# Your cream separator questions!



## Heritagefarm

Got one? Post it here, I can help you! If not, I have several other people I know who will probably know! Know someone who knows someone who knows something about separators? I'd like to hear!
Good day all,
Ted


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## Cheryl aka JM

Oh! Oh! Thats ME! I have questions! I was thinking about creating a post with my questions but you've already created one for me to ask in. Thanks!

so~
1. How does a cream separator work? I just don't entirely understand what is happening and when I try to look at pics of them online they are not clear enough for me to see what the parts really are.

2. Wow are they expensive! Why? They do something really impressive and complicated? Guess this should be part of question one.

3. Is there a big difference between the hand crank ones and the electric ones? Some of the hand crank ones ALMOST come down where I might be able to justify the cost~ but the electric are really expensive.

4. Where should we be looking for the best prices on separators?

5. When you use a cream separator does it leave the milk like grocery skim milk~ looks like milk but doesn't taste like milk anymore? Specifically asking about goats milk but would like to know about cows milk too.

6. The cream you get when you use a separator~ this is considered "Heavy cream" "light cream" "Half and Half"?

I'll probably think of more questions. Hope thats not too many to start with. Thank you!


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## HomersGoatLady

I've got a question. I have an old Montgomery Ward hand crank table top model from 1953-1954. It works great! Much easier to clean and use than the old International Harvester stand up model I had before. My question is...how do you adjust it to control the thickness of the cream? I'm separating cow's milk right now and it gives me cream that is thick enough to hold a spoon straight up without falling over.


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## Heritagefarm

Cheryl aka JM said:


> Oh! Oh! Thats ME! I have questions! I was thinking about creating a post with my questions but you've already created one for me to ask in. Thanks!
> 
> so~
> 1. How does a cream separator work? I just don't entirely understand what is happening and when I try to look at pics of them online they are not clear enough for me to see what the parts really are.
> *I do not how the exact physics of how they work. On most separators, the milk goes out of supply can and into the bowl (see http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/4543532559/), where the milk is separated from the cream.
> *
> 2. Wow are they expensive! Why? They do something really impressive and complicated? Guess this should be part of question one.
> *Antique separators are usually pretty cheap. They are a farm implement, thus with use their value goes down, and they are an antique and their value goes up, making an equilibrium of sorts (not precisely true, just what I think). Yes, they new ones are VERY expensive. Impressive? They are amazing.*
> 
> 3. Is there a big difference between the hand crank ones and the electric ones? Some of the hand crank ones ALMOST come down where I might be able to justify the cost~ but the electric are really expensive.
> *The electric ones would be the ones to wear out first (the motors). Most have an attachment for a hand crank, though.*
> 4. Where should we be looking for the best prices on separators?
> *Depends on your area. I use a google alert for all of US craigslist, and am usually alerted to separators (although I posted one for sale 3 times and it never showed up, ACK!)*
> 5. When you use a cream separator does it leave the milk like grocery skim milk~ looks like milk but doesn't taste like milk anymore? Specifically asking about goats milk but would like to know about cows milk too.
> *I haven't come into much contact with store milk, so wouldn't know. Unless there is something wrong with the bowl, it will take all of the cream out.*
> 6. The cream you get when you use a separator~ this is considered "Heavy cream" "light cream" "Half and Half"?
> *Depends on what the bowl is set to do.*
> 
> I'll probably think of more questions. Hope thats not too many to start with. Thank you![/QUOTE


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## Heritagefarm

HomersGoatLady said:


> I've got a question. I have an old Montgomery Ward hand crank table top model from 1953-1954. It works great! Much easier to clean and use than the old International Harvester stand up model I had before. My question is...how do you adjust it to control the thickness of the cream? I'm separating cow's milk right now and it gives me cream that is thick enough to hold a spoon straight up without falling over.


If you open the bowl there will be a disk with ridges, and it has a small screw at the top. Find a square object the adjust it with. (hex keys don't work) Would you like the manual? I've got a copy I bought from an amish guy (so he probably wants me to just send your bussiness his way but I'll give you a photocopy!)


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## Cheryl aka JM

Thank you!
Looking on ebay I see a lot of plastic handcrank ones coming out of the Ukraine. They are not cheap~ but less expensive than others I'm seeing at $61 plus $36 shipping. Anyone tried any of these? Any good?


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## Heritagefarm

I'd recommend those only if you want to send something else to the landfill in a year or two. If you only have a couple goats, I could see why you'd want to spend as little money as possible. Someone I talked to said theirs broke in a year, but I sure they usually last a little longer.
$61 is a good price.


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## mosepijo

The lady I get my milk from just bought a $600 cream separator, Anyway she gave me a quart of the cream the other day and it was as thick as butter. Did not pour at all. You had to scoop it out. It seemed more like butter than cream. It really tastes like a combination of the two. I don't think it would whip at all for whip cream.

Can a separator turn it into butter?


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## Heritagefarm

A separator can make very thick cream, but it will not actually make butter. She just has her separator set on a too thick of setting...


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## f4icraig

Hello Ted,
I saw your thread about an offer to send a copy of the manual when I goggled
Wards separators. 
I just got the separator. It turns freely but I see it has no oil in the bottom and is a tad rusty looking through the hole in the side. Is there suppose to be rubber plug in that hole? 
I did a bunch of research yesterday to find out what kind of oil I should use. Looking at oil cans for sale on EBay I saw the oil could be used on all kinds of things so I'm guess it would be similar to 3-in-1 oil? 
Any help is appreciated! 
Craig


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## myminifarm

HI, I also found this thread while searching for a montgomery ward cream separator manual. I just bought one & it does not come with it, any help would be appreciated, I have never used one before. This is a hand crank one.
Thank you,


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## Heritagefarm

Hi,
Just PM me your email and I'll send you a copy.


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## myminifarm

My cream separator arrived today. We put it together & thought everything was there but there is a small round hole (that looks like it is supposed to be there) in the side of the "bowl chamber" but the milk kept coming out of that hole. Not sure if it is supposed to have a plug or something in it?
Thank you,
Jessica
[email protected]


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## myminifarm

Here is a link to the pics that shows a pipe cleaner sticking out of the hole that the milk is leaking from

Cream Separator pictures by myminifarm - Photobucket


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## Heritagefarm

Hi,
Yes, that is the bowl chamber and no, milk is not supposed to come out right there! Before you run a bunch of milk through, run a little water through and make sure it comes out of the spouts. Now run through a couple things:
A. Make sure that the holes in the side of the centrifuge (bowl) line up with the spout's interior.
B. Make sure you get it all the way up to 60 rpm before turning the milk on!
and C. tighten the centrifuge some more.
Hope this helps!


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## myminifarm

Thank you, yeah, I don't think we've been getting it up to 60rpm


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## mlawless

I was wondering if you could use a cream separator to separate out whey from liquid whey byproduct.


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## Heritagefarm

I have never heard of such a use. It is entirely dependent on the weights of the two different substances. If the wieghts were similar to the weights of milk (skim) and cream, I would say give it a go. Otherwise, I would say it wouldn't work. Whey, from my understanding, it what is left after cheese is made - which means all particulate solids would be removed from said milk. This would render the whey most likely way lighter than milk?


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## Phag58

Good morning...just joined the Homesteading sight and found this thread right off through the search and hoping you can help. I purchased an electric Delaval table top cream separator a couple of months ago, still in excellent working condition. I buy raw goat milk and have been separating with a Delaval Jr. crank top previous to finding the electric. My problem is this: the return milk creates a foam that is almost like whipped cream and there's quite a lot of it. With my cream adjustment I get a quart of cream off of two gallons of milk that is excellent and I have no foaming troubles with it, the milk however is another story. I've had just a slight foam with the crank model, but more like you'd have with a fresh milking in the pail...what I'm getting from the electric is scoopable and thick...like whipped cream. Any thoughts, suggestions, or ideas of how to fix this problem or is this something that occurs with the model in question. I'm attaching a pic of model which I'm thinking is around a 1950's. Thanks in advance for any help you can give!


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## terri9630

Cheryl aka JM said:


> Oh! Oh! Thats ME! I have questions! I was thinking about creating a post with my questions but you've already created one for me to ask in. Thanks!
> 
> so~
> 1. How does a cream separator work? I just don't entirely understand what is happening and when I try to look at pics of them online they are not clear enough for me to see what the parts really are.
> It works by centrificial force. Not exactly sure how though.
> 2. Wow are they expensive! Why? They do something really impressive and complicated? Guess this should be part of question one.
> They just separate the cream.
> 3. Is there a big difference between the hand crank ones and the electric ones? Some of the hand crank ones ALMOST come down where I might be able to justify the cost~ but the electric are really expensive.
> I bought mine off of ebay from a lady in the Ukraine. I think I paid $125+shipping for the electric one and a bit less for the hand crank one. Both work well.
> 4. Where should we be looking for the best prices on separators?
> Check ebay.
> 5. When you use a cream separator does it leave the milk like grocery skim milk~ looks like milk but doesn't taste like milk anymore? Specifically
> asking about goats milk but would like to know about cows milk too.
> My husband likes skim milk and he doesn't complain about it. The separators have an adjustment screw so you can take out more or less cream. I've found that 1tsp of cream per cup of skim milk is _almost_ 2%.
> 6. The cream you get when you use a separator~ this is considered "Heavy cream" "light cream" "Half and Half"?
> That one I don't know. I've never bought cream from the store.
> I'll probably think of more questions. Hope thats not too many to start with. Thank you!


Hope that helps. Oh, I have goats.


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## terri9630

Cheryl aka JM said:


> Thank you!
> Looking on ebay I see a lot of plastic handcrank ones coming out of the Ukraine. They are not cheap~ but less expensive than others I'm seeing at $61 plus $36 shipping. Anyone tried any of these? Any good?



I've had a hand crank one for 3 years and an electric one for 2 years now. Both still work fine.


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## Mary-R

Hi, the label with the motor specs was not imprinted and the ink is long gone. I need more info to replace the cord with the correct type.

Also, what kind of oil would this equipment need? At only 60ish RPM, something pretty common should work reasonably well. 

From the restoration standpoint, is there a type of OEM paint that could be applied to keep that maroon color but not damage any 'antique' value?

Thanks!


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## CircleStarRanch

I figured out the fat setting for the cream on my Ukranian separator. I am still tweaking it tho - having trouble making butter from the goat-milk cream. I guess I need to make it more "fatty". The doe I am milking atm is in the later part of her lactation cycle for this year. We will be breeding her this month (August), so we will be drying her off in Mid-November/December for a January kidding. We will be back in milk the end of January, 

My question is: Will I have to readjust the fat setting after she is freshened? 

Thanks in advance
-Dutch


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## SlavicBeautyNet

CircleStarRanch said:


> I figured out the fat setting for the cream on my Ukranian separator. I am still tweaking it tho - having trouble making butter from the goat-milk cream. I guess I need to make it more "fatty". The doe I am milking atm is in the later part of her lactation cycle for this year. We will be breeding her this month (August), so we will be drying her off in Mid-November/December for a January kidding. We will be back in milk the end of January,
> 
> My question is: Will I have to readjust the fat setting after she is freshened?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> -Dutch


I always keep my separator set up for highest fat in cream if I'm planning to do butter. If you need to have some cream for coffee or anything else (not so fat), just add a bit of skimmed milk back to it


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## SlavicBeautyNet

check out the blog post "Separating Liquid Gold" on internet. It is very informative about adjusting cream thickness in the cream separator

we made this video to help understand how to operate a cream separator

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA75kHoQvak[/ame]


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## Heritagefarm

Mary-R said:


> Hi, the label with the motor specs was not imprinted and the ink is long gone. I need more info to replace the cord with the correct type.
> 
> Also, what kind of oil would this equipment need? At only 60ish RPM, something pretty common should work reasonably well.
> 
> From the restoration standpoint, is there a type of OEM paint that could be applied to keep that maroon color but not damage any 'antique' value?
> 
> Thanks!


That depends on the separator type. Most American separators are going to be able to use any regular power cord; the only thing that could damage the motor would be the voltage coming out of the wall being wrong, and there's nothing you can do about that!

I generally recommend lightweight oil, such as sewing machine, or hydraulic oil. 

I'm not too sure on the paint - I'd check with an antiques restorer. I would find a high quality metal paint, match it as closely as you can with color matching services, and tape off certain parts and then spray with a high-end car paint sprayer. Aim for the $100 mark - that should be a good enough sprayer to do the job nicely.

HF


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## Heritagefarm

CircleStarRanch said:


> I figured out the fat setting for the cream on my Ukranian separator. I am still tweaking it tho - having trouble making butter from the goat-milk cream. I guess I need to make it more "fatty". The doe I am milking atm is in the later part of her lactation cycle for this year. We will be breeding her this month (August), so we will be drying her off in Mid-November/December for a January kidding. We will be back in milk the end of January,
> 
> My question is: Will I have to readjust the fat setting after she is freshened?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> -Dutch


I'm not sure about this. In 6 years of goat dairying I never actually managed to make goat butter - I guess I just didn't have the knack, but I assume it is very difficult. Another problem is not most separators were designed deliberately for cow milk, whose milk fat molecules are a slightly different size.

HF


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## PrairieDairy

I would absolutely love a copy of that manual too HeritageFarms! I just bought one from the original owner in excellent shape.


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## PrairieDairy

Heritagefarm said:


> If you open the bowl there will be a disk with ridges, and it has a small screw at the top. Find a square object the adjust it with. (hex keys don't work) Would you like the manual? I've got a copy I bought from an amish guy (so he probably wants me to just send your bussiness his way but I'll give you a photocopy!)


Would love a copy of this! Let me know if you still have it. Thanks!


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## Firstmeadowfarm

Yes! I would love to have the manual!


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## rosalind

https://spiritedrose.wordpress.com/...ity-milk/delaval-cream-separator-manual-1940/

I've scanned my cream separator's pages all onto this link. It may not be the same style as you have, but a lot of the parts tend to be the same and it may be of help when putting yours together.


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## Heritagefarm

Thanks Rosalind. That's the famous De Laval manual, by the way - not the montgomery wards manual that I've got. I have about 5 or 6 manuals I need to pub up on my website. One for primrose, McCormick Deering, de Laval #17 (almost identical to the main manual), a dairymaid, and Lily, and one for baby Alpha laval.


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## rosalind

I have a Montgomery Ward Royal Blue separator, but no manual.

When I bought the DeLaval, half the reason I bought it was because of the manuals - came with 2 full manuals and all the parts. Gorgeous condition.


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## stanb999

You do all know that you shouldn't be using any of the older cream separators. Unless they were completely rebuilt by someone who knows what they are doing because they contain lead. Which was acceptable in their construction till 1995. 99% are land fill trash, not treasures.


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## stanb999

CircleStarRanch said:


> I figured out the fat setting for the cream on my Ukranian separator. I am still tweaking it tho - having trouble making butter from the goat-milk cream. I guess I need to make it more "fatty". The doe I am milking atm is in the later part of her lactation cycle for this year. We will be breeding her this month (August), so we will be drying her off in Mid-November/December for a January kidding. We will be back in milk the end of January,
> 
> My question is: Will I have to readjust the fat setting after she is freshened?
> 
> Thanks in advance
> -Dutch


We made goat butter. The key is letting the cream sit in the fridge for a few days to a week. Never try to churn fresh cream. 

The issue we had is by the time it would churn, it was goaty.


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## Heritagefarm

stanb999 said:


> You do all know that you shouldn't be using any of the older cream separators. Unless they were completely rebuilt by someone who knows what they are doing because they contain lead. Which was acceptable in their construction till 1995. 99% are land fill trash, not treasures.


People take this risk into account when they use antique machines of any sort. Yes, many of them contain lead solder - this is actually what prevented me from creating a business based on powder coating them so they'd be useable. However, your last sentence is offensive and unnecessary.


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## stanb999

Heritagefarm said:


> I'd recommend those only if you want to send something else to the landfill in a year or two.





Heritagefarm said:


> People take this risk into account when they use antique machines of any sort. Yes, many of them contain lead solder - this is actually what prevented me from creating a business based on powder coating them so they'd be useable. However, your last sentence is offensive and unnecessary.




You were talking them up pretty good... And folks should be informed. No?


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## rosalind

You could take into consideration that the cream doesn't come into contact with the metal (and potential lead) because the first cream cools as it's exiting the spout and coats the spout. Maybe not foolproof, but probably some protection.

You can also buy swab kits to test anything you want to use for lead content.

Generally, I'll stick to only glass or stainless, but it's near impossible to find stainless, non plastic, cream separators.


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## terri9630

Heritagefarm said:


> I'm not sure about this. In 6 years of goat dairying I never actually managed to make goat butter - I guess I just didn't have the knack, but I assume it is very difficult. Another problem is not most separators were designed deliberately for cow milk, whose milk fat molecules are a slightly different size.
> 
> HF


I know this is kinda old, but I make butter from my goats milk. I let it get to room temperature first and us my KA stand mixer.


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## SlavicBeautyNet

I have manuals for both manual and electric units. If anyone needs a copy, please let me know. I will be happy to email you one. Any questions about the use of the Ukrainian cream separators are also welcome!


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## terri9630

SlavicBeautyNet said:


> I have manuals for both manual and electric units. If anyone needs a copy, please let me know. I will be happy to email you one. Any questions about the use of the Ukrainian cream separators are also welcome!


I have 2 of your machines, I think. One elect and one manual. Both work great.


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## FarmboyBill

When we milked, and we used a Wards CS, We used Rieleys Seperator Oil. Ive been told there still in business. U might wanna check it out to get the right grade oil.

We used Rapid strainer discs. Came in a double pack in a blue box. I hauled my IHC CS here and went to assembling it and somehow have misplaced the bowl. Anybody having one in good condition to sell, id be interested.


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## FarmboyBill

I been watching CSs on U Tubes. Saw one called The Iowa something. Never seen one like that before. Saw one woman actually separating in the barn with the cows looking on.


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## FarmboyBill

Hope you can help Heritage. Im needing the whole bowl assembly, with rubber, and tightening wrench for an enclosed motor IHC cream separator.


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## FarmboyBill

Thanks HF for the help.


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## Heritagefarm

I'm currently entertaining the idea of using novel technologies to create separator replacement parts. Unfortunately, it would require lots of my time, of which I have extremely little! Also, the tech is expensive and may not be able to produce larger parts.


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## FarmboyBill

Whatcha gonna do, 3D parts??


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## Heritagefarm

That's what I was thinking. I'd have to get good at using graphics programs, though, it's just one more squirrel to chase that I don't have time for. Maybe someone else can take my idea and run with it.


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## eggersmama

How much more cream do you get using a separator vs skimming it out by hand?


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## Heritagefarm

eggersmama said:


> How much more cream do you get using a separator vs skimming it out by hand?


I'm not sure, but you can get several cups of cream out of a gallon with a separator. Skimming the milk takes a while; sometimes your milk is sour by the time you get enough cream. Further, it's usually only about half a cup or so per gallon in my experience. But I've never done cows milk; goats milk barely separates by itself. After a week there's maybe half an inch in the jar and then it tastes dreadful.


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## Loftynancy

Heritagefarm said:


> Got one? Post it here, I can help you! If not, I have several other people I know who will probably know! Know someone who knows someone who knows something about separators? I'd like to hear!
> Good day all,
> Ted


Yes. Why does my Slavic beauty cream separator have a hole in the back? If it's not plugged milk spews out of it. But there's no plug.


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## FarmboyBill

I see a lot of milk bowls with discs and bottom, BUT none of the owners seem to know if they will fit my McCormick Deering Seperator. Whaddia you think?


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## Heritagefarm

FarmboyBill said:


> I see a lot of milk bowls with discs and bottom, BUT none of the owners seem to know if they will fit my McCormick Deering Seperator. Whaddia you think?


I've got measurements somewhere... Mostly you have to make sure all the holes line up with you put the spouts on. So you put the bowl (centrifuge) on the stem, make sure it fits nicely, and place the milk spout on, make sure it's just below the milk outlet on the bowl, and then the cream spout, and make sure it's also below the cream outlet on the bowl... and then experiment. Keep some towels handy in case the experiment goes south.


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## bartender

Hey everyone, 
First time post and I’m curious whether a cream separator will work for clarifying lime Lemmon grapefruit juice etc. 
thanks everyone 
Happy new year!!


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## IndyDave

bartender said:


> Hey everyone,
> First time post and I’m curious whether a cream separator will work for clarifying lime Lemmon grapefruit juice etc.
> thanks everyone
> Happy new year!!


As long as you are separating two liquids of different density/specific gravity, it should. As that goes, it would separate oil from water.


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## Katrina E Curry

Heritagefarm said:


> If you open the bowl there will be a disk with ridges, and it has a small screw at the top. Find a square object the adjust it with. (hex keys don't work) Would you like the manual? I've got a copy I bought from an amish guy (so he probably wants me to just send your bussiness his way but I'll give you a photocopy!)







Hi I have a Montgomery word hand crank cream seporator table top model is there a certain way the cone have to go in or a special order ? Thank you


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## Katrina E Curry

Hi I have a Montgomery word hand crank cream seporator table top model is there a certain way the cone have to go in or a special order they go in thanks


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## IndyDave

Katrina E Curry said:


> Hi I have a Montgomery word hand crank cream seporator table top model is there a certain way the cone have to go in or a special order they go in thanks


They should be numbered in order.


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## houndDogger

Looks like this is the place to ask some questions on a separator I just picked up. I was hoping someone could identify the make and model of it to hopefully locate a manual. The decal is worn off enough that I can read nothing from it. A quick google image search yielded nothing identical with a description. If I can figure out how to attach pictures hopefully someone can help out. Either way I appreciate ya taking time to read all this.


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## Robert Nelson

Heritagefarm said:


> Got one? Post it here, I can help you! If not, I have several other people I know who will probably know! Know someone who knows someone who knows something about separators? I'd like to hear!
> Good day all,
> Ted


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## Robert Nelson

I need the thickness adjustment screw for a #4 Montgomery Ward separator. At least a picture of one. Thanks


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## Bearfootfarm

This one appears to use an Allen head cap screw:







https://merry-farm.com/us/blog/post/guide-for-milk-cream-manual-centrifugal-separator-50-l-h-rz-ops

I suspect it will have fine threads.

It's possible you could use a wooden dowel that is just large enough to LIGHTLY turn into the threads to make an impression to compare. 

It wouldn't need to cut deeply. 
It just needs to be tight enough to make marks on the dowel.
Work it in gradually by going in and out, and going slightly deeper each time until you have .25" of threads marked and measure from there to determine Threads Per Inch. It will also give you a good idea of the proper diameter.


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## KristieL

Heritagefarm said:


> Got one? Post it here, I can help you! If not, I have several other people I know who will probably know! Know someone who knows someone who knows something about separators? I'd like to hear!
> Good day all,
> Ted


Hi I,m new to this forum, I have de laval no.12 cream seperator floor model with a electric motor (original). I have only used it 5 times, the last 2 times i have used it. It will start out fine and then it will start vibrating badly shaking milk everywhere, then it stops shaking and smooths out and does it again. I made sure the oil was at the correct level. Not sure what is going on. Any help would be appreciated.


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## SlavicBeautyNet

Is your separator manual or electric @KristieL ? I know that sometimes vibration happens when the motor is not installed properly. you mention oil, so i assume it may be manual.


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## muleskinner2

My grandmother had a separator, but we never did. We would strain the milk, put it in wide mouth gallon jars and set them in the fridge. The next morning we skimmed the cream off the top with a large soup spoon. Put the cream in quart jars, with a tight lid. Wrapped the jars in an old towel. Put two jars wrapped in a towel in a burlap feed sack, hang the feed sack from the saddle horn and make two laps around the pasture at a hard run on my saddle horse. Best butter I ever had in my life.


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## lillbessjo

myminifarm said:


> My cream separator arrived today. We put it together & thought everything was there but there is a small round hole (that looks like it is supposed to be there) in the side of the "bowl chamber" but the milk kept coming out of that hole. Not sure if it is supposed to have a plug or something in it?
> Thank you,
> Jessica
> [email protected]


i have the same problem...cannot figure it out!


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