# Breed large ram to smaller ewe...



## minnikin1 (Feb 3, 2003)

I know some folks manage to pull this off without trouble, but I was wondering 
if anyone has first had experience. 

Does the trouble turn up at when the small ewe lambs, or does it turn up in the next generation?


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## ozarkcat (Sep 8, 2004)

Just from my experience, you want to reverse that - breed a smaller ram to a larger ewe. Otherwise you'll have birthing problems - a lamb too big for the ewe to deliver. The folks who have managed to pull this off have been lucky; probably if you worked up statistics, you'd still find that they are having more vet calls & more lambs pulled than if the ewes were bred to rams of their own size or smaller.


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## Somerhill (Dec 13, 2005)

I've got quite a bit of experience breeding Border Cheviots to Bluefaced Leicester rams. The Cheviot ewes were around 130#, the BFL rams used were around 250#. After several years, and a few hundred lambs, we never saw any more problem between the BFL/Cheviot crosses (called mules) than using a purebred Cheviot ram on them. 
I think a major reason for that is that BFLs are bred specifically for that purpose. They have long, narrow heads and are born with long, slender bodies, so no foreheads or shoulders to get hung up in the birth canal. There are several people in the US breeding BFLs to Shetlands. 
I normally test bred the Cheviots to a Cheviot ram their first lambing, and then to the BFL for subsequent breedings.
I'd think you'd want to be much more careful using a big ram of some of the other breeds. Romneys have big heads, and Hampshires have big shoulders, for example. 
Lisa at Somerhill
http://www.somerhillfarm.com


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## veme (Dec 2, 2005)

I agree with Lisa -
The small narrow Cheviot head is easy to for a ewe to pass.

If you want to experiment - I'd go with a large ewe/ small ram combo.

Good luck


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## RiverPines (Dec 12, 2006)

Ram and ewes even of the same breed are different weights with the ram being bigger. Thats not the issue.
When the breeds are different period then be careful. Some have a very fast growth rate, some smaller. 
Some are smaller average birth weights and some bigger.
The prob is when you cross a small breed of ewe with a breed of ram who's ewes are bigger than your breed. The lambs will very likely be very big. Perhaps to big.

So are you talking about mixing breeds?
If so, know what your trying to mix.
A breed with 150 pound ewes shouldn't be bred with a ram from a breed that has larger ewes.

I breed a Jacob ram to a longwool ewes, Jacobs are the smaller breed. I love the combo.
Nice sized lambs, nice fleece, nice growth and good eating too.


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## ajaxlucy (Jul 18, 2004)

Anyone know about crossbreeding Shetland ewes? What breeds can they be bred to, and still have lambs that are easy birthing and easy keeping?


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## thatcompchick (Dec 29, 2004)

Like Somerhill said - I know some folks breed Blue Faced Leicesters on to shetland ewes, to produce mules. A lot of it depends on the offspring of the ram/breed. Blue Faceds are ideal for smaller crosses because they come out looking like little hot dogs - very long but not huge. Look for breeds that lamb out smaller offspring...

Good luck!

Andrea


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## njredneckgirl (Apr 11, 2007)

I ended up with a dead lamb that I had to pull out of the ewe. The ewe was a small Dorset mix and the ram was a full Dorset. I got rid of all of my smaller Dorset mixes that year and keep my full Dorset ewes.

I had a full dorset ewe lamb born last year that I halter trained and was going to keep but she never grew enough like the other ewe lambs. She ended up in our freezer.


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## hintonlady (Apr 22, 2007)

njredneckgirl said:


> I ended up with a dead lamb that I had to pull out of the ewe. The ewe was a small Dorset mix and the ram was a full Dorset. I got rid of all of my smaller Dorset mixes that year and keep my full Dorset ewes.
> 
> I had a full dorset ewe lamb born last year that I halter trained and was going to keep but she never grew enough like the other ewe lambs. She ended up in our freezer.


I have almost the exact same set up.

My dorset ram is a monster in size, his shoulders reach waist high on my 6 ft/ DH. 

My ewes are the garden variety commercial size dorset cross. Their shoulders may be a couple inches above our knees. They do have nice thick bodies though. the ram has a long lean show body.

Only pulled one lamb. Most of them look awesome but won't know till we get to market size. Got a couple smallish ones but that seems to be par for the course.

I also have a pure bred ewe lamb who is small she cam from a ewe who is a monster size too. Not sure what went wrong.


Not an expert but I would guess anything big headed like an oxford or hampshire would be best to avoid.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

I've only bred with larger rams. The size difference has been minimal (same breed), or a 180 pound ram with an 80 pound ewe. You'd think the little ewe would have problems, but the birth size of the lamb is determined by the mother. I think the body type and head type are more important. I would not cross a large boned, or wide headed ram with a smaller boned ewe regardless of relative size.


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