhere in the 21 pages but I'm beat and TBH too beat to look through it all. Spent the day laying up Cedar Live Edge Siding - Strapping & backboards easy, the live edge boards, well that's a wee bit tricksy, thank goodness for the Nail Gun ! frickin heavy beast of a gun too...


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## Steve_S

Gee wiz, lost my posting.... 2nd attempt:
Lookin Good Dear ! I'm outta thumbs already so 2 Hands waving Wildly in the Air ! hehehehe.....
I forget and am too beat to go searching through the 21 pages... what are you planning on cladding the bunker and everything else with ?

I been out battling that today myself, laying up the strapping, 8" back boards and Live Edge Cedar... Thank Goodness for the Air Nailer (beastly gun firing 3-1/2" Galvanised Stick nails) geez that works the arm out big time and lot's of up & down on the
ladder, such fiddly work...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Gee wiz, lost my posting.... 2nd attempt:
> Lookin Good Dear ! I'm outta thumbs already so 2 Hands waving Wildly in the Air ! hehehehe.....
> I forget and am too beat to go searching through the 21 pages... what are you planning on cladding the bunker and everything else with ?
> 
> I been out battling that today myself, laying up the strapping, 8" back boards and Live Edge Cedar... Thank Goodness for the Air Nailer (beastly gun firing 3-1/2" Galvanised Stick nails) geez that works the arm out big time and lot's of up & down on the
> ladder, such fiddly work...


That is interesting!! Never see much of that around here. Board and batten (usually Hardi, then 4" wide cedar strips like my electrical shed), yes, but not full size live edge 'batten'. Not much will get through that! lol
I recall seeing a test report on what you are doing...they stuck a chunk of wall in the elements for years to gauge deterioration and infiltration. They did very well. Seems they shed water quickly and dry out (stay dry). The only thing to consider is a bug screen at bottom. It is almost a pseudo rain-screen job. 

No idea what I am doing, except to say it will be hardi...board and batten, staggered/non-staggered hardi shingles, or hardi panel with faux batten. Forest fires are beginning to be an issue here...given we just broke our record for most forest consumed in a year, and the season isn't even finished yet. So, I'd have to say Hardi as the base, as it is virtually fireproof and does well in our wet winters.


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## MoBookworm1957

Melli, Steve S., 
Going offline for a while.
Need to recharge.
Be back to reading in a week or so.
Mo


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> Hopefully, you can read this...click on pic to make it larger.
> 3" for horizontal seams (overlap), and 6" for vertical seams...although, it appears I am doing about a 4"-5" overlap. I assumed the red line on underlay was the 3" overlap line, but as I look at pic, it is larger than 3" overlap...I'll pull out a tape measure and see.
> Nonetheless, as long as one overlaps the top sticky bit, your probably good.
> View attachment 61711
> 
> 
> Another nice thing about this stuff is tear or rip repair. See pt 10. With resisto, you need some bitumen based sealer as the coating is sand. This stuff is so sticky, just 6" patch coverage around tear/rip.
> 
> Addition: come to think of it, I bet that is the 6" line...haha. Oh well, I have good coverage...good thing I bought another roll, just in case. I wasn't going to make it with 4 rolls anyways (doing 3" overlap), so getting the 5th roll was a good call.
> Good catch Shannon! If you saw it...


Very, very cool material!! This would solve my roof problems in a hurry, well worth the expense...
I caught the lap lines on the stuff, figured that's what they were for. Extra overlap is something I would do as well. Extremely convenient that tears can be repaired that way, I need some of this to play with now.

Thanks, Melli!!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Very, very cool material!! This would solve my roof problems in a hurry, well worth the expense...
> I caught the lap lines on the stuff, figured that's what they were for. Extra overlap is something I would do as well. Extremely convenient that tears can be repaired that way, I need some of this to play with now.
> 
> Thanks, Melli!!


No problem.
I laid some more before dark, and I noticed it is easier to work with when it is cooler (20C). When warm-hot, the stuff sticks!
I measured that line...around 3-1/2"-4" overlap.
$100USD for a roll (covers ~200sqft).
First course is tricky, as one has to pull release film at 45 degrees for best results (release film is split down center, so you have to pull from high side first, then low side)...hard to do low side as there is no roof to stand on...I pulled enough film so I could reach it from the ground, and pulled walking alongside building. Following courses, I reversed order (low side first, and I was also pulling top strip film release (it says 'Remove' on it) of previous row at same time). While I am pulling low side release film and previous course topside release with one hand, I am using other hand to smooth/push down/align unreleased underlay in front (so when release film is pulled it lays flat and online). I am probably not making sense, but you'll see what I mean once you have it. Don't pull topside film release before you put on next course, or you'll have a sticky problem.
There is hand roller one can use to smooth it out, but feet work just as well...just take tiny steps all over (squash any bubbles).
Eventually, the sun will fuse it to ply, and that will be that.


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## melli

Done. And I feel done. So, 70% of build is protected. Just have to deal with that 30% (2nd floor). 
BTW- make sure you lay it right...if any time has passed, impossible to pull it up without pulling up pieces of ply and de-laminating underlay (I tried, then thought better of it). 
Time will tell how long it lasts...I suppose I am fortunate, as I'm above the 49...less UV (almost nil in winter).


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## ShannonR

Looks great, Melli! Your build is coming along so nicely. It's always a pleasure reading about your progress!!


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## Steve_S

Less UV in Winter ? Ummmmm... snow reflects it back, while it is less direct from SOL the reflection makes up the difference, haven't you ever gotten a sun tan in winter ? I have, more than once (not intentionally mind you).

Bet you feel a heck of a lot better now that part is done eh... daunting task done to high spec... 

BTW: My siding as shown previously was inspired by "The Japanese Forest House" if you google that a bunch of good photo's & website will pop up... That is Western Red Cedar, mine is Eastern White Cedar and is a rain screen with passive airspace venting behind it. (putting this here for future readers & you if interested)


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## melli

Early morning coffee...look up and see this bouncing around my yard. Most unusual. Figured either an eagle or coyote would have had him before daybreak...
Looks like someone's released pet, yet it is rather big, like a hare. And the coloring is really odd. Never seen one like that in the wilds. It was rather curious about me, yet extremely skittish. Would come fairly close, then zip away 50yds, then stop. Then slowly bounce back to me, and repeat. It seemed like the squirrels were none too pleased, chirping away. I know my neighbors have no rabbits, nor hares, so someone either dropped him off near my place or he/she bounced from a ways out. Very very fast animal, like it has been running around for a while. ????


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## Echoesechos

melli said:


> Early morning coffee...look up and see this bouncing around my yard. Most unusual. Figured either an eagle or coyote would have had him before daybreak...
> Looks like someone's released pet, yet it is rather big, like a hare. And the coloring is really odd. Never seen one like that in the wilds. It was rather curious about me, yet extremely skittish. Would come fairly close, then zip away 50yds, then stop. Then slowly bounce back to me, and repeat. It seemed like the squirrels were none too pleased, chirping away. I know my neighbors have no rabbits, nor hares, so someone either dropped him off near my place or he/she bounced from a ways out. Very very fast animal, like it has been running around for a while. ????
> View attachment 61736
> 
> View attachment 61737


Pretty fur. Tame it down for a companion. Rabbits are kinda fun to have around.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Pretty fur. Tame it down for a companion. Rabbits are kinda fun to have around.


How do you propose I do that...the thing is loopy....lol. Bounces around without rhyme or reason (doesn't see me as a threat, but I can't get near it). I saw it this evening...mowing my grass I suspect. I think it might be sheltering under shipping container. It seems to like Granola cereal though...same as the Ravens...hmmm.


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## Steve_S

That does look like a Domestic Rabbit and I suspect your right, it either escaped it's humans or was let loose by them. You might try to catch it with a baited (food) in a cage or just let it be as it will likely find local native rabbits and do what they do as it seems to be surviving ok... If you keep feeding it, it will remain close by, so you have to decide which is the better route. 

Another possibility, it could be a domestic / wild crossbreed already which should be no surprise... We have the usual bunnies around here but also some "weird ones" that look like crossbreeds about 1/2 the size of Aussie Lop Ears but look like them with all brown fur or odd colouring. There have been people who started breeding rabbits for food and found it either too difficult or just could not eat them afterwards so they "let them free" from guilt... not bright but some survive and reproduce with local wild rabbits.


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## melli

Well, now I have two of them...new one appeared this morning....same coloring as the other one. They seem to like hiding under car and shipping container. Very strange, as I've seen coyotes cruise through my place often. 

Was going to start 2nd floor low wall, but never got to it. Instead, did some maintenance items, like getting one post fully bolted up, and doing the high side with hurricane ties, until I had my fill. Took down a scaffold, as I'll need a couple for 2nd floor. Then, it was lunch time....








Bit of a bugbear, as I had to use 12" bolts with washers, as the 10" wasn't quite long enough...so close...I'll have to chop the ends off one day.


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> That does look like a Domestic Rabbit and I suspect your right, it either escaped it's humans or was let loose by them. You might try to catch it with a baited (food) in a cage or just let it be as it will likely find local native rabbits and do what they do as it seems to be surviving ok... If you keep feeding it, it will remain close by, so you have to decide which is the better route.
> 
> Another possibility, it could be a domestic / wild crossbreed already which should be no surprise... We have the usual bunnies around here but also some "weird ones" that look like crossbreeds about 1/2 the size of Aussie Lop Ears but look like them with all brown fur or odd colouring. There have been people who started breeding rabbits for food and found it either too difficult or just could not eat them afterwards so they "let them free" from guilt... not bright but some survive and reproduce with local wild rabbits.


I almost stroked out one day when I read an article about a couple who started a "chicken sanctuary" where urbanites whose chickens could bring their hens when they quit laying. I have a retirement home for chickens who quit laying - its called a stewpot! It would be more merciful to humanely kill domestic rabbits and dump them in the garbage if you can't stand to eat your "furry friends" than to turn them out into a wild they are not prepared for in any way. Killing a rabbit by snapping its neck is much more humane than what a hawk, coyote, or dog will do to it.


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## Echoesechos

Just keep feeding them. Sounds like they were dropped off. Get some hay so they can line their home for winter etc.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Just keep feeding them. Sounds like they were dropped off. Get some hay so they can line their home for winter etc.


In a few years, I won't have to buy any animals...they are slowly showing up at my door...I recall in my youth, my Mom was into game animals, and she cooked up some rabbit. I think it tasted like chicken. 

Got started on second floor...went for the easier wall (the low side - 6' 1-1/2" tall - needed a feel good day...lol). Decided that in order to speed things up, I am not going to frame in any windows, I can do that when I actually have them in hand. Plus, heading into winter, I can seal up 2nd floor better. Takes me a bit to do layout, as I have to drill holes for anchoring (in bottom and top plate). And, since I am solo, I do it two sections (easier to raise). I was going to slap on ply before raising, but I'm holding off until ply prices come back to earth (interior forest fires raised prices by almost a 100% at some places).









Camera white balance seems off...you can sort of make out the two sections...I offset top and bottom plate seams by three studs (wall is 17'+ across and I can't get long 2x6's, so I use two to span the distance). I then tack on a 2x4 diagonally to hold the studs in place (ones with no top plate) and it keeps the wall square while raising it. I avoid any stud toe-nailing.
It is pretty easy doing it this way solo. I then can nail the top plate into studs from longer section.









Once everything is nailed together, I'll use ratchet straps to tweak the wall square by strapping diagonally...and refasten the diagonal 2x4 to hold the wall square. Lastly, I'll nail the sucker to the floor (I'll make sure it is straight with a chalk line).
I'll finish it up tomorrow and start on the tall wall....that one will be fun (being facetious), as it will be 10' tall, very heavy and 10' off ground. I'll have to set up some scaffold around the edges...and some 'stops' so when I raise it, it won't fall off.


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## oldtruckbbq

Have you thought about tying off with a fall protection device? I'd hate to hear from you 3 months from now that you have been out of the loop recovering from going splat. Sorry, I've worked Maintenance and Engineering for over 20 years in manufacturing facilities and safety has been drilled into the core of my brain.


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## ShannonR

A word of caution on your new friends-- rabbits burrow, and can badly damage building foundations. I have seen in person how rabbits destroyed a barn

http://www.evergreenrabbitcontrol.co.uk/Damage-caused-by-rabbits/c-1-5.htm


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Have you thought about tying off with a fall protection device? I'd hate to hear from you 3 months from now that you have been out of the loop recovering from going splat. Sorry, I've worked Maintenance and Engineering for over 20 years in manufacturing facilities and safety has been drilled into the core of my brain.


Appreciate concern. Actually, I do have a harness...that will be put on for work on the 2nd floor roof. Problem with my fall device, is it takes 8ft or so to come to a stop, which could do me more harm than good at 10ft. Plus, I may end up doing the tarzan swing. 
But for sure, the roof of 2nd floor, I will be harnessed up. 
Was putting up scaffold for 2nd floor this past evening, to further limit any fall issues. Your right, I cannot afford to fall.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> A word of caution on your new friends-- rabbits burrow, and can badly damage building foundations. I have seen in person how rabbits destroyed a barn
> 
> http://www.evergreenrabbitcontrol.co.uk/Damage-caused-by-rabbits/c-1-5.htm


Wow...they can be terrors. Well, one of them disappeared today...I suspect the animal kingdom is at play. 
Feel bad for the one remaining, but there isn't a lot I can do...I have no pen, no shelter for it. 
A neighbor offered to get it, but I haven't heard back from them yet...no idea how they plan to catch it.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Appreciate concern. Actually, I do have a harness...that will be put on for work on the 2nd floor roof. Problem with my fall device, is it takes 8ft or so to come to a stop, which could do me more harm than good at 10ft. Plus, I may end up doing the tarzan swing.
> But for sure, the roof of 2nd floor, I will be harnessed up.
> Was putting up scaffold for 2nd floor this past evening, to further limit any fall issues. Your right, I cannot afford to fall.


My wife is very concerned about me cutting down trees when I am out at our property by myself. To calm her fears, I have promised to only cut down trees when there is someone else with me, and when it is just me I will clear out smaller growth and saplings I can clear with pruning shears. I'll buck trees that have been previously felled. It makes her feel better than I wear steel toe boots with a metatarsal guard, chainsaw safety chaps, and a hard hat with face shield. It only takes a chunk of wood hitting the face shield once to really appreciate it being there. I wear the chaps because there have been a couple guys here miss several weeks of work healing up from a wayward chainsaw getting them in the leg and one miss work because he had to have surgery on his eye to remove debris from a chainsaw. Of course, no safety gear for any of them. I don't need that!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> My wife is very concerned about me cutting down trees when I am out at our property by myself. To calm her fears, I have promised to only cut down trees when there is someone else with me, and when it is just me I will clear out smaller growth and saplings I can clear with pruning shears. I'll buck trees that have been previously felled. It makes her feel better than I wear steel toe boots with a metatarsal guard, chainsaw safety chaps, and a hard hat with face shield. It only takes a chunk of wood hitting the face shield once to really appreciate it being there. I wear the chaps because there have been a couple guys here miss several weeks of work healing up from a wayward chainsaw getting them in the leg and one miss work because he had to have surgery on his eye to remove debris from a chainsaw. Of course, no safety gear for any of them. I don't need that!


Where in the world are you...lol


I so agree about safety gear....although, I don't have steel toed boots nor chaps. Eye protection because I don't want to be blind, and ear protection because the chainsaw racket annoys me...not so much because it will, over time, affect hearing.
And good leather gloves. I've had more than my share of tree falling, and it is my firm belief that if one stays out of the plane of the spinning chain, your good. I've had a chain spin off, but because I was standing outside of plane, it spun beside me, not in me. Same goes for kickbacks...

And this is where I plug Bobby (Bobcat 331)...haha (I do this often). Felling trees is dangerous (period). I follow all the safety tips about having a clear path to walk/run away from a tree falling to the proper cuts...yet, there is something about being near a falling object that weighs several tons. And sometimes they are so unpredictable in falling behavior. Our province's number one work related killer is in forestry. And those guys working the bush, are felling some absolute monsters. Anyways, I've shied away from chainsaw falling, and now I use Bobby whenever I can. The safety of sitting in a cab with roll-over-protection means I'm also pretty safe from a falling tree...plus, a tree cannot fall through the arm, which is pushing said tree. I just dig out roots on one side, then push with wide bucket with teeth. Falling accuracy is perfect, and as a bonus, the root pops out of ground. Once the tree is horizontal, bucking it up, is easy and safe. (I posted my method in previous pages, with pics of course)

I recall when I exclusively did the chainsaw felling method, before I wised up and realized Bobby was the better tool, that I was playing a dangerous game. Our trees are usually very tall (100ft+), not too big diameters wise, but the lower branches are usually dead, and even one of those whacking you in head is like falling baseball bats at height. And they were too far up to trim prior to felling. Since I use Bobby now, I've had a few dead branches hit my cab roof. Makes a racket, and startles me silly, but no injury.


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## ShannonR

Smart move skipping the steel toes, Melli!!
Steel toe boots are not a logger's friend...in the event of a tree or branch or rocks coming down on your toes, would you rather have smashed toes or no toes?
Steel toed boots cover just the toe portion of the boot in steel... in the event of something falling on your steeltoe-clad feet, the edge of the steel can shear off toes right at their base or do other major damage. This was explained to me by a logger (who still has all his toes)


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## Steve_S

I Hafta Chuckle Melli, the way you go on about Bobbi... It's a Love Story ! LOL I'm sure your a little artistically inclined (your work says you are), there's a Cartoon Strip potential there ! 

I drop smaller trees all the time and praise my Husky XP-576/AT all the time as it's the Best Saw I've owned (had other Husky's & other brands over the decades) but when it comes to the Big Ones, I like to have a spotter on hand, even with a clear escape route etc... can never be too safe around big trees & chainsaws, seen too much over the years.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I Hafta Chuckle Melli, the way you go on about Bobbi... It's a Love Story ! LOL I'm sure your a little artistically inclined (your work says you are), there's a Cartoon Strip potential there !
> 
> I drop smaller trees all the time and praise my Husky XP-576/AT all the time as it's the Best Saw I've owned (had other Husky's & other brands over the decades) but when it comes to the Big Ones, I like to have a spotter on hand, even with a clear escape route etc... can never be too safe around big trees & chainsaws, seen too much over the years.


I can't help myself...Bobby is a drug. In the dead of winter, and it is miserable outside, I hop into Bobby and tool around 'landscaping' (knocking over trees, moving boulders, making paths). A great pick-me-up. Just costs me a few liters of diesel and some grease. I was pushed into owning one way back when I couldn't find any excavator operators to dig a 100 holes for cedars my neighbors and I bought. And given I was the full timer, the task was foisted on me. In a panic (trees due to arrive in a day or so) I drove around looking for excavator operators as all the ones I knew were busy. I then saw a "Rent me" sign on a Bobcat 331 near my place....the rest is history. I never planned on owning one...they seemed very expensive and high maintenance. But once I got over the learning curve of operating one, there was no question of whether I should get one, especially after my experience in a skid steer. 

Got the tall wall banged up....even with my safety devices deployed, it was sketchy (lifting the wall was the easy part, but lifting it and getting the anchors in holes, in sill plate, was interesting). Once in position, I found using timber washers hold the wall in place quite well...gave me time to bang on bracing. I still have to frame in a door in that opening. The other two walls will be a walk in the park....Nice to see it take shape. My nerves are shot...lol
The stress (working at heights) takes more out of me than the actual carpentry. So odd...I used to be great with heights.

















From the side view, the slope looks right (match main roof slope), but from front, it looks way off. 








Nice thing about having a garage door sized opening is cleaning...fire up blower and a minute later, clean floors (it was full of sawdust an hour ago)...no sweeping required.


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## oldtruckbbq

Looks like you might just get it dried in before the cold weather hits. Good job.


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## Steve_S

I think your right there OldTruck, it certainly looks like it, hopefully she'll be closed in and weather tight... That is when the Real Fun begins... Ohh My ! I'm already pondering renting another backhoe for a few days... That will be the end of that type of need as there is just no way on this earth I can manually labour up what's next... If only I hadn't lost the a 3rd of this year to health issues... ruckus, stuckus, frickus fruckus as Fred would say....


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Looks like you might just get it dried in before the cold weather hits. Good job.


I really hope so...the idea of scrambling on 2nd floor roof when the monsoon hits is what scares me. 
Even a slowpoke like me should be ready for rafters by end of month. Rafters are just brutally heavy, but there are only 16 of them...the strapping, blocking, fascia and ply install are the time killers. Time will tell. 

Doing my best to take a zen approach to it all...worse case, I throw several tarps on it (with lots of lumber to hold it in place)...lol
Some falls have been kind here (rains start in November), but last year, they started in September and never let up (6 mths of cloud). Longest 'winter' in memory. It never gets cold here like Steve's place in the eastern bush 
I am in the warmest and probably wettest place in Canada, in winter.


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## Steve_S

We are already seeing single digit nights, albeit not too often yet... End of October usually some snow hitting and by then it's get's pretty "frosty" BUT have seen green Xmas' too (hope this year is one of those)... Environment Canada has been terribly OFF all year and their projections for this winter are meaningless due to the major heat at the Arctic Circle, everything is "Whack-a-doodle". Even now, +35c one day, next +19c and storms... ohh my, 2-3 nasties a week, all summer long and so wet... "The Chinese Conspiracy" lmao.... Twisters & Micro Bursts too... way more than ever before and WHY they (Env Canada) don't mention them (when we can observe & report them) has many around here baffled & questioning... something is not right with that...

Melli, I have a lot of Positive Vibes headed your way to get it wind & water tight by the time the rains begin in earnest... You sure have the determination, drive & ability to do it and seemingly unlimited "energy" (bottle some and ship it my way OK ? I could use the nuclear power).


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## Mr Bond

We've already had frost and hail in the Kootenay's Melli, and single digits are already common (though +33C yesterday.....). Need rain to dampen the fires. So here's hoping you catch a weather break!

I know you don't like renting equipment, but have considered a scissor lift or zoom boom/basket to help speed things along on the envelope? Can make an incredible difference for a single person (even Hercules ).


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> We've already had frost and hail in the Kootenay's Melli, and single digits are already common (though +33C yesterday.....). Need rain to dampen the fires. So here's hoping you catch a weather break!
> 
> I know you don't like renting equipment, but have considered a scissor lift or zoom boom/basket to help speed things along on the envelope? Can make an incredible difference for a single person (even Hercules ).


I was expecting rain last night and today...nothing but clear blue skies. Dare I say, I was expecting *some *rain. 
I will have to look into boom or scissor lift for soffit. Right now, all I have money for is material to finish framing. A machine would be a big help in humping up rafters and ply. Problem is, I am in boonies, and just the delivery charges would be silly. 
You got me curious, so I just called to see what they wanted...$250/day or $1250/wk...ouch. And this is just for a 'man lift'...no materials. 
Hmmm. I have to make some sort of fork lift attachment for Bobby. Just to lift ply up 10' near bunker...from there I can pull it off and set into place easily. I am sort of good for roof framing, as one wall is just over 6' tall. Getting the ply onto roof will be a headache...I usually get delivery truck to drop it on roof, but I doubt they can get close enough (25' reach) to do so as 2nd floor is at opposite end of drive access. 
Going to fire off an email to a neighbor...heard they have a scaffold....


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## melli

Neighbor might come through for me about scaffold...see him next week. 
Another wall...really easy not framing in any windows...lol
I still managed to make a boo-boo when framing it up...seems I forget the 'X' on side of line for a stud means put it on that side...doh! Just one stud mistake...thankfully.


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## Breezy833

Been a great time watching alone with you. I've even been inspired to do some of my own things. Our house was pre-built but the beatification part is taking place. It got me wondering, are you a builder full-time?


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## melli

Breezy833 said:


> Been a great time watching alone with you. I've even been inspired to do some of my own things. Our house was pre-built but the beatification part is taking place. It got me wondering, are you a builder full-time?


Glad to hear I inspired you, as I was inspired by others too...

No, just stuff in hood...it was a weird situation. About a decade ago, I 'helped' (that was the plan - ended up doing the whole thing myself) someone build a deck, and things exploded. Everybody in hood would see what I did, and they wanted an uber deck, or bunkhouse or reno etc. In my youth I worked for a contractor for a spell...hated it...lol. Now, I seem to like it, although my days of 'helping' are pretty much over...it wore on me. Don't mind doing my own stuff unless heights are involved. 
I'm all for folks doing carpentry..there is something rewarding in building a structure or in your case, beautification. Suggest you research really well what you plan to do, and just go for it. First time is the toughest, then after dozens of jobs, it comes easily...lol

Really read the technical literature on building science, and be careful of following someone's work, as they may have no clue or followed someone's poor example. I don't profess to be a pro, but I feel good about what I do, and my motto as always been to build it to last beyond my lifetime and the next. Plus, I am always open to new ideas. For example, it took me weeks to research the best way to 'develop' rebar in concrete footings (engineering term for how to place rebar). I was on the eng-phys boards sussing out the best way, and even they couldn't agree. I was looking at seismic damage of buildings to see what went wrong, before I built my place (my place is unique to me, as I never built ICF walls). Our local university has a shake table where they built a shed and tried to shake it to pieces...that sort of stuff really gets your head wrapped around how to do it well. 
Lastly, I look at contractor builds...some work I see, I wonder, while others, I have to do that! Every stick of wood, and nail has a purpose. 

Speaking of which, I was making a header for a door...and being a 'light day' decided to make a good header (piece above door that supports the weight above and limits shear). Normally, I'd slap 2 - 2x10's together, but today, I glued in a piece of 1/2" ply in between. Nowadays, folks will use LVLs, Parallams, Microllams etc., for uber strong headers (especially wider spans for french doors, living room windows etc.), but I didn't have any lying about. This is the next best thing, as I sort of created an engineered header. 









And this is the finished result;










I should note that many building science gurus are on the 'less wood' bandwagon because they want to maximize insulation values. They wouldn't have the 2x6 capping top and bottom of header (they want less 'thermal breaks'). I'll deal with insulation later...I'm all about strength of build. Even the bottom 2x6 on header is usually not sitting on jack studs (trimmer studs), but between jack studs because I was told, the drywall may crack...not good enough for me...lol. Care less about drywall...I want strength, and with header capped top and bottom, it creates an 'I' beam. It'll be a while before I get to drywall, so the build will find it's final moisture content (won't shrink or expand anymore). 

Should note: I will be cladding outside of plywood sheathing with 2" XPS insulation, so I'll get a complete thermal break.


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## Steve_S

/me chuckles... Headers, I went nuts as I super insulated... here's one example of mine 
but then here's the HD-EPS-II that's inside my inside my walls... as well... So carrying on with the "theme" what choices did I have ? Note, the EPS has Bonded Fibre on it which is fire & bug resistant... you can drive a car over it and it won't dent and barely mark... It's NOT that open cell stuff used in packaging, it from a commercial roofer (not avail to public). The B.I. thought I over did it and he was right, one good fart inside and you have to open a door / window to cool off... (Good for my old bones).








The Header (over windows) 







The EPS inside the walls. * Cathedral Ceilings have 7-1/2" Poly-ISO (3.5" & 4.0" cross lapped).


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## melli

Great pics Steve! 
No way I'll be doing that! lol. I'd feel tortured painstakingly cutting each foam-board to size. I will hand it to you, for doing it. I just about lost it, doing staggered Hardi siding...I don't have that kind of patience.


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## Steve_S

Let me say this, I fully grasp the concept of TEDIUM !, over & over & over again ! The straight cuts were bad enough (circ saw them hand saw to finish) but all the cuts where rafter's meet top plates, 3 angles for each piece, interlocked - essentially they are R50 and zero cold leakage (one of the weakest heat loss points in a home) and worse, was squeezing spray foam between the pieces & woodwork to completely seal everything... Did it once, luckily the only time I will ever do it as my building days are pretty much over. MANY lessons learned and a few Should've, Could've, Would've but no regrets.


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## melli

I commiserate with you Steve, and maybe chuckle a bit at what you went through...oh my, that would suck. And I thought doing my main roof sucked...lol
Onward...decided to face block the studs where the plywood seams will be...it is a 'newish' code thing up here. They want all ply wall seams blocked. I used to do the horizontal blocking mid height on walls, but now, they want the seams blocked. So, you can see the blocking I put up...the ply will cover the rim joist and come up about 3' on studs. I'll be using 5/8" T&G, if the price comes back to earth. And Steve, I'll be inverting ply this time (so tongue is facing up)...loose fit. Unfortunately, this side of build will be taking the brunt of the windstorms, so I want this wood box tight. I'll have to do more rows of blocking 4' up (width of ply).









If any of you saw Jeff Piotrowski live Hurricane Harvey feed, I want this second floor to be as good as that Blue/Green shed (I say Teal) he was filming as eye-wall approached. Everything around him was disintegrating, but that shed. He was in a car 'warsh' (concrete block building), and some of the roof peeled off, and beams were cracking. I've been in some nasty storms, but his film was over the top. What folks do for a paycheck.


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## melli

Hey Steve...heard your chatter on another thread about insurance...didn't want to usurp their thread. Found it interesting they demanded a 30 foot buffer around home. I am having difficulty in getting insurance 'while' I build. Apparently, easier to get insurance before building...no idea why. Plus, my insurance company wants to see my credit score. Supposedly, if I have a good credit score, I'll get cheaper insurance. I need to change my broker, as the one I got is brutal (my emails to them go to junk mail...lol). At any rate, as I may have mentioned, I am paying more for insurance now, without a house, than I did with one...defies logic. A house can be a quarter million hit, but an RV, 7k (roll eyes). 

Last wall ready for raising...I needed to get some ply first...going to install a sheet or two, as when I raise it, I won't have access to nail as the rafters for main floor are in the way. I then need to slide ply in a gap I left between wall and rafter to tie in tall and short wall. Will be interesting...and that underlay hanging off rafters will be attached to wall I raise.


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## Steve_S

Dunno what to say about your insurance woes BUT I did have dealings with ICBC once... OI what a shambles that disaster is.... and it's still allowed to operate... Shop around for home insurance and remember YOU are paying THEIR salary so if non-responsive or lackadaisical then send a complaint to corporate / head office and find another company. WHAT The heck does your Credit Rating have to do with insurance and getting a better premium rate ? SOUNDS FISHY TO ME ! What about someone like me, who has NO CREDIT RATING ?? Last time I used any form of credit anywhere, was over 20 years ago and have zero regrets to using cash only and no impulse buying either ! I'm not sure but I do believe that in BC there are setback rules as well for trees and whatnot, they are likely different than here... BUT your concrete bunker, clad in Hardy Board & metal roof = Good Points to drop rates (not like you built a cedar mansion with cedar shingles !) wink wink...


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## Hitch

That sucks about the insurance. As you may recall we've had our challenges too getting insurance. As it is we could only get a liability policy but not property. So if anything happens to the shed or its contents we're f#$%&! I'll share an email our agent sent me previously about the construction policy.

A Course of Construction, sometimes referred to as Builders Risk, policy covers the structure from fire and vandalism while it’s being built. We use the estimated completed value of the home as the basis of insurance. So, if it will cost $500,000 to have the home completed, then that’s the limit we use. 

Some carriers will allow you can add on coverage for theft of building materials. 

Policy should be issued just prior to breaking ground. Coverage cannot be purchased after the home has been started. The policy is good for one year. Premiums are fully earned which means that if you complete the home with 6 months to spare, you do not get any premium back. 

Once the home is completed and ready to move in, we write a homeowners policy if the home is to be owner occupied.


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> Dunno what to say about your insurance woes BUT I did have dealings with ICBC once... OI what a shambles that disaster is.... and it's still allowed to operate... Shop around for home insurance and remember YOU are paying THEIR salary so if non-responsive or lackadaisical then send a complaint to corporate / head office and find another company. WHAT The heck does your Credit Rating have to do with insurance and getting a better premium rate ? SOUNDS FISHY TO ME ! What about someone like me, who has NO CREDIT RATING ?? Last time I used any form of credit anywhere, was over 20 years ago and have zero regrets to using cash only and no impulse buying either ! I'm not sure but I do believe that in BC there are setback rules as well for trees and whatnot, they are likely different than here... BUT your concrete bunker, clad in Hardy Board & metal roof = Good Points to drop rates (not like you built a cedar mansion with cedar shingles !) wink wink...


Here in the lower 48 it is common practice to use credit score when determining insurance cost. I've read a couple articles about it where insurance actuary studies show a correlation between credit score and reliable payment, and data that shows that people with lower credit scores seem to engage in behaviors that increase the risk of claims. Decisions aren't made by the agent across the desk from you whose hand you just shook. Decisions are made by computer programs.


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## melli

Hitch said:


> That sucks about the insurance. As you may recall we've had our challenges too getting insurance. As it is we could only get a liability policy but not property. So if anything happens to the shed or its contents we're f#$%&! I'll share an email our agent sent me previously about the construction policy.
> 
> A Course of Construction, sometimes referred to as Builders Risk, policy covers the structure from fire and vandalism while it’s being built. We use the estimated completed value of the home as the basis of insurance. So, if it will cost $500,000 to have the home completed, then that’s the limit we use.
> 
> Some carriers will allow you can add on coverage for theft of building materials.
> 
> Policy should be issued just prior to breaking ground. Coverage cannot be purchased after the home has been started. The policy is good for one year. Premiums are fully earned which means that if you complete the home with 6 months to spare, you do not get any premium back.
> 
> Once the home is completed and ready to move in, we write a homeowners policy if the home is to be owner occupied.


The only reason I can think why there is a problem getting insurance during the 'course of construction' is it has been abused, but I figured it would be abused prior to construction also? It occurred to me to get insurance prior to breaking ground, but I was like, what is the point, I have nothing to insure. Even after getting walls up, I was willing to take on the risk...it is when I got to the wood framing bit, I realized my time and effort needed to be insured more than the materials...lol
Then the building inspector chimed in with what my build is worth, and I'm like whoa...Material loss is one thing, but I don't want to have to go through with free labor (me) again. BTW - BI figures going rate for a home is about $200/sqft (average). That would put my home in the 180k range, but with carport and ICF, I'm thinking well in excess of 200k.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Here in the lower 48 it is common practice to use credit score when determining insurance cost. I've read a couple articles about it where insurance actuary studies show a correlation between credit score and reliable payment, and data that shows that people with lower credit scores seem to engage in behaviors that increase the risk of claims. Decisions aren't made by the agent across the desk from you whose hand you just shook. Decisions are made by computer programs.


Yeah, I figured that was the deal. North of 49 we frown on using credit score for anything, other than when seeing a bank for a loan. I see it has crept into our insurance business...they said I didn't have to agree to having them take a look at my credit score, but it could reduce my payments. Ha! I am fortunate, as of now, my credit score is very good from what I heard from bank guy processing my mortgage. I heard accessing your credit score can actually make it worse, so I've never looked...never had a need to. 
I find it odd all around...I've used the same insurance company (and broker) for decades...never missed a payment because I authorize them to take it out of my bank every month. Never had a claim either.


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## susanneb

Here in Oregon, we had difficulty finding Course of Construction insurance because 1) we are surrounded by forest, 2) we were living onsite in a mobile home, and 3) we have miniature horses on the property. They listed all three reasons, but we figured those vicious, tiny horses were the real problem. You never know when they might stampede...


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## melli

susanneb said:


> Here in Oregon, we had difficulty finding Course of Construction insurance because 1) we are surrounded by forest, 2) we were living onsite in a mobile home, and 3) we have miniature horses on the property. They listed all three reasons, but we figured those vicious, tiny horses were the real problem. You never know when they might stampede...


Well, I am changing brokers to see if I can get some customer service at least. Yep, horses are high risk...someone might slip in a patty. What I really think it comes down to is the fact I am living in a RV. It is a class thing. While I should have acquired building insurance prior to building, I'm guessing they've had issues with folks living in RV's and building. It doesn't fit into their model. Even the paperwork was geared towards a contractor. Thing is, I've had building insurance in past, with a contractor building my home (I was 3hrs away), and back then, I'd say the risk was much higher, as no one was around at days end or weekends. At least I am here, right beside the bloody thing. I can hear a mouse squeak in build from my RV at night (or in my case, those rabbits running around). 24/7 security (me) and cams are watching all the time. 

Another hot day...should be cooling down, but it is getting warmer. Got the *last *wall up. Went pretty smoothly, although I failed to account for the width of wall when I put in beam and stair width (well, I knew wall would protrude over beam, but I never adjusted stair width to account for it). Up here, a stairwell can be up to 42" wide without two handrails. Anything wider, and two handrails are needed. I don't want two handrails (they get in way when hauling stuff up stairs). So, instead of 42" wide stairs, I'll be around 40". Not a big deal, but as wide as possible would have been better. 









And this the view from main roof...was able to get some of the underlay on wall. Glad I left some extra hanging to do so...will seal the 2nd floor wall to main roof.










I just need to get another top plate on, all around, and maybe a couple sheets of ply on far corner to stiffen up walls, then I can start hauling rafters up. I can finish wall sheathing when ply prices come down. The objective is to get the roof up and underlay on...then, I can truly chill (relatively speaking....lol).










You'll note my little boo-boo on closest wall...never lined up top plate seam over a joist. Another 'no big deal' issue, as another top plate goes over it, and it isn't a load bearing wall. Part of me thinks this solution is actually stronger, than having a seam over stud (especially with blocking there). Was plain 'user error' (term we geeks used in school when we messed up an equation). Never do layout first thing in morning...one has to warm up first (upstairs).


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Well, I am changing brokers to see if I can get some customer service at least. Yep, horses are high risk...someone might slip in a patty. What I really think it comes down to is the fact I am living in a RV. It is a class thing. While I should have acquired building insurance prior to building, I'm guessing they've had issues with folks living in RV's and building. It doesn't fit into their model. Even the paperwork was geared towards a contractor. Thing is, I've had building insurance in past, with a contractor building my home (I was 3hrs away), and back then, I'd say the risk was much higher, as no one was around at days end or weekends. At least I am here, right beside the bloody thing. I can hear a mouse squeak in build from my RV at night (or in my case, those rabbits running around). 24/7 security (me) and cams are watching all the time.
> 
> Another hot day...should be cooling down, but it is getting warmer. Got the *last *wall up. Went pretty smoothly, although I failed to account for the width of wall when I put in beam and stair width (well, I knew wall would protrude over beam, but I never adjusted stair width to account for it). Up here, a stairwell can be up to 42" wide without two handrails. Anything wider, and two handrails are needed. I don't want two handrails (they get in way when hauling stuff up stairs). So, instead of 42" wide stairs, I'll be around 40". Not a big deal, but as wide as possible would have been better.
> 
> View attachment 61937
> 
> And this the view from main roof...was able to get some of the underlay on wall. Glad I left some extra hanging to do so...will seal the 2nd floor wall to main roof.
> 
> View attachment 61943
> 
> 
> I just need to get another top plate on, all around, and maybe a couple sheets of ply on far corner to stiffen up walls, then I can start hauling rafters up. I can finish wall sheathing when ply prices come down. The objective is to get the roof up and underlay on...then, I can truly chill (relatively speaking....lol).
> 
> View attachment 61944
> 
> 
> You'll note my little boo-boo on closest wall...never lined up top plate seam over a joist. Another 'no big deal' issue, as another top plate goes over it, and it isn't a load bearing wall. Part of me thinks this solution is actually stronger, than having a seam over stud (especially with blocking there). Was plain 'user error' (term we geeks used in school when we messed up an equation). Never do layout first thing in morning...one has to warm up first (upstairs).


What size lumber will you be using for rafters? I'm working on designs for the house we are going to build and had been planning a conventional gable end roof using pre-built trusses. I really like the look of your shed roof and am contemplating that style roof instead. Since we will be building a post and beam timber frame using 8x8 timbers, it should have no problem supporting a shed roof instead of a gable roof. In fact, the load on the frame will actually be considerable less. The savings on decking, underlayment, and steel panels alone is substantial. That money could go into upgrading bathroom and kitchen fixtures or flooring.

Also, what length will your rafters have to be? Our place will be 30 feet deep, and I want at least a 3 foot overhang on each side. I was figuring 2x8, doubled up with a piece of 3/4" plywood sandwiched between them. This will give us more roof insulation and I plan on insulating, then putting drywall or beadboard over the rafters for the ceiling. It would be a dramatic look since the kitchen, dining, living areas will be on the side with the tallest wall.


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## Steve_S

susanneb said:


> those vicious, tiny horses were the real problem. You never know when they might stampede...


 Indeed Guard Ponies ! A neighbour & friend (Mennonites) has 3 of the little beast for the kids... Amazing animals and the kids can do just about anything they want with them BUT an adult cannot approach said beasties, they champ, snort, stomp hooves to let you know, Adults are NOT Acceptable in any way... but the kids can call them and they come running !



melli said:


> Was plain 'user error'


 Translation: Keyboard Chair Interface Malfunction. hehehehe,,, maybe in this case Hammer & Swinger failure.... Another Good Day for Master Melli ! More WOOTNESS !


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> What size lumber will you be using for rafters? I'm working on designs for the house we are going to build and had been planning a conventional gable end roof using pre-built trusses. I really like the look of your shed roof and am contemplating that style roof instead. Since we will be building a post and beam timber frame using 8x8 timbers, it should have no problem supporting a shed roof instead of a gable roof. In fact, the load on the frame will actually be considerable less. The savings on decking, underlayment, and steel panels alone is substantial. That money could go into upgrading bathroom and kitchen fixtures or flooring.
> 
> Also, what length will your rafters have to be? Our place will be 30 feet deep, and I want at least a 3 foot overhang on each side. I was figuring 2x8, doubled up with a piece of 3/4" plywood sandwiched between them. This will give us more roof insulation and I plan on insulating, then putting drywall or beadboard over the rafters for the ceiling. It would be a dramatic look since the kitchen, dining, living areas will be on the side with the tallest wall.


My rafters and joists are 2x12 (Douglas Fir) all around. The main and 'soon to be' second floor roof are also strapped with 2x4's and sheathed with 5/8" T&G ply. If I were doing it again, I might have swung for the fences and used 1-3/4" x 11-7/8" LVLs. Stronger and always true. They would have cost near double though. 

In your case, with the spans you want, engineered trusses (many flavors like gabled to flat) is the only way, unless you have mid span support. Dimensional lumber can only go so far...LVLs and their brethren can span further, but for cost considerations, engineered trusses are cheaper. My issue with engineered trusses is they are light, relatively speaking...I visit homes around here that managed to get the monster dimensional lumber (shed style roof like mine, but with 4x16 true rafters). That kind of roof is bullet proof (nothing shakes those roofs). Heck, my neighbor has them for floor joists too...just no big trees left to mill nowadays. I can only imagine what one of those would cost now if a 24' 2x12 is $70 (and that was contractor pricing).

I am a fan of shed style mainly because they are simple and cheaper to build. And with transom (clerestory) windows, they look good too. You get high ceilings with less headache. Plus, working on a low slope roof is just easier. I do have to say, if money was no object, I would build a gabled roof with dormers and a large turret with low slope wrap around porch...I have a love of dormers. 

I like your idea of 8x8 posts, but would lean towards something taller for beams. Depends on spans you had in mind.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> My rafters and joists are 2x12 (Douglas Fir) all around. The main and 'soon to be' second floor roof are also strapped with 2x4's and sheathed with 5/8" T&G ply. If I were doing it again, I might have swung for the fences and used 1-3/4" x 11-7/8" LVLs. Stronger and always true. They would have cost near double though.
> 
> In your case, with the spans you want, engineered trusses (many flavors like gabled to flat) is the only way, unless you have mid span support. Dimensional lumber can only go so far...LVLs and their brethren can span further, but for cost considerations, engineered trusses are cheaper. My issue with engineered trusses is they are light, relatively speaking...I visit homes around here that managed to get the monster dimensional lumber (shed style roof like mine, but with 4x16 true rafters). That kind of roof is bullet proof (nothing shakes those roofs). Heck, my neighbor has them for floor joists too...just no big trees left to mill nowadays. I can only imagine what one of those would cost now if a 24' 2x12 is $70 (and that was contractor pricing).
> 
> I am a fan of shed style mainly because they are simple and cheaper to build. And with transom (clerestory) windows, they look good too. You get high ceilings with less headache. Plus, working on a low slope roof is just easier. I do have to say, if money was no object, I would build a gabled roof with dormers and a large turret with low slope wrap around porch...I have a love of dormers.
> 
> I like your idea of 8x8 posts, but would lean towards something taller for beams. Depends on spans you had in mind.


Spans for beams will only be 8 feet. We will be infilling with cordwood construction. There are a lot of oak trees I have to cut down for the drive and house site. They will easily yield at least 1 8"x8"x8' timber each. I can either cut them myself with a beam cutting jig, or I can haul the logs to a local saw mill. They will cut beams for me in exchange for logs. I take them 9 logs, they provide me 6 timbers and whatever dimensional lumber they get when trimming for the timbers. I figure the Brits use oak for their timber frame construction and they have stood for hundreds of years. Besides, its a lot cheaper than if I had to buy rough cut pine timbers from Menards!

2x12 rafters would be interesting because I could put in 6-8 inches of insulation and inset beadboard or drywall inside and leave several inches of rafter exposed. A nice stain and they would look great. The house will basically be split in half with living, dining, kitchen in the front half and bedrooms and bathroom in the back half. That would mean a load bearing wall at the midpoint so max span on rafters would be 15 feet. The span chart with the snow load rating for this area shows that would be permissible.

We continue to refine what we want in the house while working on clearing the land and getting the road and utilities put in. I'm hoping to have the foundation poured this spring so we can start construction, pending what our fall and winter are like. I'll be posting pics of the proposed design this weekend. I have a Home Architect software package that lets me place furniture and fixtures, do 3D camera views of rooms, and a 3D external view. Helps to make sure room layouts and traffic flow are actually workable before construction.


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## susanneb

Steve_S said:


> Indeed Guard Ponies ! A neighbour & friend (Mennonites) has 3 of the little beast for the kids... Amazing animals and the kids can do just about anything they want with them BUT an adult cannot approach said beasties, they champ, snort, stomp hooves to let you know, Adults are NOT Acceptable in any way... but the kids can call them and they come running



Mine are most likely to mug visitors for food. Our show pony/driving horse stretches and struts, asking to be told he's beautiful, and our mare, Scarlett the harlot, would stand at the gate and bat her eyes, saying "Hey sailor!" They all thought the never-ending parade of workers were there just to see them.


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## melli

I know why they are giving me grief over insurance...rabbits.









Haven't had a whole lot of progress...been fighting with T bracket on high post. With it so high up, I cannot get good leverage when drilling, and of course, my holes were slightly off (drilling through bracket to other bracket on other side (even an 1/8" off means no-go)...just over 9" of the hardest wood I've ever drilled through in my life). I'm in the process of trying to ream the holes slightly larger, so I have a little wiggle room to slide bolt through, but I seem to have glazed the holes. Then I go to an auto store and get the most expensive metal bit they have to ream hole larger...sort of worked, as I got two more bolts through. Just one more, and it is the most awkward one. Being 15' up brings about a certain amount of nervousness. After a half hour of going through a variety of bits of various lengths (auger, spade, forstener, metal), I am toast...soaked and dripping with the sweat, and my legs are ready to collapse. I try to attack it near dusk, when it is the coolest...sort of my last gasp of energy before retiring. 

Give you an idea how ridiculously tight and firm the wood is, I can take a 5 foot chisel point construction bar, cram the tip under post a quarter/half inch, and lift the carport roof without damaging or compressing the bottom of the post (when I had no bolts in bottom bracket). BTW - I was slightly amused I could do that.


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## Steve_S

Wererabbits ! Wait till the Full Moon !
Glad to see the strap around that ladder ! Goodness Gracious (me hates heights on ladders and scaffolds) One more beastly Bolt and another item checked off with success ! Enviro Canada is saying we, here in Ontario will have a respectably nice September... not holding my breath but hoping for the best... Hope you have a nice September as well (BC could use it !) and you'll be dried in hopefully. Got your windows & doors organized yet ? IF you can get all closed up, Wind & Water Tight, you can plug along inside in reasonable comfort. Fingers Crossed for ya !


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## melli

A relief finally getting all the bolts in bracket and getting rid of scaffold. Really opens up carport area, as ducking timber to car wasn't working out that well....

Got the second top plate on all around the 2nd floor, so tomorrow, I can see about hauling those massive 24' rafters up there. Joy. Only sixteen of them....Will look very cool with rafters up (final shape will take form).





























Tip: when sourcing 2nd top plate, get the straightest ones you can find...they straighten out any bow in wall, as they will invariably be bowed slightly with one plate (especially longer walls where one is butting several plates end-to-end). Also, I always have ALL stud 'crowns' facing up or down (dealer's choice) when building a wall. When you put on ply (sheathing), it will take most of the crown out. If you looked closely at previous pics I posted (post #442), you'll see a slight bow on high wall when I had one top plate...now, they all look (and are) true. Makes a world of difference when it comes to putting up rafters...as I mentioned, I make a template, an use it to cut all succeeding ones, and they will all fit perfectly. And as a bonus, your rafters tails will line up when it comes time to put on fascia (rim joist). Really hard to torque a crooked wall when you have rafters on it. JM2C.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> A relief finally getting all the bolts in bracket and getting rid of scaffold. Really opens up carport area, as ducking timber to car wasn't working out that well....
> 
> Got the second top plate on all around the 2nd floor, so tomorrow, I can see about hauling those massive 24' rafters up there. Joy. Only sixteen of them....Will look very cool with rafters up (final shape will take form).
> View attachment 61989
> View attachment 61991
> View attachment 61992
> View attachment 61994
> 
> Tip: when sourcing 2nd top plate, get the straightest ones you can find...they straighten out any bow in wall, as they will invariably be bowed slightly with one plate (especially longer walls where one is butting several plates end-to-end). Also, I always have ALL stud 'crowns' facing up or down (dealer's choice) when building a wall. When you put on ply (sheathing), it will take most of the crown out. If you looked closely at previous pics I posted (post #442), you'll see a slight bow on high wall when I had one top plate...now, they all look (and are) true. Makes a world of difference when it comes to putting up rafters...as I mentioned, I make a template, an use it to cut all succeeding ones, and they will all fit perfectly. And as a bonus, your rafters tails will line up when it comes time to put on fascia (rim joist). Really hard to torque a crooked wall when you have rafters on it. JM2C.


We were going to build our place with a standard gable end roof. I showed my wife the pics of your place with the shed roof and she really likes the look. Calculating out the difference in material cost shows about a 35% lower cost for the roof. And I won't have to rent a mini excavator or backhoe to lift trusses in place. The house will be 30' deep, so I'm planning on using 20' 2x12 so I have a nice overhang.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> We were going to build our place with a standard gable end roof. I showed my wife the pics of your place with the shed roof and she really likes the look. Calculating out the difference in material cost shows about a 35% lower cost for the roof. And I won't have to rent a mini excavator or backhoe to lift trusses in place. The house will be 30' deep, so I'm planning on using 20' 2x12 so I have a nice overhang.


Whichever way you go, all good...for engineered trusses, it is ideal to have them delivered when your walls are up so they can just plop them on roof, like dominoes, saving you money by renting a hoisting device. They have to come on a truck with hoist, so it doesn't matter to them if they put them on ground or on top of build. 
With a low slope roof like mine, I got the ply delivered (not expensive through my lumber dealer) and they plopped a load on my roof...saved me a *lot *of back ache. Shame they can't get close enough do that for 2nd floor roof...25ft is their max range with their crane...I've seen some with much longer range. 
I will say this about engineered trusses, that the ability to plop them on 'roof' makes for a super quick build. Once they are up there, it is just a matter of setting the first, and the rest just flow like water. Can easily set a roof in one day. With me humping 2x12's, not a chance, as I have to slice them up, then hump them up....
But at the end of the day, my roof will not peel off in a hurricane...lol. 
Not dissing engineered trusses, as they can withstand a load, but I think their lightness is what contributes to shuddering and oscillations in heavy winds (harmonics), which 'can' cause issues. A heavy roof, well secured, won't creak...it'll just sit there.


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## melli

A heat wave in September is rather unusual to say the least. My thermometer is at 31C in the shade. And those bloody forest fires, which have burning for months, will smoke us out, according to forecasts. Usually, the weather takes a nosedive in the beginning of September. I suppose I can't complain, as rain does put a damper on home building. Just need a few weeks of decent weather to get my bunker waterproof. 

And to that end, started on rafters. Got my template made up, and started chopping up 2x12s. Tomorrow, I'll be able to really go, relatively speaking. Just making sure template is 'perfect' takes time. 

















The heat got a hold of me, and I mocked up the first one backwards...doh! Obviously, it didn't fit. Bit of a drag rotating 24' of timber around on a floor that is less than 20' wide or long. 










After a consult with BI, who consulted another BI, it was decided I could get away with extending front side rafter tails another foot by sistering a 3' chunk of 2x8. It makes it easier this way, as my plan was to sister 4' of 2x8, which would mean blocking over top plate would have to be notch cut. I can do it after all rafters are up and blocked (no notch cuts in blocking). 
Usually, for a cantilever situation, one wants a lot more than 2:1 (ratio of lumber supported (in my case sistered - nailed) to lumber in air) but these are rafter tails, and I can get away with it. 
Sort of trying to visualize how that would look? (imagine rafter at high end extending another foot)
The idea was I will put a deck off second floor high side, and the extra eave protection would be nice.


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## melli

So much for a 'fast' day....heat came on, and I wilted. Plus, I was getting cute 'ladder blocking' the edge rafters to the one beside it, and decided toe-nailing the blocking wasn't good enough, which meant a whole lot of time (faced nailed blocking on inside rafter, then slid it up against outside rafter). 
Maybe tomorrow, I'll roll...








FYI - the purpose of ladder framing the edge is to make roof stout as this side will bear the brunt of the windstorms. Less prone to shuddering etc.


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## melli

Now, I am rolling...only 4 more to cut, 6 more to place.
I know folks down south put up with killer hot temps, but being a Canuck, we don't...lol. Unless, you live in Okanagan (dry heat), or get a heat wave in southern Ontario/Quebec (humid heat). I'm on the coast, and anything over 30C is unusual. I better not jinx myself, or I'll get 6 months of straight rain.


























I'll end doing a ladder blocking job on far side...but hopefully, I can finish up rafters tomorrow!
Then, I'll do the mid-span blocking. Real bugger about ply prices...wish I had ply on walls as the rafters weigh a ton (tighten up build). I got a tad smarter on these rafters, and where the rafter tails notch cuts come down on top plate, they are flush to edges, so I can bring ply right up under tails (tie walls to rafters and blocking with ply).


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## melli

No more rafters...maybe my rib cage will heal (I pulled it again lifting up rafters). Have tennis elbow from nail gun, and wrist is acting up from worm saw....lol
As you can probably guess, I send pics to family and friends, and last mass email I mentioned I lost a bit of weight, and suggested that if anyone is looking for a good core workout, and muscle mass/toning, build something...bigger the better. I never noticed it on small stuff, but this build, entering month #6 has proven to be a winner in that regard. While I may suffer some aches and pains, there is a huge upside. Grey hair I could do without. 


















Can see the forest fire smoke in background (courtesy of California this time)


















Everything has an orange tinge from smoke. 
Going forward, midspan block before rafters contort, then 2x4 strapping...I might frame in the wedges on one side. The wedge over main roof I'll leave open as it is a perfect spot to hump ply and myself through (access to 2nd floor roof).


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> No more rafters...maybe my rib cage will heal (I pulled it again lifting up rafters). Have tennis elbow from nail gun, and wrist is acting up from worm saw....lol
> As you can probably guess, I send pics to family and friends, and last mass email I mentioned I lost a bit of weight, and suggested that if anyone is looking for a good core workout, and muscle mass/toning, build something...bigger the better. I never noticed it on small stuff, but this build, entering month #6 has proven to be a winner in that regard. While I may suffer some aches and pains, there is a huge upside. Grey hair I could do without.
> 
> View attachment 62063
> 
> View attachment 62064
> 
> 
> Can see the forest fire smoke in background (courtesy of California this time)
> 
> View attachment 62065
> 
> 
> View attachment 62066
> 
> Everything has an orange tinge from smoke.
> Going forward, midspan block before rafters contort, then 2x4 strapping...I might frame in the wedges on one side. The wedge over main roof I'll leave open as it is a perfect spot to hump ply and myself through (access to 2nd floor roof).


You're welcome for the smoke!! Gotta share our misery with someone, LOL


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## oldtruckbbq

ShannonR said:


> You're welcome for the smoke!! Gotta share our misery with someone, LOL


I have a friend in OK who works with a Cherokee Nation fire fighting crew. He had been home for a little over a week when he was sent out to another fire. He said it has been his busiest year since he joined the crew, and the fires this year are the "meanest" he has fought in the past 6 years. Here's hoping for some rain - minus lightning - to help put some of those fires out.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> Grey hair I could do without.


 Ohh Melli ! Wisdom Streaks ! Realize how much wiser you are today to even a year ago ! roflol ! Well Done you inspiring little Hammer Swinger you.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> You're welcome for the smoke!! Gotta share our misery with someone, LOL


I've been watching your smoke creep up here! It looked pretty bad in your hood, especially a week or so ago. At beginning of August it was bad here from our own forest fires, but those fires basically ran out of high plateau forest. Looking at sat pics, you can easily see the almost 3,000,000 acres that have burned, so far, in BC. Absolutely epic size of burns (broke all recorded records). Here is a shot of our air quality (PM2.5 = Particulate Matter of 2.5 micron size - they say this small stuff is bad for one's lungs) since beginning of August when smoke came over coast mountain range and settled along coast. Anything over 25 ug/m3, authorities say limit outdoor activities to a minimum. 








That last bump is your California smoke. In a couple of days it will be blown away as we will hit a cooling trend and possibly rain! 

Oldtruckbbq - I can only imagine...all of North America has had a good whiff of forest fire smoke this summer. I think fighting forest fires is a dog's breakfast...being immersed in smoke all day, for weeks on end cannot be good, for one's health. When I was young, it was a summer job option. Thankfully, I thought better of it.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Ohh Melli ! Wisdom Streaks ! Realize how much wiser you are today to even a year ago ! roflol ! Well Done you inspiring little Hammer Swinger you.


Haha...not sure if I am wiser...definitely greyer. Oh, there is ICF knowledge, for sure. That piece of the job really amped up my stress levels. And my fear of heights...lol


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## melli

I have been playing around doing different things...then BI showed up, so I put him to work giving me a hand throwing up a sheet of ply on end...while I have it braced well, really prefer walls sheathed, as they firm everything up. It went so quickly with another pair of hands, I must get some more ply in case he visits again...lol
Finished up blocking rafters (midspan). Then, ripped some 2x4's for rafter tail ends (11 degree bevel). Realized I needed to get rafter extensions on before I do high side...bugger. I was hoping to procrastinate on that. I even thought about nixing the idea. I am using string around all sides for strapping and rafter extensions, as I don't want to 'cut-to-fit' when I am 20ft up. I need rafter tail extensions on so I can put on strapping (need string up so I know how far to extend strapping off edges). You can just make out string in one pic (between two rafter tail extensions)...glad I relented and started on extensions. Will provide shade and a rain protection on high side (where deck will go).


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## melli

I pulled out the 'harness' today...second time I've pulled it out of box in ten years. I bought it ten years ago, on sale, thinking it would be some good kit to have. Back then, I was into accumulating tools (tool hoarder). I bought it, pulled it out of nice plastic pail it comes in, inspected it, and decided it was crap, then put it back in box. Well, as I look at it with rheumy eyes, 10yrs later, I realize it is an awesome harness....lol
For some reason, I didn't see the adjustable slide lock rope clamp the first time around, and thought, geesh, that sucks. I needed a situation where I could adjust rope slack as I move around, easily.
You can see blue harness, and in front of it, is a 42" fall arrester (black web thing that cushions a fall). At the bottom of the black web, is the adjustable slide lock (rope going through it).
It comes with two options for attaching rope to whatever you climbing on...the red metal bracket on floor (use nails to attach to a gabled roof peak), or the red cinch rope to left (wrap around a beam/joist/rafter etc).
Really relieved it has all I need, and when I get to the point where I am putting on ply on 2nd floor roof, it will not only be a life saver, but just plain old peace of mind. If you have been reading any of my posts, you'll have figured out, that I worry incessantly...lol
This harness will put that to bed.










In the worry vein, I was wondering if ten years in a box would have degraded the rope etc.... everything is like new (never used it). Saw a stamp on eyelet (rated for 5000lbs!). I think it'll support me with a full belly. 
After I'm done with harness on build, I got to thinking, it'd make a great swing.....


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## melli

Found out these guys have been visiting my neighbors...they leave for a couple of days, then come back for a meal.
Really amazed at their perseverance...was chatting to a local who said he used to raise them. Didn't know they had two stomachs, and are prodigious diggers. Although, they won't get far in my dirt, unless they are rock miners. Our drought conditions are leaving them very hungry. They couldn't wait for the granola to come out of box (they were trying to get into the box...lol). I'll have to get some real rabbit food when I go into town. 








Excuse the mess...Once I get home watertight I can clean up my disaster.


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## melli

Well, if it isn't raining...I recall we had a very light sprinkle a month or so ago (doesn't count, as it didn't cover all the ground - left spots on dusty car), but the last real rain was in May...I think. First time in my life, I've not seen rain/snow for that length of time. Hmmm. 
Got the rafter extensions done...doesn't look like much, but an extra foot will make a big difference. Using a string, I placed extensions...I see I am a tiny bit off...hmmm...Hard to tell from ground, and with rain hitting my face. 

Well, I'll get a 6' level (straight edge) on it, and see if it is within the realm of acceptable. If it is, I can get cracking on strapping. 

















I do like taking pics...especially high res ones. Can zoom in and see 'defects'.


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## melli

Finally got string up all around, and end strapping pieces...now I can roll with strapping. Never used string as a 'stop' before, but there is always a first time...lol
It will save me from scaring the crap out of myself if it works. Normally, I just snap a chalk line (better line imho), and cut rafter tails or in this case, strapping. But being a solid 20ft drop to mother earth, I will give this a twirl. If it works, great, if not, on goes the harness...


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## melli

BTW - I think I have my wall sheathing issue solved...you may have noticed more sheets go up. Every-time the BI comes by, another sheet goes up...lol
My evil plan is working. 
I think he enjoys it...takes but a couple of minutes with four hands. 
Still wondering how to do backside...I guess I'll have to get some scaffold up.


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## Mr Bond

Well he can't fail you on sheeting then! 

NB If you thought ply was expensive now, wait till Irma goes through. I'm betting boarding up damaged properties will seriously strain supply for boarding very quickly, even up here.

"Demand for plywood in storm-ravaged Florida and Louisiana has caused prices to soar as much as 40 percent in Connecticut"
From http://articles.courant.com/1992-09-25/business/0000112044_1_plywood-price-lumberyard

PS I can see the mountains for the first time today (Fernie, BC), smoke has cleared for now and we can BREATHE again. Sadly fires will now burn hotter, but at least the planes can fly again.


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## melli

I sort of think the string line will work as a guide for strapping...hard to see in pics, but I was off an 1/8" on one (short). Not a big deal, but I am trying not to push string...if I do that, every succeeding 2x4 will be off. Seems to be going faster than main roof, as it should, given it is almost half the size (real easy day today...watching Jeff P. with live Irma coverage). What slows me down is staggering all the seams. I am mindful of not having seams within three rafters of each other, nor repeating a seam on the same rafter within every four courses.


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Well he can't fail you on sheeting then!
> 
> NB If you thought ply was expensive now, wait till Irma goes through. I'm betting boarding up damaged properties will seriously strain supply for boarding very quickly, even up here.
> 
> "Demand for plywood in storm-ravaged Florida and Louisiana has caused prices to soar as much as 40 percent in Connecticut"
> From http://articles.courant.com/1992-09-25/business/0000112044_1_plywood-price-lumberyard
> 
> PS I can see the mountains for the first time today (Fernie, BC), smoke has cleared for now and we can BREATHE again. Sadly fires will now burn hotter, but at least the planes can fly again.


No, he won't...lol. 
I know, I am resigned to paying an extra $500 for ply. Really crimps my so-called budget. Glad you can breathe again. Smoke was probably the worse it has ever been in our province, especially interior. That cannot be good for one's health. Two years back, we had it really bad, and RV living made it worse. I cannot wait to get an air exchanger with HEPA filter in house. Actually, I cannot wait to get in house...lol

I figured prices would fall in September, given the duties of stuff going south, but with two hurricanes, I suspect prices will stay sky high for the foreseeable future. Real bugger, as I had the opportunity to get ply at less than $30 sheet...now, it is $45-50. 
We finally got some rain yesterday, so maybe you'll get some. Best.


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## melli

Last night, I was looking for something to do, that didn't involve climbing on roof...I had some redi-rod (5/8" threaded rod), so I figured I ought to install it. We've have new seismic code updates to our building code, in which the walls have to be anchored to foundation. Usually, we could get away with anchoring sill plate (bottom wall plate) to foundation, but now, all the way to top of wall. One could use straps at bottom and top of wall to accomplish same thing, but a rod covers it all. I will likely even anchor rafter to top of rod (hurricane straps will also be used - brackets from rafter to top plate - see previous pics). I have 7 more rods to go...did 4, and wow, what a difference in stiffness of wall! Since the walls are not fully sheathed, I could get a small vibration when on roof. Not now...
I am all about making the second floor an immovable box. More for windstorms, but if it covers seismic, all the better. When you tie down your house to the footings, it will not go anywhere and it will not groan with wind gusts. Not long ago, a similar method was employed for wooden shed grainaries on prairies and homes in Newfoundland (east coast of Canada). In NFLD, they'd anchor their homes (with flying struts - metal rods attached to house and extending down to rock on outside of house) as they be sitting on a rocky perch with Atlantic winds pounding them for days on end. Eventually, a house will fall apart after taking on constant storm/gale force winds.








You can see 3 in pic...4th is just peeking in bottom left hand corner.
Below floor, they bolt into those rods I installed when I poured walls. Really pumped about this mechanical aspect of build. While good wood framing can hold up to Mother nature, these rods will seal the deal, as it were.

Late pic addition: This is the Redi-Rod attachment to sill plate on reinforced concrete wall (below second floor). 
I have a thing for timber washers. I also used PT sill plate...not necessary, as it is sitting on sill gasket (foam) and blueskin. But, just in case...one thing though, you have to use ACQ rated nails or screws into it which is a pain (have to root through my supply of ACQ hardware). 
One of my gigs is repairing rotten sill plates, and 90% of the time, rotten sill plates are the problem. Folks never learn...lol. Having sill plate too close to ground, and/or lack of flashing/housewrap is the culprit. Sill plate is rather important, as it keeps house on foundation. I've jacked walls off foundations, as nothing but gravity was holding house to foundation. Basically, the studs were perched on rot. 








I'm such a picky bugger...regret using concrete form board for blocking (perfectly fine, but it 'looks' bad...lol). In my defense, I am not made of money.


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## melli

Funny how a person gets stuck in a rut and they do something a certain way, then way after the fact, realize, oops. I always painted Fascia while it was up...why not, it is primed. I just never realized my will would wane with heights. I should have pre-painted the main roof fascia before putting up...much easier to paint over caulked screw holes, than to paint the whole board, especially backside where soffit goes. The problem is I mostly did fascia on decks or sheds, where height was never an issue. 
Anyway, I got to it....Linden Bud (Behr color I think) is the color...I really like how it contrasts off the Sikken teak stain. 








Almost same color as metal strapping on posts...


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## melli

A better pic, I think...shade plays havoc with pics.


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## Steve_S

Psst.... see you gained more wisdom in the past 36 hours, reinforcing the "Wisdom Streaks & Highlights" ... wink, wink, nudge, nudge, eh whut.... hehehe... Looking Good, such progress and another milestone about to be reached I suspect.


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## melli

Making my way on strapping...get close to finishing tomorrow. The string idea is working, but far side string started to sag on me...doh! Re-tightened...I may have to trim that side. Will see...
Problem I am having is guessing ply seam location, as I want strapping to sit in middle of each course of ply. With T&G, it is a bit of a guessing game (depends on how much one pounds them together). A moot point, as my lumber store had no T&G ply today! That must be a first. All the hurricane'd zones must need a lot.









Like that blue sky...really starting to cool down up here. Rain in forecast later in week....


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## melli

Backside view...


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## melli

Usually, in evening, I will putter on something easy. Doing the strapping didn't resonate with me, but getting a fascia (rim joist) board up did (odd, as they are a bear to put up). 2x12 - 18' of board is not easy to handle, nevermind a board that attaches to the perimeter of roof. Being solo, I have come up with a way that takes out the risk of dropping it and more importantly, melli taking a 20' nosedive. It is time consuming, but it works. I mentioned it before, but here are some pics. Two tie-down straps a few feet apart in middle, wrapped under strapping, hooked together, with plenty of slack. Here it is just ready to be dropped;








Then bombs away...I push it over edge, and winch it back up enough so I can get the big clamps on it. Note: you don't want too little slack or board won't be down enough, and loosening ratchet straps is not a good idea. 
Once I get clamps on it, I use them to fine tune final position;









I can't say enough about my Irwin clamps...while pricey, they are a solo person's best friend. Actually, they can tweak any board not behaving into position (1000lbs force or something like that).
















I then throw in a couple of screws at each end, and remove strapping and clamps...then screw the rest of fascia into position. While a tad time consuming, super safe, as I am nowhere near edge of roof....speaking of which, I was somewhat smug that I could stick my bod between the rafters and strapping (14.5" x 12.5" rectangle). Other than when I went on a crash diet long ago, this build has whipped me into shape. Required I raise my arms and twist a bit, but it sure beats being on top (I was standing on ladder, on 2nd floor, with half my bod poking through - no way to fall). Sure beats building a 20ft scaffold for one board. And I think even having two people tackle it would be unsafe, as holding a rather heavy board with one hand (other hand is hanging on for dear life) isn't ideal. This way, no hands are supporting board.


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## Steve_S

I was going to suggest tie down straps for holding (drop prevention) the boards... I 100% Agree on the QuickGrips they ARE a Genuine Gift for 2 handed folks... Another benefit, if a deer comes on the property, they won't turn to look ! Maggie was holding a 2x8 as I was circular sawing it, pair of deer wandered past cabin and so she turned to look... body moved with her a touch AND as a result I got 2 fingers "edged" by the cir saw, just the tips. 2 Good Things: 1 I was using the 20V DeWalt which stops automatically as soon as you let go of trigger (saved more damage) unlike the 120V plug in model which keeps spinning and 2: only lost the tips and recovered fairly quickly (all things considered, only needed a 6 stitches)

BTW Melli... As you know I am doing Live Edge Cedar on my final cabin... I love the look and the effect BUT had I realized exactly how fiddly and what a PITA to do.... I likely would have thought different about it.... Boy have I learned a bunch of new things... 3 frickin days to strap, back-board and face-board ONE WALL (21' long by 16' high) and ME hates scaffolding (and I have the MetalTech commercial 10 footers). Geez, something uniform with straight lines & square sure would have made it go quicker... but that would have been so humdrum IMO and as my last real build of anything I wanted something different / unique. One good thing about this siding, is the perfectionist in me has to take a back seat LOL... no straight lines, no perfect corners, none of those things that can & do make me nutz, the whole Organic Natural thing rules... makes for a nice break not to be obsessing.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I was going to suggest tie down straps for holding (drop prevention) the boards... I 100% Agree on the QuickGrips they ARE a Genuine Gift for 2 handed folks... Another benefit, if a deer comes on the property, they won't turn to look ! Maggie was holding a 2x8 as I was circular sawing it, pair of deer wandered past cabin and so she turned to look... body moved with her a touch AND as a result I got 2 fingers "edged" by the cir saw, just the tips. 2 Good Things: 1 I was using the 20V DeWalt which stops automatically as soon as you let go of trigger (saved more damage) unlike the 120V plug in model which keeps spinning and 2: only lost the tips and recovered fairly quickly (all things considered, only needed a 6 stitches)
> 
> BTW Melli... As you know I am doing Live Edge Cedar on my final cabin... I love the look and the effect BUT had I realized exactly how fiddly and what a PITA to do.... I likely would have thought different about it.... Boy have I learned a bunch of new things... 3 frickin days to strap, back-board and face-board ONE WALL (21' long by 16' high) and ME hates scaffolding (and I have the MetalTech commercial 10 footers). Geez, something uniform with straight lines & square sure would have made it go quicker... but that would have been so humdrum IMO and as my last real build of anything I wanted something different / unique. One good thing about this siding, is the perfectionist in me has to take a back seat LOL... no straight lines, no perfect corners, none of those things that can & do make me nutz, the whole Organic Natural thing rules... makes for a nice break not to be obsessing.


Bet your still obsessing...lol

Once an obsess-or, always an obsess-or. Need to see some pics...
You got two fingers 'planed'. Bugger. I never use my circ saw anymore (one has been converted to a metal chop saw). Too many kickbacks, too close to blade, and plain lack of power, has me swearing to never use them again. While my worm saw weighs a ton, I can do things you'd never do with a circ saw. I was just thinking about it an hour ago. Cutting a board while holding it with one hand, and cutting with other, or cutting a board in half when it is supported at both ends...lol. That is asking for big trouble with a circ saw. With a worm saw, I approach the 'jam' by letting go of trigger and nudging it into jam. The momentum of spinning blade plows through. No kickback. 

Metal scaffold certainly would be ideal for my bunker, but I'd need a lot of it, and once done, likely never need it again. It is one of those things that would be great to have, but most of the time, it would sit. A contractor friend uses two ladders with board support brackets. I've been meaning to get them. While not as safe as metal scaffold, I'd just be using them for lower heights. He uses them in lieu of scaffold. Easy to set up. You can even screw the board to bracket and it stiffens the works up. Even the ability to put tools on it, and work off ladder would be great. I'm good on a ladder to about 14'. My stepladders are my fav, as I can reach near 16' on them, and having four feet in ground just makes them more stable.


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## melli

That strapping was getting tedious...but then I thought about what comes next...ahhh. Have to put up vertical 2x8s under those 2x4s flying off edge...even though I am safe working from below (or poking through rafters), it still sucks when I look down.


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## melli

BTW - I get free delivery of ply and redi-rod my lumber store ran out of...they promised me it would be in store this morning. I go to pick it up this afternoon and behold, they didn't have it. Nothing new...lol (btw - I do love them (know some staff members better than my neighbors!)...they may run a store with product out of stock, all the time, but they do treat me well). I mean, what lumber store runs out of framing nails, T&G ply or 2x4s?! lol

I used to go ballistic when they didn't have obvious lumber store items, but I think I've mellowed from living up here. Even a long time staff member noted it...I mean if they commented on it, I must have been a terror...lol. Wash that city slicker out of me. Patience was never a virtue of mine. 

I put a guilt trip on the store owner and a delivery IOU from days past. I got to thinking if they deliver with Hiab truck, they can plop ply on main roof...easier to hump up to 2nd floor. Because hauling 5/8" ply up the stairs, lift through gable end on 2nd floor roof, then lift onto roof would suck. I feel worn out just hauling a few sheets up the stairs...lol

My joints ache and muscles/tendons are groaning when I wake up nowadays...I never put in a sustained labor job like this before. It is why I did small stuff. Just have to grind out 2 more weeks til waterproof stage. 

In among all this building, I got some fill for Bobby to chew on. I need to bury those footings for carport and get backside of house filled in before it gets nasty. Get the house 'planted' as it were.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> Wash that city slicker out of me. Patience was never a virtue of mine.


 ROFLOL indeed... We call them Citiots around here and can spot them a mile away ... You know you've graduated when you walk into a business and they all know your name and smile, wave and brightly say Good Morning, what do you need today ! Local builder's suppliers, coffee shop to subway, grocery stores etc.... (OK I'm near a pimple of a little town, so, that's the way it is...) Heck I walk into the coffee shop and they start making my coffee and getting my order ready even before I get to the cash... the question is usually, anything else besides "the usual" ? 

Patience is a toughy BUT you got it even when you don't recognize it... sometimes patience is "forced" like when money is slowing you down which is not necessarily a bad thing, gives you thinking time to make sure you are doing the right thing and not missing steps... Although, sometimes it can lead to change in direction or an "add-on" as a "Should do this now, while I'm at it" which in turn affects budget & patience levels.

Think you got it tough now... wait till he finishing details start... Building the Box is the Easy Part - it's the fiddly bit's, details (and the DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS) and that's when the budget really get's knackered ! and BTW: The pickier & fussier you are (your as fussy as I am, no doubt there) well the costs are relative, especially when you have that vision in your head on how you want it to look and just how it's gonna get there. THAT will be the biggest test of Patience you'll face ! Take your time and enjoy the Easy Part ! (with semi-chuckle, big grin and both hands up in the air in surrender mode).


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> ROFLOL indeed... We call them Citiots around here and can spot them a mile away ... You know you've graduated when you walk into a business and they all know your name and smile, wave and brightly say Good Morning, what do you need today ! Local builder's suppliers, coffee shop to subway, grocery stores etc.... (OK I'm near a pimple of a little town, so, that's the way it is...) Heck I walk into the coffee shop and they start making my coffee and getting my order ready even before I get to the cash... the question is usually, anything else besides "the usual" ?
> 
> Patience is a toughy BUT you got it even when you don't recognize it... sometimes patience is "forced" like when money is slowing you down which is not necessarily a bad thing, gives you thinking time to make sure you are doing the right thing and not missing steps... Although, sometimes it can lead to change in direction or an "add-on" as a "Should do this now, while I'm at it" which in turn affects budget & patience levels.
> 
> Think you got it tough now... wait till he finishing details start... Building the Box is the Easy Part - it's the fiddly bit's, details (and the DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS) and that's when the budget really get's knackered ! and BTW: The pickier & fussier you are (your as fussy as I am, no doubt there) well the costs are relative, especially when you have that vision in your head on how you want it to look and just how it's gonna get there. THAT will be the biggest test of Patience you'll face ! Take your time and enjoy the Easy Part ! (with semi-chuckle, big grin and both hands up in the air in surrender mode).


You know it! Interior costs can easily eclipse 'lock-up' stage. I think it will be about even, in my case. Although, to get my rump inside, a lot lot less. I can fiddle later. My shell, although rather expensive relative to most home builds, was free labor. That saved me probably a 100k to date, if not more (Still need windows, doors, siding, soffit, trim and metal roof to get to lock up). I don't mind a minimalist interior, just as long as I am in it..lol

I hear you on knowing your community, being a part of it. Staff at lumber store know my account number by heart...lol
If I don't show up to the local corner store for a spell, they want a story as to why I've been absent. The post office has my number and calls me if a package has arrived. I rarely eat at a restaurant, but I eat out a lot, as I get invites by neighbors to dinner. In summer, I get about 5 party invites. I feel amiss because I am in no position to reciprocate right now. Heck, a few weeks ago, some neighbors from old hood brought over lunch and we had a picnic in my yard (that was sweet of them). I used to be the go-to place for evening campfire chats, as I served cheesecake...lol

Bobby (Bobcat 331) saved me a ton of money (most money saved in my homestead adventure). Folks may not be aware, but all the service runs to a new home would have required a machine, and a contractor isn't going to throw a crew into digging for several days or do stump pulling the old fashioned way, especially in my rock infested 'soil'. I never showed pics of what this gin joint looked like before Bobby wiped the area clean. Layers of screened fill were used to topcoat the 3ft swale, and hours of compaction (I used rubble (glacial till type material) for the base of swale). About half the bunker site used to slope down towards where septic field is and bedrock extrusions were plainly visible on both ends of where bunker is now. All that was initially there, was a game trail partially leveled when they did driveway or logging ops about 50yrs ago. 

I know I plug Bobby as a 'tool' to have, if you buy a bare lot (that is, one native, no clearing, no services, no nothing). It really is a huge money saver, in the end. As daunting as it initially may seem to own one, I guarantee, if you have minimal mechanical skills, you'll eventually know your machine inside and out. I even made a testing kit (hydraulic hoses, couplers, and gauges). I wrote about it on the Heavy Equipment site. It allows me to not only monitor health of machine, but tweak it, like a hot rod. I can alter pressures to get more oompf. Excavators have test ports for all facets of the spaghetti factory under hood. I won't get into what machine you should get, but at the very least, a 3.5-4 ton model with thumb. Anything less, and you've severely limited what you can do. Some clearing jobs with a big excavator can cost more than if you bought a mini excavator. While quick with a big machine, your back to back breaking hand work when machine leaves. And you will always find ongoing uses for a mini.

About where bucket of excavator is, is the location of the SW corner of my bunker, so everything behind excavator was cleared. Shipping container has never moved (point of reference in pic below). 










This is recent pic from about same perspective;
I would be about 10-15ft to right to be in same spot as above pic (would just see side of building...note the shipping container in background)


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## melli

One of those days...had BC Hydro pay me a visit, as they managed to chew up the low side bank of driveway...doh!
Now, more trees have to be cut because they tore out roots, while installing guide wire anchor. Hmmm....hopefully, they make it right.
So, an easy and safe day...no sweat! lol. Just put up eave blocking for one side (easy side today!), and infill between strapping. Now, I have to do the other side, the 20ft straight down side...Hmmmm.

Out of curiosity, I hung off one of the blocked eave ends to see how stout it was...it stops the 2x4 from bending down and snapping. Worked like a charm. FYI - I put in three 3-1/2" building screws (toe-nailed into 2x8 into rafter), and 2 - 3-1/2" screws through 2x4 into 2x8 blocking.

















I was thinking about blocking every 2x4 (as you can see, I did every second one), but thought that is silly, plus all that extra weight on eaves. I don't know if it is worth it, to lighten pocket anymore?


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## melli

It seems gabled end eave building is kind of an appendage, from my research on the matter. On engineered trusses, they will get the last truss slightly smaller and have 'outlookers' or 'lookouts'. Or in my case (dimensional lumber build), they nail on a ladder to end gable. All of it seems flimsy, especially if one wants a good overhang. I look at my old home (not built by me), and I was kind of shocked to see they just had flying 2x4s as eave support on gabled end (double rafter at end gable like my build, but they notch cut them for lookouts - my MO for small builds). Then again, I've never seen a gabled end eave fall off, so maybe I am the problem...lol. In my mind, an eave ought to be as stout as the rest of build. Obviously, it cannot happen, but it should be close. I suppose I am over thinking it, and over engineering it.

Here is my old house, and the end gable eaves...just 2x4s support the eaves (about 18"). My home above has 23" eaves.








BTW - don't ever take what I say as gospel on framing. While I do have a fair bit of 'bottom-to-top' experience, I am never 100% sure (never will be). The above home was built to 2006 Building Codes, and I see many things I wouldn't do today. They doubled up rafters at end gable, then notched room for 2x4 lookouts (boards that support fascia)...the 2x4s extend back to the previous rafter. I do this method for small bunkhouses/sheds, as the span is quite small relative to a home. But my current place has a 24' span, which changes the equation, I think.

I've had many a discussion with building inspector on framing engineering. There is a move towards tying the sheathing into floor plates (not done in pic above), minimal or no gap in ply, and all seams blocked (on inside). In days long past, gaps in sheathing was a must, as wood expands and contracts, and one needs to account for it (ply back then is different from today). Plus, houses were not very airtight, and 'unofficial' ventilation was needed...lol
Of course, a home in deep south may need 'drying potential' as humidity levels are high, but up north, in most places, we only see high humidity for a couple of months (absolute humidity levels). Plus, with gaps in ply like above, one can see a lot of heat being sucked out of house in our winters, especially with our rainscreen rules (siding is raised off sheathing to allow airflow).

While I consider my old home a rather good build, in terms of framing, it groaned and shuddered in windstorms. Might have been because it is on pylons, but I also think the lack of seam blocking contributed to 'wiggle' room.
I was amazed with framing crew (2) who could knock this up in 2-3 weeks! One great thing about being quick, is you can see little water staining...

Addition: nice blurb about why eaves are so important...some folks on 'gutter thread' noted their solution of no gutters...nice pic showing the gravel bed solution. 
http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/every-house-needs-roof-overhangs


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## melli

Stardate update 9152017 - my store is stiffing me for lumber. Apparently, they only have one driver for two stores...might have something to do with their pay scheme (a birdie told me). And my small request is probably on the bottom shelf. C'est la vie. 

Got the 'dark' side eave blocking done, and some blocking for tall wall ply. I swear a person's BO smells different when facing fear...lol. I couldn't reach the low corner screw I put in for string...should have thought how I planned to remove it (or used a nail). Hmmm....I made a feeble attempt to crawl to corner, but maybe another day. Not really dangerous, it just looks freaking dangerous when your suspended in air on roof eave framing.


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## melli

Looks like I am not going to beat the rains...coming in 36hrs or so...
Put up the easiest chunk of fascia on main roof side. Easy-ish when one is standing on a roof. Lumber store is delivering today, after several phone calls...with a Hiab. Sweet. Not humping ply is one thing I could do without right now.


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## MoBookworm1957

Good job Melli,


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Good job Melli,


Thanks MoBookworm! 
Enjoy sharing pics and my work. 

Aside: I wish others would post their 'palaces'. I miss those folks actually building stuff (Homestead Construction category after all), whether it be a rough log cabin in woods, a polished estate house, landscaping, garden, chicken coop, artistic shed (still have your feature wall stuck in my head Shannon! - thumbs up!), etc. Sadly, they have gone by the wayside. 

I suspect we scared off a couple of folks. I tried to connect with a couple of them, but nothing. To all those lurkers, please don't feel you need to post a Taj Mahal...it is the variety and uniqueness that makes this topic and site wonderful. I know in construction, egos, pride and feelings are at stake, and some folks feel the need to 'suggest' the 'right way' of doing things, but in my mind, *just doing it, is the right way*. I too am guilty of unsolicited advice, but I try to espouse the view that taking the plunge is all that really matters. Homesteading, is about doing it yourself, as it wasn't long ago, a homesteader did do it all. I get some folks may wish to hire help, and that is great too! Not all of us took woodworking classes or were born with a skil-saw in our hands. Please share your work, your dreams. Sort of sad that I seem to be the only one posting an active home build. When I first posted here, I thought this was the perfect venue for me, but as time goes on, I wonder... 

We seem to be turning into a society where we have lost that pioneer spirit. Bureaucracy has stifled many a dream. I know, because I almost capitulated myself, and building stuff is my forte...lol
The joy of living off the land knows no equal. 
And the peace, sanctity of living 'off the grid' has it's rewards. A natural way to live. A natural tonic for me. 
Best
Melli


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## Mr Bond

"We seem to be turning into a society where we have lost that pioneer spirit"

Melli, that's Britain in a nutshell.... and one of the biggest reasons we left and first moved to Calgary. Alberta is still a get up and go province and working in construction (I was a sustainable building specialist) I was amazed at the amount of small businesses stepping up and filling needs, often one man and that fabled Bobcat! Eventually ended up working for local Government supporting economically sustainable green building. Instead of barriers we provided technical support, contacts and training to permit applicants. Sadly politics killed the project, but proud of what we achieved.

We've only been in BC since May, but already it feels more restrictive; my sense is that regulators are far less willing to take any risk or be entrepreneurial themselves. Tried buying land for an agri-tourism enterprise, but between the Agricultural Land Commission and municipality they had legislated out any hope of making an income. I was threatened with a public enquiry to add a stove in a cabin....... 

BUT, we are currently launching my wife's photography business and as my health improves (on disability) I'll find another opportunity. In the meantime I bought myself a restoration project to keep my brain from going to mush, a 1980's Trackless municipal tractor..... http://tracklessvehicles.com/Company/History. Never done hydraulics so this is a hands-on lesson for me!










Thanks for sharing Melli, and enjoy the snow!


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## melli

Wow, Mr Bond, that is an interesting project! It screams utility. That would be a homesteader's toy if the attachments were cheap enough. Would rather have that, than the garden tractors or CUT they have on offer. Simple, easy to work on by the looks of it, 4x4, rugged...Any idea what they cost? A running one, with some attachments? 
I have a Husqvarna lawn tractor (YTH1542XPT) but being 2 wheel drive sucks. Husqvarna came out with a 4x4 articulating lawn tractor with some oopf to handle some attachments, but it is still a toy compared to what you have there. 
You must start a thread with some interior/engine pics of your project...be interesting to follow.


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## Mr Bond

It came with the 6' snowblower, plow, broom, sickle mower and a monster flail mower: $4500 all in! Bought at a farm sale so no warranties or guarantees but it does move. I'll get some pictures up for you. 

Hoping this is cart before horse: i.e. we get land again soon on which we can play again.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Thanks MoBookworm!
> Enjoy sharing pics and my work.
> 
> Aside: I wish others would post their 'palaces'. I miss those folks actually building stuff (Homestead Construction category after all), whether it be a rough log cabin in woods, a polished estate house, landscaping, garden, chicken coop, artistic shed (still have your feature wall stuck in my head Shannon! - thumbs up!), etc. Sadly, they have gone by the wayside.
> 
> I suspect we scared off a couple of folks. I tried to connect with a couple of them, but nothing. To all those lurkers, please don't feel you need to post a Taj Mahal...it is the variety and uniqueness that makes this topic and site wonderful. I know in construction, egos, pride and feelings are at stake, and some folks feel the need to 'suggest' the 'right way' of doing things, but in my mind, *just doing it, is the right way*. I too am guilty of unsolicited advice, but I try to espouse the view that taking the plunge is all that really matters. Homesteading, is about doing it yourself, as it wasn't long ago, a homesteader did do it all. I get some folks may wish to hire help, and that is great too! Not all of us took woodworking classes or were born with a skil-saw in our hands. Please share your work, your dreams. Sort of sad that I seem to be the only one posting an active home build. When I first posted here, I thought this was the perfect venue for me, but as time goes on, I wonder...
> 
> We seem to be turning into a society where we have lost that pioneer spirit. Bureaucracy has stifled many a dream. I know, because I almost capitulated myself, and building stuff is my forte...lol
> The joy of living off the land knows no equal.
> And the peace, sanctity of living 'off the grid' has it's rewards. A natural way to live. A natural tonic for me.
> Best
> Melli


So far all I have to post is pics showing where I am clearing a drive to get to the house site. I'm going to get it leveled and graveled ASAP so I have easier access. Following that will be weeks of clearing the house site, garage site, and septic tank field. The goal is to put a foundation in this spring so we can start construction. I'll be posting lots of pics of that. We are going to build a post and beam home with cordwood infill and a shed roof, and I will post lots of pics. I've got my eye on a couple white oak trees that I have to cut down for the house site, and my plan is to use an Alaska Mill to cut them into boards to use in making custom arched entry doors 3-4" thick. Once I get the boards milled, I'll bring them back to our current residence and build the doors during the week when I can't get out to the property. I have already set aside some 6" logs that I'm planning on using to make a 4 poster bed from, so I'll post pics of that as well. I've got ideas for several furniture items that I want to build for the new place using wood from the land, and I can do that during the week when I can't get out to the property to do work.

My wife and I have mulled purchasing a travel trailer to put on the property once we get utilities, then putting what won't fit into a shipping container while we build the house. I could get work done every day without having to drive an hour each way between our current residence and our property.

Our goal is to do the work and the financing ourselves so we don't have a mortgage when it is all said and done. We find it very satisfying to do for ourselves what most people pay someone else to do. If you have average mechanical abilities and some sense, you can learn to do most anything. And if you take the time and pay attention to detail, you can make it look really nice. I was always inspired by my Grandfather. He labelled, dismantled, and moved his log cabin from his river bottom property that is now at the bottom of a lake 9 months of the year to a 40 acre piece of property in the area the lake was built to protect. Only 2 of that 40 acres was cleared. He cleared the rest and built a house, barn, tool shed, chicken coop, and smoke house from the trees he cut down. He bought a new truck in 1958 and kept it for almost 40 years, rebuilt the engine twice and the transmission once. Into his late 80's he never bought eggs, chicken, or produce from the grocery store because they raised their own. Into his 70's they didn't buy pork or beef because he raised one of each for the freezer each year. Into his early 80's that was supplemented with rabbit, squirrel, fish, and duck that he shot or caught himself. He spent the last 2 weeks of his life in a nursing home at the age of 92, and was still reading books because "a fellow never knows when he might learn something useful." My wife and I both find that kind of lifestyle more comfortable than the consumerism and rat race that we have finally decided to leave.


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## melli

Disappointing day... 3+ hrs to hang one fascia board!...ran into issues. Got to use my harness though...cooler weather use only. It did make a difference, in terms of my will, to go to the downhill edge and have my head peeking over...lol
Shame, as weather is turning tomorrow.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> So far all I have to post is pics showing where I am clearing a drive to get to the house site. I'm going to get it leveled and graveled ASAP so I have easier access. Following that will be weeks of clearing the house site, garage site, and septic tank field. The goal is to put a foundation in this spring so we can start construction. I'll be posting lots of pics of that. We are going to build a post and beam home with cordwood infill and a shed roof, and I will post lots of pics. I've got my eye on a couple white oak trees that I have to cut down for the house site, and my plan is to use an Alaska Mill to cut them into boards to use in making custom arched entry doors 3-4" thick. Once I get the boards milled, I'll bring them back to our current residence and build the doors during the week when I can't get out to the property. I have already set aside some 6" logs that I'm planning on using to make a 4 poster bed from, so I'll post pics of that as well. I've got ideas for several furniture items that I want to build for the new place using wood from the land, and I can do that during the week when I can't get out to the property to do work.
> 
> My wife and I have mulled purchasing a travel trailer to put on the property once we get utilities, then putting what won't fit into a shipping container while we build the house. I could get work done every day without having to drive an hour each way between our current residence and our property.
> 
> Our goal is to do the work and the financing ourselves so we don't have a mortgage when it is all said and done. We find it very satisfying to do for ourselves what most people pay someone else to do. If you have average mechanical abilities and some sense, you can learn to do most anything. And if you take the time and pay attention to detail, you can make it look really nice. I was always inspired by my Grandfather. He labelled, dismantled, and moved his log cabin from his river bottom property that is now at the bottom of a lake 9 months of the year to a 40 acre piece of property in the area the lake was built to protect. Only 2 of that 40 acres was cleared. He cleared the rest and built a house, barn, tool shed, chicken coop, and smoke house from the trees he cut down. He bought a new truck in 1958 and kept it for almost 40 years, rebuilt the engine twice and the transmission once. Into his late 80's he never bought eggs, chicken, or produce from the grocery store because they raised their own. Into his 70's they didn't buy pork or beef because he raised one of each for the freezer each year. Into his early 80's that was supplemented with rabbit, squirrel, fish, and duck that he shot or caught himself. He spent the last 2 weeks of his life in a nursing home at the age of 92, and was still reading books because "a fellow never knows when he might learn something useful." My wife and I both find that kind of lifestyle more comfortable than the consumerism and rat race that we have finally decided to leave.


I had my first go with an Alaskan Mill a year ago...even got to use two posts I made on carport (I posted that a few pages back with plenty of pics). Grueling business. I really need to get a proper ripping chain before I do that again (roasted a Oregon bar and chain). Still, it feels kind of cool to actually make my own lumber. 

I agree, if you have the will, you can do anything. Congrats on making the leap. 

BTW - I got a shipping container and RV...lol. It has worked out. Not paying rent, but I do pay a small mortgage. The bleeding will soon stop and I can aggressively pay it off. I pondered selling Bobby, but I just can't bear the idea of being without some heavy metal. Around here, a excavator is almost needed as much as a lawnmower. Trees die, and need to be taken down. One can take out trees by hand, but your left with a stump. While not a bad thing, our trees are so tight, falling is a challenge. Often time, even with Bobby, I have to push a tree through other trees, to get it to fall. Then, there is my driveway. Snow removal was a bonus last winter, but regrading is it's main purpose, until I get around to concreting the sucker. 
Plus, I still have to finish landscaping! I thought a 150 tandem axle dump truck loads of material would do the job...I am around 172 now...probably need another 50 or so. I am jealous of you guys down south...you have dirt! 

Great story of your Grandfather. My Grandfather was an able bodied man, built his house and a recreational cabin. Lived in both til his last breathe. While I like to do it all, I hope to reach a point where I can take a long break! lol
6 mths ago, I had nothing (house)...I am surprised I made it this far, this quickly, even though I am rather slow per se. 
I do miss the fun I had last summer though...had to be done I suppose.


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> It came with the 6' snowblower, plow, broom, sickle mower and a monster flail mower: $4500 all in! Bought at a farm sale so no warranties or guarantees but it does move. I'll get some pictures up for you.
> 
> Hoping this is cart before horse: i.e. we get land again soon on which we can play again.


You bugger...lol 
I never come across deals like that! You got the works...all anyone could want on a homestead. I'd be all over something like that if one ever popped up in my hood. Although, I am broke. You must start a thread on that! Be really curious to see the guts. I read the brochure in link you gave me. Tons of horsepower, and it sounds like a bullet proof hydro transmission. Well, they were made for city work...meant to take a beating and plenty of hours. 

Well, Bobby has been kind to me, but I paid market value (maybe a tad less).
I did get a near new Troy-Bilt roto tiller (late 90s edition) for garden, for $300. That was a deal for me. I love the engineering in those suckers. Solid transmission...it should last another 20yrs.


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## ShannonR

Ok Melli, you totally busted me!! I have been working on some homestead construction this year myself, but it's going at a snail's pace.... lol

I posted a short thread about it for you.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Ok Melli, you totally busted me!! I have been working on some homestead construction this year myself, but it's going at a snail's pace.... lol
> 
> I posted a short thread about it for you.


Never mean to bust anyone...
Hard not to forget your work. That wall....
Well, you have a bona fide excuse. Read your blog. You have a full on farm happening and a youngin!


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## melli

Got one piece of ply up! Yahoo! Silly, but it has been a haul to get here...14 more sheets to go I suspect. And all the fascia is up except for one long length and a couple of small chunks. I think I will try to do underlay as I roll with ply. Every run across is 4' less rain pouring down through build. 









You can see I got all the redi-rod installed (or at least placed), as it is difficult to thread 10' lengths with roof deck on. I noticed it has firmed up 2nd floor walls a bit, especially without wall ply installed. 








And that white rope is my harness lifeline...bloody long. Must be a 100' (most of it is sitting on 2nd floor). They use a very thick rope (tested to like 9400lbs). Better safe than sorry I suppose.


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> Never mean to bust anyone...
> Hard not to forget your work. That wall....
> Well, you have a bona fide excuse. Read your blog. You have a full on farm happening and a youngin!


Yes, life and the baby do make things happen alot slower! He's totally worth it, though.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Yes, life and the baby do make things happen alot slower! He's totally worth it, though.


Nothing is even a close second, to having a child. I'll excuse you this one time only...

OT - it appears I've hit the magical mark of 33,272 hits! Wow, what a magical mark. I somehow feel guilty that I've had that many hits. I hope you folks weren't tortured by my gushy long-winded repetitive humble brag drivel...

Let it be known, I am not making a penny, nor will I. For me, this is about sharing *our *journey, not plugging you to click on a link. HT forum has ads for that purpose. I think I will make a web blog about this homestead journey. Clean up the long winded rambling (have mostly pics). 


I prefer pics, as my attention span isn't very long and if I want to see a vid, I watch a movie. Thankfully, my phone takes reasonable pics. BTW - if you want specific pics, just PM me, or post a request. Beyond what I've posted here, I have thousands of home building pics. As I mentioned in past, I take pics, willy-nilly, of every facet of build. I've found they come in handy when I am planning an order, or just seeing what needs to be done, late at night. I've also found, especially in old home, the benefit of taking pics. I did a second floor extension, and wanted to know what I was looking at behind drywall (that is, what I could attach to). Even simple things, like hanging a mirror with a piano hinge, my pics saved me from electrocuting myself, as I was putting a mirror over main panel.

For instance, this is my job tomorrow:









Hmmm.....

Kidding and satire aside, I hope you all can realize your homestead dreams. I really mean that.


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## ShannonR

This wall?

Truly, I couldn't help myself. Pic is from back in December.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> This wall?
> 
> Truly, I couldn't help myself. Pic is from back in December.


That's the one! A work of art. My art lingo is deficient, but an impressionist art piece comes to mind. Or maybe post-impressionist work like this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impre..._on_La_Grande_Jatte,_Georges_Seurat,_1884.png


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## Steve_S

ShannonR said:


> This wall?
> 
> Truly, I couldn't help myself. Pic is from back in December.


Mmmm Cordwood / Stackwall... I LOVE that and really wanted to build my Cabin with Cedar Coordwood but Lifeus Interruptus Maximus occurred and plans changed. 

PS, a Cordwood "Veneer" can be made as a Finishing Detail quite easily that will give the look and feel of it inside, some even do it on outside. cut 2-3" thick log disks, attach to good solid backing board with glue & screws and mortar in between the logs and attach to conventional wall frame. 

But don't listen to ME... The guy who decided on Live Edge Cedar exterior... the guy who had to cut countless Poly-ISO & EPS-II Foam sheets to fit between Rafters & Studs... ALL Time Killing, back twisting and fiddly as all heck.... Oi... sure am glad I won't ever be building anything like this again... Greenhouse will be the last "building" as such next year (2 yrs behind schedule).


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## melli

Ah Steve, you should be proud of what you've you accomplished! At least the BI tells me that ad nauseam....lol
I'm with you on veneer cordwood, as true stacked cordwood has numerous issues to overcome, namely dissimilar materials expanding and contracting, lack of appreciable R value and wall strength. It does look gorgeous though. To each their own. 
Your live edge siding looks great, and it covers well (rock solid siding). Time will pass, and the pain of installing it will abate...

Meanwhile, I am slowly getting sheathing on roof. Won't be particularly fast, as strapping all the edges of ply takes time, and this morning, I was hooked up in harness leaning over low edge to finish off fascia on low side. 
With it being cooler, I seem to be getting more done.


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## Hitch

You might have said this before and I missed it, but what type of roofing material are you gonna use?


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> true stacked cordwood has numerous issues to overcome, namely dissimilar materials expanding and contracting, lack of appreciable R value and wall strength. It does look gorgeous though.


Ohh Melli - U made an OOPSIE on scale. Cordwood is best built with Dry CEDAR (min 18 months after cut & split to size), not pine and especially not any form of hardwood... as for other softwoods, well, they are bug food. R Values for Cedar is R6 per inch + Thermal Mass values which push it to more like R7.5 with heat return from the mass. Use ONLY Mortar and *never ever* Cement, a good Lime Mortar breaths with the wood and will set well and mix Round with Split for strength - also the Line & Cedar have the advantage over bugs. Cordwood Durability - there are examples in Europe that are 400 years old, examples around here 150+, and as for Fire, dense mass wood with lime takes a LONG time (hours) to burn through.

I seriously studied and considered Cordwood for my cabin but 2 years lead time to start wall building, was the stopper as my time is a factor - I'm behind schedule by 1.5 yrs now, which is bad. We have 3 Cordwood Builder's in this area and they know me well & vice a versa and several people have kept them extremely busy... Lot of New Cordwood cabins & large homes within 150km of here... Cedar Country !

Fingers crossed for ya on Weather remaining good... We have had great weather here BUT thunderstorms on the way... then supposed to go back to nice mid 20's (70's for our US friends)... fingers crossed as I am critical point on me cedar siding job.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Ohh Melli - U made an OOPSIE on scale. Cordwood is best built with Dry CEDAR (min 18 months after cut & split to size), not pine and especially not any form of hardwood... as for other softwoods, well, they are bug food. R Values for Cedar is R6 per inch + Thermal Mass values which push it to more like R7.5 with heat return from the mass. Use ONLY Mortar and *never ever* Cement, a good Lime Mortar breaths with the wood and will set well and mix Round with Split for strength - also the Line & Cedar have the advantage over bugs. Cordwood Durability - there are examples in Europe that are 400 years old, examples around here 150+, and as for Fire, dense mass wood with lime takes a LONG time (hours) to burn through.
> 
> I seriously studied and considered Cordwood for my cabin but 2 years lead time to start wall building, was the stopper as my time is a factor - I'm behind schedule by 1.5 yrs now, which is bad. We have 3 Cordwood Builder's in this area and they know me well & vice a versa and several people have kept them extremely busy... Lot of New Cordwood cabins & large homes within 150km of here... Cedar Country !
> 
> Fingers crossed for ya on Weather remaining good... We have had great weather here BUT thunderstorms on the way... then supposed to go back to nice mid 20's (70's for our US friends)... fingers crossed as I am critical point on me cedar siding job.


I'm willing to be schooled here ...show some pics or links of a cordwood home. I admit, never played nor studied cordwood. Although, I am familiar with cedar, as they are pretty much every second tree on property. We don't build with cedar around here...not strong enough. But, cedar has a natural rot resistance, so used for shakes, trim work, decks etc. It would really need to dry out, as every cedar log I have cracks when it drys out. I've used it in decks, 2x for decking and railing. It works (being slightly moist helps when screwing it down to avoid cracking). 
Now mortar to me, is cement and fine sand or cement and lime. The masons use the former for chimney work. I've used it for rock work myself (walkway and pony wall, made out of real rocks). Never worked with lime. I extensively use a polymer mortar for tile jobs (usually slate). 
I have never seen a cordwood home around here...might have seismic issues? I don't know. How does one make the wall stout? 
I cannot see the R value being great if your packing voids with mortar, and we are moving towards having a 'thermal break home', to avoid wall stud cold zones. I do get the thermal mass of a log home, but the walls have to be darn thick to approach R values we are looking at today (R-40). Someone posted a mortar-bale home here (Texas?), and I do see that being a very energy efficient home by virtue of having 1-1/2' wide walls. 

I guess one has to be very good at constructing a cordwood home, as it wouldn't take much to mess up (cracks in wood, wood not perfectly sealed by mortar would defeat the insulation value pretty quick).


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## melli

Hitch said:


> You might have said this before and I missed it, but what type of roofing material are you gonna use?


Metal roof all the way.....lol
I refuse to use asphalt shingles ever again...around here, it is silly. Every home with shingles is a maintenance nightmare. We get too many dark wet days, and moss thrives on roofs around here. Then folks pay thousands to have them cleaned every other year. And for those who fail to maintain their shingle roofs, they can expect to replace them in 10-15 (depends on exposure, trees etc).
Plus, I just plain hate installing shingles...lol
Heavy gauge Copper penny (color) from Varsteel/Makin Metals is what I'll be getting. PVDF resin on metal.
http://specialtymetals.varsteel.ca/varsteel-specialty-metals-colours/colour-chart

Here is an example (my electrical shed);








And that crazy bearded guy on roof isn't me...my neighbor, an electrician, hooking up mast. Well, he isn't all crazy...he got a forge and now makes knifes and other weaponry...lol
Addition: he is a very nice guy!


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> I'm willing to be schooled here ...show some pics or links of a cordwood home. I admit, never played nor studied cordwood. Although, I am familiar with cedar, as they are pretty much every second tree on property. We don't build with cedar around here...not strong enough. But, cedar has a natural rot resistance, so used for shakes, trim work, decks etc. It would really need to dry out, as every cedar log I have cracks when it drys out. I've used it in decks, 2x for decking and railing. It works (being slightly moist helps when screwing it down to avoid cracking).
> Now mortar to me, is cement and fine sand or cement and lime. The masons use the former for chimney work. I've used it for rock work myself (walkway and pony wall, made out of real rocks). Never worked with lime. I extensively use a polymer mortar for tile jobs (usually slate).
> I have never seen a cordwood home around here...might have seismic issues? I don't know. How does one make the wall stout?
> I cannot see the R value being great if your packing voids with mortar, and we are moving towards having a 'thermal break home', to avoid wall stud cold zones. I do get the thermal mass of a log home, but the walls have to be darn thick to approach R values we are looking at today (R-40). Someone posted a mortar-bale home here (Texas?), and I do see that being a very energy efficient home by virtue of having 1-1/2' wide walls.
> 
> I guess one has to be very good at constructing a cordwood home, as it wouldn't take much to mess up (cracks in wood, wood not perfectly sealed by mortar would defeat the insulation value pretty quick).


Typically cordwood walls are 12-18" thick, so lots of R Value there. The mortar is in 3" bands on the outside of the logs, and the space in between the mortar bands and logs is filled with loose insulation or spray in foam, so there is a definite thermal break. As you can see, the R value for an 18" thick wall with insulation between the mortar bands can be quite high. They typically use either a post and beam construction with cordwood infill (8x8 posts and beams), or sometimes the corners are made with stacked wood joined with threaded rod. At any rate, the posts are anchored to the foundation and the stacked lumber is quite strong because the staggered and irregular joints cause forces to be dispersed at angles instead of straight down like it would in a stud wall. Best of all, for those of us who love this type of construction, it is a way to build using materials on your land or from a nearby sawmill instead of a big box store. Of course, the roof construction for ours will follow latest codes and best practices, even though there are no codes or code enforcement officers in our county. That includes fastening the rafters with hurricane straps so they don't blow off unless we get a vicious tornado.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Typically cordwood walls are 12-18" thick, so lots of R Value there. The mortar is in 3" bands on the outside of the logs, and the space in between the mortar bands and logs is filled with loose insulation or spray in foam, so there is a definite thermal break. As you can see, the R value for an 18" thick wall with insulation between the mortar bands can be quite high. They typically use either a post and beam construction with cordwood infill (8x8 posts and beams), or sometimes the corners are made with stacked wood joined with threaded rod. At any rate, the posts are anchored to the foundation and the stacked lumber is quite strong because the staggered and irregular joints cause forces to be dispersed at angles instead of straight down like it would in a stud wall. Best of all, for those of us who love this type of construction, it is a way to build using materials on your land or from a nearby sawmill instead of a big box store. Of course, the roof construction for ours will follow latest codes and best practices, even though there are no codes or code enforcement officers in our county. That includes fastening the rafters with hurricane straps so they don't blow off unless we get a vicious tornado.


If I am seeing it right, the cordwood (generally) goes right through...the mortar doesn't. 
I have to say, go for it! All the power to you. No question, it looks like an undertaking. Stunning result on this one:
https://cordwoodconstruction.wordpress.com/2013/05/08/cordwood-castle-in-maine/
And this one:
https://cordwoodconstruction.wordpr...-makes-it-energy-efficient-and-fortress-like/

I suppose if you get near 2' of wall! your bound to get good thermal mass. One thing I am finding out with my bunker, is thick walls turns windows into portholes. Make them big enough to account for the thick walls. I opted for a number of windows, instead of a few big ones (seismic concerns). 
An interesting article:
http://www.cordwoodconstruction.org/img/Backhome_article_Barchacky_shed.pdf

So, it appears 3-3-1-1 is the recipe (sand-sawdust-Portland cement-hydrated lime). I can see the sawdust acting as a bit of insulator and 'hydration unit' to limit cracking (along with lime). 
Very interesting. I have never seen this around here...For homes nowadays around 'here', an engineer has to sign off (liability), and given our seismic zone, one would have to reinforce the walls somehow. Back east, full stone and brick is used in abundance, but not here (only in older buildings - grandfathered). We do use stone/brick veneers.


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## Steve_S

LOL, OldTruck got to it before me.... 
There are of course many variations and I could grab photo's of local places that are new & extremely old (even some Homestead Barns) but that is precious time for me right now... I am fighting time against the impending arrival of S**w. THAT 4 Letter Word I hate so much....

http://cordwoodmasonry.com/ Rob's site is another good resource. BBQ got the rest but there is heaps & heaps of info out there.... 

Foundations can / are tricky, not only do you have to account for thickness of the wall but the collective weight loading. As we were intending on 20" thick walls our minimum perimeter would have been 24" wide, 24" thick with 4, 14mm rebars and to complicate it more (seems to be my hobby) the intention was to put down a 2' high SlipForm Stone wall and then the cordwood on top of that. That way the stone wall base would have taken any/all splash back and more...

Personally I harangued over corners & framing and we had planned on this type of corners & posts as shown below.


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## melli

Yeah Steve, I heard the interior of BC might be getting SNOW right now! Brutal. On the coast, we got dumped on (rain) last night. My Bunker fills up like a bathtub. 

OldtruckBBq and Steve - I hope I haven't come across as a curmudgeon with respect to cordwood building. _Not my intention at all._ Although, I have yet to see a perfect home build, no matter the material. Even my home has serious limitations and it uses some unsustainable materials (like a boatload of concrete, and foam). They say my foam is Eco-friendly, but that is horse patty. Sure, it doesn't off-gas like XPS foam, but they are all made from oil. And concrete is one of the biggest energy hogs on the planet. Also, I really think we ought to build homes based on location and climate. Too often I see architects/engineers design a home without taking into consideration where they are building. Like when we had adobe style homes built in a rainforest. Sure, they look great, but it does a disservice to the owners of the said homes (it even has it's own Wiki entry! - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaky_condo_crisis) when many were forced into bankruptcy because they bought a home ill suited to our climate. Here is a blurb from that link: "the most extensive and most costly reconstruction of housing stock in Canadian history"

At any rate, that 'crisis' put into motion new government regulations. While the screws were already being put to *Homeowner Builders (Homesteaders)*, the crisis made it a nightmare. In a nutshell, government doesn't want folks like me to build their own homes. They are risk adverse, and I suspect, had some urging of the insurance and trade racket. It is killing Homesteaders, drip by drip. I strongly believe, in the most passionate way possible, that everyone ought to have the right to build shelter. I've even lobbied wherever I can on the issue. It should be a fundamental right enshrined in our constitution. 

Right now, I see Millennial's camping in dilapidated RVs and even tents down the road. And the reason is because housing stock has gotten so expensive, nobody is building rental units. It costs too much in red tape to build a home. And developers have given up on 'cheap' housing stock, as they cannot make any money on starter homes. Every developer home in my area is at minimum, a half million dollar affair. I've only seen one 200k job in the past few years. 

So, getting back on topic, the fact both of you are building (or planning) your version of paradise is a blessing. It is the way it should be. I've heard all the 'talking points' of why a homesteader shouldn't be able to build their own shelter - safety, substandard efficiency, and passing on (selling) their home to an unsuspecting public. While I do agree in part, theses issues should take a back seat to a person needing shelter. It is fear-mongering. Usually, if a person builds their own home, it makes them capable of fixing it. Wasn't long ago, when everybody built their own home. Now, we have a class of folks who have no clue of what is behind their walls. And their lobbying, has turned home building into a morass. It is why folks are living in substandard accommodations (RVs, tents or their parent's basement). 

While I might have some concerns about cordwood, earthen, straw bale, ICF, stick frame, shipping container, concrete homes, it is immaterial. At the end of day, I salute those who build their own homes. 

BTW - it won't stop me from being a skeptic....lol. I look at my bunker, and see so many areas where I could have made it better. Eventually though, I have to draw a line. I only have so much coinage. 
I see cordwood as a viable alternative, but I would be inclined to build it in a non-seismic zone. Trying to reinforce the walls to withstand a sizable earthquake, would be an undertaking...imho


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Yeah Steve, I heard the interior of BC might be getting SNOW right now! Brutal. On the coast, we got dumped on (rain) last night. My Bunker fills up like a bathtub.
> 
> OldtruckBBq and Steve - I hope I haven't come across as a curmudgeon with respect to cordwood building. _Not my intention at all._ Although, I have yet to see a perfect home build, no matter the material. Even my home has serious limitations and it uses some unsustainable materials (like a boatload of concrete, and foam). They say my foam is Eco-friendly, but that is horse patty. Sure, it doesn't off-gas like XPS foam, but they are all made from oil. And concrete is one of the biggest energy hogs on the planet. Also, I really think we ought to build homes based on location and climate. Too often I see architects/engineers design a home without taking into consideration where they are building. Like when we had adobe style homes built in a rainforest. Sure, they look great, but it does a disservice to the owners of the said homes (it even has it's own Wiki entry! - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaky_condo_crisis) when many were forced into bankruptcy because they bought a home ill suited to our climate. Here is a blurb from that link: "the most extensive and most costly reconstruction of housing stock in Canadian history"
> 
> At any rate, that 'crisis' put into motion new government regulations. While the screws were already being put to *Homeowner Builders (Homesteaders)*, the crisis made it a nightmare. In a nutshell, government doesn't want folks like me to build their own homes. They are risk adverse, and I suspect, had some urging of the insurance and trade racket. It is killing Homesteaders, drip by drip. I strongly believe, in the most passionate way possible, that everyone ought to have the right to build shelter. I've even lobbied wherever I can on the issue. It should be a fundamental right enshrined in our constitution.
> 
> Right now, I see Millennial's camping in dilapidated RVs and even tents down the road. And the reason is because housing stock has gotten so expensive, nobody is building rental units. It costs too much in red tape to build a home. And developers have given up on 'cheap' housing stock, as they cannot make any money on starter homes. Every developer home in my area is at minimum, a half million dollar affair. I've only seen one 200k job in the past few years.
> 
> So, getting back on topic, the fact both of you are building (or planning) your version of paradise is a blessing. It is the way it should be. I've heard all the 'talking points' of why a homesteader shouldn't be able to build their own shelter - safety, substandard efficiency, and passing on (selling) their home to an unsuspecting public. While I do agree in part, theses issues should take a back seat to a person needing shelter. It is fear-mongering. Usually, if a person builds their own home, it makes them capable of fixing it. Wasn't long ago, when everybody built their own home. Now, we have a class of folks who have no clue of what is behind their walls. And their lobbying, has turned home building into a morass. It is why folks are living in substandard accommodations (RVs, tents or their parent's basement).
> 
> While I might have some concerns about cordwood, earthen, straw bale, ICF, stick frame, shipping container, concrete homes, it is immaterial. At the end of day, I salute those who build their own homes.
> 
> BTW - it won't stop me from being a skeptic....lol. I look at my bunker, and see so many areas where I could have made it better. Eventually though, I have to draw a line. I only have so much coinage.
> I see cordwood as a viable alternative, but I would be inclined to build it in a non-seismic zone. Trying to reinforce the walls to withstand a sizable earthquake, would be an undertaking...imho


I didn't take it as you being a curmudgeon. Nothing wrong with being a skeptic either. I was skeptical and have looked at many different options, even did a spreadsheet listing pros and cons, along with cost, of several different options. Most people say to stay away from non-standard construction because it is harder to sell and insure. While that may be true, life isn't all about $$$. People tell us that instead of building a 2 bedroom, 1 bath house with roomy bedrooms we should build it with 3 smaller bedrooms and cram 1 1/2 or 2 baths in because it has better resell value.

We are building our home the way we want, not for resell value. This is our place to live until they haul us off to a nursing home or cemetery. We have thought long and hard about the lifestyle we want and the home that we want. A home we build mainly with our own hands and on our terms is what we want. It will meet, and probably exceed, electrical, plumbing, ventilation, and safety codes, even though there are no building codes or enforcement in our the county we are building in. Some people will like it, some people will call us crazy, and that is just fine. We will be spending the remainder of our years living in a place we have dreamed of and worked toward for years. I'm not going to hold our choice of home construction up as the best and everything else as inferior. Everyone has their own dreams and requirements, and I don't need everyone else to follow in my footsteps in order to feel validated in my choices. You build your dream house, I'll build mine. I'll appreciate the care and craftmanship you put in yours and would hope you can appreciate the care and craftmanshp in mine. Everybody walks away happy, happy, happy! If we wanted what everyone else had, we would buy a home in a subdivision instead of buying a piece of woods in the middle of nowhere to carve out our own place.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I didn't take it as you being a curmudgeon. Nothing wrong with being a skeptic either. I was skeptical and have looked at many different options, even did a spreadsheet listing pros and cons, along with cost, of several different options. Most people say to stay away from non-standard construction because it is harder to sell and insure. While that may be true, life isn't all about $$$. People tell us that instead of building a 2 bedroom, 1 bath house with roomy bedrooms we should build it with 3 smaller bedrooms and cram 1 1/2 or 2 baths in because it has better resell value.
> 
> We are building our home the way we want, not for resell value. This is our place to live until they haul us off to a nursing home or cemetery. We have thought long and hard about the lifestyle we want and the home that we want. A home we build mainly with our own hands and on our terms is what we want. It will meet, and probably exceed, electrical, plumbing, ventilation, and safety codes, even though there are no building codes or enforcement in our the county we are building in. Some people will like it, some people will call us crazy, and that is just fine. We will be spending the remainder of our years living in a place we have dreamed of and worked toward for years. I'm not going to hold our choice of home construction up as the best and everything else as inferior. Everyone has their own dreams and requirements, and I don't need everyone else to follow in my footsteps in order to feel validated in my choices. You build your dream house, I'll build mine. I'll appreciate the care and craftmanship you put in yours and would hope you can appreciate the care and craftmanshp in mine. Everybody walks away happy, happy, happy! If we wanted what everyone else had, we would buy a home in a subdivision instead of buying a piece of woods in the middle of nowhere to carve out our own place.


So true. 
Besides, it is fun leaving the corral. Well, truth be told, this being my first ICF job, I was a nervous wreck, but once the pour happened, it was all good. 

Well, when it rains here, it just doesn't want to stop. I spent the morning using a squeegee and a blower to remove water off main floor. One big bathtub. Hindsight is always a curse, but I should have been particular in asking the crew to have a minor slope towards exits. I think at the time, I didn't want to complicate things. 
Well, I am marching on with sheathing...


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## Mr Bond

Looking great Melli! Snow in Fernie....


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Looking great Melli! Snow in Fernie....


Well, the ski hill is close for you...
I often thought of living in interior. Similkameen - Keremeos or Grand Forks - Creston - Fernie area. Problem is, your guaranteed snow in winter, usually a lot and much cooler. 
Still, having all those mountains at your doorstep, is unbeatable. 
I always wonder...lol


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## Mr Bond

After 3 countries and 2 provinces have to say this feels like my spiritual home, for all I am unable to get much beyond my doorstep! We traveled a lot to find potential locations that hit our criteria, and just kept coming back to Fernie. Some incredible locations on the west coast too, saw many on our honeymoon years ago (Whitehorse in a snowy September).


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## Steve_S

@melli no curmudgeon-ism felt from your post... Heck, I thought I had Curmudgeon cornered (used to be a nickname for little ol me). Funny, not many people know what that word is... glad to run into another who does.



oldtruckbbq said:


> We are building our home the way we want, not for resell value.


GOOD, all I can say is "Screw the Jones' & Smith's next door) and what they tell you to do or not.... they need to MYOB and bugger off.... everyone has an Opinion, just like they have assh*les and often worth as much too... BTW: Those same Jones' & Smith's will come and see what you built later and go Ohhh Wow ! So build the way YOU want for YOUR needs the way you envision it... Warning: what we see in our "Mind's Eye" sometimes does not realize the way we envisioned it... Reality and technical hurdles can bugger that up a bit... LOL. I really really wanted to build a Cordwood Shack for my last build but it just wasn't in the cards for me... 10 years ago I certainly could have built it but no way now as my health issues have the override, I'm lucky to be building what I want now but it's been a series of compromises, some not so great but others resulted in something better than what I envisioned at the start... In fact some of the compromises led to some pretty cool & interesting feature quite unintentionally... I call it "Organic Construction" as somethings just "come together". I may just build a small Coordwood Building on my property for something so I can say I did build my cordwood something.... Hmmm cordwood Greenhouse (north & side walls) ?

PS: Anyone notice the extensive use of FOUR LETTER WORDS lately... Rain, Snow... All potentially BAD words - Starting to hate 4 letter words.... must be the Curmudgeon in me grumbling to get "Out'n About" (with the heavy Canadian Accent, EH ! ) again....


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## melli

My utility decided to undermine a tree not slated for removal for their power pole replacement and upgrade (boosting power down line). I wasn't happy. Plus, they left the downhill slope of driveway entrance looking like a bomb went off. I was hoping to avoid my involvement (well, Bobby's involvement) in the matter. So, I had to motor down and dig around trees so they can cut below grade (I decided leaving roots in ground is a good idea as it will keep the bank from eroding til new vegetation takes hold). Then, they graciously offered to compensate me for material to cover up the blight (and they will give me some dough for vegetation). Not ideal, as the entrance will look like a clear-cut. I just had other things on the go....









In above pic, you can just see the anchor (left side, a tad over halfway up pic - shiny round thing poking up), and the new pole will go in a vertical culvert (right side of pic, lower third, a stake and piece of ply covering hole)








This is the rubble I dug out around tree roots...the second tree further up wasn't part of the 'plan', but they undermined tree with anchor. Seems the person acquiring my signature for RoW (right of way) didn't tell the crew installing anchor which trees to save. Figures...Interestingly, the anchor is not drilled in, but excavated 6' down. The anchor is a rod with a flat plate on bottom.








Going to miss those trees...they not only greened up entrance, but they gave snow shade to driveway (less shoveling, and I had a clear strip near trees in case I decided to live dangerously and try climbing hill with snow on ground). 
I'm so close to getting home waterproof, and this drops in my lap....


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## melli

I am pumped now...lol
Just 5 more sheets of ply and some bits...If my lumber store comes through for me and gets the underlay I ordered by Friday, my bunker will be waterproof before the next round of rains come. 
And I can rest.


----------



## ShannonR

Steve_S said:


> Ohh Melli - U made an OOPSIE on scale. Cordwood is best built with Dry CEDAR (min 18 months after cut & split to size), not pine and especially not any form of hardwood... as for other softwoods, well, they are bug food. R Values for Cedar is R6 per inch + Thermal Mass values which push it to more like R7.5 with heat return from the mass. Use ONLY Mortar and *never ever* Cement, a good Lime Mortar breaths with the wood and will set well and mix Round with Split for strength - also the Line & Cedar have the advantage over bugs. Cordwood Durability - there are examples in Europe that are 400 years old, examples around here 150+, and as for Fire, dense mass wood with lime takes a LONG time (hours) to burn through.
> 
> I seriously studied and considered Cordwood for my cabin but 2 years lead time to start wall building, was the stopper as my time is a factor - I'm behind schedule by 1.5 yrs now, which is bad. We have 3 Cordwood Builder's in this area and they know me well & vice a versa and several people have kept them extremely busy... Lot of New Cordwood cabins & large homes within 150km of here... Cedar Country !
> 
> Fingers crossed for ya on Weather remaining good... We have had great weather here BUT thunderstorms on the way... then supposed to go back to nice mid 20's (70's for our US friends)... fingers crossed as I am critical point on me cedar siding job.


Steve, how much cordwood building have you actually done? I get that you know people, but have you actually done a build to see for yourself?

I used all types of wood in mine, as an experiment (and to get all the shapes I wanted, used dimensional lumber in mine also!) The cedar, even bone dry for many many years, shrinks away from the mortar nearly as bad as the pine did. I had the best luck with dry oak, no shrinkage with the oak pieces!! I was willing to sacrifice the pittance in difference where R-value is concerned so I didn't have wind howling through the shrinkage gaps before it all gets chinked.

Part of the beauty of cordwood building is using materials on hand, and there is no cedar to speak of on the property. It isn't some law that cedar needs to be used, and like I said oak worked much better in my cordwood build.


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## melli

I read in one of the cordwood builds that the guy used 4 or 5 yr seasoned (dry) wood. That is a long wait...
To each their own, but I do see any wood species causing issues with shrinkage rates with mortar no matter how dry it is...Wood and mortar expand and contract at different rates, even when they've reached equilibrium. Part of the charm I guess. 
Heck, it is the reason why windows fail...they expand and contract in their frame. 
I have to agree with you Shannon, on using whatever species one has at hand. There are charts which show which species has good dimensional stability. I also think one has to seal whatever species they use, as some species may have good expansion coefficients, but are sponges when wet. 
I would go for a species that isn't a bug or mold haven, over R value, since the walls will be super thick.


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## oldtruckbbq

ShannonR said:


> Steve, how much cordwood building have you actually done? I get that you know people, but have you actually done a build to see for yourself?
> 
> I used all types of wood in mine, as an experiment (and to get all the shapes I wanted, used dimensional lumber in mine also!) The cedar, even bone dry for many many years, shrinks away from the mortar nearly as bad as the pine did. I had the best luck with dry oak, no shrinkage with the oak pieces!! I was willing to sacrifice the pittance in difference where R-value is concerned so I didn't have wind howling through the shrinkage gaps before it all gets chinked.
> 
> Part of the beauty of cordwood building is using materials on hand, and there is no cedar to speak of on the property. It isn't some law that cedar needs to be used, and like I said oak worked much better in my cordwood build.


I've read a couple articles on Mother Earth News by a guy who used oak because that is what was on his property. He accounted for the natural shrinkage in green oak as it dries and shows how to install your fasteners to accommodate that. Oak can be used for cordwood, it just has to be used within months of cutting instead of drying for a couple years like cedar. This actually plays right into our schedule. It allows us to use wood that I would otherwise have to burn to build our home. And yes, I may end up having to do some sealing in a couple years to seal cracks, but there is no type of home construction that is maintenance free and does not require some kind of upkeep. In fact, that is why so many older homes sell for so little - there was no routine maintenance done to the structure and it deteriorated. 

No matter what construction method you use, success only comes with a good understanding of the materials you are using and how to take advantage of their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. Being willing to ask questions, learn, adapt, and adjust is critical. 

A cousin and her husband bought a piece of overgrown land that was dirt cheap. It had a 1 acre pond at the bottom of the hill that was so overgrown that you couldn't even see it. Up the slope of the property it was so overgrown that you could't even walk it without a machete. They caught all kinds of grief. After months of hard work, they had a house site and driveway cleared out. A few months later you could see the pond. Then everyone started talking to them about putting up a modular home so they could get out of their apartment quicker. Besides, they were told, you can put up a modular home for less than you can put up a place yourself. They persisted, bought a log cabin kit they built and finished out themselves. Without a mortgage! All the naysayers were amazed and pronounced it the most beautiful home on the most beautiful location they had seen. After living there for almost 20 years, they sold their $75K investment for $350K and started over in a more remote, even more beautiful location. They didn't do what the Jones's did, they did what they wanted to do. I've been picking their brains for advice since they have done this twice. They are excited about cordwood construction and want to come help us so they can see what it is about and possibly use it for the lower walls in a screen porch they are going to add to their new home next summer.

While the Jones's and Smith's are sitting at home wondering how to pay their mortgage, we will be sitting at home thinking about what we are going to add with the money that we won't be paying for a mortgage. And we will have the satisfaction of knowing that we did it ourselves.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> So true.
> Besides, it is fun leaving the corral. Well, truth be told, this being my first ICF job, I was a nervous wreck, but once the pour happened, it was all good.
> 
> Well, when it rains here, it just doesn't want to stop. I spent the morning using a squeegee and a blower to remove water off main floor. One big bathtub. Hindsight is always a curse, but I should have been particular in asking the crew to have a minor slope towards exits. I think at the time, I didn't want to complicate things.
> Well, I am marching on with sheathing...
> 
> View attachment 62345
> 
> 
> View attachment 62346


That is quite the primordial forest just outside your cleared area. Beautiful scenery. Must be a joy to get up every day and be out in such a beautiful forest.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I've read a couple articles on Mother Earth News by a guy who used oak because that is what was on his property. He accounted for the natural shrinkage in green oak as it dries and shows how to install your fasteners to accommodate that. Oak can be used for cordwood, it just has to be used within months of cutting instead of drying for a couple years like cedar. This actually plays right into our schedule. It allows us to use wood that I would otherwise have to burn to build our home. And yes, I may end up having to do some sealing in a couple years to seal cracks, but there is no type of home construction that is maintenance free and does not require some kind of upkeep. In fact, that is why so many older homes sell for so little - there was no routine maintenance done to the structure and it deteriorated.
> 
> No matter what construction method you use, success only comes with a good understanding of the materials you are using and how to take advantage of their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. Being willing to ask questions, learn, adapt, and adjust is critical.
> 
> A cousin and her husband bought a piece of overgrown land that was dirt cheap. It had a 1 acre pond at the bottom of the hill that was so overgrown that you couldn't even see it. Up the slope of the property it was so overgrown that you could't even walk it without a machete. They caught all kinds of grief. After months of hard work, they had a house site and driveway cleared out. A few months later you could see the pond. Then everyone started talking to them about putting up a modular home so they could get out of their apartment quicker. Besides, they were told, you can put up a modular home for less than you can put up a place yourself. They persisted, bought a log cabin kit they built and finished out themselves. Without a mortgage! All the naysayers were amazed and pronounced it the most beautiful home on the most beautiful location they had seen. After living there for almost 20 years, they sold their $75K investment for $350K and started over in a more remote, even more beautiful location. They didn't do what the Jones's did, they did what they wanted to do. I've been picking their brains for advice since they have done this twice. They are excited about cordwood construction and want to come help us so they can see what it is about and possibly use it for the lower walls in a screen porch they are going to add to their new home next summer.
> 
> While the Jones's and Smith's are sitting at home wondering how to pay their mortgage, we will be sitting at home thinking about what we are going to add with the money that we won't be paying for a mortgage. And we will have the satisfaction of knowing that we did it ourselves.


That's the way to do it...imho. I could have paid as I went, like buying land outright, but then I'd be scrounging to get rolling, as it were. And my patience has a limit...lol
Instead I went for a small mortgage so I could have 'seed' money for buying Bobby, shipping container, clearing, and building in services. The idea was to get on land with all services installed, not be renting and driving over to land to work on it. 
After 4 yrs of clearing, and toiling, I got the land in shape, and services installed. I then plopped an RV on it. Last summer was divine. First summer in a while where I was free to enjoy life and I was only saddled with a small mortgage debt. 
This spring however, I went for glory, and started building. 
The flipside is my property value has rocketed since I bought it. A good and bad thing. I don't want to sell, so bad, but good, in that if the need arose, I could sell and buy almost anything in interior outright or get a line of credit to finish off bunker (not likely). 
I am nearing the stage where the bunker shell can sit for years unfinished and not be adversely affected. Nothing worse than having a build be rained on for a few winters, especially around here. The bottom half is concrete, so it can take weather abuse, but the top (roof and 2nd floor) half cannot.


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## melli

One of those days where everything is happening...and I was focused on the roof. The tree guys came by and took out the trees for the utility, so I had to go down and lightly supervise (make sure we are on same page). Nice folks, and very nice gig working for utility. I got a cedar and fir log to play with, and a very big load of cedar mulch...sweet. Love cedar mulch, as it is the best for weed suppression out here. 
The tree guys left stacks of bucked cedar on roadside and said they'd come and get it in a week...the deal is, if it is still there..lol
I heard folks were already digging in...kind of convenient, go to store for groceries, and drive home, see a stack of wood on side of road, and load up on kindling. I bet it'll be gone in 48hrs. 

I then hopped on roof and plugged away. One full row remaining! I even got drip cap on lower side and one course of underlay on (excess from main roof). Tomorrow, I hope to get two more rolls of underlay and three sheets of ply, so I can get that on before the rain hits again this weekend.


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## ShannonR

Woooohoo Melli!! You're almost there, what an amazing job!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Woooohoo Melli!! You're almost there, what an amazing job!


I know, weird, eh! lol
Just hope my lumber yard pulls through for me. 

Oh yeah, this is the after look of my driveway entrance...what decimation. Looks like a clearcut. 








Want free cedar?


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## ShannonR

Wow, they really lopped a bunch of trees down!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> That is quite the primordial forest just outside your cleared area. Beautiful scenery. Must be a joy to get up every day and be out in such a beautiful forest.


Yeah, that last pic showing woods make it look dark and mysterious. Just shading, as that part of forest is rather clear. I'm on the SW side of mountain ridge, whereas folks up on north side (10 miles away) are in another world. I must have pics of that somewhere. Like something out of special effects. Everything is coated in green moss, no sunlight hits forest floor. It looks like some primordial ooze coats everything. No idea how folks handle living there, especially in winter, when sun doesn't even reach them. Drive a person crazy. We jokingly refer to folks who live up there as mentally disturbed, as one has to be, to live in a dark green world...lol
The upside of living up there, is they have a rep, and gov officials avoid going there. Almost a build free zone.
Ok, this isn't the north side of mountain ridge but very similar...and someone was cheeky with toilet;








My place looked like this when I first looked at it (before I drove up it - couldn't because moss covered driveway was slippery):









This is from the area I was talking about, but it doesn't capture the greenery...but like this, but everything is covered in moss, bigger trees and darker.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Wow, they really lopped a bunch of trees down!


Just noticed you can see the faint roof line of my home. I better get planting! 
Utility is springing for a load of fill to smooth out bank, and plant a load of stuff (they are paying for that too!).


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> I know, weird, eh! lol
> Just hope my lumber yard pulls through for me.
> 
> Oh yeah, this is the after look of my driveway entrance...what decimation. Looks like a clearcut.
> View attachment 62381
> 
> Want free cedar?


Wow, they really left you hanging out in the open when they took out those trees! Hope they replace at least some of them to give you some privacy.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Wow, they really left you hanging out in the open when they took out those trees! Hope they replace at least some of them to give you some privacy.


Well, they gave me dough (haven't seen it yet) for fill and a $200 nursery voucher. 
Problem I have is they had to take down more trees than agreed to because their hole diggers undermined trees not slated for removal, and I am stuck doing the work. If I didn't have Bobby, I'd be hooped. I should have pushed for them to fix it. 
But part of me doesn't want them messing with my property. 
I can do a half decent terrace job...plant a whack of stuff, and in a few years, it'll be better than before. Part of me also realizes I'd have to take out the trees in a few years, as they are threatening my only section of overhead power lines (from their pole to my electrical shed). Now, I will not have that issue for decades. 
Overhead lines suck....


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## Steve_S

Ohhh my, the other side is "Fanghorn Forest" - where is Isengard again ? And what about Mordor ? (big city I suppose). The Ents are watching !

Love it, wonderful spot you got there Melli, I've always loved the Mountains and diversity within... The best I could do where I am, is small hills and valley's which is all that's left after the glaciers receded chewing down the mountain range that was here 100,000 years ago. But still have that "nestled" feeling which is what I like... open flat prairies are nice but never got that "surrounded by nature& nestled in with it" feeling from big open spaces... Must be a "Mountain Man" at heart I guess.

I hope BC Hydro follows through, they usually do when they screw up and don't want chastisements for it... something like asking for forgiveness rather than permission thing... SITE-C erf.... Maybe you can get some fast growing Cedar Bushes or something in place that will give you back your screen quickly... Or go whacky and put a Blue Police Box in the hole ! wink wink, nudge nudge... 

Behind Schedule so off'n running... big todo list for today... below is a Pic, the result of 5 days effort being such a Persnickety (and final) wall due to the Porch going in place after and the fiddly nature of the work with every single board having to be dealt with individually.. sure am glad to have my own MetalTech Scaffolding... me who hates heights when things wiggle underneath and who suffers from vertigo issues.... This was a Watershed Moment in this build as it represents a milestone where almost all siding is completed (except for some trim boards and edging work) as the porch will have to go up after I am in occupancy - which now looks like Week 2 of October and still so much todo....


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Ohhh my, the other side is "Fanghorn Forest" - where is Isengard again ? And what about Mordor ? (big city I suppose). The Ents are watching !
> 
> Love it, wonderful spot you got there Melli, I've always loved the Mountains and diversity within... The best I could do where I am, is small hills and valley's which is all that's left after the glaciers receded chewing down the mountain range that was here 100,000 years ago. But still have that "nestled" feeling which is what I like... open flat prairies are nice but never got that "surrounded by nature& nestled in with it" feeling from big open spaces... Must be a "Mountain Man" at heart I guess.
> 
> I hope BC Hydro follows through, they usually do when they screw up and don't want chastisements for it... something like asking for forgiveness rather than permission thing... SITE-C erf.... Maybe you can get some fast growing Cedar Bushes or something in place that will give you back your screen quickly... Or go whacky and put a Blue Police Box in the hole ! wink wink, nudge nudge...
> 
> Behind Schedule so off'n running... big todo list for today... below is a Pic, the result of 5 days effort being such a Persnickety (and final) wall due to the Porch going in place after and the fiddly nature of the work with every single board having to be dealt with individually.. sure am glad to have my own MetalTech Scaffolding... me who hates heights when things wiggle underneath and who suffers from vertigo issues.... This was a Watershed Moment in this build as it represents a milestone where almost all siding is completed (except for some trim boards and edging work) as the porch will have to go up after I am in occupancy - which now looks like Week 2 of October and still so much todo....


Very very nice Steve! Looks like you can fire up woodstove to keep you warm while you work inside?


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## melli

Really long day...and I'm short underlay. Well, got enough on to keep water off of 2nd and main floor, so I should be happy.
Had enough to piece together another row, but since I have to buy another roll of underlay, might as well have clean rows (no vertical seams).

I should have taken out the drone sooner but that takes time, and I am spent.
Has to be the hardest 6mths I've ever put in, in my life. I recall some seismic tours in the swamps of Louisiana that were killer, but they were only 4-6 weeks. Big difference in time frame. Plus, I really got to unwind when the tour was over (2-3wk break, jet ride anywhere in world, and a pocket full of money...lol). Here, I get no VIP jet ride, flat broke, and still lots to do. At least I won't be under pressure, in terms of beating the weather. It can rain all it wants...would be nice for a few days of nice weather so I can finish off roof though.

































One thing I have to do before I finish off 2nd floor roof is make a ladder so I have a way off...no way I am climbing down a 20ft ladder! Build just a small one from second floor roof to main floor roof. I can climb in through gabled end there in above pic. I built a step on that wall as that is where all roof materials were humped through. Only 6' difference in roof heights.


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## melli

I was chatting with a neighbor about this build and the 6 mths it took...just a tad over that. I was looking at old pics, and exactly 6mths ago to the day, I just finished pouring the footings. 









Obviously, building your own home is very doable, even solo, as I've seen on this site. I would recommend an extra pair of hands though...lol
My RV is a disaster (needs a serious cleaning), I've ignored my yard (weeding control and lost several baby cedars to drought), and I seem to be eating the oddest things for supper, like tonight, hot dogs. Usually, I make a real supper. 

Will take a few days to recover and let it sink in that I don't really have to do anything, at least on an urgent basis. True to form, I started hauling in scrap plywood into bunker (going to cover windows on east side - windstorm winds). Will clean up 'end-cut' pile and will sort through grey tarp shed behind build (it is loaded with building material, even a stove) and use the bunker as storage. Really need to dismantle the scaffolding inside building...have to finish a few things first though (anchoring pony wall, hurricane ties, and end gable over garage doors).


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> Very very nice Steve! Looks like you can fire up woodstove to keep you warm while you work inside?


Ohh yeah, my little wood stove heats the joint up fast and makes it quite toasty, too toasty if even I just get a little carried away with loading the stove. I roasted myself a couple of times last winter in there and had to open windows to cool off (in -25c weather to boot !) lessons learned dept. LOL

Gee Wiz, should have posted Drone Pics before, now THAT gives us real perspective ! Excellent !!! geez, I wonder what my place under a Drone View would look like...


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## melli

Steve - just had someone today say I need a woodstove...ha, I need windows and doors first.
I was actually trying to sell my DJI 3 Pro but no takers - money for windows and doors.
If I had money to burn on a drone (the drone was gifted to me), I'd get the Mavic. Lightweight/compact and has all the features (and more) of the 3/4 Pro series.

Had a light rain last night, but this morning was one of those days where I wish time could stop. Full sun, but not too hot, a perfect fall day. Better yet, no roof work, no nothing. Well, I did a bit of a clean up, but I was in no rush. My muscles and joints ache, so I was grateful for the easy'ish day. And these guys are still mucking about! No idea how they are managing to stay alive. This isn't rabbit country.








This is the ends cuts and scrap wood I'll be roasting over winter. Pile looks rather large in pics, but it is just a pickup truck load.
Not bad for a small house build.









Grey stuff is concrete form scrap...actually, most of it is concrete/ICF bracing scrap.

Then I walked over to my sweet pile of mulch...that tree cutting crew have an uber wood chipper. Almost too fine...not complaining, especially since most is cedar mulch.









Nice aroma. The boss of crew will keep me in mind if he is in hood doing work. Told him he doesn't even have to call me...just drop it right here. The proof of how good mulch is for trees is visible in above pic. The trees to left have a load of mulch I scored from someone...see how green they are? The tree to right has no mulch, but I did water it a couple of times. Can see it is 'flagging' and has a yellow hue. I lost several small cedars this summer (can see them in house pics above). A real shame. Well, this mulch will save the remaining ones. It is like putting a protective blanket on ground around roots, preserving moisture in the hot summer sun. Also, as it decomposes, it provides nutrients.


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## oldtruckbbq

Looking great. I may look into getting a drone. I can't wait to start posting pics of our foundation pour this spring. It would be nice if we weren't paying over $600 per month in medical expenses not covered by insurance. That would sure go a long way toward building our place!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Looking great. I may look into getting a drone. I can't wait to start posting pics of our foundation pour this spring. It would be nice if we weren't paying over $600 per month in medical expenses not covered by insurance. That would sure go a long way toward building our place!


Yeah, your healthcare situation is a mess. Too many hands in the trough, I suspect. 
I know I am lucky living up here, with respect to healthcare. None of us have a $600/mth tab for healthcare (maybe in very extreme cases). That is rent in many places. Hope your congress comes up with a real plan instead of old ones. I'll try not to turn this into a healthcare thread, but this disjointed health care system you have benefits so few, and enriches those who run it. 
Heck, if I had an extra $600 per month...windows and doors!

You can get a pretty cheap drone that takes decent pics for $100-$200. Seems they are everywhere now. To be honest, I was pumped when I got it last year, but the thrill wears off pretty quick. It takes time to set up, and run time is only 25min tops. 
Plus, I am paranoid of crashing it. 

It did take one pic that I'll always remember;









Old fire station lookout. I was trying to find a trail to top on my Honda CT90. Never quite made it. I miss last summer...lol
Maybe next one, I can visit that lookout.


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## Steve_S

Ummm a wee side trip and NOT to derail ongoing topic but I feel I should share this tidbit for Savings... As you know, I am getting to the finishing stages for this shack of mine and of course like any DIY'er I keep a close eye on things of interest and in particular with things that fit the "Theme" of my shack. Yesterday was a scorcher again @ 34C outside and decided I had to have a Light Day (I roasted myself on Friday and had a minor heat stroke thing happen - even with drinking about a gallon of cold water and many cool downs in my Cabin which still has not gotten warmer than 23C inside with doors & windows open to boot). So I went off and shopped for materials & supplies and a tank of gas & 500 kms worth of driving in the process... 

I hit TSC (Tractor Supply in USA) and grabbed my sediment filter & rainfresh whole house filters for my water - plumbing this week... Then Home Despot for PEX supplies, ceramic tile for counter tops (building my own site built cabinets & all) ouche$ there but what can you do... BUT then to Huge Savings mode... I have wanted very particular sink and faucet for kitchen as well as main lighting for the Cabin and it all has to flow with the "theme" of course... I guess that might seem a touch obvious from the couple of photo's I posted... The kitchen sink I had in mind are selling for $250+ ish at Homedepot and the faucet to go with it almost as much... Ughness ! The lighting, wow, everyone thinks lights are Gold and the bulbs are platinum ! Market Bares pricing and the sheeple just accept it... 

Save, Save and Save some more... even with the long drive To & From the big city major savings mode, I hit Ikea ! There are many things that I will buy from there and others that I would not BUT for the above noted - excellent place to get things... I figure I saved myself close to $400 and to me that is significant and I imagine you too Melli & others, we all gotta save where we can EH ! The new 2018 Catalogue is out and already reflected on Ikea's website and they have come out with even more goodies for us "Rural Type Folks" - even the antique styled light bulbs which are LED and look amazing - yep got some of them too ! Just the perfect Fit like this one for the big light in the living room (great room) for $11.99 (ok a splurge but it will last forever right & only 4.2 watts - remember I am Off Grid Solar only, every watt counts !).









*The Sink* I got: (typically $200+ at Homedepot)
http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/S89158172/ Ikea: $99








*The Faucet *
They have these in Chrome too BUT there is nothing else around with chrome and somehow, to my eye this fits better with the Motif of rough & ready shack in the woods… and given the appliances are Stainless & Black too… well twas a “Natural” choice I think.
http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/10225612/ Ikea $129








*The hanging light for the “Great Room”* lol…. Pretty Grand for a shack in the woods eh !
http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/90256497/ Ikea: $39.99









*The light for the Kitchen*
http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/70346098/ Ikea $39.99








Hmmmm Web Linked pics can't be made smaller or as thumbnails... oh well they are not too massive. No high-jacking intended and just sharing something for you to ponder on Melli, as your getting closer to the stage where you'll be considering your interior finishes and coagulating your ideas into something coherently special that can be realized within a reasonable budget. You know, I was actually thinking of making my own lighting but even with that I likely could not have done it myself (although style would be different) for less than what I paid at Ikea and somehow I think this solution works best. FYI, all my ceilings inside are 1x6 mill cut Knotty Pine, rough cut beams & facings, and even the 8" baseboards & 5" casing will be large rough cut (not bandsaw cut either, big round circular saw - old style, so the marks show the cut pattern) pine as well... and with 6+" window sills etc it all stands out... Interesting irony, is buying the rough cut and the miller planing it to 1" thick is still cheaper than buying MDF or Finger jointed pine crud from local Big Box, just a tad more effort to install BUT perfection is irrelevant too and that's something my High Detail Virgo side has had to adapt too LMAO - it's a NICE Break to not worry about millimetre perfections....

Hope this post is helpful if not thought provoking


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## melli

No worries at all Steve...post away (public thread and all). Some good ideas, but I am so far away from that stuff right now, it hurts...lol
I have to finish sheathing the roof and walls, frame garage door end, then soffit, windows and doors...not necessarily in that order. I am crashing hard right now. Unable to get a long sleep in, even though I can chill. Typical for me when I go hard at something for a spell, it takes several days or weeks to recover. I ache all over. Might be a bug, but I think it is just exhaustion.

I did get some easy stuff done, like the redi-rod anchors for pony wall. Total overkill, even in our seismic hood. But once I started on the idea, I figured why not (read a seismic book on residential construction). Generally speaking, most homes have the bottom sill plate anchored to concrete footings (foundation). But in seismic zones, they recommend you anchor the top plate to the foundation. This effectively keeps the walls from skipping off foundation and from crippling, to an extent. In addition, I have hurricane ties which hold the rafters to the top plate, completing the anchoring. Now, I don't get hurricanes here, just 'middle of the road' windstorms (usually in November when we transition from trade wind systems to arctic systems). But the hurricane ties are also seismic ties. I see too many homes disintegrate in windstorms and earthquakes because the builders fail to adequately tie the whole house together. Looking at hurricane damage, it is easy to see why. I had to laugh when one guys house remained intact except one wall fell off (I commiserate with him, but whoever built his house should be banned from owning a hammer). A wall should never just 'fall off'. Most of the damage is poorly anchored roofs or poorly applied roof sheathing and metal roofs. Once the wind peels off a row of metal, it is game over. Worse yet, is when wind can peel off a sheet of ply...now the wind can literally blow up the roof, once it has access to attic areas (usually engineered trusses). While engineered trusses are ok at gravity loads, they are not so good at negative G loads (upwards). They are light, prone to buffeting, which loosens things up, and lack of purloins can rack them (like dominoes, they fall). I noticed the houses in the Florida keys that handle hurricanes, are the one's with concrete roofs. It is coming into vogue here, at least for floors (not a topping, but a full on 6-8" reinforced concrete floor sitting on corrugated metal - almost no form-works). If I ever build a house again, it will have that.
My 'second best option' roof on my bunker will have to do...heavy and stout enough to take a tree and all windstorms, yet flexible enough to withstand an earthquake (I hope, as one never knows).








Hard to see in pics...no lights yet, but there are three redi-rods, and every rafter has a hurricane tie.


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## Mr Bond

Melli your scaffold is better built than many homes!

Question: any reason you didn't continue with ICF all the way up?


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Melli your scaffold is better built than many homes!
> 
> Question: any reason you didn't continue with ICF all the way up?


Unsupported ICF wall height max is 3m (~10ft) for our area (seismic zone - supposedly, I live in a 'high' risk area, but lowest of three levels in the 'high zone'). In non-seismic areas, I think you can go up 12' according to tech manual....higher if you get engineer approval. 
I've seen them quite high in build pics online (like 15-20' high - unsupported). 
For those unfamiliar with the term 'unsupported', it just means a wall can only be so high before a floor or ceiling. The lateral support of a floor/ceiling allows one to have an ICF wall be several floors in height. 

My ICF portion of wall is 10ft...max allowed. I wanted to have headroom, in case I wanted to have it as a garage (not likely). With the pony wall extension (wood portion) makes it 14' at the high side and 10' at low side. 

Reminded me, I must get the LVLs up over 'garage door' entrance. They are important, as they tie in end wall (turns main floor into a rectangular box (i.e. makes it stable). 

Tomorrow, I'll see about getting 3 loads of fill...2 for house, and 1 for utility clearcut at driveway entrance. This side of house needs fill;









I think I will scoop some of that fine gravel (too much there) and use as a topping. The bugger is that power kiosk there...I'll be burying it, yet I'll have to hand dig up the lines and thread them into house down the road (after I get electrical permit, and chat with inspector). I don't want rodents thinking they can make a home under skirt. I doubt they'd like it under there, with all that foundation goop I have under there, but just to be sure...


----------



## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Melli your scaffold is better built than many homes!
> 
> Question: any reason you didn't continue with ICF all the way up?


Missed your scaffold comment...thx!
The scaffold was ok when I could stand on it (while building roof), but now I have to do the limbo dance on that scaffold, which does a number on my knees. Somehow I feel less safe on it, while crawling on it, and the concrete floor is not a place I wish to land. I just re-purposed the scaffold from ICF pour. I had to make it skookum for the crew. I was worried about liability issues with 4 guys walking on it. They even commented on it...lol
I hope to take it down in a week or so...I need it for the exterior 2nd floor.


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## Mr Bond

"_Unsupported ICF wall height max is 3m (~10ft) for our area (seismic zone)_ " That would make sense if they limited _*total *unsupported wall height_ to 10 feet, but now you have a hinge in the middle (plane between ICF and framing). Intuitively it feels wrong..... The tie rods are a good fix for this, but it throws the reasoning of the code into question. Either way, the way you build this place isn't moving for anything, not even bureaucrats 

I always wanted to build a castle with them as the ease of forming curved turrets seemed a perfect fit.


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> "_Unsupported ICF wall height max is 3m (~10ft) for our area (seismic zone)_ " That would make sense if they limited _*total *unsupported wall height_ to 10 feet, but now you have a hinge in the middle (plane between ICF and framing). Intuitively it feels wrong..... The tie rods are a good fix for this, but it throws the reasoning of the code into question. Either way, the way you build this place isn't moving for anything, not even bureaucrats
> 
> I always wanted to build a castle with them as the ease of forming curved turrets seemed a perfect fit.


I hear you and totally agree. Realistically, ICF folks are covering their behinds with their specs. Plus, the wood portion, even with 'hinge' is lighter by orders of magnitude (less 'moment arm'). The other end of rafter is anchored to concrete wall, so I'd think the hinge will not come into play. AND, both ends have 'half gables', which will restrict any hinge 'moment'. Hence, the LVLs I need to get up. 
Aside: the ICF manual has specs for lintels (structural horizontal block that spans the top of windows for those curious), which would restrict somewhat those transom windows in the wood pony wall as they only have a one foot lintel (header). You'll notice I have 1-1/2 courses above main floor windows...I didn't want to run into issues there. And be mindful, I am operating on paranoia and seismic codes. 

Yep, I've seen curved ICFs. I love turrets! lol
My dream home has a large turret at one end, so I can have an office with 270 degree view.


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## melli

*Cleaning up the Utilities Bomb Crater
*
As you saw in above pic, (I'll repost it below), the utility folks ended up clearcutting the foot of my driveway, and they left digging spoils. Obviously, I cannot live with that, and I could have whined some more and got them to make it pretty, but I hate drama, and I have Bobby, so I went to work. 
I just did a rough outline of what I plan to do...I need to rustle up some more boulders. I just play it by ear as I do these things, as I have no idea what I am digging into, and what boulders I come across...like my yard, it slowly revealed itself. First I had to get Bobby on other side of ditch. Further down road, I found the ditch was shallow, and I could ford the ditch and bushwhack my way to the spot. You can see the dark tunnel I came through. 








Bushwhacking with Bobby is kinda fun...you know how laborious it is by hand? Well, flip that equation, and that is how easy it is with Bobby. No sweat, just wanton destruction...lol. As I said before, you are Iron Man in a machine like Bobby. Rip, not cut limbs off trees, knock over dead trees, level the ground a bit tossing boulders aside, and I have a very cool path. That low row of boulders was acquired enroute through the forest. Bobby is clutching another. 

Before I started:








And After today (I still have the fill to come and some boulder placing to do - that top row was placed haphazardly...need fill to place them as it is steep there);











May not look like an improvement, but once I get fill, some mulch, and greenery planted, it will look way better. Today was a rough-in job. In the days to come, I'll 'finish' it. A little perturbed I won't be able to bury that one stump. I loathe to rip it out, as the roots are stabilizing the slope. I might haul down chainsaw...hmmm...









It is sort of looking like two terraces will be the end result, with a row of boulders along driveway to keep me from sliding off driveway when it snows...I preferred the trees, as they kept a snow free strip at edge.


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## melli

*Deep Thoughts on Excavators*

I realize not all homesteaders can afford an excavator...let's face it, homesteading is not an inexpensive proposition. While the initial outlay can be relatively inexpensive (land), the improvements can tax anybody. I don't even want to think what it has cost me to date to improve my property. But life would be boring had I not taken the leap. I can say buying the mini excavator has been my most useful tool by a country mile (maybe several). It cost about 18k. I just rolled over a thousand hours on it, in about 4.5 yrs. I spend about a grand per year on maintenance items (I do not skimp, as you may have figured out by now...lol). It goes through a 5 gallon jug of diesel in about 4hrs (my daily limit as the noise, jostling get to me). It can do anything a big machine can do, except it is slower at doing it. A big machine means big headaches if something goes kaput. A neighbor has a monster (30ton beast). To remove the idler, (the wheels at front of excavator) took another excavator to remove it, it weighs that much and probably costs a fortune to replace (thousands). On mine, I've put on new ones, and they weigh about 60lbs ($300)...totally manageable.

I don't dismiss those who wish to do stuff by hand...you get a ton of exercise. I do a lot by hand, but Bobby has been a blessing for all the big stuff. And I've learned that using a tree's mass to pop the roots is the way to go. I illustrated this a few pages back. Once the root is popped out of ground, I use Bobby to shake off the dirt by raising the root ball off ground, and dropping it, several times. The dirt clinging to a root ball can increase the weight by double, easily.

Going old school and leaving stumps behind can cause more work (and money), especially for bigger stumps. Even a big machine has to dig them out, whereas, a 4 ton or 30 ton could topple a tree, and the root ball will pop out of ground. It even leaves a smaller hole to infill. When I first started, I was felling trees with chainsaw, then using Bobby to remove stumps. I was just torturing myself, as felling a monster tree with a chainsaw is not 'safe' work, nor sweat free, then I'd have to spend an hour digging out the stump with Bobby, because I had no leverage. Once I used Bobby for felling, the trees came down at a much faster clip. So fast, in fact, I'd have all these 100' trees laying over each other, and it'd take a day to clean up the mess (you'd be playing a game of 'pick up sticks' https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pick_up_sticks_1.JPG). I soon learned it is best to clean up after felling a few (top them, remove root ball, stack log, and put remnants in slash pile). 

I also admit, it was a daunting proposition to even rent a excavator, never mind buying one. But once I got over the nervous nellie syndrome, and rented one, I was hooked. Took a couple of very slow hours learning the ropes, and within a day I could dig holes all day long (actually, that was my first task, digging 100 holes for planting 6-10' cedars). After a few days, I could do most anything. Like anything, the more time you clock, the more you can do. Now, I take the machine places I never dreamed of before (like using the arm to move because your tracks cannot climb a slope or traverse a ditch like the one above). The cab has roll over protection, in case you were wondering. And no, I haven't rolled mine yet. I have slid down a moss covered bedrock slope which scared the crap out of me. I hammered the bucket teeth into the bedrock and pirouetted to a stop. It seems to handle snow much better than I thought, even on rubber tracks, but I do always keep the blade in front of me while going downhill, and the snow piling up in front of blade keeps me from tobogganing.
Speaking of rubber tracks, while they don't last as long as metal tracks, they do much less damage on my yard, when I need to traverse it. It leaves indents, but the grass recovers easily.

Although, I do seem to have fallen for Bobby, if the need arose, I could sell him for almost what I paid (15k in a heartbeat), as the demand for a good machine in my hood is very high. I would have spent at least a 150k hiring folks to do the excavation work I have done....probably more, as having your own machine means you can fuss, take your time, and do it exactly how you want it. And when you hire someone, they never do everything you need done. You always see something to be done, once the excavator is on trailer leaving your property (I guarantee it!). I think renting/hiring is a complete waste, except the first time (when your renting one to operate yourself, to see what it is capable of). I can't recommend enough, if the opportunity arose, of renting a machine to operate yourself. Yeah, there are levers and buttons everywhere, but like any video game, you pick it up quicker than you think. I let a neighbor pull alder stumps from his yard, and it took him minutes to learn how to dig up small stumps. While he hadn't mastered moving around, he could operate the boom, arm and bucket very well. Quicker than it took me I suspect. I had this habit of jamming the boom (big arm attached to cab) into dirt and raising the front of machine off ground...almost to the point of doing a back flip...lol. Ok, not the thing you need to hear. I soon had a mental checklist, 'Let go!' of controls when in a jam. Calm down, and slowly extricate myself from whatever position I had contorted myself into. When we get into a sudden jam, our tendency is to try to recover quickly, which can only make things worse. Just a suggestion, but let go of controls, as machine will stop, and you can gather your wits, and calmly get out of jam.

The maintenance side is much like doing maintenance on a car, albeit, there are hoses everywhere. Rarely, have I had odd ball maintenance issues. Once, my hot lead to starter was shorting on frame because vibrations had worn a tiny hole in cable. That is about the worse troubleshooting item I've had. I've changed out undercarriage stuff, but that is easy peasy stuff (like loosen two bolts, and out comes a roller etc. ). I do change fluids/filters more than necessary, and I think that has contributed to trouble free operation. I have gotten slightly creative, and made my own diagnostic kit, so I can alter pressures to keep everything in spec and see exactly if anything is going wrong. I find that way cool, as I can tweak pressures, much like tweaking a computer to go faster.
/blab

Oh yeah, grease your machine! Nothing creates a spaghetti noodle quicker than not greasing your machine, at least every 8hrs...just takes a few minutes (I do it while waiting for machine to warm up). I have changed bushings and pins...a real headache, and the bill can add up.


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> Ummm a wee side trip and NOT to derail ongoing topic but I feel I should share this tidbit for Savings... As you know, I am getting to the finishing stages for this shack of mine and of course like any DIY'er I keep a close eye on things of interest and in particular with things that fit the "Theme" of my shack. Yesterday was a scorcher again @ 34C outside and decided I had to have a Light Day (I roasted myself on Friday and had a minor heat stroke thing happen - even with drinking about a gallon of cold water and many cool downs in my Cabin which still has not gotten warmer than 23C inside with doors & windows open to boot). So I went off and shopped for materials & supplies and a tank of gas & 500 kms worth of driving in the process...
> 
> I hit TSC (Tractor Supply in USA) and grabbed my sediment filter & rainfresh whole house filters for my water - plumbing this week... Then Home Despot for PEX supplies, ceramic tile for counter tops (building my own site built cabinets & all) ouche$ there but what can you do... BUT then to Huge Savings mode... I have wanted very particular sink and faucet for kitchen as well as main lighting for the Cabin and it all has to flow with the "theme" of course... I guess that might seem a touch obvious from the couple of photo's I posted... The kitchen sink I had in mind are selling for $250+ ish at Homedepot and the faucet to go with it almost as much... Ughness ! The lighting, wow, everyone thinks lights are Gold and the bulbs are platinum ! Market Bares pricing and the sheeple just accept it...
> 
> Save, Save and Save some more... even with the long drive To & From the big city major savings mode, I hit Ikea ! There are many things that I will buy from there and others that I would not BUT for the above noted - excellent place to get things... I figure I saved myself close to $400 and to me that is significant and I imagine you too Melli & others, we all gotta save where we can EH ! The new 2018 Catalogue is out and already reflected on Ikea's website and they have come out with even more goodies for us "Rural Type Folks" - even the antique styled light bulbs which are LED and look amazing - yep got some of them too ! Just the perfect Fit like this one for the big light in the living room (great room) for $11.99 (ok a splurge but it will last forever right & only 4.2 watts - remember I am Off Grid Solar only, every watt counts !).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Sink* I got: (typically $200+ at Homedepot)
> http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/S89158172/ Ikea: $99
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The Faucet *
> They have these in Chrome too BUT there is nothing else around with chrome and somehow, to my eye this fits better with the Motif of rough & ready shack in the woods… and given the appliances are Stainless & Black too… well twas a “Natural” choice I think.
> http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/10225612/ Ikea $129
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The hanging light for the “Great Room”* lol…. Pretty Grand for a shack in the woods eh !
> http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/90256497/ Ikea: $39.99
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *The light for the Kitchen*
> http://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/70346098/ Ikea $39.99
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmmm Web Linked pics can't be made smaller or as thumbnails... oh well they are not too massive. No high-jacking intended and just sharing something for you to ponder on Melli, as your getting closer to the stage where you'll be considering your interior finishes and coagulating your ideas into something coherently special that can be realized within a reasonable budget. You know, I was actually thinking of making my own lighting but even with that I likely could not have done it myself (although style would be different) for less than what I paid at Ikea and somehow I think this solution works best. FYI, all my ceilings inside are 1x6 mill cut Knotty Pine, rough cut beams & facings, and even the 8" baseboards & 5" casing will be large rough cut (not bandsaw cut either, big round circular saw - old style, so the marks show the cut pattern) pine as well... and with 6+" window sills etc it all stands out... Interesting irony, is buying the rough cut and the miller planing it to 1" thick is still cheaper than buying MDF or Finger jointed pine crud from local Big Box, just a tad more effort to install BUT perfection is irrelevant too and that's something my High Detail Virgo side has had to adapt too LMAO - it's a NICE Break to not worry about millimetre perfections....
> 
> Hope this post is helpful if not thought provoking


Personally, I love it when people share good ideas about constructing and finishing out a place. The more I can learn from others, the (hopefully) fewer mistakes I will make.


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## MoBookworm1957

Gives me ideas to help my cousin get her place back up to snuff.
Mainly to give my dad peace of mind. So I can get back to work on barn house on homestead land.
Nobody right now can work on their places till her's is back up to snuff.
Went out last weekend cleared out 5 acres of poison ivy,oak, and sumac with Round up, kerosene.
Before I went got another set of shots for allergies of poison ivy,oak and sumac.
While working on that got my last piece of fence up and the gate for dad's calves in the spring.
Marked out where Porkies going ,put lean to shed for firewood up in yard by barn house. It's up by well house.Sprayed more of her poison ivy, oak,and sumac. Finished her goat pen fencing. Put up feed bunker in goat yard, water trough is in too. She's just got to put up Goat gate. Some kind of shed for them. Pruned some of her trees. My brother and nephews cleaned out brush around ponds, cut down horse weeds size of small saplings around metal barn. Her son cleaned out metal barn filled one deep holler with junk. Now we can park Dad's tractor,brush hog,gas powered post hole digger inside metal barn this winter. She was going to leave tractor outside. My dad went ballistic. He offered to buy her outright. It would give enough money to move to city where her kids are. Her kids said yes, she said no.In 60 more days, it won't matter what she wants if her place isn't back to snuff. At least what it was when she moved out there twenty years ago. Going out this weekend to dig up Johnson Grass,put kerosene,Round up on it. Thank God it's just spotty right now. Dad is buying Native grasses to reseed pastures. All the funds comes out of old family trust money. She's going to crap bricks when Dad wants to inspect house to make sure plumbing was fixed properly.


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Gives me ideas to help my cousin get her place back up to snuff.
> Mainly to give my dad peace of mind. So I can get back to work on barn house on homestead land.
> Nobody right now can work on their places till her's is back up to snuff.
> Went out last weekend cleared out 5 acres of poison ivy,oak, and sumac with Round up, kerosene.
> Before I went got another set of shots for allergies of poison ivy,oak and sumac.
> While working on that got my last piece of fence up and the gate for dad's calves in the spring.
> Marked out where Porkies going ,put lean to shed for firewood up in yard by barn house. It's up by well house.Sprayed more of her poison ivy, oak,and sumac. Finished her goat pen fencing. Put up feed bunker in goat yard, water trough is in too. She's just got to put up Goat gate. Some kind of shed for them. Pruned some of her trees. My brother and nephews cleaned out brush around ponds, cut down horse weeds size of small saplings around metal barn. Her son cleaned out metal barn filled one deep holler with junk. Now we can park Dad's tractor,brush hog,gas powered post hole digger inside metal barn this winter. She was going to leave tractor outside. My dad went ballistic. He offered to buy her outright. It would give enough money to move to city where her kids are. Her kids said yes, she said no.In 60 more days, it won't matter what she wants if her place isn't back to snuff. At least what it was when she moved out there twenty years ago. Going out this weekend to dig up Johnson Grass,put kerosene,Round up on it. Thank God it's just spotty right now. Dad is buying Native grasses to reseed pastures. All the funds comes out of old family trust money. She's going to crap bricks when Dad wants to inspect house to make sure plumbing was fixed properly.


I am grateful we don't have poison ivy/sumac around here, or any noxious weed, although I heard reports of Giant Hogweed in isolated spots, which are aggressively eradicated, as that stuff can cause serious burns. 

I feel so bad for Bobby (mini) as I am forced to leave him outside in the elements all winter. Not the way to treat my most precious piece of machinery...lol
Sounds like quite the effort to clear 5 acres! It was so dry this year, I never had to mow all summer...I will have to do one mow in fall, and that is that...
Well, fingers crossed you get the family issues resolved and the 'barn' becomes your homestead. So looking forward to pics...


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> I am grateful we don't have poison ivy/sumac around here, or any noxious weed, although I heard reports of Giant Hogweed in isolated spots, which are aggressively eradicated, as that stuff can cause serious burns.
> 
> I feel so bad for Bobby (mini) as I am forced to leave him outside in the elements all winter. Not the way to treat my most precious piece of machinery...lol
> Sounds like quite the effort to clear 5 acres! It was so dry this year, I never had to mow all summer...I will have to do one mow in fall, and that is that...
> Well, fingers crossed you get the family issues resolved and the 'barn' becomes your homestead. So looking forward to pics...


But you don't neglect your place.
Her 5 acres you can't see for sapling size horse weeds.
Horse weeds are as tall as metal barn.
Road eroded away sheer drop off.
Cousins, went in there took pictures of the road.
Brother went to fish at main pond, couldn't find it.
Because of the brush,horse weeds. So now all the cousins have to
work for nothing trying to bring her 5 acres back to what it was when she moved out there.
Not fair to any of the nine cousins to bring her 5 acres back to what it was.
That's time I can't spend with my grand daughter.


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> But you don't neglect your place.
> Her 5 acres you can't see for sapling size horse weeds.
> Horse weeds are as tall as metal barn.
> Road eroded away sheer drop off.
> Cousins, went in there took pictures of the road.
> Brother went to fish at main pond, couldn't find it.
> Because of the brush,horse weeds. So now all the cousins have to
> work for nothing trying to bring her 5 acres back to what it was when she moved out there.
> Not fair to any of the nine cousins to bring her 5 acres back to what it was.
> That's time I can't spend with my grand daughter.


Funny and sad when your brother can't find pond....sounds like she let it go.


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## melli

A few days of no roof work really paid off. I felt motivated today, and fast. Got the rest of sheathing done! Just have to patiently wait for underlay;








And my ladder to get off roof...not pretty but it works, and I'll likely leave it on til the metal roof comes. 
Glad I could make it stout enough to handle not sitting on underlay. 








I was chatting with BI about causes in which he fails inspections. It is foreign to me I said . Actually, I did fail an inspection long ago by a person who should never have been an inspector. She had issues (long story). Not the place to bash a retired person, but my oh my, I wanted to march down to city hall and go ballistic. It is probably why the BI likes to note on occasion, that I have a scary side....lol. Some bureaucrats have a power tripping complex or an inability to say yes. Some Building Inspectors of old felt it was their duty to fail you just because...thankfully, those folks have been weeded out. 

Turns out, a house recently failed inspection because water was dripping through roof (just underlay on like mine), and through insulation (which is what was being inspected). Apparently, some builders don't give a bleep about being careful. How one screws up laying underlay is beyond me. Pretty simple to install correctly, but if you do no prep work, like pound proud nails, remove slivers, etc., you will get a leak, guaranteed (if you leave underlay exposed for a period of time). Worse, trying to find and fix it can be a nightmare, especially if you have stuffed rafters with insulation. I take a sander to all seams, and along with a hammer, pound proud nails. It is easy, and not that taxing. 

Baffles me why care is not taken...once water gets under underlay, it will take forever to dry, if at all. 
I use 40-60 grit sandpaper in an orbital or belt sander...I'm just running it over nails lines, and a proud nail will shine because I sanded/scuffed it...I pound it down and move on. I also take sander to edges to take the sharp edge away. We are talking about a 30-45 min job for whole roof. The sander will also dislodge slivers...
Then fire up blower and blow off debris. Done!

Not sure if I showed this detail of the 'Titanium' underlay I am using, and the double sided top seam. It is the one thing that beats all other underlays I have used. When I put on next course, I lift up the white release tape that says 'remove' while removing course above release tape. It really seals the horizontal seam, and that seam seals to plywood (sticky as snot). No way ice damming can occur or wind drive rain getting past that. 








That black strip is very sticky!


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## melli

Being off the beaten path, well out in the sticks, has an appeal, but being within 20 minutes of a gravel pit is a must for me. I have a serious deficiency in dirt. I drool over folks in SE who are sitting on meters of dirt...lol
My west coast property is just a big rock. And being relatively new in geology time scale, not a lot of weathering to create dirt. I had tiny pockets of dirt from when last glacial event left, but no topsoil to speak of...didn't help I picked the top of a hill. Well, today, I got another 3 loads of fill. Mostly for bunker, and a bit for driveway entrance landscaping. 








Other than paying $150/load, plus $100 delivery, I do like it is uniform (this particular stuff is washed 'sand'). Not beach sand, more of crusher sand so it packs real well. The carport needs a bit more, and along both side of bunker to cover skirting. This stuff drains really well. 

This is Bobby showing off...I swear it was his idea! 









I didn't finish it off, as I just wanted to be able to drive into carport (roof wore me out)...on a rain day, I'll get Bobby to finish it. 
I think I am going to move RV into carport...won't be able to cover all of the RV, but that is ok...the tail end with all the propane burners (stove exhaust, HWT burner, furnace) will stick out. My hope is windstorm shelter...


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Being off the beaten path, well out in the sticks, has an appeal, but being within 20 minutes of a gravel pit is a must for me. I have a serious deficiency in dirt. I drool over folks in SE who are sitting on meters of dirt...lol
> My west coast property is just a big rock. And being relatively new in geology time scale, not a lot of weathering to create dirt. I had tiny pockets of dirt from when last glacial event left, but no topsoil to speak of...didn't help I picked the top of a hill. Well, today, I got another 3 loads of fill. Mostly for bunker, and a bit for driveway entrance landscaping.
> View attachment 62494
> 
> Other than paying $150/load, plus $100 delivery, I do like it is uniform (this particular stuff is washed 'sand'). Not beach sand, more of crusher sand so it packs real well. The carport needs a bit more, and along both side of bunker to cover skirting. This stuff drains really well.
> 
> This is Bobby showing off...I swear it was his idea!
> 
> View attachment 62495
> 
> I didn't finish it off, as I just wanted to be able to drive into carport (roof wore me out)...on a rain day, I'll get Bobby to finish it.
> I think I am going to move RV into carport...won't be able to cover all of the RV, but that is ok...the tail end with all the propane burners (stove exhaust, HWT burner, furnace) will stick out. My hope is windstorm shelter...


Might as well put some of your hard work to use. At least you won't have to worry about heavy snow on the RV roof, and when the monsoon hits it will be a lot quieter.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Might as well put some of your hard work to use. At least you won't have to worry about heavy snow on the RV roof, and when the monsoon hits it will be a lot quieter.


It is the hookup that bugs me...redo above ground septic lines, run another water line...the fiber optic and power are easy. 

This my roof view...










And another construction pic.... 








Such a sight to see the roof done! One thing I failed to appreciate is summer shading with longer overhanging (natural AC)...I see in a few weeks, I'll get sun peeking into 2nd floor (being north of 49, the sun gets real low, even in midday).


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## melli

Love the afternoon glow...








It pains me to see I'm about eye level with top 'bench' of property (can see it through trees)...hmmm. Should have built this bunker up there. Fiddle sticks. So that roof view above would be my 2nd floor view if I built up there....


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## MoBookworm1957

Build the other bunker for your dad. Then use as needed.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> It pains me to see I'm about eye level with top 'bench' of property (can see it through trees)...hmmm. Should have built this bunker up there.


 Roh Ohh.... those darned Could've, Should've, Would'ves ! = lessons learned dept and let go and don't make a Nasty Stew out of it... (/me guilty of doing that a LOT)... 

That Place would be good to put that Turret Tower you had pondered - another project for later down the road... Maybe a Bunkie with a Tower Top. If you make the circle with a 11' diameter that will yield 95 square feet space. I dunno IF your limited by the 100 square foot rule for un-permitted buildings... Here you can build up to 100 square feet without the need for a permit... Maybe toss the idea at your Building Inspector... 2 floor equivalent with a HARD flat roof that you could perch on with a sun lounger or... Melli's Castle Keep ! Oh no, not another Idea ! hehehehe...

Putting the trailer under the carport roof is likely a very good idea even if there are minor inconveniences... just be happy you don't get -35c temps in Winter like I do - THAT complicates a few essentials like water lines etc...

BTW: Handy tool / site for working out Square Footage of a circle & more... making life a tad easier:
https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calc...ce=0&price_unit=foot&last=circle&action=solve


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Build the other bunker for your dad. Then use as needed.


That was sort of the plan. This bunker would eventually be for pa, while mine would be on top. But I overdid this one (more than twice the dollars - probably 3x original estimate). Plus, I burned myself out. I'm sure once I get some mileage between this build I'll perk up some. I hope.
And stating the obvious, I have a ways to go before this one is done. 
This build was supposed to be simple and inexpensive, but I've done nothing inexpensive in this build. There wasn't supposed to be a second floor...lol
Actually, it was supposed to be smaller...but I bumped almost every dimension. 

At any rate, this bunker was supposed to be a launching pad (a real home from which I could build a dream home). I felt I'd feel much more comfortable taking my sweet time from the confines of this bunker. Which sounds very reasonable. Problem is, I cannot stop going 'uber' on this build. I mean, if one builds ICF walls, one doesn't want to put in builder windows, nor skimp on insulation in ceiling or second floor, etc. I put 6" under floor...

Then my insane attention to seismic reinforcement...that crap adds up. I still have to put in an interior 'dummy' wall as it seems ridiculous to start channeling the foam for services...defeats the purpose of ICF in the first place. And I'm using 5/8" ply everywhere, which is unusual (I even over spec'd the rebar for ICF walls). Usually, most builds will use 5/8" or 3/4" for subfloor, and 1/2" everywhere else. My roof is more solid than my 2nd floor, which will invariably lead me to add another layer to second floor to stiffen it up...lol...can't have my roof firmer than a floor! 

Even Dad questioned my splurge on the 'well shack'...said if I didn't go so crazy in building a shed for well mechanicals, I'd have money for bunker. Ha, that ship sailed long ago. I overdid the electrical shed (5yrs old now). My thinking was/is, I hate fixing or rebuilding things. I wanted both sheds to last a lifetime and beyond before needing attention. Heck, I look over my sheds from time to time, seeing if any need tlc, and neither need anything, except a blower to clean off entry pads and cobwebs. That is my kind of maintenance! lol. I was thinking the electrical shed might need some touch up painting, being in a hole, but nothing is needed. Good eave overhang keeps rain off siding...not even water stains on build, and being in dark (winter), the paint hasn't faded. The roof being thick metal will last 50yrs at min (probably a 100). 

I suppose, that this being my place, I can do things the way I want. I am not limited (I refuse to go cheap). Unfortunately, it will cost me dearly. Yet, financially, relative to what other folks pay to have their dream home built, mine is a pittance. With free labor, no 'cost plus' contract, I can go crazy, yet still be a fraction of the cost. 

And as I noted long ago, this 'build' was to be an experiment of sorts...to see if I liked ICF, and to see (once I'm done) if a build like this is suitable for a dream home. How efficient will it be? How quiet, how much energy to heat?


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Roh Ohh.... those darned Could've, Should've, Would'ves ! = lessons learned dept and let go and don't make a Nasty Stew out of it... (/me guilty of doing that a LOT)...
> 
> That Place would be good to put that Turret Tower you had pondered - another project for later down the road... Maybe a Bunkie with a Tower Top. If you make the circle with a 11' diameter that will yield 95 square feet space. I dunno IF your limited by the 100 square foot rule for un-permitted buildings... Here you can build up to 100 square feet without the need for a permit... Maybe toss the idea at your Building Inspector... 2 floor equivalent with a HARD flat roof that you could perch on with a sun lounger or... Melli's Castle Keep ! Oh no, not another Idea ! hehehehe...
> 
> Putting the trailer under the carport roof is likely a very good idea even if there are minor inconveniences... just be happy you don't get -35c temps in Winter like I do - THAT complicates a few essentials like water lines etc...
> 
> BTW: Handy tool / site for working out Square Footage of a circle & more... making life a tad easier:
> https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calc...ce=0&price_unit=foot&last=circle&action=solve


I wouldn't be in a RV in -35C temps! lol
Sucker would freeze solid. Do any folks in your hood live in a RV year-round? 

Yeah, we can build 10sq-m now without a permit, which is a tad over 100sqft (metric system). I need something way bigger though...
Actually, the BI is the least of my worries...I could build a castle and he wouldn't blink. As long as other bureaucrats never see it...out of sight, out of mind.


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## Steve_S

Good Morning Melli, 

Yeah, there are some "Hardies" who do live in winterized campers / RV's but IMO that's nuts around here but sometimes that's the only option at hand for some. I wouldn't do it, not as a long term thing... a weekend or week for hunting or something is one thing but for months on end... nope !

Well Melli, you have your hands full now and I think you have built your Dream Home... so do you really need more space to store more junk you only use occasionally ? That is the real question you should be asking yourself ? Besides, with all the care & attention to detail & getting it right (even if overdone) with the bunker, do you really want to do this again ? Once your in and enjoying the accomplishment and saving money again (rather then hemorrhaging it into a build) you will likely reconsider it anyways. Gonna be one heck of an upgrade from your shack on tires !

Thinking about it though.... You have a heap'o material right on hand too for another build of a different nature & you have Bobby the Wonder Worker ! For the next build / tower or whatever it pops out as, maybe slipforming with the local stone would be a workable solution for that down the road project... With that in mind... as your clearing stone, rocks & boulders, may be a good idea to pile some Stone Cairns (based on sizes of the stone) for use in other projects down the line... so a pile of fist sized stones, a pile of two hand grab rocks, a pile of long / narrow rocks (used in cross bridging) and a pile of larger "base stones" and of course the Big Rocks. Also maybe sorted by hard sharp edge / broken rock VS rounded field stones (which glacial deposits also dump along the way) although I somehow don't think you'd have too many of these as your high in the mountains, most of that get's dump in the valley's and between ridges... I have a lot because I'm on a granite ridge that caught a bunch of them on the edge of the valley below and some huge erratic's in excess to 30 tons.

In either case, sorting & pilling cairns as you do your stuff, makes for good project material for later if you want to build raised beds, landscaping or more construction even.

Gosh Dang It.... here I am injecting more items to ponder in the back of your mind... LOL... I always think about my ongoing projects and the future ones and try to accommodate potentials as I am doing and working things out... Like I have 7 Stone Cairns now and I just came across a massive pile in a natural deposit that was lurking under a bunch of shrubs farther in on my property.... So the idea of using them in Gabion Cages for another project... Gabions can solve many issues and are pretty handy for making retaining walls and more... 

Have a Great & Productive Day ! I'm off to do more plumbing, plastering (ughness I hate mudding) and other tediums...


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## melli

Steve - I have been collecting larger boulders (200-1000 lbs) for terracing work with Bobby. Haven't started a rock pile for smaller hand sized ones yet...I'll definitely be doing stone pathways and the like. 
That sort of fun comes after I've finished build...and your right, I may just call it a day with this build. 
Other than a workshop, I won't need more space. Now, if Pa wants to hang with me, then I may reconsider...lol

RV living is becoming an epidemic out here. That guy down the road I was chatting about, who was renting spots (I am assuming he is charging something), seems to be collecting a lot of RV renters, as the collection of RVs (mostly motorhomes) keeps growing! Becoming an RV park. Not a bad location, as the property has few trees, but it is on an old delta (not so good - ground will get soft over winter).
No idea if guy is supplying water or septic services...
Sounds like the bureaucrats won't step in, as they realize these folks have no place to go...wish they employed some of that reality to the rest of us, who are getting beat up paying through the teeth for the right to build a home. 

I bought some water line (1" muni line they call it), and 4" wyes etc., for redoing my septic line to RV and hooking up bunker to system as RV septic plug-in will feed off same junction. It is looking like I will move RV under carport. One small problem is how to attached a ball hitch to Bobby, as he will move the RV. I need to have hitch side up against bunker so propane end is sticking out and my 'bedroom' is up against the bunker. Only Bobby can move RV into that position.


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## melli

A good day...sunny. Probably last warm one of year...going to brave 65F- water in lake...it feels like 50F.
Got the LVLs (2) 1-3/4" x 9" x ~20' (Laminated Veneer Lumber) header over 'garage door' installed...still have to bang nails and bolts in, but it was the last big pieces of lumber I have to deal with. Also, I have more floor space to work in, with those two LVLs up where they should be and not crowding floor space. And I can think about removing interior scaffolding!

As you can see, I had cut one end to slope with roof rafters. I usually take a scrap piece of lumber (those 1x6s from ICF bracing) and make a template of the slope, then I throw template up (just a piece 4' long) at the sloped end, hold it with clamps, and then measure across (wall-to-wall). I then throw template on LVL, trace and cut. Simple...haha. Well, getting the suckers up there is another matter. Not as heavy as the rafters, thankfully, but those ears on saddles were a pain to get over, so I had to bend the ears slightly to place both LVLs (not supposed to bend them, but I had no choice...).
Hindsight is everything, and I realized I should have put the one vertical 2x10 at high end on last....would have given me room with LVLs....live and learn.

Now, I can infill with studs, and eventually get ply on. Getting those LVLs up makes a big difference in roof and garage door entrance strength. Although, not a load bearing 'half gable', it will add torsional stability to roof (effectively cut the roof length in half), and tie walls together.
I can't say enough about LVLs...they are the wonder bread of beams/headers. Companies make a variety of flavors like parallam, glulam, microllam etc., but their purpose is similar, to fill in for big timber. And they have way better specs than dimensional lumber. These guys were about $4/ft or $80 each. A wee bit more than dimensional lumber of same size, but much stronger and true...I never get a LVL with a crown...dead straight. BI bugs me because I have a LVL fetish. Thinks I should build a 4 post bed with them...lol
The ultimate in sleep protection. Funny enough, I may use one on walk through closet wall, where bed will be up against.


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## melli

I need plywood.


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## oldtruckbbq

Nah, just go with glass panels so you have a better view. JK. I used to work in the glass industry and I know what they charge for heavy tempered glass panels and custom made insulated units. There's a reason they only appear in gazillionaire homes. I know lots of people go with OSB, but I'm a fan of plywood myself.


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## melli

Although it gets dark earlier as the days pass here, I have a solution (cheap fog lamps welded to bumper). I actually like mowing near dark, as I can see the grass better in the lights (tall grass lights up). Anyways, I flip a pic to Pa (texting night as we watch NFL - rain delay), and he responds with his pic. Haha...his grass is a dark green, the benefit of living on a perennial water table about 6-12" below the turf. We had a drought this summer. My grass is anemic, and my pic is showing the best patch of grass I have. He doesn't have to water his yard, *ever*. I watered my yard a couple of times, more for the trees, and it shows (I'd say 50% of my grass died...drought was too long). 
Still, the idea of having water a foot down sounds disturbing...does wonders for grass though. And the idea of never having to water is appealing...never seen anybody in his hood with a water sprinkler or irrigation system (forget about harvesting water in rain barrels...no need). The ditches are running year round (even have fish run up them, and most folks have mini weirs at their driveways to catch them...crazy). If any of you buy Nestle water, it comes from up the hill (he lives beside a lake and a major river behind a glacial terminal moraine is up the hill...the water from mountains and river seep through terminal moraine and supply water year round). Heck, some folks in subdivision have altered their ditches so they run under their houses. Around spawning season, you look down, and pick up a fish for dinner. I've never seen anything like it in my life.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Nah, just go with glass panels so you have a better view. JK. I used to work in the glass industry and I know what they charge for heavy tempered glass panels and custom made insulated units. There's a reason they only appear in gazillionaire homes. I know lots of people go with OSB, but I'm a fan of plywood myself.


OSB will never grace my home...lol
On a builder site, the OSB vs Ply debate raged longer than all the posts in this category. 
The short of it (excuse pun), is they ran out of nice big round logs to make ply, and needed a cheaper solution. In comes the wood chips, mashed and glued together. Don't need big trees. 
On the coast, I only see OSB in cheap tract builds. OSB does lay flat, but when it gets wet, it swells, and acquires a distinctive moldy appearance. There is a joke here, that if you want 5/8" sheeting, buy 1/2" OSB, let it get wet...lol
I'm hoping ply prices come back to earth...it should once the rains start. I'm still kind of mystified, as the US gov slapped on punitive duties for Canadian wood, so there shouldn't be a lot heading south. Maybe not for ply?


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Nah, just go with glass panels so you have a better view. JK. I used to work in the glass industry and I know what they charge for heavy tempered glass panels and custom made insulated units. There's a reason they only appear in gazillionaire homes. I know lots of people go with OSB, but I'm a fan of plywood myself.


Funny enough, I would suggest deck glass (3mm tempered - 32x72 ~ $50) over pickets (better look than pickets) because the price was similar. Of course, not the same as floor to ceiling glass. A neighbor has that in their cube (waterfront place). 100k for glass alone. And structurally, not good. 
I will put glass on my deck, whenever that happens. Being 10' off ground, I'll bump it up to 5mm glass. I frame it in with wood. 
I like being able to lean on railing and set a drink on it.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> OSB will never grace my home...lol
> On a builder site, the OSB vs Ply debate raged longer than all the posts in this category.
> The short of it (excuse pun), is they ran out of nice big round logs to make ply, and needed a cheaper solution. In comes the wood chips, mashed and glued together. Don't need big trees.
> On the coast, I only see OSB in cheap tract builds. OSB does lay flat, but when it gets wet, it swells, and acquires a distinctive moldy appearance. There is a joke here, that if you want 5/8" sheeting, buy 1/2" OSB, let it get wet...lol
> I'm hoping ply prices come back to earth...it should once the rains start. I'm still kind of mystified, as the US gov slapped on punitive duties for Canadian wood, so there shouldn't be a lot heading south. Maybe not for ply?


Most of our plywood comes from managed pine "farms" in the south part of the US, so I doubt we got hurt much unless it is in the norther border states. Georgia Pacific and Weyerhauser own huge tracts of piney woods in Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and Georgia. You can drive through areas in north Louisiana with pine forests on both sides of the road keeping the road in perpetual shade. Then suddenly you will realize that the forest is planted in nice little rows. I've gone deer hunting in Texas on public land that is clear cut Weyerhauser timber land. Once all the useful trees are gone, they come in and plant new seedlings. Until they get tall enough to shade it out, the grasses and weeds come back strong and make good grazing for deer and turkey.

There is OSB out there with "waterproof" binders, but it is still OSB, still prone to chipping and flaking, and you still can't trust a fastener in it. My opinion. I don't like the stuff.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Funny enough, I would suggest deck glass (3mm tempered - 32x72 ~ $50) over pickets (better look than pickets) because the price was similar. Of course, not the same as floor to ceiling glass. A neighbor has that in their cube (waterfront place). 100k for glass alone. And structurally, not good.
> I will put glass on my deck, whenever that happens. Being 10' off ground, I'll bump it up to 5mm glass. I frame it in with wood.
> I like being able to lean on railing and set a drink on it.
> View attachment 62547


We sold 3mm tempered glass for .47/sq. ft., or $7.52 for a 32x72 in 4000 lb racks to door and window manufactures and wholesalers. They obviously have a nice markup! I agree with 5mm, much less prone to accidental breakage. The last place I worked in the glass industry was a custom fabricator. We did a lot of 10, 12, and 14mm glass for shower enclosures, store fronts, entry doors, commercial building stairwells. We had some high speed equipment to bevel and polish the edges and CNC milling machines to cut holes and notches for door hardware. Then we tempered it in one of 3 tempering furnaces. High dollar stuff.


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> Funny and sad when your brother can't find pond....sounds like she let it go.


She's overwhelmed. Bit off more than she could chew. As for my brother, well we each a a map where things are supposed to be.But with everything overgrown, he about landed in the pond instead of the road to the pond.


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## Steve_S

You would think prices would have dropped with a surplus up here but Ohh Nooo.... about a month ago, I had to buy 3 sheets of 1/2" OSB (yes, I use it for several things, not everything though) now earlier this year, they cost $11 a month ago $17 and 3/4" Ply has jumped to almost $80 a sheet... The excuse ? Because of the BC Forest Fires ! and as I look at the stamps on the Ply & OSB - Manufactured in Maniwaki Quebec !!! that's like 200kms from me.... DERP... 

Sure OSB has it's issues and quirks, heck so does Plywood if you mess up, it swells and delaminates too but not as quick as OSB... Seems to me they changed their glue formulation for standard ply... probably some health & safety something or other I'm sure... You know that LVL's essentially are the same thing with the glues but using the long strand fibre versus the random pressed fibre (scraps from processing logs). Have to say it too... OSB at least uses up scraps that would otherwise be waste fill or something else. Interesting note, some neighbours, a couple of miles away in their late 70's are most productive homesteaders and they have rabbit sheds, chicken hotels (seriously deluxe, they have too much time to furtle on things LOL) and wood sheds and 90% is using OSB and these are really very well built too IMO BUT the Mrs immediately stains & seals the walls as soon as they are up and they hold up quite well... The chicken Hotel is about 10 years old, on the edge of bush with high shade (more dampness) and not a sign of swelling or deterioration at all... tiz also about 16" off the ground and good eaves to keep water splash-back to a minimum. 

While Maligning OSB here... I'd like to point out another product that addresses that Malignition ! It's called BluWood and is also available in the States - this deals with the usual OSB issues but far more too and the price difference is negligible. Not just OSB but regular Ply & lumber can be BluWood and with the fungicidal / insecticidal properties can be a big saver on a home build in damp wet areas or areas subject to house eating critters.
REF: http://www.bluwoodcanada.com/index.html

I will be using Mag-O http://magobp.ca/benefits/ which is $45 for a 4x8 sheet as the base for my kitchen counter tops to lay the tile on. The old days I would have used 3/4" Ply but to heck with that nowadays when Mag-O is available and so much cheaper too, even used this behind my woodstove, because of the way I built things it's over the Drywall but it could have simply replaced the drywall at the stove area and finished off to blend in, still need a shield per code but still.

There is apparently a couple of companies gearing up to make LVL & More with Hemp Fibre and testing has been done to show it's superior to everything else due to the nature of the Long Strand Fibre... now that would be the ultimate Green Tech solution for renewable (it's fast growing) use of the fibre, which still leaves the seed and oils for cosmetics and more...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> You would think prices would have dropped with a surplus up here but Ohh Nooo.... about a month ago, I had to buy 3 sheets of 1/2" OSB (yes, I use it for several things, not everything though) now earlier this year, they cost $11 a month ago $17 and 3/4" Ply has jumped to almost $80 a sheet... The excuse ? Because of the BC Forest Fires ! and as I look at the stamps on the Ply & OSB - Manufactured in Maniwaki Quebec !!! that's like 200kms from me.... DERP...
> 
> Sure OSB has it's issues and quirks, heck so does Plywood if you mess up, it swells and delaminates too but not as quick as OSB... Seems to me they changed their glue formulation for standard ply... probably some health & safety something or other I'm sure... You know that LVL's essentially are the same thing with the glues but using the long strand fibre versus the random pressed fibre (scraps from processing logs). Have to say it too... OSB at least uses up scraps that would otherwise be waste fill or something else. Interesting note, some neighbours, a couple of miles away in their late 70's are most productive homesteaders and they have rabbit sheds, chicken hotels (seriously deluxe, they have too much time to furtle on things LOL) and wood sheds and 90% is using OSB and these are really very well built too IMO BUT the Mrs immediately stains & seals the walls as soon as they are up and they hold up quite well... The chicken Hotel is about 10 years old, on the edge of bush with high shade (more dampness) and not a sign of swelling or deterioration at all... tiz also about 16" off the ground and good eaves to keep water splash-back to a minimum.
> 
> While Maligning OSB here... I'd like to point out another product that addresses that Malignition ! It's called BluWood and is also available in the States - this deals with the usual OSB issues but far more too and the price difference is negligible. Not just OSB but regular Ply & lumber can be BluWood and with the fungicidal / insecticidal properties can be a big saver on a home build in damp wet areas or areas subject to house eating critters.
> REF: http://www.bluwoodcanada.com/index.html
> 
> I will be using Mag-O http://magobp.ca/benefits/ which is $45 for a 4x8 sheet as the base for my kitchen counter tops to lay the tile on. The old days I would have used 3/4" Ply but to heck with that nowadays when Mag-O is available and so much cheaper too, even used this behind my woodstove, because of the way I built things it's over the Drywall but it could have simply replaced the drywall at the stove area and finished off to blend in, still need a shield per code but still.
> 
> There is apparently a couple of companies gearing up to make LVL & More with Hemp Fibre and testing has been done to show it's superior to everything else due to the nature of the Long Strand Fibre... now that would be the ultimate Green Tech solution for renewable (it's fast growing) use of the fibre, which still leaves the seed and oils for cosmetics and more...


You know, for some reason bluwood has not caught on here...I have no idea why. I know we don't have the bugs you folks have back east, but we have the mold and fungus issues in spades. Very odd we haven't adopted it out here. Now, we do use pressure treated wood with abandon out here, but mainly for outdoor structures like decks. 
I was curious what they put in bluwood, so I looked up the MSDS on bluwood. 

http://www.conradfp.com/pdf/MSDS_Bluwood.pdf
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disodium_octaborate_tetrahydrate

Seems one can make a solution and spray it on their lumber...

https://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?233066-Home-made-bora-care-amp-timbor

Mag-O looks very interesting...I use Backer Board (concrete board). Will have to look into it. 

OSB lover! 
I looked up tech specs of both OSB and Ply a couple of years ago during my participation in the 'debate', and they are almost identical in structural attributes (shear, tension, nail pull out, etc). Yeah, OSB might use wood that would otherwise go to waste, but I suspect OSB uses a lot more glue. Probably a draw in terms of eco friendly. 
And if one throws on a sealer and stain, any wood will be preserved. I just know from my experience (albeit, a long time ago), and what we use out here in builds, that OSB has to be covered up quickly. It can't handle many rain cycles. I've seen builds with ply go through a winter (months of rain), and still be dimensionally stable and with minimal discoloration (mold). 
I might diss OSB, but I don't begrudge anyone who uses it, as it is way cheaper than ply right now. Ply is priced silly right now. 
It is why my build isn't sheathed right now. I used to not care if I roasted a piece of ply, but now I handle them like gold..lol

Yeah, LVLs are essentially thick chunks of plywood. And they are coated well, to resist mold (more so than ply). 
I would have to agree if they can come up with a longer fiber 'wood' product = stronger.


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## Steve_S

By the By Melli, I probably laid 50,000 square feet of Ceramic Flooring, wall tiles and ceramic fireplaces, used heaps of cement backer board as a necessity... never again, got turned onto Mag-O and considering it's 1/2 the price, more heat resistant, waterproof and more PLUS much more environment friendly... what can I say, it is the Cat's Meow ! Only PITA, cutting it and always wear a dust mask when doing so, carbide blades will last and no rushing the cut either, let saw do the work.

Lowes carries BluWood, I'd check to see if they carry it in BC as well... the mold, fungus and bug unfriendliness is a win in a rainforest.


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## melli

I switched gears today...literally. When it is cooler or raining, I prefer hopping into Bobby. And with 4 loads of fill being an eyesore, I knocked them down. Got pretty much the whole build 'planted'. Just a small 12ft section I left undone because I have to hook up bunker septic to main line, and make a cleanout (just a nub sticking out of ground I can use for snaking line or attach a RV to) for RV, if I move it. I had to dig by hand to find the septic line running under bunker!  Bloody thing was buried. For some reason I thought it was a foot deep, tops. I do caution tape ALL lines, as I have lots buried, and it is nice to hit the tape with Bobby, than to hit a line with Bobby. The one downside with machine dug trenches, if one can call it a downside, is getting depth isn't an issue, and coupled with my paranoia I bury things. But when it comes time to access them, one has to eventually step out of machine to hand dig. I was doubting the caution tape (a foot down), as I kept digging and digging...lol 

BI is looking into his magic bag to see if he can come up with some 1" muni water line. That would be sweet. I can return what I bought and get more ply! 

Still trying to figure out how I can attach a hitch to Bobby to move RV? I don't want to drill a massive hole into a bucket...

















I had to run outside to throw a level on the posts! Pics make them look way off...thankfully, the camera sucks (perfectly plumb).


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## melli

Black pipe (orange cap) to white pipe...
Going to be an icky job...it's all me. 
Think I'll get roof underlay tomorrow and do that...


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## Steve_S

*A Solution for Bobby and the Trailer *

https://www.palletforks.com/skid-steer-attachments/trailer-moving/clamp-on-trailer-bucket-hitch.html Read the reviews and seems a wee bit of modding may be needed ** They have some pretty nifty attachments for Skid steers, worth a good perusal anyways... 

On E-Bay too.... http://www.ebay.com/bhp/skid-steer-hitch





DIY version, seems to have included the mods suggested for the above commercial version.

Princess Auto TO THE RESCUE with a Canadian Version !
https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/600-lb-clamp-on-trailer-hitch/A-p8551087e
_The manufacturer : _http://infocusmfg.com/portfolio/clamp-on-trailer-hitch/
Awfully Pricey - surprisingly from Princess.... 

You could probably get a local Welder to whip one up too but you'd still need to get a Reese Hitch Receiver box, maybe an old wreck somewhere that you could scavenge ? In any case, prevents you from having to do harm to precious Bobby and let you wiggle your turtle shell around some to where you need it.

I would strongly suggest if you go with making up something like this, is to use a proper receiver, simply because today, you wanna wiggle & shift your trailer but next week there maybe something else that needs shifting and you'd have the option of switching if you need to change ball, or slide in a hook, or wagon clasp (like for farm wagons) etc... flexibility.

On Pipe Connections:
OK a wee bit of a difference on location, not entirely sure what your thinking on here... Gee, now I am remembering that Tunnelling Project that started on 2 sides of a mountain and were supposed to meet in the middle and they missed by a couple of hundred yards... This looks like Drain Waste Pipe. IF this is a temp hookup that you want to connect, maybe using a Rubber Coupler designed for this purpose would be easiest.. you'll just have to make up the turns to connect - avoid 45's if possible and stick with 22-1/2 degree bends, reduce the potential for blockages... just my opinion... 
Coupling Similar to This (various sizes available) : https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.flexible-coupling-4-x-3.1000120020.html
Then you don't have to glue up anything and making it easier later when you have to disconnect to change things around again.


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> *A Solution for Bobby and the Trailer *
> 
> https://www.palletforks.com/skid-steer-attachments/trailer-moving/clamp-on-trailer-bucket-hitch.html Read the reviews and seems a wee bit of modding may be needed ** They have some pretty nifty attachments for Skid steers, worth a good perusal anyways...
> 
> On E-Bay too.... http://www.ebay.com/bhp/skid-steer-hitch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DIY version, seems to have included the mods suggested for the above commercial version.
> 
> Princess Auto TO THE RESCUE with a Canadian Version !
> https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/600-lb-clamp-on-trailer-hitch/A-p8551087e
> _The manufacturer : _http://infocusmfg.com/portfolio/clamp-on-trailer-hitch/
> Awfully Pricey - surprisingly from Princess....
> 
> You could probably get a local Welder to whip one up too but you'd still need to get a Reese Hitch Receiver box, maybe an old wreck somewhere that you could scavenge ? In any case, prevents you from having to do harm to precious Bobby and let you wiggle your turtle shell around some to where you need it.
> 
> I would strongly suggest if you go with making up something like this, is to use a proper receiver, simply because today, you wanna wiggle & shift your trailer but next week there maybe something else that needs shifting and you'd have the option of switching if you need to change ball, or slide in a hook, or wagon clasp (like for farm wagons) etc... flexibility.
> 
> On Pipe Connections:
> OK a wee bit of a difference on location, not entirely sure what your thinking on here... Gee, now I am remembering that Tunnelling Project that started on 2 sides of a mountain and were supposed to meet in the middle and they missed by a couple of hundred yards... This looks like Drain Waste Pipe. IF this is a temp hookup that you want to connect, maybe using a Rubber Coupler designed for this purpose would be easiest.. you'll just have to make up the turns to connect - avoid 45's if possible and stick with 22-1/2 degree bends, reduce the potential for blockages... just my opinion...
> Coupling Similar to This (various sizes available) : https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.flexible-coupling-4-x-3.1000120020.html
> Then you don't have to glue up anything and making it easier later when you have to disconnect to change things around again.


Yep, that hitch adapter for buckets is exactly what I need!...just the price isn't...lol
Doesn't appear Titan ships to Canada, Ebay listing doesn't, and I do love Princess Auto, but $200 is not in the cards for a hitch adapter.
I have a couple of hitch draw bars...maybe I can drill two holes in bar, instead of bucket, and take one tooth off bucket, using those holes....worried about strain though. Actually, that won't work...bucket will be in wrong position.
Maybe plan B - weld the draw bar to top of bucket. Heck, if I had some square stock, I could weld a chunk to top of bucket, and just slide draw bar in....

BTW - thanks for your suggestions!


----------



## melli

Spinning low pressure system doesn't want to leave us, so no roof work today, and I wanted something easy to do...lol
I always do it to myself...no help needed. How hard could it be to connect up Bunker to septic line. Be done in an hour, and chill for rest of day. Well, it started to rain, and I'm in a muddy hole. I pull off that orange cap, and it seems it was working after all, as if the hole wasn't muddy enough, about 5 gallons more water drained into it (way back I noted those flimsy orange caps for testing are crap...mine were leaking). Hmmm...

Doing this kind of hookup kind of sucks, because you have to be exact. I can't move the black (ABS), nor white (PVC), so everything has to be measured and remeasured. The fernco fitting (trade name for black rubber boot - flexible coupling) allows a bit of play. I should have put another fernco fitting on ABS pipe, but I like to live dangerously...rolleyes. It just made it more difficult as I slipped around in that hole, having to re-clean the fittings a hundred times before I glued them.

But, as always, relieved it is done, and I can fill the hole in and move on. I now have the bunker hooked up and a spot to plug in RV...

(note: had to use two different glues - PVC glue (grey) and primer (purple) for white pipe, and ABS-PVC transition coupling glue (white). I hear in the states, you can use PVC all around, but up here, we have to use ABS in house all-around to a point 6' outside building - ABS is ridiculously expensive! However, it is sledgehammer proof...I now this because I took a sledgehammer to a fitting because I accidentally glued a fitting on wrong side of another fitting...I couldn't break it! I suppose you could crack a pipe easy enough with a sledge, but those fittings are tough *insert swear word*.)










That white pipe (PVC) running deeper than the others, I installed a couple years ago...it goes under building to about 20-30' past. I put it there for my dream home up on top. Well, time passed, and I got an RV, so I tapped into it on other side of bunker...really handy that I did that. I could carry it on further, not only for dream home, but other places on property, like workshop. With bunker firmly planted, it would be tough to trench beyond it now (bedrock is shallow at carport entrance). I am a firm believer in planning for possibilities. A few pages back, I did a quick blurb on another PVC pipe I installed under bunker for RV electrical cord...that will be handy for other things, like low voltage yard lights, irrigation, etc...

Oh yeah, after that job, I did not pass GO, I went straight into shower....lol
I need to flush that main line...


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> *A Solution for Bobby and the Trailer *
> 
> https://www.palletforks.com/skid-steer-attachments/trailer-moving/clamp-on-trailer-bucket-hitch.html Read the reviews and seems a wee bit of modding may be needed ** They have some pretty nifty attachments for Skid steers, worth a good perusal anyways...
> 
> On E-Bay too.... http://www.ebay.com/bhp/skid-steer-hitch
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DIY version, seems to have included the mods suggested for the above commercial version.
> 
> Princess Auto TO THE RESCUE with a Canadian Version !
> https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/600-lb-clamp-on-trailer-hitch/A-p8551087e
> _The manufacturer : _http://infocusmfg.com/portfolio/clamp-on-trailer-hitch/
> Awfully Pricey - surprisingly from Princess....
> 
> You could probably get a local Welder to whip one up too but you'd still need to get a Reese Hitch Receiver box, maybe an old wreck somewhere that you could scavenge ? In any case, prevents you from having to do harm to precious Bobby and let you wiggle your turtle shell around some to where you need it.
> 
> I would strongly suggest if you go with making up something like this, is to use a proper receiver, simply because today, you wanna wiggle & shift your trailer but next week there maybe something else that needs shifting and you'd have the option of switching if you need to change ball, or slide in a hook, or wagon clasp (like for farm wagons) etc... flexibility.
> 
> On Pipe Connections:
> OK a wee bit of a difference on location, not entirely sure what your thinking on here... Gee, now I am remembering that Tunnelling Project that started on 2 sides of a mountain and were supposed to meet in the middle and they missed by a couple of hundred yards... This looks like Drain Waste Pipe. IF this is a temp hookup that you want to connect, maybe using a Rubber Coupler designed for this purpose would be easiest.. you'll just have to make up the turns to connect - avoid 45's if possible and stick with 22-1/2 degree bends, reduce the potential for blockages... just my opinion...
> Coupling Similar to This (various sizes available) : https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.flexible-coupling-4-x-3.1000120020.html
> Then you don't have to glue up anything and making it easier later when you have to disconnect to change things around again.


Darn, forgot to drop by welder and see if he had some scrap box steel tubing around. A little hunk of metal on top of a bucket doesn't hinder it at all...I had two hooks on top of buckets (lost one) for attaching chain. 
With respect to Fernco fitting...yep, installed. No choice, as one cannot tap into a line without one.


----------



## melli

Sun tomorrow!

Don't look at 'grass'...lol
I'll be planting cactus next year. While my soil is crap, the summer literally baked everything away. I'll try to remember how it was...









Pics are from near same spot, just in opposite directions. That cedar tree closet to camera is in both pics. You wouldn't know it.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

You would be surprised how much of that grass will come back with some good rain. We experienced frequent periods of drought in Texas, and some years I would water like crazy to keep the grass from dying out, but still couldn't get enough water on it to get it to grow. Imagine watering nearly every day and not having to cut it for almost 2 months. All I had to do was use the weedeater around the shaded side of the house where the grass would actually grow. Hopefully your park will come back.


----------



## Steve_S

melli said:


> Darn, forgot to drop by welder and see if he had some scrap box steel tubing around. A little hunk of metal on top of a bucket doesn't hinder it at all...I had two hooks on top of buckets (lost one) for attaching chain.


As you have the welder etc... I would be consider making the DIY version in the video but with a longer bottom tube and make it as a receiver so you can change attachments as opposed to just a ball... You could swap in a Tow Hook, or even an Electric Winch on a plate that slips into a receiver and more... giving you the potential for different options for things you encounter along the way. As for the long tube that goes under the bucket, the stressing potential could be high depending on what your furtling with, maybe even a small gusset underneath to reinforce the square tube to prevent fold / shifting... but I suppose that could be overcome with thicker tube stock to some extent.

Point is, you can never have enough tools for tasks at hand and tasks yet defined ;-) and having options & different ways to tackle problems in various circumstances is always a good idea. Today, you want to move your Turtle Shell... tomorrow you may need a tow hook to extract something from somewhere you can get bobby down into, another day, you may have to winch something out of a precarious place or tough spot... may have to winch Bobby out of a hole and you need that "little bit of extra pull to get out"... 

Surprised at Princess charging $180 for that while the US made product is like $60 and why it won't ship to Canada ? *** is up with that ? 

I dunno but this X-Border stuff is getting crazy... I need a part for my On Demand water heater... the part is made in Burlington Ontario, cannot buy it in Canada ! Have to order it from the States and have it shipped up here & PAY Duty & Taxes on a Canadian Made product because some shmuck in the US adds a flange and calls it "Assembled in USA" and now country of origin is... Maximum Derpage and I am getting quite PO'd at it all... seriously, how much more stupid can it get.... This is not the first thing this has happened with either... like my Gas Venting system for the Takagi heater (radiant floor) which is IPEX System 636 PVC, made in Montreal.... can buy from USA for $60 but NOT in Canada ! Ohh No ! I could gas myself so I have to go through a heating installer and my cost $150 ! Grmbl... BUT some of the parts are available at Homedepot or Lowes in Canada BUT NOT THE END CAPS.... and they are only available in "the complete kit". 

I'm glad I am on the final stretch of this race and can see the finish line approaching "just over there"... quick, hand me the Gatorade I need another boost !


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> You would be surprised how much of that grass will come back with some good rain. We experienced frequent periods of drought in Texas, and some years I would water like crazy to keep the grass from dying out, but still couldn't get enough water on it to get it to grow. Imagine watering nearly every day and not having to cut it for almost 2 months. All I had to do was use the weedeater around the shaded side of the house where the grass would actually grow. Hopefully your park will come back.


This was the first year in which I really needed to only mow twice, once in late spring, and once in fall (late October). 
It was a burn fest...I have spots where the grass just disappeared leaving dirt behind. Nothing is coming back in the dirt areas. I see some that didn't blow away coming back. I can't get upset over it, as I never watered most areas. I need to get an irrigation system installed (I installed one head last year). Not so much to keep a year round dark green, but to keep it from dying. It seems 4 mths without one downpour is just too much for grass. A light brown seems ok, but a dark brown-black is death. 
Also, I was too busy to care, and like you, I pulled out the weedwhacker once...
Even the weeds had a tough go. 
We are definitely are in uncharted territory as far as climate goes. We never had this sort of summer weather. I recall summers where they never really came, as it rained every 3-4 days (cool). The most we'd get is 6-8wks of sunny days. But this year...wow. Not surprising we had the worst forest fire season ever, in interior. They are still burning, but the cooler temps have put a lid on the fires. 
This pic says it all...I'm on coast, and you can see the glacier topped coast mountain range, but on interior side, massive devastation. All those brown spots are burnt forest and even the glaciers on interior side are brown from falling ash. 100's of miles of burnt forest. Well, they won't have that problem next year...nothing left to burn. 









I see some fires still burning in top of pic...


----------



## melli

Took tarp off roof...a couple of sunny days ahead. I want to let roof ply get as dry as possible so I left the finishing of underlay for tomorrow. 

So, I went after that garage door gable. Was a hassle getting the LVL bolted...just awkward getting up there, and for some reason, 'user error' in getting the drill bit to go straight through (2 out of 4...not a good batting average for a thin beam). Kind of ruined the day in terms of moving things along. After a nap, I tackled the gable studs. Now that is tedious, as each one has to be measured with a level. When doing layout of where the studs go, I do so with a sheet of ply in mind. We all know, to do in 16" center-to-center (or 12"/24") so a 8' sheet of ply will land on the center of a stud. But in my case, the ply will start from edge of wood pony wall and wrap around carport beam, cover rafter up top and beam over garage doors (tie everything together). So, the first tall stud is close to pony wall. Cutting that sheet of ply will be fun, but I do feel it is worth it, as your ply is really what keeps a house from torquing, creaking or swaying in a windstorm (if done right). 









Camera is making everything look off plumb...


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Pretty stark photo. Yeah, brown grass can come back, but bare dirt, not so much, lol. I'm going to have to burn some piles on our property, but it is going to take a lot of prep work first. The area has been untouched and unused by humans for anything besides hunting for probably 50 years. There is a several inch layer of leaves over almost the entire property, and more getting ready to be added to it. I'm taking a roll of welded wired fence out with me my next trip to start a couple compost piles, but no way I can use all the leaves, lol. I will have to clear a pretty good area around each burn pile so I don't catch the whole woods on fire. I've got time though, because it will take a few months until the stuff I'm clearing out is dry enough to burn. We have been having strange weather here as well. Mild winter, then torrential rains that caused all the recreation areas at the local lakes to be closed during the Memorial day through July 4 holiday because they were under 40' of water. Even had to replace a road at one of the lakes because the 7' of water flowing over the emergency spillway took the road down to bedrock. Then in mid September we had over a week of mid to upper 90 temps. Strange times indeed. Hope your grass fares better next season.


----------



## Steve_S

@oldtruckbbq A suggestion for "Burn Pile" materials, I realize that full on clearing like your doing will generate a lot of slash to burn but consider looking around your property where you could create Berms, with a small trench, you can line up & bury quite a bit with a little layer of dirt between layers of branches etc... That will create a sort of privacy screen, decompose slowly and provide moisture & fertilizer for things you may be able to plant there... a variation on HugeKultur REF: https://richsoil.com/hugelkultur/ and you may consider it for your actual garden space too, as it does take a bit before it's ready for food production too... This can help with rain water management and drought proofing as well, might be something to consider now as you are coming up with the appropriate materials for it... These work great for Fruit Trees too which may be something else to consider. PS: Lookup "walipini" quick Ref: https://permaculturenews.org/2016/11/28/walipini-greenhouses-diy-tips/ which ties in well with HugeKultur as well... A Walipini that incorporates 6" Earth Tubes (using 6" corrugated O-Pipe [unperforated]) 4'+ deep & 50-100' long can really extend season in spring/fall and help cool in summer too, driven by small 12V Box Fans (can be solar powered for slow moving air only). Roh Oh, a ponderance... 

@melli your doing good and I love the fact you took an anti-stress nap... geez, get outta my head, sometimes I hafta do that too... when I reach overload mode. Unfortunately I have logistics issues doing so for now. Years ago I had a drill which had a Level Bubble molded into the top, made drilling holes so much easier.. that was stolen along with most of my other tools and when I went to buy new tools, I found no companies do that anymore :-( ... too bad, was a good idea IMO.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Pretty stark photo. Yeah, brown grass can come back, but bare dirt, not so much, lol. I'm going to have to burn some piles on our property, but it is going to take a lot of prep work first. The area has been untouched and unused by humans for anything besides hunting for probably 50 years. There is a several inch layer of leaves over almost the entire property, and more getting ready to be added to it. I'm taking a roll of welded wired fence out with me my next trip to start a couple compost piles, but no way I can use all the leaves, lol. I will have to clear a pretty good area around each burn pile so I don't catch the whole woods on fire. I've got time though, because it will take a few months until the stuff I'm clearing out is dry enough to burn. We have been having strange weather here as well. Mild winter, then torrential rains that caused all the recreation areas at the local lakes to be closed during the Memorial day through July 4 holiday because they were under 40' of water. Even had to replace a road at one of the lakes because the 7' of water flowing over the emergency spillway took the road down to bedrock. Then in mid September we had over a week of mid to upper 90 temps. Strange times indeed. Hope your grass fares better next season.


Yeah, it has been strange times indeed. We are getting single digit temps (4C - about 40F) at night now...brrr. Take some time to get used to that. Although, everybody else up in Canada will be getting a whole lot colder...lol

I heard about your warm weather as of late, and the summer deluges (NASA loves to take sat pics of natural disasters). 
I do machine burn piles now, and in BC, there is a weather service for slash burning...lol. Rather interesting, as it tells us if the weather is appropriate to burn stuff. Here is my province's daily report: http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/epd/epdpa/venting/venting.html
Basically, the deal is to have your burn go straight up and mix on high. They call it ventilation index (Poor-Fair-Good). I follow it, as smoking out the hood is not cool. Weekend warriors never use it, plus they seem to like burning wet material (smudge burn), that coats the hood in smoke, sometimes for days. I guess because our province is mostly forest, the forest industry uses the forecast for burning their monster slash piles (25ft tall and wide piles). There is a guy whose job is to burn these monster piles...speaking of which, a massive cutblock near me has several hundred of these slash piles. That is going to suck, as invariably we get smoked out and ash snow. But with the hot summer, hopefully the slash piles will go up quick (they are well dried out). 

Your doing hand piles and it sounds like your in the 'sticks' so you don't have to worry about neighbors. I'll admit, I am surprised at how they do these massive burns without worrying about lighting the hood on fire. Seems in winter, everything is wet, and fires just don't spread. They light them up and go home at night, leaving fire to burn all night and the days to come. I'll see the hood glow at night for weeks as the fires light up the clouds at night. I should take a pic of these 'slash field piles'. Very impressive seeing all these massive piles. Sort of sad they resort to burning them, but I suspect they do it to limit forest fuel in summer, and make tree planting easier. 

I think if your ground is moist/damp, do it mid-winter, and you have a buffer (I think here it is recommended a 100ft buffer with machine piles, but with hand piles, 20ft should be plenty), you should have no worries about lighting your property on fire. Heck, my BI friend is a firebug, and he lights slash piles with minimal buffers, then goes home...he never worries about them spreading. The only areas we have problems with is peaty areas, as the fire can go underground.


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> @melli your doing good and I love the fact you took an anti-stress nap... geez, get outta my head, sometimes I hafta do that too... when I reach overload mode. Unfortunately I have logistics issues doing so for now. Years ago I had a drill which had a Level Bubble molded into the top, made drilling holes so much easier.. that was stolen along with most of my other tools and when I went to buy new tools, I found no companies do that anymore :-( ... too bad, was a good idea IMO.


Anti-stress nap? Ha, I was exhausted...I seem to sleep for 5-6hrs, which doesn't seem to cut it. 
I remember those tools with bubble on top...usually, I am not too bad eyeballing it...drilled enough holes. 

OT - I saw a cute movie, called "Captain Fantastic"...part survivalist, part homesteading...great movie as it reminded me of us. I'll admit the first part of movie is not for me, but the very last scene strikes a nice balance. I can't give up too many details, but it is a decent movie...I wasn't expecting much, but it delivered.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> @oldtruckbbq A suggestion for "Burn Pile" materials, I realize that full on clearing like your doing will generate a lot of slash to burn but consider looking around your property where you could create Berms, with a small trench, you can line up & bury quite a bit with a little layer of dirt between layers of branches etc... That will create a sort of privacy screen, decompose slowly and provide moisture & fertilizer for things you may be able to plant there... a variation on HugeKultur REF: https://richsoil.com/hugelkultur/ and you may consider it for your actual garden space too, as it does take a bit before it's ready for food production too... This can help with rain water management and drought proofing as well, might be something to consider now as you are coming up with the appropriate materials for it... These work great for Fruit Trees too which may be something else to consider. PS: Lookup "walipini" quick Ref: https://permaculturenews.org/2016/11/28/walipini-greenhouses-diy-tips/ which ties in well with HugeKultur as well... A Walipini that incorporates 6" Earth Tubes (using 6" corrugated O-Pipe [unperforated]) 4'+ deep & 50-100' long can really extend season in spring/fall and help cool in summer too, driven by small 12V Box Fans (can be solar powered for slow moving air only). Roh Oh, a ponderance...
> 
> @melli your doing good and I love the fact you took an anti-stress nap... geez, get outta my head, sometimes I hafta do that too... when I reach overload mode. Unfortunately I have logistics issues doing so for now. Years ago I had a drill which had a Level Bubble molded into the top, made drilling holes so much easier.. that was stolen along with most of my other tools and when I went to buy new tools, I found no companies do that anymore :-( ... too bad, was a good idea IMO.


I've actually looked at Hugekultur and think it would be a great fit on our property. Hadn't thought of using it as a berm, but that would be an excellent solution for the stuff near the borders of the property since 2 sides are bordered by roads. I much prefer putting things to use over burning. That's why this weekend I'm taking some welded wire fence out to make a couple good sized compost piles for the leaves I'm having to clear up. Told my wife that instead of throwing food waste in the trash or down the disposal I'll collect it to add to the compost heap. One of our goals through this whole project is to reduce our impact on the environment and live more in harmony with our surroundings.

Thanks for the input and ideas. That's the reason I joined this board in the first place. Lots of people with experience and knowledge we can take advantage of.


----------



## melli

Finally finished underlay! All of it. What a relief....although, I have to say the Titanium PSU-30 I was tooting my horn about, kind of sucks in the cooler weather. In warm weather, stuff was sticky deluxe! But in cooler weather, not so sticky. I'll have to get on roof tomorrow, midday, when sun is shining and smooth it out when there is some heat. With underlay, they suggest using a roller (which I don't have). It is a special kind of roller, like a mini paint roller, but smooth hard surface. It helps smooth out wrinkles.

Another option is to use a heat gun, which I've used with success on Resisto type underlay (in winter).


----------



## melli

Not a productive day...had three guests, one hour each...they came not to see me, but the bunker. 
That RV really ruins the ability of taking a decent pic of bunker. I'm still waffling on moving it into carport. A bit of money and effort to do so...


----------



## Steve_S

oldtruckbbq said:


> Hadn't thought of using it as a berm, but that would be an excellent solution for the stuff near the borders of the property since 2 sides are bordered by roads.
> 
> One of our goals through this whole project is to reduce our impact on the environment and live more in harmony with our surroundings.


A solution which takes out 3 birds with one stone and costs next to nothing is usually a good way to start ! Berm for Privacy, Growing Things and disposing of waste material all in one shot...

BTW: If you intend to plant some trees (thinking fruit like apple, pear, peach etc...) when you dig the hole for the root ball, dig a bit deeper (2 feet) under it, toss in a couple of 16/20" logs standing on end with a bit of Peat Moss and grass clippings around them, top that with 6-10" soil and place the tree root ball over that. by the time the new trees roots reach the rotting logs below they will be rotting down... they will return nutrients, invite good microbiology in and act as natural moisture retention below for the roots to absorb during dry periods... by the time the tree grows big enough to pass those, they will have rotted and be torn apart by the roots themselves.


----------



## Steve_S

melli said:


> I'm still waffling on moving it into carport. A bit of money and effort to do so...


Dear, you may likely have regrets if you don't and you know this... Make up the attachment for Bobby or get a local welder to whip it up... I'd eat my hat of it costs more than $100... seriously (but I insist on washing hat first OK). You won't regret moving it under there... although getting things in/out of bunker through the big door would not be easier... 

Visitors... ugh... glad I don't get any.... no time for dawdling with that... later.. maybe... BUT then if I wanted that, I would have told people where I am and as I haven't, they can't just drop in LOL... Only the really important few know where I am...


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> Dear, you may likely have regrets if you don't and you know this... Make up the attachment for Bobby or get a local welder to whip it up... I'd eat my hat of it costs more than $100... seriously (but I insist on washing hat first OK). You won't regret moving it under there... although getting things in/out of bunker through the big door would not be easier...
> 
> Visitors... ugh... glad I don't get any.... no time for dawdling with that... later.. maybe... BUT then if I wanted that, I would have told people where I am and as I haven't, they can't just drop in LOL... Only the really important few know where I am...


I have the welder (MIG)...and now I have the parts! $20. He even drilled the holes...I forgot he is a neighbor, just around a very long block. Now, I just have weld it...fun job. 
MIG welders are pretty cheap nowadays, and I've had much fun with mine...doesn't take much experience to have nice welds. Prepping is the most important part of the job in welding (bare clean metal to bare clean metal)...imho. 








Welder says he mounts them on blade...just don't think it'll give me the flexibility to move trailer around in tights spots.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> A solution which takes out 3 birds with one stone and costs next to nothing is usually a good way to start ! Berm for Privacy, Growing Things and disposing of waste material all in one shot...
> 
> BTW: If you intend to plant some trees (thinking fruit like apple, pear, peach etc...) when you dig the hole for the root ball, dig a bit deeper (2 feet) under it, toss in a couple of 16/20" logs standing on end with a bit of Peat Moss and grass clippings around them, top that with 6-10" soil and place the tree root ball over that. by the time the new trees roots reach the rotting logs below they will be rotting down... they will return nutrients, invite good microbiology in and act as natural moisture retention below for the roots to absorb during dry periods... by the time the tree grows big enough to pass those, they will have rotted and be torn apart by the roots themselves.


Great idea. We cut out all junk food snacks (chips, cookies, microwave popcorn, pretzels, cheese and crackers) and eat several pieces of fruit a day each. The result has been some amazing weight loss and feeling better in general. We definitely plan on planting fruit trees on our property.

My wife had never heard of Hugulkulture until I told her about it last night. I had never heard about it until looking at another forum on this site. Sounds like a win/win situation to me. We were planning on raised beds anyway as that will be easier on our backs as we move into our 60's, and Hugulkulture provides a way to do that with little to no additional cost.


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## melli

I hear trucks rumbling down below, and chainsaws, so I have a look. The tree guys were pushing back the foliage for the new powerline. I chat with the guy who gave me a load of mulch last time...he has a full load in need of a home! Bingo. He dumps it at my place, and I am giddy...lol. Apparently, he will be in hood for a few days, and I may get several more loads...free! 
I literally tried to cram some token of my thanks (money, case of beer, lunch etc) down his throat, but he'd have none of it. He felt I was doing him a favor! I know they get paid well, but geesh. That mulch is gold for me, being on top of a hill. 
Sweetest, most professional guys...

I told him, no need to call, just dump it. 









He said he accumulates about a load a day...


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## Steve_S

@oldtruckbbq Something I learned some 30 odd years ago (or more ;-) ) in college from a Prof was the Power of Proper Brainstorming...
Take ANY problem, idea or concept... The base plan in your case...
Outline all the things you would "like to do", want to do and "need" to do with your building / homesteading plan. Don't forget the challenges you have in front of you too... Think of the Berms, HugeKultur etc as an example. A problem becomes an opportunity... many do in fact.
Post it on a friendly forum like in here (not melli's thread though) it's already quite "fluffy". _and here I am adding more fluff_
Post your ideas & goals for say a 5 year period.
Let everyone suggest, discuss and see what they did with similar plans.

THE RULES ! yep, there are some but nothing serious.
Any and All ideas / input is welcome on the "blackboard"
No idea or suggestion is stupid or bad !!!
Once the whole pile is there, often many strange, odd and even some considered dumb ideas, gel together to provide innovative and sometimes unconventional solutions. Sometimes what may seem a Great Idea at the outset comes out as a potentially huge fail !

Now this exercise is best in a physical room with a very large blackboard and a diverse group of folks with various experience levels. Ensure that everyone get's ideas up without any phooey... (see no bad or stupid ideas, being made fun of) . Do not dismiss ANYTHING till the exercise is completed and you start to connect the dots of ideas, suggestions etc...

You would be quite amazed at how well Collective Brainstorming works and the innovative problems solving it can accomplish AND this is applicable to many various adventures / ventures or tasks at hand. 

If you would like to bounce ideas or discuss things without disrupting the forum or adding material to it, feel free to Private Message me here... I'd be happy to assist when I can... note I am quite time compressed ATM due to juggling several projects & tasks at this time... Once I am settled into my new Homestead @ end of month, I'll have more time to babble as such

NOW Back to your Regular Programming of Melli's Hammer Swinging <<GRINS>>.


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## melli

Thanks Steve......fire away, that is why we are here. I do wish we could see more stuff or fluff from lurkers and whatnot. And build pics! Whether it be a henhouse, crib, or a home...

Got one of the end gables framed in on 2nd floor...just felt good to get that east wall (windstorm wall) framed in.









Have a love of the light, this time of year...and Steve, I rarely use a hammer. I usually use mini sledge to get nails flush that the air gun failed to do...My accuracy with a hammer is less than ideal...lol

Was thinking well, I ought to get some ply up pronto, but I see I have to get the next course (row) of blocking in first (those 2x6 chunks on their side that join the ply seams).


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## melli

Evening fun. Mounting hitch to excavator bucket. I was concerned the bucket would be too tall for hitch, but it works perfectly...I tack welded it, then tried it out on one of my 'slash' trailers, and the ease at picking it up and doing fine adjustments sold me. 
I then finished up welding it, threw on some paint lying about, and that was that. Steve, no idea why I didn't do this years ago...
Also gives me a chain point. 

This is weld before paint...I am not a pro welder by any means. More of a 2-3x a year welder. I really like this pic, as it shows heat settings were too high on far right...it melted some of the tubing. I adjusted 'heat', and weld turned out ok. I think MIGs are ideal thing to have on a homestead, especially if you have metal equipment. 









And this is the finished deal









Kind of interesting now...I can carry slash trailer around with Bobby. Fill it up trailer with whatever, then haul it to drop off point, and use Bobby to tip it. Sweet.


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> I hear trucks rumbling down below, and chainsaws, so I have a look. The tree guys were pushing back the foliage for the new powerline. I chat with the guy who gave me a load of mulch last time...he has a full load in need of a home! Bingo. He dumps it at my place, and I am giddy...lol. Apparently, he will be in hood for a few days, and I may get several more loads...free!
> I literally tried to cram some token of my thanks (money, case of beer, lunch etc) down his throat, but he'd have none of it. He felt I was doing him a favor! I know they get paid well, but geesh. That mulch is gold for me, being on top of a hill.
> Sweetest, most professional guys...
> 
> I told him, no need to call, just dump it.
> 
> View attachment 62649
> 
> He said he accumulates about a load a day...


Boy howdy!! Is that guy married? Drool.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Boy howdy!! Is that guy married? Drool.


Haha...that guy has his you know what together. He owns the biz. Always happy. I would be happy too doing jobs for BC Hydro...lol
I bet he does very well, and he has two complete setups (truck with long basket thingy, and mulcher). 
I've come the conclusion all these folks making 6 figures are very happy, and vice free. They don't even drink beer. Well, I don't either, except once or twice a year at a dinner invite. I should have taken a pic of his working partner...lol. Your tongue would be on the floor...lol
I erroneously assumed folks doing such a sweaty job would be inclined to partake in a beverage after work...nope.


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## melli

Ok, I have to post this pic...cutest thing seeing two bunnies full of granola lounging about, half asleep, while that pesky squirrel is on cleanup detail. Pretty funny watching the whole thing from inside RV. I wake up from nap, and see Bunny #1 sitting in my eyesight, staring at me...lol. He/she is telling me it is snack time. I give them a snack, and while they much away, Mr/Mrs Squirrel is running circles around them, trying to hone in on their snack. The bunnies will occasionally flip around and stare down the squirrel. Meanwhile, Mrs Raven is squawking obscenities because she sees the bunnies snacking. Once the bunnies are done, with just crumbs left, they move over, stretch out, and allow the squirrel to clean up. Absolutely hilarious. The bunnies full, pay no attention to the squirrel. The squirrel is elated and makes sure every last crumb is picked up. 









I wish I could get a better pic, but I didn't want to disturb them as they catch the last rays of the day. Squirrel is on yellow lid munching away.


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## Steve_S

I love to watch the wildlife around my place and their antics... I don't feed them though because I don't want to get caught up into that. The Chipmunks do provide the most entertainment thought... what a hilarious & BRAVE gang of characters as they are used to me now and know I am no threat to them they will come & watch as I do things, share their opinions, critique the music on the radio and quite literally give me **** & chew me out for disturbing their peace at times... AND they get insulted when I laugh at them... Even a few deer will wander onto the property and don't worry much about me but if anyone / anything else is about they won't... they seem to know me by sight now...

Glad you did the hitch up for Bobby but welding that to the bucket "may" potentially cause you grief at another time... hopefully not. Agreed a MIG is an important piece of kit... I have a 120V unit as well which can run quite comfortably off my work generator (Champion 7200/9000W).


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## Mr Bond

[QUOTE="Welder says he mounts them on blade....[/QUOTE]

That was my thought too, as blade has a high lift capacity and is stable. I was thinking if using the hitch below, but setting the bolts up to press on the blade. 

https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/class-ii-4-in-rv-bumper-receiver/A-p8489940e

I can testify they are solid, as have one for the back of my trailer.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> I love to watch the wildlife around my place and their antics... I don't feed them though because I don't want to get caught up into that. The Chipmunks do provide the most entertainment thought... what a hilarious & BRAVE gang of characters as they are used to me now and know I am no threat to them they will come & watch as I do things, share their opinions, critique the music on the radio and quite literally give me poop & chew me out for disturbing their peace at times... AND they get insulted when I laugh at them... Even a few deer will wander onto the property and don't worry much about me but if anyone / anything else is about they won't... they seem to know me by sight now...
> 
> Glad you did the hitch up for Bobby but welding that to the bucket "may" potentially cause you grief at another time... hopefully not. Agreed a MIG is an important piece of kit... I have a 120V unit as well which can run quite comfortably off my work generator (Champion 7200/9000W).


What do you mean by "'may' potentially cause me grief"? Don't think it will, as it is on top of bucket, and not long ago, a hook was welded there, until it got rubbed off. The hook was tack welded (and poorly at that - was on there when I bought machine)...this tube isn't going anywhere. 
I lose teeth on occasion, and I've settled down from when I used to use the buckets as battering rams (bad idea)...lol
Yeah, previous owner decided welding teeth to a couple of buckets was a good idea...not. Slowly been retrofitting them with two bolt teeth. Teeth need a little wiggle room or they snap in half. Teeth with bolts will snap a bolt, which are easy to replace. Once a tooth snaps in half, you need a new tooth ($$). 

Your right, I probably shouldn't encourage wildlife...Can't help myself...lol

Oh yeah, I took a pic of this last night...very cool at the time when I got it, but now there are LED solutions...maybe I can put LEDs in it? Now that nights are getting longer, I need light to continue with the madness. I was doing a small favor for a neighbor, and they were tossing out some junk...in the junk was this drilling rig light. I love the cast metal housing (aluminum), and the wing nuts with C-clamps that secure the face plate to housing (missing one wingnut - haha - on the housing - they are brass). Very skookum light...meant to take abuse and all manner of weather. I have it hooked up on well shed, where I do mechanical repairs at night, if need be. The thing lights up the neighborhood.


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> [QUOTE="Welder says he mounts them on blade....


That was my thought too, as blade has a high lift capacity and is stable. I was thinking if using the hitch below, but setting the bolts up to press on the blade.

https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/class-ii-4-in-rv-bumper-receiver/A-p8489940e

I can testify they are solid, as have one for the back of my trailer.[/QUOTE]
Like that link! That looks very interesting. I guess one has to drill holes in bumper to mount? 

Yeah, I can see the blade having more oompf than top of bucket...it's just I need the ability to move trailer (whether it be RV or slash trailer) into a spot where bobby cannot go, and by having it on bucket, I can have Bobby off to side. Bobby can easily lift tongue weight, whatever it may be, and the tracks can pull near 9000lbs (dead weight on ground - a RV with wheels is nothing in terms of force needed to pull). The other neat thing, is the bucket I mounted to has teeth, and I can plant teeth in ground, and slightly twist bucket to get near 8000lbs force...win win. One thing about blade is it has more stablility, wouldn't be as bouncy as bucket mount. When moving RV, I'll just have to go slow...with slash trailers I won't care if they bounce around...lol


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## Steve_S

Indeed the Halogen suckers CAN be switched. Ask & you shall receive....

https://www.amazon.ca/Urparcel-760-780lm-85-265V-replacement-Halogen/dp/B00CFFAULC
* see the other variations, try to avoid the "Blue Light" and go with pure white or a softer colour range around 2700k

https://www.superbrightleds.com/mor...watt-equivalent-led-t3-flood-light-bulb/1192/

NOTE ! Watch the Wattage / Lumen ratings, they come with a wide assortment of Lumen Output and of course the related wattage to drive them.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Evening fun. Mounting hitch to excavator bucket. I was concerned the bucket would be too tall for hitch, but it works perfectly...I tack welded it, then tried it out on one of my 'slash' trailers, and the ease at picking it up and doing fine adjustments sold me.
> I then finished up welding it, threw on some paint lying about, and that was that. Steve, no idea why I didn't do this years ago...
> Also gives me a chain point.
> 
> This is weld before paint...I am not a pro welder by any means. More of a 2-3x a year welder. I really like this pic, as it shows heat settings were too high on far right...it melted some of the tubing. I adjusted 'heat', and weld turned out ok. I think MIGs are ideal thing to have on a homestead, especially if you have metal equipment.
> 
> View attachment 62651
> 
> And this is the finished deal
> 
> View attachment 62652
> 
> Kind of interesting now...I can carry slash trailer around with Bobby. Fill it up trailer with whatever, then haul it to drop off point, and use Bobby to tip it. Sweet.


Multi-task tools are great. You come up with something you didn't have before, then wonder how in the world you got by without it.


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## melli

Not a productive day...just got the blocking in for east wall on 2nd floor. Then, I climbed on roof to staple edges down, and tried to work out creases...joy. Could only do it when it was hot. 









I felt like I needed a 'reset', so I jumped in lake...my infrared thermo battery died, but I'm guessing high 50's was the water temp. My friend and I call it 'embracing the icicle'. It really does wonders for stress. You feel alive, for sure, but any worries you had before going in, are gone after you jump in. 









Nighttime lows have been rather low here...not freezing, but darn close.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Indeed the Halogen suckers CAN be switched. Ask & you shall receive....
> 
> https://www.amazon.ca/Urparcel-760-780lm-85-265V-replacement-Halogen/dp/B00CFFAULC
> * see the other variations, try to avoid the "Blue Light" and go with pure white or a softer colour range around 2700k
> 
> https://www.superbrightleds.com/mor...watt-equivalent-led-t3-flood-light-bulb/1192/
> 
> NOTE ! Watch the Wattage / Lumen ratings, they come with a wide assortment of Lumen Output and of course the related wattage to drive them.


Thanks, good to know! I don't use it a lot, but when it burns out, I will go LED. I just know if I yank out bulb to check size, I'll break it or it'll burn out quicker...lol



oldtruckbbq said:


> Multi-task tools are great. You come up with something you didn't have before, then wonder how in the world you got by without it.


I know, so funny why I took so long to put a hitch on Bobby. I was planning to a while back, but in a pinch I'd use the breakaway chains on my trailers and hook them onto bucket...not exactly a smooth ride.

Looks like I get to go 'shrubbery shopping' tomorrow, as BC hydro personally delivered a check to me today. Nice guys. I'll be getting non-deer food shrubbery...lol
Look, I used to be a city slicker like the rest of them, but it pains me to see city folks buy their dream cottage, and then in a flurry of exuberance, buy deer nibbles, like Emerald Cedars, English Laurel, any kind of deciduous tree, etc. They plant them, and when they come back, especially after a long hard winter, their shrubs have been denuded...lol
What drives me nuts is local stores sell them. We call Emerald Cedars, 'Popsicle sticks', because when deer are finished with them, they look like, well, Popsicle sticks. If they get tall ones, from ground to about 6' high, just the trunk is all that is left, with a little tuft of green on top. So much for their privacy screening. 
I like Portuguese Laurel...not as bland looking as the English Laurel (more color), and the deer don't like them.


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## melli

About 20 trees and shrubs for $200...lol
Doesn't look like much...got some interesting varieties (two main ones were Western Red Cedars and Portuguese Laurel). 

















Courtesy of BC Hydro....


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## Steve_S

I looked up Portuguese Laurels and they would grow in my zone which is 4a, English Laurels wouldn't though... You have a definite advantage to what you can grow... I can only imagine the garden you'll have after the bunker is done... just remember to start your compost piles now for good use later... hehehe Ohhh Geeezzzz... I'm BAD ain't I ! LOL but knowing you from what you've written, you're probably already doing it... chuckles ;-)


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## ShannonR

Melli, what is the grey looking one in the very back of wheelbarrow? Cypress or juniper perhaps?


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Melli, what is the grey looking one in the very back of wheelbarrow? Cypress or juniper perhaps?


Your good....I am terrible at naming plant species. 
L - R
Upright Holly, Lemon Scented Monterey Cypress, Sky Rocket Juniper, Hill's Yew, Carpet Rosemary, Western Red Cedar, Portuguese Laurel. 

















The first few were cheap because they look a tad 'off'. I was really limited, as I was looking for non-deer food. Anything scented repels deer (usually). I double checked with nursery staff and she felt none of these will be murdered by a deer. Usually, the young ones will nibble on these, but they learn...


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## Steve_S

You could always run down to the local Dollar Store and buy a dozen or so bars of Irish Spring soap, cut them in half and hang them in old nylon stockings around your plants... The deer will avoid it. Someone 3else I know uses Zest Soap with good luck.... both make me sick when I smell them, so I can relate to the deer hating the stink too.


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> Your good....I am terrible at naming plant species.
> L - R
> Upright Holly, Lemon Scented Monterey Cypress, Sky Rocket Juniper, Hill's Yew, Carpet Rosemary, Western Red Cedar, Portuguese Laurel.
> 
> View attachment 62704
> 
> View attachment 62705
> 
> The first few were cheap because they look a tad 'off'. I was really limited, as I was looking for non-deer food. Anything scented repels deer (usually). I double checked with nursery staff and she felt none of these will be murdered by a deer. Usually, the young ones will nibble on these, but they learn...


That Monterey cypress if it's the plant I'm thinking of gets some nice spiney things on it, that should deter the deer!! I remember climbing one in a friend's yard as a child, being barefoot underneath one of those is not fun. 
Your juniper, if you've a mind you could harvest the berries later... good medicinal plant there. I'll be interested to see how that one fares in your climate actually, it tends to be a high desert type plant here.


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## melli

The pile keeps growing...lol


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## melli

Just posting pics of before and after at my old place...I was in my old neighborhood, and with new phone, took some pics. It really goes to show you how much stuff grows over the years. First pic is first summer...I had planted trees in late winter, and grass in early spring. The trees along house were planted in fall (basically a year later). And most were plucked from ditches in our hood.

The time frame between new and old is about 9yrs.

















Insane, the growth. Can barely see yard...here is a better one of yard from stairs (they let the grass go to pot).








Talk about privacy...they have it now! Those cedars on border really grew up in 9yrs. Interestingly, the 2 cedars in middle in background are relatively tiny. I 'hand dug' the holes for them, as they were a late addition. The big cedars on sides had holes dug with a mini excavator...I suspect the loosening of soil and much bigger holes with machinery played a role.








Only 9yrs difference between two pics (above and below).










Geesh, the new owners will have to trim trees, as they have enveloped the power lines...


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## Breezy833

You have beautiful landscaping ability. I'm trying to attractively plot out our little 1/4 an acre now. I'm going slow, finances and all, but also to make sure the thing I do are Chosen, not just thrown in.


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## melli

Breezy833 said:


> You have beautiful landscaping ability. I'm trying to attractively plot out our little 1/4 an acre now. I'm going slow, finances and all, but also to make sure the thing I do are Chosen, not just thrown in.


Thanks for the compliment, but my landscape ability is no different than anyone else. My vision was to have a cathedral yard, so that I could see all of it from kitchen table while I sipped on morning coffee...that was the only premise...lol.
And those 100 cedars came to me as a gift of sorts by my neighbors. I was staring at this when I first got my place (as were my neighbors).









I was the only full timer, the rest were weekend warriors, and they were none too pleased staring at a moonscape. Talk about a clean slate....lol (that whole bowl was blasted out - a rock quarry to build roads and driveways for other cottages). We agreed planting some trees was in order. Since, I lived there, it was foisted on me. The upside, is I paid much less than either neighbor as I was doing the planting etc. Funny enough, I didn't want cedars, I wanted scotch pine, or something similar. I relented because they were cheaper and easier to get. Once I had the border ringed with cedars, I infilled willy-nilly with an odd assortment of trees and shrubs, but being mindful not to overdo it. What is the point of having a yard, if you can't see it easily, preferably from house. The colorful deciduous trees were a gift from developer as he might have had some pity and/or he was worried he'd never be able to sell the remaining cottages because our places were in center of development...not exactly inspiring, buying a cottage in a setting like above. And I hated deciduous trees! lol. I was tempted to refuse them. In the end, I had him mix them in with cedars along property borders. I was pretty daft, as the color from those trees really make a difference. Later on, I bought a few more to balance the color in yard.

Breezy, take your time. Things will happen, and it doesn't take a lot to have a nice yard. And sometimes things come your way if you keep an eye out. I couldn't have afforded the cedars if it wasn't for circumstances, and my grunt. Developer got anxious and pitched in a few more trees. A neighbor cut down some cedars and didn't want logs (so now I had stairs down to yard). While digging holes for cedars (paid mostly by neighbors), I had a machine to level some sandy dirt for grass and do minor yard alterations. I was gifted shrubs and trees by neighbors for looking after their places in the months and years to come...
And pulling seedlings from ditch is free! I see now, perhaps I went overboard...lol

The biggest irony of all, is that I had several neighbors, in the years that followed, realize my property was in fact, the best of the non view lots. They told me, if they knew my property was going to end up like that, they'd have bought it. I was late to party in buying my place, and in fact, my place was considered the dregs, an absolute moon crater...developer was even thinking of not building on lot!! Instead, he was thinking perhaps a communal dog park or garden. I was like, whoah, why are folks dissing this place...it is the only lot in the WHOLE development that had flat land, and all of it was usable. And it was the cheapest...lol
Sad to say, some even sold their places because they had no yard, and no reasonable ability to landscape it. And over time, folks began to gripe they couldn't have a garden. Getting flat land is where it is at. You'll spend a fortune if you buy a rocky slope. Plus, this nonsense about yardwork is silly. That half acre took an hour to mow and weedwhack. It was another reason I kept it open..ease of maintaining.


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## melli

*Picking up after BC Hyrdo - Driveway Entrance
*
Geesh, was supposed to be a lazy day...lol. I was going to test out my bucket hitch, fill up trailer with mulch and go down to driveway entrance and dump it. Well, it ended up being much more involved...I was hunting for boulders in the bush, and that ate up hours, then I was fiddling around placing them. By the time I got to mulch I was spent. 
At any rate, ready for planting! I really wanted to get the shrubbery and trees planted. The longer they sit in pots, the harder it is for them to adapt to planting (roots start matting in pot and they take longer to branch out). 

Hillbilly setup...lol










With excavator, I can really 'dump' the trailer...










Not the most pretty landscaping job, but it will do (mulch is wonderful for covering up imperfections)...hopefully, the stuff I plant will obscure middle row of boulders. I still need to hunt for nice boulders for top row. Once they remove the pole, I can clean up that area. 

View attachment 62747


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## melli

BTW - this is what it looked like just after BC Hydro blazed through (I removed 2 logs not in pic)










A definite improvement...


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## melli

Bugger, my final pic showed up as an attachment, and it comes up as an error.
Here is the end result (minus the plantings):


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## melli

I guess I missed the memo...part of living in the sticks...lol
Happy Thanksgiving Day Canucks (Canadian TG Day)! I was PO'd when I made a rather long trip this morning, to lumber store, to find it closed. Well, I had to shop for supplies other than lumber...still...hmmm. 
I get home and throw up remaining sheet of ply and jump into Bobby to cover another section of hillside. I was reading the local rag the other day, and a mulch pile self ignited! My multi pile was getting rather warm in sections (I watered it). Steam was emanating off it. I'm thinking I better spread it around before I have a pile of ashes...lol

I have two 'tiers' on top of property, and between them, for about half of it, is a rubble slope as transition (the rest has been covered in fill and made smooth). These are where the trees grow. Mulch is so wonderful because it covers up the icky bits. Plus, it retains moisture in summer and dispenses food for trees. 

You can see the new stuff I spread out...interestingly, Bobby can drive over very rough terrain with a layer of mulch over it...kind of floats. A tad hairy given the slope, but it worked. Found two big boulders to continue the bordering thing I got going there...

















I think for blue rubble in background (rock slope) I will throw a load of fill on it before I do the mulch...have some planting spots for shrubs and more trees. 
ps - the rock border is rather haphazardly laid...one day I'll clean it up.


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## melli

Not much different from yesterday's pic (planted shrubs and trees)...only time will change the picture.


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> Not much different from yesterday's pic (planted shrubs and trees)...only time will change the picture.
> View attachment 62775


Looking good.


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## Echoesechos

melli said:


> Not much different from yesterday's pic (planted shrubs and trees)...only time will change the picture.
> View attachment 62775


Looks nice.. love rock work. We have lots at the office gardens, lots of big ones with the thought that folks will use them to sit on etc. They do too. I would recommend blue oat grass. I have it the work garden and home. Planted right up against the rocks and it softens the edges beautifully. Doesn't need trimming either. Grows about 3 feet tall and is open growing and survives my zone 3 landscapes.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Looks nice.. love rock work. We have lots at the office gardens, lots of big ones with the thought that folks will use them to sit on etc. They do too. I would recommend blue oat grass. I have it the work garden and home. Planted right up against the rocks and it softens the edges beautifully. Doesn't need trimming either. Grows about 3 feet tall and is open growing and survives my zone 3 landscapes.


Thanks. 
Long ago, I did transplant some native grasses we have growing here, but I couldn't tell what they were...
Wow, you have ESP? lol
In that last pic, I did indeed have a picnic on them (neighbors came over and brought me lunch...we sat and ate on those rocks). Understandable, considering I had nowhere to seat a party of 5.


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## ShannonR

I miss that NashvilleMama lady, also!!! The folks here sure were tough on her, with the whole "you can't do so and so with a child..." blah blah blah. I made sure to send her a PM that encouraged her instead of discouraging...and pointed out to her that I was doing the same. It sure is unfortunate when someone abandons their dreams because of what others think of them or their plans.


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## Mr Bond

"This particular category has lost it's way, as when I first posted there were several build threads. Not sure if it is the lack of homesteaders, we scared them off or they found a better venue."

So in thanks for all your posts, I've started "A Bedtime Story for Melli" thread in this forum! A brief tale of our Alberta acreage when we first landed in Canada. Hope you enjoy!


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## Echoesechos

I was rooting for her too. I love that you include pictures to document progress of your efforts Melli. I get lost in nothing but talk. Don't mean to offend anyone but I'm one who has to have visual thrown in to follow along I guess.


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## Steve_S

Melli I love following your thread, might have noticed my constant Lurking and occasional chirp.... <snickering grin>... I'm pretty darn busy with Year 3 of 5 in my own project and I did post on another forum (which you browsed through a bit, if I recall) and stopped because I got sick & tired of Armchair Experts and Geniuses telling me what & how to do things... When you can swing a hammer, build something that does not fall over and do it BY YOURSELF with no extra hands, then I will pay attention... 95% of my projects have been with the worlds largest contractor and known to all.... MMI General Contracting... Me, Myself & I ! Me, watched, Myself advises and "I" do all the damned work ! AND those other two yoyo's NEVER EVER LEND A HAND ! You didn't know you were part of the Consortium did ya Melli ? LOL

I was approached from someone on this forum asking me to post a full thread & details of my project as it incorporates many innovations as well as some very "ancient" concepts which work... They stated how they wanted to take that into a publication of some sort and monetize it... Haven't seen my build thread have you.... IF I share something it is for the benefit of ALL and I want no Profit off it... Sorry but NO FERENGI HERE !

I thought Nashville Momma was trying something very difficult and could pull it off with good sound guidance and support but some just went nutso on her... As for doing such with kids being impossible... Utter Hogwash ! I gutted to outer timbers & completely restored a house built in 1886 when my daughters were 2,4 & 6 ! Easy NO but they actually made suggestions and ideas, several of which were incorporated into the reno... Win for us, great ideas and something I would not have considered and a WIN for them because they knew their ideas / opinions were valued, to the point of being included into a major reno... Besides, every kid needs to experience Real World Work, sawdust & sand in their mouths and to see what is possible... NB My EX hated the fact that I listened & encouraged the kids to give me their thoughts... what's especially good with that, is they see & view things without foredrawn conclusions or biases.... they see things more clearly in many ways. 

Seems many are on FacePox and doing their shtick there... I will never join such a social ailment so here I sit yapping on a forum which is reasonably generic... (no last names, no one knows WHO I or YOU are or my things and no ego fluffing, self important narcissism) like on FaceBlot...

OK I rambled off a bit BUT it's been one of "those" days and this chilled me out a bit... 
Have a Marvy Day / Evening one and all...


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## MoBookworm1957

i've been to several other threads.
I read the entire thread.
Some good advice, most didn't apply to me.
I just keep coming back to your thread because it's more down to earth.
You will even answer questions without biting my head off.
You're more practical, open to suggestions.
Unlike some other threads.
Whom insist their way is the only way.
My point of view is live,learn,experience life as you see fit.
I have always lived my life on my terms.
Not as some man thinks my life should be.
I didn't know the other people you mentioned.
But if you like and approved of them, then they must be good people.
Not some idiot who is full of himself.
Everybody have a great day or night.


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## ShannonR

Bookworm, who is that sweet, precious baby in your updated profile pic? If a grandchild or even a Great grandchild, many congrats!!!


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## melli

Thanks MoBookworm! I try to be as approachable as possible, as I am cognizant of the fact that I am a schmuck (Harrison Ford stole that from me!...lol), that my way is most certainly not the best way (far from it). And I am open to critique (seriously, you or anybody see something that could be done better or even differently, I am all eyes). Steve has chimed in with his thoughts in a number of areas, and although I never took all his advice, it made me rethink some aspects of build, an absolute plus (thank you Steve). Made me research something I assumed, yet not verified with hard data.

I am in putter mode...seems my full time commitment has waned, and I've been pulled in other directions (neighbors and landscaping). Been putting up ply, nail removal (I miss the stud on occasion - more than I like...lol), took down a scaffold, that sort of thing.

Also, has certainly got chiller (4C nighttime lows), and much less daylight...entering the dark period. I am one of the more fortunate souls in Canada, as we rarely see freezing temps. 4-1/2mths of short days and rainy weather til I see signs of spring. The one huge downside (really, the only downside) of where I live, is very little sun during winter...not to say we don't get any, but in all of Canada, probably the least near the border. Of course, if you live way north, well, the sun disappears for a couple of weeks, so I cannot complain. Most Canadians refer to us as Lotusland because of our mild winters (I used to live in the prairies, and wow, some serious cold, and it seemed like 6mths of winter...lol).









Odd thing, 'good one side' (G1S) ply was the same price as standard ply, so I got the G1S ply...you can see the difference in color. Something I never noticed, as I never bought G1S ply in bulk (usually more expensive), is that it lays flatter. BTW - G1S ply is exactly like regular ply, except one side has a completely smooth surface. Any knots are filled in...usually used for floors.

















I do like picture taking...one thing I noticed is nice glow down stairwell...will be nice in winter (door for deck on 2nd floor will be a 'full light' door - a full length window in door).


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## MoBookworm1957

ShannonR said:


> Bookworm, who is that sweet, precious baby in your updated profile pic? If a grandchild or even a Great grandchild, many congrats!!!


That's my first grand child. A grand daughter.
She was unplanned, but she is oh so loved regardless.
She's 3 months old, rolling over,trying to hold her own bottle.
She holds her head up fairly well.
She making baby noises,blowing spit bubbles.
She likes to talk to Granny.
Her name is Estelle.
Strawberry is tired, she's put herself to bed already.
We had Estelle today.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> Steve has chimed in with his thoughts in a number of areas, and although I never took all his advice, it made me rethink some aspects of build, an absolute plus (thank you Steve).


 OHHH MY you haven't taken all my advice... Ohhh you naughty naughty little bush gurl you ! ROFLOL... I gave you advice ?... hmmm suggestions & thoughts with a dose of ramblings.... so I thought... Malleable as lead dear...

There is something in the Motivational Breeze past few days me thinks... Had some unexpected diversions (emergency major front end repair to truck - ouched the $$) which stressed me a bit (quite a bit) and then a few more things go topsy turvy and now.... just anti-motivated... and getting darker sooner don't help... single digit nights... impending doom of the "stuff"... I think in part for me is because I have to get back to my least favourite job of all.. Mudding Drywall... Ohh I so HATE plasterwork and never wanted a spec of that crud in my shack... 3 days of that if all goes well and then no more and onto better things... Hope that will fix motivational drive...

@MoBookworm1957 Babies are a joy IMO, such fond memories of coddling my little ones, bath times with splashes & giggles with ample silliness to go around... reading to them at night, even at 6 months old, just something I got into doing very early and loved it, nice way to wind down for me at end of day, in any case... folks thought I was nuts (babies can't understand), including Missus but was good for baby & dad... wore out quite a few "Golden Books" reading to the gang as they grew... Ahhhh the good ol days...


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## MoBookworm1957

Steve_S said:


> OHHH MY you haven't taken all my advice... Ohhh you naughty naughty little bush gurl you ! ROFLOL... I gave you advice ?... hmmm suggestions & thoughts with a dose of ramblings.... so I thought... Malleable as lead dear...
> 
> There is something in the Motivational Breeze past few days me thinks... Had some unexpected diversions (emergency major front end repair to truck - ouched the $$) which stressed me a bit (quite a bit) and then a few more things go topsy turvy and now.... just anti-motivated... and getting darker sooner don't help... single digit nights... impending doom of the "stuff"... I think in part for me is because I have to get back to my least favourite job of all.. Mudding Drywall... Ohh I so HATE plasterwork and never wanted a spec of that crud in my shack... 3 days of that if all goes well and then no more and onto better things... Hope that will fix motivational drive...
> 
> @MoBookworm1957 Babies are a joy IMO, such fond memories of coddling my little ones, bath times with splashes & giggles with ample silliness to go around... reading to them at night, even at 6 months old, just something I got into doing very early and loved it, nice way to wind down for me at end of day, in any case... folks thought I was nuts (babies can't understand), including Missus but was good for baby & dad... wore out quite a few "Golden Books" reading to the gang as they grew... Ahhhh the good ol days...


Thanks Steve,
I love it when she helps Granny hold the little books.
Today we are learning about baby animals along with sound effects.
Yesterday we learned about color. Being she had a colorful outfit on.


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## ShannonR

MoBookworm1957 said:


> That's my first grand child. A grand daughter.
> She was unplanned, but she is oh so loved regardless.
> She's 3 months old, rolling over,trying to hold her own bottle.
> She holds her head up fairly well.
> She making baby noises,blowing spit bubbles.
> She likes to talk to Granny.
> Her name is Estelle.
> Strawberry is tired, she's put herself to bed already.
> We had Estelle today.


Awwwww, how perfect!! They are so precious at that age


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## MoBookworm1957

It takes me ten minutes to pick Strawberry's tools at night.
And it takes 30 minutes to pick up Estelle's stuff at night.
It's funny to watch Strawberry try to share her toys with Estelle.
Yesterday Estelle got a hold of Strawberries ear. She was trying to put it her mouth.
Strawberry just sat there patiently, until she was putting in her mouth.
then she shook her head, gave Estelle slurp kiss.
Think they will be buddies for life much to dad's dismay
.


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## MoBookworm1957

Ear going into Estelle's mouth


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## Steve_S

LMAO... Mo you just reminded me how our Siberian Husky thought the kids were HER PUPS - we got the dog about a year before #1 was born so by the time baby arrived Dog settled into being who she was... a well versed and opinionated pooch who always had a comment or lecture at paw... BUT when the kids started popping out, Mommy Dog mode kicked in and they could quite literally do pretty much anything to her without as much as a peep and PROTECTIVE too... The dog didn't have a mean bone in her, not even a smidge BUT she freaked out some Mormon Missionaries who came by... They were chatting with Missus when one got up suddenly, we saw our Siberian jump up get between baby & the visitors, bear down growling, showing teeth and fur up on her back ! When you have a 80lb, Red/Tan Siberian with those crystal blue eyes that peer THROUGH you get angry, you SEE the wolf / wild potentials there.... surprised us and shocked them while baby giggled and yanked on her tail... geez, I miss my ol Pupper Toes, she was one fantastic dog (excepting the fur of course, which you could knit a new dog every 3 months or so....)


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## ShannonR

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Ear going into Estelle's mouth


What a beautiful little girl!!! You guys all look like you're having tons of fun.


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## melli

A sunny day! Forecast...cloudy and rainy til March. 
I won't be posting much as I am pulled away from build helping other folks. Such is life. And showing sheathing progression pics is probably not very entertaining. I do have to come up with a way to get the last row up, as I cannot use my current method of rope, pulling up sheets. And the scaffold I've put up is not tall enough...Problem is, I don't want to attach scaffold to 2nd floor wall as I will be sheathing it with XPS foam and house wrap/strapping, then siding. Or maybe house wrap, foam, strapping, then siding...haven't decided on order yet. I should get windows first before I go there...


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## MoBookworm1957

ShannonR said:


> What a beautiful little girl!!! You guys all look like you're having tons of fun.


We do.
When Granny reads animal books. Granny does the sound effects too.


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## Tomjracer

Melli,

See if you can rent a 16ft step ladder for doing the 2nd floor. I picked up one of these off Craigslist for $250 when I needed to stain the peaks on my log home. Only problem is it's big and heavy.

http://www.wernerco.com/us/en/view/Products/Climbing Equipment/Stepladders/E7400/E7416


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Ear going into Estelle's mouth


OMG...a baby and doggie...so cute. I can see strawberry is dutifully allowing the youngin to maul her....lol
Geesh, I need a dog. Once the house is done...

Thanks Tomjracer for link....wow, that is some tall step ladder. 10' feet spread! 4' wide feet and 150lbs+...wow.
Might be a bit much for me. I can only imagine they are not cheap.
I still have to bug a neighbor about real scaffolding...see if they have the real deal, and are willing to part with it for a spell. Building my own is ok, but it has it's limits. I need to do something where I feel really comfortable standing on, not only for siding, but soffit (which is gnawing on me). Without soffit, house will never be bug or rodent proof.

I treated myself to more landscape lights, as it is getting darker earlier, and I figured instead of buying a mess of construction lights, buy some landscape lights and repurpose them when done. I might be lying to myself...lol
I have a thing for lights, especially yard lights, as I like to fumble around at night, and being able to see is a plus. A bloody coyote had the nerve to scream right beside my trailer last night...no idea why. Wasn't a howl, but a guttural sound. Initially, I thought someone was screaming for help.
I've now got 6 of these about my yard and in build;
https://www.amazon.com/LEMONBEST®-Bright-Outdoor-Landscape-Lighting/dp/B00Q2I48AW
Really pleased with the light color and light intensity (6W each).

They do require connectors or soldering to hookup. I solder, liquid tape, then 'well tape'...some have been going for a couple of years (not one burnout, but two showed signs of condensation behind glass lens - still working). I hooked up some landscape lights for a neighbor, and one was a submersible from same seller above...I use the method above for waterproofing connection (2yrs sitting in pond, and no issues).

I just don't have a camera that takes good night pics (or user error)....









The three bright ones are useless (LEDs string lights from years ago). They don't throw light very far. The ones inside build are the ones I bought (see link above).








The above pic is a better example.
And was I surprised when these guys showed up again, as two days ago, only one showed up.








Maybe that was what the coyote was screaming about...???


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## Echoesechos

melli said:


> A sunny day! Forecast...cloudy and rainy til March.
> I won't be posting much as I am pulled away from build helping other folks. Such is life. And showing sheathing progression pics is probably not very entertaining. I do have to come up with a way to get the last row up, as I cannot use my current method of rope, pulling up sheets. And the scaffold I've put up is not tall enough...Problem is, I don't want to attach scaffold to 2nd floor wall as I will be sheathing it with XPS foam and house wrap/strapping, then siding. Or maybe house wrap, foam, strapping, then siding...haven't decided on order yet. I should get windows first before I go there...
> 
> View attachment 62847
> 
> View attachment 62848


Something about this picture that reminds me of our fire lookouts. Maybe the angle of the roof.


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## ShannonR

Melli, glad to see you got some ammunition against the dark days! That sure helps alot, like a breath of cool fresh air on a 110+ degree day.

Your coyote noise (that is the part that stuck in my mind, nevermind the relevance...lol!) it IS possibly rabbit related. Rabbits make a noise like that when they breed (or are being eaten by a coyote). I don't doubt at all it was a coyote, but bunnies can scream too. Just a thought.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Melli, glad to see you got some ammunition against the dark days! That sure helps alot, like a breath of cool fresh air on a 110+ degree day.
> 
> Your coyote noise (that is the part that stuck in my mind, nevermind the relevance...lol!) it IS possibly rabbit related. Rabbits make a noise like that when they breed (or are being eaten by a coyote). I don't doubt at all it was a coyote, but bunnies can scream too. Just a thought.


I need more lights! lol
I don't want to be visible from space, but geesh, it gets inky black, and black bears are invisible (probably my only worry). 
Well, both bunnies showed up again, so it wasn't them. 
Definitely a coyote, and I jumped in my car to track it down and it scampered off, to scream beside a neighbor's place (the plus of being able to drive around my property...lol).


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## ShannonR

Did you see the coyote? Good thing you don't have any livestock, how scary!!


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Did you see the coyote? Good thing you don't have any livestock, how scary!!


They are pests around here. Gashed my rental doggie one time. Kind of a funny encounter. I'm inside house, hear my dog yelp, I run outside to see my dog and the coyote (who are standing side by side) looking at me quizzically, like what is that human up to? I yell at coyote, and my doggie thinks I am yelling at him....lol. And the coyote is still standing beside my dog like they are friends. I had to run down towards them, and finally the coyote took off. Coyote had nipped my dog in leg (classic take down MO). Not a massive gash, but deep. And my dog was much bigger than coyote. At any rate, he healed up quickly. 

Not many folks have livestock around here, and if they do, it is well fenced. 
Coyotes are very skittish around humans...never any human-coyote interaction. They scare easy (I've chased a few, and they run off). Cougars are a worry, as are bears. Bears more so because their noses are checking out human places, and there are a lot of them, relative to cougars, who are rarely seen. 

This is why I need a big honkin fence. I want to enjoy my place at night without worrying about what I'll bump into.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Something about this picture that reminds me of our fire lookouts. Maybe the angle of the roof.


I could see that...a shed style roof is easy to build up on a mountain, and the high side would be perfect for large windows.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> Bears more so because their noses are checking out human places, and there are a lot of them,


 Especially in October as they are fattening up & prepping for the Big Sleep which is the highest risk time for folks... Fences also do not stop a hungry bear, just annoys them... 

I do hope you have decent rifle a .303 or .308 at least, in your trailer Melli.... being up there with the critters, could save your life. A nice Semi-auto with 5 round clip would do the deed nicely. Geez... Melli in Greb Kodiak Boots, Jeans, Red Plaid Flannel lined Jacket, Light Toque, wearing her tool belt and trusty hammer hanging in it's holder while Brandishing her .308 Hunting Rifle staring down a Grizz.... Telling it, you Got a Choice Bear ! Be my new Rug or go foraging somewhere else ?


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Especially in October as they are fattening up & prepping for the Big Sleep which is the highest risk time for folks... Fences also do not stop a hungry bear, just annoys them...
> 
> I do hope you have decent rifle a .303 or .308 at least, in your trailer Melli.... being up there with the critters, could save your life. A nice Semi-auto with 5 round clip would do the deed nicely. Geez... Melli in Greb Kodiak Boots, Jeans, Red Plaid Flannel lined Jacket, Light Toque, wearing her tool belt and trusty hammer hanging in it's holder while Brandishing her .308 Hunting Rifle staring down a Grizz.... Telling it, you Got a Choice Bear ! Be my new Rug or go foraging somewhere else ?


Haha, you have a great imagination! No gun will be gracing my hands....lol
Ok, maybe a .22 one day. Although bears do worry me, I am not scared of them, if I see them with some room to spare. I think my time on farm, in my youth, helps one understand if you have composure, you can pretty much deter any wild animal from one's homestead. I've scared off all manner of animals. Have to believe your the apex predator, and they go running. Of course, you have to read them, and their body language. I use to have Papa bear roam on my place, and a firm 'GO!' did the trick. He was a big guy, especially for black bear. 
And Steve, whenever I get livestock, I'll have to get someone in to do the butchering. I have no stomach for it anymore. I did more than my fair share in my youth on farm...plus, I'll end up getting too attached to my animals.


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## melli

*Go to get windows, came home with doors.
*
There is only one place on coast in my hood to get windows and doors, and I figured I better go see them in person to get the ball rolling (had some cash). I show up, and owner was amiss because the company who makes the UBER windows, I insisted on, never got back to him. Seems I am very small fry. Seriously, a dozen small windows is a rounding error to the company that makes them, when they are probably manufacturing quarter million dollar orders for one house. 

So, while oggling at a display model of my dream windows, the owner was cleaning out the back room of interior doors. He says, you want a couple of doors. Well sure, how much I ask. Free he says. Don't have to twist my arm, especially after he offered plain white interior doors, and I graciously declined until he came to the only two posh wood doors. I hustled those in my car pretty fast...lol

I think I owe him a bottle of something....

So, here is an example of the tilt and turn Euro windows I dream about...they tilt in at top, and turn in like a door (the screen is on outside, so no messing with screen if you want to clean them). They are built like Fort Knox. Numerous locking points. Triple seals...you close these, and not a peep is coming from outside. 

































2 seals on casing, and one on window....display model didn't have screen installed. 








The 'action' is so easy with handle. No grunting required....


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## melli

These were the interior doors I absconded with.....

Almost exactly what I was thinking for interior...a translucent glass door for bathroom, and a plain door for a closet or half bath upstairs...








Note: they are upside down


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> *Go to get windows, came home with doors.
> *
> There is only one place on coast in my hood to get windows and doors, and I figured I better go see them in person to get the ball rolling (had some cash). I show up, and owner was amiss because the company who makes the UBER windows, I insisted on, never got back to him. Seems I am very small fry. Seriously, a dozen small windows is a rounding error to the company that makes them, when they are probably manufacturing quarter million dollar orders for one house.
> 
> So, while oggling at a display model of my dream windows, the owner was cleaning out the back room of interior doors. He says, you want a couple of doors. Well sure, how much I ask. Free he says. Don't have to twist my arm, especially after he offered plain white interior doors, and I graciously declined until he came to the only two posh wood doors. I hustled those in my car pretty fast...lol
> 
> I think I owe him a bottle of something....
> 
> So, here is an example of the tilt and turn Euro windows I dream about...they tilt in at top, and turn in like a door (the screen is on outside, so no messing with screen if you want to clean them). They are built like Fort Knox. Numerous locking points. Triple seals...you close these, and not a peep is coming from outside.
> 
> View attachment 62919
> 
> View attachment 62920
> 
> View attachment 62921
> 
> View attachment 62922
> 
> 2 seals on casing, and one on window....display model didn't have screen installed.
> View attachment 62923
> 
> The 'action' is so easy with handle. No grunting required....
> View attachment 62924


Dang Meli,
I'm drooling!


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Dang Meli,
> I'm drooling!


Haha...I know! They are the Mercedes of windows. Like space ship windows...
Hard to show it in pics, but they scream quality.


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## Hitch

Nice score on the doors and windows.


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## oldtruckbbq

Doors look nice. The door with the glass panel takes me back to the house we lived in while in Germany. Loved that door.


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## ShannonR

Wooooo, Melli!!!!! Those are great! I know firsthand the sense of accomplishment and pride finding a good deal on windows and doors gives one. I actually went so far as to find a good deal on those first, before I framed up the openings for them in the Shedroom build... so I could be flexible with size.

When are you installing one to show off for us?? LOL


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Wooooo, Melli!!!!! Those are great! I know firsthand the sense of accomplishment and pride finding a good deal on windows and doors gives one. I actually went so far as to find a good deal on those first, before I framed up the openings for them in the Shedroom build... so I could be flexible with size.
> 
> When are you installing one to show off for us?? LOL


I'm exactly like you, buy stuff miles ahead, of when they are actually required. I probably would have done the same were it not for the fact, I have no room to store loot and my money was pouring out of my hands for the bunker. Heck, I have a kitchen (yes, even the sink) in a tarp shed...I got that years ago...lol. A neighbor offered it to me as they wanted to reno their city home. I jumped at the offer. Drove into town with a small trailer and stripped kitchen in 6hrs (Cabinets, countertops, sink, the works). 
Problem is, after X number of years, the mdf cabinets are shot. I might able to use the granite, doors and hardware. Another neighbor gave me a uber two piece stove...

As for installing doors, not for a bit...technically, one of the last things to install. I need to stain them too (solid wood). I might just do a clearcoat of poly. I need to finish framing! 
I haven't posted much in the last few days because I am busy elsewhere...and my nail gun arm is shot. From wrist to shoulder, I have something going on.


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> I'm exactly like you, buy stuff miles ahead, of when they are actually required. I probably would have done the same were it not for the fact, I have no room to store loot and my money was pouring out of my hands for the bunker. Heck, I have a kitchen (yes, even the sink) in a tarp shed...I got that years ago...lol. A neighbor offered it to me as they wanted to reno their city home. I jumped at the offer. Drove into town with a small trailer and stripped kitchen in 6hrs (Cabinets, countertops, sink, the works).
> Problem is, after X number of years, the mdf cabinets are shot. I might able to use the granite, doors and hardware. Another neighbor gave me a uber two piece stove...
> 
> As for installing doors, not for a bit...technically, one of the last things to install. I need to stain them too (solid wood). I might just do a clearcoat of poly. I need to finish framing!
> I haven't posted much in the last few days because I am busy elsewhere...and my nail gun arm is shot. From wrist to shoulder, I have something going on.


Rotor cup? Pinched nerve? Carptonal?
when I am working on repairing hand stitched quilt my dominant hand will go numb.
In my case that would be my left hand and will be numb to shoulder.


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Rotor cup? Pinched nerve? Carptonal?
> when I am working on repairing hand stitched quilt my dominant hand will go numb.
> In my case that would be my left hand and will be numb to shoulder.


I woke up this morning because I had a dream that as I rolled over, my forearm was dislocated (flopping around). I woke up with start, and my elbow was screaming at me. Never had a dislocation injury.
I just have to stop using it...lol
Give it time to heal. Those rafters likely pulled tendons around elbow. And the nail gun has done my wrist and shoulder in. I had a surgery long ago on wrist (gaglia something or another...they removed stuff that squirted out of wrist joint). I felt right as rain after surgery...never an issue until recently.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> I woke up this morning because I had a dream that as I rolled over, my forearm was dislocated (flopping around). I woke up with start, and my elbow was screaming at me. Never had a dislocation injury.
> I just have to stop using it...lol
> Give it time to heal. Those rafters likely pulled tendons around elbow. And the nail gun has done my wrist and shoulder in. I had a surgery long ago on wrist (gaglia something or another...they removed stuff that squirted out of wrist joint). I felt right as rain after surgery...never an issue until recently.


My hands would be numb, elbows hurt like crazy, shoulders hurt, and sometimes my hands and fingers would draw up and cramp like crazy. And then there was that annoying loss of grip strength without notice. I had 2 herniated discs and a lot of "arthritic modification" on C3, C4, C5. After 2 hours with a chisel and grinder removing "arthritic modification", a titanium plate and 6 screws to fuse C3, 4, 5 together no more problems. Still problems in a couple other areas of my back, but that will just have to wait.

And then my kids and my Dad just have to remind me once you get past you mid 50's your body starts having issues like that. If only my body felt as young as my mind!

I am a supervisor in a union plant, so the most "work" I get to do involves a clipboard and pen, sometimes a flashlight. When I have days off and use them to work on my truck, work around the house, or work at our property I really pay the price. Things like nail guns with their repetitive shocks to the hand and wrist can cause pain that will last for days.


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## ShannonR

melli said:


> I woke up this morning because I had a dream that as I rolled over, my forearm was dislocated (flopping around). I woke up with start, and my elbow was screaming at me. Never had a dislocation injury.
> I just have to stop using it...lol
> Give it time to heal. Those rafters likely pulled tendons around elbow. And the nail gun has done my wrist and shoulder in. I had a surgery long ago on wrist (gaglia something or another...they removed stuff that squirted out of wrist joint). I felt right as rain after surgery...never an issue until recently.


Getting older hurts, doesn't it?!
Tiger balm helps somewhat if it's a tendon problem. There is also other products, but I liked tigr balm the most.
I used to knit a lot (yes, really...LOL)and had to stop because the tendons in my knuckles couldnt handle it.


----------



## melli

ShannonR said:


> Getting older hurts, doesn't it?!
> Tiger balm helps somewhat if it's a tendon problem. There is also other products, but I liked tigr balm the most.
> I used to knit a lot (yes, really...LOL)and had to stop because the tendons in my knuckles couldnt handle it.


That is a shame....
You see my 'toque' here...I never leave home without it. I have another one like it. This one is my security blanket. My head feels naked without it (and I still have most of my hair). And I have folks reminding me, in high summer, that it might be a tad hot for a toque...lol
I found a knitter who makes them...but I keep losing her contact info. This one is getting a tad long in tooth...doesn't fit very snug and is fraying a wee bit. I love the colours she knitted into it.









The thing doubles as a helmet, as I am prone to whacking my head on something in my homestead venture...softens the blow. Amazing the low temps I can handle without a jacket, but if I have my toque on, I feel grand. Heck, I even wear it indoors...lol
You know when you leave the household, you always reach for phone, keys etc....my toque is the only thing I automatically remember to take with me. I only recall once, in the past few years, where I forgot it! Usually, it is always on my head so I don't have look for it (after getting dressed when I hop out of bed).


----------



## melli

Got a couple of hours in today on build. Felt good to pound on my bunker once again. The other gable end needed framing. Now, all I need to do is sheathing. It is getting rather brisk up here (one pacific front moving in after another, with some nasty winds associated with them). Having build completed before we get the really bad systems would be nice. Already had power go out...hmmm. 
Wasn't a long outage...just a few hours. I better pull out genny. I need to make a flat area on other side of build to see if I can kill the genny noise...having concrete wall with 5" of foam should muffle it a bit. 










Of course, I forgot to flip a couple sheets of ply on roof while I still had easy access...doh!


----------



## melli

*Windows
*
Got a quote for my Uber windows...basically, a $1000 ($750USD) each! Ouch. I am so out of touch with what things cost nowadays...a thousand dollars for one window (32"x38"). Seems absurd. I can buy a fridge for that.
In for a penny, in for a pound. Will see if glass place will be agreeable to my payment plan. 6k will cover all the windows that open. The fixed windows (6) I'll get from a different manufacturer (i.e. much cheaper, but still good specs).

You can read up on them here: http://www.innotech-windows.com/windows-doors/windows/tilt-turn-windows

They are essentially, the best windows one can buy. Well, NASA probably makes the best windows, but they don't open.

Will be a bit drafty in my place with only half the windows, but the ones that I do have, will be awesome.
Got me thinking, if anyone in the know, knew about my windows, they be inclined to rip them off...I better secure them really well. Be ironic if I was robbed not of my house contents, but the windows...lol

BTW - *Defender 76TS Windows*


----------



## Mr Bond

It's ironic, coming from Europe I hate tilt'n turn.... The fenestration was simply too bulky and they were prone to twisting over time as the weight distorted the frame. Admittedly far from top end, but more hassle than was worth.

Now I look for simplicity: likely to use these guys as can buy direct: http://www.duxtonwindows.com/

Great score on the doors!


----------



## melli

Mr Bond said:


> It's ironic, coming from Europe I hate tilt'n turn.... The fenestration was simply too bulky and they were prone to twisting over time as the weight distorted the frame. Admittedly far from top end, but more hassle than was worth.
> 
> Now I look for simplicity: likely to use these guys as can buy direct: http://www.duxtonwindows.com/
> 
> Great score on the doors!


Great link, thanks. 

Yeah, I could see that. Tilt-n-turn require a lot of hardware = lot of weight. 
The Innotech ones have a stout frame, and adjustable hinges. I like them because there is nothing flimsy about them...lol
Uber grade. Trying to decipher the fenestration codes the company uses...not sure if I was quoted ones with break-in resistance (glass). Waiting to hear back from glass place. I like the tilt, especially on main floor...makes it hard for animals or people to enter in tilt mode. And, if windy, the window won't shudder.


----------



## melli

Plugging away on sheathing the 2nd floor walls...really slowing down nowadays. Could be working at heights, I am cautious, and slow as a result. I've been paying attention to wall up against main floor roof. I want to anchor the sucker to main floor rafters. It needs to be sheathed first. 

















Able to get all the underlay up against 2nd floor wall. 

As a last minute job, I decided to get one sheet of ply up on low wall. I demonstrate in pics how I do it without a scaffold. 

Rope two attachment points on outside of ply (two small screws per rope). 
Screw two blocks to ply on inside, as hammer points for getting T&G tight up against lower sheet. 


















It is fairly easy to hump the sheet up the side of bunker this way. I use my feet to hold rope in place, as I pull one rope at a time. It is tied off in pic above, as I am done lifting.


----------



## Hitch

Wow, your gonna be all sheathed in by winter. I bet your relieved.


----------



## melli

Hitch said:


> Wow, your gonna be all sheathed in by winter. I bet your relieved.


I should be...lol
I should be thrilled I got the sucker 'waterproofed'. Yet, I have so much to do to reach lockup. The evil soffit (I wholly dislike working with soffit, as it upside and at heights). Yet, I cannot even think about soffit until I get some exterior XPS foam on, and strapped. That will cost a penny, as will the soffit. Speaking of which, what type of soffit to use...vinyl soffit is ok for narrow soffits, but I have fairly wide soffit. Hardi makes soffit, but working with hardi upside down doesn't resonate with me...lol. I would prefer a wood based soffit, but I cannot go with ply, even well stained, as it becomes a mold magnet.

And my issue about heights and fumbling with erecting a scaffold has me in a pickle...lol

Also, I am still trying to hunt down a suitable paint/sealer for ICF, as I need that on before I can install windows....there are not many easy options on that one. DuRock B-2000 looks like an interesting option, but it needs fiberglass mesh...
I've been googling like mad for an ICF paint/primer/parge coat, and there isn't much out there, but I did find a person who just used acrylic paint...maybe that is good enough. Something to put a UV skin on, and seal.

The 'building' phase is really over, for which I am grateful. I suspect the underlying bugbear I am tackling with, is finding a way to work at heights where the scaffold isn't in the way and is safe. I haven't even been able to nail all the sheathing because the scaffold is in the way, which means tearing it down to put a few nails in, then re-erecting. And just like that, it has gotten almost too cold to put on blueskin at the interface between floors or paint/parge ICF.

And since I've committed to spending all my money on a few windows, I have nothing to tackle the above...haha.
I guess this is where patience comes into play...lol


So close, yet so far away...funny thing, working with wood is the easy part, as I am beginning to understand...it is the finishing bits that'll drive me nuts.


----------



## Steve_S

Hey Melli, on soffit, I used perforated tin soffit which comes in 16' lengths and you cut according to need. My soffits are 24" and run with the rafters, not flat... J-Trim on the wall and the fascia handled the outside... My roof, Fascia & Soffits are Forest Green Tin, by the way...

May be a good option for you, easy to work, light weight too and cheap as chips.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Hey Melli, on soffit, I used perforated tin soffit which comes in 16' lengths and you cut according to need. My soffits are 24" and run with the rafters, not flat... J-Trim on the wall and the fascia handled the outside... My roof, Fascia & Soffits are Forest Green Tin, by the way...
> 
> May be a good option for you, easy to work, light weight too and cheap as chips.


Yeah, aluminum seems to be the strongest, in terms of spans, if one gets a thick gauge. Vinyl is certainly easier to install. Mechanical or chemical damage is not an issue around here (weather - hail, freeze/thaw, UV). Well, I did fix some soffit because of a 'human' issue, like shooting at soffit to get a squirrel (Fail). The big issue is moisture....we are in a constant damp climate for the next 5mths or so. Nothing dries out and we don't get cold enough to dry out the air.
They say vinyl has slightly better R-value. My only concern with aluminum is moisture condensing on metal. Also, I will have soffits slightly tilted (11 degrees). Odd, but I rarely see metal soffits around here, mostly vinyl, some high end places use wood (cedar etc). 
Yet, the lumber yard has metal soffits in stock. Price isn't a driver here, as they are close enough (20% more for aluminum).
The one thing I noticed, is with vinyl, one has many style options (easier to form). I have seen some nice aluminum online...likely have to special order it. The vinyl coated aluminum sounds interesting...best of both worlds. 
Decisions...


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## melli

Been plugging away on sheathing...slowly. This last scaffold build scares the beejesus out of me...lol
Building inspector comes by and scares the p out of me. I was rather curt. Anxiety does that. I am on generator power all day as the utility messes about, and the noise of genny masked his arrival...
I must be near 20ft at my head level. Anyways, almost done sheathing!









I have assumed the winter routine of hitting gym...a way to get my cardio back on track. Up against facility windows they have the reddest Japanese maples I've ever seen. Makes me like red.
















I know back east has the best fall colors, but occasionally we get some (doesn't usually get cold enough at nights).


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## melli

3 more sheets of ply to finish...not counting garage door entrance, which will be the last item on list for making it to the lockup stage. 
I've pretty much come to a full stop. Days are getting short, and my pocket book is bare. Will take a bit, to get used to the new 'normal'...lol
Sort of enjoyed having new pics to share of my progress. Won't be much to post about going forward (way slower pace). While I was fretting over soffit (type, and how to install it), the first thing needed is XPS foam or Roxul board to be applied on walls, as the soffit will butt up against that stuff. Either option will cost a penny. 

I did a temp hardwire of some interior lights in bunker in case I have something to do at night, which will soon be 4:30pm. 
If anyone recalls, I was big on security cams. I had a couple of Hikvision Security Cams. Well, it turns out, I can't update the software on them because they are considered 'grey market' cams, even thought I bought them on Amazon. What a pain. I now have two paperweights. They still work, but won't send email alerts because all Internet providers have switched to a secure email protocol, and I cannot update them because no grey market software exists. Obviously, if a cam can't send alerts, they are useless to me...lol. So, I got an Amcrest cam...not as good, in terms of picture quality as the Hikvisions, but they are not grey market cams, and have the necessary software to send email alerts. Only $120. 
Here is a pic;









And here is the latest progress on bunker...


----------



## oldtruckbbq

I know what you mean about bare pockets. We are mulling over every decision about spending on our property. For instance, I'm using a Poulan Pro chainsaw with an 18" bar that I bought from Walmart a couple years ago to deal with downed branches and a couple dead trees where we live currently. I need a bigger saw to deal with some of the trees I'm going to need to clear, as well as for use with a beam cutter and Alaska mill in the next few months. After researching online, getting input from others on the forum, I opted to buy a used Stihl saw I found on Craigslist for less than 1/2 what the new equivalent would be at a dealer.

Working with a limited budget with a priority on not accumulating debt while paying down credit cards to 0 is a challenge. We aren't going to sacrifice quality and safety, but we will have to be creative about some of the things we do and purchase. I'm a big fan of lists and my wife is a spreadsheet fanatic, so we are keeping a running list of things we want in our place. The top of the list is things that are mandatory, the bottom half is things that would be nice. Nothing gets moved up to the mandatory section until there has been discussion and a list of pros and cons. It works out well for us because I'm a gadget and tool junky and my wife is about as non-techie and tight wad as can be. If it weren't for her, I probably would have already blown the budget on neat stuff we won't need for months, if ever.

I don't know if they have them up in your neck of the woods, but less than an hour from us is a Habitat for Humanity Restore shop. They sell donated and salvaged furniture and building supplies. I'm going to be checking it out later this week since we are supposed to get thunderstorms on my days off this week. About an hour and a half west of us is a huge salvage and surplus building materials place that has some incredible buys. Prices I saw on a lot of things were about half what they would cost at the local stores. 

Some things, such as electrical, plumbing, insulation, and safety just aren't negotiable, but since we are working out of our own pocketbook we are looking for creative ways to get what we need as cheaply as possible. Hope you get dried in soon, and best of luck going forward.


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## melli

It has been a while since I've been to a Habitat for Humanity store, but last time I was there, it was silly. They wanted more for old dated aluminum clad windows than what I could pay new at window store (vinyl). Same for other building materials. I even talked to them about it. Now, I do get a discount at lumber store etc., but HfH should be way cheaper if they want to move product. 
Much of their stuff is dated or not longer code compliant (not an issue if your not getting inspected). 
Perhaps I am a snob...lol
BTW - I am a fan of Poulan Pro...have 2-1/2 (ran over one with excavator). The 50cc model with 20" bar does it all (I got rid of the OEM kiddie bar/chain and have an Oregon bar and their most aggressive chain on it). Having Hi-Lo issues on it (a first)...probably an air leak or partial plug somewhere. I dremelled screwdriver slots into the Hi-Lo adjusters so one doesn't have to buy a special tool.
At any rate, the chainsaws have served me well.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

I don't have any use for aluminum windows because of condensation and temperature conduction issues. Vinyl or vinyl clad is the way to go. I used to work in the glass industry and have been involved in installing and maintaining the equipment used to cut and temper glass make the spacers and insulated glass units. The equipment manufactures have some pretty nice equipment now that instead of using an aluminum spacer between the glass they use a vinyl extrusion that is formed by the machine while the unit is being made. It also creates a vacuum to pull out ambient air and pump in the argon. Pretty neat stuff. 

I'm figuring for windows we will go to the surplus and salvage building materials store. They buy end lots and closeouts for pennies on the dollar. Since we are building the place ourselves, I can buy windows and then design around them. To top it all off, I plan to mill wood from one of the hickory trees I cut down to use to make a custom arch top entry door.

Like you, we will have a lot of sweat equity in the place, but we won't have a mortgage and won't be stumbling upon shoddy work in coming years.

Aside from being hard to start and cold natured, my Poulan Pro with 18" bar does the job. Problem is, I will be doing cutting that will need a bigger bar and the saw I have is rated for a max 20" bar. That isn't big enough to use with an Alaska mill to cut boards and timbers from many of my trees. The Stihl MS440 is over 70cc can handle up to a 32" bar and chain, and it is rated for professional use as a forestry saw so it is more robust than a homeowner saw. I'm going to need that going forward. I bought a used saw from a guy who has more money and gadgets than sense. He has a new Corvette, Suburban, and bass boat parked in his 3 car garage, and a workshop full of top of the line goodies. He sold this saw because he bought a brand new even bigger. He had a Skil 10 1/4" worm drive circular saw that I tried to talk him into selling. He wasn't interested at the time, but he might "later". That would be a great saw for making tenons and squaring beams!

Did I mention that if it weren't for the agreement my wife and I have about discussing purchases, I would have blown the budget on gadgets and tools I might never use? I was reading a book by a timber framing expert and he advised not buying a bunch of tools before you get started, but only buying certain basic tools and then adding to that only as and if you need them so you don't end up with a toolbox full of tools that never get used. What is the fun in that?


----------



## melli

*Construction Pics
*
As many know, I love looking at construction sites. One learns a lot, both good and bad. I've picked up some neat ideas too. I look at everything, from materials used to nail schedule. On this build, I was there about three months ago, and they just started framing...now, they are a month away or less, from lockup.
I took a pic last time of view (this is today's view);








Can't complain about the view...lol. Definitely, a million dollar view, and I suspect, a million dollar build or very close. Hard to believe from street view, but three floors. 
And they are using the same underlay I am using! lol. My bunker feels like a million bucks already...









Quite unassuming from street. Those gable roof beams are decorative (i.e. not spanning all of load bearing wall).








I am mystified why so much money was spent on this house, yet they go with bare min engineered trusses for roof. I like strong roofs.








20" rafter spacing, with 2x4/2x6 rafter construction doesn't make me feel cozy.








Interesting detail - the metal strap up high. The wall is so packed with windows and a monster set of patio doors, they threw that up there to keep the wall from flopping/buckling...not sure it will help in a windstorm...








Looks like a 4 panel patio door.









As always, intrigued by window detailing and what windows they used. That stool/apron (bottom wood trim) appears to be store bought as one piece...I like it, just not the color. Also, the trim has a notch so one can have siding slide behind it (makes things quicker when putting on siding). I just didn't see any caulk behind window flange, and I like to have blueskin around the whole window, not just a foot up as they do here. Looking to left of window, I see the ply sheathing. They left large expansion gaps, yet they blocked and nailed all the gaps (newish code thing). Kind of defeats the purpose of having expansion gaps, if you block them???








I like this...see the very large header to right? But no window or door...hmmm. I see electrical boxes there, so I suspect the engineer/homeowner had a change of plans or it will be blown out once house has final inspection...lol
A common thing, to frame for future plans, legal or illegal.
I noticed most of floor is TJI joists...anything with OSB is sin...lol. Ok, I am a snob, just that OSB never fares well here. And while strong, they are light, and floor can have a bit of bounce as a result (depends on span and depth of TJIs).









This is rather odd...the holes cut into main roof. Above main roof is a fake gable. No idea what is going on up there. And to left is a wall tied into to those engineered rafters. I have to think any door in that wall when slammed will shake the roof...lol










Their window package looks very good. Have to look them up. I see a top clip on top of window...never seen that before. Usually, one puts very few or no nails in top of window to allow 'flexibility' and to minimize leaking. They put a clip on instead (holds window, yet allows wiggle room). They have window horseshoe spacers on bottom to allow any moisture to drain. I've stopped doing that because I've never seen a vinyl window have water issues (plus I overdo window detailing, so no water can ever enter). I think it is a throwback to old-school windows, like aluminum clad windows that condense water. Not suggesting you follow my lead, but if no outside air can get behind window frame, you'll have no condensation, especially on vinyl windows.


----------



## melli

*Construction Part 2
*
One last pic...this is what a building inspector would be most concerned about, albeit, now all plans are engineered approved, so a BI cannot fuss over 'structure'. That is, an engineer trumps a building inspector. 
This is engineered roof trusses that have been hung on a beam, which is then hung on another beam that sits on vertical support (actually I can't see the vertical support in pic)...quite the detail. A lot going on there...









/end


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I don't have any use for aluminum windows because of condensation and temperature conduction issues. Vinyl or vinyl clad is the way to go. I used to work in the glass industry and have been involved in installing and maintaining the equipment used to cut and temper glass make the spacers and insulated glass units. The equipment manufactures have some pretty nice equipment now that instead of using an aluminum spacer between the glass they use a vinyl extrusion that is formed by the machine while the unit is being made. It also creates a vacuum to pull out ambient air and pump in the argon. Pretty neat stuff.
> 
> I'm figuring for windows we will go to the surplus and salvage building materials store. They buy end lots and closeouts for pennies on the dollar. Since we are building the place ourselves, I can buy windows and then design around them. To top it all off, I plan to mill wood from one of the hickory trees I cut down to use to make a custom arch top entry door.
> 
> Like you, we will have a lot of sweat equity in the place, but we won't have a mortgage and won't be stumbling upon shoddy work in coming years.
> 
> Aside from being hard to start and cold natured, my Poulan Pro with 18" bar does the job. Problem is, I will be doing cutting that will need a bigger bar and the saw I have is rated for a max 20" bar. That isn't big enough to use with an Alaska mill to cut boards and timbers from many of my trees. The Stihl MS440 is over 70cc can handle up to a 32" bar and chain, and it is rated for professional use as a forestry saw so it is more robust than a homeowner saw. I'm going to need that going forward. I bought a used saw from a guy who has more money and gadgets than sense. He has a new Corvette, Suburban, and bass boat parked in his 3 car garage, and a workshop full of top of the line goodies. He sold this saw because he bought a brand new even bigger. He had a Skil 10 1/4" worm drive circular saw that I tried to talk him into selling. He wasn't interested at the time, but he might "later". That would be a great saw for making tenons and squaring beams!
> 
> Did I mention that if it weren't for the agreement my wife and I have about discussing purchases, I would have blown the budget on gadgets and tools I might never use? I was reading a book by a timber framing expert and he advised not buying a bunch of tools before you get started, but only buying certain basic tools and then adding to that only as and if you need them so you don't end up with a toolbox full of tools that never get used. What is the fun in that?


Cherish that Stihl saw! That is muscle. I've ripped apart my PP50, and as you are probably aware, it is a virtually a clone of a Husqvarna (made by Husqvarna). Mine has Husqvarna tags on components.
I do like Stihl, but they've become so expensive for parts...

I hear you about tools. I used to buy tools willy nilly (still do on occasion), but have ceased for the most part. I have a Rona table saw, that I've being trying to kill for the past decade, but it keeps on going...lol
I wanted to get a gravity rise Bosch table saw, but only if store brand table saw dies....
Other than flimsy body, the motor is a full 15amps, and motors through most anything. I've kept it outside for years, and it still works fine, with slight body work (PVC glue).
What I really need is a workshop so I can see all my tools in one spot...lol. I have them spread about in sheds and shipping container, which makes it a pain.


----------



## melli

*"Done" Framing!* (* *not really, but I might get a sign off on Monday as I eventually will be covering up framing with typar/foam so I can install soffit. And to do that, I need framing inspected. Bit of an oddball thing, not being totally done, but done enough to get signed off, as progression steps, like framing are not necessarily done before say, Electricians or Plumbers start*)
*
The sheeting/sheathing of build seemed like a never ending story, and at almost $50/sheet of ply, I was really feeling it. I slapped up 'last' piece of ply this evening before the sun set. I do need to frame in garage door, but that will be done much later. No more trips to lumber store for ridiculous priced ply. 









Of course, I am regretting not framing in 2nd floor windows. I was in a panic mode to get the roof done before the rains came, I just ignored them. Tomorrow, I get to mess about framing them in. Not as simple as it usually is, because I went crazy blocking ply seams. But on the whole, it is a change of pace, and I am so looking forward to that...lol

So, looking at above pic, I'm thinking of framing in windows matching main floor windows, except one to far right (delete). The height of windows is 44" off subfloor...wondering if that is kosher for bedroom. 

Installed a light rail, as things were getting dark in bunker. 








Not sure if there is any Mushroom aficionados but I saw this one tonight...way weird. 








And I had to chuckle when I said I stopped buying 'tools'...not sure a drywall step ladder counts as a tool, but I was checking out a drywallers step stool the other day, and was impressed. The stability is second to none and perfect for 8-9' ceilings. 








I was actually shopping for these;
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Qualcraft-2-Rung-Aluminum-Ladder-Jack-2420P/202092097
But I ran into the step ladder first....lol
*
*


----------



## ShannonR

melli said:


> *"Done" Framing!* (* *not really, but I might get a sign off on Monday as I eventually will be covering up framing with typar/foam so I can install soffit. And to do that, I need framing inspected. Bit of an oddball thing, not being totally done, but done enough to get signed off, as progression steps, like framing are not necessarily done before say, Electricians or Plumbers start*)
> *
> The sheeting/sheathing of build seemed like a never ending story, and at almost $50/sheet of ply, I was really feeling it. I slapped up 'last' piece of ply this evening before the sun set. I do need to frame in garage door, but that will be done much later. No more trips to lumber store for ridiculous priced ply.
> 
> View attachment 63165
> 
> Of course, I am regretting not framing in 2nd floor windows. I was in a panic mode to get the roof done before the rains came, I just ignored them. Tomorrow, I get to mess about framing them in. Not as simple as it usually is, because I went crazy blocking ply seams. But on the whole, it is a change of pace, and I am so looking forward to that...lol
> 
> So, looking at above pic, I'm thinking of framing in windows matching main floor windows, except one to far right (delete). The height of windows is 44" off subfloor...wondering if that is kosher for bedroom.
> 
> Installed a light rail, as things were getting dark in bunker.
> View attachment 63166
> 
> Not sure if there is any Mushroom aficionados but I saw this one tonight...way weird.
> View attachment 63167
> 
> And I had to chuckle when I said I stopped buying 'tools'...not sure a drywall step ladder counts as a tool, but I was checking out a drywallers step stool the other day, and was impressed. The stability is second to none and perfect for 8-9' ceilings.
> View attachment 63168
> 
> I was actually shopping for these;
> https://www.homedepot.com/p/Qualcraft-2-Rung-Aluminum-Ladder-Jack-2420P/202092097
> But I ran into the step ladder first....lol


The mushrooms are called orange peel fungus


----------



## melli

Thanks Shannon for the ID. 
Got the first window cut-out. Should have been able to frame it, but I'm in Saturday mode, or rather, my brain is...
I realize I was in panic mode to frame up build, but I should have, at the very least, lined up studs so I could have avoided what I'll have to do (face nail a 1-1/2"x2" board around opening for window to be mounted on). Not the end of the world, but I'd prefer to have it like I did transom windows (aka normal way of framing in a window). 

My Sawzall is a beast...had a long enough blade (two way blade) to cut right through 2x6 studs. 
























Wondering if there is too much symmetry going on there...lol
The deck will break it up, I hope.


----------



## Breezy833

I don't think so, but I've found in my decorating that I enjoy symmetry. 

The deck will look beautiful


----------



## melli

One window done....one more to go. 
Although this one looks like a standard framing job, it is far from it...lol

Hard to see in poor light.


----------



## melli

BTW - I got my framing signed off today! Sweet. Means I can cover it all up (move onto next stage when funds allow). 

I decided to go with Roxul Comfortboard-80 as exterior insulation http://www.roxul.com/products/roxul-comfortboard-80/ . I did some research into XPS/EPS exterior foam, and found out foam expands and contracts quite a bit (Dow Chemical who makes the foam recommends no taping of seams because of this). 
As I thought about it, foam @ 2" thick is too vapor impermeable. Being on wet coast, I need drying potential. And with foam expansion and contraction I might get moisture behind foam, and with limited drying potential behind foam....disaster.
Roxul on the other hand, has excellent drying potential. It is also hydrophobic, doesn't promote mold growth, and vermin don't like it. Plus, it is fireproof, and I don't have to rush to cover it up (no UV concerns). I will have a good housewrap (drain wrap) behind Roxul to keep ply dry. 
The thing I love about Roxul is that it is inert, never decomposes. And the fireproof blanket is nice. And since I will put Roxul Comfortbatt between studs, I effectively make wood framing fireproof. 

Awaiting a quote on a pallet of the stuff.


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## Lisa in WA

Wow...I haven't looked for a while. You're really moving along. Looking great!


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## Steve_S

You will NOT regret Roxul and it's quite nice to work with...


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> You will NOT regret Roxul and it's quite nice to work with...


I've worked with Roxul comfortbatts for almost a decade, but not comfortboard (initially, they never had it in my area). I went with Roxul because of the health concerns I had with pink (fiberglass insulation). I was sold on all the other benefits once I started using it. 
I even poured a cup of water on a horizontal batt...it pooled on top! Lifted batt, and water ran off. 
I should note Roxul still produces some dust (should wear a mask), but it isn't glass, and particles are heavy, so they fall to ground quickly. Plus, no sagging in walls, and one can get nice tight fits. And no itching after the job is done.


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## Steve_S

We both been busy.... This is what I did on the weekend which resulted in my having to take some recovery time as I pushed myself a tad too much (yeah should know better but sometimes I get doing and well that's bad - later).

Pic says a pile so here it is...








A side note... I have run into few folks with Radiant Heat and they complain it's not good for them, so upon further questioning & discussion, virtually all of them have a regular wall thermostat on the wall reading Air Temp (which has little to do with the floor mass temp) and when they decide to run a woodstove or other do not understand WHY the radiant heating doesn't come on... Because I have 2 other heat sources with my woodstove as primary backup, I put a 12' sleeve into the slab to centre it (well pretty much) and that has a Thermistor Sensor (easily replaceable) to read Slab Temp which is what actually guides the Real Time temp... While not in use ATM (will be very shortly \\YAY//) I expect I won't be putting the thermostat above 22C / 72F as experience has shown that will make the shack quite cozy and IF I get a chill (or need ambience) I can toss a log into the woodstove.


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> We both been busy.... This is what I did on the weekend which resulted in my having to take some recovery time as I pushed myself a tad too much (yeah should know better but sometimes I get doing and well that's bad - later).
> 
> Pic says a pile so here it is...
> View attachment 63202
> 
> A side note... I have run into few folks with Radiant Heat and they complain it's not good for them, so upon further questioning & discussion, virtually all of them have a regular wall thermostat on the wall reading Air Temp (which has little to do with the floor mass temp) and when they decide to run a woodstove or other do not understand WHY the radiant heating doesn't come on... Because I have 2 other heat sources with my woodstove as primary backup, I put a 12' sleeve into the slab to centre it (well pretty much) and that has a Thermistor Sensor (easily replaceable) to read Slab Temp which is what actually guides the Real Time temp... While not in use ATM (will be very shortly \\YAY//) I expect I won't be putting the thermostat above 22C / 72F as experience has shown that will make the shack quite cozy and IF I get a chill (or need ambience) I can toss a log into the woodstove.


Excellent call on the thermistor in the slab, especially in a sleeve so it can be replaced easily if needed. Thermostat placement is perhaps the most overlooked, yet very crucial, part of a heating/cooling system. I have worked in calibration, engineering, and maintenance almost my entire adult life and it amazes me how little people understand about how or why systems work. Just makes sense to me, but to some people it is voodoo that their brains can't seem to understand no matter how hard you try to explain it to them.


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## melli

Very nice Steve! 
Now take a less blurry pic and label all the components? lol 

You got me thinking about a neighbor's setup...at the time, I was like what! Now, I understand most of it, but still...









The main panel, well controller and pressure tank is on another wall...









At the time, I was interested in their transfer switch...up in Canada, our paranoid electrical rules require a separate panel for genny items (although, now, we can buy a very expensive two tier panel). I hear in USA, one can have a interlock switch. 









They seem pretty happy with their off-the-shelf Generac system.


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## Steve_S

Luckily mine is a simple Single Zone, Closed system and no rocket science required. The entire assembly (plumbing, pump, controllers etc) came premounted on a plywood panel, assembled & pressure tested at Radiant Co's shop, I just had to hook it to the floor manifold and plumb the water heater to it... /me likes KISS principle.

Hmmm a complicated Multi-Zone Open System so they use that for both heating & hot water. I chose to use a closed system just for the Radiant Heating and a separate On-Demand heater for my hot water, propane fueled though... no electric water tanks in my life ever again... major power sucker ! Think of it like leaving you car idling in the driveway 7/24 just in case you might decide to go for a drive... Every Hour a Hot Water tank goes off and uses power to keep 40+ gallons of water hot Just in case you flip a tap on. Hydro Co's love big tanks... not so smart in the new reality of energy costs & conservation.

If you design the wiring system properly, you can use an ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) to a Genny that feeds to base power as a backup. My Solar setup has an Inverter/Charger (Marine Class) combo which can take the power from a Genny and charge the batteries while feeding the shack as well, so slightly different challenges...

Generac is a tad out of my price range and I have two gennies, a 7200/9000 Champion for my bigger jobs & a 3Kw King Canada Inverter Generator for most regular puttering about, either can feed my solar system. Champion does make House Standby Gennies which I have been looking at as a possibility IF needed down the road. Bang for buck and flexibility these win, especially considering they can be Propane / Natural Gas which has advantages over gasoline fueled beasties. IMO https://www.championpowerequipment....rators/?fwp_product_filter_product_regions=ca


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Luckily mine is a simple Single Zone, Closed system and no rocket science required. The entire assembly (plumbing, pump, controllers etc) came premounted on a plywood panel, assembled & pressure tested at Radiant Co's shop, I just had to hook it to the floor manifold and plumb the water heater to it... /me likes KISS principle.
> 
> Hmmm a complicated Multi-Zone Open System so they use that for both heating & hot water. I chose to use a closed system just for the Radiant Heating and a separate On-Demand heater for my hot water, propane fueled though... no electric water tanks in my life ever again... major power sucker ! Think of it like leaving you car idling in the driveway 7/24 just in case you might decide to go for a drive... Every Hour a Hot Water tank goes off and uses power to keep 40+ gallons of water hot Just in case you flip a tap on. Hydro Co's love big tanks... not so smart in the new reality of energy costs & conservation.
> 
> If you design the wiring system properly, you can use an ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) to a Genny that feeds to base power as a backup. My Solar setup has an Inverter/Charger (Marine Class) combo which can take the power from a Genny and charge the batteries while feeding the shack as well, so slightly different challenges...
> 
> Generac is a tad out of my price range and I have two gennies, a 7200/9000 Champion for my bigger jobs & a 3Kw King Canada Inverter Generator for most regular puttering about, either can feed my solar system. Champion does make House Standby Gennies which I have been looking at as a possibility IF needed down the road. Bang for buck and flexibility these win, especially considering they can be Propane / Natural Gas which has advantages over gasoline fueled beasties. IMO https://www.championpowerequipment....rators/?fwp_product_filter_product_regions=ca


Wow, that is simple! Very cool they hook it all up and pressure test it before it leaves their factory. 
Although, that sort of thing is in my rear view mirror...kind of curious what that costs?

Yeah, electric HWT are inefficient relative to an on-demand, but I like them because I have almost three days of warm-hot water in a power outage. 
Need a big genny to power up a HWT or on-demand one. 
Speaking of which, a neighbor has a on-demand electric HW system...paid a small fortune for it. Plus, being an early adopter, bought one that went MIA, in terms of parts, so he had to buy a completely new system.

I'm ok with a HWT, as they are cheap, and I will be living here, using HWT, so cost isn't crazy.


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## melli

Hacking through a freshly built wall takes some courage I think...definitely a dusty affair. I measure a thousand times, as I cannot make a mistake. And these window rough-ins are a tad tricky.
So, I have the window slightly more towards the corner than the first floor window. I figure with computer desk in corner, it'll give me two window views...doesn't look all bad from an aesthetic point of view.
















And the view from one window is perfect










BTW - much easier this window than the last, as I got to adjust window opening so one edge lines up with a stud.


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## Steve_S

OK....

My On Demand systems are propane, standby power use is minimal and is only used by the exhaust fan (hot water) which maxes at 3a. and the exhaust fan + pump on the radiant heater which is less than 2a while running.

The Takagi cost me $800 USD and this is not a small unit and could do double duty, included the S-636 Venting Kit (retails in Canada for $145). Add on the Valve kit by GSW @ 200 CAD. NOTE that GSW in Canada is Takagi for On-Demand systems.

With LP your not wasting fuel, power is minimal and any little genny can run it when power is down... Besides, you should be thinking towards installing a Powerwall battery bank for the future troubles headed your way... Site-C won't happen and so everyone in BC will suffer it. What a freakin nightmare that is.... Cristy still pushing her pet pipeline too... goodness gracious... 

Takagi is Japanese and is considered Cadillac Quality if you will and been making them for a few decades. Many Companies actually use Takagi Guts & Electronics just rebranded, like GSW.

My Hot Water heater is an EccoTemp which is Chinese... I bought an earlier version (FVI-12-LP) which is fine... cost about 375 USD when I bought it, plus exhaust kit @ 300 + valving kit @ 200.. BUT now I would buy their newer version the 45HI-LP with the condensing feature (Home Depot Canada with venting kit = $1021, lowes also carries it and variants).

My Radiant Kit which included all valves, gauges, pump, electronics mounted and tested was $1,000 USD and that included the 400' of 7/8" PEX for in the concrete and the manifold for it too... All I had to provide was 12' of 3/4" copper, fittings to connect and a few bits I wanted being the retentive detail guy I am.... 

BTW: On Demand water heating was in use before Hot Water Tanks came into vogue so this is NOT new tech, it is mature tech but semi-new to people in North America... Round Houses were used for 4000+ years before square / rectangular homes came in vogue (mostly proliferated by the Romans in Europe and their sphere of influence) and guess what, people are starting to build round houses again because they have come to make some realizations that the ancient people sorted out millennia ago. IF I was to build again (won't happen) I would go Round and enjoy it's benefits and increased space.


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## melli

While sourcing housewrap, I was put onto VaproShield, a maker of housewrap. Supposedly, it is the next gen of housewrap. BI brought me a sample...it reminds me of Gortex, but much thicker, and impossible to rip by hand. 
Some folks in municipal dept., did a test, fill a container with water, and having the VaporShield stuff as a bottom...no leaks. They reversed it and air was able to escape. The green stuff is more permeable the the orange...and has been around for a while. 








Steve - I should have noted that gas is not in the picture for me. Just not a fan of any gas appliances. 
Yeah, kind of odd my neighbor had such problems with his system, given Europe is big on on-demand HW. 
And with the prices your quoting, gas seems to be the way to go! But I just don't feel good about gas for a number of reasons.


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## Steve_S

LPG / Propane is good, as it will NOT sour or go bad over time. It is unfortunately a by-product of gasoline refining so subject to the whims of Big Petro and their shenanigans. As a Low Pressure Gas, these can be used with Biogas which was part of my original plan BUT as time has gone on and as my clock is running down, I will be sticking with LPG... Down the road if someone wants to change it up, they can... I do believe that Maggie won't have the heart to use the cabin after I am gone, so it will likely hit the market in < 5 years but that's up to her. I am documenting everything on the builkd and even putting in notes in between studs etrcx explaining routing of wires, where connections are, what screws to remove if you want to remove / change walls etc.... I don't think many folks make Ink / Marker notes on studs & inside walls for future work... Even my electrical system is done with the ability to upgrade to larger service (#6/3 NMWU wiring in place, just dead headed with ample extra to run wire into panel). The original idea was to use LPG for 2-3 yrs while I built a Biogas system and got it running to fuel the little bit of propane requirements for the shack... Ohhh well...

BTW: No new Gas / LPG Appliance uses pilot lights, they are all electronic ignition with a safety valve that prevents gas flow without ignition (Code in Ontario BUT I believe it is National Code here now). It's not like 20 years ago when that stuff could blow up... I had a Caloric Cookstove blow up on me some 20 years ago, hence why I say that.

EDIT.... By Happenstance I just came across this article:
https://cleantechnica.com/2017/11/0...s-3-hours-cooking-gas-per-day-kitchen-scraps/ Imagine that, kitchen waste to Biogas....


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## oldtruckbbq

I put in an electric on demand heater once in an application where the cost of extending a gas line to it was cost prohibitive, especially considering that it was for a bathroom that would see occasional use. The big problem with it was temperature rise. We had wonderful hot water a good part of the year, but when it got cold out and the incoming water temperature dropped down by 20 degrees, we only got warmish water because the heater could only get a certain temperature rise. And yes, I used the inlet and outlet line sizes specified by the manufacturer. I have been studying passive solar water heating systems and really like the idea. Basically, it is used to feed either a tank or an on demand system. Rather than running ground temperature water into your secondary water heater you are bringing 100+ degree water into it so it doesn't take as much energy to get the desired temperature rise. Best of all, the system can be made using the tanks from defunct water heaters so there can be minimal cost in setting up a system. A little plumbing, carpentry, and black paint and you are good to go.

Interesting that you bring up round houses Steve S. We are gathering materials to build a cordwood house on our property. With cordwood, it is very easy to build a round house. The challenges come in with placing doors, windows, and the roof. The biggest benefit the proponents tout are that there are virtually no cold corners in a round house save those you create with partition walls, and wind becomes less of a factor because no matter what direction the wind comes from there is the same surface area presented, and the load is much less because the round shape redirects air flow instead of blocking it and building up pressure. A round house also broadens the range of views available from windows as well. 

I don't know if we will go with radiant heating in the floor, but it seems reasonable to me that it would be well worth the cost to put the plumbing in the slab to allow radiant heating should we decide to go that way in the future. I spent a year in Korea when I was in the Army and experienced radiant heating for the first time. The fact that they use a low table and pillows on the floor for the dining table and their bed is basically a pallet on the floor make radiant heat a fantastic solution. And it sure is nice walking on a warm floor in the dead of winter.


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## Steve_S

@oldtruckbbq by all means install the pex into your flooring and do it right... When the concrete is poured is the only time to do it. A Combo solar collector & On Demand heater can heat your floors, the radiant co has info on their site specifically dedicated to that. You could even do your hot water with the combo and so you get 3 uses out of one system...

Roundhouses have many advantages like those you mentioned and a few more... nowhere for the wind to hook it is a biggy and that pays back too... Loads etc are handled differently too so there is some flexibilities to take advantage of.

I have A Particular rule I adhere to as much as possible, that is "the rule of three" which in my cabineering project means everything has 3 uses, or 3 backups, or 3 methods... I have 3 power sources, 3 heat sources, 3 methods to get my water, etc... best crisis management is planning to avoid it and manage the potentials before it happens... Rough north country living and having endured ice storms and such fun events, much CYA is applied.


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## melli

Finished off 2nd Floor window...was going to motor some more today, but I lost my motivation.


----------



## melli

The day was going to be a write-off, but Lostcaper and his road building thread lit a fire under me...lol
I lost a dozen or so cedars to the summer drought and have been meaning to take them down, but the house build has taken all of my time. A nice diversion. 
















A neighbor wants the cedar for split rail fencing...saves me from burning them. 









Sorry about the blurry pic...camera doesn't like low light.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> Luckily mine is a simple Single Zone, Closed system and no rocket science required. The entire assembly (plumbing, pump, controllers etc) came premounted on a plywood panel, assembled & pressure tested at Radiant Co's shop, I just had to hook it to the floor manifold and plumb the water heater to it... /me likes KISS principle.
> 
> Hmmm a complicated Multi-Zone Open System so they use that for both heating & hot water. I chose to use a closed system just for the Radiant Heating and a separate On-Demand heater for my hot water, propane fueled though... no electric water tanks in my life ever again... major power sucker ! Think of it like leaving you car idling in the driveway 7/24 just in case you might decide to go for a drive... Every Hour a Hot Water tank goes off and uses power to keep 40+ gallons of water hot Just in case you flip a tap on. Hydro Co's love big tanks... not so smart in the new reality of energy costs & conservation.
> 
> If you design the wiring system properly, you can use an ATS (Automatic Transfer Switch) to a Genny that feeds to base power as a backup. My Solar setup has an Inverter/Charger (Marine Class) combo which can take the power from a Genny and charge the batteries while feeding the shack as well, so slightly different challenges...
> 
> Generac is a tad out of my price range and I have two gennies, a 7200/9000 Champion for my bigger jobs & a 3Kw King Canada Inverter Generator for most regular puttering about, either can feed my solar system. Champion does make House Standby Gennies which I have been looking at as a possibility IF needed down the road. Bang for buck and flexibility these win, especially considering they can be Propane / Natural Gas which has advantages over gasoline fueled beasties. IMO https://www.championpowerequipment....rators/?fwp_product_filter_product_regions=ca


I got a quote today from Radiant Company for a single zone system using a Takagi on demand water heater to supply domestic water and heat. It was less than what it would have cost for a central forced air heat system and a water heater! My wife loves the idea. She considers radiant heat to be "luxurious". We had some friends who added a master suite to their home and they installed radiant heat in it. She absolutely loved the warm bathroom floor. The fact that Radiant Company makes it so affordable and user friendly for the DIYer is pretty amazing. Thanks for sharing the info, it is going to save us a lot of money and make our house cozier.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> The day was going to be a write-off, but Lostcaper and his road building thread lit a fire under me...lol
> I lost a dozen or so cedars to the summer drought and have been meaning to take them down, but the house build has taken all of my time. A nice diversion.
> View attachment 63259
> 
> View attachment 63260
> 
> A neighbor wants the cedar for split rail fencing...saves me from burning them.
> 
> View attachment 63261
> 
> Sorry about the blurry pic...camera doesn't like low light.


Man, those cedars would be enough for at least an 8x8 section of wall in our cordwood home!


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## Steve_S

oldtruckbbq said:


> I got a quote today from Radiant Company for a single zone system using a Takagi on demand water heater to supply domestic water and heat. It was less than what it would have cost for a central forced air heat system and a water heater!


Glad you checked it out and discovered the pleasant surprise lurking around the corner. Surprising how many people make an assumption and decide "oh that will cost a pile" and never even call or consider it... Then you have others who will rail against something simply because they are not familiar with it and so they decide it must have problems (like arguing with someone over a water tank VS on-demand, it's a no brainer) and of course the rare screw up where some doofus messes up an on-demand hot water system will always surface as proof that these are all bad... You would be surprised that I have had those discussions with some, learned that when someone is so "preset" best to chuckle and walk away and let them suffer in their ignorance while they hemorrhage cash out on their bills.

I have to tell you that when I got the manifold & assembly and was looking at it all I thought the way they did the work, even cleaned up the copper works etc, you can see the pride they take in their work, it was artworthy... if I was a Steam Punk oriented fellow I would have done something with it in that line and made it a display kind of thing. Radiant Heat is also quite healthy for the human body, it's passive, carries / distributes nothing into the atmosphere (unlike a hot air furnace blowing dusts, moulds etc everywhere) and when you lay down on it, it's nice on the back. (My auto mechanic had radiant floor installed when he built his shop to save his back and knees, praises the value of it daily) You remember I am in North East Ontario Canada - Land of Deep Colds and crazy snows...

Yeah the pricing is good, product quality high, good instructions (be patient reading & watching the videos), good support over the phone. Lesson Learned Dept: I set the Manifold where I felt it would be best and had space for it BUT we switched out plans in mid build a little and went with a 36" front door as opposed to the original plan for 34... meant shifting a few things over and making the closet smaller a tad where it is installed, ok that little bit difference made things tougher... In hindsight, I should likely have used the same system for both heating & hot water (although the Takagi uses much more gas than my Eccotemp so maybe still did the right thing). I have it set to a corner of my build which fort radiant heating is fine BUT had I went with using for both heat & hot water I would have installed it central to my water use points to keep the plumbing runs as short as possible (essential with on-demand hot water). You may have also noticed that they can use Solar Hot Water collectors in combo as well, so if you wanted to lower energy use further that might be worthwhile considering from the outset in your planning. I know your early into your planning but seriously consider options like Solar Power, Solar Hot Water and other things during the design stage is pretty important as you can build something that will cost much less to operate and maintain while paying you back over the years you will enjoy it. You know energy costs will never go down, reliability is dubious into the future and solar power IS also independence & freedom while letting you keep precious pesos in your pocket rather than giving it to some Ferengi Business.

Something to note, they use different options for the Thermistor kits, slab temp read only, slab & air temp combo etc... mine is a simple Slab Only sensor system as I have woodstove and other heat sources too and my place is small. Your going bigger and a bit fancier so have a look at the control systems that Radiant Co uses and get the one that has the most flexibility for you and your potential application. Here is the link to the company that supplies the controls. https://www.azeltec.com/catalog.html


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> Glad you checked it out and discovered the pleasant surprise lurking around the corner. Surprising how many people make an assumption and decide "oh that will cost a pile" and never even call or consider it... Then you have others who will rail against something simply because they are not familiar with it and so they decide it must have problems (like arguing with someone over a water tank VS on-demand, it's a no brainer) and of course the rare screw up where some doofus messes up an on-demand hot water system will always surface as proof that these are all bad... You would be surprised that I have had those discussions with some, learned that when someone is so "preset" best to chuckle and walk away and let them suffer in their ignorance while they hemorrhage cash out on their bills.
> 
> I have to tell you that when I got the manifold & assembly and was looking at it all I thought the way they did the work, even cleaned up the copper works etc, you can see the pride they take in their work, it was artworthy... if I was a Steam Punk oriented fellow I would have done something with it in that line and made it a display kind of thing. Radiant Heat is also quite healthy for the human body, it's passive, carries / distributes nothing into the atmosphere (unlike a hot air furnace blowing dusts, moulds etc everywhere) and when you lay down on it, it's nice on the back. (My auto mechanic had radiant floor installed when he built his shop to save his back and knees, praises the value of it daily) You remember I am in North East Ontario Canada - Land of Deep Colds and crazy snows...
> 
> Yeah the pricing is good, product quality high, good instructions (be patient reading & watching the videos), good support over the phone. Lesson Learned Dept: I set the Manifold where I felt it would be best and had space for it BUT we switched out plans in mid build a little and went with a 36" front door as opposed to the original plan for 34... meant shifting a few things over and making the closet smaller a tad where it is installed, ok that little bit difference made things tougher... In hindsight, I should likely have used the same system for both heating & hot water (although the Takagi uses much more gas than my Eccotemp so maybe still did the right thing). I have it set to a corner of my build which fort radiant heating is fine BUT had I went with using for both heat & hot water I would have installed it central to my water use points to keep the plumbing runs as short as possible (essential with on-demand hot water). You may have also noticed that they can use Solar Hot Water collectors in combo as well, so if you wanted to lower energy use further that might be worthwhile considering from the outset in your planning. I know your early into your planning but seriously consider options like Solar Power, Solar Hot Water and other things during the design stage is pretty important as you can build something that will cost much less to operate and maintain while paying you back over the years you will enjoy it. You know energy costs will never go down, reliability is dubious into the future and solar power IS also independence & freedom while letting you keep precious pesos in your pocket rather than giving it to some Ferengi Business.
> 
> Something to note, they use different options for the Thermistor kits, slab temp read only, slab & air temp combo etc... mine is a simple Slab Only sensor system as I have woodstove and other heat sources too and my place is small. Your going bigger and a bit fancier so have a look at the control systems that Radiant Co uses and get the one that has the most flexibility for you and your potential application. Here is the link to the company that supplies the controls. https://www.azeltec.com/catalog.html


Haha. I hear you Steve! Your absolutely right. I just don't want gas in my place...lol
As safe as it has become, it hasn't become safe enough for my paranoia....lol
Plus, it is one less thing to worry about. Not making excuses (or maybe I am), but I am trying to build a cosy, efficient home, and it is currently, sucking all my money and brain power....I have nothing left to tackle gas appliances. And I see it as a minor issue, in terms of my home...a wood stove solves house heat. Heating the water is the least of my worries. 
Eventually, I will consider solar panels (both thermal and electrical). I just need to get house livable. 

Where you live, I can easily see gas as a must-have. Where I am, not so much. And with your messed up Electrical Utility, gas is the only way...lol. I've heard of the monthly tab for using electric heat back east or on prairies...almost as much as rent...maybe more.


----------



## Steve_S

Electric is now the most expensive of the options in Ontario thanks to Mz Wynne and she had the audacity to go and spend 6 billion from the sale of Hydro One Line Services on a purchasing Avista, which operates in Washington state, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Alaska AND it comes with a 2 billion dollar environmental cleanup bill for it's coal ash dumps and other legacy detritus. And people though BC had it bad with Christy... /me disconnecting from the LOT, to hell with that noise... Some things make me wanna scream blue murder... not much mention either that they have to spend I believe 30 Billion on Nuclear Refurbs for Darlington and to keep Pickering running (even though it's ancient and a disaster waiting to happen) and they are NOT telling the people how that will be paid for either .... yeah, right, like that's a hard one to figure out... the enevr ending debt retirement charges will just go on another 25 years till the next batch of refurbs and STILL no real / proper nuclear waste storage facilities... Chalk River is close to max capacity and it's having problems with poor, older containment systems which are failing... but shhhh don't tell anyone...

Current rates where I am which is Rural Residential, Medium Density rate group: On-Peak = 13.2¢, Mid-Peak = 9.5¢ & Off-Peak = 6.5¢ per kWh. This is with the rebates & correction for their aggressive pricing earlier this yr.

I'm donating 3 lifts of 4'x8'x2" PolyISO I have left over to some friends so they can cut their heating bills down and keep some of their cash in their pockets... They are stuck on Oil Heat and last year that cost them in the order of $900 for the winter on their small (< 900 sq feet) house and they don't raise the thermostat above 21c so....


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Electric is now the most expensive of the options in Ontario thanks to Mz Wynne and she had the audacity to go and spend 6 billion from the sale of Hydro One Line Services on a purchasing Avista, which operates in Washington state, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Alaska AND it comes with a 2 billion dollar environmental cleanup bill for it's coal ash dumps and other legacy detritus. And people though BC had it bad with Christy... /me disconnecting from the LOT, to hell with that noise... Some things make me wanna scream blue murder... not much mention either that they have to spend I believe 30 Billion on Nuclear Refurbs for Darlington and to keep Pickering running (even though it's ancient and a disaster waiting to happen) and they are NOT telling the people how that will be paid for either .... yeah, right, like that's a hard one to figure out... the enevr ending debt retirement charges will just go on another 25 years till the next batch of refurbs and STILL no real / proper nuclear waste storage facilities... Chalk River is close to max capacity and it's having problems with poor, older containment systems which are failing... but shhhh don't tell anyone...
> 
> Current rates where I am which is Rural Residential, Medium Density rate group: On-Peak = 13.2¢, Mid-Peak = 9.5¢ & Off-Peak = 6.5¢ per kWh. This is with the rebates & correction for their aggressive pricing earlier this yr.
> 
> I'm donating 3 lifts of 4'x8'x2" PolyISO I have left over to some friends so they can cut their heating bills down and keep some of their cash in their pockets... They are stuck on Oil Heat and last year that cost them in the order of $900 for the winter on their small (< 900 sq feet) house and they don't raise the thermostat above 21c so....


Thankfully, we don't have nuclear in our neck of the woods. I've heard of Ontario's woes. The issue with our utility is government's love of money. They pilfer BC Hydro whenever they get a chance. Plus, half of BC Hydro's employees are on the 'sunshine list' (more than 100k salary). 
While we are one of the cheapest producers in world, our provincial government has locked us into exorbitant deals with private run-of-river producers. I wish I had invested in that money machine...lol

Hmmm, I didn't know a flock of Ravens was called a 'congress, conspiracy or unkindness'. Well, my two Ravens were joined by dozens today when I gave them some granola. First time that has happened. Now, they are fighting...lol
Poppa Raven is not happy. He is attacking all comers. Momma is flying around squawking. Well, that is the end of that. Can't have dozens of Ravens squawking at each other. They are big birds and noisy as all hell.


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## melli

We've entered the late fall windstorm rinse cycle. A parade of pacific fronts spin up off coast, then pound us, one after another. Wouldn't be such a fuss (peak winds 50mph/80kph), but given we are in a forest, it causes a lot of headache with fallen trees and power outages. 

Haven't heard a squeak from my build, so that is a good sign. I need to cover up main floor east windows, as wind driven rain is coming in (not a lot). Plus, it gets breezy inside. I'm up at 5am because I hear the bloody forest making a racket (and the occasional thud). I have wised up a bit, and have genny set up on station (beside power panel). Really sucks moving genny into position, in a windstorm, in the dark. 

Got a pail of Blue Seal (https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.waterproofing-rubber-membrane.1000162969.html), but cannot use it because first, it was too cold, now too wet...Need to get a coat on around windows, so I have a smooth surface to apply peel-n-stick membrane (prep windows). Also, would be nice to sand ICF walls, but again, too wet. 

Glad I got rid of dead cedars. Although, there was a chance they could eventually fall in windstorm, they were not in vicinity of any buildings. I just think it was good for the soul, to have a `clean`yard. Staring at brown trees ruins the view of things. And since I jumped on it before they disintegrated, I had little `needle`debris. I then took my trailer, filled it up with fill and infilled the holes where dead trees used to be...limed, fertilized and planted grass seed (probably only place in Canada where one can get away with that at this time of year...lol). Grass should be dark green, but summer killed most of it. Skid marks in background is where a mess of cedars died. 










Been puttering, doing odd things, like going over sheathing, making sure I got everything nailed, pulling nails that missed. Yesterday, I removed bracing for windows. That really made a difference for light.


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## Mr Bond

Looking great Melli!

May I ask what the comfortboard is costing (and dimensions)? Roxul is amazing stuff!


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Looking great Melli!
> 
> May I ask what the comfortboard is costing (and dimensions)? Roxul is amazing stuff!


Thanks for bringing it up, as I revisited a quote I got, and it doesn't make sense...40sqft bags for $55.99. 
I was going to get a pallet which is 18 bags. ~ $1130 (which works out to about $1.57 sqft)
But, as i think about it, how a 4'x8' (32sqft) sheet is supposed to fit in a 40sqft bag is mystifying. Even if a 2'x8' boards. I gave them the right product code 168607...
I'm thinking he mixed up comfortboard with comfortbatts. 
I tried to get a quote from Rona, but they tell me I have to buy a 'truck's' worth! 3700sqft. 
They are telling me I can get 2'x8' sheets easily, but 4'x8' sheets are harder to come by...the less seams I have, the better. Plus, I will need to use more special fasteners. http://www.grip-rite.com/us/en/fasteners/nails/grip-capr-plastic-cap-nail
They have metal cap nails, but not keen on metal caps. Whatever I use is really temporary, as I'll be strapping insulation with PT furring strips (1/2" x 2") for rainscreening.


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## Steve_S

geez, wish I could ship a couple of lifts of 2" PolyISO I have left over to you - darn 3500 mile distance... I am donating it to a friend down the road to help them cut their heating costs, so my left overs will go to good use and helping the environment just another little bit, it all counts.

I think the folks at Rona are confused (seems to be a store culture issues I think with all Rona's) the comfort boards. Seems like 4'x8' is only available in ComfortBoard 80, info from Roxul direct:
*COMFORTBOARD™ 110 http://www.roxul.com/products/comfortboard-110/*
Thickness 1" (25.4mm), 1.25" (32mm), 2" (50.8mm), 2.5" (63.5mm), 3" (76.2mm)
Dimensions 24"x48" (610mm x 1219mm), 48"x72" (1219mm x 1829mm)​*COMFORTBOARD™ 80 http://www.roxul.com/products/roxul-comfortboard-80/*
Thickness 1.25" (31.8mm), 1.5" (38.1mm), 2" (50.8mm), 3" (76.2mm)
Dimensions 24"x48"(610x1219mm), 36"x48"(914x1219mm), 48"x72"(1219x1829mm), 48"x96"(1219x2438mm)​


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## Mr Bond

I find few outside of commercial contractors know about comfortboard, and assume batts. Hopefully as external insulation takes off with the new building codes it will become more common and easily available. For now you may have more luck talking to a steel cladding installer or even Roxul direct, after all it is made in BC......


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> I find few outside of commercial contractors know about comfortboard, and assume batts. Hopefully as external insulation takes off with the new building codes it will become more common and easily available. For now you may have more luck talking to a steel cladding installer or even Roxul direct, after all it is made in BC......


I got a Roxul Customer Service person working on the issue. 
And one of the local lumber stores finally got me a legit quote of $866 for 640sqft (20 - 4'x8' sheets). 

We had a break from the rinse cycle, so I decided to prep the windows. A 5" palm sander (40-60 grit paper) works like a charm in smoothing out foam, and removing the oxidation (thin film)...dusty job. I then trimmed off vapor barrier, and applied 'Blue Seal' (link noted in previous post). Wasn't what I expected at all. It had the consistency of fine drywall compound, so using a roller was out. I used a very wide putty knife. The idea is to get a fairly smooth adhesive surface so blueskin or some butyl based window flashing can adhere to foam. Plus, the blue seal will hopefully stop moisture migrating to window box. I will likely need to apply another coat...or two (of course, it started raining as soon as I finished). Blue seal is supposed to film dry in 4-6hrs, but I am applying near it's low temp range. It has no VOCs. Reminds me of acrylic paint except it is like drywall compound in consistency.


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## MoBookworm1957

Update on cousin's place:
Going to start working back out there after 8 Dec 2017.
Been working on inside plumbing(frozen Pipes in laundry room.)
Laundry room, bathroom completely replumbed.
Laundry room completely moved to opposite side of house.
It's now in the worthless pantry.
And reworked to tie in with bathroom plumbing.
Old laundry room has been re sheet rocked.
It's now the new functional pantry.
New laundry room is tight on space beings it's now under the stairs.
No room for laundry to pile up clean or dirty. 
Laundry room is now on south side of house under stairs.
Instead of north side of house with no insulation,pipe wrap etc.
New pantry has room for freezer(instead of it being in living room), shelving,
Cabinets.
Functioning part of house now.
Now to get rid of old piano.
It's going to the metal barn as soon as we can get 10 hefty guys out there at the same time.
Chimmey has been cleaned, brick work repointed.
Still working on sapling size horse weeds.
But at least now you can get up and down the road without feels like you're in forest of horse weeds. You can now see top of earth contact roof from the road. Before you couldn't.
Put in new culvert on road,gravel,fenced gully better so now at least you won't fall off into it if you start to slide. Rebuilt the road in sections parts had sheared off due to erioson.
Planted native Missouri grasses and plants on banks of road.
Finished clearing out the last of poison ivy,oak, and sumac around the house, garden,chicken yard,goat pen. Come spring got 15 more acres to clear of that crap.
All fencing around house,garden,chicken yard, goat pen has been replaced(jerry rigged) with new posts, gates and fencing.
Dad's happier, she stays for now.
Dad, my brother and myself walked all property last week.
Still need to clean couple of ponds and springs, but that will have to wait till spring.
Dad liked what I had started with barn.
My new well goes in come spring.
The well I use now is cousin's.
Her husband is type of guy if he gets mad.
He'll cut the water off.


----------



## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> I got a Roxul Customer Service person working on the issue.
> And one of the local lumber stores finally got me a legit quote of $866 for 640sqft (20 - 4'x8' sheets).
> 
> We had a break from the rinse cycle, so I decided to prep the windows. A 5" palm sander (40-60 grit paper) works like a charm in smoothing out foam, and removing the oxidation (thin film)...dusty job. I then trimmed off vapor barrier, and applied 'Blue Seal' (link noted in previous post). Wasn't what I expected at all. It had the consistency of fine drywall compound, so using a roller was out. I used a very wide putty knife. The idea is to get a fairly smooth adhesive surface so blueskin or some butyl based window flashing can adhere to foam. Plus, the blue seal will hopefully stop moisture migrating to window box. I will likely need to apply another coat...or two (of course, it started raining as soon as I finished). Blue seal is supposed to film dry in 4-6hrs, but I am applying near it's low temp range. It has no VOCs. Reminds me of acrylic paint except it is like drywall compound in consistency.
> 
> View attachment 63348
> 
> View attachment 63349
> 
> View attachment 63350


Looks good melli.
Thanks for the inspiration!


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Update on cousin's place:
> Going to start working back out there after 8 Dec 2017.
> Been working on inside plumbing(frozen Pipes in laundry room.)
> Laundry room, bathroom completely replumbed.
> Laundry room completely moved to opposite side of house.
> It's now in the worthless pantry.
> And reworked to tie in with bathroom plumbing.
> Old laundry room has been re sheet rocked.
> It's now the new functional pantry.
> New laundry room is tight on space beings it's now under the stairs.
> No room for laundry to pile up clean or dirty.
> Laundry room is now on south side of house under stairs.
> Instead of north side of house with no insulation,pipe wrap etc.
> New pantry has room for freezer(instead of it being in living room), shelving,
> Cabinets.
> Functioning part of house now.
> Now to get rid of old piano.
> It's going to the metal barn as soon as we can get 10 hefty guys out there at the same time.
> Chimmey has been cleaned, brick work repointed.
> Still working on sapling size horse weeds.
> But at least now you can get up and down the road without feels like you're in forest of horse weeds. You can now see top of earth contact roof from the road. Before you couldn't.
> Put in new culvert on road,gravel,fenced gully better so now at least you won't fall off into it if you start to slide. Rebuilt the road in sections parts had sheared off due to erioson.
> Planted native Missouri grasses and plants on banks of road.
> Finished clearing out the last of poison ivy,oak, and sumac around the house, garden,chicken yard,goat pen. Come spring got 15 more acres to clear of that crap.
> All fencing around house,garden,chicken yard, goat pen has been replaced(jerry rigged) with new posts, gates and fencing.
> Dad's happier, she stays for now.
> Dad, my brother and myself walked all property last week.
> Still need to clean couple of ponds and springs, but that will have to wait till spring.
> Dad liked what I had started with barn.
> My new well goes in come spring.
> The well I use now is cousin's.
> Her husband is type of guy if he gets mad.
> He'll cut the water off.


Glad to hear things are moving along...although, going to be tough to find 10 burly guys, unless you open a Hell's Angel chapter...lol


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## melli

After much humming and hawing, I framed in the last window. A tiny window for half bath on 2nd floor. Should I have it beside toilet, over sink, by neither, etc...that went on for a while. Then, I decided, I wanted to have it where I could see it (and peek out of it). So, as one come up stairs and turns corner, it will be staring one in the face. A nice little peek-a-boo window. And it will allow for a little cross breeze in summer.

















The window isn't anything spectacular, but I like how it opens, solid hardware, and the triple seal.









Oh yeah, while I was framing in the window, we had a wind/rain storm...how I hate them. Anyways, as I was framing in the window, during the worst of the storm, I never got one squeak nor shudder from 2nd floor framing. Build was solid throughout storm. I did overdo framing, hurricane ties, and readi-rod tie-downs, so I was expecting a solid build, but seeing and feeling is believing. Once I insulate the crap out of it, and get siding on, I hope to not hear a storm either.

Max wind gusts were 80km/h (50mph). Not hurricane winds by any stretch, but if we did, it would absolute devastation, not just for homes, but most of our trees would be down (wouldn't see power til summer). Not likely to ever happen because of the hills/mountains. As the peak winds pounded us, I went to a 'safe' tree in yard and stood underneath it to get a sense of the stress on tree...I was being raised and lowered a few inches with every gust. The root pan was heaving. It was a small cedar tree (50ft). I'm thinking it'll have to go as it sits in a water-logged area (more prone to falling over). I did lose a couple tall firs in the forested part of place. Firewood...one day.


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## melli

A neighbor was getting a shed built...looks suspiciously like the ones I did a ways back...
Like the eave overhang. I am always paranoid about having any building firmly attached to terra firma. This one is on blocks. Perhaps, I overdo things...









Meanwhile, my place languishes...so sad. But crappy weather and no funds will do that. Right now, it looks like some mad person did a willy-nilly bondo job. Used that blue low VOC muck that dries into a rubber like paint. Can't wait to cover it all up with underlay (super duper stuff I was talking about). http://vaproshield.com/products/wall-wrb-ab/wrapshield
I'll just cover foam with cheap Typar, but the wood gets Wrapshield IT. 

Oh yeah, I might paint the foam if the threat of freezing passes for a few days. Sort of act like a vapor barrier as moisture condenses on foam, and I don't want that behind siding. Plus, it'll look so much better. 









What I found, is when the windstorms were at their worst, the rain would get sucked inside through empty nail holes (low pressure inside house than outside). So, I 'caulked' all seams and nail holes (windstorms that came after...no water inside). 
Where the wood and foam meet, I threw down some blue stuff. The idea there is so when I put down some blueskin, I have good sealing. Foam doesn't like anything with VOCs in it. The blue muck (when dry), will provide a good substrate for blueskin. Looks hideous though...lol


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## oldtruckbbq

Looks like the Smurfs did a drive by, lol.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Looks like the Smurfs did a drive by, lol.


Good one! lol
Yeah, I need to paint it!


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## melli

Although, not all done, I did get a wall painted with some acrylic based paint I've been hauling around for a few years. Looks much better. Was worried about drying time with near zero temps, but within a half hour, dry to touch. Funny story about that paint (sage brush)...when I bought my last house (brand new), I asked painters for some touch up paint as they were required to provide it as part of the 'deal'. Well, one day I come home, and find a brand new 5 gallon pail on my porch! Haha...too funny. Was only supposed to get a quart. I think painters were in no mood to fill a can...lol

I am tearing down scaffold...it was a mess, and too close to build to put on house wrap or anything...I need to rebuild a scaffold with room to install drip cap flashing, typar, blueskin, insulation, siding etc...


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## Echoesechos

Looking good Melli. You still contemplating putting your trailer under the roof? Been cold here this week. Brings most outdoor activities to a halt. Just enough snow to make the roads super slick and miserable.


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## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Looking good Melli. You still contemplating putting your trailer under the roof? Been cold here this week. Brings most outdoor activities to a halt. Just enough snow to make the roads super slick and miserable.


I was super keen to do that, but now that the November windstorms have passed (I hope), I have been procrastinating and thinking why bother...With RV under carport, it would clutter access. I still have to build-in garage door, and RV would be in way. Sort of a situation, where if it isn't broke, don't fix it. RV hasn't sprung a leak (knock on wood). And although not a lot of money, I would have to fork over for septic line to hook it up under carport. If at all possible, the next time I move RV, I hope it is because I sold it...lol.


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## melli

Much better...lol


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## melli

Dirt poor (unable to do much on bunker), so I dug trenches for landscape lighting...I then decided to bury some irrigation line too, since I had some 200psi pipe left over from water works. Always causes a mess trenching...

























I moved one of those monster boulders I had beside bunker, as it was in the way of doing a good landscape job around bunker. 
Takes a bit with Bobby...a roller...I could just lift it a few inches off ground, but couldn't move...lol








I stuck it on a rock outcropping. 








Finished...rain will smooth it out.


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## melli

Emptied my bank account to get some custom drip cap flashing. The first thing I need to put on bunker to start cladding it. I opted for custom flashing as the store bought crap bends and dents just looking at (paper thin). Plus, I like shiny (Copper Penny - roof will be done using this stuff). This stuff stays straight when mounting it. Have a small problem in finding the right fasteners. Need SS wafer head self tapping screws...one of the joys of mounting to ICF. Apparently, some folks have had success using normal fastening methods (nail gun). I need to go through flashing metal, 3/4" of foam, then into a plastic strip.

As I think about what it cost, it was maybe $50 more (180') than store bought stuff. And this stuff is so much better in a myriad of ways (store stuff only has one bend).


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## melli

BTW - if anyone is interested in my plans, PM me, and I'll flip them to you. I'll send my Excel spreadsheet showing what I drew up, and a pdf of what the engineer drew up (pdf was converted from autocad so has artifacts missing, misplaced, etc). 
If you are going down same road, it'll give you a sense of what you need on plans, should you draw them up. 
Disclaimer: use them at your own risk...lol.


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## melli

Winter blues have slowed me down...was going to get around to installing drip cap flashing, but then I decided I ought to skirt below flashing with some more flashing to protect foundation (make it fire proof). Waiting on local store to bring it in. Also, been apprised the window order won't be in til mid January. No big rush to do anything...
Last night was weird...on a movie watching fest, then I decide to peer outside (have landscape lights all over). Winter wonderland! Yesterday, it was raining, and green. At night, the rain turned to snow...had to quickly remove snow from awning lest it collapse.

Lower mainland got walloped with freezing rain and 130 outages (100k folks had a cold night).










Murphy's law in reverse...cooking a monster breakfast a couple days ago. My philosophy has always been to cook more than required so I can have leftovers..even breakfast (scrambled eggs, bacon, hash browns, toast - once a week or two I indulge). In essence, I cook two breakfasts at once. So, I am cooking bacon and hash browns, pull out egg carton...only 4 eggs! Doh! I usually cook up six eggs. Bugger. Well, everything else is cooking, so I forge ahead. I crack the eggs into the bowl...I end up with 8 yolks! lol
I buy eggs from this gas station that sells jumbo free range eggs. The real thing. I know what a real egg looks like as we used to have laying hens. Bright orange yolks. I stopped buying supermarket eggs long ago...even their so-called free range eggs look sickly. 
Well, I had plenty of scrambled eggs for two breakfasts. Was kind of funny to see 8 yolks from my last four eggs. Usually, I get the odd double yolk...not four in a row.


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## oldtruckbbq

I know what you mean about winter blues. My plant closed the week between Christmas and New Year, but I haven't spent much time at the property because it has been too cold to spend more than a couple hours outdoors. I told my wife that I'm going to need a set of Carhart insulated overalls for next winter because long johns and jeans just don't cut it when the temp is in the low 20's. I have Cold Urticaria and am on 2 antihistamines to keep it at bay as much as possible, but I have to dress warm or it will still cause me trouble. I'm hoping that when I have some more time off in a couple weeks it will be above freezing and I can get some more work done to stay on schedule for getting the drive and house foundation put in this spring.


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## melli

We are gaining 2 minutes of daylight per day as we swing into late winter...8hrs and 30 minutes of daylight right now. A real slog, this time of year. At least we are trending in the right direction...a real bad winter for me (discombobulated). I suspect my lack of game plan for handling winter is the culprit. Usually, I get a gym membership and devote my time to that (or some hobby), but with an unfinished house staring me in face every day, getting a tad worn out, fretting over how I am going to pay to get it finished or at very least, livable. 

Got the Vaproshield house wrap (http://vaproshield.com/products/wall-wrb-ab/wrapshield) the other day...so I started mucking about with flashing and blueskin. Not pleased with my corner flashing work. I have searched high and low on the web, over the years, for tips on how to do good corner flashing work, but there is nothing out there...it is the one facet of building, I just can't seem to solve. And with the heavy sheet metal, it makes things worse...lol
If anyone has tips, I am all ears...I will be using some copper colored caulking to seal corner. 

















Just put some blueskin where first and second floor meet...transition zone. You can see how the wind driven rain made streaks where the nails are...this corner takes all the abuse from weather. 









Wrapshield with integrated tape...each course sticks to the course below, so one can have no visible staples. Stuff is thick, like a canvas. One roll is 800sqft. Pricey as all hell ($360/roll), but once on, house become virtually waterproof, yet can still breathe.


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## Echoesechos

I so look forward to your posts. Glad to see your updates. Not sure I could be as dedicated to the plans as you. In projects I get to a point where I just want it done so then start asking myself if I can live with how things are going differently than planned. Danged if I don’t say yes more often than I like. Lack of patience is a real downfall with me. Drives my son crazy lol Well truth be told drives me crazy too and I fight myself the whole way with it. I can get a tad grouchy too. ‍♀


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## melli

Haha, there are no plans per se...more of a "I won't compromise even it kills me" kind of thing. I could be living it now, if I didn't go so stupid-crazy on uber windows, underlay, housewrap, etc etc....Heck, could start way back at foundation detailing where I overspent on thicker rebar.
It is so hard to compromise with myself...lol. Not even sure it will make a huge difference down road. I suppose I'll know, and that is what stops me from taking the 'cheaper' route. 
I just have to grin and bear it. Really hard when one is typing this, in a tin can. When the days get longer, I usually get better...lol

OT - just saw 'Three Billboards Outside Ebbing, Missouri'. To be honest, this Canuck has preconceived notions of the heartland of America, and I was thinking the movie would epitomize the stereotype. Well, it does. Yet, as I watched the movie, I found myself thinking Missouri is friggin endearing. In your face crass behaviour, yet so brutally honest. I know it is just a movie, and we are seeing the writer's impression of Missouri, but darn if I didn't want to live in the fictional town of Ebbing...lol. Of course, I'd have to be a ways out of town...Anyways, the two leads nail it. Never liked the guy lead, but in this movie, he is great. I could never see this sequence of events happening for real, but someone from Missouri must tell me if the movie captures the 'flavor' of Missouri? Although, I've been known to throw around cuss words among my friends, can't say I'd do that to a police officer. Well, that is my review...haha. 4.5/5


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## Art_Vandelay

melli said:


> I could never see this sequence of events happening for real, but someone from Missouri must tell me if the movie captures the 'flavor' of Missouri? Although, I've been known to throw around cuss words among my friends, can't say I'd do that to a police officer. Well, that is my review...haha. 4.5/5


I guess I'll need to see it and let you know. I can tell you, having grown up in Iowa (just north of Missouri) and now living in Missouri, they are two different Midwests. Iowa is more friendly and agricultural. Missouri is more "Appalachian" if you will.


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## melli

After a visit to bank, I feel cleansed...lol. I still owe the same amount, but at reasonable interest rates.
Finally got that skirt flashing for under drip cap flashing. The idea is to make area where wall meets earth fireproof, somewhat bug proof, rodent proof etc...I'll backfill some drain-able soil up against the dark brown skirt flashing.

I can now apply some housewrap, and rumor has it, I can pick up some windows tomorrow!


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## Echoesechos

You are an inspiration.


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## Steve_S

WOOT WOOT, Windows ! A Milestone / Watershed moment in a build !!! Wait till you pop a couple in and the feeling you'll get when seeing the sparkle of that glass. That's a GOOD Feelin !

Hmmmm "cleansed by the bank", yeah like an enema no doubt... just less messy but just as uncomfortable. Rates apparently will be climbing too, so better now before that happens.


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> WOOT WOOT, Windows ! A Milestone / Watershed moment in a build !!! Wait till you pop a couple in and the feeling you'll get when seeing the sparkle of that glass. That's a GOOD Feelin !
> 
> Hmmmm "cleansed by the bank", yeah like an enema no doubt... just less messy but just as uncomfortable. Rates apparently will be climbing too, so better now before that happens.


No doubt! I got the windows home...no time to play, but been reading mounting instructions. Very odd. Unlike any window I have installed. Every window I have mounted, is with a nailing/screw fin built into window or you inset window, and screw through jamb. These guys have neither...I install thick metal clips that extend inward, and screw those into bucking. Will show pics when I get one installed. So, the face of window sees no screws.
BTW - will take a while to see sparkle of glass with all the labels/protective film they threw on these things...lol
The frame, everything, is covered in a protective covering.

Even ordered the last set of windows today while picking up the silly expensive ones...the last bunch are much cheaper, yet are triple pane jobs, albeit, none of those windows open.

Enema is an appropriate term to describe it. 12% credit card debt is not fun. All gone now.



Echoesechos said:


> You are an inspiration.


Thank you! 
I just wish I could be quicker with things...you know, I find myself, once in a blue moon, reading my earlier stuff. It sort of placates my angst at not being further along. One look at a 2014 pic and I think, holy crap, thank the stars I am not there! lol. I'd be in one bad place if I was back there...actually, I would likely put up a for sale sign...lol
With a multi year thing like this, my biggest fear is stalling. And this winter was one long slow motion crawl. But, I feel the wind changing direction, so I am hopeful I can string together days of production. 8hr and 59min of daylight...lol

Aside: have to throw this in there...some old hood neighbors/friends sold their cottage last year (identical to my old one), and poof, they were gone. Well, they were looking for more private digs, similar to mine, but the market is so tight here, farting is not an option. After a few misses, they went for old glory, and bought an estate lot, complete with a new house (a mansion with a west coast look). Really happy for them. And very glad they are back in the hood. I suggested they put up a honkin gate first thing, or they might tire of me real quick...lol. I mean, the place they bought is something else...you know those places where the carriage house is bigger than most homes...and it has room to store every toy one can think of. Bigger than what they wanted, but their choices were so limited. Looking forward to checking it out in March when they take possession.


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## melli

Rock'n roll....got enough WrapShield IT up to install a window. Fun times installing housewrap in a stiff breeze. At least the housewrap staples well (staples didn't rip housewrap when a gust came up). Threw up some rainscreen boards (vertical strips of 1/2" PT ply) to hold everything in place. Eventually, the walls will be covered in them (every 8"). 
BI came by, and I conscripted him to help install the first window. Very odd install. You'll note the outside window flange has no screws. Those metal brackets click into frame and you screw window into place from inside. Don't know how I feel about that. I get screw penetrations on outside can be a problem in terms of leak points, but I'm thinking a screwed flange is more stable (no movement). 
Well, one down....

















Hard to see, but triple seal windows...2 seals on jamb, 1 on window casing. 5 solid metal pin lock points around window.


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## Steve_S

Lookin Good !

YOU HAVE GRASS !!! Errrrmmmmm Ruckust, Stuckus, Frickus, Fruckus... still months away from seeing grass here... you, you... lucky )(*&#*^*(&@)(*+)(*[email protected]*()_(+_9 ;-)


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Lookin Good !
> 
> YOU HAVE GRASS !!! Errrrmmmmm Ruckust, Stuckus, Frickus, Fruckus... still months away from seeing grass here... you, you... lucky )(*&#*^*(&@)(*+)(*[email protected]*()_(+_9 ;-)


This is why I live 'here'. lol
I did my time on the prairies...9yrs of hard time...lol
Albeit, it isn't all roses here, even though I did plant grass seed in November and I see some sprouting.
Really comes down to choice...bitterly cold long winters, where everything is a shade of white and grey, but some sun OR decidedly mild winters where freezing temps are a rarity, green outlook through most of winter, but weeks, sometimes months of overcast drizzle (drive me nuts on occasion).
Obviously, I go for the latter, but I do miss throwing on a pair of skates.


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## lmrose

melli said:


> Although, not all done, I did get a wall painted with some acrylic based paint I've been hauling around for a few years. Looks much better. Was worried about drying time with near zero temps, but within a half hour, dry to touch. Funny story about that paint (sage brush)...when I bought my last house (brand new), I asked painters for some touch up paint as they were required to provide it as part of the 'deal'. Well, one day I come home, and find a brand new 5 gallon pail on my porch! Haha...too funny. Was only supposed to get a quart. I think painters were in no mood to fill a can...lol
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am tearing down scaffold...it was a mess, and too close to build to put on house wrap or anything...I need to rebuild a scaffold with room to install drip cap flashing, typar, blueskin, insulation, siding etc...
> 
> View attachment 63609


Hi; Just wanted you to know I admire what you are doing and hope you keep making updates. Where we live in Nova Scotia we couldn't build like that because of the strict building codes here . Have a nice day. Linda


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## melli

lmrose said:


> Hi; Just wanted you to know I admire what you are doing and hope you keep making updates. Where we live in Nova Scotia we couldn't build like that because of the strict building codes here . Have a nice day. Linda


Thanks! Curious why you cannot do what I am doing? I thought BC has the most oppressive building code and building regs in country. We are akin to California in terms of regulating everything...lol. Had to get a homeowner building license which is a farce (test one takes has nothing to do with skill but knowing their regulations). 
The paper one pushes here is silly. Speaking of which, I am not supposed to remove labels on windows because building inspector needs them to confirm windows are compliant with new fenestration regs...mind boggling. After I put up first window, I told BI, I want to see out window (I removed labels and tossed them...lol)! 

If any is curious, Canada has new window and door regs (https://www.rdh.com/nafs/nafs_in_canada_intro/). Basically, all windows and doors need to conform to certain pressure and leak tests, plus other details. My Innotech windows are beyond reproach in that regard. I could probably fill up main floor with water, and the windows would hold water and not burst. 

Got a couple more installed...are they a bear to install. They say they are 60lbs+ each, but geesh, they feel heavier than that. It takes all I got to hump one into place. Meanwhile, I am thinking, if I drop this MF and break one, I just lost a grand. 
Hindsight is everything, but I do wish the windows were 3" wider and taller. The frame of these windows is wider than I thought, which means less glass area. As I peer from inside, I figure an extra 3" all around would have been perfect. I'll live though. 










Note the tarp shed to right...blew up in windstorm (2nd one to do so, so far). Another headache to deal with. Been slowly emptying it, as I refuse to buy another tarp shed (last three years here). Wasted money. That being said, I look forward to hauling all the crap I collected to dump. I had a full kitchen cabinet set in there, but after a year or two, the mdf cabinets and solid wood doors warped beyond repair. What a waste. Live and learn. I was so eager to get a free kitchen cabinet set (in very good shape too), I failed to realize they do not last long in the elements. Hauling the works to dump will the be cathartic.


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## lmrose

Hi, All we ever wanted was a small three room house built from wood with a hand pump, no electricity and a cellar for storing vegetables. It was going to have high south windows to take advantage of the sun's heat. We were told first we couldn't build on our land unless it was approved for a house lot. Then we were required to put in the traditional septic system , wiring, air ex-changer, insulation they approve of . The house was going to have be all rigged for modern appliances. All of this they require whether we ever turned on the power or not. The house we designed was to be 16' by 24' ft. When the building inspector got through telling us what all we needed to do and cost was figured it would have been a $100,000 for everything including the subdividing and surveying required , permits, electrical and all else.. We could not and would not ever spend that much for a house even if we had that kind of money. Here you can't get approval to move in a new house unless it meets all inspection requirements and has to be completely finished. They can't force a person to hook up to the grid but even if you don't the house has to have the capability to do so in case it gets sold down the road and someone wants power. The other law passed last year in our municipality is no one can live year around in a camper trailer, motor home or tiny house on wheels. The later we thought of building until we found out we couldn't live in it year around. Yarmouth county was the first to adopt this law. But that is okay because WE CAN camp on our farm land legally and will do so. The old house trailer we bought is only a mile away and is on a good cement basement and has an acre of land 30 ft from access to a fresh water lake. It didn't cost a lot and we can fix it up to be warm. It has been there at least 35 or more years and is legal to live in. It was there before many of our present laws existed and is grandfathered in as long as we don't tear out walls and enlarge it.

The big old farm house we sold is undergoing massive renovations presently from tearing out the whole west side, building on, gutting the rest, new windows, fireplace, wiring , plumbing , new walls, insulation at an estimated bill of $200,000. All I can say is we are glad it isn't our bill to pay! Oh but it meet the building code so summer residents can enjoy the ocean view about one month a year when they come. I always say " Different strokes for different folks" and that is okay if they can afford it and that is their dream. Strange world we live in these days. The pioneers that settled North America never could have done it under our modern building laws.


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## melli

*lmrose* - thanks for your reply. Yep, everything you mentioned applies here too. I'm not 'living' in my RV, I am temporarily camping...
God knows, it certainly doesn't feel like living...lol. Plus, if officials starting cracking down on RV'ers and what have you, they'd be in a heap of trouble. We have near zero vacancy rates. A lot of that is caused by the arcane building rules you noted. I recall a couple, a few summers ago, built a home in the woods near here, and officials tore it down. Seems the loggers were not happy about it (and safety issues). Of course officials got away with it because the couple built on crown (public) land, not their own land. Still, a lot of fuss was raised over it. They had built on a cutblock. I felt sorry for them, as they put a lot of work into it.
I know of many folks who live off the grid around here, and a few, are nothing more than wooden shacks. One just down road is less than that (rundown RV with 'addition').
I agree, the whole pioneer thing is dead. You might be able to get away with it up north in some desolate spot.
BTW - I did build a legal septic field...it was one of the first things I did. Seems once you have a septic field, they don't get too antsy over you living on property in whatever you have available. What gets under my skin, beyond the mounds of paperwork and money one has to spend to build, is the push to restrict building homes by contractors only. All it does, is put home ownership out of reach for many folks. I think it should be a right to build your own shelter.


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## fireweed farm

melli said:


> What gets under my skin, beyond the mounds of paperwork and money one has to spend to build, is the push to restrict building homes by contractors only.


By that do you mean the forms required to be an Owner/Builder? Can't remember what that was called but I had to sign somewhere stating I was the "general" and if I was to sell the house within (??) years I had to warrantee it for structural issues. In BC as well, about 8 years ago.


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## melli

fireweed farm said:


> By that do you mean the forms required to be an Owner/Builder? Can't remember what that was called but I had to sign somewhere stating I was the "general" and if I was to sell the house within (??) years I had to warrantee it for structural issues. In BC as well, about 8 years ago.


Yeah, they started out (decade or so ago) requiring contractors to warrantee their builds (2-5-10: General Defects, Water Intrusion, Structural). But of course, some fly-by-night jobs were using owner-builder designation to avoid buying a warrantee, so government restricts owner-builders from selling within 1 or 2 yrs of completion. And should you want to sell before year 10, you have supply insurance for years remaining. Funny enough, I got a 2-5-10 warrantee from contractor for previous place (it was a joke) I owned. What invariably happens, is contractor creates a shell company for each build (or in my case, a multi home development), then shuts the company down after completion to limit liability. The insurance companies balk at fixing anything. 
In BC, they are punishing the owner-builder to go after a few unscrupulous types. Besides, a 2-5-10 warranty is hallow. Anybody can build a cardboard box to stay upright for 10yrs...they eventually become teardowns in 20. 
It is government's attempt to limit their liability, given the disaster over the leaky condo crisis (has its own wiki entry). Thankfully, I never owned a leaky condo, but I did own a condo at one time. Every decade or so, we'd be plastered with a 'special cost' to pay for some defect. I moved before we got hit with one (previous owners had to pay 10k+ to reinforce building because pool was sinking into underground parking). I believe our windows were ready to fall off building...lol
Actually, that is exactly what happened to a friends condo...and the tab was huge because they had floor to ceiling windows (fasteners that held them on had corroded). The one that stuck with me was a friends condo (thankfully, it was a rental) in which the foundation was frozen to stop it from tipping over.


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## Steve_S

Geez, after reading LMRose's and Melli's points... OKAY... I may be stuck with snow in my yard BUT not crazy building regs. 500 sq feet, grey water, no septic - compost toilet, solar, self-built, built above code & inspected and no crazy taxes. I dunno but it seems to me that in the past 10 years or so, the east coast provinces are doing whatever they can to depopulate the rural areas and move folks out of areas. Although there are some areas which have become precarious to live in now with rising water levels and other issues, so those I can understand.

Not really sure how long the forcing people to install Grid Power electrics will last (surprised they got away with it in the first place) as Renewable Energy is getting much more affordable while grid power is climbing and becoming less reliable.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Geez, after reading LMRose's and Melli's points... OKAY... I may be stuck with snow in my yard BUT not crazy building regs. 500 sq feet, grey water, no septic - compost toilet, solar, self-built, built above code & inspected and no crazy taxes. I dunno but it seems to me that in the past 10 years or so, the east coast provinces are doing whatever they can to depopulate the rural areas and move folks out of areas. Although there are some areas which have become precarious to live in now with rising water levels and other issues, so those I can understand.
> 
> Not really sure how long the forcing people to install Grid Power electrics will last (surprised they got away with it in the first place) as Renewable Energy is getting much more affordable while grid power is climbing and becoming less reliable.


Kind of curious how you got away with it...lol
We don't have to connect to grid, but the electrical in house (no matter how it is supplied), requires a permit and inspection.


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## Steve_S

How I got away with what ? All perfectly legal and above board. Smoke & CO2 detectors had to be installed, proper venting as required where required (remember I have 2 LPG On Demand water heaters, 1 hot water & 1 for radiant floor heat) an LPG Cook Stove and a woodstove too. Yes electrical needs to be inspected too but no power poles near me so no hydro grid and I wasn't gonna drop near 50K for hydro. ** Not all places in Ontario are like that, closer you get a Urban Containment Zone (read city) the more phooey you have to deal with, up to and including Minimum Square Footage, must have septic etc... and even worse on waterways or lake areas where even more rules, regs and minimums are the rule of the day.


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## oldtruckbbq

Makes me appreciate my neck of the woods. The county where we are building has no building code department and no building inspectors. You are required to meet state requirements for septic system, but they are pretty simple and nobody bothers to inspect. The County Water District does not require proof of a septic system before they will put in a water meter, probably because it is rural and so many people put in water to take care of their animals. And the electric utility will run up to 1000' of underground cable to a meter base and outdoor box on a post next to where we are going to build our house for $5. The $5 fee is to join the electrical co-op. We have to sign a contract stating that we will buy power from them and that we are building a home of at least 1000 sq. ft. They run to the meter base, I am responsible to see that everything is to code from there. The county recommends a minimum 18" culvert when constructing a driveway, but unless you are building on a state highway there are no permits, fees, licenses, or other requirements to put a driveway onto your property.

The down side is that because of that, some people have some really trashy places that are a real eyesore. We passed on several areas because there were so many trashy places around them. We bought property in an area that has deed restrictions to prevent commercial breeding operations, multiple dwellings on a property, single wide mobile homes, and double wide homes over 2 years old when installed. It also contains language about abandoned vehicles and property creating an eyesore. I made sure to inquire about a homeowners association because if there were provisions for a homeowner association I would have walked away. I don't mind some deed restrictions to prevent having run down junked up homes, but I don't want someone telling me what kind of flowers and mailbox I have to put up. As he said, you may get away with a HOA in the big city (St. Louis, Kansas City, Springfield), but if you tried that in our part of the Ozarks you would probably end up missing!

All the above is also part of why we are building our own place rather than buying something and fixing it up. I can do things right and above code in the first place instead of trying to figure out what kind of clap trap someone else did and having to undo it before I can do it correctly and safely. There may not be any code enforcement or permits required, but I want my place to be safe, dependable, and durable.


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## melli

If you note pic above, I have the bottom half of bunker housewrapped. To do the top half, I need to either build a scaffold or beg for one somewhere...but before I start assembling/begging a scaffold, I had to take care of the trench I dug a month or so ago for drain tile outlet (4" perf pipe running around foundation to drain any water). With the lay of the land, I could take drain tile water down the hill to edge of septic field. It was one of those $100 jobs I didn't really need right now. But since I had dug a trench, it had to be dealt with (hard to assemble scaffold through a trench). 









The 'Wye' near house will pick up gutter drainage, and that stub sticking up to right is the sewage drain. 
















As I was backfilling by hand (of course, Bobby did most of the work), I was thinking about my parents. They used to remind us to shape up or we'd become ditch diggers. They'd always ask us if we wanted to be ditch diggers (sarcasm was rampant in our family)...lol. As I am grunting away cleaning up, I realized there is some satisfaction playing in the dirt. Definitely not glamorous work, but I do get a boost of self satisfaction, especially when done. On this homestead foray, I have dug darn near a mile of ditches (trenching). While Bobby has really done most of it, I do have to dismount and do a wee bit by hand. There is a finality to burying a pipe or conduit. I'll never have to deal with whatever I've laid, ever again. One has to feel good about that. And the exercise involved should not be underrated. Not only did I bury a pipe, I got a gym session worth of exercise. Win-win...lol


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## melli

Seems Bunny and Raven (I call her Momma) are vying for the dinner plate. Momma is getting rather bold...suspect she is on a binge in prep for laying eggs. The bunny is none too pleased. He bounces around doing leg kicks. Little does the bunny know, that Momma is keeping bunny safe, as I've seen a hawk and odd eagle hang around. Momma and Poppa discourage that sort of thing by harassing hawk til he leaves. We are still in late winter, but the frogs are waking up, and a bloody mosquito tried to get me. 









With much procrastination, I got the scaffold up...still need another level higher. I also need to put up some railing. 
I may have a line on some doors...going to make a journey into the city to see them. Boneyard doors they call them (made to wrong specs for a customer...sell them for half price). Nothing cheap about them though (Euro style doors - triple seal/pane full lite). 
Meanwhile, it seems my RV has sprung two leaks! Shower 'trap' cracked, and I have a wet spot on carpet...can't figure out that one. Actually, I was looking for cause of wet carpet, and found shower trap leaking. Roof looks fine, as does 'bedroom' sink beside wet carpet. Not what I need in wet season. Wondering if my lung congestion has something to do with a wet RV....fiddle sticks.


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## Steve_S

Big virtual Encouragement Hug Melli ! Your doing great dear. Potentially a Great Score on the doors too. Am concerned over that leak, that could certainly be a factor in your breathing problems and if you have gasses from the holding tank entering the camper then indeed worrisome. Please be careful and hopefully it won't be a hard thing to get at & fix but being a camper, easy to get at is not a part of their design is it.


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## melli

Every trip into city reinforces the reason why I no longer live there (exhausted - 7hrs bumper-to-bumper on road). However, glad I gave it a go, as I got my doors, all of them (2 single doors and 1 set of french doors). 
Funny enough, I was just going to just get the 'swing doors' (French doors) as I didn't have enough money, and with french doors I could finish framing the carport entrance. So, I sit down with boss of operations (sizable manufacturing warehouse), and we get down to brass tacks. I can afford the french doors ($2k), but that is about it (btw - $4k retail). He asks how much money do I have? $2500, but I can get $500 more from bank machine. He says if I can chip in another $500 I can get all of them...naturally, I run to a bank machine. 
These are Euro style doors...weigh an absolute ton (around 200lbs just for the door, not including frame!). They also all happen to be triple pane with double seal and the same locking hardware as the Innotech windows. 
He will deliver the french doors as they didn't have a lockset. I'll have to massage my existing rough opening for single doors, as these suckers are 3/4" wider...no biggie, I hope. So, got 10k worth of doors for 3k...have to be happy about that. These doors will never creak in a windstorm...lol. Cast aluminum post hinges (like a bank vault). 

These are French doors (back to back)








And the two singles









Definitely going to need a hand mounting them...


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> Every trip into city reinforces the reason why I no longer live there (exhausted - 7hrs bumper-to-bumper on road). However, glad I gave it a go, as I got my doors, all of them (2 single doors and 1 set of french doors).
> Funny enough, I was just going to just get the 'swing doors' (French doors) as I didn't have enough money, and with french doors I could finish framing the carport entrance. So, I sit down with boss of operations (sizable manufacturing warehouse), and we get down to brass tacks. I can afford the french doors ($2k), but that is about it (btw - $4k retail). He asks how much money do I have? $2500, but I can get $500 more from bank machine. He says if I can chip in another $500 I can get all of them...naturally, I run to a bank machine.
> These are Euro style doors...weigh an absolute ton (around 200lbs just for the door, not including frame!). They also all happen to be triple pane with double seal and the same locking hardware as the Innotech windows.
> He will deliver the french doors as they didn't have a lockset. I'll have to massage my existing rough opening for single doors, as these suckers are 3/4" wider...no biggie, I hope. So, got 10k worth of doors for 3k...have to be happy about that. These doors will never creak in a windstorm...lol. Cast aluminum post hinges (like a bank vault).
> 
> These are French doors (back to back)
> View attachment 64647
> 
> And the two singles
> 
> View attachment 64648
> 
> Definitely going to need a hand mounting them...


Congratulations!


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## Steve_S

WOW Melli ! One heck of a good score dear ! CELEBATORY HUG !!! and with a whoop too !


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## melli

I have a few things on the go, but getting a door installed topped the list....lol
I really wanted to see one in action, so I spent my time 'massaging' a door opening. Had to trim bucking (2x12 PT wood frame) by 3/4" on sides, and lower top. Hard to see with Blueskin in the way. 










I was playing with fire installing the door by myself...I couldn't lift it, so I used wood blocks to raise it, so I could drop it on pins. Thing is, I lose my grip, there was no way I could stop it from belly flopping on ground. Thankfully, it never came to that. 









A magnificent door. Definitely has a bank vault feel...not sure how I feel about that. I still have to tweak it so the locking pins engage easier. I got caught up in the 'prize', I overlooked ('kept forgetting' might be the right term...lol) the fact the door being a non-standard size (that is, not a regular builder's door) doesn't line up with windows...something I'll have to live with. C'est la vie. The price I'll pay for having a door I have no right owning. This door will never rot (no wood in it), and the double seals should keep out the elements. 

Here is the spec stickers;










Perhaps a better SHGC (0.2) would have been nicer, but as long as it keep heat in, all good. U-Factor is pretty impressive for full lite door. And it would take 1300lbs force to pop window. No storm could produce that kind of pressure. 
I looked up code requirements for my area
http://www.fenestrationcanada.ca/calculator
These doors exceed local code requirements by a factor of 2.5 in all metrics. Sweet. And A3 designation is for arctic conditions.


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## Steve_S

Ohhh my, you have to live with Really Good High End Doors... awww poor ol Miss Melli, such a hardship ! LOL  /me slightly envious BUT that stuff way out of my budget range even with your outstanding deal.

So when is the Housewarming Party ? Pot Luck ?? got Bunkies ???


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## MoBookworm1957

Congratulations Melli!


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Ohhh my, you have to live with Really Good High End Doors... awww poor ol Miss Melli, such a hardship ! LOL  /me slightly envious BUT that stuff way out of my budget range even with your outstanding deal.
> 
> So when is the Housewarming Party ? Pot Luck ?? got Bunkies ???


Haha...Woe be me! lol
I know, been thinking of a house warming party, but it won't happen this year...still a long ways to go. 
The bloody soffit has me in a pickle...can't install it until I clad the exterior 2nd floor in Roxul. And I can't do that because I have no money. I have lots I can do with what I have, so I'll motor on until I run out of materials. But getting all windows and doors installed will perk me up.


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## Steve_S

melli said:


> But getting all windows and doors installed will perk me up.


You betcha it will, it's a watershed point IMO, just like when the roof is put on, or when the foundation is poured & finished. The precious milestones can (often do) drive one forward to the next major task. Just don't contemplate more than 3 majors at once or your get that "I'm overwhelmed" feeling that can be very hazardous to an ongoing project. /me not speaking from any experience at all... ohh no, not me...


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## melli

Slowly, the windows and doors are getting installed. 
Glad the Innotech Windows are up...they weigh a bit. 

The smurf color is gone, to be replaced with orange crush. 









The sun hitting bunker casts a distinctive orange color in RV...kind of like it.


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## oldtruckbbq

Not your typical house door. It looks like something you would see in a high end store, bank, or office building. Something that is built to take being opened and closed, oftentimes not too gently, dozens of times a day without coming apart. A fitting door for a concrete bunker. Just make sure to etch or engrave your name on it as a reminder to your great-great-great grandchildren when they look at it in the year 2150. It is nice when you can score deals on things that you would never expect to be able to include.


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## HeavyHauler

Just finished reading this thread, read about 25 pages tonight.

You have done a really great job so far, Melli!

I have done some concrete work (basements/foundations/pads), some framing work (dairy barns/pole sheds) and Right now, I'm a heavy equipment operator. 40ton rock trucks, 980g cat loader, 988f cat, komatsu 500 loader and other various heavy equipment here at the mine.

My wife and I are in the planning stages of our future homestead (trying to save/make more money). So right now, we're working on improving our first home (my childhood home I bought from my grandparents).

I have found lots of ideas from this thread, thanks to you and a few of the other posters.

We live in northern Manitoba, but don't plan to homestead here (no available land to buy). We're in a zone2b and I'm loathe to leave it, but looking for a zone4 as a compromise to the wife.

It will be years of saving before we can even think about buying some land. But we're working on it, slowly and surely.

We're still relatively young (I'm 28 and wife is 23, I think. Lol) We have a 4 year old and a 2 year old.

I got a lot of inspiration from your thread, so I wanted to thank you.

Your winters are much more mild than ours! Lol, ours are mostly -50c or lower, and right now, about 4 feet of snow. Tomorrow is apparently gonna be -8c or -9c (t-shirt and shorts weather!)

Anyway, I'll be watching this thread and your progress. Have fun!


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## melli

HeavyHauler said:


> Just finished reading this thread, read about 25 pages tonight.
> 
> You have done a really great job so far, Melli!
> 
> I have done some concrete work (basements/foundations/pads), some framing work (dairy barns/pole sheds) and Right now, I'm a heavy equipment operator. 40ton rock trucks, 980g cat loader, 988f cat, komatsu 500 loader and other various heavy equipment here at the mine.
> 
> My wife and I are in the planning stages of our future homestead (trying to save/make more money). So right now, we're working on improving our first home (my childhood home I bought from my grandparents).
> 
> I have found lots of ideas from this thread, thanks to you and a few of the other posters.
> 
> We live in northern Manitoba, but don't plan to homestead here (no available land to buy). We're in a zone2b and I'm loathe to leave it, but looking for a zone4 as a compromise to the wife.
> 
> It will be years of saving before we can even think about buying some land. But we're working on it, slowly and surely.
> 
> We're still relatively young (I'm 28 and wife is 23, I think. Lol) We have a 4 year old and a 2 year old.
> 
> I got a lot of inspiration from your thread, so I wanted to thank you.
> 
> Your winters are much more mild than ours! Lol, ours are mostly -50c or lower, and right now, about 4 feet of snow. Tomorrow is apparently gonna be -8c or -9c (t-shirt and shorts weather!)
> 
> Anyway, I'll be watching this thread and your progress. Have fun!


Haha, glad you found it worth reading. I saw new 218 likes, and I'm like what! Thought there was some glitch. 
Oh man, your in zone 0 to me...lol. I did my youth on the Sask prairies, and 6mths of winter is just too much for me. A bit early here, but I planted some grass seed today in a spot I chewed up with Bobby. Wish you the best in your homestead venture. Finding the right piece of land is job #1. Yeah, -8C is a mild winter day in your hood...here, it would break a record. 
We have about 3-4 weeks left of 'snow possibility', then things get wet and green. 

Your heavy equipment operation will come in handy for the right property. Best.


----------



## HeavyHauler

melli said:


> Haha, glad you found it worth reading. I saw new 218 likes, and I'm like what! Thought there was some glitch.
> Oh man, your in zone 0 to me...lol. I did my youth on the Sask prairies, and 6mths of winter is just too much for me. A bit early here, but I planted some grass seed today in a spot I chewed up with Bobby. Wish you the best in your homestead venture. Finding the right piece of land is job #1. Yeah, -8C is a mild winter day in your hood...here, it would break a record.
> We have about 3-4 weeks left of 'snow possibility', then things get wet and green.
> 
> Your heavy equipment operation will come in handy for the right property. Best.


Lol, sorry about that.

Yeah, it ain't for everyone that is for sure. The last of our snow is usually gone the first couple weeks of June.

Have you got a garden planted yet? Or plan to grow one? I don't think I have seen it mentioned, or maybe I missed it.


----------



## melli

HeavyHauler said:


> Lol, sorry about that.
> 
> Yeah, it ain't for everyone that is for sure. The last of our snow is usually gone the first couple weeks of June.
> 
> Have you got a garden planted yet? Or plan to grow one? I don't think I have seen it mentioned, or maybe I missed it.


Haha, no worries (I find myself reading my thread, partly to get motivation, and partly to put things in perspective...dreary winter for me, as the build came to a standstill). Yep, obviously, there are a few Canucks who relish real winters. I was spoiled growing up on coast, then I moved to the icebox. Ah heck, I am not going to sugar coat it...the prairies are worse than an icebox...lol. Gets so cold, it gets in your bones. But, to many, they enjoy winter activities. I do miss skating...nearest rink is 30 miles away. 

No garden yet, but definitely a plan one day. I really need to get a fence first. A big one, preferably around most of property. The deer make their rounds everyday around here, and mow down anything edible to them. 
This was my garden at my old place before I took the leap and bought the place I have now. It'll have to wait to until I get my build done. Miss the garden...


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## melli

Back to framing...need to get bunker into 'lockup' mode, so I started framing in garage door entrance with 2x8s. A tad hefty, but I need something stout to handle the ridiculously heavy french doors, and I'll have plenty of room to stuff cavities with Roxul (need to be consistent all the way around in terms of R value). Hopeful, I'll be able to lock up bunker in about two weeks. 

The opening is slightly oversized, as I need to add a 2x10 (true) frame inside french door opening, so I can clad garage door in 2" Roxul panelboard. 
Really like the idea of french doors in that opening...was going to go with a door and window, but this route takes care of two birds with one stone (a door, and a window). Plus, I can easily bring oversized things into bunker, like my scooter...lol


----------



## HeavyHauler

melli said:


> Back to framing...need to get bunker into 'lockup' mode, so I started framing in garage door entrance with 2x8s. A tad hefty, but I need something stout to handle the ridiculously heavy french doors, and I'll have plenty of room to stuff cavities with Roxul (need to be consistent all the way around in terms of R value). Hopeful, I'll be able to lock up bunker in about two weeks.
> 
> The opening is slightly oversized, as I need to add a 2x10 (true) frame inside french door opening, so I can clad garage door in 2" Roxul panelboard.
> Really like the idea of french doors in that opening...was going to go with a door and window, but this route takes care of two birds with one stone (a door, and a window). Plus, I can easily bring oversized things into bunker, like my scooter...lol
> 
> View attachment 64751


Are you gonna keep bobby in there?

PS-What will you be using for a garage door?


----------



## melli

HeavyHauler said:


> Are you gonna keep bobby in there?
> 
> PS-What will you be using for a garage door?


No room for Bobby in my 'home'. There will be no garage doors...framing it in for french doors. 
The idea was down the road, convert bunker to a garage, and blow out the wall I just built for garage doors. I don't think that will happen, unless I hit a jackpot. Plus, if I am able to build a 'dream home', I'll probably want this bunker for guests, like my dad. I put too much effort into this bunker to convert it to a garage. But one never knows the future...
At least the option is on the table.


----------



## HeavyHauler

melli said:


> No room for Bobby in my 'home'. There will be no garage doors...framing it in for french doors.
> The idea was down the road, convert bunker to a garage, and blow out the wall I just built for garage doors. I don't think that will happen, unless I hit a jackpot. Plus, if I am able to build a 'dream home', I'll probably want this bunker for guests, like my dad. I put too much effort into this bunker to convert it to a garage. But one never knows the future...
> At least the option is on the table.


Ahh ok, gotcha!


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## melli

2 sheets of plywood, some housewrap/blueskin, and should be ready for french doors. Getting antsy for the doors...


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## MoBookworm1957

Looking good !


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## melli

Plugging away...sold my drone to pay for that infill...Wonder if it was worth it.
The wall the drone built..lol

Was a nice change of pace from dealing with flashing...


















Update: called door place and they will deliver french doors the week of the 26th...


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## melli

Not keen to climb a ladder after our little snowfall and install more house wrap (a key item so I can prep remaining windows and 2nd floor door for install). Mulling over my options for the day's activities, I spied the slash pile. A slash pile is like staring at a cobweb...they have to go. Yet, I hate burning. Burning requires I be present and keep a watch on things, plus I fret over things burning that I don't want burnt, like my bunker or well shed. A slash pile spews a lot of embers. 









As usual, I start the pile (with tiger torch and blower), and the wind picks up...the forecast says very light winds, even 'calm'. Hmmm....
I suspect I am overly paranoid, but I recall the time I almost lit my forest on fire (ember started a live tree on fire, well over a 100ft away from burn pile). 









I did a little drive to corner store and saw this...looks nice on the hills.


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## melli

Ashes to ashes, dust to dust...very cathartic once it is over. I'd be left with nothing but ashes if it wasn't for the late arrival. An Arbutus tree (~60ft) fell on the groomed part of my property. How I didn't hear or notice it til yesterday is a mystery (quite visible location). Being green, it didn't burn up (was late getting it to the 'burn'). 









Then I toyed around with housewrap...move ladder a million times, and staple. At least I am ready for remaining doors and windows. 









We are in a 'cold' snap. RV didn't freeze up even though we hit -9C last night. Good news, as last night will be the coldest temp of year. We are due for -3C to -5C (nighttime only...daytime is above zero) for the next few days. Not particular surprising for Canada (actually considered balmy for winter temps), but where I live, it is like an ice age...lol
Well, it can't last forever, as the first week of March is when cherry trees bloom around here. 
In a bizarre way, was kind of novel having it cool down last night. I mean, we rarely ever see those temps (once a decade thing). I found myself tripping around in the dark, by the remnants of the burn, looking at the stars...very clear last night. The bunny rabbit startled me, as he did a tear around bunker. Seems he wanted a midnight snack. Glad to see him again, as he has been scarce these past few days.


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## melli

Not much to show, but I conscripted the Building Inspector to help me haul up the 2nd floor door...what a godsend (guy is strong like ox). I wouldn't have been able to do it otherwise (200lb door). Glad it is mounted. And it seems my remaining windows are ready for pickup tomorrow...


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## Steve_S

I can sense your growing excitement and anxiousness ! Good Going Dear !


----------



## Hitch

That's cool about the building inspector giving you a hand. Something you don't hear happening too often. Place is looking good.

I'm interested in learning more about your "bunker." My wife thinks we should build one at the property.


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## oldtruckbbq

Are you going to finish it out inside and move into it before you start the exterior finish? Looks like just a few more windows and you will be dried in.


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## melli

Hitch said:


> That's cool about the building inspector giving you a hand. Something you don't hear happening too often. Place is looking good.
> 
> I'm interested in learning more about your "bunker." My wife thinks we should build one at the property.


If you can hack it, scroll back through pages to see the build start from the ground up. Lots of pics.
Yeah, it is nice the BI gave me a hand...that is probably very unusual. He is more than a BI, but a neighbor/friend (he has a property nearby). Long ago, he inspected my work and our homesteading dreams meshed. He even got a mini-excavator to use on his property. He works his day job, and on weekends, putters on his property, clearing it, etc. It really helps he is an ox of a man...lol. I needed a serious breather after hauling door up stairs...he seemed like he was warming up. 



oldtruckbbq said:


> Are you going to finish it out inside and move into it before you start the exterior finish? Looks like just a few more windows and you will be dried in.


I'll probably move into it when neither the interior or exterior is fully finished...lol
Just done enough...like toilet, sink, heat, and hot water...I have a stove, so I just need a fridge. It will be spartan, to say the least.
Rumor has it, not only will my fixed windows be ready, but my french doors are coming up the coast tomorrow!
Be locked up in a week...tops.


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## oldtruckbbq

I'll probably move into it when neither the interior or exterior is fully finished...lol
Just done enough...like toilet, sink, heat, and hot water...I have a stove, so I just need a fridge. It will be spartan, to say the least.
Rumor has it, not only will my fixed windows be ready, but my french doors are coming up the coast tomorrow!
Be locked up in a week...tops.[/QUOTE]

Sounds like our plans. As soon as we get a bathroom and functional kitchen we are going to ditch the rental we live in now and move in. The rent money will go a long way toward finishing out the interior. Since we are doing cordwood, once the walls are up and windows in, they are done except for interior trim. Our dogs will be really bored though. Where we live now there are several noisy trucks and the locals use their ATV's and golf carts to putt around town. They race from one side of the back yard to the other barking at them. In winter you can just see the road from our house site, during the rest of the year you can't. They will be so bored.


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## melli

Got all my windows and doors today...fait accompli, as they say. Glad, as we are supposed to get a bit of snow tomorrow. 
A wee bit tired driving up and down coast, but I had enough energy to get the three transom windows up. They are Jeld-wen triple pane jobs. Nothing 'fancy', but they will do the job (good specs, for what it is worth). 
So, it looks like $10,860 for all the windows and doors in my place. It wasn't that I overlooked that tab, but I never really fully appreciated the hit in my pocketbook. That being said, except for some slightly off-color doors, I exceeded my fenestration expectations by a country mile...lol
In the grand scheme of things, 11k for window and door package is a pittance. I've been to homes in my hood that spent well in excess of 100k for windows and doors (more than the total cost of my place). If I had a do-over, I'd have collected the windows and doors first (visit every high end boneyard), and then build the house around them. I would have been able to get larger windows. In keeping with a stout and efficient build (earthquake proof and high-end energy efficiency), I didn't want to get massive floor-to-ceiling jobs, but a few large ones would have been nice in key areas. 


















I gave the delivery guys a tour of my place...seems there is a yearning for country life in all of us. They are from the Vancouver metropolis, and seeing my smallish 5 acre lot, they remarked it was plenty big...lol


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## Hitch

Must be nice to be all buttoned up.


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## melli

Hitch said:


> Must be nice to be all buttoned up.


Getting there...those swing doors were a bear to put up...I'm done for day, plus I am short of caulk, and the roads are a mess...just three more windows to go...easy ones.
After getting up swing doors, I realized there is a difference between swing doors and french doors...I was curious why the guy selling me the doors kept saying 'swing doors'. Now I know why. The sill on swing doors is like sliding patio doors, whereas my vision was a sill like a door. Oh well, life goes on. I didn't want the 'bump' like what patio doors have...easier to roll stuff into bunker when one has a regular door sill. I thought I was getting a door sill on swing doors, but I guess that is why they call them swing doors, not french doors...c'est la vie.










Not the end of the world, as I can make a little bump ramp for dolly and bike. The one benefit of swing doors is they lock all around (have pin locks on bottom), and this one has triple seal. You could take a spray hose to seams, and water wouldn't get in. The other upside is car fumes wouldn't enter home.









I've left protective tape on door. All I can say is these suckers better last a lifetime, as I can safely say in 10yrs, I won't be able to do what I did today...my muscles are shaking right now...lol










The BI was going to give me a hand, but even he turned back when he got into our area...


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## Steve_S

I personally always preferred the "Swing Door" or "French Doors" over the slider types which not only leak air like a sieve & allow water in but are so terribly easy for any burglar to pop. So I put French Doors on my "south deck side" and luckily with the blinds built into the doors which is terrific. I love the deal you got on your doors & windows, you did really good there and you know it too ! Way out of my budget range even at the prices you got.


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> I personally always preferred the "Swing Door" or "French Doors" over the slider types which not only leak air like a sieve & allow water in but are so terribly easy for any burglar to pop. So I put French Doors on my "south deck side" and luckily with the blinds built into the doors which is terrific. I love the deal you got on your doors & windows, you did really good there and you know it too ! Way out of my budget range even at the prices you got.


Yeah, never been a fan of sliding patio doors...never-mind the security issue, but over time they rattle in a breeze. With swing doors, I can bring all manner of things into bunker (up to 6' wide and almost 7' tall). My local window place was trying to offload two top-of-line sliding patio doors, but the reality is, your only getting a normal door width of accessible space. And even though they were wicked quality, they seemed clunky to operate (they pulled in, then slid). Too many moving parts. 

The internal blinds always seemed like a cool thing to have...at my old place, I bought Home Depot stick on blinds for full lite doors. They worked real well, and had glass protecting blinds. https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p....n-blind-for-flush-frame-doors.1000707807.html
It was must-have thing at my old place, but this place, not so much...

The doors and windows I got were a wee bit out of my range too...lol. Once I decided to build with ICF, I couldn't stop myself from going nutso on everything else. To take advantage of ICF walls, it seemed silly to go with 'builders windows or doors'. I see this as a bit of a science experiment...see how crazy quiet and cozy I can make it inside. As I think about, if I had gone with builders windows and doors, I bet it would have been near half the price (5.5k) I paid on what I got. I really think the extra 5.5k was worth it. The doors are works of art, in a geeky way. Nothing hokey about them. Never rot. I'll admit, I am smitten with them. Dear Door, will you marry me....lol
Is there such a thing as being OCD on quality...whatever it is, I have the disease.


----------



## Steve_S

Given that you live in such a insanely noisy place with bunnies hopping, birds chirping and squawking, chippies chattering and squirrels being, well... you know... Your not gonna hear an A-Bomb go off ! LOL As for marrying your door, hmmmm... no comment ! <safety first> grins.

Never know, the silence might drive you whacky after a while, eh. Well, ok, you seem part way there already BUT that's beside the point eh... hehehe QCD and all.

But really, good stuff indeed, have you thought about your HRV or ERV because that's going to be far too airtight to not have such. Add in venting fans for a range / bath, a woodstove etc and you'll need to put some planning into accommodating that. Not so much in warm weather when you can crack a window but even when your out, some air exchange should be happening.


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## MoBookworm1957

Congratulations Melli!


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Given that you live in such a insanely noisy place with bunnies hopping, birds chirping and squawking, chippies chattering and squirrels being, well... you know... Your not gonna hear an A-Bomb go off ! LOL As for marrying your door, hmmmm... no comment ! <safety first> grins.
> 
> Never know, the silence might drive you whacky after a while, eh. Well, ok, you seem part way there already BUT that's beside the point eh... hehehe QCD and all.
> 
> But really, good stuff indeed, have you thought about your HRV or ERV because that's going to be far too airtight to not have such. Add in venting fans for a range / bath, a woodstove etc and you'll need to put some planning into accommodating that. Not so much in warm weather when you can crack a window but even when your out, some air exchange should be happening.


Those birds! Going to drive me off deep end. Momma Raven was giving it to me today, while I was in the midst of mounting a door. God, she was loud, and I had my earmuffs on! lol. She was 10ft away, and nothing was going to deter her from her mission. 
Seems with all the snow on ground, I am their granola lifeline. 
As far as being kooky, that ship has sailed...lol
Yep, a HRV is in order...I'll have to suffer opening windows for a bit until that happens. 
Yeah, the squirrels get to me too...geesh, they get into territorial disputes and chatter endlessly. Now, the bunny is the quiet one.


----------



## melli

Naturally, I was on a mission to get the place locked up. There isn't much in the way of sticky fingers in our hood...we are not easily accessible, and the few that try get busted trying to leave the peninsula via ferry (only way out of town). Lots of chatter about us having a road link to the big city, but there is something to be said for not having a link. At any rate, nice to have non-drafty bunker. 

Before I could get the last windows up, I had to plow my driveway so I could get more caulk...had another snow last night. The first snow, I hand plowed my driveway and almost had a heart attack...this morning, I said screw it, and fired up Bobby. Then I almost had another heart attack this morning, when Bobby decided to toboggan down my driveway. Rubber tracks can make things interesting. Usually, not a problem plowing, but it had got so cold, the ground underneath snow was really frozen, so the snow sitting on top greased the ride. Thankfully, I always have bucket with teeth on Bobby when doing this, and I jammed the bucket into frozen ground to stop the pirouette. Sort of ruined a pleasant plow...lol. Adrenaline sucks. 


















Starting to get the hang of adjusting the doors...I spent last night adjusting the swing doors. 3 axis adjustment on hinges with Allen key. Rather neat one can adjust doors if they go out alignment. Got the swing door adjusted to the point I can give door a light tap and it clicks home.


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## melli

Nothing really new...just a better pic. Scheming on how to come up with a few grand to get Roxul Panelboard and Cedar Soffit...local lumber stores don't carry either item, and consequently, one has to buy the works at once. Would be nice pick up a few hundred bucks worth of material at a time...at least get started.
The birds are making their way back into my hood, and soon they'll be thinking my eaves make good nesting sites...need to cover them up before they use my bunker as a flop house.


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## Steve_S

Hmmm very odd that you cannot get Cedar Planks/Boards in BC ? Any local saw mills that do cedar ? Maybe time to start perusing around and asking about, we have many Cedar, Pine - Softwood, & Hardwood mills who don't advertise... these are all local guys will smaller mills, couple have bigger mills (those guys do the hardwoods) and these folks usually supply up the chain but people can buy from them too for cash (and much cheaper to boot.

Really surprised your having a hard time on the Roxul Panelboard ! Only other viable alternative that could be used instead would be foil faced PolyISO but in "retail land" the cost for it is 300%+ more than commercial costs, ironic because ISO is very recyclable, very cheap to manufacture with very low Carbon Footprint and super lightweight. Maybe if you have a neighbour who is building, planning a build or addition, you could get together and buy it by the lift and save (Roxul or even ISO). Possibly, another option, if you know anyone in the commercial roofing business who could get you that at their marked up value (still far less than any bog box or lumber supplier). Last option, possibly Building Inspector could refer you to someone that could help with.

BTW: Both PolyISO & Roxul (even better) meet fire code requirements plus and neither have toxins nor stuff that flashes off into the atmosphere (specifically VOC's).

Hope it helps and HUGS for a quicky Boost ! Keep on inspiring !


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## MoBookworm1957

Looks good.


----------



## melli

Steve_S said:


> Hmmm very odd that you cannot get Cedar Planks/Boards in BC ? Any local saw mills that do cedar ? Maybe time to start perusing around and asking about, we have many Cedar, Pine - Softwood, & Hardwood mills who don't advertise... these are all local guys will smaller mills, couple have bigger mills (those guys do the hardwoods) and these folks usually supply up the chain but people can buy from them too for cash (and much cheaper to boot.
> 
> Really surprised your having a hard time on the Roxul Panelboard ! Only other viable alternative that could be used instead would be foil faced PolyISO but in "retail land" the cost for it is 300%+ more than commercial costs, ironic because ISO is very recyclable, very cheap to manufacture with very low Carbon Footprint and super lightweight. Maybe if you have a neighbour who is building, planning a build or addition, you could get together and buy it by the lift and save (Roxul or even ISO). Possibly, another option, if you know anyone in the commercial roofing business who could get you that at their marked up value (still far less than any bog box or lumber supplier). Last option, possibly Building Inspector could refer you to someone that could help with.
> 
> BTW: Both PolyISO & Roxul (even better) meet fire code requirements plus and neither have toxins nor stuff that flashes off into the atmosphere (specifically VOC's).
> 
> Hope it helps and HUGS for a quicky Boost ! Keep on inspiring !


There is a guy a couple blocks away who mills lumber, but mostly rough cut (I need at least smooth one side and T&G). Rarely does he plane or edge them. I need cedar, as it is the only lumber I've seen that can handle the elements around here. I want to do the soffit once...then forget about it. 
And oddly, PolyISO is not stocked here. XPS and Korolite foam is stocked. I wanted to stay away from foam because it doesn't breathe. I can get Roxul Panelboard, but have to order a skid worth. And I haven't seen any builds around here that are 'exterior insulating'. 
A while back, I did peruse the local miller's cedar, but he wanted near the same price as the lumber store, and the lumber store offered D4S (dressed four sides) for what the miller wanted for his rough cut lumber...I used cedar for trim on well shed. It is holding up really well. The ply I soaked in stain for well shed soffit is showing signs of discoloration. 

A store down coast says they have a few cedar boards in stock, so I'll go have a look. I really want to see the stuff first, before I commit. I won't be able to afford 'clear' cedar, but too often, the knotty stuff is just too knotty. 

Building Inspector knows exactly what I need...lol. I yap to him about it, every other day. 

Thanks MoBookworm1957! (great sig pic)


----------



## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> There is a guy a couple blocks away who mills lumber, but mostly rough cut (I need at least smooth one side and T&G). Rarely does he plane or edge them. I need cedar, as it is the only lumber I've seen that can handle the elements around here. I want to do the soffit once...then forget about it.
> And oddly, PolyISO is not stocked here. XPS and Korolite foam is stocked. I wanted to stay away from foam because it doesn't breathe. I can get Roxul Panelboard, but have to order a skid worth. And I haven't seen any builds around here that are 'exterior insulating'.
> A while back, I did peruse the local miller's cedar, but he wanted near the same price as the lumber store, and the lumber store offered D4S (dressed four sides) for what the miller wanted for his rough cut lumber...I used cedar for trim on well shed. It is holding up really well. The ply I soaked in stain for well shed soffit is showing signs of discoloration.
> 
> A store down coast says they have a few cedar boards in stock, so I'll go have a look. I really want to see the stuff first, before I commit. I won't be able to afford 'clear' cedar, but too often, the knotty stuff is just too knotty.
> 
> Building Inspector knows exactly what I need...lol. I yap to him about it, every other day.
> 
> Thanks MoBookworm1957! (great sig pic)


Sounds like the guy at the mill didn't want to be bothered with selling to you. I've priced 8x8 rough cut cedar beams at a lumber mill about 50 miles away and they are half what the big box store charges for 8x8 SYP beams. I'll take cedar for my sill over SYP any day!


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## Steve_S

You know Melli, you could buy Rough Cut Cedar and with a table saw and a reasonably cheap planer like say a King Canada 12" model (inexpensive but good for general duty (not commercial use). I actually bought an older (mid 70's) King Canada planer from a Garage Sale for $50, best $50 spent, paid for itself several times over already. Look at the 12-1/2" and 13" but the 12" is cheaper and less fancy (not commercial model) similar to the one I have.

REF: http://www.kingcanada.com/search-results/?cid=62&mid=7

PS: Still designed & engineered in Canada but outsourced to China for manufacture, not bad quality at all... I even have one of their 3KW Inverter Generator and that has taken it really really well and is quite a treat to use, even with the 500+ hours on it. I think OldTruck may be right, that this guy just didn't really want to sell private.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Sounds like the guy at the mill didn't want to be bothered with selling to you. I've priced 8x8 rough cut cedar beams at a lumber mill about 50 miles away and they are half what the big box store charges for 8x8 SYP beams. I'll take cedar for my sill over SYP any day!


It isn't so much he doesn't want to sell, as I have bought lumber from him before, but when his prices and my 'contractor' rate at lumber store are close, well, I am heading to lumber store, as I can be picky, and even return crap. 
This was something I made with his lumber...a picnic table that would never budge and seat a whack of people...lol








I sanded it and routered edges (not in pic). Western Red Cedar. Pic doesn't show how big it is, and how heavy it is...lol. Had to assemble on-site. Funny thing about a picnic table, is finding specs to build one! Such variation on web, and I spent way too much time deciding at what height the seat and table should be at. 











Steve_S said:


> You know Melli, you could buy Rough Cut Cedar and with a table saw and a reasonably cheap planer like say a King Canada 12" model (inexpensive but good for general duty (not commercial use). I actually bought an older (mid 70's) King Canada planer from a Garage Sale for $50, best $50 spent, paid for itself several times over already. Look at the 12-1/2" and 13" but the 12" is cheaper and less fancy (not commercial model) similar to the one I have.
> 
> REF: http://www.kingcanada.com/search-results/?cid=62&mid=7
> 
> PS: Still designed & engineered in Canada but outsourced to China for manufacture, not bad quality at all... I even have one of their 3KW Inverter Generator and that has taken it really really well and is quite a treat to use, even with the 500+ hours on it. I think OldTruck may be right, that this guy just didn't really want to sell private.


In my tool acquisition days, I was so close to picking up a planer, but it didn't happen. I just can't justify the cost for such a small job. One day, if I ever get around to a workshop, that would be a tool to get. Steve, I am tanked right now...lol. I'll have to practice patience until I can afford more building supplies. So hard given I am so close to being bug/rodent proof. The one problem is I need to get on Roxul before soffit, so I have two relatively expensive hurdles.


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## Steve_S

Spring Yard Sales always provide good finds, people get the darndest things from Santa and then have goodies in the spring for the eagle eyed bargain hunter.  love that Table BTW, that will outlast you ! LMAO geez Louise... no 1/2 measures nor even a hint with you eh ! MARRY ME ! hehehe ... naw, we'd tussle over who get's to the tools first on the projects hehehehe...


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## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> Spring Yard Sales always provide good finds, people get the darndest things from Santa and then have goodies in the spring for the eagle eyed bargain hunter.  love that Table BTW, that will outlast you ! LMAO geez Louise... no 1/2 measures nor even a hint with you eh ! MARRY ME ! hehehe ... naw, we'd tussle over who get's to the tools first on the projects hehehehe...


Personally, I hate yard sales, but they are a good place to find tools. Better than estate sales. I've gone to a couple of those and saw people get so wrapped up in winning an auction that they paid near retail for used stuff! And if you catch wind of a yard sale being held because of a divorce, you can really score big there!


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## HeavyHauler

Melli, just a question; but does the BI have a woman in his life?

If not, maybe you guys should try dating. Sounds like you guys have a bit of chemistry to work with anyway.

Could be an adventure.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Personally, I hate yard sales, but they are a good place to find tools. Better than estate sales. I've gone to a couple of those and saw people get so wrapped up in winning an auction that they paid near retail for used stuff! And if you catch wind of a yard sale being held because of a divorce, you can really score big there!


We don't have auction sales out here in the sticks. We do have old timers passing on, and some relatives, from far away, who inherit the homestead, eager to offload their possession and property, hold garage sales. If one is quick to the scene, they can get some silly good deals, as the relatives either haven't a clue or don't care. 
I was at a guy's place getting some flashing, and he showed off his 'new' excavator. We are talking a 20-30 ton job (massive). Seems the relative had no idea how to turn it on, and if it turned on. Well, the relative asks the guy how much he is willing to pay, and the guy says how much do you want...$2k. He jumps in, fires it up and takes it home. A machine that big is worth $2k in scrap alone, but this is a working machine in good shape...geesh, some folks know how to find a deal. I mean the guy could turn around and sell it for $20k in a heart beat. Seems he wants it though, to add to his fleet (3rd one). I'm sitting there, mouth agape...Bobby could fit in the cleanup bucket of this excavator.


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## Lisa in WA

HeavyHauler said:


> Melli, just a question; but does the BI have a woman in his life?
> 
> If not, maybe you guys should try dating. Sounds like you guys have a bit of chemistry to work with anyway.
> 
> Could be an adventure.


I may be misremembering but I think Melli is a guy.


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## Steve_S

Lisa in WA said:


> I may be misremembering but I think Melli is a guy.


 Hahahaha...... Well Melli Dear, I guess Scratch that Proposal eh ! <<grins>> wink wink, nudge nudge, eh what !

Spring Yard Sales are best, I learned to avoid auctions long ago.


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## Lisa in WA

Steve_S said:


> Hahahaha...... Well Melli Dear, I guess Scratch that Proposal eh ! <<grins>> wink wink, nudge nudge, eh what !
> 
> Spring Yard Sales are best, I learned to avoid auctions long ago.


Lol...my h7sband went to an auction once for an auger and came home with a dump truck. He enjoyed the HECK out of that dump truck too.


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## melli

Lisa in WA said:


> I may be misremembering but I think Melli is a guy.


Uh, no...lol. Where did you remember that?
I think the perception is because I am building my home, I must be a guy. Bit of a shame, we are still in that mode of thinking. My parents took on any obstacle, and absolutely nothing deterred them (rubbed off on me). In terms of how I stumbled into building stuff, it started over a decade ago, when I decided to build a shed...a very small shed. I had taken a woodworking class in high school, but really, I had no clue how build a 'proper' shed. Once I finished that (took a long time), I never looked back...

While I grew up in a gender binary based society, things are changing. I go the gravel pit, and a young woman is running the heavy machinery...and this isn't tonka toy stuff, but monster metal (my Bobby, relatively speaking, is a tonka toy). Times are changing. I'll admit, even I was taken aback when I saw her doing her thing on a excavator. She is in her late teens, early 20's. I watched a documentary a while back about how the oil sands business likes to hire women, because as it turns out, they are quite good at operating heavy equipment. No disrespect towards men intended...

Heavyhauler...BI is married. He is helpful where possible, especially helping me haul up door to second floor and installing it. No way I could have done it otherwise. Kind of worries me, as the door better last. Swapping it out, is not an option.


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## Lisa in WA

melli said:


> Uh, no...lol. Where did you remember that?
> I think the perception is because I am building my home, I must be a guy. Bit of a shame, we are still in that mode of thinking. My parents took on any obstacle, and absolutely nothing deterred them (rubbed off on me). In terms of how I stumbled into building stuff, it started over a decade ago, when I decided to build a shed...a very small shed. I had taken a woodworking class in high school, but really, I had no clue how build a 'proper' shed. Once I finished that (took a long time), I never looked back...
> 
> While I grew up in a gender binary based society, things are changing. I go the gravel pit, and a young woman is running the heavy machinery...and this isn't tonka toy stuff, but monster metal (my Bobby, relatively speaking, is a tonka toy). Times are changing. I'll admit, even I was taken aback when I saw her doing her thing on a excavator. She is in her late teens, early 20's. I watched a documentary a while back about how the oil sands business likes to hire women, because as it turns out, they are quite good at operating heavy equipment. No disrespect towards men intended...
> 
> Heavyhauler...BI is married. He is helpful where possible, especially helping me haul up door to second floor and installing it. No way I could have done it otherwise. Kind of worries me, as the door better last. Swapping it out, is not an option.



Lol... I thought you were! No idea where I got it. I know women build things...I did so with my husband.


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## Steve_S

OK, proposal is BACK ON THE TABLE ! hehehehe.... I just LOVE a woman who can swing a hammer, solder a pipe, set a window in place and not be fearful of "muck" (British sense of the word)... and Melli, you come with a Bunker & a Bobbi ! 100% WIN for any smart guy with any sense ! and I bet it's really easy to weed out the weirdo's too with regressive mindsets.

BTW: My last Race Engine (Big Block Chev, 396 bored to 402, balanced to 10,000 RPM and 1000HP with NOS) was built by a drop dead beautiful blonde woman in her 30's whop built drag cars ! who no one would have ever dreamed she knew what a crescent wrench or tap & die set was, yet she was a master machinist and race engines is her thing ! One of the nicest ladies (and a TRUE LADY) I have ever known.


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## melli

Good story Steve...world is changing. No worries Lisa...I get it. Funny how a trip to get an auger resulted in a dump truck (even I know they are not remotely similar...lol). Speaking of which, that guy who got an excavator for 2k, did get a dump truck from Kansas, of all places! A single axle, 4x4 dump truck...very handy for around here. A common issue around here is dump trucks are limited where they can go on our hills.

Ok, moving along....house is sort of on hold....plenty to do, but I got fixated with my lumber pile (eyesore). Perhaps I can make a couple dollars. Anybody have any idea how much someone would pay for cedar logs, for split rail fencing? I have about 20 of them, from 12'-20' long. 










All I have left is two decent logs (in background)...I mounted one on a pedestal in case the desire to Alaskan mill it into posts for 2nd floor deck on bunker overtakes me...actually, I was going to buck them up, but ran out of steam...lol

Looking a lot cleaner over there...










Chainsawing is seriously beginning to wear on me...I had some neighbors drop by and tell me they went through all the firewood they took from me over the years! A few years back, I gave it to them for free. They went nuts, and hauled truckload after truckload. All they had to do was buck it up and haul it away. Then I discovered I could make a few bucks to cover the costs (mainly Bobby, but chainsaw is greedy too). Flash forward to today, and now everyone is out of firewood...seems this past winter was heavy on firewood use. Well, all I have left is this pile.


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## MoBookworm1957

Dad went to auction, came back with single prop. plane.
He went for tin sheeting.
Sold it for three times what he bought it for. lol......


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## Lisa in WA

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Dad went to auction, came back with single prop. plane.
> He went for tin sheeting.
> Sold it for three times what he bought it for. lol......


Funny thing about the dump truck. Everyone who saw it walked around it, kicked the tires and asked how much he paid for it. 
When he told them he paid 2k, they all said, “hmph. Tires are worth more ‘n that!”

He learned about hydraulics, fixed them on the truck, used it for a couple of years to haul rock and gravel for our very long driveway and had a fun time with it and then sold it for 5k....before he had to replace the tires. 
It was a good purchase.
Though I wish we still had it because my grandson LOVES dump trucks.


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## HeavyHauler

melli said:


> Uh, no...lol. Where did you remember that?
> I think the perception is because I am building my home, I must be a guy. Bit of a shame, we are still in that mode of thinking. My parents took on any obstacle, and absolutely nothing deterred them (rubbed off on me). In terms of how I stumbled into building stuff, it started over a decade ago, when I decided to build a shed...a very small shed. I had taken a woodworking class in high school, but really, I had no clue how build a 'proper' shed. Once I finished that (took a long time), I never looked back...
> 
> While I grew up in a gender binary based society, things are changing. I go the gravel pit, and a young woman is running the heavy machinery...and this isn't tonka toy stuff, but monster metal (my Bobby, relatively speaking, is a tonka toy). Times are changing. I'll admit, even I was taken aback when I saw her doing her thing on a excavator. She is in her late teens, early 20's. I watched a documentary a while back about how the oil sands business likes to hire women, because as it turns out, they are quite good at operating heavy equipment. No disrespect towards men intended...
> 
> Heavyhauler...BI is married. He is helpful where possible, especially helping me haul up door to second floor and installing it. No way I could have done it otherwise. Kind of worries me, as the door better last. Swapping it out, is not an option.


Well that's unfortunate! You guys seem like a great fit!


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## HeavyHauler

Lisa in WA said:


> I may be misremembering but I think Melli is a guy.


Melli is a dudette, not a dude.


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## melli

Decided I ought to prep for soffit...feels good to have at least started. Once the soffit is on, then the place becomes a summer cottage (fully sealed). Then I can work inside, to get it functional to live in.

I had to get the housewrap to the top, on the sides of the second floor...first, I had some roof underlay (grey stuff) left over, so I used it as a splash guard on the 2nd floor wall. Rain hitting main roof will splash onto 2nd floor wall, but the underlay will make sure I have no issues down the road. 

















Once the housewrap was on, I could block along the inside of the fascia (aka bargeboard) and wall so when I put up soffit (likely cedar T&G), I have a nailing surface. I was going to bring Roxul panelboard insulation up behind fascia, but nixed that idea so I could move things along. I really need to move things along...lol


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## melli

I am in a pickle. Went on an expedition to find out who has what and how much (soffit). The T&G knotty cedar 1x6 (3/4x5-1/2" true with 5" coverage) looked a wee bit too rustic for me (get dizzy looking at all the knots). Was hoping to stain the cedar with a teak stain. At around $1.50 per foot, I'd be looking at 2k for soffit. 
Then for fun, asked what it would cost for clear cedar (cedar with no knots - gorgeous stuff). About 5k...ha, that would take a while to save up for...
Then moving in other direction, looked at plastic (vinyl) soffit. Probably under a grand to do the works. Problem there is color selection. Some real 'sad' colors to choose from...lol
BI thinks I should go with plastic, and down the road swap it out for good stuff. I don't like do-overs...once is enough for me. Plus, it would mean rebuilding a scaffold. Champagne tastes on a beggars budget. 

The thing is, the soffit, unlike a traditional gabled roof is front and center in terms of visibility. A good looking soffit actually becomes part of the bunker's character, a focal point, especially under carport. 

I like cedar, especially clear cedar (just looks beautiful) because once it is up, I can forget about it. No chance of blowouts. With the plastic stuff, I'll have to reinforce eaves so the stuff doesn't sag or blowout. 

Some pics to highlight the difference between clear and knotty;
http://coastalcedardirect.com/products/1x4-tongue-and-groove-clear-cedar/
http://www.buffalo-lumber.com/stk-mill-select-wood-grade/


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## Mickie3

Clear cedar on front and vinyl on sides and back? Around here, there are some soffit materials that are made to look like (color / texture) as some wood types.


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## melli

I might have briefly touched upon some long time neighbors/friends in my old hood who sold their cottage (exactly like my old one), and began their long search for an acreage lot. They would come visit me, over the years, as I cleared and developed this property, and they'd pine for something similar. Things were not looking good for them, as available acreage lots seemed to vanish in the past few years. Wouldn't say we've been discovered, but with Vancouver prices they way they are ('average' house is around $1.5 million), it has forced folks to look further afield. When folks sold here in past, one had to have extreme patience, as their listing could languish for years, as my old cottage did. Now, if a reasonable place, sold within days or weeks.

At any rate, I'm thinking it will be some time before they find an acreage lot. Actually, over winter, there were no real acreage lots for sale. The only acreage lot for sale, had a newly built monster home on it (it was an estate lot with numerous buildings). And the sellers wanted a premium. I didn't think they'd take the plunge and buy it, but I was wrong...lol

They basically bought the premier lot on the market, of the past year. A couple built their dream home, then put the place on the market, never spending a night in their new home (property actually has two other livable homes on it). Seems their extended family didn't want to move from afar (another country), so they are moving back to them.

In the interest of privacy, I can only show one pic I took of their new place...I think this pic gives a viewer a sense of what they got. The previous owner milled all the lumber used in build...this is why owning a mill can do wonders...lol










This is the top floor...there are three floors in total, with a massive wrap around deck. The house has a view of the ocean, and harbor.
Just to hire someone to do the log work on this home would be a fortune. Actually, every stick of wood you see in pic was milled by previous owner, including windows...


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## melli

Mickie3 said:


> Clear cedar on front and vinyl on sides and back? Around here, there are some soffit materials that are made to look like (color / texture) as some wood types.


I've looked around, but I've seen nothing that looks reasonable that isn't cedar. I briefly looked at hardi type material for soffit, but not very easy to put up.
Two-toning the soffit would be noticeable, as the soffit is so visible from south side.


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## oldtruckbbq

I'm going to be facing the same quandary when it comes time. We are planning a shed roof with 4 foot overhang on all sides. That is a LOT of soffit area to cover, even if the house is just 32 x 40. Although I would have to do a lot of work, I can buy bundles of cedar slabs (42"w x 36"h x 8'l) for $30. This is "scrap" from a lumber milling operation. It would take some time and there would be a lot of waste, but I figure I could get enough to work with out of a couple hundred bucks worth of these bundles. Sometimes those of us on a beggar budget have to come up with creative ways to get or make what we want. Probably about the only lumber we will buy from the lumber yard will be some pressure treated, I beam joists, rim board, subfloor, and roof. That will end up costing enough.

The only scrap any of the yards around here sell is cedar. The oak and hickory scraps all go to the charcoal briquette plants.










I can also get red cedar bundles, 1 1/8" thick boards, 8' long in bundles of about 500 board feet for $150. Red cedar might make for a very interesting soffit.


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## melli

As I mull over a soffit 'deal', I got cracking on the interior. I have to frame the walls on interior with 2x4, to support carrying services and more insulation. 









Soffit deal: 2500 linear feet of clear cedar S1S (smooth one side) 1x4 T&G (profile below) for $2600 CDN ($2000 USD). As usual, I called everywhere...absolutely the best price I'd find anywhere, I suspect. One smallish problem, all 5' lengths. I can make it work...and work it will be. End gables are no problem, as they are 2' wide, but lower and upper eaves are long runs. Just wish they were a tad longer, and multiples of 2', so I have less wastage. That being said, clear cedar is beautiful...rivals any premier wood I've played with. A bonus is the guy will deliver for free, which is huge, as it would cost me a penny to get it. 









Actually, as I look at it, I realize it is less than a 1/2" thick...hmmm...
Decisions...


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## melli

I bailed on the 11mm thick soffit. Just too thin for my taste. Last thing I want to do is fix soffit after installed. Hopefully, they will come back with something better. I did chat with my local mill, and he could help, but could take weeks or months to line up. A part of me loathes spending anymore money...lol. Not a good time, over halfway in build, to acquire that mindset. 
Was framing up interior, and then I stalled. Deciding on exactly where to put walls is head scratch-er. A bathroom and a narrow utility closet need to be put in. Mulling over how narrow I can make the utility closet without getting grief from the electrical inspector. A HWT will be in narrow utility closet, and if one has to squeeze by to access electrical panel, is that ok? Looking at bottom pic, one can see all the electrical conduit up against ICF wall, and in foreground are three pipes coming out of floor. Big one is septic for upstairs bathroom, little one is floor drain for HWT, and the other is washer machine drain. 
I took a step away from wall building and painted the backside wall...weather has improved dramatically (grass is growing). 

All those logs and rounds in above pics are all gone...the place is cleaning up nicely. 

























Forgot to stick some vapor barrier behind first wall I threw up...doh. Not the end of world, as I don't see much vapor (moisture) passing through a concrete wall with 2-1/2" of foam on both sides.


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## Mr Bond

Do you need vapor barrier Melli? From what I know and a quick look online the answer is no......

http://www.nudura.com/divisions/builder/faq---builders
http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com...15749/vapor-barrier-location-icf-construction


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Do you need vapor barrier Melli? From what I know and a quick look online the answer is no......
> 
> http://www.nudura.com/divisions/builder/faq---builders
> http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com...15749/vapor-barrier-location-icf-construction


Haha, good find! Thanks for that. I vaguely remembered something to that effect, but felt it would be nice to throw something up, like the CertainTeed Membrain, https://www.certainteed.com/building-insulation/products/membrain/
Partially for moisture control, but mostly for dust control (both ways) and aesthetics, as it will be a while before walls get covered. 
Funny, how I forget my research...What I needed, was a big blackboard where I could tape up all my research into sections, as it seems I am jumping around like a flea from one building science facet to another. Like watching a Cirque du Soleil circus, my brain is rebelling...lol
Doesn't help I am stressing over the bloody soffit (different prices, sizes, flavors, patterns, finishing, and grades).


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## Steve_S

You know, I installed aluminium facia (bent to my spec by the local tin man) over 3/4" ply (facia backing) which is the same colour as the roof and the perforated / vented aluminium soffit which is the same colour too, all forest green. I chose vented for a few reasons, one being that I did not wish any spot to be able to collect damp / humidity and hold it, especially being in-bush, the second was that due to the cool roof system, I needed to allow air to go up under the tin into the vertical air channels that use the natural convection to vent out heat in summer and keep the thermal break working. I have owned two places with closed up soffits (unvented) and in both instances I had repairs to do and then switched to vented, critters nested in there and they caused damage and then water & other issues followed after that... I bought those places like that.

The aluminium facia was just bent up from coloured flat tin stock supplied by the roof tin manufacturer and the soffit came in 12' lengths so they just had to be cut to fit, very easy to cut too, a pair of good scissors would cut it but straight tin snips are better of course. All of that was actually pretty cheap really, well except for the 3/4" ply which is never cheap. (albeit I did use G1S)


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## melli

Will be vented, albeit, via a vent strip. As per our code, the general rule is 1:300 (ex. 1 sqft of venting per 300sqft of insulated roof). 1:150 for low slope roofs (2:12 pitch or lower). 
http://rpm.rcabc.org/index.php?title=Building_Ventilation


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## Steve_S

As Requested Melli, you can see the soffit & facia which is 11-1/2" high, as you may recall I built my Hovel with a Cool Roof that has a 2" air space between the tin & the hard roof to allow air intake from the soffit and venting out the top Ridge Vent which makes a BIG difference for managing temps, it's an amazing method for roof structure.

REF the Cool Roof design for you and anyone else following along: 
(one of the best descriptions out there but can be found in some building codes, green building advisor and will be in the next Canadian Building Code Standard due later this year) ** it does have different names, depending on where you look.








http://www.houstoncoolmetalroofs.com/cool-roof-information/cool-roof-design-texas/


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## melli

Getting the interior walls put up...getting cramped. My 'large' bathroom and kitchen are shrinking by the day...lol
I had to make the utility closet/corridor wide enough so that I don't have any grief by the electrical inspector, as the panel requires 1m (39inches) clearance in front of it. Plus, I plan to stick HWT in utility closet, and need room to shuffle by to get to electrical panel. So, the bathroom became a little smaller...still sizable, but not spacious (you can see a toilet I bought sitting in bathroom - a one piece job). 
Found another toilet on sale for upstairs (have to pick it up). 

The BI will give me a hand sorting out plumbing, as it is his expertise (I probably test his patience on the matter...lol). Seems the vent pipe rules require a 3" pipe because some bozos back east were flushing a street sewage line and homeowners toilets started to bubble....sheesh. Well, I am going with a 2" pipe...I am not hooked up to street septic line (we don't have one). We discussed the minutiae of pipe sizes required. Should you care to know, 2" for drains, except 3" min for toilet. 1-1/2" vent lines, except one vent line from main trunk (3" min - the big pipe that goes to septic field) to roof must be 2". I should get started on that soon enough. I'm looking forward to doing the electrical...once the place is 'hot', good things can happen. 

I've come to a standstill on soffit acquisition. I am balking at paying 3k for soffit. I may end up with knotty cedar...see if my fav teak stain can mute the knots. I am obsessing over the soffit because in this shed style build, it is front and center (highly visible). It will make or break the overall modern style I am looking for. I like wood tones, but not a rustic look. It seems clear cedar is hard to source, unless money is no object. 

























You'll note I went with a 2x6 wall on one side of bathroom. A joist or two for second floor was slightly sagging...the 2x6 wall applies enough pressure to level second floor. Plus, the 2x6 wall, being thicker, can easily handle vent pipe from bathroom sink. I walked on second floor and the difference is quite noticeable...very solid, plus darn near perfectly level. Glad it worked...seems one second floor joist wasn't happy with all the bloody knots in it, so it sagged a tad (3/8"). Also glad I added extra rebar in concrete floor for that wall, so it can handle the load.


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## HeavyHauler

Are you gonna be putting railing on the stairs?

If not, it may be a good idea to do so.


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## melli

HeavyHauler said:


> Are you gonna be putting railing on the stairs?
> 
> If not, it may be a good idea to do so.


Yeah...railing and stuff like that will go on near end (finishing stage). 
I'd end bashing them or getting drywall mud/paint on them, if I put them up sooner. 
I still have to finish the stairs (lower section is missing), and put on real treads. Still mulling over railing style...was thinking of using treads (will be big slabs of wood ~ 2" x 11" true) as supports for pickets. I might do something similar to this for second floor railing along stair well...









Albeit, a pain getting center post mounted solid, as I had to mount it flat on subfloor. In US, they have inexpensive mounting brackets (hidden), but in Canada, not so inexpensive. The railing (S4S Fir) isn't all that cheap...might end up going with a pony wall...

Although plumbing drain/vent pipes can be messy, look forward to getting the bunker plumbed. Picking up plumbing stuff tomorrow.


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## melli

Rolling along the ICF walls, on inside, putting up interior walls to carry services. Fairly easy, but I am a sloth nowadays. Easy, because I just have to stick a board up against the ICF wall, and nail it to the sleeper boards screwed into wall. 
As I got to living room wall, it occurred to me, I don't have to frame right to ceiling. My R-values for walls will be near 40. If I continued with dummy wall to rafters, that section (above ICF wall) would have an R value of 60, which is a bit much, and just more money.
Plus, the BI noted the transom windows jambs will be really deep, reducing the view and light coming in. 

There will be a ledge at top of ICF (about 7" deep). Not keen for a ledge so high (10'), as ledges become dust repositories, but it would be a good place to mount upward facing LED lights...sort of mood lighting. Figure 4 lights in between windows, shining upwards (similar to cornice lighting). I have a collection of colored vases...might look good up there.









You can see the bathroom and utility closet easier in pic above...thinking of putting washer/dryer where clamp is (on other side of wall).


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## melli

The other wall...and now upstairs to finish the last of walls. 
















The toilet will fit in that corner, behind wall.









Have a hankering to clean the bunker out, of everything. My tarp shed blew up, so I am stuck with piling 'stuff' in bunker. Need to do a purge...


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> The other wall...and now upstairs to finish the last of walls.
> View attachment 65453
> 
> View attachment 65454
> 
> The toilet will fit in that corner, behind wall.
> View attachment 65455
> 
> 
> Have a hankering to clean the bunker out, of everything. My tarp shed blew up, so I am stuck with piling 'stuff' in bunker. Need to do a purge...


I see what you mean about the depth of the windows. The walls in our cordwood home will be 16" thick, so we will have really deep window ledges. We plan on having large windows so the wall depth doesn't block views so badly, while also being aware that windows are the biggest source of heat transfer. On the flip side, the cats will love the deep ledges. We will have to keep some of the windows lower to the ground so the dogs can also see out. They are Labs, so tall windows 18-24" off the floor will work for that.

Making good progress. It must be nice to have indoor work to do when it is cold and wet outside.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I see what you mean about the depth of the windows. The walls in our cordwood home will be 16" thick, so we will have really deep window ledges. We plan on having large windows so the wall depth doesn't block views so badly, while also being aware that windows are the biggest source of heat transfer. On the flip side, the cats will love the deep ledges. We will have to keep some of the windows lower to the ground so the dogs can also see out. They are Labs, so tall windows 18-24" off the floor will work for that.
> 
> Making good progress. It must be nice to have indoor work to do when it is cold and wet outside.


Yes, nice to do something in bad weather, but the main floor of bunker is like a Styrofoam cooler...it traps the cold...haha. Be nice in summer I suspect.
Put up wall dividing walk-through closet and bedroom...of course, I forgot to get some poly up there...doh! I keep reminding myself, even a day in advance, yet I forgot. Just need to bump out end of toilet wall so it is even with closet wall, and then I'm done with upstairs. Forgot about closet I wanted to put in for downstairs, by door...I better get that up before I start wiring (may want to have a switch on closet wall).
Might take a break from carpentry and start the plumbing...










I call the wall dividing closet from bedroom, a 'headache rack'...I used 2x6s, in case a tree visits the roof. My bed will probably be up against that wall. I was joking with BI that I was going to put up a monster LVL beam there...lol


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## Hitch

That's the first time I've seen framing to the ICF walls... very interesting. I know this is a stupid question, but the screws into the styrofoam will be strong enough to support the framing and drywall? I'm sure it's got to be nice working inside lately.


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## melli

Hitch said:


> That's the first time I've seen framing to the ICF walls... very interesting. I know this is a stupid question, but the screws into the styrofoam will be strong enough to support the framing and drywall? I'm sure it's got to be nice working inside lately.


No, not stupid at all...the ICF has embedded nailing strips (plastic flanges) every 8" apart about 3/4" deep in foam. See if I have a pic to show you...
This webbing of plastic is what keeps the foam from blowing up when you pour concrete in it. It also holds rebar in place. I will be using these nailing strips to support siding too.
As you see in pics, I have 'sleepers' lying on wall (2x4s). I've screwed those into the webbing every 8". The interior wall nails to those sleepers. I might even anchor the sleepers to concrete, but we will see. A 2x4 wall usually has a bit of shimmy when you whack it, but not these walls...lol. Rock solid. One benefit I noticed, was that I could straighten a bung board, since I am nailing to sleepers every couple of feet up wall.








You can see the black plastic nailing strips where I cut for door entry in above pic. Those nailing strips are attached to webbing holding up rebar.

Should add, an ICF wall has about a R-20 insulation value...actually, better than just about any insulation system, as there are no thermal breaks (like wall studs). I am just bumping up that number a bit with the interior framing (add another R-12 or R-22, depending on what size batt I use). Now, a person can channel into foam for service runs, but I figure that defeats the purpose of having an ICF wall. I'll use the 2x4 walls for service runs, leaving foam untouched. I actually have 5" deep wood walls, as the sleepers add 1-1/2".


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## Steve_S

Lookin Good Melli ! suggestion for the forgetfulness on the plastic for example, use a marker mark the walls / ceilings whatever you want to put something on (covering the marker of course). I have a habit of doing that and pencil marks on floors when figuring things before cutting, there's always some detail lurking waiting to be forgotten or missed.


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## Hitch

Oh, ok I can see it now. That makes total sense. I've been watching "Pure Living for Life" on YouTube and they poured ICF walls, which was the first time I had seen it. I really like it and am interested in it for our house when we get to that point.


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## melli

I took the plunge and started plumbing. No idea why I was nervous about it...while I haven't plumbed a house before, I have done a lot of DWV repairs/mods etc. A neighbor lent me his awesome forstner bit set for plumbing sized holes. I have a forstner set, but for smaller holes. What a difference! No sweating involved. 2-1/8" forstner bit chewed through double studs in 6 seconds or so...sweet. Left nice clean holes. I wasn't looking forward to using a hole saw, and now I don't. If I was keen, one could rough in plumbing in a day, easy. It'll take me several...lol

You can see forstner bit on drill in pic. These runs in pics, are for venting...got the worst section out of the way (bathroom).

I am dry fitting everything...when done, I'll go back and glue it (after I get my bud to look things over).


























The 'glued P-trap' is for washer machine (2" - cannot use a screw together P-trap like what you see under sinks). Cleanouts at every pipe coming up through concrete. I use miter saw for pipe cutting...the sawzall is just for cutting the pipe coming out of floor. I was educated to really clean the pipe ends of burrs (use a half round file). Don't want stuff to get hung up at joints.


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## melli

Several days later, I finished the plumbing rough-in. Wasn't too bad, except drilling through Douglas fir ceiling joists. Had no 4-1/2" hole saw, so I had to use smaller ones to get the desired result (for 2nd floor bathroom). Standing on a ladder while every ounce of sawdust coats you, while you are heaving with everything you have, does wear on one. I was ok with exposed plumbing in utility closet, but didn't want a bulkhead on stair landing (where toilet is above). Once I sorted that out, everything else went well. Have to reiterate, having a forstner bit set, made quick work of hole drilling, albeit, a pail and a half of wood chips was the spoils.
Now, I can mess around with water side of things...putting in a thermal expansion tank. Going to mount a large hunk of plywood for water service. Sort of a circuit board for water. Trying to source two water manifolds like this:
http://www.siouxchief.com/products/supply/powerpex-systems/astm-f1807/manifolds/1-2-pex-branches/3-4-pex-×-spin-closed-trunk/valved
In USA, no problem getting them, but in Canada, a problem (as usual).









Main stack in background, laundry in foreground, and that nub is a floor drain and overflow drain for hot water tank, which will nestle between two vertical pipes.









2nd Floor half bath - note the 2" vent pipe (which came from 3" main stack), and the 1-1/2" secondary vent pipe (it vents downstairs bathroom, laundry and kitchen). They join above the 2nd floor sink level, after which, the 2" pipe will go through roof.


















Hard to take pics, in totality, of plumbing system...just a few of different areas.
I figure it was about $400 in piping and fittings. I have to give props to Noble Plumbing (a plumbing supplier an hour away). They gave me contractor prices. Beat big box building supply store prices easily.
Have a plumbing pro friend who will inspect the works before I glue it (just dry fitted everything).


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Several days later, I finished the plumbing rough-in. Wasn't too bad, except drilling through Douglas fir ceiling joists. Had no 4-1/2" hole saw, so I had to use smaller ones to get the desired result (for 2nd floor bathroom). Standing on a ladder while every ounce of sawdust coats you, while you are heaving with everything you have, does wear on one. I was ok with exposed plumbing in utility closet, but didn't want a bulkhead on stair landing (where toilet is above). Once I sorted that out, everything else went well. Have to reiterate, having a forstner bit set, made quick work of hole drilling, albeit, a pail and a half of wood chips was the spoils.
> Now, I can mess around with water side of things...putting in a thermal expansion tank. Going to mount a large hunk of plywood for water service. Sort of a circuit board for water. Trying to source two water manifolds like this:
> http://www.siouxchief.com/products/supply/powerpex-systems/astm-f1807/manifolds/1-2-pex-branches/3-4-pex-×-spin-closed-trunk/valved
> In USA, no problem getting them, but in Canada, a problem (as usual).
> 
> View attachment 65524
> 
> Main stack in background, laundry in foreground, and that nub is a floor drain and overflow drain for hot water tank, which will nestle between two vertical pipes.
> 
> View attachment 65520
> 
> 2nd Floor half bath - note the 2" vent pipe (which came from 3" main stack), and the 1-1/2" secondary vent pipe (it vents downstairs bathroom, laundry and kitchen). They join above the 2nd floor sink level, after which, the 2" pipe will go through roof.
> 
> View attachment 65522
> 
> View attachment 65523
> 
> 
> Hard to take pics, in totality, of plumbing system...just a few of different areas.
> I figure it was about $400 in piping and fittings. I have to give props to Noble Plumbing (a plumbing supplier an hour away). They gave me contractor prices. Beat big box building supply store prices easily.
> Have a plumbing pro friend who will inspect the works before I glue it (just dry fitted everything).


The place we are renting was freshly renovated before we moved in. All the plumbing was brand new. Guess he dry fit everything, then went back and glued it all. Except for one joint in the 4" drain line. Problem is, everything else was already glued on both sides so it was a challenge. The "handyman" who did the plumbing ran some primer over the joint hoping it would get sucked in, then ran some glue over the joint hoping some of it would get sucked in. Then he took a roof sealer compound and put a couple heavy coats on the joint. Luckily it is low pressure drain pipe and so far it hasn't leaked again. We don't put anything on that side of the basement.

I know some areas require ABS, but most use white PVC for DWV applications. A friend in the construction trades once told me to make sure to have a solid ring of purple primer visible on the pipe or the BI would fail it because the joint wasn't properly primed, therefore the joint was suspect.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Several days later, I finished the plumbing rough-in. Wasn't too bad, except drilling through Douglas fir ceiling joists. Had no 4-1/2" hole saw, so I had to use smaller ones to get the desired result (for 2nd floor bathroom). Standing on a ladder while every ounce of sawdust coats you, while you are heaving with everything you have, does wear on one. I was ok with exposed plumbing in utility closet, but didn't want a bulkhead on stair landing (where toilet is above). Once I sorted that out, everything else went well. Have to reiterate, having a forstner bit set, made quick work of hole drilling, albeit, a pail and a half of wood chips was the spoils.
> Now, I can mess around with water side of things...putting in a thermal expansion tank. Going to mount a large hunk of plywood for water service. Sort of a circuit board for water. Trying to source two water manifolds like this:
> http://www.siouxchief.com/products/supply/powerpex-systems/astm-f1807/manifolds/1-2-pex-branches/3-4-pex-×-spin-closed-trunk/valved
> In USA, no problem getting them, but in Canada, a problem (as usual).
> 
> View attachment 65524
> 
> Main stack in background, laundry in foreground, and that nub is a floor drain and overflow drain for hot water tank, which will nestle between two vertical pipes.
> 
> View attachment 65520
> 
> 2nd Floor half bath - note the 2" vent pipe (which came from 3" main stack), and the 1-1/2" secondary vent pipe (it vents downstairs bathroom, laundry and kitchen). They join above the 2nd floor sink level, after which, the 2" pipe will go through roof.
> 
> View attachment 65522
> 
> View attachment 65523
> 
> 
> Hard to take pics, in totality, of plumbing system...just a few of different areas.
> I figure it was about $400 in piping and fittings. I have to give props to Noble Plumbing (a plumbing supplier an hour away). They gave me contractor prices. Beat big box building supply store prices easily.
> Have a plumbing pro friend who will inspect the works before I glue it (just dry fitted everything).


https://www.ebay.com/itm/6-port-PEX...727087&hash=item2a9e2cc468:g:xK4AAOSwXEdabpMX

They even ship to Canada. Each line has its very own shut off valve. Can't have too many shut off valves, IMHO.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> The place we are renting was freshly renovated before we moved in. All the plumbing was brand new. Guess he dry fit everything, then went back and glued it all. Except for one joint in the 4" drain line. Problem is, everything else was already glued on both sides so it was a challenge. The "handyman" who did the plumbing ran some primer over the joint hoping it would get sucked in, then ran some glue over the joint hoping some of it would get sucked in. Then he took a roof sealer compound and put a couple heavy coats on the joint. Luckily it is low pressure drain pipe and so far it hasn't leaked again. We don't put anything on that side of the basement.
> 
> I know some areas require ABS, but most use white PVC for DWV applications. A friend in the construction trades once told me to make sure to have a solid ring of purple primer visible on the pipe or the BI would fail it because the joint wasn't properly primed, therefore the joint was suspect.


Good advice...in good old Canada, ABS is required for DWV applications in a residence, up to about 6' (2m) from residence. I guess whoever wrote our plumbing code regs are a paranoid lot (PVC not allowed - not strong enough), and a result, it costs us more to pipe a house. I did use PVC for septic field. I didn't care how neat I was, and the blue-purple primer was evident everywhere...lol
I know Fernco couplings (rubber boot) cost a penny, but in your example, a good solution, I'd think. I had to use one to tie into septic line outside bunker since line was already buried. I have it running under bunker in case I build my 'dream' home (it will probably stay that way, a dream...lol). Although, now that I have a line running to nowhere (easily allowed me to hook up RV), I could run line to workshop I plan to build down the road. Glad I planned ahead. Access to septic field is blocked by bunker. 

Thanks for link! I was perusing Ebay for water manifolds...just not exactly what I was looking for, and I'm cheap...lol. I'm waiting to hear back from a plumbing guru at a lumber store to see if he can get me the ones I want.


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## Mr Bond

Another option Melli" https://www.amazon.ca/Viega-36183-P...=UTF8&qid=1522605179&sr=1-1&keywords=Manabloc

I used this model to replumb our last house: high quality and very nice to work with. May be too may branches for the bunker, but other sizes are on Amazon. Lowes.ca used to sell some small manifolds too.


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## ozarkansas

Looking awesome Melli!


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> Another option Melli" https://www.amazon.ca/Viega-36183-P...=UTF8&qid=1522605179&sr=1-1&keywords=Manabloc
> 
> I used this model to replumb our last house: high quality and very nice to work with. May be too may branches for the bunker, but other sizes are on Amazon. Lowes.ca used to sell some small manifolds too.


Thanks, but out of my price range ...was kinda of curious about them, in terms of what they were made of? Very skookum looking. 



ozarkansas said:


> Looking awesome Melli!


Thanks! Always wish I was further ahead, but it is coming together. 

Been doing oddball stuff the past few days. Stuff that should have been done a long time ago. Finished flashing the perimeter sill, caulked and painted the fascia, all the windows have their final layer of blueskin, got the water line mounted inside (and valved), put up a couple of spare chunks of 3/4" ply on wall where water manifold and thermal expansion tank will go. After all the fuss I put up over the fascia, I think I am going to get 3/8" ply (one side smooth), and use that. Price wise, it beats any option by a mile, and right now, I need to keep my focus on making the bunker habitable. I'll stain the beejesus out of the ply, then clearcoat it. Hopefully, it will keep mold at bay. 


















Got another roll of housewrap ordered, to finish off the bunker...need that on, before I put up soffit.


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## melli

Got my plumbing inspected (drain and vent side), so I've been gluing it all together. With everything rather compact (2 bathrooms, kitchen sink, tub and laundry), I really had to take my time gluing it or I'd glue myself into a jam (not have enough flexibility to move a pipe into a 'T' for instance). A couple of times, I was gluing 2 pipes into a fitting, at the same time...
Got it mostly done, except for hole in roof...bit wet to be climbing on roof right now. BTW - I made one mistake...my horizontal vent in kitchen wasn't high enough. Apparently, the horizontal 'run' portion of vent has to be at or above counter height (36"). Makes sense, in case of backup. Funny thing, I psyched myself out on that, as I did the bathroom right (first thing I did), but then thought BI would chide me for having it so high, so I promptly did the kitchen too low! LOL.
I learned some basic plumbing truths (that is, being code compliant) doing this job...suggest you find an expert to give you the basics...not all that difficult to comprehend. The real proof, of the quality of job I did, is when I start flushing...

I picked up the 3/8" G1S (good one side) plywood for soffit. Feels good to have it in my hands. When we get some non-liquid sunshine, I'll be staining 19 sheets of ply...joy 

I think it'll really look sharp. The idea of having a million knots up on soffit just doesn't resonate with me. 









Kitchen fixed - see the horizontal vent run - you can just make out where it used to be...









Not one knot on any sheet of ply. They remove them if any crop up while making the ply. I figure it will cost me about $1.50 sqft to do soffit (including stain and vents). Cheaper than plastic/metal soffit, and a whole lot cheaper than cedar T&G.
The only issue could be longevity. I've used plain 3/8" ply on outbuildings, and in one case, the stain didn't stop mold growth. They used an eco variant of stain (water based). I will be using a toxic variant of stain...lol (2 coats). Then, I might clear-coat, for extra insurance. The plus for ply, is strength. Will never get a blow-out (I've fixed a few plastic soffits after windstorms). Also, I think I will get some sound dampening, relative to plastic or metal soffit.


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## MoBookworm1957

Looks good Melli!


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## melli

Working on the water side of things...not as 'fun' as I thought it would be...lol
I spent a lot of time trying to make it look efficient, neat and clean. Problem is, one has lines running everywhere, and it was rather maddening. At least working with Pex pipe is about as easy, as one can get. I haven't crimped the setup yet...
You can see the two manifolds (Copper tubes) I was hunting down. Was supposed to make things look organized, but I wonder...at least most of the runs are what they call 'home runs'. That is, each line leaving manifold goes directly to an appliance (faucet, toilet, tub). There are no runs longer than 20ft, so when I turn on a tap, I should get hot water pretty quick. Chit chatting with plumbers, the new way to do this, especially in larger homes, is to have a hot water system that recirculates (trunk and branch system). Basically, a line (trunk) is run around perimeter walls, and 'T's are installed (branch) where needed. Then, you have a pump to recirculate hot water on the big loop (trunk). I felt that is just another headache, and not very efficient. I was also trying to limit number of fittings buried in walls...I just feel it makes good sense to have as few fittings as possible (less leak potential).









From the bottom of the manifold with red pipes running into it, I will run a line to HWT, which will be below pressure tank (little tank mounted).

On a nice day, I decided to 'almost finish' house wrapping bunker...have to 'finish it' before I put up soffit.









The remaining bunny is getting rather friendly...a pretty lucky bunny, given the predators around here.


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## melli

Getting close to turning on the main water valve. Been mucking about with two bathroom vanities I bought. Seems the deal I got for matching vanities wasn't all that sweet, given they both had transport damage. Go back to store to see what can be done. Was going to cannibalize their display model for unbroken pieces, but the display model was an earlier iteration of the model I have...geesh (in other words, crappier than the ones I have). What to do...in the end, I get another 25% off, and a free tube of gorilla glue...lol
I've always known box stores carry a hefty markup on certain items, like vanities, but I was gobsmacked when I found out their 'sale' price (markdown) still meant a 150% profit over cost! I got them down to a 100% profit initially, then got another 25% off that because of damage. These are not my first choice for vanities, but I needed something...down the road, I can get a nice wall mount vanity.

I'll post some pics of my vanities, once the glue cures...
Just some pics of the plumbing;









Washing machine outlet









Backside of plumbing board where manifolds are mounted. 









Downstairs bathroom. Really like those copper stubs. Instead of having a chunk of PEX dangling through wall, these copper stub elbows are a much better solution (screw mounted to a 2x4, makes for a firm mount). The ends are 'spun closed' (sealed shut). All I have to do now, is use a metal tube cutter to lop off the ends, and install a valve with compression fitting or sweat on a valve. I'll be doing the former, as I'll be hooking up stuff before drywall (can remove valve for drywall install). The copper stubs were only $5 each. The nice thing, is you can turn on the water main, without having everything hooked up.


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## melli

The toilet is installed, the vanity is just sitting there...have to adjust plumbing so I am not using line extensions.
Note the institutional 'yellow' floors...lol (actually kind of calming). Miss-tint paint from box store...a stop gap measure until I can afford nice floors. Hard to beat $15/gallon. The floor gobbled it up. Not that I wish I had more of that color, but another coat would have been nice.









I read the sink/countertop is cultured marble...no idea if it is any good, but I like it is all one piece (easy to clean).








Insisted on a push button drain...god knows how many times I've fixed the plunger type ones. 










BTW - That vanity cost me about $200 ($150USD) after all the deductions. Yet, the box store is still making a penny (~50% markup). The tap was marked up 300%! I ended up paying a 100% markup ($80). Thing is, I really don't know the 'true' cost. What I do know, is this sort of stuff, is a store's money maker.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> The toilet is installed, the vanity is just sitting there...have to adjust plumbing so I am not using line extensions.
> Note the institutional 'yellow' floors...lol (actually kind of calming). Miss-tint paint from box store...a stop gap measure until I can afford nice floors. Hard to beat $15/gallon. The floor gobbled it up. Not that I wish I had more of that color, but another coat would have been nice.
> 
> View attachment 65706
> 
> I read the sink/countertop is cultured marble...no idea if it is any good, but I like it is all one piece (easy to clean).
> View attachment 65707
> 
> Insisted on a push button drain...god knows how many times I've fixed the plunger type ones.
> 
> View attachment 65708
> 
> 
> BTW - That vanity cost me about $200 ($150USD) after all the deductions. Yet, the box store is still making a penny (~50% markup). The tap was marked up 300%! I ended up paying a 100% markup ($80). Thing is, I really don't know the 'true' cost. What I do know, is this sort of stuff, is a store's money maker.


I'll bet it feels nice to be getting some things in so it isn't an empty shell. Having a dried in place so you can work no matter the weather is a good thing.

Are there any building supply surplus/salvage stores anywhere near you? There are a couple less than 2 hours from us that we have visited to get some ideas. Unfinished cabinets with birch veneer plywood fronts and doors, vanities, sinks, bathroom fixtures for about half what they cost at the big box stores. A tub size one piece shower with seat that costs $850 at the local big box store is $396. An American Standard toilet much like yours for $150. We have our eye on a vanity with a top identical to the second picture and found one there for $200 complete. Who knows what they will have next visit, and who knows what they will have when we get ready to buy, but when I can get things for half price or less, I'm all in! Now if I could just find a place where I could buy Sonotube and I-joists for half price, I'd be a really happy camper.


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## melli

OTBBQ - yep, it is nice to see stuff in it, that gets me closer to moving in. Been dying to turn on the main water valve, but holding off while I hook up a few more things. Be a hassle trying to put on fixture valves when lines are full of water...lol
Not going to mount HWT, until I've done most of the electrical, as the HWT would just be in way of electrical install. But I can get cold water running throughout fairly soon. Be nice to use a real toilet...lol. I bucket filled the top floor toilet, and flushed a few times, looking for leaks...all good, so far.

BTW - I haven't been to a salvage store in quite some time. We only have a Habitat for Humanity on coast. A while back I went in there and found their prices rather high, and their stock dated. Felt like a retail store, than a discount store. At least around here, we don't have real good thrift stores like you do in states. One of our failings up here...lol. We just don't have the plethora of shops vying for your dollar like you do. Albeit, I am particular, but it is hard to shop around, per se. In moments like this, when I am burning through cash like no tomorrow, I wish I had easy access to city wares. I know of a few building supply specific stores that offload their discontinued and old stock for near cost. That is a problem building out in the sticks...access. Do I drive all day, take a ferry, for a few bucks in plumbing supplies, or just go local and pay through the nose. Bought a 3/4" Pex valve for $14 the other day...I know it is half that an hours drive away...knowing exactly what I need, and making a big list would be the way to go, but I always fail to account for everything.
One positive...I have been collecting building materials over the years, much of it free from the 'share shed' at dump. And I've been using it, here and there. That helps. I'm going off on a tangent here, but the first thing I should have done when I bought this land, was build a monster shed for building supplies...to heck with 'regulations'. lol
If my shipping container wasn't full of my earthly possessions, that would have been perfect. I've decided not to sell it, as per my grand plan, but keep it as a tool shed. I'm sick of tarp sheds. Useless things...last a couple of years (tops), then blow apart.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> OTBBQ - yep, it is nice to see stuff in it, that gets me closer to moving in. Been dying to turn on the main water valve, but holding off while I hook up a few more things. Be a hassle trying to put on fixture valves when lines are full of water...lol
> Not going to mount HWT, until I've done most of the electrical, as the HWT would just be in way of electrical install. But I can get cold water running throughout fairly soon. Be nice to use a real toilet...lol. I bucket filled the top floor toilet, and flushed a few times, looking for leaks...all good, so far.
> 
> BTW - I haven't been to a salvage store in quite some time. We only have a Habitat for Humanity on coast. A while back I went in there and found their prices rather high, and their stock dated. Felt like a retail store, than a discount store. At least around here, we don't have real good thrift stores like you do in states. One of our failings up here...lol. We just don't have the plethora of shops vying for your dollar like you do. Albeit, I am particular, but it is hard to shop around, per se. In moments like this, when I am burning through cash like no tomorrow, I wish I had easy access to city wares. I know of a few building supply specific stores that offload their discontinued and old stock for near cost. That is a problem building out in the sticks...access. Do I drive all day, take a ferry, for a few bucks in plumbing supplies, or just go local and pay through the nose. Bought a 3/4" Pex valve for $14 the other day...I know it is half that an hours drive away...knowing exactly what I need, and making a big list would be the way to go, but I always fail to account for everything.
> One positive...I have been collecting building materials over the years, much of it free from the 'share shed' at dump. And I've been using it, here and there. That helps. I'm going off on a tangent here, but the first thing I should have done when I bought this land, was build a monster shed for building supplies...to heck with 'regulations'. lol
> If my shipping container wasn't full of my earthly possessions, that would have been perfect. I've decided not to sell it, as per my grand plan, but keep it as a tool shed. I'm sick of tarp sheds. Useless things...last a couple of years (tops), then blow apart.


As soon as we get a drive in we are putting in a storage shed specifically to store equipment and supplies. I've passed on a couple really good deals because I don't have a place to store anything out of the elements. We are in the process of going through things in our house, especially the "stuff" that has been in boxes in the basement for 4 years, and in boxes in a spare room for 4 years before that. I just dumped out a box of electronics that were obsolete 10 years ago. And we discovered 2 boxes with Christmas stuff that my wife re-bought a couple years ago because she couldn't find it. Problem is, she wants to keep it all because it is somewhere in the rulebook that you can't throw away Christmas stuff.


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## Echoesechos

oldtruckbbq said:


> As soon as we get a drive in we are putting in a storage shed specifically to store equipment and supplies. I've passed on a couple really good deals because I don't have a place to store anything out of the elements. We are in the process of going through things in our house, especially the "stuff" that has been in boxes in the basement for 4 years, and in boxes in a spare room for 4 years before that. I just dumped out a box of electronics that were obsolete 10 years ago. And we discovered 2 boxes with Christmas stuff that my wife re-bought a couple years ago because she couldn't find it. Problem is, she wants to keep it all because it is somewhere in the rulebook that you can't throw away Christmas stuff.


It is in the rule book. Chapter 2001, paragraph 4a.


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## melli

Was an odd feeling listening to all the pipes fill with water (turned on water main!). Hear all the water and air gurgling. As per my nature, I was waiting for the inevitable rain-shower inside my bunker. It didn't come. All 100 or so fittings, did their job. The upstairs sink and sink are hooked up, so I tested them, repeatedly. I got a leak where the sink drain is...an easy fix. Was having an issue tightening it. Some plumbers goop will solve that. 
I am plumbed (oh, forgot the HWT, isn't hooked up yet...after electrical is done, I will put that in). 









You can see the gauge needle...supposed to be 60psi, but it seems you get what you pay for in a $8 gauge (5psi out). 

















Downstairs bathroom - tonight's project (install vanity and toilet). Not being a master plumber, I was concerned about those compression valves. They work like a charm, plus they look good (love quarter turn ball valves). 









Water lines are all in...just need to hook up the fixtures. On some sites, they have a dancing banana emoticon. Insert here...lol


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## oldtruckbbq

Interesting that you used copper 90's where you made turns. I've seen several Pex applications and been involved personally in a couple, and the pics above are what I'm used to seeing. Solid line from one end to the other with supports for 90 degree bends so they can't kink. I know it is too late in your application, but when the plumber replaced PVC with PEX in the house we rented in Texas, he put a plastic bushing in each 2 by that he ran through so if the tubing flexed it didn't rub and wear a hole.


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## Mr Bond

I was thinking the same! In Europe PEX is used to its full advantage with fewer fittings and graceful bends that don't restrict flow. In North America it seems plumbers are still wedded to straight lines and elbows whatever the material.

PS Melli: The manifold I used from Amazon was an ABS type material, very nicely made.


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## oldtruckbbq

Mr Bond said:


> I was thinking the same! In Europe PEX is used to its full advantage with fewer fittings and graceful bends that don't restrict flow. In North America it seems plumbers are still wedded to straight lines and elbows whatever the material.
> 
> PS Melli: The manifold I used from Amazon was an ABS type material, very nicely made.


Probably due to Building Inspectors who are stuck in the past and not really up on newer technology and applications. Part of the reason people doing off-grid and sustainable building run into so many stumbling blocks.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Interesting that you used copper 90's where you made turns. I've seen several Pex applications and been involved personally in a couple, and the pics above are what I'm used to seeing. Solid line from one end to the other with supports for 90 degree bends so they can't kink. I know it is too late in your application, but when the plumber replaced PVC with PEX in the house we rented in Texas, he put a plastic bushing in each 2 by that he ran through so if the tubing flexed it didn't rub and wear a hole.


I hear ya...lol. I wanted no 'hidden' fittings. Your first pic looks like an in-floor radiant heat manifold...not suitable for potable water (I checked). 
I did just a couple of gratuitous brass 90's because I was running out of pex, and didn't want to buy a full length for a few feet. Actually, all my 90's are up against the 'white board' (what manifold is mounted on) or within a few feet (laundry being the only one). None of that will be covered up, as it is in utility room. Everywhere else, sweeping bends. 
Actually, I was told by a plumber the sweeping bend supports are not needed. Pex pipe doesn't shift once installed and clamped down (at least mine doesn't). 
The 90 degree bend support in your pic serves to 'stub out' the pex. I didn't like that...lol. I didn't want to see pex on other side of drywall. While perfectly fine, what they have in pic, I wanted something solid. When it comes time for them to put on a valve, they will have to cinch crimp on a valve, and you'll see all that on the inside.

I agree (OTBBQ and MrBond), many plumbers throw in a million fittings to make bends without trying to do sweeps. I can't say it took me all that much more time to do sweeping bends, but my place is pretty small, relatively speaking. I did a few fittings around manifold to make it look reasonable, and to save space. 

Mr Bond - for some reason, I am leery of ABS manifolds...I'm irrational. I wanted a metal manifold (copper, brass, SS). Really wanted the manifold like what I have, except they sweated on valves for each run. Life goes on...


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## melli

Ok, this is rather funny...found out why I had a leak in vanity. My button plunger has no hole for overfill drain. Between the two rubber washers, there should be a hole(s) so overflow can drain, otherwise it just sits there, and eventually leaks. I didn't notice it when I bought them...actually, sales guy pulled them out of a secret spot, as I balked at paying $50! for a button plunger. He gave me an $18 one...lol
I guess I am returning them....








Downstairs bathroom installed...less bathtub (lake will have to suffice until I sell RV). 
Something to consider, that I never appreciated until I was installing stuff, was the tap and vanity basin match. In a nutshell, I was looking for a palatable vanity, and tap set, that didn't cost a lot...lol. What I didn't do, was ensure the tap and vanity basin were a 'match' (they were made by different manufacturers), in terms of turning on tap, and not having water spray out of basin. That would suck. While I was installing the vanity and tap, I was thinking about it, as the basin isn't all that deep and the tap head doesn't dispense water straight down...a slight angle towards user. Anyways, I got lucky. When I opened up tap, it streamed dead center into basin, right on top of button plunger. I was thinking, that would suck, if water shot past the plunger, rode the shallow basin up towards user...lol. 








Staining ply for soffit....joy (heavy sarcasm). Why I almost 'hate' staining/painting is beyond me...Never had any childhood trauma with a paintbrush. I did suffer egregiously, about 8yrs ago, staining lattice (your chasing drips for hours). I will never buy lattice again, unless it is pre-stained.


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## Steve_S

LOL on staining.... Melli, BTDT 4 times (exceeded rule of three) before I had to do it again, I bought a cheap spray gun for my compressor and NO DRIPS plus nice even finish... It was a $15 spray gun on sale at Princess Auto, still have it and it's great for shooting crap whatever on something. I would never ever use my HVLP guns for such things (they are only used for auto-paint, but I don't do that anymore but still).


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## melli

Went to the big box store and bought 'parts' for a kitchen counter-top. $25 in parts, slight alterations, painting, and voila. Carrying around a donated kitchen sink, and my old tap for almost a decade, has finally paid off. 
It'll tide me over til I find money to get a nice kitchen. It reminds me of days long past, when I was in Germany, and my friends were renters, at the time. Apparently, when they moved (rented a new place), it was customary to bring the WHOLE kitchen with them, including the kitchen sink. I remember thinking, geesh, what a hassle. Moving is bad enough, but having to install a kitchen...They did have spartan kitchens, unlike our cabinet fetish.


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## oldtruckbbq

View attachment 65752

Staining ply for soffit....joy (heavy sarcasm). Why I almost 'hate' staining/painting is beyond me...Never had any childhood trauma with a paintbrush. I did suffer egregiously, about 8yrs ago, staining lattice (your chasing drips for hours). I will never buy lattice again, unless it is pre-stained.

View attachment 65753
[/QUOTE]

Good idea to stain the ply before installing. Sure is a lot easier doing at ground level.


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## melli

Got the 2nd floor soffit up. Incredibly tedious and a sweat-fest. Had to add another layer to scaffold so I could really scare the crap out myself. Of course, I ran out of screws to assemble scaffold, and used suspect boards, which gave me pause every time I stepped on the 'top shelf'. Felt sturdy, but there was this annoying creak in one spot. How I cannot wait to take it down. First, I just have to go around and do minor stain touch-ups. 
When I started doing the soffit on sides, it occurred to me, that I left no gaps for venting. While it is an unheated portion of roof, it still needs some venting, so I pulled out a monster Forstner bit and chewed out holes to facilitate that. Just another thing to slow me down. Double coated the ply with Sikkens Teak stain (1 coat on backside). Then cut to fit, and stain again. Each time, I had to wait for it dry (24hrs). 
I feel pretty confident the soffit will not budge no matter the winds (3/8" G1S ply). 









Also on sides, you can see that I had to add blocking so I had a place to screw the soffit to. I see contractors throw up a 'dummy rim joist' (fascia) before they put on fascia. By doing that, they avoid having to do what I had to do, as the dummy rim joist acts as a soffit nailing surface. I recall thinking about it, but putting up two rim boards at height, was too much to bear.


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## MoBookworm1957

Looks good melli!


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## ShannonR

Wow Melli, you are killing it with the build!! I see you are anxious to move in. You are so close!!!


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Looks good melli!


It is looking ok, but I will have to do a mess of touch-ups, as some screw holes made a mess...no way I am putting in pilot holes. I have to 'prepare myself', mentally, every-time I go onto top catwalk...takes a lot out of me. First time I've used smooth ply, and I'm liking the look...contemporary, but with wood grain. All the layers of stain is giving the soffit a sheen. 



ShannonR said:


> Wow Melli, you are killing it with the build!! I see you are anxious to move in. You are so close!!!


Other than a lot more soffit to put up, the electrical is the last bit, then I am in...will be a sweet day when RV rolls away. I was just telling a friend, I want to enjoy summer...I missed last summer (don't remember a thing, except slaving away on build). 
Just a few days away from having living portion of bunker totally sealed...the bees (bubble bees, hornets and wasps) are in full force, and they really seem keen to hang out in my eaves. I know what they are thinking...nice place for them to build a home.


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## melli

I overexposed the pic, so one can see the 2nd floor soffit (it looks dark in regular pics because of the sun). 








Got some good news, sort of...I can insure my place with a temporary occupancy permit...once I get electrical in. Rather ridiculous I can insure my outbuildings etc. (well and electrical shed, RV, excavator), but not the biggest building on my lot...silly.


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## Steve_S

Hahahahaha Melli, well what else can you expect from an Insurance Company, they mastered the weird & strange requirements to baffle all normal folks ages ago. Some companies have some really really peculiar requirements &/OR conditions too. Try seeing if you could get insurance for an offgrid <1000 sq foot home that is solar powered... 90% will just balk or make an outrageously crazy quote only a lunatic would take, I lost count of how many companies I had to hit that would even consider insuring as a primary residence... they all seem to think a minimum of 1200 square feet and grid attached is a MUST as a principle and THEN you can insure a recreational... I actually had one broker dude (foreigner from who knows where) tell me that OFFGRID is a fantasy, that obviously I must be living like the Amish - yeah, actually said it, wish I still had my phone recorder (doesn't work with cell phone though :-( ) You could say I was somewhat Gob-Smacked ! Another said they cannot insure a home that has wood siding ? ! SERIOUSLY !!!


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## melli

Just a pic showing I carried the wall insulation into rafters (white foam)...wish I did this all around, but time and money are in short supply. Had to do it on this section or it would look odd.








Now I can get back to installing soffit.
Got my plumbing signed off...and just filed my electrical permit (online). What a piece of work that is...lol. They purposely make online form confusing to dissuade folks from doing it themselves (an electrician friend noted this, as he was giving me a hand). It reminded me of filing taxes before there were programs to make it easy.


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## Steve_S

Well Check Post !

How you doing Melli, everything ok in your little corner of paradise ? So much in the news about flooding etc in your corner and you haven't posted since Saturday (unusual) so just a wee bit concerned.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> Well Check Post !
> 
> How you doing Melli, everything ok in your little corner of paradise ? So much in the news about flooding etc in your corner and you haven't posted since Saturday (unusual) so just a wee bit concerned.


Thanks Steve!...I am puttering along, surviving. Usual gripes (lost appetite for anything do with construction, etc). 
Hit a milestone of sorts...bunker is sealed (bug and rodent proof). Got enough soffit up that it seals the living areas. Essentially, it is an un-insulated cabin now. 
Hornet and wasps were busy annoying me...they love eaves. 









Waiting to hear back from lumber yard about electrical parts pricing. Apparently, new code rules dictate CAFI breakers (or maybe just AFCI will do) be used not just in bedrooms, but everywhere, with exceptions (of course). And CAFI breakers range in price from $60-$100 a pop! And my electrician friend has me convinced I ought to get a main panel with plug on neutrals, which means hunting around for this 'leading' edge tech. Plus, one bathroom fan has to be on, all the time, because folks are too stupid to open a window, if it gets muggy inside. 
That requires a special fan...
Then building inspector tells me of a wonderful junket he went on, ostensibly to get trained. Well, these egg heads giving the training session, want municipalities to adopt all these wonderful high tech solutions, like HRV (which I hope to get one day), and door blower tests ($$$), etc. etc. We are in the middle of probably the greatest housing shortage, and they are thinking of upping the cost to build a home. We all should be living in Passive Houses. I took some time off yesterday (can't take it anymore), and trolled the hood looking at new builds. Some pretty nice houses going up. But what struck me, was the boom in RV living! Every vacant lot has an RV, and that is it...lol. While I expect many will build a home, I suspect for many, the RV is their permanent home. Also noticed a few motor-homes, parked in the woods.


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## melli

Not much in the way of pics to show, as I've been mounting the electrical boxes. Never realized just how many electrical boxes I need. Would like to finish that before I start wiring, as I need to economize not only wire runs, but number of circuit breakers. New code here stipulates just about everything be CAFI protected (Combination Arc Fault Protection). Used to be a reg for bedrooms only, but now, everywhere. And the CAFI breakers can cost a penny (~$100/each). I found a sweet deal on Amazon in which they are $40 each. Will see if they are as advertised (haven't got them yet).
Basically, those 5 breakers can supply (5x12) 60 fixtures. Now, one may wonder how a 900sqft+ bunker can need 60 fixtures, you'd be surprised at how many one needs. I am not going crazy, in terms of lighting or plugs, but they do seem to add up. And those fixtures don't include baseboard heating, HWT, Dryer, Fridge, Stove, Oven, Range Fan, Dishwasher....those guys go on dedicated non-CAFI circuits.
Then, I have to be mindful of the circuits that need to be GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit) protected (outdoor plugs accessible from ground floor, bathroom plugs/lights, and separate dedicated 20amp GFCI/CAFI circuit(s) for kitchen plugs). Crazy....
Oh, I had to give the electrical department just over a grand for a permit.

So, I mock up the electrical panel (200amp job, as lower rated ones cost about the same BTW - $210) to see where I have to drill slots into 2x4 on sides to allow wire passage. You might note the panel has neutral bars running up both sides of line power (up middle). Normally, CAFI breakers, you have to hook up neutral to breaker, but these new panels incorporate a neutral so one can just plug on a breaker without having those 'pigtails'. Makes the panel less messy when hooked up.









A couple pics of boxes I've mounted...one issue with a sloped roof is finding LED lights with gimbals, so I can point lights straight down. I found LED lights (good ones) without gimbals, that plug right into those octagon boxes, making life easy.
Thing is, most LED lights with gimbals are made for 'cans' or are the type you just drill a hole in drywall. I like the box mounted versions, as it makes life easy, as once the box is mounted, it is lined up in perfect position.









The silver box is for ceiling fan.









I finally got both bathrooms and kitchen sink done...I had some issues with P-traps, as the factory left some extra plastic bumps where they connect, causing leaks...no matter how much I tightened them, they'd leak. Eventually, I figured out the issue, and sanded down the plastic. Nice to have all those fixtures operational.









A cautionary tale: I was hauling around three kitchen tapsets from renos. I really wanted to use another one, but darn, if they didn't leak (ceramic cartridges). I spent way too much time trying to fix them...In the end, the oldest version worked, but I had to hunt down special fittings. With all the headache getting the kitchen sink functional, I might have been better off buying a new sink and tapset.


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## Steve_S

Melli I want to make a suggestion while it is still possible for you. Please wrap your hot & cold water lines in foam as shown below. The cold water running will act as a condenser and cause in-wall drips leading to potential mould & mildews... The hot water will also remain hotter and improve general efficiency. This will also quieten down the noise somewhat making it more comfortable for you & any guests. It's not expensive and the benefits are quite worthwhile. Please consider it, I know it's one of those little "nice to do" things and not a must but if your intention is to be planted there a long time it makes it more liveable for the long haul and better for you too. Just because you cannot see mould does not mean it is not affecting your health & wellbeing. Have you ever torn open a wall where the pipes are running next to Batt Insulation and seen the black mould on the insulation ? You've done reno's, so I'm sure you've seen it along with where the pipes run through studs, joists etc too where you see water condensation stains, and your being in a fairly dampish area, certainly worth a serious consideration .









Looking good and serious progress being made there, just hoping all the rain storms & flooding are steering clear of you but at least you up on nice high ground.


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## melli

Steve, I've been looking for signs of condensation, but I think my well shed takes the brunt of it, as it has the pressure tanks etc. And my bunker is exactly like a Styrofoam cooler (for BBQs), and it seems to keep things dry (Downstairs is a pleasure to work on, but upstairs, not so much). Once I start using water a lot, we shall see. And speaking of water, the flooding is happening mostly in interior of province (spring runoff...aka Freshnet). In BC, everybody has to live beside a river, lake or ocean, without any regard for flooding. I don't suspect I'll EVER flood, unless Vancouver Island disappears...lol.
Yep, I'll put the foam wrap on my list....lol


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## Steve_S

Two reasons... you will get condensation on your cold water pipes when running the cold water as it will just condense on them. As for the hot water, the shorter the distance from where it's being heated the better but to maintain max temp and minimal heat loss the foam really makes a difference, it's quite surprising. I believe you said you were installing a Hot Water Tank rather than On-Demand Hot Water, if that is the case, then a foil insulation blanket will help retain about 15C temp loss but follow the instructions closely and ensure that you have flaps for the element access ports etc... as stated in the instructions.

Point on the blankets... When I rented the last apartment, it came with a 40gal electric tank (4500w) I immediately wrapped it in a bubble foil blanket and told the landlady. She came down to check my work (and learn a few things for her home as she was & is greening it up) and she could nopt see why it would make a difference. 1st thing she noticed is that the "closet" it's in, was much cooler than it ever was before, the 2nd thing (clincher) was when I popped open a flap and told her to stick her hand between the heater & blanket - she instantly felt the amount of heat being retained inside ! Well within the week she had all the apartments get that on their hot water tanks... She dumped her Tank and replaced it with a larger On Demand heater, 3 months later she was telling me how her hydro dropped by $100 a month ! She has a Hubby & 4 kids, so lot's of hot water ! The on-demand heater was paid for in a year by the savings AND she even qualified or a Energy Saving rebate of $200 I think from the province. Their plan now for the apartments as the water heaters age out, they will be replaced with on-demand ones, which will be good for her tenants & the environment too.


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## melli

Been 'roughing in' electrical. Still a ways to go, but incrementally making my way. I'm always too optimistic, and it is killing me (stress through the roof). I figure I will have used 1000ft of 14/2, 250ft of 12/2, 250ft of 14/3, and 100ft of 8/3. Probably 100 outlet/switch boxes. And I'll need more breakers...$$$$
Note to do-it-yourself electricians - buy big rolls of wire! You save big buying large rolls, and I can almost guarantee, you will need more than you think. 

Haven't even thought about the actual lights, switches and receptacles I will need. I grossly under-budgeted electrical. And being a tad OCD, I am in a fit over my runs not being like a printed circuit board...lol

I think my self delusion of irrational optimism is what gets me started on these projects...lol. While a good thing, in that it gets me thinking I can tackle anything, it does crush me when I come to the realization I just took on a job that is herculean in scope. I figured, how difficult could it be, a few wires for lights and plugs, and away I go...lol. Then, my electrician friend 'encourages' me to maximize every circuit (12) which introduces it's own set of problems. In the trade, that is what they do, because they want to minimize their work, and having too many circuits, one can run afoul of the electrical code.

Here are a few pics of work in progress...










In pic above: The wires coming down, are going into electrical panel...about half the runs are done. 


















The last pic is what gets me...in the quest to string together 12 outlets (receptacles and lights), I have 6 wires entering one 2-gang switch box. Yellow wires above 2-gang box is for bedroom baseboard heater, and it is the source of power for bedroom, and both bathroom heaters (max 3600 watts in baseboard heaters allowed). BTW - only needs to be 14/2, but me being me, went with 12/2 for a little extra insurance. Problem arise when you've got 13 wires coming up a wall cavity...there is only so much room, and it looks like a spaghetti factory. 

At any rate, I am far enough along, that I sort of see light at the end of the tunnel...lol


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## Steve_S

ouch... baseboard heaters. Why build a high efficiency home and then go and make it an energy pig? Haven't you heart about climate impact & change ? 

Good Luck and have fun.


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## melli

Steve_S said:


> ouch... baseboard heaters. Why build a high efficiency home and then go and make it an energy pig? Haven't you heart about climate impact & change ?
> 
> Good Luck and have fun.


Haven't you heard, electricity is free over here...
Of course, Alberta is making us pay at the pumps for not playing nice and allowing another pipeline...our eco warriors are going to be the death of us (provided climate change doesn't do us in first). 
The baseboard heaters are for 'show' until I can afford a split air heat pump. One needs to have something...


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## Mr Bond

FREE Electricity, I wish! Just got my first BC Hydro bill since buying a fixer upper and nearly fell over, but then 4" external walls don't hold much insulation!!!! Glad we put in new doors, windows and gas HVAC in for next winter; worth every penny. 

Wiring kitchen last couple of days, cost us $350 in materials and permit compared to $2500 for sparky... He is however going to fix our very un-code breaker panels.

Would you like some gently used baseboard heaters Melli, free to pickup in Kimberley... I can't give away half the stuff we salvaged from our new/old home, hardly seems worth my being an eco-warrier


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## melli

Mr Bond said:


> FREE Electricity, I wish! Just got my first BC Hydro bill since buying a fixer upper and nearly fell over, but then 4" external walls don't hold much insulation!!!! Glad we put in new doors, windows and gas HVAC in for next winter; worth every penny.
> 
> Wiring kitchen last couple of days, cost us $350 in materials and permit compared to $2500 for sparky... He is however going to fix our very un-code breaker panels.
> 
> Would you like some gently used baseboard heaters Melli, free to pickup in Kimberley... I can't give away half the stuff we salvaged from our new/old home, hardly seems worth my being an eco-warrier


Kimberley! Might as well be half way around the planet...lol
Thanks for offer though. I actually have one already...some neighbours didn't seem to want theirs, as it interfered with their new bench kitchen seating. 
$350 for whole kitchen! Heck, I almost spent that on four kitchen plugs, as per code, they require 2-20amp breakers (CAFI/GFCI), 12/2 wire, boxes, and 20amp tamper proof plugs. Hmmm, call it $230 for the works. 
I have to pull out the stops to impress the electrical inspector, as things can go sideways if things are not to his liking (like paying for another inspection).


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## Mr Bond

We stuck with the 15amp GFCI's for the kitchen; seems to be a grey area of the code around the sink. Luckily a few spare breakers in the panel as we removed some old circuits and amalgamated a couple. 

Fingers crossed for the inspection: I know full well they can be nerve wracking! Hoping for our first fix to be inspected within a week.


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## melli

Did I mention that 'my' cast away bunny decided to gnaw on my fiber optic cable the other day? Seems he was hungry. Made me think of rabbit stew. Getting a repair tech to string another line to RV seemed pointless, so I made an Ethernet line from power kiosk to RV (bypassing fiber). I can only imagine what trouble the bugger is up to elsewhere on my property. I caught him on my Electrical shed cam (which is near driveway entrance). He was either watching the bats eat flying insects (fav haunt of bats - I think the IR cam lights attract flyers) or he has a tunnel nearby....








I'm scolding him while I take pic....he/she is thinking, you got more granola? 

Been plugging away on electrical. Definitely a half mile of cable laid. Only two more runs left of small lines (14/2 - 12/2). Bunker is looking like a Faraday cage. 










I have a very strong impulse to mow the lawn, as it is rather cathartic (listen to tunes on lawn tractor), and nothing looks better than a freshly mowed lawn. However, I noticed a lot of grass wants to go to seed, so perhaps I should? Maybe it will save me money from my endless re-seeding campaign. My hope is, by letting it go, is that it will auto re-seed and thicken. There are not many weeds in mix. Hmmm....


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## MoBookworm1957

Looks good Melli


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## susanneb

Letting your grass go to seed is more likely to benefit weeds than your lawn. Mowing gives grass a big advantage over weeds, which do not thrive on being cut, unlike most grasses. If you can spread composted manure or other organic fertilizer, you can make your lawn less inviting to dock, thistle, tansy, and other common regional weeds that love poor soil. (I don't think it helps with dandelions at all, and you'll almost certainly have buttercup no matter what you do. I try to tell myself that my garden needs yellow...)


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## susanneb

I wish our property grew big rocks like yours does! My garden needs them...


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## melli

Been plugging away, as much as I can take. Seems I have lost my mojo. I grossly underestimated the pesky electrical code (Million exceptions to a rule). Electrical fussing is supposed to be one of my strong suits, but working with house wire stretches my mind to near capitulation. Mostly, I tell myself, you got to be 'bleeping' kidding me. 
Give you a couple examples....Smokies (smoke/CO2 alarms) have to be on a non-AFCI circuit, but cannot be alone. Technically, the whole house should be on AFCI and/or GFCI circuits (if we are playing the 'safety' game), but they want one to put some lights on the smoky circuit, just in case, your smokie circuit breaker flips. Don't know about that, given I will see the smokie light from my bed, they will have battery backup, and will beep if battery runs low. A triple fail safe. Then I got into a discussion with electrical friend of how many lights should be on Smokie circuit??? The deal is, if your smokie circuit flips, so will the lights, which supposedly will alert you to a problem. We never settled on an exact number of lights. 
I was yapping earlier about a bathroom fan having to be on low, all the time, to pull out air, if you don't have a HRV. Seems we are incapable of opening a window. Well, it gets better...the low speed 'always on' switch cannot be in bathroom...they want one to 'hide' it in another room! LOL. I've heard it all...that electrical rule takes the cake. Since I am doing the wiring, I will know were it is, and will disable it the second the inspector leaves. What nonsense. So, now, I have to run yet another wire from bathroom to utility closet. 

I've been playing hooky from my build, and went on a scooter ride to a new build in my hood. This house is smack dab on top of a little mountain. BTW - it is for sale (~2-3 million). This is the view from deck. 









Getting close to running line into house...had to do a wee bit of digging to unearth main line. I left a loop buried so I'd have enough wire to run into house. As mentioned long ago, I went with two parallel monster 250MCM ACWU cables, as I was worried about line loss (voltage drop). Bunker is about 350ft from road pole. But my 'dream house' would be 470ft from road pole. If one wants to preserve amperage, you have to go big, or have transformers at both ends ($$$$$), and up the voltage. 










This is what the cable looks like on end;









Needless to say, my hands cramp up for a week after messing with it. 


An assortment of electrical pics


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## melli

As I get closer to the 'opportunity' to move some furniture into bunker, things seem to take longer...Have a neighbor who insisted on doing the panel (wiring). Well, I deferred to his expertise, but I must be patient. Have to admit, he is pulling out all the stops to make it look 'perfect'.










I moved onto the idea of getting the ceiling insulated before I bring in furniture. Be an absolute pain insulating the ceiling with stuff all over the place. Plus, insulation leaves a coating of fines. I found another absurd building code regulation. If I put up those rafter vents (insulation vents/baffles), I can have insulation 1" from roof sheathing, as that is the space these vents provide. If I didn't put up vents, I'd have to be 2-1/2" away from roof sheathing. Basically, the building code doesn't 'trust' a builder to leave ample venting...surreal. It is a pet peeve of a local inspector...seems, as of late, folks are forgetting about venting above insulation. In our climate, a roof would rot pretty quick. So, to make myself and the inspector happy, I vented the whole roof (egg carton material between rafters). Since my roof is 'strapped', the 'insulation distance' to roof sheathing is 2-1/2", and 1" away from strapping.










I was also keen to see what R-value of Roxul I could cram in rafters. While building, I was worried I wouldn't be able to cram them with enough R-value. As it turns out, I can easily get R-44 (double row of Roxul R-22 batts). I am waiting for the local store to get some R-28 in, and hopefully, I can do a row of R-22 and R-28 = R-50. R-50 is one R value away from SIL status (Super insulated) for our area. I've put a lot of work and money into having well insulated walls and floor, so it would be a shame to skimp on ceiling (arguably the most important area to insulate). BTW - code here is R-28 (min) for ceilings. A well insulated home naturally means a smaller utility bill, but I am kind of curious to see how quiet I can get it (Roxul dampens sound well). As I've mentioned in previous posts, Roxul is Lava and Slag, spun into batts. Fireproof, hydrophobic and rodents don't like to burrow in it.


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## oldtruckbbq

A well laid out an neatly terminated electrical panel is a thing of beauty.


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## melli

My bunker is 'live'. Spent the whole day moving the 'temp' service that was outside, inside. Long overdue. Was a sweat-fest. My electrician friend said he'd come over late in morning...11:59am, he shows up...lol
He was a godsend, because I likely would still be out there, till midnight. All power, even for RV was shut down to do the move, so it was do or die (no AC or water in tin can). 
Wish I could run around and hook up lights and outlets, but that'll have to wait until the inspector has had a peek. It seems us homeowners cannot hook up a plug until it is inspected. Yet, electrician can for a contractor. Hmmm....
I have an odd setup. 2 - 250MCM monster ACWU cables come up from electrical shed (to limit line voltage drop). They have to be recombined in a splitter box. From splitter box, a 4/0 ACWU feeds the panel (enters bottom of panel). You'll note a large one coming in top...that goes to well shed. 










Splitter box is the one with lock on it. Don't want to accidentally open it and fry myself.


----------



## Steve_S

I always love to see & work on a nice clean & proper electrical setup and your neighbour did wonderful work ! Now your on the other side of the adventure, I can imagine you chomping on the bit to get in now...


----------



## Hitch

Place is looking great Melli. It's so nice to see good clean work.


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## melli

Been in a bit of lull, as I waited for electrical inspector. Without a peep, after two weeks, I sent an email telling him I am moving on...lol
I couldn't find the rule that if they fail to show after a spell, I can carry on. Nonetheless, I felt I gave lots of time, and that time is up. Really wanted him to inspect it, given I gave them a grand for a permit. 
So, I got a whack of insulation...started putting it up, and being the dog job that it is, I called for help (the dust gets everywhere, and my patience is razor thin right now). A local insulation installer sent me a young lass who put up the living room ceiling in 4hrs...well worth the dough! She is coming by tomorrow to get the poly up. Sweet. 
I am also mucking about putting up lights, plugs and switches, and fixing a stove a neighbor gave to me. 










Roxul R50 fits snug in 2x12 rafters
(R22 and R28 layers)









A neighbor lent me his scaffold and help...awesome scaffold and much needed help. Gives a 7'x7' platform...I should have begged to use it sooner. Hopefully, I can finish soffit with it. This is the view from kitchen. When we get clear days, an stunning view of the coast mountain range in distance.


----------



## FreeRange

I just discovered this thread. You've got an awesome view! I should be insulating right this second, but I dread the itchies, so am dragging my feet. What keeps your rockwool in place since it doesn't look like it is stapled in?


----------



## melli

FreeRange said:


> I just discovered this thread. You've got an awesome view! I should be insulating right this second, but I dread the itchies, so am dragging my feet. What keeps your rockwool in place since it doesn't look like it is stapled in?


They make it a tad larger than a 14.5" cavity, so it sticks in, and stays put. Roxul isn't all that itchy, but the grit gets everywhere! I wear a mask, but I still find grit in my teeth.
The view pic is from my neighbor's place (I wanted to add 'their kitchen' in last post, but the edit button disappeared) ...they are perched on a hill (small mountain).

All the ceilings are done! Hopefully my insulator will come by next week and knock off second floor walls...she is killing it (twice as fast as me).


----------



## Green Acres

melli said:


> Been in a bit of lull, as I waited for electrical inspector. Without a peep, after two weeks, I sent an email telling him I am moving on...lol
> I couldn't find the rule that if they fail to show after a spell, I can carry on. Nonetheless, I felt I gave lots of time, and that time is up. Really wanted him to inspect it, given I gave them a grand for a permit.
> So, I got a whack of insulation...started putting it up, and being the dog job that it is, I called for help (the dust gets everywhere, and my patience is razor thin right now). A local insulation installer sent me a young lass who put up the living room ceiling in 4hrs...well worth the dough! She is coming by tomorrow to get the poly up. Sweet.
> I am also mucking about putting up lights, plugs and switches, and fixing a stove a neighbor gave to me.
> 
> View attachment 67372
> 
> 
> Roxul R50 fits snug in 2x12 rafters
> (R22 and R28 layers)
> View attachment 67374
> 
> 
> A neighbor lent me his scaffold and help...awesome scaffold and much needed help. Gives a 7'x7' platform...I should have begged to use it sooner. Hopefully, I can finish soffit with it. This is the view from kitchen. When we get clear days, an stunning view of the coast mountain range in distance.
> View attachment 67370


Spent a few years in Surrey B.c. Visited Kamloops, Vernon and the island. That was back in 1981. It is a beautiful part of the world.


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## Steve_S

Lookin Good Melli, another Milestone being crossed. BTW: Love to see all that Rockwool - nothing like doing it for the best possible outcome !


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## melli

Got a call today...apparently, the Electrical Inspector wants to inspect after all! Doh! After a brief discussion, it was decided he'd overlook certain elements given nobody replied for almost three weeks. I was feeling amiss at not hearing back from them. So, now, I have to 'prep' for an inspection tomorrow (uncover panel etc). Glad he is coming (and nervous). 
Meanwhile, I've been playing around hooking up stuff. A hand-me-down stove/oven still works after sitting in a tarp shed for 4 years. Hooked up HWT, and got hot water. 

Going very spartan with kitchen counter until I can afford something better...


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## Echoesechos

How exciting. Steps closer to being in the bunker.


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## oldtruckbbq

What, no AC? Congrats on the stove and oven still working.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> What, no AC? Congrats on the stove and oven still working.


That is a concern...the bunker acts like a Styrofoam cooler and it definitely keeps things cooler. I do have a portable AC unit in shipping container...hopefully that will make up any shortfall. It is the one thing about RV that I like...the AC unit can turn RV into a fridge. 
Will have a split air heat pump on wish list. 

Passed electrical inspection, so I can 'officially' carry on...lol. Inspector went on vacation, and nobody covered for him. And us Homeowners who pull electrical permits *have *to get an inspection, unlike a sparky, who gets 'audited' (occasional inspections). Not a fan of two tier inspection rules, or the fact we pay slightly more for a permit, but it is in my rear-view mirror now. At least the guy didn't have an enforcement attitude, but instead came with a pleasant and helpful attitude. We went over code book to decipher bonding requirements and what circuits get AFCI/GFCI treatment. We had a laugh over his staple fetish, and how I heard it through the grapevine. Seems some electricians/homeowners don't use the right staples for the wire size (it says on the staple box). It is easier to have a tight fitting staple (means less staples, and wire stays put). The reality is, you want a staple to cradle a wire, not pinching it. Should be able to easily move wire underneath a staple. And the last thing one wants to do is redo all staples, in a job...


----------



## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> That is a concern...the bunker acts like a Styrofoam cooler and it definitely keeps things cooler. I do have a portable AC unit in shipping container...hopefully that will make up any shortfall. It is the one thing about RV that I like...the AC unit can turn RV into a fridge.
> Will have a split air heat pump on wish list.
> 
> Passed electrical inspection, so I can 'officially' carry on...lol. Inspector went on vacation, and nobody covered for him. And us Homeowners who pull electrical permits *have *to get an inspection, unlike a sparky, who gets 'audited' (occasional inspections). Not a fan of two tier inspection rules, or the fact we pay slightly more for a permit, but it is in my rear-view mirror now. At least the guy didn't have an enforcement attitude, but instead came with a pleasant and helpful attitude. We went over code book to decipher bonding requirements and what circuits get AFCI/GFCI treatment. We had a laugh over his staple fetish, and how I heard it through the grapevine. Seems some electricians/homeowners don't use the right staples for the wire size (it says on the staple box). It is easier to have a tight fitting staple (means less staples, and wire stays put). The reality is, you want a staple to cradle a wire, not pinching it. Should be able to easily move wire underneath a staple. And the last thing one wants to do is redo all staples, in a job...


I was investigating an intermittent outlet and tripping breaker in a house we rented. Someone decided that the way to secure a piece of romex was to drive a nail through the center of the cable and bend it over. I removed that and installed a fresh piece of romex secured with staples. Unfortunately, there is a reason for codes, inspectors, and enforcement. Glad to see you doing things correctly.


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## melli

As I mentioned, a neighbor lent me his scaffold, so I feel obligated to do stuff that requires it. Pretty much done the soffit. Just a few strips on low side need putting up, but they will be done with a ladder. What a dog's breakfast that was! Glad it is behind me. Got another coat of stain on it...looking a lot cleaner. Now I can shop for lights...









I'll eventually trim out the carport area where hurricane ties and nail plates are visible.


----------



## Green Acres

Man that is beautiful. I can't wait to get to that stage. Right now I am putting in the road but next I will be cleaning off the site and planning the cabin. Yesterday I put the road into the beach with my 47 hp Kubota and backhoe implement. Here is a video of it.


----------



## melli

Green Acres said:


> Man that is beautiful. I can't wait to get to that stage. Right now I am putting in the road but next I will be cleaning off the site and planning the cabin. Yesterday I put the road into the beach with my 47 hp Kubota and backhoe implement. Here is a video of it.


Always had a fondness for Kubotas. Might be that I have a Kubota engine in Bobby (Bobcat 331). 
You'll get to that stage one day...just plug away, and never think of how far you have yet go...lol (being a tad naive helps). I found clearing and modifying the land to be rewarding. Being outdoors, bulldozing and landscaping terrain was cathartic. Plus, you see results. 

Insulation is done for second floor (walls, ceiling). Just main floor walls need insulation, but no rush, as the ICF is automatically R20. I started moving my stuff into bunker! Felt good to sit on my couch (missing a leg???). But before I can be a potato, still need to do a lot of electrical hook-up (lights, switches, plugs). 
Went on a little spin on Woo-woo, and admired the harbor.


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## Green Acres

Beautiful job. Hope you enjoy living there. Good luck with all your endeavours and thanks for sharing.


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## LostinPrGeorge

melli said:


> Always had a fondness for Kubotas. Might be that I have a Kubota engine in Bobby (Bobcat 331).
> You'll get to that stage one day...just plug away, and never think of how far you have yet go...lol (being a tad naive helps). I found clearing and modifying the land to be rewarding. Being outdoors, bulldozing and landscaping terrain was cathartic. Plus, you see results.
> 
> Insulation is done for second floor (walls, ceiling). Just main floor walls need insulation, but no rush, as the ICF is automatically R20. I started moving my stuff into bunker! Felt good to sit on my couch (missing a leg???). But before I can be a potato, still need to do a lot of electrical hook-up (lights, switches, plugs).
> Went on a little spin on Woo-woo, and admired the harbor.
> 
> View attachment 67750


----------



## LostinPrGeorge

Good to see woo-woo is still getting some attention shown her way, but how about those daily swims in the lake?


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## melli

Moving Day

Spent my first night in bunker, last night. RV is almost empty...amazing how much crap I can put in RV! Now, I get to spend several days cleaning it, and then selling it. Be a sweet day when that sucker rolls away. Yet, I feel pangs of regret, as it has been my home for so long (a soother). 
Hard to believe I spent 4 years and 23 days in bloody thing. All for a chunk of paradise. Hopefully, I won't mull over the cost of my venture in the days and months to come. Don't look in rear view mirror they say...lol
One observation I've had so far, is I cannot hear a peep from outside, while inside. It is like the world doesn't exist. Well, I could make out the faint thump thump of a passing helicopter. Poor Ravens...they can squawk all they want now. There is no substitute for triple pane glass, 6" of reinforced concrete sandwiched by 5" of foam, and a foot of Roxul in ceilings. 









RV'ing is definitely a young person's game.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Moving Day
> 
> Spent my first night in bunker, last night. RV is almost empty...amazing how much crap I can put in RV! Now, I get to spend several days cleaning it, and then selling it. Be a sweet day when that sucker rolls away. Yet, I feel pangs of regret, as it has been my home for so long (a soother).
> Hard to believe I spent 4 years and 23 days in bloody thing. All for a chunk of paradise. Hopefully, I won't mull over the cost of my venture in the days and months to come. Don't look in rear view mirror they say...lol
> One observation I've had so far, is I cannot hear a peep from outside, while inside. It is like the world doesn't exist. Well, I could make out the faint thump thump of a passing helicopter. Poor Ravens...they can squawk all they want now. There is no substitute for triple pane glass, 6" of reinforced concrete sandwiched by 5" of foam, and a foot of Roxul in ceilings.
> 
> View attachment 68118
> 
> RV'ing is definitely a young person's game.


I'm sure you already have plans for the "windfall" from selling the RV.


----------



## ShannonR

Congrats, Melli!!!! Doesn't it feel good to move into your build, finally?


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> Congrats, Melli!!!! Doesn't it feel good to move into your build, finally?


Thanks! You can say 'Finally' again....lol
For a spell, I thought it would never happen. 6 yrs ago I bought the property...I never stay engaged with something that long....lol
I suppose one is motivated to get a roof over their head. 



oldtruckbbq said:


> I'm sure you already have plans for the "windfall" from selling the RV.


That money is spent, and then some...lol


----------



## oldtruckbbq

You must love having a full size fridge again.


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## melli

Notice something missing?
Haven't been able to take a pic from this angle before...
Sweet relief seeing the RV roll away. May I never have to live in one again. I need therapy now...


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## Echoesechos

Lol Melli. Well you can't go Backwards now. Sold the rv. This winter will be such a snug comfortable one that you'll be able to sit back eating bonbons while catalogue shopping. Lol

You've come a long way. And can I just say, I'm very jealous of that refrigerator.


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## oldtruckbbq

Now that you are safely ensconced in the bunker, any plans to put in a garden and any food critters?


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## Mickie3

oldtruckbbq said:


> Now that you are safely ensconced in the bunker, any plans to put in a garden and any food critters?



She is already raising rabbits.


----------



## melli

Echoesechos said:


> Lol Melli. Well you can't go Backwards now. Sold the rv. This winter will be such a snug comfortable one that you'll be able to sit back eating bonbons while catalogue shopping. Lol
> 
> You've come a long way. And can I just say, I'm very jealous of that refrigerator.


That sounds like a plan. 
Haha... what a difference a real fridge makes (KitchenAid counter depth with internal water/ice)! Lots of real estate inside, and food just tastes better...lol
Found myself making late evening slushees (fridge spits out ice pretty well). 


oldtruckbbq said:


> Now that you are safely ensconced in the bunker, any plans to put in a garden and any food critters?


Definitely...still have to wait as the bunker needs to get finished before I get into that....and I need a fence first. 


Mickie3 said:


> She is already raising rabbits.


'My' rabbit hasn't brought any guests home yet...I cannot see myself eating 'bunny-bunny'...lol
Not a very imaginative name. I should probably call it 'Granola', as it comes running when I say that word.


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## MoBookworm1957

Congratulations Melli!


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## FreeRange

Congratulations Melli! After 18 months in an RV, I think I could take up the full-time life - if I didn't have to unload half the trailer every time we wanted to go somewhere.


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## MoBookworm1957

Enjoy your new home melli!
Congratulations! Job well done!


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## melli

MoBookworm1957 said:


> Enjoy your new home melli!
> Congratulations! Job well done!


Thanks MoBookworm! Indeed, I am enjoying it...I basically stopped doing anything more of substance once I moved in. Still lots to do, but all in good time. 

Impressed with heating requirements since we've moved into fall mode (went from hot to cool about a week ago). This Styrofoam cooler seems to moderate temps, day or night. Waiting for cold weather to see energy usage. 

Finally got my tub installed! What a bear it was to hookup. Not your typical tub (Maax - Delsia), so it required a little 'creativity'. I picked up a roman faucet set from amazon (Grohe Eurosmart). Germans design some skookum hardware. Never thought I'd be impressed with how smooth the taps work...lol

Recently, been cleaning up yard (post construction cleanup). Moved shipping container. I've never known my place without the shipping container parked in the middle of it...nice to see it out of the way (used Bobby to drag it). Brown patch in pic below is where it used to be...










































First thing I did after installing tub was 'test' it. Filled it up and jumped in...4 yrs, 2 month and about 14 days since I had a tub....way too long to be without a tub. Just thinking about it, makes me want to turn the taps on....


----------



## LostCaper

Just found your thread. I am starting the same on the east coast. We have 23 acres that I am trying to recondition. We have a house but looking at building a cabin by the shore. I am learning lots from your thread.. thanks for sharing.


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## ShannonR

That's a great tub, Melli! Wow!!!


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## LostCaper

melli said:


> Biggest tree that I've seen in my hood...I'm almost 6' tall.
> That tree has seen a lot...dark marks are from a forest fire.
> I'd have to say that is a 500yr old tree.
> There is nature museum down the road that has a slice of a tree mounted on wall...it was something like 2000yrs old before someone took an axe to it...incredible. They show major world events the tree has seen...if a tree could see...
> View attachment 55016


Man what a tree. I have a cold and couldn't sleep so I am reading through your postings. Hope my reply doesn't interrupt the current conversation to much.


----------



## LostCaper

melli said:


> Being in a rainforest-ee type environment, one expects their share of rain. Usually, we get most of it over winter, but it usually is a light rain, day after day after day. Lack of sun is the biggest headache though.
> Anyways, as I mentioned, we got a deluge a few days ago, which is not very common at all. It absolutely overpowered my drain sluice box and did a number on my driveway. Probably the most intense rainfall I have ever witnessed up here, in all my life. Down my road, I noticed all these 'sod rolls'. At first, I thought a grader was to blame, but as I drove down the road, I noticed lots of them, apparently random. Of course, I had to investigate. The shoulder sod had been ripped up and floated, then partially rolled. There were no grader marks...it dawned on me, this was the rain we had. The places where the sod was ripped up, was in places where the river of water would flow into the ditch (like at corners or low spots). The force required must have been quite substantial. For a moment, I thought, wow, free sod! lol
> Then, I thought, it was probably contaminated with the road oils etc. Speaking of which, lawns around here are prone to becoming moss lawns, due to the moisture and lack of sun, but the roadside turf doesn't have any moss?! I concluded the iron particles off trucks and cars keep the shoulders free of moss...especially since we use road salt for a few weeks over winter. You'll note how lush the roadside 'lawn' is...lots of iron. That's my guess...lol
> View attachment 55597
> 
> View attachment 55598
> 
> btw - for moss control up here, we use iron based solution.


I seen bear roll sod back like that. The keep rolling the sod to get the ants and grubs.


----------



## melli

LostCaper said:


> I seen bear roll sod back like that. The keep rolling the sod to get the ants and grubs.


Yeah, I could see that. In this case, I'm sure it was the rain, unless the bear did the whole road....we had a pour. 


LostCaper said:


> Man what a tree. I have a cold and couldn't sleep so I am reading through your postings. Hope my reply doesn't interrupt the current conversation to much.


Haha, not at all! Actually, I was letting the thread die, as I am done, in a manner of speaking. Going forward, things will move very slowly. 
Ironic, I just found myself re-reading my thread, from page 1...it seems like it was from decades ago. 
Last couple of days, I've been planting nursery trees (pick them from ditches) around the perimeter of property. Would like to 'wall' the property borders with green. Could use more dirt though....

BTW - I passed that tree today, while hunting nursery trees. I'd have to bushwhack my way to it now (that tree was on the edge of a new powerline RoW). Nature doesn't sit still...


----------



## LostCaper

Well


melli said:


> Yeah, I could see that. In this case, I'm sure it was the rain, unless the bear did the whole road....we had a pour.
> 
> Haha, not at all! Actually, I was letting the thread die, as I am done, in a manner of speaking. Going forward, things will move very slowly.
> Ironic, I just found myself re-reading my thread, from page 1...it seems like it was from decades ago.
> Last couple of days, I've been planting nursery trees (pick them from ditches) around the perimeter of property. Would like to 'wall' the property borders with green. Could use more dirt though....
> 
> BTW - I passed that tree today, while hunting nursery trees. I'd have to bushwhack my way to it now (that tree was on the edge of a new powerline RoW). Nature doesn't sit still...


No nature doesn't sit still. That why I have a lot of trees to cut to clear of our farm. 

Reading through your posts makes my to do list look smaller. Man you did a pile of work. At least I have a house and garage already. I am planning on building a log cabin but no real hurry thus no pressure.


----------



## Tomjracer

Melli,

Don't let the thread die  I've learned a ton from your posts and would encourage you to keep at it (I'm being selfish).


----------



## melli

Tomjracer said:


> Melli,
> 
> Don't let the thread die  I've learned a ton from your posts and would encourage you to keep at it (I'm being selfish).


Haha...thanks, but there isn't a whole lot left to blab about. I'm in chill mode...might be because I have no money....lol
So, I have been going on walks in hood with a friend, and I've been dying to see this place go up. Bit of a problem seeing new builds when they are hiding in forest...never deters me though...
The view from this place speaks volumes. Doesn't look like much, but it has an concrete underground garage/parkade (below floor in pic). 









Very high bank waterfront - would have to rappel down a cliff to get to water. 








If you recall, I made extra 'pylons' when doing the house concrete pour. I always over order on concrete pours...be a nightmare if you did a pour and ran short (especially out in sticks). I used Bobby to 'plant' them. A bit of a pain (lot of fussing to get them perfectly aligned), but cheaper than calling in a concrete truck. They will be used for 2nd floor deck off bedroom. 
















I had two Corsica Pines growing on edge of septic field, and they needed to be moved. About 20yrs ago, two friends went to Italy and came home with a pine cone. It sat on fireplace mantle for a decade. While visiting them, I commented on it (big honkin pine cone!). Well, at their request, I took the pine cone and seeded it. Amazingly, after a year, I had 9 trees. I gave away 7 and kept 2 for me. In the midst of developing property I had to plant them somewhere (they were in pots). I finally got around to moving them...I used Bobby to scoop them out. I do hope they can establish themselves...given our drier climate in summer, as of late. I am hopeful they can survive better than my cedars, which are dying off. 








An interesting tree...really long needles. Note: we always have to brace freshly planted trees ~4' or taller. The wind will mess with their ability to root properly (or tip them over). I prefer to use strapping, than rope, as it is easier on trunk, but rope is all that I had lying around. I will have to monitor them to make sure the rope doesn't bite into bark too much.


----------



## melli

Have to show off a couple of pics of my mountain jaunt. I finally climbed Mt Hallowell. Just a 1000ft stair climb from hell. Glad I did it, because I've tripped all over the Caren Range, but had yet to ascend the premier peak (one with an old fire lookout on it). 








See the anchor wires holding the shed on top of mountain...and the trees don't grow very tall on top. 
Two views - one easterly, and one westerly.


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Sure is beautiful country. You going to be planting a garden in the spring?

I've used pieces of old bicycle tire or hose against the trunk to keep the rope from digging in. It works and it is free.

If your cedars are dying and are large enough, you might try cutting them into 1" boards with a chainsaw mill or bartering with someone to mill them for you. That would be a great way to do siding on your bunker. I've seen a couple examples where people left one live edge exposed and ran it horizontally. Looked amazing.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> Sure is beautiful country. You going to be planting a garden in the spring?
> 
> I've used pieces of old bicycle tire or hose against the trunk to keep the rope from digging in. It works and it is free.
> 
> If your cedars are dying and are large enough, you might try cutting them into 1" boards with a chainsaw mill or bartering with someone to mill them for you. That would be a great way to do siding on your bunker. I've seen a couple examples where people left one live edge exposed and ran it horizontally. Looked amazing.


Great idea on hose. I've been meaning to use some defunct garden hose for strapping around HWT, but it never happened. 
Bartering for milled lumber isn't done much around here...you either have a mill or don't...lol. I should have bought one from the get-go. Most of my dead cedars are too puny for milling. I have one large one that might be a mill candidate. I don't want to use cedar for siding (fire hazard). I will need plenty of cedar for trim work though....
Speaking of cedar, I went to store to inquire about rough cut 2x12 - 12' cedar. Over a hundred bucks each! I need 5 to do my stair treads. Ouch. As I think about it, maybe Douglas Fir would be the way to go (less than half the price). I just like the meatier tread, cedar offers. 
A garden would be wonderful, but I need a fence and more dirt....


----------



## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Great idea on hose. I've been meaning to use some defunct garden hose for strapping around HWT, but it never happened.
> Bartering for milled lumber isn't done much around here...you either have a mill or don't...lol. I should have bought one from the get-go. Most of my dead cedars are too puny for milling. I have one large one that might be a mill candidate. I don't want to use cedar for siding (fire hazard). I will need plenty of cedar for trim work though....
> Speaking of cedar, I went to store to inquire about rough cut 2x12 - 12' cedar. Over a hundred bucks each! I need 5 to do my stair treads. Ouch. As I think about it, maybe Douglas Fir would be the way to go (less than half the price). I just like the meatier tread, cedar offers.
> A garden would be wonderful, but I need a fence and more dirt....


I have plenty of dirt, just don't have the views that you have. Seems that dirt and views don't seem to go together. I'm going to have to do something for fence as well because there are a lot of deer in the area. I have a couple big dogs, but they sleep indoors in comfort at night, so not much good at chasing away deer when they are most active.

Cedar is indeed expensive, especially in large sizes. Around here it is all Easter Red Cedar, none of the white cedar. If I want that, I have to pay through the nose at the lumber yard. I can get red cedar lumber just about anywhere. Of course, I need lots of cedar logs for our home and have one big cedar and a handful of small cedars on my acreage. Across the highway the area is choked with them, so I may see if they have some they want cut down in exchange for the logs.


----------



## Steve_S

WOW... shocked at the cedar prices... I did my whole place in Live Edge Eastern White Cedar (looks great but what a pile of labour) and it was very reasonably priced... The difference is that I did NOT buy from any retail place, a local small mill cut everything up as I needed and he even threw in 2 loads of slab for other projects I am doing. It is certainly worth getting to know the local mills and small guys doing it on the side... Many out here but I am in a Cedar & Pine logging area so....


----------



## oldtruckbbq

Steve_S said:


> WOW... shocked at the cedar prices... I did my whole place in Live Edge Eastern White Cedar (looks great but what a pile of labour) and it was very reasonably priced... The difference is that I did NOT buy from any retail place, a local small mill cut everything up as I needed and he even threw in 2 loads of slab for other projects I am doing. It is certainly worth getting to know the local mills and small guys doing it on the side... Many out here but I am in a Cedar & Pine logging area so....


Lots of Red Cedar around here. You can get 8 ft posts minimum 4" diameter for as little as $3.50 each, bundles of 8ft x 1 1/8" boards are $150 for 500 board feet. Those bundles have about 25% cull rate, but the boards can be cut up for smaller projects. White Cedar isn't readily available locally so it is really pricey.

I think I've worked out a deal with a local mill that cuts oak for making pallets. Trying to get them to mill some logs in exchange for logs. We'll see. We have to get creative to come up with deals that don't break the bank.


----------



## melli

Yeah, it is odd cedar (western red) is so expensive around here nowadays. Funny, but cedar used to be considered a trash timber (other than shakes, not used a lot). Back in the day, foresters were after the big Douglas Fir timber. The cedar was just in the way. Now, the tables have reversed. A clear cedar log is gold. 

Well, I bailed on cedar treads...I was at the lumber store in town, and with time to burn, decided to rip apart a lift of 8' Douglas Fir 2x12s. I am picky...lol BTW - I occasionally get in crap for ripping apart a lift of lumber. My philosophy is quite simple...I ain't buying crap.

Actually, I wasn't planning to get nice treads laid for a bit, but I figured I ought to have nice uniform treads if I plan to use bedroom upstairs. It is nice having a bed in living room, but perhaps I ought to be civilized...lol. Have to admit, it is easy 'retiring' to the bed from the couch.

Suckers weigh a bit, but after picking through a fresh lift, I found 7 boards I could live with (about 100 in a lift). Take them home and dice them up, router every edge, and sand until I can't take it anymore (dust fest). I dissembled my stairs and take the stringers outside to sand. Once satisfied, I put on two coat of poly (oil based stuff, not the water based stuff). I get the stringers reinstalled and just lay a few treads down for inspection. Not sure if this is the way to go, but the 'plan' is to have the treads extend under the beam. Then, build balusters down from beam and have them sit on treads (saves squishing stairway width). Not sure if that will look good aesthetically? Thing is, I need to have a railing of some sort...with exposed stairs, it makes it interesting. 

























I worry the stairs will look unbalanced? Maybe once the pickets are installed, it will look better....handrail will be on other side (wall side). Up to 42" width is allowed for one set of handrails (my stairs are about 40" wide). I may go for a unique infill - instead of pickets, create a design like what I did for a gate....idk


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## Tomjracer

Have you thought about using stainless wire for the railing system?


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## melli

I like that Tom!...be a bit pricey. I installed some wire railings a while back...big money. And in above pic, I see they have a custom made stainless steel handrail, which firms up the posts (an issue with wire). 
Our local codes are anal that the infill of a railing not be a climbing or choking hazard (4" min gap). Since I'd just be putting wire on a slope, not a problem (climbing). 

I do like wire though, if I could afford it. Doesn't block light or view.


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## melli

Finally got around to getting treads screwed down. I procrastinated for days. First, on whether extended treads would look good (stop at railing or extend under railing - Tom's pic above shows treads extending under railing), then on screw size....lol
Part of the problem was my desire to glue and screw...once you glue, you are stuck. Once I decided not to glue (at this point), I could proceed. Then I mulled over size of screw. Finally went with these guys (GRK 5-5/8"). They don't look like much, but they are structural rated screws. And they are frigging expensive. 
Really happy with screw grab, and the fact I have sizable treads to tread on...In the past, one had to be mindful when climbing stairs, given treads were a hodge podge of scrap lumber. 
I guess I now have no excuses for not using bedroom upstairs...


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## ShannonR

The stairs look amazing, great job! Can't wait to see what you decide to do for railing.


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## Tomjracer

melli said:


> I like that Tom!...be a bit pricey. I installed some wire railings a while back...big money. And in above pic, I see they have a custom made stainless steel handrail, which firms up the posts (an issue with wire).
> Our local codes are anal that the infill of a railing not be a climbing or choking hazard (4" min gap). Since I'd just be putting wire on a slope, not a problem (climbing).
> 
> I do like wire though, if I could afford it. Doesn't block light or view.


Helped a friend do stainless wire and cost wise it wasn't bad at all. We bought a spool of cable from Home Depot and picked up stainless fittings from the local marine store. (Home Depot also had fittings but they weren't what he was looking for). We used wood newel posts and handrail that matched the treads.


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## melli

ShannonR said:


> The stairs look amazing, great job! Can't wait to see what you decide to do for railing.


Thanks Shannon. They are about as simple as one can get. I just tried to make them look presentable. Once I drywall the utility closet wall, and paint it white, I think the stairs will 'pop' even more. Sort of 3D painting (warm wood on white canvas). Should note I am not a fan of drywall, but having spied on a neighbors place, in which they literally painted their interior completely white (and white furnishings), I am seeing how drywall (and white) can act as a contrast. Gave their place a minimalist look. 

Now, I have to deal with Tom putting a bug in my ear about wire railing...lol
I had my heart set on a 2x2 wood pattern in Douglas Fir. I was going to disregard the building 'rules' and do and go crazy...something similar to this:
https://www.jensilvermath.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Timurid-Lattice-Close-Up-copy.jpg
To pass inspection, just throw up some wire mesh on backside (something easily removable). But, as I think about it, perhaps too much wood? An intricate wood pattern railing might diminish the stark and simple stairs. Lots of time to think about it...


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## Tomjracer

The wood pattern is beautiful, but I personally think it would take too much away from the beautiful set of stairs you have there. 

I think I might copy that wood pattern for my new place though. Have a little 10x20 "cottage" / guest house that needs a railing outside the door.


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## Elli

Wow Just read all 49 pages. You have done such an impressive solo build Melli! I can’t wait to see it finished and you are almost there.


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## coastalhermit

Didn't read it all, M. But some. I am familiar with the story. Did it, too. Remote Island about 80 miles NW of you. Still, you have my congratulations. NOT easy. But well worth it. I am happy living OTG. Fifteen years and counting (tho not for too long as I am 70 now). I wrote OUR LIFE OFF THE GRID if you want the whole story (Amazon). Our challenges were different - no heavy machinery, for instance (no roads). Everything is 'by barge'. Anyway....good on ya!


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## melli

coastalhermit said:


> Didn't read it all, M. But some. I am familiar with the story. Did it, too. Remote Island about 80 miles NW of you. Still, you have my congratulations. NOT easy. But well worth it. I am happy living OTG. Fifteen years and counting (tho not for too long as I am 70 now). I wrote OUR LIFE OFF THE GRID if you want the whole story (Amazon). Our challenges were different - no heavy machinery, for instance (no roads). Everything is 'by barge'. Anyway....good on ya!


I read the available bits of your story on Amazon. Getting run over by a boat and still being to talk about it in lucid sentences, is a miracle....lol
A OTG homestead up in your area was my first choice, but the logistics suck. I can imagine humping materials up your homestead was no easy feat. I think that is what deterred me. It wasn't the building that worried me, but how to get settled enough to start. My 'dream' included having a sizable yard to have a garden and room to grow (outbuildings). If I had oodles of money, I'd be on some island in the Desolation Sound area. I'd be barging in soil and heavy equipment. Now, that I've settled, I am ok with my resting spot. It allows me to easily roam, but I still have the seclusion and privacy. 

Interestingly, I have neighbours who hope to join you soon. They have their place for sale, and have eyed a couple OTG homes in your area. They plan to use helicopters to carry some bulky stuff. 

Since I've moved into my home, as noted, I've been focused on trying to get myself back into tip-top shape. It seems the stress of living in a RV wasn't conducive for self care, especially exercise and eating healthy. I have this hill near me, which has a 1100ft vertical trail from hell (2.5 mile round-trip). It is on the dark side of hill (no sun), so is chilly climbing, at this time of year. Every second day, I climb it. Loose rock, roots, and tree detritus make it one of those walks where one is stooped over staring at ground watching every step. I feel my legs protest and lungs are heaving, as I hump up hill. The 'reward' is view at top. Initially, I would be in a near coma when I reached the top, and it was hard to take in view (vertigo). Now, I can calm down a bit and watch the Ravens and Eagles catch thermals on sunny side. 













The above pic is my vertigo spot. Every time I go to this spot, I feel it coming on, so much so, I can only hang out here for a few seconds, furiously take pics before I feel the 'wave' coming on. Really odd, as I am not in any great danger, but the illusion from this spot, is that I will fall off mini mountain (one of those spots where ground slopes in such a way to make you feel like if you make a misstep, your toast). And the last thing I want to happen, is to pass out, so I quickly scramble to level'ish ground. I think staring at tops of trees a thousand feet below brings on the nausea...lol. Just over the brow in pic, it does get vertical (cliff). 









A tree at top...the sea brings in constant moisture.


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## melli

In terms of construction, not much happening...been scoping out materials to insulate window boxes and hardware to attach deck ledger to house. In keeping with the spirit of over-doing it, I want to attach deck joists/ledger with these tension ties. 
https://www.amazon.ca/Simpson-DTT2Z-Galvanized-14-Gauge-Tension/dp/B002LOJQ3A
Basically, I attach these to house floor joists, then throw in some bolts that will attach to deck floor joist (which will also have these tension ties on them). That way, deck will never detach from house, unless it can rip out these brackets or house floor joist, which ain't going to happen. 

I had some XPS foam lying about, so I insulated a door frame. I plan to do all the window and door boxes with foam...problem is, I can do most in 1" foam, but 6 windows will need 1/2" foam because of space considerations (need to open windows when done).


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## coastalhermit

You are right about the effort required to build here. Daunting to say the least. Worse, we were not in the least familiar with tools. City folk. Basically stupid and incompetent. But that changes as you continue to hammer and saw....and bleed. We are still stupid but more capable. I wouldnt hire us but no one laughs and points anymore. So, thats good. 
The best route, it seems, is to get everything together, put it on a big barge, and use the helicopter to unload it. But start first with a tough-to-build large workshop that serves as a temporary home while building. 'Course, we were in max stupid mode back then.
Glad you're a neighbour.


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## melli

coastalhermit said:


> You are right about the effort required to build here. Daunting to say the least. Worse, we were not in the least familiar with tools. City folk. Basically stupid and incompetent. But that changes as you continue to hammer and saw....and bleed. We are still stupid but more capable. I wouldnt hire us but no one laughs and points anymore. So, thats good.
> The best route, it seems, is to get everything together, put it on a big barge, and use the helicopter to unload it. But start first with a tough-to-build large workshop that serves as a temporary home while building. 'Course, we were in max stupid mode back then.
> Glad you're a neighbour.


Yeah, have to agree about the workshop/temp home...unfortunately, I am in red tape zone, and might have been busted for building a workshop before the home. Hindsight is everything, but I should have done it anyways. I'd have my workshop already built. Spent too much money and time building small legal sheds (well and electrical - max code 10sqm/108sqft). 

I consider myself quite good with tools, yet I nick/cut myself all the time...lol. Funny thing is, I almost finish a job, and count my lucky stars for no cuts, then I end up cutting myself...usually on last bit. I really think living in the sticks, it is mandatory to have cuts and bruises all the time. 

Does your book have lots of pics? I like pics...or post some here....


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## coastalhermit

melli said:


> Yeah, have to agree about the workshop/temp home...unfortunately, I am in red tape zone, and might have been busted for building a workshop before the home. Hindsight is everything, but I should have done it anyways. I'd have my workshop already built. Spent too much money and time building small legal sheds (well and electrical - max code 10sqm/108sqft).
> 
> I consider myself quite good with tools, yet I nick/cut myself all the time...lol. Funny thing is, I almost finish a job, and count my lucky stars for no cuts, then I end up cutting myself...usually on last bit. I really think living in the sticks, it is mandatory to have cuts and bruises all the time.
> 
> Does your book have lots of pics? I like pics...or post some here....


There are SOME pics but most are on my blog: ouroffthegridhome.ca.


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## LostCaper

ShannonR said:


> The stairs look amazing, great job! Can't wait to see what you decide to do for railing.


Yep.. I agree. You are doing an awesome job.


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## oldtruckbbq

coastalhermit said:


> There are SOME pics but most are on my blog: ouroffthegridhome.ca.


Checked out your site. Interesting articles, and I like your conversational writing style. I'll go back and read more later.


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## melli

I finally clad all the rough window/door jambs with foam. Tedious affair. I suppose winter does that. 
We finally had some doozy windstorms that tested my bunker. During one storm, the building inspector and I stood at french doors and watched the unfolding chaos outside. Trees flailing in wind like blades of grass. We were behind triple pane glass with triple seal. What a difference from RV days! It was like someone hit 'mute' on the remote. You can see it, but you can't hear it. I suppose the concrete walls and 5" of foam helped too. Our utility is still cleaning up from last windstorm (2 days ago). 500k folks without power in total...over 1500 line breaks. They have 900 left to fix...We escaped with just a few hour outage...think our area is battle tested (we are prone to outages around here). I only had one sizable tree topple. I did some hocus pocus and hooked up genny to my grid (might be illegal.... I was in middle of running a bath, power goes out, then pressure tanks empty...no water. Well, that won't do. Now, genny can roar away over at well shed and it powers 'everything'. 









I can put 1" foam around doors and fixed windows (to allow room for drywall or wood trim), but can only put 1/2" foam around windows that open.


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## melli

Since I am not doing much at my place, I've taken to visiting building sites. Really enjoy looking over what other construction outfits do. I think it helps one obtain a critical eye. 
This one is a neighbor I know. A nice 'little' house perched on a hill with a view of harbor entrance. Shed style seems to be all the rage. 

















I do wish I had made bigger overhangs on my bunker....
Notice the double ply deck joists...interesting. 









Look underneath in crawl space and I see they used TJI joists. They are not that thick, and one failing of TJI joists is they are light, and when you bounce on floor, everything shakes. 








Noticed they sheeted an interior wall with ply...new codes here for seismic stability. When things start shaking, the interior wall in pic will help keep things from falling apart. 








Black fascia seems to be all the rage now...hides dirt well (not sure I like it). Hard to see in pic, but metal roofing job was superb. The standing seams were pinch at ends, and the bottom lip of roof was bent over the drip cap, so no way for driving rain to sneak under roof, nor could roof peel up in a hurricane (we don't get them here, but what the heck).


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## melli

Construction site #2

Another shed style home...this one on waters edge.


















This one uses engineered trusses for roof, unlike the last one, which used TJI joists. Also been noticing every roof job has 2x4 strapping now. Not a code thing, but I think there has been concern about ensuring the roof assembly has horizontal air flow. Plus, it makes the roof that much stronger. I've heard that roofs without adequate venting have had issues (rotting). 
They also have glue laminated lumber. I really like those monsters. That is what I should have used to get an extended overhang. Albeit, they are not cheap.









Not a bad view...but one needs a 'tight' house or your listening to crashing waves 24/7. I prefer silence.









Couldn't understand why they had fans humming away in basement...maybe to dry out TJI joists...???
House had construction fence (obviously, a city outfit) and ply over doors...but windstorm destroyed fence, and blew out ply doors...










With LED lighting, one doesn't need to throw up J-boxes (junction boxes) in ceiling, so the problem is how to place them accurately once drywall is up...I see the solution they used here...plastic templates. I probably should have done that. I put up J-boxes, but it limits my LED selection.









Not a great pic, but I am noticing in new builds they are using stud tie downs/tension ties (see metal brackets up against studs). I even saw them using redi-rod like I did at my place...in construction, it takes time for builders to adopt new techniques, but I would never see this sort of thing just a few years ago. Even the blocking between studs to cover ply seams (horizontal chunks of wood between studs) is a fairly new development. It begs the question why they leave gaps when sheathing house in ply...if all they are going to do is block them over. I don't buy the expansion and contraction gaping anymore. After all, we use T&G ply on floors with no gaps. I should point out I used 5/8" T&G on my walls and roof...in addition to floors. Actually, I wished I used at least 3/4" T&G on floors...5/8" is too soft.










Nice roof overhang....grumble grumble....lol









Not bad specs for windows...double pane vinyl jobs. But if your going to spend an easy million on a house, windows and doors should be the best of the best. Note - they are rated for Zone 1 Canada (Zone 3 is the best).


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## oldtruckbbq

I would think that diagonal bracing between TJI joists would provide plenty of rigidity. We are going to use 11 7/8" TJI joists for our floor. They are spec'd for up to 19' clear span, but I won't have more than 11'. That should provide enough of a safety factor to take care of bounce. I'm also planning on 3/4" T&G plywood for the subfloor with cross bracing under joints to provide even more rigidity. Thanks for sharing pictures. Always like seeing new ideas.

Around here, seems like everyone is building houses that all look the same. Ours is definitely not going to be the same! We were going to have 4' overhangs on our shed roof because I can buy TJI joists up to 40' long. Construction would go pretty quickly with single piece rafters. I've looked at some things online and seen even larger overhangs and really like the look, so I may end up going with 24' TJI so we can have a larger overhang.

BTW, nice use of an Amazon box for curtains.


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I would think that diagonal bracing between TJI joists would provide plenty of rigidity. We are going to use 11 7/8" TJI joists for our floor. They are spec'd for up to 19' clear span, but I won't have more than 11'. That should provide enough of a safety factor to take care of bounce. I'm also planning on 3/4" T&G plywood for the subfloor with cross bracing under joints to provide even more rigidity. Thanks for sharing pictures. Always like seeing new ideas.
> 
> Around here, seems like everyone is building houses that all look the same. Ours is definitely not going to be the same! We were going to have 4' overhangs on our shed roof because I can buy TJI joists up to 40' long. Construction would go pretty quickly with single piece rafters. I've looked at some things online and seen even larger overhangs and really like the look, so I may end up going with 24' TJI so we can have a larger overhang.
> 
> BTW, nice use of an Amazon box for curtains.


Can't get curtains until I get window boxes finished out. Cardboard will have to do...
TJIs are engineered to span decent distances, but it is their makeup that makes them bouncy. Perhaps a thicker subfloor and TJIs will solve the problem and/or plenty of blocking. I would visit construction sites, if you can, and see what I am talking about. TJIs while strong, are light, and don't give the floor a lot of mass. Was yapping with BI about it the other day...he actually brought it up. Just don't have a china cabinet in a TJI room.
I get what your saying about shortening the span, but the feel is very different than dimensional lumber joists when bouncing on them. Actually, I just went upstairs to 'feel' the difference. While the span lengths may be a bit different, dimensional 2x12 floor joists feel solid...almost hurts, as there is very little give. While bouncing on TJIs the other day, there was give in the floor, along with a lot of rattling of stuff on it. 
Structurally, TJIs are fine, if spanned according to their specs...just not sure they make a house feel solid. If your a light walker, maybe no big deal. 

The way of the world nowadays...running out of cheap large dimensional lumber, so just like plywood became OSB, joists are becoming TJIs.


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## LostCaper

melli said:


> So, after purchase, I plop my shipping container on property.
> Oddly, my insurance company wanted pictures of it. Getting insurance for a vacant lot with stuff on it was a hassle and it cost more than my previous home, which had a house on it (a new one).
> They call these containers, 'one trippers', in that they were made in China, filled full of crap and shipped to our shores, then emptied and sold to me. Was $4500 $CDN delivered. Tad pricey, but virtually a new box. It has been sitting in the same spot in a rain-forest for 4 yrs, full of my worldly possessions, and no leaks, nor moisture. I was going to put in some desiccant, but never got around to it.
> View attachment 54673


Man them insurance company likes to make up lies to justify overcharging. Here on the east coast of Canada the place is littered with them and not one of them I heard of leaking.


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## LostCaper

melli said:


> Have to show off a couple of pics of my mountain jaunt. I finally climbed Mt Hallowell. Just a 1000ft stair climb from hell. Glad I did it, because I've tripped all over the Caren Range, but had yet to ascend the premier peak (one with an old fire lookout on it).
> View attachment 70646
> 
> See the anchor wires holding the shed on top of mountain...and the trees don't grow very tall on top.
> Two views - one easterly, and one westerly.
> 
> View attachment 70650
> 
> View attachment 70652


Man what beautiful country.


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## LostCaper

melli said:


> Now that I had power, I needed a septic field, as one cannot get a building permit without one up here. I also needed a well, which needs to be 100ft away from septic field (min). I had sited my septic field in a low spot, as I wanted a gravity field (that is, one that requires no power). So, should the need arise, I can install a toilet anywhere, except electrical shed (too low).
> I did a write up on that at DIY...was one of the easier things I had to do. There was a manual, and it covered all the bases. Since I had no native soil, I had to do an engineered field, which meant getting an engineer to spend a half hour looking over site and saying ok. Once done, I gave him a form, and money to file the paperwork.
> 
> http://www.doityourself.com/forum/w...eld-1000g-2-chamber-septic-tank-complete.html
> 
> For the well, it was a tad tougher than septic. But having Bobby helped a whole lot, as he had to dig more power and water lines. I got a driller to dig the well. There goes another 8k....
> 
> http://www.doityourself.com/forum/w...35648-new-well-setup-options.html#post2331739
> 
> I didn't have to build another shed, but I did. I figured the well gear (pressure tanks and whatnot) would cramp my garage home. And I needed another place to put junk. As luck would have it, it was a great idea, as a neighbour gave me a near new washer and dryer...betty crocker versions, but I am not one to complain. So, the well shed has a washer and dryer...


Man I read through you escapades with obtaining water and sewer. Having such a system would be nice but I am not sure if I want the trouble. For one the initial cost but worse than that, the more I do to the property the more my land taxes go up. It's criminal what they charge for land taxes for beach front. If I build a hole it will be to bury the tax man. jk. ≈ I was looking at turning it into a legit farm because taxes will be reduced but there are lots of catches like when you go to sell they tax the hell out of you and if I want to hand it over to my children they tax the hell out of you. Corruption at it's best. 

Having said that a small cabin with a wood stove to boil up map syrup. It would need a good vent with a fan ran by a solar panel which would also provide lights. I have a backhoe and there is a soft area which I suspect a couple of crocks in the ground would produce water. Think I will go with a compost toilet. I will heat my water with the wood stove. In short I think I will stay of guid.


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## melli

FYI - LostCaper - the assessor could care less about the septic and well in terms of assessment. They only came when I built something requiring a permit (they scope out the building permit records to do visits). My assessed value only changed significantly when I started to build the bunker. My land incrementally rose in assessed value throughout the years, but was at about the rate of inflation. 
Having a good septic system and virtually unlimited clean water is a nice thing to have, I think...
Well, the septic system had to be done or no house permit. They could care less if I had potable water, which I find odd...
I get if you want to live on the down-low, but if I am putting all this work and money into my homestead, I want to see value should I sell one day. And in my hood, I should (easily and then some). I won't go so far as to say this is the Hamptons, but we do seem be trending up, as it were. So far, property taxes are minimal here...no services.


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## LostCaper

melli said:


> FYI - LostCaper - the assessor could care less about the septic and well in terms of assessment. They only came when I built something requiring a permit (they scope out the building permit records to do visits). My assessed value only changed significantly when I started to build the bunker. My land incrementally rose in assessed value throughout the years, but was at about the rate of inflation.
> Having a good septic system and virtually unlimited clean water is a nice thing to have, I think...
> Well, the septic system had to be done or no house permit. They could care less if I had potable water, which I find odd...
> I get if you want to live on the down-low, but if I am putting all this work and money into my homestead, I want to see value should I sell one day. And in my hood, I should (easily and then some). I won't go so far as to say this is the Hamptons, but we do seem be trending up, as it were. So far, property taxes are minimal here...no services.


Maybe the taxes would remain fairly decent but in my area I am very skeptical because others who have improved and did great things with their water front property their taxes tripled. If I decide to put something substantial on the property then I will definitely bite the bullet but that is not in the foreseeable future. I'm getting old so the foreseeable future has an expiry date. lol.


----------



## LostCaper

LostCaper said:


> Man I read through you escapades with obtaining water and sewer. Having such a system would be nice but I am not sure if I want the trouble. For one the initial cost but worse than that, the more I do to the property the more my land taxes go up. It's criminal what they charge for land taxes for beach front. If I build a hole it will be to bury the tax man. jk. ≈ I was looking at turning it into a legit farm because taxes will be reduced but there are lots of catches like when you go to sell they tax the hell out of you and if I want to hand it over to my children they tax the hell out of you. Corruption at it's best.
> 
> Having said that a small cabin with a wood stove to boil up map syrup. It would need a good vent with a fan ran by a solar panel which would also provide lights. I have a backhoe and there is a soft area which I suspect a couple of crocks in the ground would produce water. Think I will go with a compost toilet. I will heat my water with the wood stove. In short I think I will stay of guid.





melli said:


> My drone was giving me the gears about it being too cold...no way it was 15F (lower limit of operation). So, I charged the battery, and in doing so, it heated up, to get a quick flight in. I wanted to capture the snow still hung up in trees...later in day, wind and higher temps pretty much washed the trees of snow.
> 
> View attachment 58906


Sweet picture. Man I have to get a drone. Such nice unique shot can be taken.


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## melli

Construction bit is on hold because I don't feel like doing anything (winter), and of course, money is always an issue. I am cozy, so there is no rush.
As with any house, I was worried about whether I had sealed it well for winter, as mice around here, are opportunists, especially when it gets cold. So, I set some traps inside, just to be sure...months go by, no mice, no nothing. Since the peanut butter bait had probably gone off, I throw the traps outside. Got 5 mice in one night! Hmmm. Surprised, as I have no wood piles or anything near house that would entice them. Well, the Ravens were happy. Too happy I think...they are stalking me now in the morning. As in, they are walking up to my french doors at first light and spy on me.

I do wish my lawn tractor was 4wd, given I can have issues driving up driveway in summer (loose gravel = spin out). So, I got these suckers for drive wheels. Really impressed with traction now! 








Since it was a nice day (fall windstorms over), I hooked up my lawn sweeper and motored around picking up twigs and whatnot.








Not a very robust piece of equipment, but it works...beats hand raking a couple of acres. With new wheels on lawn tractor, can even clean up driveway.
As I noted in previous posts, I've been hitting a nearby hill almost everyday. I really like this pic...lots of color.


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## melli

Oh yeah, there is this pic...inversion. 









I do believe those are the Olympia Mountains way in background to left.


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## oldtruckbbq

I'm going to have to get me a lawn sweeper. That would be much better than raking leaves and twigs off my drive!


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## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I'm going to have to get me a lawn sweeper. That would be much better than raking leaves and twigs off my drive!


It is a bit finicky on driveways. The height has to be set right or your picking up gravel...and driveway has to be pretty smooth. It seems to be good on lawns, even my moss, rubble lawn. If I ever get my driveway concreted, I bet it would be good on that. Normally, I haul out the stihl hand blower and walk down drive, but sitting on a tractor is more civilized...lol. Ironic, but I've never used sweeper for leaves, as I don't have many deciduous trees on property. Would like to change that one day (not too many, just a few for color/texture and some fruit trees).


----------



## melli

Sort of getting out of my winter slumber. Thought we were going to have an early spring, then a month of cool and snowy weather arrived. Usually, I only have to plow my driveway once a winter...this winter, 4 or 5 times. Upside is, that cooler weather (that which gets just below freezing) means sun, which just makes things brighter.

Got some true 10"x10" posts for bedroom deck. Sliced and diced them, routered, sanded and stained them. Felt good to be back at it. I'll have to do another coat, at least, of Sikkens teak stain to match carport posts. It also why they are beefy. Spec-wise, 6"x6" would have been plenty for deck, but I like posts that look like they will support absolutely anything...lol










Their eventual landing zone.


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## Hitch

Were you working on the inside over winter?


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## melli

Hitch said:


> Were you working on the inside over winter?


Not really...just mickey mouse stuff. I virtually came to a full stop when I moved in.
Hopefully, I'll get cracking soon. I need that 'final' (piece of paper that gets the local gov out of my hair). Fairly common to have folks in perennial build stage around here (like a decade or so). Supposedly, it keeps property taxes down if you don't have a final. Local gov doesn't like that, so they instituted new rules on how many times you can renew your permit (every 2yrs). Worse, if you renew too many times, they will want your build to conform to current code. And we just adopted the 2018 building code, which just makes a build more expensive. Eventually, we will have to build passive houses (2030).

Reminded me, I need to get the engineer to draw up the altered plans...talk about tardy...lol. I've been asking him to do it for 2 years now. Even the building inspector is exasperated. Things just move slowly around here. Starting to get worried he'll 'pass on'....lol


----------



## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Not really...just mickey mouse stuff. I virtually came to a full stop when I moved in.
> Hopefully, I'll get cracking soon. I need that 'final' (piece of paper that gets the local gov out of my hair). Fairly common to have folks in perennial build stage around here (like a decade or so). Supposedly, it keeps property taxes down if you don't have a final. Local gov doesn't like that, so they instituted new rules on how many times you can renew your permit (every 2yrs). Worse, if you renew too many times, they will want your build to conform to current code. And we just adopted the 2018 building code, which just makes a build more expensive. Eventually, we will have to build passive houses (2030).
> 
> Reminded me, I need to get the engineer to draw up the altered plans...talk about tardy...lol. I've been asking him to do it for 2 years now. Even the building inspector is exasperated. Things just move slowly around here. Starting to get worried he'll 'pass on'....lol


I appreciate more and more that I live in a county with no building inspectors and no code enforcement. I also appreciate that all my neighbors are building nice places and following codes so we don't have junk 1/4 mile away. If however, we had purchased a fixer-upper in a town just 20 minutes away, we would have to get a certificate of occupancy before the city would turn on the water and the electric utility turn on power.


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## Mickie3

oldtruckbbq said:


> I appreciate more and more that I live in a county with no building inspectors and no code enforcement. I also appreciate that all my neighbors are building nice places and following codes so we don't have junk 1/4 mile away. If however, we had purchased a fixer-upper in a town just 20 minutes away, we would have to get a certificate of occupancy before the city would turn on the water and the electric utility turn on power.


Sure they are, sure they are.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I appreciate more and more that I live in a county with no building inspectors and no code enforcement. I also appreciate that all my neighbors are building nice places and following codes so we don't have junk 1/4 mile away. If however, we had purchased a fixer-upper in a town just 20 minutes away, we would have to get a certificate of occupancy before the city would turn on the water and the electric utility turn on power.


The last bit about city being in charge of water and power is foreign here...Power utility does their own thing (they don't bow down to anyone), and while the water is controlled by city, never heard of them not allowing anybody to have water, whether they have CoO or not. Would be a safety issue, not allowing a house to have water. I know contractors are not happy without power. Means running a genny all day. 

Got the posts mounted, with a little help from Bobby. 










Be nice to have a deck, and be done with some of the scaffolding.


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## Tomjracer

Looking great Mel!


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## MoBookworm1957

Looking good Meli


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## melli

Got the beam and joists up...have to decide how much cantilever I want (4:1 is considered 'safe'), snap a chalk-line, then lop of ends. 









BTW - this is way overkill. True 10"x10" posts dwarf beam (4 ply - 2x12) and joists (2x10). Only 8' span.


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## oldtruckbbq

You won't have to worry about it collapsing when you have 100 people on it during a wild party.


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## melli

Plugging away...in slow motion because I can. 

One of the issues with decks is the ledger connection. Seems, over the years, decks have collapsed because the ledger (board flat up against house) detached. Building inspectors look to see they are well attached. I not only nut and bolt the ledger on rim joist of house, I use these tie downs, which attach to house joists. No way deck can 'fall off'. Odd thing, they were hard to source up here...

















I am almost done laying decking...then I'll trim edges with saw...makes for a straighter line. I'm waiting on 'T' brackets (being made by a local welder). I'm thinking I'll stop here, and tackle more important items, like the roof. If I start on railing, it might be a bear to put on siding with railing in the way.


----------



## melli

Got the posts installed and hardware stuff done...lots of fun hanging off a ladder augering holes for bolts. Clear sailing from here, as far as the deck goes. Building Inspector put a bug in my ear about having SS wire railing (seems our code now allows it). From memory, I recall it being expensive, but as I think about the cost and fuss to install glass, wire might not be so bad. Pickets are out of the question...obstruct view too much.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> Got the posts installed and hardware stuff done...lots of fun hanging off a ladder augering holes for bolts. Clear sailing from here, as far as the deck goes. Building Inspector put a bug in my ear about having SS wire railing (seems our code now allows it). From memory, I recall it being expensive, but as I think about the cost and fuss to install glass, wire might not be so bad. Pickets are out of the question...obstruct view too much.
> 
> View attachment 76272


I vote for the stainless wire. We have a friend that replaced the pickets in their deck railing with stainless wire. It is nearly invisible and makes the deck feel more a part of the outdoors. We really like it and have decided that is what we will do with our deck. I'd be willing to bet that with the size of your posts and the hardware you used to fasten them you won't need a top rail for strength and stability. Combine that with stainless wire and you will have a great view!

He bought 3/16" stainless wire rope in 100' rolls on MSC's website. I think he said it was a little over a dollar a foot, and he has over 1000 feet of it in his deck. So yeah, it is pricey, but he figures that he'll never have to replace it, unlike the pickets in his rail that were shrinking away from the nails and getting loose.

I saw another deck where they used woven wire fencing, and yet another where they used cattle panels. Don't know if you inspector would like that though. Cattle panels wouldn't be bad looking, don't know if I'd care for the woven wire.

Glass would be a really expensive, although beautiful, option. It would have to be 8mm or 10mm thick glass, tempered, with beveled and polished edges. I used to work in the glass manufacturing and fabricating industry, and I'm here to tell you, that type of glass is very pricey! Most fabrication shops only deal with installers and contractors and don't sell to the general public.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I vote for the stainless wire. We have a friend that replaced the pickets in their deck railing with stainless wire. It is nearly invisible and makes the deck feel more a part of the outdoors. We really like it and have decided that is what we will do with our deck. I'd be willing to bet that with the size of your posts and the hardware you used to fasten them you won't need a top rail for strength and stability. Combine that with stainless wire and you will have a great view!
> 
> He bought 3/16" stainless wire rope in 100' rolls on MSC's website. I think he said it was a little over a dollar a foot, and he has over 1000 feet of it in his deck. So yeah, it is pricey, but he figures that he'll never have to replace it, unlike the pickets in his rail that were shrinking away from the nails and getting loose.
> 
> I saw another deck where they used woven wire fencing, and yet another where they used cattle panels. Don't know if you inspector would like that though. Cattle panels wouldn't be bad looking, don't know if I'd care for the woven wire.
> 
> Glass would be a really expensive, although beautiful, option. It would have to be 8mm or 10mm thick glass, tempered, with beveled and polished edges. I used to work in the glass manufacturing and fabricating industry, and I'm here to tell you, that type of glass is very pricey! Most fabrication shops only deal with installers and contractors and don't sell to the general public.


I was googlin last night, and it seems wire prices have come down, especially the hardware prices. I did a wire railing long ago, but owner paid for wire (they being Americans, just took a trip down south to source it).
I see I never took an after wire install pic...just the railing...lol.


















I've done a lot of glass railings. We have to use 4mm (min) tempered if we frame it in (no exposed edges). If we have exposed edges, 8mm tempered (min - usually thicker). Never dealt with the really thick glass, the stuff you talk about, as I never ran into someone with deep pockets or should I say, those willing to part with it...lol.

An example;











My local glass retailer has been pretty good about prices. Around $50 for standard size 4mm tempered (32" x 72"). Custom sizes almost double. The hassle is framing it in. I'd use 1/2"-3/4" roundover trim, on both sides, on all edges. Buying all that trim adds up. Just ball-parking it, but I'd need about 212 ft of trim. At around a $1/ft = $250.

I like a top rail, because I like to lean on something as I peer over the edge and to set my drink on. I'll stick on a sub-rail (2x4 right under top rail, but between posts) to keep posts from migrating towards each other, when using wire.

BTW - I use 5/8" bolts (not lags) and true 4"x4" posts for every railing, I've ever done (except for the odd cedar post railing). I get little railing flex with that setup. For glass trim, 16g SS brads for trim and Lexel clear window caulk (use lots). You get no glass rattle in windstorms. I've seen folks router notches in posts and railing to accommodate glass, but over time, the railing dries out, and you're left with a rattle.


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## oldtruckbbq

I like the look of the glass, just wouldn't want to have to keep it clean! I'm into low maintenance so I have time to do more productive things.


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## MoBookworm1957

I vote for wire.ire


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## melli

*Roof
*
Finally getting the roof on...even though the 'Titanium' underlay kept me dry for a year and half, something about having metal over-top one's head (reminds me, I ran out of tinfoil). I was hoping the order would be bundled into two units, but they created a monster cage, which nixed my idea of having a bundle craned up to second floor roof.

Metal roofing on a low slope shed roof is about as easy as one can get. Still, I had to put down some drip cap (lower edge), which made me a tad nervous. Roofing sucks the life out of me, as I am always tense on a roof, no matter how safe it is. Hopefully, I'll finish before the hot weather comes.

Ideally, it would have been nice to have the copper drip cap flashing below underlay, but that is life (well, I do have drip cap flashing below underlay, just not the copper flashing - just some cheap stuff).
This is a new supplier, as my go-to guy closed up shop. Looking good so far. BTW - 24g Copper Penny (stout with a top shelf finish).


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## melli

Continuing on with roof...got the 2nd floor roof done. It was my Achilles. Even though it is a low slope roof, it disturbs me (feels like I am standing on a 22ft high pedestal). Had to wear gym runners to avoid sliding.









You'll notice there is no exposed screws, except on trim (they call it Prolok 12" concealed fastener system). Although, this is taking me forever to put up, my hope is, I'll never have to climb up on it, ever again.










The above pic is showing the 'Profile Ridge Vent' (black mesh stuff tucked under ridge cap). It stops rain from splashing up under the ridge cap. Supposed to be bug/flame resistant, yet allows airflow (useful for gabled roofs). Miami-Dade county approved, so it must be ok. I read a lot of technical literature on building components, and it seems to me that a selling point is if Miami-Dade county approved it (i.e. withstand hurricane force winds). 

The profile ridge vent has notches cut into it every foot so it rides over metal roof ridges without pushing up ridge cap too much. Was lucky I found this stuff...figured I would be held up having it shipped from the city. My local lumber store had special ordered a stack of it, but the buyer bailed.

I used to get metal roofs from a different source, and the guy there would bend over the bottom edge of ridge cap. I would then notch the metal so the ridge cap seated down.
See example below:









It was tedious work notching ridge cap, but you can see that no rain will sneak under ridge cap (not suitable for gabled roofs where you need ventilation).

While I am on a roll blabbing about roofs, I took a pic of this one because the workmanship is sublime. They rolled over the bottom edge of roof, over the drip cap, so there will never be ice damming under roof. You can also see they closed off the ridges at bottom, so bugs nor water can get up there. I was debating doing that, but probably won't because I'll just mess up my roof...lol. My tin work is suspect.


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## MoBookworm1957

Looks fanastic


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## melli

Too many days on the roof messed me up. Started to get vertigo walking down my house stairs. A couple days removed from roof work, and I seem to be back to normal. Spent a rather leisurely day putting up exterior insulation (Roxul Comfortboard 80 - 2" thick - spun slag and basalt like an SOS pad, but denser). All wood frame sections of bunker get exterior insulation, so as to roughly match the ICF portion, in terms of R value. 
I framed up the wood sections (inset them 2") so the Comfortboard would be flush with ICF walls. This task was weighing on me, as it is something I've never done before. I had never touched Comfortboard until today. Pleasantly surprised to find it is rather stiff. It does compress, but bounces back to shape. I liked how it fit together (tight seams). 

BTW - a bread knife cuts it to size easily.


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## melli

Got the exterior insulation up, and am currently fiddling with Typar (house wrap). Slow going, as it involves working at height. Once I get house wrap on, then I can play with dual zone split air heat pump I bought (Senville 18kW). I got a spot for the compressor all set up (using now defunct electrical kiosk location). Thanks to 'Bobby', getting some boulders and dirt in place wasn't much of an issue. And 10 bags of concrete, have a nice pad for compressor unit. I do wish I had thought of extra conduit for split air heat pump...will have to rent a monster bit and drill through concrete wall.


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## melli

Got the split air heat pump hooked up. I do hope it lasts. Took a bit out of me, as there was a mix-up on parts I ordered (2wks to sort out), was the first time dealing with this sort of thing, and I had another electrical inspection in the middle of it. 

Drilled 7 holes in concrete wall to run all the copper lines and electrical wiring. Got a disconnect for heat pump, which turned out to be a fusible disconnect...doh! They look the same, but one requires fuses, while the other doesn't. Basically, you need a means of electrically disconnecting heat pump beside the unit. It doesn't have to be a breaker or fuse, just a switch rated for 20amps. The power supplying heat pump has a 20 amp breaker in main panel. Each head unit (2) requires a 4 conductor control line, and the one supplied was basically an extension cord which would probably cause some angst with electrical inspector, so I swapped it out with Teck cable (waterproof armored cable) I luckily had lying around. Note: might be ok for interior portion of run, but not for outside (need mechanical protection). 
I had to splice copper lines together for 2nd floor run, because of long run. Then, once hooked up (use Nylog gasket sealant), I had evacuate copper line sets. I was going to get an HVAC person in, but for $250, I bought a vacuum pump with hoses and gauges (what HVAC folks use). Lots of manual reading, and a few YouTube vids later, I got the system evacuated. 

These things should be mandatory up here. I've seen them in use all over the world, but not many in my hood. Very efficient, inverter tech (quiet) and none of that AC smell. I've only had this thing hooked up for a day, but looking at my electrical usage, I am 20-50% lower than previous days ($2.35 vs ~$3.35 - the $2.35 day includes a bath, which costs a $1). Better yet, my whole house is at the exact temp I set it. Was a tad chilly this morning, and the unit heat up my place in less than half the time of baseboard heaters. Speaking of which, they are now museum pieces. 


























Yes, I can turn off LEDs. It seems the prices have gone up for split air heat pumps...I bought mine a few months ago for $500 less. My setup was complicated/fussy, and I didn't want to mount compressor on side of house. Youtube vids make it seem so easy....


*Senville SENA-18MO-209 18000 BTU Dual Zone Split Air Conditioner and Heat Pump, Mini*
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00UV3LL1S/

*Kozyvacu Mini Split/HVAC/AUTO AC Repair Complete Tool Kit with 1-Stage 4.5 CFM Vacuum Pump, Manifold Gauge Set, Hoses and its Acccessories *
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B07MZ5T96H/


----------



## oldtruckbbq

I'm thinking a mini-split with 3 interior units would be perfect for our place. I won't need one that can heat because we are putting radiant heat in the floor and a wood stove for makeup heat if we need. I like not having to run all that ductwork in the ceiling. We are doing a shed roof with no attic, so running ductwork would be a challenge. Not having to deal with ductwork will make life so much easier.


----------



## melli

oldtruckbbq said:


> I'm thinking a mini-split with 3 interior units would be perfect for our place. I won't need one that can heat because we are putting radiant heat in the floor and a wood stove for makeup heat if we need. I like not having to run all that ductwork in the ceiling. We are doing a shed roof with no attic, so running ductwork would be a challenge. Not having to deal with ductwork will make life so much easier.


The difference between my portable AC unit, and the split air heat pump (SAHP) is night and day. The portable needed a hose to outside, which sucked in warm air from outside. The SAHP doesn't suck in outside air...just cools or heats inside air. Eventually, I will get a heat recovery ventilator or energy recovery ventilator, but for now, at least I am not sucking in forest fire smoke. We have some warm days coming up, will see how it performs. My 2 head unit seems to be easily handling my 1000sqft abode. I probably overshot the size of unit required for my home. Compressor rarely fires up to max. Compressor fan is moving so slow I can almost count revolutions. It is so quiet, I find myself walking up to head units to see if air is blowing.


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## oldtruckbbq

melli said:


> The difference between my portable AC unit, and the split air heat pump (SAHP) is night and day. The portable needed a hose to outside, which sucked in warm air from outside. The SAHP doesn't suck in outside air...just cools or heats inside air. Eventually, I will get a heat recovery ventilator or energy recovery ventilator, but for now, at least I am not sucking in forest fire smoke. We have some warm days coming up, will see how it performs. My 2 head unit seems to be easily handling my 1000sqft abode. I probably overshot the size of unit required for my home. Compressor rarely fires up to max. Compressor fan is moving so slow I can almost count revolutions. It is so quiet, I find myself walking up to head units to see if air is blowing.


The way you built your bunker, I'm sure that any unit will have a higher efficiency than if it were in a standard stick built home. That should make for more comfort for you and your wallet.


----------



## Nevada

melli said:


> *Senville SENA-18MO-209 18000 BTU Dual Zone Split Air Conditioner and Heat Pump, Mini*
> https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00UV3LL1S/
> 
> *Kozyvacu Mini Split/HVAC/AUTO AC Repair Complete Tool Kit with 1-Stage 4.5 CFM Vacuum Pump, Manifold Gauge Set, Hoses and its Acccessories *
> https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B07MZ5T96H/


While a vacuum pump is always nice to have, newer models of mini-split systems don't require one. The lineset connection fittings are low-loss. Just connect the lineset to the service valves, open the service valves, and turn on the system. Of course, follow the manufacturer's instructions that came with your system.

PS - Don't pay $2300 for an 18000 btu/hour mini split heat pump. This is more like it.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/362389755482

You're also paying about twice what you should for a single-stage vacuum pump. But as I pointed out, you shouldn't need one for a new mini split installation. I bought my vacuum pump off eBay and paid about $55, delivered.


----------



## melli

Nevada said:


> While a vacuum pump is always nice to have, newer models of mini-split systems don't require one. The lineset connection fittings are low-loss. Just connect the lineset to the service valves, open the service valves, and turn on the system. Of course, follow the manufacturer's instructions that came with your system.
> 
> PS - Don't pay $2300 for an 18000 btu/hour mini split heat pump. This is more like it.
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/362389755482
> 
> You're also paying about twice what you should for a single-stage vacuum pump. But as I pointed out, you shouldn't need one for a new mini split installation. I bought my vacuum pump off eBay and paid about $55, delivered.


Manufacturer was pretty clear about vacuuming lines. Since I didn't use a 'qualified' HVAC installer to install, no warrantee, but I wanted to cover my bases in case something went south. I do think it best not to mix atmospheric air in line-sets (I had 45ft worth). 
I should point out I didn't pay $2399 for a one head unit, but $1899 ($CDN) for a two head unit. I got my unit just before they jacked up the price for the summer crowd. Plus, they have a Canadian presence, which gave me free shipping. 

A month of use so far, and I can't complain. Doesn't matter what the weather is like outside, inside, I am exactly where I want to be, temperature wise. The most startling difference is my electrical bill. We have 'smart' meters, and can see the hourly usage, and rolling estimate for expected bi-monthly bill. My estimated bill for next billing cycle has been falling like a rock since I installed it (~30% decrease so far). 

Given, I am in Canada, by default, we seem to pay more for anything, including shipping. Prices I gave are in Canadian bucks. The vacuum pump selection was really based on reviews. I was mulling over a cheaper option, but it had too many negative reviews, and there was some chatter about it not having the R-410A fittings. 

Initially, I thought buying a 2-head unit was a bit of a splurge for my modest place, as I thought the air would circulate throughout house easily with a one head unit. I was wrong...Upstairs used to be the oven (warm air rises), and downstairs the cool zone. With heat pump, I can turn upstairs into a fridge, and downstairs just sits there at 70F. Figured cool air would descend...I seem to be creating an inversion in house, but with another head unit in living room, I can fix that disparity. 

My biggest worry is that I am getting dependent on my heat pump. My gosh, I remember just having a good fan and plenty of open windows was, supposedly enough. My heat pump better not let me down. Never lived in a place where temps were exactly what I wanted. I am getting too soft. Saw a neighbor the other day, and he was replacing his expensive rolling screen door. I was thinking I should get one...then I realized, it isn't a necessity anymore. I even wired my place for 2 ceiling fans, and even had a decent ceiling fan offered to me. I turned it down. Now, I am wondering, do I need ceiling fans...be more for show, than practical applications.


----------



## rebar

I'm humbled.. Beautiful.


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## Zoomyn

<bump>

90 days plus since last update... how goes it?


----------



## melli

Zoomyn said:


> <bump>
> 
> 90 days plus since last update... how goes it?


It goes good, thanks! Was letting this thread fade down the pages, since I don't really have much more to show per se, and I took the summer off (being in building and land development mode for 6 yrs wore me out). Drywall and siding are the two items left on the agenda for this build. I got hung up on siding options. Wanted to go with extruded aluminum 'Easy Trim' with Hardie flat panels, but sticker shock has pretty much nixed that idea. 

Bought a whack of metal roofing on the cheap...going to stick it on the underside of deck to give myself a dry space under deck. 









Got some gutters installed, and installed 4" PVC pipe to drain it far away from house...should I ever get motivated on siding, I won't get pelted by rain on low side. 










Noticed the heat pump in above pic...we went from full-on summer to fall in a few days, even reaching freezing for a few nights. My electric usage hasn't spiked, as it would with baseboard heaters. 

This a comparison with neighbors (light blue is my house);








And this is a comparison with last year usage (light blue is this year's usage);










It looks like I will incur ~$100/mth for electrical usage, which isn't all bad ($75 per month this past summer with heat pump in AC mode all the time). I have no gas appliances or wood stove. Was gung-ho to get a wood stove, but for the effort, I won't be saving much. And if we get a power outage, my genny can easily run the heat pump. We had one outage already...just 4hrs. My guilty pleasure is having cooling mode on at night in bedroom, because house doesn't cool down very well at night, then waking up and cranking on heat to warm up my mornings...lol.


----------



## Zoomyn

It is a pleasure to read & reread this thread, thank you for accommodating distant-folk by sharing your process! Remember it's not the big things that age people the most, it's just the normal hassles of everyday living that wear folks down - so maybe continued sharing here could be therapeutic eh?

I'd like to see how you approach under-deck water barrier, neighbor three lots up from me has near same layout as your raised deck complete with drip-festival lurking just outside the doorway...

Those usage comparison charts? In my neighborhood just this year they finally filtered out the 'Snow Bird' residences, I mean we are frugal but they kept touting neighbors were using half or less energy that made their charts useless. 

I'm curious where that 15-20kwh goes on your low-use days, well pump and... ?


----------



## melli

Zoomyn said:


> It is a pleasure to read & reread this thread, thank you for accommodating distant-folk by sharing your process! Remember it's not the big things that age people the most, it's just the normal hassles of everyday living that wear folks down - so maybe continued sharing here could be therapeutic eh?
> 
> I'd like to see how you approach under-deck water barrier, neighbor three lots up from me has near same layout as your raised deck complete with drip-festival lurking just outside the doorway...
> 
> Those usage comparison charts? In my neighborhood just this year they finally filtered out the 'Snow Bird' residences, I mean we are frugal but they kept touting neighbors were using half or less energy that made their charts useless.
> 
> I'm curious where that 15-20kwh goes on your low-use days, well pump and... ?


Low use days would be heat pump in cooling mode for a few hours (mild days), no washer/dryer, fridge, stove (a big consumer), computer/TV, landscape lights, HWT, DW, interior lights (all LEDs, so minimal energy usage). Well pump would turn on for about 10 minutes a day, so energy use would be minimal there. The HWT costs ~$1 per day (bath), which is the biggest energy consumer (stove 2nd). 

Yeah, going to try to avoid the drip-festival by having a gutter catch the water dripping off metal. Will have to put in sleepers of varying thickness's to get a slope on metal.


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## melli

Zoomyn said:


> ........
> Those usage comparison charts? In my neighborhood just this year they finally filtered out the 'Snow Bird' residences, I mean we are frugal but they kept touting neighbors were using half or less energy that made their charts useless.
> 
> ................


Yeah, I was wondering about that...specifically, grow-ops. Those places would blow up the average. They are probably on commercial accounts. My immediate neighbors are mostly full timers. 
One thing I do know, I am the only one without a wood stove or fireplace.


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## melli

After I got heat pump installed, I cocooned...lost a family member, then the pandemic hit. Repeatedly driving up to an unclad house began to irritate me. Lot of procrastination with siding options. Clad it in metal, no rain-screening required, but I am, more or less, stuck with color. I went with Hardi (12" wide), but that meant Rain-screening. The siding has to be at least 1/2" off wall to allow drying behind siding. With main floor being ICF, it is considered a 'mass wall', and no rain-screening required. But I failed to account for rain-screening on second floor (first floor flush with second floor), so I just rain-screened all of it. Absolute pain in the .... Felt like I was putting on siding twice. However, after months of fussing, it is almost done. 

I did all trim in metal (no rot for me...see how long the metal finish lasts). First pic shows rain-screening. I used 3/4" PT ply strips, aluminum bug screen above window.


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## Steve_S

Looking Good Meli.

As you know I also did a Rainscreen installation but used live edge Easter White Cedar with a 1" airflow space behind it. Ohh I am SO Happy with the result and the efficiency gain is certainly worth it. Because I used Bailey Boxes for the window & door openings I did not have to Bug/Critter screen for those spots. 

But sure enough I got a "Gotcha". Frappin Chipmunks ! The damned blighters found a hole and made it bigger, got behind the siding and into the inside of the soffits too, now that airspace acts like a freeway for Chippie's so now it's Critter Combat time... Today they will encounter the Nuclear Solution hahaha... Tobasco Sauce & Garlic Juice mixed with 25% water and strained into a sprayer... Anything the blighters have nibbled on and entry holes are going to get "DOSED" with "the juice". I've seen how well this works on a garden and Ohh Boy they HATE IT and COMPLAIN while running away from it.

You were smart to go with the Hardyboard, no squirrels or chipmunks will bother with it and the hard critter screening was well thought out. Might be a pain in the caboose to install all of it but in the end, you'll be really happy you did.


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## MoBookworm1957

melli said:


> After I got heat pump installed, I cocooned...lost a family member, then the pandemic hit. Repeatedly driving up to an unclad house began to irritate me. Lot of procrastination with siding options. Clad it in metal, no rain-screening required, but I am, more or less, stuck with color. I went with Hardi (12" wide), but that meant Rain-screening. The siding has to be at least 1/2" off wall to allow drying behind siding. With main floor being ICF, it is considered a 'mass wall', and no rain-screening required. But I failed to account for rain-screening on second floor (first floor flush with second floor), so I just rain-screened all of it. Absolute pain in the .... Felt like I was putting on siding twice. However, after months of fussing, it is almost done.
> 
> I did all trim in metal (no rot for me...see how long the metal finish lasts). First pic shows rain-screening. I used 3/4" PT ply strips, aluminum bug screen above window.
> 
> View attachment 90209
> 
> 
> View attachment 90208
> 
> View attachment 90207
> 
> View attachment 90210


Looks good Meli,


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## rebar

melli said:


> After I got heat pump installed, I cocooned...lost a family member, then the pandemic hit.


I'm sorry to hear about your lose..

Looks beautiful and like your on the home stretch. Be happy you've paid for everything because material costs have gone through the roof.. Makes me wonder if I'll ever be able to afford and start my retirement home.


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## melli

rebar said:


> I'm sorry to hear about your lose..
> 
> Looks beautiful and like your on the home stretch. Be happy you've paid for everything because material costs have gone through the roof.. Makes me wonder if I'll ever be able to afford and start my retirement home.


Yeah, material costs....I haven't bought a stick of wood since pandemic. 
Yesterday, I bought some 2x4s - 8' long. $9.71! Wow. I seem to recall pre-pandemic, I'd get 2x4 - 10' long for under $5. 
I've been told builders are now having to 'secure' their lumber at job sites. 
Well, once the DIY'ers run out of money or motivation, prices will come back down.


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## melli

I finally got some concrete around house. Spanish Gold is the color. I wanted it a touch browner, but I am warming up to color. Too dark, and I'd get depressed in winter.

The concrete finishers nailed it! Power troweled the carport and triple hand troweled the rest. So glad I got the carport power troweled until concrete ‘burned’. It is baby bottom smooth. I was warned too smooth is hazardous for one’s health in winter (slippery). I said it easier to make smooth concrete grippy, than to make a brush finish smooth. Glad I persisted. It is so easy to clean. I’ve since put a sealer on it. I can walk out my door with socks on. That was the prime directive. I might be a tad OCD with my dust mop. It really is easy to clean and wash. I have a floor squeegee. I can dry the pad in a minute. I am not finding it slippery at all.

I went a little heavy on rebar when forming up forms. The plus is when/if pad cracks, they will not grow in width.


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## melli

Got my first fruit tree planted (one of those Frankenstein apple jobs - each (4) branch is a different variety). It'll establish over winter. The 'cage' is for marauding deer. I do wish folks liked venison around here. They are like locusts. Unfortunately, my place in on their feeding circuit. Blueberries are in the other cage.


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## Farmerjack41

Good to hear from you. Been wondering if one of the local four legged bears got yea. Hope everything is going well up that way. Take care, know you folks have already had your Thanksgiving, we are about to have our locked down one just south of you.

Don't wait so long between posts. 

Take care

Jack


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## Hitch

The house looks great! I can’t believe it’s been 4 years. It must feel so nice to be done.


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## B&L Chicken Ranch and Spa

Very nice job, good luck to you!


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## Zoomyn

Remember on the"Frankenstein apple job" tree there is usually a fifth grafting, where the trunk is grafted on a robust root-stock... and I've seen that wound area to be the weakest spot on Northern trees...

So don't mulch around trunk, let sun & oxygen help keep fungus & blight away - watering the buried root ball with mild hydrogen peroxide water now should help keep surprises down in the next few years - and make sure there are pockets / slices of lime for roots to seek out if needed to wall off tiny infections...

Looking fine, fine, fine.... thanks for sharing!


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## melli

Novembers usually suck around here, but occasionally, between deluges, we get some sun.










Trying to finish interior...just the ceiling left! My hill-billy kitchen will have to be redone, but not necessary for final. Get that done, I can call for a FINAL (building final). Passed my electrical final (we won't discuss that). 
A neighbor joked if I was still at it (building the house), 10 yrs later, he'd worry. I figure it'll be about 5 years from breaking ground. 










Once I finish ceiling, I'll redo stairwell treads.


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## melli

Zoomyn said:


> Remember on the"Frankenstein apple job" tree there is usually a fifth grafting, where the trunk is grafted on a robust root-stock... and I've seen that wound area to be the weakest spot on Northern trees...
> 
> So don't mulch around trunk, let sun & oxygen help keep fungus & blight away - watering the buried root ball with mild hydrogen peroxide water now should help keep surprises down in the next few years - and make sure there are pockets / slices of lime for roots to seek out if needed to wall off tiny infections...
> 
> Looking fine, fine, fine.... thanks for sharing!


Oh, I did get about 7 apples this year! 
I've since planted a Granny Smith...my fav apple tree. 











I was so excited I got some apples, I sent this pic to my sis. She was mum on the fact she has a couple monster apple trees in her backyard. It was only when her husband sent a pic of his summer project (deck), I noticed her trees. We are talking two of the biggest apple trees I have ever seen in my life! I was killing myself laughing. 
A tree with hundreds of apples....possibly, a hundred on the ground. She did say it is a chore cleaning up around the tree. It'll be a while before I am saddled with that chore....😂


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## B&L Chicken Ranch and Spa

Nice apples! (It won't get away with that fence you've got there )


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## B&L Chicken Ranch and Spa

Zoomyn said:


> Remember on the"Frankenstein apple job" tree there is usually a fifth grafting, where the trunk is grafted on a robust root-stock... and I've seen that wound area to be the weakest spot on Northern trees...
> 
> So don't mulch around trunk, let sun & oxygen help keep fungus & blight away - watering the buried root ball with mild hydrogen peroxide water now should help keep surprises down in the next few years - and make sure there are pockets / slices of lime for roots to seek out if needed to wall off tiny infections...
> 
> Looking fine, fine, fine.... thanks for sharing!



H2O2 and lime wedges for trees? Interesting, I am going to look this up.


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