# Food aggression becoming a real pain in the guts



## Rectifier (Jun 12, 2011)

My Akbash dogs usually get along great. They love to play, patrol and hang out together pretty much all the time, except at feeding time.

Unless I stand and supervise, the dog to finish his dish first will take a run at the other dog and try to take his food. They get vicious and it is scary to watch. I don't scare easily - these are big dogs and they are giving it 100%. 

The real problem is that over the last few weeks the dog who is typically the "loser" of the eating contest (strangely, the fatter dog) has taken to gulping his food so quickly that he becomes ill. He will woof the dog food so hard that halfway through the meal, he will throw it back up. Then, eat it again. Repeat until it is all in the stomach, followed by queasy gagging sounds and staggering around. He does keep it all down in the end though and it appears to cause him no harm otherwise.

Meanwhile the other dog's slow and steady munching gets his meal chewed up and in his belly faster than this ordeal and he is there to cause trouble.

Now I stand and supervise with a shoddy old airsoft pistol to pop the aggressor in the butt as soon as he makes a move. It stings like a bee but obviously doesn't break the skin (that's what it's made for after all). This works well to stop the aggression but it doesn't stop the gulping!

I feel sorry for the poor guy and worry he will choke to death one day or get gastric torsion. Any way to stop this behaviour?


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## Kwings (Dec 21, 2010)

Is it possible for you to feed them out of sight of each other? Maybe if the one being bullied out of his food doesn't have to see the other dog(s) eat near him maybe he'll eat normally again. 

or perhaps you could feed the bullied one in the barn or shed (or wherever)? so the others don't steal his food from him.


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## Rectifier (Jun 12, 2011)

Only 2 dogs.

I usually feed them on opposite sides of an old tandem disc that is hard for them to run through, so they have to run a long ways around it to get at each others' food. It has attracted a huge snowdrift, however, they can still see each other and constantly pop heads up to peek at each other.

It's a little hard to separate them because they are always together and have been raised as wild LGDs. They respect me, I can handle them in any way but they cannot be tied/kenneled etc. I have tried feeding one in the quonset and one outside, but while I am carrying the pail for the other dog, if he doesn't get it quick enough he decides to take the food already put down for the first dog.

Maybe I should try using some barrier that they can't see through like a big piece of plywood? Cutting down visibility might really help.


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## hercsmama (Jan 15, 2004)

My female Pyr is very food aggressive. It's the only thing she does that I find unacceptable, so we work with it. She's just such a good dog other wise.

We put up a kennel, she hated it at first, but has adjusted. She is only in it during feeding time, for a few minutes.
Also, she MUST be fed first, always. I simply take her dish into the kennel and shut the gate. Then feed my male.
By the time he is fed and finished, so is she. Takes all of about 5-10 minutes. Then I just open the gate and they are good to go.
The first month or so was difficult, as she absolutely did not want to go in the kennel, but I'm the boss, not her. so in she went.
Now, she just hangs her head a bit and walks in, she knows who's going to win the fight between her and me, lol!
Try the plywood, and maybe some kennel training.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

If you can&#8217;t separate them well enough, and if you are out there with them anyway, you could reward the aggressive dog for giving you a sit. Sit, good dog, toss kibble. Sit, good dog, toss kibble&#8230;.


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

Maura has a great suggestion. However, if you choose to use a kennel, I would suggest you put the aggressive dog into it and leave the one out that gulps its food. Then you can put one bite of food in that gulper's dish, let it eat it, put another in its dish, let it eat it, etc. until it has eaten the entire portion...all in front of the one inside the kennel. (This could actually be a start to teaching the gulper not to gulp AND teaching the food thief to "watch" while the other one eats.)

I don't have near the problem you do; however, I do have two dogs I feed side by side. The lab eats much faster than the LGD; and when the lab is thru eating, he would quickly eat the other's food IF I WERE NOT THERE. With some training, now the lab will NOT even make an attempt to get the LGD's food because I am there saying "eehhh" in a growling foice. (I can even be standing at a distance doing other chores, yet keeping an eye on what is occurring when these two are eating. Thus my vocalization can be at a distance and still work.) I'm thinking maybe something similar could be taught your thief. LOL


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## Skandi (Oct 21, 2014)

motdaugrnds said:


> I don't have near the problem you do; however, I do have two dogs I feed side by side. The lab eats much faster than the LGD; and when the lab is thru eating, he would quickly eat the other's food IF I WERE NOT THERE. With some training, now the lab will NOT even make an attempt to get the LGD's food because I am there saying "eehhh" in a growling foice. (I can even be standing at a distance doing other chores, yet keeping an eye on what is occurring when these two are eating. Thus my vocalization can be at a distance and still work.) I'm thinking maybe something similar could be taught your thief. LOL


I have that issue, with a labXcollie and a pug. the bigger girl now knows that she may not steal untill the pug has finished and walked away, however if the pug picks up a piece of her dinner and moves a bit away from the bowl the other will still try to sneak in so I have to watch, and "uh uh" normaly is enough. However I was starting with a trained housedog, so she already responded to wait really well.


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## Rectifier (Jun 12, 2011)

Thanks for all the suggestions! I like the feeding kennel idea as I know that either dog would go in for the food. They are real hog dogs.

The aggression is mostly solved with the airsoft gun. I just have to stand and hold it and he behaves. For some reason, he really respects the sting of it - it is a lot like an E-collar in that respect. After all we all respect bees!

The gulping is now the main issue and I will try to separate them and feed him small portions so he cannot hog it down.


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## okiemom (May 12, 2002)

I have used the feed out at all time and for us it worked. In dog training terms what are the pros and cons?


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## aoconnor1 (Jun 19, 2014)

Rectifier said:


> Thanks for all the suggestions! I like the feeding kennel idea as I know that either dog would go in for the food. They are real hog dogs.
> 
> The aggression is mostly solved with the airsoft gun. I just have to stand and hold it and he behaves. For some reason, he really respects the sting of it - it is a lot like an E-collar in that respect. After all we all respect bees!
> 
> The gulping is now the main issue and I will try to separate them and feed him small portions so he cannot hog it down.


A few things that might help the gulping. 

1. Put a tennis or similar ball in the dish with the food. The dog will have to eat around the ball and it slows them down.

2. Put the food on a flat cookie sheet. That will stop the ability to get large amounts at one time and hopefully stop the gulping.

3. Do as suggested and feed small amounts several times a day. For me, that one wouldn't work because I am not home for the entire day, I run errands, do chores, etc, but it would be difficult for me to stop 4 times a day just to feed my dog.


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## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

LGDs commonly have resource guarding and food aggression. You have to feed them separately. It is a very, very common trait in the breeds.


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## Kwings (Dec 21, 2010)

I had an idea! What about getting one of those food dishes that makes your dogs eat slower? You could feed the dog who bullies the other with that dish, it would take him more time to eat so the other would have more time to finish and wouldn't feel like he had to gulp. 

or you could replace both their bowls with the slow feeding bowls and perhaps it would solve both problems? 

http://www.amazon.com/Indipets-Extra-Heavy-Piece-Stainless/dp/B0033PR7CI/ref=sr_1_4?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1425082571&sr=1-4&keywords=slow+eating+dog+bowls

http://www.amazon.com/Dogit-Slow-Anti-Gulping-Black-Medium/dp/B0032GG5Z8/ref=sr_1_2?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1425082571&sr=1-2&keywords=slow+eating+dog+bowls

Just an idea.


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## BGE farms (Jan 28, 2014)

One thing I try to do is as a pup teach the dog to be patient. You can do this by waiting to place their food down til they are calm and progress from their til they don't move til you say. I think this will help your situation in the long run but may take time depending on the age of your dogs.


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## Rectifier (Jun 12, 2011)

Things are going OK. What I've done:
- Working towards waiting for command to eat. They are only a year old and are taking to this pretty quickly.
- Separating them around the corner of the house, so they can't see each other
- Feeding the gulper first and then making the other dog wait, so he can't finish first even if the other dog is having gut troubles. If he does finish, I just point at him and he goes back and licks his bowl. Gulper never knows.
- Changed feeding routine. Over the last month or so I have been giving an extra 50% calories in the form of cooked rice for cheap fuel to stay warm. Huge boost in energy level but not much condition improvement - they are running it all off. Was feeding 5 cups rice in the morning, 5 cups kibble at night. Noticed he never throws up the rice, only the kibble. The rice requires more "eating" whereas the kibble just goes down the throat unchewed. So today they got a mix of 2 1/2 cups of rice/kibble at both feedings and he ate slower and kept it down.

Okiemom, cons to leaving food out all the time? My dogs successfully ate $50 worth of dog food in under a week. At that rate it's more economical to lose lambs to coyotes! In the summer I managed to free feed using a much less palatable LGD "free-feed" food from a feed mill. High protein but crummy tasting. However, supplies dried up and I have yet to acquire more. 

Free feeding is the best if it will work for you, you can put the feeder with the animals and you will get better guarding as they can guard their food supply and flock at the same time. My dogs always come back to the yard at feeding time, and have to be fed before they will return to work. I have yet to use them in our far pasture as I don't want to drive out there twice a day just to feed the dogs.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

If you train our dogs to a whistle you should be able to get them to come to you even from a distance. If a whistle is not loud enough, you could use a bell. Use the sound at dinnertime so they have a quick positive association with it. If you decide to do this, you will have to train them to the whistle or bell everywhere, pasture, yards, barn, etc. TIme worth spent.


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## hercsmama (Jan 15, 2004)

Good suggestion Maura. This is what we inadvertently did!
We are so in the habit of calling in our house dogs by whistling at meal times, that both Pyrs associate the sound with their dinner and come running.


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## Rectifier (Jun 12, 2011)

I usually just yell for them. Sometimes it takes a couple minutes for them to show up at a full gallop, but they always show. I yell pretty loud 

However, I don't think I can yell loud enough (or whistle) to get them to come from the 1-2 miles away that is the far pasture... that is the problem.

I now have them sitting for their bowls waiting for the command to eat it. They are smart dogs, especially considering that they are such dumb dogs


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

You can get a collar that emits a sound or vibration. These are used with deaf dogs. Just train the dog to recall or &#8216;go home&#8217; when the collar beeps.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Once when my dogs seemed to be going thru way too much feed I decided to hang out and watch the feed dish a while from a distance. Discovered blue jays were emptying the dish. They were lining up on a branch and flyiing down one right after the other to take a piece and fly off. Took them no time at all to empty a large pan. I bought a self feeder and that kept the jays out.


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## hastyreply (Nov 10, 2012)

Good idea to mix the rice and kibble. I remember we had a dog that really gulped his food and then got sick and my mother would make oatmeal and pour it over the kibble the night before and serve it the next day and the oatmeal would have hardened enough to really slow him down.


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