# Success with gelding?



## Preston (Oct 28, 2013)

We have a mini donkey approximately a year old that is "playing" but really hurting our ewes. He has recently started biting their necks really hard, chases them, and has started to pull them down to the ground. 
He is not gelded and was raised with these sheep. Any thoughts on how to correct the problem? He is soo good otherwise and our children love him.


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## where I want to (Oct 28, 2008)

Cut him fast lest it be one of the children he hurts. Handling an entact male is not something children can do well.


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## SFM in KY (May 11, 2002)

Geld him now. It's only going to get worse.


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## G. Seddon (May 16, 2005)

Separate him from the sheep right away. It won't be long before he fatally injures one of the ewes. Have a vet do the procedure...sedate, ligate, etc. Keep him away from the sheep for a good long while. You might be able to try them together after a period of time, supervised of course, haltered and on a lead but never unsupervised. 

This is what can happen when folks don't geld their donkeys as youngsters. The donkey behaves like a donkey and comes out looking bad every time!

Sorry if I sound harsh, Preston, but I bred miniature donkeys for quite a while. Intact males are unpredictable, do not make good pets, and should not be handled by children. I doubt you'd let your kids have a yearling bull or ram as a pet.


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## Preston (Oct 28, 2013)

Actually you're wrong. I do allow my children around some of my rams and they handle the donkey daily *gasp* can you believe it?! My children know how to respect the animals and that they are unpredictable. After the last incident we separated him from the ewes. We have spoken to the vet and are considering having him gelded but still have not decided. The vet clarified that it will not fix all of his behaviour problems-which to be honest aren't horrendous. We are still considering purchasing a Jenny hence the delay in decision making. 
To be honest I come on here to bounce ideas, lessons learned, Etc. However I am finding more and more that people's responses on here ( to others questions not just my own) are arrogant and ignorant.


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## aoconnor1 (Jun 19, 2014)

Preston said:


> Actually you're wrong. I do allow my children around some of my rams and they handle the donkey daily *gasp* can you believe it?! My children know how to respect the animals and that they are unpredictable. After the last incident we separated him from the ewes. We have spoken to the vet and are considering having him gelded but still have not decided. The vet clarified that it will not fix all of his behaviour problems-which to be honest aren't horrendous. We are still considering purchasing a Jenny hence the delay in decision making.
> To be honest I come on here to bounce ideas, lessons learned, Etc. However I am finding more and more that people's responses on here ( to others questions not just my own) are arrogant and ignorant.


I have gelded a jack as old as nine years of age (he was a rescue), and it took about 6 weeks but he did stop all interest in my jenny or horses when they came into season. He doesn't bother any of them at all now. 

I have a 1.5 year old jack that is getting gelded next week. He is as gentle as they come, but he does follow my mares around like a love sick puppy when they are in heat. I simply don't want any mules, so my donkeys are always gelded. I have small grand children that have been around the. Donkeys a lot, not one time have any of my boys tried to hurt one of my grand daughters. I have 4 males, 3 of which are gelded. It doesn't bother me at all to have my grand babies around them. 

I am sorry if you feel anyone has been rude or arrogant here, I am sure that isn't the intention. A lot of times, people who have asked questions on this or other boards I am on are not really equine people and have a back yard kept donkey or horse that they know nothing about and are trying to figure out an issue about something they shouldn't even have to begin with. It can get very frustrating for a lot of us that have to try to "talk someone down", so to speak, and attempt to handle their problems with no information other than an OMG what do I do now kind of post!

I wish you the best. If you get a jenny, remember that every single time she is in heat that Jack will be on her, and you will have donkey foals every year if you have a jack with her. Donkeys foal easily enough, but it is cruel to allow them to be bred repeatedly over and over again with no real purpose or plan other than wanting to keep a donkey intact. They are just as loving and fun as a gelding as they are as a jack. 

Good luck


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Preston said:


> Actually you're wrong. I do allow my children around some of my rams and they handle the donkey daily *gasp* can you believe it?! My children know how to respect the animals and that they are unpredictable. After the last incident we separated him from the ewes. We have spoken to the vet and are considering having him gelded but still have not decided. The vet clarified that it will not fix all of his behaviour problems-which to be honest aren't horrendous. We are still considering purchasing a Jenny hence the delay in decision making.
> To be honest I come on here to bounce ideas, lessons learned, Etc. However I am finding more and more that people's responses on here ( to others questions not just my own) are arrogant and ignorant.



I'm sorry you find good honest advice to be out of line. 

If your donkey is dragging down smaller livestock, there is a very good chance, based on my experience, that you're going to be dealing with injuries or mortality sooner than later. It would be a good idea to consider separating him from smaller stock and giving him some extra training. 

I'm a big advocate for proper training and if your jack is simply gelded without training, you will only correct part of the problem but I found behavioural issues in intact jacks to be more pronounced and get progressively worse but never stay the same.


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## G. Seddon (May 16, 2005)

Preston, sorry if you think I'm being "arrogant and rude." 

You have observed the beginnings of what could be a very serious problem with your animals, not to mention the safety of your children. If you care at all about this donkey, you will have him gelded. It will go a very long way toward giving him a chance at a better future if you should decide to part with him. Very few people need or want a jack. Gelding allows him to keep the good qualities without the unreliable hormonal up's and down's. 

Breeding with top quality jacks is best left to the professionals and even they have recognized that the donkey market is not what it was a decade ago. Sadly, they are a dime a dozen these days. To needlessly contribute to the donkey population simply to experienced having a foal is foolish; donkeys can live up to and over 30 years, and unless you can guarantee a lifetime home and care, you are only adding to the problem. 

There is a reason why children under 18 aren't allowed to handle jacks at donkey shows. As for the dangers of keeping a jack, here's an old but valid collection of true stories called "The Jack Files" sharing unhappy and tragic experiences with jacks.

http://www.calkinsart.net/donkeyinfo/jacks1.html


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

Preston said:


> Actually you're wrong. I do allow my children around some of my rams and they handle the donkey daily *gasp* can you believe it?! My children know how to respect the animals and that they are unpredictable. After the last incident we separated him from the ewes. We have spoken to the vet and are considering having him gelded but still have not decided. The vet clarified that it will not fix all of his behaviour problems-which to be honest aren't horrendous. We are still considering purchasing a Jenny hence the delay in decision making.
> To be honest I come on here to bounce ideas, lessons learned, Etc. However I am finding more and more that people's responses on here ( to others questions not just my own) are arrogant and ignorant.


It's not arrogant to tell the truth. I think it's ignorant to have children around an intact male that has already hurt other stock, but that's just my opinion. 

I concur with everyone that has posted that the mini donkey needs to be gelded. Unless his genetics are so wonderful and rare that they must be perpetuated, which is highly unlikely.


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## Molly Mckee (Jul 8, 2006)

Most of us are parents and many grandparents. Safety is a big concern to us, and we point out unsafe things. If you think that is arrogant, so be it. I do hope you will think about it, we do have years of experience.


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## RideBarefoot (Jun 29, 2008)

I agree, gelding and training may make him an asset to your farm; otherwise, he is a liability

(I can tell ya some scary stories about donkeys and children!)


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

Donkeys guard territory rather than bond with a flock or herd and while he may ease up on the current goats, there is a strong chance his current behaviour, he will kill the resulting kids.


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## DaniR1968 (May 24, 2008)

Preston, 

The donkey is not playing. At this point, I would worry that even gelded he would not be safe for your sheep. Can you separate him until he is gelded and given a couple months for hormones to get out of his system? Even then, only have him with the sheep if he can be supervised.


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## Maura (Jun 6, 2004)

This is why only gelded jacks or jennets are used as guardians. The neck biting is what he would be doing to a jennet, but a sheep can&#8217;t take that abuse.


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## haypoint (Oct 4, 2006)

I do not want you or your children killed or seriously injured by an aggressive animal.
You seek out the advice of those with a wide range of experiences and much wisdom that comes with years of experiences. Everyone is trying to help.
Up to now, the stud has not killed your sheep nor injured your children. Most livestock attacks were first time events. I'd rather you think badly of me and my advice than to unknowingly continue down this dangerous path. But, once you have been warned, it's on you. I've done my part.
He should have been gelded at 4 months. I won't get into the overpopulation of equines in this country and some folks desire to mate everything on the farm that has the reproductive equipment.
Studs, large and small are unpredictable. Even small ones can injure. IMHO, it was a mistake to neglect to neuter him. It was a mistake to allow your children around an aggressive stud. It is wrong to run sheep with a stud. I had a neighbor lose several sheep to an aggressive male Alpaca that crushed them to death. It is wrong to breed donkeys unless they are top quality ( not " I think he's cute and I love babies").
That's what I think. Don't mean to hurt feelings, admit you didn't want to hear this and invite you to ignore me.


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## offthegrid (Aug 11, 2009)

Certainly it seems that there couldn't possibly be any harm from gelding him, but those with donkey experience suggest that might not be enough. Training and supervision are probably necessary no matter what you choose to do.

I'm always surprised at how many people don't neuter miniature horses and donkeys in comparison to regular sized equines. Just because they are *smaller* doesn't make them any less of a job to keep them behaving properly, and - unless they are excellent, what's the point? Minis are a dime a dozen on Craigslist, as are the "free older stud....needs a firm hand." All day, every day. Because ungelded, untrained minis are as unwanted as last week's trash. And, small minis still weigh ~300lbs...my 33" mini-mare is sweet and timid until you try to vaccinate her - and then 3 people can't restrain her. I think we underestimate their strength because "they are cute and little."

Even well-bred mini horses don't fetch more than $1K in my area; not sure you could really get more than a few hundred for a mini-donkey. They are super cute...it's true. But then what? Cute, expensive pets, that need a well-trained home. And unfortunately, there aren't enough of those around.

Perfect example from today -- (mini horses, not donkeys): Mare,10 years old. Stallion Proven Sire, hand or pasture breeds. Both fine in stall or in run in.500. for pair if go together.If sold separately,mare 550, stallion 375. *Not for beginners as stallion can be high spirited around cycling mares (typical stud) and mare can be hard to catch at times, shy with strangers. *


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## aoconnor1 (Jun 19, 2014)

offthegrid said:


> Certainly it seems that there couldn't possibly be any harm from gelding him, but those with donkey experience suggest that might not be enough. Training and supervision are probably necessary no matter what you choose to do.
> 
> I'm always surprised at how many people don't neuter miniature horses and donkeys in comparison to regular sized equines. Just because they are *smaller* doesn't make them any less of a job to keep them behaving properly, and - unless they are excellent, what's the point? Minis are a dime a dozen on Craigslist, as are the "free older stud....needs a firm hand." All day, every day. Because ungelded, untrained minis are as unwanted as last week's trash. And, small minis still weigh ~300lbs...my 33" mini-mare is sweet and timid until you try to vaccinate her - and then 3 people can't restrain her. I think we underestimate their strength because "they are cute and little."
> 
> ...


There are always donkeys at our local animal shelter here. They try to auction them off, but no one bids on them. Right now, they have a pasture full of jacks that are on the auction site, not one bid. Sad. They will be euthanized, and some are beautiful spotted donkeys. 

I just gelded my little jack yesterday. He was never a menace like others have talked about, but he didn't need to remain a jack and possibly breed his own mother or one of my good horses. He did fine, and it was funny...one of my vets who had been tending to another patient came over after we were done gelding the little donkey. He said "Ah, another gelded jack. The sun just started shining brighter, the birds began singing louder....it's a fine day after all"! I am fully persuaded that man knows how many unwanted donkey births we just prevented!!


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## wr (Aug 10, 2003)

You can always find minis free to good home up here and they always seem to have issues. I think that people view them as pets too cute to discipline or train and underestimate the damage that small can actually do. 

My daughter was called to retrain or train 8 minis one summer and every last one of the little beasts were biters and kickers. She did her job but as their 'mommy' was loading them onto the trailer with a handful of treats, we figured they'd be back. It's my understanding that one bit her human kid pretty bad and they all ended up with a meat buyer.


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## Joshie (Dec 8, 2008)

I am always amazed when somebody asks for opinions then is offended by differing views. Behaviors like hugging might be cute in a baby but can kill you when that same baby turns into an adult. Minis might be small but they are still equines. A stud is a stud is a stud.


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## ToshRunner (Jun 23, 2013)

I'd like to toss my two cents in.

Sometimes even the gelding of an equine won't change the behavior they already have, or the inclinations they already have.

I am really sure someone here has already written the equivalent of this, but I mention this because I have this kind of situation with my own miniature donkey.

My donkey was gelded late, and because I have not gotten to handle other donkeys, I cannot tell if his behavior and attitude is just his personality or if it has anything to do with being gelded late in life.

He doesn't like goats and I wouldn't trust him with any. Though he is a gelding, I keep him alone. He has more of that pushy, dominating type of mind. He respects me and I work with him frequently, but I don't trust him with other animals. 

So if your donkey is like this, and particularly, is still like this after gelding, he just might not be the flock guardian you will ever want him to be.

You might be better off with trading him for someone who has cattle, which will be able to handle themselves better than sheep, or buying yourself a flock guardian dog instead.

TR


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## Irish Pixie (May 14, 2002)

ToshRunner said:


> I'd like to toss my two cents in.
> 
> Sometimes even the gelding of an equine won't change the behavior they already have, or the inclinations they already have.


True, but you won't know what the animal is like until he's gelded. Right now, not gelded, he's an accident waiting to happen.


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## ToshRunner (Jun 23, 2013)

I agree. I wasn't trying to suggest that NOT gelding him was okay. I was just wanting to mention that there may not be a magical transformation that makes him suddenly sweet with all forest creatures once the jack is gelded.

TR


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## MDKatie (Dec 13, 2010)

OP, please listen to those saying he's going to eventually kill or maim your sheep.

I got a small jack (one inch over mini standards) and the very first thing I did was geld him. He was gelded before he ever met the sheep. I think he was young, but no exact age on him. He went on to kill 2 goats. One was an adult Toggenburg wether (no small goat). He was bit severely on the neck. We separated the donkey after that, but a small goat kid escaped and managed to squeeze in with the donkey. He was also killed. 

The donkey seemed to stop the behavior after that (or so we thought), and when I moved to a new place I had to house them all in the same pasture. For the most part he was fine, but now and then he'd get pissed at the other animals and chase them. He liked to try to bite their necks. 

I gave him to a donkey breeder who did some rescue/rehoming, and he found the perfect home with another donkey. 

*IMO, it is cruel to keep a donkey alone* with no other equine companionship. They are incredibly smart animals, and they NEED the companionship of another donkey or horse. They get bored and take it out on whatever else they're pinned with, if not. 

PLEASE listen to folks who have been there/done that. Gelding will not solve your issue, and you WILL end up with a dead sheep.


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## Kasota (Nov 25, 2013)

Biting the ewe's neck and pulling her down to the ground is not playing. Sorry if you think it is rude but I think the ignorance is on the part of the person who thinks such behavior is playful. 

I hope no one gets hurt. Truly wish you the best.


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