# AHB in Ohio??? (Trying to substantiate something I heard)



## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

I heard that the AHB is expected in Ohio this year. Anyone confirm this? The reason being that the bottom third of Flordia is populated by the AHB and that they begin pollinating with their travelling hives up this way.

Anyways, does anyone know if this is true or not? Links, anything?


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## james dilley (Mar 21, 2004)

The only thing I see here is A chance for the Beekeepers to lose. The A H B only travels about 50 miles A year. in their patterns, However there is A chance that they can be spread by migratory bee keepers .Thats Why most ststes require A permit before you can move hives from A H B areas to others. While there may be A chance it would be slim. On A side note The Bee lab in LA. Had imported A H B back in the 1960's to breed with the domestic stocks that were here.I gleaned that fact from Bee Source.


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## dcross (Aug 12, 2005)

Supposedly "african" queens were given out around Madison WI, too. 

I think it's more than the southern 1/3 of Florida. Pretty much any big outfit coming out of Florida probably has some african genetics in its hives. Just my opinion, take it for what it's worth.


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## james dilley (Mar 21, 2004)

In reality there Are few if ANY A H B 's in fla. The few that there are came off of ships. They have just this last yr. been reported near Mississippi. So they are spreading but the more they breed with whats here already they are gentling down. I mean when they first hit here in S. texas back in 94 they were meaner than all get out, But they are getting Calmer as time goes on.


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## dcross (Aug 12, 2005)

http://nationalatlas.gov/mld/afrbeep.html

Spread of africanized bees as of last year.


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## btai (Mar 3, 2006)

There's no way an africanized colony could survive a winter in ohio or anywhere a few hundred miles south of there anyways, so even if queens got there it wouldn't be that big of a deal


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

btai said:


> There's no way an africanized colony could survive a winter in ohio or anywhere a few hundred miles south of there anyways, so even if queens got there it wouldn't be that big of a deal


hmmm, the bee experts around here are not so sure of that. Why wouldn't they? Our bees do every year...


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## dcross (Aug 12, 2005)

Hives move all over the country from Florida, lots of queens are raised in Texas, California and Florida, they can lay a lot of eggs before winter hits.


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## btai (Mar 3, 2006)

africanized bees don't store up honey for winter supplies & africanized bees don't make "winter bees" in the fall with extra fats and lipids & other physiological differences to last 6 months. Dr DeJong doesn't believe they can survive in North Georgia, much less Ohio. If there's an Ohio expert with more AHB experience than DeJong then I'd listen to him.

here's a good way to look at it. In the tropics, africanized bees outcompete european because they're more suited to the climate. The bees in Brazil are actually MORE africanized than they were 20 years ago...because the more africanized bees outcompete less africanized bees. The same thing happens in temperate regions...european bees outcompete africanized bees and even if there were some africanized genetics in the mix, they would slowly become more and more european.

If africanized bees could survive in Ohio, why would they wait at the Oklahoma or Texas border for 16 years? They'd have spread there naturally. The reason they haven't is because they cannot survive temperate winters.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

Well, since my hometown is the home to A.I. Root and pretty much invented the modern bee industry as it is today, sometimes they know a thing or two about bees. From everything I read, it's a pretty even split on the experts. I suppose time shall tell.


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## btai (Mar 3, 2006)

Well, here's to hoping...

I figure Ohio's climate is probably fairly similar to Chile...and the AHB have had 50 years to spread to Chile and haven't done so. I bet the same tropic/temperate lines will be drawn in the US. I guess they already have above the SW states, but let's hope they stay.

ps. I'm not trying to downplay ohio beekeepers...just saying that DeJong is the one of the top experts in africanized bees in the western hemisphere(if not the top), so I give his assertion more credence


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## james dilley (Mar 21, 2004)

Hate to burst A bubble but as time goes by, The A H B will continue to cross breed with the E H B and then it will be able to survive thru the cold winters .But thoose in the north won't have to worry for A few decades at least.


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## btai (Mar 3, 2006)

Chile as a case study doesn't support that at all


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## dcross (Aug 12, 2005)

South America does seem to show that there isn't much hybridizing after a while, the AHB take over completely where they are suited to the climate.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

dcross said:


> South America does seem to show that there isn't much hybridizing after a while, the AHB take over completely where they are suited to the climate.


That's what I understood also. I think the "reports" of gentler AHB may be just the local populations learning to adjust to them.


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## dcross (Aug 12, 2005)

Yeah, Brazil is building a heck of a honey industry with AHB. All organic from what I understand. Definitely would end backyard beekeeping though.


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## Timber (Jun 15, 2003)

Zeal, as I'm in a little bit south of you haven't heard of anything.
Funny you stated this. On the felt issue, maybe a different story. I've caught two swarms yesterday. The same tree with the swarm sizes that of over inflated basketball. Got stung by some flyby loners, about 75 yards and about couple of hours of putting them in their boxes (hives). As of this morning all doing well, did feed them and treat them with wintergreen for mites. 
Maybe just a few hot headed Italians that could carry the label.. 

Timber


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