# First Swarm



## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Caught my first swarm today. A textbook example of a swarm too. It was about 10' up on a maple branch just hanging there clustered up. I doused them heavily with sugar water and waited about 30 minutes but they were aggressive as all get out. I got stung a LOT, even through my suit. 

I didn't bring a saw so I just brushed them off the branch into a deep body with my hands until I was sure I had the lion's share of the mass, then I shook the branch hard until they all either flew away or fell into the box. 

I then set the box up on a picnic table and waited for about 40 minutes. The workers came out to the entrance of the box and started fanning their little Nassanofs off and it was like a slow motion vacuum cleaner. All the bees loitering around in the air slowly got pulled into the box to join their sisters.

Probably one of my coolest beekeeping moments ever. I'm very pleased with how it went.


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## Callieslamb (Feb 27, 2007)

I have caught 2 swarms so I dont' have that much experience, but I haven't ever even used a suit for catching them - they weren't aggressive at all. Are you sure your swarm has a queen? 

glad you caught them. It is fascinating to watch them walk into the hive.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Not 100% sure they have a queen, but they were fanning and they did move from the limb to the box after I got most of the cluster. My book-learning says they won't fan the Nassanof _unless_ they're with the queen, but I'd appreciate some real-experience confirmation on that.

If they don't have a queen, I've got about 5 pounds of really angry workers. Could I take a frame of brood (capped and uncapped) from another hive and let them supercede one?


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## springvalley (Jun 23, 2009)

Ernie, congratulations on your first swarm!! I've never even seen a swarm, let alone try to capture it, but was wondering if you should have tried a sharp 'wack' to the limb first to knock them into the box instead of brushing them off the branch with your hand. Could that have been the trigger to getting the gals riled up? Looking forward to further posts on this!!
-Catherine


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Could have been. I thought about just trying to shake them in but there were a number of branches beneath the one they were on and I didn't want them all scattered across creation. 

I looked at the hive this morning and boy are they aggressive. I got stung on the face just walking up to it. So I suited up and put in the rest of the frames but they were really, really hot. I'm hoping they will calm down.

A couple of questions though:

1. Is the queen in a swarm already fertilized? If not, how long until I can expect her to start laying eggs? There's 2 frames of drawn comb in there already.

2. Should I put a frame of brood in there just in case?


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## Michael W. Smith (Jun 2, 2002)

Ernie, a swarm comes from a hive where once they've started queen cells, the old queen and half the workers take off for a new home. Your queen would be fertile.

The old home hive has to wait for a new queen to hatch, where she then goes around and kills off any other queens in the cells. She now has to leave the hive, mate with a drone, and get back to the hive or the old hive will be trouble.

Odd that a swarm would be so aggressive. Supposedly they fill up on honey before leaving and aren't inclined to sting, but I've seen some mean swarms too. What state are you at Ernie that you have swarms already?


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Illinois. This one was in Belvedere (about an hour and a half west of Chicago) up in a maple tree. First call of the season. I'm not on the regular list but another beekeeper took the call and then passed it to me because it's outside of his convenience range.

We've had unseasonably warm weather here and the dandelions are in full bloom. There's a pretty good honey flow going on right now.


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## upnorthlady (Oct 16, 2009)

Maybe they didn't like the sugar water and hand brushing? Last summer we had a swarm, and were able to catch it about 10 ft up in the trees and just carry the swarm on a branch back to a box. Husband brought along a hedge trimmer to cut the branch they were in. Neither of us got stung. We have noticed, though, that the bees we got this year (in 3 lb package bees) were a lot more aggressive than last year's bees.


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## Michael Bush (Oct 26, 2008)

Violence is really the only way to get bees that are clinging to one thing to let go and get them in or on something else. In other words, brushing gently is ALWAYS a bad idea. With a swarm on a limb, brushing at all is a bad idea. What is called for is a violent shake. The harder the better. To get bees to let go you have to surprise them with enough force that they can't hang on.

I have the best luck just setting up a bait hive with some old comb, some lemongrass oil and some queen juice (alcohol from a jar full of retired queens) and letting them move in. No ladders. No cutting branches. No falling off of ladders. No bees down the back of my shirt while at the top of the ladder...


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

That's such good info. I've watched video after video and read book after book on obtaining swarms but the first time I go to collect one I'm staring at it thinking, "What do I do?" And a bunch of people watching too. As I pulled up and saw it my first thought was, "Oh Lord, don't let this end with me running for the truck screaming like a little girl."


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## rainesridgefarm (Dec 1, 2002)

glad the swarm worked out for you. If I get any more calls I will send them your way also. If they call from your side of the county line. If they stay aggressive let me know I will graft from them to raise some new queens. I like the aggressive ones. 

Phillip 
www.raineshoneyfarm.com


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

rainesridgefarm said:


> glad the swarm worked out for you. If I get any more calls I will send them your way also. If they call from your side of the county line. If they stay aggressive let me know I will graft from them to raise some new queens. I like the aggressive ones.
> 
> Phillip
> www.raineshoneyfarm.com


Thanks! They're over at Don's so I haven't gotten a chance to go check on them in a few days, but the word is that they're settling down and drawing. I plan to open them up and see if there's any brood yet on Monday. I'll let you know!


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## John Carter (Oct 6, 2004)

Ernie said:


> _my first thought was, *"Oh Lord, don't let this end with me running for the truck screaming like a little girl.*_[/B]"


Though we have never met, rest assured that comment gave me pause, a chuckle and a good feeling that Im not the only one with such tremors when I approach them..............thanks:run:


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## alleyyooper (Apr 22, 2005)

some wise person said you only need to fear, fear it's self. I find that to be true with swarms.




























 Al


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## marinemomtatt (Oct 8, 2006)

Ah, love swarm stories...each one is different.
Dealing with swarms ourselves...two in two days...bummer they're both our own bees.
hours of blackberry cutting and fir de-limbing and not tall enough ladders to get to 'em.

Hope everyone else has a GOOD season...May your own Bees not swarm. May you increase your apiaries and may your harvests be plentiful.


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

Well, I checked the swarm box and they've started drawing out comb on the additional frames I put in there and have been collecting honey and pollen and storing it in the existing comb that I put in for them.

However there are no eggs, no brood, no capped brood ... nothing ... and I couldn't find the queen. I also saw what looks like the beginning of a queen cell being drawn but for the life of me I can't imagine what they'll put in it.

We're 11 days into that hive now ... shouldn't I be seeing larva?

In other news, the split I made back at the first of May has TWO queen cells in it, one of which looks like it was starting to open. There's no more brood cells or larva in there so I'm guessing those two queens are their last hope.


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## no1cowboy (May 2, 2004)

Have you seen the queen? I would think that you are queenless at this point,


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

I have not seen the queen in that hive. 

What are my options at this point? Can I move a couple of frames of brood from another hive?


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## Forerunner (Mar 23, 2007)

53convert said:


> Though we have never met, rest assured that comment gave me pause, a chuckle and a good feeling that Im not the only one with such tremors when I approach them..............thanks:run:


I have met Ernie.

We've spent some considerable amount of time discussing and sharing many thoughts and experiences re the political and homesteading worlds.
I read his rendition of the swarm capturing experience and just about fell out of my chair at the thought of him running to his truck, screaming like a girl..... both at the unlikelihood of such an event, and, at the thought of the look in his eyes as he ran, screaming.......

:hysterical:


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## CFF (May 19, 2007)

If you think they may be queenless you could go ahead and add a frame of brood or if you have other hives go through them and see if you can find a frame with a queen cell to add to the hive. 
I caught a swarm a few days ago that was a lot warmer than I like, I'll let them get settled for a few weeks then there getting a new queen


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## G3farms (Dec 18, 2009)

If you do add a frame of brood it will need to have eggs in it. 

I agree if one of your other hives does have a frame with a queen cell on it move it over.

G3


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