# Boar breeding daughters



## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

Will it hurt for a boar to breed his own daughters? I'm planning to keep 4 gilts off my boar but having a hard time keeping them apart.These are just mixed up pigs,no idea what breeds are mixed in.

Thanks for any help.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

No, it really isn't a big deal to breed the boar to his daughters. Very taboo in human society because we're not willing to eat the defective offspring but with pigs simply breed the best of the best and eat the rest. Rinse and repeat.

Obviously you should not breed defective animals. If the boar or gilts show any problems cull them to meat.

If you do breed them and get problems in the litters then you know there were hidden problem recessive genes so cull all the piglets and the parents to meat. Fine to raise them up, just don't breed them again.

By doing this over generations you gradually weed your genetics and select for better and better animals. This is how our dear Mother Nature uses evolution to improve the species.

When you do it accidentally without controls it is called inbreeding and produces problems.

When you do it intentionally it is called linebreeding and this is how the various breeds were created. From that, with enough individuals, you can then create lines within the breeds.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Alan,
I am no pig expert, but have had animals of some sort breeding most of my adult life. If you breed a boy pig and girl pig you will more than likely get a pig of some sort (not being a smart ass please read on).
Worst case scenario, some birth defects, dead piglets possible. Best case scenario they all come out as pigs. So what is the problem? The idea of line breeding is to take an animal of known genetics and breed with a similar animal (closely related) to intensify a positive trait (ie. 14 teats, big ears, etc). When you take animals of unknown lineage and inbreed them, now what traits are you intensifying???? You have no way to know!! This is the problem, with a mixed pig of unknown makeup and no real history (most line breeders would have a many generation history of the animal they intend to use) 
People do what you are talking about, I personally would not. Breeding for a purpose with known genetics, known history and a specific goal in mind of intensifying a specific trait is called line breeding. Breeding close relatives simply because they are together, or you do not have another boar is called inbreeding. Physically the same thing, but the outcome is not.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Muleman is right, those are the biggest keys in a genetics program - having goals, keeping track and culling hard. Eventually you weed out the genetics so you have a nice line. The problem with a small group is the temptation to keep an animal because you 'like' it or because it is your 'only' one. Only keep the good ones. Cull very hard. I figure I select only 5% of our gilts to get a chance to test breed and then some go to market after failing that test. Only 0.5% of males get a chance. Life's tough on the farm for guys.


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## Bondo (Apr 12, 2014)

I wouldn't do it just to do it. If you are line breeding for certain traits then yes. Like big litters, body types, etc... If they have genetics you are after then yeah go for it.


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## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

I don't want him to breed them,don't think they are big enough to breed either.I was just curious if it would hurt the offspring.I'm going to cut him soon as the signs are right again and eat him.I have not seen him pay them any attention,none have been in heat yet to my knowledge.
I've bred game chickens for 50 years and do it all the time with them.Father to daughter,mother to son,etc.Even bred full brother/sister before,when I had to to keep them pure.But you better have GOOD fowl to do that.I use to have a family of black chickens that was bred father to daughters then grand daughters,great grand daughters for 5 generations.6th generation all chicks produced came snow white.Same size,build,and ability of the original trio.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

Genetics is certainly an interesting study. With all of our technology and science there is still much we simply do not know and don't have figured out completely about how it all works. I guess mother nature has never read the rule book science sometimes attempts to make her follow.


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## Muleman (Nov 8, 2013)

I do apologize to the original poster, as when I made the post "Registered breeders, a few observations" I fully intended to create a new thread, but somehow once I answered your thread, I added it on, sorry


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Muleman, I moved it to a new thread for you titled "Registered breeders, a few observations".


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## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

Post whatever you like on my threads.No apology needed.


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## PasturedPork (Jan 22, 2014)

Here is a good article about breeding:
http://davidcavill.wordpress.com/a-beginners-guide-to-inbreeding-and-line-breeding/

I often joke about linebreeding when done right and inbreeding when wrong. The truth is that isn't accurate. Boar to daughter breeding is dangerous in my opinion because of the likelihood of increasing negative traits. I would avoid it at all costs.

I once bred a gilt to her sire and I still feel bad all these years later. I had to euthanize all the piglets they were so deformed.

My advice is explore every other alternative first


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

That is rather unusual. If there are no nasty traits then you won't be getting deformed piglets like that. That merely means you had bad genetics and should cull both the boar, the dam sow, the gilt and probably closely related pigs to market as meat and not keep them as breeders.

That's data. Data is good. Good data is better. Log it.


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## PasturedPork (Jan 22, 2014)

It was super unusual. I have great genetics but I think it was one of those 1 in 10,000 things


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

Hmm... Then it's just a time to cull that specific genetic group, not to generalize about the line breeding.


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## PasturedPork (Jan 22, 2014)

highlands said:


> Hmm... Then it's just a time to cull that specific genetic group, not to generalize about the line breeding.



This is good advice for someone with hundreds of pigs like yourself. I only have 6 sows and 1 boar. For those of us with small herds these types of issues are a larger gamble because it's harder to cull whole lines.


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## highlands (Jul 18, 2004)

I used the same hard culling back when I had only a few sows. I culled entire lines backwards at times in order to eliminate problems. It worked. That's why I now have really good genetics. It's a process. It takes years. Pigs need to go to market. Always be culling and cull hard so you keep improving.


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## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

We cut him about 10 am. So if they were not bred before today,daddy won't be doing it.It wasn't near as much trouble as I thought it would be.1 shot from the vet,a new razor knife blade and done.


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## ErikaMay (Feb 28, 2013)

Ug. I know i need to be more aggressive with culling. Of my 3 sows one did great farrowing by herself, but has smaller piglets and eats more for slower growing piglets. She'll be getting the cut. I'm still debating on the other two pigs....i know technically the main girl should be culled because she's had trouble getting bred in the past. But when she does get bred shes the best momma and her babies grow crazy fast! Its hard to choose when to cull sometimes.


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## Paquebot (May 10, 2002)

Having been involved with raising pigeons for longer than most here have been on this planet, the rules for inbreeding for a factor was always cock to granddaughter and hen to grandson. As far as I know, the genomes and the potential myriad of factors have not been applied to pigs but father-daughter or mother-son consequences possibly applies to that species as well.

Martin


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## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

Traded for a registered Hampshire boar,didn't get the papers on him though.Didn't care about the papers,the goat I traded was gonna get shot for eating my fruit trees.He's 3 months old and thinks he's a lap pig.He should be in hog heaven with 8 gilts,when he figures out what gilts are for.lol 
I'll get pics of the hogs if anybody wants to see my junk.


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## Waiting Falcon (Nov 25, 2010)

I bought a gilt as a piglet with the idea of breeding her when she was ready.
I discussed which boar to use with the breeder of the gilt and went with his suggestion.
8 big piglets were born 5 lived, only three did not have a deformity we could see(who knows what they looked like inside). The breeder of the gilt and owner of the boar got together and found that she had been bred to her own brother. 

I have been told genetic are different in hogs. You might get by with breeding close/linebreeding in other species but it is different with hogs.

If anyone has proof this is not so i would like to see it. That was to say the least a disappointing litter. And as you can imagine, people that raise hogs for the market can not afford to lose litters like this.


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## Waiting Falcon (Nov 25, 2010)

Correction 
The gilt's dam was bred to a littermate of the sire the gilt was bred to.

So that made a very close breeding


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## alan anderson (Mar 2, 2014)

boar pics


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