# Ammo shortage.



## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Birthday party Sunday for my brother who shoots a lot so decided to get him a gift card from Williams Gun Sight a full like gun shop near our home.
I sure was surprized when I walked in the place and found every size of ammo I would ever want *except 22lr and 22 mag.* I saw 220 swift, 22-250, 223, 204 rugar, 243 winchester, 7MM08,308, 30-06, 300 win mag and many many more. Checked out the reloading shelves and found all the primers a person would need except large rifle. The signs posted on the ammo shelves said 5 boxes per customer the sign on the primer counter said 4 boxes per customer.
Prices seemed to be right in line with what I remembered from last fall too.

http://www.williamsgunsight.com/


 Al


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

Try armslist.com for ammo and private gun sales also slickguns.com for ammo .The problem I have seen is some people think the value of their guns has elevated do to the ammo shortage when in reality it should have dropped ,There really is no ammo shortage it's just that the demand (by the government ) has risen and the ammo is still available but cost is more than most want to pay ! I bought in bulk last december and just received one order in july and still waiting on others ...


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

looks about the same most places I have been , most everything is back on the shelves 

EXCEPT 22

I even saw primers for 29.99 a K last week, that's a good price I had seen them for a lot more during the worst of the shortage.


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## CJ (May 10, 2002)

Central Arkansas here. Very little ammo to be found, and certainly not any .22lr


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Try to find #11 Percussion caps.. not gonna happen ... Not even #10 either...


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

Williams had all primers for reloading except large rifle, #11 caps, Musket caps and 209 primers including the ones for use with Triple 7 powder.

Wal Mart and Mejires are still bone bare except for some shot gun shells.


 Al


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## homebody (Jan 24, 2005)

So, is it the government that's buying all the 22lr? I would think that they would want something bigger than that. Shelves are pretty bare here in southeast MO and just forget the bricks of 22's.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

I went yesterday to a range and gunshop in Huntsville running a Federal brand ammo sale and found 50 count boxes of acceptable loads of center fire pistol ammo for $20 a box and a free box of .22 cartridges with a $50 order.

Might go back today for a few more boxes for range use If I get some money owed to me today, can catch a ride with a friend going to buy some ammo today and he feels like popping a few caps at indoor range there or the open air range a few miles north of it and the weather agrees.


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## Jolly (Jan 8, 2004)

I'm lucky enough to have a WalMart connection, so I get 22LR almost off of the truck.

Problem is, the price is horrible, at least to my wallet.

Who would have ever thought 7.62x39 would only be pennies more a round than 22LR?


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## tarbe (Apr 7, 2007)

Local Bass Pro advertised 1,400 round buckets of Rem Hi-Vel 22 ammo for $70.

Buddy went and stood in line waiting for them to open...he ran to the back where the ammo is. No buckets of 22 ammo in stock! 

He was not a happy camper.


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

The 525 round box of 22LR used to be plentiful and 24.95. Here, you are lucky to get the 325 count "tuna can" for 49.95...when they have it. One place had a bunch of them...at 95 bucks...no thanks.

Matt

BTW, why is 22 so scarce? Too busy producing higher calibers?


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## credee (Aug 17, 2013)

it's going to get worse again, after this Navy yard mess.


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## ace admirer (Oct 5, 2005)

NRA article from last month. its people like us that are causing ammo shortage, we buy every thing thats on the shelf, whether we need it or not.

It WILL get worse as Credee says....it always gets worse......

At the last match we went to the match director (Virginia University Shooting Coach) told us that one of the leading USA lead smelters is going out of business next year.....i was told they are responsible for 50 % of USA lead...


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

ace admirer said:


> At the last match we went to the match director (Virginia University Shooting Coach) told us that one of the leading USA lead smelters is going out of business next year.....i was told they are responsible for 50 % of USA lead...


You're talking about the plant in Herculaneum MO... yep.. as far as I know, it's the largest in the country... A lot of people will be out of jobs, but then again, a lot of people have complained for years at the toxic mess the place has made and all the people the place has made sick... My wife has relatives that lived in that area so been there a few times... interesting place to say the least.. I have heard that Doe Run, the company that runs the smelter is looking at building a different pant, possibly even in the same town.. The real reason for the shutdown is the costs to get it up to EPA standards and other fines they have to pay..


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

buy all the ammo you will need or can afford because even at the current prices it will only cost more and be harder to get later on .they don't have to have gun control when they can control ammo and there is no law saying we are entitled to an endless supply


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## credee (Aug 17, 2013)

it will get fixed, by smuggled in imports. prices to make .22's overseas, especially in mexico won't have gone up much. So you can still buy, in bulk there, for 2x per shot, when you can sell them for 10x per rd, in 5 gallon buckets at any swap meet, legally, no contraband or dope dog risks? oh yeah, gonna be some new rich folks in town.  The headstamp die can be changed to mark whatever you want on the cartridges. If there's no boxes, there's no proof where they came from and who would think to ask, (or care)?


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

Feds maybe ?


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## credee (Aug 17, 2013)

if they could give away guns to mexican dope cartells, they could have those buddies bring in .22's, right?


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## rod44 (Jun 17, 2013)

Scored on some CCI Mini Mags today. Luckily they are the ones that shoot the best groups at 100 yards in my rifle. Only $7.80 or so, at least they are not "holding you up"!

Max of 300 per customer.


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## credee (Aug 17, 2013)

I'd be in there most days, if i were you, and send some friends relatives, too, for about a month.


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## rod44 (Jun 17, 2013)

Only problem is that it is about 20 miles away. I have about 1000 of mini mags and 500 blazers, so I am good for a little while. Also about 700 goldens for the 10/22.


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## credee (Aug 17, 2013)

could do what so many others do. Pay a gaggle of the homeless to stand in line for you.


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Just got back from LGS...
No dice...only thing they had in 22 were 22 short BLANKS, $10.49 box of 20 or 50, didn't take close look since I have blanks for my hilti gun...
7.63x39 $8.99 for 20, Tul
308 Winchester bronze, 20 rounds $17.99
NO 30-06, this close to deer season?
12 ga, 20 rounds, $6.99 Federal
22 Hornet, 20 rounds, $21.99
NO .177
Guess the shortage finally hit my area. We were seeing higher prices, but everything was readily available. Great, just when my boys started getting into the 22s over the Fury pellet guns...
Matt


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

wow.. that's a crazy price for the TuL 7.62... recently saw a couple boxes at our local wally world.. $5 a box or so..

You can still order it by the case on the web for $250-300..


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

wally world around here (2, 1 14 miles away, the other 20) has had only shotgun shells last couple of times. No rifle or pistol.
Gander mountain is about 40 minutes away, I don't get out that way but every other month.
Going to another LGS probably tomorrow. Other end of the lake, see what he's got going on.

Matt


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Plus, I don't use an awful lot of 7.62. I just like to keep my shelves stocked...LOL!
Glad I picked up a bunch of 22 a few years ago, and have made a few swaps recently. 20 30-06 rounds for a 555 box of Remington 22, and he tossed in 2 100 round bricks of mini mags...wife bought the wrong stuff, he needed 22 mags...worked out well for me.

Matt


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Thankfully I too bought up a bunch of .22 before the madness started... I am still kind of reserved on doing any shooting with it though.. I did go through a few hundred last month though just to keep up on the skills... 

I also bought a lot of other stuff before the madness thinking I'll be set for a while.. but now that it's gotten more expensive and harder to find, I've cranked back on punching holes... I can still find everything I need, I just ain't real fond of the prices... I remember when I used to buy a case of 7.62 for around $100... man do I miss those days..


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

I have always been of the mindset that ammo is better than currency sometimes. The swap I made is an example...about $18 (todays cost) of 30-06 reaped 655 22s (Todays cost, about $75).
I need to redo my inventory system now that my boys are getting closer to shooting the real thing. The Crosman Furys they have are similar in recoil and accuracy to 22s, just a bit quieter. Got lot of pellets for them too...I have a lot of fun with them!

Matt


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I've been seriously considering a few air rifles.. from .22 on up to 50 cal... You can always smelt your own lead if things get any worse... I've been thinking a .22 air rifle would be nice for small game hunting... much cheaper than 22. ammo is now and just as powerful and accurate..


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

The .177 are pretty acceptable, and even cheaper on the pellets. Ours go thru 55 gallon drums (burn barrels...we add ventilation, LOL), 5 sheets of 3/8 drywall, almost thru 3/4 plywood, and a friend of mine took a deer last year...granted, it was a perfect shot, otherwise he would not have risked just injuring it...Plus, our are factory equipped with a noise reduction device...won't use the other word. Sound just like and old pumpmaster 760...in other words, nothing...
Plus, my boys, both under 12, are doing dime sized groupings at 75 feet, consistently. Worth the investment simi.

Matt


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

I smelt my own lead now , but if you don't have a mold , they can be almost as hard to find as ammo , lots of people started casting and reloading or at least buying the equipment


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I'd think if a person had access to a lathe coming up with a mold wouldn't be such a hard thing to fabricate..

I've got a fairly decent .177 rifle, but I was thinking going bigger sure wouldn't hurt.. Especially something that could be used for deer hunting...


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

as soon as you want something more than a cylinder it gets harder , lube grooves , skirts , and such you need a mill and the right cutters and you actually vertically milling the bullet shaped cutter half way into the block then doing the other side of the cavity 


for the price of a air rifle that you could hunt deer with , you could buy a suppressor and work up a sub sonic load for a rifle you already have and have much greater ability to have repeat shots

for that mater you would be surprised how quiet a 308 bolt action rifle gets with a can on the front of it even with off the shelf hunting ammo , it cracks and sounds like a 22lr

last time i looked at 45 or 50 cal air rifles they were 8-900 dollars , maybe that changed


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Well.. I just happen to have access to three mills, 5 lathes, and a gang drill and the guy that can run it all... I'll also be having a mill and a lathe moved out to my place, and I can run them both OK.. but not like he can.. 

At The Nation's Gun Show we have out here, it's really not that hard to find molds... A show this weekend, but I'll be gone, but I will be making the show in November... I've been thinking about getting set up for some reloading and for balls for my black powder stuff.. 

Yeah.. a good air rifle isn't cheap.. but I was just up at the local shop this past weekend (the shop the Navy Yard shooter got his Biden gun from) and they had probably 30 different cans for sale.. I was talking to him about applying for the stamp for one, and he said right now it's taking 9 to 14 months to get them back.. 

I was thinking a few air rifles mostly for the fact of how hard it's been, and could eventually get for trying to find ammo or the components.. Rainy day stuff ya know..


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

then you should be set , I used to run lathe , mills , welders , and radial drill press now i have access to none of it , and most companies around here won't let you work on your own projects at work any more , we used to be able to buy steel at cost and stay over on 3rd shift and work on personal projects if your supervisor was cool with it , guys from the front office would come down and need a draw bar for their tractor or some other part and we would end up helping them lay them out and drill them. 


it's a lot of work for a mold you can buy for 20 dollar when they are in stock , it is just that a bunch of molds where on back order thru the ammo shortage it is getting better most any of them can be had on back order with expected ship dates in about a month


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

On the plus side, I've got about 3 full 5 gallon buckets of old wheel weights, just taking up space...I'll save them for when I can't get pellets 'tho. Got a friendly mechanic...

Matt


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

wheel weights are a little to hard to make pellets pure lead makes better pellets if you need them to have a skirt that expands to seal the bore , but they make nice bullets 

bullets are not hard to make , several molds drop them almost ready to load , just lube and load


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Another cool plus is, I've recently been gifted a nice size crucible and the burner for it..


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

I live 60 miles from ATK which owns CCI, Winchester and I believe Federal ammo and probably others. They produce 4 million rounds of 22LR a day, yes that is per day. And where does that many rounds go? You got me. Someone must be doing some major hoarding.

Bob


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

think about it this way if 40 million 22 shooters each buy 500 rounds one brick that is 20 billion rounds or 5000 days of production or about 13 and 2/3 years 

I don't think it is hard to see were it is going if the first time any one of those 22lr shooters went to the store and couldn't find their usual brand on the shelf the bought 2 bricks of it next time they saw it , when things got even more scarce they bought a brick every time the saw one on the shelf , It doesn't take long and your selling billions of rounds so that everyone can have 2 bricks on the shelf.

then you have a number of people who saw this coming and bought even more 10k 20k

then shooting sports it's not hard to go through 5k with 25 shooters thats only 200 rounds each that just isn't that much 

league shooters between practice and competition


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## Conhntr (Aug 7, 2010)

unioncreek said:


> Someone must be doing some major hoarding.


:whistlin:

4S22RSURP-5000	Remington .22 Long RifleAmmunition	$90.00
Im glad i planned ahead!! I got 6 cases of this at 90$ (115$ shipped) 2.3c/round!! Not bad ammo either


















Haha keep drooling!!! I added up how much 22 i thought i would shoot in my lifetime then doubled it. Got 6 cases (30,000). Im SOooOoOo glad i did!

Sorry for gloating but i had several shooting buddies make fun of my 22 stockpile now they are begging for some haha. Only the ones that didnt make fun can have any


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

I was just skimming over the replies here and noticed the comment about muzzle breaks on an airgun. These devises are not considered that dreaded word "silencers" although they will quiet the sound of a shot. these are "LDC's" which are lead dust collectors.For shooter that go through a lot of lead down the barrel,they catch some of the dust keeping it from entering the air.And they do silence the shot. Even if it were a "silencer" the ATF does not have jurisdiction over airguns,archery equipment or black powder(providing there are no parts to the black powder gun that can be used on standard "firearms".SO as of this point in time there is nothing illegal about using ldc's on airguns. The airgun community maintains a blanket of silence on this subject primarily because of the fear the government finding a way to start restricting airguns and there use.The silencing part about lcd's are used primarily in the suburban setting so you can "plink" in your own back yard without upsetting the neighbors. Airguns are not quieter than powder burners. It all has to do with foot per second or fps. Staying subsonic (1110fps I think) keeps it quiet. If you fire a 22 cal pellet at supersonic speed it will sound like a 22 powder burner at the same speed provided there are no silencing devices.
On this subject,the advertised fps on airguns are not even close to actual use. You se these 1400 fps but what they are not telling you is that that is with a .5 grain projectile. Continual use of that lite of a pellet will wreck your gun in a mater of days. The standard pellet weight for .117 is 7.9 grains and in .22 is 16.0 grains. Your true fps in a .117 that advertises 1000 fps will actually be 775-850 fps with this higher weight ammo.It will maintain 14 - 7.5 fpe (foot pounds of energy) from muzzle to a fifty yard target.(It takes 6.0 fpe to kill a squirrel) so these are up to the task of taking small game.They are a real challenge (in Springer airguns) to learn to shoot considering the double recoil which is so sever in some airguns that scope manufacturers will not stand behind their warranty if they were mounted on a springer airgun(with certain models exempt)
Check it out. It's a whole new world of shooting.Wade


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## Stephen in SOKY (Jun 6, 2006)

The CCI SV we stocked Wednesday morning actually lasted til noon Friday this week, the longest we've had any in stock in months. Of course I suspect the $5/50 price had something to do with it as well.


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

There is plenty of ammo out there , Just not at the prices we have become used too . Well.. milk is not $2.00 a gallon any more either .


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## Conhntr (Aug 7, 2010)

Im really looking at something in 5.45x39 then getting 50k rounds for it now at 15c. Problem is the Ak74 that chamber it have gone up to 600+ and they are really a 300$ rifle!!


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

slickguns.com for ammo or armslist.com


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Another week of ZERO 22 on the shelf. not really surprised.

Matt


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

Talked to a salesperson at Walmart yesterday and he said all the employees are grabbing the .22 lr before it hits the shelf and selling on craigslist or the local flea markets at a huge mark up and nobody in management cares . He said most times it's spoken for before it even gets to the store .


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

Something new to me was the bulk "bucket" of 1700 Rem HP 22. . . .$65

The manager had kept it "under" the counter--for himself..

And I was out of cash......


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## TRellis (Sep 16, 2013)

Roadking said:


> Another week of ZERO 22 on the shelf. not really surprised.
> 
> Matt


I am assuming that you are just trying stores around the lake. 

If you want to take a nice, leisurely, view the fall foliage drive down Rt. 402 or Rt. 507 into Stroudsburg you can get 500 round bricks for $40 at Dunkleburger's. Not the best price (.08 per round) I have ever seen, but they do have quantity.

Trellis


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## ace admirer (Oct 5, 2005)

Conhntr said:


> :whistlin:
> 
> 4S22RSURP-5000 Remington .22 Long RifleAmmunition $90.00
> Im glad i planned ahead!! I got 6 cases of this at 90$ (115$ shipped) 2.3c/round!! Not bad ammo either
> ...


hmmm,,, that looks like the cmp ammo that was suppose to go to junior nonprofit clubs only,,,,,,,:whistlin:

truck loads of it have shown up at internet sites and gun shows....while youth education clubs have been left wanting......not pointing fingers, just letting you know one source of that ammo.


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Thanks Trellis. I usually wander northerly, but have a friend down that way. Will ask him to look.

And Ace, I am trying to get some for my boys as well as the Scouts (shorts are as welcomed by them as longs).

Matt


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## lurnin2farm (Jun 10, 2012)

I was in Pa last weekend at a field and stream store. They were well stocked on reasonably priced ammo. I was very surprised and bought a few rounds. No 22 to be found though but then again I didnt look very hard. 223 was 50 cents a round. Not as good as it was but not as bad as I have seen either.


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## Grumpy old man (Aug 6, 2013)

The local walmart has everything but .22


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## Conhntr (Aug 7, 2010)

ace admirer said:


> hmmm,,, that looks like the cmp ammo that was suppose to go to junior nonprofit clubs only,,,,,,,:whistlin:
> 
> truck loads of it have shown up at internet sites and gun shows....while youth education clubs have been left wanting......not pointing fingers, just letting you know one source of that ammo.


Nope available for any cmp member (sold out in about 24 hours). You snooze you loose!! The affiliated clubs did get a better price (20$ less i think)

I would pick a new director for any of those youth shooting clubs who cant plan ahead and have ammo for their program.


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## 65284 (Sep 17, 2003)

i scored twelve 50 round boxes of .22 lr at Bass Pro today $2.78 per, not cheap but glad to get it. Wife was with me so she and I bought 3 each (the limit) at firearms counter, and 3 more each at main checkout, per salespersons suggestion.


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