# pressure canning crushed tomato w/o lemon



## Melesine (Jan 17, 2012)

I don't get it, NCHFP says acidification is still required when pressure canning tomato? Why? I can understand being careful and adding lemon juice if you are BWB canning but I don't understand how science supports the need for additional lemon juice when pressure canning. 

Can someone explain it to me?

I'm planning my garden in anticipation of putting up enough crushed tomato to see me through the year.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

There's no 'splanen, they want the PH. I don't add any acid and have been canning sinse I could stand on a chair to reach the sink. (with my Mom)


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## Melesine (Jan 17, 2012)

It just doesn't make sense to me that acidification is needed when pressure canning tomato. Since pressure canning is safe for low acid foods.


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## Ohio dreamer (Apr 6, 2006)

It's a CYA thing for the Federal Government. I don't add lemon, and I water bath.


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## Cookie2 (Feb 21, 2014)

I had to look up the recipe ... it seems because #1 - raw tomatoes are added to the hot pack (these are the uncrushed tomatoes) and #2 - the processing time is so very short. The short processing time keeps your crushed tomatoes bright and nutritious without making them mushy but that also means the larger tomato chunks haven't been heated high enough or long enough to kill any pathogens.


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## suitcase_sally (Mar 20, 2006)

I think the USDA screwed up and doesn't want to admit it. I've never heard of anyone getting sick from pressure canning tomatoes.


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## ceresone (Oct 7, 2005)

I've wonder about this--and since I trust what SS says, I might do mine without this summer. I can taste the lemon, or citric acid what ever I do


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## mathchick (Aug 13, 2013)

I've wondered this before as well - and actually saw a legitimate possible explanation (I think on the forums at gardenweb.com) It could be that it's still acidified so that the processing time can be shorter. Idea being that you could pressure can tomatoes w/o added acid, but it would have to be at a longer processing time.

No idea if it's the case or not, but I found it helpful to hear that there is a possible explanation.


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## Vosey (Dec 8, 2012)

There was a good explanation in a thread last fall. It had to do with being able to pressure can for a shorter amount of time. So the time given for pressure canning tomatoes is for tomatoes with acid added, were you not to add acid the time would have to be longer (not that they give you that time).


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## Melesine (Jan 17, 2012)

So alternatively I could just use the processing time for the lowest acid vegetable ( like beans, or stock?). I don't think there is really any harm in longer processing of crushed tomato. It's not like I need it to hold it's shape. 

I do think it's stupid that they don't just give us the time without the acidification. Playing devils advocate what if the SHTF and I can't get bottled lemon juice anymore? Having said that, I've never added lemon to my canned tomato products and I've previously always BWB canned them. I just wish they would give us the correct times without relying on additional products.


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## IowaLez (Mar 6, 2006)

If you add vinegar rather than lemon juice it doesn't taste bad. In fact, last Fall I made canned salsa and the recipe called for lime juice and vinegar and it was really good. I don't like lemon juice, so I use limes instead all the time.

The deal with extra acidification is that if people are canning store-bought tomatoes, they are so bland and non-acidic it isn't safe. If you are using homegrown high-acid tomatoes, then you are basically safe to begin with.


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## Melesine (Jan 17, 2012)

But the thread is about pressure canning. There should be no question that pressure canning tomato is safe, low acid store bought or not.


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## IowaLez (Mar 6, 2006)

Here you go... it says acidification is still needed, and that the two canning methods are equal.


Recommendation: Use of a pressure canner will result in higher quality and more nutritious canned tomato products. If your pressure canner cannot be operated above 15 PSI, select a process time at a lower pressure.

If a procedure from the USDA Complete Guide to Home Canning for canning tomatoes offers both boiling water and pressure canning options, all steps in the preparation ("Procedure") are still required even if the pressure processing option is chosen. This includes acidification. The boiling water and pressure alternatives are equal processes with different time/temperature combinations calculated for these products.


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## freelove (Jun 17, 2005)

It doesn't make sense to me. You can other vegetables, meat, etc. without adding acid so why add it with tomatoes?


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## Goldenmain (Jan 7, 2018)

I totally agree!! Green beans, yellow squash and many others, including meats have zero acid and doesn't need acid. I cant stand the flavor of tomatoes with any type acid added and my family doesn't like it either. It makes no sense to add anything but tomatoes. No water either.
Plus No other countries do it either not even Italians. It's come to the point that I dont trust or believe anything the US government says anymore. Therefore I am canning tomatoes like my grandma did except pressure canning because the time for hot tomatoes is shorter and tastes better. I want to thank you for posting this comment. I looked all over the internet for a common sense answer to this but found nothing. Lets not ruin our wonderfully tasting tomatoes by adding sour citric acid or lemon or anything else to them. Amen.


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

I’ve been pressure canning home grown as well as store bought maters for years without adding anything but a tsp Of salt per quart. I usually cold pack, use 10 lbs pressure for 25 minutes.


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## JOAT (10 mo ago)

The science says...

For hot water bath canning, you must have the pH below 4.6 to prevent the germination of botulism spores into botulism toxins.

Hot water bath canning does NOT kill botulism spores. If you have spores in an oxygen-deficient jar with a pH of 4.7 or higher (low acid), they will germinate and produce botulism toxins.

And we should note that you can't kill botulism spores in a hot water bath. You have to reach 240°F to kill the spores. Max temperature in a boiling water bath is 212°F. The only way to reach the required 240°F is to run a full Pressure canning cycle at 15psi for usually an hour or more (varies a little by product being canned). If you could can at 250°F, you could do it quicker, but it takes commercial-grade equipment to achieve that and home canning equipment is not capable of that.

The native pH of tomatoes varies greatly by type and ripeness. But the typical tomato pH ranges of common ripe tomatoes is around 4.4 to 4.7. That means there are tomatoes that fall into the low acid range. If you hot water bath can those, you are not making anywhere close to enough heat to kill botulism and the low acid, oxygen-free environment is perfect for growing botulism.

If you actually measure the pH of your tomatoes and they are well below 4.6, then you could probably get away with hot water bath canning. However, good luck finding ANY official source that would recommend doing this. Adding 1/4tsp of citric acid per pint lowers the pH of tomatoes by roughly 0.5ph points. It takes 1 Tbsp of lemon juice to do the same.


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

JOAT said:


> The science says...
> 
> For hot water bath canning, you must have the pH below 4.6 to prevent the germination of botulism spores into botulism toxins.
> 
> ...


The OP (back in 2014) was saying that she is pressure canning, not boiling water bath.

Many people pressure can tomatoes at home, without fancy commercial-grade equipment. Some consider it rebel canning to do it without further acidifying the tomatoes, but since I don't acidify meat or veg when I pressure can, I don't think I'd lose sleep over running tomatoes through a pressure canner _sans_ lemon juice.


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## Texas23 (6 mo ago)

To further the argument the acidifying the tomatoes is unnecessary IF PRESSURE CANNING, just look at the following USDA approved recipe for “Tomatoes & Okra” or “Tomatoes and Zucchini“.

No acidifying is require, despite adding very low acid ingredients (okra or zucchini) to the tomatoes.


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## Texas23 (6 mo ago)

JOAT said:


> The science says...
> 
> For hot water bath canning, you must have the pH below 4.6 to prevent the germination of botulism spores into botulism toxins.
> 
> ...


Joat….
While your overall explanation of pH levels and how that relates to water bath canning & pressure canning is good, some of your numbers are off.

At sea level, the vast majority of approved canning procedures call for the canner to be held at *10 psi NOT 15 psi.*
Additional, there are numerous recipes that are pressure canned for LESS than a hour. Some recipes are even processed for *LESS THAN A HALF HOUR.*


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## Evons hubby (Oct 3, 2005)

Texas23 said:


> Joat….
> While your overall explanation of pH levels and how that relates to water bath canning & pressure canning is good, some of your numbers are off.
> 
> At sea level, the vast majority of approved canning procedures call for the canner to be held at *10 psi NOT 15 psi.*
> Additional, there are numerous recipes that are pressure canned for LESS than a hour. Some recipes are even processed for *LESS THAN A HALF HOUR.*


Yep, different foods absorb heat differently than others. The trick seems to be sure they get hot enough all the way to center of jar.


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## Orchardsmith (5 mo ago)

Find a Blue Book from 20 years ago and follow the directions for canning tomatoes in a water bath canner. Can't fail. Until I saw this thread, I had never heard of pressure canning tomatoes. Sounds like them gummint types have had way too much time on their hands again.


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## Pony (Jan 6, 2003)

Orchardsmith said:


> Find a Blue Book from 20 years ago and follow the directions for canning tomatoes in a water bath canner. Can't fail. Until I saw this thread, I had never heard of pressure canning tomatoes. Sounds like them gummint types have had way too much time on their hands again.


Sometimes, pressure canning tomatoes is preferable. 

Instead of a steaming cauldron of the boiling water bath, which I have to heat to boiling and then hold the tomatoes for anywhere from 15-45 minutes, I can bring the tomatoes up to pressure, hold them there for 10 minutes, and then let the pressure come down. 

It may take a few extra minutes, but the house is less humid and hot with the pressure canner.


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## Danaus29 (Sep 12, 2005)

Pony said:


> It may take a few extra minutes, but the house is less humid and hot with the pressure canner.


And that makes a huge difference when canning bushels of tomatoes.


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## Orchardsmith (5 mo ago)

Pony, I learned something today. That makes it a good day. Thank you.


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## lowrider04 (Dec 18, 2012)

Melesine said:


> I don't get it, NCHFP says acidification is still required when pressure canning tomato? Why? I can understand being careful and adding lemon juice if you are BWB canning but I don't understand how science supports the need for additional lemon juice when pressure canning.
> 
> Can someone explain it to me?
> 
> I'm planning my garden in anticipation of putting up enough crushed tomato to see me through the year.


I did roma tomatoes raw packed yesterday and just added a little citric acid to each jar. Did the same thing in my peach salsa.


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## JOAT (10 mo ago)

Texas23 said:


> Joat….
> While your overall explanation of pH levels and how that relates to water bath canning & pressure canning is good, some of your numbers are off.
> 
> At sea level, the vast majority of approved canning procedures call for the canner to be held at *10 psi NOT 15 psi.*
> Additional, there are numerous recipes that are pressure canned for LESS than a hour. Some recipes are even processed for *LESS THAN A HALF HOUR.*


My numbers for what it takes to kill botulism spores are accurate. Those were not recommendations for any particular food, as different foods are run at different pressures and times. However, the science of botulism is that the only way to KILL the spores is to reach 240°F. Yes, you can get to that temperature at around 10psi; technically it's like 10.3psi at sea level as the minimum pressure to force water to 240. The hold time depends entirely on the type of jars, the type of food, how it's packed, etc. You have to get everything in the jar to at least 240°F. I wasn't super clear in my wording that the 15 for 60 was an example, so thanks for calling that part out.


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