# Mixing frame sizes.



## k9 (Feb 6, 2008)

Is there any potential problems with placing 6 1/4" frames in the 9" deeps?

The nucs I bought are on 6" frames and I want to use deeps for the hive bodies. Thanks.


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## copperkid3 (Mar 18, 2005)

Additional comb and/or burr and cross-comb
WILL result along the bottom area of each frame.


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## k9 (Feb 6, 2008)

Am I better off just putting them in a medium and being done with it?


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## goodatit (May 1, 2013)

k9 said:


> Am I better off just putting them in a medium and being done with it?


3 medium frame bodies are the equivalent of one deep hive body. lot of people do this to make it easier to work the bees. not as much weight.


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

goodatit said:


> 3 medium frame bodies are the equivalent of one deep hive body. lot of people do this to make it easier to work the bees. not as much weight.



Help me out here! I was always under the impression that 3 "shallows" or 2 mediums were equal to one deep.Did I get crossed up somewhere along the line?
I just checked my boxes and don't know what's going on for sure. One box has very little activity and the other acts like a hatch is on.I guess I'll have to get in them in the next few days!


Wade


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## goodatit (May 1, 2013)

1shotwade said:


> Help me out here! I was always under the impression that 3 "shallows" or 2 mediums were equal to one deep.Did I get crossed up somewhere along the line?
> I just checked my boxes and don't know what's going on for sure. One box has very little activity and the other acts like a hatch is on.I guess I'll have to get in them in the next few days!
> 
> 
> Wade


can't point you toward anything in writing that says that. if you know an experienced beekeeper in your area i'm sure he would enlighten you. if i come across an article about this i will send you the link. http://basicbeekeeping.blogspot.com/2007/09/basic-hive-componens-deep-hive-body.html


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## goodatit (May 1, 2013)

long lane honeybee farms


The standard and common size for a deep hive body is: 19 7/8" in length, 16 1/4" wide and 9 5/8" in height. A deep hive body is heavy when it is full of bees, honey and pollen. Therefore, some beekeepers choose to use the medium size super for hive bodies. The dimensions of the medium super is the same except for the height. It is 3" shorter, with a height of 6 5/8". If you choose to use medium supers for hive bodies, you will need to plan on using 3 supers if your winters are cold, and 1-2 supers if your winters are mild. We will assume your winters are cold and you plan to use two deep size hive bodies on your new hive.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

K9 you will get a bunch of unsupported bur comb that may or may not hang straight from the bottom of the frame. Just use deep frames in the deep bodies and not have to deal with the mess that could results.

Easier is not a good term for using 3 mediums or 4 shallows to replace a deep. Ya they may be lighter to lift when full but those of us who use our heads for more than a hat rack know how to get around that full deep weight.

To me it is a royal pain to have 30 or 40 frames to deal with as brood chambers instead of just 20 in two deeps. lifting brood boxes need not be done but once when you place them empty before installing bees.

Honey supers I do go with mediums as I bought several truck loads cheap but were I to build my own I would go with shallows.

 Al


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## k9 (Feb 6, 2008)

Al,

I normally use deeps for the hives, this is what i want to do.... I ordered two 5 frame nucs this winter and when i got the receipt in the mail i find they are 5 medium frames... I really did not want to use medius for the hive itself so was thinking slip the 5 frames in with 5 deeps. Doesn't sound like that is the best idea either.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

Place your medium frames in a medium box and then place a deep on top. Hopefully the queen will move up into the deep pretty quickly. Once she does place the medium with remaining brood in it above the deep super with a queen excluder to allow the brood to hatch out. Then you can use the medium as a honey super. I'd also limit the brood area in the medium so she will move up into the deep rather than expand in the medium.

If she doesn't want to move out of the medium after a month or so, go ahead and move her up into the deep and place the medium up above with a queen excluder to empty the medium of brood.

The only other way I could see of doing it would be to cut the comb out of the medium frames and transfer to deep frames. A whole lot of trouble though.


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## k9 (Feb 6, 2008)

Thanks TexMex, sounds like a good way to preserve the work already done by the girls, and still get them into deeps.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

K 9 You can cut a piece of wood the size of a normal deep then cut a hole the size of a nuc top and set the deep on top of that. Since it is a 5 frame nuc they will move up into the deep quickly. 

If you watch dumpsters you will find a chunk of flat stock that will work if your fugal like I am.

 Al


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## k9 (Feb 6, 2008)

Al, 
The nucs are cardboard boxes, but i can use the same method as you describe by making a couple baffles the size of the medium so they can't use the empty space and covering the top, as you describe. Thanks to you and TxMex for the help.


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

You can always put legs on the cover platform to hold the weight of the deep.

 Al


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## gweny (Feb 10, 2014)

1shotwade said:


> Help me out here! I was always under the impression that 3 "shallows" or 2 mediums were equal to one deep.Did I get crossed up somewhere along the line?
> I just checked my boxes and don't know what's going on for sure. One box has very little activity and the other acts like a hatch is on.I guess I'll have to get in them in the next few days!
> 
> 
> Wade


Just a side note question about your response from a prospective beek...

Can you better define and describe the event "like a hatch is on". I am thinking you mean bees hatching. How does the hive react when this happens? How long does this last?


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

gweny said:


> Just a side note question about your response from a prospective beek...
> 
> Can you better define and describe the event "like a hatch is on". I am thinking you mean bees hatching. How does the hive react when this happens? How long does this last?


I'm not real good at explaining things but I'll try.When a hatch is on the bees fly outof the box and orient themselves to their hive. It looks like they are getting ready to swarm. When I first got into bees it took me a while to learn the difference.The bees are "bobbing" around the hive learning how to approach/;land etc.It kind of reminds me of the actions of "robber" bees trying to steal honey from another hive.Maybe I'm using to wrong words here but that's the best I can explain it. I'm sure some of these guys that are big time into bees can do a better job!

Wade


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## gweny (Feb 10, 2014)

1shotwade said:


> I'm not real good at explaining things but I'll try.When a hatch is on the bees fly outof the box and orient themselves to their hive. It looks like they are getting ready to swarm. When I first got into bees it took me a while to learn the difference.The bees are "bobbing" around the hive learning how to approach/;land etc.It kind of reminds me of the actions of "robber" bees trying to steal honey from another hive.Maybe I'm using to wrong words here but that's the best I can explain it. I'm sure some of these guys that are big time into bees can do a better job!
> 
> Wade


Thank you! I think you explained it well? It was enough for me to form a mental pic, so thanks!


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

So you mean that the queen has come into full laying production and there are many new bees hatching out. When a young bee moves into the job of being a field bee they must orient themselves to their home. We use this behavior as beekeepers. New worker bees, or bees that have been moved to a new location will hover just outside their hive while facing their hive. They are orienting themselves. They will fly a bit further away and repeat. Then a bit further. They will orient themselves for a long ways away. That is why when you move a hive it is best to move it 5 miles away so that the bees do not return to the original hive location.

Even if you just want to move a hive to the other side of the bee yard...you must first move the hive at least 5 miles away. Let them re-orient themselves to that location for a couple of weeks and then move them back to where you want them. They will then re-orient to the new spot.

One way we use this as beekeepers is if you have a hive that is boiling with bees and in danger of swarming. You can change out hive positions with a weak hive that needs more field bees. The bees from the strong hive return to the location of their hive and enter the weak hive you have placed there. The strong hive is then in the location of the weak hive and all field bees will go to the weak hive. The strong hive then will only have the new field bees that haven't yet oriented themselves. With the population much reduced the strong hive likely will not swarm, but because they have a strong queen they will build back up rapidly. The weak hive will get a tremendous boost towards storing honey.


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## 1shotwade (Jul 9, 2013)

TxMex said:


> So you mean that the queen has come into full laying production and there are many new bees hatching out. When a young bee moves into the job of being a field bee they must orient themselves to their home. We use this behavior as beekeepers. New worker bees, or bees that have been moved to a new location will hover just outside their hive while facing their hive. They are orienting themselves. They will fly a bit further away and repeat. Then a bit further. They will orient themselves for a long ways away. That is why when you move a hive it is best to move it 5 miles away so that the bees do not return to the original hive location.
> 
> Even if you just want to move a hive to the other side of the bee yard...you must first move the hive at least 5 miles away. Let them re-orient themselves to that location for a couple of weeks and then move them back to where you want them. They will then re-orient to the new spot.
> 
> One way we use this as beekeepers is if you have a hive that is boiling with bees and in danger of swarming. You can change out hive positions with a weak hive that needs more field bees. The bees from the strong hive return to the location of their hive and enter the weak hive you have placed there. The strong hive is then in the location of the weak hive and all field bees will go to the weak hive. The strong hive then will only have the new field bees that haven't yet oriented themselves. With the population much reduced the strong hive likely will not swarm, but because they have a strong queen they will build back up rapidly. The weak hive will get a tremendous boost towards storing honey.


Yah,that's pretty much what I was trying to say. I just went by my hives a few minutes ago and there is no activity at all and it's45* so I'm not sure I even have bees. What I saw could very well have been Robbers! I'll find out in a few days I guess!


Wade


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## WildPrGardens (Mar 8, 2014)

45Âº is a little cool for the bees to fly. Especially if there is any wind.

Now if it's sunny & calm and it finally warmed up to 45Âº after a long cold spell, the bees will take cleansing flights. No foraging tho.


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## WildPrGardens (Mar 8, 2014)

I meant to add that *three* _8-frame mediums_ is equal to *one* _10-frame deep_.

8-frame meds are easier on an old back and everything is easier with the same size equipment. 

In long spells of real cold the bees can move sideways to food stores when the winter cluster spans the gap of two boxes.

I've had bees chimney up the middle of two or three 10-frame deeps and then starve when they hit the cold lid, not being able to move over and down to food by then and leaving 20 to 50 lbs of honey in the hive.

Heartbreaking.


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## Randy Rooster (Dec 14, 2004)

TxMex said:


> So you mean that the queen has come into full laying production and there are many new bees hatching out. When a young bee moves into the job of being a field bee they must orient themselves to their home. We use this behavior as beekeepers. New worker bees, or bees that have been moved to a new location will hover just outside their hive while facing their hive. They are orienting themselves. They will fly a bit further away and repeat. Then a bit further. They will orient themselves for a long ways away. That is why when you move a hive it is best to move it 5 miles away so that the bees do not return to the original hive location.
> 
> Even if you just want to move a hive to the other side of the bee yard...you must first move the hive at least 5 miles away. Let them re-orient themselves to that location for a couple of weeks and then move them back to where you want them. They will then re-orient to the new spot.
> 
> One way we use this as beekeepers is if you have a hive that is boiling with bees and in danger of swarming. You can change out hive positions with a weak hive that needs more field bees. The bees from the strong hive return to the location of their hive and enter the weak hive you have placed there. The strong hive is then in the location of the weak hive and all field bees will go to the weak hive. The strong hive then will only have the new field bees that haven't yet oriented themselves. With the population much reduced the strong hive likely will not swarm, but because they have a strong queen they will build back up rapidly. The weak hive will get a tremendous boost towards storing honey.


 
When I want to move a hive a short way I move it in increments- a few feet a day.


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## TxGypsy (Nov 23, 2006)

If you just have 1 or 2 hives that might work.


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