# Trees as Fence Posts



## subiej (May 11, 2015)

Hi there,

I thought this topic might like its own thread.

I am planning a low-tension, electrified, 5-line perimeter fence, and would like to use some existing lines of mature trees (mostly maple, spruce and ash) as fence "posts."

I've heard that it's a good idea to mount the insulators on some kind of narrow board (a 1x4? 1x6?), and then mount the board to the tree (with screws I guess? rubber ties?). This would hold the insulators off the trees themselves. Otherwise, the theory goes, the tree can eventually grow around the insulators and short them out. Supposedly, the board will be pushed outward by the growing tree. Of course, I also want to minimize damage to the trees, but they're pretty tough 

I also suspect that attaching all those insulators to pieces of lumber in the comfort of our barn will be much easier than attaching them individually to the trees, so there's that...

Does anyone have experience with this? 

Also, I guess I'm wondering how one might extend this system to use of a tree as a corner postâ wrap wire around tree, with boards as a buffer? I would love to hear of anyone's experience with this.

Many thanks!
Susan Johnson


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## ShannonR (Nov 28, 2012)

I have been toying with this idea myself. Let me know how it works!


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

It's better to set posts and avoid using live trees


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## subiej (May 11, 2015)

Any particular reasoning for this, Bearfootfarm? Obviously, there are blow-downs that could be a problem. Is that what you had in mind?

I'd love to be able to get the animals close to the tree line, for some summer shade. Thanks!


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

I really like these insulators on trees....

http://expandfarmproducts.com/


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

subiej said:


> Any particular reasoning for this, Bearfootfarm? Obviously, there are blow-downs that could be a problem. Is that what you had in mind?
> 
> I'd love to be able to get the animals close to the tree line, for some summer shade. Thanks!


Trees are constantly moving and growing while a fence needs to be stable.

If you want shade, run the fence outside the trees. If that's not possible, you can still get much of the shade by running the fence close to the trees. Keep in mind with electric fence any falling limbs will break or short out the wires, and you may need to mow beneath the lowest wires


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## dsmythe (Apr 21, 2013)

I fenced in 9 acres about 20 years ago. I set all of my braces in concrete. I used High Tensile wire, I put springs, and the ratchet tensioning devices on each strand. I used 2X4's fastened to any tree in the fence line with nails. I threaded on insulators on each strand and stapled them to the board. The fence is still up "after all of these years". I used the 2nd strand from the bottom as a ground, no insulators and connected to metal T Posts. The sections that ran through the trees had more problems with limbs or trees falling on them but all I need to do is cut the limb/tree off with the chain saw and ratchet the line back tight. I love this system but it does require a little more maintenance and care. I fenced all of this in by myself while I was out on medical leave after breaking my foot and wearing a surgical boot.
I would never use a tree as a brace, the wire WILL embed into the tree. Yes, the trees have pushed the board away but all I have needed to do is reattach it with the nail. I did use some screws, most of them stayed in the tree and split the board so I replaced the screws with nails when that happened.
I hope this is what you were asking and good luck with your project.


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## wy_white_wolf (Oct 14, 2004)

Be careful what you put in trees. My DD killed their cherry by putting coated screws into it.

WWW


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## subiej (May 11, 2015)

Thanks for the feedback, everybody. Yes, this is exactly what I wanted to know.

Dsmythe, it sounds as though your system is working well for you. I realize attaching to trees isn't optimal, but it's what I've got right now. Great point, about the nails vs. the screws. I had been planning on using coated screws, but after your and wy_white_wolf's advice, definitely not!

I happen to have a bunch of scrap 1x4 and 1x5 lumber I was hoping to use for this, but maybe it's worth buying 2x4 lumber, if I want it to hold up for 20 years. Assuming yours wasn't treated, dsmythe. Glad to know it's done its job!


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## j_maki (Feb 23, 2010)

We have lots of high tensil fence in the trees. I was always told not to use the trees but one fall I needed to get some fence up in a hurry and didn't have time put in posts so we used the trees. It as worked great. The first summer we had to replace some broken insulators be causes the trees grew faster than I thought and pulled the screws through the pin lock insulators. So now we just leave the screws about a quarter inch out and go around every fall and back the screws out so we are good for the next summer. I find the trees help keep the fence tight as each one acts like a little spring and keeps tension on the wires, our fence is not straight. Terminal ends have strainers and aluminum reinforced tubing as insulators, we made the loops twice as long as needed to go around the tree to account for new growth. I really wish I would have done this more, I wasted lots of time clearing fence lines cutting down trees only to replace with fence post because that is what everyone said has to be done. I do anticipate eventually I will have to go around and move each insulator down a bit but that is far less work than "planting" post.


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## subiej (May 11, 2015)

Great info- thanks so much, j_maki. I was wondering about whether the aluminum-reinforced tubing was worth the expense, but it sounds like you are happy with it. Is this what you are using on the corner trees as well? Thinking either that or these http://www.kencove.com/fence/Heavy+Duty+Lag+Corner+Insulator_detail_ILC.phpâ Heavy Duty Lag Corner Insulators from Kencove. It seems like they might pull out, though. The corners are kind of my last problem to solve before we start installing.

Thanks so much!


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## j_maki (Feb 23, 2010)

The aluminum tubing is meant for corners, that is what I use on all my corners now regardless of type of posts. Just make sure you make a big loop so the tree has room to grow. Personally I would not us lags as it just causes undue damage to the tree. Just to clarify we is pin lock insulators on all the " line" trees, I really like the pin locks as I can disconnect the wires and cross the fence wherever I want. I always run the wire so it pulls into the tree not away from it that way there is no stress on the pin lock itself.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I do anticipate eventually I will have to go around and move each insulator down a bit but that is far less work than "planting" post.


Trees grow *upwards* from the top, not from the bottom.
They grow outward at the base, and will grow around insulators or anything else attached to them


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## j_maki (Feb 23, 2010)

Always just kind of assumed there was a slight upwards growth at the trunk. I guess that will make things easier then. As far as growing around insulators that is what is nice about the pin locks, as you check your fence line in the fall just carry your cordless driver and back the screws out quarter to half an inch and there is nothing to worry about.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

j_maki said:


> Always just kind of assumed there was a slight upwards growth at the trunk. I guess that will make things easier then. As far as growing around insulators that is what is nice about the pin locks, as you check your fence line in the fall just carry your cordless driver and back the screws out quarter to half an inch and there is nothing to worry about.


I've never had to adjust any insulators on my 13 year old fence posts :shrug:

If I expect to keep animals in and predators out, I try to check the fence at least once a day, especially if there are trees close by


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## j_maki (Feb 23, 2010)

Well if you like setting posts have at it......it's far easier to adjust insulators once a year than to set dead wood back into the ground.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Unless they're 'trash trees', I'd not put screws or nails in them..... mount your insulators on a board, and 'wire' it to the tree.... as the tree grows, the wire will loosen.

Don't think you're going to keep an 'electric fence' that long though.... if there are trees present, limbs will fall, and the line will be down...


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

j_maki said:


> Well if you like setting posts have at it......it's far easier to adjust insulators once a year than to set dead wood back into the ground.


I never said anything about "easier"
I said "better"


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