# I screwed up and killed them. Whats the next step to rebuild?



## Cheryl aka JM (Aug 7, 2007)

Well..... :flame: My fault. I'm a new beekeeper, started with three hives last April. Came through the summer fine, sent them into winter with three meduim supers as hive bodies each. All seemed to be going gangbusters 3 weeks ago when I looked at them, but they were extra mean so I didn't do any more than open the tops of the hives and have a look to see lots and lots of MAD bees.

Then yesterday I noticed a lot of dead bees on the landing board of hive 1 and hive 3. This morning I went out with syrup. Hive one is completly dead. I could not find a single living bee in all three boxes. Thousands of dead bees, some capped brood I think (I'm new...it's black I think it's brood). Hive 2 had some slow but live bees I put syrup on them. Hive three I suspect is completely dead but I was kind of upset by then so I put some syrup on them and came in to ask y'all what my next step should be. 

Now what? I know I can buy more package bees this spring, at least I hope its not to late to order some. I *Think* I can re-use the drawn out brood comb? How do I clean or prepare it for use by new bees? I'm thinking I screwed up big time letting them starve, but if I understand correctly it doesn't have to be a total loss is I re-use the brood comb to give the next bees a head start?

What should I do to clean up the mess and what can I save and re-use with new package bees?

Thanks for any help


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## copperkid3 (Mar 18, 2005)

What makes you so sure that YOU screwed up and killed them??

Are all the hives low or depleted of honey? It's entirely possible

that they might have been decimated by a nearby spraying or even

someone could have poisoned them deliberately. Investigate further,

as there is not enough information that has been presented, to make

a definite diagnosis. Sorry for your loss . . . it sucks and is expensive,

but it is the nature of the business in this present age. A lot of possibilities,

but very few will own up to being responsible for killing someone else's bees.


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## Cheryl aka JM (Aug 7, 2007)

In their location it is pretty much impossible that they would be accidentally poisoned, and only people I know would be in a position to intentionally poison them and I really don't think anyone would. Everyone was excited at the idea of getting honey and making mead this summer. It's really very disappointing.

I looked at lots of pics online, and I'm pretty sure they starved. The two dead hives were the two that were going the strongest three weeks ago. I think they built up too fast without enough food and I didn't know they didn't have enough because I didn't want to upset them even more by pulling the frames and inspecting. Looking now~ I'm brushing hundreds and bees off the frames, in the frames I'm finding mostly empty comb with bees face first in the comb. Some comb capped black. Mostly not capped at all. 

I can go out and take pics if that would help.


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## copperkid3 (Mar 18, 2005)

What makes you so sure that YOU screwed up and killed them??

Are all the hives low or depleted of honey? It's entirely possible

that they might have been decimated by a nearby spraying or even

someone could have poisoned them deliberately. Investigate further,

as there is not enough information that has been presented, to make

a definite diagnosis. Sorry for your loss . . . it sucks and is expensive,

but it is the nature of the business in this present age. A lot of possibilities,

but very few will own up to being responsible for killing someone else's bees.


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## Cheryl aka JM (Aug 7, 2007)

I went out to take pics, my camera didn't want to co-operate but I got some. It may not be as bad as I thought at first. There are a lot of bees out there flying around now. Three hours ago there were not any flying. Hive 1 is still apparently dead. All three pics are of hive one. None of those bees are moving. The bees that look like they are alive on the frames are dead, no movement at all. The ones in the grass are ones I shook off a frame to take the pics.

Now the good news though~ there were several piles of bees on the grass that I shook out of hive 1 three hours ago that were moving. I suspect it is bees from hive two moving around the bodies from hive one, but I went ahead and put a quart of sugar syrup on hive one and shook some powdered sugar on the bees on the grass. If it is just robbers from hive two~ well at least my bees are getting the sugar still.

Hive two has a lot of live bees. It appeared to be the weakest hive three weeks ago~ but there are a lot of live bees in there now and the quart of sugar syrup I put on the three hours ago is gone! I'm making more syrup as I type. Hopefully their queen is still alive, and if she is I can take some brood from her and rebuild the other two hives and get them to raise a new queen if need be. Maybe. I think. At least I have some hope now. I may need some advise about that too please.

Hive 3 is a hot bed of activity. It was the strongest hive three weeks ago. Three hours ago I saw NO movement at all, but I didn't pull any frames out. I just put some sugar syrup on and came back up to the house. NOW there are bees everywhere. I suspect hive 3 did have live bees in it afterall~ hopefully even a queen. I'm going to put more syrup on them when it's ready and stuff some grass in the entrance of their hive to reduce hive 2 robbing them out of the syrup.

But I still need to know what to do with the extra frames from hive 1 and possibly 3 until I can get them built back up. There are a LOT of dead bees out there and I don't see how they can keep the moths off that comb. And I'm not sure how to go about rebuilding the hives. I can buy 3lb package bees delivered locally for a pretty good price~ $85 and the store selling them is hoping to get them early April. But I need to order now if I want them.


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## Cheryl aka JM (Aug 7, 2007)

WOW! I went down there with a tape measure thinking to make a couple entrance reducers cut down the robbing. There are a LOT of live and busy bees down there! I didn't think there were anywhere near that many live bees. Maybe this is not as bad as I thought. And there are a LOT of bees moving in and out of hive 1. I'm sure NO bees moved at all when I was messing with it earlier today~ but it looks like some of the live bees are cleaning up the mess I made shaking the dead bees off some of the frames from hive 1 this morning.....and the other two hives might rob hive 1 out but they wouldn't clean it up would they?


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## indypartridge (Oct 26, 2004)

Cheryl said:


> ... I'm pretty sure they starved. I think they built up too fast without enough food ...


This happens all too frequently in the spring. You get a warm spell, the queen kicks into gear raising brood, and then a cold snap hits and there are too many bees and not enough food. 

Yes, you can re-use the comb from the dead outs. Shake out as many of the dead bees as you can. Add a package of new bees and they'll do the rest of the clean-up.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

If you are still wanting to know what killed ythre bees for sure collect a sample. Serch this site for the beltsville Maryland bee lab post I did some time bacvk or do a internet search for USDA BEE LAB BELTSVILLE MARYLAND. They have instructions on their web site on how to prepare and send the sample.

Yes you can re use the drawn comb. Clean the dead bees off as best you can, the new package bees will take care of the rest.

 Al


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## thenance007 (Mar 18, 2013)

Your first pic shows lots of bees with their heads stuck deep in the comb--almost a sure thing that they starved. That is also why they were so mean--defending what little stores they had and just plain hungry. Feed a lot! Depending on temps, syrup in a gallon baggie with a couple slits on top laid on the top bars if it is 50 degrees or higher, plain sugar dumped on a piece of newspaper laid on the top bars with a small slit or two torn or cut into it if it is below 50. A quart feeder probably isn't enough at this point, especially if it is an entrance feeder that can induce robbing. After they have been fed for 3 days, they will forget they were starving and their tempers will improve.

If there are live bees in the "dead" hive, spray them with a little sugar syrup and shake them into the live hives--especially if you can put a drop of Honey Bee Healthy in it to help disguise their scent. If there are any frames with brood, put them next to the brood in one of the live hives too. 

The spare frames, just put somewhere where it is light to discourage the wax moths. You can seal them in a big clear garbage bag, temporarily. Shrink the hives down to manageable size and use your entrance reducers. You should soon be able to put the extra frames back, or if you get a new package, use them for it. The bees will clean them out.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

In the south you also have to be alert to Hive beatles in the hive.

 Al


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