# Adjusting your level of comfort (thanks Ernie)



## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

On another thread, Ernie said something to the effect of adjusting your level of comfort to your circumstances instead of the other way around (only in less words lol).

Which got me thinking. 

My story. I am 55 years old, female and am retiring from full time work this December. My ex and I built a cottage/retirement home from scratch and got it up, sided, framed and roofed. Then we split. I gave up pretty much everything to get this place in a rural/resort area. I couldn't afford to hire anybody to do anything so I learned to do it myself. I wired the house, put up the mast and passed my first electrical inspection. I then insulated it (50 R in the attic) and am just about finished the vapour barrier. Just the crawl space needs to be finished. Oh, and did I say that I hate doing vapour barrier? Once I finish in the next few weeks, I can get my vapour inspection and then drywall.

For the past 4 years I have been living in this dwelling on and off as I was able to get it warmer. I still don't have indoor plumbing but I have an outdoor well and a holding tank. (my winter job is to learn how to do the "outflow" plumbing as I am totally unknowledgeable about that). I use a homemade porta-potty with a frame, seat and plastic bags that I dump into the holding tank. At first I used a bucket but that is too heavy for me to take to the tank in the slippery snow and ice. 

I have a fridge, a microwave, a hotplate and a round convection oven thing I picked up at a garage sale. I bathe in the winter using the sponge method and lots of old blankets. I shower when I can at friends and family but they don't live close by.

I haul my water from the main free artisian well a few blocks from me (in the winter once I shut my well down) and go once a week on a Sunday that seems to do me. I wash my clothes in a wonder washer (small stuff) and go to the laundrymat for the big stuff.

I have no cable, i use the internet to watch hockey games and football and I listen to a lot of radio online.

Sorry, that was long........


I commute 2 hours a day but when December comes I am getting enough money to sort of finish the big stuff and will be retired so I will have time and money hahaha.

Every week, someone comes and says to me - I could never live how you live. I am astonished everytime I hear it. I am warm, have food and water, own my own place free and clear and am very happy. My ideas of comfort have greatly changed. I do have the internet, I consider that a necessity right now as I use youtube and other sites to learn the skills that I need to employ in finishing my house.

When I do get to finish this place, it isn't going to look like and I am not going to go back to what is considered normal to most people. I have adjusted my comfort to my reality and I am quite liking it.


I am a different person than I was 4 years ago. I hardly recognize me.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

I think most people who do this "dip below" their comfort zone and then come back up a little. But you never go all the way back up to the "modern" level of convenience and comfort.

You do what is needful. 

Thanks for posting!


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

No, THANK YOU for posting all that you do. You and others are an inspiration to me when I get down. Which usually happens when the government (and I live in an extremely nannyish province) lines up all the inspections that they feel I need. And regulations I have to meet.

I just am keeping my eye on the prize. To quit working for anyone other than myself and to be as self-sustaining as I can with what I have to work with.

I have waited 55 years to sit here in my own place with the windows open (and it's kinda cool here today) and not hear a single thing other than some geese and my cat whining to be let in, again.

Bliss.

But now I have to head down into the bowels of my crawl space and mess around with vapour barrier. Hell is vapour barrier. lol


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

No, hell is sharing that crawl space with poisonous spiders and snakes.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

We spent one summer living in a tent while we began building this place (and fall and half the winter in a shed). People also said to me that they'd never live like that. My reply was that half the world lives like this. That said, we do now have a modern house. I guess you have to not be scared of something different, and a little less comfort. Good for you. Are you going to have to put in running water and a bathroom in order to pass living inspection? I know you are living there now, but officially we had to get all of that in order to be "allowed" to live in the house.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

I have heard of countless "permit" nasty-ness. . . . but I have never heard of a "vapor inspection". . . . wow
I guess you are in one of those zoning-night-mare places. . .

Bless you and your 'can do' attitude . . .you will make it................


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

Ann - LOL Fortunately, we have no poisonous snakes or spiders where I live. And my crawl space is berefit of any creatures whatsoever. That would be Hell.

Maura - yes, technically, I can't live here. I am a squatter (as my son calls me). I have an alternate address but the town knows I live here. They just wink at me. After all, it is hard to work on a place an hour away and not be here at all hours of the night. My running water is going in in the spring. Once i get my money, I will be hiring out a guy down the way to bring the property up to grade, put in the posts (the screw in kind) for the deck and front landing and bring in the machinary that digs under the foundation to bring the water under the house into the crawl space. My neighbour is living at his place now doing the same thing, as long as you have a well and a holding tank, they don't get bent out of shape.

Jim - Thank you. I have everything sunk into this place and I have no choice but to just "do". The vapour barrier inspection is written for contractors, so that they don't sell a house that will cost the owner a ton of money to heat. I just fall under that because I am my own contractor. But it sucks. The funny thing is my son is a drywall contractor that works commercial and he couldn't believe how insanely picky the guys out here are. But I have no choice but to smile and do what they want. Once this is over, then only 2 more inspections to go. The final electrical one and the final house one. 

They are trying to institute mandatory sprinkler systems for residential homes here. hahaha Only thing is, the antifreeze that is required is a carcinogen and can burst into flames so I have to get this done before they figure out those problems. Well, break is over, back into the pit mine.


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## Ozarks Tom (May 27, 2011)

I sure wish your self confidence was contagious, the world would be a much better place!


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## elkhound (May 30, 2006)

one person happiness and reality is another persons night mare and misery.....lol


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## Ann-NWIowa (Sep 28, 2002)

I could say I would never "whatever", but I've learned that is tempting fate. I will say I'd prefer not to have to do without my own home, hot & cold running water, city sewer, natural gas, etc., but if I had to I'd survive and hopefully thrive. At 70 and with physical limitations I have to admit I like my comforts.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

Jim-mi said:


> I have heard of countless "permit" nasty-ness. . . . *but I have never heard of a "vapor inspection". . . . wow*
> *I guess you are in one of those zoning-night-mare places. . .*
> 
> Bless you and your 'can do' attitude . . .you will make it................


The OP lives in a Canadian province that gets extremely cold in the winters. In all provinces in Canada homes are required to have vapour barrier and vapour barrier inspection. There's no avoiding it for any home builder/contractor in any province up here but it's a necessity because of the lengthy and often bitterly cold Canadian winters.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I knew it, Canada. Sounds to me like you'll do just fine. Don't let folks get You down, they just don't like to work. Some of us find it the only way we are happy.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Paumon said:


> The OP lives in a Canadian province that gets extremely cold in the winters. In all provinces in Canada homes are required to have vapour barrier and vapour barrier inspection. There's no avoiding it for any home builder/contractor in any province up here but it's a necessity because of the lengthy and often bitterly cold Canadian winters.


Wasn't it Jack London who wrote about the vapour barrier and brave vapour barrier inspectors taming the wild north of Canada and making it safe for the pioneers?


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## oneraddad (Jul 20, 2010)

I sold my house and moved into a VW bus down by the Truckee river. I've been getting a little more comfortable everyday. Four months in the VW, 3 years in the trailer. The last three years I've been taking over the house one room at a time.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Nice looking place! I see why you fenced that garden.


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

Wow Oneraddad.........I see drywall. And a toilet! Ahhh to dream.

That snow looked like me last year. It got so cold here my clutch froze and didn't thaw completely till I was 5 miles down the highway. This year I won't have to drive 64 km's to go to work at 6 in the morning in the -30 to -40's. I am finished working Dec 4th and will only go in if they really need me till Christmas (and then if it isn't too cold or stormy).


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

Ernie said:


> Wasn't it Jack London who wrote about the vapour barrier and brave vapour barrier inspectors taming the wild north of Canada and making it safe for the pioneers?


Well yeah, eh! Good ol' Dudley Do-Right and Inspector Fenwick.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

It is amazing how far removed we've become from our days before cheap energy! We've gotten fat, greedy, and succumbed to a nanny state...and cost us dearly in taxes and freedom!


I like things at the basic level....an example....I'll take a plain jane wood stove over a fancy pricey one or a pellet stove any day because I don't want to fuss with catalytic converter issues, I can harvest fuel in its rare form and I don't need electric to use it.

As long as fuel is cheap I will use it but I do as much by hand as possible to stay fit, save money, and be well practiced when standards change and necessitate such an adjustment. 

In the past 2 years we have had our income cut in half the first year of unemployment and now we are down to about a third...42k to 22k to 11k. My garden and goats that I've been perfecting over the years have done really well for us this year....14 years of practice made the transition less traumatic.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

Beautiful bathroom.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

parthy said:


> ...... I have a fridge, a microwave, a hotplate and a round convection oven thing I picked up at a garage sale.


For six years I lived in somewhat similar 'rustic' conditions as you've described. I had a small bar fridge, a single burner hotplate, small convection oven, a little multi-purpose toaster oven and a small microwave (which I rarely used except for reheating things). In the warm seasons I did a lot of cooking outside using my cast iron ware over an open pit fire.

What turned out to be one of the most indispensable cooking implements for me was a large electric crockpot. When you're busy working hard and alone all day around the stead at the end of the day you're often just too exhausted to come in and start cooking a balanced, fortifying meal. This is when a crockpot is a blessing, to be able to come in from work to a hot savoury meal that is waiting in the pot or that was cooked the day before and only needs to be reheated in the microwave. If you don't have a crockpot, may I suggest you get one at your earliest convenience, you will thank yourself for it.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

you could also start using saw dust in your bucket , and save the holding tank pumping


when you do plumb your drains if you can join all your drains from shower , sink , and such all but the toilet then run them to the 3 inch that your toilet is plumbed to. that way when your last inspection has happened you go down and cut that , install a set of valves so that when the ground thaws you go down there and direct all your grey water out the other drain pipe you installed before you graded the place , as a just encase drain.

my uncle build a house with a holding tank , 5 teen kids took a lot of showers , it wasn't very long before he figured out how to just direct the shower water outside , but in his case he ran it to a pump , the laundry sink in the basement went down into a sump and was pumped back up to the main and out to the holding tank , well not for very long it wasn't and it got the shower tied into it.


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## mzgarden (Mar 16, 2012)

Oh boy, I read the above and thought: 
her-o; herÂ·oÂ·ine (_noun)_
*1*. 
a man or woman admired or idealized for their courage, outstanding achievements, or noble qualities
and then I added #2
2. Parthy and the rest of you that have shared your inspirational stories. :clap:


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## jwal10 (Jun 5, 2010)

We have 2 tanks at the off grid cabin, 1 for toilet, 1 for all the rest. Each system has a 100 gallon tank with 30' of leach line. Our spring is way up on the hill, it runs through a 2" PVC line down to the cabin. It feeds the mini hydro turbine that makes 24 volt power. That water is piped into the springhouse to keep it cool. The spring gives us running water at the house. No pumping. The solar power system is a small 4 battery 12 volt system. We have 1 LED 12 volt light in each room and 1 outlet in each room. We have a small 12v to 120 converter but it is seldom used. It shares a quick disconnect with my pickup. We do have a very small generator for emergency backup, a very old set with a Maytag engine. We heat our water and cook on a wood kitchen range. We are very comfortable here. It started as a get away property and got moved up to full time use. Now we have retired there. We have a more rustic property, but we are updating that one also. It is an old barn, rebuilt smaller using 3-8' bays of the original 6. The main floor posts had rotted off so we gave the first floor 8' headroom under the beams. The lower floor is a bunkhouse/storage area, upstairs was built into a small well insulated apartment, the water tank is in the attic, 30 gallons, filled with a hand pump. It was just a summer place but we are making it livable year around. Many people do not know what to do with so much quiet. We love it....James


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## longshot38 (Dec 19, 2006)

what province are you in Parthy? Im in Newfoundland and Labrador and i've never heard of a vapor barrier inspection, i will check on that tomorrow.

dean


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

longshot38 said:


> what province are you in Parthy? Im in Newfoundland and Labrador and i've never heard of a vapor barrier inspection, i will check on that tomorrow.
> 
> dean


Dean, when you check on the vapour barrier inspection codes you might also want to check on the air barrier inspection codes as well. In some provinces effective January 1st, 2012, the building codes changed. Now air barrier systems have become a separate inspection and the air barrier inspection needs to be booked separately from the previously combined insulation and vapour barrier inspection.


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## SugarMag (Jun 30, 2011)

Good for you!
I live similar, I have a rain water cistern and wood stove. Last winter I lived in a shell cabin while learning what to do. This winter I'll have the life of Riley, with insulation and all!
I can't say I was uncomfortable very much, maybe about 5 days all winter.
Actually, I find it kind of peaceful.
I like my little routine of bringing water in and out, and bringing wood in and ashes out.
I am looking forward to getting a fridge someday though. 
Sure does make life easier!


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

Paumon - I don't know what an air barrier is? Could you expand on that? 

I am in Manitoba. Vapour barrier is the poly that is over the insulation on the warm side that is picky. I have to use the acoustic sealant at all seams and the tuck tape only as a thing to keep ends finished to make it easier to drywall. I cannot (with my inspector, use the red tuck tape instead of the acoustic sealant (black gunk) just as an adjunct.

Greencounty - I have saved this thread to re-read once I do the plumbing. I took a serious look at what I have started (I have the roof vents and stack down through the floor that my dad helped me with before he got alzheimers and forgot how to do plumbing and am getting a small, and I say small idea of what I need to do....I have a lot of research and learnign to do, but have to just focus on each inspection as it comes right now). thanks. I will definately look into that and may have some questions once I get to that point.

Thanks to everyone who has replied to this thread. Believe me, I have read each and every post, even if I didn't personally reply to you.


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

SugarMag said:


> Good for you!
> I live similar, I have a rain water cistern and wood stove. Last winter I lived in a shell cabin while learning what to do. This winter I'll have the life of Riley, with insulation and all!
> I can't say I was uncomfortable very much, maybe about 5 days all winter.
> Actually, I find it kind of peaceful.
> ...


 
I started out with a bar fridge, and then my neighbour gave me their fairly new large fridge because they were getting a new one. Last winter I used a contractors heater that uses a special plug (that I rewired from the wire for the dryer) to use as supplement heat when it got to -40 below with an even lower wind chill for about a week, but only when I was home. It cost a lot of money.


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## logbuilder (Jan 31, 2006)

Your winter situation will change a lot for the better when you get the underfloor insulation in place. I lived one winter without it and could just not keep the house warm enough with the wood stove. After I put in the insulation and the wood flooring, it is just fine.


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## logbuilder (Jan 31, 2006)

A thought about crawl spaces. I think they are great. Mine is 20" below grade with 34" height. In the summer there is so much cool air down there that I keep wondering if there is not some way to use it. Here in western WA we don't generally have AC. It is only hot enough for it maybe 3 weeks a year but for those weeks, I sometimes wonder about this. In the winter, it is not nearly as cold under the house as outside. My wood stove does draw from under the house so that might help a bit. Beyond that, clueless.

Just rambling thoughts.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

parthy said:


> Paumon - I don't know what an air barrier is? Could you expand on that?


I won't attempt to personally expand on that, I'm not a contractor but my sons are contractors and it's through them that I learn the basics about construction and Canadian building codes. Some of them are quite different from building codes in America and other countries and even from province to province because of the many different climate conditions across Canada. 

There's information on internet though so I found these websites for you. They explain about air barriers and vapour barriers. There's more info if you google _"Canada building codes vapour barrier vs. air barrier"_ but a lot of it is on PDF files which I can't copy the links. These 4 are not PDF's. 

http://www.ecohome.net/guide/difference-between-air-barriers-vapour-barriers

http://www.brettsichellodesign.com/blog/Vapour-Barriers-and-Air-Tight-Building-Envelopes.php

http://www.naba.ca/technical_library/air_barrier_technical_library.php

http://www.wbdg.org/resources/airbarriers.php


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## bourbonred (Feb 27, 2008)

I think this concept of adjusting your level of comfort is very important to both prepping and happiness. The idea of storing a room full of toilet paper is a perfect example. Eventually, that paper will be gone. Why not adjust your level of comfort earlier and store something less disposable and more renewable. 
As happiness goes...My house is not as nice as other's houses I have visited. It is full of unfinished, in the process projects both inside and outside. I could be unhappy. I could push my husband to finish projects, nagging like an old hag. Or I could remember the settlers who pushed through this country. They were glad to have a house if they had one. Maybe their roof was sod. No windows, no plumbing, no running water, no electricity. Their floor was dirt. I like my house, it has a lot of character. When my DH finishes it, it will be lovely, and until then I am glad of what I have. Sometimes we are so blessed here in the US as to just be totally spoiled.


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## parthy (Mar 17, 2008)

Paumon said:


> I won't attempt to personally expand on that, I'm not a contractor but my sons are contractors and it's through them that I learn the basics about construction and Canadian building codes. Some of them are quite different from building codes in America and other countries and even from province to province because of the many different climate conditions across Canada.
> 
> There's information on internet though so I found these websites for you. They explain about air barriers and vapour barriers. There's more info if you google _"Canada building codes vapour barrier vs. air barrier"_ but a lot of it is on PDF files which I can't copy the links. These 4 are not PDF's.
> 
> ...


Ok, I know what you are talking about now. My son is a drywall/insulator and that doesn't affect me as I am residential. However, the new codes do apply to me if I install a heat ventilator recovery system. I am in limbo right now about that code. The last inspector who came and re-did my framing inspection (long story) said I was grandfathered under the old code that did not require one. That said, I don't have that in writing so we shall see.

I house-sat for 2 people over the last few years who had pre-fab homes with HRV systems. In both places a heat gun was left outside near a plug so that when it got to -20 below or lower, you could heat up the lock with heat gun in order to get the lock to unfreeze so you could get into the house. Not a great thing when you are miles away from anything warm. I had to use the heat gun on a regular basis.

They also had socks on the door handles to try and help the situation. REally??? socks???

I have told anyone in authority here that if I have to install an HRV system I will, but I won't be using it. It blows cold air and because we have crawl spaces, the unit hangs on the floor joices and gives me a headache from the noise.

I am prepared to do whatever I have to, just hope I don't have to.


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## logbuilder (Jan 31, 2006)

Here in WA state, they have a clean air regulation that says you need a whole house ventilation system. I installed one to pass inspection but it has been off ever since.


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## Paumon (Jul 12, 2007)

logbuilder said:


> A thought about crawl spaces. I think they are great. Mine is 20" below grade with 34" height. In the summer there is so much cool air down there that I keep wondering if there is not some way to use it. Here in western WA we don't generally have AC. It is only hot enough for it maybe 3 weeks a year but for those weeks, I sometimes wonder about this. In the winter, it is not nearly as cold under the house as outside. My wood stove does draw from under the house so that might help a bit. Beyond that, clueless.
> 
> Just rambling thoughts.


You can use that cool air. Put very small screened trap doors in the floor in places where there is no foot traffic. In summer when it's hot you open the trap doors to allow cold air to escape up from the crawl space. Put an oscillating fan in the crawl space to move air around down there and force the cool air up through the trap door opening. In winter you put insulation inside the openings and close the trap doors.


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## AngieM2 (May 10, 2002)

And to add to what Paumon is suggesting. I think having an open small window as high as you can would make the pull from the crawlspace opening to house work more.

It's the basic principle of how old Southern houses would use their windows. Bottoms opened on some, and top of windows opened where the hot air could escape.


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## mpillow (Jan 24, 2003)

We used to just turn the fan part on for the hot air furnace so the cool air in the duct work (under trailer) would move through. It helped tremendously!


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

Ernie said:


> Wasn't it Jack London who wrote about the vapour barrier and brave vapour barrier inspectors taming the wild north of Canada and making it safe for the pioneers?


For God's sake, Ernie....don't forget Farley Mowat !!

I bet Jack and Farley used to have their local inspectors on speed-dial.


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## Sawmill Jim (Dec 5, 2008)

logbuilder said:


> A thought about crawl spaces. I think they are great. Mine is 20" below grade with 34" height. In the summer there is so much cool air down there that I keep wondering if there is not some way to use it. Here in western WA we don't generally have AC. It is only hot enough for it maybe 3 weeks a year but for those weeks, I sometimes wonder about this. In the winter, it is not nearly as cold under the house as outside. My wood stove does draw from under the house so that might help a bit. Beyond that, clueless.
> 
> Just rambling thoughts.


This area I have only saw one house with a below grade deal .some northern contractor built it . I bet in this area his resell value is near o . If i got a hole under my house i want it to be a basement ,not a snake pit . :help:


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## plowhand (Aug 14, 2005)

Forerunner said:


> For God's sake, Ernie....don't forget Farley Mowat !!
> 
> I bet Jack and Farley used to have their local inspectors on speed-dial.


Don't you mean speed-trials. Folks around here would have reached behind the door if someone came to their place to "make sure stuff was built right to "specs".


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

I do marvel at the gullibility of our predecessors...... to have let things get started to come this far.....


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

plowhand said:


> Don't you mean speed-trials. Folks around here would have reached behind the door if someone came to their place to "make sure stuff was built right to "specs".


 psst...don't tell anyone,but that is a reason a fence and gate is going up as we speak-insurance agent wants to "pop" in and take pictures. I like touring the gardens in my jammies in the morning. And if I need to take a wee, well many here know about that, I sure ain't going to run up the hill to 'go', and the dogs I am not supposed to have...even thou all of my neighbors have yappers that bite and mine have never...but I have saved a few punks from sleding on my hill from the longhorn bull with that handy friend that hangs out everywhere round her.


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## farmgal (Nov 12, 2005)

GREENCOUNTYPETE said:


> you could also start using saw dust in your bucket , and save the holding tank pumping
> 
> 
> when you do plumb your drains if you can join all your drains from shower , sink , and such all but the toilet then run them to the 3 inch that your toilet is plumbed to. that way when your last inspection has happened you go down and cut that , install a set of valves so that when the ground thaws you go down there and direct all your grey water out the other drain pipe you installed before you graded the place , as a just encase drain.
> ...



Is this a septic tank or a holding tank? There are areas around here since we have so much ground water, that if you dont keep water in your septic tank and its fairly new, the tank will be displaced up out of the ground by the ground water.


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