# Fence charger



## clothAnnie (May 6, 2011)

We have a solar charger. Pretty happy with it but it is wimpy at times. Like when there's little sun or the electronet is a tad too saggy. Like I can stand there holding the fence between my finger and thumb and it just feels like a tiny sting every second or so. Sometimes I barely feel it. Thankfully it kept our pigs in and keeps my dog out from eating our hens' eggs. He actually yelped and ran away the other day; I'm like, "Is it just surprising him?! I barely feel it!" 

Flexibility to move it was my primary goal in getting solar, as well as not having to take out and recharge a battery.

It pulses; think I'd like a constant zap. Pardon my electrical ignorance. I keep trying to understand the options and how they work but I'm confused!

If I get an ac powered energizer, why can't I use extension cords? The rep who took my call at Premier1 fencing said they don't recommend that, IIRC.


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## bmurphy96 (Nov 23, 2013)

I started with a solar charger. My pigs thought it was a joke. I moved up to much stronger AC powered charger. They don't think it's a joke anymore.

The extension cord is going to drop the power the longer the cord. That being said I use one and it will probably be six months or more before I get around to burying a line out to the charger. It's a pain, but pigs running around isn't any fun.

My charger will cover 100 miles of fencing. Even with three strands of electric that is acres and acres and acres so I'm not worried about moving it around. Oh, and I touched my AC powered one once. It hurt like you wouldn't belive. I actually saw "stars" and my bones in my arm actually hurt for the rest of the day (I brushed one arm on the fence while working on another section that wasn't live....it was dumb).

Hpoe that helps.

I would highly recommend you do it.

keith


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

Yep, get a fencer that is capable of burning through weeds. I've been hit a few times. Nothing I will soon forget... its like something is trying to rip your bones out. I probably look like a contortionist when I have touched it too. Lol! My pigs squeal if they touch it anymore even if the fencer is turned off! I'm serious. Lol!

I use an International Super 98 model... its a real butt kicker. Most important, with any E-fencer... put in a better ground than your fence and even a flimsy single strand will tame the hardest headed pig you have.


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## sandraandjess (Feb 22, 2014)

My opinion is the opposite, as a very experienced electric fence user for a range of animals there is no need to shock them to hell. We frequently just leave tape up with no charge. If they know what it is you need very little shock.


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

sandraandjess said:


> My opinion is the opposite, as a very experienced electric fence user for a range of animals there is no need to shock them to hell. We frequently just leave tape up with no charge. If they know what it is you need very little shock.


I agree, thats why I don't worry if the power goes out or some other reason the fencer is off. Make the first shock or two memorable and they will respect it forever. Some animals are more sensitive but a pig with a stiff coat of hair needs to learn quick and learn not to "test" the fence. Jmo....


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## LivingstoneFarm (Jul 28, 2013)

There is absolutely no "one size fits all solution" when it come to electric fences and fence chargers. I started with a battery powered charger that is adjustable up to two joules. I'm now running a three joule ac powered charger. That suits my needs based on distances run, weed growth, and species raised. If ac is not the best option for you then look into the battery powered chargers; Kencove sells some higher powered ones. I wouldn't want a charger that doesn't pulse; I'm not sure where you get one with continuous output. Either way, one with a continuous output would use a lot more power and that wouldn't be suited well for a battery or solar powered unit. 

I always leave my fence on. My experience has been that after about a week of having it off some pigs figure it out and go right through it; better safe than sorry.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

clothAnnie said:


> Flexibility to move it was my primary goal in getting solar, as well as not having to take out and recharge a battery.


Solar is the best way to get the least fencer for your money. Wall power (AC) gives you the most bang for your buck. Part of this has to do with extra equipment needed for solar, part due to scale of manufacturing (more AC made). I would suggest AC and then run it out to where ever you need it as perimeter fence line. If you must have solar, build your own from an AC and an inverter on a solar power to get a stronger fencer.



clothAnnie said:


> It pulses; think I'd like a constant zap. Pardon my electrical ignorance. I keep trying to understand the options and how they work but I'm confused!


That pulsing is designed for your safety and the safety of the animals. It sends out a very brief high voltage low amperage pulse and then stops so you have time to let go of the fence. While the pulse is goings your muscles contract. If there was no off phase you would die if you grabbed the fence the wrong way.



clothAnnie said:


> If I get an ac powered energizer, why can't I use extension cords?


You can. Better yet, put the energizer at the wall power, run insulated wire out to where you want your perimeter and run perimeter fence from there. Then put paddocks off the perimeter fence.

-Walter


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## bmurphy96 (Nov 23, 2013)

I wish I had nice pliable little piggies like you all seem too. Because I have been out of town for work my dear wife and oldest son have been feeding the pigs. It took the boar three days to figure that they were turning off the fence during feeding time. Once he discovered that it was game on....

Fortunately he was hungry so he went right back in pretty much but no more turning off the fence during feeding time. And since that incident on Tuesday he keeps testing the fence during feeding time..hoping..hoping...

keith


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

highlands said:


> Solar is the best way to get the least fencer for your money. Wall power (AC) gives you the most bang for your buck. Part of this has to do with extra equipment needed for solar, part due to scale of manufacturing (more AC made). I would suggest AC and then run it out to where ever you need it as perimeter fence line. If you must have solar, build your own from an AC and an inverter on a solar power to get a stronger fencer.
> 
> -Walter


I have a 12 volt parmak battery charger, it is supposed to be the same charger as the 12 volt solar model, I've been very satisfied with it. I don't feel the charger is the problem with the solar models but the power supply is, a little bitty battery and a ----y solar panel won't produce enough electricity when it is cold and the days short and cloudy to keep the charger working at full capacity. I've considered buying a solar battery charger and connecting it to my battery to maintain it and have a solar charger that way.

I've a 6 volt parmak solar charger that works in the day time but not at night, some where I have a connection problem. They use the cheap piggy back crimp on connectors, I need to look and see what power source is hooked in with them.


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

I would like to try one of the better solar fencers, 2 joules or higher, but they are pricey. Maybe soon though? Manufacturers should offer a 90 day free or money back trial.

Still the better the grouding system you make and use with any fencer, the more effective your fence is. :goodjob:


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

As far as them not recommending a extension cord. That goes back to warranty and insurance issues. You will find NO electrical device being made (no matter what it is) that the manufacturer will recommend using an extension cord. This is a liability risk for them. This does not mean it will not work just fine, but if they tell you it is fine and you run a cord across your carpet and out a window and catch your house on fire, then you could sue them and say "They told me it was fine to use an extension cord," You get the idea.
When I first got my electric fencing. I knew nothing about them. I had never had one before. I went to our local co-op and found them to be expensive (in my opinion) I finally found a constant shock model that was fairly strong for about $39.00 I used this inside my small pig pen for training purposes. I was told it may would kill a small animal, so I bought another weaker, pulse unit for outside the small pen where dogs and cats may contact it. These two chargers have worked well for me. The constant charger has no light so you need to use a tester to check that it is working. They also make small lights to hang on the hot wire, which will blink to let you know the fence is on or off.
So I get my fencing stuff home after buyin everything the guy at the co-op said I needed and put it all up, Great!!! No how do I know if it is working??? So I get shocked several times testing and reconnecting till I got it all just right. Electric fence sucks I thought. The next day I go back to the co-op and complain that I have no way of knowing if the fence is on or off to the owner/manager. He says to me "Well we do sell these little lights and testers, but they are kind of expensive, one is $8.00 the other is $14.00". I ask why they did not tell me about them earlier, and gladly paid the money and brought them home. Now checking the fence is easy, just hook it on the fence, shove the little rod in the ground and see if it lights up, it even has a graduated meter, so you know how strong it is. Very well worth the money and feels much better than touching the wire.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

bmurphy96 said:


> I wish I had nice pliable little piggies like you all seem too. Because I have been out of town for work my dear wife and oldest son have been feeding the pigs. It took the boar three days to figure that they were turning off the fence during feeding time. Once he discovered that it was game on....


One of the keys is to train the pigs in a physically secure space for about two weeks. Once well trained they are very respectful of electric fencing. If you have pigs that are not, eat them. That solves the problems and culls over thinkers.

I would suggest a a minimum of 2.5 joules for a fence energizer no matter what the power source. We use two 15 joule energizers to power our outside perimeter (1.5 miles). Then our field fences come off of those with paddock divisions off of those. We also have a 6 joule energizer for another area. If you have a large setup multiple energizers is nice incase one gets blown by lightning. Don't connect two energizers together on the same wire - keep them as separate areas. Do not believe the claims on the fences for how much they will do. The ratings are way optimistic.


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## cooper101 (Sep 13, 2010)

highlands said:


> You can. Better yet, put the energizer at the wall power, run insulated wire out to where you want your perimeter and run perimeter fence from there. Then put paddocks off the perimeter fence.


How far away from AC are your fences? Insulated wire is not really that expensive. I bought a 200' spool and have been slowly burying runs out to every fence I use. They all come back to a main "circuit panel" of knife switches at the barn so I can just turn on or off whatever I need to be running. My barn is in the center of all my fenced areas.

I agree that the key is training. If trained correctly (mating urges aside), a small charger will do the trick just fine. I have an "up to .25 joule" battery charger that they respect just fine. My main is a 2.5 joule and I sure hate touching it. Judging by their squeals, they don't like it either. You don't have to electrocute them and eventually you will touch it, so no need to make it tougher on yourself.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

AC is at the center along one edge. About 50' of underground insulated from fence energizer to active fence. Underground wire does not have to be underground. Outer perimeter of fence is about 1.5 miles. Fencing for field and paddocks is off of that like a fractal. Top down so it is easy to cut power to lower wires which tend to take the weed and snow load.

The voltage is what provides the pain. It is 10,000 volts on modern fence nergizers roughly no matter the joule rating. It has nothing to do with electrocuting them. The amperage is very low and the time of the pulse is very short - that's what makes it safe. All fence energizers are the same voltage, timing and delivered amps that I have ever dealt with - possibly regulatory. The joule rating determines how much of a weed load the fence can handle, how much snow load, how long a wire run. It's stored energy. Kick.

I've touched our energized fences many times. I will do so if needed through multiple pulses. It really isn't that bad. It's a psychological effect. You don't want to do it but if you have to do it you can. For fun with fences see:

http://sugarmtnfarm.com/calibrating-pain-fence-testing/

Cheers,

-Walter


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

I test my fence with a small (green with sap) grass stem to locate shorted sections until I get close enough to see and hear the *Snap*. Lol... its just a tingle. I only get a JOLT if I touch it direct.

As I understand it joules is related to the length of time and wattage is dispersed. Weed choppers like mine if they were rated in joules would be high because it has a long cycle or pulse... hence why it can burn through tough weeds. Some of the newer fencers will still burn through weeds but most have a shorter cycle now days.


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

How about these? Anybody own one?

http://www.cyclopsfence.com/ac_powered_chargers.htm


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## solsikkefarms (Jun 1, 2013)

HerseyMI said:


> I test my fence with a small (green with sap) grass stem to locate shorted sections until I get close enough to see and hear the *Snap*. Lol... its just a tingle. I only get a JOLT if I touch it direct.


Same here.. That's how Grampa taught us kids to check it. Except my dumb little cousin who he told to pee on it.


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

solsikkefarms said:


> Same here.. That's how Grampa taught us kids to check it. Except my dumb little cousin who he told to pee on it.



Lol! My nephew did that, of his own accord. I can still hear him stutter for help. :hysterical:


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## clothAnnie (May 6, 2011)

Thanks, all. I've got three young kids. So I guess I don't want a super strong zap and thankfully what I've been using has so far prevented problems. (Except when snow shirted it out at the same time we boarded a friend's pig as well lol!)

My youngest actually has cochlear implants and I've researched and she should be fine but the thought of electricity messing with her technology makes me extra cautious. 

Just wish I had a better grasp of it all. Amperes. Joules. Watts. Volts. It's all Greek to me! Our charger (fencer- new term of me!) came with a tool to touch to the fence and I never saw it show anything! But I've heard it snap on grass on the ground and I've seen our pigs squeal and my dog yelp. But it's just never felt like too much of a zap to me. I just hope it's enough to keep away predators (also use it for our chickens) and continue to keep in our pigs. But I'm wanting to fence in our garden which means we will need a new fencer so I'm trying to buy an effective one and really considering AC. 

When I read " insulated wire," does that = extension cords?

Also, improving the grounding... What are ways to do that? I wasn't prepared and red lizard early on that I could move the fence but if I wanted to move the fencer I needed to move/a new grounding rod. I've read about wiring several grounding rods together (?!). 

Thanks again. Man I wish I were more knowledgable about electricity!!!


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## HerseyMI (Jul 22, 2012)

Yes, several rods wired one to the next and then connected to the ground terminal on your charger. Two rods minimum about 8 ft to 12 ft apart each. Put them in a damp area also improves grounding making it easier for your livestock to complete the path of least restriction for electrons to flow. SNAP!

Yes, an extention cord is usually insulated wire. But you want the charger plugged in direct to a wall outlet etc. Then run a single insulated wire (14 gage house wiring will do) run from your charger to your bare wire electric fence. Outdoor insulated wiring would be best between the two. Hope that helps?

Oh... peeing on the fence is kinda like the ground rods beeing in damp or wet soil... those electrons can really flow! Makes a little Snap feel like a big SNAP! Lol!


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## PasturedPork (Jan 22, 2014)

You could have insufficient grounding. I have 3 grounding rods in a sequence. I can't cite the facts but without good grounding the animal won't experience the same shock. Moist soil helps too.

I use solar and it works like a charm. No added electric bills and no hassle.
It's more cost effective for me because I don't have power close.

I always suggest a good woven wire fence for pigs with an electric wire running along the inside. If the electric goes down then your fine. Also safe for kids because they can't reach it.


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

clothAnnie

Are you wearing tennis shoes with thick soles when you check the fence? They can insulate you from the ground enough that the fencer will feel weak. 

You need something like this http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail.html?pgguid=8f382ae0-e788-47a7-ba96-469fe8d2b050 for your insulated wire, an extension cord isn't insulated heavy enough and will ground out.


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## sky61 (Feb 9, 2013)

Along the lines of what Allen W is saying, if I touch the electronet with my rubber muck boots on, I will feel the shock, but no big deal. If I put my hand on the ground (no gloves) and touch the electronet with my other hand, it will be a much more painful experience. Premier1 has a cheapy fence meter (just red LEDs to show voltage), but there are other fence specific voltmeters around 35 dollars that will give you a more accurate reading on a pulsed charge. Like others have said, the ground is important. Also, with the netting the weed load can be an issue because of wires close to the ground. There will always be grass touching it, but try to minimize the amount of grass and weeds touching hot wires. I hear so many different opinions about electric fencing, even from the fence charger companies it can be hard to sort out. That being said, most of the companies can give helpful info and Premier1 has a good catalog with tips on fencing techniques, even better than their website. I dare say you need to be careful with running above ground electric lines (extension cords). Will you have to mow around them? Run equipment over them? Once those lines are damaged or not fully insulated, you have an issue.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Not to incite fear, but I would also warn using above ground 110 volt extension cords for anything than a temporary solution for a short period of time. There are people killed and injured by 110 volt electrocution yearly, so one should be cautious, when dealing with a/c wiring. 

Annie, A very simple explanation of electricity would be to compare it to a water hose. Thing of a 1" water hose, as the wire. The water coming out, as the voltage. Now think of the amps. or amperage, as the flow of water. If the amps are low (as with a fence charger) then there will be only a small amount of water (voltage) released. Like the water hose, it will still be a 1" stream, only very slowly and a small volume. But, if you open the valve now you have more amps.(more water flow), now there is much more energy being released, but it is still a 1" stream, just more of it. 
220 volts? same principal, just a bigger size water hose. like a 2" hose, so to speak.


But what is the valve? The valve would be the breaker in your breaker box ( ie a 20 amp breaker will allow 20 amps maximum flow, still 110, but limited flow, only 20 amps, also note 20 amps can still be lethal) The fence chargers have basically a electric valve in them similar to a water valve. the electricity form you 20 amp breaker flows to the charger then the charger limits the flow even more. Different chargers, have different flow valves, which determines their strength
I know this is very simplistic, but maybe will help you understand it a bit more


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## clothAnnie (May 6, 2011)

Hard to believe that I did a science fair project on NiCad batteries back in high school lol. Did use my dad's voltmeter at the time; never thought of using it to check the fence! Yes I'm wearing fairly think tennis shoes with orthodic inserts; I'll try to take comfort in my dog's yelp a few days ago, plus the fact that it was mostly effective at keeping our pigs in (really really well until we had snow the same day we got a not-trained-to-the-fence pig pal for our gilt. AND most pleasingly that we have lost a good number of chickens to foxes when they've been outside the fence but haven't lost one yet while they've been inside it. 

Mule man, thanks for the analogy. It's a tiny bit clearer for me. Also appreciate the warnings re: extension cords to 110 volts. I don't want to mess with potential for electrical danger with our kids all over the farm. (Feel a bit false calling ourselves a farm but we are trying ) I guess I need to figure out a plan for the garden, chickens, and once we get new pigs. I want to fence them all but don't have a perimeter fence and only have our one charger and two electronets.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Careful, using a regular volt meter on a fence line may destroy the meter.


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

I've always used a screwdriver or hammer to check an electric fence. Ground to a post and hold close to the wire until the spark jumps to judge how hot the fence is.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Annie,
I did forget to mention, but glad Walter caught it. The fence chargers!! At the same time they limit the amps, they normally raise the voltage. This could indeed damage your meter, as it is probably a small household unit not designed for the higher voltage your charger probably puts out. I would really suggest anyone, not just you, who has an electric fence, invest in one of the small, simple, handheld "Electric Fence Testers" designed to give you safe, accurate readings. They should be under $20.00 at your local farm supply store.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

I have a Pakton fence tester. Back when I got it (8 years ago?) it cost $120. I've seen them and ones like them for $40 now. They are very worth having. They give voltage, amp draw and direction of the problem. Once you learn how to use them they're extremely useful for diagnosing fence problems. We have a large fencing system covering about 70 acres divided into a lot of little paddocks. Walking the fence is something we do regularly. This saves considerable time. See the link above.

There are newer ones that work with the energizer to turn off the power while you're out in the field. I would love to have that but it means replacing both the energizers (3 we have) and getting a new tester (1). Maybe when I'm rich. Right now we have one person stand back at the switch when needed and lots of switches out in the field. That works. Man power.

-Walter


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Ok, What Walter has is quite different than what I have. I wish I were at home I would post a picture and more info. Basically the one I have is about the size of a large cell phone or I-phone. The body is plastic and it has a small metal hook on the top. On the bottom a insulated wire extends about 2' and has a insulated probe with an exposed metal tip. The (cell phone looking thing) has about 6 or 8 rows of lights with power levers in Joules by each light. more lights, more power. The lights will pulse on a pulse fence and stay on on a constant shock fence. No electricity, no lights!! very simple to use. Hold the cell phone with the lights where you can see them, hook it on the fence then with your other hand stick the probe in the dirt. It is so simple my 12 year old can use it to test the fence when they go to feed. I got it at the local Co-op and it was less than $20.00


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

I have one of those too. Much less expensive but it works to give the rough voltage levels just fine. Don't get shocked! The insulating plastic wore out on the ground wire on mine... :}


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

So what you are saying is yours gives 2 indications of a hot fence, both visual and physical? Are you sure the insulation is worn out, or did you just get the "DELUXE" version????

:teehee::whistlin:


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

It wasn't deluxe when I got it - that feature seemed to evolve later.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Ok, Here is the fence tester I have.
ZAREBA brand, zarebasystems.com model number RSVT8, designed for standard duty and low impedance fence controllers. Indicates voltage produced on a fence line or by a fence controller.


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