# Outlook for a dog on phenobarbital



## Rouen (Aug 19, 2004)

I was looking at a dog at one of my local shelters. he had one seizure while there and the vet they took him to told them to put him on phenobarbital. they've been told that since he's on it he can never be taken off. I did some reading online and found some sites that said long term(3 months or more) use of phenobarbital in dogs can lead to liver damage and possibly death.
what is the likelyhood of a 5 year old large breed dog living the rest of his natural live on this drug?


----------



## Willowynd (Mar 27, 2005)

I had a dog years ago on phenobarb and it only lived about a year after starting on it. It was about 2-3 yrs old when I got the dog and started him on it for epilepsy. The dog got lymposarcoma and passed away a few months later. Now that could have been from the meds, but also could have been caused by the BB's he was shot with by neighbor- one of which was never removed, or could have been poor genetics. Will never know. As with any other long term drug use though, periodic blood panels should be run to determine if the drug is causing organ damage. Its really a terrible situation...medicate and worry about the drug causing damage- possibly deadly or not medicate and know that the ailment will kill it. If I were to go through this again (God forbid), I would try other things first (like trying to determine the triggers and treating with valium as sezured occured, changing diet and enviromental factors, etc). One seizure is not a signal to jump right on meds. Seizures can be caused by many things. It is best to wait and see if they repeat and how often and if there is an underlying cause. For instance, I had a dog that was inadvertantly poisoned at a yr old and suffered from severe organ damage as a result (we almost lost him). He would seize once a year... until I switched him to a raw diet. I found out the grains were building up in his system and saw the effects before the seizure (release) occured with pale eye rims and nose (they were normally dark brown) and after the seizure, they would return to normal color. After we eliminated grains from the diet, he never seized again. His organs were still damaged, but the seizures stopped. His last 2 yrs he was seizure free and he eventually subcumbed to organ failure. No, he did not live as long as a dog that would not have suffered organ damage, but he lived much longer than any vet ever thought...especially the ones that had sent him home to die at a yr old. Even my regular vet was shocked when I called him to tell him that the dog was down and failing...he thought he had passed away a couple years before. So my point is not to jump on the meds. Find out the cause and frenquency and triggers and try to reduce the number of seizures or at least the severity through enviromental management first. Keep a log- date, length of seizure, what kind of seizure, what possible triggers, what was going on at the time and right before the seizure occured, etc so you have some history to go by. Then take it from there.


----------



## farmmom (Jan 4, 2009)

I had a dog that started on Phenobarbital when she was 6 or 8 months old. She had epilepsy. She died at the age of 14 years, and was only sick once that I can recall - someone poisoned her, but she pulled through.


----------



## BusyBees2 (Dec 10, 2004)

I had a dog growing up that lived to be 14 or 15...he was on phenobarb for at least half his lifetime! Died of old age. He was a husky/shepherd mix.


----------



## beccachow (Nov 8, 2008)

Had a chow on it for seizures. He would have lived out his natural life on the drug, but the seizures themselves got to the point they weren't being controlled anymore and he had to be put down. So technically, it was the seizures that took him, not the drug.


----------



## Marie04 (Mar 3, 2008)

We had an 11 year old collie/lab/shepherd mix who developed seizures.. she was on Pb for several months, but the seizures got worse and finally one night were uncontrollable.. brought her in to the vet at 1 in the morning, seizing all the way, and put her down.. But she was an older dog when it began.


----------



## GoldenMom (Jan 2, 2005)

With proper monitoring I wouldn't worry about a dog on Phenobarb. Proper monitoring is a blood phenobarbital level at least once per year and a full blood panel once, or preferably twice, a year.

I too am not quick to put a dog on seizure meds for one seizure. My own dog, Ruby, has now had two seizures and I am not at all ready to medicate her yet. Her seizures were 3 months apart and it's been over 4 months since the second one. My threshold for starting the meds is seizing about once a month (or more).

And I've know several clients who have weaned their dogs off phenobarb (on their own initiative) and the dogs haven't suffered for it-several of them eventually needed to go back on meds, but they didn't suffer withdrawal or anything. And sometimes I will wean a dog off phenobarb if I switch seizure meds (there's other options besides phenobarb).

I've seen one dog with suspected phenobarb toxicity (out of dozens on the med). She recovered fully with some supportive care and stopping the drug.

I would suspect that Marie's older dog's seizure were not caused by epilepsy. In an older dog that suddenly develops seizures the most common cause would be a brain tumor or a metabolic problem. Those types of seizures can be somewhat controlled by the phenobarb, but the tumor or metabolic problem will progress and the seizures will become uncontrollable.


----------



## Willow101 (Feb 20, 2008)

I have a seven year old Rott that has been on Pheno for five years with no problems. I suspect her seizures will do her in before the meds.

One thing that did catch my eye was that the dog went to the vet and was immediately put on meds. There are so many things that can cause seizures....whip worm and round worm are two which can easily be taken care of. Before assuming this dog will have to have meds it's entire life....a complete physical with stool samples and blood work should be done. Determining what the problem is could be a bit expensive but well worth the money.

Willow101


----------



## frogmammy (Dec 8, 2004)

Quite a few things can cause seizures, and to me, one seizure does not an epeliptic make! Food, and environmental allergies can cause seizures, so can underactive thyroid (easily treatable!) and vitamin deficencies. Under hydration can cause seizures...and a whole lot others that I can't even think of right now.

Mon


----------



## Rouen (Aug 19, 2004)

like I said he's not my dog, I was there when he had the seizure though. it lasted about 5 minutes and he recovered quickly once it was over. They said they took him to the vet and the vet put him right on the meds, they got a second opinion afterward and were told they should have waited to see if he'd have another. I guess the vets had told the shelter staff that if they take him off the meds he will die since he's on them now, but from what I've read thats not true(?). he is underweight and they said he's on a lower dosage but wouldn't go further than that.
this is him http://search.petfinder.com/petnote/displaypet.cgi?petid=12293634


----------



## Marie04 (Mar 3, 2008)

aw, he looks like a sweetie.. 

I'm wondering if the original vet thinks that since he had one, he'll probably always tend to have them.. hope he does okay though, and it doesn't get worse...


----------

