# 6 Reasons a Rural Retreat May Not Be As Safe As You Might Think



## Trixters_muse (Jan 29, 2008)

This is an article copy and pasted from my received Survival Mom newsletter. I thought it might be food for thought.

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Way back in 2007, when I first became aware of the need to prepare for an increasingly uncertain future, I was convinced that our family needed to move from the city to a hidey-hole, commonly referred to as a, "survival retreat." Preferably in Idaho.

Our retreat would be located at least 25 miles from the nearest interstate and 10 miles from the nearest town, which would have no more than 1000 residents. We would be safe from zombie biker gangs and hoards of desperate people leaving the big cities en masse.

Since then, I've given a lot of thought to survival retreats and have come to realize they aren't the be all, end all when it comes to preparedness and survival. Here's why. 

1. Rural areas are hot spots that attract the self-reliant and libertarian learning citizens.

In case you haven't noticed, self-reliance isn't exactly a lifestyle encouraged by a federal government and many state governments intent on increasing the level of dependency of citizens. Incredibly, top politicians boast of the number of Americans on food stamps and are actively working to increase those numbers!

Citizens wishing to decrease their level of government dependence are viewed with suspicion. Without a doubt, those living in rural areas will come under increasing scrutiny as their activities are viewed as oppositional to those of the federal government. You will be in their bullseye.

2. In a word, drones.

Recently it was reported that the federal government had some 30,000 spy drones it was willing to bequeath to law enforcement agencies across the country. Has your local police or sheriff's department requested one of these? Is there any reason to believe it won't be used to spy on the activities of innocent civilians, especially those who may show signs of uppity self-reliance activities?

It has been reported that these drones have been used by the EPA to keep track of the activities of independent farmers and ranchers. I can't think of a single reason why they won't be used to check out "suspicious activities" of those living off the radar.

3. Google knows where you live!

Do you really think your survival retreat hasn't been mapped by Google? Activate a drone, and a survival retreat is less of a retreat, with survival questionable. And, Google has a very cozy relationship with the federal government.

4. Government entities with limitless money and power but no accountability are almost impossible to fight.

Here is just a sampling of stories that illustrate all too well how powerless a rural family is against the force of government.


"EPA power grab to regulate ditches, gullies on private property"
"Wood burning fireplaces to disappear in Southern California"
"U.S. top court backs landowners, limits power of EPA," The Supreme Court did not say that the EPA's methods were unconstitutional, just that citizens have the right to sue after the fact.
"Oregon man sentenced to jail for collecting rain water"
"New labor rules threaten role of farm kids," This idea was dropped but serves to illustrate the lengths that some in government are willing to go in order to squelch those desiring and promoting self-reliance.
"County sues farmer, cites too many crops"

How many rural families have the time and resources to fight unjust charges and policies? Not many, and I haven't even started on the I.R.S.!

5. The drought could spell big trouble for rural retreats.

I've noticed that every crisis seems to cause some in government to react with reactionary speeches and, often, unnecessary policies. The current drought has me worried because I can easily see it used as an excuse for government interference with the use of well water. How hard would it be for an agency to declare that one person or another was, "using more than their 'fair share' of water," and regulating well water usage for everyone? 

6. Leave it to the United Nations to harass rural Americans.

Has your local news media been covering Agenda 21? No? Thought not. Americans don't even realize that the policies of this oppressive document are already being implemented in many states. The goals of Agenda 21 are shocking. You can read all the official documentation here. 


I haven't written this to discourage anyone from establishing a retreat somewhere away from big cities, but I think it's important to not over-estimate the level of security such a retreat might bring. 

No, I don't think cities are safer! They come with their own challenges and dangers, but at least city-dwellers are aware of their vulnerabilities. Too often, survival pros sell the concept of a "survival retreat" as a cloak of immunity from coming troubles. 


Lisa Bedford,
The Survival Mom


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## nadja (May 22, 2011)

One very important thing to consider. When you live as remote as I do, just about anything that moves could and would become a target. Bury it or eat it, no real difference. Also, the gobernut would not be too interested in us rural country hicks, as it cost them to much to come, whereas in the city, they don't find what they are looking for in one house, they simply go next door. Not so out here. We also have far more areas to make things disapear, such as food supplies.


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## Bluesgal (Jun 17, 2011)

Pros and cons to everything. Safer in most situations, maybe not so much in others. IMHO it's going to take more than just 3 or 4 people to survive in the long run and while the isolation will provide protection from the initial stuff, not so much when the baddies get organized into gangs of 100 or so. With planning and luck, this too can be dealt with.

Something else to think about...


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

I still wish I was more rural....2 local stabbings ((relatives to my neighbors(sex offender and attempt murder bunch) are the perps)) one guy died from his wounds...lots of alcoholism/drugs/robberies and other related activities that just grate at my want for peace and civility and trust....Don't get me wrong I know some super-- class A people in this town of 5000 but many more are "dangerous" in other ways ----how they raise their kids and live off plastic and look oh so pretty and the criminal element....

And, I know this is everywhere BUT the numbers are fewer the farther out you get....

I think the renters in front are dealers now....but the fireworks have stopped since I had words with them...

I wish the gov't would do more toward the criminal element versus the guy who just wants to live and be free on respectable(Constitutional) terms...


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

My Government will protect me, and care for all of my needs. My government exists to serve the people. I have NO worries.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

Sourdough said:


> My Government will protect me, and care for all of my needs. My government exists to serve the people. I have NO worries.


I'm glad they love you and take such good care of you and give you scooby snaks.


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## Trixters_muse (Jan 29, 2008)

I need to clarify that I am not the "Survival Mom" Lisa Bedford, I just get her newsletter and wanted to share it with all of you to get your input and give us some new perspectives. I guess when I said I copied it from "my" newletter it came across differently than what I meant, which is the newsletter I get in my e-mail, not "my" newsletter that I write and own rights to.

I am A survival mom, but not THE Surival Mom who owns the website, writes the blogs etc...

I am just Aine 

That will teach me to write posts after staying up all night drinking coffee!


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## nadja (May 22, 2011)

Bluesgal said:


> Pros and cons to everything. Safer in most situations, maybe not so much in others. IMHO it's going to take more than just 3 or 4 people to survive in the long run and while the isolation will provide protection from the initial stuff, not so much when the baddies get organized into gangs of 100 or so. With planning and luck, this too can be dealt with.
> 
> Something else to think about...


My nearest neighbor , is also my old framing partner, and sent home from the jungle playgrund because he liked it to much. My best friend, who lives about 2 miles from here started as Air American in the early 60's and spent 20 years in the Marine Corps. Myself, I spent my time (65-69) also over in really neat playground areas. If all failed and the big groups of baddies did manage to even find us, we could I assure you make them very uncomfortable before they got within range.


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## nadja (May 22, 2011)

mpillow said:


> I still wish I was more rural....2 local stabbings ((relatives to my neighbors(sex offender and attempt murder bunch) are the perps)) one guy died from his wounds...lots of alcoholism/drugs/robberies and other related activities that just grate at my want for peace and civility and trust....Don't get me wrong I know some super-- class A people in this town of 5000 but many more are "dangerous" in other ways ----how they raise their kids and live off plastic and look oh so pretty and the criminal element....
> 
> And, I know this is everywhere BUT the numbers are fewer the farther out you get....
> 
> ...



The nearest town to me has a pop. of about 8,000 and a good percantage of them are Mormon. About 1/2 or better. Thats after you find me about 26 miles out of town. The last 6 miles are dirt roads after dirt roads, and then a mile or so of old cow trails until you get to one of several more cow trails, one of which is my actual driveway. You can't even see my wind generator until you get to my front gate and my dogs will let me know long before you get anywhere near that close.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

The problem for rural dwellers is NOT drones, or Google, or the UN, or the Feds.....the problem is Bubba.

Bubba is a guy that lives down the road from you in a run down kinda place, or in a trailer on Daddy's property. He works off and on, enough to feed his wife and kids, and maybe some left over to drink with the boys on Friday night, but basically doesn't do any more than the bare minimum to get by. He owns a rusty old 30-30 and could maybe scrounge up one box of shells. He owns a nice, jacked up, accessorized pickup truck, but can't find the money to put in a chicken house or the time to put in a garden.
There are two different satellite dishes on the post of his front porch, and big screen TV in the living room, which has a window AC about to fall out of a rotting window.

When things get REALLY tough, and Bubba can't feed his brood, he is gonna come to you...maybe "for some work".....maybe in the middle of the night to steal your chickens....but he IS coming. And he knows where you live without Google. And he has a fair idea what you have, because he's seen your AltE system, or your cows grazing, or the fact you keep your fences nice and neat.....You GOT stuff, and Bubba deserves his share, after all, because that's "fair".


Yeah.....you want to worry about something.....worry about Bubba.


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## nadja (May 22, 2011)

Well Andy, I am very aware of Bubba. As a matter of fact, he lives a mile or so down the cowtrail from me right now. BUT, because I am aware of him and a couple of other problems just like him and so do my friends, they are already on our "fix it" list. kinda sorta like..... hmmmm m just love the smell of nalpalm in the morning !!!!


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## Laura (May 10, 2002)

We are all aware of our Bubba out here and know how to manage him. We aren't afraid of Bubba, but outsiders are terrified of him. Besides, his wife is a hardworking, longsuffering woman and we want to keep her happy.

I love articles that attempt to discourage others from moving out here, even portraying us as ignorant, scarey know-nothing cousins of Sasquatch. It works for me.


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## Old Vet (Oct 15, 2006)

TnAndy said:


> The problem for rural dwellers is NOT drones, or Google, or the UN, or the Feds.....the problem is Bubba.
> 
> Bubba is a guy that lives down the road from you in a run down kinda place, or in a trailer on Daddy's property. He works off and on, enough to feed his wife and kids, and maybe some left over to drink with the boys on Friday night, but basically doesn't do any more than the bare minimum to get by. He owns a rusty old 30-30 and could maybe scrounge up one box of shells. He owns a nice, jacked up, accessorized pickup truck, but can't find the money to put in a chicken house or the time to put in a garden.
> There are two different satellite dishes on the post of his front porch, and big screen TV in the living room, which has a window AC about to fall out of a rotting window.
> ...


I am afraid that Bubba thinks that I am crazy and knows that in a pinch I shoot first then ask questions. In fact I am sure of that. And he know that I have a backhoe.


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

As to the OP....sounds like somebody has some urban land they're desperate to sell. :thumb:


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## MO_cows (Aug 14, 2010)

The whole premise of the article didn't work for me. Does anybody really believe they are "safe" from the after effects of a SHTF event just because they moved out of the city?? I'd still rather take my chances in a rural/remote location than the 'burbs, but thanks for discouraging the riff raff.

TnAndy, right on about Bubba.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> *6 Reasons a Rural Retreat May Not Be As Safe As You Might Think *




"Safety" is largely an illusion, and at best is only a temporary condition.
I'll still feel *SAFER* in my rural location


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

We have several Bubbas here. They are people that have been friendly and neighbourly but they grew up..."soft". Not really the right word but I can't think of a better one right now. Here in the past year they have started acting standoffish. We usually keep to ourselves so I really hadn't noticed until I was talking to the new neighbors. They were walking past our place when I was getting home and the guy said "you better start keeping your dog under control and keep your chickens off our place". ????? I have a 6 foot wall around my place and my chickens have never left the property and my dogs are ALWAYS leashed when we take them off property. We started talking and he told me that the others around don't like that I raise the chickens, the horses stink and he was told that our dogs run loose and chase people and bit a horse. My horses don't stink, the manure goes in the dumpster and gets hauled off weekly, no rooster so no crowing, my dogs have never run loose or bit a horse(I have the only ones around here). 

This is 4 families that have been friendly up till now and one neighbour that doesn't like us because of my husbands job. 2 of them were getting eggs from us, I was giving them some when I had extras. We have decided to cut them off because I don't like gossips and liars. I guess it's a good thing that they don't know that we had a pig and calf over the winter (in freezer now), or that we raise chickens and rabbits for meat or can everything I can get hold of. We helped all of them (even grumpy) with pvc parts after a bad freeze 2yrs ago. I guess next time I didn't restock.


Wow. Sorry y'all. I guess that was bugging me more than I realized. Its not nice when people you've known for 6yrs and thought were friendly turn on you all of a sudden.


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

Yer in our-soil-could-use-a-boost New Mexico and have your horse gold hauled off in a _dumpster_?!!!! 


:sob:


Whatever are you gunna bury Bubba in............ after ?


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## Trixters_muse (Jan 29, 2008)

Looks like most of you pretty much feel like I do, I just posted the newsletter to get others perspectives. I live close to town but am working hard to buy a small piece of land further away, much more rural and a little more private. Even here in the neighborhood we have our share of Bubbas, lots of them.

No matter where I live, I will fortify that place the best I can, keep lots of ammo, know my neighbors well and worry little about drones and the goobermint and more about keeping me and mine fed and alive.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

We have Bubbas of various degrees all around Us. They all seem to think we are ignorant because we weren't born here. I guess that's OK. We certainly can't be smart enough to "be prepared".


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## fffarmergirl (Oct 9, 2008)

I tend to be a little bit paranoid and have an overactive imagination. DH always says "just because you're paranoid, that doesn't mean they're not out to get you" which really helps LOL.

Anyway - we have a very rural retreat. The part of our property that borders the road is heavily forested and it's hard to see our garden etc. from the road. We don't get a lot of visitors.

A couple of years ago I posted on a forum about the guy who has a camp across the road from us and how he behaves very oddly and threatens anybody who even looks in the direction of his camp etc. and I said something about maybe he was growing MJ back there. Very shortly after that one of those little airplanes started flying over very low, around and around over our place. We've seen a lot of them since.

This year we put up one of those big black round-topped tent building things - don't know what they're called - right along the boundary between the forest and the open fields, where it's most inconspicuous and put a screen tent right next to it, and that's where we processed our chickens. We had a bunch of friends and family come over to help us and we were all back there, out of sight, and a stranger moseyed back with a clipboard. He said the camp next to ours was going up for tax sale and he was wondering if we could answer some questions about the place. I just thought it was odd that he showed up when he did . . . . . right after we put up a new building and when we had a lot of people over and we were kind of in a hidden area. We might have looked a little suspicious from the air.

Last week a young man knocked on our door, selling aerial photos. We actually bought one because it's just beautiful. It shows our property and our garden in great detail. He was interested in what the outbuildings were for and I thought "if I was a police officer or investigator, that's definitely how I would go about looking around. Take a plane over people's houses and then use aearial photos as an excuse to stop by and see things a little closer."

I love the photo but I definitely do not feel like we have a private retreat anymore.


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## stickinthemud (Sep 10, 2003)

Anybody who thinks they have a private retreat anywhere anymore has never looked closely at Google maps satellite view:
Google Maps


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## nadja (May 22, 2011)

I think that by and large, those of us already way out in the sticks so to speak, are already safer then the masses in the cities or 'burbs. Oh am not advocating that there are not criminal types out here in the boonies, only that to get to us requires a lot more work then just walking down the street looking for the next easy target. 

Yes, we will be a target at a certain point and time, largely due to the fact that most of us in some fashion grow our own food. However, after living here for over 16 years now, we are far more ingrained into our rural areas then somebody trying to move here in the last or next few months. In other words, without even talking to people about it,we already know what very well will happen in the not so distant future and in most ways are prepared to deal with it.


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

stickinthemud said:


> Anybody who thinks they have a private retreat anywhere anymore has never looked closely at Google maps satellite view:
> Google Maps



Keep in mind that google satellite view is about as bland and generic as they could muster. The sophisticated equipment that they use when they want to see shows a _little_ more detail, inside your house and out.


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

Forerunner said:


> Keep in mind that google satellite view is about as bland and generic as they could muster. The sophisticated equipment that they use when they want to see shows a _little_ more detail, inside your house and out.


Sorry for the thread drift, how well does that equipment work on cloudy days? The ones with low clouds and maybe some mist in the air. 


Drones are flown in the ME from Syracuse, NY, not far from where I live. The tax assessor uses Bing which shows real good detail. No, not much is private. Safety is fleeting, can change in a second. Still rather be rural, wish we were more so. Bubba lives down the road but at least he isn't on all sides as in an apartment building.....now where is that toothless smiley?


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

I don't know that it would have to be a clear day for them to see through the roof and walls. 

Maybe sunning yourself on a cloudy day would give you a slight increase in privacy. :shrug:

Thread drift ?

I thought this thread was about maintaining the illusion of security........... :huh:


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## cast iron (Oct 4, 2004)

MO_cows said:


> The whole premise of the article didn't work for me. Does anybody really believe they are "safe" from the after effects of a SHTF event just because they moved out of the city??


Oh yeah, they absolutely do believe that, and it's not people who have moved out of the city who believe it, it's long time, multi-generational rural living people. Many rural folks live very sheltered lives and are far less prepared than most folks Assume they would be.


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

> preferabley Idaho


I'd like to point out that Idaho is a very dangerous place.

Our libertarian leanings prove we are kooks. My horses stink. The winters are cold, summers hot and dry. The growing season short. The place is crawling with gov agencies. The wolves have killed all the game. Dogs bite. The kids walk around with their butts hanging out, crotch of pants down to their knees. Kalifornians retired and liberalized the cities. The mountains have all been strip mined leaving only a contaminated, smoldering landscape. Loose chickens act like a swarm of locust, decimating gardens. Anyone over 25 years old with more than three teeth are considered "vain". WE DO NOT SHOWER(or wear underwear). We eat with our fingers and a hunting knife.

:teehee::teehee::teehee:

I hear Florida has good weather and civilized people.:whistlin:


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## Wintersong Farm (Aug 22, 2007)

Wind in Her Hair said:


> interesting perspective - and just another reminder that it pays to be flexible -even in your prepartions.
> 
> My mantra is: "Adjust, adapt, avoid".


Very similar to "improvise, adapt, overcome."


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

Forerunner said:


> Yer in our-soil-could-use-a-boost New Mexico and have your horse gold hauled off in a _dumpster_?!!!!
> 
> 
> :sob:
> ...


Until I can build a rabbit/jack rabbit proof fence for my garden all the horse manure my horses could possibly make wont do me any good. Hubby may be getting transfered soon so I am going to wait until we find out before building fort knox for the veggies.

Besides, I now have to many Bubbas for one little garden.


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

time said:


> I'd like to point out that Idaho is a very dangerous place.
> 
> Our libertarian leanings prove we are kooks. My horses stink. The winters are cold, summers hot and dry. The growing season short. The place is crawling with gov agencies. The wolves have killed all the game. Dogs bite. The kids walk around with their butts hanging out, crotch of pants down to their knees. Kalifornians retired and liberalized the cities. The mountains have all been strip mined leaving only a contaminated, smoldering landscape. Loose chickens act like a swarm of locust, decimating gardens. Anyone over 25 years old with more than three teeth are considered "vain". WE DO NOT SHOWER(or wear underwear). We eat with our fingers and a hunting knife.
> 
> ...


Sounds great.


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## KMA1 (Dec 9, 2006)

I am still convinced that my family is much safer where I ma than if I lived in a large or small city, or even a town. I think I, and my neighbors, have a lot more options than we would if we lived in town, including but certainly not limited to, growing more food. Now for those that just plan on moving out to a rural place once TSHTF, I am not so sure.


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## pamda (Oct 14, 2004)

time said:


> I'd like to point out that Idaho is a very dangerous place.
> 
> Our libertarian leanings prove we are kooks. My horses stink. The winters are cold, summers hot and dry. The growing season short. The place is crawling with gov agencies. The wolves have killed all the game. Dogs bite. The kids walk around with their butts hanging out, crotch of pants down to their knees. Kalifornians retired and liberalized the cities. The mountains have all been strip mined leaving only a contaminated, smoldering landscape. Loose chickens act like a swarm of locust, decimating gardens. Anyone over 25 years old with more than three teeth are considered "vain". WE DO NOT SHOWER(or wear underwear). We eat with our fingers and a hunting knife.
> 
> ...


 YEP!LOL...Florida is a great place..


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

pamda said:


> YEP!LOL...Florida is a great place..


I wasn't talking about Florida. If meant that it sounds good up there by your stinky horses. Well, times stinky horses. They can't be worse than my gossipy neighbors.


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## tab (Aug 20, 2002)

Heh, I would pick horses over pigs. Pick them both over gossipy neighbors. Maybe I should move my pigs to the front yard to give Bubba something to gossip about {evil grin}.


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## pamda (Oct 14, 2004)

terri9630 said:


> I wasn't talking about Florida. If meant that it sounds good up there by your stinky horses. Well, times stinky horses. They can't be worse than my gossipy neighbors.


 I know,but I live in Idaho and we have enough people moving here to make what was my little farm almost in downtown now. The people in the subdivision behind here are from Cali..they want no horses, no chickens,no smell no noise, but they moved here, and all that was here first. Just trying to be silly, and send people to Florida, or maybe an island off the coast or some place else...


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## Trixters_muse (Jan 29, 2008)

time said:


> I'd like to point out that Idaho is a very dangerous place.
> 
> Our libertarian leanings prove we are kooks. My horses stink. The winters are cold, summers hot and dry. The growing season short. The place is crawling with gov agencies. The wolves have killed all the game. Dogs bite. The kids walk around with their butts hanging out, crotch of pants down to their knees. Kalifornians retired and liberalized the cities. The mountains have all been strip mined leaving only a contaminated, smoldering landscape. Loose chickens act like a swarm of locust, decimating gardens. Anyone over 25 years old with more than three teeth are considered "vain". WE DO NOT SHOWER(or wear underwear). We eat with our fingers and a hunting knife.
> 
> ...


NOOOOOO!!!!! Don't send anymore to Florida! LOL. 

It's hot, humid, mosquitos as big as pigeons and a multitude of other bugs, we have water restrictions all the time, most of the state smells like a swamp, hurricane season lasts 6 months, unemployment is terrible, crime is rampant, boys wear pants to their knees and girls wear butt floss in public. As far as being civilized, people here have forgotten what southern hospitality is, folks are rude, mean and down right nasty.

Hopefully I have spoiled your evil plot to send the undesirables HERE. MUWAHAHAHA!:bouncy:


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

TnAndy's post about 'Bubba' is so right on its scary . . . . . . . .

Got to add to that........If and when 'Bubba's' sources of beer and ciggies dry up he then will be one nasty sob............

Also down the road a piece is the "Clamperts".........
They grow mcdonalds wrappers . . .the seven year olds are already 75 pounds overweight . . . . . .not to say how over weight (obese) the parents are..........

Now since mcdonalds is totally closed . . .they are powerfull hungry . . . . . 

Between the Clamperts and Bubba . . . . . the odds are not in my favor ............


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## BoldViolet (Feb 5, 2009)

Maybe I need coffee, but is she listing libertarians being a CON ??


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

Trixters_muse said:


> NOOOOOO!!!!! Don't send anymore to Florida! LOL.
> 
> It's hot, humid, mosquitos as big as pigeons and a multitude of other bugs, we have water restrictions all the time, most of the state smells like a swamp, hurricane season lasts 6 months, unemployment is terrible, crime is rampant, boys wear pants to their knees and girls wear butt floss in public. As far as being civilized, people here have forgotten what southern hospitality is, folks are rude, mean and down right nasty.
> 
> Hopefully I have spoiled your evil plot to send the undesirables HERE. MUWAHAHAHA!:bouncy:


I had to try. 

West coast Canada seems willing to accept more community members. And,,,,,,,they have restricted their ability to arm themselves. That's what I'm told anyway.


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## time (Jan 30, 2011)

BoldViolet said:


> Maybe I need coffee, but is she listing libertarians being a CON ??


Yep. The theory being it will attract gov agencies on the lookout/hunt for anti-gov folks. Extreme rightwinger types. You know, possible "domestic terrorists" according to the "lists".


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

Jim-mi said:


> TnAndy's post about 'Bubba' is so right on its scary . . . . . . . .
> 
> Got to add to that........If and when 'Bubba's' sources of beer and ciggies dry up he then will be one nasty sob............
> 
> ...




We've got 3 of those near us. Counties been out to one twice in 5 yrs to clean up their property and in that same 5yrs another has had the swat team out 3 times.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

time said:


> I had to try.
> 
> West coast Canada seems willing to accept more community members. And,,,,,,,they have restricted their ability to arm themselves. That's what I'm told anyway.


Absolutely. Aside from the fact that it has a deserved reputation for being the rainiest and least friendly place in Canada everything else is all lies I tell ya. There are no hidden caches of arms in every 3rd household in the cities, there's no guns on every homestead out in the country, there's no drug dealing gangs, no homeless people, there is no such thing as the "Highways of Tears" where people go missing, and there's especially no rural ******* communities protecting BC's cash crop all over the province. That is totally a bald-faced lie! There are no mysterious SSS disappearances, no cars going off mountain roads into gorges and rivers, no missing women and children, no crazy survivalist mountain men holed up in bunkers with explosives and machine guns, no bands of angry protesting natives, no large dangerous wild animals anywhere, and there's no snow avalanches or mudslides, no storms, floods or forest fires every year, and no Japanese garbage and radiation approaching. The only thing you have to be careful of are the orcas and bull sharks, and really, who goes fishing anyway? All you'll catch is another shoe with a human foot in it and I hear those shoes don't taste good, so why bother?

So come on up and stay awhile, we'll be glad to meat ya ... er, meet ya, that is.

:trollface


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## jdrobison (May 28, 2012)

We eat with our fingers and a hunting knife.:gaptooth:


I thought that was the only way to eat.:teehee:


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## countryfied2011 (Jul 5, 2011)

Not all Bubba's are created equal.... DH's nickname is Bubba has had it since he was a baby...and he retired from the fire dept with 34 yrs, owned a fence company on the side, and is a hard working man....and he has all of his teeth....lol He was born and raised where we live...and most of our neighbors are either relatives or lived in our area most of their lives.


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## lurnin2farm (Jun 10, 2012)

Interesting perspective but I dont think she has thought this all the way through and I will point out some errors IMO. Also Tn Andy is spot on. Bubba is everywhere nowadays but as long as your aware Bubba wont last long.. 



> 1. Rural areas are hot spots that attract the self-reliant and libertarian learning citizens.
> 
> In case you haven't noticed, self-reliance isn't exactly a lifestyle encouraged by a federal government and many state governments intent on increasing the level of dependency of citizens. Incredibly, top politicians boast of the number of Americans on food stamps and are actively working to increase those numbers!
> 
> Citizens wishing to decrease their level of government dependence are viewed with suspicion. Without a doubt, those living in rural areas will come under increasing scrutiny as their activities are viewed as oppositional to those of the federal government. You will be in their bullseye.


The main reason TS will HTF is because Gov is broke and has overspent for years. Those that are on "The system" may be increasing today but in the near future that "system" is finished. Noone will be on Gov benefits and when those benies go away its going to be ugly in the cities and surrounding burbs. 

My activities coming under scrutiny dont bother me. If they want to watch me grow tomatoes and milk cows then have at it. They are going to have way more problems in the cities to deal with and that will keep them occupied for a very long time. But again, they have no money so no way to pay the help to do their dirty work when things get really bad. 
They also wont be able to borrow money to get this done. With a population out of work and no prospects for the future the chances of getting a loan are very slim. Who will they tax to raise funds? All of those that are out of work? 



> It has been reported that these drones have been used by the EPA to keep track of the activities of independent farmers and ranchers. I can't think of a single reason why they won't be used to check out "suspicious activities" of those living off the radar.


2)Again what suspicious activities? Sounds a bit like fear mongering to me. I have yet to see them go into a rural area and stomp on someone because they are growing a garden or raising some animals. Even if they classified that as suspicious activity, see my argument in 1) no money. 



> 3) Google knows where you live!
> 
> Do you really think your survival retreat hasn't been mapped by Google? Activate a drone, and a survival retreat is less of a retreat, with survival questionable. And, Google has a very cozy relationship with the federal government.


Again who cares? Your addy in the city is mapped as well so what difference does it make. There may be some privacy issues but the info is nothing that is going to cause the federal Gov to come barging into your home. 



> 4. Government entities with limitless money and power but no accountability are almost impossible to fight.


 What does she thing is going to cause a SHTF scenario? Its going to be an economic collapse. The Gov will have no money to do all the things they like to do now to create jobs. See my #1 again. 


as for the rest, yes water can and probably will be a problem in the future, any retreat should have a way to get and or store water. 

In any major city there are areas you dont want to be at after dark. This is true of just about anyplace in the world with the exception of maybe Cuba. Go to some of these welfare infested places during the day and just imagine what they are like at night. Add in the 1.4 million gang members here from south of the border and the cities are ripe for disaster. In a survival situation its all about your odds of survival no matter where in the world you go. IMO she does a dis service to her readers by this article. Your chances of survival are far greater in a rural retreat than in a city and thats really the bottom line. You can and many will die no matter where they are. I'll take my chances here in the sticks.


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## BoldViolet (Feb 5, 2009)

time said:


> Yep. The theory being it will attract gov agencies on the lookout/hunt for anti-gov folks. Extreme rightwinger types. You know, possible "domestic terrorists" according to the "lists".



Isn't she precious.


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## Ozarks Tom (May 27, 2011)

We'll take our chances in the country. The potential bad actors here can be numbered on two hands. The city? Not just the current bad actors, but the rest of the unprepared population eventually to become bad folks. I like the odds here much better.

We have several folks within a few miles who grew up here who we've more or less cultivated as "good to talk to/trade canning" friends. They know just about every soul within a 5 mile radius, and if SHTF would most likely fire up the backhoe.


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## ET1 SS (Oct 22, 2005)

After I retired we moved rural, right into the middle of Bubba-ville.

Less than 10 people per square mile so everyone has lots of elbow room. Plenty of water so crops and livestock never go dry. The average household income is very close to the poverty level, and Bubba is about 9 guys out of 10.

Very few people here are full-time employed. Most only do seasonal part-time jobs at minimum-wage.

These folks have seen this economy for nearly a century now, with no cycles. The housing bubble skipped this region as did the housing collapse.

I give permission for one Bubba to take a bear off my land every fall. Another Bubba asks each year to take a deer. A third does his fir-tipping on my land. The two who take meat need it to feed their families. As for the tipper, his wife makes wreaths and that is their only income in the fall [they have three kids].

They all know I have dogs, weapons and a backhoe.

They also see my 'house', it is a steel warehouse like an airplane hanger. No big display of wealth here. Some of them see me as a friend. I do not think any of them will be attracted to steal from me.


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## mamaof3peas (Oct 8, 2009)

lurnin2farm said:


> Interesting perspective but I dont think she has thought this all the way through and I will point out some errors IMO. Also Tn Andy is spot on. Bubba is everywhere nowadays but as long as your aware Bubba wont last long..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hey, fyi, the drones have already been used go charge a farmer bc e had someones cow on his property or something...trust me, our gov here in OK signed us up for a huge dronr program, and we are on notice


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## terri9630 (Mar 12, 2012)

mamaof3peas said:


> Hey, fyi, the drones have already been used go charge a farmer bc e had someones cow on his property or something...trust me, our gov here in OK signed us up for a huge dronr program, and we are on notice


There is a discussion on that. It started over cows and blew up well beyond that.


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## Peacock (Apr 12, 2006)

I think you're safer living in an area with which you're comfortable, no matter what. I am in the minority at HT but I admit that if I were plopped down in a rural remote area, after I'd gotten past the initial romance with the place I would FREAK. I wasn't raised that way and the learning curve would be huge.

I'm an "exurb" kind of girl -- that's a suburb that's a little on the rural side, nice and quiet, but less than a half-hour from the mall should I choose to go there. Grocery's only a few minutes away. I know I can't always count on those conveniences, but they do help me prep, and if the SHTF I could enjoy whatever government-provided help was available. I'm out of the city limits - of our little tiny city - and my immediate neighbors are good salt-of-the-earth folks like us, so we'd help each other - and I don't think we'd be one of the first affected by crazed hungry mobs anyway. Plus we can have livestock here and big gardens and most of us know how to do that at least - my next door neighbor takes care of our chickens when we're out of town, as an example.

But some are happier in the city, because they were raised that way, and they know how to cope with all the complexities of close relationships needed to survive in such a place. Those lucky enough to be in good city neighborhoods might benefit from those relationships.

So honestly I don't think one area is necessarily better than another - all have drawbacks, all have benefits. The best place to survive a disaster is the place you're comfortable.

One more thing - think about the wildfires - you've got this awesome rural retreat and then here come the fires - not doing you much good if you have to evacuate your bug-out spot, is it? No place is ever going to be 100% safe.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

Wow . . . . "Good city neighbor-hoods . . . . . . .Is there such a thing . . .??????????????

In a city neighbor-hood when/if a "house" gets torched the next door place can/will catch fire . . .and so on . . . .
And zombie torches could/can put a whole *neighbor-hood* a blaze REAL fast.........

I drove through the area where the Detroit riots were . . . . . .pretty darn NASTY......

Guess I'll stick right where I'm at . . .in the country...........


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