# I need advice, help, and experience



## Alice Kramden (Mar 26, 2008)

I like a guy. More than like, really. He is now without a female in his life again, they've just broken up. I've known him for 23 years. We used to work together. I want to see him, spend time with him, ride the motorcycle with him, all the things girls do with guys. ALL the things, if you know what I mean. 

He is so good looking, and has such an outstanding personality. We like the same things, our politics are the same, our likes and dislikes. Guns, Harleys, everything. 

I have written him several times, actual pen on paper letters. I've called him a few times, which I feel uncomfortable doing, as I think it is tacky for a girl to call a guy. But, he does not call me. He has called me one time, to thank me for sending him some DVDs. 

He is the one I got the bottle of Scotch for and took to him. We have not seen each other in 12 years, since I left work. He has put on some weight, and gone bald, which I think looks cute, I don't care how he looks, I am still crazy about him. 

I, on the other hand, have aged some, and with all the weight loss, my skin has loosened and I have some wrinkles and lines. I feel like I look awful, and he would find me repulsive. He is still so handsome, at 56, that he could get a younger, prettier girl than me. The only thing I have going for me is my figure, which is now very nice. I'm good from the neck down.

Here's what I need. How do I get his attention? I cannot go back to his house, that is unacceptable behavior. Like I said, calling him makes me think I am pestering him. Right now, all I can think of doing is to write him another letter, finding some subject to write about other than my passion and needing him. I can't do that, it is too creepy and stalker-ish.

Guys, help me here. What could a girl do to get you interested, especially one like me who is not a pretty one. If you've had a major break up with someone you'd been dating (his words) for 7 years, how long would you take to get over how rotten women are and be interested in another? He is twice divorced, and now this one left. She was not living with him. 

His kids are grown and out on their own. He has his own house, car, and Harley. He rides with a club, is into the motorcycle club thing big time, wears their colors, has the tattoos, the whole bit. 

He has a good job, makes good money, and is well known and respected. I have been madly in love with him (he didn't know, because we had to work together, so I kept it hidden) for 23 years. 

Now, I want to get with him so bad, it is killing me. 

Come on guys, what would you do if a girl got back in touch with you after all these years and started giving you the signal that its okay to be interested? 

Does a man really notice the lines in your face when you're older, or does he look at a trim, well kept body? 

I am just dying here. Give me some encouragement.


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## Huckleberrie (Sep 23, 2015)

"I, on the other hand, have aged some, and with all the weight loss, my skin has loosened and I have some wrinkles and lines. I feel like I look awful, and he would find me repulsive. He is still so handsome, at 56, that he could get a younger, prettier girl than me. The only thing I have going for me is my figure, which is now very nice. I'm good from the neck down."

Stop. Be yourself. Love yourself. Yes, he could get someone younger. Let him. She isn't you. If he doesn't want you, then he isn't worthy.


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## Lazerus (Apr 23, 2015)

Email, or write a letter. Not a phone call. Something that can be read again, once the "Huh?" moment is over. Lay out exactly what you said here. He'll probably read it a couple times, and give a well thought out reply. If not, he may not be all you think he is. There's nothing more attractive than honesty.


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

well yes Alice even though it's been awhile for some of us we do vaguely recall what you mean! first thing I'd wonder is why did 3 women leave him if he's got so much going for him? just sayin. and for god's sake don't show him how desperate you are for him Alice. that'll drive a man away quicker than anything. any woman can get a man regardless of her looks if she goes at it the right way. ease off for awhile. don't bother writing, calling anything. sometimes that draws them in. 

on the other hand you have to face that he might not be all that into you. even without seeing your looks and not all men are obsessed with looks. a lot of them see the inner person. and if all he cares about is looks he's not worth your love anyway. maybe he's skittish because of past failures with women. also, are you sure it's not the Harley and the lifestyle. you mentioned the Harley a couple times. I don't want to see you get hurt. hope you get him though. ~Georgia


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## Ellendra (Jul 31, 2013)

Can't make a man fall in love with you. It just can't be done.

Desperation usually indicates that there's another problem going on, and it has nothing to do with the object of your affliction. Time to spend some time soul-searching, find out what's really missing that you think this guy could provide. Because chances are, it isn't him.


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## gibbsgirl (May 1, 2013)

My two cents. Sounds like he already knows you're interested.

Honestly, I'd not say a thing, but just try and be happy and independent, glad to see him but not hanging on his every word, and just try and occassionally be at the same places or events doing your own thing. That gives him the opportunity to approach you if he's interested. If it's not easy to do, then just try and cross paths sometimes with the same folks he does, and that may let them think to bring you up.

Imo, guys like to find a way to get a girls attention and fit themselves into her world, not the other way around. If it's obvious you're saving yourself for for him, that can lead guys to avoid you til they decide there's nothing else better, then use you as their fall back plan.

I had a few boyfriends growing up that were reasonably serious. When, I split with my ex after five years, I decided I was destined to be an old maid. Ended up doing my own thing and dated several guys.

Met hubby, but had four other guys I'd been dating off and on, wouldn't be exclusive cause they didn't give me any indication they had serious intentions with me. Met hubby, he wouldn't leave me anytime for anyone else, he ran them all off and married me in less than 2 months. 

That was over 15 years ago.

Don't know if that helps, but hope it does. Best wishes finding your contentment and happiness.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

You've already contacted him. He hasn't responded. Unless he's the dumbest man going he knew you were interested. Whatever the deal is, it's him not you. You can't be anyone except yourself. Until someone likes you for being you and wants an LTR, it won't work. 

It's time to move on. Sorry.


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

Club guys love their club first and their "ole lady" second


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

1. Is he on a dating website? If he is, send him a message......

2. If you guys are friends, reach out to him for lunch just to see how he's doing.

3. You sound like a beautiful woman......be you. Inner beauty trumps outward beauty every time to a man who has depth and substance. Sounds like this guy does.


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## homebody (Jan 24, 2005)

I distinctly remember someone in my past that I assigned qualities to that he never possessed. Even when I saw twice with my own eyes that he was looking around for someone else, I refused to accept/believe it. Devastated me when we went our separate ways, now hindsight is 20/20. He was/is an alcoholic who I KNOW I could never have lived with, was NOT a one woman man and was raised much differently than I was. 

I am so glad that we parted company and since I always burn my bridges behind me, I have had NO regrets for 21+ years. We are our worst enemies sometimes.


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## Alice Kramden (Mar 26, 2008)

Lazerus - I don't know his email. I have written him several letters over the past months, which I know he did keep. 

newfieannie - Yeah, I try not to show that I am desperate. I am. Horribly lonely. We used to have the best conversations when we worked together. No, not the Harley and the biker lifestyle. I would be glad if he sold the thing and never rode again, I don't like the club stuff, the women that hang around, none of it. I used to like motorcycles, but I got away from that 30 years ago. The only thing about his having the Harley is that I would like to ride to the mountains with him. He goes all the time. I would be perfectly happy to sit behind him and look at the scenery. I like a Harley's sound, and to take pictures of them. 

Ellendra - Yeah, I know. How well I know. 

gibbsgirl - I've never had a date, nor a relationship. As a teenager I was ugly, I have pictures to prove it. No boys were ever interested. Same as a grownup. I look very homely, and guys just do not see anything they want to take out or have around. I seem to give off a look of being so dumb that they figure I'm only good for one thing. They don't realize behind this dumb look is a brain and intelligence, far beyond theirs.
He knows how intelligent I am, he's told me so. I was so happy when we talked about things, as he is as smart as I am and we could have a deep and involved conversation about anything. I miss that. 

He lives in a different city, I have no idea where he goes, who his friends are, or what he does. All I do know is where his house is and right now he is staying at home with his little dog. She gave up the dog, he loved the dog more than she did. 

Darren and oneraddad - noted and filed away--understand what you are saying.

Laura - No he does not do social media. Neither do I. 


When I went up to take him the whisky, everything I had wanted to say and do went right out of my head. I could do nothing but stand there and shake, trying to hide it from him. I was like a high school girl seeing Elvis or something. I couldn't make a coherent sentence for a little bit. There's no telling what he thought. I could kick myself. One chance and I screw it up. He's probably laughing his head off at me, she thinks I would want her? 

Yall probably think I'm nuts, too. I may be.


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## Darren (May 10, 2002)

Alice, you're not nuts. You're normal. It took a lot for you to post your feelings and ask for advice. What you're getting is a lot of second opinions. I suspect you already knew the answer. You can't judge yourself by other's responses. 

Don't ever put yourself down.


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Alice, you mention you used to have such great conversations with this man so why not try and look at the situation from a different angle and work on culturing that old friendship before you worry about taking things to another level. 

You do mention that you'd be happier if he sold his bike and changed his lifestyle and I would caution you that people who are comfortable in their life and not always receptive to the idea of change and if there is that much of his life that you aren't fond of, you may come to resent how it permeates his everyday life. 

You seem negatively focused on your outer appearance and I think you may be missing a very important point regardless of gender. Inner beauty is far more relevant than hairstyles, jawlines and the effects of time and gravity and you need to start putting a higher value on yourself by standing up straight, shoulders back, look the world in the eye and remember that you're an awesome person and anybody who thinks otherwise can get stuffed.


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

What Darren said, Alice, is exactly what I thought. The lady's got guts putting it out there like that. 

And, no! You're not nuts for feeling the way you do. By revealing the internal dialogue and struggle that many of us also experience, you're simply human. 

I don't have advice for you. Frankly, I'd be skeptical about putting much stock in my own advice. I hope that sending you encouragement to add to your obvious strengths, will help to see you through this emotional time.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

Tell him you think you can take him, and ask him if he wants to rassle on the grass. If he says no, punch him in the stomach and ask him if he's sure.


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## arnie (Apr 26, 2012)

Most guys are kinda dence when you just hint ; come straight out n tell him you want to be his girl . were not teenagers any more if its not to be ,so be it ,and you can move on .


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## Sumatra (Dec 5, 2013)

I agree with arnie. Men are denser than most females think. Unless you're close and somewhat attuned to each other, hints do not work. Even if he got the signal and were interested, right now he could still be wondering if he's just imagining those things. It's alright to try and get him to fall for you if you lived nearby and had the ability to communicate frequently enough. But that's not yet the case here. Since he already knows you decently enough to understand your good qualities, it's much simpler than starting from scratch.

You already know this, but there is no way of going about this that will guarantee he'll like you.

I can't give you a good answer to the questions at the end of your post, because it all depends on the guy, his personality, and how he's feeling at the time. If he's shallow enough to worry so much about your looks, then he's not worth it. After 2 divorces, either the guy knows what's important, or he will never learn.

Loving someone and not being able to tell them is one of the most painful extended experiences. I can't imagine how much of it you've gone through for 23 years. But no matter what the response is, if you tell him, you'll get closure on the matter. Fear holding you back is something that applies to all aspects of life. 

That includes this one. Don't let it go on anymore. Telling him might be difficult. Anticipating a response might be the longest few seconds too. Worst case the pain might be hard, but it'll be short, and a little later you WILL be glad you did it. Relieving a load carried for so long like that really helps you in the long run. ...If it goes the other way though, you'll be glad beyond belief you said something.


No, nobody here thinks you're nuts. If anything, you came to the right place for this.


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## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

Wouldn't it be odd....if he's sitting there alone, thinking of you, and that he's just too dumb for a bright person like you? Maybe thinking about when he saw you, he became tongue-tied, forgot everything he wanted to say to you?

How about you find something you both might be interested in, call and tell him that you'd like to go but don't want to go alone...maybe he could meet you there? Something to eat after?

Take it easy and just enjoy.

Mon


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## Raeven (Oct 11, 2011)

I've got a little different take on your situation, Alice. A few observations. These things are not universally true, but they are generally true, in my experience.

First, look around you at all the couples in the world. How many of them are made up of earth-shatteringly beautiful people? We both know the answer. Not very many, except in Hollywood. So obviously, attraction is often based on something more than looks. Men are actually pretty forgiving in this regard -- *if they are attracted to you for some other reason*.

The thing men usually say they are attracted to is self confidence. That has certainly been my experience. These days, I don't have much more than that to offer -- and male attention is still occasionally turned my way.

It doesn't work much different now than it did when I was youthful. *If they're interested, they'll find a way to make it happen*. *YOUR* job is to create a few opportunities to see what he'll do with it. And here's the main thing: *You started out as friends, why not continue being a friend*?

Call him. Invite him to do something. Coffee is always nice. He's just a guy, and he's your friend. Be a friend to him. Give him a chance to see and remember that intelligence in you about which he was always so admiring. He can't enjoy the qualities that might attract him to you if you don't give him access to do it. 

If coffee goes well, you find yourselves having a nice, long fun conversation like the Good Old Days, go from there. Invite him for a home-cooked meal. Don't lay your big crush on him. I'm pretty sure he already knows. Give him space and time, and most importantly, opportunities to spend time with you in a comfortable, safe, pleasant environment as he gets over the previous situation and decides when he wants to dip a toe back in the pool. In other words, let him get to know *you* again.

*If he wants them to*, things will progress as you wish. I promise, they will.

Whatever happens, respect and love yourself first. Don't become a doormat just because your feelings for him are strong. Be at least as discerning about whether or not he will truly meet your needs as he will be of you meeting his. Your feelings and needs count just as much as his!

I wish you success and every happiness. Go, Tiger!

Oh, and just as an aside? Any man who is only interested in your "pups" doesn't warrant you giving him the time of day.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

Let the record indicate that I have no advise to contribute in this matter.


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

But......BUT.....what if he is "ONLY" interested in the time of day, and not your "pups"....??? :kiss:



Raeven said:


> Any man who is only interested in your "pups" doesn't warrant you giving him the time of day.


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## Raeven (Oct 11, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> But......BUT.....what if he is "ONLY" interested in the time of day, and not your "pups"....??? :kiss:


Oh, AS IF!!!


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## Sourdough (Dec 28, 2011)

Maybe he discovered that he is Gay.......at some point in the last 12 years.......



Raeven said:


> Oh, AS IF!!!


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## Raeven (Oct 11, 2011)

Sourdough said:


> Maybe he discovered that he is Gay.......at some point in the last 12 years.......


Oh, staaahhhhppp. Don't muss this nice lady's thread. <swat!>


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## Shrek (May 1, 2002)

Alice Kramden said:


> I like a guy. More than like, really. He is now without a female in his life again, they've just broken up. I've known him for 23 years. We used to work together. I want to see him, spend time with him, ride the motorcycle with him, all the things girls do with guys. ALL the things, if you know what I mean.
> 
> He is so good looking, and has such an outstanding personality. We like the same things, our politics are the same, our likes and dislikes. Guns, Harleys, everything.
> 
> ...


 In 1982 I was broken up with my steady of five years when her mother decided she didn't like that I had her daughter's name tattooed on me and chose to send her out of state to go to college.

My parents didn't like the idea of me taking my high school steady along as I started my career and took their own steps to dissuade me from looking for her from my side of our relationship.

For 26 years through dating relationships , marriage and my return to the single side of life every time I rolled up my sleeves to wash my hands and saw the salt and gauze debride lightened deep inked meat tag of her name and birthdate on my forearm, I always thought about her.

After we reconnected she showed me a picture one of our friends gave her of me taken at a birthday party in 1999 or 2k while I was in my second marriage and she was in her third.

She told me that through all three of her marriages she sometimes looked through the box of stuff she had of our time and wondered what I was doing and how life was treating me and after she got the most recent picture of me she hoped that somehow both of us would cross paths and both be single again.

Maybe my forearm meat tag and her box of memories of days gone by helped end whatever relationships we were in, but they also helped both of us to keep an old flame from going completely cold.

She and I have visual aspects that helped us keep the flames flickering , but all it takes is a memory and for me she looks totally different than she did in 82, except for her eyes and when I look in them , its all good.

And I know for sure that I look nothing like I did in 82 but since she still calls me to come over at least three or four times a week around our Monday through Friday breakfast meets before she goes to work .

Your alone now. If he is alone also, what have you got to lose asking him.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

I disagree that men are dense.

I think a vast majority of men are keenly aware of affections show towards them, and they ENJOY that ego stroke, and 'play dumb' because they enjoy the feeling they get when their ego's are stroked........

Personally, I would just let him know.

Hey Joe, can we do lunch?
Sit down, and just put it out there:
Hey Joe, I'm not trying to make this weird or put you in a tough spot, but I have had a crush on you for a long dang time. What do you think about that?

Then go from there.
If your heart and (more importantly) your gut gets the "he's not into me" vibe, go with it. 
Shake his hand tell him if he changes his mind, he knows how to get a hold of you. 
The End.

www.meetup.com is a great site to find others in your area, with similiar interests.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Laura, your both right AND wong. If its not blatent enough, then a guy will never know. He may wonder if, but if so, hes NOT going to try to find out and make a fool out of himself on an wrong assumption.
If it IS plenty blatent, THEn he has to decide what he wants to do. Generally that decision will be based on looks as he knows generally absolutely nothing about this woman.

As to your last, Yes, he knows how to get ahold of you. IF YOU LET HIM lol


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

Just ask for a ride on his bike, the rest will fall into place.


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## Alice Kramden (Mar 26, 2008)

Ah, replies and comments while I slept. Good. Thanks, yall.

raeven, sourdough, I wish. You'd be surprised at how men have been conditioned and trained to be afraid to give you any compliments or comments on how you look. I appreciate and love for them to call me "sweetheart" or "hon" - the guy in Publix helping me pick out steaks called me "sweetheart" one time, and I could have just hugged his neck it made my day. 

Where he and I worked is real strict on avoiding any form of perceived sexual harassment, so no one says anything to the women about how they look. I guess the lesson has been well learned, 'cause I wore my skinny jeans, and I know he had to see a well toned body, but didn't say anything. 

Laura - Yes, I've seen him liking to get his ego stroked, suits me just fine. I like to stroke it. His ego, I mean, uh. I get a kick out of doing stuff like that. That's what women are supposed to do for a man, build him up and make him feel good. 

Bill - Only, he DOES know me, we worked together for 10 years. I've written him interesting letters about music, work, things I like--motorcycles, airplanes, guns, and he referred back to them when he did call me. I did not put any "mush" or passionate pleas in what I wrote, just straight forward correspondence. The closest I came to anything personal was complimenting him on how fine he looked in the picture in the company newspaper, and that I wanted to see if I could whoop his butt. 

oneraddad -- Have asked many times. I guess he doesn't want me on the back of the motorcycle for whatever reason. He knows I like motorcycles, and had one at one time, and that I used to be into that. 

You know, while I was walking this morning, the idea occurred to me, what if he thinks I am not ...uh, how to put this...what if he has the impression I am a "L", I can't even write the word. I have always been a tomboy, worn my hair short, and wore jeans, no makeup. I am not very feminine or girly-girl. At work, we all cussed and swore like sailors, I was doing a man's job, with the men, shoulder to shoulder. I've never been married, and they all knew that. That alone makes you an object of suspicion as to your orientation. 

But, if I were one of those, I would imagine he would be wondering what I want with him. Hm. Fodder for thought, there. 

I must have hidden my feelings too well back then, if he does not have a clue about how strongly I am attracted to him. Guess I should have gone ahead back then and barnstormed his happy self and let the chips fall where they may. We were both young and crazy then, and we both might have gotten fired. I couldn't do that to him, so I just worshiped him from afar. 

Ah, jeez, the complications of life, love, and the opposite sex.


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

If you asked to ride on his Harley and he didn't offer, he's just not into you.


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## newfieannie (Dec 24, 2006)

oh what the heck Alice. you can't go on like this. life is too short as it is. you've loved this man for over 20 years. you can't afford to waste another 20. believe me I know what it's like to love a man like that. looks didn't come into. I had to practically drag a bag over his head to take him out. I'm with Arnie. tell him!. if you can't talk to him face to face then write it all down what you've told us. and send it to him. he can only say no and it's better to know how he feels or if he feels anything . either way it will be over with and you can go on with your life. it's a wonder you haven't had a heart attack before this. I might have one myself if you don't get this straightened out! ~Georgia


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## emdeengee (Apr 20, 2010)

I agree with the sound advice from Newfieannie. Be direct and get it over with. Better to know one way or the other. But be prepared. I do not wish to be harsh but I think that you are deluding yourself. One sign that a man - or woman - is not interested in you is that the relationship does not progress. You have known this man for many years and he is available right now and yet he has not made any effort to be with you. One sign that a man - or woman - is interested in you is that he/she is always around you. Wishing you peace and happiness.


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## Fennick (Apr 16, 2013)

> Have asked many times. I guess *he doesn't want me on the back of the motorcycle for whatever reason.* He knows I like motorcycles, and had one at one time, and that I used to be into that.


If none of his other behaviour tells you anything that rejection right there should tell you that he's not into you. For whatever reason. 

You've already given him plenty of opportunities and he's made no effort to follow through on all the openings you've given him.

Don't let 23 years of unrequited love turn into an obsession that ruins your life. I think you need to face up to the fact that he doesn't want you. Let go of what you think could be, should be, might be, let go of him permanently and get on with your life. You deserve better.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

IF you have the fine body you keep referring to, Then your minusing its effect with short hair. Id say MOST men like a gal with long hair. 
ALSO< IF you would put on some pics, we might see something your not.


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## RichNC (Aug 22, 2014)

FarmboyBill said:


> IF you have the fine body you keep referring to, Then your minusing its effect with short hair. Id say MOST men like a gal with long hair.
> ALSO< IF you would put on some pics, we might see something your not.


I do not agree with you on the long hair thing, my beautiful wife never had long hair, but I loved her all the same.


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

I have to agree with RichNC. Having short hair definitely doesn't automatically detract from a woman's beauty. Long hair may be your preference, Bill, but that doesn't mean _"MOST men like a gal with long hair"_.


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

FarmboyBill said:


> IF you have the fine body you keep referring to, Then your minusing its effect with short hair. Id say MOST men like a gal with long hair.
> ALSO< IF you would put on some pics, we might see something your not.



My first response was, women have hair.

As long as it is clean and neat length doesn't really matter to me.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

A gal should never underestimate the power of a confident belly punch in their arsenal of weapons to defeat a man's reluctance to move in the woman's desired romantic direction. That, and pie.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

What kind of pie?

Crust w/ butter or lard?

Lattice or not?


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

There is only two kinds of pie, hot pie or cold pie.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Sweet pie?
Savory pie?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

You are overthinking this guys are very simple creatures. 
Give him a call. Say the following words. I am interested in dating you if you are interested too we need to arrange a date if not I need to move on. 

Give him 15 seconds or so to arrange a date do not take any kind of other answer other than a date as an answer of he's interested 
anything other than a date means he is not interested.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> What kind of pie?
> 
> Crust w/ butter or lard?
> 
> Lattice or not?



One of each should be just fine.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

AmericanStand said:


> You are overthinking this guys are very simple creatures.
> Give him a call. Say the following words. I am interested in dating you if you are interested too we need to arrange a date if not I need to move on.
> 
> Give him 15 seconds or so to arrange a date do not take any kind of other answer other than a date as an answer of he's interested
> anything other than a date means he is not interested.



You should see the problems with that. You haven't even gotten a date yet, and you're already giving ultimatums, for one.


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## Alice Kramden (Mar 26, 2008)

Going to fight the urge to call him. Just let it be for a little while. 

You all do realize its been 12 years since I last saw him, I lost contact with him after I left work, could not find him with an online search as I didn't know where he lived or what his phone # was. 

I found his address back in March and wrote him then. Searching for someone has improved drastically over the years. You can find people now.

Then, the first I'd seen him in 12 years was the other day. Its not like we'd been in contact with each other all these years.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

Alice, I just contacted a guy I grew up with (dated at 16, briefly) about a year ago, via written letter. He's on ZERO social media; so I sent the letter to his parents house!!

We emailed, chatted on the phone a couple times.....

He's gonna come visit me next week.
He's in Fla on business, and I said "why don'tcah come down and sit a spell".
Haven't seen him in 30 years.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

After my divorce from my first wife I really wondered if I'd ever trust anyone to get close again. I won't get into the details but, afterwards, I was a hollow man. I dated a couple of times but had no feelings. I was young, in my prime early 30s, had a couple of flings, but no feelings. 
After 5 years I moved from rural SC to Boston, MA to just get in the middle of things and to, hopefully, prevent my murdering someone. 
I met my second wife a month or so after landing in down town Boston. I was still hollow, and very wary but, I held a door open for her the first time I ever saw her and distinctly remember saying to myself, "why can't I find a girl like that?". 

She worked across the street from me, and we became friends. She introduced me to her fiancÃ©, and I thought, "dam, why can't I find a gal like that?". We talked almost daily and I shared a lot of my story with her. Her and her coworkers would sometimes stop in the neighborhood pub afternoons after work. One December, several years later, I met them in there and sat with them, laughing and telling stories. She got up to leave and I said my goodbyes, and went to kiss her on the cheek. She turned her head, and my kiss landed on the corner of her lips. :O 

I beat myself up over that. How could I have not seen the signs??? I swore, if I ever had another chance, I'd kiss her smack on the lips. 

Weeks later, it was Christmas Eve, she and her friends were in the bar after work. I came in and sat with them and, we played pinball and joked, talked and laughed. At one point her friends got up and went to the bar for more drinks. I was sitting across from her and we were talking. I said something funny and she grabbed my knee under the table and laughed. At that point I leaned across the table and kissed her on the lips. Kaboom! It was fireworks all the way. We kissed for days!!!m

Wouldn't it have been much simpler if she'd have just punched me in the stomach??? 

ETA
Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I'm kind of joking, but I'm not. All that talking and strategizing some are suggesting is just too much. To quote Josey Wales, "are you gonna pull them pistols, or whistle Dixie?". 

There is way of skipping all that talk and just getting down to it, whether that mean biking, picnicking or diving for pearls, that all the talk in the world can only lessen. 
I'm not advocating violence, but touching, less the talk. 
All of the suggested verbal exchanges would send me off. I'm sure there are some that would be good, but yall haven't come up with one that comes close. 

Do something with your hands.


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

> Wouldn't it have been much simpler if she'd have just punched me in the stomach???


Yes. I like that plan. Somehow I think the general population of men would slap an assault charge on me if I did it! HAHAHAHHAHAH



> ETA
> Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I'm kind of joking, but I'm not. All that talking and strategizing some are suggesting is just too much. To quote Josey Wales, "are you gonna pull them pistols, or whistle Dixie?".
> 
> There is way of skipping all that talk and just getting down to it, whether that mean biking, picnicking or diving for pearls, that all the talk in the world can only lessen.
> ...


I am a very 'touchy' person. 
I didn't realize I was until recently.....but I have to really 'concentrate' to keep my hands to myself.

I get 'read wrong'......guys think I am 'all fired up and ready to go' because I 'touch' them.
I get read wrong by women too.....

I created a 'profile' on POF so I could just look around.
It CLEARLY says "I do not kiss on the first date, probably not on the second either" just to give the hound dogs the heads up: I am not looking to 'hook up', so move along if that's all that's on your mind.......
It's shocking how many men send 'very sexually suggestive' messages......
Oy.

There should be a safe place to go to meet people.


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## RideBarefoot (Jun 29, 2008)

Laura Zone 10 said:


> I created a 'profile' on POF so I could just look around.
> It CLEARLY says "I do not kiss on the first date, probably not on the second either" just to give the hound dogs the heads up: I am not looking to 'hook up', so move along if that's all that's on your mind.......
> It's shocking how many men send 'very sexually suggestive' messages......
> .


From my experience on POF, writing you're not looking for a hook-up is waving a red flag to a bull. The serious players take that as a challenge. Maybe it's the area I'm in, but I really do think their thought process is "hmm, doesn't sleep around, less chance of STD's, but she won't be able to resist my incredible manliness..." 

Barf.

ETA: It just dawned on me, I should have been responding to the sleazies with "I don't believe in pre-marital sex", and watch it from there...


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## Laura Zone 5 (Jan 13, 2010)

RideBarefoot said:


> From my experience on POF, writing you're not looking for a hook-up is waving a red flag to a bull. The serious players take that as a challenge. Maybe it's the area I'm in, but I really do think their thought process is "*hmm, doesn't sleep around, less chance of STD's, but she won't be able to resist my incredible manliness..."
> *
> Barf.


That's screwed up.
Funny, it's those types that call me the b word, cause I don't mince words with idiots like this.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

vicker said:


> You should see the problems with that. You haven't even gotten a date yet, and you're already giving ultimatums, for one.



Or you could hold the door open for him and wait a few years. 

Vicker if while you were standing there holding that door she had turned around and said you just did meet a girl like that now ask me out before the elevator gets here think how many year more happyness you would have gained.


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## tambo (Mar 28, 2003)

Alice Kramden said:


> Going to fight the urge to call him. Just let it be for a little while.
> 
> You all do realize its been 12 years since I last saw him, I lost contact with him after I left work, could not find him with an online search as I didn't know where he lived or what his phone # was.
> 
> ...


When I read this, my first thought was that sounds like a good reason/opportunity to get together to catch up just as friends.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

I agree with you about long or short hair. THATS WHY I said M O S T. That was/is MY assumption. IF there is 100 men in a survey, I assume that 75 guys would rather like a gal with long hair, and 25 wouldn't. That leaves, likely another 25 guys out of my 75 who couldn't care less.


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

I like the runway look


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

_"IF there is 100 men in a survey, I assume that 75 guys would rather like a gal with long hair, and 25 wouldn't. That leaves, likely another 25 guys out of my 75 who couldn't care less."_

So, to put it another way, Bill, out of 100, 25 prefer short hair. That 25, plus the 25 that couldn't care less, make 50 out of 100. That's 50%. Meaning, the remaining 50% prefer long hair. 

Does that mean that, by your reckoning, 50% equals most? Got me kinda confused there, bub. 'Course, math is hard for some folks. I've even heard that 5/4ths of the people surveyed can't figure fractions.


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## homebody (Jan 24, 2005)

tambo said:


> When I read this, my first thought was that sounds like a good reason/opportunity to get together to catch up just as friends.


So, did he hug you or seem glad to see you? Make any indication that he wanted to "catch up"? If he couldn't give ME a ride on the motorcycle for whatever reason, that would have told me volumes. ALL my thoughts /attention would NOT be on him, for sure. I once had to "see/talk" to a mental therapist for approx. 3 months before I could give up hope on someone. Not ashamed to admit, I saw what I thought I needed in him. It was NEVER there.


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## Alice Kramden (Mar 26, 2008)

You guys talking about "pie" be careful, it has a different meaning over on arfcom.:whistlin:

Bill, yeah, I want my hair back long and curled like years ago, only it doesn't grow back over night. I'm already past the date to have it cut again, so it is going to look worse before it looks better. I have a friend who does hair at her salon, and we are going to get together one day for a make over, just to see what can be done. My hair is still red, with a few silver ones here and there. Not bad at all.

Vicker - I am physical, too, but was so overwhelmed I couldn't think. I did run my hand down his arms looking at his tattoos, and oh, lordy, what smooth, fine skin he has, wooooo. 

oneraddad - naughty, naughty, :nono:

homebody - several hugs. Rides on the motorcycle, well, years ago he was married, and couldn't, then, up until now he had someone, and couldn't. We'll see what happens now, even though it is getting colder weather for riding. 

Bear in mind, yall, I come up to his house unexpected and unannounced, the last thing in the world he would have expected. It is about to rain, nearly dark, and he is relaxed with his dog, cat, and eating supper. He has had a major break up with some girl, and I betcha anything she started pushing him to get married, after going together for 7 years. He is not going to do that, after losing everything in the last divorce. He was not even letting her live in his house. He has put on weight, gone bald, and some other stuff going on in his life that he's told me about, worries, problems, and such. I come bebopping in, wishing him a happy birthday, which he wants to forget about. You know he has to be a bit confused and wondering "What?" Then, I get so intimidated by standing there with him that I can't think of anything I wanted to say or do. 

He was very interested in the things I'd gotten him along with the scotch, and I hope each time he looks at them he thinks about me. 

I am several years older than him. I don't know if he knows how much older or if he has reservations about it. I can be searched for online and my info is there, if he wants to look. I don't look my age. I don't feel my age. I feel good, told him I feel good, while doing a little footwork and moving around. 

He is an extrovert, always "up," always positive, he urges me to go and do things I want to do, his kids are doing well in very good jobs because they have a dad that encourages them to go get'em. He has a strong work ethic, and is moving up in his job.

He is just one heck of a guy, I think. Maybe he is just being cautious, and can't figure out the what and why about me after all this time. 

Why did I recontact him after all those years? It wasn't for lack of trying, running a search years ago was not as easy as it is now. It wasn't until I had a dream about him, a dream of him being in trouble, of fear for him, that I went back to the computer to try one more time. When I did, there he was, address, phone number, everything. 

In that dream, I was told emphatically to find him and communicate with him. I had that dream two nights in a row. It was a dream full of dread and foreboding, that something bad was going to happen to him if I didn't get in touch with him. 

Sounds crazy, but that's what happened. I haven't even asked him if anything happened to him, or almost happen, or even about the dream. 

I think sometime later I will write to him again, and tell him about the dream and explain some things.


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## FarmboyBill (Aug 19, 2005)

Billy, With my 50% for sure, theres some in that 25 who will like long hair if it is on the POI. So I still stand by my thoughts that more men than not like women with long hair.


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## homebody (Jan 24, 2005)

Been thinking about all this, enough years have been wasted and gone forever, I'd strike now while the iron is hot, lay it out plain and simple to him and get my answer, not a maybe. Otherwise you will find yourself an old woman, still living a dream and NOT having taken a chance. Maybe he is dense but I doubt it, don't you think you deserve an honest answer?


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

AmericanStand said:


> Or you could hold the door open for him and wait a few years.
> 
> Vicker if while you were standing there holding that door she had turned around and said you just did meet a girl like that now ask me out before the elevator gets here think how many year more happyness you would have gained.



You're working under the assumption that I could form a sentence before the sun goes down. You know what they say about assumptions.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

My idea of how to let the little redhead gal in second grade know I liked her was to wrap a note around a rock and throw it at her. It was lost in translation. I'm not much better now.


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

Pffttt! I been reading your posts long enough to know that's a crock, vicker. You seem to have it together pretty ---- good, from where I stand.


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## moonwolf (Sep 20, 2004)

Alice Kramden said:


> I like a guy. More than like, really. He is now without a female in his life again, they've just broken up. I've known him for 23 years. We used to work together. I want to see him, spend time with him, ride the motorcycle with him, all the things girls do with guys. ALL the things, if you know what I mean.
> 
> He is so good looking, and has such an outstanding personality. We like the same things, our politics are the same, our likes and dislikes. Guns, Harleys, everything.
> 
> ...


I don't have good advice for you about this, sorry. But I'll give
a story about the past about romantic attachments....
I worked with a gal was head over heels about...she knew of my
'Attentions' and 'intentions' obviously, but remained indifferent
towards me. We hung out sometimes, went out for dinners, took long
car rides in the country, but never hit it off that seriously. She was 
a city girl moving back to the biggest city around...I lost interest,
but had 'feelings'....just not meant to be, but 'might have been' if
you follow.....next thing ya know I met someone who I eventually
proposed to.....wouldn't ya know, two weeks before the planned 
Wedding the 'flame ' phones to 'congratulate' me....I almost fainted
hearing from her and just didn't know WHAT to say, except 
thanks for the call....
Irony of it is I married....years later split up....and she married.
I never bothered to want to know more about any of her life.
It's all just fate in the mysteries of human attachments.


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## sustainabilly (Jun 20, 2012)

moonwolf said:


> I don't have good advice for you about this, sorry. But I'll give
> a story about the past about romantic attachments....
> I worked with a gal was head over heels about...she knew of my
> 'Attentions' and 'intentions' obviously, but remained indifferent
> ...


Yup. Timing is _everything_. Plus, most of us have learned you just can_ not _force, or finagle, the results you want. Even if you did succeed, it would probably come back and bite you in the butt, in some fashion. People always pooh-hoo overused catchphrases like chemistry, but it really does come down to that, IMO. 

Back in the dark ages of 'the day', you'd hear of people marrying for duty, etc. (Heck, part of the reason I stuck it out for almost 30 years was because of the kids. So, I can relate to that concept.) You even heard about some of those marriages that lasted for 40, 50 years and more. But, you seldom heard about if they were happy marriages or suffering in silence... on either side of it.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

I'm ok on the Internet, I write better than I talk. In real life I am like this. 
(I've noticed these YouTube links I post from my phone don't load right. If someone could add a better link, I'd be grateful.)
http://youtu.be/_PZimPUMbH0

It appears that this one works.


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

vicker said:


> You're working under the assumption that I could form a sentence before the sun goes down. You know what they say about assumptions.



Uba , uba, uba means yes ?


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## AmericanStand (Jul 29, 2014)

What show is the clip from ?


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## Bret (Oct 3, 2003)

Sourdough said:


> Let the record indicate that I have no advise to contribute in this matter.


Prosecution rests.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

AmericanStand said:


> What show is the clip from ?



The Gods Must Be Crazy. My all time favorite film. I think it's available in youtube. You have to see it.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

If you've not watched this movie, your life is incomplete. 
http://youtu.be/47ksi1IyPuA


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

This is s very pour copy of that film LOL! But, it only makes it better. The Gods Must Be Crazy is about the lowest budget low budget film ever made. That's a large part of its charm.


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## Terri (May 10, 2002)

vicker said:


> This is s very pour copy of that film LOL! But, it only makes it better. The Gods Must Be Crazy is about the lowest budget low budget film ever made. That's a large part of its charm.


The OTHER part of its charm is that the actors were the local people and a lot of them thought the film crew were crazy! They saw no point in what they were doing and what the film crew wanted them to do. Still, they did what they were told to do, and many of them were paid in store credit as they did not want money. Being able to pick out food and new knives and such in exchange for them acting and for having their kids hopping around in a circle? They did not see the point but they thought it a fair trade.

The lead actor was paid $2000 for the film, but it made so much money that they went back and gave him more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Gods_Must_Be_Crazy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nǃxau_ǂToma

Or so I have heard! 

It really was o of the funniest films that I have seen.


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## vicker (Jul 11, 2003)

At one time I had a DVD and in the extras they had more on the relationship with the film people and the real people. They really do laugh heartily. It's a wonderful movie. I just love it.


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