# Basic questions about LGD's



## Nicholie Olie (Dec 16, 2012)

Hey all - I can't seem to find out how much certain LGD breeds wander/roam. I read a lot of people saying Great Pyrenees wander a lot, of course it has to do with the individual dog, but i was curious on how much other LGD's wander?


Spanish Mastiff
Pyrenean Mastiff
Kangal
Maremma

and any other LGD's that you found to work well. Websites are appreciated.

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Also, what kind of fencing do you use?


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Here's a good link on livestock guardian dogs http://www.lgd.org/
I don't know if the roaming is specifically a breed thing. I recommend very good fencing for any breed of lgd you choose. I have had good luck using taller woven wire(farm fencing) with a strand of hot wire on top. Both of my dogs are Pyr/Anatolian crosses. Neither are roamers. I used to have a pyr/anatolian cross that would roam.


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## Batt (Sep 8, 2006)

I can only speak to the 2 Pyrs I have owned. Agree completely with the fencing. Also they need a job/family to keep them home. If they don't have something to guard, they will go looking for something to guard.


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## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Don't forget to check out the very top thread sticky in this livestock guardian animal section for more links.


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## TamiJoyFarm (Oct 18, 2012)

Had two Caucasian Mountain Dogs with lots of animals to protect and they always wandered away from home, miles and miles away in fact. We tried the invisible fence and it only worked at keeping them from coming back into the yard once they had taken the zap while heading out of the yard. Wonderful family dogs but very stubborn. Now we have a GP and no wandering but I am also home fulltime now and able to train/work with him daily which wasn't the case with the CMD's.


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## peteyfoozer (Nov 23, 2012)

We are in kind of a unique situation as we work on a 250,000 acre ranch. There is no dog proof fencing here, unfortunately, except for a very small corral and being ranch hands, we can't afford to refence the large pastures. Back when the boss' wife ran sheep, she had Pyrs, but the dogs would patrol as far as 20 miles away, at the next ranch down. When we got sheep, we got Maremmas because 2 different breeders, when I asked 'why Maremmas' both said "because they tend to stay closer to the stock." We have found this to be true in our case. Our dogs generally have the run of the entire ranch, but stick with our sheep and goats of their own volition. We have coyote, cougar, bobcat and raptors as well as the ranch dogs to worry about with the sheep, calves and free range poultry. We haven't lost a thing in 3 years. I can't speak for other breeds, as these are the only LGD's we have owned, but I have been pretty happy. We rarely lock the dogs in the tiny corral, but when we do, they stay behind a 3' high panel they could easily go over if they were of a mind to.


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## Oregon Julie (Nov 9, 2006)

As far as I am concerned unless you have a situation like what peteyfozzer has described you shouldn't have any breed of LGD unless you have the fences to keep them in. I am well aware of people who don't and things seem to mostly work out okay for them, but I would never consider owning a LGD without being able to keep them on MY land and MY land only.


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## peteyfoozer (Nov 23, 2012)

Oregon Julie said:


> As far as I am concerned unless you have a situation like what peteyfozzer has described you shouldn't have any breed of LGD unless you have the fences to keep them in. I am well aware of people who don't and things seem to mostly work out okay for them, but I would never consider owning a LGD without being able to keep them on MY land and MY land only.


Absolutely agree! The risk of harm or injury to these dogs is much too high and it does livestock precious little good if the guardian is absent. Oregon Julie's advice is absolutely sound!


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## Nicholie Olie (Dec 16, 2012)

Yes i understand fencing is a good idea, why i asked what kind of fencing is recommended/works well for you. We're looking into 200 acres at the most I was just wondering if people bought dogs that wandered/roamed the amount of acres they owned or if it didn't matter. Like i said, i read an article of GP's just always wanting more land no matter how big!


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## peteyfoozer (Nov 23, 2012)

LGD's that are of a mind to, will go over, under or through. It's amazing what a tiny hole these enormous dogs will fit through! Not sure what most folks use but the small area we can contain ours in, is field fence. I put hot wire not far from the bottom to discourage digging. I am lucky my guys don't climb fencing. The DVD by bountiful farms has a ton of info. There is a link to them in the stickies. :cowboy:


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## lostspring (Jun 29, 2007)

Had Pyrs for a number of years and they all roamed. Had 4' stock panels with a hot wire on top and never even slowed them down. These guys were nuetered also. If they can get their head in a hole they can go through it.


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## CageFreeFamily (Jul 19, 2012)

We have just under 300 acres and our dogs do not leave the property. They never go more than about 1/5 mile. Even then they are only going so far because they are cleaning up an elk carcass. Once they've brought home all the bones they don't go more than a few hundred feet from the house/barn. 

Our property has only a badly damaged barbed wire fence running along the road, and we never close the gate. I have had a mix of altered and unaltered dogs. I have not seen a difference in roaming tendency due to spay/neuter.

However, I did have one that roamed very far, but she was a 3 year old rescue that was picked up as a stray in the first place.


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## loli (Aug 14, 2011)

We have short 36inch woven, 2 strands of barb on top of that, a top hot wire for the climber and a lower hot wire for the digger. Keeps them at home. Doesn't seem to matter what breed we have tried, I don't think wandering on 100 acres is enough room for them.


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## Sanza (Sep 8, 2008)

I'm on a quarter (160 acres) and my maremma will go to the neighbour right across the road, but that's ok with them because they like the idea that he's protecting their yard too. He does not wander to the neighbours on the next quarters, and rarely leaves the farmyard unless he's chasing something. 
Last summer I decided to get him a helpmate and brought home a gp. I kept her tied up for about a week and the first day I let her off she was gone....never to be found again.


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## Nicholie Olie (Dec 16, 2012)

loli said:


> We have short 36inch woven, 2 strands of barb on top of that, a top hot wire for the climber and a lower hot wire for the digger. Keeps them at home. Doesn't seem to matter what breed we have tried, I don't think wandering on 100 acres is enough room for them.



Really? I thought it'd be more then enough, at least for one of them to go by themselves?

I was reading the stickys on the thread and saw a fence like that, i'll probably be going with something like that! Thanks. I'd feel horrible if my dogs got out and i never saw them again ):


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## peteyfoozer (Nov 23, 2012)

loli said:


> I don't think wandering on 100 acres is enough room for them.


There ARE some folks who use LGD's as service dogs, so if they grow up with less room, they don't require it. It depends very much on the individual dog and what they are used to. My Maremmas have free run of the enormous ranch, but have also been quite happy confined to the small back yard for at least a week or so at a time, as they grew up there where they could see the stock but not get in trouble unless I was supervising. Our's are HEAVILY socialized and even get to visit in the house for a while each morning. While this isn't the recommended protocol with LGD's it works for us and I am pretty confident my boys would be happy enough just learning to guard me in the house and yard if I ever got rid of the livestock...which is important to me because the dogs are irreplaceable and I do have health issues.


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## jordan (Nov 29, 2006)

Nicholie Olie said:


> Hey all - I can't seem to find out how much certain LGD breeds wander/roam. I read a lot of people saying Great Pyrenees wander a lot, of course it has to do with the individual dog, but i was curious on how much other LGD's wander?
> 
> 
> Spanish Mastiff
> ...


My Spanish Mastiff's stay on the property with a 5 strand, high tensile fence and two strands of electric rope. So long as my Great Pyr is kept separate from them :grumble: the SM's aren't inclined to leave the property at all. The Spanish Mastiff's will alternate 'jobs' every day too, so while one or two will stay close to the herd, another will go to the top of the hill so they can oversee everything and yet another will do perimeter checks. It's really cool to watch this every day :goodjob:


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