# The razor wire thread...



## Mike in Ohio (Oct 29, 2002)

Just got to thinking that I don't remember seeing a thread on razor wire and figured I'd start one. After googling I see that there are different diameter coils available as well as different finishes (galvanized vs stainless).

So, any useful comments or thoughts? I'm thinking a few rolls might be potentially useful if I ever have some extra dollars floating around.....

Mike


----------



## sandc (Apr 26, 2010)

Just so happens that I was in a army surplus store a week ago and ran across a box full of concertina gloves. I bought several pairs for future use. Finding the wire if a need ever arises will be easier than finding the proper handling equipment.


----------



## JuliaAnn (Dec 7, 2004)

Razor ribbon/concertina wire can be easily defeated by someone flopping a piece of carpet over the section they want to crawl over. Ask me how I know...


----------



## Mike in Ohio (Oct 29, 2002)

I'll bite..... How do you know? Was anyone shooting at you while you were flopping the carpet over the concertina? How long a frontage did the wire cover? Was it a single set of coils or multiple/stacked? Was the intent of the configuration to "stop" individuals or to channel them by making alternative approaches more appealing?

Just curious, not intending to be confrontational.

Mike


----------



## JuliaAnn (Dec 7, 2004)

Quote "not intending to be confrontational.""

BS. Yes, you are.

Sorry dude, but I'm not a thief. My business was broken into, that's all.

Never mind. Have a nice day.


----------



## Mike in Ohio (Oct 29, 2002)

Apologies for provoking your hostile attitude JuliaAnn. I don't see anywhere that I explicitly or implicitly indicated you are a thief. You invited a response in your post.... if you weren't interested in providing details, why did you post the response that you did in the first place? Did you truly think that it wouldn't invite additional questions? Again, apologies dudette for ruffling your feathers. 

So JuliaAnns use of concertina appears to have been in an urban/suburban environment for a business facility that sounds like it was unattended at the time - with something which someone obviously wanted inside. I'm guessing that the concertina was probably relatively small loops on top of a wall or fence.

My potential intended use would be in a rural environment in a true SHTF situation where my goal would be to dissuade individuals from going certain ways and incentivizing them to go other ways. For example, channel people towards using a particular drive or path.

I have 14 - 80 rod rolls of (12 1/2 gauge 2 barb) barb wire in the barn (we have a lot of fence with more going in) that could be used but I don't think that is as "aggressive" as razor wire. I like to keep a few rolls handy. Could be used in combination with razor I'm guessing. Razor does appear to be a bit more spendy than barb.

I suppose I could always drag rusty old (field fence and barb wire) fence tangles to those spots. Like many other farms we have a couple of piles that even the recyclers don't want.

Just kind of thinking out loud.

Mike


----------



## wendle (Feb 22, 2006)

Never really thought about using something like that, but do have barb wire. Barb wire can be handled though with care. That got me to thinking the reason I don't generally use barb , because the livestock and dogs. If used, I would likely have it high on a fence. The down side of that would be a person with bolt cutters could get through other fence like chain link. Either way they will be slowed down hopefully long enough to be noticed. 
Another thing to keep handy would be bolt cutters, hacksaw and wire cutters. If things got bad tools would be in short supply.


----------



## MelTX (Aug 25, 2009)

JuliaAnn said:


> Quote "not intending to be confrontational.""
> 
> BS. Yes, you are.
> 
> ...




I didn't see him as confrontational and he didn't accuse you of being a thief. I believe he was just prompting people to think from a different perspective. It is assumed (on this blog anyway...) that if you have the need to defeat concertina wire, you have been put in a position to flee oppression or evil, not instigate it. If you want to survive, you can't think in a box. "Carpet" might not be available or if available you might get killed trying to use it. 

But, thanks for the carpet tip. It is a good option to be considered.


----------



## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Around here we have the "mesquite option". If you have mesquite, mow along the fence line and put up your fence wire then don't mow the mesquite but let it grow up into the fence. If it gets too big over time, just top it and it will fill out again.

You could do the same with any thorny plant that does well in your area.


----------



## salmonslayer (Jan 4, 2009)

We trained to cross concertina in the military and it can be done with carpet, burlap, the lowest ranking guy prostrating on the wire while you run across etc. but most zombies will be looking for the easy target and the true value of concertina or razor wire would be to delay, deter, or channelize...with emphasis on deter.

A tripple lay of concertina staked with T-posts would be a formidible obstacle. I have about 400 feet of road frontage on my property and confess I have thought about this as well if things go south. I think even a standard field fence with a couple coils of concertina out front would be pretty effective. I have also been batting around some ideas to block my driveway ....


----------



## Fat Charlie (Sep 9, 2010)

Mike in Ohio said:


> So JuliaAnns use of concertina appears to have been in an urban/suburban environment for a business facility that sounds like it was unattended at the time - with something which someone obviously wanted inside. I'm guessing that the concertina was probably relatively small loops on top of a wall or fence.
> 
> My potential intended use would be in a rural environment in a true SHTF situation where my goal would be to dissuade individuals from going certain ways and incentivizing them to go other ways. For example, channel people towards using a particular drive or path.


You've got it right, Mike. It's an obstacle. Nothing more, nothing less. It won't keep anyone in or out, but it will delay and make them wonder if going that way is worth the bother. The military (and prisons) use it as an obstacle to be covered by sensors and weapons. Civilians tend to use it as if it were a magical wall. 

JuliaAnn- that wasn't to criticize you. It sounds like hopping a fence was only step one of what they did to you. It's a great illustration, though, that fences, walls and locks only delay and annoy the bad guys. I've watched guys wriggle under triple stacked concertina just to retrieve a soccer ball that was kicked out of bounds.


----------



## rancher1913 (Dec 5, 2008)

its only good as a stoper if the party is rushed. i've put up miles of the crap and seen it defeated several times. one inmate on a dare climed inside a roll hanging from a fence about 10 feet in the air and flipped me the bird because i told him it couldn't be done, he did not even get scratched, took him about 15 minutes. he was part of a crew installing the stuff.


----------



## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Concertina wire screams out... there's something very valuable behind me.

Something to think about.

Never tried, but doubt if it'll stop bullets. Zombies yes. Humans with rifles, no.

Imho, if someone's got that close to your 'hideout', you've already lost the game, unless you have a concrete reinforced bunker, with remote controlled firing options.

Saw pallets of concertina/razor wire on a recent Govt. Liquidations auction... went for minimum bid.


----------



## oregon woodsmok (Dec 19, 2010)

Barb wire is easy and so is razor wire. One little set of bolt cutters and it's all over. Electric fence would work slightly better. A lot of folks are afraid to touch it.

I suggest a nice hedge of osage orange, rosa rugosa, or himalayan blackberry. People appear to be programed to go around the bushes and trees and they don't like to push through a tangle of nasty thorns.

Yes, you can get through thorn bushes, but the first impulse is going to be to find an easier way around. I've never seen anybody deliberately try to walk through a blackberry thicket and I've seen lots of folks go through barbed wire.


----------



## Mike in Ohio (Oct 29, 2002)

For the folks in favor of planting hedges, I'm looking at spots where I don't normally want hedges but would like a barrier if the S truly HTF. For example, our front lake is along the road. Behind the lake the hill is steep enough that it verges on being a cliff. There is about 100 feet of grassy area between the lake and one of the drives up into our place. On the other side of the drive is a creek with low marshy ground. That 100 foot of grassy space is one of the gaps I'm concerned about. It gives access to the shoulder of the hill as cover for someone with ill intent. The grassy space can be covered from up the hill. Hope this makes sense.

If you really want to plant something that will stop folks, I recommend multiflora rose.... about 10 foot wide strip. Just don't plant it anywhere near my place please.

Mike


----------



## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

i also think you want to blend , rather than stick out with concertina wire 

you want fencing that looks a lot like other fences in your area with the extras hidden or part of the plant life like briaer.

maintain the some one may live here but they or are of no great importance or consiquence

most man made barriers , fences, ect are fairly easy to defeat , at best they slow some one down or they decide that it isn't worth the time.

if you had a 6 foot chain link or sinilar with several large dogs most anyone but the most deturmined would stay away 

fences and concertina only keep prisinors in at the prison because they have gaurds in towers watching them 

i would spend less worrying about your fence and more time working on a good survalence system with spares backup parts ect then the people to watch it if the time came if you were that worried


----------



## salmonslayer (Jan 4, 2009)

> most man made barriers , fences, ect are fairly easy to defeat , at best they slow some one down or they decide that it isn't worth the time.


 I agree but for me the purpose IS to make someone decide to find an easier mark. 6 foot chain link with dogs is also easy to defeat if you have a determined adversary but its like locking your doors, you do that to deter the opportunists not the professional or determined thief.

It really takes a combination of deterence, avoidance (i.e., lots of people around here seem to be right proud of all their stuff and leave everything out in plain view for everyone to see), and surveillance to protect your property. 

Personally I dont plan on putting concertina up unless things really get bad but I admit I do enjoy the planning and thinking about the various possibilities!! I have even had a vague plan to put a couple of 20 foot containers on either side of the drive with a 40 footer across the top with some type of gate. Mostly just wishful thinking but you know...who knows?


----------



## shaycool (Sep 1, 2004)

Depending where you live, there maybe legal issues with razor wire...

http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/12/letter_re_the_legalities_of_pr.html

http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/12/two_letters_re_the_legalities.html


----------



## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

shaycool said:


> Depending where you live, there maybe legal issues with razor wire...
> 
> http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/12/letter_re_the_legalities_of_pr.html
> 
> http://www.survivalblog.com/2010/12/two_letters_re_the_legalities.html


I don't have razor wire, but if I did, and some poor peace loving soul were to be caught in it, trying to rob me of whatever, the only issue I'd have is do I waste good protein by digging a hole in the ground, or spread the wealth with my coyote, buzzard, and feral hog friends.

I really wouldn't worry about legalities, in a TEOTW scenario. Hopefully one is on good terms with all the neighbors, and everyone knows you shouldn't sneak around. Now, morality, yes, that's always an issue, both now and 'later'. But that'd be another thread...


----------

