# Are these GP mix?



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

I have recently lost a hen to a raccoon that pulled it under a gate and have had two hawk attacts recently. Fortunately, none of the hens or chicks were taken in the hawk attacks. I have had a couple of chicks disappear during the day so think it might have been hawks.

So, I have started keeping my eyes open for an LGD. These two are advertised at GP mixes and the pup is theirs. The owners don't know what they are mixed with but says they are used as LGDs.

I'm really leaning toward "no" but thought I would check with you knowledgable folks and see if they look like any breeds of LGD you have ever seen. 

Thanks all


----------



## Goatress (Feb 4, 2011)

Tsk tsk Dani as much as you are on this board by now you should know to follow your gut instinct and say NO to impulse buys like this. Owner "thinks" they are LGDs....gads gal...RED FLAG. 

RUN in the opposite direction. How much do you value your stock? If you do at all you will invest in a REAL LGD from a reputable source that can back up their dogs with proof that they will guard - not eat, maul or chase - your flock or herd.

Please.....buying an LGD is not done on a whim....this is supposed to be an investment in peace of mind and safety not chaos, death and destruction.... You will be taking a huge risk if you take these dogs with as many 'if's and unknowns behind this. I can't stop you from doing it but later I can always say "I told you so...." OK lecture over! Hugs, Brenda PS no personal offense meant to you just trying to save you grief...


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

I did say I was leaning toward no.  I even deleted the e-mails but got to wondering if maybe they really were mixes of LGD I hadn't seen. I was more just double checking my initial thought. I don't see GP in the parents. Oddly enough, that pup could pass for a GP/Anatolian mix.

I'm not in such a hurry I will just take anything. If I was that desperate, I would go pick up the 7 month old Anatolian/GP around the corner. The parents are working dogs and the pup was raised in the goat pen. Problem is, the mother and/or her brother killed most of their chickens not long after they got them. It could be lack of training, but I am not willing to take that chance. Like you said, I would rather be safe than have the dog that is supposed to be watching them, killing them.

Oh, I forgot to mention I was never thinking of taking the parents. They don't look like they are friendly. I like my animals friendly. I don't want a dog that thinks it has to guard the animals from me and that's how they look to me. 

No offense taken. I love your no nonsense approach. And I still want a Kangal one day!

*Thought I should add that I know a pup won't reliably guard my chickens and will take training and work and supervision. That's not a problem.


----------



## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Those are just plain MUTTS 

LOL

Unless you have other livestock you need to protect, you'd be just as well off to get a mixed breed medium to large puppy from a pound and train it to not harm your birds.

True LGD's aren't the best "yard dog" choice

One of the best "chicken hounds" I've ever owned was part Bloodhound and part Coonhound.


----------



## Looking4ewes (Apr 30, 2006)

I think that pup is the cutest thing ever. Why couldn't it be trained to be a poultry protecting yard dog?

@BFF-love the hound, great pic.


----------



## Ross (May 9, 2002)

I wonder if they are described as retreivers if someone is looking for that.


----------



## BarbadosSheep (Jun 27, 2011)

GP mix? they might have gotten close to a GP once, but that's about it. they look like retriever/terrier mix to me. Even if they are half pyr, you still have to be really careful with that. Only one parent had the instinct necessary to be good guardian dog, the other parent might have been a hound that wants to trail stuff, or a herding dog that wants to round the stock up. A mix of two LGD breeds would be fine, but not just a random mix of LGD with something else.


----------



## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

The one in the bottom picture definitely looks like a GP mix to me. Do the other ones have double dew claws on the back? And the heads of both the brownish red one and the bottom picture look like they have some LGD in them. The shapes are right.
The white hairy dog in the top pic looks like it has terrier in it to me. I wouldn't guess GP mix unless it has double dew claws and is HUGE. 
As far as the pup's protection ability? Even if she is a GP mix, you won't necessarily get a dog with no prey drive. The other mix can bring in prey drive.
If the puppy is free then I would take a chance on it. If you have to pay for it, then I really wouldn't buy it for an LGD. A pet? That's a personal choice, but I wouldn't waste money on it just because you don't know the mix. If the white furry dog turns out to be a poodle mix or a terrier mix, then there will be prey drive which would defeat the LGD idea.


----------



## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

Looking4ewes said:


> I think that pup is the cutest thing ever. Why couldn't it be trained to be a poultry protecting yard dog?
> 
> @BFF-love the hound, great pic.


LGDs have no prey drive. If a mix is with a bird dog or a breed with lots of prey drive, you can't train it out. It's a drive or an instinct. It's like trying to teach a duck to hate water.


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

I have a total of 2 acres so not a back yard kind of situation. I also have a couple of goats and horses. I plan to start expanding my goat herd in the next year. 

The other option is to fix the chicken area so it's preditor proof. Not such an easy thing. They have a coop in the middle of a large yard which is shared with goats. Their fence is stock panel to keep the goats in but let the chickens go pretty much where they want. That could be fixed but the hawks can still get them in the yard so we would have to build a completely enclosed area off of their coop. That would cost as much or more than a LGD. Not to mention a dog is so much more fun, don't you think?


----------



## Ross (May 9, 2002)

> That would cost as much or more than a LGD. Not to mention a dog is so much more fun, don't you think?


 Too many variables to say either way but long term a LGD is expensive enough and if it causes problems then the costs can be considerable. I'm not sure how much the chicken you lost is worth, but it is important to consider all your options. I'd say go with the fencing and save on dog food and vetting, but thats just my opinion.


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

I have been considering getting a LGD for a while. I was going to wait until spring before seriously searching. The loss of the most recent to a racoon and then seeing hawks on two different occasions prompted me to consider a LGD sooner rather than later. We have plans to sell and move to a larger property in the not too distant future. Hopefully within the next 3 years. So, if we have more of a predator problem, they will be mature and trained.

I know it seems like I'm looking for a dog on a whim. I'm not. I have been considering this for a good while and have been reading boards on them for several months. I'm just considering moving up my plans. That's all. 

I was never seriously considering this pup after seeing the parents but did want to check with the experts on LGDs before completely rejecting her. For all I know, someone would tell me thay had a GP crossed with a xxxxx and it looked just like that!

I do thank everyone for the input. I know I probably seem a bit flaky sometimes, but I'm honestly not.


----------



## Goatress (Feb 4, 2011)

Ross is right.

LGD's are not about 'fun' as much as they are a lifelong commitment, a huge responsibility.....

LGD's = huge responsibility that should never be taken lightly or done on a whim....I'm for fencing in the chickens...you don't really need an LGD as much as you need to contain or surround your chickens with 'invasion proof' type of fence or netting....just my .02 cents worth.


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

Brenda, I don't mean they are fun in a light way. I promise. Have you ever watched Ice Road Truckers? There is one episode where Lisa makes a comment about the job being fun and others did not take that well taking it that she took the whole job lightly. She meant it more like it was something she really enjoyed and couldn't believe her luck that she was being paid to do it.

I also will usually pick a young, green or completely unstarted horse because that is more "fun" to me than getting a been there done that horse. Taking a young horse and turning it into what you want is challanging but rewarding. Not to mention you don't have to undo anything someone else has done.

That's how I look at having a puppy. It's a fun challange to take a blank slate and turn it into a good and productive citizen. Up until one of my girls got too old, I could take both doberman for a run while I was on my bike. You can't do that with two 80lb dogs with high prey drive if you take owning those dogs lighly. KWIM?

Some people would rather cut off a body part than start their own horse or train a pup from scratch. To me, it's kind of fun.

Now, I am willing to bow to the masters if you think I don't need a LGD.


----------



## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

Well, I don't know about anyone else, but my LGDs are fun. I really like them.


----------



## BarbadosSheep (Jun 27, 2011)

I really like my LGDs too, and I do think they are fun. they are huge, gorgeous and very sweet dogs. What's not to love about that? It is a lot of work getting them ready to be full-time LGDs, but I enjoy them so much it's worth it.

One other thing I forgot to mention earlier. don't worry much if the parents don't seem really friendly. That's really common with guardian breeds. It's not a bad reflection on them, it's just how they are. they tend to be stand-offish towards strangers. Not snarling vicious (That I would avoid), but they may not seem to anxious to make friends with you either.


----------



## HappyFarmer (Jun 17, 2006)

They'd make nice house pets.

HF


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

Sorry, didn't mean to disappear. My internet went out.

I really appreciate all input. Whatever I do, I take animal ownership very seriously. If the pup or dog didn't work as a LGD, then I will have another house pet. I have a large yard and could take him/her with me when I ride my horse.


----------



## Looking4ewes (Apr 30, 2006)

"LGDs have no prey drive"

Sorry to go off topic, but is that really true? Why is there so many chicken-killing LGDs then? Also, how do you explain the poultry guarding hound that BFF offered?


----------



## mekasmom (Jan 19, 2010)

They play when they are puppies. And they like to eat. But they don't run rabbits or trail deer, etc. They aren't like retrievers or beagles.


----------



## Fowler (Jul 8, 2008)

Looking4ewes said:


> "LGDs have no prey drive"
> 
> Sorry to go off topic, but is that really true? Why is there so many chicken-killing LGDs then? Also, how do you explain the poultry guarding hound that BFF offered?


They will chase and play them to death yes. 
And it looks to me that in BFF's pic, the cat is guarding the chicks from the Bloodhood...LMAO!!!! J/K BFF


----------



## BarbadosSheep (Jun 27, 2011)

Exactly. I always say that even though they don't have a prey drive, they DO have a play drive and chickens are great squeaky toys. Once they get in the habit, it's hard to break them. Pups have to be supervised with livestock of any type while they are young and playful so bad habits don't get started. 

Some odd breeds end up being good LGDs, but it's really hit and miss. It's better to start out with known breed of LGD because at least most of them are born with the right instincts.


----------



## sawman65 (Sep 8, 2011)

Bearfootfarm said:


> Those are just plain MUTTS
> 
> LOL
> 
> ...


 i have also taken the hound path for my flock i got a redbone x walker hound


----------



## HappyFarmer (Jun 17, 2006)

Wondering if, or how many, livestock lives will be lost before the dog is determined to not be of lgd quality.

HF


----------



## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

HF, if you are talking to me, I am not getting that pup. I was posting because they didn't look like GP mixes to me at all but wanted to make sure before passing. 

If I do get a pup, he/she will not be left with the livestock unsupervised. I'm going to have a pen next to the goats and chickens for the pup when I'm not out there to supervise.


----------

