# Dog recommendation 1/2 Acre lot with a sturdy chicken tractor.



## heliotropicmoth (Mar 5, 2010)

Hello, 

My fiance and I are trying to decide on a dog breed to live on our 1/2 acre fenced yard. We will have a large chicken tractor this year and rabbit pens next year. My main concern for getting the dogs is to protect against the raccoon and possum population around us as well as other smaller rodents and whatnot. 

I have built a insulated dog condo next to the house. They will also have access to a detached garage with supplemental heating if we get another winter like this one. We are looking for a breed that isn't large like most LGD's, we don't have the room or high enough fences, which are 4 ft. We are looking for cold hardy, medium sized dogs that will do well around livestock. The dog house is built for three medium dogs no taller than 27 inches. We are in USDA zone 6a.

We are thinking about German Shepards, Chow Chow's, Norwegian Elk Hounds, Shiba Inu's, Australian Shepards, American Fox Hounds and Samoyeds. Or any combination / mixes of these. Any reasons against any of these or other suggestions? 

We are dedicated to training them properly and spending the time it takes to do so. We will be getting puppies and raising them up with our livestock. Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. 

Thanks, 

Patrick


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

1/2 acre is small. I would start with an electric fence around the area where the chickens and rabbits will be. Dogs that are more likely to kill the livestock rather than guard them include chow chows, elk hounds, shiba inus, and samoyeds. Australian shepherds are going to be to busy and active. Fox hounds are hounds, they will be noisy and require a lot of hard running exercise. 

You need a dog with low exercise requirements that will guard bark (a smaller version of a Great Pyr). Terriers are great small or medium guard dogs, but they were bred to kill small animals. You may be able to train a puppy to leave the chickens and rabbits alone, but don't bet on it. A sheltie may be a good choice, or a Dobermann. Most dogs that would be good in this situation are going to be dogs who need to be part of the family, so you can't just stick the dog in the yard and forget about him.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

You wrote "them". Get one at a time. It will make training easier.


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## terradura (Mar 19, 2012)

Look into English Shepherds. Get one and train it, then get another when the first is about a year old. But like Maura said, these dogs want to bond closely with you and be part of the family.


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## Cookie2 (Feb 21, 2014)

Our black flat-hair retriever was an angel around our chickens and turkeys. He was exceptionally protective - a little too much, though. He thrived in protecting the chickens so much that he barked periodically all night long! Of course, that is when most of the predators come around (foxes, raccoons, etc) so that is when the dog was most watchful. Needless to say, that was quite annoying - for us and the neighbors.

A mutt that is a blend of any of the working breeds would be best (avoiding beagles since they are 'barky' by nature). I prefer rescue dogs - usually around 2-yrs old to avoid the problems that come with training a puppy. You can test the dog with the chickens before you commit by either fostering the dog first or by bringing a chicken with you to see how the dog reacts.


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

for that size lot out of the breeds you mentioned the Chow would be the best (not so human dependent, not huge excercise requirement, good guardian tendencies)... the other breeds will either need additional excercise -- or like the Shiba will have fairly high prey drive and will need alot of work training against that (their natural tendencies).... Chow- lab mix would be really nice....


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## heliotropicmoth (Mar 5, 2010)

The dogs will not have access to the chickens or rabbits which will be in a large chicken tractor and a raised rabbit hutch. We prefer to train puppies. Exercise will not be an issue, we are both very active and plan on including the dogs on the morning and evening walks / hikes / runs. We are just trying to find a good cold weather breed that will protect our livestock and alert us if anything gets into the fenced yard. No electric fence will be needed since the livestock will have predator protection in the forms mentioned above. We do not want to get one at a time. The plan is to get two this spring and add another the next year. Right now we are thinking about a Australian shepherd / Collie mix of some sort. Does anyone have experience with these breeds?


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

A dog with a high predator or herding drive will make it his mission to get into the chicken tractor and rabbit hutches. Even if they can't break in, they will stress out the animals. The Australian shepherd, as well as the collie are herding breeds. I would trust a rough coated collie over the Aussie.

Your puppies will be babies, you can't just put them in the yard and hope for the best. You need a dog that is not a 'smart' dog, but more middle of the road. You don't need a highly active dog. Actually, a rottweiler might work for you. And get ONE.


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## heliotropicmoth (Mar 5, 2010)

Why would you think we would "just put them in the yard and hope for the best."? A rottweiler would be a very bad choice for an out door dog in my climate. I think two dedicated people can train two puppies at the same time. What specific arguments do you have against getting two puppies at once?


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## terradura (Mar 19, 2012)

_Right now we are thinking about a Australian shepherd / Collie mix of some sort. Does anyone have experience with these breeds?_

Again, I suggest the English Shepherd breed (aka Farm Collies). They are lower energy than a lot of herding breeds. They are a herding breed, but kind of "herding lite" -- they are not obsessive/compulsive. They do not have a strong prey drive (at least our two don't) and their main interest seems to be to figure out what their owner wants them to do and then do it. They will alert to anything out of the ordinary. Ours love cold weather.
I've had a variety of dogs over the years (decades) and none were so compelled to please nor as bonded to us as these English Shepherds have been. I wonder why I didn't find them sooner. If you include them on walks and other activities that you mention, you will have not only a devoted friend, but an eager helper.


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## heliotropicmoth (Mar 5, 2010)

Thanks terradura, 

I think that is the breed we are going to go with. I found this website on another forum, great info. http://www.farmcollie.org/


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## mrs whodunit (Feb 3, 2012)

We have a lab that keep our chickens safe. The neighbors loose their chickens to predators we don't.

She does sleep inside at night. We also have donkeys that I am sure help but they are on the other side of the property.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

You need to put your location on your profile. It will show up in the upper right corner of all your posts. This way, people can give you advice on gardening, etc. for your area. Rottweilers are from Germany and they do fine in the cold.

If you get two puppies they will bond to each other. It is much easier to train one and learn from your mistakes before getting the second.


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## CAjerseychick (Aug 11, 2013)

X2 on not getting 2 pups simultaneously... for a lot of reasons... its called "littermate syndrome" and you want these to be your pets as well as protectors too....
You could even do what we did and get a pup one year and then another the next- it worked great! Second pup took to the first like a big brother, they were inseperable their whole lives....as well as great family pets and companions (boxers).....


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## Squeaky McMurdo (Apr 19, 2012)

Jack Russels make great farm dogs. Mine is best friends with my baby goats. She would probably kill a chick, but she ignores my chickens especially when they're in the run. If you have the time to excercise and play with one they are content to lounge around the rest of the time but are protective of their things. My place is 3/4 acre.

For her size she is fearless. She's a smooth coated shorty Jack so not very cold tolerant or big, but she chased a huge German Shepard and his Lab buddy out of our front yard and now they stay on the other side of the road in their wanderings even when she's not outside. Lol. A wire coated taller JRT might work for you. AKC calls them Parson Russells and they are as tall as they are long, so would have a more visible presence.

Would try to get pups at least 6 months apart if not a greater gap. I've seen littermate syndrome first hand. My brother-in-law got two of my Lab's brothers to train as hunting dogs. My girl Cammy only visited them and she was easy to train because she wanted to please me. Meanwhile her brothers were difficult to train. If you separated them they would learn things sometimes but they instantly forgot everything the moment they were back together and were more interested in playing with each other than having anything to do with people. Cammy on the other hand would play with them but instantly did as she was asked.

9 years later I still have Cammy....her brothers were mischievous, roamed, and lived short lives.


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## Lucky S Ranch (Feb 21, 2014)

Interesting about the littermate syndrome. http://paws4udogs.wordpress.com/2012/03/30/littermate-syndrome/

What about a Blue Heeler?

I am in the same boat as you. I am moving to a place with a 30 acre pasture. I plan on having a good size chicken flock and might get into meat goats. I am not the biggest dog person but it would sure be nice to have something protect the yard/animals. Seeing on how I land borders BLM land. I guess there are coyotes?

I just am not sure about getting a HUGE pyrenees? 

I was more interested in border collie, blue heeler type size dogs.

But I have always liked the jack russell terriers. So I might have to put them in the mix also.

But I guess the one nice thing about a pyrenees is it would basically live with the animals. The other ones would be a little of both inside and outside dogs?

decisions, decisions.


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## heliotropicmoth (Mar 5, 2010)

Thanks for the input. We are reconsidering our decision to get two puppies at once. My main concern was having one dog alone for a season. I guess if we decide to go that route it will just have to make friends with the chickens. Updated my profile, thanks Maura.


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