# Nesting box to rabbit size ratio?



## NorWester

How big are your nesting boxes compared to the rabbits you intend to use them with?

I picked up a used set of commercial cages and the nesting boxes wire up to the bottom of each cage and are about the size of a large shoe box. 
I've got a a couple of NZ Giant does I believe (hope) are bred and they can fit in the boxes but I wouldn't say it's spacious.


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## MaggieJ

I believe that kind of nest box is called a "drop-down nest box" and I've heard very good things about them. They need to be big enough for the doe to jump in and out without trampling the kits. From what you say, it *sounds* as though they may not be big enough for the giant does. Telling us the actual dimensions in inches and the weight of the does may help.


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## NorWester

I've never weighed a rabbit but the boxes are 40 cm by 22 cm by 14 1/2 cm 

Here's a couple of pics, let me know what you think.


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## MaggieJ

It does look a bit small. What worries me more is that except for a couple of inches at one end, the kits are right in the landing zone. If you made a box that was maybe 8 inches longer than the hole, the kits could be up under the wire where the doe wouldn't step on them. Much like the hood protects them in a conventional nest box.

I hate centimeters. Let's see... 40 cm by 22 cm by 14 1/2 cm would be about 16 inches by 9 inches by 6 inches. That's pretty close to standard size, but with your does being so big, I'd be afraid that it could be a problem.


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## NorWester

That's my daughter doing the measuring....lolol.... kids these days, eh?

Anyway, thanks for your thoughts, I was concerned it might be too small.


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## brody

great question ... it does look small doesn't it ...


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## NorWester

Another nesting box question.... what's the reasoning behind putting the nexting box in with the expectant doe *only* just before she is to have her litter?
I've noticed some comments where specific dates are listed as to when the box should go in and out. Is there a reason one just wouldn't leave the nesting box indefinitley?


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## Guest

NorWester said:


> Another nesting box question.... what's the reasoning behind putting the nexting box in with the expectant doe *only* just before she is to have her litter?
> I've noticed some comments where specific dates are listed as to when the box should go in and out. Is there a reason one just wouldn't leave the nesting box indefinitley?


I do it for 3 reasons.
1) To keep them from using the nest box as a litter box
2) To allow for better ventilation
3) To allow for more cage space

If I had a setup with permanently attached nestboxes, I'd figure out a way to block off the entrance to the box except when necessary.


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## arachyd

I've noticed that my rabbits like to use whatever I put in their cages but not necessarily the way I intended. I no longer offer a nest box. If they have the nest box too soon they WILL use it as a toilet. They won't just ignore it. By the time the babies come they will either have them on the wire out of the nest box because it is dirty or they will not care and have them in the nest box and continue to use it as a toilet making it a filthy place to raise a litter. I give mine enough good hay to keep any babies off the wire and the doe will make a nest. When she kindles I pack more hay up around the nest so it looks like a mini volcano. The pulled fur helps hold the hay together. It does waste some hay but I've never lost a baby on the wire.


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## farmmom

The nestboxes I have for my Cali's are 16"x12"x12", which may not be right, but they work well.


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## Lazy J

NorWester said:


> I've got a a couple of NZ Giant does .....


What is a NZ Giant? I have never heard of a NZ Giant only NZ White, Red, or Black.

Jim


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## jkmlad

I hate to disaggree... but that nest box looks plenty big for a NZ and a litter. The problem with a bigger box is that mom can go in when she isn't nursing and foul it. That doe will have plenty of room to get in, nurse, clean, and get back out. Helpful hint. Take those boxes off, give them a good scrub down or power wash, and spray them with a bleach solution to get them ready for the new kits. In answer to a previous question, there is not a NZ Giant. I don't think your rabbits are giants, I think they are NZs.


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## Devoville

What I wonder is if those bungee cords will hold a doe and litter of 8 @ 2weeks? thats a lot of weight!


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## MaggieJ

jkmlad said:


> I hate to disaggree... but that nest box looks plenty big for a NZ and a litter. The problem with a bigger box is that mom can go in when she isn't nursing and foul it. That doe will have plenty of room to get in, nurse, clean, and get back out. Helpful hint. Take those boxes off, give them a good scrub down or power wash, and spray them with a bleach solution to get them ready for the new kits. In answer to a previous question, there is not a NZ Giant. I don't think your rabbits are giants, I think they are NZs.


You may be right about the nest box size. My main concern is that in jumping down the doe may land on the kits... and that this would be more difficult for her to avoid in a box that size. In a regular nest box there is a hood that provides some protection. 

As far as does soiling nest boxes because of the larger size... I've never seen any indication that size of box is a factor. Some soil and some do not. I believe that their early training by momma has a lot more to do with it.

I took New Zealand Giant to simply mean they were larger than average NZs. I certainly have never heard of such a breed.


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## Guest

I, too, think the box itself is plenty big for a NZ . My nest boxes are 15X10 and have plenty of room for a 12 lbs doe and have had up to 12 babies in there at once. The only problem I have with those cages, is that the opening is not big enough. I think the opening should be as big as the box. 

Also, IF those are only attached by bungee cords, they could easily be removed when not in use. Also, how can just a bungee hold a 12 lb doe and a litter? You would think it would sag with them in it. How do the commercial producers who use this type of nest box attach them to the cage?


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## NorWester

I'm pretty sure the bungee cords will hold. The rabbits are heavy.......but not that heavy. I've pulled those cords tight....very difficult to budge those boxes once in place. The fellow I got the cages from told us that's how he did it. Hopefully it works.

As far as the terminology I was just going by what I'd heard, I think. Perhaps there is no such critter as a New Zealand "Giant"........ Maybe just New Zealands and I misunderstood. 
Jeezus...... I hope they're rabbits and not muskrats or something:shrug: 

I fabbed up a bigger nesting box and will put up some pictures later. I have noticed that when I just pop a nesting box in the cage without rigging it to the bottom the rabbits will hop in and hang out in it. Once rigged to the bottom port like designed they tend to ignore it...... not sure why that is and I hope they don't ignore it when the have their pups.

jkmlad & Lyndseyrk I hope you're right, I'm a horrible carpenter and wasn't looking forward to building a slew of bigger nesting boxes.


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## vmos

NorWester said:


> I've never weighed a rabbit but the boxes are 40 cm by 22 cm by 14 1/2 cm
> 
> Here's a couple of pics, let me know what you think.


The boxes look great but I am concerned that they are taking away from her habitat space. My husband built our boxes on the side of the cage with sliding doors so we can open it when she needs to use it and close when not needed. they have lifting lids inorder to insure live births and can use it also when it is time to wean. We use small wire so her pellets will drop threw and add hay when the time is right. It seems to still give her the space she needs with an added extra room for baby time.
I think your bungie idea will work but I am concerned about her jumping down into the box with the babies. I think they feel more secure in an inclosed area where she has some privacy similar to her natural underground way of life.


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## vikav

vmos said:


> My husband built our boxes on the side of the cage with sliding doors so we can open it when she needs to use it and close when not needed. they have lifting lids inorder to insure live births and can use it also when it is time to wean. We use small wire so her pellets will drop threw and add hay when the time is right. It seems to still give her the space she needs with an added extra room for baby time.


I'd so loooove to see pictures of your nest boxes. I've been thinking about building some that would attach on the side, with slider doors, but have no idea where to start. My nest boxes are driving me crazy







. My does think they are toys to be tossed around.


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## MaggieJ

vikav said:


> My nest boxes are driving me crazy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . My does think they are toys to be tossed around.


I was thinking about this. I know you prefer the metal boxes because they are easier to sanitize, but perhaps if they sat inside a simple wooden frame made of 2x4s, they would be more stable. The wood would also provide a bit of a step back up for those precocious popples who pop out early. Just an idea...


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## vikav

MaggieJ said:


> I was thinking about this. I know you prefer the metal boxes because they are easier to sanitize, but perhaps if they sat inside a simple wooden frame made of 2x4s, they would be more stable. The wood would also provide a bit of a step back up for those precocious popples who pop out early. Just an idea...


Good idea. I think, I can modify those boxes by attaching several clips or something like that to each corner on the bottom of the boxes, so these clips or whatever can protrude down through the floor wire and anchor the box in place, without attaching it permanently. The does can't lift the boxes, only push them around, so that should work, and I could just lift the box out of the cage if I need to. BTW, you should see those two crazy kits now. They climb out of the box easily now, even when there is no bedding in it  I think, it's because they are just big for their age, because there is only two. It doesn't happen in bigger litters, as the kits are a bit smaller. I wanted to leave the box with the doe this morning, so did a test to see if the kits can handle the wire by putting them on the floor of the cage. Nope . Their poor feet just fall right through, and the doe tries to push them around like that, threatening to rip their poor stuck feet off. I've tried the cardboard thing, and decided against it, as the doe's pee was collecting in places and dripping around onto the floor. The whole thing was kinda gross. I'm just going to have to keep bringing them to her for feedings for several more days. They seem to be growing well, and she is feeding them whenever I bring them to her. In fact, she has become very friendly now, lets me pet her, does not attack me any more, even if I handle her kits right inside her cage. Oh, and the kits have now completely opened their eyes and have been trying to munch a little on some hay. 

And my NZR doe is such a lazy butt. At feeding time, she pushes her nest box to the feeder, so she can eat without having to get out of the box.  What a character :cute:

Before I had these nest boxes, I wanted some of the Extrona ones. Unfortunately, I couldn't find any anywhere.  Still looking.


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## NorWester

vmos wrote,



> The boxes look great but I am concerned that they are taking away from her habitat space


With these larger does that was a concern of mine too, so I cut out the dividing wall into the next cage. Gives them double the amount of space to move around in, appox 4 feet in length and just over 2 feet wide. One less cage but that's ok.
As for the nesting boxes they have been working out great (knock on wood). The original size IS plenty big enough. The does don't "jump" in and out, they hop on over to the box and simply nestle in to nurse and then casually wander off again. 
I lined the boxes with some hay and of course the does lined it with fur also. Could the kits pop out? Possibly, but so far they haven't and in the event that they do I'm thinking they'll have decent chance at getting back in due to the top of the box being at wire level, no wall to overcome.

The bungee cords hold perfectly, no budge or give and when all is said and done I'll detach the boxes and let down the hinged floor and it becomes a regular cage again. 

I've got three litters on the go right now and expecting another shortly. Haven't lost a kit yet (again, knock on wood).
So far it's been easy enough that I'm growing increasingly suspicious by the moment.

Here's some updated pics.

After cutting out the dividing wall without the nesting box hooked up.










Here's with the box hooked up and new litter



















Now here's a shot of a bigger box I built. It works fine too, used on our mini rex litter. Truth be told it's big enough to hold 2 does and their litters now that I've witnessed it's application.


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## Guest

Love what you've done to the cages! It's great they have more room now, and as suspected, the boxes are perfect size. Great idea with the hinged wire floor to put up when the nestbox is gone. The new box is HUGE!


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## NorWester

I'd like to take credit for the hinged wire floor...... but the cages came like that. Someone must have known what they were doing

Yeah, that new nesting box is definitely a "double wide"...lol


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## MaggieJ

I had some worries about the set-up, I admit, but I'm _*very glad*_ to hear they turned out to be groundless and that the cages and nestboxes are working out so well! :goodjob:


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## NorWester

I *still* have worries, but so far so good. 

thanks to everyone for the input :clap:


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## vikav

Looks great


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## o&itw

It seems as you have already figured out they will work OK. Many people use those kind of boxes comercially, with good success. I think some of then are set up with wort of a "drawer" approach where there are rails that are suspended from the bottom of the cage and the box slides in like a drawer. 

I like the modification that you made with the larger netstbox offset from the back.

The suggestion that I would make, is that you get some plastic wire edging (Bass, Klubertanz, and most suppliers carry it) and cover the edge of the wire leading down into the nest box.  Rabbits can usually deal with sharp wire ends, but sooner or latter, one of them will get snagged. This kind of edging is usually put around door openings. is usually put around doors. 

Your doors have looped wire ends, which is OK, but would be safer if you would pull the end of the wire straight out away from the cage and cut it off flush. (The end of the wire would be pulled through the holes in the wire till it is pointing straight at you.. it will circle the vertical edge wire like an eyelet) Actually, what is easiest, is to figure how much wire will be needed to curl it outward, and cut it off before you curl it around with the pliers. That way when you curl it around, the end will be pushed down against the wire flush.

I'm glad you got rid of the dividers, those were pretty small cages for rabbits that large.


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## viper125

Making mine like this too! But Will add a board around the top to rest on cage floor the whole way around. And just lift out when not needed. Then add a wire temporary 1/2 x 1 wire panel over top of hole with zip ties. But my boxes are 10" high x 13"" long.
Soon as my set up is moved i will add some permanent pens 2 x 4 for nesting does. But for now my cages i make are all 24 x 30 or 24 x 36. And they all seem ok with it.



vmos said:


> The boxes look great but I am concerned that they are taking away from her habitat space. My husband built our boxes on the side of the cage with sliding doors so we can open it when she needs to use it and close when not needed. they have lifting lids inorder to insure live births and can use it also when it is time to wean. We use small wire so her pellets will drop threw and add hay when the time is right. It seems to still give her the space she needs with an added extra room for baby time.
> I think your bungie idea will work but I am concerned about her jumping down into the box with the babies. I think they feel more secure in an inclosed area where she has some privacy similar to her natural underground way of life.


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## GraceAlice

Oh I love how big your cages are! I need some of those for quarantine, lol! Nice nest boxes too, I like the more natural option since rabbits are used to going _down_ and digging, not hopping _into_ and digging or nest building.

My nest boxes easily weigh 20 pounds at least. I like my does to have LOTS of room... my boxes look like they are built for godzilla. I can't even fit them through a cage door. lol


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## GraceAlice

Also, please excuse the buck in his cage, just a few more days and he will have his new 4x4' pen ready for him. I'm selling most of my adults and then he will have his new place. He hasn't been in there for very long.


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## redneckswife

I've had removable nestboxes,permentantly attached nestboxes(wouldn't recommend that to anyone ever)...and the drop downs.(some removable and some not)..I like the drop downs for bunnies in a sheltered environment (like a barn,etc.). I actually like the drop downs best for the smaller size breeds(nd,lops,lionheads) but that is just personal preference.

I wound up selling a 4 hole heavy galv. cage with a drop down nestbox in each cage for $40(they were a steal at that price...hubby got tired of mowing around them)....People called about that for 3 weeks after it had sold and I removed the listing, so obviously there are a lot of people out there that have interest in them...now I wish I would of kept them..afterall a girl can never have to many cages:thumb:


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## wamplercathy

I have seen several different types of nest boxes. Metal, wood, wire, solid floor, slotted floors, wire w/cardboard. I live in the northwest corner of Missouri and was wanting to know which box is better for my area. I plan to raise Californians for personal consumption. Any and all advice is appreciated.


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## Jack Burton

Your area can get pretty cold so during the winter a box that will retain heat is best. That is almost always a wood box. They are simple to knock together and are cheap if you use existing lumber. 

I use a wire floor that does well in the summer with letting out excessive heat (and baby bunnies can generate a surprising amount) and then line it with several layers of cardboard for the cold months. It works well for me but some momma bunnies are diggers and will scratch thru the cardboard if it is on top of the wire instead of below it. Sharp claws help with that project. 

Wood boxes are harder to keep clean between kindlings. They should be scrubbed and bleached. Some folk just knock together cardboard boxes and throw them away after the babies leave the nest. 

Metal boxes get cold in the winter and hot in the summer.


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## wamplercathy

Thank you. Up here it can be 75* today and 37* tomorrow.


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