# Generator fuel usage"



## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Short winter days and clouds always equal more generator run time for us. We have several generators that we alternate usage on but try to run the smaller ones more to save fuel. (Smallest is 3,500 watts)

I've been looking at getting a Honda or ____ brand 2,000 watt inverter generator just for charging the battery bank and wonder what the real fuel usage is when working at about 1,500 watt load? I find usage for 1/4 and full rated loads but nothing for 3/4. 

Anybody have any fuel usage amounts for 3-4 hour per day run time powering a charger that needs about 1,500 watts?

I know they are nice and quiet/light but do these little ones last? I'd like to get at least 400-500 hours.

Thanks

Don


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## farmerj (Aug 20, 2011)

I'd consider something like this and / or solar panels before going to a generator.
http://www.windbluepower.com/


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Sorry. Should have said we are totally off-grid using solar. There are always spells where we get little or no sun so generators are the only way to recharge the battery bank of 16 six-volt batteries.


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## farmerj (Aug 20, 2011)

I'd still back it up with wind instead of a genny.

a genny would be 3-4 level back up.


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## biggkidd (Aug 16, 2012)

I haven't had my honda eu2000 long enough to give a true answer. With mixed loads we are averaging 32-36 +- hours on a five gallon tank. I'll know more in a few months. 

Larry


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## biggkidd (Aug 16, 2012)

In addition the EU2000 is rated for 1600 watts continuous and 2000 serge so your 1500 watt load is pretty much a full load. So far I am very happy with mine.

Larry


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

No wind or hydro chance here so generators are only option for backup. I can dial the charge rate up or down and I'd like to bulk charge the bank at about 50 amps. (bank is wired at 24 volts) My thinking is to start at 50 amps and dial down if the generator breaker trips and up a bit if it doesn't. I want to be around 1,500 watts continous out of the generator and in the sweet spot for fuel usage, whatever that is. I like the idea of it automatically slowing down and using less gas when the charger is in float or absorb.


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## PorkChopsMmm (Aug 16, 2010)

I am in the same boat, but happy with what we have. We are offgrid too and use a Champion 3500 watt with remote start -- so my wife can start the generator from inside the house. We are up to ~800 hours on this thing and I am wondering how much more life she can give. By the end of this winter I expect we will be up to 1,000 hours which we would have reached in 2 winters. I need to find a more robust generator that can be remotely started but last longer.


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## nosqrls (Jun 9, 2012)

I would spend the money on more batteries or panels. or both. If you can find a little diesel gen. they are more exp. to buy but less to run. and last longer. You can find a refurb. 6kw for about 900$ 3.5 gals last 7 to 10 hrs. they run on no. 1 or 2. electric start. or look for military surplus rebuilt. seen some rack up 10000 hrs. but 5kw is the smallest I've seen.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

The Yamaha EF2000iS is highly rated
I don't run mine quite that hard . . . .1000 watts to start tapering down in short order as batts come up.
You should get your 3-4 hours on a tank (one gallon) which is quite reasonable.
You could also consider a Yamaha EF2400i or a 2800i so as to get into a sweeter--lower rpm-- spot on those larger units......

The inverter units are the better way to go because of throttling down when the load lessens.........


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## K.B. (Sep 7, 2012)

Gray Wolf said:


> Anybody have any fuel usage amounts for 3-4 hour per day run time powering a charger that needs about 1,500 watts?
> 
> I know they are nice and quiet/light but do these little ones last? I'd like to get at least 400-500 hours.
> 
> ...


Have you looked at LP (whole house) generators as an option, assuming you already have a large tank on site?

I don't have any firsthand experience, but my impression is that they have a fairly long lifecycle. Likely more expensive up-front, but perhaps it would be cost-effective in the long run.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

I have toyed with the idea of getting a propane kit to put on my Yamaha EF2800i . . . . .
much cleaner burning . . .longer oil life . . . .

I believe you can also get a propane kit for a 2000i . . . . .

Yes there are many larger gens that will run on propane . . but those don't have the great advantage's that a inverter genn has . . .mainly constant throttle . .regardless of the load.

A pipe dream; . . .3 -1000 gallon propane tanks . . .would be heat and electric for a long while....


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Didn't know there were propane kits for the little inverter generators. Does that void guarantees or does any factory sell them already converted? We have a 1,150 gal propane tank......


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## K.B. (Sep 7, 2012)

Jim-mi said:


> I have toyed with the idea of getting a propane kit to put on my Yamaha EF2800i . . . . .
> much cleaner burning . . .longer oil life . . . .
> 
> I believe you can also get a propane kit for a 2000i . . . . .
> ...


Thanks Jim

I will further show my ignorance and ask about the larger whole house generators such as the one at the link below... are they not load responsive?

http://www.costco.com/Honeywell-15kw-Generator.product.11671400.html

Or perhaps they don't mesh well with an off-grid system as a backup for the battery bank?

Something like the one above is definitely oversized for battery charging, but I have been thinking about something along those lines as a way to use larger power tools while battery charging (double-dipping).


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## Gray Wolf (Jan 25, 2013)

Battery charging doesn't need a whole-house generator, just a little one (2,000 - 2,500 watts would be enough for us). We have 10,000 and 8,000 watt ones for the shop, welders etc and smaller 3,500 and 4,000 watt ones for battery charging and to use out on the property. To save fuel and wear out the cheaper generator, we use the smallest one that will power the load we need.

Our inverter, and most larger ones, is smart enough to run house loads from generator and charge batteries at the same time.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

Yes K.B. that is a reasonable generator . . . .and certainly no problem running an air conditioner 24/7 . . . .
But . . it is one of those that run at a constant throttle . . . .wether the load is AC or a couple 100 watt light bulbs..........
An apples and oranges thing.......

Grey Wolf's inverter/charger will eventually taper off the charging load . . . . .and with that a inverter generator will throttle down . . . .a very good thing.......

Giggle up generators (prefferably Yamaha) and you can then find the propane kits.....
warranty. . .don't know for sure . . . .but if done right the warranty should have expired before needing warranty work....
Call a dealer and ask............


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## farminghandyman (Mar 4, 2005)

just a question here for charging batteries, would taking a smaller motor, 3 to 5 hp, running a "truck alternator" of the proper voltage as the battery bank, 

In most instances the more steps one takes to get some place the less efficient it is, and I have read that battery chargers are less efficient running a generator power verses grid power, in some instances up to 50% less efferent. I think it has some to do with the RMS voltage and distortions in the sine waves, 

a few urls that talk some what about the same,
http://www.zrd.com/faq/esdfaqwdcgs.html

http://www.polardcmarine.com/cms/applications/onboard-power-systems/

http://www.rpc.com.au/pdf/woods_technical_manual.pdf


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## Alaska (Jun 16, 2012)

WE run the honda 2000 inverter with an iota charger. Low fuel consumption and low noise. Online for under a grand thought the money spent on a larger propane would be better spent on more solar panels.
If the wind genny comes on or the clouds clear it idols down and burns almost no fuel until we shut it off


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## K.B. (Sep 7, 2012)

interesting - thank you. The spec sheet indicates different fuel usage rates depending on the load, so I must not be understanding something. I will keep looking...

Gray Wolf - I have seen smaller propane generators (Yamaha) that come set up from the factory for propane use. They were pretty pricey for the power supplied, but they may save you on fuel in the long run.


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## Jim-mi (May 15, 2002)

yes it is the poor wave form--voltage regulation--. of those cheapy generators that will make a battery charger be less efficient.......

People expect wonders from a super noisy $199.95 gennie . . .all they are buying are headaches and junk.

Yes that Honda and Iota will get the job done very very well.


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## Alaska (Jun 16, 2012)

Jim-mi said:


> yes it is the poor wave form--voltage regulation--. of those cheapy generators that will make a battery charger be less efficient.......
> 
> People expect wonders from a super noisy $199.95 gennie . . .all they are buying are headaches and junk.
> 
> Yes that Honda and Iota will get the job done very very well.



Yes and we can top of the golf car at the same time as long as I start it first and let it charge until the charger amps come down below 10 and then start the iota.


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## topofmountain (Nov 1, 2013)

Gray Wolf said:


> Short winter days and clouds always equal more generator run time for us. We have several generators that we alternate usage on but try to run the smaller ones more to save fuel. (Smallest is 3,500 watts)
> 
> I've been looking at getting a Honda or ____ brand 2,000 watt inverter generator just for charging the battery bank and wonder what the real fuel usage is when working at about 1,500 watt load? I find usage for 1/4 and full rated loads but nothing for 3/4.
> 
> ...


Don, 

I bought on of these out of the box building a shed & working our property I ran it between Eco & Regular for about 8-9 hours on a gallon of gas.
Check out this site. Free Shipping, great generator, They had it to me in three day, great customer service. 

I see they have a refurb for $375. I bought one of their refurbs I love it. This company does all of Champions warranty work. I found them when I emailed Champion about were to buy one. Home Depot carried them at one time but not in my area. I read reviews from both Home Depot & Amazon they reviewed very good like 4.5 out of 5.

http://supergenproducts.com/


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## artificer (Feb 26, 2007)

If you're an advanced DIY/homesteader, here's a link to some build your own systems. http://www.microcogen.info/index.php?board=12.0

If you take a large frame 12V truck alternator, and drive it to produce 24v, you get better efficiency. Add in a three stage voltage regulator to automatically handle the charge rates, and you're good to go.

One of the projects on the site is a diesel powered alternator system for a boat. Automatic start, speed control, current output, load shedding if an alternative load has priority... The controller is an arduino system, and the author created the pc boards. If you can solder, and have a bit of computer know-how, you could make your own complete system. I think the author was also working on just an alternator controller.

One of the people on the forum has done efficiency testing on a simple setup. Direct charging 24V with an over-driven 12V alternator was as good, if not better, efficiency as an AC generator/charger.

Michael

Edit: I already have a 6hp Caroll Stream electric start Honda clone, Leece-Neville 110-555 alternator, and a 4 step Sterling Power Pro Reg B alternator regulator to make up a system. The system could be remote started, or even automated.

http://www.microcogen.info/index.php?topic=2930.msg33112#msg33112


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## farmerj (Aug 20, 2011)

why go reinvent the wheel then.

The controller and everything are available already made in a pretty well laid out kit. With a rather nice reliable engine to boot.

http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=4389137


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## artificer (Feb 26, 2007)

farmerj said:


> why go reinvent the wheel then.
> 
> The controller and everything are available already made in a pretty well laid out kit. With a rather nice reliable engine to boot.
> 
> http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=4389137


About $5,500 worth of reasons...

It does look like a nice unit, however. I wonder what the expected life is, since the linked units already have 6,000 - 11,000 hours on them.

Michael


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## farmerj (Aug 20, 2011)

Mine has 9800 hours on it already. The engines are rated to 20,000 hours.

It also has an ac compressor on it and is a 2 cyl yanmar diesel engine.

That $6500 also includes installation in a semi truck. So you could get at least $1500 knock d off there.


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