# Clearing out the snakes?



## Number21 (May 28, 2017)

I recently bought about 6 acres of overgrown land in North Carolina. I've lived my whole life in NW Oregon, and we have no venomous snakes there...and very few non venomous. It's not something I've ever had to deal with before. My land in NC is heavily overgrown, and has a creek, it's the ideal habitat for copper heads and cotton mouths. 

I'm slowly clearing the land, and yesterday found myself standing with a BIG cotton mouth between my feet. I was using a handheld brush cutter, and concentrating on the blade area more than where I was walking. I had been buzzing around in the area for a good 30 minutes, I thought most of the critters would have left by then. By the time I could put the brush cutter down and grab my gun, it was already hiding again somewhere. Now I know it's out there just waiting for me. 

Is there anything I can do to help clear snakes out of an area BEFORE I work? Sort of give them a sign that I am there, and move out? I thought the 2 stroke engine at WOT would do it, but I guess not. Would it help if I used a hose and squirt the area down with water? Would that make them move around? Should I just beat around on the ground with a stick in the area? Anything else I can do?

Yeah, I know I gotta watch where I'm going and eliminate the good places for them to hide, but right now everywhere is a good place to hide and I'm obviously not very good at spotting them. There are some rock piles I need to move, and, a ton of ground cover that needs to be buzzed off. Also some old garbage scattered around that I need to get rid of, that makes a perfect hiding place for them.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

What part of NC? That will partly determine the species you're most likely to run across.

Really the only thing one can do is be careful where you put your hands and feet, and keep clearing out the hiding places.

The good news is most people get bit when trying to catch or kill snakes, so the odds of you being bitten are minute.

I've lived in NC my whole life and have spent countless hours roaming the woods and swamps, but I've never been bitten by a snake I wasn't holding in my hand or trying to grab.

Also, there are many harmless water snakes that resemble the Cottonmouth, so until you get good at recognizing the differences, don't assume every snake near water is venomous.

I wear snake boots to work in hazardous areas, and move things with tools before grabbing them with my hands.


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

Im in wv. Our telephone man ie: guy that climbs the poles always wears snake boots. Big boots come up over his knees he's a big man but terrified of snakes. Look into getting snake boots. I use mothballs around the buildings in basement under porches


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## ForestToFarm (Feb 28, 2016)

Get some guinea hens. They claim guineas will run snakes off or even eat them.


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## Forcast (Apr 15, 2014)

Turkeys will help as well as guinea


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

I have had to deal with a heavily snake-infested environment and the best things I have found to snake-proof myself are my eyes (keeping a sharp lookout), a pair of *to-the-hip *snake leggings, and snake boots. Snakes can propel themselves up and outward a surprisingly good distance from a standstill, so I am not comfortable with only to-the-knee protection.

Don't rely on the idea that snakes _always _will move out of the way if you disturb them. Some remain motionless and will bite if you come closer. Other snakes are more aggressive and will actually move towards you. And, some snakes do actually move out of harm's way (I wish they all do.)

I'm speaking from experience, and nearly lost my leg to a rattlesnake bite. (That ONE time I did not have snake protection...)

Here is what the forestry guys use (I did not get mine here, but if ever I need to replace what I have now this is where I will shop.): http://www.forestry-suppliers.com/search.asp?csearch=Y&cat=57&catname=Snakeproof Chaps and Leggings

(No, this is not an affiliate marketing link.)



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## chaossmurf (Jan 6, 2017)

theres only one thing snakes love more than eating prey BITING SNAKE LEGGINGS them plastic suckers rubbing together is a mating call to every snake in the area ---heavy sided boots are ok ---but those snake chaps & snake leggings & whatever else people label them are a sure fire way to get hit on the leg
someone once told me snakes absolutely scatter at full speed away from goats --the smell I think they said ----if any goat people read this & confirm it ---youd have a 2 sided attack --the goats will eat that cover down nicely  and apparently the smell rids the area of snakes ????


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

chaossmurf said:


> theres only one thing snakes love more than eating prey BITING SNAKE LEGGINGS them plastic suckers rubbing together is a mating call to every snake in the area ---heavy sided boots are ok ---but those snake chaps & snake leggings & whatever else people label them are a sure fire way to get hit on the leg



I am not saying what you said is not true, but I have never heard (or read) such a thing. Curiosity led me to Googling...and unless I am missing it, nowhere do I see anything like it, nothing...not even a single experience alluding to the idea that the sound of plastic chaps rubbing together attracts snakes. If this was more than an isolated opinion, there would be some chatter about it on the internet. 

I wonder if the idea may have sprouted because of the wearer's overconfidence in the protective plastic and sticking his legs in snaky places without any further precautions. Then, surprise! A snake bit the plastic!

Who knows?


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## chaossmurf (Jan 6, 2017)

nope it was from growing up hunting hogs ---we had a friend whos wife bought them for him ---so she could feel better about him chasing down hogs and roping them up to bring home alive &&& we never got bit once --yet he musta got hit on them leggings well over a dozen times b4 finally trashing them ---on at least 2 instances we had a snake slither right over our boots to get to him & curl up and whack him --with us watching the danged snake (drawing our pistols of corse)
my dad on the other hand was ussualy hanging from the closest tree screaming at the top of his lungs for someone to shoot that da**ed snake 
as for all the new types --I got no idea but them darned plastic ones from back in early 80-s just flat out drew snakes to them & I don't have any clue how many other times a snake went after him when I wasn't hunting with them ( we couldn't hunt with dad if we hadn't done our homework in time )


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

Wow, now I am glad I have the Kevlar-type chaps. 

I am getting a good visual of your dad. LOL! That would be me, f'sure.


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## motdaugrnds (Jul 3, 2002)

Not sure this will help; but in Texas there is an area that is so over populated with copperheads and rattlesnakes that the people do a "round up" every single year in an attempt to keep the numbers down. They do this by covering the area at 3 sides and making lots of noises with whatever will make noises (pans, etc.) which drives the snakes in the direction where others are waiting to kill them. (In that same area my aunt lived and she always kept guineas. She saw the guineas circle copperheads and kill them.)

Myself, were I in your area, I would not be "walking" around clearing. I would be using heavy machinery and have a shotgun handy!


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

http://www.ncpedia.org/wildlife/cottonmouth
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Range and Distribution
Cottonmouths range from southeastern Virginia through eastern North and South Carolina, south to Florida, west to Texas, and north along the Mississippi River to southern Illinois and Indiana. The Eastern cottonmouth is restricted to Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Florida and Alabama. In North Carolina, cottonmouths are predominantly found in the Coastal Plain and on some parts of the Outer Banks. In a few places, they are the most abundant snake species. Pre-1900 records also exist from the lower Piedmont, but the Wake County sightings reported each year are superficiallysimilar nonvenomous watersnakes (Nerodia).

Click to expand...

http://herpsofnc.org/eastern-diamondback-rattlesnake/








The shaded region represents the range of the eastern diamondback rattlesnake in North Carolina.

http://herpsofnc.org/timber-rattlesnake/








The shaded region represents the range of the timber rattlesnake in North Carolina.

Pygmy Rattlesnake range:
http://srelherp.uga.edu/snakes/sismil.htm























Coral Snake Range:
http://srelherp.uga.edu/snakes/micful.htm

























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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

That's a good idea, to get a big brush cutter to go ahead of you, and good snake boots of course.
I've always heard that heavy vibration will give them a warning, but I have run across a few ill tempered ones, moccasins and copperheads, that just seem in the mood for a fight. I had a young one bite the tires of my truck as I rolled slowly by near my mom's creek near Chimney rock NC.
I backed up and over his head when I saw that, he might have made it if it weren't for his attitude, lol.

I won't kill a non venomous one, and even a poisonous one can escape if he's quick, but a bold nasty one is a goner.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

I added this one, Bearfoot.


http://herpsofnc.org/copperhead/









The shaded region represents the range of the copperhead in North Carolina.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

farmrbrown said:


> I added this one, Bearfoot.


I left that one out because they are likely to be anywhere in the state while the others aren't.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I left that one out because they are likely to be anywhere in the state while the others aren't.


I figured that, you asked him earlier about his specific region.
The guy isn't used to any of them and copperheads are 1 of the 4 in the Southeast I knew about, but never ran across them until I moved to NC.
I gotta say that out of the 4, they seem to be the most aggressive without provocation.
Mean little buggers.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

They're the most common, and the one that bites the most people, but luckily their bites are the least deadly of the Pit Vipers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agkistrodon_contortrix


> Although venomous, these snakes are generally not aggressive and bites are rarely fatal.[_citation needed_] Copperhead venom has an estimated lethal dose of around 100 mg, and tests on mice show its potency is among the lowest of all pit vipers, and slightly weaker than that of its close relative, the cottonmouth.[_citation needed_] Copperheads often employ a "warning bite" when stepped on or agitated and inject a relatively small amount of venom, if any at all. "Dry bites" involving no venom are particularly common with the copperhead, though all pit vipers are capable of a dry bite.


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## Number21 (May 28, 2017)

CajunSunshine said:


> Don't rely on the idea that snakes _always _will move out of the way if you disturb them. Some remain motionless and will bite if you come closer. Other snakes are more aggressive and will actually move towards you. And, some snakes do actually move out of harm's way (I wish they all do.)


That's what scares me, is that there are no real hard rules for these things. I've seen both copperheads and cottonmouths at a friend's house nearby, and his neighbor is always dead set against killing them and showing them off. I've read that both can be aggressive towards humans, though I'm sure not always. Just a little bit to the left or right I would have walked right on it, and I'm sure he wouldn't be happy about that! I'm in north/central NC, near Kerr lake. Even if they are non venomous, anything that bites is not welcome!

I've thought about getting a goat, so that I don't have to be the goat...would be nice if they scared the snakes off too. I'm sure some of those snake guards would also be helpful against brush cutter/chainsaw accidents also, this land has never been cleared before. Got a lot of work left to do...


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Number21 said:


> Even if they are non venomous, anything that bites is not welcome!


Many of the non-venomous snakes will kill and eat the others.
Copperheads are the only ones you have in your area to worry about.
The rest will be harmless Rat Snakes and assorted water snakes for the most part.


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## barnbilder (Jul 1, 2005)

Water snakes get called water moccasins a lot. They are aggressive, but not venomous. Moth balls will do nothing to keep snakes away, all they will do is stink and contaminate your soil. I have caught lots of snakes in the goat barn, not sure that they do much good. Your best bet is habitat modification, dig out the big rocks, cover the area in topsoil or gravel, and keep vegetation cut close to the ground. Don't allow clutter to accumulate. These activities can be carried out in cool weather, if not completely inactive they will at least be sluggish.


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## CajunSunshine (Apr 24, 2007)

100% + to what Barnbuilder said about cool weather making them more sluggish. This is definitely a winter-time job!! 

When it comes time to do the rock piles, have a sharp shovel handy for killing snakes. (I would be like the great queen herself yelling, "Off with their heads!") It would be hard to prevent ricochet accidents around all those rocks with a gun.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

CajunSunshine said:


> It would be hard to prevent ricochet accidents around all those rocks with a gun.


 A revolver loaded with shot shells works well for that, but the best thing is work when the weather is cold (when possible) and learn to identify the venomous species so you know which ones NOT to shoot.


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## Number21 (May 28, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> and learn to identify the venomous species so you know which ones NOT to shoot.


No offense, but as far as I'm concerned the only good snake is a dead snake. If I need other critters to run snakes off for me I'll get some birds or a goat that don't have an affinity for being aggressive and/or biting humans. Even if a snake bite is non venomous, I would most certainly go to the emergency room just to be sure, and that is going to run up a big bill for no reason, not to mention painful.

The problem is snakes are hard to see, hard to identify, like to hide, and, will bite even if you *accidentally* step on them like I almost did. I don't welcome any creatures with that kind of attitude on my property. I'd rather accidentally get rid of a "good" snake than accidentally let a bad one go. Maybe if they were color coded in bright colors and identified themselves by sound I would leave them be.

It's kind of like mice...everybody wants to kill them even though they don't bite. They're pests. I do keep a revolver loaded with shot on me when I'm out there, pretty much anything that moves is fair game.


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## chaossmurf (Jan 6, 2017)

well ya can always look into black-snakes at least --they are very good snake eaters & pretty danged easy to notice at a glance & even my dad loves them buggers ---though he doesn't get too close to them ---but he sure loves that type froma distance 
ive been told that blacksnakes ONLY eat other snakes & nothing else at all----but that seems unlikely to me --after all what would a newly hatched one hunt ?


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## coolrunnin (Aug 28, 2010)

chaossmurf said:


> well ya can always look into black-snakes at least --they are very good snake eaters & pretty danged easy to notice at a glance & even my dad loves them buggers ---though he doesn't get too close to them ---but he sure loves that type froma distance
> ive been told that blacksnakes ONLY eat other snakes & nothing else at all----but that seems unlikely to me --after all what would a newly hatched one hunt ?


Its not only unlikely is false, they steal eggs eat baby squirrels mice tons of stuff.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

Number21 said:


> Even if a snake bite is non venomous, I would most certainly go to the emergency room just to be sure, and that is going to run up a big bill for no reason, not to mention painful.


No, there would be no need for emergency rooms nor panic.
A bite from a venomous snake is obvious compared to a non-venomous snake.
Your odds of being bitten are less than 1/10th of one percent.

http://snakesarelong.blogspot.com/2013/11/the-truth-about-snakebite.html


> Worldwide, estimates range from 1.2 million to 5.5 million snakebites annually. Remember, there are several billion people out there, so although those numbers are large, each year over 99.92% of people are *not *bitten by a venomous snake.


You're more likely to be bitten while trying to kill them than if you just learn how to avoid them.



Number21 said:


> The problem is snakes are hard to see, hard to identify, like to hide, and, will bite even if you *accidentally* step on them like I almost did. I don't welcome any creatures with that kind of attitude on my property.


They really aren't that hard to identify since there are only a of couple venomous species you will ever see in your area.


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## farmrbrown (Jun 25, 2012)

I like to leave the good ones alone. Not only do they keep the rodent population down, they keep the venomous ones in check too, either by competing for food or in the case of King snakes, eating them directly.


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## Number21 (May 28, 2017)

Bearfootfarm said:


> A bite from a venomous snake is obvious compared to a non-venomous snake.
> Your odds of being bitten are less than 1/10th of one percent.


Maybe to you, me not so much. 

I think your odds are a little skewed there, the average person doesn't go off into overgrown woods to work. My job here is to go into their prime habitat, and get rid of it. Seems more likely that I will encounter a snake than the "average" person in doing so. I'm not just walking down a trail in the woods, I'm making the trail. Also usually wearing a helmet with a mesh face shield and ear protection, makes spotting them buggers a little harder. 



Bearfootfarm said:


> They really aren't that hard to identify since there are only a of couple venomous species you will ever see in your area.


A "couple" is plenty, and I've seen verified kills of cotton mouths and copper heads, so I know for sure they are in the area. I'm not an expert and many non venomous snakes look eerily like the venomous type with only subtle differences. It's very hard for me to be sure. Kind of like picking wild mushrooms - you shouldn't eat any unless you are an expert.

I've heard people say your odds of being bitten are higher if you try to kill them, but with a .44 magnum full of shot I find that hard to believe. Maybe if I was trying to get up close to pick it up, identify it, or hit it with a shovel. A lot of people do dumb things with snakes - I'd like to keep my distance and blow it away.

I'd also like to point out they won't go to waste - I know a crazy guy who grows and kills almost everything he eats, and will happily grill anything I kill.


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## Scratchmade (May 21, 2016)

I've been around plenty of cottonmouths, copperheads, etc (have grown up in the South and still live here). Your experience is scary but not uncommon, but snakes won't chase you down and will rarely bite without provocation. It seems you've just experienced that. A few things that are just plain fact:

- You won't ever completely get rid of them. They live here and this was their territory long before it was ours.
- You will rarely see them. It's shocking how camouflaged they truly are, and they prefer to hide from humans.
- You can reduce their numbers by clearing out underbrush, fallen logs, etc. (Burning really helps.) This gets rid of a lot of hidey holes for them AND their food sources.
- In an hour or two, you can easily learn to recognize venomous snakes. (Mushrooms... not so much.)

Snakes that many think are similar, for example corn snake vs copperhead, actually have very distinct markings and are very different once you know a marker or two to look for. About the only time ID can be doubtful is when a head darts out from under somewhere like a rock or log, bites, and then retreats before ID is possible. And if bitten, you'll know within a few seconds to a couple of minutes if it is a venomous snake. It's not always the venom that is so dangerous, at least immediately, but the shock that can result from the scare and the pain involved.

I've grown up in these woods, swimming in every waterbody imaginable, clearing brush and rocks, gardening, etc. I've probably run across hundreds of snakes in my lifetime. I've had them fall out of trees at my feet and swim through my legs in the creek. So far, I've never been bitten. Thankfully! I'm careful where I put my hands and feet (be cautious around crevices and brush), but otherwise, I live my life and try not to sweat the small stuff... or the small things. 

Best wishes as you work to develop your homestead!


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