# American Gypsies?



## Haven (Aug 16, 2010)

I see a new spin off of the European Gypsy Wedding show on tv now. It follows "American Gypsies."

We all know there have been bands of gypsies in other countries for thousands of years, but in the USA???? On the show they dress in flamboyant clothes, have little education, live in a male dominated culture, and the girls are married young and dress like street walkers, dance like strippers, but are supposed to be so chaste that they never even kiss a member of the opposite sex before marriage.

Who are these people? I was born and raised in this country and never heard of Gypsies or "travelers", as they call themselves on the show. Is this for real?


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## strawberrygirl (Feb 11, 2009)

Yes.. It is for real. 

My mom used to tell me about the gypsies that lived near us when I was a baby. I am guessing they were different from what you see on tv today, but they were definitely gypsies. I'll leave it at that.


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## gunsmithgirl (Sep 28, 2003)

We had some that lived down the road from us for a while when I was growing up. They did not dress weird, mostly kept to themselves. I do remember that they lived in falling down mobile homes crowded together on their plot, but drove brand new corvettes.


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

Oh yes in the USA. My Grandparents told me they had gypsies around the area. Parked their wagon and such just out of town limits.


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## julieq (Oct 12, 2008)

Wow, this is news to me! The only gypsies I know of are the ones I read about in my James Herriott novels. Of course, here in the high desert of Southern Idaho, it might not be a great stopping place for them!


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## tiffnzacsmom (Jan 26, 2006)

My grandfather remembered gypsies coming to town when he was a child so about 1925. His grandmother would tie him to her if she had to go outside with him for fear he'd be stolen.


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## SteveD(TX) (May 14, 2002)

Gypsies are definitely in the U.S. 

About 40 years ago, my father became gravely ill in Louisville, KY and I flew up there to be with the family as I was still in Texas after my folks moved there. A man who the nurses called the "king of the gypsies" was in intensive care at the same hospital. Families came from all over, most of them pulling travel trailers or driving motor homes that were parked in the parking lots of the hospital. They were in the halls, everywhere; the police finally had to tell them that only a few could be in the hospital at once. 

Several years ago there were some home improvement scams reportedly run by gypsies praying on homeowners that had tornado damage in the DFW area. I think most are from Romania.


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## Chixarecute (Nov 19, 2004)

Cher released a song a looong time ago, sung from the perspective of a young gypsy woman. I believe the title was "Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves"...the next segment "you hear it from the people of the town..." In the song, one of the way they made money was the women dancing "but every night all the men would come around, and lay their money down."

Anyway, I always assumed then, that there were gypsies in America.


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## HeelSpur (May 7, 2011)

We always saw gypsies when I was a kid, they would park in the farmers market lot and set up shop.


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## Haven (Aug 16, 2010)

Wow, they must have some similar ethnic background in another country or something. Maybe they are known in only certain regions of the US.

I thought the US show was just trying to create Gypsies since the Euro show was so popular. I guess they really do exist here...


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## Sawmill Jim (Dec 5, 2008)

Fun reading Gypsy Travelers put it in a search . Think those guys running around selling tools are travelers .:clap:


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## tinknal (May 21, 2004)

My town is under a Gypsie curse. Some years ago a bunch were camped in the city park. There is a low head dam there and a 12 year old Gypsie boy was swimming and drowned. His Grandmother put a curse on the town. Far as I can tell it hasn't had much effect.


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## empofuniv (Oct 14, 2005)

My MIL tells of when she was a child in northern OK and one day her parents had to leave the homestead and go into town. The oldest boy was in charge and they saw a wagon of folks coming up the road. Brother put all the children in a closet, but MIL was the littlest one and had to go up on the closet shelf. Some one knocked and knocked but none of the children would answer. After a bit they heard the wagon leaving. All of the tools that were outside were gone and so were all the chickens and most of the vegetables from the garden. That would have been in the late 20s and she swears that they were gypsies and that they would steal children.

In the mid 50s I know there were gypsies in south OK as my g'parents would let them camp on the property. We never had any negative experiences w them. They had beautiful horses and one of the older women would sit w my g'ma and they would chat in the evenings. I was fascinated because she was the first woman I ever saw smoking a pipe. My g'ma dipped snuff. I would sneak up and sit as quiet as a church mouse under the porch to hear them chatting.

The old lady even told my grandmother where to find a ring my gm had lost. I was never allowed to go into any of their wagons. They would give me little toys and carved dolls. And when they left there would always be a stack of chopped wood and some fresh caught fish or other game left on the back porch.


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## sewsilly (May 16, 2004)

Bunches of them life just outside of a town in SC... gigantic mansions, and until the mansion is paid off, they live in a trailer in the backyard. Keep to themselves, mostly and 'travel' at certain seasons.


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## Trixie (Aug 25, 2006)

My impression, maybe wrong, is there are gypsies we think of as those from central Europe, who tell fortunes, supposed to steal babies, like horses, etc. 

Then there are the Irish Gypsies or 'travelers'.

I


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## GammyAnnie (Jun 2, 2011)

Haven said:


> Wow, they must have some similar ethnic background in another country or something. Maybe they are known in only certain regions of the US.
> 
> I thought the US show was just trying to create Gypsies since the Euro show was so popular. I guess they really do exist here...


Gypsies are generally of Romani decent, but racially named as a slur Gypsy i.e. short for Egyptian.

The Travelers, or Irish Travelers, are, as their names states generally Irish in decent.

Both cultures are living and thriving in the U.S. and have been for many generations.

Annie


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## 36376 (Jan 24, 2009)

We have a whole community here. About 4 or 5 family names. All of the women dress the same from old to young. Long hair, lots of make-up, high heels and short skirts. The clan is patriarch in nature with a "king". I worked at a local funeral home and we were the funeral home that did all of gypsy funerals. When the king spoke, they obeyed without question. The ones here typically do paving and do a good job if you watch them closely. You can only deal in cash with them here. Now they have to marry outsiders because there aren't as many of them. A lot of the men are barrel-chested and do not live to see 65. (At least this is the way it was when I worked at the funeral home over 10 years ago.)


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## Trixie (Aug 25, 2006)

GammyAnnie said:


> Gypsies are generally of Romani decent, but racially named as a slur Gypsy i.e. short for Egyptian.
> 
> The Travelers, or Irish Travelers, are, as their names states generally Irish in decent.
> 
> ...


You explained it better.

I remember seeing the Romani gypsies when I was a child. 

The part about stealing babies wasn't mean as fact, just the old folklore. 

It was only fairly recently that I heard of the Irish Travelers or gypsies. Probably we have seen them, just didn't recognize them as such. A few years ago, some lady was caught on tape on a Wal Mart parking lot, treating her child badly and she was said to be an Irish Traveler -


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## GammyAnnie (Jun 2, 2011)

Trixie said:


> You explained it better.
> 
> I remember seeing the Romani gypsies when I was a child.
> 
> ...


Charlie Chaplin was born of Romani parents in the back of a "gypsy" wagon.

Irish Travelers and Rom (as they preferred to be called) Gypsy folk are completely and totally different.

Annie


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

I was in Dearborn flirting with one of them.Her Mom put a curse on me but would take it off if I paid the right amount. :awh:

big rockpile


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## chickenista (Mar 24, 2007)

Yep. I agree. The Romani people are NOT the same type of people (scum) that are in the Southern US.

The American 'gypsies' are truly bad news.
Come spring you can see them rolling on the highways of America in their new trucks with SC plates. They look for older homes with elderly owners and promise them new driveways, roofs or paint jobs. They do shoddy work and quite often have a guy going in the back door as the first guy is talking at the front.
The television stations run warnings during commercial breaks trying to keep the elderly folks from being taken.

Their 'culture' is very strange as well. It is very insular and difficult to escape from. The girls are trotted out in skimpy dress from toddlers on up and marriages are arranged and consumated at very young ages.
Quite often it is an abusive life for women who are not to work outside the home..ever. And are not well educated.

They may be referred to as gypsies, but we know them as Travellers.


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## secretcreek (Jan 24, 2010)

gunsmithgirl said:


> We had some that lived down the road from us for a while when I was growing up. They did not dress weird, mostly kept to themselves. I do remember that they lived in falling down mobile homes crowded together on their plot, but drove brand new corvettes.


How did I know gunsmithgirl was from Michigan before I even looked? I know of a group in Upper MI that live as a clan. Just like the description by gunsmithgirl... Uneducated, but skilled, they never have much money- but they barter many thing amongst each other, they live next to- or near each other, they trade skills with each other, they have leaders- but the men "groom" the women-even the girls (I don't mean physically groom) but dictate what the women wear, check if they are gaining weight, pair up young people, etc... it's real creepy. I know a young woman who left her adopted family during a rebellious stage and took up with her bio family who were gypsies. She was unable to get away once she straightened out/figured things out. She was threatened that "they would come after her to come get her and it wouldn't be pretty if anyone got involved...as others from another state would get involved. " They grow, smoke, sell m-juana. They identify with an Irish heritage.


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## hippygirl (Apr 3, 2010)

Yeah, we have them here...cons and scammers.


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## Big Dave (Feb 5, 2006)

Big community of Gypsies live in the Fort Coffee Oklahoma area. They travel in the summer to do asphalt work. They used to camp on the Albert Pike rd now in Fort Smith. Irish travelers are a different story.


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## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

Gypsies are on the east side of Fort Worth, used to come in the 7-11 I worked at. I never had problems with them, although others did. One fellow had ALL the gloves in the showcase stolen when they came in one time. Wasn't unusual for them to come in, change a baby's diaper and leave the dirty one in the packages of diapers, still on the shelf. Sometimes they'd have a nice lunch...they were tidy with their lunch leavings too, when they ate lunch on us.

One time, one of the men came in and bought some stuff and we talked a bit...he said, "I am a gypsey" so I replied, "Hey man, everyone has to be someone". He then said he worked for CBS and showed me an ID, and I said I bet you work for NBC, ABC, PBS and a few others, too. He said as a matter of fact, I do, and pulled out ID for ALL the networks! So then, he said that since he was a gypsey, he was going to steal from me. I said "Ok. But you have to take the WHOLE thing at once."

Maybe that's why I didn't have a problem with them...they were still trying to figure out how to steal the whole store at once.

They were NOT the Travelers, just American Gypsies, the Adams clan, in fact.

Mon


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

There are gypsies in Spokane, WA. In fact Jimmie Marks, a gypsy, put curse on the city of Spokane about 20 years ago.


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## Joshie (Dec 8, 2008)

A few years back they did a segment about Travelers/Gypsies on one of those news shows. They would take advantage of older people and swoop in after natural disasters. They'd do roof and driveway scams. 

Just gotta wonder how they afford those expensive, gaudy clothing.


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## Horseyrider (Aug 8, 2010)

I heard an interesting story from a woman now 101 years old; she told it to me about twenty years ago. She said that their farm has a gypsy curse on it.

Apparently her father, who was a very wealthy man and could afford the best of everything, back in the years after WWI, had a beautiful black stallion. The black stallion was known all around as being the very best-- beautiful movement, exquisite looks, perfect temperament, and babies that were exceptional. A gypsy king heard of this horse while traveling through, and was smitten by it. He approached this old woman's father about buying the horse.

The old woman's father was reluctant, but they finally arrived at a colossal price. The gypsy paid and left with the horse. Her father was jubilant; he knew the horse was laminitic.

A few months later the old gypsy king figured it out. He came back and demanded his money back. Of course the old woman's father refused to pay it, so the gypsy king gave the farm a curse.

Over the next hundred years, the descendants of the old woman have had many national championships, and they run a small but world class training and boarding facility. But every couple of years, some horse or another has a freak death. Most of the ones I know involve fences-- horses running at fences and flipping over and breaking their necks, getting tangled in fences and losing limbs or degloving legs, getting cast in fences and having injuries so bad they have to be put down. Broken necks or legs from being tied. Crazy stuff.

I won't say I believe in gypsy curses, but I do believe that for a very long time these people have had way more than their share of freak injuries and deaths there. And most trainers, after they lose a couple, tend to move on.


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## lemonthyme7 (Jul 8, 2010)

Gypsies traveling through a small town near where I live, many years ago (before I was born and I'm 48) had their little baby die and he is buried somewhere in the local cemetary with no headstone. Always thought that was sad to have to bury your baby and move on maybe to never come back that way again.


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## KentuckyDreamer (Jan 20, 2012)

My great great grandmother was full Romani Gypsy. For generations they told tale sof the "gypsy woman" roaming the hills of Scioto County, Ohio on a white horse. They say when she died her coal black hair was long enough to touch the floor.

I can well remember her daughter, my great grandmother, in the later years of her life; though her hair was grey, it too was so very long. 

Knowing the Romani "values" it came as a shock to know my great grandfather had left a wife and five children for this younger woman and they could never legally marry. After his death, my great grandmother had several men friends. 

In the older census it was often recorded when one was a gypsy.


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## KentuckyDreamer (Jan 20, 2012)

In reading several of the post, and having seen the program, I am wondering if there aren't bits and pieces of the culture in Appalachia. I married young and moved to Appalachia...culture shock for sure. I can remember my sister-in-laws having to "get in the house" if a car drove down the road. And girls marrying from in the early to mid teens.


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## SteveD(TX) (May 14, 2002)

One of the last times I saw people that I suspected were gypsies was maybe 15 years ago. My family and I were dining at Benihana and at the table next to us, there were several young couples. The men were all wearing similar shiny suits with lots of jewelry; the women were dressed up like prostitutes but obviously were not since all looked to be of the same culture. The men were quite loud but friendly enough and had a couple of exchanges with us. My teenage son, who had never seen such behavior and dress, finally asked them bluntly: "where are you guys from?" Their answer (as I suspected it would be) was "Romania man".


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## Ardie/WI (May 10, 2002)

As a child, in rural Wisconsin, I remember being told about the gypsies and ow they steal.

One day, some people were on the road by the house and my grandpa and my father told my grandma and mother to take us into the house. I don't know what the conversation between my family and those people was about. I was told the were gypsies, but they didn't look different than us.


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## homefire2007 (Sep 21, 2007)

I am watching the show with great interest. Growing up in Texas, we knew them as Irish Travelers, who at that time dealt in horseflesh and any kind of scam, etc. known. As recently as twenty years ago, word was they would take care of a horse that wasn't panning out for the insurance money for owners of said horses. We were warned if they were in the area, their MO being to send a horde of children up to the counter, trying to ring up their purchases of candy bars etc. individually led to interesting shortages in the register....all talking at once, changing their mind, diverting your attention, what a nightmare!

Wrapping my mind around the 'purity' of gypsy girls is interesting to say the least. Purity of heart is more meaningful in my book. My sons tell me to be more fair and I'm trying.... this show is not changing my mind:shrug:


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## Haven (Aug 16, 2010)

How do they raise horses if they live in small campers and travel?


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## demeter (Jul 15, 2010)

Yes, the Rom pass through here about once a year heading west. Mostly pulling campers often painted with signs and symbols. The King is in front. If he waves, they all wave. If not, no wave. I always get waves. Kinda cool.

Demeter


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## shannsmom (Jul 28, 2009)

We watched an interesting series last year on Netflix about the Travelers. It was called "The Riches" and starred Minnie Driver and Eddie Izzard IIRC. Amused me when we started watching it, but by the end, it irritated me thinking that people really go around scamming other folks, and I was rooting against them!


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## Ozarks Tom (May 27, 2011)

A friend relates a good tale about gypsies. He was staying in an RV park when a caravan of gypsies pulled in, and after a long negotiation with the manager, parked their trailers near him. A man across the way saw them, and started chaining up everything he had, propane bottle, chairs, table, etc.. My friend was talking to one of the men, and the gypsy noticed the guy chaining everything up. He said "ah, he's thinking about us". The next morning the gypsies were gone, and every chain the guy had used was laying in a pile, with the locks on top. Nothing missing.


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## stamphappy (Jul 29, 2010)

Great, interesting, and informative thread. Thanks everyone for sharing. The closest I've come to gypsies was when we lived in a year-round campground in our RV waiting for our Navy housing. 

Most of the campground was filled with people who worked for a traveling carnival. They pretty much kept to themselves. Had a couple of conversations in the laundry room. One of the gals said that they homeschooled, paid for everything in cash, and loved their nomadic life style. I do recall they had really nice rigs. 

I do remember my mom talking about gypsies stealing kids when I was young. She talked scornfully of them. This would have been in the late 60s/early 70s in Portland, Oregon.


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## Dusky Beauty (Jan 4, 2012)

I think the historical gypsies valued horses for the same reason they value cars now... 
A home (be it a house, a mobile home or an RV) is common family property, but a nice car is personal property. 

You see the same thing in traditional low income mexican families in America-- a multi generational extended family will all live and work out of one house, but the young members of the family (particularly the young men) spend all their extra money on the hottest car they can afford-- something that is just theirs. 

My anthropological theory anyway.


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## tinknal (May 21, 2004)

Haven said:


> How do they raise horses if they live in small campers and travel?


I think that is mostly in the past. They traveled in horse drawn caravans and traded along the way. 

I doubt that few people know about the fate of Gypsies in Romania and the rest of Europe. Hitler committed genocide on them in the same way he did the Jews.


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## Lada (Jun 7, 2008)

KentuckyDreamer said:


> My great great grandmother was full Romani Gypsy. For generations they told tale sof the "gypsy woman" roaming the hills of Scioto County, Ohio on a white horse. They say when she died her coal black hair was long enough to touch the floor.
> 
> I can well remember her daughter, my great grandmother, in the later years of her life; though her hair was grey, it too was so very long.
> 
> ...


I grew up in Scioto County and don't remember hearing this tale. I'll have to ask some of my family about it. Interesting.


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## Elsbet (Apr 2, 2009)

I saw them once, I think in Georgia, when I was very small. We would have been traveling from Maine to Florida to visit my great-grand parents. They had beautiful wagons drawn by horses. It was just a glimpse as we drove by, but it stuck with me. I wanted to be a gypsy for years after, lol. That would have been in 1979.


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## Karen (Apr 17, 2002)

When I was a kid growing up in Toledo, OH we had a lot of them, but they pretty much stayed put and lived in storefronts. My grandma use to warn us about staying away from them because they kidnapped little kids. :hrm:

My grandpa was an executive for the Toledo Blade newspaper and he use to take me to work with him sometimes. At the corner where the newspaper is located, there use to be a Gypsy organ grinder with a little monkey that would tip his hat and do tricks if you paid him for it. Grandpa always would take me over there and give the organ grinder a dollar. Grandma use to get so mad at him for contributing to the Gypsies. LOL!


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## KentuckyDreamer (Jan 20, 2012)

Lada said:


> I grew up in Scioto County and don't remember hearing this tale. I'll have to ask some of my family about it. Interesting.


Lada, Melvina lived in the Hanging Rock area. She died in 1936.
Terri


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

There are a million Romani in the US and most are Roman Catholic. Romani have been persecuted for centuries. Hitler sent almost 500,000 to the death camps. This has taught them to be wary and they choose to live outside society but within a very tight society of their own.


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## Kmac15 (May 19, 2007)

There is a community of Irish travelers not to far from us, in North Augusta. They were even on an undercover news show a few years back. My sister works in a grocery store near them, says that there is no mistaking them.


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## rancher1913 (Dec 5, 2008)

My experience with gypsies are the "Rom" variety, not the Irish variety. There are quite a few in the central KS area that run some recycling (metal) facilities. Let's just say that having multiple experiences with them in the health care setting.... none of them were pleasant.

Moldy


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## lexa (Mar 30, 2012)

never mind


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## Peacock (Apr 12, 2006)

Spring Grove Cemetery & Arboretum in Cincinnati is supposed to have a whole section of Gypsy graves, and legend tells that every Memorial Day Weekend a huge group of Gypsies come to decorate the graves. I don't know if this is true, as I've never been to this cemetery -- it's a HUGE place and very picturesque, people come there just to take nature photos, go for walks, even hold weddings. The stories I've heard are that these are the Irish type of Gypsy, but who knows?


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## scfarmchick (Mar 1, 2012)

I grew up in the same town in SC were there is a large group of Irish travelers. I went to school with them through 6th grade (they don't go to school past that). The men travel around and mostly rip people off and the women stay home. In the front of their community the houses are big and tacky, but there is alot that live in trailers in the back. There is alot of inbreding so birth defects are a problem, but they don't let them out to stores and such. The only time you ever see them was random times at the hospital. They all pretty much look alike and they look and talk just like the ones on the show in England. The girls marry very young usually when they get out of public school (6th grade) and mostly arranged marrages. When they go out from their community it is in large groups (all women and young boys very rare to see a traveler man). They are all dressed like hookers even the yound girls.


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

Back in the late 80's or early 90's we went to Blackhawk State Park for a family reunion. Two of dh's uncles had big 5th wheel campers and they would park next to each other with the canopies extended and we'd use the area between for tables. Anyway when we got there the campground was full of gypsies. At the entrance to the campground they had set up maybe 12 to 15 tables end to end and they were piled with food and flowers. It was obviously some sort of celebration. They had dug holes and were cooking meat. I believe they butchered the animals (sheep or goats?) right there. The women were dressed ridiculous for camping!! High high heels don't do well on dirt!! They did look like hookers. Lots of kids running everywhere. There was a pickup with a trailer that held a generator and a washer going from trailer to trailer so they could do laundry. Most of their campers were newish and very nice. Being nosy I walked over to the "altar" and asked what they were celebrating. I don't recall the answer but I'm thinking it was some Saint's day. They kept to themselves other than approaching to ask dh's uncle a question. I do recall that dh's uncle was extremely rude.


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## Old John (May 27, 2004)

Peacock said:


> Spring Grove Cemetery & Arboretum in Cincinnati is supposed to have a whole section of Gypsy graves, and legend tells that every Memorial Day Weekend a huge group of Gypsies come to decorate the graves. I don't know if this is true, as I've never been to this cemetery -- it's a HUGE place and very picturesque, people come there just to take nature photos, go for walks, even hold weddings. The stories I've heard are that these are the Irish type of Gypsy, but who knows?


Hmmm! Interesting!
When I was a child in grade school, I went to St. Patrick's Catholic School, on the Northside, Cumminsville, I think. I finished 4th grade there. It use to be a very Irish side of the City. A couple times a year, the Gypsies would have a very big Wedding or Funeral at St. Pat's Church. 
We only lived a few blocks from there. Close to Blue Rock St, I think. 
All the streets around the Church would be parked full of really big cars & vans. 
This was back in the late 1940's and I was nearly 10 years old. We moved to Indiana, in 1950. I remember Spring Grove Ave. But do not remember where it was located. It's been 62 years.......


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## Trixie (Aug 25, 2006)

We have stayed in a lot of RV parks, and I don't think I have ever seen what I think was Irish Travelers - not that I was looking for it. I'll have to pay more attention.


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