# Bed and Breakfast anyone?



## th_Wolverine (Apr 15, 2013)

One thing I want my homestead to be capable of doing eventually is being profitable enough to allow me to share my blessings with others. So this brought to question, would a _bed and breakfast_ be a way to help pay the few bills every month?

Anyone own one? Any Idea what it takes to start one other than an IKEA futon and some scrambled eggs? I know some of it depends on WHERE you're located, what if I'm located within 25 minutes of a major vacation destination (Kentucky Lake, Paris Landing TN)? It seems like it wouldn't be that hard to start up, and fresh eggs and farm fresh produce seem like somthing I'd take over a motel 8 any day.....

But I'm new to all this, so thats why I'm asking. Wanna get all my homework done before I throw all my chips in at once


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## Belfrybat (Feb 21, 2003)

I don't own a B&B but have stayed in several. I prefer the ones with a separate entrance from the main home, even a separate building. I also don't like the ones filled with antiques. Give me a plain simple room with amenities like in-room coffee/tea maker, WIFI connection, a comfortable chair and hopefully walking distance (or very short drive) to local attractions. If I were married or travelling with a companion, I'd want either two beds or a king sized -- not a double because "it's an antique". 

I have friends who have a B&B about 10 miles from Fredericksburg, TX, a huge tourist attraction. Theirs is a separate building with living room, kitchenette and four bedrooms. They also have a swimming pool and clay tennis court. They specifically do not cater to families with children. From what I hear, they stay busy all year around.


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## nwcountry (Apr 22, 2013)

I am only coming from a "visitor to B&B's" point of view as well. I think the hardest part of a B&B might be the food end of it as well as liquor license if you want to serve wine. Probably have to have the whole food inspection thing they do for restaurants etc.

Other then that, I think it would be a great way to have company once in awhile and meet new people! I think you are right to be close to some sort of entertainment like a town, or maybe a lake where "I" could kayak, :thumb:

Denise


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## nwcountry (Apr 22, 2013)

I also agree with all of Belfrybat's suggestion (no antique clutter and teeny beds, LOL). I think a "cement pond" would be a real draw!


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## th_Wolverine (Apr 15, 2013)

hahahah ok that makes sense. I tossed around the idea of making a hobbit hole bed and breakfast in an earthcovered BnB with a Green round door XD But I mean, my house and such are going to have the colonial and pioneer log feel to them, so maybe a small separate cabin to the side with simply a bedroom and easy access to the dining room in the mornings for breakfast? Maybe have the modern Appalachian log cabin feel to it rather than stuffy old antiques?


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## MJDC (Mar 26, 2013)

Maybe forget the breakfast part and put small kitchen amenities and fixings in the room. Simpler and a lot of people would rather not have to see strangers in the morning. If you could offer some home comforts, privacy and a nice setting that isn't fussy or invasive, that could be attractive. You could also offer it to local businesses for long term arrangements for visitors at a special rate. Business people might appreciate comfort, simplicity and privacy that isnt a cold motel/hotel room and you could offer a bettter rate than a hotel would. It could provide more regular income during the weeks off season.


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## th_Wolverine (Apr 15, 2013)

MJDC said:


> Maybe forget the breakfast part and put small kitchen amenities and fixings in the room. Simpler and a lot of people would rather not have to see strangers in the morning. If you could offer some home comforts, privacy and a nice setting that isn't fussy or invasive, that could be attractive. You could also offer it to local businesses for long term arrangements for visitors at a special rate. Business people might appreciate comfort, simplicity and privacy that isnt a cold motel/hotel room and you could offer a bettter rate than a hotel would. It could provide more regular income during the weeks off season.


Well I do like making dinner more than breakfast, what about an inn where you are provided with the means to make your own breakfast and an option to be brought dinner "room service"?

And as for marketing; how would you dig into the vacation niche at a vacation town and lake resort?


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## nwcountry (Apr 22, 2013)

Whoa, I like this idea way better!! A more homey place when you're on business or other trip. Good for a writer to rent!! Denise:kung:




MJDC said:


> Maybe forget the breakfast part and put small kitchen amenities and fixings in the room. Simpler and a lot of people would rather not have to see strangers in the morning. If you could offer some home comforts, privacy and a nice setting that isn't fussy or invasive, that could be attractive. You could also offer it to local businesses for long term arrangements for visitors at a special rate. Business people might appreciate comfort, simplicity and privacy that isnt a cold motel/hotel room and you could offer a bettter rate than a hotel would. It could provide more regular income during the weeks off season.


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## Raymond James (Apr 15, 2013)

Check with you local visitors center, chamber of commerce. Also current local B&B owners.

Ask about rules that apply in your area. Check with your insurance agent. Check with a B&B owners association to research options. Many B&B comply with voluntary rules and voluntary inspections done by the association. 

Many establishments that are called B&B are not legally a B&B. I know of one that routinely serves 100 people for dinner and serves alcohol. They have a food permit, alcohol license and are inspected by the city fire marshal. 

B&B's in wine country meet department of agriculture licensing requirements for a winery. This license allows the winery to sell wine, most states it must be wine they made on site. To serve beer or hard alcohol they need a license same as a bar. A couple of rooms that they rent out have nothing (legally) to do with the wine they serve. 

In Missouri the Department of Health defines a B&B as - the owner must live on site. No more than 4 rooms (5 or more is a lodging establishment and requires a lodging license same as any hotel/motel). If Breakfast is the only meal served no food permit is required by the state . Some cities/counties may have a local food code/rule that requires a food permit. Rural area not likely to have this. 

More than 4 rooms, meals other than breakfast served, no owner on site then other rules Food / lodging apply. 

Best bet research your local city/county/state Health/Fire to figure out what is required. Check with the B&B association on what they require join. If a permit is required in your area (building, septic, food, lodging, fire/occupancy) ask the local agency to meet with you so you can ask questions. I always wanted to do this at the person proposed place so I could see what they were talking about. Rather than quote a book I tried to offer multiple suggestions on how they could comply with the rule (s). 

Some of these rules seem over the top but then- A full service restaurant opened in a former garage without obtaining any advise or business license. At the time a food permit was not required in the county. Still not required by the state. No building, planning, zoning laws. 

So they open an a day of two latter I am driving by when I notice lots of cars parked and a sign for a restaurant. Lots of issues with sanitation, food temps, improper handling do to lack of knowledge . However no training, supervision can make up for things like.... 

NO hand sinks- hard to wash hands with no sinks. 

Very low ceiling over unvented hot water dishwashing machine- ceiling fell that afternoon due to the moister.

No ventilation in kitchen and a extremely small passage way between a gas stove and refrigerator- less than 6 inches. You had to squeeze you way into the kitchen in this 6 inch wide opening. Once in the kitchen no windows or doors to the outside. The 275 lb cook passed out in the kitchen and the only way into or out of the kitchen was to drag them over the hot stove top. 

Septic system failed - it was design to handle a single toilet/sink used by 2 guys 40 hours a week - for a small garage . Not to handle water waste from a kitchen serving 600 meals a day and three hand sinks / two toilets serving hundreds every day. 


Insurance companies would not insure- there words fire trap. No fire exits, no detectors, no alarms, no sprinklers, no vent hood or extinguishing system over stove or fire extinguishers. No rules so not required by government but hard to do business with no insurance. 

The business failed in only a few weeks despite trying very hard to comply with rules (after they opened ). They had good tasting food, lots of customers/traffic. But with sewage on the floor it is hard to sell food. 

The first thing to know about restaurants they are usually located in a town because that is where there is septic and potable water.

So please do your research and remember with B&B many people will not stay if you are not a member and pass audits/ inspections done by the B&B association the time to figure out how to pass those audits is before you build/remodel.


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## whodunit (Mar 29, 2004)

th_Wolverine said:


> Well I do like making dinner more than breakfast, what about an inn where you are provided with the means to make your own breakfast and an option to be brought dinner "room service"?
> 
> And as for marketing; how would you dig into the vacation niche at a vacation town and lake resort?


We stayed at a B&B like this during our honeymoon. They had fresh eggs, bacon, danishes, etc. and the means to cook them right in the room. It might also avoid having to go through all the "restaurant" law hoops and hurdles.


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## MJDC (Mar 26, 2013)

I think once you start providing food preparation of any kind, you are buying into a lot more govt. interference and red tape, and I doubt you want lot of that. Check into local regulations or a local B&B owner who might have advice (maybe not so local as to be a competitor for business, not sure about that!)

I guess this was covered basically, anything beyond breakfast for a few guests and you are a restaurant. If you like to cook, you might want to add a small restaurant to your plan eventually. . . I think a "serviced apartment suite" might be a good idea to find long term guests, minimal problems and less overall hassle with govt regulations. If that is impractical for the business needs of your area,stick with the B&B. 

A big thing around here (in more urban areas) are "pop up restaurants". As you are in a resort area, I will tell you of a fun thing I remember from my childhood when I was staying in a resort area on the San Juan Islands in WA state. There was a family that took an empty lot in town(had a nice view of the water) and had set up a BBQ outside. Literally, they had a paid backyard style BBQ for tourists in town, and it was so simple it was ridiculous-grilled burgers/hot dogs (made right in front of you like a home BBQ), bins of icy sodas, potato salad and chips. Literally, that is all they served, there were porta potty stations at the edge of property and they charged a few bucks a head ($ back then, but all inclusive and in a tourist town). I still remember it, it was great fun. The sun was shining, sky was blue, water sparkled. That was over 35 years ago and it did really make an impression. They probably didn't have a lot of regulations OR overhead and I am pretty sure they made some good money. (this was back in the day when an order of nuns ran the ferry concession on one of the islands, so it was pretty old school).


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## ldc (Oct 11, 2006)

Most libraries have books on how to start a B & B. There are lists in these books for local B&B assoc. in each state, the latest on laws and how/who to call, etc. How much liability, fire, etc. Good luck!


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## eyeofthestorm (Mar 21, 2008)

We owned/ran a BnB for a couple years. We'd still be doing it, but other things (family life) forced our hand in making choices.

That said, I strongly recommend you spend some time reading on http://www.innspiring.com/. I've not been on there since we closed (a while), but it's an active forum compromised mainly of people who are doing it right now -- read the things they have to deal with, give it some thought. A lot of thought. We found it to be a very enjoyable endeavor, but many people who get into it come to the realization that running a BnB is NOT what they thought it would be.

There has been a lot of commentary in this thread about regulations...I strongly suggest you simply find out what YOUR local code (state, county, and municipal, if applicable) says. We could serve breakfast to our guests (without a commercial kitchen), but no other meals. I set up a service where guests could order dinners, which I had brought in by a local caterer. There's always some sort of work around, but you really want to stay within the parameters of the law.

Insurance is...interesting. Personally, I wish from the beginning we'd selected a company that specializes in BnB's. Once we switched, it made all the difference in the world.

You probably (really) also want to join PAII. They give many webinars that are free to members -- these were invaluable BEFORE we opened. After, it was just okay, but it was good to be listed with them (some guests like to see you're a member).

For us, the biggest stumbling block with the amount of time and the amount to do. Marketing easily took as much time as everything else combined. We were small -- small town, small quantity of rooms -- so there wasn't really a budget for outsourcing marketing. But, I do think it would have been doable under other (personal) circumstances.

Good luck. Running a BnB, you will meet a few stinkers, but the vast majority of people are just really nice, and there aren't many other ways in the world that you get to meet interesting people -- who come to you -- and pay to do so


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