# Working people are in a bind !



## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

Angie . I hope this is the right spot for this. My family has been in the rental business for over 35yrs. We have'nt had an eviction in over 4yrs. Things are really getting bad. With over 50 units we have seen a 100% collection rate from January til September. Some work and some get payments from the government. We have 50% of the people that work are 2 months late as of today..the 15th is what I call behind. Yall keep prepping!!


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## GarlicGirl (Mar 12, 2010)

I think we are unaware of how many people are the working poor. My granddaughter and her husband both work and are sharing a 2 bedroom apartment with another couple, just to make ends meet. Neither couple have children, nor do they expect they will be able to afford them in the near future.


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## nchobbyfarm (Apr 10, 2011)

It's going to get much worse. Hold on.


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## stamphappy (Jul 29, 2010)

I'm confused OP but I don't know the rental business. 

You haven't had an eviction in over 4 years, that's good right? That means you don't have to evict anyone and you've collected all necessary rent from January - September. 

But 50% are 2 months behind----you mean since September 50% have become at least 2 months behind?

I'm confused, so please explain this to me.


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## Halfway (Nov 22, 2010)

America has spoken.

This is what we chose.


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## bluetogreens (May 31, 2010)

stamphappy said:


> I'm confused OP but I don't know the rental business.
> 
> You haven't had an eviction in over 4 years, that's good right? That means you don't have to evict anyone and you've collected all necessary rent from January - September.
> 
> ...


It does read weird, But of those that are "working class" i.e. non government assistant (Social security etc) 50% are now 2 months behind. 

Which shows that more and more are being effected by the economy even those with jobs. Be it increased cost of living via groceries/gas/utilities-decreased hours/pay or whatever. People working in the private sector are not making what they once did, and what they do make is worth less.


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## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

bluetogreens said:


> It does read weird, But of those that are "working class" i.e. non government assistant (Social security etc) 50% are now 2 months behind.
> 
> Which shows that more and more are being effected by the economy even those with jobs. Be it increased cost of living via groceries/gas/utilities-decreased hours/pay or whatever. People working in the private sector are not making what they once did, and what they do make is worth less.


You got my thoughts right. I couldn't put it in to words last night. The working folks are getting worse off.


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## edcopp (Oct 9, 2004)

I sold my last rental house a couple of years ago. There is a reason for that.


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## Sonshine (Jul 27, 2007)

And now many businesses are cutting hours to under 30 hours a week due to Obamacare. Less hours, less pay, pay not going as far. As another poster said, hang on, it's going to get worse.


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## Roadking (Oct 8, 2009)

Lot of empty rentals around here. Been getting worse recently.

Matt


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Work is hard. If working people get no respect, which means respecting the money they pay in taxes, they will increasing choose to let the government take care of them.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

yep its much worse...we'd be homeless if we had not bought a small house and paid it off quickly(6 years ago)....our income went from $800 a week to unemployment $380....back to work at 600 minus taxes and gas....and down again with this latest drop....from 40k a year to 24k....and it sucks. Now all the hostess/nissen folks will be out of luck too.

We qualify for no gov't benefits due to 401k money....which the govt prolly will take soon enough.


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## MJsLady (Aug 16, 2006)

What many do not realize is that for many of us, just a few hours in a pay check can wreak havoc in the bills we are able or unable to pay. 

I remember long long ago when my boys were little I had to apply for food stamps.
The guy across the desk had a list and read down it, do you have this? This this this. The list was a page long.

When he was done I looked at him and said, I never knew how poor i was until you read me all those things that I could have but don't.

He said Ma'am, I am only 1 pay check away from you. 

Our only debt besides our mortgage now is medical and I am doing my best on that.


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## bluetogreens (May 31, 2010)

Due to my injuries/recovery Suzy has not worked outside the home since we moved back from Germany 2yrs ago. We did real good paid off all of our non secure debt-but we have ran a bunch of it back up with "feel good" buying, and fencing etc for the homestead animals.


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

mpillow said:


> We qualify for no gov't benefits due to 401k money....which the govt prolly will take soon enough.


I hope its not invested in the stock market. If it is, you might be better taking it out and rolling it into an IRA, or cashing out and taking the tax penalty and buying some gold.


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## houndlover (Feb 20, 2009)

The working poor get half of all government assistance in the way of food stamps. It's sad that people work full time and can't make ends meet.


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## NamasteMama (Jul 24, 2009)

We work 2 jobs and still qualify..... Sucks.


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## LonelyNorthwind (Mar 6, 2010)

Sonshine said:


> And now many businesses are cutting hours to under 30 hours a week due to Obamacare. Less hours, less pay, pay not going as far. As another poster said, hang on, it's going to get worse.


Since Obamacare doesn't go into effect until 2014 how does it make sense that businesses are cutting hours due to Obamacare? Yes, the economy is in the ditch...all over the world...


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

It's being phased it, it has already had effects and accumulating funds to make it work the 4 years before it goes into effect.

I don't have a link - but if you look into the funding for it, you'll see the articles on the funding.


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## Marshloft (Mar 24, 2008)

You all that work in the rental industry,, maybe you can answer a question.
My boy's mother just had a rate increase of 100.00 a month..
Well,, today,, I printed some signs for this same apartment bulding,, advertising "free rent" to get new renters.
I know the free months rent is at the end of the lease,,, but why raise their rent, have people move out, and then give away a months rent to new renters, How does that compute.


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## sss3 (Jul 15, 2007)

For some reason, they wanted rid of just her.


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## countryfied2011 (Jul 5, 2011)

> My boy's mother just had a rate increase of 100.00 a month..
> Well,, today,, I printed some signs for this same apartment bulding,, advertising "free rent" to get new renters.
> I know the free months rent is at the end of the lease,,, but why raise their rent, have people move out, and then give away a months rent to new renters, How does that compute.


She might not have had a rent increase in a long time especially if she has been on a yrs lease or longer. If the rental rate is higher than what her lease was, they probably raised her to the current rate. New people moving in would be paying the current rate when they moved in.


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

GrammasCabin said:


> Since Obamacare doesn't go into effect until 2014 how does it make sense that businesses are cutting hours due to Obamacare? Yes, the economy is in the ditch...all over the world...


Angie is right. It becomes effective in phases, with a big one occurring January 1, 2013.


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

countryfied2011 said:


> She might not have had a rent increase in a long time especially if she has been on a yrs lease or longer. If the rental rate is higher than what her lease was, they probably raised her to the current rate. New people moving in would be paying the current rate when they moved in.


They will do the same thing to the people the give the specials to also - when their leases are up. Their prices have gone up also and have to be covered. If people are under lease, their rent is set so the owners have to get leases that bring in more money. 

I hope everyone is doing everything they can to get and stay out of debt. We just don't know what is around the corner. If you have debt, your options are limited. Forget the new car, new shoes, new whatever. Save until you can pay cash. Use it up. Wear it out. Make it do - or do without. Our grandparent who lived by this survived. Today, we consider them to have lived a poor lifestyle. They actually lived a real life. What they had was real. What they had was truth. So much of today is built on a house of cards. Some people might look rich with things - when they are actually rich with debt.


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

We have rental properties and just had one family move out on October 1st. They had been there for 6 years. However, we got the place painted and ready for the next family and had them lined up within a couple of weeks. There was a lot of interest in renting a whole house. They just moved in on the 15th. I did note that of the people that viewed the rental, about half were what I consider to be homeless. They were usually staying with a relative or in one case...at a shelter due to domestic abuse. I had never seen that type of ratio before.

I serve on the board of a non-profit housing agency that has around 250 properties, all in an urban setting. So far, we haven''t seen a tremendous turnover. With rent being in the range of $450-650, most of the tenants find that it is pretty affordable. About 25% of the tenants receive some sort of social service help. When a tenant falls behind, it is usually because of not working due to a health issue. We run at 96% occupancy with the remaining 4% (mostly) being units that our crew hasn't had a chance to get ready yet for a new tenant yet. Any units that remain empty longer than a month or two are usually because there isn't as much demand for 2 bedroom apartments as there is for 3 bedroom units.


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

Marshloft said:


> You all that work in the rental industry,, maybe you can answer a question.
> My boy's mother just had a rate increase of 100.00 a month..
> Well,, today,, I printed some signs for this same apartment bulding,, advertising "free rent" to get new renters.
> I know the free months rent is at the end of the lease,,, but why raise their rent, have people move out, and then give away a months rent to new renters, How does that compute.


This can also be a trick...By the time that the tenant moves out, the landlord may happen to "find" enough damage to avoid actually conceding the free rent.

Also... while some people will move out when the rent is raised, many others will opt to stay because moving is a hassle. We try to adjust our rents when our units are empty, but we don't get many empties. We just raised the rent on the property that I mentioned in my other post...after 6 years!


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

beaglebiz said:


> I hope its not invested in the stock market. If it is, you might be better taking it out and rolling it into an IRA, or cashing out and taking the tax penalty and buying some gold.


A small amount is in the stock market, some is in other much safer sorts of things....without giving it away...


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## beaglebiz (Aug 5, 2008)

Reason: this is for what is happening, not putting down those talking about it. wrong forum.

Angie, I would like to clarify the reason you deleted my post ...I didnt insult anyone, I was the one insulted. Reading that makes it appear I am the bad guy again, which is why I got insulted in the first place


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

The house next door to us is finally up for sale. I wish I had more confidence in the rental market - we'd snap it up in a minute. But I don't want to have it trashed and I don't want people that won't pay move in and me not be able to get them out. Especially if they are next door. I would love to be able to offer a nice, simple home at a very reasonable price to a family that could use a break. I want the land. I'm afraid it's too big of a risk though. Which is very sad since we could easily invest this amount without any debt.


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## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

OP, you are too soft. Your tenants have discovered that they can pay their other bills first, or even buy toys, and they can pay the landlord last. Then the word goes around to all the tenants: you don't have to pay because the landlord won't evict. That's why half your tenants are not paying.

I suspect that all of your December rent is going to go to tenant Christmas presents, because the landlord won't evict if you don't pay him, so why not have a great Christmas? If you want to be successful as a landlord you must train your tenants that the rent gets paid first, before anything else.

The economy is bad, but that is not why you aren't getting your rent money.


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

Callieslamb said:


> The house next door to us is finally up for sale. I wish I had more confidence in the rental market - we'd snap it up in a minute. But I don't want to have it trashed and I don't want people that won't pay move in and me not be able to get them out. Especially if they are next door. I would love to be able to offer a nice, simple home at a very reasonable price to a family that could use a break. I want the land. I'm afraid it's too big of a risk though. Which is very sad since we could easily invest this amount without any debt.


If you do decide to go this route...just be firm with your tenants. Don't select them based upon their need for housing. Select them for their ability to pay and their track record of paying.You have to take the emotion out of the decision. Breaks are something that you only give to very deserving, long-term tenants that have earned that break.


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## Nimrod (Jun 8, 2010)

Oregon has a point. Let it be known that being behind is not permitted. Evict one and the others will fall in line.

Renting is a cyclical business. Right now it is a sellers market. Many people have had their homes forclosed and they have to rent. There is not enough units so the price goes up. Now there is a large number of starts of multifamily buildings. When they all get done there will be a glut of rental housing on the market. Landlords will have to lower rent and offer specials to get their units rented. 

Landlords are also in competition with the government. The gooberment keeps building low income "affordable" housing. It's not real fun to be in competition with an entity that taxes and regulates you.


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## Spinner (Jul 19, 2003)

Rental prices are dropping like a rock in this area. A house that rented for $350 a short 2 years ago is renting for $150 today. I guess landlords have decided a little bit is better than none. AND, upkeep on an empty house is expensive as they will fall apart quickly if left unheated in the winter, or if homeless people live there stealthy, using toilets, etc. leaving a complete disaster for the owner to clean up before they can rent again. That doesn't even count the thieves that will rip out the copper wiring and anything else that can be turned into cash.


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

Spinner said:


> Rental prices are dropping like a rock in this area. A house that rented for $350 a short 2 years ago is renting for $150 today. I guess landlords have decided a little bit is better than none. AND, upkeep on an empty house is expensive as they will fall apart quickly if left unheated in the winter, or if homeless people live there stealthy, using toilets, etc. leaving a complete disaster for the owner to clean up before they can rent again. That doesn't even count the thieves that will rip out the copper wiring and anything else that can be turned into cash.


May I ask what state you live in that has whole houses being rented for under $300 per month? I've never heard of whole homes renting for so little.


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## NamasteMama (Jul 24, 2009)

No kidding, a house rental is minimum 950$ where I live, and thats in a bad area, $1300 is more realistic for a tract home in a decent area.


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## whodunit (Mar 29, 2004)

I just applied for a "part-time" job (which is all I wanted since I already have a full-time one) and found at that place it's 32 hours a week. What happened to 20 being part-time?

I was interested in looking into becoming a pharmacy technician because I thought it paid better than it does. Well, I was wrong- at least here in our parts. It starts at minimum wage. That surprised me because there are some hoops to jump through and training required. I always thought minimum wage was for the uneducated and inexperienced worker.

The only places paying anything decent are government jobs, which is what I have, but we even faced being shut down recently.

Things have really changed and I see them getting worse.


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## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

oregon woodsmok said:


> OP, you are too soft. Your tenants have discovered that they can pay their other bills first, or even buy toys, and they can pay the landlord last. Then the word goes around to all the tenants: you don't have to pay because the landlord won't evict. That's why half your tenants are not paying.
> 
> I suspect that all of your December rent is going to go to tenant Christmas presents, because the landlord won't evict if you don't pay him, so why not have a great Christmas? If you want to be successful as a landlord you must train your tenants that the rent gets paid first, before anything else.
> 
> The economy is bad, but that is not why you aren't getting your rent money.


I think you need to read my OP again... We've been the bus. for along time . This just started . If you are in the same business and have a better track record than I posted you are doing well. Half of the tennants ? You lost me on that...My thoughts were those that work are having a tougher time than the ones that receive Goverment assistance. I am successful as far as I'm concerned .


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## TripleD (Feb 12, 2011)

Nimrod said:


> Oregon has a point. Let it be known that being behind is not permitted. Evict one and the others will fall in line.
> 
> Renting is a cyclical business. Right now it is a sellers market. Many people have had their homes forclosed and they have to rent. There is not enough units so the price goes up. Now there is a large number of starts of multifamily buildings. When they all get done there will be a glut of rental housing on the market. Landlords will have to lower rent and offer specials to get their units rented.
> 
> Landlords are also in competition with the government. The gooberment keeps building low income "affordable" housing. It's not real fun to be in competition with an entity that taxes and regulates you.


It's a buyers market here. Location Location Location was the first thing I learned in Real Estate school . 3br brick ranch houses built in the 70's go for 15 to 25 k. Spend some dollars on them and they rent for about $600.The government is no competition here....


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## sdnapier (Aug 13, 2010)

AngieM2 said:


> It's being phased it, it has already had effects and accumulating funds to make it work the 4 years before it goes into effect.
> 
> I don't have a link - but if you look into the funding for it, you'll see the articles on the funding.


O no-Care is already hitting doctors offices and hospitals. You're correct in that it is being phased in. And it's only going to get worse. Watch


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## MJsLady (Aug 16, 2006)

We are waiting now to see if Beloved's employer keeps or cancels our insurance.
With our health issues even if insurance acceptance is guaranteed we could not afford the higher premiums.


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

My Dr was playing with retiring in a few years. With the requirement to move everything to computers it pushed her right out. She hates the things. Doesn't think they are safe or reliable. Now we re looking for a new Dr because we don't like the replacement the clinic brought in. I asked my dentist if he was gonna retire too and he said that he left Canada to get away from stuff like this and if it looked like it was going to be the same he might move home to help his folks instead of having them move here. He likes it here but it would be much easier for him to move and if they were going to have the same issues with health care they might as well stay with what they know.


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

It seems lime people around here move every time the rent is due. I work for the school and kids are constantly updating their addresses.


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

AngieM2 said:


> It's being phased it, it has already had effects and accumulating funds to make it work the 4 years before it goes into effect.
> 
> I don't have a link - but if you look into the funding for it, you'll see the articles on the funding.


My son was working a contract job with Navistar, he pays $600/month for insurance. Their going to have a baby in January and the hospital told them even with insurance they will be paying $10k. Hospital said that their operating in accordance with Obamacare. He just got a new job that starts next week with Terex and will have Blue Cross/Blue Shield that starts January 1st. He said their hoping the baby doesn't come early.

Bob


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

TheMartianChick said:


> If you do decide to go this route...just be firm with your tenants. Don't select them based upon their need for housing. Select them for their ability to pay and their track record of paying.You have to take the emotion out of the decision. Breaks are something that you only give to very deserving, long-term tenants that have earned that break.


Good advice. I'm more worried that they will lost a job and then what? They might have the best track record available but when that job is gone...then what?


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

edcopp said:


> I sold my last rental house a couple of years ago. There is a reason for that.


Me too....2006 to be exact......right at the peak of the housing bubble.

Buddy of mine is just getting in the rental biz after being laid off as a mortgage banker by a major bank in this State. I told him "big mistake".....and he says "I've got to put the money SOMEPLACE to earn something....you just about have to pay the bank to leave it there "

and I reminded him of Will Rogers quote "I'm not so concerned about the return ON my money as I am about the return OF my money".

:lookout:


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## Wendy (May 10, 2002)

> May I ask what state you live in that has whole houses being rented for under $300 per month? I've never heard of whole homes renting for so little.


We rented here for 13 years for $50.00 per month. We had to mow our landlord's grass at the house across the road as part of the deal. He died in 1998 & his daughter got the place. We rented from her for the same amount & bought the house & 3.5 acres in 2006. She kept the remaining 180 acres surrounding us. She just didn't want to mess with the rent & upkeep anymore.


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