# Teaching textbooks for math?



## mammabooh (Sep 1, 2004)

Our son (age 11) just hates math for some reason. It's very frustrating because I love math and find it very easy. I want him to love it too! We have tried Saxon, Alpha Omega Lifepacs, Bob Jones, and, this year, were trying Life of Fred and Math Detective (from Critical Thinking Co.). None of these have done the trick. I have tried flash cards, manipulatives, all sorts of things with no success.

So, a few weeks back I heard some of the moms at gym class talking about how much they and their kids like Teaching Textbooks, but that it is a bit behind some of the other math courses and most moms suggest doing a grade ahead, but I want him to really get the basics (without being bored to death), so want to try his grade level. Our son is in 6th grade and I found the 6th grade Teaching Texbooks on craigslist for $70.00...workbooks and books not written in, cd's in great shape...looks like they are over $100.00 new. Anyway, I am supposed to pick it up tomorrow. Even if we don't end up using it, I figure I can sell it easy enough.

I am hoping that the fact that it is on the computer will help our son enjoy it. I tend to get annoyed when he doesn't grasp what I consider very simple, basic concepts and I'm sure that doesn't help anything! 

Suggestions, opinions, or advice?!?!?


----------



## cindy-e (Feb 14, 2008)

If you need a gentle encouragement to engage in math again, it might help for a while. We tried it for a few months once, and when comparing side by side, the computations were so much simpler that kids would think they were understanding better, but the math was just easier. Most of the time, kids aren't really having a comprehension problem where it concerns math. If they were, I suppose that this program would work. But instead it is usually holding it all together to remember each of the minute details in math... FOIL, keeping signs the same on both sides of the equation, doing the same thing to both sides... that kind of thing. So you can easily get the right answers to problems if you reduce the numbers of those things that a student is required to do to get the right answer. For this reason TT has a statistically bad rep for kids going to college for not really preparing them for the SATs. I would strongly caution you not to continue to use it into high school, or even for very long once you get him back to where he needs to be with math. But for a while, to increase his enjoyment and confidence, it's probably OK. 

What I think is missing in math instruction for struggling kids is something in the middle between TT and a typical text, so that struggling kids can "step up to" regular math texts and then possibly beyond them. I can't think of anything like that out there. But Singapore might be a good next step when you are done with TT. It is pretty visual at the elementary school level and very thorough.

JM2CFWIW,
Cindyc.


----------



## mammabooh (Sep 1, 2004)

Yes, I just plan to use this for a while in hopes that he can get a better grasp on things. It seems like he has no retention...perhaps it's just his age or the fact that he's a boy and thinks that math is useless and dumb, but, whatever the reason, we need to get it figured out. Things that he spent a great deal of time on in 3rd, 4th, and 5th grades have completely left his little brain and he has no recollection of every doing it. It is maddening!


----------



## bluefish (Jan 27, 2006)

mammabooh said:


> Yes, I just plan to use this for a while in hopes that he can get a better grasp on things. It seems like he has no retention...perhaps it's just his age or the fact that he's a boy and thinks that math is useless and dumb, but, whatever the reason, we need to get it figured out. Things that he spent a great deal of time on in 3rd, 4th, and 5th grades have completely left his little brain and he has no recollection of every doing it. It is maddening!



Wow! That's my dd to a T! I've been using Math on the Level for a little bit and it's been good for us. It is a lot more parent work, but it's been helping dd a lot, so it's worth the trade off. This curriculum breaks down math into tiny steps. I mean tiny! But that's what's been working, so.....

Arrgh, I do not seem to be able to write coherently today, so you'll have to look it up if interested. Sorry!:ashamed::hair


----------



## cindy-e (Feb 14, 2008)

mammabooh said:


> Yes, I just plan to use this for a while in hopes that he can get a better grasp on things. It seems like he has no retention...perhaps it's just his age or the fact that he's a boy and thinks that math is useless and dumb, but, whatever the reason, we need to get it figured out. Things that he spent a great deal of time on in 3rd, 4th, and 5th grades have completely left his little brain and he has no recollection of every doing it. It is maddening!


If you need a back-handed way to get a boy to like math (or see the use of it), I have found that letting them build something can help. My son built a rabbit hutch. Had to design it first and get the maths right. He is math interested, and is doing other mathy stuff now, but if he wasn't I would have probably let him start a business making and selling those hutches. ... and maybe even breeding some rabbits. Nothing like making a thing useful in a child's life to get them to respect it. =)

I hope you get it all sorted. I know that is really frustrating. 

FWIW,
Cindyc.

ETA: A lot of people love TT, and will swear by them because their kids really do seem to be doing better with them than other things, and therefore like using it better. And if their kid is having success where they weren't having it before, or are not having tears at the word math anymore, that is comforting, so they will be strongly supportive of it for reasons I completely understand. Unfortunately, it may not be a real comprehension jump if the math is just not as complex as in other books. The stats for college admissions testing for this curriculum do not back up the idea that kids who use it are understanding better. Something you can do to help you evaluate, is to look at the TT materials side by side with what you are using now once you get it and see what you think. Is it just as good? or is it just easier, which is how you can account for the sudden comprehension jump with kids who were struggling with something else, but suddenly, miraculously, and almost overnight "get it" once they go to TT. For some parents, whose kids are not college bound, if the goal is just to be able to put down that maths were done on a transcript, I am sure it is perfectly fine. Or for some who have seriously math challenged kids when used with heavy supplementation, that might work too. People have different goals in math instruction. YMMV, but really look at both the curriculum (side-by-side with something else) and the stats before you decide, not just the testimonials. (I almost never answer about TT anymore since it usually results in my getting my head bitten off, but I really hate for someone to start it without all of the info thinking they are doing something really good for their kid only to discover after *years* of wasted time that they only traded one problem for another and their kids are not where they should be with math even though they are getting good grades.) FWIW again.


----------



## Jakk (Aug 14, 2008)

We love Teaching Textbooks!! It is the only thing that helped my older daughter understand algebra. She used it for all four years of high school. My younger daughter is on her first year of using it along with Christian Light Education math.


----------



## Kristinemomof3 (Sep 17, 2012)

My kids love teaching textbooks too. Another thing to check out is Khanacademy.org for instruction & extra practice.


----------



## offthegrid (Aug 11, 2009)

We use Teaching Textbooks and we like it very much. For a couple of reasons - one, it gives nice positive feedback to the kids when they get things right; it is a much more cheerful teacher than I am.

Secondly, the kids can watch the solutions if they get something wrong - again and again, if necessary. For my older daughter in Algebra I, this is really useful. It's useful because it's not just wrong - but shows her how to do it right.

Finally, *I* don't have to be the math teacher. Of course I am happy to help, answer questions, etc., but it is a subject that is ready to be worked on at any time. So, if I am busy, or working with the other kid, math is ready and waiting to be done.

I think just like anything; if you get hung up on "5th" grade or "6th" grade you might have trouble. I think it seems like the 6th grade math my younger dd just finished was easier than 6th grade....but the Algebra I was harder than I expected since my older dd had already done both Pre-Algebra books of Life of Fred, and was halfway through Algebra when we decided to switch. She did so well on the pre-test that we considered skipping to Algebra II, but when the materials arrived she actually had to go back to the beginning even though we thought she might be able to skip some of the earlier chapters.

So...just like anything else it depends. Personally we abandoned Singapore for this because it didn't have enough explanation and practice sometimes, and we would have to find additional materials to supplement. Both my kids got lost in Singapore at the exact same place, several years apart -- equivalent fractions. There seemed to be some expectation that kids would just "get" this...for some reason neither of mine did. 

Anyway, if you can find used TT materials, it's worth trying to see what you think. We like it.


----------



## mammabooh (Sep 1, 2004)

Well, we picked it up today. They ended up giving me $10.00 back since we drove to pick it up...so I got it for $60.00 and it looks brand new. Hopefully we can get it loaded easily and start Monday.


----------



## cindy-e (Feb 14, 2008)

Well... I hope it helps your son. Short term, I think it could be good. Maybe he just needs a little confidence. Good luck with it all!

Cindyc.


----------



## mammabooh (Sep 1, 2004)

cindy-e said:


> Well... I hope it helps your son. Short term, I think it could be good. Maybe he just needs a little confidence. Good luck with it all!
> 
> Cindyc.


I certainly hope so! He was in public school for 1st and 2rd grade and the bonehead 2nd grade teacher told hm he was bad at math. Makes me so mad I could punch her in the face. She has since retired, but it sounds like she should have done it much sooner. My son evidently believed her and mentions it often. Ugh.


----------



## cindy-e (Feb 14, 2008)

mammabooh said:


> I certainly hope so! He was in public school for 1st and 2rd grade and the bonehead 2nd grade teacher told hm he was bad at math. Makes me so mad I could punch her in the face. She has since retired, but it sounds like she should have done it much sooner. My son evidently believed her and mentions it often. Ugh.


Wow! That is crazy! At least she retired so she can't say stuff like that to any more kids! Hard to get past self-perception sometimes. But sometimes little successes help. Hang in there!

Cindyc.


----------



## offthegrid (Aug 11, 2009)

cindy-e said:


> Hard to get past self-perception sometimes. But sometimes little successes help. Hang in there!
> 
> Cindyc.


I think more than self-perception, kids who are forced to "keep up" (aka kids in school) may be just as GOOD at math as any other kid, but if they are not ready to move on to the next step, it makes them *bad* at math. But only because the pace is wrong.

Obviously homeschooling helps immensely with this, no matter what curriculum you use. But for a student who has struggled, and/or who has been told (or thinks themselves) that they are *bad* at math....let them go slowly until they DO get it. Because math is one of those things that does have to have those essential building blocks. And if they are there, the child will progress just fine. But if they are skipped or rushed...they will always struggle.

Personally, I see no reason to "rush" in math. There is no prize for finishing first but not getting it. In school you can prepare for the state tests and "cram" the math, but come September, it's gone and kids can be behind and struggling again.

Good luck!


----------



## mammabooh (Sep 1, 2004)

He did the first three lessons today and said it wasn't as bad as he thought it would be (he has stated in the past that he has no desire to do any work on the computer). It was ridiculously easy, but I told him that it would eventually get a bit harder. 

He's actually one of those kids that grasps things quickly and I think that is part of the problem. When he "gets" it, he's ready to move on (and I've obviously been a bad influence on him and have allowed/encouraged it). Since he moves so quickly, he doesn't really retain it, I guess...no mastery. I take the blame for moving too quickly, and it's going to take dedication from both of us to slow down and let things sink in better. I'm the same way...I despise repitition and am always on the quest for new and more exciting information.


----------



## cindy-e (Feb 14, 2008)

mammabooh said:


> He did the first three lessons today and said it wasn't as bad as he thought it would be (he has stated in the past that he has no desire to do any work on the computer). It was ridiculously easy, but I told him that it would eventually get a bit harder.
> 
> He's actually one of those kids that grasps things quickly and I think that is part of the problem. When he "gets" it, he's ready to move on (and I've obviously been a bad influence on him and have allowed/encouraged it). Since he moves so quickly, he doesn't really retain it, I guess...no mastery. I take the blame for moving too quickly, and it's going to take dedication from both of us to slow down and let things sink in better. I'm the same way...I despise repitition and am always on the quest for new and more exciting information.


progress! =) retention... if he is stronger in english than math, it sometimes helps to write out the steps to solving new kinds of problems in english words... like in a list. That gives them something to remember that is derived out of an area where he is strong. If he is a visual learner, he may actually 
"remember" the list (be able to "see" it in his head when it is not there.)

Good luck!
Cindyc.


----------

