# Ammo shelf life



## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

I am at the point where I am wanting to stockpile some ammo (.38 Special and 9MM mostly) I would be rotating as I go shooting buying a couple extra boxes each time and rotating them out.
Don't need enough to supply a small army or anything like that, but perhaps a few thousand rounds on hand, kept in ammo boxes in the spare bedroom.

My question is I have googled the shelf life for ammo and seen answers ranging from 6 months to indefinitely.
So kept in my house - temps range 68F - 78F, humidity 30% - 60%
ammo in its original box inside the plastic ammo boxes you can buy at any gun store - how long will it last?


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Indefinitely. 

As long as it is kept dry (and even in some cases when it is not), and out of wild temperature swings (and even in some cases when it is not (see the trend)), ammo will last 100 years or more. 

I've personally used 75+ year old ammo, that spent at least 20 of those years in cardboard boxes in a barn, with no issues.


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

We just used up some ammo yesterday...about 30 years old. 
Have older stuff. WWI ammo for some of my old relics...they go bang.

Matt


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

I recently shot some 30-06 that was loaded in 1991 and it worked fine.
If you live in a really humid area, you might throw a desiccant pack or two in the ammo box just for fun, but it will last a long long time.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

how about I just tell you what I have shot 

I bought a bunch of pmc , Winchester ,and Remington 9mm about 18 years ago , shot some of each last year , all went bang not one dud in the lot 

how was it stored , in a closet in my house in a 30caliber can in factory boxes 

if you keep the house a normal temp for human occupancy the ammo will go on for a long life 

22year old 30-06 , just like the day I bought it stored the same way 

16 year old 30-30 same as off the shelf , also stored the same way

the only issue I have had was with some 22lr that was probably 20+ years old that I have no idea how it was stored a friends parents had a bait and tackle and carried a little ammo and when they retired his mom sent me a bucket of odds and ends that were found in cleaning out the store after they thought they had sold everything , faded boxes and old style packaging, the only issue was Remington thunderbolts they all went off just fine and worked fine in the bolt action but dirty dirty dirty in an auto would jam up the bolt in 50 rounds and need cleaning to work properly again for approx 50 more rounds I gave up on them in any semi and just shot them in the bolt till I ran out , but thunderbolts were always kind of dirty , and who knows they could have been in the back room with the minnow tanks for a lot of years. any thing center fire mostly shotgun shells that I got from her all worked fine some of the 12ga packaging looks like that from the early 80s


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

Buy a bag of rice and dump in the ammo box and walk away. You're done till you need some ammo.

Wade


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

And you've got rice in case of an emergency!

Make sure to stockpile a decent amount of .22lr too. It's an acceptable survival round for the whole family. I keep about 20,000 rounds of .22lr on hand and about 1,000 rounds for everything else that I shoot. I doubt I would ever need to use all of that, but it makes a good bartering tool if you're ever in dire need.


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

V-NH said:


> And you've got rice in case of an emergency!
> 
> Make sure to stockpile a decent amount of .22lr too. It's an acceptable survival round for the whole family. I keep about 20,000 rounds of .22lr on hand and about 1,000 rounds for everything else that I shoot. I doubt I would ever need to use all of that, but it makes a good bartering tool if you're ever in dire need.



SO, YOU are the reason I can't find 22lr ammo!!!! LOL !


Wade


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I got ammo from the 30's... some of it goes bang... Some times it waits 20 seconds or so, then goes bang... It's some old 7x57 military surplus.. .No telling how it was stored.... 

I had a brand new round the other day that went CLICK... (PPU) I wasn't happy about that.. Cost me a coyote..

I've got ammo I bought 25 years ago that still pops off the way it should. I've kept it in steel ammo cans that have good rubber seals in the lids.. 

If you store it, and you know how you store it, it will last and be reliable longer than you'll be around..


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## unregistered41671 (Dec 29, 2009)

Been shooting some I loaded 35 yrs ago.


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

1shotwade said:


> SO, YOU are the reason I can't find 22lr ammo!!!! LOL !
> 
> 
> Wade


:thumb:

I have been known to buy it whenever I see it, but I only buy bricks, I don't bother with 50 and 100 round packages. I figure I should leave those for others


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

simi-steading said:


> I got ammo from the 30's... some of it goes bang... Some times it waits 20 seconds or so, then goes bang... It's some old 7x57 military surplus.. .No telling how it was stored....


You need to cut your losses on that stuff, Simi, and destroy it. Hang-firing loads are the most dangerous ammo you can have around - and 20 seconds is some seriously long-hanging stuff. 

Eventually, you going to have one that is a 'dud' until you find out that it was hanging just a little longer than the others, and blows your fingers off, or sends the bolt through your jaw as you go to clear it.

Even if you know it is sketchy, someone may come along behind you, pick it up, and have no idea how dangerous it is.

I'm no safety nazi, but seriously, bro, you need to go destroy that stuff tomorrow.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Nope.. I don't shoot it and won't... Longest I had one of them hang was over 30 seconds.. It was crazy. I'd wait two minutes before I'd open the bolt... and then I'd do i with the chamber pointed away and my head turned... It was all the ammo for the gun I had at the time, but I gave it up after about 5 hangs.. It's pretty wild to pull the trigger, wait 15 seconds, lay the gun down and walk away and have it go off.. 

I still have it though.. The intention is to save the brass...


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

simi-steading said:


> I still have it though.. The intention is to save the brass...


It's not worth it, bro'. Not. Worth. It. 

bro'.

Look, I tend to be a live-fast-die-young type of guy when it comes to guns and 'splosives. I once chose to join a specific gun club because they would serve your drink orders right on the skeet field. (The "guns and alcohol don't mix" rule somehow never translated in Wisconsin.) I've hand built and tested rifles indoors, chucked in a lathe, on a bet that the load was unsafe. I've used a drift and hammer as an ignition system to proof a barrel.

I'm not the preachy-gun-safety guy, but hang-firing ammo is not worth it. 
There's no safe way to get at that brass. 

You could go out in the morning and fire each round, letting them all hang "safely" and hope you don't lose some flesh to an apparent dud that turned out to just hang a little longer than the others....

...or you could pull each bullet, and hope (assume) that it was the propellant that was compromised and not the primer. You can't safely decap a live primer, so you dump the propellant, intending to recharge and reball. What are you going to reload them to? Do you have data that lists "European, unknown surplus" in the primer column? What if the contaminant made it into one of the primers and left you with a single hang-fire in your new load? That's arguably more dangerous than a lot that is known to have hang-fires. You're that much more likely to suspect that hang-fire as a dud. 

Those rounds you have are like the prettiest "girl" in a Thai bar.

I'm telling you, man, hang-fires are spooky-bad-mojo. 
There is no safe way to get at that brass.

Cut bait, bro.


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

Semi wants the brass of a rare cartridge, yes? Hows about he pulls the bullet, puts the powder on the tomatoes, and fires the empty brass in the gun? Discard any brass with a primer that won't go bang and uncap the ones that fire.

I didn't know any of the bros in the hood reloaded. I guess it's better to have as many reloaders and shooters as possible to protect the second amendment.


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## wogglebug (May 22, 2004)

"STORE IN A COOL, DRY, DARK PLACE".

Standard rule for storage. Always works better that way than not, FOR ANYTHING.
Ex-mil stuff from a reputable manufacturer will last better than others. If it's made to withstand high temperatures (e.g. ADI (Australian Defence Industries - the powder Hodgdon are now relabelling and reselling) then even better).
Quality stuff (ex-mil or civilian) will last several decades if it hasn't been stored in a tin shed in the sunshine in Arizona for decades. If your max temp of 78F is accurate, you should be fine, but getting up beyond 85F every year for decades I'd start getting doubtful, and want some test firing. Still, I've shot .22LR that's over 30 years old, sat in the back-room cupboard and topped the century in storage many days each year, and it functioned just fine.

I wouldn't do it by choice now I know better.


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

I am currently using some .38 and .357 magnum rounds when going to the range to shoot my revolvers that my father stored in rubber seal lid steel ammo cans with mil spec desiccant packs in the 1970s and so far out of 350 rounds I have had no dud or delayed fire cartridges.

I am confident from the good condition of the brass and my father's diligence in storing the ammunition that all of the 45 year old rounds are viable and safe but still use the older rounds for my range shooting and reload my carry revolver with newer manufacture rounds after cleaning just to be sure.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

V-NH said:


> :thumb:
> 
> I have been known to buy it whenever I see it, but I only buy bricks, I don't bother with 50 and 100 round packages. I figure I should leave those for others


They still make bricks? Haven't seen one of those for a long time.


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## V-NH (Jan 1, 2014)

They do, you just have to be willing to travel. There are two local gun stores of about medium size (thinking 20,000 sq ft of retail space or so) in a town about an hour away from where I live. Those stores frequently have Federal bricks for sale, but their price has risen to $35/ea, which is where I expect it to stay indefinitely. When they post an update on their Facebook page(s) mentioning an ammo shipment I generally head on down and try to pick up a few bricks. They had Remington Bucket O' Bullets on Black Friday for the first time in a couple years, but I didn't pick any up because I was spending my extra $ on a shotgun for me and a dress for my wife.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I was figuring I could safely pull the slugs, then fire off the primes.. If they didn't fire, then soak them in water for a few days, then decap... Is that an unsafe way?

I figured with a kinetic puller it would be no big deal.. They don't set off good primers... Then ones I planned to save the bras from have not been in a gun.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

JJ Grandits said:


> They still make bricks? Haven't seen one of those for a long time.


I just saw a bunch a couple weeks ago at the local pawn.. at $85 each... You gotta wonder why no one was rushing to buy them... :facepalm:


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

GunMonkeyIntl said:


> It's not worth it, bro'. Not. Worth. It.
> 
> bro'.
> 
> ...



I just wanted to add that "we" really don't understand the power of just the primer going off if it is not contained in a chamber. As a younger man, I had some ww2 50cal. and pulled the projectile and dumped the powder,replaced the projectile, and cranked it down in a vice as hard as I could. I then took a hammer to the primmer. It went off and drove the projectile through a concrete block wall 60 feet away destroying 3 blocks. I found it in the back yard a few feet from the wall.
No doubt there was powder residue in the brass but that's tremendous power from such a small explosion! Don't do dumb stuff!

Wade


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

Nimrod said:


> Semi wants the brass of a rare cartridge, yes? Hows about he pulls the bullet, puts the powder on the tomatoes, and fires the empty brass in the gun? Discard any brass with a primer that won't go bang and uncap the ones that fire.


7x57 is not rare. 
Good point, though. He could try to snap the caps in the rifle. 
There is a good chance that the ammo he's describing is berdan, which would complicate reloading any of them that ignite. 

And still a good chance that whatever contaminant ruined them is still residual in the case. The brass would have to be thoroughly cleaned and degreased. 

Still think those rounds are more danger/trouble than they're worth. Especially if they're left around as one of those "when I get around to it" projects.


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## mnn2501 (Apr 2, 2008)

Thank you for all the answers. I doubt I will have more than 2 years worth on hand and will rotate through that, replacing what I shoot every time I hit the range.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Ok Ok.. I'l go bury the stuff.. It's only about 100 rounds..


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

An easy way to dispose of old ammo is in a bermed fire barrel. I found an assortment of corroded pistol, rifle and shotgun ammo in a rat chewed cardboard box in the attic when I first moved here.

I buried a fire barrel with a vented lid in a berm on my outdoor range , started a good fire in it,separated the rounds into smaller count bags and threw one bag at a time into the fire barrel and let the lead melt and the primers and loads bounce the brass shrapnel around in the fire barrel from a distance after a days morning rain.

Only a few pieces of brass shrapnel popped out of the top of fire barrel used as a questionable round igniter/ grenade sump pit combination.

Best part of burning old rounds in a containment environment is once burned there is no concern of a 100 year old round someday surfacing and becoming a brass short range shrapnel mine injuring kids a few generations in the future.


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

Old ammo has a reputation for a long shelf life, but the newly made ones...time will tell. 

A few years ago on another gun forum, there was a thread similar to this one. I remember reading more than a few posts about how manufacturers were cranking out ammo made of slightly lighter weight/less durable material these days. And how the shelf life may not be as long as what we're used to seeing. 

The posters cited links to solid, reputable sources of info that I wish I had saved. I probably could find them with some Google-time...I may do that because I'd like to follow up on this. 





.


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## GunMonkeyIntl (May 13, 2013)

I suppose you're right that we'll have to wait for time to tell, but I know that the premise about "lighter" materials is not true.

The raw materials that ammunition is made from, other than the use of some steel in metallic cartridge cases, and aluminum in shotshell bases, hasn't changed. Neither of those should cause any reduction in shelf-life, the projectiles have not changed (other than in design advances), and the propellants and primers have become more stable as chemistry improves. 

If there is any one key difference in potential shelf life, it is in the waterproofing around the primer pocket and crimp. A lot of the old ammo that we use is mil surplus, which was waterproofed for deployment. Sporting ammo is less likely to be waterproofed, though the trend is making it a more common feature on hunting ammo. As the cost of raw materials goes up, taking the price of ammunition with it, non-cost-sensitive features like waterproofing become cheaper in relation to the over-all cost of the cartridge, making it an easier add-on for the ammunition companies to tolerate in exchange for the marketing benefits. 

If anything, sporting ammo purchased today will almost surely last longer than sporting ammo purchased 50 years ago, and is at least likely to last as long, or maybe longer, than old surplus ammo.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

you can also buy primer sealer if you want to seal your primers 

the crimp on factory rifle rounds is solid but you can also seal it if you like http://www.midwayusa.com/product/954332/markron-custom-bullet-and-primer-sealer-1-2-oz-liquid


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

oh and don't leave 22lr ammo in your pocket and run them though the wash , click , click , click, at least I only lost 6 rounds


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## Malamute (Sep 15, 2011)

I've also shot ammo that was 50 or more years old, and shot some of my handloads that were 30 or more years old. Kept from excessive heat and humidity, ammo will last a long time.

I disagree about there being no safe way to deprime live primers. They simply arent that powerful, the 50 cal story notwithstanding. Anyone thats used a Lee Loader Hand Tool knows they simply make a surprising loud noise, but nothing really happens. I dont recall how many I've set off with Lee Loader tools when I started loading way back in the 1900's. Wearing glasses and hearing protection is all that I'd suggest. I've decapped many live primers, and never had one pop in a bench press.

Assuming they werent Berdan primed, I wouldnt hesitate in the slightest to save the brass for reloading by breaking them down, and wouldnt pop them off in a rifle if they were corrosive, as it can affect the brass in some cases.


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

Malamute said:


> I dont recall how many I've set off with Lee Loader tools *when I started loading way back in the 1900's.*


You young whippersnapper, you! lol



.


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## 700ti (Nov 4, 2014)

If I remember correctly WD40 will kill primers. 

I agree with Malamute I have set off a few with the Lee Loader. I punched out a lot of them when all I could find was 223 and wanted to make 300 blackout from the brass I reused those primers. 

Also I have had primers cause me a lot more failure to fire or hang fires than powder. I bought some off brand primers when they were hard to get and 10 to % percent were bad. Made a couple of scary trip to the range. Tossed them after the second trip.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

any oil that creeps will kill primers if it gets to it , there are plenty that work better at getting into tight places than wd40 

so far most wd-40 gun failures I have seen first hand where the firing pin glued in place by the wd-40 after the solvent evaporated and it turned to varnish 

cost my cousin a nice deer a few years back , he had clean and oiled with wd40 his gun right after deer season the year before , got busy with work and grabbed his gun out of the closet where it had sat all year barrel up 

had a nice deer in close never seen him miss a shot like that , he has had the same gun for 20+ years knows right were it hits and hadn't fired any rounds all year 

CLICK , not even a scratch in the primer , put that slug back in aimed at a dead tree and tried it again boom hit right where he was aiming


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