# Did butcher steal my bacon???



## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Hi all,

This is my first post here and I require some of your more experienced knowledge and opinions from you folks..

My wife and I raised some pigs this past summer.. our first experiment into this field and we started with three pigs.. one for us, the other two go to friends. 

The breeds were some variation of "blue butt" (did I spell that right?) and/or Hamshire cross types.. 
I would say the one pig we had looked almost identical to this guy here:
http://www.saddlebackpigs.co.uk/images/img/hampshire_1.JPG
The other two pigs we had were almost exact in size and shape but they were an off-white / pinkish color with dark faded patches on their rear ends.

Here is an actual photo of one of our pigs sometime in the middle of the summer:
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j237/Murphy2000/IMG_1941copy_zps31c3c426.jpg
(I built them a stainless steel feeder)

We bought them at around 50lbs May 1st and took them to the butcher on Sept 16th. I estimated their weight with the length and girth technique to be around 310 to 320+ lbs.. 

The butcher listed the hanging weight at 250, 255 and mine was 258

I built an 8 x 10 shelter for them with an attached 10 x 16 play area that was mobile so we moved it every month to fresh ground. The pigs were feed grain from the local grain mill at 18% protien as well as all our garden clippings and lots of bagged lawn clippings. 

My problem:

We got back 12 lbs of bacon from a 300+ lb pig... Does that seem right? 

I've been researching this for a while and I found this link posted by some lady who listed all her cuts and weights.
http://terrabytefarm.com/wp/2009/05/21/back-from-the-butcher/

I post that link because the hanging weight of 238 lbs in that example is very close to my 258.. 
So, we weighed our hams and other cuts on our postage scale and we found that everything we got back was just a bit heavier then the weights listed in her story.. 
Her hams were 42 lbs, our hams weighed in at 48 lbs.. Her picnic shoulders were at 17 lbs, ours were 18 lbs. And so on an so forth with all the other comparable cuts. 

But, she got 24 lbs of bacon.. I got 12 lbs.. Almost seems like the butcher stole a whole side of bacon from each of our pigs. 

The butcher knew I was a newbie at this because I told him I was and asked for any advice. I'm wondering if he has taken advantage of me.

Any thoughts?


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

I'm wondering if he took one side of bacon from each pig, then left the other side of bacon on the ribs?


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

That size pig should have yielded about 20lbs or more.

Some things that could change that:

How much sausage did you get ? (more of it could have gone into sausage)

Were the spare ribs really meaty ?(didn't trim them close, and more of you bacon is on them)


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

simi-steading said:


> I'm wondering if he took one side of bacon from each pig, then left the other side of bacon on the ribs?


Thank you for the reply..

We got spare ribs with our cuts and the weights match right up with the link I posted.. Her ribs came in at around 6 lbs and ours were also 6 lbs.. 

Even the sausage she listed falls right in line with our weights..


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Sure does sound like you may have had a little skimmed then.....


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

TnAndy said:


> That size pig should have yielded about 20lbs or more.
> 
> Some things that could change that:
> 
> ...


Thanks.. Ribs and other comparable cuts all line up with the example link I posted.. But we're cooking ribs tonight so we'll see if they're meaty or not... 

Even the sausage lined up with the posted example..


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## Philosaw (Mar 3, 2014)

I don't know about your pigs, but I have butchered many pigs where there just isn't much bacon.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Philosaw said:


> I don't know about your pigs, but I have butchered many pigs where there just isn't much bacon.



Thank you for your input.. I would like to hear more of your opinion on this.. 

Our pigs were fed an all they can eat diet of 18% hog feed from the local grain house.. 

Here is a photo of them about 5 weeks from their slaughter date.. 
Does this look like a pig with a less than normal amount of bacon?

I'm certainly no expert, but my pigs don't look any different than any other pigs I see.


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## GreenMomma (Jun 3, 2008)

We didn't get bacon from the pig we had butchered a little while back and had the bellies left on the ribs... you would know before cooking if the meat was left on the ribs, very different in shape. 

By the way, I will never do that again. Those ribs were the worst I've had. All of the delicious meat that would have been bacon was just chewy and awkward.


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## Silvercreek Farmer (Oct 13, 2005)

There is an old saying that butchers don't buy meat. Butchering a hog is not very difficult if you skin them. I'd give it a try next time.


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Silvercreek Farmer said:


> There is an old saying that butchers don't buy meat. Butchering a hog is not very difficult if you skin them. I'd give it a try next time.


Agreed. I've butchered three pigs this year... Finding time is the hardest part of butchering..


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

The amount of bacon can vary pig to pig, shrinks during the smoking and will be different if skinned vs scalded.

Maximum weight if untrimmed fresh (not smoked), scalded from a long fat pig.

Minimum weight if trimmed square, sliced, ends off, skinned post smoking.

There are some butchers who steal. Try not to do business with them. When you find a good honest butcher, and there are many, cherish them and build a good working relationship. Alternatively, consider doing it yourself so you know everything in and out. See the sticky.

-Walter


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## MDKatie (Dec 13, 2010)

Our last pig was 200 lbs hanging weight and we got 18 lbs of bacon. I'd call the butcher and said, "I was wondering if we may have forgotten a box of meat. We only got 12 lbs and we were expecting more." Be polite about it, and see if there's a reason there's only 12 lbs. If he did skim, this will give him the chance to say, "Oh yeah, I missed a box" and make it right. If he didn't skim and there just wasn't much bacon, he'll tell you.


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## Guest (Oct 17, 2014)

I once bought a processed 3 legged pig. Started out with 4 legs but a ham was missing. Good thing I was counting because if not asked i'm sure it would not have been mentioned. I found only 1 processor that gave cut sheets with counts. Wish that was required though.

So easy unfortunately to have some cream skimmed off the top. Most would never know.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

MDKatie said:


> Our last pig was 200 lbs hanging weight and we got 18 lbs of bacon.


And I only got 12 lbs of bacon from each of three pigs... I could almost understand if one pig was a bit short, but all three??



> I'd call the butcher and said, "I was wondering if we may have forgotten a box of meat. We only got 12 lbs and we were expecting more." Be polite about it, and see if there's a reason there's only 12 lbs.


I have already done that.. I was polite and gave him a chance to "save face".. He played me like I was an idiot.. He said: "Oh, your pigs just didn't have much bacon on them".. 
Ya right.. all three of them? (See pictures above!)



> If he did skim, this will give him the chance to say, "Oh yeah, I missed a box" and make it right. If he didn't skim and there just wasn't much bacon, he'll tell you.


Unless he's already done away with the bacon.. It took us 3 weeks to notice the problem.. Being that I am new at this, and the butcher knew I was inexperienced, I didn't realize I as missing any.. But one of my buddies who purchased one of the other pigs has done this before and said something about it. That got me to researching on the internet and led to my discovery.


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## Ruff Times (Feb 6, 2013)

Murphy625 said:


> Thank you for your input.. I would like to hear more of your opinion on this..
> 
> Our pigs were fed an all they can eat diet of 18% hog feed from the local grain house..
> 
> ...




I'm a hobbyist and have raised three to four per year for a while now. Here's what I've experienced. 

Hanging weight has generally been 70% of live weight. That would put your hogs at 217 hanging and not 250+. 250+ would put your live weight in excess of 350. You hogs in the picture look around 300. Hard to tell from pics

I raise lean hogs and will get 24lbs of bacon per. That's off a carcass that hangs at 210 or so. Your hogs should have easily produced that amount. 

All that being said, you need to call your butcher and explain that your one hog produced twice as much bacon as what you received from yours. That's the only way to get the answer. I would be very interested in reading his answer.


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## secuono (Sep 28, 2011)

This issue of theft and the issue of cattle cuts coming from other people's cattle, is what keeps me from ever allowing a butcher to cut up my animals. 
It takes forever to skin a pig, even a small, 55# hog, that hide doesn't want to come away from the fat and it all gets so slippery real fast! But the rest of it was easy. Everything's larger, much larger than rabbits, so I found it super easy and fast to cut the hog up compared to a small rabbit with small bones and small spaces to go around. 

Hopefully, you can find a more trustworthy butcher next time. And never admit being new to anything unless you're pretending to be new and know how that backfires and you're using it to your advantage. 
"Who would notice 6-12# missing from a 260# hog anyway?" =/


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## Ruff Times (Feb 6, 2013)

After reading the post that came before mine, you were ripped of without a doubt. When you picked up your meat did you receive a bill for the quantities that outlines charges for cured and uncured cuts? If so, try to acquire a copy from your customers order. This will give you something to prove to a JUDGE the comparison. Take the lowlife to small claims court if that's an option. 9 times out of 10, when someone receives a notice of small claims, they settle before they get to court. Not sure how it works in your area but you need to nail this guy.


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## Ziptie (May 16, 2013)

It may not have been your bacon. Most butchers will take all the cutting from the days butchering,weigh them for each hog, and then make sausage in very large vats. Same for all the smoking items.

We have food allergy so we make sure our hogs are processed first thing in the day. I have them coarsely grind meat left overs and use that to make my own sausage. The butcher told me if they do not run other meat through the grinder that I would lose 10 lbs of meat, so I have them run the fat through last to clear out all of the meat through the grinder.

Point being for the most part if you want just your meat back don't have the butcher cure or grind anything for you.

PS. It took me two different butchers to find the one I am currently using. Still have to constenly remind them to give me the innards , plus they won't let me have the ears.


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## MDKatie (Dec 13, 2010)

Ziptie said:


> , plus they won't let me have the ears.


Why is that? 

I won't take lambs to the butcher that we used for the hog, because when I told them I wanted the hides back, they told me they'd charge me $40 for it. :grumble: For MY hide! They said they sell them and that's how they keep the prices low. Their "low" price is over twice as expensive as the butcher we use for the lambs now, and he even salts my hide for me!


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## TnAndy (Sep 15, 2005)

Small claims is probably a waste of time. No way to prove one way or another what was there...you'd be wasting your time, IMHO. Just take your lumps and move on...and don't use THAT guy again.



Silvercreek Farmer said:


> *There is an old saying that butchers don't buy meat.* Butchering a hog is not very difficult if you skin them. I'd give it a try next time.


Yep. We took animals to many different places around here, and got varying results from time to time. The only way to control the process is just make sure the critter never leaves the farm. It takes two of us about an hour to kill, skin and split a hog, and get it hanging in the cooler. I know that isn't fast for pro's, but we only do 2-3 year. 

As Silvercreek said, it's just not that hard, and you won't have to worry about shortages.


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## Guest (Oct 17, 2014)

TnAndy said:


> Small claims is probably a waste of time. No way to prove one way or another what was there...you'd be wasting your time, IMHO. Just take your lumps and move on...and don't use THAT guy again.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I agree you will spend more in small claims than your loss and still not recover.

You also have to watch what is said when you question them in case you ever need to use them in the future. There are so few processors around, and even less USDA certified if you legally sell retail cuts. The next one might be another hour or two further if you are lucky.

The only way to be sure you have all of the parts is to process them yourself, but that is only for your own use. I continue to feel there is a conflict of interest in custom processors having a store front. They always have plenty of bacon and high end cuts available

A pair of pigs I took a while back did not return the trotters, heads or loins as I requested. I also only requested two cured hams and received two hams AND two shoulders cured. I asked about all but they no longer had them but offered me some from other pigs?? no! But what are you going to do with the limitations.


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## Pig in a poke (Mar 27, 2013)

Ziptie said:


> Still have to constenly remind them to give me the innards , plus they won't let me have the ears.


By innards, do you mean organs or stomach and intestines. The butcher we have used doesn't want to mess with giving back the intestines, which is why I have to mail-order sausage casings. Would prefer to use our own.


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## Ziptie (May 16, 2013)

That would tick me off too.

I was told they weren't allowed to give them to me beacuse they use a 22 to shoot the pigs and the brain matter gets all over the ears. They had to ask the inspector if it was ok to give me the jowls when I first started getting my meat butchered.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Ziptie said:


> It may not have been your bacon. Most butchers will take all the cutting from the days butchering,weigh them for each hog, and then make sausage in very large vats. Same for all the smoking items.


I would not deal with a butcher who does that. I spend ten months from breeding to butchering to raise my animals my way on my pastures. Not only do I not want someone else's meat, it is illegal for me to sell someone else's meat under my label. There is a chicken farmer who got caught doing that when the label claimed it was his meat and he got in bad trouble. My customers want my pigs's pork. The butcher must give me back my meat. If you've got a butcher who is pooling the meat then complain and find a new butcher.

This is a big issue. It does happen. Don't tolerate it.

-Walter


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## simi-steading (Sep 27, 2012)

Ziptie said:


> That would tick me off too.
> 
> I was told they weren't allowed to give them to me beacuse they use a 22 to shoot the pigs and the brain matter gets all over the ears.


I'm calling BULL... Not one pig I've ever shot has ended up with brain matter on their ears, and I have used a 9mm that didn't splatter brains everywhere either.. With a .22, I've seldom seen any blood run from the hole.. 

Sounds like they may have been selling the ears for dog chews or something?


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## cooper101 (Sep 13, 2010)

Ziptie said:


> That would tick me off too.
> 
> I was told they weren't allowed to give them to me beacuse they use a 22 to shoot the pigs and the brain matter gets all over the ears. They had to ask the inspector if it was ok to give me the jowls when I first started getting my meat butchered.


 
That's odd. No brains go anywhere near the ears with a .22 caliber. Same with the jowls.

Heads are usually not returned unless they use a captive bolt or electrical stunning. If there's lead in the head, you usually won't get it back. Jowls should always be returned to you. Often, anything with skin on it becomes trash, so that may be why you didn't get ears and feet. I slaughter onsite and the carcasses are taken in for processing. My processor will take the carcass and organs, but nothing with skin on it or lead in it.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

TnAndy said:


> Small claims is probably a waste of time. No way to prove one way or another what was there...you'd be wasting your time, IMHO. Just take your lumps and move on...and don't use THAT guy again.


I've never been the type to just lay down like that.. While I would agree that the legal system may not be of use in this instance, I think the internet could be a useful tool to let everyone know about my experience. 

Heck, I might even take an ad out in the local paper and question why a 330+ lb pig only produced 12lbs of bacon.. Where did it go mr. butcher?

Better Business Bureau, Facebook, yellow pages reviews, business finder.mlive, local.yahoo, superpages, merchantcircle.. etc etc.. 

There are many places where a pissed off consumer can post online reviews that google puts at the top of their search results. 

As that little geek said in the move "Core".. My Kung-Fu is strong..


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Just be careful that you are sure of everything before making accusations publicly with names associated. You wouldn't want to accidentally accuse someone of something, or get sued for doing that...


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> Just be careful that you are sure of everything before making accusations publicly with names associated. You wouldn't want to accidentally accuse someone of something, or get sued for doing that...


The secret to ruining the reputation of a bad business is to just tell your side of the story without insults or accusations.. Facts are facts and so long as one sticks to them, no matter how bad those facts make the business look, they are not actionable as defamation. 

The easiest way is to remove the emotional component..


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## Wanda (Dec 19, 2002)

Was the total pounds of meat returned within your expectations? A long tail left on the pork-chops and a bit of extra meaty ribs will change the bacon yield greatly. Lay a side out on the table and separate the rib from the side and you will see what I am talking about.


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## Gravytrain (Mar 2, 2013)

Murphy625 said:


> The secret to ruining the reputation of a bad business is to just tell your side of the story without insults or accusations.. Facts are facts and so long as one sticks to them, no matter how bad those facts make the business look, they are not actionable as defamation.


What may seem to be a "bad business" to you might be, in reality, just a difference in policy or procedure that you are unaccustomed to...or it may just be a misunderstanding or miscommunication. Telling your side of the story in a public forum without the accused having the ability to respond in kind is the same as making an insult or accusation. 

I had a young couple that made a completely false claim in one of my businesses last year, and when we didn't refund their purchase price AND let them keep their item on top of it, they took to facebook. They made all kinds of outrageous claims that were completely unfounded. So I called them. They admitted to me that they made all the stuff up just to punish us. I asked them to remove the post and they agreed. Then they were joking in the post that I had asked them to remove it, yet they never did. I took a hit of several thousand dollars because of their post. Fortunately, I have a very good reputation in my area, and a lot of people came to my defense. If my business was new, it would have destroyed me.

If I'm unhappy with the service I receive from a business, I punish them by giving my business to their competitors. I don't feel the need to destroy anyone.

I didn't realize there was an art to ruining the reputation of someone. Thanks for filling me in.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Wanda said:


> Was the total pounds of meat returned within your expectations? A long tail left on the pork-chops and a bit of extra meaty ribs will change the bacon yield greatly. Lay a side out on the table and separate the rib from the side and you will see what I am talking about.


I'm not sure exactly what you mean but my strips of bacon are longer than the longest part of the spare ribs I got back.. Oh,, and we just ate one of the slabs of ribs last night.. I was a bit disappointed as the only meat on them was between the ribs and a small (less than full bite) at one end. Rib slab weighed in at 3 lbs. 

If you're asking for a diagnostic test of sorts, please be specific because I know very little about butchering.. I do butcher my own deer but I turn them all into jerky strips and ground meat so its not a very precise operation for me.

I'm going to get those butchering videos they talk about in the sticky's in this forum.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

I have used a few processors for some of the butcher hogs i sell. Have 4 within 50 miles of my farm. I always take the pig and have it weighted before it goes to the processor. The total meat i get back is what i mostly go by. I talk with the butcher and we decide how much goes for bacon, how much for sausage, etc. I found good talks with the butcher before i decide is the best way to go. Not got skinned yet. If i did have a problem i would talk to the butcher about it. 

I do check with friends and other people in the business about who is the best processor in the area.

Best,
Gerold.

P.S. I would not go to court over 12 lbs. of bacon. If it can't be replaced be aware of what you are doing the next time and change processors.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Thank you very much for your response.. I do appreciate you sharing your experience with me for free like this. 



Gravytrain said:


> What may seem to be a "bad business" to you might be, in reality, just a difference in policy or procedure that you are unaccustomed to...or it may just be a misunderstanding or miscommunication.


This is why I have been reading dozens upon dozens (hundreds?) of web pages pertaining to the cuts of meat that come from a pig. This is why I am in this forum asking questions. 
I am involved in a situation for which I have little experience so I am collecting some experience from the internet. 



> Telling your side of the story in a public forum without the accused having the ability to respond in kind is the same as making an insult or accusation.


When I asked him on the phone why we got such a small amount of bacon back, his response was that "Some pigs just don't have as much bacon as others".. 
I gave him 3 pigs and he reported hanging weights of 249, 252 and 258 lbs. I got back 10 lbs, 10, lbs and 13 lbs of bacon. 

Do those numbers seem right to you? 

The 249 lb (hanging) pig returned 146 pounds of meat.. with bone in.
The 258 lb (hanging) pig returned 165 pounds of meat.. with bone in.
(both counts include heart and liver)
I did not get an opportunity to weight the meat from the third.



> I had a young couple that made a completely false claim in one of my businesses last year, and when we didn't refund their purchase price AND let them keep their item on top of it, they took to facebook. They made all kinds of outrageous claims that were completely unfounded. So I called them. They admitted to me that they made all the stuff up just to punish us. I asked them to remove the post and they agreed. Then they were joking in the post that I had asked them to remove it, yet they never did. I took a hit of several thousand dollars because of their post. Fortunately, I have a very good reputation in my area, and a lot of people came to my defense. If my business was new, it would have destroyed me.


I would never conduct myself in that manor.. I have been a business owner all of my adult life. 
That said, the farmer I bought my pigs from said he won't take his meat to the butcher in question anymore because of the same problem.. he didn't get all his meat back.




> If I'm unhappy with the service I receive from a business, I punish them by giving my business to their competitors. I don't feel the need to destroy anyone.


I think there is a big difference between bad service and outright theft. If I just simply got back sloppy cuts or too much fat or whatever, I wouldn't be here wasting my time talking about it.. But I don't just lay down when somoene steals from me.



> I didn't realize there was an art to ruining the reputation of someone. Thanks for filling me in.


Unless you want to be sued for some form of defamation, there is. As you stated above, the "accused" does not have a chance to respond, so you must tell your story in a factual and objective nature. Subjective statements, insults, and direct accusations can get you in trouble.


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## Gravytrain (Mar 2, 2013)

Murphy625 said:


> That said, the farmer I bought my pigs from said he won't take his meat to the butcher in question anymore because of the same problem.. he didn't get all his meat back.


Problem solved.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Gravytrain said:


> Problem solved.


I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but how do you mean that? I still only have 12 lbs of bacon and I'm wondering what will happen to the next poor soul who goes to the guy..


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## Gravytrain (Mar 2, 2013)

Murphy625 said:


> I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but how do you mean that? I still only have 12 lbs of bacon and I'm wondering what will happen to the next poor soul who goes to the guy..


I mean unless you can prove definitively that he skimmed your pork bellies: let it go...lesson learned....move on...find another butcher. The guy may very well be a dirtbag, but we're talking about a couple pounds of bacon here. I'm not saying you should be happy about it... just that you'll never recoup your bacon. Take your future business elsewhere. If this guy did skim your pork, and does this regularly, my guess is he already has a poor reputation. 

If it will make you feel better to try to destroy the guy because you feel he shorted you some bacon...have at it. That's your business. IMO life is too short. 

Now, if the guy threatened or hurt my friends or family...I _would_ destroy him, and perhaps not figuratively.


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## Ziptie (May 16, 2013)

Pig in a poke said:


> By innards, do you mean organs or stomach and intestines. The butcher we have used doesn't want to mess with giving back the intestines, which is why I have to mail-order sausage casings. Would prefer to use our own.


The heart,tongue,liver. I guess most people don't want them so they keep forgetting. 

Overall, I think this butcher does pretty well. It is really hard to find a butcher that will just spray the carcass with hot water. Most use lactic acid or ammonia and we can't have either. 

I sure miss the mobile butchers that were in Oregon. If I had those guys, I would have them come out cut everything into primal cuts then finish the meat myself.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

I have looked at what you said the hanging weigh was and the pounds of cuts you got back from the two hogs you listed. The pounds of cuts your got back are within reason of what the normal pig would produce. I would be happy with the amount of total meat you got back from this processor. 


Best,
Gerold.


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## copperkid3 (Mar 18, 2005)

Murphy625 said:


> I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but how do you mean that? I still only have 12 lbs of bacon and I'm wondering what will happen to the next poor soul who goes to the guy..


*************************
IF folks can read, then they have the choice 
on whether to do what they came for or go elsewhere.

Just make sure that you don't do it on other than public sidewalks....


It's beginning to get cold, wet and rainy around this time of year.

If you feel the need to demonstrate outside his business establishment, 
perhaps it would be easier on you to do so in the springtime?


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

gerold said:


> I have looked at what you said the hanging weigh was and the pounds of cuts you got back from the two hogs you listed. The pounds of cuts your got back are within reason of what the normal pig would produce. I would be happy with the amount of total meat you got back from this processor.
> 
> 
> Best,
> Gerold.


Are you suggesting that 13 lbs of bacon from a 330+ lb pig is within reason?

Everywhere I read, they say the average 225 to 250 lb (live weight) pig will return 20 lbs of bacon. 

Am I misunderstanding something?


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

I've cut a lot of hogs. Don't assume that a hog gets more bacon on it the bigger it gets. There is a reason that industry standards call for 240 pounders. The red meat stripes can spread out on a larger hog to the point that if you attempted to cut bacon out of the belly you would have a big slice of lard with a nickel sized sliver of red here and there. You probably got the side bacon and not the "belly bacon". When you run it through the slicer and have nothing but white, it's pointless slicing any more. Really fatty bacon won't weigh as much as lean bacon, either. I would still think you would get more than 12 pounds of salvageable bacon, though.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

Murphy625 said:


> Are you suggesting that 13 lbs of bacon from a 330+ lb pig is within reason?
> 
> Everywhere I read, they say the average 225 to 250 lb (live weight) pig will return 20 lbs of bacon.
> 
> ...


 I have butchered nice fat 500 lb. Yorkshire hogs that cut only about half the bacon because of a large amount of fat. I still used all the meat on the whole hog just not as much of the bacon that i get from smaller Hereford hog. 

What i hope you understand that i don't know how much bacon was on your hogs. So i can't say anything about that. Just saying that you got back the normal amount in lbs of meat for that weight hog and that breed. 

If i got back the normal amount of meat that the hog would produce i would not be complaining. If you told the butcher hay i want all the bacon you can get from this hog even if it has a lot of fat on it i still want that bacon cut instead of using the extra fat on a different cut of meat. 

Question for you how was the bacon? Did it have fat trimmed off. Was the lean meat in it thin or thick. How wide was the slices of bacon?

P.S. I did butcher a 450 lb. Hampshire boar last year. This boar was in great shape but was not fat and his sides were not fat at all. He had the greatest ham and nice broad back Hardly any sides just lean. When i skinned this fellow i said gee where is the bacon.


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## Dstrnad (Aug 9, 2014)

Is the bacon smoked? Did you get any packages that say side pork? My uncle will only cure the best part for bacon the rest is side pork or goes into sausage.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

barnbilder said:


> I've cut a lot of hogs. Don't assume that a hog gets more bacon on it the bigger it gets.


Can someone else chime in on this statement? Doesn't seem logical.. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing, but its counter-intuitive.. Bigger animal, more meat seems logical.



> There is a reason that industry standards call for 240 pounders.


I'm confused on this too.. The butcher in question told me that market pigs are now 280 to 290.. and they don't get "docked"(huh?) until they're over 300 lbs.. (I understand none of what that means)...




> I would still think you would get more than 12 pounds of salvageable bacon, though.


Ya.. I think I got ripped off.. 

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my thread..


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Dstrnad said:


> Is the bacon smoked? Did you get any packages that say side pork? My uncle will only cure the best part for bacon the rest is side pork or goes into sausage.


Bacon is smoked. No packages marked side pork.. I got 12 lbs of sausage from a 330 lb animal that weighed 258 on the hook..


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

In this case docked means taking a cut in price, as opposed to getting their tail cut off. 

And when I say a large hog can have less bacon, what I mean is not that the volume of animal is lower, but that the attractiveness of the cut decreases. The bands of fat that give bacon its white stripes can become much wider on a fatter hog, leading to a cut of meat that has very little red in it. Most people don't like a piece of bacon that is almost all fat, because they are not programmed to accept that. Breeding can have a lot to do with this, too. The whims of the market are driven by what is most profitable. And apparently they have decided it is a 290 pound hog now, with the commercial genetics available. Efficiency plays a huge part in this but don't think for a minute that what consumers expect cuts of meat to look like doesn't also have a role.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

barnbilder said:


> In this case docked means taking a cut in price, as opposed to getting their tail cut off.
> 
> And when I say a large hog can have less bacon, what I mean is not that the volume of animal is lower, but that the attractiveness of the cut decreases. The bands of fat that give bacon its white stripes can become much wider on a fatter hog, leading to a cut of meat that has very little red in it. Most people don't like a piece of bacon that is almost all fat, because they are not programmed to accept that. Breeding can have a lot to do with this, too. The whims of the market are driven by what is most profitable. And apparently they have decided it is a 290 pound hog now, with the commercial genetics available. Efficiency plays a huge part in this but don't think for a minute that what consumers expect cuts of meat to look like doesn't also have a role.


The very reason we decided to raise our own pigs is due to the seemingly exact opposite of what you seem to be implying. 

We got stick of paying high prices at the grocery store for pork products that contained an unusually high percentage of fat.. Bought a ham, it was almost a full 75% fat.. Bacon that was pushing 80% all fat for a hefty per pound price. 
Even the store bought pork chops had a huge thing of fat on the outside edge.. it was like 20% of the pork chop.. 

I have to admit that we have only a little fat on our meat cuts. Lots of little bone pieces so we have to be careful before biting down.. but little fat..


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## Gravytrain (Mar 2, 2013)

My pigs have much more intramuscular fat than commercial hogs. My pigs also have more subcutaneous fat than commercial ones. Commercial hogs are bred to be very lean. It is very normal for even lean pigs to have large deposits of fat between the muscles of the leg (ham). However, I would not want a ham that was lean, as this would result in a dry ham roast.

I agree with you about grocery store bacon that seems to be mostly fat. They sell it that way because they can...people will buy it. I would rather just have the fat cut off and made into ground pork, sausage or render it for lard. Many local butchers would do just that. When the butcher has more fat from these cuts than they can use for sausage or ground, they often toss it into a bin to be used for when they don't have much. Not saying this is good, just what is commonly done. My butcher doesn't save the fat for you unless you specifically ask for it.

This is why I'm urging caution before you set out to destroy this guy. He may have trimmed your belly/side fat and used it for your ground product or tossed it in the scrap bin. Your total weight received is in the right ball park.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Murphy625 said:


> I'm not sure exactly what you mean but my strips of bacon are longer than the longest part of the spare ribs I got back.


That is normal. We cut ribs down to 3" to 5" depending on what the customer wants. The bacon itself is far wider as were the ribs prior to being cut down. This is why one animal produces four to six racks of ribs, depending on cutting.

-Walter


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Gravytrain said:


> This is why I'm urging caution before you set out to destroy this guy. He may have trimmed your belly/side fat and used it for your ground product or tossed it in the scrap bin. Your total weight received is in the right ball park.


We got our fat back in a bag.. Since we have chickens, I had told them I wanted all fat trimmings to be saved.. (We never discussed why with him)..

But ya, I did get three basketball sized bags of fat back.. I also requested and got back the feet and ears for my dog.. I kept all of it from all 3 pigs. I rendered and pressure canned some of the fat for cooking and will feed the rest to the chickens when the ground freezes in the deep of winter.

I've been wondering about the "total weight received" thing.. Hanging weight of 258 means our pigs were about 330 lbs.. I read in several places the amount of meat you get back will be about 50% of the live weight.. 
But it didn't specify if that was boneless cuts or bone-in-cuts.. The only cuts that don't have a bone in our meat is the bacon so far. 
We pressure canned some pork and bean soup yesterday and used one of the roasts.. After it was all cut up, I had a couple pieces of what I can only describe as spinal column in there.. I'm pretty sure it was the spinal column bone as it looked almost identical to what I pull out of deer when I slice them up.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> That is normal. We cut ribs down to 3" to 5" depending on what the customer wants. The bacon itself is far wider as were the ribs prior to being cut down. This is why one animal produces four to six racks of ribs, depending on cutting.
> 
> -Walter


Oh great.. is this another warning sign? We only got back two racks of ribs each weighing 3 lbs a piece. 

The longest side was about 6 inches, the short side was about 4.5 or so.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

Murphy625 said:


> We got our fat back in a bag.. Since we have chickens, I had told them I wanted all fat trimmings to be saved.. (We never discussed why with him)..
> 
> But ya, I did get three basketball sized bags of fat back.. I also requested and got back the feet and ears for my dog.. I kept all of it from all 3 pigs. I rendered and pressure canned some of the fat for cooking and will feed the rest to the chickens when the ground freezes in the deep of winter.
> 
> ...


With my Yorks and Hamps i get approx. 46-48% of cuts from live weight most of the time.
My Hereford and Duroc/Berkshire hogs i get 50-52 % of cuts from live weight. It does vary a bit from breed to breed and also what the diet of the pig was.


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## woodsman14 (Oct 6, 2014)

Just my opinion, based on personal experiences, 18% protein feed will produce a very lean hog and most people have to request additional fat in order to make it more palatable. 18% straight thru might have left little fat in the belly to make bacon with. 

I recently had a lean gilt butchered and I fully expected it, after killing and skinning her the butcher called and told me she was so lean he would need to add fat in order to make our sausage. I had her processed into 100% (whole hog) sausage.

Try a lower protein mix like 14% if you are going to feed one mix straight thru it might improve your take on cuts that require FAT.


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## njenner (Jul 15, 2013)

Been reading this with interest - and wondering if there is any way to tell if your pig is high in fat or lean simply from observing the live animal? I can tell when my dog/horse/cat are too fat.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Yes, one can look at a pig and see quite readily if it is lean or fat, well muscled or thinly. Sounds like a good topic for photos for people to post of their pigs...


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> Yes, one can look at a pig and see quite readily if it is lean or fat, well muscled or thinly. Sounds like a good topic for photos for people to post of their pigs...


What do you think of the pigs in the photo I posted? They're about 300 lbs when I took the picture.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

They look good. I like to see the hams and shoulders a little bigger but they're well within spec looking at proportions. Size is hard for me to judge. Nice length. Not overly fat.

As to fat, I aim for about 0.75" of back fat skin-on. That fits are market well.

-Walter


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> They look good. I like to see the hams and shoulders a little bigger but they're well within spec looking at proportions. Size is hard for me to judge. Nice length. Not overly fat.
> 
> As to fat, I aim for about 0.75" of back fat skin-on. That fits are market well.
> 
> -Walter


Those pigs at 330 lbs produced a whopping 12 lbs of bacon! LOL


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

If you could please fill in your location information it makes it easier to answer questions. At the very least your zone. See this thread:

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/livestock-forums/pigs/505485-please-fill-location-info.html


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> If you could please fill in your location information it makes it easier to answer questions. At the very least your zone. See this thread:
> 
> http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/livestock-forums/pigs/505485-please-fill-location-info.html


Pig were raised in the summer months and it was a cool-ish summer with only a few days above 90.. 

I filled in my info..


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

Murphy625 said:


> Those pigs at 330 lbs produced a whopping 12 lbs of bacon! LOL


I have looked at the photo a few times and with the weigh and breed it really is hard to think that you only got that amount of bacon and sausage back. Belly just don't disappear on its own. At the very least you should of had 17 lbs. of bacon.


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## Philosaw (Mar 3, 2014)

Actually, I disagree with the whole idea that you were ripped off. I have butchered dozens of pigs and some have so little bacon that it's not even worth curing. It doesn't mean anything that your pig weighs 300 pounds, what counts is the thickness and meat to fat ratio. I suggest you butcher a couple yourself before you condemn the butcher


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

It is important to remember that when dealing with livestock, numbers, ratios and percentages are guidelines, not absolute rules. There is difference between breeds, and difference between families within breeds. Different bloodlines might reach their optimum carcass traits at far different ages. Differences in feeds, even differences in the same mix from different mills, can play a part. If you are looking for absolutes, farming is maybe not the best field.

If the pigs were skinned instead of scalded and scraped, a poor skinning job can leave 20 pounds of bacon on the hide, but I hope no one that inexperienced is turned loose in a butcher shop to skin someone's hogs. If you don't trust the guy don't take any more pigs to him. But don't burn your bridges. You might find out that the other butchers in your area are even worse. Taking a pig to him after picketing his place would be a little awkward.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Philosaw said:


> Actually, I disagree with the whole idea that you were ripped off. I have butchered dozens of pigs and some have so little bacon that it's not even worth curing. It doesn't mean anything that your pig weighs 300 pounds, what counts is the thickness and meat to fat ratio. I suggest you butcher a couple yourself before you condemn the butcher


Did you see the photos of my pigs? Also, while I am not experienced enough in this subject to make any challenge to your statement, did you intend to mean that ALL THREE of my pigs would have the same problem?? Wouldn't that indicate something else? 

I fed them high protein feed from the local grain house.. also gave them all our garden veggies and grass clippings.. They were confined to a 10 x 8 shelter and a 10 x 16 pen that was moved to fresh ground monthly. 

Please educate me on how all three pigs could exhibit the same "lack of bacon" characteristic.. one pig maybe.. but all three? 

Bye the way, when the butcher called me to pick up my meat, I asked him about "how it went".. specifically I asked "were they on the lean side or the fat side? should I do anything different with the next batch?" 
He said everything was just right... 

I still have an open mind about this but its not looking good..
*
You are also the only member suggesting this lack of bacon thing.. * not that I have any problem with that, but the general consensus seems to go against what you're saying. Let me say this again to be clear.. I have no problems with you screaming the earth is round while everyone else says its flat.. Sometimes learning experiences require an open mind.. But I have to ask you to comment further based on what I've said..


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## Philosaw (Mar 3, 2014)

Murphy625 said:


> Did you see the photos of my pigs? Also, while I am not experienced enough in this subject to make any challenge to your statement, did you intend to mean that ALL THREE of my pigs would have the same problem?? Wouldn't that indicate something else?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes, I did see your pics, but that means nothing. I've raised many, many pigs and still cannot tell what the quantity of bacon will be. I would have to agree with others that if the overall quantity of meat is within the norm, then it is highly likely that most of the belly either went to fat or was made into sausage, which is exactly what I would do if I were the butcher.


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## Gravytrain (Mar 2, 2013)

Murphy625 said:


> Did you see the photos of my pigs?


Yes, we all saw your pigs.



> Please educate me on how all three pigs could exhibit the same "lack of bacon" characteristic.. one pig maybe.. but all three?


If they all came from the same stock and were fed the same thing, it doesn't strain credulity to think they'd finish the same.



> Bye the way, when the butcher called me to pick up my meat, I asked him about "how it went".. specifically I asked "were they on the lean side or the fat side? should I do anything different with the next batch?"
> He said everything was just right...


If he was planning on ripping you off, wouldn't he have prepped you by condemning the carcass?



> I still have an open mind about this...


Do you really? It doesn't appear that way.



> *
> You are also the only member suggesting this lack of bacon thing.. * not that I have any problem with that, but the general consensus seems to go against what you're saying. Let me say this again to be clear.. I have no problems with you screaming the earth is round while everyone else says its flat.. Sometimes learning experiences require an open mind.. But I have to ask you to comment further based on what I've said..


That's not necessarily true. The truth is NONE of us _knows_ if you were ripped off or not. I think there is certainly a possibility that you WERE ripped off, but I think there is an equal chance that you were NOT.

I try to keep accurate records of my slaughtered animals. I like to see about 10% of the hanging weight in cured bacon. Usually I'm close to that. Occasionally, it yields higher than that, but when it does it's pretty fatty bacon. Sometimes it's lower than that...in a couple cases much lower than that. Cases in point:









The Duroc X on the left had a hanging weight of 390#. She yielded 21# of bacon (about 5% of hw). The one next to her went to a customer who picked up her own meat, so I don't have any data on her other than hanging weight. The one in the background, however was her sister. They were both Berk X Hamp. Her hanging weight was 423# and yielded 38# of bacon (about 9%).

These pigs were all raised together on the same forage/feed. Was I disappointed in the bacon yield for the Duroc X? Yes, I was, but she had an awesome flavor, and very tender hams. She was more laid back than the rest and always waited until the rest of the pigs were done before digging into the fray at the feed tub. Other than the difference in breed, that's all I can think of for a reason.

I asked the butcher about the yield and he told me what I told you in a previous post...The belly muscles trailed off into very thin streaks until it was mostly just fat. He trimmed it for ground product. Case closed. This guy has done dozens of pigs for me, and although there are a few things about his policies that bug me... I trust him. He could have just packaged 20# of mostly fat into my bacon packages, but I would not have been happy with that.

Again, I don't know what happened to your bacon. But, it seems to me that you've invested more time researching whether or not you've been ripped off, that you could have put into building infrastructure for your next projects or finding the next butcher you could try. There are bad butchers out there...avoid them. Don't burn bridges unnecessarily.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

People could probably tell more about what's going on from pictures of your bacon than pictures of your hogs. Keep in mind that the professional fix for really thin bacon with a huge outer fat rind is to trim the rind and put it on a slicing machine and cut it at an angle. So sliced bacon means nothing. And as has been stated before, a huge hog can have a very thin coating of bacon over the ribs and a huge outer band of fat. I have thought I was robbed several times through the years, and I was the only one doing the cutting.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

http://www.oda.state.ok.us/food/fs-hogweight.pdf 
Most hog i have butchered is about in line with the link above.


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## Dstrnad (Aug 9, 2014)

Not trying to jump on the band wagon, but it does seem like you are here looking for justification to wage jihad on the guy. There is no way to know for sure one way or the other. It may just be how he processes it, heavy trimming, etc combined with how the animals finished. If the total amount back is close then it would be pretty hard to accuse anyone of anything. A butcher makes money butchering animals not in black market bacon. Not saying that didn't happen but a few pounds of bacon has little value to a butcher.


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Gravytrain said:


> Yes, we all saw your pigs.
> 
> 
> If they all came from the same stock and were fed the same thing, it doesn't strain credulity to think they'd finish the same.
> ...


Thank you very much for taking the time to write all that out for me.. Very good information..



> Again, I don't know what happened to your bacon. But, it seems to me that you've invested more time researching whether or not you've been ripped off, that you could have put into building infrastructure for your next projects or finding the next butcher you could try.


This is what it takes for me to learn something new of this nature.. Research it, do it, analyze it, make adjustments, rinse and repeat. 
I'm an engineer, if this was a simply a project of basic physics, I wouldn't be here looking for opinions and experience.. it would have been right the first time.

Thank you again for taking your time to explain all that above.. Very informative...


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

barnbilder said:


> People could probably tell more about what's going on from pictures of your bacon than pictures of your hogs. Keep in mind that the professional fix for really thin bacon with a huge outer fat rind is to trim the rind and put it on a slicing machine and cut it at an angle. So sliced bacon means nothing. And as has been stated before, a huge hog can have a very thin coating of bacon over the ribs and a huge outer band of fat. I have thought I was robbed several times through the years, and I was the only one doing the cutting.


That's interesting.. Should I take some photos of the sliced bacon then or would it be useless due to the cutting tricks you mentioned?


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

Dstrnad said:


> Not trying to jump on the band wagon, but it does seem like you are here looking for justification to wage jihad on the guy.


I wouldn't need to come here for justification then.. I'm trying to learn something about a relatively subjective subject.. its not always a smooth road.


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## Allen W (Aug 2, 2008)

Murphy625 said:


> Did you see the photos of my pigs? Also, while I am not experienced enough in this subject to make any challenge to your statement, did you intend to mean that ALL THREE of my pigs would have the same problem?? Wouldn't that indicate something else?
> 
> I fed them high protein feed from the local grain house.. also gave them all our garden veggies and grass clippings.. They were confined to a 10 x 8 shelter and a 10 x 16 pen that was moved to fresh ground monthly.
> 
> ...


I don't want to jump in here and pick on you but your pictures don't show enough detail for me to make a good judgement of your pigs. A good side view and one down the top would be more usefull.


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## Dstrnad (Aug 9, 2014)

Did you make any comments about preferring lean sausage or bacon? Was the meat from the 3 pooled and then divided into 3 similar proportions? How many hogs does he butcher a year? What does the bacon look like? What is the guy like? You can size up a man in about 5 min? How did you pay for processing and curing, by the lb or set price?


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## Ziptie (May 16, 2013)

Don't know if I missed the numbers but did you keep the fat? Maybe that would help you figure this out.


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

I am sure sorry to hear about your experience. After all that hard work, it is terrible you got ripped off! The reason I believe you were has to do with getting the same amount from each pig, although they weighed differently. We got different amounts from each of our 3 pigs.

All I can add to the good advice thus far? Only use a Butcher you can watch. No, I am not kidding. We raised (3) pigs and were "invited" to watch the entire process. We brought our own pigs in, watched them get weighed and tagged with our name. Took the time to watch the entire process. While they butchered our pigs, it was assembly line fashion, and very slick! As the process began, the tag was recorded and every single package of resulting meat had our name & tag# on it. When our own pig was done, we were told the weights RIGHT ON THE SPOT. I took notes on absolutely everything. In addition, I purchased a book and knew how much we would be getting. Getting this education up front, was so helpful when it was time to make our choices. When we went back to pick up everything, there wasn't a single package missing. This business takes pride in cleanliness, customer service, and are good honest folks!


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## Dstrnad (Aug 9, 2014)

Also hot smoked or cold smoked?


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

I had posted a thread back when we raised our (3) pigs. While I didn't see my hang weight listed, I did have live weight. Here is what we got from our 400# pig (8.5 months old, delayed due to schedule of guy who slaughtered/dressed them out):


(5) pkgs Pork Roasts (1 larger one) ***We had different cuts made so less roasts)***
(3) pkgs Spare Ribs
(4) pkgs Sirloin Pork Chops (4 to a pkg)
(10) pkgs Pork Chops (variety of types, 4 to a pkg)
(1) pkg Baby Back Ribs
(11) pkgs Ground Pork (1# packages)
(33) pkgs Breakfast Sausage (1# packages)

Now, of the 86#s cured/smoked, I know we will have:

20#s of Thick Sliced Bacon (1# pkgs)*
5#s of Canadian Bacon (1# pkgs of thick sliced)
( 8 ) 5# Hams
(2) Hocks
Balance of the weight in Shoulder Bacon (md sliced) and anything else cut out of the 86#s.

We netted 30#s of fat to render, but will have to check my notes & later post how much the meat pkgs weighed total.

Here, I have to note that I don't have more detail (exact weights on the packages or total weight of meat). There were a lot of posts on my old thread and I am not sure if I posted hang weight or meat net weight. This was the best pork I have ever had! The other two friends who bought pigs, also told me it was the best they ever had. 

*We ended up with *23#s of bacon.* Here is what it looked like:


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

I went back and checked...of our (3) pigs, ours was 400#s, other two were 375#s and the run was 250#s (live weight). That runt even netted 20#s of bacon!


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## CJBegins (Nov 20, 2009)

MDKatie, I had a beautiful jersey bull that we took to butcher. I told them I wanted the hide and they told me it would cost $65 to get it back. I was one ticked off ex- customer at that point.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Philosaw said:


> I've raised many, many pigs and still cannot tell what the quantity of bacon will be.


It is worth keeping good records over the years with the pigs because in time you can build up a pretty good idea of what a pig will yield. I can look at our pigs and get a good idea of what I expect to get back off a pig. I do this every week with pigs as I'm making up the cut sheets for the butcher from the compilation of standing and special orders I have that week from our customers. Knowing what pigs will yield is pretty important and the yields are fairly consistent.

That said, I'm dealing with my pigs, my breeding, my feeding, my management and the way our butcher slaughters and cuts (scald & scrape). Other breeds, lines, feed and management will have different results. I've worked with our butcher since 2009 so I know how they cut and they know what I expect. It takes time to build the relationship.

There are some butchers out there who cheat - no question about it. If you have a butcher cheating you then move on and find another butcher, or learn to do it yourself (see the sticky thread on that topic). It is well worth finding a good butcher, developing a relationship and figuring out how to work together smoothly. It has to be a mutually beneficial relationship.

-Walter


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## woodsman14 (Oct 6, 2014)

ChristieAcres said:


> I went back and checked...of our (3) pigs, ours was 400#s, other two were 375#s and the run was 250#s (live weight). That runt even netted 20#s of bacon!


Those are all live weights? Beautiful bacon pics!


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## ChristieAcres (Apr 11, 2009)

woodsman14 said:


> Those are all live weights? Beautiful bacon pics!


Thanks, yes, those were live weights. For some reason, I hadn't posted the hang weights. I likely have them in my book (the one on butchering). With our move, I don't have direct access to the book yet.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

As a general rule:

Hanging Weight = 72% Live Weight

although it will vary some with the breed and type of slaughter (scald & scrape vs skinning). We use scald and scrape and it pegs pretty close to that.

-Walter


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## Ruff Times (Feb 6, 2013)

highlands said:


> As a general rule:
> 
> Hanging Weight = 72% Live Weight
> 
> ...


I'd add the following

http://animalscience.psu.edu/extension/meat/pdf/The Butcher Stole My Meat.pdf


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## Philosaw (Mar 3, 2014)

highlands said:


> It is worth keeping good records over the years with the pigs because in time you can build up a pretty good idea of what a pig will yield. I can look at our pigs and get a good idea of what I expect to get back off a pig. I do this every week with pigs as I'm making up the cut sheets for the butcher from the compilation of standing and special orders I have that week from our customers. Knowing what pigs will yield is pretty important and the yields are fairly consistent.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Highlands, I can certainly see that you would be able to tell the expected quantities of the various cuts. This is solely because you have developed your own line of animals. I do keep meticulous records of the animals that I have bred, but for the many more that I have not, there is always some level of suspense when getting to the bacon.


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## gerold (Jul 18, 2011)

Philosaw said:


> Highlands, I can certainly see that you would be able to tell the expected quantities of the various cuts. This is solely because you have developed your own line of animals. I do keep meticulous records of the animals that I have bred, but for the many more that I have not, there is always some level of suspense when getting to the bacon.


You are correct in where is the bacon. :} As before i stated i butchered a Hamp boar weight 400 plus. Had him hanging and was looking for the bacon. Where did the bacon go.  Very thin sliver of lean meat and the rest was pork belly fat.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

On of the surprises with bacon is that different butchers may cut it differently, leaving more meat on the ribs, etc. This can make a large difference in the amount that is left for making bacon. We've been working for a long time with the same butcher so that helps reduce the element of surprise.

-Walter


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

highlands said:


> On of the surprises with bacon is that different butchers may cut it differently, leaving more meat on the ribs, etc. This can make a large difference in the amount that is left for making bacon. We've been working for a long time with the same butcher so that helps reduce the element of surprise.
> 
> -Walter


Our ribs had almost no meat on them.. Some meat in between the bones, a small bite at the end.. but that was it.. We got 6 lbs back total.. 2 packages at 3lb each.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Normally our ribs are low on meat but one of the specialty cuts we do for some customers on request is what we call "Meaty Ribs" which has the bacon still on. Even more special is we do that in a BBQ sauce and smoke it, "Smoked BBQ Meaty Ribs". Those sells for almost $10/lb _wholesale_. Restaurants and bars love them for quick heat and eat. Something to think of when you're cutting up a pig and making delicious bits.

Best way to make sure you get what you raised is to process it yourself. If you're not up to doing the slaughter you can probably find an itinerant slaughterer. They come to your place and do the kill, scald or skin, gutting and then you need a place to hang it to chill to get the animal heat out. Once the carcass has cooled and aged you can do your own meat cutting. See the sticky thread:

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/li...ces-meat-processing-slaughter-butchering.html

Butchering isn't hard and you don't even need to have a meat saw. For years I just did it with a knife, deboning everything. Bones went in the soup pot, meat to canning or freezer. I still do the occasional hog this way field dressing it. Not for sale of course since it isn't inspected but good meat doesn't have to be fancy for our table.

If you're selling then that is another matter and you'll need, and want, the inspection stuff.

Doing it once will give you a real good sense of what comes off the pig.

-Walter


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## woodsman14 (Oct 6, 2014)

Murphy625 said:


> Our ribs had almost no meat on them.. Some meat in between the bones, a small bite at the end.. but that was it.. We got 6 lbs back total.. 2 packages at 3lb each.


Are you sure it was a pig you took in? Lol!


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## Murphy625 (Oct 16, 2014)

woodsman14 said:


> Are you sure it was a pig you took in? Lol!


Why do you say that? 6 lbs of ribs seems about right to me if I based my weights on what this lady posted here:
http://terrabytefarm.com/wp/2009/05/21/back-from-the-butcher/

My hanging was 258, her's was 238 so pretty close.


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## rachelanne05 (Sep 13, 2014)

So the pictures of my pigs the one lying down was the male hanging weight 314 and the female had a hanging weight of 272. I got back one slab of bacon that's about 10 pounds maybe 14?and the other slab is being smoked. I didn't weigh my meat but as I was putting it away everything added up. I forgot to add that I sold the male pig. So I took the female home the picture of all the meat that doesn't include the smoked ham or the other slab of bacon.


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## Dstrnad (Aug 9, 2014)

rachelanne05 said:


> View attachment 38349
> View attachment 38350
> 
> So the pictures of my pigs the one lying down was the male hanging weight 314 and the female had a hanging weight of 272. I got back one slab of bacon that's about 10 pounds maybe 14?and the other slab is being smoked. I didn't weigh my meat but as I was putting it away everything added up. I forgot to add that I sold the male pig. So I took the female home the picture of all the meat that doesn't include the smoked ham or the other slab of bacon.


What does everyone mean when they say how many lbs of bacon they get. I wouldn't consider uncured side pork bacon. There can be a big weight difference from raw to finished, especially when hot smoked. 

On a side note is the actual weight 12 lbs or did you get 12 packages of approximately 1 lb each? I once had issues with an order of 50 lbs of burger that was only 42- 1 lb packages. I thought I was taken but they all were actually 1.1-1.2 lb packages.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Uncured is fresh side pork or pork belly.
Cured and smoked is bacon. This will be a bit lighter than fresh.
But people confuse the terms and are often loose with the words.

How much you get depends on how it is trimmed of the pig, how it is squared up, how old the pig is, how big the pig is, the breed, how it is smoked (hot vs cold), how it is cured (wet vs dry), etc. Considerable variability.

-Walter


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