# poachers are tickin me off



## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

one shot with a high powered rifle at 8:10 pm followed 5 minutes later by a truck spinning its wheels and speeding away can only mean one thing. i just want to catch them doing it someday...


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## tamarackreg (Mar 13, 2006)

Wed. night 10:30 p.m. there was a shot very close to my house. I went out and looked around and listened but was too late. Late night and predawn shots are fairly common. Last year I found 2 decapitated bucks near my home shortly before firearm season, this year I found one (so far). Last year and the year before I could take you to over a dozen deer laying along the road with only their hindquarters removed, the rest left to spoil. All were within 3 miles of my house. This is the work of genuine lowlife scumbags. I too just want to catch them doing it someday.....
It makes you wonder what else they would be capable of.


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

it is just so discouraging when it is the night before firearms season. the shots were very close to my property and treestand but on the state. i also have heard shots after dark throughout the summer. i have lived here long enough to know what poaching shots are compared to target practice and when poaching occurs. as a result of the dozen plus incidents i heard throughout the fall, i have seen nothing but fawns on my hunts. i saw 20 fawns and no mature does during early muzzleloader season.


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

Makes it real nice when you move into an area and two of your neighbors tell you they poach,done it all their life and will continue to do it.Plus they both think that your property needs burned every year.

big rockpile


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

i can understand someone taking a doe if they are starving or poor and have bad luck DURING hunting season. preseason antler poachers tick me off. so does being a hog and taking one every week of the fall.


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

MELOC said:


> i can understand someone taking a doe if they are starving or poor and have bad luck DURING hunting season. preseason antler poachers tick me off. so does being a hog and taking one every week of the fall.



How about killing one a day.Same with Turkeys.

big rockpile


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## moonwolf (Sep 20, 2004)

In this province we have a Poacher's Hotline. 
Carrying cell phones makes it handy to call in when any poaching action is suspected, with usually a good police or CO (conservation officer) response and apprehension rate. Poaching won't ever stop, but with programs that the public is aware to help curtail it, like the Hotline, it helps put the poacher with second thoughts if they know they are being 'watched'.


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

If the Bible is to be believed, God gave man dominion over the animals, after making man with none but God having dominion over them. Eventually some half-witted men decided to give other men dominion over them, and their personal lives, those men, so empowered, claimed the animals as their own; the "King's" deer or whatever, and now the states' deer or whatever.

There are those folks who exercise their "God given rights", those who exercise their "man given rights", and those who kill for the joy of killing. It is this latter group who are the most visable respresentatives of the hunting community.


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## RoyalOaksRanch (Nov 14, 2003)

Haggis said:


> If the Bible is to be believed, God gave man dominion over the animals, after making man with none but God having dominion over them. Eventually some half-witted men decided to give other men dominion over them, and their personal lives, those men, so empowered, claimed the animals as their own; the "King's" deer or whatever, and now the states' deer or whatever.
> 
> There are those folks who exercise their "God given rights", those who exercise their "man given rights", and those who kill for the joy of killing. It is this latter group who are the most visable respresentatives of the hunting community.


 Man manages our deer herds so that they are able to flourish and not get over populated which would cause them to starve thru winter. The laws protects the does in the spring when they are needed to feed and raise the fawns, point restrictions benifit both the hunters and the deer as it allows bigger bucks to have more of a chance to better the gene pool, Taking some of the bucks out of the herd also allows the bucks a better chance at surviving rut and going into winter. Rut takes a big toll on the bucks, thinning some out helps the mature ones not have to spend so much time fighting for does, and they go thru winter in much better condition, it also takes some of the pressure off the does from having 20 bucks chasing her all over... With proper management the deer herds are maintained at levels suitable for the area. Poachers arent helping the herd, they are greedy people who give no thought to anything or anyone but themselves.. 
I also do not think that those who kill for the joy are killing are the "most visable representatives of the hunting community. That would be like saying the rapists are the most visable representives of a certain community. Or that gangs represent a different community. There are way more legal hunters than there are poachers. 
Just because there are some who believe they are above the law doesnt make them the most visable representative. How about all the legal people who hunt? Heck go to a gun show, or hunting expo and youll see just how many hunters are there. Poachers come in all sizes, shapes and sexes.. Poaching IS a problem, and it takes all us legal hunters to help stop them.


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## dagwood (Jul 17, 2006)

> Poachers come in all sizes, shapes and sexes.. Poaching IS a problem, and it takes all us legal hunters to help stop them.


Amen to that statement! Years ago we had a problem with poachers on our property. The bums even shot one of our horses! 

It was only after all the hunters in our area banded together were we able to stop the poaching. Many methods we used were illegal but they sure worked. Once the word gets out that poachers (and their vehicles) will be dealt with severly they will move on to an area where folks are either too stupid or too afraid to take the fight to them.

Poachers are scum IMO and deserve whatever stray bullet finds its way into their legs.


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## Highground (Jan 22, 2003)

Once upon a time there was a family known for heavy poaching in this area. One of them had a brand spankin new Ford pick up he was sooooo proud of.
After he was overheard bragging about the big buck he poached from the wrong person's land, that pretty new truck didn't look so pretty anymore.
And the driver had a new nick-name....... Ricochet.


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## dagwood (Jul 17, 2006)

Highground said:


> Once upon a time there was a family known for heavy poaching in this area. One of them had a brand spankin new Ford pick up he was sooooo proud of.
> After he was overheard bragging about the big buck he poached from the wrong person's land, that pretty new truck didn't look so pretty anymore.
> And the driver had a new nick-name....... Ricochet.


ROFL!! Funny how them stray bullets work huh?


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

Growing up I knew a man had more kids than he could afford to feed. He knew how to, poach deer but not how to keep his wife from getting pregnant. He worked six days a week sometimes seven. I am pretty sure he and his family ate every deer he shot. I can't say I had a problem with that back then.

Poachers who don't need the meat and brag about the "buck they shot" aren't huinters. They are low life no good "deleted deleted deleted (by myself)" :flame: 

A nice thing about a cell phone is that you can call while "driving by a suspicious truck parked by the side of the road". "I think they my be doing drugs or selling drugs". Hey it is just your opinion and you could be wrong but ..... Most cops will jump on that one while they may have something else to do rather than check out a poacher (that they may know). Always take a license plate number and save it. If you have some trouble the plate number mnay help you.

I'm sure that Ricochet is more careful where he hunts and how wide he opens his mouth.


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

Growing up I knew a man had more kids than he could afford to feed. He knew how to, poach deer but not how to keep his wife from getting pregnant. He worked six days a week sometimes seven. I am pretty sure he and his family ate every deer he shot. I can't say I had a problem with that back then.

Poachers who don't need the meat and brag about the "buck they shot" aren't huinters. They are low life no good "deleted deleted deleted (by myself)" :flame: 

A nice thing about a cell phone is that you can call while "driving by a suspicious truck parked by the side of the road". "I think they my be doing drugs or selling drugs". Hey it is just your opinion and you could be wrong but ..... Most cops will jump on that one while they may have something else to do rather than check out a poacher (that they may know). Always take a license plate number and save it. If you have some trouble the plate number mnay help you.

I'm sure that Ricochet is more careful where he hunts and how wide he opens his mouth.


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

NJ Rich said:


> He knew how to, poach deer but not how to keep his wife from getting pregnant. He worked six days a week sometimes seven. I am pretty sure he and his family ate every deer he shot.


There are those who believe birth control in any form is morally wrong; he sounds like he provided for his family the best he could.


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## Yeti (Nov 3, 2006)

its kinda funny, my house was finished being built in Oct. and the gun season opened a couple weeks after we moved in. we used to get strange trucks in the driveway that would just sit and stare at the new house. that gave me the clue it was good hunting here. one of the biggest deer I ever saw was out my back door. last year the neighbor found 8 gut piles on the back of his place. I have one neighbor who has already claimed to have run off a poacher on her place a week ago


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## dagwood (Jul 17, 2006)

We have one fellow here in town who was thought to be a poacher. A little snooping soon proved that the only meat his family ate was venison. The guy simply could not afford to buy meat for his family.

He is the only one I allow to hunt on our farm year-long. Friends of mine have pitched in and the guy now finds nice chickens in crates on his doorstep, whole hams,pork loins,beef roasts,,,,,and for Christmas I make darn sure a big hunk of Prime Rib gets to his table too....


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## NJ Rich (Dec 14, 2005)

Haggis, 

If you knew this fellow you would know it wasn't religion that prevented birth control. If it was religion I would certainly respect that.

Dogwood,

I think that is a wonderful thing to do. You and your friends certainly have warm spots in your hearts. 

Reminds the rest of us that many people don't have it as well as we do.

NJ Rich


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## cowboy joe (Sep 14, 2003)

Thought I was the only one with a poacher issue. There were a couple of nice bucks hanging around the apple trees next to the house. Some road 'hunters', and I use the term hunter loosely, apparently thought they would get a head start on the season...blistered my ear drums after dark the night before gun opened. All of the bedrooms are on that side of the house...including where my girls sleep. There's no excuse for that kind of stupidity...it's just plain irresponsible.

LEO busted a van full of poachers in front of my house that year. Hoping they do they same this year.


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## shadowwalker (Mar 5, 2004)

Check with your game and fish personell. See if they have one of those robotic deer. Or just a mounted one that they use to catch poachers. If they can set it up around your properties. They will figure out where and how. It will do an amazing job. If the poachers are that bad. It will make a big dent in that activity. And the game personell will be the ones to make the bust so no land owners will get fingered.


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## sleeps723 (Sep 10, 2006)

We have one fellow here in town who was thought to be a poacher. A little snooping soon proved that the only meat his family ate was venison. The guy simply could not afford to buy meat for his family.

He is the only one I allow to hunt on our farm year-long. Friends of mine have pitched in and the guy now finds nice chickens in crates on his doorstep, whole hams,pork loins,beef roasts,,,,,and for Christmas I make darn sure a big hunk of Prime Rib gets to his table too.... 




thats what makes the world go round


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## jen74145 (Oct 31, 2006)

Ah, Dagwood, you've made me smile today. Thank you, world needs more people like you and your friends who help feed that family.


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## Rockin'B (Jan 20, 2006)

I hope you all call the game officers when you find whole deer with antlers sawn off or deer with just select cuts of meat taken. Without evidence it's hard to convict.

Game officers need to know about each and every one of the obvious poaching incidents. It's hard to catch people if they don't know it happened...


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## bgak47 (Sep 4, 2003)

I hope you all realize that a poacher is an armed criminal, & could be capable of violence against people.


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

bgak47 said:


> I hope you all realize that a poacher is an armed criminal, & could be capable of violence against people.


Very true, but then, any hunter who makes commits the slightest infraction of the law, knowingly or unwittingly, is by definition, an armed criminal, and very many really "nice" people are capable of violence against people.


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## texican (Oct 4, 2003)

big rockpile said:


> Plus they both think that your property needs burned every year.
> 
> big rockpile


BR... I've heard the same thing, oh, about ten years ago... After hearing similar words, I rubbed my beard, looked up into the sky, and mused on the mysteries of fire, and how embers that burned me out could float around in the sky for weeks, even months, and float for miles, and suddenly fall without any warning, on their places... 

....never ever had any outlaw utter such words again... got to get the crazy bluff in on the crazies....

And Meloc, after catching a couple of poachers and running em down, and embarrassing the heck out of em... basically making examples of em... my poaching problems have disappeared...

Crazy Bluffs are Very Useful!


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

here is what burns me. in my area, it is all good hunting. at least it is all about the same. i live at the end of the state forest and a place where the open fields and such begin. some are now lawns, but they are open. folks drive around spotlighting, have trouble seeing anything in the woods, but seem to see deer in the open. all of a sudden, the area i live in is "the hot spot" simply because folks hunt their spots with a spotlight instead of scouring the woods looking for sign. one nice buck or two gets a reputation and some ding-dong always poaches it. this year it happened at 8:10 pm the night before season opened and i heard the shot and getaway truck. the next day there are "first day $%^#@#$" all around my property. i may eventually have to post safety zone signs, leading me to hunt illegally on my own property. i would have to put up animal coups strategically around the property near the edges i guess.

i am no antler nut, i enjoy the meat. it would be nice to bag a nice buck near home at least once. at least i bagged a heavy, mature doe on tuesday.


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## Beef11 (Feb 2, 2006)

> There are those folks who exercise their "God given rights", those who exercise their "man given rights", and those who kill for the joy of killing. It is this latter group who are the most visable respresentatives of the hunting community.


I agree with this statement. I haven't hunted deer for the last 2 years myself i don't mind the meat i've just been busy with other things. I have been around some fish cops (no i've never been sighted or investigated) I haven't met many that were worth having around. They seem to have a mentality that lacks any common sense for instance shooting a wounded (dying) deer will get you a ticket. shooting an animal that is doing damage to your property Ticket. Animal that is attacking you has to kill you before you can defend yourself. The game laws in some states are a joke and when a man taking care of what needs to happen or bending rules that serve no purpose other than to harass sportsman gets labeled a poacher i don't think the label is so bad.


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## bgak47 (Sep 4, 2003)

At a time not so long ago there were absolutely no game laws or hunting restrictions in this country. I think we all know where this led. I have heard it estimated that there are now more whitetail deer in this country than when Columbus arrived. I can say from my personal experience of 50yrs of hunting that deer are certainly more plentiful than when I started hunting. IMO wildlife management has been a great success for more than just the game species. Poaching is reprehensible to me & makes real hunters & hunting look bad to the people that oppose it,& to those who would be neutral to the idea if not for poachers.


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

bgak47 said:


> At a time not so long ago there were absolutely no game laws or hunting restrictions in this country. I think we all know where this led. I have heard it estimated that there are now more whitetail deer in this country than when Columbus arrived. I can say from my personal experience of 50yrs of hunting that deer are certainly more plentiful than when I started hunting. IMO wildlife management has been a great success for more than just the game species. Poaching is reprehensible to me & makes real hunters & hunting look bad to the people that oppose it,& to those who would be neutral to the idea if not for poachers.



i agree to some extent. i think the population increase (humans) has made regulation necessary. i don't really agree that management has increased deer population. most of the old timers i talked to always saw BIG herds of deer locally. 20-25 years ago, i saw a herd of 10-20 deer come off the ridge every single day. i have not seen more than 6 deer in a herd for many years.

i think the chestnut tree population that died off had a great impact on deer herds. oaks produce nuts every other year (for many species). chestnuts produced nuts every year and composed @ 50% of the tree population. if the chestnuts were replaced by oaks, it stands to reason that a very large percentage of the annual nut crop has been eliminated from the death of the chestnuts. i think this is often overlooked when folks talk about how modern management has increased the deer population.


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

On the subject of what is compared to what was in the way of deer herds, I've read historical accounts of men armed with old Kentucky rifles, and hunting alone, killing hundreds of deer in a fall hunt just for the "buckskins". On face value that seems wasteful, but on a second look the question begs be asked, "How did these men find, see, get a shot at under 100 yards, and kill scores of deer on a single fall hunt, when so many hunters today hunt an entire season without even seeing a deer?"

I do believe there are more deer than when my father was growing, but even now the herds are just a shadow of what they once were a 125 to 200 years ago. It took the market hunters, men who made their yearly living off the sale of deer meat, decades to wipe out even local deer herds. Today a few poachers looking to fill their freezers seem to be able to do the same thing in just days.


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## tamatik (Jan 3, 2006)

I was stopped on day while coming home from work at a camp in the bush.I thot it was just a random chekstop,except it was in the boonies not on the hiway.It was dark and they were in the back of my truck with flaslites and looking behind the seat etc. and asking lotsa questions.Eventually they said I could go..I got home and was late of course..the girlfriend said"They stopped you didn,t they?"I said how did u no..She said they had been to the house earlier and cheked the freezer and outbuildings etc.
I knew the game warden and called an dasked what,s up?he said they had a report that I had 2 deer out of season..But I,m ok ..I freaked..I told him I wanted to know who made the call ..Denied.I went on to tell him that this type of thing plants a seed in the mind,kinda like saying"hey wasn,t he in on some sorta poaching a few yrs back?"These guys don,t forget the names of poachers.After that I ALWAYS got stopped during season.Never did figger out who hated me enuf to do that.I have never poached and hated the fact that the game wardens mite be thinking they just didn,t catch me at the rite time,.
Gord


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## outgunu (Sep 14, 2006)

You just want to catch them someday??? Might not be a good idea unless you want to be in a gunfight. 1. They disreguard the law. 2. They are armed. 3. They don't want to go to jail.


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

we all gotta go sometime.

if no one gets info, like a tag or plate number, it will never end.


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## Drizler (Jun 16, 2002)

Involve the local game warden and police If you can. If you do catch one in the act I would not recommend confronting him yourself directly. You are much better off just finding his car. They have to come from somewhere. Write down the description and tags, take a pic of him getting in if you like but notify the authorities via 911 and get them heading there. 
Remember a couple years back where that idiot shot those landowners in the Midwest. A guy I work with recently confronted a few cooters hunting on his land. The oldest one was really agitated and kept fingering his rifle the whole time acting strangely. You never know who you are dealing with and lots of these people aren't playing with a full deck to begin with. Call the cops. Remember if you have a cell phone you can simply shadow the guy from a safe hidden distance and vector them right in on them using the phone.


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## cowboy joe (Sep 14, 2003)

cowboy joe said:


> Thought I was the only one with a poacher issue. There were a couple of nice bucks hanging around the apple trees next to the house. Some road 'hunters', and I use the term hunter loosely, apparently thought they would get a head start on the season...blistered my ear drums after dark the night before gun opened. All of the bedrooms are on that side of the house...including where my girls sleep. There's no excuse for that kind of stupidity...it's just plain irresponsible.
> 
> LEO busted a van full of poachers in front of my house that year. Hoping they do they same this year.


Went for a walk to check out an old cherry orchard I plan on clearing this spring. Found more than I bargined for...three spent shotgun shell casings on my property in the tree line about 200 feet from the house. That really cheeses me off...


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## fishhead (Jul 19, 2006)

You might get some relief if you contact the Fish and Game enforcement and tell them about the problem and offer to let them put up one of those robotic deer decoys. In MN under some circumstances they can confiscate the gun and truck plus the fine and restitution.


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## moonwolf (Sep 20, 2004)

Wildlife and field biologists in this region say more deer are present than anytime they've had records kept on them. In this northern climate the deer populations are limited by the severity of winters and access to predators in early spring. 
On the wider scale, the reading would suggest that numbers of deer are higher than a hundred years ago due a lot to agricultural practices. 

There are lots of deer around, but back in the 'old days' there wasn't so much private property. To go hunting, a woodsman or hunter would just take off any direction where he felt like hunting, and be as successful as he would wish and not be bothered by game laws or trespassing laws. 
Today, a poacher can be just as 'successful', but may also be caught taking his game out of season, or over the limit. 
Technology is helpful in combating some of the poaching problem by use of simple cell phones to alert the conservation departments of your locale to bring in the game warden if you see an infraction. The Hot Lines available are with annonymity and effective if more good citizens would report the poaching.


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## beowoulf90 (Jan 13, 2004)

Haggis said:


> On the subject of what is compared to what was in the way of deer herds, I've read historical accounts of men armed with old Kentucky rifles, and hunting alone, killing hundreds of deer in a fall hunt just for the "buckskins". On face value that seems wasteful, but on a second look the question begs be asked, "How did these men find, see, get a shot at under 100 yards, and kill scores of deer on a single fall hunt, when so many hunters today hunt an entire season without even seeing a deer?"
> 
> I do believe there are more deer than when my father was growing, but even now the herds are just a shadow of what they once were a 125 to 200 years ago. It took the market hunters, men who made their yearly living off the sale of deer meat, decades to wipe out even local deer herds. Today a few poachers looking to fill their freezers seem to be able to do the same thing in just days.



This might have been true in the times of Daniel Boone, but if you also check the history you will see that it wasn't true around the 1900's. Pennsylvania for one State had all but wiped out the deer herd here. Once they created hunting laws and repopulated the deer the herd started to regrow. If I remember correctly Pennsylvania had to get deer from Michigan and Wisconsin in order to repopulate the deer herd. If you also look at the history at that time you will see that about 90% of the forrests in PA were gone...Now through conservation we have huge forrests. 
So my point is if you leave it to "gods laws" there would be no deer along with other animals. Example; when was the last time anyone in the lower Susquehanna River area saw a river otter?


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## MELOC (Sep 26, 2005)

beowolf,

i keep hearing that info about past populations being very small, mostly from foresters and game officers, but i have trouble believing it. for one, i doubt they had the ability to properly measure populations 80-150 years ago. populations of people were a bit spottier than today. i remember my uncles telling me they used to see massive deer herds back in the 1920's. (just west of gettysburg) i think there may have been areas where deer were scarce, but i don't think it was a statewide near-erradication of deer populations. i think foresters and conservation professionals do benefit from the hype.

i will concede that many factors could have hurt the populations though. the iron industry used to clear-cut the forests and make charcoal to fire the furnaces in the early 1800's. this would have been disruptive, but i doubt it was a near extinction/eradication throughout the state. 100 years later, the chestnut trees all died off due to disease. i don't think people realize that they constituted 50% of the trees and produced nuts every year. many oaks only produce nuts every other year, so the amount of food availible to deer in the 40's and 50's could have dropped by 50%. the effect on deer then was caused by a lack of food and not by hunters.

in the seventies and early eighties, deer were brought in from michigan and other places. this was to add fresh genes to the gene pool and counter inbreeding that resulted in smaller deer size.


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## fantasymaker (Aug 28, 2005)

3 years ago there were otters around Berwick PA if they can get there they can get pretty much anywhere in pa


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## Haggis (Mar 11, 2004)

beowoulf90 said:


> This might have been true in the times of Daniel Boone, but if you also check the history you will see that it wasn't true around the 1900's. Pennsylvania for one State had all but wiped out the deer herd here. Once they created hunting laws and repopulated the deer the herd started to regrow. If I remember correctly Pennsylvania had to get deer from Michigan and Wisconsin in order to repopulate the deer herd. If you also look at the history at that time you will see that about 90% of the forrests in PA were gone...Now through conservation we have huge forrests.
> So my point is if you leave it to "gods laws" there would be no deer along with other animals. Example; when was the last time anyone in the lower Susquehanna River area saw a river otter?


Aye, 1900 would have been toward the tail end of the market hunting in Pennsylvania, and the deer herd would have been quite sparse and at its lowest ebb. There is a little book titled, "50 years a Hunter and Trapper" published by the people who put out the _Fur, Fish, and Game_ magazine; the fellow who wrote the book was a professional market hunter in Pennsylvania during the second half of the 19th century. I think ithe book is about $5 now, but if one lives in Pennsylvania it would be worth a read.

Personally, I think the best thing that ever happened to the deer population was the migration of America's population away from the land and to towns, the second best help to the deer herds was probably Food Stamps.

I do note though that the conservation folk, and hunters, take all of the credit for the increase in the deer herds, but none of the credit for the damage and deaths the deer herds cause on America's highways via automibile accidents.


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## pancho (Oct 23, 2006)

During the 19th century deer had been eliminated from most of the eastern half of the U.S. The cause was a general destruction of their habit along with over exploitation of the animals. Around 1890 there was only 350,000-500,000 whitetails left. The great plains had been stripped of deer.
Restoration began in 1878 when a sportsman group in Rutland, Va. bought 17 deer and released them in woodlands closed to hunting.
Pennsylvanis soon began their own restoration program. In 19078 hunters took 200 bucks in an area that 10 years earlier had no deer at all.

Back years ago people hunted for something to eat. It was either hunt or starve. They had to be good at it. The hunters of today, or a large number, hunt for sport. If they are not successful they go home and eat anyway. In the past if you were not successful you went home hungry along with the family. It will make a hunter try a little harder when the survival of them and their families are on the line.


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## big rockpile (Feb 24, 2003)

You Guys can keep all your *^&%$*#^ Otters :flame: 

big rockpile


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## tn_junk (Nov 28, 2006)

It's not just deer. Was out scouting for Turkey Sunday and found a fairly fresh kill, minus the beard and Tail Feathers. And this was on a Wildlife Management Area. 
IMHO, even when poachers are caught around here, they get off way too easy.

galump


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## beowoulf90 (Jan 13, 2004)

MELOC said:


> beowolf,
> 
> i keep hearing that info about past populations being very small, mostly from foresters and game officers, but i have trouble believing it. for one, i doubt they had the ability to properly measure populations 80-150 years ago. populations of people were a bit spottier than today. i remember my uncles telling me they used to see massive deer herds back in the 1920's. (just west of gettysburg) i think there may have been areas where deer were scarce, but i don't think it was a statewide near-erradication of deer populations. i think foresters and conservation professionals do benefit from the hype.
> 
> ...


This might have been true, but as others have noted, by this time the deer herds were being restored. Deforrestation, lack of food, over hunting, etc. all caused the deer population to drop in the late 1800's, early 1900's . This also include other animals. When I bought my 21 acres in 1991, we had no wild turkeys, now after working with the Game Commission we now have 2 flocks with at least 20 birds per flock. Now that there are enough birds to sustain the flocks myself and the other property owners have opened our land to hunting again. If the hunting pressure or any other outside pressures are to great we will close the land to hunting until the birds can sustain themselves again. Just last week I think I've found markings for a black bear. I found a tree that had the bark tore away about 6' up the tree with what looked like claw marks running up & down the tree. This is unusual for York County PA. I've also had 2 people report sightings to me...


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