# UC Merced Slasher Identified



## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

It will be interesting to see what triggered this attack, if they ever figure it out


> The student who stabbed four people on the campus of UC Merced was identified Thursday as 18-year-old Faisal Mohammad from Santa Clara, Calif., the university confirms to Fox News.
> Link


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

LOL
I knew as soon as I saw the thread title, and who started it, that the perp would be Muslim.


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

Not much different from anything else going on around here. Let's just talk about the facts and the story itself for a while. We can always fight after, oh, I don't know....let's give it another twelve hours.


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## M5farm (Jan 14, 2014)

Radical Muslim


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Bearfootfarm said:


> LOL
> I knew as soon as I saw the thread title, and who started it, that the perp would be Muslim.



Not sure what you are getting at?


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

wiscto said:


> Not much different from anything else going on around here. Let's just talk about the facts and the story itself for a while. We can always fight after, oh, I don't know....let's give it another twelve hours.


I did present facts
Who did i offend this time?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

wiscto said:


> Not much different from anything else going on around here. *Let's just talk about the facts* and the story itself for a while. We can always fight after, oh, I don't know....let's give it another twelve hours.


There's really not much to talk about now since all we really know is someone with a Middle Eastern name stabbed a few people and then was killed by the police.

BO won't go on TV talking about "knife violence", and no one will call for background checks for cutlery


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Cornhusker said:


> I did present facts
> Who did i offend this time?


The video you presented shows green grass and I just got my lawn swathed before it snowed so maybe it offends northerners


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Bearfootfarm said:


> LOL
> I knew as soon as I saw the thread title, and who started it, that the perp would be Muslim.


Could have been Amish instead.


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## M5farm (Jan 14, 2014)

Faisal Mohammad, who was killed by University of California Merced police, was described by at least one witness as smiling as he slashed at victims, called a loner by a fellow dorm resident and drew praise Thursday from a Twitter account associated with ISIS, which just last week released a series of videos calling for lone wolf stabbing attacks.

&#8220;May Allah accept him,&#8221; read a tweet in Arabic from a Twitter account that terrorism experts say has carried previous ISIS propaganda, just minutes after Mohammad&#8217;s name was divulged by campus authorities
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/11/0...etails-on-his-background-emerge/?intcmp=hppop


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## Fennick (Apr 16, 2013)

Cornhusker said:


> It will be interesting to see *what triggered this attack*, if they ever figure it out


Personally I don't think it matters what triggered the attack. IMO there's only one thing that is the root cause of whatever triggers those kinds of attacks regardless of who the person is or what their race, religion or culture is. That one thing is universal, no respecter of race or creed and everyone is at risk of being influenced or susceptible to it to a lesser or greater degree. It is mental instability and mental instability causes all kinds of bizarre behaviours that might be triggered by even the most innocent seeming things.


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## lordoftheweeds (Dec 27, 2012)

I blame it on those assault knives


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

Cornhusker said:


> It will be interesting to see what triggered this attack, if they ever figure it out


Here you go. http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uc-merced-attack-20151105-story.html. Apparently he was upset about being kicked out of a study group.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Fennick said:


> Personally I don't think it matters what triggered the attack. IMO there's only one thing that is the root cause of whatever triggers those kinds of attacks regardless of who the person is or what their race, religion or culture is. That one thing is universal, no respecter of race or creed and everyone is at risk of being influenced or susceptible to it to a lesser or greater degree. It is mental instability and mental instability causes all kinds of bizarre behaviours that might be triggered by even the most innocent seeming things.


Why does it have to be 'mental illness'?
Why can't it be that a person is evil / rotten, and has murderous hate in his/her heart. Period?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/06/us/chicago-tyshawn-lee-shooting/index.html

The person who lured and murdered this child did so in a gang related retaliation. 
Is the person who lured this child, and shot him, mentally ill?
Is there an 'excuse' for this murderous monster?
Why is it those who do 'big media' crimes all get the 'mental illness' label, but monsters like this gangster that lures a 9 year old kid, and murders him to get back at his daddy...........just get labeled "thug, murderer, monster"?

This I want to know.

ETA: Seems these big media murderers their 'excuse' for their behavior is 'rejection'.
This clown, gets kicked out of study group.
The clown in OR, couldn't get a girl friend.
The sandy hook clown, didn't get his mothers attention.
Columbine because they were bullied
The guy that murdered a reporter and her cameraman live, got fired/replaced.
The list goes on and on..........


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

mmoetc said:


> Here you go. http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uc-merced-attack-20151105-story.html. Apparently he was upset about being kicked out of a study group.


Isn't that the way it goes? Every time a person gets upset, like we all do at times, the first thing they do is take a knife and start stabbing people. To insinuate Islam was a root cause for his anger and contempt for others would be foolish. Everyone knows Muslims teach peace and tolerance of others and would never think to harm others with sharp instruments. I mean, C'mon, it isn't like they behead people, lop of appendages, or are currently stabbing Jews in Israel.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

mmoetc said:


> Here you go. http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uc-merced-attack-20151105-story.html. Apparently he was upset about being kicked out of a study group.


It's pretty safe to say that mental illness rather than islam for the reason behind the attack.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> It's pretty safe to say that mental illness rather than islam for the reason behind the attack.


Can it be he's just a spoiled brat w/ zero self control and a murderer?

Can it be something other than 'hes a muslim' or 'he is menally ill'?

This is a serious question.
I feel like we 'slap' mental illness on too many things that are not true mental illness; thereby cheapening what really is mental illness.


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## mmoetc (Oct 9, 2012)

poppy said:


> Isn't that the way it goes? Every time a person gets upset, like we all do at times, the first thing they do is take a knife and start stabbing people. To insinuate Islam was a root cause for his anger and contempt for others would be foolish. Everyone knows Muslims teach peace and tolerance of others and would never think to harm others with sharp instruments. I mean, C'mon, it isn't like they behead people, lop of appendages, or are currently stabbing Jews in Israel.


Sorry his manifesto and reasons don't fit your agenda. To insinuate anything lacking facts to back up those insinuations says much about the one insinuating. Doubling down on those insinuations after facts prove otherwise says much more.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> Can it be he's just a spoiled brat w/ zero self control and a murderer?
> 
> Can it be something other than 'hes a muslim' or 'he is menally ill'?
> 
> ...


We won't know unless more information comes out about his life, and that's unlikely because he's dead. It's still a safe bet to say he was mentally ill simply based on what he did.


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

Cornhusker said:


> Not sure what you are getting at?


I'll explain. 
Basically, if a white person does something & MIGHT be a person of faith, the non-conservatives here will post about it. Its rare, of course, b/c terrorist acts are predominately committed by TERRORISTS. 
Now, if a radical muslim murders, we'll post it & get ridiculed for it.
See?


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Tricky Grama said:


> I'll explain.
> Basically, if a white person does something & MIGHT be a person of faith, the non-conservatives here will post about it. Its rare, of course, b/c terrorist acts are predominately committed by TERRORISTS.
> *Now, if a radical muslim murders, we'll post it & get ridiculed for it.*
> See?


You don't think it goes both ways?:hysterical:


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## Tricky Grama (Oct 7, 2006)

Fennick said:


> Personally I don't think it matters what triggered the attack. IMO there's only one thing that is the root cause of whatever triggers those kinds of attacks regardless of who the person is or what their race, religion or culture is. That one thing is universal, no respecter of race or creed and everyone is at risk of being influenced or susceptible to it to a lesser or greater degree. It is mental instability and mental instability causes all kinds of bizarre behaviours that might be triggered by even the most innocent seeming things.


So, ISIS is mentally ill?
So, Al-queda too?
How 'bout the % of muslims who agree w/the killings of infidels? Mentally ill?

There's an element of evil in the world, most will acknowledge.


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## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

Irish Pixie said:


> It's pretty safe to say that mental illness rather than islam for the reason behind the attack.


The sheriff clearly states that there is no evidence of mental illness. They further state this was revenge from a young person who didn't know how to channel his anger. 

And to say his religion played no part is completely false. He clearly invoked Allah several times in his manifesto. I would argue his religion did teach him a way to channel his anger toward being disrespected by infidels and he used his teachings. 


http://www.wral.com/worker-a-hero-for-facing-attacker-at-california-university/15062201/


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

nchobbyfarm said:


> The sheriff clearly states that there is no evidence of mental illness. They further state this was revenge from a young person who didn't know how to channel his anger.
> 
> And to say his religion played no part is completely false. He clearly invoked Allah several times in his manifesto. I would argue his religion did teach him a way to channel his anger toward being disrespected by infidels and he used his teachings.
> 
> ...



There is a clear pattern among the left to deny any connection to Islam for all these attacks. I guess they take their lead from Obama. We've seen it over and over. To the left, nothing is evil, except perhaps Christianity,


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

poppy said:


> There is a clear pattern among the left to deny any connection to Islam for all these attacks. I guess they take their lead from Obama. We've seen it over and over. To the left, nothing is evil, except perhaps Christianity,


There is a clear pattern of some here to see the opposite.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> We won't know unless more information comes out about his life, and that's unlikely because he's dead. It's still a safe bet to say he was mentally ill simply based on what he did.


http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/06/us/chicago-tyshawn-lee-shooting/index.html

Ok.

Is the shooter in the above report mentally ill?


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/06/us/chicago-tyshawn-lee-shooting/index.html
> 
> Ok.
> 
> Is the shooter in the above report mentally ill?


I'd say yes. Anyone that would kill a 9 year old to hurt his father must have psych issues of some sort.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

mmoetc said:


> Here you go. http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-uc-merced-attack-20151105-story.html. Apparently he was upset about being kicked out of a study group.


So naturally, he decides to try and kill some people.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Irish Pixie said:


> It's pretty safe to say that mental illness rather than islam for the reason behind the attack.


What happened to waiting for the facts?


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Tricky Grama said:


> I'll explain.
> Basically, if a white person does something & MIGHT be a person of faith, the non-conservatives here will post about it. Its rare, of course, b/c terrorist acts are predominately committed by TERRORISTS.
> Now, if a radical muslim murders, we'll post it & get ridiculed for it.
> See?


The old knee jerk defense of muslims even when nobody accused anybody of being muslim routine?


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Cornhusker said:


> What happened to waiting for the facts?


He's dead. Do you think there will be much more information forth coming? They released that he was angry about a study group, I based _my opinion_ on that.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

painterswife said:


> There is a clear pattern of some here to see the opposite.


Nobody mentioned muslims until the snarkfest began
Seems like those defending muslims are the ones who actually thought it was because he was a muslim, therefore they had to bow to Obama and dig in.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Irish Pixie said:


> He's dead. Do you think there will be much more information forth coming? They released that he was angry about a study group, I based _my opinion_ on that.


Because you want the case closed and swept away before any more facts come out?
You know as well as I do the bigoted media will hide muslim related facts until the bitter end.


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:


Cornhusker said:


> Nobody mentioned muslims until the snarkfest began
> Seems like those defending muslims are the ones who actually thought it was because he was a muslim, therefore they had to bow to Obama and dig in.


:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Cornhusker said:


> Because you want the case closed and swept away before any more facts come out?
> You know as well as I do the bigoted media will hide muslim related facts until the bitter end.


No, because he's dead and I don't think there will be much more information forth coming. 

I know no such thing.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

painterswife said:


> :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:
> 
> :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:


I can honestly say I've never bowed to Obama. Have you?


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## painterswife (Jun 7, 2004)

Irish Pixie said:


> I can honestly say I've never bowed to Obama. Have you?


I must have because someone believes it.:bouncy:


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

Irish Pixie said:


> I'd say yes. Anyone that would kill a 9 year old to hurt his father must have psych issues of some sort.


Good grief. It was a gang hit. Is it your opinion that all gang members are mentally ill? They do not care who they kill and have no remorse. They are simply animals, and evil animals at that. I know it's hard for some to believe that there is pure evil in the world. Those animals think no more about killing a kid than some do about killing an unborn baby. In reality, they are both the same.


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## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

poppy said:


> Good grief. It was a gang hit. Is it your opinion that all gang members are mentally ill? They do not care who they kill and have no remorse. They are simply animals, and evil animals at that. I know it's hard for some to believe that there is pure evil in the world. Those animals think no more about killing a kid than some do about killing an unborn baby. In reality, they are both the same.


It makes me wonder what happened to the Wanted Dead or Alive posters like the old days ?


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

poppy said:


> Good grief. It was a gang hit. Is it your opinion that all gang members are mentally ill? They do not care who they kill and have no remorse. They are simply animals, and evil animals at that. I know it's hard for some to believe that there is pure evil in the world. * Those animals think no more about killing a kid than some do about killing an unborn baby. In reality, they are both the same.*


What is a person called that kills and has no remorse? A sociopath, aka antisocial personality disorder. Correct? Which is a psych disorder. 

http://psychcentral.com/disorders/antisocial-personality-disorder-symptoms/

Slipped in the nasty pro unborn rhetoric didn't you? It's not nice to compare someone that supports a woman's right to choose and a sociopath.


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

Cornhusker said:


> I did present facts
> Who did i offend this time?


Sorry, wasn't talking to you.



Bearfootfarm said:


> There's really not much to talk about now since all we really know is someone with a Middle Eastern name stabbed a few people and then was killed by the police.
> 
> BO won't go on TV talking about "knife violence", and no one will call for background checks for cutlery


He posted a news story with an agenda, open for discussion. A lot of people here are doing that. You seem to mostly have a problem with it when you don't agree with the person's point of view, and otherwise you don't seem to question their posting etiquette. 

And I get your point. Not much to talk about, so why post political rhetoric. But then here you are putting your own knife violence gun control spin on it all. Interesting stuff. If you can put into a context, so can he. He didn't state for a fact that it was a terrorist... And you know what? It WILL be interesting to see. Although at this point it looks like it wasn't terrorism.


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

nchobbyfarm said:


> The sheriff clearly states that there is no evidence of mental illness. *They further state this was revenge from a young person who didn't know how to channel his anger.
> *
> And to say his religion played no part is completely false. He clearly invoked Allah several times in his manifesto. I would argue his religion did teach him a way to channel his anger toward being disrespected by infidels and he used his teachings.
> 
> ...


Usually a good indicator of some kind of mental illness. You don't have to be schizophrenic, bi-polar, or delusional psychotic to be mentally ill.


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## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

I am sure the investigation included using his medical records and that lead the sheriff to state there was no evidence of mental illness. Yet some here can diagnose over the internet. Interesting!

ETA- since we are declaring our profession opinions, I would say it is poor parental guidance.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

wiscto said:


> Sorry, wasn't talking to you.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It wouldn't have been posted at all if it had been a white guy.
It fits a pattern



> You seem to mostly have a problem with it when you don't agree with the person's point of view, and otherwise you don't seem to question their posting etiquette.


Like you're doing now?


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

nchobbyfarm said:


> I am sure the investigation included using his medical records and that lead the sheriff to state there was no evidence of mental illness. Yet some here can diagnose over the internet. Interesting!
> 
> ETA- since we are declaring our profession opinions, I would say it is poor parental guidance.


You're on the internet. And somehow you're sure that the Sheriff did a thorough investigation into the medical records, and is otherwise qualified to speak on mental illness. Do you not see the irony there? A lack of diagnosis doesn't mean a lack of mental illness. Again. Usually when you create an elaborate plot to kill people who kicked you out of a study group, complete with Vaseline on the floor in front of the door and tying people to chairs so you can punish them.......is a good sign of mental illness. Do you think there is evidence of something else? What is it that you've managed to discern from the internet that the rest of us should have gathered?


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It wouldn't have been posted at all if it had been a white guy.
> It fits a pattern
> 
> 
> Like you're doing now?


It was a major media story, as shootings general are these days, and it was before they knew the guy's name. And how do you know that it wouldn't have been a thread here? When is the last time it was a white guy and did someone here post a thread about it? 

Oh yea you really caught me there. Except I actually agree with you that it was a leap to assume that the guy was a Muslim extremist. I'm actually just confronting you for immediately making the thread personal instead of just making your point. But you know, you're onto something, I should just let you mock a dark corner all by yourself.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

poppy said:


> Isn't that the way it goes? Every time a person gets upset, like we all do at times, the first thing they do is take a knife and start stabbing people. To insinuate Islam was a root cause for his anger and contempt for others would be foolish. Everyone knows Muslims teach peace and tolerance of others and would never think to harm others with sharp instruments. I mean, C'mon, it isn't like they behead people, lop of appendages, or are currently stabbing Jews in Israel.


Isn't it the Jews stabbing the gays in Israel? Seems to me everyone over there is bit stabby.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/06/us/chicago-tyshawn-lee-shooting/index.html
> 
> Ok.
> 
> Is the shooter in the above report mentally ill?


Nope that's just old fashioned ugly vengeance. It crosses all human made lines of religion, sex, and race.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Irish Pixie said:


> No, because he's dead and I don't think there will be much more information forth coming.
> 
> I know no such thing.


What was the "racist *******'s" name?
The one who shot up a church?
Seems like there was quite a bit of blaming his religion, his racism, his beliefs, his looks, his flag, his locale, his color.......way before all the facts came out.
I guess that's different, he didn't have a muslim sounding name, he was white, etc.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Cornhusker said:


> What was the "racist *******'s" name?
> The one who shot up a church?
> Seems like there was quite a bit of blaming his religion, his racism, his beliefs, his looks, his flag, his locale, his color.......way before all the facts came out.
> I guess that's different, he didn't have a muslim sounding name, he was white, etc.


Dylann Roof. I said the same thing about him that I will say about this kid: 



Patchouli said:


> Real life is this: like all of the other recent shooters this guy had no life. He wasn't going anywhere. He had no hope, no plans, nothing on the horizon. So he looked around and he said I might as well just go out and if I am going to go out I am going to do it with a massive bang. It's the same reason Dylann Roof shot all those church goers, the reason Vester Flannagan shot those news people, it's the reason Abdulazeez shot the people at the Naval Station in Chattanooga.
> 
> Every single case has one thing in common: a disgruntled man whose life has become hopeless and untenable and they decide to go out in a blaze of glory. So if you want to fix the problem you need to start with why do we have so many young men in this country with no hope? No jobs? No family, no friends, no purpose in life? Not one thing they can think of for their future other than death and shaking up the world on their way out.


It applies to every single shooter in the last decade or so. It has nothing to do with race or religion or politics. Until we get past making it about whatever political hay we are trying to make this week we won't fix the problem.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> I'd say yes. Anyone that would kill a 9 year old to hurt his father must have psych issues of some sort.





Patchouli said:


> Nope that's just old fashioned ugly vengeance. It crosses all human made lines of religion, sex, and race.


What I fear is that every murderer will claim 'mental illness', thereby diminishing TRUE mental illnesses.

Hundreds of thousands of people who have legitimate mental illness function just fine in society on and off medication. 
For us to paint every murderer 'mentally ill' it will cause those with true mental illnesses to be treated like criminals or worse? Be dismissed and not treated.

It's kind of like ADD / ADHD.
It's legit, but now ever kid that mouths off or can't sit still gets labled and medicated.......even when the problem is the kid is undisciplined, not truly ADD /ADHD.

I like Patchouli's word vengence.
The murderers that I mentioned on page 2?
All were seeking revenge of some sort or another.
Grand Maul Temper Tantrum.

For those who do not believe in evil......vengence is easily understood.


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## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

wiscto said:


> You're on the internet. And somehow you're sure that the Sheriff did a thorough investigation into the medical records, and is otherwise qualified to speak on mental illness. Do you not see the irony there? A lack of diagnosis doesn't mean a lack of mental illness. Again. Usually when you create an elaborate plot to kill people who kicked you out of a study group, complete with Vaseline on the floor in front of the door and tying people to chairs so you can punish them.......is a good sign of mental illness. Do you think there is evidence of something else? What is it that you've managed to discern from the internet that the rest of us should have gathered?


I know there is evidence of something else if the investigators are to be believed per the statements given to the media. In the second paragraph of my linked story says he wanted to terrorize students. I thought there were many who said wait for the details before jumping in on these types of stories. Well I did but now apparently the details provided can't be trusted based on your opinion. Since you know more than the investigators, I'll leave you to your diagnosis. I simply based my opinion on the facts as stated by those actually handling the case. If the facts change, so to might my opinion. Good day.


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## keenataz (Feb 17, 2009)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> What I fear is that every murderer will claim 'mental illness', thereby diminishing TRUE mental illnesses.
> 
> Hundreds of thousands of people who have legitimate mental illness function just fine in society on and off medication.
> For us to paint every murderer 'mentally ill' it will cause those with true mental illnesses to be treated like criminals or worse? Be dismissed and not treated.
> ...


As one who does suffer a mental illness, I truly appreciate this. I am guessing 90% of the mentally get along fine in our society. Probably another 9% have more difficulty, but are no threat to anyone and there is the 1% who could be problematic-that is just a guess.

Thanks


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## wiscto (Nov 24, 2014)

nchobbyfarm said:


> I know there is evidence of something else if the investigators are to be believed per the statements given to the media. In the second paragraph of my linked story says he wanted to terrorize students. I thought there were many who said wait for the details before jumping in on these types of stories. Well I did but now apparently the details provided can't be trusted based on your opinion. Since you know more than the investigators, I'll leave you to your diagnosis. I simply based my opinion on the facts as stated by those actually handling the case. If the facts change, so to might my opinion. Good day.


And I'm just discussing these facts. When people disagree with you.......it's okay. Good day.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> What I fear is that every murderer will claim 'mental illness', thereby diminishing TRUE mental illnesses.
> 
> Hundreds of thousands of people who have legitimate mental illness function just fine in society on and off medication.
> For us to paint every murderer 'mentally ill' it will cause those with true mental illnesses to be treated like criminals or worse? Be dismissed and not treated.
> ...


Anyone at any time can claim mental illness, but it needs to be proven in a court.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Irish Pixie said:


> Anyone at any time can claim mental illness, but it needs to be proven in a court.


I know it has to be proven in court......but it really wizzes me off that the media is QUICK to call 'mass murderers' mentally ill.

Yes, some may be......maybe if we took more of them ALIVE we'd know the truth!

I would like, if it's the truth, for the media to say "yeah, he was a horses back side, spoiled rotten brat that chose to let his murderous emotions act".

We call the 'thugs' of Chicago, Detroit, DC, 'thugs and murderers'.
We call the 'thugs' who do 'mass media' style murders "mentally ill".

That's a total insult to those who suffer from / battle with / manage true mental illnesses.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I know it has to be proven in court......but it really wizzes me off that the media is QUICK to call 'mass murderers' mentally ill.


Anyone who commits those acts is "mentally ill".
No one in their right minds would do it.

It really doesn't matter in court unless they are so delusional they can't tell right from wrong


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> *Anyone who commits those acts is "mentally ill".*
> No one in their right minds would do it.
> 
> It really doesn't matter in court unless they are so delusional they can't tell right from wrong


I find that offensive.
It's like saying 'all crimes of terrorism are committed by muslims'.
It's not true.


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

painterswife said:


> You don't think it goes both ways?:hysterical:


Why should it have to?


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

Irish Pixie said:


> I can honestly say I've never bowed to Obama. Have you?


Is that to the east or west? 

I forget.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

*****


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> I find that offensive.
> It's like saying 'all crimes of terrorism are committed by muslims'.
> It's not true.


It is true, and it's nothing like your analogy.
Sane people don't kill other people.
Losing control of your actions to that degree is a sign of mental problems, whether you find it "offensive" or not


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## mreynolds (Jan 1, 2015)

Irish Pixie said:


> *****


Pixie, I was joking and actually taking your side on that one. Maybe my voice inflection was a little off but you take everything so literal.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

mreynolds said:


> Pixie, I was joking and actually taking your side on that one. Maybe my voice inflection was a little off but you take everything so literal.


And after several cups of coffee I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. What you couldn't hear the tone of my ****?


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Are these killers mentally disturbed? Yes. The problem comes from what they do about it. If the disturbed person associates with a peaceful group or religion they are in many cases swayed by the others in that group to be peaceful. Not really pier pressure, more like group identity pressure. If they associate with a group or religion that believes in violence these disturbed people are in a sense given permission by that group to do violence. All the disturbed person has to do is convince themselves that the violence they commit supports their groups belief instead of their own inadequacies. In this case convince themselves that they are fighting for Allah and then be more approved by Allah as a result. So if your a loser, you can be a winner with Allah by use of violence. 


> Quran (4:95) - "Not equal are those of the believers who sit (at home), except those who are disabled (by injury or are blind or lame, etc.), and those who strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with their wealth and their lives. Allah has preferred in grades those who strive hard and fight with their wealth and their lives above those who sit (at home). Unto each, Allah has promised good (Paradise), but Allah has preferred those who strive hard and fight, above those who sit (at home) by a huge reward " This passage criticizes "peaceful" Muslims who do not join in the violence, letting them know that they are less worthy in Allah's eyes. It also demolishes the modern myth that "Jihad" doesn't mean holy war in the Quran, but rather a spiritual struggle. Not only is this Arabic word (mujahiduna) used in this passage, but it is clearly not referring to anything spiritual, since the physically disabled are given exemption.


http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

BlackFeather said:


> Are these killers mentally disturbed? Yes. The problem comes from what they do about it. If the disturbed person associates with a peaceful group or religion they are in many cases swayed by the others in that group to be peaceful. Not really pier pressure, more like group identity pressure. If they associate with a group or religion that believes in violence these disturbed people are in a sense given permission by that group to do violence. All the disturbed person has to do is convince themselves that the violence they commit supports their groups belief instead of their own inadequacies. In this case convince themselves that they are fighting for Allah and then be more approved by Allah as a result. So if your a loser, you can be a winner with Allah by use of violence.
> 
> http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm


Fair and balanced? Here is the main page to the above link. You decide. 

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It is true, and it's nothing like your analogy.
> Sane people don't kill other people.
> Losing control of your actions to that degree is a sign of mental problems, whether you find it "offensive" or not


No, it's not true.
Yes, it is exactly like my analogy.

If every time a terrorist attack happened, people say "Oh, definitely a muslim. No non-muslim would kill people."
Saying 'all who commit murder are mentally ill" is exactly the same as saying the above.

If someone holds to that opinion, all terrorist attacks are done by muslims, then THEY are considered/ called a BIGOT.
I can reference oodles of posts that say that almost verbatim.

So you saying "Sane people don't kill other people.
Losing control of your actions to that degree is a sign of mental problems,"
is exactly the same bigoted opinion as "only muslims commit terrorism'.

Perfectly sane men who catch their wives in bed with another man, can 'snap' and commit murder "in the heat of the moment/rage".
They never have, and never again show any signs of TRUE mental illness.
To call that man 'mentally ill' is bigoted and an insult to folks who truly battle with / live with, real mental illnesses.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It is true, and it's nothing like your analogy.
> Sane people don't kill other people.
> Losing control of your actions to that degree is a sign of mental problems, whether you find it "offensive" or not


Sane people murder other people every day. I don't think it all comes down to mental illness. A lot of times it's just a fit of anger and easy access to a weapon of some sort.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

Patchouli said:


> Sane people murder other people every day. I don't think it all comes down to mental illness. A lot of times it's just a fit of anger and easy access to a weapon of some sort.


Knives and baseball bats are everywhere!


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Irish Pixie said:


> Fair and balanced? Here is the main page to the above link. You decide.
> 
> http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/index.html


Who cares? I was only interested in the verses in the Koran, they are self explanatory. I could care less about the sites agenda all I wanted was the verses. The verses in the Koran speak for themselves. As with all liberals you attack the messenger when you can't argue the facts. Yet these Muslim treat women like dirt. I don't see liberals calling them out. It is in the news everyday about girls being raped over in Europe by these male refugees. Where is the liberal out cry? 


> An atheist professor said Tuesday that itâs acceptable to criticize Christians but not Muslims, because he does not âfearâ retaliation from Christians.
> âI know what keeps me from critiquing Islam on my blog is just fear,â Phil Zuckerman said .....


http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...isparage-christians-islam-limits-because-fear

Cowards.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

BlackFeather said:


> Who cares? I was only interested in the verses in the Koran, they are self explanatory. I could care less about the sites agenda all I wanted was the verses. The verses in the Koran speak for themselves. As with all liberals you attack the messenger when you can't argue the facts. Yet these Muslim treat women like dirt. I don't see liberals calling them out. It is in the news everyday about girls being raped over in Europe by these male refugees. Where is the liberal out cry?
> 
> http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...isparage-christians-islam-limits-because-fear
> 
> Cowards.


Strange isnt it? I can't understand it one bit. Islam is a horrible religion,they call it Satans religion it's so awful. I'm not enough of any religion to understand what the libs talk about when compareing religions to islam,but dang, that is some horrible stuff in their 3 books which includes the k. I'd be running so fast the other way, and ya know to leave the cult is death,iD STILL RUN. Good Grief people if its' as bad as it is, then a "religion" is not worth it by any meens. Besides a virgin isn't no big deal unless the other person is well,pretty much ulsess, I sure wouldn't want 42 virgins, one good "Mate" is worth all the .....


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

BlackFeather said:


> Who cares? I was only interested in the verses in the Koran, they are self explanatory. I could care less about the sites agenda all I wanted was the verses. The verses in the Koran speak for themselves. As with all liberals you attack the messenger when you can't argue the facts. Yet these Muslim treat women like dirt. I don't see liberals calling them out. It is in the news everyday about girls being raped over in Europe by these male refugees. Where is the liberal out cry?
> 
> http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...isparage-christians-islam-limits-because-fear
> 
> Cowards.


Those are cherry picked suras from the quran. If you've OK with having a decidedly bias site spin information to what it _wants_ you to think, have at it.


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## BlackFeather (Jun 17, 2014)

Islam is a combination of church and state, lets look at one state...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Saudi_Arabia

By their fruits you will know them. I won't even get into ISIS...


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

BlackFeather said:


> Islam is a combination of church and state, lets look at one state...
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Saudi_Arabia
> 
> By their fruits you will know them. I won't even get into ISIS...


Please explain American muslims and how they have lived here for a half century with no violence? Don't American muslims follow sharia law?


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

Irish Pixie said:


> Please explain American muslims and how they have lived here for a half century with no violence? Don't American muslims follow sharia law?


There has been violence, you just don't want to admit it. Start with maj. Hassan, the fort Hood shooter. Should I post some links to others? Or would you like to retract that lie? Most American muslims cannot follow their law in public, because they go against laws already accepted by the people. Is stoning their wives acceptable to you, or chopping off hands and heads, making woman subservient, that's all ok right? I don't expect an answer, but I asked anyway!


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

JeffreyD said:


> There has been violence, you just don't want to admit it. Start with maj. Hassan, the fort Hood shooter. Should I post some links to others? Or would you like to retract that lie? Most American muslims cannot follow their law in public, because they go against laws already accepted by the people. Is stoning their wives acceptable to you, or chopping off hands and heads, making woman subservient, that's all ok right? I don't expect an answer, but I asked anyway!


There certainly have been acts of violence by Islamic terrorists and while I don't feel that all Muslims are terrorists, I do strongly feel that those who commit acts of terrorism or violence should be recognized as such and punished accordingly.

If someone is stoned to death or is beheaded in North America, I believe our own laws would apply and while I don't condone any of the acts you mention, I'm uncertain how we can enforce our laws in other countries. 

I certainly care that it is happening and they are significant issues which I'd be interested in how people feel we correct human rights violations in other countries.


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## Patchouli (Aug 3, 2011)

BlackFeather said:


> Islam is a combination of church and state, lets look at one state...
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Saudi_Arabia
> 
> By their fruits you will know them. I won't even get into ISIS...


Any religion that is combined church and state turns ugly. Crack open a European history book. Spanish Inquisition converting Jews at knife point ring a bell? How's about Bloody Mary in England? Or her Protestant counterpoint Cromwell? And yeah they used bits of the Bible to support their reigns of terror.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

wr said:


> There certainly have been acts of violence by Islamic terrorists and while I don't feel that all Muslims are terrorists, I do strongly feel that those who commit acts of terrorism or violence should be recognized as such and punished accordingly.
> 
> If someone is stoned to death or is beheaded in North America, I believe our own laws would apply and while I don't condone any of the acts you mention, I'm uncertain how we can enforce our laws in other countries.
> 
> I certainly care that it is happening and they are significant issues which I'd be interested in how people feel we correct human rights violations in other countries.


I'm not concerned about what other countries do, none of my business. Why should we "correct" their business? That's for their leaders to decide. Meddling only leads to war.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

Patchouli said:


> Any religion that is combined church and state turns ugly. Crack open a European history book. Spanish Inquisition converting Jews at knife point ring a bell? How's about Bloody Mary in England? Or her Protestant counterpoint Cromwell? And yeah they used bits of the Bible to support their reigns of terror.


Is this still done? Muslims still stone woman and children, beheadings, do other religions do this on a regular basis?

Do you support these muslims too?


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

JeffreyD said:


> I'm not concerned about what other countries do, none of my business. Why should we "correct" their business? That's for their leaders to decide. Meddling only leads to war.


I agree. I did a quick search and I couldn't find examples of anyone lopping heads or hands off in our country but if it has happened, those that chose to take the law into their own hands should be punished according to our laws and it should never be overlooked. 

I believe there have been cases of honor killings in both our countries and I'm sure the US addresses it as Canada has and classified it as murder but I would hope that if they are not citizens born of the country, they would be deported as soon as their sentence is served. 

I have never been a fan of pointing out things done in the name of faith that predates my actual memory and while my kids figure I'm older than dirt, the crusades were before my time and the entire world has evolved a great deal since then so it's not an example I prefer to use. In my opinion, it would be a lot like using the James Gang as an example for gun control.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

wr said:


> I agree. I did a quick search and I couldn't find examples of anyone lopping heads or hands off in our country but if it has happened, those that chose to take the law into their own hands should be punished according to our laws and it should never be overlooked.
> 
> I believe there have been cases of honor killings in both our countries and I'm sure the US addresses it as Canada has and classified it as murder but I would hope that if they are not citizens born of the country, they would be deported as soon as their sentence is served.
> 
> I have never been a fan of pointing out things done in the name of faith that predates my actual memory and while my kids figure I'm older than dirt, the crusades were before my time and the entire world has evolved a great deal since then so it's not an example I prefer to use. In my opinion, it would be a lot like using the James Gang as an example for gun control.


Pixie said this never happens here. These are just a few and were easy to find. Im not sure if the first attack on the world trade center was by American muslims or not.

In addition to Nadal Hassans violent murdering rampage.

http://nypost.com/2014/09/26/woman-beheaded-by-co-worker-in-oklahoma/

A fired Oklahoma factory worker inflicted a brutal, ISIS-style punishment on colleagues he tried to convert to Islam &#8212; cutting one woman&#8217;s head off with a 10-inch fillet knife, law-enforcement sources said Friday.

http://sites.duke.edu/tcths/files/2...ism_Cases_Involving_Muslim-Americans_2014.pdf

The most deadly plot involved Ali Muhammad Brown, who shot and killed
four random people on the street in Washington State and New Jersey in April and June, 2014

Zale Thompson, who injured two police officers with a hatchet and was shot
dead; and Ismaaiyl Brinsley, who shot and wounded his former girlfriend in Baltimore.

eta: I remember this guy, he's Canadian. He shot up your Parliament didn't he?

Michael Zehaf-Bibeau, was a 32-year-old Canadian habitual offender and drug addict from Montreal. Considered by several acquaintances to have mental issues, he had been observed by acquaintances and mosque staff exhibiting erratic behaviour. Zehaf-Bibeau, who had a Libyan-Canadian father,* had converted to Islam in 2004 *and visited Libya.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

JeffreyD said:


> Pixie said this never happens here. These are just a few and were easy to find. Im not sure if the first attack on the world trade center was by American muslims or not.
> 
> In addition to Nadal Hassans violent murdering rampage.
> 
> ...


Obviously, I can't speak for others and only stated my opinion. 

I did notice in one of the links you posted that there were several cases where acts of terrorism was by way of attempting to join terrorist groups in other countries and while I personally feel they should be tried in our courts, there is a part of me that simply feels they should be allowed to go and find out that the life of a freedom fighter isn't all that glamorous and tends to have a short expectancy. It is my understanding that joining ISIS is a bit of a permanent thing and they have internal solutions in place for those that change their mind and want to go home. 

Terrorists and people who harm others get no free pass in my world.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

I misspoke. My apologies. My point was that if all (as has been stated on multiple occasions) muslims follow sharia law why isn't there more brutality here? After all, if American muslims followed their religious law rather than American law, wouldn't there be more attacks? 

I'm sure I could find non muslim beheadings, "murdering rampages" and other violence in the last half century that dwarf the amount done by muslims.


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## JeffreyD (Dec 27, 2006)

wr said:


> Obviously, I can't speak for others and only stated my opinion.
> 
> I did notice in one of the links you posted that there were several cases where acts of terrorism was by way of attempting to join terrorist groups in other countries and while I personally feel they should be tried in our courts, there is a part of me that simply feels they should be allowed to go and find out that the life of a freedom fighter isn't all that glamorous and tends to have a short expectancy. It is my understanding that joining ISIS is a bit of a permanent thing and they have internal solutions in place for those that change their mind and want to go home.
> 
> Terrorists and people who harm others get no free pass in my world.


Im not sure that they should be sent, not all want to go, some want to stay here and commit their terror. The other problem is that they are sent, they may kill innocent citizens or the military fighting them. My opinion is that if they are tried and found guility, they get to see their profit in person!


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

JeffreyD said:


> Im not sure that they should be sent, not all want to go, some want to stay here and commit their terror. The other problem is that they are sent, they may kill innocent citizens or the military fighting them. My opinion is that if they are tried and found guility, they get to see their profit in person!



I do agree and occasionally my Canadian humour doesn't translate well.


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## poppy (Feb 21, 2008)

Irish Pixie said:


> I misspoke. My apologies. My point was that if all (as has been stated on multiple occasions) muslims follow sharia law why isn't there more brutality here? After all, if American muslims followed their religious law rather than American law, wouldn't there be more attacks?
> 
> I'm sure I could find non muslim beheadings, "murdering rampages" and other violence in the last half century that dwarf the amount done by muslims.


Could you please point out any other group whose religion commands them to behead people? I've not read of any pagans, Buddhists, Christians, Jews, or any religion besides Islam that promotes beheadings. The attacker was Muslim and his writings said he wanted to behead someone as well as shoot several people. He also wrote 5 times about praising Allah. Given that, how can any sane person pretend his religion didn't figure into his actions? As to the level of Muslim violence here, watch and see. They are fanatical but not brave. Once their population gets high enough, things will change. Simply look at the problems EU countries are having with them. The recent influx is now causing problems in Germany. I saw a story today about them rioting in Australia as well. They do not want our culture or laws in their own countries and they do not want our laws or culture in countries they migrate to. They want Islamic culture and Sharia law by a large percentage. They do not recognize borders, period. They believe Islam is destined to rule the world and they migrate to further that goal.


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

poppy said:


> Could you please point out any other group whose religion commands them to behead people? I've not read of any pagans, Buddhists, Christians, Jews, or any religion besides Islam that promotes beheadings. The attacker was Muslim and his writings said he wanted to behead someone as well as shoot several people. He also wrote 5 times about praising Allah. Given that, how can any sane person pretend his religion didn't figure into his actions? As to the level of Muslim violence here, watch and see. They are fanatical but not brave. Once their population gets high enough, things will change. Simply look at the problems EU countries are having with them. The recent influx is now causing problems in Germany. I saw a story today about them rioting in Australia as well. They do not want our culture or laws in their own countries and they do not want our laws or culture in countries they migrate to. They want Islamic culture and Sharia law by a large percentage. They do not recognize borders, period. They believe Islam is destined to rule the world and they migrate to further that goal.


This is about *American muslims* and the small amount of violence from them in the last half century or so. If they lived by sharia law here, wouldn't there be more violence? Most have lived peaceably, raised their kids, worked hard, and paid their taxes. Some are citizens, were/are soldiers and some have died for this country. 

Christians want their own version of sharia law but so far they haven't been able to undermine the country's judicial system. Praise Rock! they never shall.

I've said this dozens of times- I don't like any religion, I think it's caused more pain and sorrow than anything else on earth. I personally don't care about christians, muslims, jews, or anything other religion. What does bother me is hypocrisy. And you're (collective you) a hypocrite if you say that all muslims everywhere just want to kill members of other faiths. It's simply not true.

Many muslims, like many christians, pick and choose which parts of the tenet of their religion they will follow.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Can anyone tell me when did this stabbing happen (date) and why I have heard nothing about it on the news??

If this was a shooting, I'd be hearing about this for DAYS and DAYS........
Is it because it's a stabbing? (which by the way is a MUCH MORE personal crime)
Is it because the kids is muslim?

What is it?


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## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

The investigation into the motive behind the stabbing has been turned over to the FBI because it appears to be ISIS inspired. Looks like religion played a lot bigger role than we were led to believe.

The linked article says the FBI has taken over because he was carrying a picture of the ISIS flag, the multiple mentions of Allah, websites he had frequented the last several weeks and his dress. Looks like the rejection from the study group was just the excuse. Seems he was looking for a reason.
http://www.mercedsunstar.com/news/local/crime/article43916628.html


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

nchobbyfarm said:


> The investigation into the motive behind the stabbing has been turned over to the FBI because it appears to be ISIS inspired. Looks like religion played a lot bigger role than we were led to believe.
> 
> The linked article says the FBI has taken over because he was carrying a picture of the ISIS flag, the multiple mentions of Allah, websites he had frequented the last several weeks and his dress. Looks like the rejection from the study group was just the excuse. Seems he was looking for a reason.
> http://www.mercedsunstar.com/news/local/crime/article43916628.html


What?
Terrorist muslim related?
Who would seen that coming after all the discussion and verbal beatings to convince us it wasn't any such thing?


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Cornhusker said:


> What?
> Terrorist muslim related?
> Who would seen that coming after all the discussion and verbal beatings to convince us it wasn't any such thing?


No one has ever said that no muslim can be a terrorist, obviously they can be, as can any religion, race, etc.. The sticking point is when it's alleged that ALL muslims are, or will become, terrorists. That is simply not true.


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Irish Pixie said:


> No one has ever said that no muslim can be a terrorist, obviously they can be, as can any religion, race, etc.. The sticking point is when it's alleged that ALL muslims are, or will become, terrorists. That is simply not true.


There were those on this very thread who claimed he didn't have terrorist links or actions.
I didn't say "all"


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