# Hardship 2nd house on Property



## CindyOR

Hi all - we moved on our property almost 18 years ago when we were both hale & hearty. Since 2005, my husband has had one thing after another (including dying for 15 mins in 2007) and is permanently disabled now. I have been able to be his full time caregiver, and work 2 jobs, but after 6 years of going it alone, it's time to put another system in place before I burn out. I've been pondering bringing in a caretaker couple, but would want them to have their own place. We have almost 20 acres and room for another type of residence - be it a single wide mobile or a small cabin. Our county zones us as only being allowed 1 residence on this size of property, but we can get a hardship type of zoning variance and then put some kind of housing in.

Has anyone done anything like this and if so, if you can tell me what are some of the issues you have run into? I don't have a ton of money to work with, and plan on finding a used mobile or starting out with people who have an RV or trailer to begin with. My main worries are putting in another septic system. Luckily we have 4 wells that are unused on our property, so at least we don't have to dig them - just activate and put in the equipment.

Any info or feedback on this issue would be appreciated. Also, how do you find reliable type of caretakers? I know how to screen because we used to have rentals but people are very good at hiding who they are until it is too late. Since I would want one person in the couple to be my back up caregiver, I want to screen especially carefully. Any tips for this would be very appreciated.

CindyOR


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## TnAndy

Good question Cindy. 

I have thoughts along the same lines, not so much as a caregiver ( but that may be down the road ), but simply as help around the farm as we age. Thinking of building a small ( 1 bed/ 1 bath ) (no 2nd home restrictions here) cabin, and the 'rent' would be a couple days work mowing, cutting firewood, etc. Ideal situation for a college kid or young couple w/o kids.


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## SimplerTimez

I would suggest trying the Caretakers Gazette and placing an ad there. I've been watching it for some time, for the future when I am debt free, in case I don't ever remarry and can't afford to buy/build my own place again. 

Be very specific in your requirements. There are literally hundreds of people looking for the type of things both of you are needing.

You might also post in Singletree here on HT, to see if anyone there is looking for such a type of situation.

Hope this helps.

~ST


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## Wolfy-hound

And put everything in writing. Be specific. Put in a "out" clause for if things go south.


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## CindyOR

Having been a landlord back 20 yrs ago and not wanting those sorts of problems again - that, I have to say - is my major concern. I'm sure we'll go through a few people before finding the right match, but I don't feel up to the mess you have to go through before getting there. But it is the right solution to our situation I believe, so I'll have to make myself go through the process. There are a lot of good people out there looking for this type of thing I know. I want to match up with one of them, not one looking for a free ride or everything for nothing or anyone who does drugs. I know I'll need to get with an attorney to map things out carefully to make sure if it doesn't work out we can get the person off the property too.
Trading living space for occasional work seems to be a win/win situation for older folks and I'm surprised more of this isn't going on by non-family members.
CindyOR


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## where I want to

Not from personal experience but I had a boss that had to go through a court case and have the sherriff out to evict what grew into a flock of non-working potheads from his uncle's place.
Turns out his uncle invited one to live with him to help and that person brought in another, then more arrived ans soon his home was full of people sponging off him. The case went on for years before they exhausted their appeals and made to leave.
I have had cases where people had taken over the life of an older person who was afraid of them and afraid of being left without help at the same time so a bad situation went on and on.
I would research with local social agencies, churchs, caregiver support groups, etc before I went down that road.
I think I would go with hiring someone for occasional respite care- someone bonded and licensed.


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## Wolf mom

I guess I need clarification on what type of a caregiver you are looking for - one to assist with your property or one to assist you with caring for your husband. 

If the issues is caring for your husband, I'd weigh the expense of building a "small cabin" versus paying licensed caregivers to come to assist you. 

If it's your land, I'd just pay someone to do what's necessary on an "as needed" basis. 

By the time you pay electricity, insurance, and all the other costs and issues others here have brought up, - you mentioned septic, getting a zoning exemption - I bet it'd be cheaper to hire people. 

Having been associated with care giving professionally, the basic need is being able to lessen the stress of the caregiver - not add more with extra issues.

If you are low income, call your local Area Agency on Aging. If they have the funds, they have housekeeping, pay for meals on wheels and respite care to relieve you. They can also assist you with other options.


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## RDuke

You haven't stated whether or not the disability entitles him to SocSec disability payments or if he is on Medicare or Medicaid. Your local Social Services office can tell you what types of programs he can be enrolled in to get home care assistance. Please talk to Social Services first before taking on any other living/working arrangements. If, after talking with them, they are unable to give you adequate assistance then proceed with your plan.


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## jwal10

Polk Co Oregon will let you place a MIL cottage on the existing septic and water service. No kitchens allowed in the MIL cottage. Regular meals would need to be taken in your house. If you have a 3 bedroom septic, and 2 bedrooms in your house, the cottage counts as 1 more and is allowed. IF you have 3 bedrooms, 1 has to be converted into a family room. The bath fixtures have to be removed and CAN be converted to storage after the person passes. Getting good help? Good luck. I have built one for elderly tenants. Their daughter lives in it....James


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## notthereyet

Cindy,

In terms of being able to build an additional dwelling, have you considered sub-dividing your property? Think about carving out a new parcel (maybe a half acre or whatever the minimum might be). You would retain ownership, but the potential increase in the value of your estate could be tremendous.

If your county will do this, then you can build a complete new home (with their own septic and well). Talk to your local tax office to see if this is doable.

I've been on the other side of the country for nearly 20 years now, but if I ever get around to moving back to Oregon, I'd love to find an opportunity like this, especially if some sort of deal could be worked out with a mutually beneficial long-term lease or lease/purchase with the estate.


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## Bellyman

Like another poster above, I'm not sure whether you are wanting someone to take care of your husband or whether you're looking for someone to take care of your property... or both. (?)

I do have a suggestion, though.

Can you put in an "rv pad" with hookups? It sounds like water would be no issue. Electric isn't usually that difficult either, though if you're going to do it, make it a standard 50 amp rv hookup if you can. Most rvers would really appreciate that. Sewer can be a little more of a problem if the system you are using couldn't handle the extra that a person or two in the rv would put out. (They don't put out nearly as much as a standard home. A standard rv toilet flush is likely something like a pint to a quart, not a gallon. And an rv shower is likely 3 or 4 gallons, not 50.) There are also macerator pumps that quite a few rvers have that can pump their waste for a pretty fair distance through a garden hose to a sewer cleanout or other place to access your septic system.)

An rv pad doesn't have to be anything fancy, really. It doesn't have to be concrete. I put in an rv pad on a piece of property I owned once. It was just some gravel right on the ground. Worked just fine. I did put in a sewage system, city water hookup and had an electric pole put in for electric. 

Ok, if you have a place for an rv to park, one possibility for finding workers is Workamper News. Look them up online. You may be able to download a copy of their magazine. (It comes out every other month, plus, they have daily updates for those who subscribe to them, through email and maybe online.) They're one of the biggest for that type of thing, usually rvers looking for places to work or volunteer for anywhere from a few weeks to a season or maybe even longer. 

You can ask for anything you want. If you need someone to mow or take care of your gardens, you'd want to state that clearly. If you need someone to look after your husband, you'd need to state exactly what you need. There are some pretty qualified people that do workamp but as you get towards some of the higher end workers (such as nursing, licensed caregivers, etc.), they are going to be much harder to find. Not saying you can't find someone that way, but it'll be a much smaller group of qualified people. 

I might suggest you read through some of the current ads in Workamper News and figure out whether you think that there may be a workamper or workamper couple that would fit what you'd need from them. Like I said, you can ask for anything you want. Just be totally up front about it. (People don't like to be told they'll be doing one thing and arrive to find that the job they're expected to do is totally different.)

One thing about the workamper crowd... they're generally not wanting to be permanent in one spot for years on end. A lot of them do travel and move around. There will be some that won't want to stay more than a few months. (Some states don't like you staying too long without actually "moving" there.) So it may be that you'd need several people over the course of a year. Also, depending upon the weather where you are located, it might be more difficult to find someone to be there over the coldest of winter, for instance, if you have very cold and snowy winters. Lots of rvers try to avoid that kind of thing and head to warm places for the winter. Not sure quite what it's like where you are. 

If the place is nice and the circumstances are good, it will likely be attractive to someone. If there are things to see and do in the area, so much the better. 

Just something to think about. Best of luck as you get it figured out!


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## TnAndy

SimplerTimez said:


> I would suggest trying the Caretakers Gazette and placing an ad there. I've been watching it for some time, for the future when I am debt free, in case I don't ever remarry and can't afford to buy/build my own place again.
> 
> Be very specific in your requirements. There are literally hundreds of people looking for the type of things both of you are needing.
> 
> You might also post in Singletree here on HT, to see if anyone there is looking for such a type of situation.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> ~ST



Thanks for the tip on the publication !


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## CindyOR

Thank you everyone for some excellent ideas and direction. 

In regards to subdividing the property, minimum to subdivide is 20 acres and we have 18-3/4 acres So no subdividing for us unfortunately. We wanted to do that right after we purchased the property because we have 2 kids and wanted them to each have their own parcel after we departed. They both live out of the area and would probably end up selling their parcel, but just in case one wanted to keep it, they could. But, here in Lane Cty, that's not possible.

However, I am positive it would be possible for the Hardship permit to be obtained.

I'm not sure on the RV part. We already have it set up for RV here where we store our camper, but I'm looking for a more permanent solution than a person with an RV would probably want. You are right - they like to travel for the most part.
And I figured that if I had an actual 2nd house, it would attract a more stable person or couple who is looking for a house of their own in exchange for giving help. We have a couple of sites where wells were drilled and although the water output isn't enough to get a mortgage, it would be enough to keep a house going. Putting a single wide on a concrete slab would work best for us in all the places the wells are. Septic would just require creative thinking I believe. Ours would be a couple of acres above and across the driveway from where the trailer sites would be, so tapping in to ours would not work. But maybe a sandfilter style would work OK. It is pretty hilly ground, so hard to put a standard septic "field" in but may be doable using a old logging road close by.

As I age, I think I'd probably be looking for a couple, one for the caregiving and one for the caretaking of the property and animals. I'm 57 now, so by the time I get all this in place I'm sure it will be a couple of years down the line.

In answer to the first question asked about Medicare etc - my husband is on SSDI and Medicare, but doesn't qualify for Medicaid, so no help for him because he's under 60 yrs of age. Even the Senior and Disabled Services group turned him down for respite care and any type of therapy due to his age, even though he has many disabilites and needs training to learn how to live life while blind, partially deaf and with short term memory loss. I've looked high and low and there doesn't seem to be any services to help unless you are hiring a private party - and after all the hospitalizations over the last 6 + years we just can't afford that.

Again, that's for the ideas and it gets me thinking creatively about where to find people and what is possible.

Thanks,
Cindy


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## Tacoma

In the county I live in Central Florida, I was able to get a conditional use permit to put a small manufactured home for my mother to live in, without subdividing our 10 acres. The home had to be 1200 sq ft or under and I had to sign that I would not sell the land under it. Well, no problem as it was placed very close to my home. 
Now realize that my property taxes really went up, double the garbarge fee which is built in the tax bill and of course double the fire tax. The appraisal of the entire property went way up- to the point that it is even harder to make ends meet now. All that came with the additional address and mailbox. I regret having ever done it now.


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