# The "Dirty Dozen" Most Contaminated Produce



## Jeffery (Oct 25, 2011)

According to the Environmental Working Group, these are the the most pesticide contaminated produce items in the supermarkets. 
If you buy these items, be sure to wash very well or look for organic. 

1. Strawberries
2. Apples
3. Nectarines
4. Peaches
5. Celery
6. Grapes
7. Cherries
8. Spinach
9. Tomatoes
10. Sweet bell peppers
11. Cherry tomatoes
12. Cucumbers

http://www.ewg.org/release/ewg-s-20...ce-strawberries-most-contaminated-apples-drop


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Did anyone notice none of those are GMO crops?

There's a lot of hype and hysteria on that source, and I doubt their honesty because of it.



> In California, where most U.S. strawberries are grown, each acre is treated with an astonishing 300 pounds of pesticides. More than 60 pounds are conventional chemicals that may leave post-harvest residues but most are fumigants &#8211; volatile poison gases that can drift into nearby schools and neighborhoods.


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Makes me glad we grow most of that list. Picked 25gal of strawberries off our beds and didn't spray anything on them.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

She's a political hack with no background in what she wrote. "Shannon earned her master&#8217;s degree at George Washington University&#8217;s Graduate School of Political Management and holds a B.A. in Government and International Politics, with a minor in Electronic Journalism, from George Mason University. Prior to joining EWG, she worked as a communications manager for New Partners Consulting, where she provided strategic and tactical support on a range of issues, including immigration reform and the anti-Keystone XL campaign. Shannon also previously worked as a strategic campaigns officer at the British Embassy in Washington, D.C. Shannon hails from Wildwood Crest on the New Jersey shore. In her free time, she enjoys hiking, running, rock climbing and cheering for the Philadelphia Eagles."


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

Lots of bs for sure in that list. But my goodness how many have gown up with your folks saying Wash Apples, rinse this, rinse that, etc. etc.???? Many of you if not all., LONG before anything was getting stayed around. Long before all this bs stuff was being floated around on the net that is for sure.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

I hunted around a bit to get the actual amounts and what it was they found, but couldn't get what I was looking for. 

Some times out ability to test for something runs far ahead of our understanding of what we are testing. On a sort of different topic, 25 years ago, if lead was found in our blood, it was a concern, not a health risk, but a concern. The best test available was down to 1 part per 1,000,000. But now, we can test down to 1 part per 1,000,000,000, a thousand times smaller! Now we expect that to be the level we get concerned. We are getting to the point where just being on earth will give us "elevated" levels of something.

While strawberries raised in CA might get lots of chemicals, the strawberry growers in Michigan rarely use any fungicides or insecticides and never herbicides.


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## geo in mi (Nov 14, 2008)

The Environmental Working Group didn't make a single study or take a single sample. Here's the summary report by the USDA for 2015, if anyone cares to look at it. https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/2015PDPAnnualSummary.pdf

Seems like a lot of folks like to get spoon-fed their "truth" by those who might have a vested interest in the subject---or, who know how to puff up a couple of half truths and make a very alarming article out of it. 

For me, I always wash my fruit and vegetables.....the produce section is on the right hand side just past the public restrooms. Sometimes, I think maybe I should _boil_ the stuff first..... 

geo


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

I always thought onions, peanuts and carrots would be way up there.


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## Lisa in WA (Oct 11, 2004)

very bad source. Bunch of crackpots.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

LisaInN.Idaho said:


> very bad source. Bunch of crackpots.


I resemble that remark.


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## JJ Grandits (Nov 10, 2002)

Its not the chemicals.
It's the filthy hands that touched the stuff and the rotting carcasses of the dying insects. They poop before they die you know.


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## Fennick (Apr 16, 2013)

Just wash everything thoroughly anyway, whether it's on the list or not and no matter if it's from the store or from your own garden.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

JJ Grandits said:


> Its not the chemicals.
> It's the filthy hands that touched the stuff and the rotting carcasses of the dying insects.* They poop* before they die you know.


But they don't poop *pesticides*, which is what the OP is about.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

fireweed farm said:


> I always thought onions, peanuts and carrots would be way up there.



Onions ?
Onions will absorb anything. 
Years ago I hauled a semi load of Monsanto nastycides ( herb,pest and fungicides) powdered chemicals to Oregon. 
When unloaded it had left three inches poison powder in the trailer for me to deal with. 
No one would clean it out. 
But this onion broker said bring it over and he would load it. Even after I told him what was in it. 

By the time I got it over too Chicago the onions had sucked it all up. When unloaded it looked like the floor had been steam cleaned. 
After unloading and getting signed off I told the usda inspector about it

He said no problem.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Onions ?
> Onions will absorb anything.
> Years ago I hauled a semi load of Monsanto nastycides ( herb,pest and fungicides) powdered chemicals to Oregon.
> When unloaded it had left *three inches poison powder in the trailer* for me to deal with.
> ...


That defies the laws of physics unless you're saying you hauled a trailer full of onions that were not packaged in any way


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## fireweed farm (Dec 31, 2010)

I can see dry powder sticking to moist onion bulbs, vibrating down the highway.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Pesticides are costly. If one is to believe this story, this expensive cargo was packaged worse than sand bags. I find it hard to believe that hundreds of dollars, perhaps thousands of dollars of product was deemed worthless. No one selling, transporting or buying is going to accept that amount of loss.

We have Cops that shoot innocent people in the back, so I guess it is possible that a USDA inspector accepted, signed off on a load of onions piled directly on top of a cocktail of pesticides. Possible.

IMHO, this tail was concocted to further the belief that our food system is awash in toxic chemicals and no one is watching out for chemical contamination. None of it makes a bit of sense. But I wasn't there.......

Since there is a lengthy list of "organic" chemicals that are used to battle insects and plant diseases on organic fruits and vegetables, I wonder if anyone is testing organic fruits and vegetables. Some of those organic or herbal treatments are used at far higher rates and have greater toxicity levels.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Well I guess you are gonna have to ask a trucker. 
The onions were in large net bags I'd guess 50 pounds. And they not only accepted the pesticide dust they sucked up the dirt the floor. Looked scrubbed when done. 
The usda inspector never saw the pesticide residue the onions absorbed it. 
Back then those pesticides came in paper bags on pallets the dust filtered down and filled the space under the pallet. I'm guessing at the three inches but it was certainly significant if it was just one bag it woulda scared me but it would have been far more that that 1 percent loss would have been ten bags, twenty if ya figger it fluffed some. 
Then going the other way it would have been the same. 
Will a onion suck up 1 percent of it's weight in dust ?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Well I guess you are gonna have to ask a trucker.
> *The onions were in large net bags* I'd guess 50 pounds. And they not only accepted the pesticide dust they sucked up the dirt the floor. Looked scrubbed when done.
> The usda inspector never saw the pesticide residue the onions absorbed it.
> Back then those pesticides came in paper bags on pallets the dust filtered down and filled the space under the pallet. * I'm guessing* at the three inches but it was certainly significant if it was just one bag it woulda scared me but it would have been far more that that 1 percent loss would have been ten bags, twenty if ya figger it fluffed some.
> ...


Onions won't "suck up" anything not a liquid.

Weren't the net bags on pallets which generally sit 3-4 inches above the floor to allow fork lift clearance?

When you're already in a hole you should stop digging.


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## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

It's a well known fact that onions are useful in cleaning.


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## Steve_S (Feb 25, 2015)

Makes one appreciate the garden out back of the cabin eh... When you see the Veggie Picker's on the produce farms peeing on the veggies they are picking, consider it... and everything else that happens along the way to the "factory processing" which introduces even more "goodness" to your meal.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Onions won't "suck up" anything not a liquid.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Nope the onions were stacked directly on the floor. 
How much are you willing to bet that onions will absorb a powder ?

Just exactly what hole are you talking about ?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Nope the onions were stacked directly on the floor.
> How much are you willing to bet that onions will absorb a powder ?
> 
> Just exactly what hole are you talking about ?


Onions can't absorb *powder* through their skins.
Only liquids or energy can be "absorbed".

I still don't believe there was "3 inches of poison powder" any more than I believe you "shot thousands of dogs".


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## Murby (May 24, 2016)

On a positive note, here's what I've learned about pesticides.

1. They are nasty to eat.. 
2. They are temporary.. You pretty much have to re-apply after each heavy rain and water is quite effective at washing them away.

I learned this with our grapes.. we get this fungus that destroys them every year and we have to start spraying as soon as the budding begins in the spring.

So I called up "Bayer".. yup.. the aspirin people who also make the pesticides.. and I got to talk with one of their scientists about my pesticide fears.. The lady was very nice, and answered all my questions and within about 5 minutes on the phone, I had the feeling that I was being told the truth. I spent almost half an hour picking her brain.

Yup.. pesticides are nasty.. you don't want to ingest them.. but they're also easy to wash away. 

I was also told that when you wash fruit, you want to make sure you use soft water as hard water does not do nearly as good a job. Rain water is very very "soft" water and has virtually no minerals in it.. Well water, if not softened, is horrible at washing anything.. So to solve the hard water issue, just use soap which contains surfactants which basically mimic the effects of soft water.

Certain fruits are more difficult to get clean.. Things like apples, pears, peaches, etc are easy to wash because they are firm and have smooth surfaces.. But others, like strawberries have thousands of little indentations and cracks where the seeds are and the chemicals can hide in those places.. Others like grapes and blueberries are smooth but very delicate so you have to be gentle. 

No harm comes from soaking fruit in water before eating.. you can soak strawberries in distilled water, or any other really soft water, and the pesticides will wash away quite effectively.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Onions can't absorb *powder* through their skins.
> 
> Only liquids or energy can be "absorbed".
> 
> ...



BFF I don't know how the process works I simply know it does you can ask any onion trucker they will tell you the same. 
For all I know tiny little men hide in the onions with tiny brooms and shovels. 

But if your theory is true what is the point of powdered herbicides pesticides fertilizers etc.?
Seems to me that would be that much money invested in these things if they didn't work. 

Your preference to Live in ignorance rather than learn from those experience baffles me. 

You remind me of a uncle that refuses to admit that grandma's red flannel cloth will cute a sore throat overnight. Even though it has cured his many times. 
Simply being ignorant of how something works doesn't mean that it doesn't work.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

I have hauled many loads of onions, and unless they sweated they didn't soak up anything, if they sweated they were always refused.

I can't even figure out how you hauled a hazardous load and a food load in the same trailer without a washout ticket...

On this one I'm with BFF and called bull excrement...


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> BFF I don't know how the process works I simply know it does you can ask any onion trucker they will tell you the same.
> For all I know tiny little men hide in the onions with tiny brooms and shovels.
> 
> But if your theory is true what is the point of powdered herbicides pesticides fertilizers etc.?
> ...


I never said anything about how pesticides/herbicides work.
Read my signature if you're still confused about that part.



> Your preference to Live in ignorance rather than *learn from those experience *baffles me.


But I *have* learned from you.
I've learned you aren't credible.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

coolrunnin said:


> I have hauled many loads of onions, and unless they sweated they didn't soak up anything, if they sweated they were always refused.
> 
> I can't even figure out *how you hauled a hazardous load and a food load in the same trailer without a washout ticket...*
> 
> On this one I'm with BFF and called bull excrement...


That's another clue it probably never really happened.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

coolrunnin said:


> I have hauled many loads of onions, and unless they sweated they didn't soak up anything, if they sweated they were always refused.
> 
> I can't even figure out how you hauled a hazardous load and a food load in the same trailer without a washout ticket...
> 
> On this one I'm with BFF and called bull excrement...



Really ?
Sounds like you were using clean trailers to haul your onions. 
So how would you Know if they cleaned up anything. 
Don't ggetme wrong I applaud using clean trailers on food. 
But to be honest in all my years of hauling food nobody ever asked me for a washout ticket. In fact I don't think anybody ever asked what the load was that was in the trailer before. 

The one exception would be when hauling for Pillsberry if there was any smell in the trailer they would throw a conniption. 
But sweeping the floor with coffee grounds would solve that. 

To explain the situation a little further I unloaded in nyisa Oregon then went get the trailer cleaned out and no one would touch it. 
I was sitting in the back row of the truck stop in Boise Idaho wwhen an onion broker came by and asked if I would be interested in going to Chicago. 
I explained that yes I sure would but I also explained what I had in the truck and tthatI couldn't load anything. 
He said not to worry we can take care of it at the onion co-op. 
I rather naÃ¯vely assumed that they had some sort of a washout bay or something there that they could use. 

He had me back into the bay and by the time I came back from loading doing paperwork and a trip to the bathroom they had the trailer half loaded. 
I ggrabbedbthe loading supervisor and told him what was going on ,his only response was to go get a paper air mask for himself and not for the workers loading the truck. 
I then asked him what kind of a mess all that would be when we got to Chicago and he replied it would take care of it. 
And whether you guys believe it or not it did.


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## arabian knight (Dec 19, 2005)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's another clue it probably never really happened.


Not only that, but How many YEARS ago did this happen, IF it did happen at all. Ya before laws were changed to protect such stuff from happening. I know I washed MANY a trailer before it was loaded to go out and distribute food stuffs to stores. MANY straight trucks as well. All had stainless steel fools and were Steam cleaned each and every day.~! Loads of them were cleaned. And so much produce is now palletized and wrapped up that even semi trailers are easy to wash before loading more food in it.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

Yes my trailer was always clean. I am a professional...lol
I have had shippers refuse to load the trailer because of a little dirt in the corners, forget 3 inches of powder across the floor.
All I ever had to have as far as hasmat to food was residue from the glue holding the placards on for them to require a wash ticket, didn't matter if the residue was 6 hours or 6 months old.

Heck the recievers were looking for any excuse to refuse the load so they could get it at a bargain, you had to make it perfect to hope to get paid.

So yeah I call bull on your claims.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

The incident happened in 1984. 

The only trailers I've ever seen washed out where reefers and tankers. 
I've swept out many a dry van but I've never seen one washed. 
And I will certainly agree about receivers looking for any excuse to get a discount. 
Pillsberry did not like the looks of my trailer and required me to paint the inside of it. 
After I did that of course they refused it due to the paint smell. 
I would've said before I painted it that I had one of the best looking trailer to come into that place. 
But it wasn't a reefer with aluminum or stainless steel floors.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

I've pulled Pillsbury out of Joplin often never wanted the interior to be painted...


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

I've pulled out of 1000 places that never even worried about the interior of the trailer but Springfield Illinois did. 
It really ticked me off too because I had a fiberglass trailer with the gelcoat interior it was one of the cleanest prettiest and trailers you would ever seen on the road at the time. 
It was my personal trailer and I took care of it.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> It was my personal trailer and *I took care of it*.


And yet you let people stack onions directly on top of a ton of poison.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> And yet you let people stack onions directly on top of a ton of poison.


In fairness a loads a load


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

coolrunnin said:


> In fairness a loads a load


Load. snicker, he said load. Yup, sounds like a load to me, too.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> And yet you let people stack onions directly on top of a ton of poison.



no more than you did. 
Re-read my it was done without my permission and while I was gone. 

And if I had had them remove the load from my trailer the onions would've still been covered with pesticide jdustso I did the best I could and told the USDA inspector of the situation.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

AmericanStand said:


> no more than you did.
> Re-read my it was done without my permission and while I was gone.
> 
> And if I had had them remove the load from my trailer the onions would've still been covered with pesticide jdustso I did the best I could and told the USDA inspector of the situation.


What? They stole your truck while you were in eating or whatever, loaded their onions and then brought the truck back and forced you to drive it to the recievers, yep I'll buy that scenario...


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> no more than you did.
> Re-read my it was done without my permission and while I was gone.
> 
> And if I had had them remove the load from my trailer the onions would've still been covered with pesticide jdustso *I did the best I could* and told the USDA inspector of the situation.


You knew the truck was full of "poison" when you unloaded.
It's YOUR responsibility, and yours alone.

"The best you could" would have been cleaning out the truck yourself, or refusing any loads until it was done.

Stop digging this hole.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

AmericanStand said:


> I explained that yes I sure would but I also explained what I had in the truck and tthatI couldn't load anything.
> He said not to worry we can take care of it at the onion co-op.
> I rather naÃ¯vely assumed that they had some sort of a washout bay or something there that they could use.
> 
> ...



Didn't ya see this part ?


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

AmericanStand said:


> Didn't ya see this part ?


Dude you put it in the loading dock, what did you think they were going to do, sweep the crap onto the dock?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Kinda. 
I guess I thought they would collect it somehow, perhaps a vacuum or washout type thing. 
It's been a LOOOONG time 
But I clearly remember. Being appaled at what they were doing and skeptical of their claim that it would be ok.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Didn't ya see this part ?


It's your truck, and your responsibility.

You say you *knowingly* delivered contaminated food, but you're trying to claim it's everyone's fault but yours.

Except I don't believe any of it really happened at all.
You have no credibility.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

BFF What would you have done that would have been better than I did ?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> BFF What would you have done that would have been better than I did ?


I still don't believe it really happened so it's all moot.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I still don't believe it really happened so it's all moot.



In other words you couldn't have done any better. Heck it's obvious you can't even think of a way to do it better. 
I I think I did pretty good for a young kid with huge bills and a family to feed.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

When you saw your trailer wasn't clean at the recievers back right back to the door go in and either make them sweep it out, or sweep onto their dock yourself...
But I'm with BFF this is a fairytale nothing more.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> In other words you couldn't have done any better. Heck it's obvious you can't even think of a way to do it better.
> I I think I did pretty good for a young kid with huge bills and a family to feed.


There's only one logical answer, which was to* clean it out*.
But that never seems to have crossed your mind.

Nothing you've said about the entire tale makes any real sense which is why I don't think any of it really happened.

You just made it up and think people will fall for it.
Would you want your family to eat those onions?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> There's only one logical answer, which was to* clean it out*.
> 
> But that never seems to have crossed your mind.
> 
> ?



Why speak such degrading nonsense ?
Obviously I tried to get it cleaned out or I wouldn't of known that nobody would take it. 
I suppose you think I should have just swept it out onto the truck stop parking lot or perhaps somewhere along a country road ?
I've asked what you would've done but obviously you have no idea. How would you have cleaned it out ?





Bearfootfarm said:


> Would you want your family to eat those onions?



Of course not that's why I made sure that nobody'Family had to eat them.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Why speak such degrading nonsense ?
> Obviously I tried to get it cleaned out or I wouldn't of known that nobody would take it.
> I suppose you think I should have just swept it out onto the truck stop parking lot or perhaps somewhere along a country road ?
> I've asked what you would've done but obviously you have no idea. How would you have cleaned it out ?
> ...


That's not what you said before.
You didn't stop them from loading and you still delivered them.

I've already answered all your questions, and told you what I think about the whole story.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> That's not what you said before.
> 
> You didn't stop them from loading and you still delivered them.
> 
> ...



You haven't answered anything. 
You need to read for comprehension , after doing the job I was paid to do I alerted the authorities that they were poisoned. 
I said that the first time and you still haven't explained how you would have done anything better.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

.............................................


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

The "news" report is based on fictional data. The amount of soil fumigation prior to planting strawberries is not an indication of the amount of actual pesticide on the finished product. If pesticides persisted in the environment like some want to believe, all weeds, harmful fungus, pest insects would be gone and the manufactures out of business.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> You haven't answered anything.
> *You need to read for comprehension* , after doing the job I was paid to do I alerted the authorities that they were poisoned.
> I said that the first time and you still haven't explained how you would have done anything better.


You need to take your own advice.

The trailer should have been cleaned out *where you delivered the load* of "poison" that was already leaking massive quantities, *if* your "3 inches" is to be believed. 

I already said that amount would require about a ton of material, so your bill of lading wouldn't have matched the weight of the product delivered. 

The facility where you delivered it would be able to handle it, and you could have reported it to the proper authorities* before* allowing anything else to be loaded. 

You knowingly delivered contaminated food and did nothing to *prevent* it.
You have no credibility.

None of what I just said hasn't already been said in prior posts, so if you are still confused, go back to the beginning and read it all again.


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## Waiting Falcon (Nov 25, 2010)

In Oregon the trucks are loaded with onions and sent elsewhere Texas or where ever to be bagged.
I have watched many loads of onions leave Ontario Oregon for elsewhere to be bagged


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

There's no point wrassling a pig in the mud.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> There's no point wrassling a pig in the mud.


There's no point in pretending what I said isn't true either.
You dug your own mudhole.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

Waiting Falcon said:


> In Oregon the trucks are loaded with onions and sent elsewhere Texas or where ever to be bagged.
> I have watched many loads of onions leave Ontario Oregon for elsewhere to be bagged


Interesting. Potatoes are also transported in trucks to be warehoused or bagged later. Carrots and cucumbers, also.

These are, of course, open topped semi trucks and no way would anything except vegetables go into them.

Pallets of bagged chemicals would go into semi-trailers with a roof and sides.

I don't see any way to load pallets of chemicals into a bulk vegetable hauling trailer.
I don't see any way to load bulk vegetables, carrots, cucumbers, sugar beets, string beans or onions, into a trailer with a roof.

Just different facts. One says 8,000 pounds of expensive chemicals was wasted on the floor (3 inches deep, 8 feet wide and 50 feet long). He continues to explain that he witnessed four rare events. 1.)The company buying the pesticides wasn't worried about the loss. 2.)The onion place wasn't concerned about laying onions into a bed of chemicals. 3.) The Food inspector wasn't concerned over this serious contamination issue. 4.) Onions absorbed massive amounts of toxic chemicals. 

Another person, who wasn't witness to this series of events, finds the story implausible. 

Pick a side or shake your head that the initial fake journalism resulted in several pages of comments about nothing.

The horse has expired, finished, passed on, ceased to be alive, dead, has gone to meet its maker, so the beatings may now cease.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Hold the boat HayPoint 
Where did you get the idea ther was 8000 pounds of chemicals ?i certainly never weighed it but that seems like a lot. 
I think you have somehow got two wrong impressions. 
First it's not uncommon to load bulk commodities in van trailers , but the onions in this load were in large net bags. I think they were 50# bags. 
Second the USDA inspector was concerned enough to condemn a entire load .


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Hold the boat HayPoint
> Where did you get the idea ther was 8000 pounds of chemicals ?i certainly never weighed it but that seems like a lot.
> I think you have somehow got two wrong impressions.
> First it's not uncommon to load bulk commodities in van trailers , but the onions in this load were in large net bags. I think they were 50# bags.
> Second the USDA inspector was concerned enough to condemn a entire load .


Just using the information you supplied. A 50 pound bag of insecticide is about 16 inches wide, 24 inches long and 3 inches thick. The 3 inch layer of pesticides covering the floor of your trailer, assuming you had a 50 foot trailer would equal 154 bags laid side by side. That's 7,700 pounds. Sorry, I rounded it up 300 pounds.

Now you say they were bagged but not on pallets. Who walked into your trailer 200 times, with a hand cart, carrying 3 fifty pound bags of onions?

Initially, you stated you reported it to a USDA inspector and he said, "no problem." Well to me that is a huge problem! I took it that even after this huge contamination had taken place, no one was going to do anything. Now, you indicate that " No problem." means the USDA inspector had condemned the load of onions?

If you were hauling 15 tons of chopped onions, shoveled in, I can envision that load absorbing water soluble chemicals. I can't see dry, onion skin intact, bagged onions absorbing much.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Hold the boat HayPoint
> Where did you get the idea ther was 8000 pounds of chemicals ?i certainly never weighed it but that seems like a lot.
> I think you have somehow got two wrong impressions.
> First it's not uncommon to load bulk commodities in van trailers , but the onions in this load were in large net bags. I think they were 50# bags.
> Second *the USDA inspector was concerned enough to condemn a entire load* .


That's not the version you gave the first time you told this fairy tale:



> By the time I got it over too Chicago the onions had sucked it all up. When unloaded it looked like the floor had been steam cleaned.
> After unloading and getting signed off I told the usda inspector about it
> 
> *He said no problem.*


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

HayPoint that no problem is what scared me. 
It was like it happened all the time and didn't really surprize him. 
That's why I posted this in the first place, to point out how casually contamination was accepted. 
But what if I hadn't pointed it out ?
Did that no problem mean his tests had already detected it or was it simply that common to reject a load ?
What I remember them really seeming to pay attention to was a mold in the onions. 
Perhaps that no problem meant they were already condemning the load for mold ?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

haypoint said:


> Just using the information you supplied. A 50 pound bag of insecticide is about 16 inches wide, 24 inches long and 3 inches thick. The 3 inch layer of pesticides covering the floor of your trailer, assuming you had a 50 foot trailer would equal 154 bags laid side by side. That's 7,700 pounds. Sorry, I rounded it up 300 pounds.
> 
> Now you say they were bagged but not on pallets. Who walked into your trailer 200 times, with a hand cart, carrying 3 fifty pound bags of onions?
> 
> .



That's not how I meant it 
I suspect there were a dozen or two piles Under the pallets that built up as high as the pallets would let them. Other places there was a layer 
As the fork lift unloaded those piles got spread out and dragged around with peaks and streaks about 3 inches tall. 
I'm sure some of the piles went out on the pallet boards. 
But looking into the trailer it looked like a huge mess, well it WAS a huge mess. 
45' trailer.....Huge for the time. 
I really don't know for sure your 8000 might be close but I feel like it was a lot closer to 500 maybe 1000. 

Who loaded 1000 bags ?
Local labor, seemed Hispanic to me. When I told the Dock Forman he got himself a paper mask but not any for the guys carrying the onions. 
When I told them they just shrugged , perhaps they didn't understand but even after I went and got masks and handed them out most refused. 
The fact that he had masks in his podium made me wonder how common it was. 
On the up side this was outside at a open air shed with a good breeze and I opened all the vents.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> HayPoint that no problem is what scared me.
> It was like it happened all the time and didn't really surprize him.
> That's why I posted this in the first place, to point out how casually contamination was accepted.
> But what if I hadn't pointed it out ?
> ...


So now you're saying you really don't know if the condemned the load or not.
As I've often said and you continue to verify, you have no credibility.
You just keep digging.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

AmericanStand said:


> That's not how I meant it
> I suspect there were a dozen or two piles Under the pallets that built up as high as the pallets would let them. Other places there was a layer
> As the fork lift unloaded those piles got spread out and dragged around with peaks and streaks about 3 inches tall.
> I'm sure some of the piles went out on the pallet boards.
> ...


Come on dude you can make up a better story than that in the time you've had...

What kind a trucker are you with that weak --- story?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

What like you've never had a Mexican crew load your truck ?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> So now you're saying you really don't know if the condemned the load or not.
> .



I never said that. 
Why do you keep lying ?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> *I never said that*.
> Why do you keep lying ?


You certainly did say that:



> *Did that* no problem mean his tests had already detected it or was it simply that common to reject a load *?*
> What I remember them really seeming to pay attention to was a mold in the onions.
> *Perhaps* that no problem meant they were already condemning the load for mold *?*


You wouldn't be asking those questions if you already knew.

You first claimed he just said, "No problem"
Then you claimed he "condemned the load" due to the "poison"
Then you claimed you don't really know why he condemned the load.

None of what you've said really makes much sense and it keeps changing.
You really should stop digging.
You're approaching China.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

AmericanStand said:


> What like you've never had a Mexican crew load your truck ?


What did you do with the load if it was condemned?

Many times have had Hispanics load and unload...lol


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

I didn't do anything with it. The Usda guy took charge of it.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

Bearfootfarm said:


> You certainly did say that:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Nothing has changed I've just tried to explain every tiny detail for you.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Nothing has changed I've just tried to explain every tiny detail for you.


And none of them sound realistic, just like your "I shot thousands of dogs".
Why not stop digging?


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

AmericanStand said:


> I didn't do anything with it. The Usda guy took charge of it.


Never had a condemned load unloaded, at that point it was mine to deal with.

Why don't you give up and just fess up this was a poorly fabricated story


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

coolrunnin said:


> Never had a condemned load unloaded, at that point it was mine to deal with.
> 
> Why don't you give up and just fess up this was a poorly fabricated story


He didn't bother to tell anyone anything until *after* it was all unloaded:



> By the time I got it over too Chicago the onions had sucked it all up. When unloaded it looked like the floor had been steam cleaned.
> 
> *After unloading and getting signed off I told the usda inspector about it*
> 
> He said no problem.


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## Clem (Apr 12, 2016)

I'm surprised that the spelling and punctuation police aren't up in arms about the wrong "too" being used.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

coolrunnin said:


> Why don't you give up and just fess up this was a poorly fabricated story



Simple because it may have been poorly told but it wasn't fabricated. 

It happened 30 some years ago and it wasn't something I thought about every day. 
So perhaps I didn't tell it in the best way. 
But of course the more we talk about it the more I remember. 

Remember the original point was simply that a USDA inspector was not the least surprised to find(or find out about ) contamination. 

Actually the fact there was a USDA inspector there tells me that contamination must not be Uncommon.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

Was this your truck and trailer or a company truck?


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

AmericanStand said:


> Simple because it may have been poorly told but it wasn't fabricated.
> 
> It happened 30 some years ago and it wasn't something I thought about every day.
> So perhaps I didn't tell it in the best way.
> ...


They inspect for mainly proper labeling, spoilage, mold and insect pests.
They don't test for poisons since that requires a laboratory and time.

He wouldn't have condemned the load based on what you told him without taking samples from the trailer too.


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

Bearfootfarm said:


> They inspect for mainly proper labeling, spoilage, mold and insect pests.
> They don't test for poisons since that requires a laboratory and time.
> 
> He wouldn't have condemned the load based on what you told him without taking samples from the trailer too.


Not necessarily true, produce can be and is rejected on a whim all the time.

Ask a trucker that goes to Hunts Island, NY.. I went there 4 times and all 4 loads where rejected and sold just down the dock, it's a game these produce houses play.


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