# Long shot rifle



## Rob30 (Nov 2, 2004)

I am looking for suggestions on a long shot rifle. I need to be able to shoot 2-300 yards. I currently only have a stock 303. I want something more powerful and accurate. Something older as well, I can't spend to much on it. The rifle will be used for wolves and coyotes. I will be getting a scope as well.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

Find a used Savage 110 in most any caliber. 2-300 yards is a gimme shot for a good rifle and scope, especially on targets the size of coyotes and wolves. I'd look for a 243, 25-06, 6mm, 257 Roberts, something in that range to give you good energy but not too much explosives when it hits valuable hide.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Many cartridges will work at those distances.

A 243 would be great, but the 22 calibers (223 or 22-250) could do the job too.

Anything much larger would be more power than you need, with the added expense and recoil.

In older military rifles, a 6.5 Swedish Mauser would be a good cartridge, but it's hard to mount scopes on many versions.

I'd look for a used MODERN rifle because it's more likely to be accurate, and EASIER and CHEAPER to mount a scope


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

I suggested the larger calibers because he wants to shoot wolves.


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## Dead Rabbit (Oct 30, 2010)

DPMS PANTHER .223


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

I shot a deer at 400+ yards with my .243 and it went all the way through it.


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## agmantoo (May 23, 2003)

I shoot a 22-250 with a Leupold scope (6.5 to 20 power) and as stated the yardage mentioned is not a problem. The bullet is very fast and there is little recoil. The damage done to a ground hog or a coyote is hardly imaginable. It is as if an explosion occurs. Incidently, I got a coyote this morning!

PS...study some ammunition charts for the various calibers. The 22-250 is a very flat shooting caliber. You will see from the charts that some of the recommended calibers drop drastically as the distance increases.


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## BigJ (Nov 5, 2010)

I vote for the 243, excellent at 300 yards, has plenty of power I have taken mule deer, whitetail, antelope, pig and coyotes and never had to shoot an animal twice. you can find them used pretty resonable.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hey,
I really enjoy my 243 and it will do so many differant things along with being easy to reload.
Dutch


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## foxfiredidit (Apr 15, 2003)

Everyone has great suggestions I see, so I'll vote mine in for the 25-06, and if you can find it in a Savage go for it. Other makes are good as well, 300 yds. is not a problem shot. The 257 Roberts is my second choice.


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

different places in the Ottawa Valley, I'd vote for the .243 WIN, which you can find in so many different rifles you can always get a deal.

2nd Choice, since I am in total awe of the 6.5 X 55 Swede and had 3 of em, would be the .270 Winchester, since it is basically a Beltless Magnum operating at 54K PSI, and is a basic duplicate of the 6.5 in function, and has total HOT ammo availability, like the .243 Win, at Canadian Tire & Walmart. I love to handload stuff, but if you cant, then stick to the modern calibers that are so popular and come in dozens of rifle configs.

Both the .243 & the .270 are loaded to modern pressures and can be found in all common and custom ammo brands, unlike some older calibers, and military calibers. Regardless of range an brush, IMO, the .243 & .270 will do any job given. The only exception I'd make is I'd never go looking for a griz if all I had was a .243, unless an emergency. Moose fall to .243 regularly.

DG



Rob30 said:


> I am looking for suggestions on a long shot rifle. I need to be able to shoot 2-300 yards. I currently only have a stock 303. I want something more powerful and accurate. Something older as well, I can't spend to much on it. The rifle will be used for wolves and coyotes. I will be getting a scope as well.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

a few rifels come to mind , a rem 760 or 7600 pump they are realy quite acurate and have fast follow up shots 
rem 700 
i have a cusin that has both a old savage 110 and a mossburg bolt in 243 he swears by them for wisconsin deer and most any thing else any of these should serve you well

if you can't find a deal on one of these used look at Nef Handi rifles they are acurate but lack follow up shots 

all used you should find somthing 

check out the varmint al page http://varmintal.com/
top left hand corner coyote hunting he has lots of good info on guns , scopes and calls 


your not going to want a pretty gun , cause your going to probably want to paint it camo any way 


your old brit 303 with the right reload might not be to bad to 300 yards i have seen scope mounts made for them, actualy from angle iron they screw to the left side of the reciver then have a weaver mount screwed to them
depends how low of a buget your on.

3 more rifles that are a good deal new , the stevens it is a savage 110 basicaly with a grey stock and no accutriger so basicaly an old savage 110 reciver sold under the stevens name 
the marlin edge , and the weatherby vangard all are right around 300 dollars new but are built solid


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## Dead Rabbit (Oct 30, 2010)

hes after coyotes and wolves. isnt a .243 and over a little much for this type of game? i know nothing of wolves, but coyotes are very prevalent here.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

Dead Rabbit said:


> hes after coyotes and wolves. isnt a .243 and over a little much for this type of game? i know nothing of wolves, but coyotes are very prevalent here.


The wolves around here are 80-130 lb and 36" at the shoulder. That makes them pretty much whitetail deer sized. Coyotes are a good bit smaller. 

I've shot coyotes with every imaginable caliber and gauge. They were all dead after being killed, so too much gun wasn't a problem.


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## oneokie (Aug 14, 2009)

Ed Norman said:


> so too much gun wasn't a problem.


Never knew or heard of having too much gun being a problem. Does such a situation exist? :grin:


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

oneokie said:


> Never knew or heard of having too much gun being a problem. Does such a situation exist? :grin:


Sometimes it knocks you out from under your hat, but if you cinch down the stampede string first even that isn't a problem.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

Savage 110. 

25-06.

You may want to bed the action and adjust the trigger.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

OTOH, if y'all have a bout six grand to spare, have I got a rifle for you:

http://www.jarrettrifles.com/beanfield.html

Yeah, they're that good....


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> OTOH, if y'all have a bout six grand to spare, have I got a rifle for you


Those guns are nice, but a Remington Sendero off the shelf will do all the same things.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

I like the 220 Swift that is chambered in the older Rugar with a tange safety. Second choice is the 243 , light recoil enough power to kill a wolf and deer. Ammo easy to find even at those far our of the way Mom and Pop gas stations that sell ammo

Some nice rifles with bolt actions are the winchester model 70, Remington Model 700 (my favorite in the 243), Rugar model 77's with the tang safty (mark !!'s might be ok but have butt ugly tupper wear stocks IMO.) and the Savage line of bolt actions.

Range for the 220 Swift, 22-250 and 243 is a lot more than 300 yards for the shooters who pratiacs at longer ranges.

 Al


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

Jolly said:


> Savage 110.
> 
> 25-06.
> 
> You may want to bed the action and adjust the trigger.


weigh out the cost the 111 with the acutriger and acu-stock is a bedded with ajustable trigger and safer than most light trigger jobs 

they put alluminum rails that bed the action and the barrel in the stock that do with high speed precion machining what used to take hours of hand fitting to do with glass bedding , it seems like good science i haven't shot one to be able to tell you how they are but that still puts it above my budget so the stevens or a used 110 makes the most price wise


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## doc623 (Jun 7, 2004)

What is wrong with the 303?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> What is wrong with the 303?


Most of the old military guns really aren't what *I* would call "accurate", ammo choices are limited if you don't reload (and sometimes even if you do ), and it's hard to mount scopes.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> weigh out the cost the 111 with the acutriger and acu-stock is a bedded with ajustable trigger and safer than most light trigger jobs
> 
> they put alluminum rails that bed the action and the barrel in the stock that do with high speed precion machining what used to take hours of hand fitting to do with glass bedding , it seems like good science i haven't shot one to be able to tell you how they are but that still puts it above my budget so the stevens or a used 110 makes the most price wise


I've shot them and they're accurate.

The old 110 had a decent adjustable trigger and Brownell's Accuraglass is not expensive...I just got through doing a .300 Win Mag for a friend, and while I don't have a pet load worked up yet. it'll shoot factory Remington core-loks in sub-moa groups.


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## Rob30 (Nov 2, 2004)

I should mention bears are on the rise as well. So I may have to take the odd black bear.


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## Ed Norman (Jun 8, 2002)

I'll stick with my original suggestions if you throw black bears into the mix.


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

Rob30 said:


> I am looking for suggestions on a long shot rifle. I need to be able to shoot 2-300 yards. I currently only have a stock 303. I want something more powerful and accurate. Something older as well, I can't spend to much on it. The rifle will be used for wolves and coyotes. I will be getting a scope as well.


When it comes to killing a coyote or wolf, out to 300 yards, there are several score of rifles up to the task; as seen by the numbers of calibres mentioned in this thread. _*BUT*, _there is yet another issue; Do you intend to sell the fur from these canines once they have been harvested? If so, and if you want top dollar, you will not be wanting to blow large holes through the center of your pelt profits by using some large calibre pelt destroying bullet. You will want your bullet to make as small a hole going out as it made going in; indeed, if possible, it would be much better if there were no exit hole at all.

Were it me, and it isn't me, I would opt for the smallest and flattest shooting calibre my means could acquire; any coyote, or wolf, shot through the middle of things will not go far, and in point of fact will more likely expire where the are hit, even if hit with the smallest of centerfire varmint type calibres.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I should mention bears are on the rise as well. So I may have to take the odd black bear.


You need 2 guns.

The best predator guns aren't the best for bigger game


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

i have been doing some reading up , the new savage edge or axis as they now call it.
most seem to be reporting 1/2 to 3/4 groups from the 223 ,243 but even the 30 cal. chamberings most all reviewers are under 1 MOA with many claiming 1/2 MOA from the 22s

there was a thread about the edge here a few months back that HTer was also having very nice consistant groupings and posted pics.

and most of these results are comming on factory ammo.

and it is about as easy on the budget as a strait shoooting HP rifle can be, i see an online price of 262 dollars with free shipping for the rifle without optics


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## denaliguide (Aug 30, 2008)

If your recoil sensitive, get the .243. If not, the .270. Far as I know, virtually every modern rifle in N.America is chambered in them, and I am SURE that every Walmart, and Canadian Tire carries the ammo. nuf said, imo



Haggis said:


> When it comes to killing a coyote or wolf, out to 300 yards, there are several score of rifles up to the task; as seen by the numbers of calibres mentioned in this thread. _*BUT*, _there is yet another issue; Do you intend to sell the fur from these canines once they have been harvested? If so, and if you want top dollar, you will not be wanting to blow large holes through the center of your pelt profits by using some large calibre pelt destroying bullet. You will want your bullet to make as small a hole going out as it made going in; indeed, if possible, it would be much better if there were no exit hole at all.
> 
> Were it me, and it isn't me, I would opt for the smallest and flattest shooting calibre my means could acquire; any coyote, or wolf, shot through the middle of things will not go far, and in point of fact will more likely expire where the are hit, even if hit with the smallest of centerfire varmint type calibres.


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## lonelytree (Feb 28, 2008)

Look at a 30-06. Shoot accelerators. 

If it was just coyotes and wolves I would suggest a 788 chambered in .223 or 22-250. Shoot the semifragile hollow points if you are savinh the pelts.


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## d37fan (Dec 22, 2004)

Something to consider is the H&R handi rifle, that is if you don't need an immediate follow-up shot. Don't get me wrong, you can be quick with it, just not auto quick. A new one will run in the $250 range and you can get a decent scope to go with it. Nothing against a used savage, I own some, there is just something about being the first to own a gun. I have a handi in .204 Ruger that is surprisingly accurate, and the .204 is the best pelt gun around with ballistic tips due to no exit wound. Anyway just another in the long list of ideas to consider. Oh BTW, check out H&R's accessory barrel program, a cheap way to have another caliber on hand.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

I still vote the 243 as most versital for any Ont. Can. game except the moose. I would not shy away to much even on a moose just really consider the bullet I would use. Youtes and smaller varmits includeing crows I like 85 grain HPBT by serria.
For deer and bear I like the old stand by Remington 100 Grain core locks. Probably use the 100 gr. core locks on a moose too.


 Al


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## ninny (Dec 12, 2005)

I'll second the vote on the .22-250 on coyotes. My father in law killed many a deer with his. Wouldn't use it on bear. 

.


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## lonelytree (Feb 28, 2008)

243 will tear the pelts all up.


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## uhcrandy (Sep 16, 2010)

The old SMLE 303 is a great gun. Very smooth action. The 303 is not a tremendously powerfull cartridge, but still pack a punch. It is somewhere between a 30-30 and 30-06. It would be a good choice for a longer distance, with a 180 grain boatail. Not the flattest trajectory, but consistant. Your right its not well suited to scope mounts, but can be drilled/taped bu a gunsmith. There are also many aftermarket "bolt-on" scope mounts. 
If you are sold on a new gun (and who isn't) by all means, get one. But dont be too quick to discount the british 303. They were used by british snipers very successfuly during WWI. They had a well earned reputation for smooth / simple / accurate operation.


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

If you don't want that 303 Rob put a price on it and let me know some details


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## Dead Rabbit (Oct 30, 2010)

Haggis said:


> When it comes to killing a coyote or wolf, out to 300 yards, there are several score of rifles up to the task; as seen by the numbers of calibres mentioned in this thread. _*BUT*, _there is yet another issue; Do you intend to sell the fur from these canines once they have been harvested? If so, and if you want top dollar, you will not be wanting to blow large holes through the center of your pelt profits by using some large calibre pelt destroying bullet. You will want your bullet to make as small a hole going out as it made going in; indeed, if possible, it would be much better if there were no exit hole at all.
> 
> Were it me, and it isn't me, I would opt for the smallest and flattest shooting calibre my means could acquire; any coyote, or wolf, shot through the middle of things will not go far, and in point of fact will more likely expire where the are hit, even if hit with the smallest of centerfire varmint type calibres.


this was my point. to much gun ruins the pelts. even on coyote a .22-.250 will wreck havoc on the pelt. thats why i recommended the .223

if its for just flat out killing...what the hay...use a .45/70 i got one here that will knock holy hail outa any living thing in the N. Amer. continent. me included. lol


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## lonelytree (Feb 28, 2008)

Dead Rabbit said:


> this was my point. to much gun ruins the pelts. even on coyote a .22-.250 will wreck havoc on the pelt. thats why i recommended the .223
> 
> if its for just flat out killing...what the hay...use a .45/70 i got one here that will knock holy hail outa any living thing in the N. Amer. continent. me included. lol


I used to pelt hunt coyotes in NM. 22-250, 10% below max with 53GR semifragile match grade hollowpoints. They go in the size of a dime and don't come out very often. Ballistics are actually pretty close for a .223.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I used to pelt hunt coyotes in NM. 22-250, 10% below max with 53GR semifragile match grade hollowpoints. They go in the size of a dime and don't come out very often.


Yep

It's all in which bullet you use, and *shot placement*


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

I concur it is all about the bullet slected and shot placement. Go to a varmint hunting site and do a poll. For ranges 300 yards and over the 243 will poll very high and if you stick a bit of wind in the poll percentage goes even higher. 
while the 223 is popluar it is a less than 300 yard rifle cartarage.

 Al


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