# 100% canning newbie



## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

I would like to start by saying that I searched through some of the topics and didn't find exactly what I was looking for, so if this has been asked before (I'm sure it has been), then I apologize!

I currently live in an apartment and am interested in starting to learn some skills. I have been interested in canning for awhile and I have looked up some info. online but am having a hard time finding a step-by-step walk-through for begginers. I literally need everything spelled out for me.

I do not have money or space for fancy equiptment (small apartment, crappy job), but I have heard that it can be done as long as I have a pot deep enough to submerge jars in boiling water. My plan was to use that method until I can afford an actual canning "machine" or whatever you call it. My biggest pot is maybe 6 inches deep so I was going to start with smaller jars.

I know that I need the pot, the jars with 2 part lids, a set of canning tongs and a canning rack (what is that)? I would absolutely love if someone has the time and patience to write out step-by-step directions. Or give me a link to a good site.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Also, is a pressure cooker the same as a pressure canner?

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## kentuckyhippie (May 29, 2004)

ok a rack is to keep the jars from setting directly on the bottom of the kettle. the water has to be able to circulate under the jars while it is boiling or the jars will break. you will need a kettle a lot taller than 6 inches because the water needs to cover the jars by at least one inch a tall stock pot or soup pot would work for pint jars. a pressure cooker is not the same as a pressure canner. only a pressure canner will get to a high enough pressure to sterilize the food so you don't get food poisoning. the best book for a new canner is the Ball Blue Book. Walmart carries them or your library may have a copy. they have very simple instructions about canning almost everything. hope this helps. anymore questions just ask. all of us on here were newbies at one time so we are glad to pass on info to anyone who asks


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## hercsmama (Jan 15, 2004)

Here is a great site to help you get going. http://www.freshpreserving.com/getting-started.aspx
As was mentioned, a pressure cooker, and a pressure canner are two totally separate things.
Alot of people start out just doing high acid foods in a Boiling Water Bath,(BWB). For this all you need is a deep stock pot, some sort of rack to keep the jars from touching the bottom, jars, lids and rings, and that's all.

I have used a small round cooling rack that fits in a pot for my rack. 
When I first started all I had was a 15 qt. pot, and that cooling rack. Now I've got 4 pressure canners, various sizes, thousands of jars, 3 BWB canners, and two propane camp stoves that I use .
Be careful, canning can become as addictive as Knitting!!! :teehee:
Good luck and have fun!


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Buy The Ball Blue Book and read it.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

What types of foods are high enough in acid to be safest to do the boiling water method? And where would I find a pressure canner?

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## Ms.Lilly (Jun 23, 2008)

Exactly what Kristinemomof3 said!!!!

Go get a Ball Blue Book. It is less than 10 dollars and will give you step by step instructions. Explain high and low acid foods and lots of other important stuff.

A pressure canner is for canning and cooking. A pressure cooker is for cooking only.


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## standles (Apr 12, 2013)

Great responses. I started of focused on water bath canning as it was easiest and cheapest to get started with. Ball Blue book is an excellent start. As for materials all you need is something like this..

Waterbath Canner set


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Also sbcanning.com is a great SAFE site. Not all recipes you find on the internet are safe.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Kristinemomof3 has great advice and do be careful of a lot of canning stuff you find on the web. Feel free to post here and ask if something is safe or not.

http://nchfp.uga.edu/ I don't know why this site doesn't come up in searches, I didn't find it until someone here posted it. This has a good home study course on canning, but it takes a while for them to get you set up for it. But you can find lots of directions and info here. 

I use a stock pot with a rack for water bath canning. You can probably find a used one at yard sales or a big speckled water bath canner. But since you are just starting on this homesteading path I suggest a stock pot. There's no way to make homemade stock or soups in a 6 inch deep pan! You can get an insert for the stock pot that is great for cooking pasta and steaming things. You will get lots of use out of it.


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## Homesteader (Jul 13, 2002)

I recommend you begin with only the recipes that are found on the usda site, or Ball Blue book at first. That way you know you are safe.

Simple thing to understand first, is generally, your fruits, jams, jellies and juices are waterbath canned. This is because, they are higher acid foods, and certain bacteria cannot live in those ph levels.

Meats and veggies, and mixes of those, are pressure canned. This is because they are low acid, and more bacteria, including botulism, can live in those environments, and also, it takes very high temps to kill them. Only when pressure is applied can those temps be achieved!

Tomatoes are that odd, weird, is it a fruit or a veggie? Right now the approved method is to water bath can them with extra acid (lemon juice or citric acid) added to assure they are acidic enough for water bath canning.

DO NOT automatically assume what you read even here on this forum is correct. I have seen improper canning suggestions here, which later were responded to to point out why they were wrong. But for a few days, they stood as being "okay", and if you or anyone else new to canning had not come back to read the subsequent posts correcting it, you might have done something unsafe. 

If you mess up an indoor garden, no biggie. If you do your canning wrong you could kill someone. Big difference.

It's not hard to understand, just be sure you don't do it without having that understanding first.

Your first step, determine what your altitude is where you live. This is important because water does not boil at 212F everywhere. The altitude affects the temperature. This will also determine how many pounds of pressure you will can your pressure canned foods at.

Yes you will need some supplies of course. One of the biggest mistakes newbies make when purchasing the stock pot is they get one that is not high enough. You have to have the appropriate amount in inches of a rolling boil over the tops of the jars. Pints are easier to cover of course, as the jars are shorter. Quarts though, are much taller.

When you measure, remember to account for the "rack" that you will have in the bottom, plus the height of the jars when sitting on that rack, then, at least an inch or two above that. A rolling boil is that mean, scary, oh-my-gosh-it's going to come out of the pot and attack me kind of boil. You don't want that to spill out over the pot, and when you do water bath canning, you can those jars with that very rolling boil going on. So do choose your pot carefully.

The other difficult thing for newbies is, there are still many conflicting "directions" floating out there. Some people do their canning with old methods, and you often hear comments such as "well I've never killed my family", or, grandma never killed anyone, etc. Only you can decide if it was luck that saved them.

If you go with science, you have no problem, just follow the usda's current guidelines for canning.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

How would I find out my altitude and how to adjust cooking accordingly? I want to start with jelly/jam if that makes a difference.

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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Tmama said:


> How would I find out my altitude and how to adjust cooking accordingly? I want to start with jelly/jam if that makes a difference.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


I saw a link from one of the main canning sites, but now I can't find it! If you put your town into NOAA weather, when the weather comes up it lists the altitude under the little map picture on the right. 

I'm just a word search would bring it up as well.

All the canning guides listed above will have tables for altitude adjustment.


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## JamieCatheryn (Feb 9, 2013)

This site has good step by step recipes and info http://www.pickyourown.org/


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Would pumpkin be ok to do in boiling water? Want to make pumpkin jelly =)

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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

No, pumpkin is a low acid food. It can only be pressure canned in chunks. Pumpkin butter is too dense to can in either a hwb or pc'er.


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## kkbinco (Jun 11, 2010)

Tmama said:


> How would I find out my altitude


Easy way is to go to the NOAA site, enter your City and State. You'll see your elevation on the right side above the forecast info.



Tmama said:


> how to adjust cooking accordingly? I want to start with jelly/jam if that makes a difference.


http://www.freshpreserving.com/tools/reference/adjust.aspx


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

First, welcome to the wonderful world of home canning and food preservation.

Others have recommended the Ball Blue Book, and that is a great resource. Others have provided links to some good sites.

You can think of canning as the gateway drug to being a kitchen gadget fiend. Peelers, choppers, slicers, jar handling gizmos, not to mention pressure canners. After that, you will want dehydrators, then vacuum sealers.

After that you will want to learn how to make sausage so you will want a meat grinder. Then a sausae stuffer. A smoker...

Then you will start reading the ingredient labels of packaged food and you will realize that you have no clue what that stuff is that you are putting in your body. You will start growing a bigger and bigger garden. 

Then you will want animals.

You start with chickens.

Chickens are the gateway drug to the farming lifestyle.


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

But getting back...

Start with something easy to can. It may not be great, but consider trying some basic jam. Not the best time of year, but consider buying some frozen berries. It is easy to make and fun to can.


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## wannalive (Aug 29, 2013)

Tmama said:


> I would like to start by saying that I searched through some of the topics and didn't find exactly what I was looking for, so if this has been asked before (I'm sure it has been), then I apologize!
> 
> I currently live in an apartment and am interested in starting to learn some skills. I have been interested in canning for awhile and I have looked up some info. online but am having a hard time finding a step-by-step walk-through for begginers. I literally need everything spelled out for me.
> 
> ...


sorry buddy, but without the proper equipment, you just cannot do it...and no.. the deep pot with boiling water, is called water bath canning... and NO it WONT work for MOST foods, http://www.freshpreserving.com/home.aspx here is a good place to start... and I highly recommend getting the ball blue book guide to home preserving.. its like the canning bible..


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## wannalive (Aug 29, 2013)

Tmama said:


> How would I find out my altitude and how to adjust cooking accordingly? I want to start with jelly/jam if that makes a difference.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


what I do is this.. in the ball book.. it will give you the pressure and time for the altitudes... I always pick the highest pressure and longest time. and not worry about altitude...


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Ball Blue Book.

Check it out at your local library or Lowes has them 50% off right now.
Go to your state/county's extension site.
They will have oodles of hand outs / web pages you can reference.
They may even have a 'club' where women get together and can food.
4-H would be great for the kids too!!


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Kristinemomof3 said:


> No, pumpkin is a low acid food. It can only be pressure canned in chunks. Pumpkin butter is too dense to can in either a hwb or pc'er.


So would it be possible to make the pumpkin jelly and then just eat it within a certain amount of time? I know it's made because there are recipes floating around out there but if it can't be canned then I'm just wondering if there is still a way to do it. 

With Halloween coming up, we have a ton of pumpkins and I wanted to try something different this year =)

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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Tmama said:


> So would it be possible to make the pumpkin jelly and then just eat it within a certain amount of time? I know it's made because there are recipes floating around out there but if it can't be canned then I'm just wondering if there is still a way to do it.
> 
> With Halloween coming up, we have a ton of pumpkins and I wanted to try something different this year =)
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


You should be able to make pumpkin jelly and keep it in the fridge.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Tmama, I had an idea from reading your post in the main forum that has nothing to do with canning. Making yogurt at home is pretty easy and doesn't involve a huge investment in equipment. If your family eats yogurt daily you can also save a ton of money. There are a million and one ways to make yogurt at home, I'm sure you could find one that would work with what you have on hand. There are some yogurt threads in the dairy forum. 

And you can make delicious flavored yogurt for the kids with your homemade jam!


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Vosey said:


> And you can make delicious flavored yogurt for the kids with your homemade jam!


Pumpkin yogurt!? Lol, yum! I will have to look into that, thanks so much!



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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Many of you have mentioned the Ball Blue book. I looked it up on Amazon and Walmart and didn't find it at all on Walmart's sight but Amazon had several different editions pop up. I didn't find a website for Ball. Is there a specific edition I should get, or just the newest one? 

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## cntrywmnkw (Jun 5, 2013)

Tmama said:


> Many of you have mentioned the Ball Blue book. I looked it up on Amazon and Walmart and didn't find it at all on Walmart's sight but Amazon had several different editions pop up. I didn't find a website for Ball. Is there a specific edition I should get, or just the newest one?
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


There are several ball canning books, but the one you want, especially, to start is called: Ball Blue Book; guide to preserving. I have it & as others have said, it's almost like your canning bible, it has recipes & detailed instructions PLUS step by step pictures. It's not expensive, especially on Amazon.


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## kkbinco (Jun 11, 2010)

You'll want the newest one as recipes evolve over time.

Ball's website is http://www.freshpreserving.com and they offer the Blue Book here.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Thank you so much! Any one have any recommendations for pressure canners? Brand, size, anything like that? 

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## standles (Apr 12, 2013)

You will get many replies.

I will simply state that I have used many and once I got my American Canner I fell in love with it.

I have the 930 Model. It is large and I use it outside on a fish cooker.

I would not recommend one that large to just start with but one of the smaller ones is great. You can pressure can and water bath can in them.

Not dinging any other brands as thier supporters will surely be long shortly. :icecream:

Steven


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

A Mirro or Presto will work just as well and you can get one for under $100.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Tmama said:


> Thank you so much! Any one have any recommendations for pressure canners? Brand, size, anything like that?
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


Uh oh, the great canner debate starts again! 

I love my All American smaller sized 915, but they are pricey. It'll last a lifetime but if it's not in your budget many people love their Mirro or Presto. The AA is made in the USA. 

Then there's the debate about starting large or small. I'm an advocate for starting small, you can always get a bigger one when you have your huge garden and homestead. Many people have 2 sizes. Since you're in an apartment small probably makes the most sense! And if you have a flat top stove you need to make sure you can can on it. 

I use my pressure canner all winter to can chili, stew, beans, taco meat, meatballs etc to have on hand for "fast food".


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

I was just saying that not everyone may have the money to spend on an AA canner. In the end, they all do the same job. No debate, just options. I have 2 Mirro, one that was a gift & one that was a garage sale find for $10. We are a single income family and so that worked for us. It doesn't have to be expensive to get started.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Kristinemomof3 said:


> I was just saying that not everyone may have the money to spend on an AA canner. In the end, they all do the same job. No debate, just options. I have 2 Mirro, one that was a gift & one that was a garage sale find for $10. We are a single income family and so that worked for us. It doesn't have to be expensive to get started.


Oh, I didn't mean you were starting a debate, just that we have had so many threads on canners, everyone feels pretty passionate about the one they have! Sort of like what's the best homestead dog : )


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Vosey said:


> Uh oh, the great canner debate starts again!


Ooops, sorry, didn't meant to start a debate haha =):fussin:


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Vosey said:


> Sort of like what's the best homestead dog : )


Uh o, now I wanna know the answer to that!! lol


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

I looked at all 3 brands mentioned. The All American cheapest, smallest one I found was $170, Mirro around $70 and Presto around $80.

I asked earlier in the thread if there was a difference between a pressure cooker and a pressure canner and I got an answer. I have another question concerning that. On Walmart's website, it lists some as pressure cooker/canner. Are there some that do both?


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

O found a 16 quart Presto for $66. I guess I will have to do my research ha?! So when you guys/gals talk about the different sizes, what would be considered small and big? Someone mentioned earlier the importance of the pot height for water bath canning, would a 16 quart be tall enough? Sorry I'm asking so many questions I'm sure you all have answered so many times before! Thanks for all your patience and advice!!


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## CountryCabin (Mar 8, 2007)

You sound as if your geared in to canning and if you are, soon you will want not only a pressure canner but one for water bath canning. 

So I would recommend buying one for water bath canning as well. They are not expensive and then the guess work for you is gone as to 'how high'. 
Plus you will have the rack with it as well and they are not expensive.

Good luck on your future canning.

Might I suggest you start thinking of building shelves..and then more shelves..and more. :whistlin:


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

CountryCabin said:


> Might I suggest you start thinking of building shelves..and then more shelves..and more. :whistlin:


Unfortunately I can't build any shelves in my apartment but might be able to set something up in our little storage locker/garage. But that is not tempurature controlled and our winters get really cold and summers get pretty hot...is there a certain temp. you should store your canned items at?

Also, some pressure canners say that they can be used for water bath canning also, so they are kinda 2 in 1? Or you mean buy a seperate water bath canner?


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Some can be used as a cooker/canner. You just can't use one as a canner that only says cooker. Also, if you don't seal it completely, you can use it as a waterbath. Just make sure, waterbath gets submerged completely when canning and pressure canning is inly a few inches of water.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Kristinemomof3 said:


> Some can be used as a cooker/canner. You just can't use one as a canner that only says cooker. Also, if you don't seal it completely, you can use it as a waterbath. Just make sure, waterbath gets submerged completely when canning and pressure canning is inly a few inches of water.


And that ball blue book explains all that all?! Thanks!


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## CountryCabin (Mar 8, 2007)

Tmama said:


> Unfortunately I can't build any shelves in my apartment but might be able to set something up in our little storage locker/garage. But that is not tempurature controlled and our winters get really cold and summers get pretty hot...is there a certain temp. you should store your canned items at?
> 
> Also, some pressure canners say that they can be used for water bath canning also, so they are kinda 2 in 1? Or you mean buy a seperate water bath canner?


Tmama , Yes I meant another one, for water bath only. 
While the pressure canner is going, you can do your jams in the water bath one.

I store my canning in a back bdrm that I erected free standing shelves all long the back wall. I put a drape over the works to keep the light from them. Plus I didn't want it out for show and tell. 

The room is not heated but never freezes as I heat with wood stove only, in another room. 
If it gets to near freezing, I opened the door a wee bit.

As to the shelves. Keep an eye out a building/lumber/hardware stores and be prepared to grab them when they come on sale.

I have bought the steel (free standing) ones that are very sturdy and takes less room space then building with wood. The steel ones are well worth the money, as you can always add on and they will last a life time.

You can also lower/raise the shelves on them. Found that to be very handy.
Mainly if you are doing more pints then quarts...where you need less space between the shelves.

Hope that explains it a little better.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

CountryCabin said:


> Plus I didn't want it out for show and tell.


You don't want people to see your hard work? Lol, I think I might be a bit of a show off, especially when I first get started!


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

When you're looking at a canner, look for how many quart jars it will hold as compared to the quart size of the pot. I know, confusing! For instance, pots come in quart sizes, meaning how many quarts of liquid they can hold. Canners should say how many quart jars they can hold. 

A small pressure canner often holds 7 quarts or 8-9 pints. You can usually water bath pints or 1/2 pints in that same canner. You need space for 2-3 inches of water over the jars for BWBW canning. 

As for canner/cooker, I think most pressure canners also say they are cookers, but many cookers are not canners. I've never used mine to pressure cook in as it's aluminum and it doesn't fit in the sink to clean!

As for space, there's always the classic under the bed. I've read of people stacking boxes of canning jars, top with a piece of wood and cover with nice fabric for an end table, lots of creative ideas out there. Ideal temps for storage are 50-80.


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## wannalive (Aug 29, 2013)

Tmama said:


> O found a 16 quart Presto for $66. I guess I will have to do my research ha?! So when you guys/gals talk about the different sizes, what would be considered small and big? Someone mentioned earlier the importance of the pot height for water bath canning, would a 16 quart be tall enough? Sorry I'm asking so many questions I'm sure you all have answered so many times before! Thanks for all your patience and advice!!


that one would work just fine..


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## cntrywmnkw (Jun 5, 2013)

The 16qt Presto will work great, at least to start, LOL. That is what I had to get because I have a smooth, glass top stove & nothing else would work on it. If you have a regular "burner" stove, you're not limited, whatever your wallet can stand.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

cntrywmnkw said:


> The 16qt Presto will work great, at least to start, LOL. That is what I had to get because I have a smooth, glass top stove & nothing else would work on it. If you have a regular "burner" stove, you're not limited, whatever your wallet can stand.


Why does the stove type matter?

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## wannalive (Aug 29, 2013)

a lot of the glass top stoves, have kind of a thermostat, and kick of if the heat gets to high.. is my understanding. this is to keep the glass/ceramic top from busting,, and this sometimes doesn't let it reach a high enough temperature, or sustain the temp. making it unsafe to can with.. you can call the manufacturer and give them the model number and they can tell you if that stove is safe to can with.. regular coil burner stoves, or gas is recommended..


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## cntrywmnkw (Jun 5, 2013)

wannalive said:


> a lot of the glass top stoves, have kind of a thermostat, and kick of if the heat gets to high.. is my understanding. this is to keep the glass/ceramic top from busting,, and this sometimes doesn't let it reach a high enough temperature, or sustain the temp. making it unsafe to can with.. you can call the manufacturer and give them the model number and they can tell you if that stove is safe to can with.. regular coil burner stoves, or gas is recommended..


True, also, the water bath canners DON'T have flat bottoms, which isn't recommended for glass top stoves, so to be safe, they recommend using a "burner" type stove for water bath or larger pressure canners. This is what I was told by MY stove manufacturer, so I do my canning on a propane burner outside.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

I have an electric stove with regular burners. BUT, I have a microwave right above it so that might limit me in the size too depending on the height of the pot?!


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## cntrywmnkw (Jun 5, 2013)

True, Measure the distance between bottom of Microwave & top of your burner, that'll give you an idea of how big you can go, you'll also have to allow for being able to put jars into & getting out of canner.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Homesteader said:


> DO NOT automatically assume what you read even here on this forum is correct. I have seen improper canning suggestions here, which later were responded to to point out why they were wrong. But for a few days, they stood as being "okay", and if you or anyone else new to canning had not come back to read the subsequent posts correcting it, you might have done something unsafe.


How true, how true! In fact, within the first 5 replies to this post I saw errors. Case in point: some have said to water bath _"all you need is a rack under the jars to hold them off the bottom of the pot"_, but several days ago, someone posted that their jars _"ended up all bunched together in the center of the pot"._ The canning guides will tell you that you need to have the jars held off the bottom of the pot and seperated from one another *so that the water can circulate over, under and around the jars.* The water can't circulate if the jars are bunched together, thus preventing the proper water circulation.

Water bath canners generally are of a wider diameter than a pressure canner in order to allow the proper spacing of the jars. It comes with a special wire basket designed to hold the jars apart.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Vosey said:


> Oh, I didn't mean you were starting a debate, just that we have had so many threads on canners, everyone feels pretty passionate about the one they have! Sort of like what's the best homestead dog : )


I find the small "shelf size" is about perfect!

Here's Mud Puppy "Guardin' the Goods!"






GET BACK!!! Or I'll lick you to death!!!


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## Homesteader (Jul 13, 2002)

About water bath "canners". The whole thing is confusing but let's see if I can help you understand why it's confusing.

First, the thing about water bath canning pots, is just that you are putting your jars into the water, with 2-3 inches of water above the lids. You need a rack to keep the bottoms up off the bottom of that pot. You need enough room above the 2-3 inches to allow it boil vigorously.

Any pot with a rack that does this will work. I use a very large enamel pot and a wire rack for the bottom of it. 

Some companies sell "water bath canners", which include a nice basket wire thing to keep the jars apart and up off the bottom. You can find your own, like I did, or buy one all ready to go.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Suitcase_sally-cutest dog ever!! =) Are those stickers for putting dates on them? Once something is properly canned, how long can it sit for? Also, how come there are no rings on your jars? All the jars I have seen have these ring things...just curious


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Most canned food they say to eat with in a year, but things can be still good a lot longer, it may just change color or lose nutrients. You are supposed to store your canned goods with the rings off and not stacked, that way if something goes bad, the lid will stay popped and not reseal, possibly creating a false seal.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Yes, store your goods with the rings off. I use an old toothbrush to clean the threads with soapy water. You don't want to store the jars with "residue" (goop) on the threads as it will mold and be all yucky.

If you keep the jars in a place where the temp is 70 deg. or less, they will keep for years.

The labels have the contents and the year on them. Sometimes things with tomatoes all look the same (spaghetti sauce looks about the same as Creole sauce, as does Italian tomato sauce). FIFO (first in, first out).


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Tmama said:


> Suitcase_sally-cutest dog ever!! =)


Yes, he's my little darlin'.

Here's why I call him Mud Puppy. I came home from an hour visit to the grocery store one day and this is what I was met with. He thinks he can run with the big boys thru the mud and swamps.



YUM!! GOOD!!!


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## blynn (Oct 16, 2006)

Sally awww, he's adorable! What kind of dog is he? He looks a little like my pug/shiatsu mix, except she is all light brown.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

So what are the rings even for? Lol, love the mud puppy!

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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Tmama said:


> So what are the rings even for? Lol, love the mud puppy!
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


The rings keep the lids on during processing(they would just fall off without the rings) and then after 24 hours can be removed.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Kristinemomof3 said:


> The rings keep the lids on during processing(they would just fall off without the rings) and then after 24 hours can be removed.


So glad that came up because I have never heard that before!

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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

*Tmama: *my 2 cents worth

Since your largest pot is 6" deep, you will need to purchase another pot. You may as well purchase a hot water bath canner that will come with a rack for your jars (sometimes they are sold in kits including a rack, jar funnel, jar grabber, maybe even a stick magnet to get the lids out of hot water).

With a hot water bath canner you will be able to process fruit, fruit juice, jams and jellies, pickles and tomatoes.

To process pumpkin or pumpkin products, you will need a pressure canner. A pressure canner would also be used to can other vegetables, meat, beans.

If you decide to purchase a pressure canner, please consider an All American. They are about twice the price of the others, but could easily last the rest of your life (and possibly future generations). You will never have to be concerned about the viability of a gasket, you will also have a redundant system of a pressure regulator as well as a gauge to help you keep an eye/ear on things.

That being said, my suggestion would be to start off with a water bath canner. Put up all the fruit, fruit juice, jams, jellies and pickles that you can get your hands on next spring. By that time you'll have a real good idea if you like canning. If the process is rewarding to you, if hearing the jar lids "plink" as they cool makes you feel like giggling, if the exhaustion you feel after canning all day feels good, then invest in a good pressure canner. You will be twice as pleased and twice as proud at the end of the day because you will be able to preserve so many more types of food.

- wish I could be there to see your face when you first hear the lids plink down


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

blynn said:


> Sally awww, he's adorable! What kind of dog is he? He looks a little like my pug/shiatsu mix, except she is all light brown.


He's full-bloodied Shi-tzu, papers and all. He turned 16 this year.

I guess we're thread drifting, huh?


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Just bought my first pack of jars! 4oz Ball jelly jars! =D

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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

You're on your way now, Tmama!

You might also keep your eyes open at auctions/yard sales for canning jars. I often find them for a couple of dollars a case. And if you really get into canning, check Amish stores in your area for lids. They often carry a huge kraft paper sleeve of unbranded lids at a good price.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

So, when I was looking at jars, I looked at the canning stuff they had (Walmart). They had canning racks, a few of you said that the jars not only need to be of the bottom, buy not touching. The racks they had at Walmart didn't have anything to space jars apart...

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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> You're on your way now, Tmama!
> 
> You might also keep your eyes open at auctions/yard sales for canning jars. I often find them for a couple of dollars a case. And if you really get into canning, check Amish stores in your area for lids. They often carry a huge kraft paper sleeve of unbranded lids at a good price.


I made some pumpkin butter and used my jars (not canning, just storing in refrigerator) just to get the general feel of making stuff. 

Thanks for the ideas! Do you new lids every time? Or can you re use them?

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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

Tmama said:


> I made some pumpkin butter and used my jars (not canning, just storing in refrigerator) just to get the general feel of making stuff.
> 
> Thanks for the ideas! Do you new lids every time? Or can you re use them?
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


If you don't "process" them, you can reuse the lids, if you do process them, you are supposed to use new lids, but some people have used lids 2-3 times. It's just not "recommended."


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Kristinemomof3 said:


> If you don't "process" them, you can reuse the lids, if you do process them, you are supposed to use new lids, but some people have used lids 2-3 times. It's just not "recommended."


Process meaning actually boiling them or pressure canning them?

Today I just followed cleaning directions, made my recipe, put it in jars, put the lids on and put them in the refrigerator.

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## Goats Galore (Aug 28, 2012)

Picked up my canning books on ebay...give it a try. Also, it would be nice to add a dehydrator to your search list. Though many dehydrate using an oven, we use our dehydrator to process pumpkin slices, as well as all sorts of fruit and veggies, even low acid foods like all sorts of squash.


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

Tmama said:


> So, when I was looking at jars, I looked at the canning stuff they had (Walmart). They had canning racks, a few of you said that the jars not only need to be of the bottom, buy not touching. The racks they had at Walmart didn't have anything to space jars apart...
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Homesteading Today mobile app


It is okay of the jars touch. they are round and water will be able to crculate. You will need to have a rack or platform to keep the jars off the bottom of the pan. Tou can get a purpose-made rack for this, as long as it fits your pan.

You can also make on by simply placing extra jar rings on the bottom of the pan, filling it up so they cannot slide around much, then put the jars on top of it.

Here is a picture.

View attachment 17053


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

deleted


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

If you want to see the type of rack that we have been talking about for water bath canning, look inside the water bath canners the next time you are in Walmart. You should find one there. They come with handles that will enable you to lift all of the jars up so the top half or so is out of the hot water. You can then hook the handles over the top sides of the canner.

Have you tasted your pumpkin butter yet? What do you think?


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> Have you tasted your pumpkin butter yet? What do you think?


Yes, it's so good! Although I haven't tried it on bread or anything yet...


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

Do you have a good baking powder biscuit recipe?  Sounds like brunch to me.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Goats Galore said:


> Picked up my canning books on ebay...give it a try. Also, it would be nice to add a dehydrator to your search list. Though many dehydrate using an oven, we use our dehydrator to process pumpkin slices, as well as all sorts of fruit and veggies, even low acid foods like all sorts of squash.


And dehydrated foods take up so little room! You can make fruit roll-ups for your kids, how about pumpkin roll-ups?


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> Do you have a good baking powder biscuit recipe?  Sounds like brunch to me.


I do not...=)

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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Vosey said:


> And dehydrated foods take up so little room! You can make fruit roll-ups for your kids, how about pumpkin roll-ups?


I love dehydrated foods but as far as meats go, it takes a large piece of meat to give you a small piece of dehydrated meat so I don't think I would do meats...

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## Rivmage (Dec 24, 2012)

Tmama said:


> Process meaning actually boiling them or pressure canning them?


The answer is water bath or pressure canned. 

Scott


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## wannalive (Aug 29, 2013)

some say you can reuse the lids just not the rings, I have heard you can reuse rings just not lids.. I personaly don't like either idea, and for the price why not go ahead and use NEW every times.. its a small price to pay for piece of minds.. botulisium is not joke.. nothing to play around with.. and with piece of mind, some will say it is ok if the jars touch, because they are round and water can still circulate, well once again, it is recommended they don't touch,, so why risk it... better safe than sorry,, imo, get the ball book that most have recommended,, and follow it.. will keep you out of trouble..


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

wannalive said:


> some say you can reuse the lids just not the rings, I have heard you can reuse rings just not lids.. I personaly don't like either idea, and for the price why not go ahead and use NEW every times.. its a small price to pay for piece of minds.. botulisium is not joke.. nothing to play around with.. and with piece of mind, some will say it is ok if the jars touch, because they are round and water can still circulate, well once again, it is recommended they don't touch,, so why risk it... better safe than sorry,, imo, get the ball book that most have recommended,, and follow it.. will keep you out of trouble..


I, too, have heard about reusing lids. I think the real limiting factor is the sealing compound. I have heard that boiling the lids in a baking soda solution for a few minutes and restore the compound. I have not yet tried this and do not know if it is true.

Years ago, I tried reusing lids. That was before I heard about boiling in baking soda. If I recall correctly, I had failure rates in the 10 - 20% range. While that is lower than what I get using new Walmart (Mainstay) brand lids, that is way beyond acceptable. With new Ball, Kerr or Tattler lids, I am well under 1% failure.

I do tend to agree that there are some things that it is just not worth being frugal with. Canning jars and lids is one of those areas where safety is important. But it is not because I am afraid of botulism (I am not, by the way). Rather, it is because the expense and trouble when seals fail. The food has to either be consumed right away, re-canned and processed or thrown out. That is a big waste. Lids are cheap. Reuse Tattler lids more than 3 times, and they are even cheaper.

I said I am not worried about botulism because it is, in fact, pretty rare. Fewer than 100 cases per year in the USA from food-borne sources out of 200+ _billion_ meals. So, while food safety is important, I think there is a good deal of fear mongering from the now politicized NCHFP rather than simply good guidelines. If I were paranoid, I would think they were slowly trying to move in the direction of determining home canning any food is unsafe.


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

wannalive said:


> some say you can reuse the lids just not the rings, I have heard you can reuse rings just not lids.. I personaly don't like either idea, and for the price why not go ahead and use NEW every times.. its a small price to pay for piece of minds.. botulisium is not joke.. nothing to play around with.. and with piece of mind, some will say it is ok if the jars touch, because they are round and water can still circulate, well once again, it is recommended they don't touch,, so why risk it... better safe than sorry,, imo, get the ball book that most have recommended,, and follow it.. will keep you out of trouble..


You can definately reuse rings, I would not buy more rings unless they were an awesome deal. I have a 5 gallon buckt clear full of rings.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

I agree. I've NEVER heard of not reusing the rings.


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## Homesteader (Jul 13, 2002)

I agree with being surprised about the idea of not using the rings. Lids, I would never use again, for sheer safety but the rings? There is no reason I can find to not use those again.


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

Check the baking soda container for a good biscuit recipe, that's where I got the one I use. If you can't find one, pm me.

Of course, you would reuse the rings. Even after they get a little rough or corroded, just scrub with a brillo pad, then apply a very thin layer of vaseline or cooking oil. Those things could last for two lifetimes!

Re: reusing the flat lids has been an ongoing debate here. Personally, I decided to do a little research after I heard of others having success with reuse. I scrub the sealing compound with a toothbrush to make sure there are no minute food particles lurking in there. Then when I put the lids in boiling water, I let it continue to boil for several seconds to resoften the compound. Surprisingly, I have had a better seal rate with reused lids. Very, very seldom do I have a failure with them.

I don't see a safety issue with reuse. Either it's going to seal or it's not. If it doesn't seal, you know about it right away. It won't put botulism into the jar.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

Marilyn said:


> Check the baking soda container for a good biscuit recipe, that's where I got the one I use. If you can't find one, pm me.
> 
> Of course, you would reuse the rings. Even after they get a little rough or corroded, just scrub with a brillo pad, then apply a very thin layer of vaseline or cooking oil. Those things could last for two lifetimes!
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting your re-using secret. I don't currently re-use but have saved all my lids in case the SHTF and I can't get or can't afford new lids. 

Do you think the compound dries out over time, even with new lids? A canning tutorial I saw online mentioned you should buy all new lids every year and toss any you didn't use. What?? Must have been sponsored by the lid manufacturers : ) Even when you buy new lids they aren't all that new, I often pick up a box and they are the older Ball lids from before they changed the center doohickey.


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## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

I wonder if you boiled the lids to resoften them and then store them like that before use if that would be better? I may start reusing lids for jam. Might be worth it to at least try.


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

Sure *Vosey, *I was pleasantly surprised by the success rate.

That could work *Kristine, *I just haven't thought to try it ahead of time like that.

I originally decided to research the option for a few reasons. First, was obviously frugality. I was going through more and more lids each year (and they were getting more and more expensive). Secondly, I came across an old box of jar rubbers and the first step said to USE *NEW* JAR RUBBERS! I knew that our grandmothers, et al, would never have discarded the jar rubbers after only one use. In fact, the Joy of Cooking offers a couple of tests one can do to make sure that the jar rubbers are still good from year to year. The third bit of news that encouraged me to get started on my research came when a friend said that her Amish friends use each lid 7 times before discarding.

Once I put all that together, I knew it was time to get started.


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

*Tmama: *Please accept my apologies! The good baking powder biscuit recipe came from the baking POWDER container, not baking soda. So sorry.


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> *Tmama: *Please accept my apologies! The good baking powder biscuit recipe came from the baking POWDER container, not baking soda. So sorry.


FYI, Baking power is made from baking soda. 1 part baking soda, 2 parts cream of tarter. It is that simple.

The thing is that once mixed together, baking soda and cream of tarter, start to deteriorate and lose their leavening properties. Unmixed, each have shelf life in years, if kept dry and closed up. Mixed, and the shelf life is about a 12 - 18 months.


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

Warning: Thread Drift

Thanks rrp, I did not know that.

I already purchase baking soda in bulk. Is cream of tartar available in bulk, also?
Where does the aluminum fit into all of this?


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

I am slightly confused about the re-using lids debate. I keep seeing the word compound...On the lids that came with those 4oz jars I bought, there doesn't appear to be any rubber or anything on the lid except the metal it's made of. Unless it's SUPER thin...


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## Marilyn (Aug 2, 2006)

Wow, Tmama! There should be a ring of sealing compound around the outside - a big red or grey flat doughnut as you look at the underside of the lid. Do you see anything like that? You should be able to poke your fingernail into it and it will leave a faint mark.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> Wow, Tmama! There should be a ring of sealing compound around the outside - a big red or grey flat doughnut as you look at the underside of the lid. Do you see anything like that? You should be able to poke your fingernail into it and it will leave a faint mark.


It is the same color as the rest of the lid, silver/grey but yeah it makes a Lil mark when I push in it. 

I feel dumb now lol

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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

Marilyn said:


> Warning: Thread Drift
> 
> Thanks rrp, I did not know that.
> 
> ...


Okay, do not mean to take this thread far so let me answer this question quickly.

Baking soda is is sodium bicarbonate.

Cream of tarter is potassium bitartrate.

Separate, they are chemically stable. However, straight sodium bicarbonate is a desiccant and tends to absorb all sorts of things, including moisture and odors. 

Aluminum hydroxide tends to help extend the dessicant and odor absorbing qualities without reducing the leavening characteristics much. It also tends reduce clumping and help the baking soda remain powdery.

Some claim that it can leave a metallic taste, but I cannot detect it.

Together they make baking powder, but begin a slow chemical reaction which will decrease the levening characteristics over time. Aluminum hydroxide also tends to slow this reaction, extending the shelf life of baking powder.

Some baking soda is available without aluminum hydroxide. When you can find, you must be careful to store it away from oxygen and moisture, but the leavening effect is better.

See, cooking is chemistry! 

I wonder if that makes chefs chemical engineers? 

Okay, back to the thread.


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## SJSFarm (Jun 13, 2012)

This is what I LOVE about this site! Almost 100 posts to a newbie question in just 10 days! 

I posted some pics of some meat I canned. I was a newbie on the pressure canning. I thought it was bad because if what was looking like some contaminate. Nope, all was well. 

These people may argue about reusing commercial jars and lids, and reusing the two piece lids. But they are are almost always polite, respectful and most of all helpful. Everyone here wants the newbies to succeed.

Keep reading and posting! 

God Bless


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Regarding boiling the lids to soften the compound. The directions on the box state: DO NOT BOIL! Boiling will soften the compound too much, so much so that if you tighten the lid down too much the jar rim will cut right through the compound and the seal will fail.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

suitcase_sally said:


> Regarding boiling the lids to soften the compound. The directions on the box state: DO NOT BOIL! Boiling will soften the compound too much, so much so that if you tighten the lid down too much the jar rim will cut right through the compound and the seal will fail.


I did read that on the directions when I bought my little jelly jars. It did say, do NOT boil lids and I don't remember exactly what it said but I do remember it saying something about it being bad for the compound. But how do you sterilize the lids then?


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## Homesteader (Jul 13, 2002)

What I do is heat water to almost boiling. Then I soak the lids in that while filling the jars.


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## Tmama (Oct 22, 2013)

Ok, so you can heat them, just not too much?


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## Wendy (May 10, 2002)

Yes, just get them warm, not hot.


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## The_rpp (Oct 19, 2013)

Tmama said:


> I did read that on the directions when I bought my little jelly jars. It did say, do NOT boil lids and I don't remember exactly what it said but I do remember it saying something about it being bad for the compound. But how do you sterilize the lids then?


The lids will be sterilized during the canning process. Heating the lids is only to soften the sealing compounds for a more reliable seal when the lid is initially applied.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

Back in the old days, they actually used RUBBER on the lids. Rubber could stand up to boiling. The stuff they use nowadays is not rubber, hence the reason to NOT BOIL them.


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