# Fodder growing system



## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

OK, after experimenting with some seed flats on the kitchen counter top, I decided to set up a full blown automated watering system to grow fodder for my chickens this winter. Total amount in the system is about $175. 

Bought 150lbs of wheat for feed stock from the local feed store @13.75/50lbs.

Components:

1. Rack built out of treated lumber I already had, but I'd estimate about $30 cost.

2. Bulk tank for water storage and pump to sit in was a plastic mortar mixing pan from Lowe's for $14.

3. Pump is an Eco396, Amazon for $20.49

4. Timer is a Titan Apollo 7, Amazon for $15.90 Does max of 8 different settings per 24hrs.

5. Trays are Rubbermaid FG334900WHT, 4 5/8gal, approx. 15"x20"x5", white plastic "bus" (as in restaurant dishes) trays.

6. Misc stuff: Wood screws, 4 casters for the bottom (recycled off something else), vinyl hose between pump and copper, some 1/2" copper, and a few fittings...already had most of this stuff, so I'll guess another $30 would have covered it.

Built the wood rack to hold two sets of trays, 4 on each side. I figured based on my kitchen seed flat results that one tray of fodder ought to come off the system every 8 days, so as that one is emptied, it will be refilled to start the process over.

Rack is approx 28" x 36", bigger than needed for the trays, but allows the bulk tank to sit on the bottom of the rack. I wanted the tank there so I could roll all of the unit around. That will allow me to roll the rack over someplace like the garage door to dump the bulk tank water and refill it when it needs changing.

Slats that hold the trays are sloped slightly from front to back, or back to front, alternating. I drilled a dozen small holes ( like 1/8" ) in the bottom of the trays on one end with the plan the water enters from above on the un-drilled end, floods the tray, and drains out the bottom end. It then goes into the tray below, which is the upper end of it, floods it, and drains out the lower end. Repeat for the trays below that until it drains back to the bulk tank.

Pump submerses in bulk tank, feeds thru a 5/8" vinyl hose to the 1/2" copper line on the back of the rack. I put a ball shut off valve in the line at that point to regulate the water flow in case the pump put out too much, then the line runs up to the top, where I put a T and a short section of capped off copper over the top of the two upper trays. Drilled some 1/8" holes in the copper to for the pump water to flood the tops trays.

















































This is day 5 sprouting. First couple days, I had the trays in the shop while finishing up the rack, and I think the temperature was too cool....in the mid 50's. Based on my kitchen counter growing, at day 5, these ought to have a lot of green showing. So I moved the rack into the basement near the wood stove, and the temperature is a lot closer to 70 there, so I hope to see some improvement in growth rate. May also have to tweak the pump cycles. Right now, I have it running 15 minutes, 4 times a day....may need to bump that up some. 

May also need to cut down on the amount of wheat I put in....used two Coolwhip bowls ( weighs about 1 1/2lbs ) in the first tray.....seems fairly 'thick' as it's spouted, so I've cut that back to about a pound a tray in the later trays.

It's a work in progress.











Hopefully, every 8 days it will look like these grown on the kitchen counter:


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## K.B. (Sep 7, 2012)

As with your other projects, thank you for the clear description and excellent photos. This kind of detail is very helpful to help in making the decisions for a DIY project.

I have read elsewhere that the light requirements for this process are minimal due to the fodder being used before any significant photosynthesis occurs. Have you had a chance to compare the growth and color of the fodder from one location (kitchen counter) to the basement (lower light)?

Even without the need for photosynthesis, I would expect a different development of the chloroplasts between the two. May not be a big deal as far as nutrition goes, though...

Thanks again and merry Christmas!


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

K.B. said:


> As with your other projects, thank you for the clear description and excellent photos. This kind of detail is very helpful to help in making the decisions for a DIY project.


Thanks. Former shop teacher, old habits die hard. 





K.B. said:


> I have read elsewhere that the light requirements for this process are minimal due to the fodder being used before any significant photosynthesis occurs. Have you had a chance to compare the growth and color of the fodder from one location (kitchen counter) to the basement (lower light)?


Little less than a week into this round, and so far, growth does seem slower and less green....BUT that may be due to the fact I had the temp too low for the first few days while it was in my shop before I moved it to the basement.

I had planned to put it in the new hoop house, where it would get light, but that would also require closing up the rack with plastic sheeting, and adding some supplemental heat ( probably a light bulb ), and maybe a fan/vent at some times to keep it from getting TOO hot. I'm trying to get off without adding that layer of complexity to it.

Even bought a little $18 120v controller with two pair of 15a contacts to turn on heat if needed, or turn on cooling if the temps go too high.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008KVCPH2/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## [email protected] (Apr 1, 2009)

TnAndy,could you tell me about the seed you are using from the feed mill? I use rolled and crimped oats which would probably not sprout, but I would like to set up a system also for goats and chickens for the colder an leaner as in no fresh greens time of the year, I love the simplicity of your design and if I could give them a flat once or twice a week as a supplement to their diet I think it will be a big plus.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

I'm using plain winter wheat seed....same kind I sow as a cover crop in the garden. They also have a few bags of barley seed, I'm going to try that next.

The wheat seems to be taking about a 8-9 days to 'cycle'. I plan to add another layer of trays on the bottom of the last layer ( above the tank ) to give me a 10 day cycle instead of the 8 day one I have now.


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## Raymond James (Apr 15, 2013)

I visited a sprouting operation on a dairy farm. They sprouted and then fed all their grain. 

They had no outside light , only a couple of 12 volt lights so you could see but barely . 12 volt fan to move air around. 12 volt pump to move the water . I do not recall what they did to heat it in winter. The walls seemed to be very think , they had metal on the inside of the room and out. as was the ceiling. Floor was concrete . This room was built inside of the barn. The dairy operated a generator to cool the milk then ran the poser to the room. 

I commented on the lack of light but was told it was better as they were not starting plants they were sprouting. Seems they had a window that they filled in and thought things worked a lot better without it.


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## Farmerjonathan (Mar 11, 2013)

TnAndy, to a former shop teacher from a current shop teacher! I have not done any research on the fodder systems. They have caught my eye and something I have on a list for someday. I have read on the internet on a couple of cattle forums big verbal/personal arguments concerning the value of the fodder. Some claim it is medicinal quackery. The only addition is the weight of water. I am not stating this to create friction, only to state what I have read and don't understand. Do you believe the fodder grown has more nutritional value than the seed if fed straight from the bag? And I will assume you are going to say sure it has more value due to the time, energy and expense you have put into this system. Where does the additional benefits come from and are they paying for the system and your time? Just wondering and appreciate any information you care to share. 
By the way, I am an Ag teacher that spends all of my day in the welding shop, engine shop and wood shop. What a life!


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

FJ,

Yeah....going to work is tough, isn't it ? 

NOW, here is a little secret: Being retired with a shop chock full of tools, and a homestead to play on is EVEN better.....no kids, no parents, no administrator weenies..... 

I've read the arguments back and forth about "yes you get loads of benefit", and "No, you're simply gaining water".

I lean in the direction of "yes, you're getting SOME benefit". I know the chickens will naturally RUN to green stuff over dry matter, so that tells me something. I'm fairly sure that 'living food' is better for them than dry stuff. I think there are things that 'happen' in the sprouts over dry seed in the way of nutrients, but no, I don't have any proof of it.

I can't put a pencil to it and convince you (or me) that it IS worth doing....but I have this gut feeling it is.

SO, I lean toward doing it, if nothing else them seem to go wild over it.....and a happy chicken is a working chicken !



YMMV ( Your Mileage May Vary )


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## Farmerjonathan (Mar 11, 2013)

TnAndy said:


> FJ,
> 
> Yeah....going to work is tough, isn't it ?
> 
> ...



TnAndy, 

I tip my hat to you and if we were face to face I would shake your hand. You are THE FIRST person to give me an honest answer about this fodder system. Thank you for being frank and honest.

Yeah it is a great life as long as I continue having students that want to be there (last five years have been excellent). Current administrator is appreciative of the work I do for the school and students. So it is good. Being nosy, what age did you retire and would you teach longer or retire earlier if had to do over?

Your answer about live food, I agree completely and that is exactly what interested me in the beginning. I know when summer comes how much I appreciate the food straight from the vine so to speak. 

Thank you again for your post, hope to continue talking to you about your homestead and what it is you are doing.

Jon


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Farmerjonathan said:


> TnAndy,
> 
> I tip my hat to you and if we were face to face I would shake your hand. You are THE FIRST person to give me an honest answer about this fodder system. Thank you for being frank and honest.


Just calling it like I see it, Jon.

I'm sure one can make arguments for and against it, but as I often tell folks when they ask me about something they plan to do, and I consider kinda nutty....."You know, I can't see it from my house"......ahahahaaaa




Farmerjonathan said:


> Yeah it is a great life as long as I continue having students that want to be there (last five years have been excellent). Current administrator is appreciative of the work I do for the school and students. So it is good. Being nosy, what age did you retire and would you teach longer or retire earlier if had to do over?


I'm not from here originally....came to east TN to go to ETSU ( teacher's college ) for a degree in industrial arts when I got out of the Army in 1975. Then I got into building houses ( starting with our own, to get In-State tuition  ) for a living....going full time winter quarters, and part time with building the rest of the year. 

By the time student teaching rolled around in my last year, and they sent me to a city school for that, I came away convinced I wouldn't teach in a circus like that if they gave me a whip, a chair and a .45 ! ( They REALLY ought to have folks do their student teaching as the first course ). Place was a zoo...overcrowded, under staffed, bunch of rowdy hulligans in my opinion. I almost didn't even go back to finish my degree, except my wife beat me into it.

BUT then the great housing recession of 1980-81 rolled around.....when FED chairman Paul Volker decided he was going the to hammer the Jimmy Carter inflation, and raised the FED rate to mid teens. House rates went to 15-18% (YIKES !) and construction DIED...DEAD. I sat on a spec house for 18 mo, and finally managed to sell it. Bank made $6,000 in interest, real estate guy made $3,000 in commission ( this was about a mid 50's average house for the time ), and I made $1500. I looked in the mirror and said "Nope....ain't doing all the work and taking all the risk for that kind of deal again"....and never built another spec house !

My wife ( graduated year behind me, Home Ec degree ) had found a job at a small county system (read that as "farm kids"....used to working, and far better behaved ), and she came home one day and said "The Vocational building trades guy is retiring, you ought to go apply".....thus began my teaching career. That went from 1981 to 1989. It was fun at first, I enjoyed the change. The REALLY hired me to build a baseball field house the previous guy said no to and retired. I thought "Boy, I'll teach this kids something !".....well, I don't know if they learned anything or not, but "I" got a heck of an education.....ahahahaaaaa....I'm sure we could swap stories.....but we got the project done, and I stayed around a few more years.

But eventually, it got to be like factory work to me.....same work, different faces, and I decided to go back to construction work. ( been doing it anyway on our own place...we sold the house in town and bought the current property in '82.....then moved up here in '84 when we'd finally hacked out enough trees off the mountain to have a place ).

SO, I cashed in my teacher retirement, put it in my construction business, and did specialty sub-contracting this time around.....vinyl siding, soffit, replacement windows. Also built some rental homes and a few custom homes along the way. Sold all my rentals off 2005,06, (when it looked to me like the housing market was nuts....and it was ) and pretty much retired to the 'homestead' couple years later.

Wife continued to work at the school system for a total of 32 years, becoming a supervisor about 8 years in, and she retired two years ago.

Life was always great, but it's even better now because I don't do much of anything for anyone else anymore unless it really interests me.




Farmerjonathan said:


> Thank you again for your post, hope to continue talking to you about your homestead and what it is you are doing.
> 
> Jon


Probably hard to stop me Jon....I actually enjoy teaching, and add to that, I'm a certified loud mouth, and there ya have it......ahahahaaaaa


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## bafflez (Jan 6, 2014)

Fodder as I see it, is like malting barley for beer making. When you sprout grains you increase starch content. Even though you are not roasting the sprouted seeds to convert starch to sugar like they do for beermaking, by just allowing the seeds to sprout & grow, you have at the very least, chemically changed the dormant seeds structure nutritionally.

My two cents.

-Baff.


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

silly question, maybe, but do your birds eat all the green? My turkeys ate more of it than my chickens. The chickens seemed to only really like the grains barely sprouted hardly even green. They went crazy for that, but didn't seem to really know what to do with the "grass". Maybe if they were hungrier...I can see that the growing 8 or 10 day old plant has much more mass than just the seed alone. I can see how it would really benefit rabbits goats, or sheep, though. I really like the idea and have played with it here too.


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## Fire-Man (Apr 30, 2005)

bourbonred said:


> silly question, maybe, but do your birds eat all the green? My turkeys ate more of it than my chickens. The chickens seemed to only really like the grains barely sprouted hardly even green. They went crazy for that, but didn't seem to really know what to do with the "grass". Maybe if they were hungrier...I can see that the growing 8 or 10 day old plant has much more mass than just the seed alone. I can see how it would really benefit rabbits goats, or sheep, though. I really like the idea and have played with it here too.


 
My chickens go crazy over it, eating every thing!


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## kalos72 (Aug 27, 2012)

I've looked at fodder systems as a way to become self sufficient in feeding livestock. And regardless, you still have to have some purchased input.

Either your buying your feed directly or buying the grains to sprout correct?

Is there a cost difference?


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

kalos makes a good point, what type of seeds are easy to grow without diesel on a small spread and could be used for sprouting and feeding poultry or ruminants? I know wheat can and was grown with only manpower, however, if we were back to that point, I think we would need the wheat worse for bread. Any other ideas?


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## K.B. (Sep 7, 2012)

I haven't seen people on here mention corn or sunflower seed, but I have seen mention of them elsewhere. Probably some of the easiest to grow on a small scale for seed.

I have sprouted sunflowers in the past in trays, but it was always by planting them in a couple inches of soil, then harvesting the plant above the soil line.


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