# Silkworms



## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

The newest form of my fiber insanity has arrived. Actually they have been here, I was hoping they would have hatched by now, but all along knew they wouldn't yet. 

What can I say, I am an impatient type.

I ordered them from Buy My Bugs. She also carries the food for them for those of us who have no access to mulberry leaves. With very good instructions too. She also included some preservative.

Here was the package I recieved in the mail. She sent it out on a Monday, I recieved it Tuesday.









I know, it doesn't look like much. 

The eggs actually hibernate. The breeder puts them in the fridge until ready to ship. They are very small. Here is a horrible picture of the eggs close up. 










The eggs need a slight amount of humidity to hatch. I placed a folded paper towel at the bottom of an old pie pan. Here is another picture.








On the corners I dropped a few drops of water. Not to much, as I don't want the eggs to mold. Silkworms are sensitive to a couple of things, mold and bacteria. 

They should hatch out in about 10 days. I covered the pie pan with plastic wrap placing a couple of holes in it. 80 seems to be the ideal temp. We are snowing here, yesterday and early this a.m., the air temp it is not warm enough without a little boost. So I am putting them under a small watt lightbulb.

A good start or so I hope. And, if I totally flub this..... I have all these witnesses.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Thanks for sharing! This project looks really cool. I know this is a kind of dumb question....what do you do with the silk? I'm assuming it is really fine. I read the web sites posted on the other thread and I'm pretty sure I know how to proceed up through the unwinding process.....but what then? How do you use it ? Can't wait to see how you do!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Aunt C said:


> And, if I totally flub this..... I have all these witnesses.


 :baby04: 

Aunt C, you crack me up!

Can't wait to raise silk worms vicariously through you!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

TxGypsy,You can make the threads as fine or thick as you like, and use for things like needlework or accent weaving. Silk takes dyes wonderfully.

Or.....you can degum the buggers and card and spin. You can blend with other fibers and spin the whole lot up. 

Personally I am hoping this works, raising the worms thing. I would like to order more or even let some of mine hatch out to adult and lay more eggs. I have so many ideas for silk. I love using hankies but they are soooo expensive.
Anyway my goal is..... I made a wonderful wool comforter for DH and I and I would love to try and do the same with a silk blend. I would love to do silk alone but, wow, that would take alot of worms. 
I also makes bath products. Silk is a wonderful addition to lotions and soaps.


Cyndi, I am so glad I could give you a chuckle.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Sitting back and eagerly watching to see how things progress. Silk worms....my husband will kill me....where can I put the silk worms.


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## littlebird (Mar 30, 2007)

OMG, I was so sad when I realized that mulberries don't grow up here, and you're telling me that there is FOOD YOU CAN BUY?!!

Where is that website and my credit card?

DH will kill me if I get silkworms. He hates my composting worms, and silk worms are uglier.

You know I'm going to get some anyway though...


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I bought them on ebay and she doesn't have any listed right now. I emailed and asked if she would have more soon.

My biggest thing is the chow. I think I can let a couple of my worms hatch out to moth and breed so eggs shouldn't be a problem.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

This site is SO COOL!

http://www.wormspit.com/bombyxsilkworms.htm

I found it while looking for information on Bombyx Silk


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

The seller of the worms relisted some. Here is her lsitings http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQfgtpZ1QQfrppZ25QQsassZbuymybugs

There is another informative site on raising them too. It is geared toward a reptile keeper but still has great info on raising them as well as feeding. The breeder sent me the page. I'll post directions to it in a bit.
My grandson is really being a pill this a.m. and I am shocked I have gotten this far. Actually he is the real reason behind my thoughts on raising these buggers. Spinning is out of the question with him around. I am hoping he will take an interest in the buggas. I also needed something to fix that fiber itch. I have visions of silky/wool batts laying around everywhere.


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## holleegee (Mar 3, 2005)

http://www.aurorasilk.com/index.html

Another site for silkworms!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Cool site!


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Oh this is going to be such fun watching this experiment.

I read something not too long ago, of course I can't remember where I read it  Anyway, the silk from Buddhist countries is darker because they do not believe in killing things and therefore let the moths hatch and then use the cocoons after they have hatched out. It is still a beautiful silk, just a bit more rustic looking.

Please keep posting pictures!

BTW what are those white balls in that other baggie?


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Sorry March, those are a food grade preservative for the worm food. Which I did make up a batch the other night. I'll get pictures and post them. I don't have a microwave so I made it on the stove top. You just add about 5 of those little balls to 3/4 cup of water and stir until they disolve. Then add 1/4 cup of the chow mix and whisk up real well. It smells like a mixture of spirilina and moss. After it is well blended you cook on medium heat stiring constantly until it reaches full boil, reduce heat simmer for a few minutes. I put it in a glass casserole pan, covered with plastic wrap an dput in the fridge. I guess it keeps for 6 weeks in the fridge.

Still no hatching action. They are kept around 76-78 so I don't know if that delays it or not. Today will be day 7 that they were removed from the fridge. So honestly I do need to wait another 3-5 days. I am jsut such an impatient type.

Oh I forgot to tell everyone. 100 hatching eggs cost me $6 and that includes shipping. The chow, for 1/4 pound mix which would actually feed about 500 critters, was $4.00 with $2.00 shipping so this venture has set me back a whole $12. Hatch rate runs 90-95% so I am looking at less than $15, electricity for cooking chow and lights ect., for 30 silk handkies (if I wanted to make handkies that is). 
1000 would be $15 and the chow would be $7.50 with $3. shipping so a total of $25.50 for a hatch of 900+. With extras you could still figure 300 handkies for $30. :hobbyhors

Edited because my fingers got ahead of my brain


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Aunt C once they hatch how will you contain them? I would be climbing the walls having to wait for those to hatch. This is so fascinating thought. Thank you for sharing all of this with us.

BTW, is there any sort of warranty if they don't hatch?


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

G U E S S what I........ got. 


BABIES. 


Well just one so far, but I was soooo very happy to see the bugger. 

Now I have heard that most hatch out the same day but you should expect a few early birds. He is so very tiny and I placed a bit of food in there for him to munch on. 

That reminds me, I do have to get pictures of the worm chow. That cracks up my hubby. He wants to know if it came from Purina. 


Oh sorry March, you don't really have to worry about containing them. They don't go anywhere. That was a big attraction for me. I don't want bugs crawling around the house.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Where there was one.....now there is two.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

PICTURES :dance: Congratulations Mom!!!!!! Roll up some mulberry leaves and pass them around.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I think I counted 14 more this am. 

Here are some pictures, it is tough to get good closeups of something this small with my digital. The first is them on the chow and it is on a paper towel.If you look close you can see a bunch crawling around on the food.









Here is a picture of two of them next to a 000 craft brush to give you an idea of how tiny they really are. They are about the size of a lowercase i, minus the dot.


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## holleegee (Mar 3, 2005)

aawwww they are so cute (in their own way I guess.) My daughter wants to do this for 4-H next year.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Those pictures turned out great! Very cute and sooooo tiny. I suppose they grow fast. How long till they begin to cocoon?


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

It will take a whle before they cocoon out. However they are already putting out silk threads.

These little buggers eat at least 4 times a day. About 1/8 of a teaspoon right now, cut off the main portion and put on the towel. I don't feed them in the middle of the night, but I am sure they would like it if I did. The chow dries out and gets hard so I need to move them to the fresh food. At least for now while they are so small. It is an interesting procedure.They don't move around very much or very well.
To move the buggers I was trying a piece of paper and sliding that under them, but that wasn't working to well. I now use the tiny paintbrush gently scooping them up utilizing the silk thread.
Today, I had 6 more hatch out so far. We will seee what the rest of the morning brings.


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## swamp_deb (Jan 9, 2004)

Fascinating reading and pictures, looks like success, congratulations!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Wow!!! go worms, go worms, go worms!!!


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

This is SO interesting! Thanks for sharing it with us, Aunt C!!!


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## vickiesmom (Feb 25, 2005)

Oh LOrd...why did you have to post this??? I want to try it too. Every time I see people in Asia making silk, I think "Gee, if I were there"...now you tell me it is possible here! Next thing, I want a water buffalo...have wanted one since I was a kid. Would the silk worms do well in Michigan??


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

vickiesmom said:


> Would the silk worms do well in Michigan??


 :happy: Sure they will......I live in Montana. 

They are kept indoors and don't take up much room at all. They also won't climb out of your conatiners so I am thinking of those under the bed plastic boxes for larger amounts of worms.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Yeah, you've got me hooked, too. I've raised plenty of other insects, why not another one! You've already got me planning, but I'm going to wait and see how things go for you first!  

Meg


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## Katherine in KY (May 11, 2002)

Aunt C, thanks so much for this post. I've read a lot about people raising silk worms and seen them reeling the silk to spin, but to see the actual little buggers is fascinating. This may be something for the "to do" list--who would have thought you'd be spinning your own home-grown silk in Montana


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Well, it's update time. I am typing holding a fussy yet active toddler, so please excuse any typos. 
These little guys are getting big. all I do is feed them and occasionally move them to a clean paper towel.

This picture was taken on the 16th









And this was taken today. I put my little paint brush in there so you can see how much they have grown.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Wow!


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Marchwind said:


> Wow!


You're not kidding!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Grow babies, grow!


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

What kind of hatch success did you end up with? Definately going to put this on my 'gotta try this one day' list!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Are you all ready for an update and more pictures?

These pictures were taken on the 26th of June.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

This picture didn't turn out well but I wanted to include it to show how large these buggers are getting. That is the same 000 paint brush I have used in all the pictures.











Here are more pics. All of these were taken on the 30th
In this first one you can see how they are all different sizes.









This is hard to see but it is a picture of the casings. They are so neat when they shed their skins. They wander over to the side of the group and stick their bottoms on the paper towel. They raise up like the food dance (I'll post a picture of that too.) then they walk out of their old skin. It is really interesting and they leave these small casings behind.











Here is one doing the food dance.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

My hatch rate was less than I had hoped for. It was more than likely my weather. The days before they got here we had snow and cold. The eggs are not supposed to get cold once they have been taken out of the refridgerator. I only have 42 worms.


I really wanted to try unrealing the silk but have decided I don't have it in me to kill these buggers so I will let them all hatch out to moths. I can still degumm them and spin the cacoons so that won't be bad. Maybe subsiquent batches I won't be so sentimental about.

My daughter was worried about the moths flying around the house but they don't last but a few hours to a few days. The adults of the silk worm families have no mouths, so they die after mating and sometimes before of starvation. Also these guys don't wander. The wings are to small to support them in flight.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Aunt C said:


> My hatch rate was less than I had hoped for. It was more than likely my weather. The days before they got here we had snow and cold. The eggs are not supposed to get cold once they have been taken out of the refridgerator. I only have 42 worms.
> 
> 
> I really wanted to try unrealing the silk but have decided I don't have it in me to kill these buggers so I will let them all hatch out to moths. I can still degumm them and spin the cacoons so that won't be bad. Maybe subsiquent batches I won't be so sentimental about.
> ...



You are really talking me into trying this....

An almost 50% hatch rate on your first try is better than many people get with a poultry incubator, and there's more info out on those!

And having them not be mobile is a plus, too. I raise mealworms from time to time, and they don't go anywhere, either, so they're easy.

Yeah...I'm rapidly being converted.....you enabler, you! 

But, hey...I teach biology, so I can keep them in my office and nobody will care!

Meg


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Thanks for keeping us updated, Christy. It's amazing how fast they are growing!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Here are a couple pics from today. This one has a big one and a small/medium. Most of these are in between these sizes.









Here are a few more, including the tiny guy. I don't know what is wrong with him but his bottom is very dark and he is very small.









Here is another










Do you see all the droppings they have left? This is just today as this A.M. I changed out the towel. It is almost time to move them into their bigger homes.


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## Katherine in KY (May 11, 2002)

Fascinating, Aunt C!


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Thanks Aunt C! I'm looking forward to the next update!


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## gracegarden (Mar 30, 2007)

This is the best silkworm site! So practical, and great pictures!

I hope you like it -- it is so educational  

http://www.wormspit.com/index.htm


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## vickiesmom (Feb 25, 2005)

I gotta get a house so I can try so much of the stuff I learn on this website, I probably wouldn't be as broke as I am....but silkworms sound cool!!! :dance:


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

:Bawling: Tiny Guy died. He was the little one on my hand, in the picture above.
I had two very very small ones that just don't seem to want to grow and now Tiny Guy has died. Just Teeny is left.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

My sympathies Aunt C. It's hard to raise anything and have it not make it when you've urged it on and taken special care of it. Hopefully things will go better with teeny.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

I'm sorry, Aunt C. I know you have gotten attached to the little guys.

I do want you to know that you've inspired me to get some silkworms. I have a short trip to the field coming up, and when I get back, I'm ordering eggs and feed! And it's all your doing! 

I think that's step 12, but I skipped step 10.......

Meg


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Thanks, I never in a million years thought I would get attached to a WORM or 4 dozen. 


Meg, you will love them. They are a great stress reliever. I have mine where I can see them when I am at the desk. Not fo rmuch longer though, they are really getting big and I need to move them to roomier quarters.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Aunt C said:


> Thanks, I never in a million years thought I would get attached to a WORM or 4 dozen.
> 
> 
> Meg, you will love them. They are a great stress reliever. I have mine where I can see them when I am at the desk. Not fo rmuch longer though, they are really getting big and I need to move them to roomier quarters.


Aunt C., you get as attached as you want to to your silkworms. Fondness knows no species boundaries! Being able to get attached to the less universally appealing critters shows someone with a loving heart.

After mine come out of the incubator, I think I'm going to take some of them to work and keep them on my desk. They'll be a hit! :nerd: 

Meg


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Well I don't think Teeny is going to make it either. 



Here are some more pics. I think these guys are ready to start spinning.

These are pictures from the 5th. See how big they look in my hand!

















These are pictures from today. I have them ranging in size from 1 1/2" to 3"
These are in my daughters hand.



















Here is their last home. I have their paper towel tubes cut and ready for them.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

I'm getting so excited!! Thanks for the update!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Wow! This is so cool!! I really appreciate you sharing these pictures!!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Teeny didn't make it.

The rest are munching away in there. Some are giving me indications that something is about to happen.

When they were smaller they would throw out alot of silk strands. Everyday, I change out the paper towel and it would have large amounts of silk in the area that I put the food down. Sometimes, I would have to extract a couple little ones that got buried in it. As they got bigger they stopped doing this. Well a couple are starting to do it again. They are also quieter, setting off to the side and not eating as much.

Years ago, I had a book that had a small amount of information about the silk trade. A small silk operation. There were women who's only job was to encourage the larva to eat. They used feathers to prod them. I try to encourage them to eat too, but it is not my only job. I keep the chow availabe at all times, even at night. I place slices in for them before I go to bed. 
I also handle them very gently. That is what I used the little paint brush for, I could grab some of the silk strands and lift them to the clean towells. Now they are bigger more hardy I can gently pick them up by hand. Sure makes moving them quicker. 
I am going to let them hatch out and lay eggs. With this chow available and reasonably priced too, I don't have to wait for a certain time of year to do this.


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## Simpler Times (Nov 4, 2002)

Hey Christy. I have to jump in and tell you that you have inspired me too! Your picture log has been great. I ordered 1000 eggs and have just started the hatch out process. Pretty neat stuff. You mentioned doing it all times of the year using chow, what are you planning on doing with the cocoons/silk? Are you going to use it personally or try to market it? I am intrigued with both reeling and using the spent cocoons but, like you, I will probably allow the moths to emerge. There is a great video clip on YouTube of a guy pulling out several cocoons at once and stretching them over an inverted 2' x 2' U wire frame. He does that several times, stretches one group on top of another, then pulls them off the frame as a composite of groups, wrings them out, and places them in a box beside him. The product isn't a hankie but I'm not sure what you would call it. I'm also not sure what the next step would be, i.e. whether the material would then be spun or used someway like it is. I don't have a link because I accessed YouTube on another computer. I have dialup at home and can't download video clips. Anyway, just search YouTube under silkworm and you should be able to find it. If I remember right it is on about the second or third page or search results and the title frame will have a guy on it sitting by the inverted U frame.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

1000 eggs, yahoo!!! I hope you have fun.

I am going to hog all the silk for my own use.


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## gracegarden (Mar 30, 2007)

http://www.wormspit.com/index.htm
I posted this site earlier in the thread but I guess you'all didn't notice.
(Or maybe you're ignoring me?  )

Either way...it has great pics as well, and lots of information on raising these guys.

Aunt C, I can't wait to see your pics on them spinning!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Sorry Grace, I didn't mean to ignore you.

Wormspit is a great site. 

Holleegee also posted a link for another good one too
http://www.aurorasilk.com/raisesilk/index.shtml 


I found my best information was from a site that raises these guys to feed Chameleons. They are lacking in the cocoon department, for obvious reasons. But as far as getting them to grow and getting the best hatch rate it was a good site. The eBay seller sent me the link and I am having trouble finding it again.


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## Simpler Times (Nov 4, 2002)

I think the link you are looking for Aunt C is http://www.chameleonnews.com/silkworms.html


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Yep, thats the one. Thank you so much.

I love the info they have esp. concerning the chow. Since I don't have access to Mulberry leaves. Also I can raise them year round on chow and not have to wait for the trees to leaf out.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

I was googling silkworms and browsing through different sites when I ran across something shocking. Can you believe that folks buy tomatoe hornworms!! Some poor misguided soul actually perpetuates the evil little garden destroyers! I couldn't believe it. I'm still in shock.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Yea they sell those evil buggers for feeding the chameleons. I recommend them on my turtle site too.


Well my babies are spinning. I have a few getting very comfortable. I also have had a few that have died. I am not sure what is going on, but I have had a terrible loss the last 12 hours.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

:Bawling: 
My son came home late last night and saw my worms had eaten all their food. He didn't know where the food was so he fed them leaves from a tree in my yard. He felt it would be ok since he saw other catepillars eating them. 

I don't know how many will survive.
So far I have three spining. They must not have eaten the leaves. I have 12 dead so far and many more are not acting right. Also their bodies have turned from pure white to bands of dark grey and white.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

oh no!!! To come so far!


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

I suppose the good side is that your son did what he thought he should, feed mom's pillars. I think my son would have let them starve :grump: Im sorry this happened but he was only trying to help and I bet he feels really rotten about it. You have raised a thoughtful son Aunt C.

Maybe they will be okay, lessons learned all around I guess. Keep us posed on how they do.

I cant wait until they finish spinning this is just so cool. Thank you again for being willing to post about your whole experience for us.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

Aunt C, I hope you save enough that you can breed your own babies....if you do have moths that lay eggs, you will get quite a few from each moth. It will just set you back for a year. 

I'm not even a spinner (yet ), but I've been following this story and loving the pictures, because I collected eggs from a cecropia moth, years ago, and raised them until they formed cocoons, and know just how exciting this is for you. It's been exciting for all of us.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I have pictures. I just haven't downloaded them yet. I have a couple pics of the cocoons in progress.

I am so heartbroken over this. I know Shawn never intended to hurt them. He thinks he was helping.

Some of them seemed to overcome the effects, some didn't. I don't know what type of treee it is. In the spring it blooms heavenly little white flowers, very fragrant and they last about 3-5 days. Then it leaves out green. Now it is a purple and there are small uniformly sized berries that look dark blue. The new growth of leaves is green and that is what he said he gave them. I have never seen birds eating the berries of this tree but like my son, I have seem catepillars. Last year it was full of cocoons from the Cercropia moths. I think they are just wonderful. *Naturewoman* you are so very lucky to have raised them.

I just wonder if this will set me back a whole year. I have read conflicting reports. Some say you can start them again in 3 months with chow. Others say this one was breed to not need hibernation. Maybe I will have enough eggs to try both ways.

I found a good supply of food. Mine have already gone through what they said would feed 500. But they are huge/ or they were. I am going to sign off now. This has just made me so ill.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

naturewoman said:


> I'm not even a spinner (yet ),


Hang on this forum long enough and you will be!!


Oh FOLD!!!


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## Simpler Times (Nov 4, 2002)

Your loss has made me ill too. I read your post this morning and just didn't have the words to reply till now. You have invested so much effort and caring to have it bottom out at the very end! On the bright side though you do have some survivors and they will yield tons of eggs! I, like you, have read conflicting reports on how much cold time the eggs need. I think I would be tempted to try and hatch some immediately, some after a week in the fridge, some after a month, etc. Have you found Mulberry Farms for a feed supply? That is the best price I have found on it but its in very large quantities.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

You know, out of all the eggs I collected, and all the baby catapillars I had hatch out, I only ended up with about five that actually made it to cocoon stage. I'm wondering if that might not be the norm...but then I haven't looked at the silkworm sites to see if they give statistics on that. And it seems that once they got to be a few inches long, they survived...it was the tiny ones that died.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I love the prices at Mulberry Farms. I was going to order the 50lb bag of food. I can store the bulk in my freezer so no problems there.

A couple more are spinning today.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Hi Naturewoman, good to see you here too! What did you raise your catapillars for? Do you have any pictures?

AuntC I'm happy to hear you have more spinning.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Update and more pics.
A couple of notes. I see where some people use egg cartons. I would not do so unless you use natural cardboard ones. These guys are chewing on these toilet paper tubes. Also the cardboard box I have them in was for canned goods. These guys are so very sensitive I did have a plastic shoe style box but decided not to use it. Maybe I should have. They couldn't have eaten it and it would have been easier to keep clean.

Here are some of my babies that died. :Bawling: 








See the dark spots behind this ones head?










On a better note here is what they look like spinning. 
This is the start, on the bottom left. He is building a sling. They are like spiders in a way. They start by putting up a frame work. This was last night









Here is what he looked like this a.m. You can still see his outline in there.









This is a different one after a day and a half.










A face only a mama could love.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

MW, I raised them out of curiousity, because I've always loved insects, and the cepropia moth is so large and beautiful, I was hoping to see them hatch out and fly around my yard. I never did see them hatch...the disapeared from the lilac bush I put them in to winter over (since lilac was listed as one of their foods). I think something ate them.

Many years ago, in Colorado, I found the moth on a path at work, laying in the snow, and thought she was dying...so brought her inside to warm up and observe her. She was not moving much, but once she warmed up, she climbed a fabric cube wall and started laying eggs on the fabric. I knew they wouldn't survive there, so I collected them and bought a tiny fish tank to raise them in. 

It was a fascinating experience...they start out so tiny you can barely see them...tiny black wiggly dots, and end up about three inches long. I did have a picture of one of the adult caterpillars, but haven't seen it in a long time, so don't know where it is.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

AuntC, those are great pictures...especially the face! 

How many do you still have alive?


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

28 are left. Some of the ones I thought had died actually started twitching and seem to have overcome the effects. Others that were doing ok are gone. I lost two of them this a.m.. When they stop moving, I put them in the glass pyrx containers to see if they will snap out of it or not. Most have not. I started out with 42, 44 if you count Tiny and Teeny. 14 have died in the last day and a half.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Last year my daughter and I were working in our greenhouse when we found a huge moth in one of my plants. 
Of course we took lots of pictures. (locked in my dead computer) and saved it until Dad got home from work so he could see too, before we turned it loose.

Then we researched what it was. It was a cepropia moth. Google it, they are beautiful. We live in Montana so we don't get Luna's so this was a real treat. Then we found the catepillars all over in our lilac hedge as well as the tree out front. They wintered over and this spring I had these beautiful moths all over my yard. That was a wonderful treat.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Christi look at those babies, they are amazing. This is so fun to watch. Did that one guy have another in his little hidey hole, it looked like there were two in there.

I think we get Luna moths here, I know we used to in Michigan. I wonder if we get Cepropia up here. I'm going to have to check this out.

I have a ton of Monarchs here, I have a huge patch of milkweed Ive encouraged for years. I love to go out there and watch the caterpillars in all their stages. Is especially exciting when I find a cocoon. God those are beautiful things.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

So wonderful! I'm definitely going to try some! Woohoo! What an inspiration you are!

Meg


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Watching them spin has been facinating. 
After they make the little sling, they hang, folded in half, upside down. Some make small cocoons some make very large ones. They make the outside dementions first. For the first part you can still see them folded in half working diligently. As the cocoon gets thicker I was using a strong flashlight to peek inside. They work and never stop. On day two you can no longer see through the cocoon even with the light, it looks so thick and a beautiful white. Well a couple of them are more of a golden color but they are beautiful too. It looks liek they are done but they are not. By day three it is very apparent that they were still working as teh whole cocoon has a finished look. So far I have 17 in various stages of cocoon. A few more I don't think are doing to well. One started a cocoon only to drop to the bottom of the tube and not move. I think this really takes alot out of them.



On a side note: the Cecropia moth is also known as the wild silk moth.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

Aunt C, how many cocoons does it take to make a small ball of silk thread? How thick is the yarn when spun (I'm guessing it's very fine) and how much does it take to make something small like a hanky? I'm just finding it amazing that a tiny cocoon like that can produce enough fiber to create the silk industry of today...wow!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

You can use the silk in so many ways. You can steam or bake the cocoons and then unreel the silk strands. This way you can have as many or as few as you would like. I wanted to do some of this for some fine embroydery. But I don't have the heart to kill this batch. Another option for spinning is to make handkies out of them. You can again steam the cocoons and then degum them in a solution of Ivory in warm water. When the cocoons get mushy you can open them up in a square shape. Someone here recommended youtube, search silkworm. There is a neat video of a guy washing the cocoons and placing them on a hoop or a horseshoe looking frame. You can then spin from these. 
I think I will let my moths hatch out. The moth spits out a chemical to disolve the silk so the opening is ruined. You can trim this area out and then again place the cocoons in a degumming bath, rinse and fluff up. This can be spun or I am going to blend it with some fine wool for another quilt for DH and I .

I agree, I find it facinating that silk, a totally natural fiber, depends on these little guys. I wonder how many moths are hatched out yearly for the silk trade.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Here is the video.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1RTqAWKenM[/ame]


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

Wow, thanks Aunt C...it's amazing that a tiny cocoon like that can be stretched out so wide! One cocoon produces a lot more silk that it looked like it would.


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## Simpler Times (Nov 4, 2002)

Naturewoman, the hankie is one cocoon. What the guy is doing on YouTube is bells or what they call silk caps. They are made of several cocoons. A thread consists of five to ten silk strands and the strand from one cocoon can be over one-thousand yards long. The number of threads you spin together to make the yarn varies according to the thickness you want. From what I understand it takes around 2600 cocoons to make one pound of silk! I think I read somewhere that one silk shirt would take around 1000 cocoons. That would vary, of course, according to the size and style of the shirt.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

They should start emerging from the cocoons any day now. I do have more pictures that I need to upload. I have cocoons of differing sizes and a couple strange shapes to show you.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Are you ready?
This baby seemed to have run out of energy making such a large cocoon.








Here are some different sizes and shapes



















I went to check on them after I posted and guess what I found....3 little boys.


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## goatladie (Oct 1, 2005)

CONGRATS!~ You must be so proud  How fascinating this has been and continues to be!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Now the process starts again - mating and more eggs!

WooHoo!

will you take pictures of processing the silk too!?!?!

Please!


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## Hovey Hollow (Apr 25, 2005)

I'm getting to this thread late. I just did this earlier this year. Someone on a local yahoo group hatched out ALL the eggs that their moths laid and she had WAY too many worms. She gave me a bunch. I swear there were thousands and thousands. We used many of them for feeder insects at work because we weren't able to harvest enough mulberry to feed them all. I did let a few hundred spin coocoons. Many did seem to die right before they got to that stage in the process, so you may have had losses regardless of what your son fed them. 
I had a wide variety of colors of cocoons. They ranged from white, yellow, green, and orange. We had to many of them to put in cardboard tubes, so they just made their cocoon in the corners of the boxes, on mulberry branches, inside curled up leaves, etc. 
I let them all hatch out and as they paired up I put them on a coffee filter to lay their eggs. It seems that the one's I put cups over didn't lay as well as the one's left out in the open. I put the coffee filters in the fridge. This was SO much work with that many that I'm reluctant to do it again any time soon. I certainly will limit the numbers I hatch at once. 
I don't spin or do fiber arts, but I plan on using the silk in soaps. I will have plenty left over and if there is interest I could list some cocoons and/or eggs on the barter board.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

auntC, those are beautiful moths. They remind me of a white (and extremely mellow moth) I love that has bright red legs under the pure white fur. 

This has been such a fun process to watch. I too want to see you process your silk.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Congratulations! How many cacoons did you end up with?


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I ended up with 24 cocoons but we will see how many hatch out.

Right now I have 5 wee little lads and 2 lassies. The poor gals can't hardly dry off before the lads came calling.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I have 7 little boys and 4 girls today I also have lots of little yellow eggs.


I will not be posting here for a little while. I lost someone who ment the world to me. My Gram left us last night. Words do not describe what she ment to me. I just need time.


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## swamp_deb (Jan 9, 2004)

Aunt C said:


> I have 7 little boys and 4 girls today I also have lots of little yellow eggs.
> 
> 
> I will not be posting here for a little while. I lost someone who ment the world to me. My Gram left us last night. Words do not describe what she ment to me. I just need time.



I'm so sorry, I will keep you in my prayers.


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

AuntC, thank you for your gift of this thread, and your special gift to me today (especially at such a time as this), and also for the obvious love you had for your Gram. The more love there is in the world, the better it is for everyone. Come back when you can and let us help you with wide-open arms and hearts. I am so sorry for your loss.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Christy I am so sorry you lost your Gram. You will be in my thoughts.


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## MTDeb (Feb 20, 2003)

I'm so sorry for your loss, Aunt C. I bet your Gram was a very special lady. Thoughts, hugs and prayers are with you and your family.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Aunt C. I'm sorry you lost your Gram. But I'm glad she had, in life, someone who cared about her as you obviously do. That's what we all need.

Meg


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## Simpler Times (Nov 4, 2002)

My thoughts and prayers are with you Aunt C. You are obviously a very special individual and your Gram was very lucky to have you.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Christy, I'm just seeing your post about your Gram.

I am so very sorry your Gram passed over.

I will keep you in prayer as you mourn her passing.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

My babies produced many eggs for me. I am going to try and hatch them out in the near future. Right now I have cocoons to process. I'll get pictures when I do and post them.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Best of luck with your cocoons!!! Can't wait to see the pictures!!!


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## naturewoman (Nov 12, 2002)

Me too Christy...and I hope you are starting to feel better. It's nice to see you back here.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Well it begins again. :help: I just hope I don't get so attached this time. It was hard watching them all die. I think part of it was bad timing.

I ordered more food, and I have somewhere around 12-1400 eggs. They are hard to count. Shall we see what happens?


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## swamp_deb (Jan 9, 2004)

Good luck Christy, I'll be watching for the progress of this batch, I really enjoyed seeing your pics and reading all about your babies.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Are you going to try to hatch all of them? OMG you are a brave women Christy


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Sure am, March.
Well, maybe I'll hold a few back, but afterall, no guts, no glory.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

glutten for punishment!!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I came to the conclusion, that the effort to raise these little critters is intense. It wouldn't take much more to do 1500 or so than it takes to do 100. And I will be so happy when I get enough silk to really play with. I am just trying to come up with enough tp and paper towel tubes. 

I am justifying here, so just go with it. OK  :rotfl:

Here is a picture of my degummed, worm part removed, silk. Not much to look at but once it dries it should be a lovely creamy white.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

hmmm, I'm all for saving tp & pt tubes for you ....

Hey! the flax got here YESTERDAY! How did you do that? We only talked about it Thursday afternoon! The wind must have been blowing hard from the west!


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Woo Hoo, I am so glad you got it. 
I think it was the cold, it was trying to escape. Although it has been fairly windy too. :rofl:


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Would you like us to save tubes for you? Check with the local schools, talk to the janitors. Check local stores, cafe's and such.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Hubby's second job is at the local bowling alley. He talked to the janitor last night and they are going to save tp tubes for me, so I should have enough. That is alot of fluff.  

I played with one of the cocoons last night. I was worried about the quality of the silk feeding the chow. It seems to be fine. A little creamier in color, but not much. I was thinking of dyeing some flax and thowing a bit of the silk in my dye pots to see how it takes.


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Hey, don't forget that Christmas is coming, too! All those rolls and rolls of wrapping paper! Ask everyone you know to save them for you.

I'm going to order some eggs this month. I finally have gotten organized enough...I think.  It's your fault, Aunt C. So, some advice, please! Since I'm gonna do it anyway, would you suggest I start small, and just do 100 eggs, or go ahead and order 500 or even 1000? Space isn't much of an issue...my plant growing light bank is sitting unused at this time of year, so I have all that space I can use. 

Meg


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

Oh dear, sorry Meg. Once you try it, there is no going back ya know.  

When they are small it is time consuming. They have to be moved and it would be so very easy to crush them. That is why I used the paint brush. But once they reach the second ishtar, things go really easy. I figured the amount of effort will not be to much greater having all 1200 of my eggs than the 100. I will save a few back, but I am going to go for it. I have taken them all out of the fridge. I haven't warmed them up to much yet, as I am waiting to be sure my chow gets here first.

Buymybugs had a great deal on the eggs. Large amounts of chow can be purchased more reasonably through Mulberry farms. http://www.mulberryfarms.com/orders.htm


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## Meg Z (Jun 8, 2004)

Do you have a link for Buymybugs? I haven't been able to find them. Thanks!
Meg


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

:doh: Sorry about that, she is an ebay seller.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Christy, I thought that if you let the worms hatch out that caused the cocoons to become darker. I think I read that in the article in Spin Off a few years back.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

I had two of them not hatch at all, the cocoons ended up the same color. This time around I THINK I am going to steam them. (Can you just imagine 1000+ moths) I will be able to see any differences. 

I am warming them up. The food should be here today. I just don't want to be caught with some early hatchers and no food for them. That would devistate me.


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Good luck!


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## AshleyB (Aug 6, 2005)

I just read through this thread, and I have to say, I never even thought about raising silkworms before, but now I am intrigued.

One little question. Do they smell at all? I am pregnant and my sense of smell is so sensitive right now. I don't think I could do it right now if they smell.


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## Aunt C (Aug 29, 2005)

AshleyB said:


> One little question. Do they smell at all? I am pregnant and my sense of smell is so sensitive right now. I don't think I could do it right now if they smell.


The food smells like alfala and seaweed. I like earthy smells so it didn't bother me.

Congratulations, when are you due?


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## AshleyB (Aug 6, 2005)

Thanks for the info. I just might have to try it.

I'm due in March with #4


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## Marchwind (May 10, 2002)

Only the best babies are born in March


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