# Wood Gas Experiance?



## fantasymaker (Aug 28, 2005)

Has anybody here have any actual experience with wood gas? I'm interested in the possibility of a wood gas truck.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

I think there is some info on the DOE site.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

not yet ,in the middle of building a unit for my truck.
let you know when its done. plenty of research just no hands on.

just google fema gassifer plans and the go check you tube out.
lots of stuff anymore,seems many are trying to make money more then open source. still plenty of free resources though.


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## AVanarts (Jan 2, 2011)

I think you'll find lots of people with plans and some with prototypes or "proof of concept" models.

I have yet to find anyone who has used such a device for any length of time.


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## fantasymaker (Aug 28, 2005)

There is some great stuff out there alright I was just hopeing to find someone in this circle with real world experiance.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

I've tried to get discussions going on it myself.
Some mild interest at most. 

I think the recent Mother Earth article has got more peoples attention. And possibly doomsday preppers.

I think its a no brainer for some people. 

I've been exploring for some time and finally got most of the stuff together. 

Wind and solar are Cool but nothing like having what you need when you need it. 

Originally I was going to go the WVO/waste auto route still may,not so practical since it came to the mainstream attention. Noticed lots of folks this year asking for waste motor oil for heating. it would be more of a back up thing though.


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## AVanarts (Jan 2, 2011)

I still bet that if it was worth doing we'd see all kinds of reports from people who are happy with their wood gas units.

I just can't see turning a primary fuel (wood) into an inefficient secondary fuel (wood gas) to get a little electricity.

If you do build one of these units, please let everyone know how much wood you need to burn and how much power you get from it.


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## fantasymaker (Aug 28, 2005)

Its the reports of 1 mile per pound that got me interested.


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## WisJim (Jan 14, 2004)

Some friends near here (nw Wisconsin) have been getting together once in awhile to build a gasification unit, and got it to the point where they ran a small engine for about an hour as a test. Here is a blog about it, with the newest stuff at the top of the page. Gasifier Blog - Hay River Transition Initiative 2011


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

Its pretty well accepted that 20 lbs is equivalent to a gallon of gas.
so I suppose a fuel efficient vehicle could get 1 mile a lb. or even better.
I had read a paper where Wayne Keith went to a University and they tested 50lbs of various feedstock,

http://driveonwood.com/sites/default/files/pdf/Keith Final Report.pdf

if I read the chart right the run with gas he got 65 miles? 
now they could be scewed a little or they may be right on the money.

it not so much wood gas is inefficient, its that many gassifiers are not. there's lots of improvements that can be made on the fema design. 

Its not everybodys cup of tea, most folks dont care how the car runs or why just as long as when they sit down and turn the key it does. if you watch someone start up a gassifier and engine its not instant gratification. then take into account many folks don't have the know how or ability,most of the stuff out there is a imitation of a bad design and you can't just pull up anywhere and get your fuel. it does take a little effort. But you don't have to burn just wood, many alternatives exist. Wood would not be a great option out west but biomass from crops could be. Seen one guy that uses sunflower seed shells and some guys in the UK used coffee grounds. I have even heard of people experimenting with adding amounts of waste oil. its a tried and true but almost forgotten technology and for the most part buried. But its still in wide use in a good bit of the world.
the Nazis used Gasification and the Fischer Tropsch Process. So did South Africa when they where embargoed. That same process as far as I know is used today to produce synthetic oil.

Since I've been looking into it there are numerous start ups here in the US selling gassifiers and gassifier gensets. looking at the price I got to say I have more brains then money so I'm got to build it.

Seems to me once upon a time laughed about a completely new and untried thing called the Interweb. I kinda of wonder what happened to that? 

I don't know about you but I cant just go out and gather gasoline with sweat equity, takes dollars and if things keep going the way they are there may not be enough dollars to get enough to go to the end of the driveway let alone if there's any actually available?

I do keep coming back around to oil though, with out that doesn't matter how much fuel you can buy,steal or make. 

thats why I'm exploring the Fischer Tropsch Process, and well the gassification is in my reach there is not much in laymans terms yet. 
when it comes to chemistry I'm more of a cook rather then a chemist. Just need a recipe and a basic understanding.
But I think it could very well be in reach just a little more in depth then I can wrap my self around with available info. But if You can tackle that I think you would have a very large advantage over many.


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## snake35 (Jan 24, 2011)

I am interested in converting a generator to run on wood gas.


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## rockhound (Sep 25, 2009)

As someone mentioned, woodgas has been used by folks in wartime or some other desperate situation. It is messy and requires more maintenance than say a gas genset. Then there's the highway tax on gas you pay with every gallon. If you use wood gas for a year and then get hit with an assessment for the taxes, what's your plan on paying that? If you can get over those humps, wood gas generates carbon monoxide, that's how it works. Even a tiny leak will be bad and potentially deadly. Proceed with caution.


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

Can the smoke of a wood stove be burned without treating it? I know it burns as does anyone who's ever opened the door on a barrel stove and gotten flashed.

I see those outdoor wood furnaces (smudge pots IMO) and have to wonder if running that smoke through an engine might be a way to get some use out of it and clean it in the process. if it could I could see using it to run a stationary engine like a wood splitter or saw or feed grinder.


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## ||Downhome|| (Jan 12, 2009)

fish you don't even use would gas with out treating it. 

You remove the moisture and ash,tars and creosote.

I have to think that in gassification that its more of a controlled burn. 
As well as cooler then a stove/burner.

in the application you mention, I don't think you could burn it hot enough for the initial
use.

then draw and draft would also come into play. in a most gassifier designs you have some sort of suction, fan or a engine for draw. 

in a stove you rely on draft. 

there's no reason you can not co-produce both heat and power from a gassifier.
that is a intention of mine. Not feasible with a mobile application but very doable in a stationary one.

besides filtering the wood gas it needs to be cooled before entering the engine.
I see as heat expands and cold contracts,so a cool gas is more energy dense per volume.
But if you collect that heat from that as well as use a water cooled engine and collect that heat,you would be increasing the efficiency of the whole process.

I also like the Idea of a absorption process for cooling!


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## Guest (Apr 18, 2012)

Fishhead,

I think a gassifier works by providing the fire with just enough oxygen to burn the wood chips partially. This produces tars, smoke, creasote, water vapor and ash. This mixture is sucked through the coals of the fire and chemically converted to ash (it doesn't burn), carbon monoxide, hydrogen, methane, some water vapor, and a few others. This chemical reaction begins at something like 400 degrees. The CO, hydrogen, and methane are flamable. The rest, about 60%, is mostly nitrogen which is not burnable. The gas produced by a gassifier is not as concentrated as propane or natural gas. or gasoline vapor. The gas has to be cooled (water condenses and is removed) and the ash filtered out before it will run an engine without hurting it. 

You would have to heat up the woodsmoke with no oxygen to 400+ degrees for the chemical reaction to take place.


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## artificer (Feb 26, 2007)

fishhead said:


> ...
> I see those outdoor wood furnaces (smudge pots IMO) and have to wonder if running that smoke through an engine might be a way to get some use out of it and clean it in the process. if it could I could see using it to run a stationary engine like a wood splitter or saw or feed grinder.


Many of those heaters are being misfired. If you see smoke, you're not burning correctly, unless its just at startup for a few minutes. Most common, I think, is the claim that you can burn green wood... and then they wonder why you can't get the heat out of it that the seller claims. The "smoke" probably has too much moisture in it to burn properly, but I don't know.

Don't know if you've seen this group on Yahoo, but they have a lot of information there. One of the latest posting is pictures of what looks like a continuous flow wood chip gasifier. Haven't read anything on the site for a while, so not sure what it is. (yahoo groups sends update of things added to the group site, and I saw the photos.)

Michael

Edit: heres an amusing photo... (if it displays correctly)


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

A friend of mine has an outdoor burner and the temperature range it's set on is only like 5 degrees. If it drops below the blower kicks on and once it hits the upper limit the blower shuts off and it smolders. That's what makes me think there is a way to recover the energy in that smoke.


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## lraiser (Apr 26, 2009)

I've been reading and searching on wood gas for some time. The best info I found so far is here:

Home Â« Gasifier Experimenters Kit

They have a forum, photos and some videos. They will sell you a set up (BIG dollars) but best of all they GIVE you the CAD drawings of the entire set up.

I'm waiting on a reply from an ebay seller on the CNC cutting of the parts.

My primary interest is in running a generator for the refrigeration, and with a 100 acres of woods I expect to do ok until I figure something else out.


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## NVSmith (Aug 12, 2010)

-Check out: Table of Contents, "Wood gas as engine fuel" put out by the UN Food & Agriculture Organization (FAO).
-The URL, less http://www. is: fao.org/DOCREP/T0512E/T0512e00.htm
-The pub can be downloaded as pdf.
-What I found particularly useful was the section on gasification in Paraguay.


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## Harry Chickpea (Dec 19, 2008)

Your best source for discussions with people who have walked the walk is the yahoo woodgas group.


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