# Tallow or Lard?



## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

I started out making soap saying I`d never use any animal fats. 
Last "festival/market season" I had several people ask about "Grandma`s Lye Soap". My reply would be,"All my soap is made with lye",and it is! I knew what these people meant most likely, I`m sure they were talking about soap made with lard.
So I asked a friend of mine who raises pigs on pastures, feeds good food and does not use hormones or additives.But he explained that he only butchers two or three a year and didn`t have any lard right now. So I bought lard off the shelf at my local grocery store and tried it. I must admit it made a very nice creamy bar. Still I felt bad about the additives but mostly I hate the way these animals live out their lives. I will continue to look for a farm with pigs who raise them like my friend because I do think lard makes an exceptional bar of soap,and my customers ask for it.
My question is has anyone worked with tallow? Do you get the same results? Using tallow may be an option because I also have friends that raise beef on pastures and treat the animals right.


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## bowdonkey (Oct 6, 2007)

Tallow seems to make a harder bar. Harder meaning it takes more to put a dent in it. Actually I like both. But I like the new Castille soaps I'm experimenting with.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

14 years ago I started with lard & tallow in my soaps. When I read online about animal oils contributing to acne, I switched to palm oil. The soaps made from palm made my skin very dry. That was what led me to make single oil soaps recording how they soaped, how they kept scents, how hard theyv are, how they felt washing with them. Also their fatty acid makeup.

From this info I started creating recipes..

Tallow creates a slightly harder bar & holds scent better. Lard slows trace (great for fast moving scents), shows colors better. 

I use both but personally prefer lard


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

bowdonkey said:


> Tallow seems to make a harder bar. Harder meaning it takes more to put a dent in it. Actually I like both. But I like the new Castille soaps I'm experimenting with.



I like Castille soaps to,for the conditioning appeal. But what I`m aiming for is to please that group of people who always seem to think grandma`s soap was best.
I have a local store that stocks (right on their front counter) a soap labeled as "Grandma`s Lye Soap", it is made in Minnesota. The store owner says it sells like crazy! I asked him if I could provide him with the same soap only without all the additives would he stock mine instead,he said he would after he sells out of the other.


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

MullersLaneFarm said:


> 14 years ago I started with lard & tallow in my soaps. When I read online about animal oils contributing to acne, I switched to palm oil. The soaps made from palm made my skin very dry. That was what led me to make single oil soaps recording how they soaped, how they kept scents, how hard theyv are, how they felt washing with them. Also their fatty acid makeup.
> 
> From this info I started creating recipes..
> 
> ...



I`ve never tried tallow. I did make a lard soap when I first started making soap and it was really nice. It did have a smell though,but I used only a little EO so maybe I didn`t use enough.
Thanks for the tip about lard on fast moving scents. Now to find some "clean" tallow and lard and experiment.


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

I want to ask deer processors for deer fat. 
I'm kind of scared...


Last year I asked out of season and they wanted some $4/lb!


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

When working with animal oils, either rendering or heating, keep your heat very low


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## lathermaker (May 7, 2010)

Follow the suppliers recommendations for how much fragrance oil to use. I use both lard and tallow, but prefer lard. I think the bars are more conditioning and have better lather. And by the way, to ask a store owner to stock your soap_ instead _of some other company's is rude and won't gain you any friends in the soap making world.


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## Puddin (Mar 31, 2003)

I started soaping using lard (store bought), made a wonderful creamy soap. In my opinion. Nice scents staying a long time, good colors. I make my laundry soap with lard, lye heavy. The bars didn't last very long.
Then I started using beef tallow. I wasn't all that impressed with it, but it created a slightly harder bar. I could still smell the 'beef' ... I didn't use enough scent to overwhelm that smell. But the bars lasted a longer time. Subsequently, I've used more scent (I dont' like a strong scent).
Lately, I've had access to deer tallow. This is an even harder bar (using the same recipe as I'd used for beef tallow). It hasnt' taken color very well unfortunately. It's very white.... maybe this soap will just have to remain white! It takes small amounts of scent to cover the tallow smell, very subtle. 
Conclusion: I'll use lard for easy scent and color. Beef tallow for a slightly harder bar (I think I'll be using it for laundry soap recipe, lye strong), where the scent isn't all that important. At this point, Deer tallow is my favorite, it's a hard bar, keeps it's scent.... and I'll find a better way to color it. 
Gloria


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## linn (Jul 19, 2005)

I have worked with lard and with tallow briefly. I prefer lard. Although tallow may make a harder bar, my home rendered tallow left a slight smell in my soap. I think lard makes a lovely soap.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Gloria, instead of using an animal oil for your laundry soap, try coconut or palm kernel oil. They're higher in lauric fatty acid and work better for laundry


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## SueMc (Jan 10, 2010)

Im so happy to see this being discussed. We butchered one of our hogs and I've been rendering lard for two days. I'm freezing the leaf fat lard but have so much of the rest that I wanted to ask about soap making using my lard. I'm just learning to make soap so not smart enough yet to ask many questions. Mainly what I was wanting to know (quality/popularity of lard soap) has already been answered here.
Our pigs have been raised on pasture getting guernsey milk, eggs and produce almost every day. I really don't want to waste any more of him than absolutely necessary. 
Thanks!


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## Gailann Schrader (May 10, 2002)

SarahFair: Deer fat makes a wonderful soap... But here in Indiana you can't sell it. Whitetail products are regulated.


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

Here in ga I don't think you are allowed to sell it either. The price they quoted me was"processing fees"


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## Wendy (May 10, 2002)

I only use lard. My BIL just rendered a bunch of lard from a hog they butchered & gave me the leftovers from the last hog, which was a 5 gallon bucket almost full! Yeah for me! That helps the profit margins.


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## peteyfoozer (Nov 23, 2012)

Most of the soap I sell is made with lard. I use the tallow for Body butters instead. Never had problems with 'acne' from using lard soaps. They outsell the veggie soaps for me.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

Grandma's Lye Soap is a commercial soap, not 'homemade'.

I have made lard soap. It is hard and comes out of the mold real nicely. In the future I'm planning on adding mutton fat (which I'm collecting as I empty the freezer) or lard to the soaps since I'm no loner selling them.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Mutton is the hardest tallow I've ever worked with. Great stuff!


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

lathermaker said:


> Follow the suppliers recommendations for how much fragrance oil to use. I use both lard and tallow, but prefer lard. I think the bars are more conditioning and have better lather. And by the way, to ask a store owner to stock your soap_ instead _of some other company's is rude and won't gain you any friends in the soap making world.



whoa now...it`s not like that at all....this is a guy who I give a lot of business to,he is a local garden store in a VERY small town. He was very happy to hear I made soap and didn`t blink an eye when I asked if I could supply him with soap instead of someone a few thousand miles away?? 

I see it as smart a business move AND a way for people to shop locally. Like I said this is a SMALL town and I`ve worked really hard and continue to work hard to make a name for myself here.


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## lathermaker (May 7, 2010)

I stand by my opinion. Offer to supply him with soap, but not at the expense of another company. It doesn't matter if the other company is 10 miles or 1000 miles away. It's not a smart business move to put down your competition. Offer him a local option and let your products speak for themselves.


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

lathermaker said:


> I stand by my opinion. Offer to supply him with soap, but not at the expense of another company. It doesn't matter if the other company is 10 miles or 1000 miles away. It's not a smart business move to put down your competition. Offer him a local option and let your products speak for themselves.



well your entitled to your opinion. 
The "company" is commercially made soap with lot`s of preservatives and additives. 
And IMO mass-produced goods made a 1000 miles away is detrimental to the environment and my local community.
I`m not trying to sound like a ECO-snob...but I am one.I keep my opinions to myself but you opened the door. I do let my product and labels speak for itself.
I mean I can`t grow and produce sustainable palm oil here in the mt`s of Tennessee so I have to buy it from a company thousands of miles away but I spend extra buying it,because I take the time to buy it from a place with little impact on the planet and which benefits those producing it.
IMO my soap is a better product than one laced with stuff that hurts people or the environment. So no I don`t feel like I`ve done anything wrong by moving in and moving that company out.
I feel like it`s about being a good steward of the gift we have been given,and if that means pushing out the bad to make room for the good then so be it.


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

Wendy said:


> I only use lard. My BIL just rendered a bunch of lard from a hog they butchered & gave me the leftovers from the last hog, which was a 5 gallon bucket almost full! Yeah for me! That helps the profit margins.


 so one hog will yield 5 gallons...that`s great to know. What did you have to do to it before using it?


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Depends on the hog and how big it was when butchered, what it ate, et al.

I dry render my lard and tallow either in the oven but more often now in a couple roasters.


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## 4nTN (Jan 28, 2005)

MullersLaneFarm said:


> Depends on the hog and how big it was when butchered, what it ate, et al.
> 
> I dry render my lard and tallow either in the oven but more often now in a couple roasters.



perfect!...thanks for sharing the link


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## gleamer (May 7, 2012)

Tallow makes a wonderful hard bar, but I use both. I'm a fairly new soapmaker, and I make both all-veg oil soap and animal-fat soap to sell and tallow is by far my favorite. I have a deal with the local butcher to trade fat for soap, so that I can render the tallow.


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## cybercat (Mar 29, 2005)

I have acne and so does my hubby. Neither one of us can use all veggi soaps. I started making a lard base soap because hubby remembers his grandma making it and they raised pigs. I will not use OO in my soap for it causes us to break out. We now just butchered our own pigs so I am swimming in lard. Since I have been making soap 6 years now we have had less acne. When I ran out and we switched back to store bought what a mess my hubby's back was. I use 4 oils only and milk and everyone loves it. BIL says it is the best for cutting grease better than Dawn and neighbor loves it for her face and she has thin skin. I have not changed my recipe now in a year and it is bugging me to play with it but why fix what is not broke. i will play with FO and maybe color.


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

cybercat said:


> I have acne and so does my hubby. Neither one of us can use all veggi soaps. I started making a lard base soap because hubby remembers his grandma making it and they raised pigs. I will not use OO in my soap for it causes us to break out. We now just butchered our own pigs so I am swimming in lard. Since I have been making soap 6 years now we have had less acne. When I ran out and we switched back to store bought what a mess my hubby's back was. I use 4 oils only and milk and everyone loves it. BIL says it is the best for cutting grease better than Dawn and neighbor loves it for her face and she has thin skin. I have not changed my recipe now in a year and it is bugging me to play with it but why fix what is not broke. i will play with FO and maybe color.


By OO do you mean olive oil? 

I have a big problem with acne and "backne". It's cleared up since I started making my own soap and a few other change ups, but I still get the "BB acne" (feels like bbs deep under the skin) on my temples and sometimes right under my jaw line. 
They will last for months. Im not a pimple popper in the least so there they stay. 
I just ordered tea tree oil and have been spot treating with concentrated and a q-tip. Over a week and a half/two weeks it's cleared it up and shrunk then down pretty well. 
I think I might make a facial soap bar with tea tree oil


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## Wendy (May 10, 2002)

> so one hog will yield 5 gallons...that`s great to know. What did you have to do to it before using it?


I'm not sure how many hogs they butchered to get that amount. It does depend on the hog. Some will yield more lard than others. 
I don't have to do anything to it before I use it. It is already rendered down & clean.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

Sarah, yes, OO = Olive Oil. It is high in oleic fatty acid. 

If you have problems with acne, stay away from the butters (cocoa butter, shea butter, et al)

Another positive note I found about using lard in my soaping oils, it evens out my skin tone and made the beginning age spots on my overworked hands disappear!


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## cybercat (Mar 29, 2005)

I love Tea Tree oil but do not put it in my soap. It is not as cheap as it use to be since all the hype on it. I mix it with witchhazel to use on cotton balls. If you keep it simple and do not use alot of other additives a basic soap will help clear up alot of skin problems. But not all as some are hormone related and some diet related. But I find for us lard, coconut oil, safflower or almond oil and palm oil works best. I can get mine oils cheap as I said and all are renewable sources. For others it might be a different combo that is cheap to get.


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## PlicketyCat (Jul 14, 2010)

I use lard (either hog or bear) for body bars. Tallow (sheep, goat, sometimes beef or moose) for hand and laundry bars. Coconut/lard for face bars. Palm/lard for dry/coarse shampoo bars and palm/coconut/tallow for oily/fine shampoo bars.

I don't sell my soaps, they're just for us; so I also don't add a lot of scents or colors. Most essential oils I use have other properties more important to us than fragrance Lard bars lather better, and tallow bars last longer and are low foaming... at least with our well water. I find palm & coconut and superfatting is just a little gentler on face and hair, and adding milk helped a lot with winter dryness and chapping.


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

PlicketyC, 

Good to see you on the soap forum, too! You'll see a few of us from the fiber forum here.

I quit using palm oil over decade ago. My skin just doesn't like the oils high in palmitic fatty acid ... dries me out like old leather.


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## PlicketyCat (Jul 14, 2010)

I don't like palm on the skin so much, it does tend to dry; although it works great on my oily skin in the summer when I'm sweating a lot. But oddly, it seems to work great for my husband's dry coarse hair when split with lard without drying out the follicles or scalp like it does with hand and face soap. Weird, huh? I figured I'd try the palm for my shampoo since I'm oiler than Crisco and hoped to dry things out a bit, but it made things worse... I had to balance it with coconut and tallow. Lard didn't work for my shampoo either, just couldn't seem to cut through that sebum and made my fine hair limper than ever.

DH gets winter eczema really bad, but also gets beard bumps and back acne. I've been considering making him his own bath soap... thinking coconut, lard and avocado (maybe?), something soothing and rich. He's allergic to lanolin and soy so that takes a few moisturizers out of the mix. I'm already making separate shampoo for us, might as well make separate soap, too. It's hard for me to make a test batch to see how something works since I'd be so greasy you could lube a semi if I had to use up a batch of "moisturizing" soap that didn't work for him. It's not like you can really make one travel-sized bar by itself!


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## SeaGoat (Aug 17, 2012)

Can you use the lard in the baking isle at the Wal-Mart? 
The green and white bucket?


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## PlicketyCat (Jul 14, 2010)

SarahFair said:


> Can you use the lard in the baking isle at the Wal-Mart?
> The green and white bucket?


Yes, you can use commercial white lard. It's already been rendered and cleaned. The only things I've ever had issue with grocery lard is some have added preservatives and some are whipped with a little wter to look really white... avoid the first and you may have mixed results with the second because your liquid ratios will be a bit off. IIRC, the green & white tub at Wal-Mart is 100% lard, but double-check the label.


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## Homesteader333 (Apr 29, 2014)

Can't you just have a mix of lard and tallow? Then you would have the best of both worlds. Or do they not work together?


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## MullersLaneFarm (Jul 23, 2004)

They work fine together!


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