# Anybody do stem cell therapy?



## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

I injured my knee months ago. The worst is over as I was actually limping slightly by the end of the workday for the first few weeks. Now that it has kind of leveled off pain wise I’m looking at options. My chiropractor recommended his stem cell therapy. He said that he actually had patients that were considering joint replacement surgery have such good success with the stem cell therapy, that they didn’t need a joint replacement.
First off, I never go to traditional doctors unless absolutely necessary. I would much rather treat through alternative methods. If a traditional doc was my only option, I’d honestly just live with it at this point.
My knee wakes me a couple times at night because of the pain when sleeping, it feels like it stiffens up. Not too bad while up and around during the day, unless I twist my foot on something (which seems to happen about 1 or 2 times a week while working!).
Just curious if anyone had tried or knows anything about this therapy. I know NOTHING about it outside of some brief reading on the internet. I have no idea what the cost is till I talk to my chiropractor again, but it couldn’t be worse than a few visits to a specialist at a doctors office.
Thanks for any info.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

Sorry I don't know anything about stem cell therapy. I just wanted to suggest a comfrey soak with Epsom salts. Arnica oil during the day. Maybe try that while you learn more about the stem cell stuff.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

My doc says it’s not proven yet, but I am starting to think about it, too.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Thanks for the input. 
Worst part is I don’t know anyone personally who has tried it, so I have nothing to go off of.
We all know how internet info can be,if I don’t know or trust the source it’s just words. 
My knee has actually been worse this last week, not nearly as bad as when it first happened, but worse than say a month ago. 
I think I’m going to make an appointment with the chiropractor Monday, just to see how much the cost is. 
I’ll have to see if we have any arnica oil in my wife’s essential oils briefcase. . I’ve actually never heard of it.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Arica is good stuff.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

67drake said:


> Thanks for the input.
> Worst part is I don’t know anyone personally who has tried it, so I have nothing to go off of.
> We all know how internet info can be,if I don’t know or trust the source it’s just words.
> My knee has actually been worse this last week, not nearly as bad as when it first happened, but worse than say a month ago.
> ...



Arnica oil isn't an essential oil - you can also get an arnica cream at a pharmacy like Walgreens.









Arnica Oil


Certified Organic Sustainably Cultivated Arnica flowers, Arnica Oil. Supports healthy muscles, tendons and ligaments.




www.avenabotanicals.com














Amazon.com: Boiron Arnicare Cream for Soothing Relief for Joint Pain, Muscle Pain, Muscle Soreness, and Swelling from Bruises or Injury - Fast Absorbing and Fragrance-Free - 4.2 oz : Health & Household


Buy Boiron Arnicare Cream for Soothing Relief for Joint Pain, Muscle Pain, Muscle Soreness, and Swelling from Bruises or Injury - Fast Absorbing and Fragrance-Free - 4.2 oz on Amazon.com ✓ FREE SHIPPING on qualified orders



www.amazon.com


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

wdcutrsdaughter said:


> Arnica oil isn't an essential oil - you can also get an arnica cream at a pharmacy like Walgreens.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you! I just ordered a 2 oz. bottle. Being on sale was a bonus.


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## robin416 (Dec 29, 2019)

A friend's husband had his shoulder done. Right now they are dealing with a death in the family so I don't want to ask how it's doing. I know they considered doing his knee but it was too worn out for the stem cell therapy to work. 

As soon as things calm down in her family I'll ask for you.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

67drake said:


> Thank you! I just ordered a 2 oz. bottle. Being on sale was a bonus.


you're very welcome! I love that company, they are right here in Maine. 
side note: They practice biodynamic farming- ever heard of it?
"Biodynamics is a holistic, ecological, and ethical approach to farming, gardening, food, and nutrition."
(from biodynamic association)


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Actually, no,I’ve never heard of it, but seeing your posts since I’ve been a member here for the last 2 years, I respect your opinion on things like this.
I also believe a lot of times smaller companies put out a better product than mass production companies that you would find at Walmart, for example.
I also try to heal and medicate with things “from the earth” as opposed to taking prescription medicine and seeing a doctor. Problem is I don’t know much about how to do that. I’m very early in the learning stage.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Oh, and a few weeks after it happened I started taking glucosamine twice daily. It obviously hasn’t helped enough, if at all.
It happened right before Thanksgiving.


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## altair (Jul 23, 2011)

Is it very expensive? I say it's worth a shot if surgery is the only other option.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

altair said:


> Is it very expensive? I say it's worth a shot if surgery is the only other option.


I don’t know what he charges. I’ll have to ask when I call on Monday.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I found the following link. It looks like joint injections start around $1000.









The Cost of Stem Cell Therapy in 2022 - DVC Stem | DVC Stem


Sep 05, 2022 - This article explains the costs associated with different stem cell treatments, what will impact the price, and why stem cell therapy may be a good alternative to traditional medications.




www.dvcstem.com


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

wdcutrsdaughter said:


> Sorry I don't know anything about stem cell therapy. I just wanted to suggest a comfrey soak with Epsom salts. Arnica oil during the day. Maybe try that while you learn more about the stem cell stuff.


The comfrey, I’m not familiar with that. So reading about it I see you pour almost boiling water over the leaves to prepare it. I also see they make salves. Honestly I don’t see me spending a lot of time preparing leaves. Do the salves work too?


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I found the following link. It looks like joint injections start around $1000.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks! I hadn’t read that. I looks like one treatment is all that’s needed sometimes, and should last a year or so. That would be doable. I guess it would kind of be along the lines of a cortisone shot in a way.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

My issue with traditional doctors- I just had a physical in December. The doc said I’m due for another colonoscopy, which I am, it’s been about 4 -5 years, and I’m higher risk. So we start the process to get me scheduled for a colonoscopy. I have one scheduled for the middle of this month. I get a call last week saying I have to get a physical! I told the nurse I just had one, and that’s when we got the ball rolling on the butt scope deal. She said it has to be within 30 days, December was too long ago! What a racket! Just the two physicals are almost $1000 out of pocket with my insurance.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

67drake said:


> The comfrey, I’m not familiar with that. So reading about it I see you pour almost boiling water over the leaves to prepare it. I also see they make salves. Honestly I don’t see me spending a lot of time preparing leaves. Do the salves work too?


I have only used it as leaf. I use it as a compress, not the tea, as some sites suggest. 

I chop up the leaf (if you order it it will come chopped). and then I wet it a little to make it like a mush.
then I put it in some cheesecloth and hold it on the sore area. I healed chipped cartilage in my nose this way, it was amazing.

I would guess a salve would be effective, if it is made well. 

I think you could also use a strong tea as a soak in the tub with Epsom salts.
Epsom salt lowers inflammation, if that is what you are dealing with. 
My chiropractor recommended it for me so I know it is not just a wu wu idea, he is very knowledgable and reputable.

As for the December being too long ago - I've gotten the impression there are rules for billing mostly. cha Ching


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

wdcutrsdaughter said:


> I have only used it as leaf. I use it as a compress, not the tea, as some sites suggest.
> 
> I chop up the leaf (if you order it it will come chopped). and then I wet it a little to make it like a mush.
> then I put it in some cheesecloth and hold it on the sore area. I healed chipped cartilage in my nose this way, it was amazing.
> ...


Thank you!
The thing I worry about with a salve is they can say it has this and that ingredients, but may be so “watered down” that it is ineffective. 
I just know my lazy self, I won’t want to go through a20 minute routine to make up the leaves and then sit still long enough to apply them to the area. 
The write up I read was more involved, and seemed like a procedure. If I can simply soften with water, and apply to the area on a cloth, I think I’ll give it a try. I’ll shop for some on the internet today, as I HIGHLY doubt I can find any leaves local.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Comfrey won’t heal damage in the knee joint.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Comfrey won’t heal damage in the knee joint.


That’s disappointing!
Oh, and to answer an earlier question, there is no swelling. Just pain.


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

Have you tried DMSO? You can pick it up at the horse section of your local feed store.

I've used it on my messed up back, as well as my knee. Don't know if it accelerates healing like comfrey, but it really does help with the pain.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Comfrey won’t heal damage in the knee joint.


So definitive, you had a poor experience?

Please share how you use it, I like to learn of people's methods

It is written frequently that it aids in joint pain, so that was my original thought.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

@67drake if you do end up buying some comfrey, I would recommend mountain rose herbs or frontier.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I have grown it and purchased comfrey powder. When used topically, it can reduce skin inflammation and encourage healing at the skin level.

A knee joint with damaged cartilage is, unfortunately, not even served by the circulatory system directly. Joints are surrounded by a capsule filled with lubricating fluid. The fluid is made by cells lining the capsule.

There is no direct route for comfrey applied to skin to have an effect on damaged cartilage.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Pony said:


> Have you tried DMSO? You can pick it up at the horse section of your local feed store.
> 
> I've used it on my messed up back, as well as my knee. Don't know if it accelerates healing like comfrey, but it really does help with the pain.


No, actually I have never heard of it. But I’ll see how the arnica oil works out. Thanks for the tip!
At this point I was more looking at how to heal it, and hopefully the stem cell might work, than how to deal with masking the pain. Ibuprofen helps, but I detest taking pills every day like that.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I have grown it and purchased comfrey powder. When used topically, it can reduce skin inflammation and encourage healing at the skin level.
> 
> A knee joint with damaged cartilage is, unfortunately, not even served by the circulatory system directly. Joints are surrounded by a capsule filled with lubricating fluid. The fluid is made by cells lining the capsule.
> 
> There is no direct route for comfrey applied to skin to have an effect on damaged cartilage.


Interesting. I see the skin as the direct route. I had an experience where it did heal the cartilage on my nose. I wacked myself in the face with a building block (in a classroom.) There was a little loose piece I could feel it and it was sore. My experience was after a couple days of applying the compress, the loose piece was no more. Of course my nose is directly under the skin where the knee joint is more complex.
I'd still try it.
Can't hurt, and comfrey is always good to have on hand.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

No problem with trying it. Daily application and attention gives your body’s healing process time to work.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

yes and also thoughtful attention given to your body aids that healing process.


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## Digitalis (Aug 20, 2021)

67drake said:


> I injured my knee months ago. The worst is over as I was actually limping slightly by the end of the workday for the first few weeks. Now that it has kind of leveled off pain wise I’m looking at options. My chiropractor recommended his stem cell therapy. He said that he actually had patients that were considering joint replacement surgery have such good success with the stem cell therapy, that they didn’t need a joint replacement.
> First off, I never go to traditional doctors unless absolutely necessary. I would much rather treat through alternative methods. If a traditional doc was my only option, I’d honestly just live with it at this point.
> My knee wakes me a couple times at night because of the pain when sleeping, it feels like it stiffens up. Not too bad while up and around during the day, unless I twist my foot on something (which seems to happen about 1 or 2 times a week while working!).
> Just curious if anyone had tried or knows anything about this therapy. I know NOTHING about it outside of some brief reading on the internet. I have no idea what the cost is till I talk to my chiropractor again, but it couldn’t be worse than a few visits to a specialist at a doctors office.
> Thanks for any info.


What have you done for exercise/physical therapy?
Check out Ben Patrick "Knee over toes guy." Lots of youtube videos, and here's his book.









Knee Ability Zero: Patrick, Ben: 9798985135800: Books


Knee Ability Zero [Patrick, Ben] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Knee Ability Zero



www.amazon.com


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Digitalis said:


> What have you done for exercise/physical therapy?
> Check out Ben Patrick "Knee over toes guy." Lots of youtube videos, and here's his book.
> 
> 
> ...


My physical therapy right now is 20,000 steps a day with steel toe boots on. 
I haven’t really done any therapy on it. But I’ll check it out. Thanks!


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

So…. I talked to the receptionist and told her I wanted to make an appointment with the doc to find out more about the stem cell therapy doc talked about. It’s $125 per session,and he usually recommends 5-6 sessions. Hmmm. 
I asked if it’s an injection, she said “No, it a lot like an ultrasound machine, he puts jell on the area, and he runs it around the area he treats. It attracts stem cells to the injured area”
This was not what I was expecting. I had that done to my feet when I had plantar fasciitis years ago, if it’s the same thing, and I don’t suspect it’s going to help much. JMO.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

I’m going to the county seat tonight, and there is a Walgreens in that town. I figured I can get some of that Arnica cream, if they have it, and also one of those copper fit knee sleeves. I figured I’d try this till the arnica oil gets here. The brace/sleeve should help hold gauze or whatever in place better when I apply the oil or cream. I just do to much running around at work for anything else to stay in place. The 20,000 steps is not an exaggeration.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

I think your call was to a snake oil prescribing doctor.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

*What Are The Different Types Of Stem Cell Therapies?*
In a nutshell, there are two categories of stem cell therapies –


One approved by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA)
One unapproved
Whether or not stem cell therapy is approved holds critical implications for the effectiveness, safety, and science of the procedure.

Currently, only a handful of FDA-approved stem cell therapies are available. The most common one is blood stem cell therapy. In this, blood stem cells are transplanted in the patient. This helps treat patients with blood cancers. The therapy works by attacking harmful cancer cells via chemotherapy. These are then replaced with healthy stem cells. The stem cells will then, hopefully, divide and give rise to healthy tissue.

Similar to all FDA-approved treatments, the blood stem cell transplant procedure involved rigorous testing and research over many years.

Other than blood stem cell transplants, the FDA website lists a limited number of additional approved therapies.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

*How it works*
_Stem cell therapy_ is largely painless. Often local anesthetic is not necessary. *The doctor will inject stem cells into the affected joint*. This is done with a needle and may require multiple injections for it to work effectively. The process takes only about 30 minutes to complete. The doctor will monitor the patient after the procedure to ensure that there are no adverse reactions.









How Stem Cell Therapy Is Used to Treat Arthritis Joint Pain - Freeman Orthopedic and Sports Medicine Manalapan Township, NJ


Stems cells are the basic materials of the body that build tissue and serve important functions.




www.freemanorthoandsports.com


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> I think your call was to a snake oil prescribing doctor.


Yeah, this is more like ultrasound therapy. It does make it feel good-for about an hour.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

From the same source:
Stem cell therapy may not be a standard practice when treating arthritis, but more and more people are trying it. Your doctor may suggest pursuing this procedure if you are suffering from this condition. You no longer have to live with joint pain. Make an appointment today to determine whether you are a good candidate for this treatment.

This treatment can start working to relieve joint pain in a few weeks. However, most people should see results within two or three months. *The effects can last for up to a year.* At this point, the patient should see their health care professional and discuss further treatments.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Sigh. It’s NOT stem cell or ultrasound. I went into the office and talked to my chiropractor this evening, and it’s pulse wave/shock wave treatment. I have been reading about this for the last hour or two, and some studies do show it as being effective in a lot of cases. 
So now does anyone have any experience with this treatment? He apologized for his receptionist calling it “like ultrasound “.


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## Alice In TX/MO (May 10, 2002)

Extracorporeal shockwave therapy?


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

Alice In TX/MO said:


> Extracorporeal shockwave therapy?


Yes


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

I've had the ultrasound treatment but not the shockwave therapy. I looked it up and at first found how it is used to break up kidney stones. Then I added the word chiropractic and found a bunch of ads.


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

I think they used to call it diathermy? A friend of my folks had some kidney stones broken up with it a couple of decades ago. 

I'd give it a try, if I could afford it.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

He said it basically micro injures the area, and the body sends extra blood and whatever to that area. He treats it once a week, six week maximum. He said often his patients don’t need further treatments after the 3 or 4 session.


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## robin416 (Dec 29, 2019)

Finally got to talk to my friend. I hadn't realized it but it's been a year since his shoulder was injected and it's held up all of this time. Now this is the true stem cell injected therapy, no some ultrasound thing.


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## 67drake (May 6, 2020)

I have been using the Arnica gel 3 times a day since I bought it (the oil hasn’t arrived in the mail yet) I will say my knee does feel a lot better. Not 100%, that’s for sure, but at least better than the last couple weeks. Thanks for letting me know about this! I had never even heard of it before this thread.


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## wdcutrsdaughter (Dec 9, 2012)

67drake said:


> I have been using the Arnica gel 3 times a day since I bought it (the oil hasn’t arrived in the mail yet) I will say my knee does feel a lot better. Not 100%, that’s for sure, but at least better than the last couple weeks. Thanks for letting me know about this! I had never even heard of it before this thread.


I have to tell you I also have been using the oil on my knee and it's really helped a lot. I stupidly tried some squat 4 min work out and hurt myself. haha I am really glad you are having good results too.


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## YetiGal (9 mo ago)

67drake said:


> I injured my knee months ago. The worst is over as I was actually limping slightly by the end of the workday for the first few weeks. Now that it has kind of leveled off pain wise I’m looking at options. My chiropractor recommended his stem cell therapy. He said that he actually had patients that were considering joint replacement surgery have such good success with the stem cell therapy, that they didn’t need a joint replacement.
> First off, I never go to traditional doctors unless absolutely necessary. I would much rather treat through alternative methods. If a traditional doc was my only option, I’d honestly just live with it at this point.
> My knee wakes me a couple times at night because of the pain when sleeping, it feels like it stiffens up. Not too bad while up and around during the day, unless I twist my foot on something (which seems to happen about 1 or 2 times a week while working!).
> Just curious if anyone had tried or knows anything about this therapy. I know NOTHING about it outside of some brief reading on the internet. I have no idea what the cost is till I talk to my chiropractor again, but it couldn’t be worse than a few visits to a specialist at a doctors office.
> Thanks for any info.


While I also have been using natural remedies for decades, and I may be too late to be of any use, I want to add my experience about some stem-cell patches. I've been using a crazy cool stem cell "patch" like a little round band-aid for a couple years now to help my brain heal from a series of concussions. ( I stop until I get a fresh head injury!) It actually has also taken me on a tour around my body and healed a whole bunch of old injuries I had forgotten about. One cool thing about this method is that the body can put the stem cells wherever it wants them. Another cool thing is that it doesn't give the body stem cells, it actually stimulates the body to produce more of its own. and the third thing is that it's ridiculously inexpensive. Not sure how to post yet or how to tell if anyone replies and I know it's been a few months, but I wanted to chime in with an option.


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