# Guerilla Rifle



## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society, whatever ... which one would it be and why?

Would it have a scope? Simply iron sights?


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## deaconjim (Oct 31, 2005)

I'd probably take my Mauser .308, with the scope. It's accurate enough to make me look like a good shot, and will handle most anything I would need to use it on.


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## Badger (Jun 11, 2010)

I'm afraid my pick would not be a rifle at all but a double barrel 12 gauge.


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

Ernie said:


> If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society, whatever ... which one would it be and why?
> 
> Would it have a scope? Simply iron sights?


 I'd take my Mosin. I know its a bolt action, only holds 5 shots yadda yadda. But if I was on the run and needed something that would fire every time I trust it. I broke the firing pin on one in the field. I broke it down without any tools and filed the pin on a rock. I still haven't replaced that pin...

Besides, in that situation I'm sure I could use the Mosin to acquire a 'better' rifle later.


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## PhilJohnson (Dec 24, 2006)

InvalidID said:


> I'd take my Mosin. I know its a bolt action, only holds 5 shots yadda yadda. But if I was on the run and needed something that would fire every time I trust it. I broke the firing pin on one in the field. I broke it down without any tools and filed the pin on a rock. I still haven't replaced that pin...
> 
> Besides, in that situation I'm sure I could use the Mosin to acquire a 'better' rifle later.


My choice too  My second choice would be a good old fashioned pump action 12 gauge although that isn't really a rifle.


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## deaconjim (Oct 31, 2005)

Naturally, I'd also have the .44 Mag Redhawk with me as well.


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## tinknal (May 21, 2004)

I'm almost wondering if something like a lever action 22 magnum of some sort. Iron sights. It has decent range, and is good for game from squirrels to deer. It doesn't have to kill an adversary, just discontinue pursuit. If the folk after you are "civilized" they will have to stop to aid wounded pursuers. It doesn't make a bunch of noise, and you will be able to carry hundreds of rounds of ammo.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Probably take the 303 British Enfield, though I'm more comfortable with the .22.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

I'd take something much like this:










Or this:


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Cyngbaeld said:


> Probably take the 303 British Enfield, though I'm more comfortable with the .22.


Same here,Dh and his 303 British, he likes his spine shots and the 22 Win. semi auto for me. I have sighted it in to a quater(thin side) put into a crack in a fencepost, the lead just meshes it'self up on the edge of the coin, works for me.Kinda like shooting dots with the bow.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

Ernie said:


> If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society, whatever ... which one would it be and why?
> 
> Would it have a scope? Simply iron sights?


For this, the Fox double barrel or the Ithaca pump.The Fox is always "right there" when you throw it up and the Pump never jams.


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## ryanthomas (Dec 10, 2009)

AK-47. Designed for guerilla warfare. Not particularly accurate, but you can literally drop it in the mud and it still cycles. No scope. Running through the wilderness you're going to bump it on all kinds of stuff so it will quickly become worthless.


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## SocialAnarchist (Mar 23, 2011)

AK-47, with all the spare magazines I could carry.


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

If it had to be a rifle that I OWN, it would by either my SKS or my Mosin.

PROBABLY my Mosin, because it has a nice scope AND iron sites if I bump the scope out, I could quickly pick it off and still have a chance at hitting something.

Funny, I just wrote about my little scope/stock change on my Mosin tonight:

http://themodernhomestead.com/Blog/?p=817


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

seedspreader said:


> If it had to be a rifle that I OWN, it would by either my SKS or my Mosin.
> 
> PROBABLY my Mosin, because it has a nice scope AND iron sites if I bump the scope out, I could quickly pick it off and still have a chance at hitting something.
> 
> ...


 She's a beauty. I'm making a new stock for mine now, all that wood...too much. I'll have to post some pics once I get it finished.


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## Blu3duk (Jun 2, 2002)

Ernie said:


> If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society, whatever ... which one would it be and why?
> 
> Would it have a scope? Simply iron sights?


running from the law: am i gonna shoot at them or just to use to gather game?

running from mobs: Run are you serial? am i out gunned?? run??? me??

running from lawless society: Where am I running to?? and who is likely to follow? and who might I meet out there to warrant defenses? Am I alone or with others???... with family????.... kids???.... harem???

running from whatever: Am I just trying to be alone, whats my motivation??

10-22 cut down to about 12 inch barrel, stock sawn off to pistol grip and wire buttstock made to screw on. Why? cause it works, it accurate, and its fast and lightweight. it will take the small game anyone needs to survive on daily, bird, squirrel, skunk and so forth, and yes even a larger game animal but what would id with that on the run. 

The 10-22 locks excellent, it is nearly is infallible as a falling block or rolling block, though not quite. I would rather have my old model 06 Winchester hammer-pump take down, but it does need more care than other rifles, and I would want a tang peep for it if it was going along as "the" rifle..... and that i dont have..... yet. The 06 locks up like a falling block also if you ever get a chance to look at one of them, they are tack driving firearms because of that alone.... accuracy and one shot for a grouse, squirrel or whatever else.
*warning: the following is highly unlawful to possess, and is for educational and "what if" purposes only:*
If i was to have the time to make one up, a ruger MKI or II driled about 3/4 inch in front of the projectile angled out front, add a ***** of exhaust pipe and epoxy it on [threading both pieces can be done too time and equipment allowing] solder/weld in a chunk of thick shim stock, place firearm in vise add length of twine to trigger and discharge while standing behind a reasonable shield so projectile can drill its own hole in shim stock, add scope, wire buttstock and you have a very stabilized projectile expeller accurate to a couple hundred yards that about the only noise that you hear from it is the bolt closing after each spent casing is ejected. because I have shot these "proto-types" thats why.... but they take a day or three to make properly and well i aint gonna make one and have it laying around without paperwork on it... thats why.... but I know how to make one, and the above description is close with a few things left out, but the one i got to shoot years ago, had 30-40,000 rounds that had gone through it before i was shooting it, and it was ACCURATE..... ya could hear a ricochet if ya hit a rock. but thast would be my preference over anything, second would be the 10-22 and third would be the winchester 06 in that order..... for reason stated.... accuracy and quietness in all three.... the 10-22 being the loudest more than likely.

William


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## jerrwhy (Jan 12, 2010)

I always thought Col Jeff Coopers Scout Rifle concept was about the dumbest idea known to man. However, once Ruger released their Thunder Ranch Scout Rifle that's based on Cooper's concept I have to admit that I'm fairly lustful and really, really want one. 

So that's my choice the Ruger Scout Rifle, with a defensive pistol, and my Ruger Mark 3 hunter .22 pistol.


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## crispin (Jun 30, 2010)

SocialAnarchist said:


> AK-47, with all the spare magazines I could carry.


+2


I would never ever want to take a 5 shot anything as my get away gun.
Nostalgia isn't going to keep you alive.


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## spurdie (Oct 6, 2008)

Ak 47 here as well. Kiss principle.


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## Chuck R. (Apr 24, 2008)

Hereâs mine:










Colt LE6920, with a Trijicon Tri-Power (Fiber Optic, Battery, Tritium) red dot, a SureFire 300X light, and Troy BUIS. Itâs light, handy, and modular:

Swap out the optic and it will work as a DMR.
Drop in my Spikeâs Tactical .22LR conversion unit, and it works for small game.
Change loads and in a pinch it will work for medium game.
Stock adjusts for those with smaller stature or to compensate for layered clothing/armor.

Ammunition is readily available and so are spare parts. I use it for 3-gun matches and have taken several carbine classes with it and have never had an issue. After 22 years in the Army, itâs the system I know best.

Chuck


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## CocalicoSprings (Mar 12, 2008)

Ruger Ranch rifle ...min mag 14...
.223 caliber
Reasons: inexpensive ammo, accessible almost anywhere, accurate, semi-auto with easily switchable ammo clips, lightweight, short barrel length, powerful enough to kill a deer or a human yet doesn't tear too big a hole in an animal you wish to eat.
Scope is not necessary but I would probably recommend unless you do a lot of shooting!


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## zant (Dec 1, 2005)

Either my 45-70 Giude Gun or one of my faithful Klatchs.....either will provide protection and a means to aquire any other firearm I want.....and of course my 1911.


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## Cabin Fever (May 10, 2002)

Ernie said:


> If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society, whatever ... which one would it be and why?
> 
> Would it have a scope? Simply iron sights?


Me, my M1A Scout Squad. I have six loaded mags in two pouches (#7 is in the gun). The two pouches, my 1911 and its ammo pouches, canteen and day pack, are all attached to a web belt with suspenders and ready to go.

WIHH, her Colt AR-15A3 tactical HBAR carbine. She has the same set up with ammo pouches, canteen, day pack, etc. on a suspendered web belt. Her belt includes a holstered .45acp revolver.


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## fordy (Sep 13, 2003)

...................Regardless of who I was hiding from , I'd chose A combo pistol\rifle using 22 mag ammo ! I feel it's feasible too carry 1,000 rounds along with other gear necessary for survival . Any caliber above 22 mag is going too severely limit the volume of rounds most think is necessary for survival . What good is any firearm , regardless of caliber if a body can only carry a limited number of rounds ? I'm assuming this scenerio is based upon an extended period of disengagement with society which prevents resupply . , fordy


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

crispin said:


> +2
> 
> 
> I would never ever want to take a 5 shot anything as my get away gun.
> Nostalgia isn't going to keep you alive.


 That's exactly what I'd hope my pursuers would be thinking.


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## Win07_351 (Dec 7, 2008)

Going into the wilderness, I'd take a .22 rifle and 12ga. shotgun .

I'd also have my trusty .380 pocket pistol which is with me anyway.


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

Hey Ernie, you asked the question but didn't answer. What would you carry?


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## Ernie (Jul 22, 2007)

InvalidID said:


> Hey Ernie, you asked the question but didn't answer. What would you carry?


Why does it always have to be about me? 

Hard to say in any specific situation, but I'm awful partial to my Mossberg and a 1911.

If you're a one man show then you'd best not get in a firefight where you need more than 5 shells or you're dead anyway. I also don't plan on trying to disappear into the wilderness. I'm more than prepared to disappear into an urban setting as well and I'd want something easily concealable.


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## radiofish (Mar 30, 2007)

It all depends...

Probably my M-1 Garand in .30-06 Springfield along with my web gear set up for it.. Plus a few bandoleers of extra ammunition/ en-bloc clips. In the butt stock compartment, I do have a cleaning kit and oiler at all times.

Or for convenience of a single caliber of ammunition - maybe one of my lever action carbines (Marlin with or Winchester without a scope) chambered in .357 magnum, along with one of my .357 magnum revolvers.

I don't think that I would grab a .22 caliber weapon in this scenario. I would rather have one of my Mosin-Nagant M-44 carbines chambered in 7.62X54mm, instead of a .22 rifle/ pistol.


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## Cyngbaeld (May 20, 2004)

Certainly would be easier to disappear in an urban setting, IMHO. In that case if I could only have one, it would be the .38 special undercover from Charter Arms.

I have a hand held cattle prod. Could I take that too? Quiet and could buy you some get-a-way time.


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

Ernie said:


> Why does it always have to be about me?
> 
> Hard to say in any specific situation, but I'm awful partial to my Mossberg and a 1911.
> 
> If you're a one man show then you'd best not get in a firefight where you need more than 5 shells or you're dead anyway. I also don't plan on trying to disappear into the wilderness. I'm more than prepared to disappear into an urban setting as well and I'd want something easily concealable.


 I'm with you on the 5 rounds thing. If I'm on the run from something I'd avoid shooting if at all possible. If I had to shoot it'd be a fire and scramble kinda thing. That's why the Mosin for me. I can hit (with iron sights) a pie pumpkin at about 500 paces. Not dead center, but good enough for me.

Handguns I'm kinda contrary. I see 3 main uses:

1) Cover fire so I can escape, get to a long gun, wait for help.
2) Extreme close range, everything else has failed and I'm about to die. Hoping to pull one out of my 
3) Urban environments where I need to conceal my weapon. This can include both of the above.

In any of the above I'd want more rounds above 'stopping power'. Also, in an Urban environment I can see how you'd want more 'stealth' so I'd want something quieter. I think a 22 with a hi cap mag would be just the ticket.
Hope I never have to find out though.


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## TheMartianChick (May 26, 2009)

Ernie said:


> Why does it always have to be about me?
> 
> Hard to say in any specific situation, but I'm awful partial to my Mossberg and a 1911.
> 
> If you're a one man show then you'd best not get in a firefight where you need more than 5 shells or you're dead anyway. I also don't plan on trying to disappear into the wilderness. I'm more than prepared to disappear into an urban setting as well and I'd want something easily concealable.


Why do I picture Ernie with a tank strapped to his back instead of a rifle?:runforhills:


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

TheMartianChick said:


> Why do I picture Ernie with a tank strapped to his back instead of a rifle?:runforhills:


 I picture most people not noticing Ernie till he wants them too.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I'm with you on the 5 rounds thing. If I'm on the run from something I'd avoid shooting if at all possible.


That's a good plan, and also why I prefer long range "communications"


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## Ross (May 9, 2002)

I have no reason to run from the law but Lee Enfield #4 mk1* works in the ice, works in the heat, works in the mud or the dust. Not as powerful as some yet more than enough for Moose and down.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

This is one of those very tough questions...

If I'm being followed, and there's a chance of shooting back, I want a large bore rifle... I'd use the .300 win mag and take 'long' shots, and then move to another location. 

If I'm not being followed, and can carry only one rifle, odds are I'd be thinking about the 10-22.

With the 300, I can take down any animal in NA. However, it makes a hellacious noise, that can be heard for miles... See: Williams post on silencers. Noise attracts Zombies, hungry folks, folks that might be hunting you. I might be able to carry 100 rounds, 200 at the outside, without getting weighed own. Shooting anything less than a deer sized animal is going to obliterate the carcass. Rabbits, squirrels, *****, possums, ....small game.... the kind that might survive the first 'hungry months' wouldn't even be worth shooting with the big magnum. Perfect for humans and big game.

10-22... I can carry several bricks of ammo, in the same volume as the large bore. Can take any animal, if you get close enough. Inuits kill polar bears with 22's. William discussed briefly methods of silencing the 22... there are books online that go into detail. Some can be jury-rigged quickly. One could hunt small game for months, or years, without attracting attention. A well placed 22 round will seriously ruin someone's day.

Shotguns are great... but the shells are massive.

Sidearms? .44 mag for sure. Whatever the 22 won't kill, the .44 will, esp. with handloaded rounds. I've yet to find my bullets are killing mule deer and wild hogs. Would probably try and take the Contender, with multiple barrels. One frame, multiple barrels that'd take squirrels all the way to buffalo.

Firefight? I'm going to die... don't harbor any Rambo fantasies... there are too many folks out there with more training and experience than I have.... but if did look 'bad', I'd sling the AK and the AR, with a dozen mags... and at least make the folks hunting me duck every now and then....


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> This is one of those very tough questions...


It really is since most *plan* NOT to be limited to just one.

It realistically takes 3 or 4 to cover all scenarios


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

I like the AK-47 for durability and simplicity.
If it had to be one I own, I'd probably grab a .223. A guy can carry a lot of .223 rounds.
I like the AR because it's light, as is the SU16.
The Saiga .223 is AK tough and simple though.
Not sure a Mini-14 would be the rifle for that scenario.


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## Txrider (Jun 25, 2010)

If I had to choose one, it would be my lever action winchester.


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## watcher (Sep 4, 2006)

I'd choose one which I could find a ready supply of ammo and/or replacement parts for in the area I was in. Most likely the same weapon the local military or police used.


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## Guest (Apr 26, 2011)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It really is since most *plan* NOT to be limited to just one.
> 
> It realistically takes 3 or 4 to cover all scenarios


 Yes, it does. And eventually we end up with something to cover them all.

But if I'm going to have to carry the things on my back I'm back to the "one gun" decision again.

Hard to say really. Just at the moment I'd probably go with the Marlin lever-action in .357 and six inch N frame revolver in the same to match.

But tomorrow I may say something else.


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## Dutch 106 (Feb 12, 2008)

Hey Ernie,
I think there are too many variables in your question, if I'm actually in Gurrila mode I would chose the same cartridge as the oppresor uses, easier logistics.
For wilderness survival I keep a pair of 1917 enfields that have been sporterised, excess metal removed stocks cut back and a 100 rounds along with the BOBs in either vehicle. there is of course the 41 mag on my hip and a box of 50 rounds in the BOB's and the 30 rounds with me all the time.
Both of the 1917's have 4 power leopolds mounted and have the original sights still there with the stock pad set up to work with the scope and if its taken off (and the scope) you have the fixed sights ready to line up.
The bus BOV will eventually end up with an extended Bob and armoury.
CHeers,
Dutch


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## Mike in Ohio (Oct 29, 2002)

InvalidID said:


> I'm with you on the 5 rounds thing. If I'm on the run from something I'd avoid shooting if at all possible. If I had to shoot it'd be a fire and scramble kinda thing. That's why the Mosin for me. I can hit (with iron sights) a pie pumpkin at about 500 paces. Not dead center, but good enough for me.
> 
> Handguns I'm kinda contrary. I see 3 main uses:
> 
> ...


http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y 

Add a foregrip and a laser on the side. 

Light/small and easy to carry/Hi-cap mags/


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## InvalidID (Feb 18, 2011)

Mike in Ohio said:


> http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y
> 
> Add a foregrip and a laser on the side.
> 
> Light/small and easy to carry/Hi-cap mags/


 That would work fine, just fine. Good looking piece there. I've also been looking at this lil gem.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/our-guns/pistols/plr-22/


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## snake35 (Jan 24, 2011)

Savage .17 hmr It is light weight and accurate to 200 yards.


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## poorboy (Apr 15, 2006)

Probly would take my single shot .22 a bulk pack of ammo and about that much in cb short for quiet work.
reason it's the most reliable, highly accurate, and easiest to maintain. Would be able to obtain other types of weapons with it, if needed.


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## Usingmyrights (Jan 10, 2011)

Badger said:


> I'm afraid my pick would not be a rifle at all but a double barrel 12 gauge.





7thswan said:


> For this, the Fox double barrel or the Ithaca pump.The Fox is always "right there" when you throw it up and the Pump never jams.


I don't know what it is with people and double barrel shotguns there's better options out there when it comes to shotguns. As far as pumps not jambing then can and do. I bought a pump rifle that jams, unfortunately it was the risk I took from buying a used gun.



Blu3duk said:


> 10-22 cut down to about 12 inch barrel, stock sawn off to pistol grip and wire buttstock made to screw on. Why? cause it works, it accurate, and its fast and lightweight. it will take the small game anyone needs to survive on daily, bird, squirrel, skunk and so forth, and yes even a larger game animal but what would id with that on the run.


Why not just buy a Ruger Charger and add a folding stock? If you bought the folding stock you may need to trim the end of it some if it sticks out past the barrel, but thats it. (I don't think that Rugar changed the mounting setup between the Charger and the regular 10/22





texican said:


> With the 300, I can take down any animal in NA. However, it makes a hellacious noise, that can be heard for miles... See: Williams post on silencers. Noise attracts Zombies, hungry folks, folks that might be hunting you. I might be able to carry 100 rounds, 200 at the outside, without getting weighed own. Shooting anything less than a deer sized animal is going to obliterate the carcass. Rabbits, squirrels, *****, possums, ....small game.... the kind that might survive the first 'hungry months' wouldn't even be worth shooting with the big magnum. Perfect for humans and big game.
> 
> Firefight? I'm going to die... don't harbor any Rambo fantasies... there are too many folks out there with more training and experience than I have.... but if did look 'bad', I'd sling the AK and the AR, with a dozen mags... and at least make the folks hunting me duck every now and then....


A regular 270, 308, 30-06 will also take down any animal in North America. This is without the noise, recoil, cost to buy/feed, harder to find ammo, less wasted meat, etc.


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## unioncreek (Jun 18, 2002)

I'd take my Savage over/under with 22 LR on top and 20 gauge on the bottom.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Why not just buy a Ruger Charger and add a folding stock?


It's illegal to add a shoulder stock to a handgun, just as it would be to cut the rifle below 16"


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## Cornhusker (Mar 20, 2003)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It's illegal to add a shoulder stock to a handgun, just as it would be to cut the rifle below 16"


Well, it's illegal unless you pay the $200 tax stamp


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## jnh (Oct 4, 2007)

1 plus for the m-1 garand they are hard to beat


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

Usingmyrights said:


> A regular 270, 308, 30-06 will also take down any animal in North America. This is without the noise, recoil, cost to buy/feed, harder to find ammo, less wasted meat, etc.


True... I've taken elk with the .270.... but, I can take elk further away, with the .300.

Public land hunting, you need every edge you can get. No doubt I could take one with my .44.... I carry it as a sidearm while hunting, in case I get the awkward behind the back, off side, shot.

If we have a major, civilization ending shtf scenario, every Tom, Dick, and Mary Jane that doesn't have a private BOL, will be heading towards Public lands... Every ******* peckerwood I know has a prep plan.... hunt and fish (that stupid C/W Rock song, A Country Boy Can Survive)... imagine the non-******* peckerwoods will have the same plan... and game will become scarce. Imho, it'd be rare to find a large ungulate six months after the fall... seeing one close would be rarer than seeing one cresting a hill 500 yards away.

I have a 'few' rifles, of differing calibers. I hold no illusions that finding ammo for ANY of them, would be possible, if the shtf. Would you trade your last box of Ought Six for a couple of silver eagles? or even 'double eagles'? Some 'might', I wouldn't. If I were to take off to the hills, on a guerilla campaign, or just bugging out, I'd operate on the premise that I have exactly '100 rounds'... and to make each and every one count (Daniel Boone syndrome... bring home two animals for every bullet shot). Imagine the only ammo one would 'find' would be off someone who no longer was breathing fresh air (pickup ammo).

Knowing all this, I find the 22LR to be a wise choice... a few bricks will fill the stew pot for a long long time... without alerting everyone in the valley that texican has kilt another large critter... let's eat!


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## naturelover (Jun 6, 2006)

Bearfootfarm said:


> It's illegal to add a shoulder stock to a handgun, just as it would be to cut the rifle below 16"


I don't think the legalities of it would matter much to the escapee given the lawless scenario he described in the original post. 



> "_If you had to take one rifle with you into the wilderness, running from the law, mobs, lawless society_,....."


Just saying ...... 

.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I don't think the legalities of it would matter much to the escapee given the lawless scenario he described in the original post.


I took it to be multiple choice:



> the law, *mobs*, lawless society


You could be running from a bunch of angry Cannucks after they lost a soccer game 

You wouldn't want to be carrying an illegal weapon in that scenario


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## seedspreader (Oct 18, 2004)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I took it to be multiple choice:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Actually you'd be in more danger of carrying Tim Horton's in that instance.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

things i would be looking for in a guerilla gun 

common ammo 
this falls into a few catagories 
first common cartrige like 30-06 , 308 ,223 somthing that i might happen appon 
308 and 223 are ideal as most any oppsiing force would use them


12 ga may be good lots of them are sitting in the backs of drawers frendlies may have lost thier guns already but can scrounge a few rounds from the back of a drawer or coat pocket that was not searched at confiscation time 

if your a guerrila force you will have some support from those freindly to the cause 
if you don't have some support your not a geurilla your all alone 

concealable could be a bonus in some cases 

taking a lesson from some modern day geurillas (not that i think ther cause is for good but they fit the definition of indiginouse people fighting and outside force with some support of other locals they may border on the definition as they may have less support if they wernt terifying people into supporting them) the wars we are fighting right now in afganistan most of the guns are AK's from 1950s production mixed and mached parts stuff left over from the soviet war the ammo is newer 
some of the ammo is our own supplied to security forces and it turns up in ememy hands many of the AK's being carried have the but stock cut off so that they can be concealed by traditional dress and carried easily on motor bike 

many reports of aks in iraque that looked like they were drug form a drainage ditch as they were they can be hidden in plain sight in the mud of the dranage canal or river bed then recoverd and cleaned up and oild well enough to work why they can grease the inside heavily , and the crome lined barrels don't corrode much also grease can be packed into the barrel and gas tube then recover dis-assemble clean and return to action they arn't concerned about sub minute groups at 100 meters they arn't marks man the round is inefective at ranges of 600 meters but they figured out how to use a little fire to get people to ruin were they want right into the IED 

coalition forces have started training soldiers to stay in thier trucks becuse the ditch they would have normaly jumped into is were the IED's are this is as much mental war fare as it is anything 

so concealability , common ammo , and the ability to stash it and retrive it later.
a glock 17 9mm or 22 in 40 sounds like a great guerilla gun they can be frozen in ice , stuck in mud , concealable , interchangable parts , lots of them out there but they only fill part of the need but definitly a gun to get a gun with.

others would be anything that can be stashed and recoverd 

her is an interesting idea the rusians originaly were chambered 7.62x53 but the finns also had that , so the rusains rechambered by cutting 1mm longer then thier ammo would not chamber in a 53 but 53 ammo would chamber in thier rifle


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## longshot38 (Dec 19, 2006)

for me its a toss up between a pump 12 gauge for small game and big game with slugs and my .303 Enfield it will take all large animals here regardless of the number of legs.


id probably take the .303 because i could use other methods of taking the small game.


dean

ETA id use iron sites because that's what the rifle was designed to use and they've worked for 100 years.


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## longshot38 (Dec 19, 2006)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I took it to be multiple choice:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


that would be a hockey game LOL good point though.

dean


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> that would be a hockey game LOL good point though.


I almost said hocky, but I remembered her thread about the World Cup games


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Well, it's illegal unless you pay the $200 tax stamp


I hate paperwork and taxes, and there's no real advantage to a short barrel in lots of guns.
A 22 will get maximum velocity in a 16 in barrel. if you get much over 18 inches, they can actually start to slow down.


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## naturelover (Jun 6, 2006)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I almost said hocky, but I remembered her thread about the World Cup games


Correction - that's my sister's thread, not mine. I know .... I'm a bad ambassador for Canadian hockey but I can't stand the game, it's too brutal for my liking and I don't understand a thing about it except that hockey sticks and ice skates have potential as deadly weapons.

.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> Correction - that's my sister's thread, not mine.


Oops!
LOL
Twins confuse me


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## Usingmyrights (Jan 10, 2011)

Bearfootfarm said:


> I hate paperwork and taxes, and there's no real advantage to a short barrel in lots of guns.
> A 22 will get maximum velocity in a 16 in barrel. if you get much over 18 inches, they can actually start to slow down.


I'd have to look it up again to see where I saw it, but I read that the ideal barrel length for a 22lr was either 18 1/2 or 19". This was supposed to be the perfect balance between velocity and accuracy.


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## 7thswan (Nov 18, 2008)

I don't know what it is with people and double barrel shotguns there's better options out there when it comes to shotguns. As far as pumps not jambing then can and do. I bought a pump rifle that jams, unfortunately it was the risk I took from buying a used gun.quote) Because I've been using these guns sinse a kid, in stressul situations,I'd like to have something I know well. No sence in using any of my dh's guns, I simply do't know them and they are sited in for him.


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## Bearfootfarm (Jul 13, 2006)

> I read that the ideal barrel length for a 22lr was either 18 1/2 or 19".


It varies a little depending on the exact load.

The test I remember was done by cutting a barrel one inch at a time, but I don't remember if they did different loads too

The velocity changes weren't huge either way until they got below about 14 inches

There are a *LOT *of different 22 loads available, and it pays to try as many as possible in very gun to see what performs best

Barrel length alone really doesn't relate that much to accuracy since there are so many other variables.


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## GREENCOUNTYPETE (Jul 25, 2006)

my favorite the best of the guerilla movies is American Gurilla in the Phillipenes



"the best gun is the one you have with you" some smart person


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## Blu3duk (Jun 2, 2002)

Since i missed the quetion being asked of me about a ruger charger and Bearfoot answeree it perty well, I would only add, that since they came out i aint never seen anyone locally with one, and i have friends who did cut a couple old 10-22 rifles down like i described and they do work well, I believe, if i remember rightly,that shorter than 10 inches they got louder..... the "stabilized" MKII a different friend made up had a 4 inch barrel, and he had experimented on it numerous ways, even drilling hols in the side of the barrel, that poor firearm should never have shot a 12 inch group at 10 feet, but i shot dime groups at 150 yards, and we hit gophers [groundsquirrels] over 200 witht he scoped tool..... I miss that old fella, he passed on about 3-4 years back.... but i learnt many things from him over the years i knowed him. *"Everything is legal 'til you get caught"* was his favorite saying..... so i stopped asking if it was or wasnt after about the fiftieth time he said it! [yeah i is a slow learner sometimes] he also fished with homemade c-4 for fun and excitement, and to top it all off he was a korean war vet and was only 15 when he enlisted.....

besides i can pick up used 10-22's for less than a charger right now if i watch the pawn shops and craigslist and newspapers..... the MKII is harder to get at a deal price, but ya can git one of those once in a while too reasonable like.

I am with texican, a person can only carry so much weight, and so many rounds with them, so I believe its better to have the 22 and not try to take on that angry canadian hockey fan horde! or if i meet them be able to holler in my bestest canuck accent ABOOT time you showed up EH! they went OOOT there----->

William - former semi-canadian from top of idaho
now in North Central Idaho


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## oldasrocks (Oct 27, 2006)

If I could only take one rifle with me it would be a 17HMR Marlin bolt action. Quiet, deadly to 200 yards and I could carry a lot of rounds.


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